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welcome to the best interest podcast
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where we believe Benjamin Franklin's
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advice that an investment in knowledge
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pays the best interest both in finances
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and in your life every episode teaches
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you personal finance and investing in
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simple terms now here's your host Jesse
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Kramer hello and welcome to episode 93
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of the best interest podcast my name is
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Jesse Kramer later in today's episode
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Joe Sal SEI is back Joe from the
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stacking Benjamins podcast if you
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haven't heard of Joe stacking Benjamins
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is the best money Show on Earth I think
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Joe calls it because stacking Benjamins
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not only is it amazingly popular not
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only does it have great guests but
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stacking Benjamins is always
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entertaining I've been really honored
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that in some recent months Joe has asked
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me to join the stacking Benjamin's
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Friday Roundtable to be part of the the
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expert panel that they have on Fridays
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and Joe and I have a really fun
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conversation today it's going to be
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quite similar to episode 78 where I
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asked Justin Peters to come on the
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podcast and he and I had a fun debate
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about what we thought are the most
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important rules of personal finance
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today Joe and I are doing something
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similar Joe came with a list I came with
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a list and we talked about what we think
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are the most important questions that
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someone should ask themselves as they
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glide into retirement we didn't know
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each other's list as we came in but we
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went back and forth we compared and
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contrasted what we thought were the top
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priorities for pre-retirees what are the
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questions that they should be asking
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themselves so it's a really fun
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conversation but first let's do a
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customary review of the week this one
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comes from pivot Points MD who wrote in
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and said Jesse is a changemaker he
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really does take tricky or complex
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topics in the personal finance Arena and
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boils them down into digestible bites he
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shows us how to eat the elephant in the
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room I have had the Good Fortune to meet
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Jesse and the content he produces they
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are both topnotch I'm an avid Fanboy and
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urge you to become one too he really
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does have your best interest at heart
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well thank you very much pivot Points MD
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for the kind words and the multiple food
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references in there I I saw that
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digestible bites he shows us how to eat
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the elephant in the room I like it I
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like it so pivot Points if you're
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hearing this please send me a note to
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Jesse bestter interest. blog and we'll
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get you hooked up with a super soft
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bestest t-shirt now before Joe sa SEI
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joins us today I wanted to read to you
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from a recent article I wrote called
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putting a dollar sign on financial
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planning considering we're talking about
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retirement planning today which is
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certainly I'd say one of the pillars of
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financial planning I thought this
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article would be uh pretty interesting
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to you listening today because whether
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you're a dedicated diyer or you prefer
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to lean on professional Guidance the
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truth is clear that Smart Financial
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Planning can save you a lot of money
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over time and in this article and what
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I'm going to tell you today I'm just
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going to share some recent examples of
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tactical planning moves that I
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participated in or that I noticed that
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other people should be taking advantage
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of and I'm going to include today how
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much money was saved by these Smart
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Financial Planning moves first we're
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going to start with the covid panic back
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in March 2020 you could be forgiven for
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thinking that the world is ending and I
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want to sell everything but with proper
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perspective and an investment policy
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statement which are both Hallmarks of
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sound financial planning many investors
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stayed the course they rode the stock
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market down more than 30% from Peak to
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trough ouch right that must have been
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very hard for them to do but then
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nevertheless they rebalanced along the
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way selling the more stable assets in
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their portfolio like bonds or money
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market funds in order to buy stocks now
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that's not natural behavior buying
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stocks as they decrease in price in fact
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I'd say it's the opposite of natural
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behavior that the natural thing to do is
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to run away from the threat right if
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stocks are falling and if that hurts us
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to see that if that's a threat to our
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mental stability to see our stocks fall
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the natural inclination is to run away
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from that to sell our stocks to run away
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from that pain right to remove your hand
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from the hot stove but the smart thing
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to do in investing is to run toward that
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threat right to buy more stocks to
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rebalance into stocks as stocks drop
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that's not natural behavior that's
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learned behavior through experience
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through education through proper
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perspective proper guidance in the end
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While others might have made portfolio
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mistakes during the covid Panic that
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cost them 10% or 20% or more things that
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are probably permanent impairment of
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capital that can never be recovered from
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the intelligent investor has a better
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portfolio now than if the covid crash
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hadn't occurred because they rebalance
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throughout it so we should ask ourselves
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what's the value of a say a 10% mistake
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on a $1 million portfolio that's a
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$100,000 mistake right there and as our
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portfolio continues to compound the the
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the dollar value of that mistake is only
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going to grow larger and larger over
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time okay a second example which I call
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bring me a higher yield a friend of the
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blog recently sold his successful small
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business here in Greater Rochester for
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about $10 million or so which is
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certainly not your everyday event to be
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certain but it's actually more common
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than I realized I kind of had this
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interesting realization over the last
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couple years of just everywhere you look
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there are small and medium-sized
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businesses a lot of them are more
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successful than than you might think
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from the outside looking in but anyway I
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sat down with this individual just to
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spitball some ideas and my honest advice
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to him was hey first put together a
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financial plan which would detail the
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the future planned inflows and outflows
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of money from your from your family's
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Financial ecosystem which would of
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course include some very well observed
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near-term spending you could even say
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splurging I mean hey you just sold the
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business for $10 million do something
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fun with some of your money but then
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once you have a plan in place pick an
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asset allocation that corresponds with
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that plan and with the various timelines
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embedded in that plan and then dollar
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cost average the money into that asset
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allocation for example it might look
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like four large tranches of investment
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over a 12-month period or something
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similar to that now one of the problems
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was that the idea of investing million
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dollars into the stock market concern
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ear this individual and personally I
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mean I think good investing education is
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is one way to solve that problem but
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that type of education doesn't occur
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overnight right it's it takes a while I
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think for that to sink into someone
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where they say okay they start to trust
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if you will the stock market as a good
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long-term investment short of that as we
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discussed next steps I I asked this
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individual I said where's the money
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right now right where's the money right
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now and the answer was it was in a large
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US Bank that you all would have heard of
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in their in a savings account there ear
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05% that was the interest rate 05% and
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now the math there on a $10 million
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deposit 05% is about $5,000 in annual
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interest so while we continued the
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long-term conversation about investing
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in the stock market I gave him some
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important near-term advice seek out a
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higher yield via a brokerage money
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market fund and in the 18 months since I
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gave him that advice his average yield
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has been about 4 a half to 5% per year
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or about 400
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$75,000 per year in interest on his $10
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million deposit so yes a very simple tip
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to be sure but sometimes financial
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planning is all about identifying the
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simple fixes in your financial ecosystem
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that yeah will provide
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$475,000 a year instead of $5,000 a year
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suffice to say he bought my coffee that
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day don't tell Susie Orman okay on to
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the next one the car loan one of my
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clients bought a new car a few months
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ago and came to me with a simple
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question should I take advantage of the
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0% financing that the dealership is
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offering me so the question there is
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should they pay $40,000 cash out of
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pocket or take on a $40,000 loan with
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zero interest now the math here is quite
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simple if this person takes the loan
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they can keep their $40,000 in a high
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yield account just like the one we just
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talked about and earn something like
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$1,500 to $2,000 per year in interest
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with no downside right there's no
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interest on a loan AC crewing against
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them so $22,000 a year that's not
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life-changing money but it sure is easy
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money it sure is lwh hanging fruit it's
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a small easy few percentage points that
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can move the needle over time so again
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much much different than the
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$475,000 year advice from the previous
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example but hey every dollar matters
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every dollar is fungible with one
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another and would you say no to $2,000 a
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year in interest I don't think so okay
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the next little piece of advice sneaking
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through the back door another client of
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mine that came to me with the following
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details of their situation they're a
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couple a married couple in their early
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30s they're high earners their total
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income is over $350,000 per year they're
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using their 401K accounts wisely putting
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a lot of extra money after their 401ks
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into a joint taxable brokerage account I
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asked them if they'd looked into saving
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money in an IRA and they said yep we
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looked into it but we earned too much
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money and they were partially correct
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they do earn too much money for normal
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Ira contributions but they're the
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perfect candidates for back door Ira
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contributions and I'll I'll link an
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article here in the show notes that I
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wrote All About backdoor Ira
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contributions because they're now using
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backdoor IRA and as long as the back
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door Ira remains open in the IRS code
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because that's certainly a topic of
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conversation who knows how long uh that
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option will be available to us but I
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think we can conservatively calculate
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that for this couple if they were to
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make backdoor Roth contributions for the
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next 30 Years and compare that to the
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alternative what they were doing which
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is putting the money in a taxable
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brokerage I mean in the Roth of course
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there's tax deferred growth and then
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there's no capital gains taxes when they
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withdraw that money eventually so the
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question is how much extra money will
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they save and earn over the next 30
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years I think it's easily in the six
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figures by utilizing a backdoor Roth IRA
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instead of putting the money into a
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taxable Brokers account again not rocket
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science per se a lot of people execute a
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backdoor Roth IRA on their own there's a
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couple tricky parts to it and you want
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to make sure you get it right but that's
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the kind of thing that doing financial
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planning again whether it's working with
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a cfp or whether just being aware of all
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the available tools on your own backdoor
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Roth IRA contributions can really move
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the needle over your financial lifetime
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the next situation which house should we
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buy another client of mine lives in the
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greater Washington DC area and with
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their growing family they face a really
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interesting question where should we buy
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our forever home there are three options
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right if you're not familiar Washington
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DC itself U Maryland and Virginia which
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are both right on the outskirts of
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Washington DC they each come with their
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own Financial pros and cons and so we
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help this family weigh the following the
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the cost of the homes themselves right
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how far does their dollar go the
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long-term cost of property and school
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taxes in those three different areas the
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state tax benefits of home ownership in
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those three areas the impact of state
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income taxes on their earnings over the
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coming decades right they're a high
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earning couple and Maryland versus DC
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versus Virginia will tax their income at
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different rates so even though really
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what they're thinking about is buying a
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house they also need to think about how
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will their income be taxed and and
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that's a really big part of this
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equation and then the impact of again
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another state tax capital gains taxes on
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their long-term investing and the
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differences and capital gains taxes
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between Maryland Virginia and DC so of
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course this family they should first and
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foremost pick a home that's right for
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their lifestyle right the finances
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should come second here but the maximum
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versus minimum that we calculated puts
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their range of possible outcomes at a
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net present value of over $500,000 in
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other words imagine house a for this
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couple it's located in the most
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expensive locality for them in the
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greater DC area and then imagine we pick
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up that same exact house in terms of you
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know square footage and amenities
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everything like that and we place it in
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the least expensive area for them in
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Greater DC and then we look at how much
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those two houses will cost this family
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over the next 30 Years the most
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expensive area is going to be
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$500,000 more expensive than the least
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expensive area that's their range of
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outcomes it's a really wide range and
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that's why it's important for them to
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factor this in to their question so as
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always we should ask ourselves if they
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had an extra
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$500,000 how might that affect their
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lifestyle how might their life's plans
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change with an extra $500,000 how much
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earlier could they retire what could
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they do with that extra money that's the
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fun part of financial planning our next
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topic the value of a base point now
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portfolio reviews are a vital part of
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financial planning and if an expert
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looks at your Investments and says you
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know you can accomplish the same asset
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allocation as you already are but you
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could save 20 or 30 or 50 basis points
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if you do it this way now what's the
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value of that recommendation now quick
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aside if you don't know a basis point
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equals
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0.1% 1/1 100th of a percent so 50 basis
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points that's 50 hundreds of a percent
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or half a percent okay basis point one
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100th of a percent smart simple
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investing strategies don't have to be
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overly expensive and so while
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professional financial planners do need
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to charge for their time and expertise
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they can and should also save their
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clients money by keeping investing costs
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low so the question is what is a basis
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point actually worth imagine this simple
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scenario an average investor they might
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invest for 35 years during their life
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putting away $110,000 per year and
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achieving a long-term average return of
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8% per year throw that into a spread
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sheet pretty easy formula pretty easy to
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do an Investor's final portfolio in that
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case would be worth $1.86 million okay
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just shy of $2 million and in that case
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each extra basis point along the way
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decreases the final portfolio value by
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about
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$4500 11 basis points of difference well
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that adds up to
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$50,000 the lesson here is simple keep
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fees low where you can and make sure
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you're getting value above and beyond
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the basis points that you're paying
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every single one counts the next topic
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what's a cash balance plan financial
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planning as I've learned in my time it's
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a deep subject area there are a lot of
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different nooks and crannies that I
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haven't even heard of yet you might have
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heard me here I use the cave diving
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example right when you hear these
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stories of cave divers they say yeah I'm
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deep down in this cave and I realize oh
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there's a a fork in the road here in
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this cave that I've never explored
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before and the deeper I go in the cave
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the more options I find and you realize
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that cave systems are fast and and
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mostly unexplored that's kind of how I
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feel about financial planning at times
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well one example of this occurred
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earlier this year in 2024 when my
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colleagues recommended a cash balance
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plan to one of my clients he's a
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successful solopreneur last year he
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grossed about $700,000 in income and a
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lot of those dollars obviously were
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taxed at the highest possible levels his
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effective tax rate total tax rate was
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north of 40% a cash balance plan it's a
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defined benefit retirement plan whereas
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a 401k is a defined contribution
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retirement plan so in this case it's a
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defined benefit which in other words
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it's kind of like a self-funded pension
00:15:07
cash balance plans are especially
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beneficial when all of the following are
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true we have a solo business owner or
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someone with a very small staff the
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business owner has a high income and
00:15:17
they would benefit from putting away
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more tax deferred dollars and the
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business owner is higher in age as I'll
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explain in a minute the annual
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contribution limits are very high for
00:15:27
older business owners and they aren't
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quite as high for younger business
00:15:30
owners which is why it starts to make
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more and more sense the older the
00:15:34
business owner is so in my case this
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particular client can contribute about
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$200,000 into his cash balance plan this
00:15:40
year saving about $80,000 on his 2024
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tax bill and those savings that amount
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of savings is likely to increase every
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year between now and his retirement of
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course kind of like a traditional 401K
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he will eventually have to pay income
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taxes on those dollars when he withdraws
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them in retirement but in in the
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meantime he benefits from tax-free
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growth and more importantly from the
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flexible and planned nature of his
00:16:05
retirement withdrawals in other words a
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Smart Financial plan a smart retirement
00:16:10
plan will plan his eventual withdrawals
00:16:14
such that the rate of tax he pays is
00:16:16
going to be much lower than the 40% that
00:16:18
he's currently scheduled to pay right
00:16:20
he's saving 40% now to pay much lower
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than 40% in the future and that
00:16:26
Arbitrage is money in his pocket as I
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alluded to before of the tax balance
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plan I mean for this is for 2024 limits
00:16:33
a 50-year-old can contribute about
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$200,000 a 55-year-old about 250 a
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60-year-old over $300,000 and and it
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goes up from there so quite clearly if
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you're an older solopreneur or just an
00:16:47
older entrepreneur with a with a
00:16:49
relatively small business you can sock
00:16:51
away a lot of tax deferred dollars into
00:16:53
a cash balance plan the final example
00:16:55
here ugly annuities I dove deep into
00:16:58
annuities on episode 86 of the best
00:17:00
interest podcast in short the vast
00:17:02
majority of annuities are either vastly
00:17:04
overcosted or disappointing in terms of
00:17:07
return on investment and for that reason
00:17:09
about 99% of us are best off never
00:17:11
touching annuities in the first place
00:17:13
but what if you've already bought an
00:17:14
annuity what should you do then as
00:17:17
always an essential part of financial
00:17:18
planning is to let the numbers be your
00:17:20
guide annuities typically have surrender
00:17:23
fees which charge the owner of the
00:17:25
annuity an extra fee to exit the
00:17:27
contract these fees range from say up to
00:17:30
10% of the total annuity amount so
00:17:32
that's like $100,000 fee on a $1 million
00:17:34
annuity but those surrender fees they
00:17:37
typically decay in size as the annuity
00:17:39
matures so it's common to see for
00:17:41
example an 8% surrender charge in year
00:17:44
one of the annuity but it decays down to
00:17:47
zero surrender charge after year 10 or
00:17:49
something like that and again here I
00:17:51
have I have a client example working
00:17:53
with a gentleman who owned multiple
00:17:54
annuities at various maturity levels uh
00:17:56
we analyzed each one and showed him the
00:17:58
potential upsides and downsides of
00:18:00
dissolving those annuities paying
00:18:02
surrender fees and then investing the
00:18:04
proceeds into a moderate Investment
00:18:05
Portfolio and together we created a
00:18:08
multi-year schedule to flip his
00:18:09
portfolio to what I'm going to call here
00:18:11
the light side of the force and in the
00:18:14
long run say over the next 20 years I
00:18:16
can confidently say that he'll save 1
00:18:18
and a half% per year on fees and then
00:18:21
slightly more conservatively I can
00:18:23
predict that his new allocation will
00:18:25
outperform the annuities by 3% maybe
00:18:28
even up to five or 6% per year if I'm
00:18:31
being a little less conservative so he's
00:18:32
saving on fees and he's going to get
00:18:35
better performance especially when we
00:18:36
start to measure over a multi-decade
00:18:38
time span so on his
00:18:41
$750,000 annuity portfolio which is now
00:18:44
flipped over to the the light side of
00:18:45
the force over the next 20 years those
00:18:48
conservative saving assumptions between
00:18:50
fees and and extra performance is likely
00:18:52
to lead to an extra 1.3 million in extra
00:18:55
compounding in his pocket so you see
00:18:57
Smart Financial plan it's not about
00:18:59
outperforming the stock market right
00:19:01
it's not about finding the hot stock
00:19:02
it's not about options trading it's not
00:19:04
about Bitcoin instead it's about
00:19:06
identifying places in your personal or
00:19:08
your family's Financial ecosystem where
00:19:10
you can and should be saving money where
00:19:12
you can and should be paying less taxes
00:19:14
or earning better returns reallocating
00:19:17
assets paying lower fees taking
00:19:19
advantage of special types of accounts
00:19:21
etc etc it's about knowing all the
00:19:23
different rules of the game and then
00:19:25
playing that game effectively so this
00:19:27
idea or you know this this little
00:19:28
monologue here showed you just a few
00:19:30
examples whether it's avoiding panic in
00:19:32
the stock market earning higher yields
00:19:34
on your money on your savings things
00:19:37
like backdoor WTH contributions or cash
00:19:40
balance plans understanding the value of
00:19:42
a basis point optimizing a home purchase
00:19:44
decision or car decision detangling ugly
00:19:47
annuities and the list goes on and on
00:19:49
and on just a few of many examples and
00:19:52
none of which are picking the winning
00:19:53
stocks the real value of financial
00:19:55
planning lies elsewhere here's a quick
00:19:58
ad and then we'll get back to the show
00:20:00
every week I send a quick free email to
00:20:02
thousands of readers that shares three
00:20:04
Simple Things One my new articles and
00:20:07
podcasts two the best financial content
00:20:10
of the week from all over the Internet
00:20:12
and three a financial chart that
00:20:14
explains some important Concept in the
00:20:16
news that week it's a great primer to
00:20:19
boost your financial knoow ah but Jesse
00:20:22
I don't want another email well this
00:20:24
might not be for you but I do hear you
00:20:27
which is why I make it very short sweet
00:20:29
and full of only the essentials a
00:20:31
whopping 66% of subscribers read my
00:20:34
email at least once a month they're
00:20:36
enjoying it and maybe you will too you
00:20:38
can subscribe for free on the homepage
00:20:41
at bestter interest. blog again that's a
00:20:43
free no strings attached subscription at
00:20:46
bestter interest. blog and without
00:20:48
further Ado I want to welcome Joe Sal
00:20:50
SEI back onto the podcast Joe originally
00:20:53
joined us back on episode 73 of the best
00:20:56
interest podcast and Joe really need an
00:20:58
introduction I'll give him one anyway
00:21:00
Joe is the the founder and and the main
00:21:02
host of stacking Benjamins one of the
00:21:05
most popular Financial podcasts in the
00:21:07
world always entertaining always
00:21:10
informative at stacking Benjamin for
00:21:12
what it's worth I am a Avid listener of
00:21:13
stacking Benjamins I don't listen to
00:21:15
every episode though because he puts out
00:21:17
three episodes a week which is amazing
00:21:19
but at least once a week I'll see a
00:21:21
guest I'll see a topic I'll just see
00:21:23
something funny or entertaining that
00:21:24
they're doing and I'll tune in that's
00:21:27
the nature of stacking Benjamins and and
00:21:28
his team have been doing it for over a
00:21:30
decade so without further Ado here's Joe
00:21:33
Saul
00:21:34
[Music]
00:21:38
SEI Joe thanks for stopping by the best
00:21:42
interest podcast to be clear the best
00:21:44
interest podcast you're fresh off the
00:21:47
the plane right are you calling in from
00:21:49
the tarmac right now almost almost it
00:21:52
was so fun I went to South America had a
00:21:55
great time I was telling you about this
00:21:57
before we started recording it was
00:21:58
amazing but the cool thing is they're
00:22:00
very close to our time zone Jesse so I'm
00:22:02
here I'm wired I've had a little bit of
00:22:05
coffee so let's bring it very cool and
00:22:08
we are going to talk today as we as we
00:22:09
talked offline it's it's a similar to
00:22:11
episode 78 for you listeners who listen
00:22:13
to episode 78 where my favorite
00:22:16
episode Justin Peters and I compared and
00:22:19
contrasted our list of the five golden
00:22:21
rules of personal finance and today Joe
00:22:24
and I are going to talk about the most
00:22:25
important questions we each brought a
00:22:27
list of five the most most important
00:22:29
questions one should ask themselves as
00:22:31
they glide into retirement some of these
00:22:34
questions are probably going to be
00:22:35
Financial some of them might not be
00:22:37
Financial at all some of them might have
00:22:39
to deal with how many trips you're going
00:22:41
to take to Peru in your retirement I
00:22:43
don't know that might be one of Joe's it
00:22:45
could be it could be in in Justin
00:22:47
episode we ended up deciding to start
00:22:49
with our our most important question if
00:22:51
you have ranked them by importance Joe
00:22:53
and as the guest here I think it's only
00:22:55
fair that I I let you go first just so
00:22:57
you can years on top of mine go that
00:23:00
stupid one I got a better one Joe I got
00:23:03
a better one I don't know I don't know
00:23:04
if that's possible but why don't you
00:23:06
kick us off what was either your your
00:23:07
number one or just the most important
00:23:09
question that one should ask themselves
00:23:11
as they glide into retirement yeah and
00:23:13
generally Jesse when I do these I like
00:23:14
counting the other way I like doing like
00:23:16
the Dave Letterman style if you remember
00:23:17
that like 54 3 2 one but I like doing it
00:23:20
this way for your particular list
00:23:21
because mine all flow from this number
00:23:24
one every single thing I bring up after
00:23:27
this one is going to flow from number
00:23:29
one because it solves so many problems
00:23:34
when you focus on this first so many
00:23:36
people start with what's the best
00:23:38
investment I should use when should I
00:23:40
take Social Security what's the optimal
00:23:42
withdrawal rate draw down rate how do I
00:23:45
make sure that I don't get caught in a
00:23:47
Black Swan event like you know as soon
00:23:49
as I I get into retirement all these big
00:23:52
questions people have one question you
00:23:54
ask one that's it and by the way I want
00:23:57
to clarify this before I even say it
00:24:00
which and I do this to build dramatic
00:24:01
tension by the way totally build
00:24:03
dramatic tension just people like just
00:24:05
say it Joe that's an experienced host
00:24:07
right there you you've done this for a
00:24:09
while haven't you you're you're gonna
00:24:11
wait for it but I'll say this if you're
00:24:13
25 you're 30 years old and you don't
00:24:16
plan on retiring until 55 60 65 don't
00:24:19
worry about this number one but
00:24:22
specifically Jesse because the homework
00:24:24
you gave me was as you glide into
00:24:26
retirement this is super super important
00:24:29
and it is this what are you going to do
00:24:32
with your retirement Years first of all
00:24:35
a lot of people don't even spend a lot
00:24:36
of time on retirement there was a survey
00:24:38
once that showed that people spend more
00:24:39
time planning a family vacation than
00:24:42
they do planning their retirement you're
00:24:44
going to go on vacation for two weeks
00:24:46
maybe to South America maybe have the
00:24:48
time of your life but then retirement
00:24:52
just it's going to be like 30 years and
00:24:54
what you do the more things change
00:24:58
change over the course of my career the
00:25:00
more important this question gets like
00:25:01
when I started back in
00:25:04
1993 things were all about the money it
00:25:07
was just about what funds do you pick
00:25:08
what's the money what's the okay how
00:25:10
much Social Security you going to get
00:25:11
it's all that but it's funny how even on
00:25:13
the certified financial planner courses
00:25:16
they've added Behavior to the game right
00:25:19
and what we're learning more and more
00:25:20
and more is if you only focus on the
00:25:24
money in your planning there's not only
00:25:26
a good chance that you're going to get
00:25:28
it wrong there's also a good chance
00:25:30
you're going to die sooner because if
00:25:34
your goal is for a fulfilling retirement
00:25:36
it isn't about the money it's about what
00:25:38
are you going to do how much life are
00:25:41
you going to live what does that look
00:25:42
like and so if you're gliding in
00:25:44
retirement I think you need to be
00:25:45
crystal clear about what you want to do
00:25:49
and and and and I get this all the time
00:25:50
right I used to get this I've been a
00:25:52
financial planner people don't know I've
00:25:53
been a financial planner a long time but
00:25:54
when I was and I talked to OG my co-host
00:25:57
on stacking bment about this
00:25:58
people always say I want to travel I
00:26:00
want to play golf and then just poke my
00:26:02
eye out with a pen because playing golf
00:26:06
can you play golf every day for 30 years
00:26:08
I had clients that said I'd like to try
00:26:10
like a few of them might right maybe one
00:26:13
or two but you know like three months
00:26:15
into it you're like is this it well and
00:26:17
very seriously this is the most common
00:26:20
thing according to a guy named Ken
00:26:22
diwald who studied for a long time
00:26:24
longevity planning 18 months in
00:26:27
retirement people go from a sense of
00:26:29
euphoria to a sense of is this it is
00:26:33
this all there is really and you know
00:26:35
who those people are those are people
00:26:36
that haven't asked themselves what am I
00:26:39
going to do in a much more serious
00:26:41
manner than Golf and travel so I've got
00:26:45
four more but the four are going to
00:26:47
Spring directly from that and these four
00:26:49
become easy if you start with that
00:26:52
really hard question I love that and I
00:26:54
will say that that's in my the way I
00:26:56
phrased it is what kind of life style do
00:26:59
I want in retirement yeah I think that's
00:27:01
a very a very similar analogous question
00:27:03
and as you're explaining this Joe I
00:27:06
think back to a few things that I've
00:27:07
discussed before just a few of my little
00:27:09
lines that I like to drop on people
00:27:11
which is you know if you're going into a
00:27:13
regular weekend you might not really
00:27:15
plan for that weekend you know if you're
00:27:17
taking a one trip a onee vacation though
00:27:19
you're you're probably going to do some
00:27:20
planning but retirement is almost like
00:27:22
the weekend that never ends or the
00:27:24
vacation that never ends and the fact
00:27:27
that more pre-retirees don't spend more
00:27:30
time thinking about it which we know is
00:27:32
true you mentioned I I his last name was
00:27:36
Ken dyal Ken dyal hadn't heard of Ken
00:27:38
we'll we'll try to find some of his work
00:27:39
and Link it in the show notes I think a
00:27:41
study that Fritz Gilbert helped put
00:27:43
together I think last year in the last
00:27:45
couple years which I've cited a few
00:27:47
times here the number one concern for
00:27:49
pre-retirees tends to be Financial if
00:27:51
you PLL pre-retirees they're worried
00:27:53
about finances but if you ask post
00:27:56
retirees people in the first three or 5
00:27:57
years of their retirement finances is
00:28:00
usually not even in the top five because
00:28:02
they've realized you know their finances
00:28:03
are okay now they're having some
00:28:05
existential concerns about right is this
00:28:07
it or the other analogy I think of is
00:28:10
whether it happened to you maybe as a
00:28:12
teenager going to college or or maybe it
00:28:14
happened to you as a college graduate
00:28:15
entering the workforce where you have
00:28:18
some new freedoms you have maybe more
00:28:20
time or more money than you've ever had
00:28:21
before and we all know the story or we
00:28:24
know maybe even a person who they went
00:28:25
to college and they kind of went off the
00:28:27
deep end they they slept in didn't go to
00:28:29
class they drank too much they they let
00:28:32
themselves go a little bit hopefully
00:28:34
though at some point they kind of look
00:28:35
themselves in the mirror and they say
00:28:36
okay is my lifestyle finishing last
00:28:39
night's beers every single day for the
00:28:41
rest of my life and then dragging my ass
00:28:43
to class and and like no you got to get
00:28:45
your together and figure out what
00:28:48
you're going to do and I think in my
00:28:50
experience talking to retirees sometimes
00:28:52
there's some of that which is right the
00:28:54
golf trips wear off the beach days wear
00:28:56
off and there has to be a little bit
00:28:58
more substance underneath do do you have
00:29:00
any specifics Joe or I mean if I'm kind
00:29:02
of trespassing on your other answers
00:29:04
don't don't let me but any specific
00:29:07
types of changes in thought process that
00:29:10
come to mind where you entered
00:29:11
retirement thinking a and then after a
00:29:14
year or two someone starts thinking B
00:29:16
I've got three different ones you know
00:29:18
you were on a recent episode of stacky
00:29:20
Benjamin where we talked about the idea
00:29:22
of goal setting in general not being
00:29:25
about the goal but about it being a
00:29:27
quest where along the way the whole
00:29:29
thing is this dramatic journey I feel
00:29:31
like too many people look at retirement
00:29:33
as the Finish Line when it truly isn't a
00:29:35
lot of ways a starting line of a new
00:29:38
quest which means a few things it's
00:29:40
really disturbing I talked to Christine
00:29:42
Benz recently from Morning Star and
00:29:44
Christine said some things I think that
00:29:47
will scare and upset people going into a
00:29:50
retirement that is not real which is
00:29:55
it's important to still have an alarm
00:29:56
clock it's important to still get your
00:29:58
butt out of bed it's important to have
00:30:00
goals and to have things that you're
00:30:03
doing and for most successful retirees
00:30:05
and this comes from Wes Moss who wrote a
00:30:07
great book about what the happiest
00:30:09
retirees know it is because you have so
00:30:12
many other things that you want to do
00:30:14
it's just like Jesse it's like a
00:30:15
different career but it's a career it's
00:30:18
it's more of a Dr Seuss you know the
00:30:21
places will go kind of career where
00:30:23
where we can do it now because we love
00:30:25
it not because we're financially
00:30:26
committed to it we now can get passioned
00:30:29
about speaking of Fritz Gilbert by the
00:30:31
way this guy for people in in the best
00:30:33
interest community that don't know Fritz
00:30:36
Gilbert like Fritz Fritz Gilbert this
00:30:39
dude definitely has an alarm clock you
00:30:41
can feel his sense of purpose his wife
00:30:43
is this phenomenal nonprofit they do
00:30:46
with animals fences for Pho yes putting
00:30:50
hours and showing up quote at work
00:30:53
during your retirement which means Jesse
00:30:56
the more that you and I read about
00:30:58
Retirement Research the more we need to
00:31:00
take the word retirement and kind of put
00:31:02
it in the trash because there's so many
00:31:05
connotations that don't work if you want
00:31:07
to live a long time have a great
00:31:09
existence where retirement that sitting
00:31:11
back in a rocking chair doesn't work for
00:31:13
anybody yeah post employment maybe we'll
00:31:16
have a competition how about that what
00:31:18
if we do a joint competition to rename
00:31:21
retirement that could be fun anyway I
00:31:24
want people to do the most ridiculous
00:31:25
name though yeah the European the B
00:31:27
mcboat face are you familiar with this
00:31:29
story B mcboat face won the the prize as
00:31:32
the most popular name for some big
00:31:34
auspicious boat that's good that's good
00:31:37
let's go on to number two and I'll I'll
00:31:38
volunteer to go first this time Joe
00:31:41
because after all I'm thinking to myself
00:31:43
all right this is a financial podcast
00:31:44
it's something that you and I share as a
00:31:46
passion and something we love to talk to
00:31:47
people about and there are a ton of
00:31:50
different directions that we can go for
00:31:52
finances in retirement and so I thought
00:31:54
to myself of what's a a relatively easy
00:31:57
question
00:31:58
but but also a question that's like an
00:31:59
onion with many different layers that
00:32:01
someone can ask themselves as they're
00:32:03
gliding into retirement and the one that
00:32:05
I settled on is what does a typical
00:32:09
month of finances look like for me a
00:32:12
typical month of finances look like for
00:32:14
me and my thinking was that if somebody
00:32:16
sits down and tries to answer that
00:32:18
question they will start to check off
00:32:21
whether it's Social Security whether
00:32:22
they're collecting a pension whether
00:32:24
they're living off of some savings
00:32:26
whether they're pulling some money out
00:32:27
of their investment accounts it'll at
00:32:28
least get their brain thinking you know
00:32:30
maybe they won't get to uh the Black
00:32:32
Swan events quite yet maybe they won't
00:32:35
have a efficient Frontier safe
00:32:36
withdrawal rate complexity stuff quite
00:32:38
yet but at least it'll get them moving
00:32:40
in that direction of trying to
00:32:42
understand all the various interplay of
00:32:44
their income sources and then of course
00:32:47
what they want to spend in retirement
00:32:49
right what their monthly uh expenses
00:32:51
will look like so this overarching
00:32:53
financial question in my top five is
00:32:55
what does a typical month of expense of
00:32:58
finances look like for me well I think
00:33:00
the important thing that you nail there
00:33:02
Jesse is that just the exercise is
00:33:05
sitting down and talking about what a
00:33:06
typical month looks like kind of goes
00:33:08
back to your mind number one it goes
00:33:10
back to okay now that I've dreamed it up
00:33:12
let's put some numbers behind it and I
00:33:13
got to tell you this is a little bit
00:33:15
like putting on my running shoes let me
00:33:18
explain what I mean by that I run I've
00:33:20
run 11 marathons and and still every day
00:33:24
I really don't want to go out there and
00:33:27
run it just feels like it's going to
00:33:29
hurt it's not going to be any fun of
00:33:30
course when once I get out there it's
00:33:31
great and it's fine and I finished the
00:33:33
workout and I'm happy I did when I
00:33:35
finish when you tell somebody sit down
00:33:38
and begin spreadsheeting out what your
00:33:41
typical month is going to look like
00:33:42
expense wise you're like oh God no oh
00:33:45
please no no no no no no but just like
00:33:47
putting on my running shoes Jesse once
00:33:49
you get the spreadsheet open you start
00:33:51
doing it Cheryl will tell you this she's
00:33:53
not a money geek like you and me my
00:33:55
spouse Cheryl loves it we have a we
00:33:57
money meeting like getting the two of us
00:33:59
to sit down and do it sometimes it's
00:34:02
difficult but we get into it for two
00:34:04
minutes and then next thing you know we
00:34:06
are both just nerding out on oh yeah
00:34:09
look Hulu's raising their prices we we
00:34:11
just had our meeting Hulu raising their
00:34:13
prices in a couple months and we have
00:34:15
Hulu so what are we going to do we going
00:34:16
to keep it we G to and then the cool
00:34:18
thing is this whole idea around what
00:34:22
does a typical month look like isn't
00:34:24
about the spreadsheet anymore and we
00:34:25
talk about Hulu it becomes about Val
00:34:27
value do I value Hulu enough to pay $89
00:34:32
a month like do I really value Hulu that
00:34:34
much or is it time to look for a
00:34:35
different solution and when we get
00:34:37
beyond the money to the value part like
00:34:39
pow I get super excited yeah agreed I I
00:34:43
like that you brought up that when you
00:34:44
started in the financial industry what'
00:34:46
you say 90 93 93 it really was just
00:34:49
about the money and over time it has
00:34:51
evolved to be more about some of the
00:34:53
softer things and one of those I think
00:34:56
is those values right is sitting down
00:34:58
with someone and saying well you've got
00:35:00
x amount of money how are we going to
00:35:03
align that with what you value what you
00:35:04
want to spend it on and with retirement
00:35:07
planning be this multi-decade period
00:35:09
it's just such a ripe opportunity to
00:35:12
pursue the things that are most valuable
00:35:13
to you so to to not answer those kind of
00:35:16
questions early on or at least to not go
00:35:18
in with some sort of direction right it
00:35:19
doesn't have to be forever you're always
00:35:21
allowed to change course but to not have
00:35:23
some direction up front is is probably a
00:35:25
mistake no which is why it's so
00:35:27
important to start with what you had is
00:35:29
number one right I mean your number two
00:35:31
flows flows right from your number one
00:35:34
thank you Joe thank you how how about
00:35:35
you what was your uh what was your
00:35:36
number two believe it or not mine does
00:35:38
too
00:35:39
Jesse mine is not that far off yours so
00:35:41
I don't need to spend a lot of time on
00:35:43
mine mine is and from now on all my five
00:35:46
are organized as if it's a timeline
00:35:49
instead of a Finish Line I want people
00:35:51
to draw out their life and I want them
00:35:53
to start drawing these events on their
00:35:55
life but also think about what you
00:35:57
brought up what's my average month look
00:35:59
like but then when am I going to need
00:36:02
the money my goal next is to figure out
00:36:05
what streams of income do I have coming
00:36:06
in how do I want to spend my money based
00:36:09
on what am I going to do and once I've
00:36:12
done that then that's going to create
00:36:14
these holes and in those holes I know I
00:36:17
need to fill those in with the buckets
00:36:19
of money that I've accumulated over my
00:36:21
retirement CU it's super important to
00:36:24
know when am I going to need that money
00:36:26
one of the things that me when I was a
00:36:28
financial planner was when people would
00:36:30
just think well I got x amount of money
00:36:32
and I'm taking y out per month so I'm
00:36:35
good I'm like have you ever done the
00:36:36
math on this cuz this ain't math and
00:36:38
this is going to run out faster than you
00:36:40
think and people are like what are you
00:36:41
talking about it's only you know I've
00:36:42
got 880,000 left and I'm only taking out
00:36:44
2,000 a month I'm like yeah but you're
00:36:48
64 it isn't going to last it's not going
00:36:51
to last classic 20% per
00:36:54
year that's a withdrawal rate I could
00:36:56
stand behind as long as you die very
00:36:59
soon when are you going to need the
00:37:01
money filling in and knowing what that
00:37:02
deficit is now it's going to drive the
00:37:06
next three things that I wrote Because
00:37:09
when you know what the deficits are like
00:37:10
you're going to know so much and and
00:37:12
here's the thing we often start off with
00:37:15
the dream and this is why this whole
00:37:16
exercise I think scares people we often
00:37:18
start off with the dream and then we get
00:37:20
to this number two when you going to
00:37:21
need the money and you realize oh crap I
00:37:23
don't have enough but what's cool is
00:37:25
Jesse then we go back to what you and I
00:37:27
were talking about with your number two
00:37:29
now we can talk about what do we value
00:37:31
in that Vision that I built how can I
00:37:35
rearrange this so I get the stuff I
00:37:37
value and I just eliminate the stuff
00:37:39
that's nice but it's not great or maybe
00:37:42
I decide that I do want to keep quote
00:37:44
working during my retirement years for a
00:37:46
while maybe I want a part-time job my
00:37:49
father-in-law retired early he didn't
00:37:51
have any health insurance he looked at
00:37:53
health insurance this is before the
00:37:54
Affordable Care Act and regardless of
00:37:56
what the name is health insurance Across
00:37:58
America pretty unaffordable care but he
00:38:01
couldn't afford it before Medicare so he
00:38:05
went he loved kids he didn't want to
00:38:08
keep working in engineering he got a job
00:38:11
as a school bus driver because he got to
00:38:14
spend time with kids and he got health
00:38:17
insurance as a bus driver he got health
00:38:19
insurance working for the school system
00:38:20
so he found a creative way around his
00:38:22
problem because he knew that he was
00:38:25
going to need that money later and he
00:38:26
didn't want to spend it on Healthcare
00:38:28
today we've talked about it here on the
00:38:29
podcast before and and it's gotten some
00:38:31
positive and some negative feedback from
00:38:34
experts out there the idea of goal-based
00:38:36
investing which is a fancy way of saying
00:38:39
and the way I like to summarize it is
00:38:41
try to understand what your future
00:38:43
financial needs are try to assign
00:38:45
dollars in your current ecosystem to
00:38:47
those future needs and then invest
00:38:50
accordingly and that that I think it's
00:38:51
pretty similar to what you were just
00:38:52
saying there Joe how would you get push
00:38:54
back on that so uh the reason why is
00:38:57
because it's it's funny you and I were
00:38:59
talking offline about some some people
00:39:00
who push back on other people's content
00:39:03
you know well that's not on the
00:39:04
efficient Frontier kind of criticisms
00:39:07
and essentially the criticism is that
00:39:08
goals-based investing this whole Bottoms
00:39:11
Up kind of investing approach doesn't
00:39:14
always mathematically lead to a perfect
00:39:17
portfolio and therefore it's somehow
00:39:19
inherently flawed to me it's when
00:39:21
someone says the criticism it overlooks
00:39:23
the behavioral aspect of this all it's
00:39:26
actually funny Jesse say that because
00:39:28
goal-based Investing For Me is the thing
00:39:31
that saves your behavior cuz I'll tell
00:39:33
you this if I tell you you've got x
00:39:35
amount of money and we don't put a
00:39:37
ribbon on it that this is what it's for
00:39:39
it's for the second home it's for that
00:39:41
vacation it's for this thing it's for
00:39:43
whatever you effing touch it right you
00:39:46
go and you blow up your plan but if I
00:39:49
tell you no no no no no you need this
00:39:51
money five years later from X people
00:39:54
don't care about the name of the fund
00:39:56
they don't care about the asset class
00:39:58
they don't care about anything about the
00:39:59
investment they care about their goal
00:40:02
and if I tell you this money meets this
00:40:04
goal
00:40:06
behaviorally you're going to keep that
00:40:08
money where it needs to be and leave
00:40:09
your hand out the damn cookie jar your
00:40:11
hand's not going to go near the cookie
00:40:12
jar so that person is totally wrong
00:40:15
Jesse you're the
00:40:17
king just no it's it's true I'm I'm
00:40:20
laughing to myself not only because of
00:40:22
of what you're saying Joe but also it's
00:40:23
this whole like there are some people
00:40:25
out there who hey respectful
00:40:26
disagreement I try to say but it's
00:40:28
almost like their approach is a little
00:40:29
bit of investing for robots like you and
00:40:32
here we're here Joe and we're kind of
00:40:34
thinking to ourselves like let's invest
00:40:35
for humans like sure the the math needs
00:40:37
to make sense but also like we want to
00:40:40
think about the human element of this
00:40:41
all and there's some other people out
00:40:43
there who like nope investing for robots
00:40:45
and uh don't worry about the mushy brain
00:40:47
just worried about the hard numbers I
00:40:49
got another rant on this one more please
00:40:51
let's hear it when people in this
00:40:53
community
00:40:55
nitpick stuff like this
00:40:57
I'll tell you what it does to the
00:40:59
average person who's just getting
00:41:00
involved it scares the hell out of them
00:41:02
and they do nothing it scares the hell
00:41:04
out of them and you know what's funny
00:41:06
that way directionally is correct this
00:41:08
way is directionally correct I actually
00:41:10
went after somebody on Twitter the other
00:41:12
day because they were like I just don't
00:41:15
understand where asset-based management
00:41:17
makes sense anymore I just don't get the
00:41:19
percent for asset-based management and I
00:41:22
wrote back I don't understand why you as
00:41:24
a certified financial planner are
00:41:26
arguing over things that yeah might be
00:41:30
important like number 678 but there's a
00:41:32
ton of people who will never go get help
00:41:34
from anybody because you're scaring them
00:41:37
with this BS I saw somebody in a forum
00:41:40
yesterday saying this target day fund
00:41:41
has a
00:41:43
0.07% expense ratio is that high I think
00:41:45
I should get rid of it I've never seen
00:41:47
somebody not retire because of a
00:41:50
0.07% expense ratio I've never seen
00:41:53
anybody not retire frankly because of a
00:41:56
1%
00:41:57
one per here I pay
00:41:59
1% you know what fees are important and
00:42:02
between two things I want to keep I want
00:42:04
to I want to keep my fees low if if
00:42:05
everything else is equal duh that's what
00:42:07
I want to do but there are people who
00:42:10
are trying to shrink everything and when
00:42:12
you don't have smart people around you
00:42:14
you kick your own ass you do nothing you
00:42:17
got to surround yourself with smart
00:42:18
people and people nitpicking this crap
00:42:20
drives me crazy you you said crazy there
00:42:24
Joe but I but I think what you meant was
00:42:26
it just no I'm kidding let me pick your
00:42:29
words can we can we have a semantic
00:42:31
argument here no I I I couldn't agree
00:42:34
more and it's it is funny too and it's
00:42:36
sometimes I get sucked into certain
00:42:38
pockets of the internet and I have to
00:42:39
remind myself that you know what not
00:42:41
everybody thinks this way thankfully and
00:42:43
you're right I've seen it on LinkedIn
00:42:45
I've seen people are now referring they
00:42:47
they call it the fee Wars and what
00:42:50
they're referring to is like cfp versus
00:42:53
cfp arguments that go viral because all
00:42:55
these other cfps chime in where one cfp
00:42:58
is saying I charge my clients $7,000 per
00:43:01
year flat fee and the other one's saying
00:43:03
I charge my clients you know a 0.9%
00:43:06
asset fee and they have some giant
00:43:08
argument about it and it's like guys
00:43:10
talk about like missing the forest for
00:43:11
the trees yeah not to blor this point
00:43:13
but I did see something that was pretty
00:43:15
cool yesterday at a spot I don't talk
00:43:17
much about white coat investor I I
00:43:19
generally don't talk about that brand a
00:43:21
lot but he was talking about how they
00:43:24
have recommended advisor lists on their
00:43:27
thing and they were kicking some people
00:43:29
off because they charged too much and I
00:43:32
love his point of view Jim's point of
00:43:34
view the white coat Investor's point of
00:43:35
view is like listen good advice costs
00:43:38
money hiring good people cost money he
00:43:41
goes but at some point it does and I
00:43:44
totally agree at some point it does
00:43:46
become prohibitive he goes I don't like
00:43:49
cutting my grass but if somebody's going
00:43:51
to charge me $36,000 to mow my lawn I'm
00:43:55
cutting my own grass and I thought that
00:43:57
that analogy is great but it totally
00:43:59
puts this argument where it belongs too
00:44:01
which is you should expect to pay smart
00:44:03
people you want to throw we used to have
00:44:05
this problem with charitable giving for
00:44:07
a long time in charitable giving it was
00:44:09
less money less money less money less
00:44:11
money then we figured out these
00:44:13
Charities are giving away all the money
00:44:14
but they're giving away crappy places
00:44:16
you know why because none of the smart
00:44:17
people want to work there and all of a
00:44:19
sudden you realize oh I got to pay
00:44:20
something for smart people so that we
00:44:22
can be more effective and you will be
00:44:25
more effective if you pay the right
00:44:26
people I hear you the other example you
00:44:28
know why should I be 80% stocks in my
00:44:30
portfolio I feel like 75% is better oh
00:44:33
God okay that's fine that's like saying
00:44:36
why am I painting my wall off white I
00:44:38
think cream is better yeah that's fine
00:44:40
go ahead you know you won't get an
00:44:42
argument from me here's a quick ad and
00:44:45
then we'll get back to the show a few of
00:44:47
you occasionally inquire about two
00:44:49
different topics that are actually
00:44:51
related the first type of question seeks
00:44:53
out details about my professional life
00:44:55
and the wealth management firm that I
00:44:57
work for here in Rochester New York the
00:44:59
second type of question involves the
00:45:01
best interest which operates with no
00:45:02
advertising no pushy sales no pay walls
00:45:05
and the question is how can the best
00:45:07
interest stay afloat well to answer both
00:45:10
of those questions I want to point you
00:45:12
to episode 78 of the best interest
00:45:15
podcast I intentionally recorded episode
00:45:17
78 to shine light on those topics and
00:45:20
inform you how you can actually help the
00:45:22
best interest if you're so inclined so
00:45:25
if you've ever been curious about the
00:45:27
business of the best interest please go
00:45:29
listen or download episode 78 and let me
00:45:32
know what you think I think now it's
00:45:34
your turn to describe your number three
00:45:36
on your list so we start off building
00:45:38
this timeline what are we going to do
00:45:39
with our Years and we're going to
00:45:41
timeline that out then we're going to
00:45:42
see where there's holes in the timeline
00:45:44
and then that leads to goal-based
00:45:46
planning that leads to what funds or
00:45:49
what assets are you going to meet this
00:45:51
is a huge huge problem that people have
00:45:55
Jesse what's the good thing I should
00:45:57
invest in Jesse this Nvidia now lately
00:46:00
it's been going nowhere like what's
00:46:02
going on with the Nvidia train it was
00:46:04
going to the Moon forever and now it's
00:46:06
kind of stalled what do I do Bitcoin is
00:46:07
that a thing should I get in there
00:46:09
instead of asking these ridiculous
00:46:11
questions because there's so many
00:46:12
different Investments we freak out about
00:46:14
which one's the right one and instead of
00:46:16
doing that we go hey I'm going to need
00:46:18
this money probably in 12 years it looks
00:46:21
like I got this big hole 12 years from
00:46:22
now if I don't need this money for the
00:46:24
next 12 years and I know I'm probably
00:46:25
gonna need year 12 where do I go and we
00:46:28
take this monster list of investment
00:46:30
choices and we narrow it down to just a
00:46:32
few and now our valuation process and
00:46:35
the freakout Factor goes from a million
00:46:38
to almost none because they go hey guess
00:46:41
what instead of having to evaluate
00:46:42
300,000 we can look at these five and
00:46:45
then we can decide how these five work
00:46:47
and then we know we have the appropriate
00:46:50
vessel the appropriate train to get us
00:46:52
to where we need the money so number
00:46:54
three on my list is what funds assets
00:46:56
are you going to use
00:46:57
I love it I love it there's a cool stat
00:47:00
that you might be familiar with Joe and
00:47:02
listeners maybe are too but I I when it
00:47:03
comes to this asset allocation decision
00:47:06
the stat is and this comes from like the
00:47:08
CFA the real nerdy investment Minds out
00:47:11
there that basically 90% or so of
00:47:15
someone's return can simply be
00:47:18
attributed to the asset selection
00:47:21
meaning like stocks versus bonds versus
00:47:23
pixelated pictures of cats at nfts I'm
00:47:27
kidding uh it was a serious Point except
00:47:29
for the Cat part but then only that the
00:47:31
remaining 10% or so is well did you
00:47:35
select a a stock manager who's going to
00:47:38
outperform did you end up just going
00:47:39
with an index fund what were the actual
00:47:42
Securities selected under that asset
00:47:44
class umbrella and generally the way
00:47:46
that I talk about things whether I'm
00:47:48
writing on the blog or speaking here is
00:47:51
exactly what you just talked about as a
00:47:53
retiree that you're hopefully going to
00:47:55
have 20 or 25 or 30 plus years of
00:47:58
spending and for some of those near-term
00:48:00
years well it might not make sense to
00:48:02
take a risk in the stock market to help
00:48:05
support your lifestyle in in 2025
00:48:07
because we don't know if the stock
00:48:08
market will go up between now and 2025
00:48:11
so maybe for those near-term years you
00:48:12
want to lean more on slightly safer
00:48:15
fixed income or cash or something like
00:48:17
that but once you get out into year 12
00:48:19
like you said Joe or year 15 whatever
00:48:21
your your personal risk measurement or
00:48:23
risk appetite is at some point it makes
00:48:25
sense to introduce some some higher risk
00:48:27
higher return Investments and just
00:48:29
starting with that just you don't have
00:48:30
to worry about picking Nvidia or picking
00:48:33
Facebook or picking anything else just
00:48:35
start thinking about your overall asset
00:48:37
allocation and how that meshes with your
00:48:40
timeline I I think that's a great place
00:48:42
to start it's wonderful what's your
00:48:44
number three my number three has to do
00:48:47
with health and healthcare because I I
00:48:50
just think that you know if I had to if
00:48:52
I had to put it into an actual question
00:48:54
or an actual topic it would just be how
00:48:56
I manage my health and health care in
00:48:59
retirement because I think all this
00:49:00
conversation we're having and just think
00:49:02
about all the ink that's been spilled
00:49:04
about retirement planning and think
00:49:06
about all the words that have been
00:49:08
spoken about retirement planning and all
00:49:10
the money that's changed hands when it
00:49:12
comes to retirement planning and then
00:49:15
juxtapose that with the current state of
00:49:18
the American Health not only health
00:49:20
system not healthare system but just
00:49:22
Americans Health right the American food
00:49:25
and fitness Industries and and you
00:49:26
realize there's something funny going on
00:49:28
where we've got plenty of 65 and 70y
00:49:31
olds who are financially prepared for
00:49:33
retirement and they are going to get
00:49:35
sick and die very soon into their
00:49:38
retirement unfortunately and and it is a
00:49:41
pretty widespread you can use some
00:49:43
flowery language here and I I'll let you
00:49:45
fill in the blanks but I think it's so
00:49:47
important for people to yes you want you
00:49:50
want to think about your multi-decade
00:49:52
financial retirement and all the fun
00:49:54
things you're going to do and you also
00:49:56
owe it to yourself to say how will I
00:49:59
increase my probability that I have a
00:50:01
happy healthy that I'm there that I'm
00:50:03
living and I'm vibrant during that
00:50:05
retirement it's so frustrating to see
00:50:08
somebody who did a great job with the
00:50:09
money and they're not healthy enough to
00:50:11
get any of those goals which brings up
00:50:13
two things number one if you're younger
00:50:15
and you're listening to this this idea
00:50:17
sabatical whenever possible is such an
00:50:19
important thing because you know you
00:50:21
have your health now do the things that
00:50:23
you want to do now take a break and and
00:50:25
do those plus part of that Jesse is also
00:50:28
play testing maybe some other time I'll
00:50:30
share my complete story with people
00:50:32
about me being a nomad for a while but I
00:50:34
thought that was going to be my life I
00:50:36
was sure we sold our house we sold all
00:50:37
our stuff we were going to go live and
00:50:41
then covid hit we looked at each other
00:50:43
and said okay my wife was taking a job
00:50:46
in Arizona we lived in Michigan at the
00:50:48
time and it was funny we were just
00:50:50
waiting on one license she needed and we
00:50:53
get this call there is no job because of
00:50:54
Co and we'd already sold everything we
00:50:57
sold our we sold everything and we look
00:50:58
at each other and this is the first time
00:51:00
when I when I realized how cool
00:51:01
Financial Independence is because we
00:51:03
went from horrified oh my God there's no
00:51:05
job which would be 99% of us to looking
00:51:09
at each other going wait a minute you
00:51:11
don't need to work we can to live where
00:51:13
the hell we want like where do you want
00:51:14
to go so we went we lived in Vermont for
00:51:16
a month we lived in Palm Springs for a
00:51:18
month like we spent most of covid in
00:51:19
these outdoor places exploring national
00:51:21
parks and trying to stay stay safe and
00:51:24
away from people do all the cool things
00:51:25
for two years away from people but I'll
00:51:27
tell you I hated it you're saying by the
00:51:29
by the end of the nomadic lifestyle or
00:51:31
kind of throughout it it started to
00:51:33
grind on you yeah probably by month
00:51:35
three or four I was like there's
00:51:36
something missing here I like slow
00:51:38
travel I will be okay during my quote
00:51:41
retirement years when I when Cheryl
00:51:43
decides she doesn't want to work because
00:51:45
also during this process we went through
00:51:47
valuing work and she said no I really
00:51:50
want to work I like what I do I really
00:51:52
like what I do it's not about the money
00:51:53
and so she decided to go back to work
00:51:55
but when she decides to retire Jesse I
00:51:57
like slow travel we're going to go spend
00:51:59
summer it's hot as hell here in Texar
00:52:00
can in the summer so we're going to
00:52:02
spend three months in Portugal or maybe
00:52:04
three months back in Chile or Peru where
00:52:06
I just was or Vermont even go love
00:52:09
Vermont so or Northern Michigan which is
00:52:12
amazing maybe go stay at Jesse's house
00:52:14
in Rochester do do some of that cool
00:52:17
stuff we've got a little corner in the
00:52:19
basement it's a little musty and dank
00:52:21
but it's all yours well it it it's going
00:52:22
to be perfect then cuz it's exactly what
00:52:24
we have here mom's basement so but
00:52:26
anyway but back to healthcare the the
00:52:29
the fact that the fact that you play
00:52:31
test stuff so you know what you like and
00:52:33
what you don't like is super important
00:52:35
sabatical is super important because you
00:52:37
don't know what your health is going to
00:52:38
be like but also then taking care of
00:52:40
your health and I found as I get older
00:52:42
well I get frustrated that I can't do
00:52:45
things the way that I used to I can see
00:52:47
my time slowing down speaking of running
00:52:49
like I just become happier as a slower
00:52:51
and slower and slower Runner it still is
00:52:54
really fun the challenge of staying
00:52:55
healthy is fun but it's a mindset shift
00:52:58
I like it let's go to number four do you
00:53:00
want to go first do you want me to go
00:53:01
first are we are we doing a snake draft
00:53:03
I think we are doing a snake draft which
00:53:04
means you're up my number four is that a
00:53:08
pre-retired re gliding into retirement
00:53:10
needs to identify their important
00:53:13
relationships and understand how they'll
00:53:16
maintain those relationships throughout
00:53:17
retirement because again going back to
00:53:20
some of the Retirement Research that
00:53:21
I've read a very common stressor or a
00:53:25
common complaint or ation that retirees
00:53:27
have is the change and usually it's the
00:53:31
lack of the same type of social
00:53:33
engagements and relationships that they
00:53:35
had during their working years that
00:53:37
could be I used to obviously know a lot
00:53:40
of people at work and I spent 45 hours a
00:53:42
week at work and now I don't see those
00:53:44
people anymore it could be I was
00:53:46
participating in kind of professional or
00:53:48
Civic societies whether you know the
00:53:51
rotary club or or the network after work
00:53:53
club and now I'm not doing that anymore
00:53:55
I used to work with clients and I'm not
00:53:57
doing that anymore now it's no offense
00:53:59
to my spouse it's just me and my spouse
00:54:01
all day every day that's a very common
00:54:04
frustration and going back to what it's
00:54:06
the Harvard Grant study the longitudinal
00:54:08
happiness study that's very famous and
00:54:11
one of if not the biggest outcomes from
00:54:14
that study is that human happiness is
00:54:17
directly correlated to our relationships
00:54:19
and when our relationships suffer we
00:54:22
tend to suffer as social animals so I
00:54:24
think it behooves any pre-tie to
00:54:26
understand how their relationships will
00:54:29
ideally flourish throughout their
00:54:31
retirement it's a harder Point than I
00:54:34
think a lot of people think it is and as
00:54:36
a guy who's in his
00:54:37
mid-50s let me tell you I see friends
00:54:40
falling into this trap already I have
00:54:43
two friends that within the past five
00:54:46
years have bought a quote vacation house
00:54:49
away from all of their friends and they
00:54:51
increasingly spend more time at the
00:54:53
vacation house because you know what
00:54:55
Jesse you get to a certain amount of
00:54:57
money you get to a certain point of your
00:54:59
life and you go I deserve it but the
00:55:01
thing that they're really doing is
00:55:03
isolating themselves from those
00:55:05
communities I love board games so I have
00:55:08
board game nights fairly often there's
00:55:11
one dude that I've forgotten to invite a
00:55:14
few times because he's isolated himself
00:55:16
so much I didn't do it to him he did it
00:55:18
to him but the cultural expectation is
00:55:21
this is good if I told you oh this guy's
00:55:24
got this beautiful property on a lake
00:55:25
about an an hour and a half away and he
00:55:27
spends a lot of time there and it's up
00:55:28
on a hill and he's building this
00:55:29
gorgeous huge like 4,000 foot house like
00:55:32
it's gorgeous unbelievable house uh on
00:55:35
top of this this hill just looking down
00:55:37
the spine of the lake it's beautiful you
00:55:39
would think everybody would think well
00:55:41
yeah it's retirement Vision that's great
00:55:43
it's horrible it is medically going to
00:55:47
make him die sooner I've got another
00:55:50
friend who is retiring and chasing his
00:55:52
children chasing your children I don't
00:55:55
think is
00:55:56
horrible but what I've found is I've
00:55:59
been around people that are on the other
00:56:01
end of that once the kids get past High
00:56:02
School your kids kind of look at you and
00:56:05
go yeah thanks yeah okay don't need you
00:56:08
around anymore I have I have one friend
00:56:10
of our families who moved from Michigan
00:56:14
to California to take care of her
00:56:16
grandkids after Grand her last grandson
00:56:19
graduated from high school she within 6
00:56:22
months moved to Virginia to be with
00:56:24
other family and during that the whole
00:56:26
time think about how hard it is to get
00:56:28
friends especially for men like study
00:56:30
show men have a hard time making friends
00:56:32
after age 35 40 years old it's the only
00:56:35
reason why I podcast actually I need to
00:56:37
invite people I mean this is my social
00:56:39
engagement right now Joe he needs a
00:56:41
buddy it is so difficult so I think
00:56:44
that's an issue the other issue there's
00:56:45
one more I know people in their 70s
00:56:48
there's a guy who's a wonderful
00:56:49
podcaster I love him a lot but the thing
00:56:52
that I hear people say about him is this
00:56:54
guy's in his 70s what the hell is he
00:56:55
still doing working what's funny is
00:56:57
Jesse I want to be that guy I can't
00:56:59
imagine not doing this 20 years from now
00:57:01
Cheryl and I said that if we go live in
00:57:02
Portugal for 3 months I'm taking my
00:57:04
podcasting stuff with me I'm find a
00:57:06
place with fast internet I'm GNA do
00:57:07
because I love it but it is the first
00:57:09
thing people ask about this guy all the
00:57:10
time like what's he does he not enough
00:57:12
money so these cultural things of I
00:57:15
deserve the vacation house I deserve to
00:57:17
stop working are actually the lifeblood
00:57:21
for the guy still working it's his
00:57:22
lifeblood and he's great at it why the
00:57:24
hell should he stop because he's 75
00:57:26
why should I go isolate myself from my
00:57:29
friends because I'm nearing retirement
00:57:31
age I think we have to carefully
00:57:33
reexamine those things so I love I love
00:57:35
the fact that you brought that up I I
00:57:36
agree with what you said and not only
00:57:38
because you agree with me it's not just
00:57:39
pure confirmation bias speaking I
00:57:41
actually agree with what you said there
00:57:43
Joe what's your uh what's your number
00:57:45
four my number four is very similar to
00:57:47
your number three which is how are you
00:57:49
going to protect yourself how are you
00:57:51
going to protect yourself now you've got
00:57:53
illness on just the everyday end to
00:57:56
if I pass away and I'm married what's my
00:57:59
spouse going to do if my spouse pass
00:58:01
away what am I going to do do I have my
00:58:04
estate plan set up do I have have I
00:58:06
thought about long-term care long-term
00:58:08
care is you know is such a big problem
00:58:10
this idea of I'm going to have a
00:58:11
catastrophic illness at some point
00:58:13
what's my strategy think about this
00:58:15
stuff early on think about it once
00:58:18
develop your plan and don't sit around
00:58:20
worrying about it but problem I saw when
00:58:22
I was a financial planner too many
00:58:24
people in their retirement years sitting
00:58:25
around worrying about this stuff without
00:58:27
a plan create your plan live with it
00:58:29
have fun like go do your thing go do
00:58:32
whatever your mission is but don't worry
00:58:34
about all that stuff frankly this should
00:58:37
have been my number three because I
00:58:39
agree with this client that I had she
00:58:41
was an engineer for the state of
00:58:42
Michigan and she told me when we were
00:58:44
talking about protection right we're
00:58:46
talking about insurances and having a
00:58:48
big enough cash reserve and our state
00:58:50
plan she said I like this because as an
00:58:53
engineer when we're building a new
00:58:55
highway the first thing we do is we look
00:58:57
at everything that could go wrong and we
00:58:59
protect against all those things like we
00:59:00
on a whiteboard try to make sure we've
00:59:02
covered everything and once we know we
00:59:04
have a plan for all this then we start
00:59:06
building but I think that narrative wise
00:59:09
thinking about what funds or assets
00:59:10
first goes along in people's brain
00:59:13
easier so really before you start
00:59:16
investing in funds and assets you should
00:59:18
figure out how am I'm going to protect
00:59:19
myself and then do it but narrative wise
00:59:21
I think number four I like this better
00:59:24
it's scary to think about and so we're
00:59:25
we're not wired to ask that question
00:59:27
well what if I die sooner than I expect
00:59:30
what if something terrible happens what
00:59:31
if I fall off you know what if I become
00:59:33
like those what if questions the scary
00:59:35
what if questions that as you alluded to
00:59:37
your your engineering client I mean I
00:59:39
can certainly relate to that as in my
00:59:40
former engineering career absolutely
00:59:43
what kind of things do I need to design
00:59:44
for and what factors of safety do I need
00:59:46
to include and what don't I fully
00:59:49
understand what are the unknown unknowns
00:59:50
can I try to figure that all that kind
00:59:52
of stuff I think it's it can be scary
00:59:54
for the average person to
00:59:56
commit a lot of their brain power to
00:59:58
those questions because it's really not
00:59:59
fun to think about and not to belabor
01:00:03
the point not to steal a spotlight but
01:00:04
that my number five is it's worded a
01:00:06
little bit differently but it's what
01:00:08
legal or estate planning do I need to do
01:00:11
am I all set on the legal Estate
01:00:13
Planning and I should throw uh Insurance
01:00:15
in there too if that's a a need for
01:00:17
someone gliding into retirement because
01:00:19
if if you haven't thought about it yet I
01:00:21
mean I I feel a little bit behind I'm in
01:00:23
my mid-30s and I think there are some
01:00:25
things where ask myself boy have I have
01:00:27
I really set up my family as optimally
01:00:29
as I should have probably not because
01:00:31
you never know when that bus is going to
01:00:32
when that plane is going to land on you
01:00:34
on the highway inside joke inside joke
01:00:36
right there you know if you haven't
01:00:38
thought about it by the time you're 50
01:00:40
or 55 or 60 and you're going into
01:00:42
retirement with a partner or if you plan
01:00:44
on leaving money behind to your airs or
01:00:46
whatever those kind of questions are
01:00:48
it's really time to get all those
01:00:50
Affairs in order 100% absolutely 100%
01:00:53
it's so funny how closely our list align
01:00:56
it's either great minds think alike or
01:00:57
fools seldom differ it's one of the
01:01:00
two could be one of those so that that
01:01:02
was my number five and that completes my
01:01:04
list but what what's your number five
01:01:05
Joe my number five is for all the snarky
01:01:08
people out there because Money podcasts
01:01:10
tend to attract money nerds and money
01:01:12
nerds are like oh yeah done all those
01:01:14
I'm good I'm good and you know what
01:01:17
generally I think it's not great
01:01:19
somebody doing what you or I do or back
01:01:22
when I was a financial planner to be
01:01:24
snarky but this is the one spot where I
01:01:26
get snarky where I'm like oh good for
01:01:29
you good for you that you're going to be
01:01:31
okay boy I bet you feel great don't you
01:01:34
and people might be wondering why the
01:01:36
hell what's that about here's the deal
01:01:40
you know when we look at things like the
01:01:42
efficient Frontier as an example and we
01:01:45
look at organizing your assets better
01:01:47
people that listen to this type of show
01:01:49
usually people are pretty damn good at
01:01:51
this and when we're suboptimal with
01:01:54
stuff we let it go cuz I'm going to be
01:01:57
okay and yet you think about those
01:01:59
people around you those communities
01:02:01
around you those you could do some
01:02:04
serious good in your own backyard
01:02:07
whatever that means to you whether it's
01:02:09
your immediately immediate family if
01:02:10
it's your kids if it's your social
01:02:12
organizations you talked about
01:02:14
communities while we fight more and more
01:02:17
online about politics you know what's
01:02:19
happening Community organizations in our
01:02:21
backyard are shrinking nobody's going to
01:02:23
the Kanas Club anymore helping out their
01:02:25
organization nobody's going to the
01:02:26
Rotary Club anymore I go and I speak to
01:02:29
these organizations about Trails which
01:02:31
is what I do in my backyard make walking
01:02:33
trails around Tex Arcana our mutual
01:02:35
friend Chad Carson does the same thing
01:02:37
in Clemson it was funny when we found
01:02:39
that out that we're both passionate
01:02:40
about walking trails in our town like we
01:02:42
both are on boards for those so I work a
01:02:44
lot with the parks department but I'm on
01:02:47
this group of just citizens that build
01:02:50
matching gifts for more walking trails
01:02:52
and beautification safe roots to school
01:02:54
with kids great place to work work out
01:02:56
but these communities need your help and
01:02:59
you know what's funny is when I started
01:03:02
getting involved with Community stuff I
01:03:05
realized that I should and I thought as
01:03:07
a financial Planet it would be good
01:03:08
marketing just getting to know people
01:03:10
because you always see the movers and
01:03:12
shakers in a town do this stuff right
01:03:15
and I thought it was all marketing I
01:03:18
realized I wasn't really PR good
01:03:20
passionate about anything like I had no
01:03:22
real goal I had no cause I had no
01:03:24
whatever so I just picked one frankly I
01:03:26
picked one at the time that my client
01:03:28
was the head of the Arthritis Foundation
01:03:30
my mom has arthritis my grandmother had
01:03:34
really bad arthritis so I did stuff with
01:03:36
the Arthritis Foundation instead of
01:03:37
waiting for passion to hit you just go
01:03:40
get your hands dirty and when you go and
01:03:42
you get involved and you see what the
01:03:44
need is then all of a sudden you're 100%
01:03:47
on it and now any way that I can use my
01:03:51
money and my brain and whatever to help
01:03:54
the people and the community around me
01:03:56
grow it sounds like I'm like Joe
01:03:58
humanitarian some Monk who's just you
01:04:01
know doing great it isn't Jesse this is
01:04:03
completely selfish I will tell you you
01:04:05
will feel so kickass if you get more
01:04:08
involved and if you help out so if
01:04:11
you're feeling okay after Jesse and my
01:04:14
list well good for you great now go do
01:04:18
something you know what I mean so it is
01:04:20
snarky but I think there's a wealth of
01:04:22
knowledge that gets wasted and I'll tell
01:04:24
you specifically who I'm talking to I'm
01:04:27
talking to people that read J Collins
01:04:30
book The Simple path to wealth they put
01:04:32
all their money in vtsax they know
01:04:35
nothing about either goal-based
01:04:36
investing the in fishing Frontier and I
01:04:38
will tell you that strategy is beatable
01:04:41
by a lot and if you have more than 70
01:04:46
80,000 sitting in
01:04:48
vtsax you are you're doing it wrong I
01:04:51
mean you just just quite frankly you're
01:04:53
doing it wrong and and you missed the
01:04:55
point of the book the book was hey
01:04:57
you're young stop freaking out about
01:04:58
what to invest in just invest in vtsax
01:05:01
and you will become wealthy and he's not
01:05:03
wrong he's he's 100% right it's a simple
01:05:06
path to wealth not the optimal path to
01:05:07
wealth not the best path to wealth jail
01:05:09
count smart dude he didn't name it any
01:05:11
of those things he named it simple and I
01:05:14
see otherwise brilliant money nerds get
01:05:17
caught in this trap of suboptimization
01:05:20
which is so easy to beat they'll have a
01:05:22
budget that is unbelievable they will
01:05:26
have the right insurances exactly mapped
01:05:29
out and then it comes to their asset
01:05:31
allocation and they crap on it because
01:05:33
of a book JL Collins read that they
01:05:36
misinterpreted anyway another rant sorry
01:05:39
yeah no no oh understood understood that
01:05:42
and that's another uh you want to talk
01:05:44
about like some nitpicking arguments
01:05:46
that I've decided to avoid now I mean
01:05:48
that's a big one it's hard having an
01:05:49
actual cohesive coherent conversation
01:05:52
with someone who's really drinking the
01:05:53
uh the VT Kool-Aid as it were well they
01:05:56
don't get the point correct exactly the
01:05:58
whole missing the forest for the trees
01:06:00
thing again and it's fun as you were
01:06:01
describing some of the ways to give back
01:06:04
to your community I thought just past
01:06:06
this past week have you heard of
01:06:07
paychecks yes the company payroll I used
01:06:10
to use them so founded here in Rochester
01:06:12
New York by a gentleman named Tom galiso
01:06:15
who is a a multi-billionaire I think
01:06:17
he's a multi multi times over
01:06:19
billionaire at this point he's probably
01:06:20
in his 80s called a surprise press
01:06:22
conference last week he invited it was
01:06:24
actually kind of cool thinking about
01:06:25
cool ways of doing things he invited all
01:06:27
these people to a room they didn't know
01:06:29
why they were there they were starting
01:06:30
to look around the room and they
01:06:31
realized like wait I'm the head
01:06:33
fundraiser for this nonprofit you're the
01:06:35
head fundraiser for that non like
01:06:36
everybody in here was a fundraiser for a
01:06:39
nonprofit then who walks on stage Tom
01:06:42
galano whoa big surprise gave away $360
01:06:45
million to like 40 or 50 organizations
01:06:49
in you know1 to20 million chunks so this
01:06:52
huge Monumental thing that affected a
01:06:54
lot of organizations here in West New
01:06:55
York and he always has been very
01:06:57
philanthropic in that way but I think
01:07:00
that's the kind of thing of course most
01:07:02
of us listening are not going to be able
01:07:03
to give away 360 millions of dollars but
01:07:06
you probably can look at your financial
01:07:07
plan you can look at how it will change
01:07:09
over time you can start giving away
01:07:11
money you can just give away your time
01:07:13
and effort which is something you
01:07:14
alluded to Joe and and speaking of when
01:07:16
you come stay in in the basement here
01:07:18
parenton New York my little suburb is a
01:07:21
trail Town USA design I don't know if
01:07:24
you're familiar with this but there's
01:07:25
something like 50 or 100 Trail towns in
01:07:28
the US that have a very high
01:07:30
concentration of walking trails that's
01:07:32
fabulous it's great you're going to love
01:07:34
it you're you can bring your board games
01:07:36
we'll put you in a tent down in the
01:07:37
basement you bring your walking shoes
01:07:39
you can walk all over I won't drive you
01:07:41
anywhere I swear you can do all the walk
01:07:42
no but it it is something that and
01:07:44
talking about making people happy giving
01:07:46
people purpose I mean putting your time
01:07:48
and effort and resources to use in
01:07:50
retirement generally is something that
01:07:52
brings people a lot of joy and it is
01:07:54
something worth thinking about ahead of
01:07:55
time well Joe here we are the end of the
01:07:58
episode thank you so much for coming
01:08:00
here on the best interest podcast I mean
01:08:02
how can people let's say someone's been
01:08:04
living under a rock they they heard of
01:08:06
me because I'm there under the rock with
01:08:07
them but they haven't heard of stacking
01:08:10
Benjamin what's going on over at
01:08:11
stacking Benjamin's these days oh we got
01:08:13
this guy who's appearing quite a bit on
01:08:15
our Friday roundtables lately some dude
01:08:17
named Jesse Kramer mixing it up with
01:08:20
Paula pant from a for anything and our
01:08:23
own OG Josh Bannerman who is my co-host
01:08:26
and we have these great Round Table
01:08:28
discussions on Friday Mondays we have
01:08:30
Mentor Mondays we have great people we
01:08:33
just had a a great Professor on from
01:08:35
Stanford University we have Seth Goden
01:08:37
coming up the marketing Guru we got Josh
01:08:39
Brown downtown Josh Brown coming on so
01:08:42
people that know CNBC or people that
01:08:44
know great financial planning people
01:08:46
Josh is going to be coming up so we have
01:08:48
great mentors on Monday people we really
01:08:51
respect Wednesday we take a headline and
01:08:53
we go deep with it we just talked about
01:08:55
the Dallas pension fund firefighter
01:08:57
pension fund and we use that as a case
01:08:59
study on a Wednesday show about how
01:09:03
these big big big Pension funds even
01:09:05
mess up their money and how easy it is
01:09:07
to do here's what they did Jesse they're
01:09:09
like we're not going to pay Pros we're
01:09:11
going to put firefighters on the pension
01:09:13
fund and these firefighters invested in
01:09:17
vacant land swads of land in Wyoming and
01:09:21
they invested in wineries in California
01:09:24
mostly I think because the wineries sent
01:09:28
them on due diligence imagine if you
01:09:30
told your spouse that we get to go to a
01:09:32
due diligence trip with a wi and you're
01:09:34
sitting back there over you know you're
01:09:36
half drunk and you're looking out over
01:09:37
the you're like we should invest in this
01:09:39
can't go wrong those are mistakes of pro
01:09:41
wouldn't make and so while it doesn't
01:09:43
need to be made by a pro we kind of
01:09:45
teach people in these case studies on
01:09:46
Wednesdays to think more like a pro and
01:09:48
then on Fridays we have a great Round
01:09:50
Table discussion about some great topic
01:09:53
we've talked about is door Dash killing
01:09:55
the community neighborhoods and our
01:09:58
wallet at the same time you know that's
01:10:00
number one we talked about instead of
01:10:03
goal setting should we be going on
01:10:04
quests having a lot of fun there so
01:10:06
Monday Wednesday Friday the greatest
01:10:08
money Show on Earth because it's a
01:10:09
circus the stacking Benjamin show it is
01:10:12
it's always entertaining and always
01:10:14
enlightening and and I mean I'm
01:10:15
definitely going to check out Josh and
01:10:17
and Seth two two people who I have a ton
01:10:19
of respect for what could I say thank
01:10:21
you again Joe Sal SEI of stacking
01:10:24
Benjamins for stopping by by sharing
01:10:25
your time and expertise and your smile
01:10:28
and your laughter with us on the best
01:10:30
interest podcast thanks a ton man you
01:10:32
and I have so much
01:10:34
fun thanks for tuning in to this episode
01:10:37
of the best interest podcast if you have
01:10:39
a question for Jesse to answer on a
01:10:41
future episode send him an email at
01:10:43
Jesse bestin interest. blog again that's
01:10:47
Jesse ATB bestter interest. blog did you
01:10:50
enjoy the show subscribe rate and review
01:10:52
the podcast wherever you listen this
01:10:55
helps others find the show and invest in
01:10:57
knowledge themselves and we really
01:10:59
appreciate it we'll catch you on the
01:11:01
next episode of the best interest
01:11:06
podcast the best interest podcast is a
01:11:08
personal podcast met for education and
01:11:10
entertainment it should not be taken as
01:11:13
Financial advice and is not prescriptive
01:11:15
of your financial situation
