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welcome to the best interest podcast
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where we believe Benjamin Franklin's
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advice that an investment in knowledge
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pays the best interest both in finances
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and in your life every episode teaches
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you personal finance and investing in
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simple terms now here's your host Jesse
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Kramer hello everybody and welcome to
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episode 75 of the best interest podcast
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my name is Jesse Kramer today I'll be
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joined by Paula pant Paula is the host
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of the afford anything podcast we have a
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really fun conversation not only talking
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about some of Paula's personal finance
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background and and how she started
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afford anything and built it into the
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empire for lack of a better term that it
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is today but also we talk about some of
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Paula's real estate investing because
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she owns seven real estate properties as
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we'll get into or seven doors I should
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say and she has a lot of cool things to
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say about real estate and we also talk a
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little bit about mindset in in a couple
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interesting ways growth mindset or just
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you know the willingness to take on
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challenge in the world and go through
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some struggle and build something new
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and unique for yourself which Paula has
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done an amazing job with first we're
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going to start with a little review of
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the week Dennis in Vermont wrote in last
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week and said an easy listen for any
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audience I have spent my entire career
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working in the financial services
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industry Like Jesse I'm a fiduciary
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investment professional with a real
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passion to deliver Financial guidance
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and education to not only clients but to
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friends family and anyone who will
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listen in today's day and age there is
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no shortage of easy to access financial
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information most of which is heavily
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jargon and filibuster I discovered the
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best interest podcast while searching
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for content to share with retirement
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plan participants who I regularly
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consult with what I like most about the
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best interest podcast is that the
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information is relevant to everyone and
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can be easily comprehended by everyone
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for this reason I highly recommend
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subscribing to the Pod if you're looking
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to improve your financial well-being or
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if you're an investment professional
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like me who need to help communicating
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complex Concepts in simple terms I
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appreciate what you do Jesse keep up the
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good work well I appreciate you Dennis
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thank you for those very kind words
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thank you for listening and for sharing
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the best interest podcast with some
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folks who you work with Dennis if you're
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listening now I hope you are shoot me an
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email Jesse bestin interest. blog and
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we'll get you hooked up with some cool
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bestest gear okay before Paula today
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we're going to talk a little bit about
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some Minds ideas I'm not talking like
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Guru woo woo uh you know kind of
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fanciful ideas but just kind of helpful
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thoughts at least some things that have
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helped me along the way and I'm going to
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start with a classic friend of the blog
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friend of the podcast Tyler Tyler you
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know who you are I hope you're listening
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right now this story starts in August of
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2021 when Tyler broke his hand on his
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birthday no less H what a bummer sorry
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Ty I know that was a tough time for you
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because sure there was the the physical
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pain of a broken bone B and and that's
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certainly not fun but I know Tyler also
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felt the mental frustration of knowing
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that I slipped I fell I took the wrong
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step this wasn't some unavoidable
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external mistake this was a
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self-inflicted wound self-inflicted
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wounds are a double bummer and and
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bummer one is the wound itself but that
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physical pain is compounded by the
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knowledge that you did it to yourself
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and that really is bummer number two
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it's the knowledge that the injury was
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avoidable and the knowledge that your
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own mistake WIll Cascade into weeks or
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months or years of negative consequences
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but I want to convince you that bummer
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number two has very little utility in
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our lives you can't go back in time to
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undo the mistake Tyler can't Unbreak his
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hand so what is the real use of feeling
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that ongoing regret I think the smart
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emotional response is not prolonged but
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brief it's to realize your mistake to
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learn the lesson to commit to changing
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diffus your behavior which I think is
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very important and then to move on
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because in finances there are a lot of
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self-inflicted financial flaws for
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example we spend money on stupid stuff
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that we later regret or we borrow too
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much money we go into too much debt for
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our houses for our cars or maybe for our
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college education or we invest too
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little money early in life we start
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investing a little too late in life now
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the obvious consequences appear on our
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balance sheets and in our bank accounts
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we don't have as much money as we hoped
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we would the secondary consequence
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though it haunts our thoughts right if
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only I bought Bitcoin in 2012 I could
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buy four jet skis like the Jones family
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down the street but just like with
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Tyler's broken hand those if only
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regrets they really don't have much use
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in our lives they're only worthwhile if
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they help you learn for next time and
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that's great if they do help you learn
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for next time that's a wonderful reason
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to have a regret but beyond that it's
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uselessly crying over spilled milk so my
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go-to overspending story as an example
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is that I bought a hot tub in 2017 I
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overspent and then I underutilized it
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but it helped me learn some amazing
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lessons so the first one I have a
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psychological weak spot for a good sales
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pitch and you might too I think most of
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us think that we're immune to sales or
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we think no no I'm I'm not going to fall
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for that sales pitch but until you
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understand the way that sales people
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work the fact of the matter is you might
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fall for a sales pitch and for example I
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found the book influence by Robert
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calini I'm looking at it right now in my
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book
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it was extremely helpful because it
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allowed me to recognize sales pitches
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more readily another thing when it came
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to the hot tub I learned a lesson that
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it's important to find the root of your
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desire so it turns out I thought hot
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tubs were so much fun because in my
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limited experience with them it always
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involved groups of friends it involved
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you know that fun weekend getaway in the
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atar around deck mountains with a kind
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of a cabin in the woods and a hot tub
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see it it wasn't the hot tub itself that
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was so fun it was the friends it was the
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weekend getaway and you don't
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necessarily need a hot tub just to hang
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out with friends and I also learned that
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good deals are always out there I bought
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what ended up being called it the
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Mercedes of hot tubs and I probably
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should have just gone with a used Honda
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maybe a new Honda but either way a Honda
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over a Mercedes I don't regret
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necessarily buying the hot tub but I
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learned some valuable lessons from that
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experience now another self-inflicted
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wound that many of us have suffered is
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over borrowing if only I knew at age 18
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what I now know at age 24 or 28 or 32 I
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never would have borrowed that $100,000
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for college I see this sentiment a lot
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it's a really tough pill to swallow a
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lot of the millennial generation are
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dealing with these thoughts and now I
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suppose what gen Z they're after
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Millennials they're starting to deal
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with it too the desire to change past
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decisions is so strong but the ability
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to change those past decisions is
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non-existent and if you let it that kind
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of frustration can consume you so what
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can you do about it a few ideas well the
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first one obviously hopefully is to
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never make that same mistake again right
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we have to learn from our mistakes the
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first time the second one is to help
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others avoid the same mistake in the
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future I think that's a powerful way of
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of learning from our stakes and then the
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third is to find an optimal path out of
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the woods so if you find yourself in
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debt maybe you don't take joy and you
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know or you just don't want to put
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yourself out there and help others avoid
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the same mistake I totally get that I
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think it behooves you to find an optimal
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path Out of the Woods for you right you
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you can't change the paths but you can
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find the quickest way to to get out of
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the mess that you find yourself in so we
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learn from the past and we lean into the
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future the last one too little too late
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the regret of an action so now that we
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are what we are 14 years into an amazing
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bull market stock run okay maybe we had
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a little blip there in 2022 that's fine
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but either way the last 15 years overall
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since the great financial crisis have
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been a wonderful time to be a stock
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investor and I read a lot of comments
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like bam I missed my chance to invest
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and that means either one I'll never get
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another chance to invest again or two I
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should wait for the market to fall
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before pulling the trigger and investing
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now this thought process is very easy to
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empathize with but thankfully it's also
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easy to refute for evidence I highly
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recommend you read two articles that
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I've written on the blog the first one
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is called are we in the best stock
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market period ever and the second one is
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called should you keep investing at
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all-time highs the current stock market
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is not a reason to feel like you
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shouldn't be investing and again those
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two articles are in the show notes now
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the last thing I want to leave you with
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from this first kind of stanza of the
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monologue is self-inflicted growth
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because I want to leave you with this
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question what are all the things you've
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done right in your life it's easy to
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focus on the negatives in life many of
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us are maybe perfectionists or at the
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very least we we seek growth we seek
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Improvement our mistakes those are loow
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hanging fruit right for the fixing right
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it's easy to see the broken hand and say
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I messed up stop I want to improve that
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does it do us good to focus on the bad
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stuff a 100 times more than we focus on
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the good stuff I doubt it so next time
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you're wallowing in self-inflicted guilt
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remind yourself of the amazing
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contributions that you've made to your
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world to your financial life etc etc etc
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and take heart in the fact that you're
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making strides to be ever better okay
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let's transition to Travis Scott's
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important investing reminder now Travis
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Scott I'm told is a a rapper I used to
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be into full disclosure when I was maybe
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12 13 14 High School age I enjoyed rap
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there was some Jay-Z fabulous I still
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know the lyrics to a lot of rap songs
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Eminem all all fine good artists
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talented people Travis Scott and some of
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the new age hip-hop and rap stars I I
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don't really know them I don't really
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know their music but anyway Travis Scott
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is a a more modern rapper and he has an
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important investing reminder for us and
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this story starts uh November 5th 2021
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where sadly there was a crowd surge at a
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Travis Scott concert in Houston that I
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think in retrospect a lot of people
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ended up blaming Travis Scott for and it
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sounds like he was probably guilty
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that's neither here nor there I'll let
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you guys do your own research if you
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want but the sad thing is the crowd got
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out of control and people panicked and
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some people died and it's a terrible
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terrible way to die and more importantly
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for the the topic today is that it's a
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preventable way to die and I say it's
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preventable because this has happened
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before crowds surges have happened
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before not once not twice but hundreds
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of times for example the Romans and the
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Jews infamously suffered a deadly crowd
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trampling incident that killed hundreds
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of people and do do you know when that
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was I mean the hint is it was the Romans
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and the Jews it was thousands of years
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ago humans have known this for a very
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long time that crowds cannot control
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themselves left to their own devices
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they will over crowd they'll Panic
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Stampede and Riot and that leads to
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death Humanity knows this or at least we
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should know it right we should have
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learned this important lesson Millennia
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before Travis Scott was a glimmer in his
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papy's eye but we need reminders and
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without those reminders we repeat our
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past mistakes it gets worse you know
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it's the same for nightclub fires or or
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structure fires and I know this is a
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morbid topic but but stick with me for a
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minute and we will get to the investing
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content I swear for example the station
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fire the station was a nightclub in
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Rhode Island the station fire killed 100
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people and injured 230 more people you
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might ask yourself wow that that's
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tragedy when did that happen was it in
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the 1800s maybe the early 1900s or I
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don't know maybe it was in like the
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1950s before fire alarms that kind no it
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was in 2003 the station fire was far
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from the first awful club or structure
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fire in the United States too we've had
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fires kill more than 500 people from one
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building but at the station in 2003 they
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forgot or ignored or never even
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contemplated the lessons we've compiled
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from generations of fire safety again
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people need reminders without them we
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repeat our past mistakes now both Travis
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Scott's concert and the station fire
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both the scenarios making me want to
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grab someone by the shirt collar and
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shake them and ask them how did you not
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know better but we already know the
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answer people need reminders it's that
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simple if we don't actively choose to
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remember then we forget entropy kicks in
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we get lazy we cut Corners our safe
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systems lose their Edge and it's a
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slippery slope downwards and then
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tragedy strikes that tragedy jolts us
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and we suddenly remember oh this is why
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we had those safety measures in place
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this is the bad outcome that can occur
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tragedy or if we're lucky a mere close
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call it's a highly effective reminder of
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rationality but of course it's a tragedy
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too right we don't want to have to
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suffer a tragedy every time we need a
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reminder of how to be rational the
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Preferred Choice
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is to maintain rationality before the
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painful reminder okay so let's talk
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investing there's a direct analogy
00:13:06
between the Panic of a crowd and the
00:13:09
Panic of an investing Market every
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investing bubble in history is marked by
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the fact that rationality was forgotten
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Common Sense became uncommon and past
00:13:19
lessons were ignored in fact the
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language of Market irrationality is the
00:13:24
same language of crowd irrationality
00:13:26
what's a synonym for a market crash
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it's a panic well how do you describe a
00:13:32
panic selling event it's like a large
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movie theater with a small door that
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sounds like a fire trap to me and in
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fact the most famous book about
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investing bubbles is called
00:13:43
extraordinary popular delusions and The
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Madness of crowds That's right The
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Madness of crowds the psychology of
00:13:50
markets is eerily analogous to that of
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physical crowds the highs can be
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similarly euphoric right we're all One
00:13:57
Soul Man the music is flowing through me
00:14:01
but the lows can be similarly
00:14:03
destructive and just like a fire or
00:14:05
crowd surge a market crash helps us
00:14:08
remember that people need reminders and
00:14:10
without them we'll repeat our past
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mistakes so when I wrote this article it
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brought me to Charlie Munger you know
00:14:16
the Bitcoin Grinch himself love Charlie
00:14:18
Munger more rationality more often that
00:14:21
is the best preventative for avoiding
00:14:23
crashes of all sorts and if I had to
00:14:25
guess that's exactly why Charlie Munger
00:14:27
says that cryptocurrency is disgusting
00:14:29
and contrary to the interests of
00:14:31
civilization those are exact quotes one
00:14:33
of my favorites ones right there
00:14:34
contrary to the interests of
00:14:36
civilization it's because Charlie Munger
00:14:38
saw crypto as a bubble and a bubble is
00:14:41
kind of equivalent to Travis Scott's
00:14:43
concert before the tragedy struck it's a
00:14:45
powder keg waiting for a spark and
00:14:48
Munger saw that and he didn't want to
00:14:50
wait for what he thought would be a
00:14:52
future Bitcoin Panet he wanted to call
00:14:54
attention to it now in other words
00:14:57
Charlie remembers he remembers the many
00:14:59
bubbles that he's read about before and
00:15:01
the few that he's seen firsthand and he
00:15:03
doesn't want to forget or repeat past
00:15:05
mistakes now is Charlie right was he
00:15:08
right about Bitcoin about cryptocurrency
00:15:10
I'm not wise enough to know myself but I
00:15:12
listen hard I listen hard when a smart
00:15:15
rational person says we've made mistakes
00:15:17
like this before and I see one again
00:15:19
Charlie was acting like a fire marshal
00:15:21
right he's seen the charred remains of
00:15:23
too many buildings and he's now walking
00:15:25
into the Bitcoin nightclub as it were
00:15:27
and calmly stating this is a fire hazard
00:15:30
and a death trap period it's hard to
00:15:32
know if Charlie Munger was right we
00:15:34
might not know this week this month this
00:15:36
year this decade it might take a long
00:15:38
time to know if Charlie Munger was right
00:15:40
or wrong but if he was correct and the
00:15:43
risk was present then the law of large
00:15:45
numbers mandates that tragedy will
00:15:47
eventually strike Charlie to his credit
00:15:50
is famously a student of psychology he
00:15:52
knew how people tick both individually
00:15:55
and in crowds and he knew that people
00:15:57
need reminders and without them we
00:15:59
repeat our past mistakes here's a quick
00:16:02
ad and then we'll get back to the show
00:16:04
every week I send a quick free email to
00:16:06
thousands of readers that shares three
00:16:08
Simple Things One my new articles and
00:16:11
podcasts two the best financial content
00:16:14
of the week from all over the Internet
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and three a financial chart that
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explains some important Concept in the
00:16:20
news that week it's a great primer to
00:16:23
boost your financial knowhow ah but
00:16:26
Jesse I don't want another email well
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this might not be for you but I do hear
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you which is why I make it very short
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sweet and full of only the essentials
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while 18% of people who sign up
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eventually unsubscribe and 133% of
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people who are signed up haven't opened
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it in the past 3 months a whopping 66%
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once a month they're enjoying it and
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maybe you will too you can subscribe for
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free on the homepage at bestin interest.
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blog again that's a free no strings
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attached subscription bestter interest.
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blog well let's go from one wise person
00:17:02
in Charlie Monger to another wise person
00:17:05
in Paula pant Paula pant is a podcast
00:17:07
host a writer speaker and media
00:17:09
commentator on financial Independence
00:17:11
real estate investing money management
00:17:13
and financial literacy she is the
00:17:15
Creator and the host of the afford
00:17:17
anything podcast which has more than 30
00:17:20
million downloads and is ranked by Apple
00:17:22
podcasts as one of the top 50 business
00:17:24
podcasts she is the founder of afford
00:17:27
anything.com person finance and
00:17:29
financial Independence website that
00:17:30
draws more than 2.5 million annual page
00:17:33
views and holds more than 78,000 email
00:17:36
subscribers and you might have seen
00:17:38
Paula starring in the Netflix
00:17:40
documentary get smart with money on
00:17:42
which she also served as a Consulting
00:17:45
[Music]
00:17:54
producer Paula thanks for stopping by
00:17:56
the best interest podcast I thought we
00:17:58
could start with the afford anything
00:18:00
Credo I think anyone who has listened to
00:18:02
you has heard the idea that you can
00:18:04
afford anything but you can't afford
00:18:06
everything so I wanted to start with
00:18:08
that statement because I think it's just
00:18:10
such a fundamental but probably
00:18:12
underrated pillar of personal finance so
00:18:16
where did the statement come from why
00:18:17
has it really become one of your
00:18:19
personal mantras sure well first uh to
00:18:22
explain that Credo a little bit to
00:18:25
anybody who's new to it the notion that
00:18:27
you can afford any anything but not
00:18:29
everything is fundamentally one of
00:18:31
opportunity cost every time you say yes
00:18:33
to something you are implicitly saying
00:18:36
no to something else and the problem is
00:18:38
a lot of people don't consciously
00:18:40
recognize that I came up with afford
00:18:42
anything when I was in my 20s my my mid
00:18:45
20s I quit my job I was making the
00:18:49
highest income that I ever made working
00:18:51
for somebody else was $31,000 a year so
00:18:54
I I quit a job at which I was earning a
00:18:56
full-time salary of $31,000 a year and I
00:19:00
lived out of a backpack and for the next
00:19:03
27 months I backpacked around the globe
00:19:05
I flew to Egypt on a one-way ticket and
00:19:09
spent six weeks in Egypt and then I went
00:19:12
to to Israel to India to Nepal to
00:19:16
Thailand Lao Cambodia Vietnam Malaysia
00:19:19
Singapore Indonesia and then I finished
00:19:21
it off with 10 months in Australia plus
00:19:24
like three weeks in New Zealand during
00:19:27
that time my friend kept saying I would
00:19:29
love to do that but I can't afford it I
00:19:31
kept hearing that over and over and over
00:19:33
I would love to travel like that but I
00:19:35
can't afford it but the thing is I know
00:19:37
that those friends were making
00:19:39
substantially more than 31,000 a year
00:19:42
many of them were making double or more
00:19:44
than double that right but they were
00:19:47
also living in apartments with stainless
00:19:50
steel appliances they would go to bars
00:19:53
on the weekends and buy $14 cocktails
00:19:57
right they would buy $50 or $100 concert
00:20:01
tickets and that's fine if you sit down
00:20:05
and you make the conscious choice that
00:20:07
hey I could either travel or I could
00:20:11
have stainless steel appliances and $14
00:20:15
cocktails right which one do I prefer if
00:20:18
you sit down and you think about it and
00:20:20
you make the deliberate conscious
00:20:22
decision that you prefer the stainless
00:20:24
steel appliances and the $15 and the
00:20:27
expensive cocktail
00:20:28
that's great I fully support that
00:20:31
because that is a deliberate conscious
00:20:32
choice but then the statement is not I
00:20:35
can't afford to travel the statement is
00:20:38
I choose not to travel I have decided
00:20:41
that travel is not a priority for me
00:20:44
right so it isn't that you can't it's
00:20:46
that you choose not to to say that you
00:20:48
can't is simply disempowering and also
00:20:50
false and so that's why I started to
00:20:52
afford anything is I wanted to eradicate
00:20:54
the phrase I can't afford it from
00:20:57
people's mouths when it comes to all
00:20:59
reasonable purchases now of course there
00:21:01
are like nitpicky nerds out there who
00:21:03
are like can you afford a rocket ship
00:21:06
you know and so afford anything is not
00:21:09
an abdication of common sense right
00:21:12
afford anything means that anything that
00:21:15
a reasonable middle class American can
00:21:18
do is something that is within your
00:21:20
reach as well I I think to myself I
00:21:23
think it's Jesse meechum and the wab you
00:21:25
need a budget app they part of their fun
00:21:28
Al rules is you know a dollar can only
00:21:29
be spent once and that's that's a very
00:21:33
similar thought process which is like
00:21:34
you know right if you want the spend a
00:21:36
dollar on that cocktail go for it but
00:21:39
that dollar can no longer be allocated
00:21:41
to your future trip it can no longer be
00:21:43
allocated to your retirement savings and
00:21:45
on the opposite end of that Spectrum you
00:21:47
know we're big Savers and and the FI and
00:21:49
personal finance Community are big on
00:21:51
saving if you allocate dollars to your
00:21:53
savings you can't then spend those
00:21:55
dollars on having fun today and it
00:21:57
really is about striking some sort of
00:21:59
balance there and I should also add you
00:22:01
know it's this applies not just to money
00:22:04
it applies to any limited resource so it
00:22:06
applies to time it applies to energy
00:22:09
attention focus all of those are limited
00:22:12
and that's something especially in the
00:22:13
FI the financial Independence Community
00:22:15
many people become obsessed with the
00:22:18
numbers they often I think this is one
00:22:21
of the pendulum swinging too far in the
00:22:22
opposite direction can devalue their
00:22:26
time in exchange for a rounding error
00:22:30
and when that happens you are trading
00:22:32
your most valuable asset which is your
00:22:35
time your energy your attention that is
00:22:37
a non-renewable asset money is a
00:22:39
renewable asset and so afford anything
00:22:41
applies to time as well it applies to
00:22:43
all limited resources that that's so
00:22:46
cool and and only out of curiosity do
00:22:48
you have a background in in economics at
00:22:49
all because the whole opportunity cost
00:22:51
is a very you know very economic uh
00:22:54
thought yeah I have a masters in
00:22:55
economic journalism Economic and
00:22:57
Business journalism M from Columbia
00:22:59
University very cool very cool well
00:23:02
let's segue a little bit because I'm I'm
00:23:04
kind of interested so you're you're
00:23:05
greatest earning year
00:23:07
$331,000 you used it to afford not
00:23:10
everything but anything in the in the
00:23:12
form of this amazing world trip so I'd
00:23:15
like to learn a little bit more about
00:23:17
your personal fi or fire or just your
00:23:20
personal finance Journey Paula you know
00:23:22
we love good examples good stories
00:23:24
everybody likes a good story so where
00:23:26
did you find yourself in life before
00:23:28
discovering the world of personal
00:23:30
finance and what's your journey and
00:23:32
growth been like so straight out of
00:23:34
college I was a newspaper reporter and
00:23:38
my starting salary was $21,000 a year
00:23:41
now this is in 2005 so you've got to
00:23:43
adjust that for inflation so actually
00:23:45
you know what let's do that really
00:23:46
quickly right now let's do it live yeah
00:23:48
let's do it live all right so
00:23:51
21,000 in
00:23:54
2005 is what today okay okay ooh
00:24:00
32752 got it got it so my starting
00:24:02
salary was today's equivalent of earning
00:24:05
32,000 a year and I worked that job for
00:24:09
three years and so at the time that I
00:24:10
quit that job which was in 2008 my
00:24:13
ending salary was 31,000 so let's see
00:24:16
$31,000 in
00:24:19
$208 so $
00:24:22
43,800 okay okay so modern dollars
00:24:25
44,000 is 434 4,000 was your top end
00:24:29
salary exactly exactly so uh during that
00:24:33
time I lived on my full-time income I I
00:24:37
still contributed 15% to a 401k but
00:24:40
other than that I lived on and I didn't
00:24:41
know unfortunately I didn't know about
00:24:43
the Roth IRA um which was dumb but I
00:24:46
contributed 15% to a traditional 401K
00:24:49
the rest of it uh I lived on and then
00:24:52
during the evenings and weekends I
00:24:53
freelanced and my freelance income was
00:24:57
at at an hourly rate was substantially
00:24:59
higher than what I was making in my
00:25:00
full-time job I would write these
00:25:02
articles where I would make the
00:25:04
equivalent of $75 an hour which when
00:25:07
you're making a full-time salary of the
00:25:10
today's equivalent of 44,000 a year and
00:25:13
on the side you're making $75 an hour I
00:25:16
mean huge it's huge the shortcut for
00:25:18
anyone listening is you you work about
00:25:20
2,000 hours a year in a standard job so
00:25:22
take your salary divide it by 2,000 you
00:25:25
are earning about $22 an hour
00:25:28
in your salary so 22 an hour versus 75
00:25:30
on the freelance side right exactly
00:25:33
exactly I mean it's just like what 4ex
00:25:36
difference yeah it's huge it's huge
00:25:38
every penny that I made from freelancing
00:25:41
after taxes I saved and so I ended up
00:25:45
over the span of three years I saved on
00:25:47
average about $800 a month and so after
00:25:50
three years that totaled up to
00:25:52
$25,000 now that for me was the
00:25:55
equivalent of about onee salary cuz you
00:25:57
remember during this three-year time
00:25:58
span I was earning 21 on the low end 31
00:26:01
on the high end so on average during
00:26:03
those three years I was earning 25 Grand
00:26:05
and after three years that was what I
00:26:07
saved I had the equivalent of a year
00:26:09
salary in the bank and so when that
00:26:12
happened a couple of things so it was
00:26:14
2008 it was I quit my job kind of right
00:26:17
before the Great Recession really kicked
00:26:19
in like there were signs that the
00:26:21
economy was not doing well but we
00:26:23
weren't really in the the throws of it
00:26:26
quite yet but was very clear that print
00:26:29
journalism was not doing well and it was
00:26:32
very clear that if you just stated a
00:26:33
newspaper hoping for promotions you
00:26:36
gonna go nowhere fast so you saw the
00:26:38
writing on the wall yes exactly exactly
00:26:42
but yeah so it was clear that the future
00:26:44
of Journalism was going to be online and
00:26:46
it was going to be independent and so I
00:26:48
did in 2008 the thing that no one ever
00:26:51
does which is I voluntarily quit a job
00:26:54
at a print newspaper which no one does
00:26:57
because those jobs are so few and far
00:26:59
between everyone was like you're
00:27:01
committing career suicide you're never
00:27:02
going to get a job again and sure enough
00:27:05
I never have gotten a job again that
00:27:08
that was the last job I ever
00:27:10
had so I guess they were right you know
00:27:13
I I never got a job again and so for the
00:27:16
next 27 months I just backpacked you
00:27:19
know I I was not trying to build a
00:27:21
full-time freelance career I was just
00:27:23
freelancing Moonlighting here and there
00:27:24
writing an article or two but mostly I
00:27:27
was in countries where the dollar
00:27:29
exchange rate really worked in my favor
00:27:31
you know I was in LA I was in Cambodia
00:27:34
like I was in places where the US dollar
00:27:36
just went a lot further so I was living
00:27:38
on about ,000 dollar a month a lot of
00:27:41
people think that traveling is like oh
00:27:43
I'm in transit all the time like which
00:27:45
is what you do if you've got 10 days of
00:27:47
holiday right right when you're
00:27:49
backpacking you go to one location and
00:27:52
you park your butt there for five weeks
00:27:54
which means you're not spending money on
00:27:56
bus tickets you're not spending money on
00:27:57
Transit you're like renting a guest
00:28:00
house for $5 a night and you're eating
00:28:03
local food you're eating pad tie for
00:28:06
25s and so travel becomes a lot cheaper
00:28:09
when you think of it not as a holiday
00:28:12
but rather as essentially just living
00:28:15
your life in a different location right
00:28:18
that's how it becomes so cheap you're
00:28:20
just living your life elsewhere like I
00:28:23
just sat there in like read Harry Potter
00:28:24
books did you take any inspiration from
00:28:27
uh
00:28:28
vagabonding but the book oh by R po yeah
00:28:31
that's that's an oldie that's an oldie
00:28:33
but goody indirectly because that's
00:28:35
that's what he talks a lot about is just
00:28:36
travel somewhere and then Park yourself
00:28:38
preferably travel somewhere cheap and
00:28:41
then Park yourself and just live life in
00:28:43
this new city and and see how the locals
00:28:45
live and it's a very cool way of
00:28:46
approaching not only travel but just
00:28:48
kind of being a global citizen exactly
00:28:51
I'm a huge fan of that like long-term
00:28:53
slow travel because that's the that's
00:28:56
the way that you sink in cool how did
00:28:58
that then so now you're probably by then
00:29:00
what in your late 20s maybe when the 27
00:29:03
months is up yeah exactly I was 20 with
00:29:05
no job yeah exactly you're you're in
00:29:09
Australia or New Zealand and and then
00:29:11
what so then I came back to the US I
00:29:16
moved to Atlanta because that's where my
00:29:18
parents live I found uh on Craigslist it
00:29:21
was five roommates sharing a
00:29:24
three-bedroom so my personal share of
00:29:26
the red was $200 per month but only
00:29:30
because we were cramming so many people
00:29:31
into such a small space I had a car that
00:29:35
was worth probably around like three
00:29:37
grand you know just a super old beater
00:29:41
and you know I basically ate from Costco
00:29:44
and those those were my bills that in
00:29:46
health insurance right health insurance
00:29:48
is probably my biggest bill but based
00:29:51
with like a extremely extremely cheap
00:29:53
cheap cheap cost of living I started
00:29:56
eeking out at at the time a career as a
00:29:59
freelance writer and eventually that
00:30:02
escalated two things happened
00:30:04
simultaneously one was that as my
00:30:07
freelance writing clients grew and grew
00:30:09
and grew and grew I came to realize that
00:30:12
I was getting more work than I could
00:30:14
individually handle myself and so I
00:30:17
formed a Content agency and so I started
00:30:20
hiring freelance writers who worked
00:30:21
under me and then I managed those
00:30:24
writers and I would pass the projects on
00:30:26
to those writers and then my agency my
00:30:29
content management agency would handle
00:30:32
you know the assignments and then I
00:30:34
began to realize that you could make a
00:30:36
little bit of money if all you did was
00:30:38
like submit an assignment but you could
00:30:40
make a lot more money if you did all of
00:30:43
the management of the editorial
00:30:45
calendars and so I was serving clients
00:30:47
these were mostly small business clients
00:30:49
small businesses paid much better than
00:30:51
Publications so I started working for
00:30:55
these two to three person certified
00:30:58
financial planner firms or these two to
00:31:00
three person accountant firms these
00:31:03
small businesses that needed content
00:31:06
they needed real estate content in order
00:31:08
to be competitive on Google to Corner
00:31:10
SEO you know they wanted to to Really
00:31:12
Corner the SEO market for like Kansas
00:31:14
City accountant but they don't have the
00:31:16
time to do all of that writing
00:31:18
themselves nor do they have the time to
00:31:20
even just broadly like if you're
00:31:22
assigning it to writers somebody still
00:31:24
has to manage that you've got to manage
00:31:26
the editorial calendar
00:31:27
you've got to study keyword optimization
00:31:30
right somebody needs to manage
00:31:31
editorially manage the project and so
00:31:34
that's what my agency ended up doing we
00:31:36
became content editors and managers we
00:31:39
became a Content editing and management
00:31:41
agency so that ended up being fairly
00:31:44
lucrative and so that was how I that was
00:31:46
the first time that I began earning six
00:31:48
figures and you know as somebody who
00:31:50
used to make 31,000 a year to be
00:31:52
self-employed and earning six figures
00:31:54
was huge and so I was doing that that
00:31:57
was my full-time work and then in
00:31:59
parallel with that I was running a Ford
00:32:02
anything I started a Ford anything in
00:32:04
2011 and for the first five years or so
00:32:07
it was making some money but not a ton
00:32:11
but I knew the audience was growing
00:32:13
right the readership was growing after
00:32:16
five years I knew that if I were to give
00:32:18
it my full-time attention then this
00:32:20
could really be something and so in 2016
00:32:24
I faced this Crossroads where I was like
00:32:26
man do I continue running this
00:32:29
six-figure business that I built or do I
00:32:33
kill the business like it it it didn't
00:32:35
seem viable enough to sell you know do I
00:32:38
kill this business that I painstakingly
00:32:40
grew and instead Focus all of my effort
00:32:45
on building out my own platform right
00:32:48
afford anything and it was terrifying
00:32:52
but my thinking was a Content management
00:32:55
agency is a service-based
00:32:57
agency model business and the gross
00:33:00
margins on that tend to be rather
00:33:02
limited I felt like that could be a
00:33:05
six-figure business but I would I
00:33:07
personally would have a hard time
00:33:08
growing that to a seven fig business by
00:33:11
contrast if you're building a platform
00:33:14
if you're building a brand that's a very
00:33:17
different business model entirely that
00:33:21
can be a seven or eight figure business
00:33:23
that was around 2016 so since 2016 or or
00:33:25
so aord that thing has been 100% of your
00:33:29
time and energy maybe even 110% of your
00:33:32
time and energy exactly and you don't
00:33:35
have to share personal details with us
00:33:36
but as far as your own Financial
00:33:39
Independence journey goes I mean how has
00:33:42
afford anything helped you in that
00:33:43
regard oh I mean it's the overwhelming I
00:33:48
mean it it's my sole source of income
00:33:50
right okay and so the money that I've
00:33:53
made through first through the content
00:33:55
marketing agency that that was really
00:33:57
key and then later through afford
00:33:59
anything the money that I've made
00:34:00
through being an entrepreneur and
00:34:02
through running businesses that has
00:34:05
allowed me to aggressively invest and by
00:34:09
virtue of a increasing my income and
00:34:12
then B using that increased income to
00:34:15
aggressively make investments that's
00:34:17
what's allowed me to build my net worth
00:34:20
here's a quick ad and then we'll get
00:34:21
back to the show one of the more common
00:34:24
questions I hear is Jesse what do you
00:34:26
like in you books blogs podcasts even
00:34:29
Banks and brokerage firms what are your
00:34:31
recommendations so to answer that
00:34:33
question I put together a web page you
00:34:36
can check it out at bestter interest.
00:34:38
blog reccommendations again that's
00:34:41
bestin interest. blog SL recommendations
00:34:45
to check out how I'm improving my
00:34:47
financial life let's transition a little
00:34:49
bit into the investing Paula I know that
00:34:52
you have done and continue to do a lot
00:34:55
of real estate investing real estate
00:34:56
investing is a a regular topic on a for
00:34:59
anything and you even you have some
00:35:01
courses related to real estate investing
00:35:04
just one just one I'm sorry so one
00:35:06
course we haven't talked about real
00:35:08
estate investing a lot here before on
00:35:09
the best interest podcast so what's some
00:35:11
of your background or experience or just
00:35:14
you know where are you in the real
00:35:15
estate investing world so I have seven
00:35:18
uh rental units all paid free and clear
00:35:21
one Triplex one duplex and two single
00:35:25
family homes so yeah that's portion of
00:35:27
my portfolio do you manage them yourself
00:35:30
as like are you the the landlord who
00:35:31
someone's going to call at 10 at night
00:35:33
if the toilet's overflowing only with
00:35:35
one of them for the rest they've got
00:35:36
property managers got it what's the
00:35:38
thought process on that well number one
00:35:41
they're all out of state right I live in
00:35:43
New York City and so these and the Seven
00:35:46
units that I have are spread across
00:35:48
three different states they're spread
00:35:49
across Georgia Indiana and Nevada you
00:35:52
know I live in Manhattan Manhattan is a
00:35:54
terrible place to invest in uh rental
00:35:56
real estate
00:35:57
so I'm a big proponent of if you live in
00:35:59
a high cost of living area don't buy
00:36:01
real estate there not as an investment I
00:36:04
mean if you want to have something for
00:36:05
yourself personally I think that's still
00:36:07
a really terrible use of money but if
00:36:09
for emotional reasons you want to then
00:36:12
you know people buy things for emotional
00:36:13
reasons all the time but specifically as
00:36:16
an investment Buy in lowc cost of living
00:36:19
areas you know that's where the good
00:36:20
investment deals are because you're
00:36:22
going to be looking for properties that
00:36:24
have a healthy cap rate right and a cap
00:36:27
rate is simply a measure of the
00:36:29
unleveraged dividend or income stream
00:36:32
that a property produces so if you think
00:36:33
of it all assets whether it's index
00:36:36
funds or income properties all assets
00:36:39
make money in two ways right there is
00:36:41
appreciation which is the value of the
00:36:43
asset rising and then there's the
00:36:46
dividend or income stream that it pays
00:36:47
so a share of Coca-Cola ideally will
00:36:50
rise over time that's the appreciation
00:36:53
and that share of Coca-Cola will also
00:36:54
pay a dividend same thing with a rental
00:36:57
property that rental property will
00:37:00
ideally rise in value over time that's
00:37:02
great but that's also market-based
00:37:04
appreciation which is largely out of
00:37:06
your control I like to conservatively
00:37:08
estimate that it'll just keep Pace with
00:37:09
inflation nothing more historically it's
00:37:12
actually been around 5% so if you want
00:37:13
to say inflation plus two if you imagine
00:37:17
around 3 to 5% uh over the long term
00:37:20
that's ballpark what you can estimate
00:37:23
there now the real money comes from the
00:37:26
dividend or the income stream that that
00:37:27
property pays and so that income stream
00:37:30
is rent minus operating expenses is your
00:37:35
net operating income and then that net
00:37:37
operating income divided by the purchase
00:37:39
price or acquisition price of the
00:37:40
property that's your cap rate you know
00:37:43
what I look for is properties with
00:37:44
healthy cap rates and you're likely to
00:37:47
find a really healthy cap rate in a
00:37:49
location that has a low cost of living
00:37:52
so Paula what what is an example of an
00:37:54
attractive cap rate to you oh okay okay
00:37:56
so in the way that you want returns to
00:37:59
be commensurate with risk right you want
00:38:01
low risk low low risk you accept low
00:38:03
returns higher risk you demand higher
00:38:05
returns in order to justify the higher
00:38:06
risk that's the same way that I look at
00:38:09
cap rates so when you think of
00:38:10
properties are class A B C or D A Class
00:38:13
A property is a property that is
00:38:16
relatively lowrisk it tends to be uh
00:38:19
newer property either new construction
00:38:21
or newly renovated it tends to be in the
00:38:24
you know what I call the the Lulu Lemon
00:38:26
Panera Bread neighborhoods the soul
00:38:29
cycle neighborhoods right yeah yeah
00:38:32
right so if you're if you're drawing the
00:38:33
Lululemon crowd right that's those are
00:38:36
the class A rental properties and
00:38:38
generally in those properties you tend
00:38:40
to have high occupancy low levels of
00:38:44
repairs maintenance Capital expenditures
00:38:46
because they are tend to be newer or
00:38:48
more newly renovated properties you tend
00:38:50
to have like I said High occupancy low
00:38:52
tenant turnover high demand so your
00:38:54
vacancy rate tends to be quite small
00:38:57
there tend to not be a whole lot of
00:38:58
problems or issues that you have to deal
00:39:00
with in those properties and so for a
00:39:02
class a property I mean if it's super CL
00:39:06
if it's class like A+ man I'll take a
00:39:09
three cap for that even or you know if
00:39:11
it's like class A++ plus by contrast if
00:39:14
you've got a property that is Class B
00:39:18
which is I would say where Homer Simpson
00:39:20
lives like if you think of Homer and
00:39:21
Marge Simpson that would be like a Class
00:39:24
B neighborhood I grew up in a like a
00:39:26
class I'd say B minus C+ neighborhood
00:39:29
this is not what you should do but this
00:39:30
is just what I personally do personally
00:39:33
I would look for maybe a five cap in a
00:39:36
place like that and then if you're going
00:39:38
Class C I would look for maybe at least
00:39:41
a six seven cap there because they are
00:39:44
worse grade real estate you're demanding
00:39:46
a higher percentage of rental income
00:39:49
like so for a seven cap that would be
00:39:50
what that the operating income of the
00:39:52
property pays you back 7% of what your
00:39:55
initial invest investment was on an
00:39:57
annual basis the net operating income of
00:40:00
the property would be 7% got it net
00:40:03
operating income okay and and and these
00:40:05
are riskier properties and therefore as
00:40:08
the investor you are saying that you
00:40:10
need more reward for them yeah exactly
00:40:12
exactly and and the reason for that is
00:40:15
because there's going to be a lot more
00:40:16
with the riskier properties there's
00:40:17
going to be a lot more volatility in
00:40:19
what you're actually making right with
00:40:21
riskier properties you are likely to
00:40:23
have much higher repair costs much
00:40:25
higher m cost much higher levels of
00:40:27
capital expenditure more turnovers more
00:40:30
vacancy vacancy is a huge huge cost
00:40:34
right massive cost because of that
00:40:37
there's likely going to be a lot of
00:40:39
variability there might be some years
00:40:41
where you are just negative right where
00:40:43
you're in the hole with a Class C
00:40:45
property and you you're bleeding money
00:40:47
you're losing money and then there are
00:40:49
other years where you need a really good
00:40:51
return in order to compensate for the
00:40:54
years where you were just bleeding by
00:40:56
contrast with a Class A property you
00:40:58
tend to have more stability right you
00:41:00
tend to have more predictable returns so
00:41:03
the returns aren't going to be as high
00:41:05
you're not going to make as much money
00:41:07
but it's going to just be a lot more
00:41:09
generally going to be a lot more
00:41:11
predictable over time and actually I I
00:41:13
do want to come back to the fact that
00:41:15
you have properties in such a diverse
00:41:17
different geographies but are your
00:41:19
properties that you own would you
00:41:21
classify them as Class A Class B Class C
00:41:24
I used to have C Properties I no longer
00:41:26
do so they range Class A and B got but
00:41:29
there's even within that there's a
00:41:30
spectrum of like you know you've got the
00:41:32
B minus and you've got the B+ they're
00:41:34
all I would say within the ab sphere
00:41:37
like this this this one there is a
00:41:40
Panera close by but the bread is kind of
00:41:42
stale usually so that's not really an a
00:41:44
it's kind of like a B+ but you you
00:41:47
mentioned properties in Georgia your
00:41:48
parents are in Georgia yeah exactly but
00:41:50
I I moved to Atlanta I liveed there for
00:41:52
five years gotcha and and is that the
00:41:54
Georgia connection which is why you you
00:41:56
have properties there exactly what about
00:41:58
the Nevada and was it Indiana was that
00:42:01
the other place yeah Nevada I also lived
00:42:04
in for five years and then Indiana that
00:42:07
one I had never I'd never set foot in
00:42:11
Indiana prior to going there to look for
00:42:13
rental real estate I actually in my
00:42:15
course uh the course that I teach which
00:42:17
is called your first rental property
00:42:19
it's for beers I documented the entire
00:42:22
process of having never set foot in the
00:42:26
state of Indiana I documented all right
00:42:29
from the internet you know from afar
00:42:31
from New York here's how I'm doing my
00:42:34
preliminary research here's how I'm
00:42:36
narrowing it down here's how I'm looking
00:42:38
at different neighborhoods and here's my
00:42:40
preliminary research from that I've done
00:42:42
from Manhattan and then I actually
00:42:44
videoed myself like all right here's me
00:42:47
boarding the plane here's me getting off
00:42:49
the flight and realizing I forgot my
00:42:51
toothbrush right and and then just
00:42:53
documented like a 48h hour trip it was a
00:42:56
weekend literally a weekend trip where I
00:42:59
was just like zipped across all these
00:43:01
different neighborhoods got like a a
00:43:04
sense of the terrain and 48 Hours on the
00:43:07
ground and then boom back home right it
00:43:09
was a weekend trip and then from home I
00:43:12
started just making offers on properties
00:43:15
with you know the knowledge of the
00:43:16
neighborhoods that I had from those 48
00:43:18
hours and then I went under contract on
00:43:20
a handful of properties before I closed
00:43:22
on uh the duplex that I have there have
00:43:25
you been back to in Indiana since cuz I
00:43:27
know you're you you're managing it
00:43:28
remotely right I've been there one more
00:43:30
time since then actually it was I went
00:43:33
under contract on another property
00:43:34
because I was going to buy a different
00:43:36
duple like a second duplex there and so
00:43:39
I went under contract on it and then
00:43:41
during the inspection a bunch of stuff
00:43:43
came to light and so I canceled the
00:43:44
contract got it that was the other time
00:43:46
that I went back that's so cool though
00:43:48
just because it shows the power of you
00:43:51
know much like in the way that Index
00:43:52
Fund investing gives you access to these
00:43:55
cash flows and access to these companies
00:43:57
you don't have to sit on the board and
00:43:58
you're not the CEO you're not the
00:44:00
employee but you get to invest in them
00:44:01
from afar and I think the average person
00:44:05
probably thinks of rental real estate
00:44:06
investing as like oh that's very
00:44:08
Hands-On and it's it's very intense and
00:44:11
you better know how to replace a shingle
00:44:13
and and fix a toilet but you're kind of
00:44:15
showing and and others have shown that
00:44:17
no it's very possible to do from a
00:44:19
remote location you can hire out a lot
00:44:21
of the help and and I'm sure there are
00:44:23
some costs involved in all of that
00:44:24
obviously that might affect your all
00:44:26
return but if you pick the right
00:44:28
property with a good cap rate and a good
00:44:29
neighborhood those kind of things it's
00:44:31
it's a great investment yeah exactly
00:44:33
exactly you could say it's a 10x
00:44:35
investment which is a perfect segue one
00:44:38
of my next questions Paula it's it's one
00:44:40
of my favorite articles on afford
00:44:42
anything it's about 10x thinking what
00:44:45
exactly is 10x thinking so this is
00:44:48
something that I wrote Because I myself
00:44:50
was struggling with thinking bigger and
00:44:53
I I think that that's something
00:44:54
particularly those of us who are
00:44:56
naturally Frugal we're inclined to save
00:44:59
maybe people especially people in the
00:45:00
financial Independence space there's a
00:45:03
bit of a mindset of hey what I earn is
00:45:06
fixed or what I earn is you know X and
00:45:09
so my job is to save more of what I make
00:45:14
and 10x thinking flips that on its head
00:45:17
and says you know what no you're you
00:45:19
can't shrink your R greatness if you are
00:45:22
entirely focused on pinching pennies
00:45:24
then you're never going to get very far
00:45:27
you're going to be overlooking
00:45:29
opportunities for dollars for the sake
00:45:31
of clutching onto dimes let's flip the
00:45:34
script and let's focus on the earning
00:45:36
side the income side the growth side
00:45:39
let's focus on what are the things that
00:45:41
you can be doing that would 10x your
00:45:44
income I remember going back to what we
00:45:46
were talking about earlier I when I was
00:45:48
making $331,000 in 2008 which is the
00:45:52
equivalent of with inflation I was
00:45:54
making the equivalent of $44,000 000 a
00:45:56
year as a full-time salary in today's
00:45:58
dollars right which is the equivalent of
00:46:01
$22 per hour but as a freelancer I was
00:46:05
making let's see let's actually do the
00:46:07
math because
00:46:09
$75 per hour in 2008 what would that be
00:46:12
in today's dollars so 75 that'd be
00:46:16
$106 per hour today that was 5x right
00:46:20
that was 5x I I in my day job was making
00:46:23
the equivalent of $22 an hour but as a
00:46:26
freelancer I was making the equivalent
00:46:27
of $100 an hour right so I was making 5x
00:46:31
as a freelancer over what I was making
00:46:33
in my day job and those are the types of
00:46:36
opportunities that allow you to move the
00:46:38
needle I mean how making 31,000 a year I
00:46:42
never would have been able to save to
00:46:44
aass a savings of 25,000 there's just no
00:46:47
way right but freelancing I could back
00:46:50
then I didn't realize that there was a
00:46:51
distinction between being self-employed
00:46:52
versus being an entrepreneur at the time
00:46:55
I thought that one was equal to the
00:46:57
other it took me a couple of years to
00:46:58
figure out that even being self-employed
00:47:01
you're trading time for money versus as
00:47:03
an entrepreneur you're building a
00:47:05
platform and a brand and systems and
00:47:07
processes and you're building something
00:47:09
that can outlive you right the goal of a
00:47:11
business is build something that
00:47:13
outlives you and outlasts you so that
00:47:15
you are not the bottleneck and it is not
00:47:17
dependent on on you and only you what do
00:47:20
you think is the thing that is holding
00:47:22
you know Average Joe or average Jane who
00:47:24
who may or may not listening to this
00:47:26
podcast it's actually um we've done
00:47:28
science we've hired the Einstein of the
00:47:30
world and listeners of the best interest
00:47:33
podcast are not Average Joe's and James
00:47:35
they are far above average we thank you
00:47:37
for listening but for those who are
00:47:39
listening who are like H how do I
00:47:41
Implement 10x thinking into my life what
00:47:44
is your thought process on that there
00:47:46
are a few things so number one and I
00:47:49
think each person listening needs to do
00:47:50
an internal check of whether or not they
00:47:52
have a tendency for this I see this a
00:47:54
lot on on social media
00:47:56
anytime that there's an article about
00:47:59
somebody's success you inevitably read
00:48:01
this long string of comments where
00:48:03
people will attribute somebody else's
00:48:06
success to some imagined advantage that
00:48:11
they just assume the other person has
00:48:13
right so there will be an article on
00:48:15
like so and so bought a house and people
00:48:18
are like bet their parents bought it for
00:48:20
them but if you actually stop and do the
00:48:22
math okay so and so bought a
00:48:26
$300,000 house using an fa loan putting
00:48:31
5% down so like 5% of$ 300,000 that's
00:48:35
what
00:48:36
$155,000 so how do you save
00:48:38
$155,000 you save $500 a month for 30
00:48:41
months can you save $500 a month yeah I
00:48:44
think you can very few people will stop
00:48:47
and actually do the math and ask how is
00:48:50
this possible instead they'll have this
00:48:52
knee-jerk reaction of like I bet it's
00:48:54
not possible
00:48:56
and so you see that and it's really
00:48:58
toxic thinking and that's the type of
00:48:59
thinking that makes people people hold
00:49:02
themselves back right because if you're
00:49:04
just always assuming that everybody who
00:49:06
has done something great has done it
00:49:09
through mechanisms that you cannot
00:49:11
access if that's the assumption that you
00:49:13
use to walk through life you are
00:49:15
guaranteed to be stuck where you are
00:49:18
right so that is not a success mindset
00:49:21
it's not a growth mindset and it's not a
00:49:23
mindset that's serving you it's a fact
00:49:25
it's a mindset that's holding you back
00:49:27
so if you want to move forward then you
00:49:28
got to get rid of that thinking I I
00:49:31
really like that and I I like the idea
00:49:32
of just open-mindedness and curiosity
00:49:35
wonderful traits to have and then some
00:49:37
something that's helped me and I'm not
00:49:39
sure if I'm at 10x yet maybe I'm at four
00:49:41
or six or 8X and working my way up but I
00:49:43
kind of zoomed out on the world and said
00:49:45
to myself you know what there are some
00:49:46
people who are the Einstein and they
00:49:49
were born with a really high IQ and and
00:49:51
maybe I'll never be there there are
00:49:52
other people who are the Shaquille
00:49:53
O'Neal of the world and you know what
00:49:55
I'm never going to be 7 foot one and
00:49:56
weigh 300 pounds and and be as strong as
00:49:59
he is so maybe that's not my future but
00:50:01
for 99% of people and 99% of jobs and
00:50:04
99% of the paths that are available
00:50:07
before us it's kind of just average
00:50:09
people like you and me but who who
00:50:11
dedicated themselves in a big way or
00:50:13
were open to try something new and then
00:50:15
they they went after that thing and it
00:50:17
worked out for them and you realize it's
00:50:20
not that someone's born with this
00:50:22
amazing trait that you and I aren't
00:50:24
privy to the Einstein or the Sha type
00:50:27
trait they just have a little bit of
00:50:29
gumption and maybe a little bit of luck
00:50:31
and and a little bit and a lot of hard
00:50:33
work and all these things kind of mix
00:50:34
together in a pot and some magic ensues
00:50:37
but it's possible for me and you I mean
00:50:39
that's the big takeaway I think yeah
00:50:41
exactly so 10x thinking I like it a lot
00:50:44
and we are I really like I was saying I
00:50:46
love that article a lot it'll be in the
00:50:47
show notes a lot of afford anything will
00:50:49
be in the show notes but just in case
00:50:51
Paula someone isn't sure how to find you
00:50:54
how to reach out to you how to I don't
00:50:56
know follow you on social media where
00:50:58
can you direct our listeners well the
00:51:01
the number one place to find me is
00:51:02
through the podcast the afford anything
00:51:04
podcast so the same way that you're
00:51:06
listening to this podcast whether it's
00:51:08
Spotify or apple podcast whatever it is
00:51:10
that you're using go there find the
00:51:12
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00:51:17
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00:51:20
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00:51:25
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00:51:27
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00:51:29
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00:51:31
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00:51:32
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00:51:38
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00:51:41
you go to afford anything.com show notes
00:51:43
that's where you can subscribe to that
00:51:45
very cool so whether you're listening to
00:51:47
this from Lululemon or Panera thank you
00:51:50
for listening and Paula pant thank you
00:51:52
for stopping by the best interest
00:51:53
podcast oh thank you you thanks for
00:51:57
tuning in to this episode of the best
00:51:59
interest podcast if you have a question
00:52:01
for Jesse to answer on a future episode
00:52:03
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00:52:06
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00:52:09
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00:52:28
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00:52:34
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00:52:36
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