00:00:00
the thing about Conan Conan's uh someone who I've known I remember when he and
00:00:06
Greg Daniels came in so I've known Conan for a long time there's some Heavy
00:00:11
Hitters writers in that show wow yeah Daniel's in the office and from King of the Hill yeah and Conan and these guys
00:00:18
you know there's just you meet a lot of Ivy League guys like you went to Arizona City College right or something I went
00:00:25
to DeVry yeah yeah I went to a San Francisco State the Gators it was sort of like uh
00:00:33
Harvard or yeah almost no name yeah because you get there and you're like oh you went to Harvard and you're dumb like
00:00:40
me and Conan wasn't like that I mean Conan doesn't wear one thing same with Kevin Nealon Conan does not wear the
00:00:46
fact that he's six six on his sleeve like he's had
00:00:52
there's no sense of him being a big guy some big guys are tall guys like Greg Holtzman you got to tell they're sort of
00:00:58
caring yeah they're kneeling's so tall too it's embarrassing I don't even like hanging out with tall people for real I
00:01:03
hate it I was with Barkley in Arizona because Charles Barkley used to play there and we went out hey yeah Charles Barkley
00:01:10
this is terrible terrible sorry Frank Caliendo and I go it's too tall he's a
00:01:17
hilarious guy but I can't look like I look shrimpy now I don't need it well I know what you mean I mean going on the
00:01:22
Conan O'Brien show when Conan would come out he's standing up then Andy Richter would stand up people don't realize Andy
00:01:29
is six four oh really six so I'm like you know I start singing the
00:01:36
munchkin song I mean I haven't put those little parakeet thing so I sit on top of it because I'm really high up
00:01:42
like a bird oh you do oh yeah yeah that's on your haunches if you get on
00:01:48
your haunches yeah I go as high as I can and then um and I sit on Apple box but yeah Conan's gonna be great he's a
00:01:55
fondue to talk to he's easy he knows what he's doing he knows how to talk Conan is obviously he has a huge podcast
00:02:00
he's a great conversationalist uh we have dinner with him all the time
00:02:05
pre-covid remember coven I know this podcast make us go of it
00:02:11
hey that's the whole idea you go I am so busy it's just because of covet I guess
00:02:16
I'm gonna pop out a little podcast game I know you almost have to do it now it's the sickening you have to do it I met a
00:02:23
comedian about six months ago I won't mention his name but he didn't have a podcast and I go are you [ __ ] me you
00:02:29
do not have a podcast and you're in Show Business you know Fallon's gonna come on by the way I just talked to him
00:02:34
Schneider Fallon it's going to be great Fallon is the ultimate Fallon is my yeah he's oh we're
00:02:41
not doing fine yet but oh that Conan okay Conan has produced more funny stuff than almost anyone in the history of
00:02:47
American Comedy if you look at all the Team Coco stuff he he kind of stayed fairly Evergreen he
00:02:55
stayed out of the intense politicalization that's true comedy so everything he does is Evergreen and my
00:03:02
my wife and son are obsessed with his travel shows that too yeah he goes
00:03:08
around the world yeah and you have to be smart I would not know what to do they watch him over
00:03:15
and over again and it's pretty cool well here he is Conan O'Brien foreign
00:03:21
[Music] I want to welcome the two uh comedians
00:03:29
entertainers performers that I've had dinner with the most in the last say seven eight years since I relocated to
00:03:36
L.A Conan O'Brien and David Spade both that's a high honor thank you yeah it
00:03:42
was uh a lot of it was tedious I'll be honest I'm going to do the back pedaling that Conan does so well I really really
00:03:48
like you but you know I've got a little a little boring there were times there were gaps in the energy sometimes the
00:03:54
energy would drop and uh you're very restless David um oh me I thought you're gonna say Dana
00:04:01
no you get up a lot Dana's gotten a lot better Dana Dana used to be very hard to
00:04:07
talk to Kevin Nealon used to be hard to talk to but I've been working on both of them and we have I actually for the
00:04:14
first time about a month ago made eye contact with Kevin Nealon and it was a
00:04:19
huge it just was a this is something I've been working on since 1988. yeah except
00:04:25
forward um David you and I don't hang as much no but that's okay
00:04:32
I say nice things about you all the time which is our last dinner together I
00:04:37
think our question is for randos what that guy runs something Rob who else us three and that was it
00:04:44
right it was us three and Ted sarandos joined us yes um
00:04:50
pitching Me shows
00:04:55
[Laughter] he
00:05:01
at one point held up one of those giant checks uh and it was already signed and
00:05:06
he said just fill in the amount and Dana was like I'm eating like a Publisher's
00:05:13
Clearing House oh and then we're at that dinner
00:05:20
yes we run into lovetts and I love it because love it's always does no matter
00:05:28
who he's with uh my favorite thing is he was once standing with this very attractive woman
00:05:33
and I was talking to him and in front of the woman he looked at her and then looked at me and went jealous jealous
00:05:41
jealous is a top five it's a top five love it's uh yeah he could be standing
00:05:47
with a hobo he can be standing with a shoeless hobo and he often is and I'll
00:05:53
be talking I'll be like oh hey John how are you and he'll go ugh as my friend uh he's homeless and I'll say oh well
00:05:59
that's uh that's too bad John sorry for and he'll look at the friend and then look at me and go jealous
00:06:06
no he's really not jealous no his big move is the he gets new sunglasses or
00:06:11
has cool sunglasses and that sets you up nice sunglasses they come down and he
00:06:17
sometimes he goes get to know me get to know me he wanted that to be his after
00:06:23
after the liar um he was desperate for a catchphrase
00:06:29
and uh and he no he really was he really didn't know I know a little catchphrase
00:06:34
yeah one of them was uh he really wanted to say so you should get to know me get
00:06:41
to know me and would say it's okay but um and then he had another one do you
00:06:47
remember Dana goodbye everybody goodbye goodbye everybody goodbye but that was a
00:06:55
good one that was a pretty good one the whole sketch was built around the guy saying goodbye everybody goodbye it's
00:07:02
really a nothing sketch just to keep getting to that yes and he would he
00:07:07
wanted um he wanted another catchphrase because I think he saw merchandise and he wanted he was thinking ahead and he
00:07:13
didn't care what sketch you pitched him as long as it got to what's the catchphrase does it get to get to know
00:07:20
me or goodbye everybody Goodbye by the way Conan have you been in those read through as well someone's jamming a
00:07:27
catchphrase down your gullet and it's not clicking for 13 pages and everyone's dead silent yeah yeah one of my favorite
00:07:33
uh I have lots of Saturday Night Live memories
00:07:38
um and uh some are the ones that people you know most people think oh my God you
00:07:45
were there when you two played you were there when you know iconic rock bands playing Neil Young spring
00:07:51
and I've told this to Neil Young it was the best live performance I ever saw on Saturday Saturday Night Live I keep on
00:07:59
rocking in the future Keep On Rocking In The Free World and I've never seen anything like it it was he he
00:08:05
it's very hard Lauren always used to say that uh TV is the worst way to experience rock music it's just TVs TV
00:08:13
is the worst way to experience rock and roll but tell our musical the second worst way is Radio
00:08:24
live in an intimate setting no Lauren that's the best and if you have a can with a string and it's to a neighbor it
00:08:31
it's like really really bad yeah but uh so anyway he um he's he said uh but that
00:08:38
was I don't know what Neil Young did but he transfixed everybody it was it was great well there's a garage band that that
00:08:45
that's right Ashley Simpson anyway oh you were there for that no I think I was
00:08:51
gone but I couldn't think we did have a lot of good bands I mean we had Nirvana we had Pro gym but you know people
00:08:57
always expect that that would be the memory that you would remember that you would think of most right uh Eric
00:09:02
Clapton and I think yeah because when you're watching them rehearse
00:09:09
um you can stand in 8h which I know looks big on TV but it's much smaller and cooler and and when you're standing
00:09:15
there at rehearsal and you're watching the greatest musicians uh of of the 20th
00:09:20
century perform right there it's quite stunning it's quite amazing but I still think
00:09:28
read-throughs that those are the memories that are with me the most because they contain uh PTSD you know
00:09:36
the the the oh yeah they're the ones good and the bad the good and the bad and so if you have a sketch that's
00:09:42
killing it read through you're delighted but I think they say negative impulses
00:09:48
affect you more than positive ones it's like gambling yeah and also yeah exactly
00:09:54
and also we all know you don't see the people that are laughing in the crowd you notice the
00:10:00
people that aren't laughing uh and um you guys have never had that but trust me it's no fun to have a nice
00:10:06
member not left yeah let me explain it to you I'll try sitting there Conan for for 45 minutes say you haven't you're
00:10:13
not reading anything and you know it's coming some are killing some are bombing it's just very hard to control your
00:10:19
energy and your emotions because all of a sudden Lauren does and in walks Conan and then you got to be on
00:10:25
see I was not a performer I was just a writer so uh
00:10:32
but mostly you guys were the ones that had to be on so what the first thing you
00:10:38
have to do when you're a writer and and one of the things that's so nerve-wracking about read through you've
00:10:43
been up for two days you haven't had a shower uh you're you're completely whacked out you've written this sketch
00:10:50
and you've you you desperately want it to work the first thing you have to do is get to the performers that are in the
00:10:55
sketch and tell them how to do the thing you want them to do you know you have to tell them obviously I'm not going to
00:11:02
tell you if it's a church lady I don't have to say boo to you but be fantastic no no because you're close you have to
00:11:08
say hey I'm going to be with 43 other writers that are going to run up to you right now and say how to do their sketch yeah exactly but you also have to get to
00:11:15
David and say David in this one your your your uh you know Cockney you're but
00:11:22
you're also kind of sarcastic uh or or Dana I've got to get to Dana and I've
00:11:27
got to tell him really quickly Dana the idea this is that you get on an elevator with sting and this is kind of how
00:11:33
you're doing it uh it's that kind of oh yeah I recognize you okay well how was
00:11:40
Harvard then I just walk away exactly no you were very nice some people were quite can I just say for a second that
00:11:47
the the time before read through is it's like Grand Central Station people are running around people trying to get the
00:11:54
scripts together and especially with a host cone and you writing for a host who's got 55 things they have to read so
00:12:01
you have just maybe what 25 seconds to give him kind of a hint sometimes yeah
00:12:06
and you have to get to them and it's intimidating because sometimes they lit they are intimidating people it's George
00:12:12
Steinbrenner you know it's a guy who fires people for a living and he's hosting the show that week and you have
00:12:18
to run up and say and you're a ballerina and in what you do and he's just like
00:12:24
get the hell out of my way by the way what about read through then they look at you and you're across the
00:12:30
table shaking your head going you blew it yeah exactly well my uh my the memories that haunt me are
00:12:39
if you've got a sketch that all relies on one turn of phrase and that's the
00:12:44
moment where everyone's gonna start laughing and then everything else is funny because of that moment right it's
00:12:50
uh it's like you've lined up 800 dominoes and what happens is you hit the
00:12:57
first one and it it falls and it hits the second one but then that one misses
00:13:03
the third oh that's the sketch so you know you're three pages in and someone
00:13:09
says really because this restaurant sells octopus that's supposed to be the
00:13:15
thing and there's no laugh and you know that everything else rides on that isn't
00:13:22
going to work you just lit the firecracker that's supposed to set off every other firecracker and every other
00:13:28
missile and it goes yeah 17 Pages you kind of overwrote it at 17
00:13:36
the worst positive you look ahead and Lauren's reading the stage Direction and it's silent and then it's like you know
00:13:43
they all then March into the mines they go downstairs he repeats this is an octopus yeah and then he starts to read
00:13:50
faster and faster really fast and swallows the words yeah and he tricks out everyone in the room hates you
00:13:58
everybody hates you because you've consigned them to 17 minutes of an
00:14:03
octopus sketch and the fuse didn't light in the first page and you're screwed
00:14:09
that's what I remember more than anything yeah sweating well I I I was lucky enough to be on the show long
00:14:15
enough that toward the last couple Seasons I never wanted to peek at read through because one time out Al Franken
00:14:22
said to me hey you peek you peaked it read through you know I did it all out
00:14:27
at read through and I never got back to them so then if you know it's on if it's George senior or church lay then you can
00:14:34
kind of cruise into it not worry about it Bonnie with Bonnie Turner will do
00:14:41
something yeah that reminds me that reminds me of something David told me uh
00:14:47
once that I never forgot which is I was there for David's audition for Saturday Night Live and wow uh I remember that
00:14:53
night very clearly because I was sitting at a table with Lauren and we were watching different people come up and
00:14:59
apparently David you were told you were given advice by Dennis Miller which to
00:15:04
me sounds like terrible advice but Dennis just before you went on said uh you know just remember you don't want
00:15:11
to like you don't want it too hard you don't want to kill too hard at your audition and I was when I you know
00:15:16
because it throws a red flag because yeah and I was thinking no kill at your audition of course
00:15:24
for sure yeah but what what does that mean don't kill I would wonder what it was it was it was spuddly because you
00:15:31
know he was like what my favorite comic and then he was with and they helped me get on this young
00:15:39
comedian special which Marcy Klein saw or whatever Shannon um by the way I hired a truck to back up
00:15:45
I thought it'd be funny now it's not there's beeping um so Marcy everyone's there I guess and
00:15:51
then Dennis comes up backstage how you doing Spud and I go I don't know obviously [ __ ] my panties don't
00:15:57
worry man you don't want to kill too hard you know it's a red flag some polished Road hack and I go right so so
00:16:03
don't do good and then he like walks away and I'm like and they're like and three two and so I go on I'm like am I
00:16:09
not supposed to you know yeah so I don't do that great I think we all remember it was what what the lesson was I think is
00:16:17
they're going to look at your writing you don't even really I don't I didn't realize this for a long time until I watched comics and liked them that I
00:16:24
could tell if someone had game when I go oh I like the way that joke is structured I like the words in that one I like whatever and and it was a little
00:16:31
offbeat I didn't see it coming or it was a bit of a surprise even if it wouldn't work I go that guy's good or something
00:16:37
and I think that's what he meant and put it in the worst possible way but
00:16:42
like don't kill and I'm like I know I want to kill I gotta that's all you knew that would work you do well and then you
00:16:48
get hired I think if someone comes in this may be different than killing or not killing but completely formed I
00:16:54
think if things are a little fragmented and not fully formed then Lauren and the staff Google you know which Peach clay
00:17:00
we can play with we'll develop it you know as opposed to being completely locked into your thing right it gives
00:17:06
them a place to it gives them a place to go no I see what Dennis was trying to say yeah but if I was going out to to
00:17:12
audition and the last thing I heard was don't kill too hard I didn't sabotage or
00:17:18
something you know also I always um but it wasn't Dennis and I uh subsequently every time I bump into
00:17:25
Dennis or talk to him he's delightful but oh yeah back back in the 80s I think
00:17:30
he you know he just had that kind of Cha-Cha way of going out people Sammy
00:17:35
Davis Jr yeah but it's almost and so he and I think for some reason I was I
00:17:41
remember I was quiet it started out live for a long time I'd be funny around the writers and then when the performers
00:17:46
said that when the performers would come around I'd get real quiet or Florence there I'd just listen and I I didn't
00:17:52
shoot my mouth off I was I was uh but I remembered and I and for some reason Maybe
00:17:59
I don't know Dennis I just feel like there was a period of time where he just was fine I don't know about this cozy
00:18:06
guy you know so I remember I remember at one time he I said something
00:18:12
and we were over by the craft service table that uh that leads into 8h at
00:18:17
where the food is and I'm standing there by the food and I'm I don't know I'm like I'm 23 24 year old string bean and
00:18:24
uh Dennis said something and I went yeah well blah blah blah I just said something and he took it the wrong way
00:18:30
he thought that I had taken that made it that I had dissed him some way and I'll never forget what he said he went ah
00:18:37
so cones it takes a shot at Denton and I'm like what anyway it's Betty Davis
00:18:44
now yeah Kelsey took a shot at 10.
00:18:50
gonna be a bumpy ride for Coco in the next couple of months on his ass and I just thought no no no
00:18:58
no no no no no I didn't well okay the bat you know the guns have been drawn
00:19:03
well we'll see how this plays huh I can't see it okay
00:19:09
don't go out as Dickie Pryor no one expects Sam Kennison last couple and get
00:19:16
out okay that's all it's about don't kill too hard cause they'll resent you I'm going to a theater
00:19:24
Broadway show dematerial but go out there and eat it
00:19:33
now I like that I explained to the guy from Harvard what Dennis meant I feel bad about that now
00:19:39
um thank you foreign
00:19:46
did you notice in read throughs like because I went to Community College San Francisco State and once in a while it'd
00:19:53
be a Jack Handy sketch or something and I would mispronounce a word and I would
00:19:58
hear little pockets Yale yeah Cornell Harvard just little Giggles probably
00:20:05
that didn't happen but I definitely felt my lack of Education like I can talk to you about you know the Third Reich or
00:20:12
the you know French Revolution and it does seem like people are Highly Educated have a bigger palette no I
00:20:20
think that's in your head I really I really do think that's in your head as smart as them they never talked to me
00:20:26
about that come on he talks about the good dumb stuff so I can understand it that's right well you call it the third rich you didn't understand
00:20:34
that I probably perceived once and didn't happen again well that's yeah that's the other thing too is uh I I if
00:20:43
I could change one thing about you know uh if I could change one thing it would be that nobody knew where I
00:20:50
went to college because you guys know me I'm I'm I don't think that's where my
00:20:57
sense of humor comes from I think I'm uh and and I think there were times when
00:21:02
people were like oh look you know Harvard guy Christ sexy yeah Harvard guy over here and
00:21:09
you'd think well okay it's not Hogwarts it's not a magical place it's a school and I met some really smart people there
00:21:16
I also met some pretty dumb people well I think it's because uh you were president of the National Lampoon
00:21:22
Harvard yeah Harvard National Lampoon and you were elected two years in a row
00:21:27
I saw some notes about that so I think it wasn't just the Harvard it was that that yeah well yeah I was you know
00:21:35
consider you wearing your intellect on your sleeve at all I do my best to hide it it's it's what
00:21:42
about that sweatshirt that said I'm the best of the best I thought that was ironic what about
00:21:49
that sweatshirt that said got Mensa they used to wear I took a Mensa test by the
00:21:54
way because my stepdad thought I was so smart and I gathered results he goes you know what this is stupid he crumpled it up
00:22:00
I had I you know what I think the mistake I made when I showed up at
00:22:05
starnot live I was wearing uh the Mortar board on your head that you wear at graduation and I walked around with a
00:22:11
tassel and a diploma it's a Mortar Board that's the thing that you wear on your
00:22:17
head at graduation yeah I didn't know it's called a Mortar Board you had a semester at Arizona State
00:22:24
football Diaries you did go to harguard David did you go to college at all Mr Spade
00:22:31
you know what Dana I have 14 questions yeah I went to Scottsdale Community
00:22:37
which is basically yeah the tiger plus yeah and the artichokes and then I went
00:22:43
to Arizona State by the way Scottsdale was like my warm-up for ASU and I got all this cruise through this and then I
00:22:49
was like wait this is hard now I gotta go to a [ __ ] ASU after this this is supposed to be the layup and then I got
00:22:56
the ASU and I was in a fraternity and I have to say and all the fraternity guys get mad at me but I just don't think
00:23:02
fraternities are a good idea in general oh no there it was 90 hazing and pouring
00:23:08
paprika my head and spray painting so David uh you're a you're a fragile
00:23:14
flower fragile I I think of them making you do a keg stand and drink six quarts
00:23:19
of vodka I think you would die immediately I think you would I think you would die the second they they had
00:23:25
you do anything I can't believe they use you as a prop to beat up the captain under football team I know that Dana and
00:23:32
Conan know I'm a fragile dandelion and then I go well at least it's within my tight friend group and then I realized
00:23:38
like I come off the world like some [ __ ] hard ass athlete but the really the world just kind of knows I am I sit
00:23:45
funny on Ellen they're like right away going what's happening on your hunches yeah I sit on my knees yeah you sit on
00:23:50
your yes at the restaurant we were at uh what you you were sitting on your knees
00:23:55
a lot and and you'd get up and you'd walk around stretch stretch out yeah you were on a line you were doing a lot of
00:24:01
cocaine at the restaurant can I ask you guys a question yeah I had cocaine mixed with um the second booster
00:24:07
I did not do well with cocaine I didn't want Dana that's too bad then I burst
00:24:13
into tears like a half hour later then I did it the second time drove to the comedy club and said what they all hate
00:24:19
me all the other everyone hates me and I drove back home that was when I only did it twice yeah I look at both of you and
00:24:26
I'm going to include myself in this I'm gonna look at all three of us because I never did it and I always just knew I am
00:24:33
not the personality type that needs to be artificially revved up yeah that you
00:24:38
wanna you need to calm down I I saw a doctor uh yeah I mean you guys saw me at
00:24:43
SNL and I was always grinding my hands together practically starting a fire with the with my Knuckles uh and the
00:24:49
coin show you would you would or you know late night you would ride a bicycle yeah yeah yeah and I would grind I would
00:24:56
grind my hands together and grind my teeth and shatter them because I was so uh uptight and the last thing in the
00:25:03
world no one's ever said you know what you need man you need some cocaine pain no one's ever said that to me and Conan
00:25:11
yeah uh just to for sure interrupt you the um sorry we're new at this but when I was
00:25:18
in Community College this comedian I like gave me a few bumps you know yeah I'm using Street exactly right now
00:25:23
cocaine line yeah yeah he bumped me up a little bit a little sniffy Jiffy little power flower and so I'd do it and then I
00:25:30
liked it I never did it before stage but I liked it and then I thought he did it was cool and I was a little bit of a
00:25:35
count gakula there for a while and then I got when I and then I slowed down in college but when I got to SNL the only
00:25:42
time I should be doing it because I had to stay up all night I never did it once and I thought I always regret that no I'm kidding but
00:25:49
I always thought it wouldn't wouldn't that be the time to be like because I'd be like yeah and I I would get myself
00:25:55
I'd make myself get up at 9 30. just because I thought it was so weird to stay up all night every night I wasn't
00:26:00
used to it I'm like this is so weird to be in New York and I I wanted some semblance of anything normal and it was
00:26:07
very hard to go in and like I don't think people at home know they always hear you write you know Tuesday night
00:26:14
all night but I would you're allowed to go in at noon and write it just no one really does it that is a completely
00:26:20
messed up thing and I've asked I've interviewed you know current cast members and I'll say do you really still
00:26:26
that thing where you come in on Tuesday and everyone stays up until Wednesday
00:26:31
night you know do still do that do you and they'll say yeah it's kind of still there and there are all these rumors
00:26:37
that it started out that it started in the 70s and obviously it hasn't changed at
00:26:43
all and people were doing cocaine now the group that I came in with you know
00:26:48
Greg Daniels and Bob Odenkirk and Robert Smigel we were all like getting we were all getting our cholesterol checked you
00:26:55
know we were we weren't we weren't guys that were hey how do we score something no we weren't partying
00:27:01
either no none of us none of us were and and and you know clearly uh there are
00:27:07
famous cast members that did but for the most part it was a very
00:27:14
I remember going into Tom Davis's office once and at like one o'clock in the afternoon and he had the same bottle he
00:27:21
yeah got a hilarious guy wonderfully sweet guy but he had a bottle of red
00:27:26
wine on his uh desk and he was drinking red wine at like one o'clock in the afternoon and I remember being
00:27:31
scandalized you know and red wine is nothing you know and I was like what it
00:27:38
was like Mad Men if you know the reference let's have a little so Tom Collins or whatever exactly but I don't
00:27:44
I don't we were not those people but we still stayed up
00:27:50
for whatever it was 35 hours in a row because that was ingrained it had been
00:27:56
institutionalized in 75. that meant you care that means you're working hard
00:28:01
Snyder would stay up and he'd wear his boxers and I'd go that's enough but let me let me ask you a question Conan would
00:28:07
you have a story there David sorry no just that we would write and I would go home because I wanted and you know Cohen I
00:28:14
don't think people know also when you're writing on a legal pad you can't the girls were like Mad Men they were typing
00:28:20
up four girls in a room remember Claire and everyone yep sure type up yeah and a sketch and I didn't know how to write
00:28:25
sketch format so I'd write it out with this guy says this and do it as close as I could
00:28:31
and put a little stage Direction and then I go home and then I'd finish it or
00:28:36
something and I'd have to drive a cab back to hand it in then I cab back home to sleep two hours then come back it was
00:28:42
such a weird process but I couldn't email stuff in that would have been [ __ ] great and then they
00:28:49
would do it for me and sometimes they would do it a little wrong you know because you want to go over it one more time you have to drive in to go over it
00:28:55
again before it went in the packet for read through and sometimes a little Teensy mistake like that would like you
00:29:02
said screw everything up let me ask Conan a question I just want because you were there as a writer to me as a cast
00:29:08
member going through I remember on Tuesday early evening the Riders are hanging out in the
00:29:15
writer's room a lot of foods being ordered and a lot of talk about sports
00:29:20
anything but the the task in anything but and then there's just hours and
00:29:25
hours of just subconscious work I guess and pressure because sometimes I would
00:29:31
leave as a baby at 3am and you guys would still be there leaning back in your chairs picking on some you know
00:29:37
tacos or whatever and then I I find out later they got done but I mean what what
00:29:43
I mean what did you think about that six hours Tuesday evening that was those are
00:29:49
the you know those are the dark times I I would get very very like I got nothing
00:29:55
nothing's happening I got nothing and I uh uh I shouldn't be doing this for a
00:30:00
living and I'm a fro seriously I I I I I would have some kind of I would say at
00:30:07
least um on any second you know not every week
00:30:13
uh every Tuesday night that I was writing but I'd say at least 50 percent of them I'd have a profound collapse
00:30:20
mental collapse because what happens is you hear people everyone else has a good idea yeah and
00:30:27
you hear Franken laughing and you hear a big gales of laughter coming from other rooms and I I remember
00:30:34
very much you know sometimes uh thinking yeah this isn't what I'm supposed to do
00:30:40
I don't know what I'm supposed to do um and then you snap out of it but uh a
00:30:46
lot of waiting for the commissary to open so you could get breakfast and it would open at like seven o'clock in the morning and that's when you could go and
00:30:52
get uh you know a bagel with some bacon on it and drink a cup of coffee yeah it
00:30:59
was really uh it was Conan do you ever say like I mean in your head like I used to think I don't think of it then but
00:31:06
what are the chances you're going to think of a bit every week a sketch that everyone
00:31:11
will talk about it's just such a impossibility sometimes I would jump on with someone I had a good idea and they
00:31:17
needed help and I'll write it with you just to get my name on something because I wanted to feel useful there and not get fired but I would blank out I'd also
00:31:24
hear Smiggle and Sandler cracking up in the office next to mine you know it was connected to mine I'd be like [ __ ] I'm
00:31:30
so jealous they're killing it Sandler was a guy who most people when they show up
00:31:36
um are somewhat nervous uh and I remember you know I remember David you
00:31:42
like walking office to office and saying hey guys you know what are you guys working on and I remember I remembered
00:31:48
very well uh Chris Rock because he showed up when I was there and when he would first she was very quiet and very sweet guy
00:31:56
yeah very sweet very quiet and not the Chris Rock that on stage that people see
00:32:03
on stage who's the most confident man in the world he's kind of asking what do you I don't know what are you guys
00:32:09
working on yeah I don't really know I don't really know uh and that was the energy people had Sandler the second he
00:32:15
showed up was just so happy and enthusiastic about
00:32:21
everything and he'd be like oh let's get milkshakes let's get milkshakes yeah you know and he would be doing bits and just
00:32:28
laughing his ass off and I thought he's he's so comfortable confident about it yeah yeah he was so confident that he
00:32:34
was I think he was one of those guys was like I'm going to be a big star and let's get started this is going to be fun it's almost like it wasn't even a
00:32:41
possibility that he wouldn't because every also everything was clicking so fast like people Smiggle Downy me you
00:32:50
guys we'd all laugh at what he's doing and it was so different and off what I would think about in my
00:32:55
own head that I was like wow that's cool he's got this whole Persona and then
00:33:01
he'd throw they throw it into Iraqi Pete or they throw it into something you know yeah and you'd see pieces of it and then
00:33:06
you go [ __ ] they're buying it they're buying they're buying more and more and he just go I'm gonna write an update I'm gonna write a song I'm gonna write another update and just keep going and
00:33:12
they were working there but he did have a period where there was I I think he
00:33:18
was inevitable and really confident but he did have a period where he was uh I I
00:33:23
don't not sure if I remember it correctly but I think at one point Lauren will kind of feel
00:33:28
somewhat out Dana Adam what what do you you do you think that's going to do because when Adam first came out with uh
00:33:35
it didn't always kill and I remember one time in the hallway near the makeup room
00:33:41
I had an office over there on 8h and I came out in the hallway and he was leaning back against and this was not
00:33:47
normal Adam he looked emotional and almost like he was gonna cry yeah because his sketch had gotten cut
00:33:54
and um as I remembered I gave him a pep talk and I forgot that but he he did um he
00:34:02
was 23 when he got but also remember I don't think uh people at the network weren't I don't think they weren't
00:34:09
thrilled uh and and that's another thing yeah yeah what happens is that stuff there's revisionist history you know
00:34:16
what happens you know later on now everybody loves Norm but they really
00:34:23
didn't you know he as they they really there's a lot of them he got fired and
00:34:29
and and Adam uh there were people at the network that really weren't supportive of that don't get him yeah yeah and I
00:34:36
think Lauren was probably get some pressure like what's with the atom guy and you think it's just so funny how
00:34:42
later on to anyone listening right now everything seems inevitable yeah
00:34:48
everything seems you know it's the way people read history they read history and they think yeah uh well of course
00:34:55
Franklin Roosevelt became president because he's Franklin Roosevelt and of course he was President like four times
00:35:02
no it's not inevitable it can go a million different ways and at the time there are a lot of people uh you know
00:35:09
who are later on you know I mean I remember Farley I was there when he was
00:35:15
waiting outside Lauren's office to get his interview and Lauren had him waiting for like two days and I was I was just
00:35:22
talking to Farley doing bits with them and at one point I took him around the the I took him around
00:35:30
um 8h and I was pretending that I was a big shot and saying like yeah and so
00:35:35
there'd be a crane that was already going up and I'd be like Joe get that crane up and the crane would be going up
00:35:40
anyway and um I was goofing around with Farley and he was he was laughing so
00:35:46
hard he was such a immediately great sweet guy but you know I think he was
00:35:52
when he first came on he was nervous and I remembered it really turning around when I think uh Jim Downey wrote The
00:35:58
Chippendale sketch and suddenly it's oh he's with Patrick Swayze it's Swayze
00:36:04
yeah and it's this that was one of the top ever knowing right off the bat like standing 10 feet away going
00:36:11
um this is like one for the books yeah yeah yeah this is this is uh
00:36:16
um and you knew just okay this is I want to be on the floor when that thing
00:36:22
happens because uh that's going to be a tsunami to be a big guy like Chris was
00:36:27
at that point and he was so athletic and so physical and to see a guy with his
00:36:34
weight move like that and so it it just blew the roof off you know back to misunderstanding Sandler for a second I
00:36:40
remember Sandy Warnick is manager at the time and he said uh he's such a good looking kid I don't know why he does all
00:36:46
that goofy stuff you know so you're right things he did have the girls right away but you know
00:36:52
what's interesting about about Adam Adam said this to me once I mean they liked him yes one of the things that um
00:36:59
fascinated me he pulled me aside he said Conan okay
00:37:06
let's get lunch it's so funny because he lives uh right up the street and he's he
00:37:13
would he'd come by my he comes by my house and you know he'll liter he'll shout outside the house Cody Cody and
00:37:22
he's got the best yell boys too but I guess one of the things that I never he
00:37:27
said this to me and it really fascinated me I asked him like who his Idol was at the
00:37:34
time and I thought it was going to be a comedy person and he looked at me and he said James
00:37:40
Khan and I was like James Khan like James Khan the the Sonny and Godfather yeah
00:37:47
and then I saw it like which is Adam has that
00:37:52
he he can channel that he has that uh yeah and you know from his dramatic
00:37:58
roles he can kill it he can lock eyes with somebody uh he can sell it he can
00:38:05
he has that energy um he's a tough guy energy and he's
00:38:13
so he's doing all this stuff that like I can kind of see what Sandy wernick's talking about which is she probably thought here's this good looking kid
00:38:20
with real acting chops and why is he dressed like a baby going okay you know
00:38:25
and it's uh uh but Adam knew what he was doing
00:38:31
I remember Adam when he was not he'd not done a movie yet he was starting to do
00:38:37
well in the show and I remember him saying yeah I love Smiggle I'm going to put him in all my movies I remember
00:38:42
thinking oh you are wow all your movies all about 70.
00:38:52
but Conan you were saying like when you see him in a hallway standing there we've all been there where you go you're
00:38:58
newer and everything hasn't clicked for him yet and he's probably in his head going what am I doing am I any good like
00:39:04
is this [ __ ] too weird like everybody am I as good as these guys everybody everybody has that
00:39:11
um I think I think about this sometimes with Saturday Night Live today which is
00:39:18
I'm always grateful that I that things happen to me when they happen to me
00:39:24
um you know when you think about it our staff especially when I first showed up the staff we were working with was
00:39:30
really small you know by today's standards it was when I first showed up it's it's uh there's there's like and
00:39:39
I've seen group pictures of the staff and it's Dana Phil you know Kevin uh Jan
00:39:47
Nora or something there's like there's like seven of you and um and and John
00:39:53
Levitz and you think it really does look like the cast of Gilligan's Island and that was the entire cast and I think in
00:40:00
a way everybody was in almost everything because they had to be yeah you were
00:40:06
constantly in the show and now I am uh always
00:40:12
you know hearing about okay there's you know Cecily Strong bow and Yanks he'd be like
00:40:18
great great I got it but then you realize there's there's 35 other people
00:40:24
um and that with that many staff I think it would be hard
00:40:30
I think it's maybe must be more challenging for the writers and can you imagine being on that staff now uh and
00:40:36
thinking how do I get on the air and also they have guest stars now we never we would do that once in a blue moon but
00:40:43
Danner Aykroyd came in and did Bob Dole and that was like a big thing I would have been live it as a cast member just
00:40:50
think Cohen when we were there we were sort of overlapping with Dana and Dennis and Lovitz and um when we all
00:40:56
came in and it was pretty full then and also Franken was available you know uh there's a lot of people that do stuff
00:41:03
and it's hard to um well no it's hard it's harder it's hard
00:41:10
to pop and it's like I think if you're playing on a basketball game and the and there's fit and there's 35 benches and
00:41:18
12 players on each bench uh you know your chances of getting in the game are
00:41:23
are are I would think be much tougher you can't beat down the the innate fear and Terror and uncomfortableness of
00:41:30
doing that show unless you get on air it's very hard to get because how do you try not to try and that's so it's it
00:41:38
tick it took me 80 shows I think to get out of my head you know right and I think that's why uh and and clearly they
00:41:46
keep finding really great talented people uh but I would think it would be
00:41:52
so much harder if you haven't found your foothold right away if you haven't found
00:41:58
your Niche right away I would imagine it being I I I would feel for a cast member now
00:42:04
because I think man that's a that's a challenge to pop you have to have a clear Niche like if we have uh I was
00:42:11
sort of sarcastic you know Chris was this Adam was doing this so at least you
00:42:16
have that then you sort of go oh I'm not just a one-trick pony anyway long story short I am but at the time I was so was
00:42:24
Johnny because I can do other stuff and then they go okay what and I go I don't know but uh maybe for the writers it
00:42:32
might be easier because you have more people to cast but you're it's also hard
00:42:37
in a new world to say can you can Dana play a girl no you
00:42:43
can't do that or if you're Asian if you're Korean are you allowed to play Japanese like there's so many there's a
00:42:50
new world where things are offensive and on a show like SNL are you still allowed
00:42:55
to be goofy and do Impressions and they must have one more there's stuff I I was
00:43:00
involved in that could never be on today I don't even want to mention it but it was uh the the
00:43:07
sketch at one point we had Candice bergon Bergen on and she kind of talked
00:43:12
about how it was you know maybe maybe a little not politically correct but do
00:43:18
you guys think that like Saturday Night Live today it's it's easy to get into grumpy old man I just like oh we did it
00:43:24
this way because I remember running into Sid Caesar in an airport and I could tell he was sort of bitter but it's not
00:43:30
you know SNL is not that good we did it better this are is Art always just built
00:43:35
for its time I mean my father just hated the Beatles and then loved them later it's just kind of an interesting idea of
00:43:41
like is Art always Andy Warhol in 1962 or whatever Saturday
00:43:47
live is exactly where it's supposed to be culturally or do you have any issues with it I don't have I don't I made a
00:43:53
promise to myself a long time ago judging too well I made a promise that that there are things I'm going to get
00:44:00
and things I'm not gonna get but that uh be happy
00:44:06
I'm very for I'm very happy that I got to do what I got to do at the time that
00:44:12
I got to do it and I make a real effort there are some things I don't understand
00:44:17
or there'll be something that people really love that doesn't click with me but I think for the most part if
00:44:24
something's getting a lot of likes uh if something's getting a lot of traction online and I look it up and it's
00:44:29
something from a you know a recent Saturday Night Live I look it up and uh
00:44:35
you know it's uh it's you know Chris Redd doing Kanye and I'll be like oh that's really funny that is uh if
00:44:42
something's getting traction it's usually for a reason and and yes there's
00:44:48
a lot that's different about that can be different about the show now but I do very much try and remind myself that
00:44:55
it's not worse or better it's just different it's just a completely Steve Higgins told me that uh I don't know if
00:45:01
he just said that Lauren wrote the Constitution this is his words and then it sort of evolves it's a
00:45:08
living document in a sense and so today uh it it is what it is but you're right
00:45:14
I think funny is still funny you know what's so funny though and now the thing now that I totally was not happening
00:45:20
when I was there um was this business of writers dating movie stars and and yeah we're hearing
00:45:29
them and I just think about wouldn't that be really funny if I can picture me and Greg Daniels and Robert Smigel in
00:45:36
1989 if uh if I you know if I was walking around
00:45:41
and I you know I I yeah it's amazing I had Madonna on my arm and I was like
00:45:48
guys guys I you know I please let me in the restaurant where you know and people are like Conan Conan this way Madonna
00:45:54
you know and it's just like it's so funny and I'm picturing I'm you know she's bragging about a cold opening
00:46:01
you wrote yeah yeah exactly and uh and and and you know nerdy me and nerdy Greg
00:46:07
Daniels and he's got uh you know he's got uh Melanie Griffith on his arm and
00:46:13
he's like please please move aside you know I remember uh
00:46:18
I I think it was for the movie Sex Lies and videotape I think Andy McDowell was
00:46:24
on the show and she's just she's so gorgeous and it was my birthday and I
00:46:30
didn't even know how she knew but I was back in my office grinding away and all of a sudden the door opened and she
00:46:37
walked in with a grinding away with with yeah with she walked in with a cake with candles on it and sang Happy Birthday
00:46:44
and like gave me a hug and I my soul left my body and never came back I'm
00:46:50
soulless uh I haven't I've never had my I've never I've never had a soul in my
00:46:56
body we didn't do drugs we didn't have women we just were there also that's my racy story is that Andy McDowell very
00:47:03
sweetly blew out the birthday candles on my cake and and uh wasn't that a nice
00:47:09
memory I'm not I I wasn't sleeping with anyone famous I I wasn't you know I
00:47:16
wasn't being hounded by the paparazzi uh so that's a world that's the way that
00:47:21
standout life has changed where you know the the third assistant director on the show is uh is is going out you know with
00:47:30
uh you know making these things we had our work in front of us we're behind the
00:47:36
facade but it seems to me that Fame is Talent now like I you can be critical or judgmental this this person's advocating
00:47:44
fame or procuring fame but it's its own talent and it's its own power I I don't know it's but that would make I mean I
00:47:51
don't want to judge it it just seems like I think you just did yeah uh um you
00:47:57
know about the new changes they can miss a lot of shows like Conan you weren't
00:48:02
allowed to miss shows no one's allowed to miss anything yeah this is a grumpy old man thing for sure but I was jealous
00:48:08
that I found out you know people would take huge chunks of time off if they felt like they just shoot a movie or
00:48:14
something well that was one of the things that's kind of mind-boggling now is the show starts in in October of 75
00:48:20
and immediately Chevy Chase becomes the biggest star in America and like a year
00:48:25
later he says well it's either continue doing sound out live or make a movie
00:48:30
I guess I gotta go make this movie so goodbye Saturday Night Live and you think no that's not what you now it's a
00:48:38
different world now it's go make your movie and then come back uh you can have
00:48:43
you can you can do both and do commercials it's incredible exactly so
00:48:48
so I think there was a um there was clearly a different the I almost think
00:48:55
the rules were different or people people didn't I couldn't do a Super Bowl commercial when I was two three years in
00:49:02
they just said no I didn't know they could but that was part were you offered one or you asked to do a Super Bowl
00:49:07
commercial and and all the com oh I had some good ideas no that's a good idea
00:49:15
no I got a Diet Pepsi and uh and it was good money obviously I was gonna say I
00:49:20
didn't know what you made when you started I think I got 900 a week to write and uh and the Pepsi commercial I think was 250
00:49:27
Grand and then I just trickled back down to me they say that's not what we do or something and I'm like that's not what
00:49:33
we do make money for working six hours it was a it was a real Crusher because I
00:49:40
wasn't getting on much I didn't know about a future there and I thought wow at least I'll get one click off this and uh
00:49:47
luckily I hung in there but I mean luckily I stayed and worked and ultimately made some money but but that
00:49:53
was a real we didn't do it I was offered a giant Taco Bell thing right as I came
00:49:58
I was gonna offered a giant Taco one so and I asked Conan should I do the Taco Bell commercial I told him the number
00:50:04
and he said absolutely not I'll never forget that Conan killed it yeah I had that kind of power back then don't you
00:50:10
love when people say this is what you said I had a guy dude stuff I said in 1979 and I remember you said that you
00:50:17
were going there and then I remember I was like 4 45 years ago you get to decide what I said you know what's so
00:50:23
funny uh what happens once you become a known person is that other people add you into stories that you weren't in in
00:50:30
the first place because it makes it a better story funny so I went back to uh I went back to I went back to a reunion
00:50:36
once at my high school and this guy there was like Hey gone in you know remember you know back in the back you
00:50:43
know I remember you yeah and he was like we had some crazy times and I was like I I was thinking I don't even know who
00:50:49
this guy is and then he said uh hey remember the time you and I broke into
00:50:55
Steven's market we broke it to Steven's market and we stole all those beers but the cops showed up so we went out the
00:51:01
back and you went left and I went right and I got nabbed and you took the beers you [ __ ] haha but I didn't squeal on
00:51:07
you you know what I didn't drink until I was like 28. I've never committed a
00:51:14
crime in my life I didn't break into a liquor store you know you know that
00:51:21
story's on heavy rotation too it is what happens after a while is you get tired
00:51:26
saying no you did that with someone else but it's been a lot of years and a lot of beers
00:51:32
since then and and then years and years so you added my autobiography in and I
00:51:38
started to think gee that I don't know it's made me read history differently like when I read a
00:51:43
history book now and they say oh you know Lincoln I remember a first-hand account I remember Lincoln once I said
00:51:50
to him you know something and he said what's that and he knocked me right on my ass and then I stood up and I knocked
00:51:55
him on his ass and he said you're a better man than I and I think I don't think any of that happened I think you
00:52:02
just added Abraham Lincoln to your story I was at a restaurant early 1980s and I
00:52:07
saw the guy doing that to Jimmy Stewart and I could tell that Jimmy Stewart is getting really impatient and remember
00:52:12
that time you know in high school we did this call the same old thing and Stewart stood up and said I don't understand a
00:52:18
[ __ ] word you're saying is that true no I just did that so I
00:52:23
could get to Stuart swing because come on yeah that was a good one a good scenario though I wanted to believe that
00:52:29
was I wanted to believe it I set you up
00:52:37
by the way by the way Conan was nice to me when I got there and I have to make sure I tell everybody no Conan I'm sure
00:52:44
you can be a prick I don't see it maybe a person I was there and Conan
00:52:50
said as a hazing you know this is right before Conan dyed his hair red he said go out and give me
00:52:55
some hair dye and you Sandler and Schneider and uh by the way Dakota did
00:53:02
you ever uh does Jack this is a weird question does Jack candy ever collaborate with the other writers he always wrote it by himself maybe
00:53:08
collaborated somewhat but Jack candy was stunning because he could go off talk about nice berries nice guys but also
00:53:17
um I always envied him because he didn't need anybody else you know and he would
00:53:22
go in his room nicest guy and then yeah typing and then he'd come out and he'd
00:53:30
say well good night everybody and would say all right sucker we're going to be here for another nine hours and you know
00:53:37
and the next morning his sketch is the funniest thing it his sketches killed I
00:53:44
would say 95 of the time and it's it was an unreal slugging percentage I would be
00:53:50
baffled because I'm our already just a newer writer learning how to write sketches try not to reek up read through
00:53:56
and then knowing the level I you know when I look back of all you guys who was so much quality there and then seeing
00:54:04
like a Jack Handy schedule just as another move not like better or worse just like so smart and twisty and you go
00:54:10
what is he talking about and right he was like a mad scientist he'd go in there and no one would bump with it
00:54:16
you're not gonna bump with this ugly this idea once and to me it was always
00:54:21
the Simplicity of the idea that would make me think why didn't I
00:54:26
think of that but it's but his ideas were so elegant and so different I
00:54:32
actually got to be in this sketch I'm there in the background and you can if you blink you'll miss me but it's James
00:54:38
Bond's you know he James Bond always makes his way to the doctor you know
00:54:44
whatever Doctor James yeah it's a lair it's a lair he always gets to the lair and shows up and the layer is always the
00:54:51
most amazing thing you've ever seen and the guy is like welcome Mr Bond well this is James Bond shows up at the lair
00:54:58
yeah but the lair still has three months to go before they're done and so there's a lot of construction
00:55:05
going on and and uh so Dr No is really pissed because he's like Mr Bond you're
00:55:13
we're not done yet and he was like well so sorry blofeld or whatever you know whatever the evil guy's name is so sorry
00:55:18
blofeld uh sorry to crash your pardon he goes well well let me show you now remember and uh if you were to be here
00:55:26
four months from now I'd have led you over to this this is going to be a tank with sharks now right now they're still
00:55:33
setting the forms the cement's coming in a week and everything was and over here
00:55:38
there's going to be a laser bonds giving China's giving him [ __ ] and
00:55:45
uh and I was I thought oh my god of course these layers have to be built
00:55:51
and bond is always showing up six months after it's been finished and
00:55:57
it looks fantastic it's working perfect he would show up wow they're halfway
00:56:03
through it was great it was great you guys obviously like his Runners that were big were froze uh Frozen caveman
00:56:09
lawyer with Phil yeah one of the weird ones I remember making you remember it but it was something
00:56:16
about people talking to aliens and they were high up on this thing and somehow the aliens only wanted to talk about box
00:56:22
office receipts of current movies and it went on and on sounds with Christopher
00:56:29
Walken that Jack I believe it was Jack Handy wrote is we're we're landing on
00:56:34
Earth and they are every time the landing gear would come down it would like kill a farmer or something so we
00:56:41
would come out and we'd be like we we come in peace you know and they'd be like Killers Killers
00:56:47
walking would always go let's get out of here and then we go back and
00:56:54
we would land again it would kill a farmer we'd come out yeah let's get out
00:56:59
of it he couldn't catch a break suddenly Chris and I are in this little tight wooden structure like a spacecraft his
00:57:05
his face is an inch from my face just crying with laughter from let's get out of here let's get out of here
00:57:13
now okay the uh that's all I got that no no what I would my question would be
00:57:21
um and you guys could answer this better than I could which is why I'm asking you which hosts when you were there really
00:57:27
made an impression on you either positively or negatively because it's such a strange thing that someone's
00:57:34
introduced to your life they show up on Monday night and by the time you get to the show
00:57:41
party on Saturday you've been through this intense experience with them and then they can spit out and yeah with
00:57:47
hosts like you know with with a host like an Alec Baldwin or a Tom Hanks or
00:57:52
Christopher Walken you know they're coming back in a year but so often you never see that person again you know
00:57:59
what I mean yeah Steve Gutenberg you know I remember he had a good show but I don't think he ever came back I do think
00:58:05
that the athletes Michael Jordan Wayne Gretzky were big and the older movie
00:58:10
stars for me this is back in first season I think it was a Jack Handy sketch Robert Mitchum and I were in a
00:58:17
sketch together and neither of us knew what the sketch was about we were beekeepers or something so uh just be
00:58:25
and Charlton Heston I mean those were the more surreal ones well also yeah I mean the to me
00:58:32
and this was true when I was doing the Late Night show any time I got to interact with someone who had been on TV
00:58:37
or the movies when I was a kid yeah that blew my mind so if you know totally uh
00:58:44
you know I I I uh I remember in the hallway
00:58:50
chatting with Mickey Rooney and and Mickey Rooney there was a there was a
00:58:56
garment rack there you know that you can hang and Mickey Rooney was very short and he jumped up while he was talking to
00:59:02
me and grabbed the bars of the garment rack and started doing chin-ups because
00:59:08
he was talking to me and then swinging kind of like a monkey and I was and he's
00:59:13
like you know and and I I remembered telling my dad yeah I hung out today
00:59:19
with Mickey Rooney and my dad couldn't process it because my dad was
00:59:25
born in 1929 so and then he was huge when he was 10 then yeah so when Mickey
00:59:33
wrote when my dad's 11 the biggest name in the world is Mick is Mickey Rooney
00:59:39
yes uh and and there's no bigger star in the world as he likes to join us so when
00:59:45
I call my dad and that oh yeah I was hanging out with them and but then I had to tell him
00:59:51
Mickey I gotta go we got to start the show and so I blew him off he just couldn't he couldn't comprehend why
00:59:59
would Mickey Rooney talk to you you know and so the same thing but go ahead finish that no no no no that it's it's
01:00:05
me throwing it to you guys saying you guys got to meet and work with these people more closely than I did I was a
01:00:12
writer Cohn and I have one too where uh you you were there uh one of my rock
01:00:17
stars was uh of my life was Bowie and then you know he was music with tin
01:00:23
machine and I told Dana you but you were there during my first receptionist was a
01:00:28
sketch I couldn't get on and then we asked we sent it to Bowie to be
01:00:34
himself and come in and then I don't know who he is whatever the hilarious jokes are and then we sent it to him in
01:00:40
a Boston hotel and then he they Marcy goes uh bo he called David Bowie's
01:00:45
looking for you who called everyone right right right you know those kind of things I think it
01:00:50
was on a yellow piece of paper and it was in my box when I walked into work and you pulled out says David Bowie
01:00:56
here's his fake name the NBC you know that stuff you get when you get messages and I I was so sick nervous and I called
01:01:04
him and he picked up gave the fake name that he picked up and then he's like oh this is the funniest sketch I'd love to be in
01:01:09
it I got things he goes but can I play your part oh and I go oh the receptionist he goes that's the funny part well I mean me
01:01:16
playing myself is boring I mean you could play me and I'll play you your part and I go uh I don't think I can do
01:01:22
that it was so weird you had to say no yeah and he was weird about it and then
01:01:28
he didn't like it he goes all right well I'll see you at the show wow and I go and he hung up and then it like you were
01:01:34
saying just about that week first I get to meet an idol I don't think I knew maybe I knew what
01:01:40
my Venom once choice for and then I then I come back and now hear the good nights I see him and I know there was some
01:01:47
friction now I don't now I'm at Bowie and there's friction some stormy past so
01:01:52
then when he leaves good nights he goes hey I saw I didn't really get what was going on that's like a running scat and
01:01:58
you know I I'm sorry said that I'm glad yeah because my experiences with him were that he was
01:02:05
such a gentleman and so and so I get that he didn't know that it was a runner that you can't you
01:02:11
can't you can't call Dana you know and say I'll do George Bush and and Garth
01:02:18
can you be the guy who comes into the room with the sandwich uh right and it was one of those lessons of like first
01:02:24
of all don't give a host nothing you know there was things you know they'd say what is the host doing this and you know you got to give them something to
01:02:29
do they don't they don't they won't pick the sketch if it's all you and they don't do anything you know that kind of
01:02:35
thing so that was a classic example he just goes that's not fun for me and I got it it was all selfish I wanted him
01:02:41
to be my sketch and I wanted to yeah you have regret or the things you say and it would bother you for a while and then
01:02:47
later on you realize it was nothing because when sting was on the show we were coming down the elevator at the
01:02:53
end of the show and I I got I was hyped up because it was Sting and I I we came out and there were all the people
01:02:59
waiting at the bottom of the elevator like a big mob yeah so I put my stoop I put my arm around sting and said ladies
01:03:05
and gentlemen sting and then he grabbed me and kind of went you know with with
01:03:11
anger so for years I thought he was mad at me you know until I ran into him later you know it would go through my
01:03:17
head sometime the only other funny moment well go ahead comment on that did you ever have did you ever hear about
01:03:23
what was he thinking you were he didn't want to bring it up I think it was obnoxious you know you're
01:03:30
just you get nervous around famous people and you can say or do stupid things Conan uh for sure yeah I I I
01:03:37
definitely but the thing is that's in your head and you're talking about it all these years later and sting forgot
01:03:44
about it seconds after it happened and I've had um after all those years of doing the
01:03:49
late night shows uh no I've had people come up to me and say
01:03:56
hey I owe you an apology and then they'll apologize and I they'll say you
01:04:01
know I I wasn't really prepared or I had a little too much to drink before I came on and I know it was it was like and
01:04:08
they'll say like I know you are really mad and I I know you're so mad I don't
01:04:13
hey I don't have any memory of it and I don't think no I you're I I'm not mad at
01:04:19
you and I haven't I don't even know what you're talking about yeah so and then they're really relieved they're they're
01:04:24
like oh my God but then also probably possibly insulted like this They carried it around in pain for decades and you're
01:04:31
like I never had a story meant nothing man all that suffering what we've had therapy now so we know that we're
01:04:37
wounded clowns in some level
01:04:44
[Music] I chose that moment to look out the window yeah you're looking at them Sandler's
01:04:51
home right now beautiful uh yeah I um it's always well if you're
01:04:59
a sensitive instrument which is a good thing to be if you're a performer an actor or a comedian and then it
01:05:04
infiltrates your normal life and you process people but everyone's okay well
01:05:10
here's the thing that I think uh you could both relate to which is people
01:05:16
their assumption would be that and uh if we make fun of somebody or we tell a
01:05:22
joke at someone's expense that we don't really care how they feel and the truth
01:05:28
is or we don't like it yeah and that and the truth is you know with yes there are
01:05:33
people you can tell a joke about who you really despise who are awful people or Impressions you can do of someone but
01:05:39
for the most part and I think this includes both of you I think most people would be surprised
01:05:46
at how much we don't want to hurt someone's feelings and that when you hear back from somebody like I know
01:05:53
there was pressure on you uh Dana because you did such a great Johnny
01:05:59
Carson impression and people would think like oh you're killing with your Johnny Carson impression because it was so
01:06:04
perfect but you're you're hyper worried the whole time that it might upset
01:06:11
Johnny or feel unflattering to him right and it and it did and it felt bad because I when I did it and when I sat
01:06:18
in that character and it's been reinforced by Tom Hanks and Martin Short on this podcast like that was the most
01:06:24
comfortable I've been doing a sketch on that show I didn't care if it got laughs
01:06:30
I was so comfortable being that the Charming Johnny so the gentleman joins
01:06:35
us for what year you folks are home are watching a television so I he was fine for a while and I would still be on his
01:06:42
highlight reel and I would see Johnny and then there was one that offended him and then I never went on the show the
01:06:48
last two years I was so I knew that I was out and it was um that was Shadow
01:06:53
band that was really really uh unfortunate I didn't like that and and someone told me that he would walk down
01:07:00
the hall at NBC in Burbank and say they're making fun of me now it's time to go just yell it out so also uh felt
01:07:08
bad about that I felt uh I heard a this was from um the great Rick Ludwin uh terrific
01:07:15
executive who yeah NBC executive Who Loved uh you know loved SNL loved late
01:07:22
night that was what he was in charge of and and and really good guy and um and
01:07:27
also the person who pretty much was responsible for keeping Seinfeld on the air uh when it was in trouble in its
01:07:33
first season or two and so lovely guy who passed away about two two years ago or three years ago and um anyway I bring
01:07:41
him up because he used to also work the Carson Show and he remembers
01:07:49
having to go and tell Johnny go into Johnny's dressing room and tell him uh
01:07:54
you know uh Johnny uh talk to you about okay you know well there's just going to be a sketch it started out live and I do
01:08:00
need to give you a heads up that he would have to tell him and that and then and that Johnny would say well I you
01:08:07
know I don't particularly think it's funny but that's their right they're that's that's their right to do that um
01:08:13
and then uh he you know it's so funny because
01:08:20
you forget because we think of him as just being on top of the world from 1962 to to uh what was it 1991 he's
01:08:29
just on top of the world yeah and what we forget 92 what we forget is that he's
01:08:35
constantly um like any comedian or any Star oh yeah
01:08:41
he's constantly afraid and on alert that that they're they're coming after me now and so I
01:08:49
read I read this interview with Johnny Carson from 1980 and it was in Rolling Stone
01:08:55
magazine and he's talking about the interviewer keeps saying what do you think of Belushi and what do you think
01:09:01
of akaroid and what keeps asking about Saturday Night Live and and what did you think of Animal House and what did you think of you know
01:09:08
Chevy you know and and Johnny you realize has been hearing
01:09:13
from a lot of young people or whatever that that's what's the cool thing now and he
01:09:20
was the cool thing from 62 to up to 75 and not that he still wasn't great and
01:09:27
revered but I thought wait in 1980 he's worried
01:09:32
about he's and he's taken a couple of shots at SNL you know and how he thinks
01:09:37
that the humor really he doesn't he thinks it's uh it's a kind of obnoxious and and he
01:09:43
doesn't quite see it and uh he's it's not his favorite thing and then you
01:09:50
realize that okay then eight years later Ten Years Later the show is directly
01:09:56
yeah directly kind of having fun at his expense I mean I I didn't think of it I just always thought of at that time
01:10:02
Johnny Carson is so secure what does he care you know what I mean and it's just funny and silly and your impression was
01:10:08
I thought I thought affectionate you know I I thought you you loved you loved
01:10:14
Johnny I loved being there and I thought it was affectionate but yeah I I do
01:10:19
think that in Showbiz but I know that there was this there was this there was a sketch I think I think uh
01:10:25
there was a sketch that was written that made him a little someone wrote A Sketch yeah yeah where Johnny's trying to be
01:10:32
cool to to keep up with Arsenio and um and and it the toughest the roughest
01:10:40
part was Phil was playing the sidekick Ed McMahon and he was saying things like he literally was chuckling going
01:10:47
peaked in the 70s old reference no old reference lost on younger viewers
01:10:54
world reference lost on younger viewers and you think wow if I was okay if if there was a hot
01:11:02
new sketch show now and there was a guy playing Conan and I'm just completely
01:11:09
out of it and I'm not up on what's Happening Now and I'm you know which
01:11:14
would and I'm old because I've been on TV too long uh I would it would hurt my
01:11:19
I wouldn't even come here it would really hurt my feelings and probably be deserved on some level so it's it's it's
01:11:27
he can't have it both ways but I'm interested in this idea that every performer becomes a caricature of
01:11:33
themselves and you can look at someone sometime and just think is that that person or is that a celebrity
01:11:38
impressionist doing that person and it happens to everyone and you have to keep a sense of humor about it well you're so
01:11:44
self-deprecating you're always ahead ahead of the well no but but I think that it's one of the things the
01:11:52
three of us have a pretty good vantage point on which is we've been at all the
01:11:57
different stages and then what you want to what I always wanted to be at the stage I'm at now is be gracious about
01:12:05
and and kind of intrigued and curious about the young people coming up because
01:12:12
um I'm five seconds away from someone ripping me a new [ __ ] for being too old so just try try be gracious about
01:12:20
all well I remember Sammy Davis Jr on television out of the blue going I'm not
01:12:25
going to be competitive with Michael Jackson anymore you know and he was like almost 60. oh
01:12:32
Sammy Davis yeah but I had a good time with Conan and thank you you're really
01:12:37
great guys I love talking to you I look forward to us uh getting a meal yeah that would be really nice that would be
01:12:43
fun yeah we don't need we don't need sarandos this time we don't need a Netflix guy oh he was he was funny you
01:12:51
know he was just patting we move on now we move on it's just it's just the three of us next time that's it no we had a
01:12:56
blast what we could do with us and um we'll fight to see who pays it won't be me okay thanks yeah yeah I do love you
01:13:03
guys and thank you for having me on it's nice to have you let's have dinner Bud goodbye
01:13:10
check in next week where our guests will be Tom Hanks [Music]
01:13:16
fly on the wall has been a presentation of cadence 13. please listen then rate review and follow all episodes executive
01:13:24
produced by Dana Carvey and David Spade Chris Corcoran of cadence 13 and Charlie finan of brilstein entertainment
01:13:31
production and Engineering led by Greg Holtzman Richard cook Serena Regan and
01:13:36
Chris Basil of cadence 13.
