00:00:00
so David I I hosted um Jimmy Kimmel James Kimmel James
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Edwards job who was also a state senator from Louisiana you did two nights great stuff uh thank you you had Quentin uh
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Tarantino my brothers was a thrill I so loved being able to
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specifically compliment someone who I really admire his work tremendously and
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to see him laugh when I was quoting lines from Once Upon a Time in Hollywood which I've seen 11 times over a period
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of time don't think I'm weird he just laughed so hard he's great you know he did um we should have Mom
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because he did us wait we should have Mom say again we should have mine that's a good plan oh yeah Brad Pitt we ship
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him on Quinn because he did uh oh he wasn't there but we did John trolt and we did Quentin Tarantino's Welcome Back Cotter
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that was a great story I would love to have been there when he was there but he uh he was such a such a kick and so much
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fun and uh I love making him laugh and the next night you had spade and we had a blast and um you came out dismantled
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with your uh what was the guy the driver was eating the limo Cheetos Cheetos
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chunk was hysterical and then uh something about mosquitoes I'll try to find that chunk and I'll put it up on
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Instagram or something uh mosquitoes uh we did talk about the the Burger King guy getting gifts uh at his 27 years of
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Burger King yeah and then I was gonna tell you that when I left SNL after six years
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um Lauren gave me a gift bag he gave me oh really yeah oh well I didn't get one yeah he gave me David please peanut M
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M's um okay a ticket to cats actually it was
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just a cat it was just cat it was one ticket and it was a different play it was not great it wasn't even cats no
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that was like a little practical oh okay okay because they gave the Burger King guy one ticket to a movie
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he's got one ticket to ride so yeah Lauren give me that in a slinky anyway it was great I was I did appreciative I
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did Trump and Biden which maybe a brave stupid or or fun whatever you want to
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think in our current cultural climate but uh my aim was to entertain and uh
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inside baseball I didn't know my glasses and I squint as Biden and the prompter was way back and I'm like man I'm [ __ ]
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right we're taping I could barely see it it was live yeah man I'd opened my eyes and like that but you know goofy wig I
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did look I did the best I could I want to tell you the Cheeto bit was something wonderful but anyway
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you're fantastic and Biden you know the thing is I did the whisper we're kind of
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the whisper was a crush on the wall because we know how to fly on the wall so that that was fun and uh staff was
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incredible and the writers and producers great great people there at Mr Kimmel's show and now here's our regular intro to
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Ellen that's still not Ellen yet Alan Cleghorn Dana Ellen Cleghorn was on
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with me and with you yes and she was a Powerhouse from the beginning she had uh
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just a great presence she had her band mates at the time Melanie Hutzel and uh
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that's okay and and oh they all sort of came in together
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yes great and Ellen was part of that that team and she she has a lot of
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Firsts in her career as a person she's Charming uh funny she is smart she went
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she's a teacher right now Ellen uh Cleghorn has a PHD uh In Theater Arts
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from Tisch University so I don't think my friend has a PHD [ __ ] Hound disease
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hey we compare that with jack off in the Box we got to keep the younger viewers here
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they're starting to flies after dark yeah glowing no Ellen is uh smart and
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it's good and sketchy she's as a raida she had a daughter on the show who is five and now she's a
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and we can't say it'll be on so we'll find out soon her daughter would come around super cute we put in a lot of
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sketches and uh Ellen is uh just a Powerhouse just a big
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big personality here she is guys here she is the adorable Eleanor
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[Music]
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oh my gosh Dana look who forgot that mask I'm naked I'm not surprised
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Ellen is it where are you where are you I'm Jesus she's dropping she goes do I
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need a volume or audio on this podcast long as we can see you we can see you
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out sign language let's just air this the video too we can't hear you when
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you're Frozen and we can't hear you it's funny we hear choppies my two sons are
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into our day hip hop and rap heavily compared to me being from the 60s so they've introduced me to it and we play
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around with Beats and do Rhymes and you know catch phrases Dana do you want to hear
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I'm going to sing a rap song Ready my name's Lamont and I was born in
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January I'm a Capricorn God Ellen will know this one if she unfreezes I got y or at one cause you got a problem with
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this and it's just a big beat you got a problem with this and it just repeats you got a problem with this that would
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work in a dance class if I'm on Molly really when I'm in when I hear it in the gym and it's big beats and and
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repetitive phrasing it's it feels like comedy in a way you know that might be
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from uh Rapper's Delight was the first one that got me hooked on
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it my name's Vermont and I was born on a uh Jam Farm in Vermont yeah give me a word
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I'll rhyme it dude I saw a snoop on the dumbest ad schnizzle it's just like some
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corny Dopey out on the side of a bus I'm like Snoop please turn something down Alan that was the funnest beginning
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we've had actually yeah we're not a professional outfit so don't worry well when you guys get
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really high tech and stuff then you have to have me back yeah we all right yes
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well it was 13.95 to get the good setup and the Cadence decided to spend 995 and
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you pay for what you get you know so do you have any questions
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or should we start okay Ellen we have one we have time for one final question
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for Ellen um we this is Ben Allen no Ellen let's start by saying I was an
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angel at the beginning when you were there and then we'll go from there you were an angel you know that's nice to
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hear because that place is so tough It's hard to not be nice to everyone but you're
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usually just walking down the hallway thinking you're like thinking of a sketch thinking of why I'm not on thinking of why am I sketch bomb
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thinking of uh if Farley's gonna eat my lunch you know there's a million things going through your head so the answer to
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her is yes the answer is always yes and it's just hard to
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uh you know well you tell your side of it I mean you're there and you're you're there on one of the times we had a lot
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of cast members and a lot of people on a mouths to feed you were very Savvy anyway
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so I don't think you would have ever done anything out on towards or whatever you're always such a forward-thinking
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man when I look back and you now you always you introduced me to the phrase a friend of the show
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we still say that Lauren would go Geraldo is a friend a friend of the show
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and then the terrorizing for the cast member still with the show
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I've never heard that before you never got still still with the show yeah Lauren that was one of Lauren's
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favorites I found it funny but he's a friend of the show you know Alan one time when I think I don't know what
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years you were there uh I was there 90 to 94 something like that okay so
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overlapped a lot but in the Summers we would call to see if we're getting picked up
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and he go I just I don't know if Dave was ever around and I'm like this is just this is the one thing my manager
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hears once a year review and that's the one thing and it's like you got to go Lauren you got to be careful what you
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say because that's it for a year he's like are you ever gonna be there I go that's all I am is here all the time
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what it's just it's just like a thing to get me off my ass I don't know but it really like would stress me out to hear
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that you all had so much more contact with him than than I did because everybody makes these I said I never
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even I didn't know what his voice sounded like do you know this is a good impression or not I couldn't tell you I
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don't know who he's doing I guess it's Lauren right how did you what happened with Lauren when you got when you got hired that's when you talked to Lauren
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and that was kind of it for the run I didn't sleep when I got hired oh you didn't I
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the person I spoke to was um Al Franken oh really Franken yeah I would go to Al
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franken's office and then I went into turn the Turner's office oh Bonnie and Terry Bonnie and Terry Turner were they
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the head writers by any chance Dana no because they were just really pivotal they were in a lot of quadrants they do
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all kinds of styles and they helped me a lot Church yeah they were great and other things
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so Ellen they kind of like gave you the ropes or whatever no they gave me no ropes they just looked at me so
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so I saw your tape and then they just stared at you and I'm like okay I guess they were sizing me up to see what could
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I do and Al Franken um all he did was ask me one time he asked me if I could belch I
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was like No And he was through with me and I was like literally hey I can't even bounce
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that was it and then he then he scratched out nine sketches
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because I didn't because you know time when when ladies don't belch there's still a
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Time she said don't you dare don't you dare bill so I always was afraid I admired
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people who could actually belch On Cue oh that I had such a low I I really admire people like that I can and maybe
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that's why I got the show I couldn't do it I could because it take I mean speak take was kind of like with a belch it's
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like an easy laugh there's an art to the spit take but I don't think I ever did one on this show
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you know I like a spit take when I see people do that if it's if it takes you by surprise
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you know you know a good spit take you don't see a lot anymore because I think they ran through them but if you see them now it's kind of funny because and
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it can't be a planned one I mean it can't be look planned that's the worst so Ellen you got you did you
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were doing stand-up right at the beginning Ellen yeah yeah I got it from doing stand up because I used to be in
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the clubs all the time and I think a lot of people that I used to stand up with got higher which uh which ones can you
00:11:00
remember their names maybe we ran into them well maybe you know him his name's Chris Rock uh wait a minute Chris let me
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write that down Chris where where has he been I mean what happened to Chris Rock
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all right Obama our president Barack Obama I go Rocky
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say everything twice in your act I told him when I was teaching my kids how to do stand up for the clarity of the setup
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you know I've said let's look at Chris Rock because he was really good at very articulated does comedy hits it again
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and it's just like really easy on your brain so you can enjoy it he obviously became a master of the craft uh
00:11:41
masterful so Ellen doing clubs back then were you doing like catch using star or those kind those are the ones I kind of
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knew but I didn't know like the underground ones I just knew like a few I never I never really went on when I was there
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but I've I saw you actually a catcherizing star oh good so you don't
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go on there David well that's the only one I knew and I think that's when I auditioned at and then uh so that's the
00:12:02
only one I could call and say can I come down if it was now and then into a set because I didn't really know the drill I
00:12:08
saw you there and you used to do this um bit about scoliosis
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girls large bag little scoliosis I think yeah funny word it is that was the first time
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I had ever even heard of scoliosis I was like this is great this this this comedy
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is educational oh my God it's more shocking that I still do the jump no
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um but I uh you know Ellen is funny I was just telling Dana I taped a special and I don't do that many specials uh no
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one's asking and beating down my door but I did one and I was telling Dana that I did a joke that was offensive you
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know I sort of did it on purpose the second show because I felt like okay I sort of got all my jokes and before I
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got off stage I did when I was telling Dane it was kind of funny because then I sort of yelled at the audience for not
00:13:00
liking it just to be stupid but here's a joke Ellen you tell me if it's if it's you see why they didn't like it so I say
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I went to Las Vegas for a show or whatever and then look at blurry setup
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unlike Chris Rock I went to Las Vegas for whatever and um and the newspaper it said that day it was the anniversary of
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the Las Vegas shootings uh which we all heard about and it said today is the
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anniversary of the October 1st shootings and I asked the guy there I go isn't
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this the Las Vegas shootings and he goes yeah they changed it they got a brand expert because the Las Vegas shooting
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sounded too much like everyone was getting shot in Las Vegas and I go well yeah that's what happened and he
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goes yeah but October 1st hits the ear better and I go oh they hired the same people that did the um Oklahoma City
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situation yeah kerfuff the kerfuffle at Columbine
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I didn't even get to I didn't even get to the Sandy Hook snafu and they had
00:13:58
already given up on me oh my gosh they got it they get they give up during the premise it's called school's out you know go
00:14:06
ahead Columbine was was where this woman was just staring in the front row and I go uh too much and she goes yeah and I
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go yeah I go you know what Netflix likes is when you try stuff on your special you don't tell them and it could be some
00:14:21
legal problems and you do it anyway and so uh they like that they like undercooked half-assed [ __ ] that can't
00:14:28
offend the crowd anyway I'm gonna wrap things up and then I did like um David's nickname is showstopper so
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what was that you know it was such a showstopper no no I was just saying know I I think
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that it could I really think that it could work because it it everybody's so
00:14:46
um sensitive right now so they have to you can't say what it was you have to make it sound palatable and that's what
00:14:52
they're doing they're making these horrible things sound like they're not fun but they're just like okay you know
00:14:59
it's softening that bad yeah they're showing an old Dana Carvey um commercial uh on the on the gram or Twitter or
00:15:07
wherever some you did a commercial with I think it was Pepsi Cola or something oh oh you're you're shuffling cards or
00:15:15
is it Lays potato chips or something yeah you're shuffling cards yes at a casino okay I can't believe that's
00:15:21
around still I think that was 20 years ago I got over my uh you know allergic
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reaction to doing commercials I turned down a lot of commercials trying to be Bob Dylan or something in the 90s but
00:15:33
then by the knots I'm like wait a minute this is crazy so I did do that you got
00:15:38
to take it while you can man [ __ ] I mean yeah yeah when I was with Ellen those
00:15:44
years actually Dana you were there too for this but Ellen I got offered a commercial during SNL when I wasn't even
00:15:50
doing that good and um I wasn't allowed to do it and I was just so bomb that I
00:15:56
finally would have had a little chunk of money it wasn't crazy but I was like God dang I'm not allowed to because you know
00:16:02
NBC decides did we ever talk about how much money we were making on this shot
00:16:07
no well not not today what did you say I'll tell you what I started at 4 500 an
00:16:13
episode so you keep about 2 000 a week I guess or for the 80 000 for the season
00:16:20
I think gross okay I'll go I started at 900 a week to write and I got a 1500
00:16:26
bump if I got on I'll tell you how much I started that okay 245 an episode no
00:16:34
what nothing extra nothing extra if I got anything on and nothing for writing
00:16:39
wow when I left there after almost five years I was making forty five hundred
00:16:45
dollars an episode nothing for writing and that's it and no
00:16:50
bumps or nothing yeah and that's it did an agent put that together do you have an agent back then or no yeah I did
00:16:58
I mean you sort of it's sort of take it or leave it I'm sure but uh exactly boy
00:17:03
I didn't I just thought there were some Union thing would I've never I've never before no you would think there was some
00:17:09
unions yeah go ahead I would ask the union and that would they said well that's Union
00:17:15
um that's Union minimum wage and you only work one day a week so what's the problem good Lord damn it God damn it
00:17:25
I'm [ __ ] pissed now what about Melanie Hutzel what was
00:17:30
she getting like twins
00:17:38
Melanie needs more money than Ellen now what was my what was Melanie Hutzel getting your peers at the time and where
00:17:44
did you ask anyone no I never did I didn't ask anyone either where did you
00:17:49
live how did you survive on that exactly exactly
00:17:55
um no but what helped that was that I was doing stand up so the week the weeks that were um right we were off or
00:18:01
whatever then I would go to stand up on the road and I could make like wow not that much but at least a couple of
00:18:07
thousand dollars it's very rare that the stand-up is more than the uh work check well in this case it was I know I'm
00:18:13
saying that's very odd uh situation because I would I got to the point where I could make some on the weekends if I
00:18:19
went to a you know a college or something but uh you know the the joke of it's one day a week work is we all
00:18:26
know is a joke because it's yeah 24 hours a day on your mind even on the weekends
00:18:32
yeah there's there's like no job harder I mean in the in the real world of like Showbiz I mean there's jobs harder but
00:18:38
uh in our little world it's it's just a constant stress and uh Wow all I add
00:18:44
that's uh that's tough to hear I don't know I mean and you were doing as much as anyone when you were getting
00:18:49
reoccurring characters and you know Queen shanifa whatever their names and
00:18:54
you were kicking it on the show like that I mean obviously they started to bump you but it just still never went to
00:18:59
anything that was reasonable at all no they they didn't but I got wait one week I got one season the whole season I got
00:19:06
like two hundred dollars a week two children change so it came out to be
00:19:11
like I just can't do it even even the next one
00:19:18
exactly the next one's like 400 and something dollars a week the second year third gear was like yeah per show then
00:19:25
it was uh first show not winter week right then um the next one was like 750 a week or something like that and then
00:19:32
finally it bumped up to four thousand to like a legitimate number like a decent number which isn't been crazy he isn't
00:19:39
even a crazy high number for sure I believe unless I got it wrong that it was 4 500 for for the whole cast because
00:19:47
we didn't have a big cast so it was Phil and Jan and I and whoever was coming in I believe it was everyone was getting
00:19:53
the same uh as far as I remember maybe love it and Nora Dunn had a little more
00:19:59
because it was their second season but you know we all have a different situation Dana because I think Ellen is brought in as a maybe a feature player
00:20:06
and not even a writer even though she wrote obviously I was brought in as a writer feature player that they wanted
00:20:12
me to write not really Beyond it's just kind of the opposite and you I think
00:20:17
were just brought in as a cast member but they didn't give you writing credit even though I'm sure you wrote no no looking for a writing no one got a
00:20:24
writing credit you couldn't get one but we all it was just it's not what we do here you
00:20:30
know so you get used to it but it was a little fun I would imagine I didn't want a writing credit I'd rather be a
00:20:35
performer but yeah everybody's writing I think you know the only one who made a joke out of it you two could talk that was Chris Farley would always say I
00:20:42
can't think of anything you know but he was a brilliant performer but that's what he said but almost everyone was
00:20:47
writing to some degree you know Ellen I'm sure to stay alive you had to write you weren't getting thrown at everything
00:20:54
no no but you guys hooked me up though be honest no we would try you and not
00:20:59
just me but me and my daughter every time I turn around she was in a sketches I think she was five and now she's
00:21:07
probably like seven or something she's an oral surgeon what really and she's a
00:21:13
wrestler for God how old is she amazing so you're a doctorate and she's an oral surgeon can you imagine
00:21:22
no I can't really but that's terrific ah so that's great
00:21:29
um good Lord but here's the thing here's the thing when I think of Dana now I didn't know Dana from nobody so um I
00:21:36
grew up in the project so I have my girlfriends and they start singing this thing that you used to do about broccoli
00:21:42
no chopping broccoli chopping broccoli yeah Chopper broccoli and I'm like what
00:21:49
are y'all seeing we would just be dying laughing they said you gotta see this guy it's hysterical and so we would tune
00:21:55
in to um SNL and hopefully it came on so luckily the day came on and love we I
00:22:02
mean you used to have us all dying and laughing in Brooklyn with that chopping broccoli business and then we would just
00:22:08
mock you not mock your mimick you we would do chopping broccoli when whenever
00:22:13
whenever we would just have a moment alone or just just start acting ridiculous we'd be on a piano or
00:22:18
something pretend something was a piano and we were just talking about chocolate broccoli
00:22:24
and then so when I met you I was like oh my God it's a chopping broccoli that is
00:22:30
so flattering I I I honestly I love Madness and silliness and catchphrases
00:22:35
and I love that they uh people sharing them I I thought it was silly and stupid but it really it
00:22:43
even with me it goes through my head when I actually chop broccoli so I like a back of that so I don't know there was
00:22:50
a sportscaster when a guy hit a home run he was on ESPN you go and he is chopping
00:22:55
broccoli so it's fun but that's cool thank you Alan it just it kind of frees
00:23:01
you up to know that anything could be funny not you know and you could just like go for
00:23:07
it just go for it it's a good way to put it yeah I I think it's like verbal physical comedy in a way in other words
00:23:12
when someone's laying out a riff like that then you have permission as an audience member you know you don't have to really listen anymore the guy's just
00:23:19
going to say chopping broccoli over and over again so you can laugh as hard as you want with Dennis Miller or something
00:23:24
you know it's a very intricate kind of thing going on so you really need to listen with that yeah every word go
00:23:31
crazy and Chris Farley with his physical comedy you just like you know
00:23:38
do you remember uh do you remember uh remember that time uh no Dana and Harry
00:23:47
oh yeah never saw anything like that in my life I was Dazed oh stunned and
00:23:54
amazed uh nothing I did I was in that sketch it was like 95 people in that
00:23:59
sketch right yeah I think we had a full cat about that punch ball in that little scene and I assume our audience knows
00:24:05
the character but I I didn't write it but I was wearing a prosthetic thing that looked like I had a massive head
00:24:11
wound and I went to a party and made it a dog got hungry that's all you need to
00:24:16
know Google it that was a sketch that like was everyone's laughing at read through it absolutely no sense I was
00:24:22
like what the hell did you notice that yeah was it Jack handle there's nothing like dogs and children I guess and they
00:24:28
put too much uh baby food on the prosthesis between dress and air so in
00:24:34
the air show the dog because I take a nap as massive heaven when Harry and the dog comes up and wants to eat my head but the dog wouldn't let go the dog went
00:24:41
crazy the prosthesis off but I held it on barely but that that was an example of the
00:24:48
audience it was like an idle of Lucy moment if I could yeah
00:24:55
nothing to do with me really just that was yeah when she's at the when she's at the um the uh the thing with the
00:25:01
chocolate chocolate thing yeah anytime that she's doing just physical comedy
00:25:07
you can just hear the audience ways and ways of laughter but anyway so Ellen
00:25:12
Dana I didn't ask you I was on mute I muted because there's a garbage truck outside oh meat meat but I forgot I was
00:25:18
on mute and I was asking you a bunch of questions I'm going to go back about a half hour were you
00:25:23
um uh was was chopping broccoli in your SNL audition yes oh so it was all the
00:25:30
way back there that was such a good one because I remember chopping broccoli one of the first things about you that I just thought it hit my ear was
00:25:37
like it was so clever and weird and then you were going chop him back up
00:25:43
and I was like what is this funny I sometimes I'll do it for 10 minutes
00:25:50
I'm doing stand up you should have done it with Paul McCartney when he came on it would have been fun you should make him do it oh you know it's very you know
00:25:58
it's humorous because you know why is he singing about a vegetables it's not you know I didn't let it be you
00:26:05
know it's about letting go and it's not but there's nothing really about a vegetable chopping it all the time
00:26:11
funny you know it's like I'm chopping a broccoli you know he set me up so Ellen
00:26:20
uh let's like do you want to talk about your your hit characters or the ones that there are
00:26:27
two that really stood out as far as reoccurring there's a page desk yes I love I missed the radar I miss the
00:26:35
Raiders so much she and I guess I'm supposed to do here you don't have to do it you don't have to do if it's
00:26:41
politically correct to do it here oh because I really do speak Spanish and um
00:26:46
I it's not like uh um but I don't know I I you know
00:26:53
we can cut anything so go for it but I just love that you you said you missed the character I relate to that sometimes
00:27:00
I'll just do characters or voices driving around by myself because I want to revisit the character you know
00:27:06
I I miserated so much she had so many problems and
00:27:13
you'd always get like the host or someone involved yeah yeah the host got involved and I mean when that first time
00:27:19
I did was with Michael Jordan wow wow and that was like major and and he was
00:27:25
like he thought that was I was being ridiculous but I was I and I promised that I would sue him and he thought that
00:27:30
was hysterical but the thing is it's bad and and I said what makes you think I won't cut you and because that is that
00:27:38
that really did happen to me I was on the train and this girl did ask me what
00:27:45
makes you think I won't cut you that's right it's a kind of a tough question
00:27:50
is that a rhetorical question no but that's a classic comedian's move is that
00:27:55
you heard that in a real situation and it is really funny because it's what not I'm going to cut you what makes you
00:28:03
think I won't cut you that is really funny and for you to take that's a good crazy person it was kind of one of her
00:28:10
she always said that at some point or no yeah yes it does what makes you think I
00:28:16
won't cut you that's really that's really funny and she did it with a Spanish what makes you think about Caillou is it like but it's not just
00:28:24
Spanish it's really Puerto Rican but a little Dominican it's like this you know
00:28:29
like it's very nasally and you like gotta put it in that like that yeah and
00:28:34
it's very emphatic oh yeah it makes you think I'm gonna cut you you know it's
00:28:40
number one what did Michael Jordan say to that he just laughed he just looked down
00:28:46
and then I said oh you said don't touch me don't don't hit me I'll sue you you
00:28:51
know he was like okay did you have to do that a read through with him yeah I mean that was great yeah
00:28:58
what a memory you and Michael Jordan I mean he was yeah that that's that just
00:29:04
hitting me funny now the idea of a host just strolling around on 8h and then this page is starting to talk to him and
00:29:10
threatening to cut him and don't forget to sue him you know it's just no wonder it just how many times you think he did
00:29:17
that well maybe six or eight six times yeah I did it I did it quite a few times but
00:29:24
I think it kind of bothered um the one I really wanted to do with was John Malkovich but it didn't get on
00:29:30
oh yeah um yeah the thing that but uh I I think
00:29:36
it kind of bothered the people who were writers you know right
00:29:41
because like if I went to if I went to if I went to Harvard to write comedy
00:29:48
this little scrappy negro from the project is over here getting [ __ ] on air you know I would be extremely upset
00:29:57
and I and I they were they used to really get they used to tease me and really they weren't very nice to me but
00:30:03
um that's Harvard listen what it's boys it's boys you know
00:30:09
boys are very different when you compete with boys and they don't win oh my gosh yeah
00:30:15
um so I think it was part of that and but but that was in the past you know
00:30:21
and you just gotta let it go and move on yeah we talked to Conan about that like he felt weird he was that had that
00:30:27
moniker like he's from Harvard and Iowa to community college so I felt weird like they would think I'm stupid and uh
00:30:34
you know I think everyone felt a little different about their upbringing getting on the show and how they got there and
00:30:40
how they would be perceived but you know if you write a sketch like that and yet Michael Jordan it gets laughs at read
00:30:45
through it's like tough [ __ ] it's getting on what makes you think I won't cut you like you you could go to Yale or
00:30:52
Harvard or Dartmouth for a long time but not come up come up with that and use it in that context so yeah I felt the same
00:30:59
intimidation I went to San Francisco State it was barely a college sorry San Francisco State and I went and I went to
00:31:05
Community College um and then I get the SNL it's just a lot of Ivy League
00:31:12
young men you know with dress shoes and tucked in shirts and jeans and short
00:31:19
kind of waspy haircuts so yeah I got it but yeah but
00:31:24
um so anyway continue Ellen did you go to the 40th you were at the 40th right
00:31:29
yes I was and I think I was was it the last one one yeah 20. that was the last big one 15. yeah yeah yeah yeah I did I
00:31:37
did um I did a
00:31:54
yeah I do I'm sorry I um I teach this class I'm teaching this class here I'm
00:32:01
at uh actually it's a school in Jersey City where I teach at um
00:32:06
the teacher at the new school in Manhattan but I also teach here in Jersey City I just started teaching here
00:32:13
and I'm really having a good time huh but but it doesn't have the money it doesn't have the money that um it
00:32:19
doesn't have the money the new school has so I have to bring all my stuff so I have a group Bluetooth speaker and
00:32:25
what do you teach yeah well in this one I teach act cool and this one I'm teaching
00:32:32
acting here at Jersey City and then and um and I wouldn't the way Dana talks about comedy I want Dana to come and be
00:32:38
a guest at my um class in the new school I teach the theory of comedy and um they
00:32:45
didn't really seems to Dana has really deep thoughts no no Dana's actually really good at articulating writes
00:32:51
amazing stuff but I I am fascinated by comedy and uh in all in all ways and and
00:32:58
the phraseology and and it's such a you know it's like trying to catch the win you you never solve it completely you
00:33:06
never Master it it's always humbling what you think will kill and will not and so forth and so on but do you mind
00:33:11
just for a second because it's kind of I've not met any a run into any X cast member who got a
00:33:17
doctor at a p PhD from Tish School of the Arts like what do you talk about how
00:33:24
that happened I mean when did you decide to go and how did that manifest for you
00:33:29
I um okay so I'm gonna tell you in just a second
00:33:35
because I'm teaching teaching at the new school and uh so I have have comedians come in and talk to the class Etc
00:33:41
Comedians and producers Etc so Mike Shoemaker came in Shoemaker and producer
00:33:47
Marcy Klein came in Marcy and um and uh Tim Meadows Timmy came and talked to the
00:33:55
to the nice right and I use recordings from different things like I use Chris Rock and I use different people's
00:34:01
recordings anyway um so many like maybe in 2007 or 2006 I
00:34:09
was doing a radio show with Paul Mooney and I was writing for him um and in New York City
00:34:16
and he just never came like like the show was from six in the
00:34:21
morning to 10 and 10 in the morning so he would show up you know our radio is you start at six it starts at six yeah
00:34:28
Good Morning America and he would show up maybe seven seven
00:34:34
and then he would have been out all night and so he would sleep right so I had signed a contract with them so when
00:34:42
they when they let him go I couldn't get out of my contract otherwise I wouldn't have to pay them all that money back and
00:34:47
I was like that's not gonna happen and um so I was like so he was mad that I stayed and I was
00:34:55
like no I can't I got um it's not gonna work I'm sorry we'll just have to be angry at one another
00:35:01
so I said well Ellen what are you gonna do what are you gonna do because this is gonna keep coming up you know whatever
00:35:07
and I said well what would you really do if you could do anything because I had this chunk of money I said well I would
00:35:13
like to get a master's degree from someplace I applied to NYU I said
00:35:19
something you've always wanted to do and I said okay and plus I was also in can I
00:35:24
if I could be really honest with you I was tired of hearing people say you know I have a master's degree you know when I
00:35:30
when I got my masters and I was like so sick of hearing people say that I had an
00:35:35
undergrad degree but you know I guess that wasn't enough so I said okay I'll go back and do it so I went and got it I
00:35:43
got into the school I applied to Tish and um I got in and so then I took it so
00:35:49
then while I was there this girl said to me he said whatever you do don't stay stick around for the PHD and
00:35:57
I was like what why not so because they're gonna they're gonna ask you to write something you
00:36:02
know these white people always want to steal your writing and I was like really David and I have that problem too you
00:36:09
know yeah that's a good idea I want to read it so I can take it
00:36:18
I said as a matter of fact so because she told me not to I said okay I'm gonna I'm gonna apply it's all I can say is no
00:36:25
so I apply and comes to find out she had applied as well so she was trying to send to her oh so it wouldn't be any
00:36:32
competition you get it oh no I totally get it sabotage subtle bit to be a
00:36:38
friend she's taking you out of the competition good subtle time right exactly exactly is so then I got in and
00:36:45
I said okay well let's see what happens and they kept saying what are you doing here and I was like what does one do
00:36:52
here so is that constant back and forth so they weren't you know it's a very competitive business it's more Cut
00:36:59
Throat than show business no and um really and people are not as yeah oh my
00:37:05
gosh yeah just competing with who's more who's smarter or why are they did they
00:37:10
only give one at the end or doesn't everybody get it no they they give they give they give out okay so 100 people
00:37:16
will apply and there's six slots there you go wow and you go that's great and
00:37:23
the thing is the thing is they pay you oh so it's like a salary position to be
00:37:28
a PhD candidate got it okay I mean it's not a lot of money it's not a lot of
00:37:33
money stretch of the imagination is it over 245
00:37:39
is about it's about really good at 245. it sort
00:37:45
of it'll take 240. it's a good number for Ellen she does very well I think 245
00:37:51
across the board rest of her life she really shouldn't go for a PhD because my
00:37:56
nephew wants to give would she be good birthday go ahead
00:38:03
so what what I love your laughs I can't see yeah
00:38:11
she's got a good laugh so hey harry do you really no but when I hear Dana Dana really hurts my stomach
00:38:18
but he's I don't know what that is that hard well thank you for yourself sweet
00:38:26
[Music] Alan what was your what was your doctoral thesis on
00:38:33
it was on um African-American humor in Social context what what is
00:38:38
there to say about that from the Civil Rights from the Civil Rights era to the um
00:38:44
Barack Obama so was it 9 000 Pages it was about 400 Pages three to four
00:38:51
hundred pages I kind of feel like and I don't know if it's fair enough but it feels like there's like a heavyweight crown for who's the best stand-up in the
00:38:58
world at any given time and I I think you could say like Carlin to prior to
00:39:04
Steve Martin to Robin Williams and then I'm not really sure where you went from there but I know at one point Chris Rock
00:39:11
was the champion and now Chris rocks Chris Rock stands the test of time yeah his
00:39:17
his stand up and I and I mean I say it's because I I've been studying it I'm not saying that because I know him or
00:39:23
whatever but his when I play it for the kids they get it it hits it hits hard
00:39:29
all the time and so I say you know that really works you know why he went on the
00:39:35
other night I was at The Comedy Store he came in and went on very it's still you know he's working on new stuff and it's
00:39:42
just as good you just sit there and go wow he put that together nicely like he still knows what he's doing he's still
00:39:48
sharp it's just exactly what you would think even Kevin Hart went on I'd never seen Kevin Hart go on and he did a great
00:39:54
job they everyone did a set you know it's kind of fun does uh Ellen going back to Dr Dr Cleghorn for a second uh
00:40:04
the elephant in the room or summing up a social Trend with a with a phrase and
00:40:09
then working that idea for a long long time he seemed to be very very good about I remember during the Clarence
00:40:16
Thomas hearings um with Anita Hill and all that stuff and then he did a thing about no woman
00:40:22
ever accuses Denzel Washington of harassment or something like that but he
00:40:27
did it in the Chris Rock Way and it was just a funny observation you know what I
00:40:33
mean you'll never find a woman leave me alone
00:40:38
you know someone do something I had the opportunity to meet Denzel and
00:40:45
I went I went to see him on Broadway when he was doing um Julius Caesar and so uh backstage and I reached out to
00:40:52
shake his hand and I'm gonna tell you something like butter his hands were sweat you fell for it too
00:41:01
were they moist and soft like Bill Clinton or just soft no no not moist and stuff no they were
00:41:07
not moist they were just soft don't add moist like they made you no voices several well he made me lose my voice
00:41:14
what oh so was it a little bit electric because he's Denzel Washington you know
00:41:19
in a way of just meeting someone who uh you know it's just really charismatic
00:41:25
sex symbol I mean he is I mean he stands on Washington right so did you get you a little weak need in a way
00:41:32
well I might we no my knees did not get weak I actually just lost my voice and all I could focus on was his hands they
00:41:38
were so [ __ ] soft I said what is this maybe you're not a real person or something no I couldn't say it no I was
00:41:44
like I couldn't even speak I lost my voice I'll ask I'll do I'll DM him on
00:41:49
Instagram I'll get to the bottom of this oh
00:41:58
I don't remember I have to find it but I did write a poem and I was doing the Radio Show in New York at the time and I
00:42:03
I read it to him over the air and I don't was it okay what what was it about
00:42:09
I mean Denzel I I I what what would be the subject about a poem about Denzel
00:42:15
just that's about his hands Dana you see how she got into it how soft hands first she was doing even he was doing um he
00:42:22
was doing Julius Caesar on Broadway at two brute
00:42:28
yeah ixnay on the um
00:42:34
Dennis Miller was playing Prospero in the Tempest at the herald how do you
00:42:40
know those words are trying to get my uh enter you know Mickey Rooney going way
00:42:45
back when 1930s actor I remember uh they told Mickey you can't change your lines the camera doesn't know where you are
00:42:51
you know he goes the only writers whose lines you can't change or build Shakespeare
00:42:58
I I just love when I go Bill Shakespeare it's like I like Mickey
00:43:03
Rooney Mickey Rooney um I liked him when he was in some movie with Judy Garland but I like when I used to love those
00:43:09
kind of movies in the afternoon on the TV and because that's all they would show and they were on Christmas
00:43:16
time he was always playing a rich guy and he was two feet tall and I guess he
00:43:21
played a child for a long time and then he was a man-child they always
00:43:27
were it was like Judy Garland and that they were like playing like sophomores in high school at one point they'd go I
00:43:33
know we could put on a show and then they would all start singing and dancing and they would sing like the wind and
00:43:40
dance and Mickey could do it all believe me so Ellen who were you got a barn oh I
00:43:47
got a barn we could throw this thing together by 6 p.m yeah yeah you'll get to get the cows out why Uncle Willie's
00:43:53
electrical stores if we could get a microphone and I'll put all the cows to sleep
00:43:58
kill them you don't have to kill them just walk them out back also some mocking moccasins
00:44:06
yeah those were those were those great you know they made like 10 of those at least do we have a costumer on the ranch
00:44:12
we do Betty Betty can you make a hundred costumes by tonight of course got the
00:44:19
train train coming in town downtown
00:44:25
got the train coming in gonna laugh laugh laugh in the town all right sorry train coming in in the
00:44:33
downtown town it's a huge hit that oh yeah we got cut off did you like going to the
00:44:40
40th did you have fun there and what sketch were you in I did a sketch with um Jerry Seinfeld whoa
00:44:46
um and I was up in the on the audience um on the side with all the kids that I
00:44:52
guess are not the celebrities okay he got in the building though that's good Victoria was on the sixth floor
00:45:00
they told me I don't even know where I am go ahead they let Beth K he'll drive
00:45:06
by and beep but they they told they told me that absolutely no plus ones they
00:45:12
said no there's absolutely because you're going to be in the audience and whatever whatever and I apologize
00:45:19
yeah I did yeah let me bring her in because she didn't sit in the audience with me but they let her bring in the
00:45:26
building uh maybe she was in the spillover room yeah she was I think she was so what happened you ask a question
00:45:33
did Seinfeld or something was there a q a yeah I asked Jerry I signed up a question how come there's no black women
00:45:39
on his show oh my God yeah what was his answer no he said I'm sorry I didn't
00:45:46
um save the world or something like that and then I had a follow-up question I don't remember what it was but the fun
00:45:51
the thing that I like the trivia part about that was that Mulaney wrote that sketch John Mulaney oh so I felt real
00:46:00
special I feel connected to to pop culture do you feel like you might be the Godmother to his baby in a way
00:46:07
I hope at least the baby could call me auntie the sad thing is that I follow all that crap on the Instagram oh me too
00:46:14
there's rumors that Pete Davidson is the actual father I don't believe any of
00:46:19
this nonsense I don't buy any of this tabloid stuff wasn't it maybe looks just like mullaney he was putting it in a
00:46:26
crock pot or something a day later do you see that picture I'm like What's Happening no no yeah he's like putting it really work what's crazy now the baby
00:46:33
you're doing baby bits but he said he's paying the baby 245 a week for all the babies
00:46:42
Gerber food More Diapers maybe a little teddy it's it's a perfect fee for All
00:46:49
Humans I like the tone of this show this is very Ellen did you know that Jerry Seinfeld has a new comedy album coming
00:46:56
out called paper clips why [Laughter]
00:47:08
because he would do 20 minutes on a paper clip what the step when the stapler came out the paper clips like oh
00:47:14
no whoa what's up I'm terrified Seinfeld good night sorry go ahead
00:47:22
um then he comes back and he goes I forgot to talk about Pop-Tarts uh he has a Pop-Tart movie Jerry you know what
00:47:29
he's not this goes forward this goes full circle to our doctor uh yeah so
00:47:36
Jerry Seinfeld over a period of years and he was in the New York Times he was trying to complete a bit about Pop-Tarts
00:47:43
and he couldn't get it to work and he spent years on it because you know Jerry is hacking the code pop tots because he
00:47:50
didn't say all this stuff we saw a pop ton we're 10 years old and our heads exploded whatever but when I meet when I
00:47:56
run into Jerry I want to tell him Jerry there was one fatal flaw from my point of view View and we had two day old
00:48:02
baked goods five kids dad was a high school teacher no one really liked Pop-Tarts that much
00:48:10
compared to Hostess berry pies or or Twinkies or snowballs or regular
00:48:17
cupcakes comment professor wow let me tell you those hosted Dairy
00:48:22
Parts with a jam are you talking with a cherry apple pie like whatever magic they were magic those are unreal
00:48:30
and the the Pop-Tarts were okay but they were a little sweet and narrow you put them in the toaster they were fine but
00:48:36
they weren't Jerry Jerry's bit treated them like they were the greatest Dana do
00:48:42
you want to hear some [ __ ] now you brought it up and I would never brought this up I would break off the crust on the edges before it got to the frosting
00:48:48
and I said [ __ ] it I just wanted the parts that had frosting on them because Pop-Tarts were not I can't
00:48:54
believe you're revealing this I know and I I was gonna say I'm checking Daily Mail right now is this already going
00:49:01
okay version you're both trending wow hashtag because the Christ destroys
00:49:07
Pop-Tart I don't even know what carbs were I just knew that I didn't really like that edge until I got to the
00:49:13
frosting so just break it off I was a [ __ ] Rubble yeah but was it
00:49:19
cherry or apple what was your favorite on the pies and the pies at 7-Eleven I
00:49:24
like oh Cherry Apple that's a tough one I would black out quickly after because all the sugar but I also like
00:49:31
um Ding Dongs ding dong sounds like a comedy punchline I like Twinkies yeah Ding Dongs
00:49:37
you know what I mean it just sounds funny I don't know how I thought you were really asking me because something did happen to my ding dong recently
00:49:46
Alan you're like why did I why did it happen get on the Wi-Fi all right edit
00:49:52
this and now we're back with Ellen Cleghorn on fly on the wall we just took us we have time for a couple more quick
00:49:58
questions we're not cutting inappropriate material what else did we not ask her uh why is she so awesome was
00:50:05
my first question yeah why is she so smart can I can I can I talk to you about this day uh David Spade yeah now
00:50:11
did you know does everybody know that you used to ride the skateboard and you
00:50:17
were riding the skateboard in that movie uh the police academy yes before SNL so
00:50:23
I'm like oh he really had it going on I was we knew all about the red carpet before no you know Ellen the true story
00:50:32
is that I was I got out to LA and I from Arizona and I did skateboard and the
00:50:37
only reason I got that audition I couldn't really Act but this is just the
00:50:42
luck of the draw they saw me at The Improv I didn't look like everyone else they said long blonde hair and I was 20 and they said oh you know we need a kid
00:50:50
to play a skateboarder but we didn't think of it but this kid could probably pull off you know high school so I go in
00:50:58
and they go did you get the script I go no and they said shoot we have one here and they didn't have one
00:51:05
and they go [ __ ] um oh we don't need to waste your time it's just about a skateboarder uh maybe
00:51:11
you could just improv a few lines and this is so lucky Ellen because I didn't know how to read a script I didn't know how to hold sides I didn't know I would
00:51:18
have shown how green I was and how new so I just uh said yeah uh oh I'm a
00:51:25
skateboarder you got an attitude and the cops are coming up I'm like hey guys I just start making up [ __ ] you know and
00:51:30
saying skateboard terms and they were like oh that's exactly what we need okay great you know let's get this guy and if
00:51:37
they would have let me act it would not have worked because they would have seen so just improving and bullshitting was what I was better at than actually
00:51:43
reading a script and so I got out there I got 25 Grand which is great 10 weeks
00:51:48
25 Grand
00:51:58
I know she can't even comprehend these she goes you mean 25 I go nope
00:52:05
it's your first time ran for riding a skateboard what the [ __ ] data and I get
00:52:12
to ride with Tony Hawk and all these guys Mike McGill so I do uh I go 10 weeks in Toronto and I get a per diem
00:52:18
this is why people get hooked on acting so I do it I come back with L and I
00:52:23
cleared 10 from all you know all the [ __ ] I I woke up like Canadian tax and then you know whatever really so I
00:52:30
pay everything I give my mom three for bills I do one in bills but I needed a car 6 000 left after 10 weeks I go up
00:52:39
and I buy a Honda Accord I drive into the Improv and it got stolen that night so
00:52:44
so I was back to zero no insurance and I just did 10 weeks on the road and I came back I have nothing to show for and the
00:52:51
next night Jay Leno showed up at the Improv in a Honda Accord I never understood that
00:52:56
yeah you know it just punked you know I used to drive the motorcycle but you know because you know it's got three
00:53:03
cylinders but it was fine you know no that's a bummer The Improv not the
00:53:08
not The Comedy Store The Improv no The Improv was sketchy yeah it was over on Kia uh this is a street right next to
00:53:16
the Improv I came out to show Tim Rose's comic I go check out this sweet pimp slot I just bought very sensible him
00:53:23
sled and uh it was gone I go maybe it's this other Street I go and he started
00:53:28
going uh oh I go there's no [ __ ] way no way I think they followed me with a key to
00:53:33
the car honestly the people sold it to me and just took her that's a that's an empty feeling anyway I was just saying
00:53:39
that to say that is a great story it sounded great and then another and then I started auditioning and I wasn't any
00:53:45
good so I was just like bombing and then I had two years of just scraping and then uh
00:53:51
got even then it started to pick up a little more but by the time I got to SNL I'd already been like humbled I'm like [ __ ] this is this has got to work
00:53:58
because I got like nothing clicking no other movies in that gap of like four years just and then you hit big with all
00:54:06
those movies with uh Chris Tommy Boy yeah so I got lucky with that too so and
00:54:12
that was direct result of like the show and Bonnie and Terry wrote that first one and then Fred Wolfe took over but uh
00:54:19
Bonnie and Terry worked on that first draft to tell me why and then we did Black Sheep and then uh I wish I was
00:54:27
really jealous of those uh Chris Farley shows because he got to have a big host like McCartney and he got to talk to him
00:54:32
and go remember when you were in The Beatles
00:54:37
is just very memorable did Downey write that one based on like just how he was at the office because it sounded so like
00:54:44
Chris you know so real yeah and it was just hysterical
00:54:52
if I don't know Dan anything else what do you got anything you want to tell her um
00:54:58
just want to hang out with you yeah a lot of times what happens on this show
00:55:03
because we're getting to see uh people that we worked with and adore and had
00:55:08
fun with and then we don't see them all these years and so this is really fun it's a good hangout yeah but I want you
00:55:15
to come I want both of you to come to my class at the new school and like zoom in and teach the kids talk to the kids they
00:55:20
would love it kids what you don't understand is the highest peak of money
00:55:25
is 245. and this is your highest goal
00:55:30
I'm gonna have a pipe and an ascot and be in front of a fireplace what you have to understand about commentary is that
00:55:38
it's not really commentary it's tragedy it's tragedy posing is comedy and the
00:55:43
thing about it I would love to go on and talk to the kids you mean on Zoom I can do that from where I am now in Missoula
00:55:49
Montana is that where you are in myself that's why I was born but no I'm in Southern California but yeah you do guess on zoom and they
00:55:57
just talk to the kids about comedy and stuff yeah yeah I I really enjoy you
00:56:03
guys in person but what I really like the most is David Spade doing Dana Carvey doing something
00:56:10
I get chopping broccoli yeah because I used to sing that around I go God damn this is funny and it was sort of out of
00:56:15
what I think like and I'm like this is so weird and Goofy and just clever and smart because of its goofiness but
00:56:22
there's some there's method to The Madness of why it's so fun can we get a little chorus of it as we fade out here
00:56:27
and drop it back up he goes low I'm chopping Maraca
00:56:32
she chop she chops yeah it goes in towards the end yeah yeah you gotta get
00:56:39
there you gotta work up to it yeah uh all right Ellen thank you hon hey what's up flies what's up please
00:56:46
what's up people that listen we want to hear from you and your dumb questions questions ask us anything anything you
00:56:52
want you can email us at flyofthewall at cadence13.com
00:56:59
can you guys provide perspective on how it was viewed to break character on SNL
00:57:06
asking because Spade stands out in my mind where he and Christina Applegate of
00:57:11
course we we laughed on the couch during motivational speaker and in Lauren's voice for Dana how was that viewed Brian
00:57:18
Steele um it's so it's if you're going to break it's that other type of joke it's it's
00:57:25
it's like [ __ ] Carol Burnett I mean it's it's really it's really not what we
00:57:30
do so you were not supposed to break when I got there yeah and then it started to erode and then you David
00:57:38
Spade were in uh one of Chris Farley's his biggest moment on the show probably
00:57:44
and it was hard not to break go talk to that sketch almost anyone that was a we'll probably have Christina Applegate
00:57:50
on soon and we'll talk about it uh but it was and I see here over the years we've mentioned it to each other because
00:57:56
it's turned into such a thing but it was uh not planned and uh
00:58:01
you're not supposed to break and you also could get fired Dana knows it I know it it was the word around town and
00:58:07
that this is not Lauren telling you that it's other people you know the other people around going oh no Lauren does
00:58:13
not like that so you could get fired and so when you do it it's fun but afterwards you don't want to walk by him
00:58:19
go okay Tim Conway uh another guy who wasn't even care
00:58:25
about that yeah you know Tim Tim Conway Harvey Corman who were brilliant and also Tim Conway when they were on their
00:58:32
sort of air show live taping would just switch stuff out and that's how he he would destroy Harvey Korman if someone
00:58:39
improvises outside their bandwidth on Saturday Night Live that might make
00:58:44
someone break you know yeah and they did it more in the in the future episodes and uh got away with it and it is fun
00:58:51
it's always fun to watch that stuff it's it can't be used as a trick if the
00:58:56
sketch isn't doing well you can't right it can't be a crutch but if it's organic I think it is entertaining yeah and uh
00:59:03
and thank you uh Brian for listening and thank you where's Brian from uh probably Bulgaria I don't know what
00:59:10
to say this again [Music]
00:59:21
fly on the wall has been a presentation of cadence 13. please listen then rate review and follow all episodes executive
00:59:29
produced by Dana Carvey and David Spade Chris Corcoran of cadence 13 and Charlie finan of brilstein entertainment
00:59:36
production and Engineering led by Greg Holtzman Richard cook Sabrina Regan and
00:59:41
Chris Basil of cadence 13.
