00:00:00
since time began we found ways to settle
00:00:02
our differences this town ain't big
00:00:04
enough for the both of us what you
00:00:08
heard looks pretty darn spacious to me
00:00:12
there ain't nothing but space but today
00:00:15
we don't shoot it out we bet it out
00:00:17
right draw right jockey man those one
00:00:20
shoots out the
00:00:25
gate bet it out with beta r18 bet
00:00:29
responsibly
00:00:35
Sean planket welcome to my podcast nice
00:00:38
to be here do good to see you um first
00:00:40
of all I'm very excited about this today
00:00:43
because um you you and I have sort of
00:00:46
met and passing over the years we've had
00:00:47
a few drinks yeah and I've always enoy
00:00:49
parties yeah yeah and you know when I go
00:00:52
into a room and you're there it's like
00:00:53
oh this is good you know you know that
00:00:54
Sean's good for a chat good for a laugh
00:00:57
um good for a bit of Gossip usually yeah
00:00:59
y always always um not not necessarily
00:01:02
factually proven gossip but but fun I
00:01:06
mean that's I mean that's the stuff of
00:01:08
life isn't it that you yarn with people
00:01:10
and we interact with people that's what
00:01:12
life's all about yet if you Google your
00:01:14
name you're like one of the most
00:01:17
despised
00:01:18
polarizing hated hated people in New
00:01:20
Zealand by some people I I don't bump to
00:01:23
them very often um apparently I'm
00:01:24
controversial I don't mind that um and
00:01:28
look I have had this my whole life life
00:01:31
um and I don't know what it
00:01:33
is but I get energy throwing at me good
00:01:36
and bad and that's a good thing um but
00:01:39
you got to take your your lumps and yes
00:01:41
there is a small group of people who
00:01:43
seem to Delight in despising me and you
00:01:47
know there bug all I can do about that
00:01:49
is there isn't there you know well I I
00:01:51
don't know I part of me feels like you
00:01:53
um you you relish being despised like
00:01:56
you're you're a [ __ ] ster yeah yeah
00:01:58
that's right but but look if someone
00:02:01
is most people and I love it when I get
00:02:04
a call on the platform and someone comes
00:02:06
in hot and heavy and you do this and you
00:02:08
do that and I love when people you're
00:02:10
always interrupting people I go yes and
00:02:12
I just shut up and I said anything else
00:02:14
you want to
00:02:16
say and most people come around and I've
00:02:19
had lots of calls and even interviews
00:02:21
with people and Patty gal would be that
00:02:23
interview with Patty paty was all by the
00:02:26
end of it he was asking me for a job it
00:02:28
was fantastic um
00:02:30
so just engagement is the joy of it
00:02:33
whether it's good or bad and look
00:02:35
nothing's more boring than sitting in a
00:02:37
room with everyone agreeing with each
00:02:38
other yeah 100% well I'm um why did you
00:02:42
agree to come here today why are you
00:02:43
here today Bella right Bella's dad is an
00:02:46
old old mate of mine he's a good guy so
00:02:48
when Bella Rings if I can do my mate
00:02:51
being a solid I will brilliant nothing
00:02:54
to do with you dog no Bella's um Bella's
00:02:56
been doing some like guest booking for
00:02:57
me for a while now and she's fantastic
00:02:58
she's absolutely brilliant um first of
00:03:00
all who who is who is Shan planket and
00:03:02
why and why not Oliver when did you drop
00:03:04
the Oliver um I'm named Oliver because
00:03:09
it's an old family name I've always been
00:03:11
called Shan the problem was if my
00:03:14
parents true story though I'm going to
00:03:17
digress here my mom wanted to call me
00:03:19
Barney I think I would have been a
00:03:21
terrific Barney I think it would have
00:03:23
suited me down to the ground I wouldn't
00:03:24
end up running a pub somewhere um and my
00:03:28
father said if if your choice of name is
00:03:30
Barney I'll call him a tiller for a
00:03:32
second name like a tiller the H so I
00:03:35
could have been Barney so Mom just gave
00:03:37
up and said to Dad you pick the names
00:03:39
Oliver is after the saint Oliver blessed
00:03:42
Oliver planket P one of the patron
00:03:44
saints of Ireland whose head sits in a
00:03:47
church West of Dublin and he was back
00:03:51
down the family line so I'm Oliver to
00:03:53
carry on that name and I've always been
00:03:55
Shan except for Nelson college and if I
00:03:59
meet someone who calls me olle I know
00:04:01
there's someone I went to school with
00:04:03
because that was I when I was at Nelson
00:04:05
college someone went through the
00:04:07
Personnel F and real names Oliver let's
00:04:09
piss him off and call him olle for the
00:04:11
rest of his school career and what what
00:04:14
were you like um what were you like as a
00:04:16
kid what was young Sean like were you
00:04:17
argumentative and combative sort of back
00:04:20
then like I had um a brother and sister
00:04:23
pretty smart and
00:04:25
argumentative and we did a lot of
00:04:26
talking in our
00:04:28
house and and I guess I'll tell you what
00:04:32
my I can always remember leaving
00:04:34
boarding school and um my housem lovely
00:04:39
guy called Harvey Proctor he wrote on
00:04:41
sort of the general assessment of me on
00:04:43
my last school report it said um sha is
00:04:46
always willing to express in a
00:04:48
reasonable manner a contrary
00:04:52
View and I just think that is that's
00:04:54
kind of me you know a reasonable
00:04:57
contrary View and not exploring whether
00:05:01
or not something is true is really
00:05:03
important in in real life and I I'm
00:05:06
pretty intolerant and I've always been
00:05:08
pretty
00:05:09
intolerant of being gaset or lied to and
00:05:13
I really try and look for the truth in
00:05:14
every situation I'm in and not pretend
00:05:17
that the truth isn't the truth I think
00:05:19
we all live lives where we construct in
00:05:21
our heads an idea of who we are or the
00:05:23
way the world is often it has no bearing
00:05:26
with reality
00:05:27
whatsoever um and like to live in the
00:05:30
real world as bumpy as it might be so
00:05:33
you've always been that way yeah yeah I
00:05:35
think so yeah so why um why a career in
00:05:38
um like journalism I I feel I feel you
00:05:41
could have been a fantastic like a
00:05:42
criminal defense lawyer you could have
00:05:43
been like a like a Greg king or a Mike
00:05:45
buay I actually wanted to be an actor
00:05:47
did you I really loved
00:05:50
singing uh dancing and appearing on the
00:05:53
stage did you and I once again at school
00:05:56
I did a lot of drama and did a lot of
00:05:58
debating as a young
00:06:01
man and
00:06:04
um I had an opportunity when I was in I
00:06:07
think the fifth for or whatever year
00:06:09
that's called now and I got offered free
00:06:12
acting lessons because some people had
00:06:14
seen me act and said we will um give you
00:06:17
free acting lessons and to do it I was
00:06:20
going to have
00:06:21
to um I was at boarding school I was
00:06:23
going to have to have two nights a week
00:06:25
when I went to this acting acad and
00:06:27
Nelson and my dad and my house Master
00:06:30
put the kibos on it and I of looked back
00:06:32
and said I should have told them to get
00:06:34
stuffed and just done it um but the
00:06:37
reason I
00:06:38
guess journalism came along
00:06:41
was it is or broadcast journalism is
00:06:44
kind of a mixture of acting and probably
00:06:46
a little bit of AD advocacy and a bit of
00:06:49
law um and my dad was a journalist yeah
00:06:52
Pat yeah really well really well
00:06:53
respected right well depends who you
00:06:56
depends who you talk to um look I quite
00:06:59
successful yeah quite successful and he
00:07:02
had a long career and he was uh
00:07:04
uncompromising in his career he did a
00:07:06
lot of things and gosh a lot of people I
00:07:08
work with now got their first jobs from
00:07:11
Dad way back in the day I think Barry
00:07:13
SOA got his first job in television from
00:07:15
my old man wow Mark sainsbury worked for
00:07:18
him kri woodam worked for him so and Dad
00:07:22
stayed sort of true to and he never
00:07:25
called it a profession he says it's a
00:07:27
vocation or a craft cuz you don't need a
00:07:30
degree to be a journalist and you don't
00:07:31
need any form of tery qualification you
00:07:34
don't get your ticket you just say I'm a
00:07:36
journalist and you learn by doing and um
00:07:40
you know Dad was right up till about 6
00:07:44
months before he died um he was still
00:07:47
covering court for the Dom he was still
00:07:48
down there and I think uh one person
00:07:51
said to me at his funeral they said your
00:07:53
father was the only guy who could cover
00:07:56
three court cases from the back bar at
00:07:58
the back bench
00:08:00
when when did he pass um got 17 18 years
00:08:04
ago okay after what um dad said he he
00:08:08
said um this isn't a battle with cancer
00:08:11
it's a freaking Massacre and I'm on the
00:08:13
wrong side of it yeah cuz he yeah he he
00:08:16
had uh lung cancer right he was a he
00:08:18
smoker yeah um but but that wasn't what
00:08:20
killed him the tumor in his brain was
00:08:22
Tiny But mzed and he got brain lesions
00:08:26
and stuff and it was a pretty awful it
00:08:28
was a pretty awful way to Jo to be
00:08:30
honest yeah it's Grim you know yeah it
00:08:32
is and and you you had a good
00:08:34
relationship like did you did you get
00:08:35
into journalism because I'll be honest
00:08:37
so my parents split up when I was
00:08:39
five and Dad remarried which was okay
00:08:42
but I really didn't see much of
00:08:45
dad till I left school and took up
00:08:48
journalism we really got to know each
00:08:50
other in my early 20s because we had the
00:08:54
Shar vocation thing so but I don't ever
00:08:58
felt like I missed out on on anything
00:08:59
with Dad he was a really good Mentor and
00:09:03
I still have days when I think gez I'd
00:09:05
like to ask Dad how I should play that
00:09:08
um because he did have a lot of life
00:09:10
experience yeah do you think um I don't
00:09:12
know if if you've thought about this too
00:09:14
much but do you think subconsciously
00:09:15
maybe you got into journalism because
00:09:16
you wanted to like impress him
00:09:20
or I'll be honest I'm a lazy preg and it
00:09:23
was the easiest thing I could do it was
00:09:25
just sitting there why not you know I
00:09:28
don't know there was a whole lot of you
00:09:30
know father son uh competitive stuff
00:09:33
going on and he did say you know dad was
00:09:36
in his time you know a bit of a legend
00:09:38
but I met so many contemporaries of his
00:09:41
and friends of his who said he may not
00:09:44
have ever told you but your dad was so
00:09:46
proud of you um and he wasn't he of a
00:09:50
generation where you probably don't
00:09:51
you're not that express it so much but
00:09:55
um certainly as he was passing we had
00:09:57
some great conversations and I think we
00:09:59
got each other yeah yeah yeah uh I heard
00:10:03
that from um an early age like your
00:10:05
goals were to be um the host of fgo and
00:10:07
Morning Report which what age are we
00:10:09
talking cuz you both got those jobs so I
00:10:11
used to we used to get up in the morning
00:10:13
and I was ly gety under bed my we had a
00:10:16
big old
00:10:17
grammophone and dad was actually the
00:10:20
first Chief reporter on Morning Report
00:10:22
when it got set up but we would start
00:10:25
the day at s my brother would wind up
00:10:26
this valve radio on Morning Report so I
00:10:29
woke up from about the age of 10 or 11
00:10:31
every morning listening to morning
00:10:32
report and by the time and then fear go
00:10:35
started I can remember watching that
00:10:36
thinking that's a great show and I kind
00:10:38
of put my mind there are two jobs I'd
00:10:40
like to do I'd like to present morning
00:10:42
report and I'd like to be on Fair go
00:10:44
what age like 10 about 12 I think 12
00:10:47
intermediate age you're very young yeah
00:10:48
yeah yeah and you got both I got both of
00:10:52
them yeah so how how did you feel
00:10:53
recently when um your F guy got canned
00:10:56
is there like a I thought it was a a
00:10:58
freaking travesty M um and to be honest
00:11:02
all this other crap on TV and those are
00:11:06
the programs you choose to X and it was
00:11:10
almost like the management or the
00:11:11
culture at tvnz was giving middle New
00:11:13
Zealand a big finger saying oh well you
00:11:17
don't like what we're doing you don't
00:11:18
like us being woke we'll teach you um
00:11:21
and I really do think I really loved
00:11:23
working on fgo that's some of the best
00:11:25
journalism I ever did how long were you
00:11:26
there for I about 3 years I think on fgo
00:11:29
with Kevin Mo Brett dumbleton was there
00:11:33
um Leanne Clark Rosy Nelson and it was
00:11:36
just it was the days before the internet
00:11:38
man we got letters from people
00:11:40
complaining about stuff we had to get
00:11:42
pick up the phone phone books stuff like
00:11:45
that but it was a really disciplined and
00:11:47
I I think I learned an awful lot about
00:11:49
journalism and checking your facts and
00:11:51
getting your story straight and also
00:11:54
about the people that you deal with and
00:11:56
often you were dealing with people who
00:11:57
had been through quite traumatic
00:12:00
issues and we're being jerked around and
00:12:03
we
00:12:04
solved as many stories off here as we
00:12:08
did on here and it was really you know
00:12:11
it was quite an amazing project to be
00:12:14
involved in yeah yeah it was it was a
00:12:16
huge show um yeah I had Hayden Jones who
00:12:19
spent a bit of time on Figo on the
00:12:20
podcast about a year ago we were rumin
00:12:22
missing about like you know growing up
00:12:24
and this is probably when you were on
00:12:25
fgo but you'd over hear people in shops
00:12:27
saying I'm going to take this to Fe and
00:12:29
gez you would pick up the phone and say
00:12:31
hello it's
00:12:33
Sean oh and the business you hear this
00:12:36
big take a
00:12:38
breath um you then now people just film
00:12:41
it and put it on Tik Tok yeah that's
00:12:42
right yeah they just hold their phone
00:12:44
out don't they there's no romance in
00:12:46
that is there yeah yeah yeah um you said
00:12:49
just before you're you're a lazy person
00:12:51
um but I I'd dispute that because um
00:12:54
actually we might bounce around a little
00:12:56
bit here there's no sort of order of
00:12:57
things but um you're wearing a t-shirt
00:12:58
that says the platform um the platform
00:13:01
is um a venture that you set up you
00:13:03
you've you've set up this business so
00:13:04
you're a CEO you're the breakfast host
00:13:06
as well that would suggest anything but
00:13:08
[ __ ] lazy well how old are you now
00:13:10
you 60 I'm I'm just about I'm about to
00:13:12
turn 60 in September um you're probably
00:13:14
working harder than what you've ever
00:13:15
worked in your life yeah and I feel
00:13:16
younger than I ever have and I think in
00:13:19
broadcasting
00:13:21
careers I mean you know it's a long
00:13:23
bloody hul and I and this September will
00:13:25
be 40 years working in in broadcasting
00:13:29
I began work September 84 um after the
00:13:33
snap
00:13:34
election um yes so so tell us about the
00:13:37
platform so you you were on a station
00:13:39
called um Magic Talk and you got um you
00:13:41
got [ __ ] canned by media works well I
00:13:43
got who knows what happen I think I the
00:13:47
cancel culture came for me yeah and I to
00:13:49
be honest I didn't spend too much time
00:13:52
interrogating what happened as I said I
00:13:54
like living in the real world the
00:13:55
writing was on the wall they paid me a
00:13:57
bit of money to go quietly
00:13:59
uh and they they didn't publicly say
00:14:02
anything nasty about me and that happens
00:14:05
you know jobs gigs come to an end it is
00:14:08
the natural thing and I reckon in this
00:14:11
game and in broadcasting it is can you
00:14:14
reimagine yourself are you going to get
00:14:15
up and go again and it's really strange
00:14:18
because I had had before that happened
00:14:20
that came a bolt out of the blue one
00:14:21
white Tang weekend I'd already been
00:14:24
formulating my head this idea that the
00:14:27
news media and and radio stations and
00:14:30
television
00:14:32
stations weren't really operating in a
00:14:35
way that was going to be sustainable
00:14:37
when you looked at social media and the
00:14:40
way the me the landscape was changing so
00:14:42
I'd already had this
00:14:44
idea that I was stuck in a sunset
00:14:47
industry and I was bored to be honest I
00:14:50
mean I love doing talk back and talking
00:14:51
to people but when I looked at the
00:14:53
bigger picture I wasn't as engaged as I
00:14:56
should have been so we in the hammer f
00:14:59
fell media works I um already had this
00:15:02
plan in my head and I gave myself 6
00:15:06
months to put this thing together and
00:15:10
I've never run a business before um and
00:15:14
but you know I literally got in my car I
00:15:17
started driving around the country
00:15:18
talking to people that might want to
00:15:20
invest
00:15:22
um and that became my thing and it still
00:15:25
is my thing and I I don't feel like I'm
00:15:28
I feel like I'm engaged with the world
00:15:31
and I don't clock in pull my paycheck
00:15:34
and go home at 5:00 which is a really
00:15:37
neat way to be at the age of 60 because
00:15:39
most people and I have got a lot of
00:15:40
mates who are you know working less
00:15:43
hours looking forward to the gold card
00:15:45
and I don't I feel like there's another
00:15:47
at least 10 years of dynamic change and
00:15:51
activity to go you I think there's
00:15:53
there's two ways of looking at it a so
00:15:54
I've had um I had Paul Henry on the
00:15:56
podcast a couple of weeks ago and he he
00:15:58
hates the idea of working
00:15:59
loves his retirement and then you got
00:16:00
someone like hosing who just loves it
00:16:03
and will die behind the microphone um so
00:16:06
I think there's no sort of right or
00:16:07
wrong but yeah I like I saw my granddad
00:16:10
he was a school principal and then he
00:16:11
retired at 60 or whatever and he was
00:16:12
dead like 12 years later like retirement
00:16:15
is um it's a mugs game for a lot of
00:16:17
people it's dangerous and to be honest
00:16:19
the other thing about I guess the
00:16:21
platform is it's lovely for the first
00:16:23
time in my life to be in
00:16:26
control um and and also to be honest to
00:16:30
have we've got all together I think
00:16:32
about 14 staff and it feels kind of good
00:16:35
that I get up every morning and I'm
00:16:37
providing an environment for other
00:16:39
people some of them my contemporaries
00:16:41
some of them much younger to be involved
00:16:44
in media and and and I that's probably
00:16:47
the most satisfying thing is that I've
00:16:50
got a team of people and that's the
00:16:51
biggest
00:16:52
responsibility is that I want to keep
00:16:54
them moving forward with their careers
00:16:57
yeah okay so for anyone that's just
00:16:58
hearing about the platform for the first
00:16:59
time now how would you how would you
00:17:01
describe it what's like the elevator
00:17:04
pitch that's an app we're a New Media
00:17:08
Company um and that's what I call us we
00:17:10
are internet TalkBack radio and we
00:17:13
engage in current affairs and if you
00:17:16
like the culture
00:17:17
wars and we are an interactive a truly
00:17:22
interactive media
00:17:23
platform um and that was you know that
00:17:26
was the philosophy of it to engage
00:17:28
people in a new way using the technology
00:17:31
that was available and it's not about
00:17:33
having a transmission tower or having a
00:17:37
receptionist and a whole corporate
00:17:39
structure um the biggest the biggest
00:17:42
problem I've had is that I always work
00:17:45
for organizations and I was a foundation
00:17:47
pupil of TV3 when that started back in '
00:17:50
89 I was are you doing Nightline night
00:17:53
line yeah yeah yeah um that was iconic
00:17:56
back
00:17:56
then I had that spirit of being new and
00:18:00
different and it's really energizing I'm
00:18:02
I'm a startup kind of
00:18:04
guy but media works and all media
00:18:07
companies very quickly can become
00:18:10
fundamentally
00:18:12
just you know advertising departments
00:18:14
with a bit of broadcasting tacked on and
00:18:18
I never want to be the platform from
00:18:19
that what we do in our engagement is the
00:18:22
primary mission of our
00:18:23
organization not to make shite loads of
00:18:27
money off manipulating data or man
00:18:30
manipulating an audience because
00:18:32
everywhere I've worked ends up being the
00:18:35
sales people are far more valued than
00:18:37
you know those who engage the presenters
00:18:40
yeah well you're being from a radio
00:18:42
background as well like I you know the
00:18:45
uh the figures the survey figures are
00:18:46
kind of cooked it's like we but I I um
00:18:50
sometimes I get served um the platform
00:18:52
content on YouTube and the analytics
00:18:54
don't lie they're right there in bold
00:18:57
for everyone to see like
00:18:59
we are still in terms of marketing and
00:19:02
selling
00:19:04
advertising the world is in chaos and
00:19:07
the old radio book is not going to
00:19:09
survive this so it is about
00:19:12
engagement and also about and I've been
00:19:16
really lucky with the advertisers we've
00:19:17
got we've had fan advertisers and some
00:19:19
of them are big companies they've been
00:19:21
very loyal to
00:19:22
us and I know it sounds counterintuitive
00:19:25
but they don't
00:19:26
always advertise on the plat
00:19:29
form because the strict figures are
00:19:32
there and they can point to a you know a
00:19:34
data point yeah it's not about the
00:19:35
return on investment they it means that
00:19:37
their company identifies with the spirit
00:19:39
of what the platform is and that's an
00:19:41
independent engaged it's honest and
00:19:44
that's a good brand value to be
00:19:45
alongside now when I start of course
00:19:47
everyone was saying you're a Nazi um
00:19:50
you're a Mis you're a misogynist um this
00:19:53
will fail and I justly said well screw
00:19:56
you we're just going to be what we are
00:19:58
and we are honest straight up engagement
00:20:01
platform for people and we will let
00:20:03
anyone have their say as long as they're
00:20:06
not inciting
00:20:07
violence um or doing anything illegal
00:20:10
are you are you a Nazi or a
00:20:13
mogist time I look I love woman right um
00:20:16
and um no I don't think I'm a Nazi but
00:20:20
you know a lot of people throw that word
00:20:21
around does does it um and I even get
00:20:24
called rightwing and I'm not even
00:20:25
rightwing right you know my dad taught
00:20:28
me I never knew how my dad voted and he
00:20:31
always said if you want to be a
00:20:32
journalist never go on a protest March
00:20:34
never join a club so you've got no skin
00:20:36
on the game and you can look objectively
00:20:38
at the world in front of you and I have
00:20:40
pretty
00:20:41
assiduously um done that um so when
00:20:45
people say you're rightwing no I'm not
00:20:47
I'm just not leftwing and the truth and
00:20:49
the truth is most journalists are
00:20:52
leftwing and look I predicted when we
00:20:56
set up the platform I went and gave a a
00:20:58
talk to the New Zealand
00:21:00
initiative and that was when the dip and
00:21:02
Trust had just started the first of the
00:21:04
surveys were coming out 3 years ago and
00:21:06
Trust was down media was down to
00:21:08
58% and I said at this conference and I
00:21:11
Petty I didn't um you know record the
00:21:14
speech I said that is going to dip down
00:21:16
to 35% in the next 3 years mainstream
00:21:19
media companies are going to lose their
00:21:21
revenue and there's got to be a new way
00:21:22
of doing things um and we were bang on
00:21:26
we were bang on yeah Legacy Media is
00:21:28
eroding at an alarming rate yeah it's
00:21:31
terrifying actually how quickly it's
00:21:32
happening yeah but I don't think and I'm
00:21:35
sick and tired of reading stories about
00:21:38
how this is a threat to democracy it
00:21:40
isn't it's just a
00:21:41
change imagine how much media change
00:21:44
when radio became idly available or the
00:21:47
bloody printing press as long as your
00:21:50
values are the same you're going to be
00:21:52
all right and the technology you've got
00:21:54
to adapt to and and move around um and
00:21:58
still you know we spend a lot of time on
00:22:01
the platform saying well that's not
00:22:02
working anymore because the
00:22:04
environment's changed so we're going to
00:22:05
have to you know we're going to have to
00:22:07
alter that yeah also if you're one of
00:22:09
these media companies and you're you're
00:22:10
posting a loss of like 30 million or
00:22:12
whatever every year eventually like you
00:22:14
know you need to you need to do
00:22:16
something to stop the bleeding well
00:22:18
without giving you any numbers I looked
00:22:19
at what magic talk did after we left and
00:22:22
and sure enough they destroyed the
00:22:24
brand and then they went to create Today
00:22:26
FM
00:22:28
which was kind of a millennial TalkBack
00:22:30
show now that's not a TalkBack audience
00:22:33
and it was never going to be so I would
00:22:36
estimate the media Works burnt about $18
00:22:39
million with Today FM and they never
00:22:42
rated what we did cuz I could I had ways
00:22:45
of telling so they never came near us
00:22:49
um 18 million is a factor of four or
00:22:53
more on what has been spent in the
00:22:55
entirety of the
00:22:57
platform wow yeah so who's who so who
00:23:00
bankrolled the platform some I um my
00:23:04
primary investors are a group a family
00:23:06
called the right family out of
00:23:08
tonger uh they run a charitable
00:23:10
Foundation which has got nothing to do
00:23:12
with the platform which runs about 280
00:23:15
early childhood education um services
00:23:18
around the country and then they have
00:23:20
the business arm of the family um which
00:23:23
has helped bankroll the platform and I
00:23:26
spent a long time looking for the right
00:23:29
people and I had a number of people who
00:23:30
wanted to invest and you
00:23:32
know um but I always said to them and
00:23:37
the editorial control of the platform
00:23:39
rests with me as the founding editor and
00:23:41
me alone and you don't get to use it for
00:23:45
your political points of view and you
00:23:47
don't get it to interfere in editorially
00:23:50
what happens on the
00:23:51
platform and I got close with a couple
00:23:54
of people and then it became quite
00:23:55
obvious that they were never going to
00:23:57
stick by that m absolute Bedrock
00:23:59
commitment and the rights have they've
00:24:02
been awesome so what what's in it for
00:24:04
them
00:24:07
um do they are they are they just like
00:24:10
banking on you as a man look I'll tell
00:24:13
you how I pitched it I met them I went
00:24:14
and met them in towerer I drove I here's
00:24:17
a story I've been up talking to NL
00:24:20
Edmonds from no's house party no's house
00:24:23
party I'd gone up to M car to talk to no
00:24:26
and Pitch the project to him
00:24:29
and we were actually having quite a good
00:24:32
discussion and but I knew we weren't
00:24:34
going to get there I I knew not nothing
00:24:37
wrong with no lovely guy and great
00:24:39
company but that the objective and the
00:24:42
vision I had wasn't going to be able to
00:24:44
line up and I was sitting on a beach at
00:24:46
Omaha Beach and I don't know it was 6
00:24:49
months after magic T the payment was
00:24:52
running out and
00:24:55
jeez and the phone went and and it was
00:24:59
Wayne Wright
00:25:00
Senior and someone had said to him that
00:25:03
guy sh planket that you hear on used to
00:25:05
hear on Magic Talk he's doing something
00:25:08
and he said I hear you doing some sort
00:25:10
of media thing I'd like to meet you so I
00:25:12
drove down to
00:25:14
Tanga um and I saw them I think the next
00:25:18
afternoon and sat down with them and
00:25:20
after 5
00:25:21
minutes and I said the pitch was do you
00:25:23
guys want to change the world I said I
00:25:25
think the media's a bit broken I think
00:25:27
New Zealand's a bit broken and it needs
00:25:29
a place for people to have better
00:25:30
conversations and I think the media
00:25:32
landscape's changing and Legacy Media
00:25:34
don't know it um I said so really I
00:25:37
don't know if we'll ever make any money
00:25:40
um but we're going to change the world
00:25:42
and that's why they did it and that's
00:25:44
why I do it and I think that's a really
00:25:45
good motivation even for a business can
00:25:48
you can you say how much their initial
00:25:49
investment was or no we're not publicly
00:25:52
listed um but you know they've spent a
00:25:56
bit they haven't spent 18 million
00:25:58
I can tell you that and I'm I'm guessing
00:26:01
I don't even know if you'd know this
00:26:03
information but they must have got some
00:26:04
backlash from
00:26:05
people we we were really honest about
00:26:08
that and particularly in the early days
00:26:09
there was you know the W Brigade and the
00:26:11
cancel culture Brigade came for us
00:26:14
um but they're solid people dug their
00:26:17
toes in well they didn't dig their toes
00:26:19
in they just most often you'll find you
00:26:22
know the online bullies and the internet
00:26:23
bullies and the cancel culture people
00:26:25
you ignore them and they go away um
00:26:29
and you know that's just what we did and
00:26:31
look I'll be honest they don't always
00:26:33
agree with what I do um I get to make
00:26:36
the decisions but when they disagree
00:26:38
with me I get the odd phone call and I
00:26:40
said yeah well that's great I can see
00:26:42
that you see it that way but it's my
00:26:43
call um so it's a good creative tension
00:26:47
um that we've got uh and I don't think
00:26:50
there would be anyone else in New
00:26:51
Zealand who would have allowed the
00:26:53
platform I I said I got incredibly lucky
00:26:56
no one else would have given given me
00:26:59
the freedom and the ability to set it up
00:27:01
in the time we did you know if if they
00:27:05
if if they took away the um that
00:27:08
pipeline now would you be financially
00:27:09
viable could you make it work we're
00:27:11
bloody close yeah really we're bloody
00:27:13
close but you know the next six months I
00:27:15
think for any business anywhere in New
00:27:16
Zealand is going to be incredibly tough
00:27:18
because we are in recession and I also
00:27:21
think in media the advertising Market
00:27:25
itself and how we as we talked earlier
00:27:27
how we measure what audiences or how
00:27:29
engaged an
00:27:31
audiences that is all going to change
00:27:33
and I think people are very um the
00:27:37
people in the middle who clip the ticket
00:27:38
on Advertising they're very unsure as to
00:27:41
what they should be buying or how they
00:27:43
should be buying I'll tell you what we
00:27:45
use and I can be accurate about
00:27:49
it time spent listening online so I'm
00:27:52
not in a I'm not broadcasting so I'm not
00:27:54
you know I'm not in a radio book but I
00:27:56
can tell because of how we stream
00:27:57
through the app and through the website
00:28:00
I can tell live hours spent listening on
00:28:02
devices and I'll give you a figure we
00:28:05
average per month about 470 480,000 live
00:28:11
hours spent
00:28:14
listening everything on the Rover app
00:28:17
all eight stations they've got they get
00:28:20
2 million live listening hours through
00:28:22
that app a month so I've got about a
00:28:25
quarter with one wow channel in my app
00:28:27
and that is that gives you a level of
00:28:30
Engagement but the other thing
00:28:33
is people can say there's the number
00:28:35
there's time spent listening cumulative
00:28:37
audience and
00:28:40
everything but are they really engaged
00:28:43
no of are they really loving what they
00:28:46
do and I'll tell you what I absolutely
00:28:49
adore about the
00:28:52
platform I know CU I'm watching the text
00:28:54
we get hundreds and hundreds of texts a
00:28:56
day and we get calls and everything
00:28:58
and people are really listening and part
00:29:01
of the goal of the platform was to
00:29:04
build uh what Kevin Roberts from s used
00:29:06
to call a love Mar I've got the book I
00:29:10
love it yeah and I went and I went and
00:29:12
did a lot of conferences back in the day
00:29:15
where Kevin would be a speaker and I
00:29:17
listened to every time he gave a speech
00:29:20
and the platform has been designed to be
00:29:22
a love Mark and that is first build a
00:29:25
consistent product that knows what it is
00:29:27
and what it's trying to be and you don't
00:29:28
try and overreach that and then that
00:29:31
product should occasionally and almost
00:29:34
erratically absolutely delight and
00:29:36
engage its audience so listening to me
00:29:39
on the radio should be a bit like
00:29:41
watching a Formula 1 race you know he's
00:29:43
going fast and he's going to go around
00:29:45
all the corners but he might crash and
00:29:47
often he does and often he does and
00:29:49
that's what you listen for and the truth
00:29:51
is I don't know sometimes what's going
00:29:53
to happen next on a show and we throw it
00:29:55
out there but I've never you know uh you
00:29:59
get through it you know yeah Kevin
00:30:01
Roberts I haven't heard that name is he
00:30:02
still alive Kevin Roberts got me toed
00:30:05
out of saari sari's went through the big
00:30:07
at the time of the me too Kevin Roberts
00:30:09
basically got Easter side um but still a
00:30:11
brilliant New Zealander was it Justified
00:30:13
or no well I don't know who know know
00:30:16
his love marks book it's phenomenal and
00:30:18
then he then he this is um actually I
00:30:20
must reread it cuz I've got this book as
00:30:22
well he he followed it up with a book
00:30:23
called syo which um stands for sight
00:30:26
sound motion and he was the this before
00:30:28
everyone was walking around with an
00:30:29
iPhone he just talked about the future
00:30:30
being screens and he's 100 110% spot on
00:30:34
yeah absolutely dead right yeah so that
00:30:37
was so when you think about it I'm not a
00:30:40
business I'm a love Mark I'm a change
00:30:44
agent and we can redefine what we are
00:30:47
individually or
00:30:49
collectively and we can do that as many
00:30:51
times as we want in our lives cuz
00:30:53
otherwise you're dead if you're not
00:30:55
changing if you're not moving you well
00:30:58
you know yeah daisies you it's I mean um
00:31:01
yeah you you've been doing this almost
00:31:02
40 years now the media thing um is is
00:31:05
the and you've done it just just about
00:31:06
every job imaginable and been fired from
00:31:08
almost well no here here's the truth
00:31:11
I've never been fired no and I wasn't
00:31:13
fired for magic talk I've never been
00:31:15
fired I've been sued for leaving
00:31:17
jobs when I left um when I was uh this
00:31:23
there must there's a lot of indas around
00:31:25
no no I was at I was no no well not as
00:31:27
far I know oh there's one that radi
00:31:30
maybe when I left
00:31:32
TV3 when I got approached by Kevin M
00:31:34
from Fe go to go on F go I looked at my
00:31:37
contract with TV3 and said that
00:31:38
contract's [ __ ] it's never ending
00:31:40
it's got no specified Clause so I handed
00:31:42
him a notice and I said well you can't
00:31:45
go we're not going to let you go and I
00:31:47
said what do you mean I said no we own
00:31:49
you and at that stage TV andz and TV3
00:31:52
had a very cozy
00:31:54
relationship that they would basically
00:31:56
trade staff among themselves they were
00:31:58
running a closed shop so suddenly I get
00:32:01
a call from Fair goat we can't hire you
00:32:03
we withdraw and I said no you've got a
00:32:04
written contract so I got a very highly
00:32:08
qualified qcm and we constructed a case
00:32:11
and we went to TV and said and said Mr
00:32:13
planket is going to successfully sue you
00:32:15
for his entire life earnings unless you
00:32:17
honor that
00:32:18
contract and they read who it was from
00:32:22
and they he's got us he's got us so then
00:32:25
they said okay let's do the deal if you
00:32:27
can get yourself fired from
00:32:29
TV3 so that they have no contractual
00:32:32
hold over you you'll be back on so I got
00:32:35
another
00:32:36
lawyer um to work for me at TV3 who knew
00:32:40
nothing about what was happening at TV
00:32:41
andz and one day I was not in good odor
00:32:45
at that stage and I'd been pulled out of
00:32:47
Parliament and I was being sent to cat
00:32:48
up tree stories and I got assigned a cat
00:32:50
up tree story in paliston north and
00:32:53
instead I went to lunch at one of my
00:32:55
favorite
00:32:56
restaurants Fone goes
00:32:59
hello oh where are you I said I'm at
00:33:01
lunch um what do you mean you're not pal
00:33:04
North no didn't think it was much of a
00:33:06
story well you know what this means y
00:33:08
yep yep yep okay and Rod peton who was
00:33:11
the in boss of TV3 news came down the
00:33:13
next day tears in a SI that's it you're
00:33:15
over and everyone thought that fair go
00:33:18
had also pulled and that I my career i'
00:33:20
blowing up my career but he kind of and
00:33:22
I broke my [ __ ] swipe card over and
00:33:26
and I was marched out with my lawyer
00:33:28
just going Sean my TV3 Sean how could
00:33:31
you do that it just destroyed your C I
00:33:32
said hang on borrow your
00:33:34
phone rang the producer F you go said
00:33:36
yeah I just been fired okay start Monday
00:33:38
thank you and I said send me send me
00:33:41
your bill I Beck and we kind of broke
00:33:44
the closed shop that broke the closed
00:33:46
shop where tvnz and TV3 were trading
00:33:48
people like freaking
00:33:50
Commodities um and I look back and
00:33:52
that's a great that was a great thing I
00:33:53
did and I got the job at Figo and I know
00:33:56
four years later I was back working for
00:33:59
TV3 what a career oh and you did 14
00:34:02
years on um Morning Report I should I
00:34:04
should have done seven with um with um
00:34:07
Jeff Robinson who was there for now um
00:34:09
hand on heart um and I don't say this
00:34:11
with a great deal of Pride but I've
00:34:12
never heard morning report in my life
00:34:14
yeah cuz I was doing morning radio on a
00:34:16
on a a music station so I've never heard
00:34:18
it but it's um so it's an institution
00:34:20
right and this guy Jeff Robinson there
00:34:21
for 40 years you were there
00:34:23
for when I listened to morning report as
00:34:26
a 12-year-old and said want to do that
00:34:29
Jeff was presenting it right so I end up
00:34:33
and I didn't know how I was in my 30s or
00:34:35
something then and that was just awesome
00:34:38
and I didn't really get comfortable in
00:34:40
that job for two years because it's a
00:34:42
hell of a it's a hell of a discipline
00:34:45
what what is Morning Report like a
00:34:46
three-hour breakfast show it's a
00:34:48
three-hour breakfast show that has no
00:34:50
ads in it and is all news breaking news
00:34:52
and interviews from New Zealand and
00:34:55
around the world it was and its day the
00:34:56
most comprehensive of news show made in
00:34:58
New Zealand and we would get in there
00:35:01
4:30 every morning we'd start doing
00:35:03
pre-record with overseas correspondence
00:35:05
and we'd run through 9:00 and we would
00:35:07
do I think Jeff and I we did eight
00:35:10
interviews each morning eight hard News
00:35:12
interviews each morning so we' notes to
00:35:15
brief uh on that so you know I've done
00:35:18
literally thousands and thousands of
00:35:20
News interviews as a result there and I
00:35:22
should have quit after 7 years and I
00:35:25
stayed for 14 and I was like is always a
00:35:28
good time and and the last seven years
00:35:30
were pretty um I was kind of bued out
00:35:34
and I didn't even know because those
00:35:36
hours kill you um they that's hard but
00:35:40
proudly I would say in our last seven
00:35:42
years um that was the last time anyone
00:35:45
beat ZB in The Breakfast slot Morning
00:35:47
Report was super successful um then it
00:35:50
was the highest rating thing on radio so
00:35:53
much so that they took non-commercial
00:35:55
radio out of the ratings yeah that's
00:35:57
right right because we were making the
00:36:01
change the rules and I look back look
00:36:02
farg go was the highest rating TV show
00:36:04
when I worked on Morning Report was the
00:36:05
highest rating um Jo so those are kind
00:36:08
of those are I guess career highlights
00:36:11
yeah for sure um why did you stay seven
00:36:13
years too long was the the money really
00:36:15
good or you just had nothing else to do
00:36:17
Mone was crap I've never really worked
00:36:18
for money unfortunately well like can
00:36:20
you say what it is now in like couple
00:36:22
hundred thousand a year no it was way
00:36:24
less than that right [ __ ] I mean way
00:36:26
less than that it was public service
00:36:28
right so so at the time holes would have
00:36:30
been on ZB what would he would have been
00:36:32
earning 600,000 yeah yeah yeah and I
00:36:34
probably was earning 120 why do people
00:36:37
go a Morning Report then just the pr
00:36:38
because because it's the was the best
00:36:41
freaking journalistic show in the
00:36:42
country and it was you know yeah but if
00:36:45
you're good you want to be paid fairly
00:36:47
oh I've never really done this for the
00:36:49
money which is probably a
00:36:51
failing but do I but do I love what I'm
00:36:54
doing do I get up every morning and want
00:36:56
to go to work getting paids an
00:36:59
incidental um but I probably stayed too
00:37:02
long because I was just physically burnt
00:37:05
out uh and because that was where I
00:37:08
first became aware of and I I told you I
00:37:11
like to see things as they really really
00:37:14
are and I would describe it I suddenly
00:37:16
realized I was a bit of a high priest I
00:37:18
mean I can remember somethingone saying
00:37:19
to me I go to meetings of public
00:37:21
servants and they're trying to think up
00:37:22
of what awards they can make to give to
00:37:25
you and I suddenly realized I had
00:37:27
certainly amongst the government cicles
00:37:29
and the Morning Report
00:37:31
listeners um I was a celebrity but then
00:37:35
I looked at some of the editorial
00:37:37
decisions we were making and some of the
00:37:38
way rnz ran I thought this isn't as
00:37:42
straight as it should be and I kind of
00:37:45
became a ghost in the
00:37:48
machine and I had some pretty nasty
00:37:52
things done to me by management there
00:37:55
and I could see the politics of why they
00:37:57
were trying to get rid of me and I dug
00:37:58
my feet up what's sort of nasty stuff oh
00:38:02
I had
00:38:03
a I had a private conversation with a
00:38:07
manager at my home
00:38:09
recorded and then a selective transcript
00:38:12
linked to another manager to try and get
00:38:13
that manager to fire me and I took the
00:38:16
chief executive of Radio New Zealand I
00:38:18
took a dispute against her I never asked
00:38:20
for any money I asked for her to admit
00:38:22
that she'd done it and apologize and she
00:38:25
did but I thought that would be the end
00:38:27
of it no for the next 5 years you know
00:38:30
once a month I had a uh QC on retainer
00:38:33
once a month they were trying to find
00:38:34
some way to fire me and the wonderful
00:38:36
thing was all the people I worked with
00:38:38
in the
00:38:39
program knew what was going on
00:38:43
and they didn't push me out it was a
00:38:46
different battle I thought and I'm a
00:38:48
pretty stubborn
00:38:50
bastard and I can remember actually
00:38:52
Linda Clark who knew what was going on
00:38:54
she was working um doing 9: to noon then
00:38:57
and she wed past one day she said I
00:38:59
don't know how you do it I don't know
00:39:01
how you survive it but it was
00:39:04
bloody-mindedness and after seven years
00:39:06
and they couldn't get rid of me I just
00:39:07
said I'm tired and I need to go and do
00:39:08
something else you know so you just
00:39:11
stayed there that long because of your
00:39:13
stubbornness flipping in the and I
00:39:15
didn't want the cancel culture I didn't
00:39:17
want the Pricks to win right and this is
00:39:19
pre sort of cancel culture as we know
00:39:22
yeah yeah internal you could see
00:39:25
underneath and this is the problem the
00:39:27
media in general and this is why there's
00:39:29
no trust I can remember a political
00:39:31
editor at Radio New Zealand one election
00:39:34
there was an issue that was running and
00:39:35
I was doing very very hard interviews
00:39:37
with the minister of the ground that was
00:39:39
clearly damaging Labor's polling they
00:39:41
were the government at the time was
00:39:42
Helen Clark and I got hauled aside by
00:39:45
the radio New Zealand politican taught
00:39:47
me for a coffee and he said you've got
00:39:48
to lay off Maran Hobs and I said why he
00:39:51
said we could lose and I said what do
00:39:54
you mean we and he said well the Govern
00:39:57
we could lose the election and I just
00:39:59
said to him mate never haul me for
00:40:02
you're paying for the [ __ ] coffee and
00:40:03
never say that to me again and I
00:40:06
suddenly realized the inherent bias that
00:40:09
was accepted and is accepted now at
00:40:11
places like TV andz and rnz and I'm
00:40:14
sorry news Hub and everywhere else and
00:40:16
it's not impartial
00:40:19
journalism I don't know that we can ever
00:40:21
be truly impartial as individuals but
00:40:23
that should be the goal man we shouldn't
00:40:26
abandon that as a good idea if you want
00:40:28
to you know be fair and be trusted why
00:40:31
does no one trust the media cuz they're
00:40:33
not freaking trustworthy you
00:40:35
know yeah yeah yeah yeah it feels like
00:40:39
there that was um I don't know at least
00:40:42
from an outside as a casual Outsiders
00:40:44
perspective it feels like um after
00:40:45
Morning Report there was almost like a
00:40:47
like a change in you like a pivot would
00:40:49
that be fair to say it feels like you
00:40:50
were this you were the sort of
00:40:54
straight I wasn't the ghost in the
00:40:56
machine anymore
00:40:57
and because I'd rejected the idea of
00:40:59
being this constructed sort of
00:41:01
cheerleader for stuff I didn't believe
00:41:03
in what cancel culture does and what
00:41:06
power structures do if you're not with
00:41:08
them you're against them so I suddenly
00:41:11
got painted as the Nazi as the right
00:41:13
ring as the misogynist it was complete
00:41:15
[ __ ] but that's what happens to
00:41:18
people that's how cultures work that's
00:41:20
how societies coer and control people so
00:41:23
I went to
00:41:25
ZB uh and enjoyed there doing a regional
00:41:28
show and then I went to live and then
00:41:30
magic and kick around a bit in
00:41:33
between
00:41:34
um and I
00:41:37
guess and I'll be honest the left people
00:41:39
on the left chose to paint me into a
00:41:41
corner and there were a couple
00:41:43
individuals who who waged personal
00:41:45
campaigns against me this guy David fer
00:41:48
who makes these weird movies with public
00:41:50
money um The Campaign he ran against
00:41:54
me and still runs against me to this day
00:41:57
and his funny little web stack thing is
00:41:59
the most bizarre piece of character
00:42:02
assassination I've ever seen you do you
00:42:05
do have a neck of getting under some
00:42:06
people's skins well I don't know why I
00:42:08
hardly ever met the guy yeah is there
00:42:11
any personal dealings no I met him once
00:42:14
I think when I couldn't I got kicked out
00:42:16
of some film doing or was ages ago but
00:42:18
he's really got an issue with me and I
00:42:20
don't know why what what about um other
00:42:22
enemies is is Patty G an enemy no pett
00:42:25
fire is that is that Friendly Fire well
00:42:27
look look we're all in the game we are
00:42:30
all in the game and what's you know no
00:42:33
news is bad news and as I said my whole
00:42:36
life I've got this thing I tend to for
00:42:38
some reason I'm a lightning rod for good
00:42:40
and bad um so when you say there was
00:42:43
that change in me there was because I'd
00:42:45
walked
00:42:46
away from playing the old
00:42:49
game and it was far less
00:42:52
comfortable it was far less
00:42:54
establishment but I could still sleep
00:42:56
straight in my bed at night right was it
00:42:58
a case of s not wanting to tow the
00:42:59
company line anymore well not the
00:43:01
company line wanting to be true to the
00:43:03
ideals I guess that my dad had instilled
00:43:06
me and that life had instilled me is
00:43:08
that you try and be straight and honest
00:43:09
with people have real
00:43:12
conversations um you are not nasty to
00:43:14
the PE people just for being
00:43:17
nasty and you report fairly inaccurate
00:43:20
and not people say both sides of a story
00:43:23
any story has more than two sides all
00:43:26
you're looking for is the truth you know
00:43:29
and that really and even doing a talk
00:43:32
back show in Cy about current affairs is
00:43:34
journalism I'm still looking for the
00:43:36
truth and the great thing is that people
00:43:38
who are listening know that and they
00:43:41
know you know I think we're in moment
00:43:43
we're at a moment in our culture where
00:43:46
people suddenly realize it's okay to say
00:43:49
look the emperor's got no clothes and I
00:43:52
think maybe for the last seven or eight
00:43:53
years everyone was too afraid to say
00:43:56
that M and it's a neat change you know
00:43:59
but there have been some like um some
00:44:00
some moments that sort of I suppose like
00:44:02
spikes where you you cross over into
00:44:05
mainstream for things you've you've said
00:44:07
and done and like one of them that
00:44:08
Springs to mind is the the Tweet um
00:44:11
about Harvey W and and that was and I
00:44:14
think that was the first social media
00:44:16
cancellation right of and I think that
00:44:19
led to things sort of going off it live
00:44:22
and I did kind of do it as a social
00:44:25
experiment but dun can grieve in the
00:44:26
spin off just piled in on that and I
00:44:30
also realized I had people who was I was
00:44:32
trying to deal with in ministries who
00:44:35
were retweeting it and I see I said what
00:44:37
the f are you doing and it was clearly a
00:44:40
tweet that was designed to be taken many
00:44:42
different ways I said is anyone else
00:44:44
feeling for Harvey
00:44:45
Weinstein yeah by the way feeling
00:44:49
what and I was just watching and he was
00:44:52
being cancelled on a global scale and it
00:44:55
was an example of just how powerful this
00:44:58
new monster of social media interaction
00:45:01
was so it was an observation but
00:45:04
suddenly as K Coach Works the people who
00:45:08
have issues with me decided I was Harvey
00:45:11
Weinstein but we what I can remember
00:45:13
being interviewed by a guy Adam duding
00:45:16
who was doing a profile on me he said
00:45:18
and he said in have you ever sexually
00:45:20
assaulted someone or anything I said no
00:45:23
of course I haven't I trying to draw a
00:45:26
correlation between your tweet and but
00:45:28
why would you even dip your toe in that
00:45:29
water oh hell because you're a [ __ ]
00:45:34
Ste it's a free country you're allowed
00:45:37
to say anything you want aren't you yeah
00:45:41
you are well you are but then yeah you
00:45:44
and if anyone if anyone is freaking
00:45:46
stupid enough to think that makes me a
00:45:48
monster then they're idiots but it was
00:45:51
that did have probably for me massive
00:45:54
consequences and I still meet people who
00:45:57
say now that I've met you you're not at
00:45:59
all the person that I thought you were
00:46:03
yeah and there's nothing I can do about
00:46:05
there and in this modern day there's
00:46:07
nothing any of us can do about it you
00:46:10
know um David F still writes the
00:46:13
craziest [ __ ] about me and I suppose I
00:46:15
could sue him for defamation he
00:46:17
threatened sue me for defamation said he
00:46:18
definitely would and he never
00:46:22
did wouldn't wouldn't your life be just
00:46:24
so much so much more more tranquil
00:46:26
though with without these little these
00:46:28
little fires to put out or I I get the
00:46:30
feeling you quite enjoy it well it's
00:46:32
like a
00:46:34
sport is
00:46:37
it life's not
00:46:40
boring life's not boring it be so much
00:46:43
easier yes so the Weinstein thing so you
00:46:45
you just got a job as one of the the
00:46:48
panel or whatever on the broadcasting
00:46:49
standards Authority and then they oh now
00:46:52
so that was weird so I go to my first
00:46:54
BSA
00:46:55
meeting and we've got
00:46:58
a a petition from action station online
00:47:01
which is a branch of the green
00:47:04
party and I'm talking to these other
00:47:06
board members and I said yeah we'll just
00:47:08
carry on with the meeting and they all
00:47:09
these people are saying this in Social
00:47:11
so so what and I sat in that meeting it
00:47:14
just became obvious to me I was sitting
00:47:16
around with a bunch of people with no
00:47:18
guts who were going to be influenced by
00:47:20
and I said you can't figure out a way
00:47:22
out of this CU you can't find me because
00:47:24
I'm appointed by the governor general
00:47:25
and they and I said but you don't want
00:47:28
to support me do you said I'm going to
00:47:30
make it easy for you said I'm going to
00:47:33
resign CU I'm not making the boat go
00:47:35
faster I said now I'm probably going to
00:47:38
have to write the press release for you
00:47:40
because otherwise you st yeah that'd be
00:47:42
really helpful so shortest career on the
00:47:44
BSA ever um and you
00:47:48
know what did I lose by that I got a
00:47:51
life experience I learned something
00:47:52
about structures I don't know was was
00:47:56
has that been a challenging time though
00:47:57
was that a challenging time or oh yeah
00:48:01
yeah I think it was I I think I sent you
00:48:03
a DM at the time I don't know I don't
00:48:04
have Twitter or any any more challenging
00:48:07
than anything else probably not actually
00:48:10
what what is the biggest adversity
00:48:12
you've gone
00:48:13
through personal or
00:48:16
professional I think the hardest thing
00:48:18
I've ever done is be a
00:48:20
dad
00:48:22
um and without a portioning blame I
00:48:25
think anyone who's had and gone through
00:48:27
a divorce when I look at it those are
00:48:30
probably that is because I think we
00:48:32
build up expectations as we want to do
00:48:35
better than our parents did towards us
00:48:36
and everything and I think having
00:48:39
divorce and that feeling of letting your
00:48:41
kids down is bloody difficult and
00:48:45
I'm uh and my ex and the whole family
00:48:47
are way out the other end of it now but
00:48:49
when I look
00:48:50
back um I think geez that was you know
00:48:53
that was a hard time you so you you've
00:48:55
only been married the one time just the
00:48:57
one and just the one son and one son
00:48:59
who's in his like mid late 20 mid 20s
00:49:01
yeah yeah yeah um how long were you
00:49:03
married um well I was with my partner
00:49:05
for 14 years yeah it's [ __ ] hard hey
00:49:08
it's hard I um yeah I'm the same as you
00:49:11
I'm one down yeah um and it's hard you
00:49:14
feel like a failure and also I got to
00:49:16
say my job
00:49:18
made and my public
00:49:21
notoriety made then and still makes
00:49:24
relationships bloody difficult does it
00:49:27
cuz people say to your partners oh what
00:49:28
are you seeing what are you doing and or
00:49:31
they say or you should do this you
00:49:33
should stop doing that you shouldn't say
00:49:35
that well you never say that to Sean
00:49:37
plank I'm just going to say it louder
00:49:39
aren't I
00:49:42
um oh God so that public Persona yeah um
00:49:47
which isn't me um can't help but seep
00:49:50
into your private life well and it seeps
00:49:52
into your private life and you know I'm
00:49:55
not
00:49:56
it it it's just bloody difficult you
00:49:58
know because people do have a perception
00:50:01
of you and everyone else is telling them
00:50:04
their opinion of their partner and it
00:50:06
can be quite difficult you know but do
00:50:08
you do you believe everything you you
00:50:10
say or is a lot of it done to I mean you
00:50:12
understand you got to listen very
00:50:14
carefully because sometimes I'm not
00:50:16
taking a position I'm just throwing it
00:50:19
out there to see what happens and yes
00:50:21
it's sometimes it's
00:50:23
provocative a lot of a lot of what you
00:50:25
say is very very very tongue and cheek
00:50:27
like maybe wouldn't necessarily work in
00:50:29
print form but on as an audio medium uh
00:50:32
you can definitely see that you're
00:50:34
you're taking the P but um I yeah you've
00:50:36
been doing this game a long time so I
00:50:37
know you understand like the importance
00:50:39
of you I've never been sued for
00:50:42
defamation I think I've only had one BSA
00:50:45
complaint upheld against me in 40 years
00:50:47
with literally hundreds of thousands of
00:50:48
interviews so I think I'm doing all
00:50:50
right but it is often you have to listen
00:50:53
carefully
00:50:55
um sometimes it feels like like it's a
00:50:57
standup comedy routine and it's
00:50:59
observational humor um that I'm doing on
00:51:02
the radio because there is nothing more
00:51:05
bizarre and weird than life itself in a
00:51:09
lot of instances that that is true I I
00:51:11
am I think you're a fantastic
00:51:12
interviewer like you you have this
00:51:14
ability to um just like dismantle people
00:51:18
um well love dismantling I always look
00:51:20
and say there's only limited time my
00:51:22
audience only has limited
00:51:24
time I only have limited time report our
00:51:27
interviews are 5 minutes long we had to
00:51:28
get to the Kel of the story and after
00:51:31
doing all those interviews I can tell
00:51:33
when someone is beaten around the
00:51:35
freaking Bush and is never going to get
00:51:37
point in about four words and I get
00:51:40
accused of being too um of interrupting
00:51:42
people too much I know when someone's
00:51:45
talking [ __ ] and I'm trying to get
00:51:46
them back online it's not being rude
00:51:48
it's just if you're going to front up
00:51:50
let's not waste everyone's freaking time
00:51:52
let's get to the point you know so it's
00:51:55
not aggression
00:51:57
um and my I look I'm like this with my
00:52:00
family my mom will start saying
00:52:02
something I said for God's sake get to
00:52:04
the
00:52:06
point oh my God you know you must be a
00:52:09
nightmare you know people who start well
00:52:10
I was that the other day or you ask
00:52:12
somebody to question and they start way
00:52:13
over here to get to the answer to your
00:52:15
question and yeah it is I my my my
00:52:19
partner does that when she she tells
00:52:21
stories and she'll be introducing names
00:52:22
of characters that are unnecessary the
00:52:25
radio guy in me is thinking could do
00:52:27
but I just bite my tongue whereas you'd
00:52:29
probably say it good story is a short
00:52:30
story you know yeah but um no I like I
00:52:35
think you're you're a fantastic
00:52:36
interviewer and fantastic debator um you
00:52:39
yeah you've you've got this neack where
00:52:41
you can almost like give people enough
00:52:43
rope to hang themselves in a way I don't
00:52:45
know what was what was the Jordan
00:52:46
Peterson thing I I remember because I
00:52:48
saw you the when we started was it was
00:52:51
this on the platform was this when
00:52:52
you're on Magic Live magic it was live
00:52:55
it might have been Magic Talk we were in
00:52:57
The Flower Street
00:52:59
Studio I think it was what what happened
00:53:01
there I remember there was a big thing
00:53:02
with well he was coming we were setting
00:53:05
up magic it was here we were setting up
00:53:08
magic and I thought who would who would
00:53:11
be the
00:53:12
greatest you know what would be the best
00:53:15
hit for this audience that I could get
00:53:16
and I'd been watching a bit of this guy
00:53:18
Jordan Peterson and been following the
00:53:21
controversy and being involved in Canada
00:53:23
and then I saw he was on a speaking tour
00:53:25
and I said to my producer I want him I
00:53:27
want him he's coming to newand I want to
00:53:29
get an interview with him and he's
00:53:32
notoriously difficult like all people
00:53:34
like that to get on so I basically told
00:53:38
Mary she was useless she hadn't got the
00:53:41
interview but then a group in Oakland
00:53:43
came out and put out this press release
00:53:45
that his visit represented a threat to
00:53:47
everything decent about New
00:53:49
Zealand and they were a group involved
00:53:52
in some pretty nasty activities hard
00:53:54
left a Liberation League or something
00:53:57
some bloody thing or peace activist
00:53:59
Oakland and I found that they had
00:54:02
terrorized elderly people by putting
00:54:03
fake bombs and movie theaters and stuff
00:54:06
like that and they fronted to do an
00:54:08
interview with me a guy who was
00:54:10
transitioning I don't know which way but
00:54:13
he was somewhere in the
00:54:14
middle um and I did an interview with
00:54:16
him and literally he just hung himself
00:54:20
it was a train wreck and I didn't even
00:54:22
have to try hard I was sitting there
00:54:23
having a coffee saying Okay so
00:54:26
and so I deconstructed him that
00:54:28
interview and someone sent it to Jordan
00:54:31
Peterson then the phone went my phone
00:54:34
goes and he goes hello Jordan Peterson
00:54:36
here I've just watched you you know that
00:54:39
interview that's better than what I did
00:54:40
with Kathy Newman which was a big
00:54:42
interview he did where he deconstructed
00:54:44
a journalist he said what do you want I
00:54:46
said I want you on air for an hour
00:54:48
tomorrow I want you to take calls so we
00:54:50
did a video link out of Sydney and that
00:54:54
at the mo I think two weeks later that
00:54:56
it had 833 th000 views on YouTube yeah
00:54:59
it was a big interview it was like a
00:55:00
podcast right it was like a podcast um
00:55:04
and that was really interesting that
00:55:05
showed me the kind of power of the get
00:55:08
or doing things right and that was a big
00:55:10
thing and I think once again though
00:55:11
because it was Jordan Peterson all the
00:55:14
detractors suddenly put me in a you know
00:55:17
put me in a box with him yeah CU I am I
00:55:20
I I was talking to you outside the um
00:55:22
the Jordan Peterson show I didn't
00:55:23
realize there was a big um controversy
00:55:25
about him like I I bought I bought his
00:55:27
book um 12 rules for life at an airport
00:55:29
and I read it and I thought it was
00:55:30
fantastic then my friend Matt Heath
00:55:33
fromi he he had tickets to the Sha and
00:55:35
invited me to go and there were
00:55:36
protesters outside I had no idea of the
00:55:38
Scandal I thought the was magic in the
00:55:40
culture wars he is one of the major
00:55:42
protagonists right in the you know well
00:55:45
because he's he's considered to be
00:55:47
transphobic in some sort to be a n he's
00:55:50
a na mate you didn't realize NY right
00:55:52
did you not see this right um and I
00:55:57
think we've I've deliberately
00:55:59
engaged in those sorts of issues in New
00:56:01
Zealand and in New Zealand we don't you
00:56:04
know I just understand you know mate we
00:56:07
don't actually engage in those things I
00:56:09
think that's changed a bit so we've kind
00:56:11
of Lent on on the platform to the debate
00:56:14
over puberty block blockers and the
00:56:16
Medical Treatments we give people who've
00:56:17
got gender dysphoria those are
00:56:19
legitimate debates to have but we had
00:56:22
been living in a culture where you just
00:56:24
couldn't question the liberal
00:56:26
orthodoxies of things like that or I'm
00:56:29
sorry you
00:56:30
know gender quotas or yes Mari language
00:56:34
on the TV news Etc these are things that
00:56:36
are debatable
00:56:38
points um and a good Society debates
00:56:42
them uh it doesn't say you're not
00:56:44
allowed to think like that or you'll get
00:56:47
cancelled you know that was the world we
00:56:50
were living in and I I think it's
00:56:51
changing you know but I'll give you
00:56:53
another example taky Carson was out
00:56:55
Aussie um just
00:56:57
recently uh his people approached me and
00:56:59
wanted me to facilitate and be like
00:57:03
Prime naming right sponsor for Tu
00:57:05
Carlson doing a New Zealand league so
00:57:08
they wanted the platform in on it and we
00:57:09
thought really hard about that and I
00:57:11
said actually you know what that's not
00:57:14
my core business everyone can get taker
00:57:16
Carlson and see what he says on the
00:57:18
internet I've got no particular School
00:57:20
set and booking you know a venue for X
00:57:23
th000 people and I would just be cailing
00:57:26
on his
00:57:28
momentary Global
00:57:30
celebrity so we kind of walked away from
00:57:33
that and also I got to say I looked at
00:57:34
some of the stuff taky Carlson does and
00:57:36
he's a bit of a
00:57:37
nut yeah I saw some clips on YouTube
00:57:39
from Australia and um yes he kind of
00:57:42
lost me a bit with some of his um ad
00:57:44
stuff like when talked about her teeth
00:57:47
and just some P some personal one thing
00:57:50
and people may not get it I you know I
00:57:52
see a lot of that um and I see a lot and
00:57:55
we get texting we get people trying to
00:57:57
say it on here and look I don't care if
00:58:00
you don't like dinder or if you didn't
00:58:02
like your policies or you didn't want
00:58:04
happen do the co lockdown but there's no
00:58:07
reason to call anyone freaking names you
00:58:09
must have a pretty lousy argument if all
00:58:11
you can do is berate someone because of
00:58:14
their physical appearance or or behave
00:58:16
like a school child
00:58:19
so and I I got admit sometimes I get
00:58:21
pissed off because I think I'm bracketed
00:58:23
in with those people I'd never use that
00:58:26
against someone I'd have an argument
00:58:27
with them ask some questions I'd have a
00:58:29
debate with them but name calling and
00:58:31
finger pointing is just bloody
00:58:32
ridiculous and it's lazy and social
00:58:35
media is [ __ ] into it isn't it in a
00:58:37
huge way yeah yeah well yeah I'm pretty
00:58:41
sure I've seen some stuff on line about
00:58:42
you like oh yeah oh no I think the best
00:58:44
one was someone wishing that I and my
00:58:46
son could be fed into a wood
00:58:49
chipper right so I've had death threats
00:58:51
I get so I'm a little bit cynical with
00:58:53
politic oh I did the shoplifting because
00:58:55
I st and someone made death threat
00:58:57
against me that just comes with the
00:58:59
freaking territory honestly it shouldn't
00:59:01
though right no but it does that's the
00:59:04
reality and that's the reality of social
00:59:06
media and how it's changed you know
00:59:10
everything and people
00:59:12
are here's an example of how it work I
00:59:14
got banned off Twitter apparently at
00:59:16
some stage which was gleefully reported
00:59:19
by all the Legacy Media that I've been
00:59:20
banned off Twitter when I got banned off
00:59:22
Twitter I had 6 and a half thousand
00:59:24
followers
00:59:26
and that was about a year and a half ago
00:59:27
I now have 25,000 Twitter followers so I
00:59:30
don't know how I got unbanned I just got
00:59:32
unbanned Elon and then B it takes off
00:59:37
but I must admit I spend less time on
00:59:39
social media than I used to and I
00:59:40
recognize that it can be bloody
00:59:42
corrosive and it can waste a lot of time
00:59:45
yeah would does Twitter add something to
00:59:47
your life or do you think your life
00:59:48
would be better it adds less less and
00:59:49
less um I do use it for news it is a
00:59:53
place strangely enough when something
00:59:54
happens someone of those 25,000 people
00:59:59
is going to know about it so it actually
01:00:00
very is a very good tool for breaking
01:00:02
news I you know I I learn of breaking
01:00:06
stories most often on
01:00:07
Twitter but I am I now monitor how many
01:00:11
hours I'm on social media day and I'm
01:00:13
trying to get it down from
01:00:15
8 it's a big time waste right it's a
01:00:18
Vortex you can be stuck there for hour I
01:00:20
look at people walking up and down the
01:00:22
street scrolling away look at their
01:00:23
phones there are people there to talk to
01:00:25
you know there are real people out there
01:00:27
and I reckon like one of the
01:00:28
government's best policies is Banning
01:00:29
smartphones and schools I reckon that is
01:00:31
an absolute a idea and there are there's
01:00:36
research in the
01:00:37
states that and we're about five or six
01:00:40
years behind increas in self harm
01:00:43
self-loathing of young women in
01:00:44
particular is all because of so their
01:00:46
exposure to social media through their
01:00:49
smartphones um people aren't living in
01:00:51
the real world and they're having this
01:00:52
unrealistic idea of you know they want
01:00:55
to be influencers or whatever content
01:00:58
creators it's YouTubers it's a whole
01:01:01
career path is and I know people who are
01:01:04
really serious about I just you are
01:01:06
insane yeah
01:01:09
um I don't know if you want to um get
01:01:12
into much personal stuff but um there's
01:01:14
a um an amazing clip online that I
01:01:16
watched yesterday from you a couple of
01:01:18
years ago it was almost like an onia
01:01:20
live o bittery for your brother yeah um
01:01:23
is that one of the hardest voice breaks
01:01:24
you've done in your life
01:01:26
it just happened um and I had to say
01:01:30
something um and that was almost two
01:01:32
years ago to the day actually yeah
01:01:36
um
01:01:38
and you know you you do a lot of stories
01:01:41
about people who commit suicide or take
01:01:43
their own lives
01:01:44
it's when it's someone you know that
01:01:47
close to you it's something else and
01:01:49
there was still to be honest some
01:01:50
Downstream of that in the next week or
01:01:53
two um some Downstream what do you mean
01:01:55
oh well the coronus report looked into
01:02:00
um uh how he obtained the means to kill
01:02:03
himself and it was part of an
01:02:04
international story there's a guy in
01:02:07
Canada who was facing multiple charges
01:02:10
Murder One charges in
01:02:12
Canada for basically on the dark web
01:02:14
having a site
01:02:16
and um he was selling suicide kits
01:02:20
online and posting them out around the
01:02:22
world Jes um and hundreds of people have
01:02:24
taken their lives through his stuff and
01:02:26
that's all the question about how do we
01:02:28
monitor the internet do we censor that
01:02:31
stuff um but to be honest n none of that
01:02:34
will bring you know James back yeah yeah
01:02:38
tell us about James he was he's my half
01:02:40
brother um and James like a lot of
01:02:43
people in Co he was a personal trainer
01:02:44
and a DJ So Co was not the greatest time
01:02:47
for him J you two could not be any
01:02:50
different could you I know James was a
01:02:52
very talented guy and he he was a great
01:02:54
talker he was a f
01:02:56
talker
01:02:58
um but um that was yeah that was a
01:03:01
pretty challenging time and what
01:03:02
happened was I went to his funeral and
01:03:05
the next day I had a heart
01:03:07
attack and suddenly realized i' been
01:03:10
setting up the platform where a thing
01:03:12
called atrial fibrillation which is just
01:03:14
a natural condition which is now fixed
01:03:17
so when I looked back and think actually
01:03:19
it was quite a two years ago was we were
01:03:21
getting things going things were quite
01:03:22
rugged but I was still having a good
01:03:24
time you get through the things don't
01:03:26
you somehow um yeah know but the way you
01:03:28
structured that voice break was really
01:03:29
good you sort of you do it like it's um
01:03:31
a news story and you're just reporting a
01:03:34
sudden death and then um then you sort
01:03:36
of break the fourth wall down and say oh
01:03:38
you know it was my brother and it would
01:03:39
just be another news story but it's yeah
01:03:42
that's really really touching and quite
01:03:43
poyant well I sat there and thought well
01:03:45
there I couldn't I didn't script that I
01:03:48
had a vague idea of what I was going to
01:03:51
say and I sat there and I'd really
01:03:53
wondered whether I was going to do it or
01:03:54
say anything
01:03:56
and I just did and I spoke Straight From
01:03:59
the Heart and the truth be told now on
01:04:02
the platform
01:04:04
because we're working on the Forum I
01:04:06
there's no script in that studio ever
01:04:09
everything I do is head is straight off
01:04:12
the top I might read a story off the
01:04:14
screen and everything but we don't have
01:04:16
scripts intros outros it is all as it
01:04:19
happens how much prep do you do
01:04:24
well I am probably 24 hours a day
01:04:27
somewhere in the news cycle in my
01:04:30
head so I would say actually I never
01:04:32
really turn off it now integrates into
01:04:35
how I live my life so I wouldn't say I
01:04:37
start work or I sit down and pray for
01:04:39
the
01:04:40
show I check Twitter before I go to
01:04:42
sleep at night um I've got news feeds on
01:04:45
my phone and I come in in the morning
01:04:47
and I scroll down so I don't know it's
01:04:51
just never s it's second it's second
01:04:53
nature now really and you know you want
01:04:55
to talk about personal things I don't
01:04:57
know I don't know that I have a personal
01:04:59
life I have my life and everything's
01:05:01
integrated but it's taken me a long time
01:05:04
to get there and I think one of the
01:05:06
things I philosophically have struggled
01:05:08
with in my life is and I think we all do
01:05:11
who am I am I this person on the radio
01:05:13
am I this person goes to work am I the
01:05:15
person in relationship I'm with the
01:05:16
father and I think the trick is you've
01:05:19
just got to be what you are um I've also
01:05:22
suffered um most of my life with extreme
01:05:25
anxiety
01:05:28
um which my entire family seemed to be
01:05:31
uh predisposed
01:05:32
towards and my answer to that used to be
01:05:35
to just work harder and harder and
01:05:37
harder and keep going and not
01:05:39
stop and I have for the first time my
01:05:42
life in the last two or three years got
01:05:43
to a place where I'm a way more chill
01:05:47
person than I've ever been before and I
01:05:50
do not sweat the small stuff anymore I
01:05:52
don't get outraged by things and I just
01:05:55
let the world unfold around me but it's
01:05:57
taken an awful 60 years yeah 60 years
01:06:00
Jes i' when I was 25 um I probably
01:06:04
wouldn't have put myself or a whole lot
01:06:05
of other people through the shot that I
01:06:07
did you know other people is in oh just
01:06:11
people around me I could be a real I I
01:06:13
can be a pain up the ass i a p up the
01:06:15
ass yeah are you are you a debater at
01:06:17
home like are you well this just me at
01:06:21
home but look I talk to you know my
01:06:25
bendus I'm talking to people all day
01:06:27
every day and I have arguments with my
01:06:29
friends and agreements with my friends
01:06:31
and family arguments as an as an um like
01:06:35
healthy
01:06:36
debate that's bullsh you're wrong about
01:06:38
that you know um oh that's fun though
01:06:40
that's and that's fun that's sport for
01:06:41
you yeah yeah as long as it's Friendly
01:06:43
Fire it's like you know bantering with
01:06:45
someone about a you know sports game or
01:06:48
whatever how's how's your mental health
01:06:50
you you battled with depression well I
01:06:51
said I've battled anxiety and
01:06:53
generalized anxiety disorder all my life
01:06:55
and I've had SPS of quite severe
01:06:57
depression um and uh drugs have never
01:07:00
worked for me anti-depressants have
01:07:01
never worked for me
01:07:04
um and as I say I don't know I just feel
01:07:07
happier than I have I drink a [ __ ] lad
01:07:09
less than I used to um and I'm not on a
01:07:12
go in this but a wower I'm giving up boo
01:07:16
um with my heart condition and a few
01:07:18
other things I just said okay that is
01:07:19
not a
01:07:21
productive that's not a productive
01:07:23
behavior when it becomes habitual like
01:07:25
that so I would drink maybe once a
01:07:27
fortnite um I can not one B but it's not
01:07:32
structured into part of my life I have
01:07:34
no alcohol at home at my home uh and I
01:07:36
haven't had any alcohol in my home for
01:07:38
about two years oh not a beer or
01:07:40
anything well the the sort of work that
01:07:42
you're taking on at the moment in terms
01:07:44
of doing the show and running this
01:07:45
organization and um you're leading 14
01:07:48
people you just you can't do that with a
01:07:50
cloudy head can you no no um but I'm not
01:07:54
a wower and I wouldn't say once you get
01:07:57
alcohol and it's evil people
01:07:59
just most people and you know I thought
01:08:02
obviously a lot about addiction um
01:08:05
because of what happened to
01:08:08
James um did he have addiction issues
01:08:11
yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah um quite
01:08:14
although you those um both those um
01:08:16
things you mentioned like DJing and
01:08:18
personal training yeah I think drugs are
01:08:20
quite rif in both those Industries AR
01:08:21
yeah yeah um but I think and I I look at
01:08:26
and I've had other people very close to
01:08:27
me that I've helped get into rehab and
01:08:29
have got through major drug
01:08:32
problems and most often it seems to me
01:08:35
addiction it is not the drug that is the
01:08:38
problem it is always the addict that has
01:08:40
a hole they trying to F right that's why
01:08:42
people take drugs escapism
01:08:45
escapism and until a person or an
01:08:49
individual is prepared to sit there with
01:08:51
themselves and have a look at the hole
01:08:53
inside them
01:08:55
um you're never going to solve them or
01:08:58
or fix them and it takes a while and I
01:09:00
think I probably think I've had a look
01:09:03
at the holes inside me and I'm slowly
01:09:05
filling them up with other stuff and and
01:09:08
not with you know not with a a quar of
01:09:10
whiskey or you know shoving something up
01:09:12
my nose yeah it takes um it does take a
01:09:15
while he like I'm I'm 51 now when I was
01:09:18
um like 20 or 30 I would have thought
01:09:19
you know 51 you see a 51 year old you
01:09:21
think they've got it all figured out and
01:09:23
then you realize that everyone's just
01:09:25
sort of like muddling their way and I
01:09:27
used to look at yeah I used to be the S
01:09:28
got 51 I'm still pretty [ __ ] at
01:09:31
this and look I might at 70 have a a
01:09:35
whole another level of karmic
01:09:38
awareness but I get I think the older
01:09:40
you get to you realize you cannot go
01:09:43
back and change the past you got to live
01:09:45
with whatever you have done or
01:09:46
whatever's happened to
01:09:48
you and you do get slightly more
01:09:51
effective but I look back even just
01:09:52
talking to you geez some whack stuff
01:09:55
happened to me I've had a really
01:09:57
interesting life and it's still going
01:09:59
you know yeah you've you've been through
01:10:01
some big battles yeah a lot lot of them
01:10:04
you got yourself
01:10:06
into I said the other day when news my
01:10:09
best day at work I got teargas I met
01:10:12
Nelson
01:10:13
Mandela before he was the prime minister
01:10:16
of South Africa and I introduced him to
01:10:17
Jim buer though Barry S say it was him I
01:10:20
say it was me then I went and got held
01:10:23
up at gunpoint turned around to gun
01:10:25
point with Mark Jennings at a roadblock
01:10:27
down the road in in Harari and we B back
01:10:30
went back the next day snuck into this
01:10:31
University and then we got tear Gast by
01:10:34
mcg's Riot police and we got footage of
01:10:36
all that and then we do stopped Robert
01:10:39
mcabby and that was a great day at work
01:10:41
wow that was a great day at
01:10:43
work wow and we won with that story we
01:10:47
won the first news award that TV3 ever W
01:10:50
for news coverage so that's what you got
01:10:52
to do to win an award yeah that's
01:10:55
extrem [ __ ] you know yeah and I was a
01:10:59
little bit sad that no one hoed that out
01:11:00
of the archive and played that um but
01:11:03
you know you know TV3 had changed by the
01:11:06
end quite quite drastically I think yeah
01:11:09
you quite drastically have have you ever
01:11:11
you ever done therapy or anything you
01:11:13
ever seen a therapist or what
01:11:17
no no listening to the show 7:00 weekday
01:11:22
mornings there's my
01:11:23
therapy and I've got these lovely people
01:11:26
who ring up and and help me out yeah no
01:11:29
you you're um but you like you're a
01:11:32
supremely talented man um yeah so I I
01:11:36
don't know maybe yeah if you into
01:11:38
therapy like it just gives you a
01:11:39
different way of like looking at things
01:11:40
which maybe you can't see yourself
01:11:42
sometimes I don't know I I I found it
01:11:44
quite beneficial for me when it's not
01:11:46
for everyone though yeah yeah but you're
01:11:48
yeah seems like you're in a good place
01:11:49
at the moment are you seeing anyone or
01:11:51
you you're riding Sol oh well look I I
01:11:53
describe it like this I'm single but I'm
01:11:54
not l
01:11:56
um and you know
01:12:00
um once again as you get older your
01:12:02
expectations I mean I've
01:12:04
done I've you know I'm a dad we've done
01:12:08
the kids I've had houses with people
01:12:10
I've
01:12:11
cohabitated um and there's not really
01:12:14
much room with everything else I'm doing
01:12:16
at the moment for that um
01:12:20
and you know I think you also when
01:12:22
you're younger you sit there am I going
01:12:23
to be alone and you Dre Yul worried
01:12:25
about being alone and yeah people say
01:12:28
it's like the worst thing that and it's
01:12:30
actually not I'm never alone you know I
01:12:33
can I can go to any City in this country
01:12:35
pick up the phone and catch up with
01:12:37
someone for a coffee and have an
01:12:39
interesting conversation I've never felt
01:12:40
less alone in my life but I've been
01:12:42
single for about I think five six years
01:12:45
and that's all right you know yeah
01:12:47
there's there's a big difference between
01:12:48
um being alone and being lonely he no
01:12:50
one wants to be lonely that's terrible
01:12:52
but but yeah being alone I I think um as
01:12:55
get older the longer you've been um on
01:12:57
your own you do kind of get stuck in
01:12:58
your ways and it's harder to I'm not
01:13:00
sure that I am ret
01:13:02
trable and probably the biggest thing I
01:13:05
got during Co I was working uh was
01:13:07
working for was it magic working for
01:13:09
live during the co
01:13:11
lockdown uh and I had my dog and my dog
01:13:14
died at the end of very end of the last
01:13:17
lockdown and I had to get him put down
01:13:19
He was 17 years old and and it was
01:13:21
always but I still bloody miss him um
01:13:25
and I do not even have time even say you
01:13:27
should get another dog I don't have time
01:13:29
to take care of a dog the way I would
01:13:31
want to with my current chedu but that's
01:13:34
they're hell of a lot easier to train
01:13:36
than girlfriend
01:13:37
stuff never answer back to I feel like
01:13:40
it's like having a kid that never does
01:13:42
anything to annoy you you know so the
01:13:44
natural progression of like being a
01:13:45
parent and having a kid by the time they
01:13:47
get to 16 17 18 you're ready for them to
01:13:49
[ __ ] off and they're ready to to leave
01:13:52
but look I've got to say too I think I
01:13:53
mean I look maybe with a little tinge of
01:13:56
regret or Envy at people and I know lots
01:13:58
of people have got good relationships in
01:14:00
their relationships uh their whole lives
01:14:04
um but it's not a must have you are not
01:14:06
an incomplete person if life doesn't
01:14:09
work that out that way for you um and
01:14:12
you know there's always you know Hope
01:14:14
Springs Eternal yeah do you still have a
01:14:17
like a cordial sort of relationship with
01:14:19
your your your son's mom she has been a
01:14:22
terrific mother and I think we all be
01:14:25
and it's funny isn't he saying I'm a
01:14:26
solo parent well there are two solo
01:14:28
parents you're never really a solo
01:14:29
parent there's always someone else is
01:14:31
the parent um but I think we had both
01:14:35
negotiated the difficulties of going
01:14:37
through that and most people
01:14:38
do uh pretty well and he's come out the
01:14:42
other end a complete and pretty good
01:14:44
decent human being and I couldn't have
01:14:46
done that without her and I hope she
01:14:50
would think she couldn't have done that
01:14:51
without me so you get there in the end
01:14:53
but I I look back
01:14:55
my parents got divorced way before it
01:14:57
was fashionable and I think they're only
01:14:59
two kids in a school of 500 people at
01:15:02
pan who everyone knew their parents were
01:15:05
divorced and we were one of them we were
01:15:07
absolutely the outliers but now I'd say
01:15:10
it's more likely that more people get
01:15:12
divorced than yeah it's at least 50/50
01:15:14
is it's at least 50/50 so the the whole
01:15:16
social stigma around it is different but
01:15:18
we were definitely at school we were the
01:15:21
kids of the solo M yeah you know yeah a
01:15:24
num standard three when my parents had a
01:15:26
break and I I remember being really
01:15:28
excited at the time because my best mate
01:15:30
Craig he was the only kid in the class
01:15:31
with divorced parents so that's all I
01:15:33
had to base it on and his dad would pick
01:15:35
him up every Friday and had have all
01:15:37
these new clothes and gifts on Monday so
01:15:39
I was like this is going to be amazing
01:15:41
but there know Dad's a tight ass so but
01:15:44
I'd say also you know when people talk
01:15:46
about misogyny one thing for
01:15:48
me that affected me I think very
01:15:51
deeply was watching my mother as a solo
01:15:54
mother
01:15:56
in a society and it was actually the
01:15:58
days before the dpb or anything
01:16:01
right and I look at the difficult
01:16:04
choices mom had to make and she did a
01:16:06
bloody good job with three of us kids
01:16:09
quite demanding kids and it
01:16:11
wasn't I had a pretty interesting
01:16:13
upbringing for various reasons because
01:16:15
mom got
01:16:16
pushed to the outside of society because
01:16:20
she wasn't married and she was a threat
01:16:23
to all her friends all her married women
01:16:26
friends oh she was going to steal the me
01:16:27
and Men looked at her in those days and
01:16:29
said she must be a woman of loose
01:16:31
virtue so Mom sort of became a hippie we
01:16:35
liveed quite a Bohemian and at times
01:16:37
very chaotic
01:16:39
lifestyle
01:16:41
um and I look that and think that's
01:16:44
because Mom was a woman and she lived in
01:16:45
a society which discriminated against
01:16:47
her in aund different
01:16:49
ways uh and I get I do get pissed off
01:16:52
when people say I'm a misogynist not I'm
01:16:54
a bloody feminist because I have lived
01:16:57
with the consequences of a patriarchal
01:16:59
society making it difficult for women to
01:17:03
care for their families and kids and it
01:17:05
that left a very deep impression on me
01:17:09
you know is your mom still around mom's
01:17:11
still around she's I think
01:17:13
83 later this month yeah she's still
01:17:16
actively engaged still active she's
01:17:17
living with my sister she lived with me
01:17:19
for a few years um and uh the brain cha
01:17:24
was attack the
01:17:25
um you know crapping out occasionally
01:17:28
um and and when I talked about Dad
01:17:31
influencing my career my life most
01:17:33
definitely I was brought up by my mother
01:17:35
and Mama's has been the I guess the
01:17:38
dominant um you know actually the
01:17:40
dominant for she got this out of me I've
01:17:42
never quite described it like that
01:17:44
before but mom mom brought me up Dad I
01:17:47
got to know you know when I entered the
01:17:50
same professional sphere as him I got to
01:17:52
know him better but really m more mate
01:17:55
relationship at that point is mom bought
01:17:57
us up and it was Bloody tough for her
01:17:59
because as I said she was a solo mom in
01:18:01
a
01:18:03
society that Bloody didn't treat women
01:18:06
well do did you you probably didn't
01:18:08
realize that at the time or did you
01:18:10
realize that at the time yeah I did
01:18:11
realize at at the time and I did realize
01:18:14
was wrong and it is heartbreaking you
01:18:16
know it really is um have you told her
01:18:20
as an adult that oh yeah yeah and all of
01:18:23
my brother and sister and I that three
01:18:25
the first batch of Dead's batch um we
01:18:29
we've we we've talked about a lot about
01:18:32
the the challenges of that and you know
01:18:34
we moved from plym which is a nice
01:18:37
little sent nor we moved to Peru because
01:18:39
Mom's economics cumstances changed but
01:18:42
Mom said no you are still going to pmon
01:18:44
school and you're going to catch the
01:18:46
train every day from per to pmon so we
01:18:49
were the only kids from P at plon school
01:18:51
but Mom insisted because she knew that
01:18:53
it was a really good school and we were
01:18:55
going to get good education there m so
01:18:57
you know she did a lot of and I look
01:18:59
back and we thought sometimes mom was
01:19:01
absolute crap to us I now you know you
01:19:05
realize yeah um just the Liv of
01:19:09
sacrifice just the Liv and how hard it
01:19:11
was I mean I can remember you know solo
01:19:13
Dad we had Joseph later in life and I
01:19:16
God it's hard being a while I was eing
01:19:18
good bloody money you know I had a solid
01:19:21
income and I was mature I looked at mom
01:19:24
she was in in her early 20s and she had
01:19:26
three
01:19:27
kids three tiny
01:19:30
kids that she was bringing up on her own
01:19:32
in a society that wasn't actually that
01:19:34
welcoming to her once she got divorced
01:19:36
and that's a hell of a thing you know
01:19:38
that's a hell of a bur to have done I
01:19:41
yeah yeah yeah well thanks for sharing
01:19:44
that you know yeah so um and so you
01:19:49
how's your health are you you okay the
01:19:52
heart is um the heart's way better so
01:19:55
when I went when I had my heart attack
01:19:57
two years ago my resting heart rate was
01:19:59
124 beats per minute is that good or bad
01:20:02
is that's is that quiet that's that's
01:20:05
like you're jogging all the time and I
01:20:07
wondered why I was tired all the time I
01:20:09
think it's cuz I get up at 5:30 and I
01:20:11
and I you know and I'm doing all this
01:20:13
work I then suddenly realized no it's
01:20:15
because I've just I've got this heart
01:20:18
condition and we had a couple of cracks
01:20:20
over the next year turning my heart on
01:20:22
and off again and then I had this um
01:20:24
procedure where they burnt out some of
01:20:26
the tissue of my heart cuz it was short
01:20:28
circuiting and my resting heart rate
01:20:30
average resting heart rate rate now is
01:20:32
68 beats per minute wow awesome so I've
01:20:35
got got a lot more energy but I also
01:20:38
struggle with um diabetes type two
01:20:42
diabetes and that's under control at the
01:20:44
moment but it hasn't always been you
01:20:46
know so you you don't need to inject
01:20:48
with insulin or yeah I I shoot up
01:20:50
insulin once a day and I take replace
01:20:52
the heroin and and I and I have about
01:20:55
six medication and it was funny I went
01:20:58
to a play the other night a um at cira
01:21:01
theater that Ross Made M Ross Jolly was
01:21:03
uh directing um and it was a Roger Hall
01:21:08
play his latest thing and I'm sitting in
01:21:11
this audience of people about my age and
01:21:13
this thing comes up on the screen of the
01:21:16
um the uh medicine's dispenser with all
01:21:19
the days of the week on it and everyone
01:21:21
laughed in recognition I thought I'm
01:21:22
laughing in recognition too I'm freaking
01:21:25
home one of the plastic containers you
01:21:28
had a double decker one or a sing double
01:21:31
a PM and every Sunday I get together I
01:21:34
load the thing up and I think God I'm
01:21:36
old but it's just what it is isn't it
01:21:38
and I guess I tell you what I do now
01:21:41
appreciate how important in a way I
01:21:43
didn't before I'd always been a pretty
01:21:45
robust guy I suddenly appreciate how
01:21:47
when people say your Health's important
01:21:50
it really is and guys in particular can
01:21:53
you know I I look at the abuse I gave to
01:21:56
my
01:21:56
body um and I suddenly realiz that is
01:21:59
actually now one of my focuses is
01:22:01
actually doing a bit more work on that
01:22:04
and you know sticking around because you
01:22:07
can reverse a lot of that stuff um oh
01:22:09
you still have the occasional cig i c
01:22:12
and God I damn it I hate it it is that
01:22:14
is my addiction how many a day would you
01:22:17
have ah I got down to like three and
01:22:21
then I can go up to 20 and then I can
01:22:23
slap a patch have a cigarette for a week
01:22:26
but it's habitual with me and oh Jesus
01:22:30
look I'm so embarrassed about it to be
01:22:31
honest are you are you really why it's
01:22:33
the dumbest freaking thing smoking is
01:22:35
the dumbest and I know I don't look like
01:22:37
[ __ ] James Bond or the MBR man I
01:22:40
don't I know it doesn't make me look
01:22:43
tough or rugged or cool despite all
01:22:45
those 50s movies with Robert Mitch and
01:22:48
them I know it's dumb and I still do it
01:22:50
and I'm angry at myself because that is
01:22:52
one it's not logical that's addiction
01:22:55
right I suppose it is yeah yeah yeah but
01:22:57
why could I be addicted to something
01:22:58
more
01:23:00
fun well you are like trolling people
01:23:03
online yeah what addictions do you have
01:23:05
so there smoking um trolling
01:23:10
well I think I was for a long time and I
01:23:12
think you get l in the game there is an
01:23:15
adrenaline Russian being live on here I
01:23:18
have a rule with my show down I never do
01:23:19
a pre-record everything we do is live in
01:23:22
the moment um and I do get it I'm
01:23:25
probably addicted to that I'm probably
01:23:28
addicted to the thrill of that and you
01:23:31
know sometimes I literally turn up there
01:23:33
and I've only got one or two interviews
01:23:35
and we got three hours to
01:23:36
fill and you know I think I don't know
01:23:39
how we're going to do this and I love
01:23:42
that that's really engaged um and that
01:23:45
is probably an addiction that I need to
01:23:46
Wing myself on it's hard like when you
01:23:49
told the story before about um you
01:23:51
Mandela and Tas and macabi like it's
01:23:54
it's it most things seem boring after
01:23:57
that you know what I mean like just it's
01:23:59
a level of excitement in your life yeah
01:24:01
like it's yeah it's tough um but I think
01:24:04
we all and I think also in this game and
01:24:08
I think you've seen it and I'm not going
01:24:10
to mention any names and I did this in
01:24:12
my
01:24:13
career um you get a little bit famous or
01:24:16
you think you're a little bit famous and
01:24:17
you disappear somewhere up your fuu
01:24:19
valve for a
01:24:21
while and you got to come out the other
01:24:23
end at some stage yeah yeah you know and
01:24:26
sometimes it's pretty bumpy coming out
01:24:28
the other end but you're a way better
01:24:30
person for IT um if you survive it and
01:24:34
that is life's journey you know and I
01:24:36
look at young people who are doing
01:24:37
incredibly well and I think there are
01:24:40
some very talented young journalists and
01:24:42
broadcasters around at the moment but I
01:24:45
still temper it with life experience and
01:24:47
say I kind of feel for them because you
01:24:51
know they are going to have to suffer
01:24:54
the crash at some stage and we all do no
01:24:58
one has a blessed upward trajectory all
01:25:02
the time uh career and I think about you
01:25:04
know Paul Henry up and down all over the
01:25:07
place and he's out of it now he's got
01:25:08
through it I looked at old Paul Holmes
01:25:10
and Paul Holmes was in our generation
01:25:12
right he was the 64,000
01:25:16
gorilla um and I ended up being quite
01:25:19
good friends with Paul for various
01:25:20
reasons I worked on a show for a bit I
01:25:22
did the only story ever that was
01:25:24
repeated due to public Demand on the
01:25:26
home show what was that it was I went
01:25:30
and made and I look back these were all
01:25:32
signals of what was to
01:25:34
come
01:25:35
um I made I went up to a little model
01:25:39
Railway up in
01:25:41
cap and I did the voice over like Ringo
01:25:44
Star and I did a thing called Thomas the
01:25:46
politically correct tankage and it was
01:25:48
just taking the piss out of political
01:25:50
correctness but this was back in the
01:25:52
'90s and we played it and then all these
01:25:55
people wrote Into the show said we want
01:25:56
to see that story again it was so funny
01:25:59
and it was the days before the internet
01:26:00
right yeah and then I found that they've
01:26:03
T they took that piece and it was being
01:26:05
taught um at the Christ use broadcasting
01:26:08
school as the way satirical journalism
01:26:11
could work I don't know I haven't seen
01:26:13
it since um how how the hell did I talk
01:26:17
about I don't know this parallels
01:26:18
between but holes but Holmes
01:26:21
was Holmes did get there and he was the
01:26:25
last he was the last vestage or the last
01:26:28
individual before the internet came and
01:26:32
busted traditional media and Legacy
01:26:35
Media apart and I think I can remember
01:26:38
thinging I want to be poor holes I want
01:26:40
to be the next poor homes and it took me
01:26:43
a while to realize there was never going
01:26:44
to be another poor homes and even if
01:26:46
there was you couldn't be someone else
01:26:49
that wasn't a good career trajectory to
01:26:51
want to be like someone else yeah cuz
01:26:52
you're only ever going to be the second
01:26:53
best po homes yeah that's right there's
01:26:56
there's a lot of parallels between you
01:26:57
and homsy I think hey um I don't know he
01:27:00
was wildly successful made a lot of
01:27:01
money and was on screen for years in one
01:27:04
show I don't think there's any parallels
01:27:05
unfortunately no they both um both
01:27:08
polarizing um both both like very very
01:27:12
intelligent and very sharp Paul Paul I
01:27:15
always needs the thing I don't know if
01:27:17
they've still got it in television the
01:27:18
star five rating and it's the secret
01:27:21
attitudinal research they do on um
01:27:24
on presenters and most often the
01:27:26
presenters never see it so it's deep
01:27:29
deep dark psychological research that
01:27:31
tells you where a presenter sits in the
01:27:34
audience's mind and my understanding
01:27:38
having talked to people who had access
01:27:39
to that stuff about home said it's
01:27:41
amazing everyone knows who he is so
01:27:44
absolute Market awareness and everyone
01:27:47
feels really strongly about him but
01:27:49
interestingly 50% of people hated him
01:27:52
and 50% of people loved him and there
01:27:54
was no one but there was nothing in
01:27:56
between and that's why he was so
01:27:58
successful because he created either
01:28:01
negative or positive emotional response
01:28:03
in people every time he was on screen
01:28:06
you know if you look if you look at all
01:28:07
the greats and i' I'd um put you in this
01:28:10
mix as well um they they all have that
01:28:12
they polarizing you know holes Henry
01:28:14
hosking even hether probably put hether
01:28:17
in that mix as well I think brilliant
01:28:19
Petty G you
01:28:20
know oh he is he polarizing he's he's
01:28:24
no he's I think he's quite widely loved
01:28:27
isn't he well equally not and depends
01:28:31
what it depends which Echo chamber
01:28:34
you're in yeah yeah right right you know
01:28:36
it really does but you cannot ignore him
01:28:39
yeah see I'd look at Patty I think his
01:28:42
leaders debates are the best lead they
01:28:44
were better than Holmes ones Patty has a
01:28:47
talent when he's got a live audience and
01:28:49
two politicians in front of him off
01:28:51
keeping what can be a very boring
01:28:53
formulation think really interesting I
01:28:55
still think he's done the
01:28:57
best um the best pre-election leaders
01:29:01
debates that I've ever seen on New
01:29:02
Zealand television and I told him that I
01:29:04
think last time I said you knowed it
01:29:06
again you know Patty yeah that's awesome
01:29:09
[ __ ] you guys might become
01:29:11
mates I would hate to I would hate to
01:29:15
think that there's anyone on the
01:29:18
C well I don't feel like I've got
01:29:20
enemies I've got people who don't
01:29:22
understand me or don't know me and I
01:29:24
always thought when I got into
01:29:27
this that I am part of a Continuum and I
01:29:30
looked up
01:29:32
to and I was talking about this on here
01:29:34
the other day I Johnson who was a great
01:29:36
interviewer and I got to know him Ian
01:29:39
Fraser uh Jeff who I work with for years
01:29:41
and had enormous and taught me an awful
01:29:43
lot and I'm just part of a Continuum of
01:29:46
people in the
01:29:47
media and I am no and I've had my career
01:29:50
thing Fair gu morning report and
01:29:52
everything and I've bumbled along since
01:29:55
and everyone else coming out behind me
01:29:56
is the next Generation
01:29:59
Um and that's what we're part of we're
01:30:01
part of this kind of circle that that
01:30:03
keeps on Reinventing itself yeah it's
01:30:06
exciting and it's exciting I think for
01:30:08
you being um 60 and being part of this
01:30:10
new wave yeah yeah um it's really
01:30:13
exciting and I can't wait to see where
01:30:14
the platform goes hey couple of quick
01:30:15
ones to finish with um are you proud of
01:30:19
yourself
01:30:21
um I'm proud of surviving
01:30:24
I hold myself to pretty high
01:30:27
standards and I'm more forgiving of
01:30:29
myself than I used to be when I said I
01:30:30
got rid of my anxiety I'm not so worried
01:30:32
about what other people think about me
01:30:34
and I'm way more gentle on myself than I
01:30:38
have ever been before in my life so yes
01:30:41
I'm satisfied with myself I wouldn't say
01:30:43
Pride that comes before a fall doesn't
01:30:45
it so you're you're in a voice as as
01:30:48
yeah you're quite kind to yourself now
01:30:50
yeah yeah much more so than I used to be
01:30:52
and your self-esteem uh pretty good yeah
01:30:55
pretty good but you know I don't want to
01:30:57
be complacent I've got a kind of
01:30:59
philosophy that I have you read a poem
01:31:01
called dayat no I'll show you deat
01:31:04
online after this and you can read it
01:31:06
and that's and that has helped me a lot
01:31:08
you know that philosophy so no I am I'm
01:31:12
am I satisfied no there's always
01:31:14
something more to do there's always
01:31:15
going to be another mountain to climb
01:31:18
it's exhausting eh but when you realize
01:31:20
that's the flow of life you just have to
01:31:22
just keep moving forward um what about
01:31:25
regrets
01:31:27
um oh
01:31:29
jeez don't get me started we haven't got
01:31:32
another hour um
01:31:35
regrets I left ZB too
01:31:38
early if I wanted to have a more
01:31:40
comfortable stable career I should have
01:31:43
stayed at ZB when I was doing the
01:31:44
Wellington show and not gone to radio
01:31:46
live and you know what I did it for the
01:31:48
freaking money and it's the only time
01:31:50
I'd ever moved for the money it was the
01:31:51
worst career move I ever if I look
01:31:54
and it doesn't seem big to you but for a
01:31:56
whole lot of reasons in my life that's
01:31:59
the worst career move I ever made and I
01:32:01
said it was motivated by money and it
01:32:02
was the wrong motivator
01:32:05
yeah um but other than
01:32:08
that no I'd still tweet anyone else
01:32:11
feeling for Harvey Weinstein I wouldn't
01:32:12
take a single bloody thing back off you
01:32:15
would why why you just making yeah we've
01:32:19
got mountains to climb it's like you
01:32:20
were just like sometimes looking for
01:32:22
mountains I think yeah yeah yeah
01:32:24
but bring it on no I wouldn't change a
01:32:26
damn thing okay and um say say it's your
01:32:29
funeral and there's a bunch of people
01:32:30
there what what three words would you
01:32:34
like people to use to describe
01:32:37
you oh
01:32:39
Jesus tell this one came about there was
01:32:41
um I had a guy on the podcast called dug
01:32:43
Allen who's um won the coasta coast a
01:32:45
number of times he's a part of Team New
01:32:47
Zealand now he was doing an adventure
01:32:48
race with Richie mcco you know what
01:32:50
people I'd like the three words I like
01:32:51
people to say what's that I'll miss them
01:32:55
there to do it I'll miss them just a
01:32:57
recognition that your passing would
01:32:59
leave a void in someone's life yeah yeah
01:33:03
that's cool yeah I think that's a good
01:33:05
place to end it anything you want to add
01:33:07
no but thanks for the opportunity and it
01:33:09
was really interesting I don't do uh for
01:33:12
someone who does a lot of interviews I
01:33:13
hardly ever get interviewed and that was
01:33:15
good I enjoyed it well I I listened to a
01:33:17
couple of podcast you've been on in
01:33:18
anticipation of this and it's kind of it
01:33:20
felt like it was just um broadcasters
01:33:23
that wanted to try and uh Jou with you
01:33:26
yeah um but I just wanted to get to know
01:33:28
the person the person behind the
01:33:29
microphone and uh well it was nice it
01:33:31
was fun yeah I've really enjoyed it too
01:33:34
Michelle Obama's got I'm I'm fantastic
01:33:36
at botching quotes I'll probably [ __ ]
01:33:38
this one up but Michelle Obama's got a
01:33:39
quite see something like most people are
01:33:41
hard to dislike up close yeah and um I'd
01:33:44
agree with that or Will Rogers I never
01:33:48
been a man I didn't
01:33:49
like you know we leave it at that Sean
01:33:52
planket thank you feast
