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Josh kwford welcome to my podcast thank
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you D I'm uh don't know what I'm I'm not
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not sure if I'm excited or what what the
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vibe is with these things but you just
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end up doing them and then they they
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occur do you um yeah do you en do you
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enjoy the reminiscing aspect of you know
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the the tapestry of your life I think I
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do I think I do I mean um and but often
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I think things have got blurred you know
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like um I've had some recent H knocks
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more recently and
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so some of me can't work out what is
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actually truth and and and growing
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flavor um so when I've got to talk
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intimately or you know publicly about
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stuff I there's a sort of doubt and a
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nervousness that sort of cre
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which is I know it seems really weird
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but
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um it's just I guess part of dealing
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with um you know these concussive States
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and uh you know CTE and all these other
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things that are sort of cropping up in
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the Rugby World now it's I guess it's
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just part of the management of it and
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you can't take the old old man's factor
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out of it either so well also also
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you're um you I mean when was the last
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time you read your book cuz you put a
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book out at the end of your career well
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ironically ironically I've just started
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doing speaking saying yes to speak
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engagements because of the head stuff I
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thought no you ually a loser and I sat
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down and read my book so I could make
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sure that
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I knew what was going on just like a
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refresher cuz well I think um as you get
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older you know what was your truth say
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20 years ago may not be your truth now
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you may look back and things differently
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and that happens yeah yeah oh look look
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my you know there's some stuff there
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happened and when I was sort of flicking
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through and reading chapters I was going
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oh jeez did that happen like that Cy
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really that's pretty intense I didn't
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realize it was that intense because
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you've you've washed it you know you've
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dealt with it and it's not it's not
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poignant or or or or or just like you
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know like that that nagging sort of
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burning sensation that you've got to you
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know say something about it it's you've
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I guess you've just left it behind and
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and it's not an issue anymore well it's
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yeah it's a time thing so at the time
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something which maybe a whole chapter of
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the Josh corfield story after a decade
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becomes a paragraph and then eventually
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it's just like a sentence or a footnote
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yeah exactly yeah but hey there's so
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much to um so much to unpack with you
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that scary I thought we start with some
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miscellaneous but some pieces first of
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all um uh you you met ta white Tity
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yesterday what was um I was really chuff
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to meet him cuz like you know you see
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him on telly and he's got this certain
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Charisma and I love the stuff that he
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puts into his movie and the the the you
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know the story he's telling and the
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humor and and the way he creates humor
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through not just like verse but you know
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the expressions and and uh and the color
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and the
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settings um just love what he does and
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you know and and I'm I'm not
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a super uh you know got to meet meet you
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know the man or whatever but it's kind
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of it's kind of cool big deal he's a big
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deal and uh so yeah I and and like I was
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a bit flustered yesterday um I was at
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the
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hucker um thing and record world record
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ATT team and um and and I've just come
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back from uh Wellies and um you know
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massive week with uh charity runs and
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the rugby and obviously too much
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drinking and um and and and I was just
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like I still hyped on that and I met his
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kids and I thought that's fantastic
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great you know and I was trying to be
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funny and Woody and and then Mom and Dad
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walked around the corner and I was shake
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his hand and introduced them and U when
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I got to the mom I was just about to ask
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him a question and it came out um when I
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greet his mom I was like hey
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bro I
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no just cringing internally and it's
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just
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like who does this dumb [ __ ] you do man
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so you said hey bro to ta's Mom yes it's
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not the it's not the worst thing in the
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world is it oh look mate I I like
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meeting moms and dads I like to make a
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good impression and I just instantly
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went Funk and hit the floor and just you
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know you know when you you trip and you
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run and you shingle your face across the
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the tarmac that's what it felt
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like that's great but it's nice to know
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that you get embarrassed about these
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things it's cool I thought it' be water
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off a duck's back for you you seem like
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such a chill dude um yeah some things
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are some things I just go over and over
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and over in my head and and my and again
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this could be part of the hul con cussin
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thing um you know cuz you do do really
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random things and um my wife's pretty
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cool she goes you're over going into
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this cuz on the flip side I'm the first
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person go n doesn't matter I Chu that
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away or whatever you know but some
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things just go round round in my head
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and and I think there's probably pretty
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normally normal of most people but um
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just that overthinking aspect High yeah
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yeah but I do I have it's it's a new
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Thing I Never Had it when I was younger
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it was bulletproof you know but um but
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everything was a lot sharper and crisper
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and you know someone gave gave me a bit
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of a quip I had a [ __ ] straight away
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now it's like I know I've got something
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there but just go through the filing
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yeah but it might take a little while to
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come out but buffering already missed
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the moment you know yeah yeah yeah oh
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that's good um oh so this you're a um an
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ambassador for tenner yeah um that's
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sort of how this chat came about um by
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the way I'm I'm wearing them right now
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is that right well if they work they
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work well I've never I've never had to
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wear them before so it's like um like an
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adult an adult diaper I guess um so
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you're an ambassador for tenner as part
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of like blue September what's it's
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pretty cool because like you know
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they're not saying like I got to bang
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their products out or anything like that
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what they want to say is they want to
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open up the chat and you know cuz guys
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are just crap about talking about their
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their health issues and ironically you
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know like pelvic floor issues um you
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know getting it up all that sort of
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stuff they're
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all they're all linked and so when you
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start getting some of the symptoms and
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you know as things start cropping up it
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could actually be related to your heart
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and so by going and have the chat to the
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doctor or within your group or or your
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wife you might end up getting it checked
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down and it might turn out to be nothing
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but it also might might be symptomatic
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for something else and you've you've got
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a head start because what we're finding
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especially with things like prostate
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cancer is
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if you do the m and you get in early
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it's preventable M but problem is in New
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Zealand and and and it's worldwide
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really but with our kiwi BLS especially
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we we don't talk about stuff we don't
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communicate we should we right you know
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hard man all that sort of stuff but if
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you had just gone in when you first
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noticed some some symptoms and uh you
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know uh like a slower stream you know um
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just seems to take forever to get a a PR
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um uh you know or even you know you're
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getting a bit you should be getting
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aroused about a such in a certain moment
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it's not quite happening how it should
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you know like um then you know if you if
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you ask a question you might find out
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and you go in you get the checks up
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nothing's there but you go in you get
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the checks up and all of a sudden oh
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yeah look there's an issue here um and
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when you when you get fully into it you
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actually might find out that there's
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some cardiac issues you know
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so the link is is there um and and
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especially with prostate man come on
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dudes let's get in get the so so easy so
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easy get done you know and don't get me
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wrong you
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know the obviously the digit check is
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one and they say with and and then the
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blood test for your PSAs you do both
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those together you're pretty and
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everything comes up clear they can
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pretty much say you're fine you know and
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depending on your age group you know you
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got to do your checks pretty regular but
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it's not really that evasive no no and
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it's you no I mean the doctor doesn't
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want their finger up your bum as it's
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it's uncomfortable forone involved but
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they're very professional about it but
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this is the first time I've worn uh like
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tener liners I just wore them today
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since you're an ambassador though it's
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it's like a very very um very chunky
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underpant
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but it's um I mean I'm I'm I'm not
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mocking them because I'm I'm I'm 51 and
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I'm fortunate that I haven't had any
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issues yet but um that may very well be
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the future you know but you got to be
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yeah you can't you can't roll the dice
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with your health can you yeah I mean but
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even you know like uh you
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know if you if you go through the stats
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you know there there was some stats that
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came out about longevity at the moment
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and what they're saying is there's
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there's a few ramp up periods where
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things start really ticking and 40 is
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the first one and 60 is the second one
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and where all your symptomatic stuff
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that may lead to you know your kicking
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the bucket all start at those you know
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those brackets and so when you hit 40 he
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should he should just start doing the
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tests and then you know they're so easy
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these days I I do get the socioeconomic
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side of things you know like I I've got
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insurance so when I've had to actually
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go and do the extra checks on top of the
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doctor um you know I've been able to go
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and get those straight away and that
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that's nice and it's good piece of mind
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but for lots of people that that's an
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issue too yeah yeah I've started I'm 51
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now it's not a long tradition but
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something I started when I was 50 was um
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on my birthday or birthday week just
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going to the doctor for a full medical
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test I've only done it twice but um yeah
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I can it's like 70 or 80 bucks whatever
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to go to the doctor so I can understand
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if money's tight and you're feeling
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perfect um a lot of people wouldn't I
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suppose have the luxury of spending that
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money yeah but yeah that is that is that
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is one of the safety needs but I guess
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and again this has been what tenner are
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trying to uh Drive the second safety
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there is creating these chat groups you
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know because when you say to one of the
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boys oh I just went on and I had the
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check ra and they go oh yeah yeah yeah
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yeah and then one of the other boys say
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yeah I better it done and then one of
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the other boys hasn't done anything and
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but because you start saying the reason
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why you've gone in or you know had the
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check they start thinking oh she I've
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got a bit of that going on and then
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he'll go home and maybe he speaks to the
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wife or whatever and or
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family you know Associated family and
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and then next thing he's in getting the
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J so I
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think there's there's a certain stigma
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or the masculine inside of things that
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um they feel you know they feel that
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pressure but I think if we are open and
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we have the discussions and you know and
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you can do it kind of funny you know I
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mean I I was talking about I've been uh
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dealing with some uh you know I had some
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OB was regular with some of my uh stool
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and stuff like that so I got in and saw
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the doctor and and um you know and they
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felt it was part of um hemorrhoids and
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the next a level of the hemorrhoids as
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the fishes and stuff like that and so I
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went in to get the check and you know I
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was telling the boys about it and I says
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I went in there and you know meet the
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doctor and and he comes out with this
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beautiful voice you know big deep and
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sexy and I was just going oh this just
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doesn't seem right and then he you know
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and then he starts telling me what the
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chers you know he's going through it all
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and he's he gets me comfortable and
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everything like that and then you know
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and then he's lubing me up and then in
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goes the and he starts winding it around
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like it's bloody Butter Churn I'm
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thinking Cy and I'm and I'm like say I'm
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thinking just relax just relax just
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relax and he um and and he goes oh
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you've broken a bit of a sweat and I'm
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thinking who doesn't break a
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sweat you know but once it was done and
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dusted you know was over it's pretty
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Quirk and um you know and then you're on
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to a treatment plan and all that sort of
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stuff um and but also you know that
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while they're there they're doing the
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checks as well you know you they can uh
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roll out the prostate cuz obviously when
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they're in there they can see if it's
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enlarged or not well feel if it's
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enlarged and um and you know and and it
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look I reckon you know half peace of
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mind and security and not having that
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worry and anxiety CU I mean the word
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anxiety is the biggest word in in in
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public you know like everybody talks
00:14:01
about anxiety you know young people
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older people and it's a big killer you
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know it leads to heart issues and stuff
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they say Stress and Anxiety are the key
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drivers for people you know yeah well
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thanks for sharing that stuff and
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opening
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up I I did Dean Barker on the podcast
00:14:21
and um he he had Bale cancer and he so
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he had blood inness still for ages
00:14:27
didn't even tell his wife Mandy about it
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and I was like why didn't you even tell
00:14:29
him and he goes That's it's embarrassing
00:14:31
it's not like but it's um we got to
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normalize these conversations a bit more
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eh and that's that's that's the whole
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premise of you know me doing stuff in
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September and and again in movember I I
00:14:43
really enjoy movember as well you know
00:14:45
it's a great great period and and
00:14:47
obviously the member uh Charities you
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know cuz it's fun you know like and and
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then you can have the discussions and
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you know because everybody's wearing a
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mo although some of the mo are aw awful
00:15:01
but um you know and my my my wife hates
00:15:03
it every year she goes oh you're doing
00:15:05
that again and I go yeah but um well the
00:15:09
thing is I never shave it off straight
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away that's the thing that annoys her
00:15:13
the most it usually makes it to
00:15:15
Christmas you know handle bars and and
00:15:18
whatnot or turns into whatever it turns
00:15:21
into well if he spent a month
00:15:22
cultivating shame to waste it that's the
00:15:24
way I feel about it too hey um we've got
00:15:27
some miscellaneous stuff here so we poke
00:15:29
around with some of these little um
00:15:30
random bits and Bobs of the Josh
00:15:33
kronfeld story and then we'll go on some
00:15:34
sort of chronological order um first of
00:15:37
all you were once named the 99th best
00:15:40
looking rugby player in the world is
00:15:42
that
00:15:43
it well not not amongst the boys it was
00:15:47
like uh when it obviously I can't
00:15:49
remember the title but they had the they
00:15:51
had everyone rated from best looking uh
00:15:55
through to um not so best looking how
00:15:59
how long was the list it was 100 exactly
00:16:02
100 and uh anyway I was I was 98 988
00:16:09
yeah and so the boys came in and they
00:16:11
and uh you know they were talking about
00:16:12
it and we were laughing and they're
00:16:15
going Crush you you're 98 mate what's
00:16:17
going on with that I and then and I says
00:16:19
oh give us a look and so they had all
00:16:21
the pictures right and all the guys that
00:16:23
were rating really highly you know like
00:16:26
um Jeremy gusot which is he is a
00:16:29
beautiful looking man there's no doubt
00:16:31
about it but he was in he was in a you
00:16:33
know a black tie sue you know the bow
00:16:36
tie looking all Jed up ready to go and
00:16:38
then they had um and Jeff was about like
00:16:41
five or six Jeff Jeff Wilson you know
00:16:44
had the long had the long Golden Hair
00:16:46
you know the flowing hair at that time
00:16:48
and um and and of course he was in a
00:16:50
suit and no dressed up and then they had
00:16:53
me at 98 and so with the head gear you
00:16:58
you know like and I'm screaming at
00:17:01
someone like you know got like you know
00:17:03
it's all pushed down and I'm thinking
00:17:06
not so fair not so fair and then um the
00:17:09
funny part of it is um we we're you know
00:17:12
we're all just sort of finished laughing
00:17:14
about it and me you know saying it's not
00:17:17
right it's not right it's not right and
00:17:19
and andon Oliver walks in and goes he
00:17:22
goes oh what's what's so funny what are
00:17:24
you guys laughing at and uh and uh the
00:17:27
boy said oh Josh is uh
00:17:29
as the um as the second ugliest man in
00:17:31
world
00:17:33
rugby and he goes oh that's funny that's
00:17:35
funny he goes and he goes oh who's the
00:17:39
ugliest everyone just
00:17:42
erupts which is uh not which is totally
00:17:46
unfair to him but um he's a good man say
00:17:50
he's 99 no he's
00:17:52
100 who who what publication did this oh
00:17:55
I think it was one of those U Daily Mail
00:17:57
or something you know like the UK um
00:18:01
tabloid type things you know was two
00:18:03
page spread like with a little caption
00:18:07
under each person and stuff and uh no it
00:18:11
was it was gold I mean it you know gave
00:18:13
us great amusement and this is going to
00:18:15
age the conversation a lot of people
00:18:16
won't even know what I'm talking about
00:18:18
when I say this but you're you're in a a
00:18:19
PlayStation game you're in you're in
00:18:22
jonom yeah yeah yeah when when did that
00:18:24
come out was that in late '90s was that
00:18:27
a PS2 what was the
00:18:29
it would have been PS2 I think from
00:18:31
memory yeah but iconic game yeah it was
00:18:34
massive all the boys were playing it um
00:18:36
you know Andrew merens was was very good
00:18:39
at it um and yeah I played it a couple
00:18:42
of times I could never get the hang of
00:18:44
it but yeah and then they'd have uh you
00:18:47
know they had the commentators you know
00:18:49
saying some of their favorite things
00:18:50
that they' use you know
00:18:52
like something there's there's Josh
00:18:54
Grell buring Like A demented mole or
00:18:57
like
00:18:59
that you know do you still have a copy
00:19:02
of it is there any way to play it I
00:19:03
never I never had a copy of it yeah um
00:19:07
and and I think uh I think I've thrown
00:19:09
the PS2
00:19:10
out oh there might be one there I don't
00:19:13
know no it might have even been PS one
00:19:15
to be honest cuz I suppose like when
00:19:17
you're in the thick of it and it's your
00:19:18
career and you're just on this game it's
00:19:20
like a whatever sort of thing but you
00:19:22
must look back now and go [ __ ] that was
00:19:23
cool yeah yeah yeah I I never thought
00:19:26
much about it at the time it was it was
00:19:28
kind of you know like in today's games
00:19:31
if you if you got it and you it' be
00:19:33
really lifelike version of you you know
00:19:35
I was pretty pck lated version with a
00:19:38
with a a black thing on my head instead
00:19:40
of
00:19:41
hair um and there was a movie made about
00:19:44
the uh 1995 World Cup which we'll get
00:19:47
into later but the movie was called
00:19:48
invict us yeah who were were you in that
00:19:50
who played
00:19:51
you I actually don't know I don't know I
00:19:54
I don't think um I don't think you know
00:19:58
like we registered much in it I mean
00:20:01
Jonah would have but um you know cuz he
00:20:04
was massive so you were just some extra
00:20:06
with head gear on yeah I'm sure I'm sure
00:20:08
I'm sure like the this and and I've
00:20:10
never seen the story line but I've I've
00:20:13
flicked through the the the actual book
00:20:15
that it was based
00:20:16
on and um you know like that I think
00:20:21
discovering just what that meant to
00:20:23
everybody over there it just changed my
00:20:26
whole look on it but I I think
00:20:29
quietly I always felt like I knew there
00:20:33
was something special going on in South
00:20:35
Africa like when we rocked over there
00:20:38
and um you know they just returned
00:20:42
from a Hiatus of out in The Ether world
00:20:45
of not being involved in any
00:20:47
international sport and they dropped a
00:20:49
paride and this was their first showcase
00:20:53
moment and they were they were actively
00:20:55
trying
00:20:56
to state that we're rainbow people and
00:20:59
one people and stuff and while we were
00:21:03
there and walking around with armed
00:21:05
security and guards with machine guns
00:21:07
and everything like that and training
00:21:08
behind 15t wire fences and um
00:21:13
and there was obviously the white areas
00:21:17
and there was obviously the black areas
00:21:19
and and there was such a segregation
00:21:23
still I you know I mean you can't just
00:21:25
you can't just break those boundaries
00:21:27
down but to me it was still pretty
00:21:29
obvious M and you'd go to the grounds
00:21:33
and you'd see um all the black
00:21:37
community and I mean see I don't even
00:21:39
know what how to address that PC wise
00:21:42
I'm not sure I'm even doing it properly
00:21:43
you know but the black population would
00:21:46
be all there in their homemade all black
00:21:50
jerseys you know with this with
00:21:52
everything you know the silver Fern the
00:21:54
Stein Luger label all hand sewing
00:21:59
um made from t-shirts and then the
00:22:01
collar's all sewed in with a button and
00:22:04
just Immaculate and they' be chanting I
00:22:07
can't remember what the the Africans or
00:22:11
you
00:22:13
know uh but they be chanting basically
00:22:15
go black and there'd be like hundreds of
00:22:19
them out out all behind the bar wire
00:22:21
fences we come the me you know come we
00:22:24
come out and we take photos you know
00:22:27
proper photo old school photos and and
00:22:30
and um and and and sign things and their
00:22:34
jerseys and stuff like that and they
00:22:37
were
00:22:38
adamantly Pro the All Blacks you know
00:22:42
and then you walking off the bus and
00:22:45
you'd be having to go through the crowds
00:22:47
to go into Ellis Park and the big white
00:22:51
balls would be spitting on you it was
00:22:53
such a contra contradiction of energy
00:22:56
you know and um and it was kind of
00:22:59
mindblowing and you know like when we
00:23:00
got to the World Cup final you know I
00:23:02
was you I still felt part of that you
00:23:05
know it was it's I don't think there
00:23:08
ever be a World Cup final like it again
00:23:10
well actually no let me take that back I
00:23:12
don't think it'd be a World Cup like it
00:23:14
ever again you know just for the sheer
00:23:18
um growth of a country you know when
00:23:21
they say not you know when we have
00:23:23
events and they say you know they
00:23:25
actually drag the the country into the
00:23:27
doldrums you know
00:23:29
and break the the countries economically
00:23:31
and stuff for this that World Cup
00:23:35
was the rest start of you know what they
00:23:38
call the Rainbow Nation you know them
00:23:40
being one people um they've still got
00:23:42
their tumors but World Cups have meant a
00:23:46
lot to that country yeah yeah that's um
00:23:50
special and we'll get into that in
00:23:51
Greater detail um later on cuz there's
00:23:53
so much to talk about there um but just
00:23:55
a couple couple more miscellaneous buts
00:23:58
so I'm um I I spent part of my very
00:24:00
early life in um Hastings um so I think
00:24:05
our family had like a like a year long
00:24:06
past Fantasy Land you worked at Fantasy
00:24:08
Land for I worked there um when did you
00:24:10
work there was it just before it
00:24:12
switched to Splash Planet or no way
00:24:14
before it was fantasy land for a number
00:24:16
of years um so I would have been um so
00:24:18
I'd gone to UNI so i' would have been 19
00:24:21
and
00:24:23
189 and so I'd probably work for them
00:24:26
when I come back from uni
00:24:28
um yeah and my last year probably
00:24:31
was uh 92 93 maybe um I loved Fantasy A
00:24:36
lot of people won't even know what we're
00:24:37
talking about but it was like a theme
00:24:38
park in h so I just I worked on all the
00:24:40
rides and then when um some of the the
00:24:44
big uh bosses were away I sort of took
00:24:47
over as supervisor of different things
00:24:49
and um I was even Chief mechanic for a
00:24:51
little while a worry um we also uh we
00:24:56
built rebuilt one of the um um a really
00:24:59
old school ride which was the um bumper
00:25:02
cars you know like um and the cars look
00:25:04
like nauy car you know and um with a big
00:25:07
steel things around it had um had a
00:25:10
positive and negative track you know and
00:25:13
Rose all the way in a circle and you
00:25:16
know cuz the modern ones have the the
00:25:18
bar up above them and anyway we uh we
00:25:23
reassembled the whole track and you know
00:25:26
with the roof on and everything like
00:25:27
that and and then broke down all the
00:25:30
cars and uh rebuilt them and of course
00:25:33
that so I and then I was working at the
00:25:35
happy tab at the same time and I spent
00:25:38
70 hours of working for that whole
00:25:42
holiday period wow and um and I made um
00:25:47
just a little over maybe 10 grand in
00:25:49
that period just going for it and um but
00:25:52
I was also training for my sort of first
00:25:55
kickoff year with atago and so how we at
00:25:58
the time like 1819 yeah 18 yeah not
00:26:01
maybe 1920 maybe cuz 93 so yeah I don't
00:26:05
know what the mess is but um I went
00:26:09
home and I'd broken up with my
00:26:12
girlfriend and I think I was I think I
00:26:15
was a little depressed you know I
00:26:16
wouldn't say it um but the whole thing
00:26:19
had just left me feeling really empty
00:26:21
and I came
00:26:22
home and so I just went on this training
00:26:26
campaign and I was I'd
00:26:29
run uh to work which I don't know was
00:26:32
maybe five or sixks from across one side
00:26:34
of Hast to the other and um and I do the
00:26:38
work and then I run back to uh the gym
00:26:42
and I smash out crazy ass tin and then I
00:26:45
run home and Mom would have this massive
00:26:47
feed for me and I just just power it
00:26:50
down and then I'd um get in the car and
00:26:54
drive to the Happy Tav and and work as a
00:26:57
glassier or a bouncer or or on the on on
00:27:00
the bar I just did whatever they they
00:27:02
wanted me to do and then so I did that
00:27:05
for like 3
00:27:07
months and then I went back for sevens
00:27:10
uh and I was ripped to birs like like
00:27:14
but hadn't really put on any weight and
00:27:17
of course when I got to the sevens over
00:27:20
sort of a 3- we period of training with
00:27:21
the sevens where the the training sort
00:27:24
of changed a little bit got more high
00:27:26
intensity you like about speed and stuff
00:27:28
like that and I dropped from doing you
00:27:32
know way too many weights during the
00:27:34
week to just like couple of sessions a
00:27:36
week and I hadn't been drinking and the
00:27:39
boys were saying come on Crush go for a
00:27:42
couple of beers and and so we have a
00:27:45
couple of bears and so
00:27:48
suddenly um I had my body had a chance
00:27:51
to catch up I think I was overtraining
00:27:54
and then with the extra carbs from
00:27:56
alcohol I know that sounds really wrong
00:27:58
but just a bit of everything I literally
00:28:01
I put on I would say 8 to
00:28:05
10K in the space of about 3 weeks just
00:28:08
went and um which was kind of really
00:28:12
weird but I also think maybe time with
00:28:14
you know like that age group you sort of
00:28:16
thicken out you know was when I when I
00:28:18
went back home before um doing all the
00:28:21
training and and I had never been
00:28:23
dedicated to training like it was that
00:28:25
particular summer um I was was a Wai it
00:28:28
was long long and wary and stuff and
00:28:32
then yeah just where did where did that
00:28:34
drive come from at that age like to to
00:28:37
work 70 hours a week and train really as
00:28:39
well that's that's something special
00:28:41
yeah look I I look I think a little bit
00:28:43
of it was I just needed cash I needed to
00:28:46
you know like um
00:28:48
obviously um you know University the
00:28:51
first year there was a little cost of
00:28:53
University and each year the cost had
00:28:55
had ramped
00:28:57
up and I could also see the debt that I
00:28:59
was incurring and I didn't like that you
00:29:01
know like um I just felt really scary
00:29:06
and I didn't yeah just didn't like being
00:29:08
in that situation so I've always I I've
00:29:11
worked all the way through University
00:29:12
different jobs and and whatnot worked as
00:29:14
a uh Valley Industries in in denen and
00:29:18
um every holidays cuz I mean obviously
00:29:20
it was a threeyear term in those days
00:29:23
and um and so I just work those
00:29:25
mainstream holidays as a sheep with Med
00:29:28
worker you know um and and then I work
00:29:31
in the holidays but I try to keep and so
00:29:34
I just try and make these boxes of money
00:29:37
versus actually um you know trying to
00:29:40
work the whole year cuz I mean you're
00:29:42
there to study yeah and and I was okay
00:29:46
at
00:29:47
study but you know I was doing the denan
00:29:50
thing pretty well you you went back as
00:29:53
an adult and got a second degree so i'
00:29:55
I'd argue you're good at study um
00:29:58
another thing that's worth um withth
00:30:00
worth highlighting just a point to drive
00:30:02
home so back when you're working 70
00:30:03
hours a week as a like in your 18s and
00:30:06
you're um doing all this hard training
00:30:08
as well rugby was still amateur then so
00:30:10
it wasn't like that wasn't your pathway
00:30:12
out of
00:30:14
uh you you were doing it just for the
00:30:17
just for the sport not Financial reward
00:30:20
I I think i' I'd had one season where i'
00:30:23
trained I'd had I had two games for a
00:30:26
Targo one is uh too president side and I
00:30:30
think we played against um New Zealand
00:30:33
universities and then I had one game in
00:30:35
the NPC against
00:30:38
Southland and in the game against
00:30:40
Southland I just got absolutely stitched
00:30:42
up by uh Paul henison and um that kind
00:30:46
of really irked me and
00:30:50
um and and through a couple of things
00:30:53
that happened you know like
00:30:55
um you know I could Hunter he said to me
00:30:58
I want you to go and ring um Jin and
00:31:01
have a discussion I and I didn't I
00:31:03
didn't I just ignored it and then so
00:31:05
then I went home and then I sort of
00:31:07
thought about it a little bit and I
00:31:08
thought if you want to push up into the
00:31:10
next level cuz I'd always been the bench
00:31:13
warmer for a guy called Tony hump who
00:31:15
was the incumbent for a Tigo at the time
00:31:18
and um and I'd never played for any of
00:31:21
the you know like the atigo sides pre
00:31:25
pre there you know I couldn't make under
00:31:26
n intigo couldn't make uh under 21s to
00:31:29
too but I had played um you know I was
00:31:36
Top Dog of i' stayed in Hawks Bay you
00:31:38
know and so I went to all the the the
00:31:41
the national New Zealand stuff on the
00:31:43
stuff that i' done
00:31:44
in uh in hooks Bay but still couldn't
00:31:48
make any teams just you know little
00:31:51
little white boy you know um but so I
00:31:55
just thought I've got to make some
00:31:56
changes here and and I guess it
00:31:59
coincided with being pissed off at the
00:32:01
at a weir girl and and and decided you
00:32:04
know I'm going to go home and I'll show
00:32:06
everyone I'll show everyone you know
00:32:08
well that's a it's a great a great um
00:32:10
yeah like a reflection great way to deal
00:32:12
with um your heartbreak like just to BU
00:32:14
yourself into some hard work yeah well
00:32:16
when I look at it back now I was think
00:32:17
why did why did I even feel that
00:32:20
heartbreak but you know I was young I
00:32:22
didn't know any different you know
00:32:24
um also I also said to myself I was
00:32:27
never going to feel like that again you
00:32:28
know like let that sort of stuff so you
00:32:31
know learn I guess learned from that
00:32:34
that moment too you know like there's
00:32:37
even when you're feeling how you're
00:32:38
feeling there's
00:32:40
opportunities to to negate that you know
00:32:44
um and ironically it was through work
00:32:48
and training that that and and and I was
00:32:50
really enjoying the work too you know
00:32:52
like um you go obviously at Fantasy Land
00:32:55
dealing with people and stuff like that
00:32:57
but I was also so rebuilding stuff you
00:32:59
know it's lovely to um create or restore
00:33:03
stuff you know was it was a really cool
00:33:05
job that that that summer and then at
00:33:08
night you're just around people that are
00:33:11
just wanted to have a good time you know
00:33:13
like so it's fun and I love love being
00:33:16
glassy you know like the working the do
00:33:19
got got it's ups and downs and working
00:33:21
the bar is just manic but when you're
00:33:24
glassy you you're out and you can talk
00:33:26
to people you can pick stuff up you know
00:33:29
you can socialize it it was it was a
00:33:32
good it was yeah it was a good really
00:33:35
good period I loved it it was nice and
00:33:38
um just a couple more of these
00:33:39
miscellaneous bits um you once called
00:33:41
Paul Henry a [ __ ] on live
00:33:44
TV was was this after you got um voted
00:33:47
off Dancing With the stff yeah it was it
00:33:48
was oh just seemed so wrong I mean he to
00:33:52
be honest he a great I don't know how he
00:33:54
used to say stuff about the girls you
00:33:57
know then
00:33:58
and don't get me
00:33:59
wrong I'm probably as bad as most males
00:34:02
you know in that respect but he just
00:34:06
stay stuff on public television and I
00:34:08
just go that's just not right and anyway
00:34:10
and he made a few comments about Rachel
00:34:13
I mean she was a be all right she was a
00:34:16
sexy looking woman you know she was
00:34:18
beautiful she was attractive she she um
00:34:21
wore um clothing that accentuated you
00:34:25
know who she and she's a dancer you know
00:34:27
like that's that's what they do that's
00:34:29
their their bread and butter they they
00:34:30
wear clothes that um present them in in
00:34:33
a in an
00:34:35
attractive uh D I say it feminine light
00:34:39
and um I don't know if that's even PC to
00:34:41
say it like that but that's the way she
00:34:45
was and then he made a CP about her her
00:34:47
boobs and it it just really annoyed me
00:34:49
cuz I saw saw her roll her eyes around
00:34:51
and I thought H you
00:34:53
know mate if you've been a [ __ ]
00:34:55
you've been a [ __ ] you know simple
00:34:58
as that and um ra ra was stucked she was
00:35:03
you know like she you know she said to
00:35:06
me afterwards that was awesome so um I
00:35:09
didn't realize it was going to make such
00:35:10
a h but anyway no it was it was good you
00:35:13
yeah you called him out I suppose you
00:35:15
were woke before woke was a thing yeah
00:35:18
well not even not even woke Just sh
00:35:21
shiver yeah may maybe like I just it
00:35:24
just was wrong manate I I I just
00:35:26
wouldn't make CP about someone's
00:35:29
breasts ever you know like so publicly
00:35:35
in front of you know and and he knew it
00:35:38
too you know but I mean he's always been
00:35:42
good at um poking the beer poking the
00:35:45
beer yeah absolutely um you were once
00:35:49
the rugby coach of U Machu Walters from
00:35:52
660 yeah yeah yeah yeah those boys are
00:35:55
um yeah uh Eli PA and aani um yeah they
00:36:01
they uh when was that so this was when
00:36:03
you were back in back studying studying
00:36:05
phys theapy inen as an adult post your
00:36:08
rugby career yeah so I went I went back
00:36:10
to UNI um decided I want to be a Physio
00:36:13
and
00:36:15
um uh John Leslie was said he was going
00:36:18
to coach the um the Cults at that time
00:36:22
and I and he asked if I'd do it and I
00:36:24
said yeah I can do that that sounds good
00:36:26
and so
00:36:28
um he was he coach uh definitely he
00:36:33
coach uh and I was the um the but I was
00:36:38
you know looking after the Fords you
00:36:39
know he wanted me to look after the
00:36:40
Fords and and I reckon we had a real
00:36:43
good uh good C cop bad cop sort of
00:36:45
scenario going you know like he he was
00:36:47
serious about things and I'd lighten it
00:36:49
up and then you know when I was serious
00:36:51
he lighten it up you know so uh we
00:36:55
worked really well together and but with
00:36:56
the one thing that we really wanted the
00:36:59
boys to understand is how much fun
00:37:02
University rugby is and we wanted them
00:37:05
to uh Play Hard uh train hard and party
00:37:10
hard you know we wanted
00:37:12
them well I look like when if whenever I
00:37:15
talk about my time in University um
00:37:17
especially when I was playing University
00:37:19
rugby it's magical it's so like you
00:37:23
can't put it in any other words it's
00:37:25
magical like you you you're playing with
00:37:28
guys who likeminded who fun you're all
00:37:32
doing the same thing together at Uni you
00:37:34
know different obviously different parts
00:37:36
of but you you're in an Institute
00:37:38
together there and um and and it's all
00:37:43
about just enjoying the moment and we at
00:37:47
the my first year at University we had
00:37:50
Tony Gilbert who became uh later on a
00:37:53
coach and yeah Highlanders coached for
00:37:55
many years and go gone blank and this is
00:37:59
that's
00:38:03
um sorry and this is what happens I just
00:38:06
lose um and he was a great man passed
00:38:10
away and um not Gordon no preg Gordon
00:38:14
preg Gordon and I'm feeling embarrassed
00:38:17
I can remember the his wife's name here
00:38:18
on but that's it um anyway probably fix
00:38:22
it with AI or something yeah it'll come
00:38:23
back it'll come um it'll come back I was
00:38:26
under pressure I just pulled it couldn't
00:38:27
pull it out but um they were they were a
00:38:31
great you know they coaching peer that
00:38:34
just encompassed just about enjoying
00:38:37
your time together as a team you know
00:38:40
and so and then I went from there and
00:38:42
then they coached us later on with
00:38:44
University uh a and I and I did three
00:38:48
years with them and we had a three Peak
00:38:50
win and it was all about you know the
00:38:54
the time within the team and playing
00:38:56
really good brand of code and then going
00:38:59
out and and sharing the joy of it
00:39:02
afterwards and so when Macho and and the
00:39:06
boys came in um we really really wanted
00:39:10
them to have that too you know and so um
00:39:16
you know we did things that we did at
00:39:19
University with them and and they seem
00:39:22
to love it what like like Court sessions
00:39:24
is that what you mean we did court
00:39:26
sessions yeah well although they the
00:39:28
first couple of Court sessions that they
00:39:30
ran uh John and I um you know we we
00:39:33
finished it and we did it a couple of
00:39:35
times and and and we were walking home
00:39:37
afterwards and I was speaking to jail
00:39:40
and I say I geez that was pretty awful
00:39:44
wasn't it he goes he goes that terrible
00:39:48
that terrible I don't understand at all
00:39:50
and so anyway the next time we organized
00:39:52
a court session he he made us take it
00:39:56
and so we set up the the the you know
00:39:59
how it's meant to be you know like it's
00:40:01
it's a serious Affair but we're going to
00:40:03
have fun when we're having fun and you
00:40:06
know and so the adjudication because
00:40:08
there's no talking Out Of Tune you you
00:40:10
only get when you've got the stage you
00:40:12
can talk how long you want to talk or
00:40:15
unless it's a a set uh limit to your
00:40:18
talk time but um but the judges are
00:40:20
control of everything and um and if you
00:40:25
penalized or you Abus that um the judges
00:40:29
come down as hard as they feel that they
00:40:31
should and often the team ends up it
00:40:35
grows that
00:40:36
discipline cuz they had no discipline
00:40:40
and uh so next thing we
00:40:43
know um they don't want they don't want
00:40:46
the the boys to play they want us to run
00:40:48
the court sessions but we we're trying
00:40:50
to install it in them to get them to
00:40:52
grow it so I don't know how many we
00:40:54
ended up taking with the boys but um
00:40:57
eventually they got the hang of it and
00:40:59
you know and but what a lot of people
00:41:01
don't get about court sessions it's also
00:41:03
a chance to a the negative stuff in a
00:41:07
safe environment you know where a young
00:41:11
man can put his hand up and
00:41:13
say I made a I made a mistake you know
00:41:17
should you know whether it was not
00:41:18
tuning out the training or not being
00:41:20
there or or stuffing some up in the game
00:41:23
or whatever it's a safe environment put
00:41:24
his hand on and the boys the boys just
00:41:28
will go yay you know you you've done
00:41:31
you're awesome you brought it out and
00:41:32
they'll patch you on the back and then
00:41:33
you're back in the fold you know you're
00:41:35
not just clearing the air clearing the
00:41:38
air and and um but it was also a time to
00:41:41
Champion the good stuff as well you know
00:41:44
and like really make a a song and a
00:41:47
dance around some some of the
00:41:50
achievements that happen cuz and they
00:41:52
they weren't always about the rugby it
00:41:55
might be you know something that have
00:41:57
been going on in the in in in the real
00:41:59
world and they've they've achieved
00:42:00
something and the boys have bring them
00:42:02
in and celebrated that achievement as
00:42:05
the team you know and
00:42:07
so uh it was awesome and you know Maru
00:42:11
didn't want to speak uh sing in front of
00:42:13
everyone but everybody knew he had a
00:42:15
good voice and in the end he was made to
00:42:17
bring his guitar and and play really
00:42:20
yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah and and
00:42:23
Lead things did you Did you sort of see
00:42:25
him grow in confidence over yeah
00:42:27
definitely definitely definitely and
00:42:29
then
00:42:30
like he just you could see he didn't
00:42:32
want to I it's all good it's all good
00:42:34
too shy too yeah yeah and but he he'd do
00:42:37
it under jur and then and then it then
00:42:40
it became I well I mean maybe other
00:42:42
people saw it differently but that's
00:42:45
what it felt like for for myself
00:42:46
watching it and but he was an awesome
00:42:49
part of of that team and and singing
00:42:51
songs cuz I can never remember all the
00:42:53
words of songs anyway so I just yell
00:42:55
along yeah I let's talk about that cuz
00:42:58
you've mentioned the memory things thing
00:42:59
a couple of times um yeah some other
00:43:03
injuries like from the well I was going
00:43:04
to say from the neck down but there's a
00:43:06
lot of there's 500 facial stitches
00:43:08
there's um there's uh a left ankle
00:43:10
reconstruction elbow cleanouts broken
00:43:13
toes and fingers broken wrists Rotator
00:43:16
CF tears a broken nose and jaw hip tears
00:43:19
yeah 500 stitches to the face and head
00:43:22
um how how are you in the mornings now
00:43:25
like when you get out of bed uh first
00:43:26
CLE couple minutes is it slow to warm up
00:43:28
or some days is really oh I've got um
00:43:31
from got given a be through from uh
00:43:34
slone and they're um oh man that's like
00:43:39
it's all I can say is get a good bed
00:43:43
that like every time I climb in
00:43:45
it's you know and um
00:43:49
I when I roll out and put my feet on the
00:43:52
floor that that's I I never know how
00:43:55
sore they going to be
00:43:57
day by day so winter it's a bit sorer
00:43:59
than summer yeah well it also depends on
00:44:01
how much weight I'm carrying you know
00:44:03
like I'm at the moment I'm I'm probably
00:44:06
about 8 kg over what I what what feels
00:44:09
most comfortable and that's my own fault
00:44:11
I've been um through the winter you know
00:44:14
rugby invited to to drink more than I
00:44:17
normally drink and um and and then when
00:44:20
you when you're drinking you tend to eat
00:44:23
more than you eat normally eat as well
00:44:25
so
00:44:27
I think you know managing your weight as
00:44:29
you get older makes a massive difference
00:44:31
especially if you're carrying um stuff
00:44:33
that's just not great like my ankles
00:44:35
when I was 33 I spraying my ankles and
00:44:37
the St John's people I was riding I was
00:44:40
racing motorbikes and and uh and a
00:44:44
highight and flipped over and landed on
00:44:46
my heels and the St John's people said
00:44:47
oh we really need you to go to the the
00:44:49
an and I just thought that sprained and
00:44:51
so I went in and they were just sprained
00:44:54
but doctor comes out and uh and she see
00:44:58
and she sees me and she goes oh my
00:45:00
goodness and I went what do you mean oh
00:45:03
my goodness and and she said she says oh
00:45:06
I was expecting you to be an
00:45:08
80-year-old and uh and and I says what
00:45:11
do you mean she says oh just been
00:45:13
looking at your ankles and they're just
00:45:16
a mess you know um and you know went
00:45:20
looking if we jump back I can understand
00:45:22
why when I jump back you know um St wals
00:45:27
did the original reconstruction surgery
00:45:30
and that I'd only played
00:45:32
one season I hadn't even finished the
00:45:34
season um I was walking we were in
00:45:36
France and I was walking back to start a
00:45:39
game and I hadn't straet my ankles I was
00:45:41
going to get a cal massage and then get
00:45:42
them
00:45:43
stra and um I stood in a pothole and
00:45:48
rolled my ankle and blew it out and um
00:45:53
uh and just went home got sent sent home
00:45:56
10 days later
00:45:57
you you injured yourself like before
00:45:59
before the anthemist before the hacker
00:46:01
before before anything yeah so I didn't
00:46:03
even so it was a it was a midweek game
00:46:06
and uh needed to play that that I'd
00:46:09
injured it previously and um in the
00:46:13
final against Oakland uh for NBC and
00:46:16
then we've gone away to France and they
00:46:19
elected to take me and everything was
00:46:22
going to plan I was back I done two full
00:46:24
trainings and you know I was
00:46:27
and this was my going to be my return
00:46:29
game to see that if I was okay ready to
00:46:31
play at a test level again and just
00:46:35
ironically stood in a pole and um that's
00:46:38
I I mean part of me thinks that's
00:46:41
hilarious but there's a big part of me
00:46:43
that say [ __ ] I was laughing and I
00:46:46
was crying and I was having all the all
00:46:49
of the uh emotions that you can have in
00:46:51
those situations and then came back and
00:46:54
Stu Walsh who was always going to do a
00:46:57
little clear out cuz i' i' broken a
00:46:58
little lug off it's called an ostr Gman
00:47:01
off the back of your ankle and it was
00:47:03
giving me some jerp and they were just
00:47:04
going to clean it out it's like you're
00:47:06
back in playing rugby in two weeks once
00:47:08
it's cleaned out and um so that was
00:47:11
going to be at the end of the season but
00:47:12
I'd destroy my ankle and so they
00:47:16
effectively did four ankle uh four
00:47:18
operations in one uh about 4 and 1 half
00:47:21
hours on the on the table and um I but I
00:47:26
reckon about a year year after it or
00:47:28
maybe about that duration St said to me
00:47:31
we weren't sure you were going to make
00:47:32
it back we were all having bets whether
00:47:34
you were going to make it back and I was
00:47:37
oh I'm glad you didn't tell me
00:47:40
that but and then when I think about the
00:47:43
rehab back from that injury as well was
00:47:46
like I had no um I had no support there
00:47:50
wasn't someone um taking me to do physio
00:47:53
every day I remember my first my my
00:47:55
first day of rehab was when I was
00:47:56
allowed to get the boot of I walked
00:47:58
around a block the second day I W walked
00:48:01
around it twice the next day I walked
00:48:03
around it three times and then then it
00:48:04
was two blocks and then three blocks and
00:48:07
then I was running and then they said
00:48:09
you need to be back on this date and
00:48:12
then and then so uh for playing Super
00:48:15
which was the last three super uh games
00:48:17
I think and so played about I don't know
00:48:22
start or started the game got about 60
00:48:24
minutes into the game and I twe twak my
00:48:27
ankle and I freaked out you know just
00:48:29
went oh you know and so I came off and
00:48:32
then I went and saw The Specialist and
00:48:35
um he said n no it's fine I think you
00:48:39
know maybe a bit of Scar isssues what
00:48:41
give you the pain but um you know cuz
00:48:44
you you're worried about it you you've
00:48:46
already destroyed it and so I
00:48:49
was that's awesome and then um I was
00:48:53
just about to walk out the door and I
00:48:54
turn around and I said to the specialist
00:48:56
I said oh
00:48:58
um I said John can you can you uh can
00:49:01
you can you have a look at my
00:49:03
wrist and anyway cuz it's been really
00:49:06
sore I don't I don't remember doing
00:49:07
anything to it it's been really sore
00:49:09
anyway poke and P it and he goes oh I
00:49:12
think you've broken there and so sent me
00:49:14
upstairs for X-ray and it was broken so
00:49:18
broken the whole lug off the side of the
00:49:20
the
00:49:21
rest and of course I'm thinking what do
00:49:23
I do now you know I've I've
00:49:27
you know if I want to be an all black
00:49:28
I've got to play so I played a whole
00:49:30
season with a broken arm when I finished
00:49:31
the season it was still broken you know
00:49:34
um yeah just like taping it up yeah I I
00:49:37
wore a I had a little cast thing that I
00:49:39
used to um it was hard that stopped the
00:49:42
you know cuz those days people used to
00:49:44
stand on
00:49:47
you you know and and uh so uh it justed
00:49:52
you know just protected that so yeah
00:49:54
that hole in 96 yeah it was wasn't great
00:49:57
um so you so you played 54 test for the
00:50:00
old blacks how many of how many of them
00:50:02
do you feel like you would have been
00:50:03
playing at
00:50:07
100% or did you always have something
00:50:09
going on uh no I I there was times what
00:50:12
I was 100% but if I think you know like
00:50:16
where I was at my best was that first
00:50:19
year cuz I I was never the same I
00:50:21
couldn't run like I don't know I reckon
00:50:24
it knocked 30% of my speed off me um so
00:50:27
I just changed my game my game I'd
00:50:30
always got over the ball and picked the
00:50:32
ball up which was unique I guess in
00:50:34
those days um but my whole real premise
00:50:39
was on about uh support play you know
00:50:42
was about getting to where I needed to
00:50:44
get and trying to crop up in situations
00:50:46
where I shouldn't crop up and so that's
00:50:50
that's kind of what I did and then I
00:50:52
realized couldn't really do that and I
00:50:54
was starting to think well what else can
00:50:55
I do in my game that it's kind of um
00:50:58
pretty strong and and then I thought all
00:51:00
right well I'm going to be on the
00:51:02
breakdown I'm going to be that dude
00:51:04
that's a pain in the ass and steal ball
00:51:06
and you know slow stuff down and get
00:51:10
people W winging at me yeah you I know I
00:51:14
know very little about rugby but your
00:51:16
your position is the same as um Rich
00:51:17
mccc's position was was he a cheat
00:51:20
everyone everyone from every other
00:51:22
country outside of New Zealand says he
00:51:23
was a cheat no as an open side flank
00:51:26
someone that was good what you look mate
00:51:29
I had dudes um tning up with a
00:51:35
computer um and showing it to the
00:51:38
referee before games and saying look
00:51:40
look at what Josh gell is doing there
00:51:41
was a massive whoar about it which I
00:51:45
thought I thought was pretty disgusting
00:51:47
you know sure you have the conversation
00:51:49
but you don't T up with video
00:51:52
evidence
00:51:54
F anyway uh um anyway look so in terms
00:51:59
of Richie was he a cheat no he just
00:52:02
understood the the rules really well and
00:52:05
applied it to the
00:52:07
in of uh of being penalized you know and
00:52:11
that's a really good number seven to be
00:52:13
honest you know especially in the modern
00:52:16
game I mean it's and it's getting harder
00:52:18
and harder you know like poor old Sam
00:52:20
with you know um you know yellow cards
00:52:24
red cards and and and and you know
00:52:28
that's not him he's not doing that stuff
00:52:31
on intentionally he's just he's pushing
00:52:34
his body to the limit to to be in the
00:52:37
best position to do his job
00:52:40
and you can't adjust as quick as they
00:52:44
you know they say you need to you know
00:52:47
like if you're if you're tracking
00:52:49
someone especially want to think of Sam
00:52:51
if you're tracking someone and you're
00:52:53
thinking right he's going to end up over
00:52:55
there I'm going to make a sight on t T
00:52:56
there and so you're not going down into
00:52:59
your tackle position yet cuz you're
00:53:01
thinking you're going to make the tackle
00:53:02
there and then the dude suddenly steps
00:53:04
back at you and you actually can't get
00:53:07
out of the way you're there you know he
00:53:10
steep back into you um and you there's
00:53:13
no way you can get down in that time
00:53:15
you're not expecting the step because
00:53:16
you're thinking you make tackle just
00:53:17
over there um yeah look the game
00:53:23
is it it's it's I I can't I can't work
00:53:28
out how they managed to ref it they've
00:53:30
created so much issue around every
00:53:34
situation and I know they're trying to
00:53:36
do it for safety reasons and stuff
00:53:38
but you know like a seat belt tackle you
00:53:41
know why do we have seat
00:53:44
belts to save people from breaking their
00:53:46
necks and their their shoulders and
00:53:48
their arms and stuff like that for
00:53:50
safety goes across the seat belt so how
00:53:52
is the seat belt tickle dangerous
00:53:54
obviously if you go around the neck
00:53:57
holder from ball game yeah there was
00:54:01
another quote from you I read it says um
00:54:03
you know nothing works my brain doesn't
00:54:06
work as good my body doesn't work as
00:54:08
good I don't have all those little
00:54:10
Nuance nuances that gave me an edge
00:54:12
anymore the the the brain thing I've
00:54:14
noticed youve paused a couple of times
00:54:15
and to be fair I think a lot of that is
00:54:17
just when we had our 50s but did were
00:54:19
there times in your career where you
00:54:21
look back now and you think you know cuz
00:54:23
there's the the whole hi thing now head
00:54:25
injury assessment um back then if you
00:54:28
knocked your head and you felt groggy
00:54:30
would you try and stay on yeah was no no
00:54:33
reason to come off um look I think I
00:54:37
know more about it now than I did that
00:54:39
back then you know like and I mean
00:54:41
that's the whole premise of these court
00:54:43
cases that are going around um was did
00:54:47
the administration know about it and I
00:54:50
don't know that'll come out in the in
00:54:52
the Woodwork when it does but for me um
00:54:56
um I had a a major concussion about 6
00:54:58
years ago where I was knocked out in the
00:55:00
water um didn't know where I was um when
00:55:04
I kind of came to in the water um
00:55:08
apparently people have been pulling my
00:55:09
head out and what were you surfing yeah
00:55:11
I was surfing and um I just remember
00:55:14
lying in the water thinking oh that hurt
00:55:16
I just need a moment like at the bottom
00:55:18
of a rock just need a moment get up I'm
00:55:20
going to get up and I know I need to
00:55:22
take a breath of air but at the moment
00:55:23
I'm sweet I just need a moment and uh
00:55:26
when I came up and sort of climbed on my
00:55:28
board and and I started paddling back
00:55:31
into the current to go back out cuz in
00:55:33
my brain eyes was getting another way
00:55:34
you know I'm just taking a hit but yeah
00:55:36
I'll be right by the time I get back out
00:55:38
and I was looking at uh the cliffs and I
00:55:41
was going denan doesn't have Cliffs like
00:55:44
that I was at Peart so it took me going
00:55:49
back in uh took me about I don't know 40
00:55:52
minutes getting re you know changed and
00:55:55
and getting in the car and thinking
00:55:57
didn't feel dizzy but I just couldn't
00:56:00
work out where I was and then I worked
00:56:02
out that I was in
00:56:04
Oakland and then it was like why am I in
00:56:06
Oakland and then I worked out that I was
00:56:08
living in Oakland and I didn't really
00:56:11
remember where I was living till I got
00:56:12
top of the P Hill and uh and I got to
00:56:17
the top and you know went into order oh
00:56:19
yeah I live just down the road here so
00:56:22
um jeez that's not great no I know and
00:56:24
then by the time I got there um you know
00:56:27
it's like it was dark and it was
00:56:29
probably 9:00 at night I came and and my
00:56:33
neck had seized up as well couldn't move
00:56:35
it and so I said to BR I said to my wife
00:56:38
bran um I'm not good I think you going
00:56:41
have take me to the hospital so she run
00:56:44
got friend around to come look after the
00:56:46
kids and took me to the
00:56:47
hospital the neck was uh as poked it's
00:56:50
got lots of issues but I hadn't done
00:56:53
anything too major so I had fractured
00:56:54
anything that are you worried about um
00:56:57
Dementia or anything like that or is
00:56:58
there a link between yeah so look yeah
00:57:01
probably I've kind of didn't even finish
00:57:03
that story in some respect so obviously
00:57:05
went through the whole process cuz I had
00:57:07
a bit of a personality change over that
00:57:09
period and my wife started to get
00:57:10
worried about it just I was just
00:57:12
reactive you know I just couldn't deal
00:57:14
with stuff and um
00:57:18
and Bonnie says we got to go and get
00:57:20
checked out and so we went got checked
00:57:22
out and everything came out pretty a
00:57:24
okay but the thing that did out was that
00:57:27
um when I was speaking to uh concussive
00:57:30
physio she was explaining why I was
00:57:33
getting so worked out because I have a
00:57:36
tracking
00:57:37
issue and so my eyes and it's real
00:57:40
common uh for people that have
00:57:42
concussion so my eyes when they're
00:57:45
tracking each eye has an image that it's
00:57:47
tracking and the eyes um put them in an
00:57:52
angle that lays the image over each
00:57:55
other like
00:57:56
like that and for
00:57:58
me um when I'm tracking it sometimes
00:58:01
does that and well actually does it a
00:58:03
lot does it HS and so I spent about four
00:58:06
months five months trying to train it
00:58:08
and it just gave up in the end I just
00:58:09
got too frustrated was just and so I
00:58:12
just I just enjoy the Halo that you
00:58:16
have and for some people that's a good
00:58:18
thing yeah wow and uh but the the thing
00:58:22
that H at it is you know when she
00:58:24
explained all this stuff to me I used
00:58:26
have a thing I called it the gong so you
00:58:28
go into a situation you go to get the
00:58:30
ball and you get smashed and you can
00:58:33
feel the hits coming so sometimes you
00:58:36
might close your eyes and but or but
00:58:39
maybe sometimes those contacts were a
00:58:41
little mini
00:58:42
blackout and you come around and you
00:58:44
feel normal you can compute and
00:58:45
everything like that but you physically
00:58:49
feel in
00:58:51
here like someone's just hit a giant
00:58:54
gong behind
00:58:56
you know and I'd get I'd have one of
00:58:59
those a month you know without fail and
00:59:03
um so the tracking thing started cuz I
00:59:07
used to talk about the Halo thing when I
00:59:09
was about 20 and I had some tests and
00:59:12
stuff like that but no one ever really
00:59:14
went down the brain route they went down
00:59:16
the neck route and as it works out when
00:59:18
you treat someone's neck often when
00:59:20
they've got head concussion through
00:59:22
impact the neck treatment relieves a lot
00:59:25
of the concussion
00:59:26
um symptoms just by the general work so
00:59:31
I can understand why the doctors
00:59:32
everyone went that way
00:59:34
but that means you know like since I was
00:59:37
like 21 22 I've had that concussive
00:59:41
stuff all the way through my
00:59:43
career but soon as someone explained it
00:59:47
to
00:59:47
me and so your brain is going there's a
00:59:51
problem there's a problem there's a
00:59:52
problem and
00:59:54
so um um it's trying to fix the problem
00:59:57
and its reaction is flight or fright you
01:00:00
know and so
01:00:02
they your C levels are ramped all the
01:00:06
time and you're ready to go and you
01:00:08
don't know that and I've always been a
01:00:11
cruzy dude and so to be reactive was
01:00:13
kind of or
01:00:15
impatient um yeah just to get frustrated
01:00:18
or F the handle e yeah yeah yeah and
01:00:20
that's what my wife was talking about
01:00:21
cuz she'd never seen that and um but as
01:00:25
soon as and and even br will say this
01:00:29
like as soon as the physio explained it
01:00:31
to me and I understood
01:00:33
it and they ruled out the other stuff
01:00:36
like dementia and stuff like that um I
01:00:40
mean that's still something maybe for
01:00:41
the future picture but at the moment
01:00:44
there was nothing uh that they could
01:00:46
find and but as soon as I understood it
01:00:49
it was like the volume KN just got
01:00:51
turned the opposite
01:00:53
way you know and um I went from being
01:00:57
that really reactive to you know more my
01:01:01
normal self and don't get me wrong I
01:01:03
still struggle you know but I'm able to
01:01:05
go well I know why you're getting fired
01:01:07
up so I can let that go slight a bit my
01:01:10
kids might not say that
01:01:12
though so yeah so um one of your sort of
01:01:15
I guess trademarks I guess was your was
01:01:17
the head gear that you used to wear was
01:01:19
that um was that to protect your head or
01:01:21
your ears what's the so originally you
01:01:24
know when I said when I first started
01:01:26
getting those symptoms as a young man um
01:01:29
they decided was the neck and the the
01:01:32
people that were dealing with it
01:01:34
suggested well why don't you try some
01:01:35
head gear and see if that helps um
01:01:38
cushion the blows transferring down your
01:01:40
neck you know cuz you know you everyone
01:01:44
remembers Sam Kane going into contact
01:01:46
points you know like and how he hits and
01:01:49
and some of the knocks that they're Tak
01:01:51
to the face and the head and all all at
01:01:53
the same time and so I well yeah I'll
01:01:56
give it a go so I wore hi gear for maybe
01:01:58
I reckon about three or four
01:02:00
games and I went ah this isn't really
01:02:03
working and then um I didn't wear it and
01:02:07
the next thing I knew I had my I had 15
01:02:10
stitches in my head I had like every
01:02:13
time felt like my I played maybe about
01:02:15
three or four games without it and it
01:02:16
felt like my head was going to explode
01:02:18
after games just cuz I was playing at
01:02:20
that top level again now you know and
01:02:22
and it was just massive and and I
01:02:26
thought I didn't have that for those
01:02:28
other four games you know but I was
01:02:30
playing at the same level so I thought
01:02:32
oh I'll try wearing it again instantly
01:02:34
made a difference you know so it just
01:02:36
takes the bruising that you get straight
01:02:39
to your skull and stuff like that it was
01:02:41
never going to oh I might make a tiny
01:02:45
difference soften the blow somewhat yeah
01:02:47
somewhat but if you're in a concussive
01:02:49
situation you're always going to that's
01:02:51
going to happen it's not going to limit
01:02:53
it might decrease the the level of it I
01:02:56
even did a um a little mini study on it
01:02:59
when I was at at FID school to see if it
01:03:01
was a um thing cuz you know you it's
01:03:04
just what you did but it became a big
01:03:06
big part of you didn't it like you could
01:03:08
identify you by the by the head gear and
01:03:10
and then there was the um the yeah the
01:03:12
known nukes thing yeah um yeah what year
01:03:15
was
01:03:16
that Cy uh so the no nukes thing must
01:03:21
have been
01:03:24
97 no maybe 98 98 cuz they were still
01:03:28
testing yeah in obviously in the
01:03:31
Pacific and um we would have been going
01:03:35
over oh
01:03:37
no oh yeah it must have been so you were
01:03:41
well as you be so you first met the team
01:03:43
in 95 so you were sort of well
01:03:44
established um but where did that come
01:03:47
from that sort of social social
01:03:48
conscience or the oh I don't I don't
01:03:51
think I had a I don't think I was that
01:03:53
way of mind but I was PR liberal and
01:03:56
thinking and um you know and around lots
01:03:59
of different people from you know I'd
01:04:03
say unique backgrounds and and and
01:04:06
thought processes and thinking just that
01:04:08
Varsity environment yeah a whole of
01:04:10
Varsity environment and um and my
01:04:13
girlfriend and I we were sitting there
01:04:16
we were reading the newspaper one night
01:04:19
um was
01:04:21
newspapers yeah yeah free internet yeah
01:04:24
so um and
01:04:26
uh and and I just sit around I I can't
01:04:30
believe that you know you've got French
01:04:33
people your people because you're a part
01:04:36
of
01:04:36
Polynesia and you're testing in your
01:04:41
people's back backyard if and you're
01:04:43
saying it's not safe how can why aren't
01:04:45
you doing it in France France you know
01:04:47
like not not not in the PO you know it
01:04:50
just didn't make any sense and of course
01:04:52
we're all still uh I think agree d by
01:04:56
the whole um you know when they come
01:04:59
over andow warbow Warrior thing you know
01:05:02
so it you know so there was a little bit
01:05:05
of Ence there and so we were sitting
01:05:07
there and then um anyway I just got a
01:05:10
new set of head gear um through
01:05:14
Canterbury and and I sort of I said to
01:05:19
her chicky why do we put a no no nukes
01:05:21
uh symbol on so we we were making sure
01:05:24
we got we went around trying to make
01:05:25
sure we got the the right symbol uh you
01:05:28
know and have it the right way up and
01:05:29
all that sort of stuff and then so it's
01:05:31
not a Mercedes ben yeah yeah yeah and
01:05:33
then um and then we and we had a twink
01:05:36
remember the twink pins you know and we
01:05:38
did it all with twink and by the pin or
01:05:40
the bottle with the little brush the
01:05:42
squeezy squeezy squeezy um you know with
01:05:45
the dot and everything like that
01:05:46
correction fluid yeah yeah yeah yeah and
01:05:47
so we we we did it we didn't do too bad
01:05:50
a job but um and we're laughing with it
01:05:53
was it was a fun project project with
01:05:55
the girlfriend and and and we laughed
01:05:58
about it and anyway I wore it uh in the
01:06:02
I think it was a shield challenge maybe
01:06:05
against um
01:06:08
wo and I don't know was going to C such
01:06:12
a you know you must have no I didn't I
01:06:15
didn't but this was a time where there
01:06:17
was no sort of individuality oh I know
01:06:20
but I mean like I was in a team where
01:06:23
everybody was individual you know like
01:06:25
Gordon Hunter and this is this is what I
01:06:28
always wish he got a chance at the big
01:06:29
job you know he was so unique and then
01:06:33
any any any player that you speak to who
01:06:35
had anything to do with Gordy will will
01:06:37
say good stuff and that you know you
01:06:40
talked to a few of the Blues boys now he
01:06:42
might not have been the greatest coach
01:06:44
coach but just for managing people
01:06:48
getting them on song with a plan and a
01:06:52
and a and a and a direction of things he
01:06:54
used people around around him to help bu
01:06:57
all there he he just knew how to to work
01:07:00
people and um so I I never felt that
01:07:05
anyone was going to and and when the
01:07:07
boys saw it you know at um you know we
01:07:10
were in the team room pre the game and
01:07:12
stuff like that they didn't give it the
01:07:14
stuff they thought it was hilarious you
01:07:15
know we always thought it was a big bit
01:07:17
of a bit of a joke but but a an
01:07:19
important statement you know the
01:07:22
Pacific's our backyard not not not
01:07:25
France ansers and
01:07:27
so I wore it and I got a letter telling
01:07:32
me Oh from who like the nzu yeah yeah
01:07:35
yeah all of that and I still remember um
01:07:40
so then we were going cuz at the end of
01:07:42
that season um that NPC we were going to
01:07:46
France so yeah I think it must have been
01:07:49
99 yeah and okay so you were a big star
01:07:52
at the time this was like Peak Josh
01:07:53
corfield yeah yeah and and then
01:07:57
um
01:08:00
and uh tree assisted me well this is um
01:08:03
s Colin me Po yeah I say he was all
01:08:06
black manager I wonder if it was earlier
01:08:08
was it earlier was it when I went over
01:08:10
and got injured it must it might have
01:08:12
been earlier sorry it may have it may
01:08:13
have been earlier so no I was just uh
01:08:16
you know but I was playing in a you know
01:08:19
with a really good at Taro side and all
01:08:20
that sort so it might have been yeah so
01:08:22
the end of year 95 I don't know it's
01:08:26
yeah I'm sorry I I just I can't pick
01:08:29
where it where it fits in but I think
01:08:31
the the the earlier the earlier into
01:08:32
your black career it is assuming it
01:08:34
happened early on the more impressive
01:08:35
this is that you had the the balls or
01:08:38
the carage the one thing that I do
01:08:39
remember and I while that a swear on
01:08:41
this thing course so uh so says to me he
01:08:45
goes uh new georia
01:08:48
look look I understand what you're doing
01:08:50
with the head gear and stuff like that
01:08:52
you know you know but I don't want to
01:08:54
[ __ ] see it
01:08:56
at all for the rest of the year and I
01:08:59
went oh yeah okay and then and then he
01:09:01
goes he goes we get to France I don't
01:09:03
give a
01:09:04
[ __ ] you actually look like Colin Ms
01:09:07
when you do the impression it's amazing
01:09:10
wow you know and and and and so he got
01:09:13
it but he was just saying look I don't I
01:09:15
don't need any trouble while while we're
01:09:17
here in New Zealand let's just go under
01:09:19
the radar but when we get so I actually
01:09:21
had one already made up in black and
01:09:23
white to go to to France
01:09:25
you know to play against uh the
01:09:28
French um ironically I've never um never
01:09:32
got to play in France oh yeah so that
01:09:35
must be around the same time that you
01:09:36
had a like a moon boot on and you had
01:09:38
the no nukes yeah yeah so it would have
01:09:39
been 95 right right in the 95 so that
01:09:42
Moon boot with the um the no nukes logo
01:09:44
on that happened after you got that
01:09:46
injury yeah 95 sorry man is that where
01:09:49
is that where you um you um cried in
01:09:52
front of colum Maids oh yeah yeah yeah
01:09:54
yeah I've got a I've got a book out
01:09:56
there from um this it's this amazing
01:09:59
beautiful coffee table book that Rick
01:10:00
celito was behind called um this I know
01:10:03
is true and it's like profiles of some
01:10:05
new zealanders and Colin Ms is in there
01:10:07
and he's talking about the last time he
01:10:08
cried and he thinks it was when he had
01:10:10
like hooping cough when he was seven or
01:10:11
eight years old so the man never cried
01:10:14
so you oh yeah so you you need to
01:10:17
understand the situation so I've just
01:10:19
blow my ankle and I hop into the
01:10:22
changing room and they freak out and and
01:10:25
they Usher me into a side room uh just
01:10:29
you know next to the um changing room
01:10:31
and cuz the boys are all getting ready
01:10:33
to play the game and we were all jammed
01:10:36
into this tiny room like smaller than
01:10:37
this room and uh I'm sitting on the seat
01:10:41
and the physio is on there the dock
01:10:44
standing over top of him Colin me
01:10:47
standing over the top of him and then
01:10:49
two coaches um I think it was ear
01:10:53
and Lori Lori and Lori and
01:10:57
um uh and the doctor grabs my ankle and
01:11:02
he just bends it around and it goes
01:11:04
around basically past 90° and just keeps
01:11:07
going and I've got no no pain none at
01:11:11
all which means you've ruptured
01:11:13
everything
01:11:14
M and uh the
01:11:19
um the dock I sorry the fizzy goes ey
01:11:23
says he just says it's [ __ ] anyway I
01:11:25
just burst into tears cuz you know I
01:11:29
wanted to play in France you know and
01:11:32
and I burst in tears and
01:11:34
then and then all of a sudden I start
01:11:36
laughing I'm crying and I'm laughing you
01:11:38
know and just at the comedy of the
01:11:40
situation it's so ridiculous and then
01:11:42
I'm angry and then I'm back crying and
01:11:44
everything like that and I remember
01:11:45
looking up and gazing into um tre's eyes
01:11:48
and I could just see them just not
01:11:49
knowing where to look and looking really
01:11:53
uncomfortable and then so then I I I
01:11:56
don't know I was regaling the story to
01:11:58
Rick one time and and Rick said to me
01:12:00
what do you know the rest of that story
01:12:02
and I say n and he goes well tree came
01:12:05
out and he goes Rick Rick what do I do
01:12:08
what do I do well Rick goes what do you
01:12:10
mean he goes I've got one of my boys in
01:12:12
there and he's crying I don't know what
01:12:13
to do and Rick goes well I think he'd be
01:12:16
you know he's pretty upset you give him
01:12:18
a moment he'd be fine tree anyways
01:12:20
anyway tree being tree he disappears and
01:12:23
he he he goes in and he goes into the
01:12:26
and at the team bag and grabs a a 22 all
01:12:29
black juicy and he comes out and he
01:12:32
goes yeah take this home don't [ __ ]
01:12:35
tell
01:12:37
anyone and I said and what people W
01:12:41
realizes the the humor of it is that you
01:12:45
don't get an all black Jersey to take
01:12:47
home unless you play a a test but he'd
01:12:52
seen one of his boys crying and not
01:12:56
and that was his way of dealing with it
01:12:59
but don't tell anyone oh that's an
01:13:00
amazing story that's incredible but does
01:13:03
that have you still got that Jersey it
01:13:05
feel feel kind of hollow wouldn't it
01:13:07
yeah no I don't think I have and I I do
01:13:10
but part of me because of who s Colin
01:13:14
mes was and and how much AG grew to love
01:13:18
who he was as a person wishes that I
01:13:22
still had that or I just knew where I it
01:13:25
have gone to I I I've I haven't given
01:13:28
away many of my jerseys to um you know
01:13:31
to sell for charity or whatever I've
01:13:34
given away
01:13:35
jerseys um to people um you know who are
01:13:40
you know very sick um oh I've heard
01:13:43
there's people that have been buried
01:13:45
in that's special so
01:13:48
[Music]
01:13:50
um yeah you know like I don't that's
01:13:55
I don't know I don't I don't need them
01:13:57
for anything else really and I sitting
01:13:59
now and and more recently I I actually
01:14:01
fun went and did a um fundraiser for
01:14:05
Billy steerman and um and that's
01:14:07
probably the first one I ever said here
01:14:08
you seller it cuz it you know like it's
01:14:12
just to get him some money cuz he was
01:14:14
paying off the back of his own pocket to
01:14:17
go and practice that chopu for the for
01:14:20
the Olympics so I thought you know take
01:14:22
one of these so you're not overly s Al
01:14:25
have you you got I'm not now I think I
01:14:27
was like there's a few Jersey I mean
01:14:29
obviously yeah 95 my first jersey
01:14:32
against Canada I've got that um and you
01:14:36
know I've got um I definitely want to
01:14:38
keep one of the 96ers I still need to
01:14:40
give one back to S Michael Jones I
01:14:43
haven't done that it's coming it's
01:14:45
coming it's coming what what do you mean
01:14:47
give oh well so I asked s Michael um if
01:14:50
I could um have one of his jerseys and I
01:14:52
and I he could have one of mine but I
01:14:54
hadn't watched it at the time and uh it
01:14:57
had gone way into the kit bag so he gave
01:15:00
me and it's it's got um signed um to
01:15:02
Josh from mik Jones and um and but I've
01:15:07
still got it there I just need to go
01:15:10
around he was he he in the same position
01:15:12
as you uh he was originally obviously
01:15:15
but um you know when I uh sort of had
01:15:18
made you know solidified where I was um
01:15:23
he he uh you know he played number six
01:15:27
cuz I in 19 90 again '95 massive year
01:15:32
when I came back um I got actually
01:15:35
dropped by uh uh Lori for Michael and um
01:15:41
you know I even I still remember I've
01:15:42
been dropped a couple of times at
01:15:44
different at different periods of my
01:15:46
game for different reasons but got
01:15:49
dropped for this time and
01:15:53
um and I remember when l was sort of
01:15:55
telling me yeah um we're only doing it
01:15:58
not because of how you play but we feel
01:16:00
like Michael has a more a brace of
01:16:03
tackle than you and and I and I went
01:16:07
okay yeah and I didn't even hear that
01:16:09
all I could hear was I've been I've been
01:16:11
dropped for Michael
01:16:13
Jones you oh goodness you know Michael
01:16:17
Jones is replacing me you're fine I'm
01:16:19
okay with it you know I didn't even I
01:16:21
didn't even hear that I don't give me
01:16:22
wrong I was I was got it and as it
01:16:24
worked out you know like um Michael
01:16:26
ended up getting I think might have got
01:16:28
a h knock and coming off at half time
01:16:30
and that was the last time he ever
01:16:32
played a h of me at 7 so um and and and
01:16:38
you know it was super special for me I
01:16:39
mean I got to play with one of my
01:16:44
Idols next to me you know what I mean
01:16:46
like we're talking code game you know
01:16:50
pretty special so Michael Jones Zen Zan
01:16:54
Brook and myself on the sides you know
01:16:56
it's it's it was pretty amazing it's
01:16:59
aack was that was that yeah what are
01:17:00
your Recollections of first making the O
01:17:02
was it an intimidating must have been
01:17:04
who who who didn't speak to you I've
01:17:06
heard so many stories about like Fitzy
01:17:08
Fitzy not speaking to people in the
01:17:09
first uh few weeks of the year yeah no
01:17:12
FY
01:17:14
FY no he spoke to me because he he that
01:17:17
they all did they had different ways of
01:17:20
managing and that I mean I wasn't a real
01:17:23
young guy when I made the old black
01:17:24
house
01:17:26
2425 but you know they they definitely
01:17:29
there's that school of hard kns you know
01:17:31
I
01:17:32
remember uh when we were doing the camps
01:17:35
in '94 and at the start of '94 it broke
01:17:38
my jaw and um so I didn't play any Super
01:17:41
Rugby and then they were going to have
01:17:42
to pick a a a World Cup team from that
01:17:48
um and uh so I didn't think there was
01:17:51
any chance of me no sorry it would have
01:17:53
been I broke maor at the start of 95
01:17:56
didn't play any Super Rugby and um so I
01:17:59
didn't think I was going to make it so
01:18:01
when we were doing these training camps
01:18:04
either like I had one of those boxers
01:18:05
mouth guards to keep my jaw closed cuz I
01:18:07
was just come back from there and and um
01:18:11
you know we trained really hard and
01:18:13
physically and I remember Shan I was
01:18:15
standing there and I come around the
01:18:17
side of a rock and was going to join the
01:18:19
next part of the phase and shord Patrick
01:18:22
lean leans out as I'm running past and
01:18:24
hooks me straight in the stomach and
01:18:26
drops me and like I'm bringing up my
01:18:30
lunch and you know like I'm trying to
01:18:32
get up and and you know Lori comes over
01:18:35
and goes get up all blacks don't show
01:18:37
pain and I'm just go trying to cough and
01:18:40
stuff like this everything like that and
01:18:43
um and I got up and got on with it and
01:18:45
everything like that and I've never
01:18:46
quite understood why why why it
01:18:50
happened but I started to think you know
01:18:53
like when I break it down
01:18:56
it was actually just to see whether you
01:18:58
were up for it you know like there's two
01:19:00
things that could have happened you know
01:19:02
could have
01:19:03
obviously I it di could pated me right
01:19:08
then at that moment but I got up got on
01:19:11
with stuff started going hard you know
01:19:14
and reacted and I got him a bit later
01:19:17
you know that's just what but he if I
01:19:19
gone ridiculous got up and then tried to
01:19:21
chase him around and and go he a chicken
01:19:24
he's no good loses the plot you know Red
01:19:27
Mist Red Mist and then but I got up and
01:19:30
then just got on with the job you know
01:19:32
and so it was old school school of of
01:19:36
hard kns to see
01:19:40
what aptitude I had for reaction you
01:19:43
know what how I going to respond to it
01:19:45
and for me it was just ignoring it but
01:19:48
yeah it's it's strange in reflection cuz
01:19:50
it is just how it was at the time but um
01:19:52
how things are now which it seems far
01:19:54
more inclusive
01:19:56
Sur that's much more conducive for a
01:19:58
better team environment oh we know that
01:20:00
but you got to remember everything that
01:20:03
was New Zealand's professional starting
01:20:05
point was amateur based you know like
01:20:09
dudes used to stand on each other all
01:20:10
the time you know uh there was a an
01:20:13
essence of you know if you couldn't beat
01:20:15
them physically then you took them out
01:20:18
you know like um you know all the old
01:20:21
school stories that we all laugh about
01:20:22
with you know guys punching each other
01:20:24
in the line outs and stuff like that you
01:20:27
know um none of that stuff was still
01:20:30
happening you know and and even in the
01:20:33
first year of professionalism to the
01:20:36
second year the cameras became more
01:20:39
involved in what was going on off the
01:20:42
ball you know like
01:20:45
oh used to get taken out all the time
01:20:48
like if the guys in my team weren't
01:20:51
looking after
01:20:52
me you know I could have been maimed
01:20:55
pretty badly you know like it just I can
01:20:58
fully remember guys like Jamie Joseph
01:21:00
and um Ro uh Robin Brooke and all your
01:21:06
kind of heavy enforcers coming to my
01:21:09
rescue at different times you
01:21:11
know um cuz you're at the bottom your
01:21:14
arms pinned and someone's dropping a
01:21:16
knee into your face or you know giving
01:21:20
you the six punch combo you know you
01:21:24
know that's terrified he trying to move
01:21:26
out of the
01:21:29
way so let's about 95 since your first
01:21:32
first year in the All Blacks it's also
01:21:33
the World Cup year and it's the year
01:21:35
where Jonah sort of bursts onto the
01:21:36
scene and um I got I was watching some
01:21:39
um YouTube clips last night an
01:21:41
anticipation of this and um that England
01:21:43
game in particular and I think Jonah's
01:21:45
third try out of those four against
01:21:47
England like you pass him the ball and
01:21:48
then he goes away with it um yeah what
01:21:51
are your Recollections of that time that
01:21:53
that tournament Joon Mania
01:21:55
oh look I I just felt blessed to be in
01:21:57
South Africa you know simple as that
01:21:59
there was it wasn't anything else I I I
01:22:03
was super fit um I was super like
01:22:07
focused to be an all black I wanted to
01:22:10
be um making a statement as much as I
01:22:14
could about cuz I mean they left Michael
01:22:16
Jones at home and taking me so I I was I
01:22:20
felt that pressure a little too you know
01:22:23
maybe not in the Forefront but just
01:22:25
little subconscious felt that I had to
01:22:27
do
01:22:28
more than validate the decision validate
01:22:31
this this decision and then
01:22:35
um but I also felt like I was part of
01:22:37
something really special too you know
01:22:39
like with that team they they were that
01:22:42
was a good team and everyone knows the
01:22:44
final outcome and like I've we've
01:22:46
already spoken about um what South
01:22:48
Africa was and what it was and I I
01:22:51
genuinely believe there was a fate that
01:22:55
played into the whole process and we I
01:22:57
know people talk about Suzie and
01:22:59
everything but there was just too many
01:23:02
things that led to South Africa getting
01:23:05
to where they got and kicking that final
01:23:08
um drop kick you know and
01:23:13
so um yeah I look back and I remember
01:23:16
games and I think F of it and all that
01:23:19
sort of stuff but I just feel like I was
01:23:21
involved in something special and I
01:23:24
don't think I took the hit that we lost
01:23:27
as bad as some of the older boys you
01:23:28
know cuz
01:23:30
they they really you know could they
01:23:34
really felt it I was new and I was still
01:23:37
excited about what was coming and up and
01:23:39
coming you know and um and that's
01:23:41
probably more when I look at it and I
01:23:44
felt to be playing next to Joon lamu at
01:23:47
his absolute
01:23:49
best um and when people mention his name
01:23:53
my name gets mentioned as you being part
01:23:55
of that you know because I was either
01:24:00
throwing a pass to him or getting
01:24:02
receiving a pass just like the rest of
01:24:03
the
01:24:04
boys um that that's a privilege you know
01:24:07
and I feel feel honored to have been
01:24:10
part of that but if you if I think in
01:24:14
about that tournament time I still come
01:24:17
back to the one game against England
01:24:20
because it was so so different to any
01:24:23
other game that I prefare for like I've
01:24:26
never seen such intensity and craziness
01:24:31
and like
01:24:33
fanatic uh responses to being absolutely
01:24:39
focused like I would
01:24:40
say out of the the older boys of that
01:24:43
four pack you know your Shan
01:24:45
fitzpatricks your um your Robin Brooks
01:24:47
your Zim brand Brook you know all those
01:24:49
those those characters ol brown stuff
01:24:52
like that every one of them would
01:24:54
reminded me of my
01:24:57
job once every day leading up to that
01:25:01
that that game like what's s the
01:25:02
reminders oh you know you know you've
01:25:04
got to make sure that you're doing this
01:25:06
in this phase or you know we want this
01:25:08
when we're playing this situation and
01:25:10
like at what point at training or just
01:25:12
if you're in the lift or line for
01:25:14
breakfast or you'll be practicing it and
01:25:15
you go remember Josh you need to be off
01:25:17
that way quicker when you're doing such
01:25:19
and such you know like it was it was cuz
01:25:21
you were a young loose unit or well I
01:25:23
was I was I was still but I played a lot
01:25:25
of r i was 24 you know like you know
01:25:28
like but it's just what it was I I was
01:25:30
just yeah yeah yeah it was but it was
01:25:31
getting kind of boring you know what I
01:25:33
mean and
01:25:35
um and then and then I and I st to this
01:25:39
St when they were doing the team
01:25:40
speeches you know like you know like
01:25:42
team chat in the Huddle just before you
01:25:44
about to run out and zenzen Brooke was
01:25:47
just thoing at the mouth you know and
01:25:51
and like you know like and and when he
01:25:53
was he was you know we've got to do this
01:25:55
and then he turned around to me and Josh
01:25:56
I need you to do this and he he
01:25:58
literally just spat all over me with
01:26:01
froth and and Fitzy was Fitzy was the
01:26:04
same and I've never seen that I mean and
01:26:07
it was all because of what had happened
01:26:09
in the previous year or or two years ago
01:26:11
when they were in toen on and I didn't
01:26:14
go on that tour and so I didn't feel the
01:26:16
hurt that they were feeling and so you
01:26:20
could argue maybe we played our our
01:26:22
final in that game you know uh I never
01:26:25
felt that though you know I've seen it
01:26:28
internationally and I've felt it and
01:26:30
other teams and things I've been
01:26:31
involved in that but that game was
01:26:34
massive you know yeah it's Inc
01:26:37
incredible like yeah but like career
01:26:40
defining for Jer obviously um did you
01:26:42
ever room with him or anything uh with
01:26:45
big J no I don't I didn't actually room
01:26:47
with big J um
01:26:50
I I he would have definitely commanded
01:26:52
the double beard yeah yeah yeah yeah
01:26:54
yeah look it's funny how that all that
01:26:56
stuff works you know you come in and I
01:26:58
can remember with when when a room room
01:27:01
with Richard L you go you go that's your
01:27:04
bed and then it'll be um there's a
01:27:08
problem here there's a problem here and
01:27:09
I what's the problem Lo he go there's no
01:27:13
cup of
01:27:17
tea and but I mean and you know like
01:27:20
that was just that was just that was
01:27:22
just how it all worked you know um big J
01:27:25
was and I were um great movie Buddies
01:27:29
like
01:27:31
probably in the entire time we were
01:27:33
together um we probably went to a movie
01:27:36
at least together every test that we
01:27:39
played together um and that that movie
01:27:43
could be at the start of the M uh start
01:27:45
of the week or or the night before even
01:27:48
just depended on what was going on in
01:27:50
the week and and what was on on the at
01:27:53
the movie theater and
01:27:55
and and so big J and I would often just
01:27:57
let the other boys know what moves are
01:27:58
on and um and uh and if anyone wanted to
01:28:03
come they' come sometimes we'd have the
01:28:05
whole whole crew there and other times
01:28:08
um it' be just me and
01:28:11
him that's cool memories an Odd Couple
01:28:14
an unlikely couple yeah yeah he was he
01:28:17
was great he's
01:28:19
like you know as much as everybody knew
01:28:21
about him you know and um um you know
01:28:26
some of the stuff he used to say at home
01:28:27
and you know um about man he came up
01:28:31
from a tough neighborhood you know I I
01:28:34
can't even imagine it and um so the way
01:28:38
he comes across you know is that that
01:28:40
kind of calm giant you know but his his
01:28:44
historical background where he came from
01:28:46
also explains why it was such a
01:28:49
ferocious attacking weapon you know yeah
01:28:52
how good did you you must have played
01:28:54
against to for like UMO or the
01:28:57
Highlanders you were you were a very
01:28:59
good Tech CL did you ever yeah look I
01:29:01
only rap myself about 50/50 on a
01:29:03
one-on-one tackle with
01:29:05
Jonah that's a pass yeah I know I know I
01:29:09
I remember um one time like you know one
01:29:13
of my attributes I reckon rugby was I
01:29:15
was always able to see uh a picture
01:29:18
rather than just the contact point so I
01:29:21
knew where people were coming from and
01:29:22
how they were coming into theu situation
01:29:24
I just could see that and um some people
01:29:28
will say other ways probably but in my
01:29:31
eyes that's what I I remember seeing
01:29:32
Jonah out of the corner of my eye um
01:29:35
sort of starting to come into a backline
01:29:37
move and I thought right you're coming
01:29:38
in I can see that this is going to
01:29:40
happen and I'm so I picked the point
01:29:42
where he came in and just as he got the
01:29:44
ball I hit him as clean and as perfect
01:29:47
as I could like couldn't have hit him
01:29:49
any any better and I don't know if
01:29:52
you've played rugby but you know when
01:29:54
when you get someone perfectly and you
01:29:55
feel them fold in half and they start to
01:29:59
go down and you're still going forward
01:30:01
through the tackle and I'm thinking
01:30:03
right I've got you and then I end up on
01:30:06
the ground and I look up as he runs
01:30:08
through John Leslie and scores under the
01:30:11
post and and I'm going and I look at my
01:30:14
hands to go as if what what just
01:30:17
happened there and I've got a piece of
01:30:19
his shorts and either
01:30:22
hand and I SAR that's just not
01:30:27
fair that's amazing yeah that's
01:30:30
incredible just the yeah wow and then
01:30:33
that's the power and strength of him
01:30:34
yeah and then Jonah I actually injured
01:30:37
Jonah um uh in a in a game too um and
01:30:42
I'm not sure if it was a super game or
01:30:44
whether it was when he was playing
01:30:46
counties and um he he had a knee problem
01:30:50
that he sort of struggled with for um
01:30:53
quite a long time and I went in to make
01:30:54
a
01:30:55
tackle and um for whatever reason I
01:30:59
caught the side of my head with his knee
01:31:04
and anyway he went off with a knee
01:31:05
injury and he I ended up with 30
01:31:08
stitches in my head you know and um and
01:31:11
he always go oh you under my
01:31:14
knee well I got 30
01:31:18
stitches oh that's good thanks for
01:31:20
sharing those memories that's cool and
01:31:22
did you mean um did you meet Mandela
01:31:25
yeah well I got to shake his hand um
01:31:27
Gordon Hunter became quite good friends
01:31:29
with um the the security um guy and I
01:31:33
can't remember Rory's last name but um
01:31:37
he used to come down and catch up with
01:31:40
gordi Hunter at at the the pub that we
01:31:43
were staying in um you know with uh the
01:31:46
Super Rugby you know which is pretty
01:31:48
amazing you know so had a relationship
01:31:52
there and um
01:31:54
you know for Nelson to go and just
01:31:56
listen to the security guard and come
01:31:58
hey can you meet him at M it's pretty
01:32:00
amazing that's awesome yeah um I and I I
01:32:04
didn't actually go and meet him and that
01:32:06
cuz all the boys were doing that I
01:32:07
thought man he's this bit bit Fon but I
01:32:09
did poke my head and have a little log
01:32:12
um but only really just to shake his
01:32:14
hand when he came down the came down the
01:32:16
aisle so you didn't say hey bro to his
01:32:18
mom no no hey bro his mom but when you
01:32:21
when you meet someone like that do you
01:32:22
do you you you feel the like some sort
01:32:25
of presence or some sort of aura
01:32:27
or not really yeah no you do you do like
01:32:30
but I mean you got to understand like um
01:32:33
for
01:32:34
me in that given situation was like
01:32:39
uh like what the hell's going on why are
01:32:41
we taking so long you know and then it's
01:32:43
like you look down oh it's Nelson
01:32:44
Mandela you know oh so this is before
01:32:47
the before the final yeah but I didn't
01:32:49
meet him in you know in a social
01:32:51
situation I could have um but everybody
01:32:54
else is doing it it's just like uh you
01:32:56
know he's had enough of as morons so you
01:32:59
meet him before why why didn't they um
01:33:01
like do the Mee and greet after the
01:33:02
final like when you're getting the the
01:33:03
silver medal or whatever oh look you
01:33:06
know like it makes perfect sense cuz you
01:33:09
know
01:33:10
like I I think that game took maybe 40
01:33:13
minutes to start from by the time we got
01:33:15
out you know was it's that's a long time
01:33:19
you got your anthems the hackers the the
01:33:22
walk down the line the sing
01:33:24
um you know the plane flying AC all that
01:33:26
sort of stuff going on
01:33:29
it's it's massive it's special you know
01:33:33
there'll be there'll be a photo of some
01:33:34
or obviously the video footage of them
01:33:37
shaking hands with me but I you know
01:33:39
I've never seen it and then then after
01:33:41
that oh oh yeah so the the Suzie thing
01:33:44
the there's a some food poon food
01:33:47
poisoning thing um before the Rugby
01:33:48
World Cup final you didn't you didn't
01:33:50
get sick right no I got managed toid um
01:33:53
I was pretty loose and skim things and
01:33:56
uh um had uh obviously diarrhea to the
01:34:01
early hours in the morning so I didn't
01:34:02
have great sleep on Thursday night but
01:34:04
sort of by Friday I was eating and um
01:34:08
and not feeling too bad but guys like
01:34:11
Jeff wison and a few other boys were um
01:34:13
really sick still you know so whatever
01:34:16
went through in the food definitely went
01:34:18
through um whether it was Suzie was
01:34:21
there a suie there I don't know but it's
01:34:24
one of those fabulous parts of New
01:34:26
Zealand sporting folklore Now isn't it
01:34:28
it's great yeah I mean I none of the
01:34:30
boys um admit to sickness being the
01:34:32
reason why we lost that game just just
01:34:35
wouldn't um but it was definitely a
01:34:37
factor um and it was a m a
01:34:41
massive like that like I said that World
01:34:44
Cup was absolutely unique and there
01:34:48
never be one like it again and I think
01:34:50
at that stage so that was only the um
01:34:52
third ever world cup so there was 87 in
01:34:55
New Zealand which we won 91 and then 95
01:34:57
so I think at that stage we probably
01:35:00
thought it was our right to win every
01:35:02
sort of World Cup yeah look I also think
01:35:04
that that team you know like then that's
01:35:06
why 96 is so special because effectively
01:35:09
was that team that went into 96 and then
01:35:12
with bar a few extras um and Ubbi and
01:35:16
stuff like that that went over there and
01:35:20
won its first ever uh tour actually got
01:35:24
um even a put out about there that's how
01:35:27
special that was what were you call the
01:35:29
incomparables no what was the something
01:35:31
like that yeah I I can't remember people
01:35:34
know these things I never know these
01:35:35
things yeah but did you Kelly here a
01:35:38
couple of weeks ago we were we were
01:35:39
talking about that and he sort of didn't
01:35:40
realize the significance of it at the
01:35:42
time yeah um and he talked about how um
01:35:45
after winning the the you know the Clean
01:35:47
Sweep series he saw some of the old um
01:35:49
EXO blacks like I think Don Clark he
01:35:50
mentioned like balling his eyes out and
01:35:52
he sort of do didn't really understand
01:35:54
the significance of it they was so great
01:35:56
for me they were so pumped on it you
01:35:59
know tree BJ lore Brian Williams you
01:36:03
know the the list goes on at some point
01:36:07
they all shook your hand and um and got
01:36:10
a little emotional about it and again
01:36:13
like Christian said I wasn't I didn't
01:36:16
notice it I just over there playing
01:36:17
bloody some games you know trying to
01:36:19
work out how I could go for a surf and
01:36:21
JB you know like um it it it was and I I
01:36:28
think it's I reckon it took even as long
01:36:30
as 10 years before I start to understand
01:36:34
the reality of it because I mean I've
01:36:35
been going to South Africa um since I
01:36:38
was 21 you know with uh Super 8 Super 10
01:36:42
and super 12 so you knew and understood
01:36:45
what the place was like and then
01:36:48
numerous um you know um games here but I
01:36:52
hadn't played
01:36:54
against South Africa other than that
01:36:56
World Cup final you know in in a tour
01:36:59
situation because they're the super
01:37:01
super generous people to a fault but I
01:37:04
think it's all part of a ploy to make
01:37:05
sure you're eating too much
01:37:07
meat weigh you down you know just that
01:37:10
whole game and and the um then the um
01:37:13
the 99 World Cup um oh that was the one
01:37:17
yeah you got knocked out by France and
01:37:18
there was that massive backlash back
01:37:20
home yeah um what was that like for you
01:37:22
at the time
01:37:24
could you could you feel
01:37:26
the yeah you did but I I never got any
01:37:29
of it myself personally um you know I
01:37:33
never had
01:37:34
any anyone say hey man you you're crap
01:37:39
and whatnot or anything like that
01:37:42
um it they were
01:37:45
all people in New Zealand you know they
01:37:48
knew that you know I always try to do my
01:37:51
best by and when I look at that team
01:37:54
like I always felt like we
01:37:56
were a team of absolute
01:38:00
uh
01:38:01
Superstars you know like you go through
01:38:04
the list of the backline you go through
01:38:06
the list and the Fords but I felt we
01:38:09
were team of individuals not a team you
01:38:13
know always felt there um you know we a
01:38:17
team of stars rather than a star team is
01:38:20
the same goes yeah yeah so you know when
01:38:23
I remember saying at a huddle when the
01:38:25
things started to go a little bit Pier I
01:38:28
say hey let's not panic let's just stay
01:38:30
in the
01:38:31
system play for each other make our
01:38:34
tackles and it'll all happen but
01:38:37
everybody started just going off on
01:38:39
tangents trying to score tries
01:38:41
themselves and panicking yeah it was
01:38:43
definitely Panic it was definitely panic
01:38:45
and it wasn't it never needed to be a
01:38:46
panic movement yes they changed the
01:38:48
momentum of the game but we just needed
01:38:51
to hold on the ball and build phases and
01:38:53
and stuff and but the Panic had already
01:38:56
started you know guys were going off on
01:38:58
doing their own thing and on a different
01:39:01
tangent you seem seem to have you know
01:39:04
quite a good um you grasp on what's
01:39:06
important and what's not and a good sort
01:39:07
of balance and perspective on life so
01:39:09
how long does something like that haunt
01:39:10
you for you manage to like draw a line
01:39:14
on the sand at the end of the season and
01:39:15
go into 2000 or does it sort of plan on
01:39:17
your mind a bit for years afterwards or
01:39:19
what oh look I think I think the thing
01:39:22
that annoys me is that um I went to two
01:39:24
World Cups and never never had a a chew
01:39:27
at the the golden cup and
01:39:31
um that's probably the only thing but
01:39:34
nah it's done it's dusted you know like
01:39:37
you got to leave stuff behind you
01:39:39
know and I think um if you're not
01:39:42
leaving that stuff behind and you know I
01:39:44
play enough Mind Games as a as a 53y old
01:39:48
with certain things I don't need that
01:39:51
[ __ ] for me so don't try and put it back
01:39:53
call me mate take it you have
01:39:56
it well just take some space hey you
01:39:59
just don't need it how are you you've
01:40:00
been so generous with your time it's
01:40:01
been an hour 40 how are you doing for
01:40:03
time are I'm all right um right all
01:40:05
right geez well there's so much of the
01:40:07
like the Josh corfield story that we
01:40:09
haven't even talked about like winning
01:40:10
Treasure Island twice
01:40:12
and um I've done lots of crazy stuff and
01:40:16
I've it's been a hell of a life yeah
01:40:17
I've I've um kind of say to people you
01:40:20
know like well had the check out
01:40:23
tomorrow and I don't want to but you
01:40:25
know at least i' I've fed a fair bit of
01:40:27
the bucket and um you know I've had some
01:40:32
really amazing moments you know I
01:40:34
enjoyed facets of uh of um Treasure
01:40:37
Island and I hated facets of Treasure
01:40:40
Island um the cool thing I think about
01:40:43
the first one is um getting to know
01:40:45
everybody in that in that crew I love
01:40:47
that part you know we were sitting
01:40:48
around a b bonfire telling stories um
01:40:51
talking like this um
01:40:53
uh with very little food and um whatever
01:40:56
was stolen and um you know and and and I
01:41:02
I think that was kind of special I I
01:41:04
never lik the um way stuff could change
01:41:07
to where I've always been sort of pretty
01:41:09
honest about stuff you know or the
01:41:11
manipulation aspect yeah I never liked
01:41:13
that I never liked that and and didn't
01:41:15
like playing it and so especially when
01:41:18
I'm um which is the game full fold now
01:41:21
when I played it as an older player I
01:41:24
just definitely couldn't do that
01:41:28
um yeah it's it's it's I don't know and
01:41:32
then Dancing with Stars was awesome like
01:41:34
I you know me and Braun um we we did a
01:41:39
bit of post that but then my ankles just
01:41:41
started to become a real posle yeah how
01:41:44
did how did you and um yeah Broman your
01:41:46
your wife who is um the owner of Tony
01:41:48
and Guy yeah um she's one of the and she
01:41:51
she's like cut hair for like Aussie was
01:41:53
born and yeah yeah she she's a legend in
01:41:55
herself how how did you guys metet was
01:41:57
she familiar with who you were look I
01:41:59
kind of knew her through um Warren
01:42:03
Alcock uh he she's the identical twin of
01:42:07
Warren's wife and so but that was just
01:42:11
like pre everything um just knew her um
01:42:15
but the I guess the the first time I
01:42:18
started really chat with her was when um
01:42:22
I came back from my overseas trip I've
01:42:24
been to the UK and everything like that
01:42:25
came back and um I had long hair and it
01:42:29
was starting to dread up and um I had it
01:42:32
in a a man
01:42:34
bun and um I had to do something in
01:42:37
dened for New Zealand Rugby and they
01:42:39
asked me to come along and be with tree
01:42:41
and everything like that and tree was
01:42:42
there and there but it seemed like tree
01:42:44
was kind of avoiding me I kept trying to
01:42:47
catch his eye and everything like anyway
01:42:48
so I finally rocked up to him and I says
01:42:51
I says Hey tree um he you G and he
01:42:54
looked at me like really strangely and I
01:42:56
thought he didn't recognize me I says
01:42:57
it's Josh keld and he goes I know you a
01:43:00
[ __ ] are don't know about the [ __ ]
01:43:02
[Laughter]
01:43:04
haircut and I was
01:43:07
mortified mortified I I um literally
01:43:11
next time um obviously Roman cut hair
01:43:15
and she she said if I ever wanted a
01:43:16
haircut next time I was in Oakland which
01:43:19
was ironically the following week went
01:43:21
up and cut my hair and
01:43:24
um uh yeah everything started
01:43:27
to um all we next I wasn't went get
01:43:31
together then either it was it was about
01:43:33
that started you know more chat more
01:43:37
talk and stuff like that so like a slow
01:43:40
burn it was a real slow burn like um and
01:43:43
then so I no I know probably 12 years or
01:43:46
whatever um and then came up doing some
01:43:50
stuff in Oakland and just keep bumping
01:43:52
into each other and stuff you know like
01:43:55
different events like nothing to do with
01:43:57
either of us just and not organized not
01:44:01
planned and it just kind of happen yeah
01:44:04
ergonomically or whatever they say it is
01:44:05
and are are you yeah are you are you
01:44:08
sort of a laner or are you like a people
01:44:10
person because it's you've spent all
01:44:12
this all this um part of your career in
01:44:14
like a team sport environment where
01:44:16
you're surrounded by others but then
01:44:17
yeah when you retire from sport you do
01:44:19
this like motorcycle Journey around
01:44:21
America and around South America so and
01:44:23
and you like surfing as well yeah I I
01:44:25
like my own company yeah and I like
01:44:27
sitting out in the water and and if no
01:44:28
one talks to me I'm happy um but if
01:44:31
someone has a chat about something I'm
01:44:33
okay with that too and you know like I I
01:44:36
can't go anywhere without sitting down
01:44:38
and having you know selfies and chats
01:44:41
and and that's just part of the life but
01:44:44
I definitely don't mind my own company
01:44:45
and and I'm happy in that person um so
01:44:49
yes you could argue I'm a bit of a loner
01:44:51
um but but I also like being around my
01:44:54
friends and having the chats and
01:44:56
catching up you know like it's been a
01:44:58
couple of reunions um organized with the
01:45:00
rugby boys and we hardly ever talk you
01:45:02
know some of the boys do some of the
01:45:04
boys do but oh my goodness when you're
01:45:06
back in amongst it's like nothing's
01:45:08
changed you know and you're you're that
01:45:10
same dude with your same job within the
01:45:13
team and uh and it all just kicks off
01:45:16
like nothing's change so and I enjoy
01:45:18
that you know it's been great um but no
01:45:21
I'm I'm super com in my own space and
01:45:25
happy doing my own thing and but um I I
01:45:29
think it's just
01:45:30
happened just the way stuff sort of
01:45:33
happens you know um kind of lucky that
01:45:35
way yeah and your mental health how
01:45:37
how's that been you you've been through
01:45:39
some stuff he so you've got um yeah bran
01:45:42
there was a story on woman's weekly
01:45:43
where she talked about her endometriosis
01:45:45
and she was crying several times a day
01:45:47
for years and um then there was your sun
01:45:49
born with um you know cereal py yeah um
01:45:53
yeah I mean one thing I've learned from
01:45:54
doing this podcast no one no one gets to
01:45:57
the privilege of making it to their 50s
01:45:58
without going through some adversity
01:46:00
yeah well I've always been good at comp
01:46:02
compartmentalization to to a fold
01:46:04
apparently I remember um John Hart gave
01:46:08
us the opportunity to have um talk to a
01:46:11
uh you know Sports psychiatrist and
01:46:13
stuff like that and she came
01:46:16
out well you clearly are good at
01:46:19
compartmentalization I said well what's
01:46:20
that he said well you box stuff far put
01:46:24
it over there but I don't know if you
01:46:26
address it when I well it's if it's
01:46:28
boxed up and it's over there then it's
01:46:30
not bothering me is isn't that a good
01:46:33
thing um but uh yeah I don't know like
01:46:38
I'm I I've really always struggled to
01:46:40
understand what what what
01:46:43
um uh you know mental health is for
01:46:46
people and and like and you're telling
01:46:48
me um what that is and I I don't get it
01:46:52
I just don't get it
01:46:54
um you know I just I don't understand it
01:46:57
like if I'm if I'm grumpy and or I'm not
01:47:01
feeling it or whatever I just can't do
01:47:03
something I love and it'll it'll drag me
01:47:06
out of whatever that is
01:47:09
so I guess I've had to learn how to be
01:47:13
receptive to it you know and um be there
01:47:15
for my mates or or um you know ask the
01:47:19
question and um
01:47:23
you know how are you and and then
01:47:25
sometimes just be in air and so and also
01:47:27
maybe no not not when to try and problem
01:47:29
fix because I am a problem fixer I think
01:47:32
I like try and help I think a lot of us
01:47:34
guys are yeah um but sometimes you don't
01:47:37
actually and that I've learned that
01:47:39
probably through Brahman you know she
01:47:40
doesn't want the help she just wants to
01:47:42
be able to tell me what's why she's
01:47:44
feeling the way she's feeling you know
01:47:46
she's gone through some U stuff that's
01:47:48
been driven through you know um I guess
01:47:52
the hormone side of things uh you know
01:47:55
like always being out of balance through
01:47:58
the you know Lecky G and then the inury
01:48:01
mosis um impacting on all of that as
01:48:04
well and you know scarred up
01:48:07
um uh ovarian tubes and you know all
01:48:11
that sort of stuff Olympian tubes and
01:48:14
um so all all of that uh stuff I guess
01:48:19
you know you get to understand of how
01:48:21
you fit into the picture but
01:48:24
oh man it's so complex it's so difficult
01:48:27
so but I do think if you can be an air
01:48:31
and and if you think you've got a a way
01:48:33
to help you know you just say you know
01:48:36
you just say that
01:48:37
can you know like you
01:48:40
just I I don't know what the answer is
01:48:42
I'm not not great at it but there must
01:48:45
have been like a challenging time for
01:48:46
you because you especially being a fixer
01:48:48
and being um a relatively uncomplicated
01:48:50
Guy having this some person that you
01:48:52
love that's going through medical stuff
01:48:54
and crying frequently every day like oh
01:48:56
she wasn't crying from me all the time
01:48:58
you
01:49:02
know like every time I cry Josh throws
01:49:04
me a jersey and tell yeah no no like I I
01:49:09
look you just I I think I've learned to
01:49:11
listen a lot more you know and and even
01:49:14
with the boys you know there's nothing
01:49:17
wrong with a high gay you know or just
01:49:19
put your arm around someone that can
01:49:21
even that's just enough
01:49:23
do real I really really think there's um
01:49:26
you know one of the boys jokes about all
01:49:28
the negative ions that you get inside of
01:49:31
a barrel when you're surfing you know
01:49:33
and that's what the sea offers up evens
01:49:35
everything out and um and you know I
01:49:39
reckon there's some truth to that so you
01:49:41
know you know that bodily contact that
01:49:43
just evens all
01:49:45
the all the energies out you know I
01:49:48
really do think we we are Just Energy we
01:49:51
are just creatures of energy and um some
01:49:54
people um suck suck other people's
01:49:57
energy 100% and some people um offer it
01:50:01
up freely and some people are really
01:50:03
healing and some people so I just feel
01:50:06
that that's you know um sometimes it
01:50:09
just gets around trying to be a
01:50:11
partnership in in in a group and and
01:50:14
that'll do the job you know we all we
01:50:17
all rally around friends when they get
01:50:18
really sick so um but we probably wait
01:50:22
too long to do
01:50:24
that do you feel like as you're getting
01:50:26
older you're getting better at like
01:50:27
showing some vulnerability and you know
01:50:30
talking about some niggly things I'm
01:50:32
just not embarrassed anymore you know
01:50:34
like I just don't care um think that's
01:50:37
that's that's another pleasant surprise
01:50:39
that comes with AJ oh well I mean also
01:50:42
just no what I learned obviously um
01:50:44
working with Crowd Goes Wild you know
01:50:47
when you're meeting all these amazing
01:50:48
athletes I love that's what I love most
01:50:50
about working for that show and and
01:50:53
they're all from different networks and
01:50:54
walks of life and what they do and how
01:50:57
they do it and
01:51:00
um but they all do it differently and
01:51:04
and and it's kind of crazy but so
01:51:07
sometimes to get the fun or have the
01:51:09
joke or cuz I mean that's the gag with
01:51:12
cgw is that we we have a laugh and
01:51:14
there's a gag or there something going
01:51:15
on it's taking the piss out of yourself
01:51:19
like and and people will say oh that was
01:51:23
really funny you know that you're
01:51:24
walking around your Speedos and ra or
01:51:26
whatever you know and um whereas my Ms
01:51:30
she go she doesn't see the humor in it
01:51:31
why are you taking the piss out of
01:51:33
yourself you know like you're not like
01:51:36
that and I'm going well it doesn't worry
01:51:37
me you know I've got so used to it you
01:51:39
know or one of one of the crew um taking
01:51:43
the piss out of you and it and and for
01:51:45
someone who didn't know that we're
01:51:47
friends that would sound might sound a
01:51:49
little bit oh that's not quite right but
01:51:52
um
01:51:53
it's okay doesn't really matter yeah if
01:51:56
it comes from a good place in your
01:51:57
relationship with that person you know
01:51:59
what you can get away with whether it's
01:52:01
being mean or not um what about regrets
01:52:04
you got any
01:52:05
regrets yeah
01:52:08
uh I regret
01:52:11
um I regret having the injury when I had
01:52:14
the injury I don't mind that I had it
01:52:17
but I just never felt I was as good as I
01:52:20
was that first year I just didn't have
01:52:22
the
01:52:23
this I just didn't have anything you
01:52:25
know like I was 30% what I was when I
01:52:27
started like
01:52:29
instantly um and you know maybe I could
01:52:32
rehab better and that would have been
01:52:34
fine but I just didn't have that but you
01:52:36
just didn't have the tools or the
01:52:37
information available the time did you
01:52:39
but that's that's rugby wise that's
01:52:40
probably only your regret um there's
01:52:42
heaps of regrets I've made saying the
01:52:44
wrong thing at the wrong time cross
01:52:46
cross lots of things might be funny or
01:52:49
whatever and it's come out with a big
01:52:51
lead balloon
01:52:53
um oh but stuff that the the other
01:52:55
person would remember or like saying hey
01:52:57
bro to ta's Mom yeah no one no one
01:53:01
remembers that stuff apart from yourself
01:53:03
I know no but yeah you know
01:53:06
like yeah there's there's been moment I
01:53:09
don't need to say the
01:53:11
all okay and last one are are you proud
01:53:14
of
01:53:15
yourself a tricky question for New
01:53:17
Zealand is yeah
01:53:21
um yeah I'm proud of myself of the way
01:53:23
I've applied stuff took myself to stuff
01:53:27
yeah am I
01:53:29
proud that I'm all black and and stuff
01:53:32
like that for sure like you know like
01:53:34
that was that was something I wanted to
01:53:35
do and it was a I never wanted to be an
01:53:37
all black initially you know it wasn't
01:53:39
until I started playing at that top
01:53:41
level and playing against my peers who
01:53:44
were all blacks that I went oh actually
01:53:46
maybe this is something I could just
01:53:47
consider you know
01:53:50
um but I think you
01:53:53
know
01:53:55
I I think the thing that I'm most proud
01:53:58
about is um that I'm open to trying
01:54:04
stuff you know or or just being able to
01:54:08
smile at how inadequate I am it's
01:54:10
different things you know but I'm giving
01:54:13
it a a good
01:54:15
work um cuz I I I I do think that um
01:54:21
young people today really struggle with
01:54:24
um putting themselves out there and um
01:54:29
and having a go whether it's just in
01:54:32
front of their friends or in front of
01:54:35
the national television or whatever but
01:54:38
they they're reluctant to to have a go
01:54:41
but I think you know I've
01:54:44
always thought oh yeah doesn't matter we
01:54:47
just have it go so I
01:54:50
think yeah I'm proud of the fact that
01:54:52
I've I've and but again maybe that's mom
01:54:55
and dad you know we haven't even talked
01:54:57
about that part of my life and you know
01:54:59
Mom and Dad are just um they were
01:55:02
hippies they were like the good life but
01:55:05
they they've created me as you know um
01:55:08
get me a really centered and and
01:55:12
um you know balanced person I think most
01:55:18
of the time when I'm not unhinged which
01:55:20
isn't too regular yeah yeah we we didn't
01:55:23
get into that like there's there's
01:55:24
definitely elements of you and your old
01:55:25
man like didn't he like chop a toe off
01:55:27
at work once and then just carry on
01:55:28
working till the end of the day that was
01:55:30
always the joke he you know like but you
01:55:32
know he you know if you want a a tough
01:55:35
Man story put Chainsaw for his leg and
01:55:38
then went right we not we not packed up
01:55:41
the family he he I remember him opening
01:55:44
it up and looking at it and then and
01:55:46
going oh that's not too good and then
01:55:48
closing it up and then just ripping his
01:55:51
T-shirt off his own back and shoving it
01:55:53
in there and then tiing it on is and
01:55:56
then loading it loading everybody up and
01:55:59
we're like an hour and a half drive from
01:56:01
the hospital and then loading the whole
01:56:03
family and driving us to the hospital
01:56:06
and uh um and and then um and then
01:56:11
admitting himself to hospital and mom
01:56:12
taking us home that's that was loose
01:56:16
that was my dad and like and all the
01:56:18
boys would have different versions of
01:56:21
stories of how tough T and hard he was
01:56:23
you know and he had these crazy hands
01:56:26
you know like um just workers hands that
01:56:29
were nil and black and full of Gunk you
01:56:33
know he he hadn't uh done any work for a
01:56:36
week and he'd eat his sandwich and All
01:56:38
His Hands would end up under
01:56:42
sandwich I'm just think but you know was
01:56:44
that I'm trying to describe the hands
01:56:46
you know and and and and and he was loud
01:56:49
and he was abbrasive and he was but man
01:56:52
he he was like the yappy dog that was
01:56:55
going to protect everybody you know and
01:56:57
he was he played dad to heaps of kids um
01:57:03
through both my brother uh uh and I's
01:57:06
rugby careers you know like loading the
01:57:09
kids up on the back of the truck it was
01:57:12
awesome I I can't talk much longer
01:57:14
though bro because I have to go to work
01:57:17
we yeah we got to wrap up uh we didn't
01:57:18
even get to talk about your um brutal
01:57:20
testical injury that'll have to wait oh
01:57:22
that's that's a good story man but you
01:57:25
never you never know I can um I can I
01:57:28
can I can irritate that at another time
01:57:31
but M this has beeny thing the key thing
01:57:33
that I would want to do is just you know
01:57:35
and especially with the tenis stuff is
01:57:38
just to finish it's just to
01:57:40
say dudes get them around your mates
01:57:44
have the conversation encourage each
01:57:46
other to do the checks because so much
01:57:48
of the stuff can be avoided cuz too many
01:57:51
of the boys check out way too early you
01:57:54
know unnecessarily so hey um mate this
01:57:57
has been great um I'm proud of you and
01:57:59
um thank you so much for being so
01:58:00
generous with your time today Josh
01:58:01
cornfeld thanks man cheers
