00:00:00
Don't [ __ ] with El Papo. Even though I I
00:00:03
always think there's certain political
00:00:04
instincts that the president has that I
00:00:07
don't see that end up being less wrong
00:00:10
than I thought and sometimes right, I do
00:00:12
not see any upside here.
00:00:20
>> Hi everyone, this is Pivot from New York
00:00:22
Magazine and the Vox Media Podcast
00:00:24
Network. I'm Carara Swisser
00:00:25
>> and I'm Scott Galloway.
00:00:27
>> Y'all back. I see
00:00:28
>> back. That's right. That's right.
00:00:30
>> Did you have a good time off? Did you
00:00:31
have a nice time?
00:00:32
>> Yeah, I didn't do a whole lot, but yeah,
00:00:34
it was really nice. I was in Florida, a
00:00:36
lot of walks on the beach with my dogs.
00:00:39
Um, actually got kind of bored, which
00:00:41
was a a lovely and strange time.
00:00:43
>> Well, we missed you. We had some good
00:00:44
hosts, but no one is you. Anyway, we got
00:00:46
to get to things. Let's get to things.
00:00:48
There's a lot of news. Jesus Christ,
00:00:49
there was so much while you're away. I
00:00:50
think we've forgotten that stuff. But
00:00:52
Poplio says he has no fear of the Trump
00:00:54
administration after the president
00:00:56
lashed out at him on true social Sunday
00:00:58
night. Trump called the pope quote weak
00:01:00
on crime and quote terrible on foreign
00:01:03
policy in his post. Neither one of those
00:01:05
are his jobs. He accused Pope Leo of
00:01:08
quote catering to the radical left and
00:01:09
then told him to focus on quote being a
00:01:12
great pope not a politician. Trump later
00:01:14
posted an AI generated image of himself
00:01:16
as Jesus, though it looks like he might
00:01:18
have deleted it and told reporters that
00:01:20
he thought the image was him as a
00:01:22
doctor. Oh my god, he's such a liar.
00:01:24
We'll get to Well, let me get it all.
00:01:26
It's not just the Pope. Trump called out
00:01:27
Tucker Carlson, Megan Kelly, Candace
00:01:29
Owens, and Alex Jones over over their
00:01:31
criticism of the war last week. Alex
00:01:33
Jones responded, "We are witnessing the
00:01:34
Epstein presidency." He's a nod to Scott
00:01:37
Galloway there. That Candace Owens said
00:01:39
that it may be time to put grandpa up in
00:01:41
a home. Uh, let's see. We'll get to the
00:01:44
latest on the war, but first, talk about
00:01:46
this this alienation of everybody. It
00:01:49
seems demented. He was tweeting all last
00:01:51
night from like 9:00 p.m. to 4:00 a.m.
00:01:54
like regularly. Thoughts?
00:01:58
>> I I don't see the strategy here. And
00:02:00
granted, I think Trump has had an
00:02:03
ability to zag when everyone else is
00:02:05
zigging. I thought one of the greatest
00:02:06
insights in political history was when
00:02:08
Trump told somebody, "Everybody claims
00:02:10
to be socially liberal and fiscally
00:02:12
conservative." He said, "The key is to
00:02:14
be fiscally liberal and socially
00:02:15
conservative." And it struck me that
00:02:17
that was sort of a genius political
00:02:18
positioning.
00:02:20
But I failed to see how alienating a
00:02:23
core constituency, the Republican party,
00:02:25
and that is evangelical Christians by
00:02:28
taking on the pope. I mean, people say
00:02:30
social security is the third rail. I do
00:02:31
think the American public is coming to
00:02:33
grips with the fact that the wealthiest
00:02:34
generation in the history of the planet
00:02:35
probably shouldn't be taking $1.2
00:02:36
trillion from the most anxious, obese,
00:02:39
and depressed generation in history, and
00:02:41
that's people under the age of 40. But
00:02:43
that used to be the third rail, but I
00:02:44
would argue kind of the most obvious
00:02:46
third rail. You don't go after the I
00:02:47
mean, El Don't [ __ ] with El Papa. So I I
00:02:50
just even though I I always think
00:02:53
there's certain political instincts that
00:02:55
the president has that I don't see that
00:02:57
end up being less wrong than I thought
00:03:00
and sometimes right
00:03:01
>> I do not see any upside.
00:03:03
>> Also an articulate pope a very
00:03:05
articulate and younger pope.
00:03:07
>> Outstanding, smart, measured everything
00:03:10
you would want in a leader.
00:03:12
>> Uh what are your thoughts? I don't get
00:03:14
this at all.
00:03:15
>> I I think this guy is incredibly
00:03:17
popular. I don't I don't understand why.
00:03:19
I think he's jealous of his popularity
00:03:21
and his intelligence. And you know, this
00:03:23
guy's been speaking out as as popes
00:03:25
sometimes do on wars. You know, Francis
00:03:28
did the same thing. And we don't want to
00:03:29
see all this war. And the way you talk
00:03:31
about like last week when you weren't
00:03:32
here talking, you know, the decimation
00:03:34
of a civilization um in just as a as a
00:03:38
tactic. It was just demented. It was
00:03:40
demented. And I think he was responsibly
00:03:43
talking out the way a pope might do. And
00:03:45
he has been very firm on war. Like,
00:03:47
let's stop it. let's stop the war thing.
00:03:49
He's still, you know, awfully
00:03:50
conservative even though you you don't
00:03:52
think about it, but he see I suppose he
00:03:54
seems liberal because he says no war. I
00:03:56
don't know how that is no war cuz and he
00:03:58
dubtales by the way with the media with
00:04:00
the MAGA media which is very against the
00:04:04
war like not just Marjorie Taylor Green
00:04:06
another one there's bunches of them that
00:04:08
are now Tim P all of them are sort of I
00:04:11
mean to an extent um Rogan but he of
00:04:15
course you know high-fived him at this
00:04:17
whatever wrestling stupid thing they
00:04:18
were at um but I think you know they're
00:04:21
like mega media doesn't speak full of
00:04:23
MAGA I'm like they kind of do they kind
00:04:25
of there's millions and millions and
00:04:27
millions of followers and they're
00:04:28
growing like crazy. And so I'm not so
00:04:30
sure picking a fight with these mouth
00:04:33
mouthy people from Alex Jones to Megan
00:04:35
Kelly and Tucker Carlson and Candace and
00:04:37
Owen and um uh Marjorie Taylor Green's a
00:04:41
particularly good idea at this moment,
00:04:43
but I don't know. I think he, as I've
00:04:45
said, I think he's suffering deeply
00:04:47
cognitively and he's losing it. That's
00:04:49
my feeling. Just looking at the tweets
00:04:52
seems to me.
00:04:52
>> Yeah, he it does feel like he's lashing
00:04:54
out. I don't. Yeah, I I I'm having
00:04:57
trouble. Susie Wilds has ended up being
00:04:59
more genius than crazy. This just feels
00:05:02
crazy. It feels as if
00:05:03
>> Yeah, she's she is breast cancer. You
00:05:05
know, she's may not be as there as
00:05:06
present. She says she is, but it feels
00:05:08
like she's gone left the building.
00:05:10
>> I didn't know.
00:05:11
>> Um I don't know who's around him. And
00:05:13
then look, Marco Rubio looked like a
00:05:15
loser at that W, whatever, whatever was
00:05:18
happening. The MF whatever the fight
00:05:20
>> invited the UFC fight at the White
00:05:22
House. Yeah, you have to go.
00:05:24
>> No, there's no way I'm going.
00:05:25
>> Oh, come on. With a little camera on
00:05:27
your head. That would have been good.
00:05:28
>> I find UFC fights disturbing. I really
00:05:31
don't like seeing young men who are in
00:05:32
peak physical shape beating each other
00:05:34
up like that. I just
00:05:36
>> even boxing, which I think is I can see
00:05:38
is such an in some ways such
00:05:40
>> so incredible. U even that disturbs me
00:05:43
now as I get older.
00:05:44
>> I went to a lot of boxing match with my
00:05:46
grandfather when I was a kid. Not a lot,
00:05:48
but enough wrestling. He was into
00:05:49
wrestling, boxing. Uh my brother Jeff
00:05:52
went to a lot of them anyway. He was a
00:05:54
big sports and wrestling and boxing nut,
00:05:56
but um and was a promoter in of a lot of
00:05:59
stuff up in Norththeast Pennsylvania.
00:06:01
>> Cole and boxing and you turned out
00:06:02
lesbian. What a shocker.
00:06:04
>> What a shocker.
00:06:06
>> I know. I know. I think I think Trump
00:06:08
>> it's in the batter. You homophobe.
00:06:10
Anyways, I can just hear people now
00:06:11
going have something to do with your
00:06:12
environment.
00:06:13
>> Yes. Yes. I think it had to exactly I'm
00:06:15
a lesbian because my grandfather took me
00:06:17
to boxing. Um, so as of this recording,
00:06:20
by the way, the the point is it's all
00:06:21
about um what's happening in Iran and
00:06:24
with Iran and the blockade of the Strait
00:06:26
of Hormuz is underway with more than 15
00:06:28
US warships in place to support the Oh
00:06:30
my god, this feels like a bad idea.
00:06:33
Trump announced the blockade plan on
00:06:34
Sunday, accusing Iran of world
00:06:37
extortion. His threats came, he No, his
00:06:40
threats came after peace talks ended, as
00:06:42
you know, without a resolution, which
00:06:43
often happens. By the way, I give JD
00:06:46
Vance a hard time, but these things take
00:06:48
time. Obviously, um he was there leading
00:06:50
the negotiations with the US and said
00:06:51
Iran chose not to accept our terms. I
00:06:53
think there was issues around the
00:06:55
nuclear proliferation stuff. Um Trump is
00:06:57
also reportedly looking at limited
00:06:59
military strikes in Iran in addition to
00:07:00
the blockade. Um uh it's really um hard
00:07:06
for him because he's stuck, as you said,
00:07:08
he's painted himself into a corner many
00:07:10
times. Um they're not budging. Um and
00:07:12
and also uh one of I want to note we've
00:07:15
seen a big new type of target in this
00:07:17
war, big tech data centers. Last month,
00:07:19
Amazon data centers in the UAE and
00:07:22
Bahrain were damaged in drone strikes
00:07:24
and Iran has been threatening to attack
00:07:25
US companies in the Middle East. I don't
00:07:28
know what to say here. What a mess. He
00:07:29
just can't like get himself out of this
00:07:32
situation since these people aren't
00:07:33
budging. even if they're on their back
00:07:35
foot, they're still have advantage in a
00:07:37
very in a weird way the way Ukraine does
00:07:39
with Russia in in you know it's very
00:07:42
hard to unseat them.
00:07:44
So I actually think the illuminating
00:07:46
analogy here is the WGA strike and that
00:07:50
is key. Robert McNamera um said this
00:07:53
back in the Vietnam War that to to
00:07:56
defeat an enemy you have to really
00:07:57
understand them and also you have to
00:07:59
understand the incentives at play. And
00:08:02
so going back to the WGA strike, they
00:08:04
said, "All right, we're going to shut
00:08:05
we're going to go on strike, which means
00:08:06
your ability to create content has been
00:08:10
cut off." But what they didn't realize
00:08:12
is the most powerful person on the other
00:08:14
side of the table was Netflix. And
00:08:16
Netflix could look around and say,
00:08:17
"Okay,
00:08:19
our queue, you know, people's playlist
00:08:21
is 2 or 3 years deep. I could watch
00:08:23
Netflix for the next two or three years
00:08:25
and still not get through my playlist."
00:08:27
linear TV, especially late night TV,
00:08:29
which people tune in every night.
00:08:31
They're not interested in
00:08:33
watching Jimmy Kimmel run down the day
00:08:35
news from two years ago. The other
00:08:37
streaming networks who had not been
00:08:38
spending $18 billion a year, who had
00:08:40
spent 102 billion a year, their pool was
00:08:42
really shallow. So, the most powerful
00:08:44
person on the other side of the table
00:08:46
had an incentive to not come to an
00:08:48
agreement. And the WGA never recognized
00:08:51
that they were negotiating against
00:08:53
themselves because the the other side
00:08:55
would pretend to care and not offend
00:08:57
anybody and make sure the strike went on
00:08:59
for as long as possible to seed
00:09:01
advantage to Netflix as everybody else.
00:09:04
All that happened coming out of that
00:09:06
that strike was the most powerful player
00:09:07
on the other side of the table garnered
00:09:10
and registered additional value. And
00:09:13
this is exactly what's going on here.
00:09:15
And to a certain extent, JD Vance would
00:09:17
they poured honey on them and send them
00:09:18
hunting for bears because the reality is
00:09:20
the incentive was to draw out the talks
00:09:22
for two or 3 weeks
00:09:25
have an opportunity to maybe rearm
00:09:27
regroup your missile launch capability,
00:09:29
lay some more mines in the straight of
00:09:30
Hormuz. But their incentive is for this
00:09:34
thing to go longer because they have
00:09:35
stumbled upon visav our in are up your
00:09:40
ass strategic planning around not going
00:09:42
in with allies around not securing the
00:09:44
straight of horn moves before military
00:09:46
action but no goals not not enabling and
00:09:50
coordinating with our Gulf allies. Iran
00:09:52
Iran has we have given Iran something
00:09:54
that quite frankly is probably
00:09:58
more dangerous and effective than
00:10:00
enriched uranium and that is their
00:10:02
ability to put a strangle hold on a
00:10:05
chokeold of the global economy called
00:10:06
the strait. So they have an incentive
00:10:10
for this to go longer. Right now the
00:10:12
IRGC looks to be gaining strength, not
00:10:15
losing it through this. They have shown
00:10:17
an ability to resist or survive this
00:10:19
type of military action and they have
00:10:22
stumbled upon a choke point which has
00:10:24
given them unbelievable political
00:10:26
>> they had but didn't think they had
00:10:27
before. This is it's a really and sort
00:10:29
of Trump's like don't block that
00:10:31
straight and it'll be interesting with
00:10:33
US ships there now. This could be an an
00:10:37
economic way to squeeze them, which is
00:10:39
important, I think, as always.
00:10:42
>> Um, but it puts like I'm like a ship is
00:10:45
there. Oh my god, a drone, a speedboat
00:10:47
coming towards it. You just feel like
00:10:49
they're we're kind of big and right out
00:10:51
there. So open for attack in a way that
00:10:54
they don't have to do much to really
00:10:57
create a problem for all of us, right?
00:10:59
So that's 15 ships sitting there like,
00:11:02
"Oh geez, this guy, this is a guy who
00:11:05
govern who who campaigned on America
00:11:07
first and not this." So I think it would
00:11:09
only hurt his political standing here
00:11:12
and at the same time make him crazier
00:11:14
than ever when they don't behave, which
00:11:16
they don't want. They don't have to
00:11:17
behave and it's their it's, you know,
00:11:20
they have the I guess they have the home
00:11:22
advantage in some weird way compared
00:11:24
unless we really want to commit troops.
00:11:26
I can't I can't imagine being I don't
00:11:28
have sympathy for JD Vance because I
00:11:30
think he's the cyber truck of
00:11:31
politicians but he they really put him
00:11:35
like in a situation and he was not going
00:11:37
to succeed in these talks and he also
00:11:39
sent him you know failed venture
00:11:42
capitalist with two real estate people
00:11:44
and then apparently the guy who's
00:11:46
leading I was reading David Ignatius's
00:11:47
column and I'm going to mispronounce his
00:11:49
name so I'm not going to leading it is
00:11:51
one of the possible candidates to run
00:11:52
Iran at some point very very worldly
00:11:55
person high level on every ad. They sent
00:11:58
apparently their best people and we sent
00:12:00
them which is like I know we probably
00:12:03
sent experts with them too, but it's not
00:12:05
like we aren't showing our finest
00:12:07
diplomatic
00:12:08
showing if we're going to have any
00:12:10
serious if maybe maybe he doesn't and
00:12:12
he's like I don't care if it works or
00:12:13
not. That's not some messaging from the
00:12:15
president you like to hear. I don't
00:12:17
know. He just keeps stepping in it
00:12:18
because he's old. The majority of
00:12:20
battles are won before anyone steps on
00:12:22
the field and that is their supply
00:12:23
chain, their strength, their military,
00:12:26
their brute force advantage. This
00:12:27
negotiation was over before it started
00:12:29
because one group showed up with with
00:12:31
incentives to not negotiate or to extend
00:12:34
the negotiations to rearm but not to
00:12:36
come to an agreement. Now having said
00:12:38
that to be fair this is in my view the
00:12:41
exact right move given where we are
00:12:42
right now and that is that we block the
00:12:45
straight of Hormuz from any Iranian
00:12:47
ports because that will bring European
00:12:49
allies and China to the table who quite
00:12:52
frankly
00:12:53
>> who who have more to lose than we do now
00:12:56
this notion of we broke it you fix it
00:12:59
diminishes our credibility globally for
00:13:01
a long time but something we have taken
00:13:03
for granted
00:13:04
>> like a lot of things we've taken for
00:13:06
granted that to took huge sacrifice,
00:13:08
huge resources, a lot of brave patriots
00:13:11
from around the world giving their lives
00:13:13
such that we can enjoy these things. One
00:13:15
of those things is the freedom of
00:13:17
maritime navigation. And that is
00:13:19
Singapore has decided not to sequester
00:13:22
and block and control the straits of
00:13:24
Singapore. And if you if you start
00:13:27
blocking straits through the fear of
00:13:29
military action such that no will ensure
00:13:32
the hundred or $200 million of cargo
00:13:34
that straight is blocked off. So
00:13:37
everybody especially the Gulf players
00:13:40
and most especially Russia, Iran and
00:13:43
China have a vested interest in the
00:13:46
Straight of Hormuz being open for their
00:13:48
ships. So America and I think this is
00:13:50
the right move have said okay
00:13:52
>> yeah many Ignatius thought so too. But
00:13:54
here's the thing. I just these little
00:13:56
drones and these little boats, I feel
00:13:58
like 15 US warships. Yikes. I just feel
00:14:01
like we are putting ourselves way out
00:14:04
there and unnecessarily
00:14:06
now that this is our only choice. That's
00:14:08
the problem. I think we, let's be clear,
00:14:12
not going to Congress, not enlisting
00:14:14
Gulf allies, not enlisting European
00:14:16
allies, not having a a clear exit
00:14:19
strategy after certain military
00:14:21
objectives were met or not met has put
00:14:24
us in the definition of a quagmire. But
00:14:26
right now, they have to say to to China
00:14:28
and Iran, we're going to create an
00:14:30
incentive for you to make sure that the
00:14:32
straight is open. and a multinational
00:14:34
force that keep keeps the straight open
00:14:38
to everyone's benefit that is job that
00:14:41
is objectives one
00:14:44
here no one wants to help Trump because
00:14:46
he's not Jesus um but like speaking of
00:14:48
the sad situation for JD Vance by the
00:14:51
way JD Vance happens to be Catholic so
00:14:53
that's even better uh and he failed in
00:14:55
Iran which I think everyone expected
00:14:58
despite some lastminute campaigning from
00:14:59
him as well as Trump's endorsement
00:15:01
Hungarian Prime Minister Victor Orban
00:15:04
has been ousted after 16 years in power.
00:15:07
Not a good sign for the Trump people.
00:15:08
Orban conceded defeat in the country's
00:15:11
general election on Sunday, saying the
00:15:12
results are painful but unequivocal. His
00:15:15
opponent, Peter Maguar, called the
00:15:17
election a miracle, telling supporters
00:15:18
that we have liberated Hungary and have
00:15:20
taken back our country. By the way,
00:15:21
Magar was a loyalist of Orban and just
00:15:24
broke with him over a pardon. Um, and so
00:15:27
he it's like as if a rhino Republican
00:15:30
won essentially. He's not, you know, Mr.
00:15:32
or liberal in any way. More than 77% of
00:15:35
registered voters cast ballots. Amazing.
00:15:37
The highest turnout in a Hungarian
00:15:38
election since the fall of communism.
00:15:41
You know, it's a really interesting
00:15:42
winner. Obviously, he's super handsome
00:15:44
and kind of sexy and everything else,
00:15:46
but he's not he's not as liberal as you
00:15:49
think. Let's just be clear. Um, and he
00:15:51
also was an Orban uh in the Orban
00:15:53
University. He switched parties, but
00:15:55
again, it's very much like, oh, who who
00:15:57
has switched? I don't know. George
00:15:59
Conway becoming the president. You know
00:16:00
what I mean? someone who was
00:16:02
conservative and now is it looks as if
00:16:05
he's not. Um, so and and George can be
00:16:07
conservative and liberal and different
00:16:09
things, but he's also running for
00:16:12
Congress, by the way, but it's like
00:16:13
that. Is this an indicator of a larger
00:16:15
move away from the far right? I mean,
00:16:16
obviously Democrats can learn a lot. Um,
00:16:19
but this is a little different in in
00:16:21
Hungary, but it is a it's the end of an
00:16:23
era. And JD Vance and Trump hugged bear
00:16:26
hugged Orban. So, and so did uh Tucker
00:16:29
Carlson. So did um Elon Musk, that whole
00:16:33
gang did also. Thoughts
00:16:35
>> since the US's decision to bomb Iran or
00:16:38
increase whatever you want to call it,
00:16:40
increase the military escalation or some
00:16:42
people would call it a new war. This is
00:16:44
the biggest thing that's happened in the
00:16:45
last month. This is Europe uh and a key
00:16:49
component and a healthy important
00:16:51
powerful economy saying rejecting the
00:16:54
movement to the far right. He said nice
00:16:56
things about said he hopes the UK
00:16:58
rejoins the European Union. It is a huge
00:17:00
win for UK the for Ukraine. They are
00:17:03
pro- Ukraine and it is a huge defeat for
00:17:06
Russia that was hoping to turn Orban and
00:17:09
Hungary into a Russian satellite. Orban
00:17:12
was the friction that way.
00:17:14
>> Orban was the friction in more European
00:17:16
aid and support of Ukraine. It says
00:17:19
something. It was symbolic that JD Vance
00:17:22
went over there and after going over
00:17:24
Orban's popularity actually went down.
00:17:28
>> But something even more important or I
00:17:30
would argue more important happened.
00:17:31
>> The people
00:17:33
>> they had the the largest turnout in the
00:17:36
history of Hungary. More a much greater
00:17:38
percentage of Hungarians voted than have
00:17:41
ever voted in a US election. There were
00:17:43
people singing in the metro. There were
00:17:45
people laughing and crying. This was
00:17:48
this was really a wonderful moment for
00:17:51
the West. And that's still not the best
00:17:52
thing that happened here. The best thing
00:17:54
that happened and it's a real testament
00:17:58
to Victor Orban was he conceded the
00:18:02
election.
00:18:04
He said he he he thanked his people. He
00:18:07
talked about Hungary and he conceded the
00:18:11
election. And when I saw three judges
00:18:14
who were being seeking Senate approval
00:18:17
to become judges, and all three of those
00:18:20
[ __ ] and when I say [ __ ] I mean
00:18:22
someone who has a low character. I use
00:18:23
it as an androgynous comment, refused to
00:18:26
acknowledge that Biden had won the 2020
00:18:29
election. Victor Orban has greater
00:18:31
character now than many of our
00:18:33
Republican- elected officials. If you do
00:18:36
not concede elections, the very basis,
00:18:39
the very foundation of democracy does
00:18:41
not exist. And a right-wing, some people
00:18:45
would call fascist in Eastern Europe had
00:18:48
the decency and the character to concede
00:18:51
the election.
00:18:52
>> Yep. Absolutely. I mean, he's a, you
00:18:54
know, it'll be interesting to see what
00:18:55
he does next. He'll probably become a
00:18:57
right-wing figure, but it seems like
00:18:58
right-wingery is sort of on the way out.
00:19:00
This guy is a dressed up version of a
00:19:02
conservative for sure, but at the same
00:19:04
time he was, as you said, back in
00:19:06
Ukraine, was not a satellite of Russia.
00:19:08
Let's hope he, you know, he certainly
00:19:10
looks great. I know it's say he's he
00:19:11
seems young and vibrant. Orbin seems old
00:19:13
and corrupt essentially. And so it'll be
00:19:16
interesting to see which way he goes,
00:19:17
how he deals with, well, Trump's, I
00:19:19
think Trump is a past tense figure at
00:19:21
this point for a lot of these leaders,
00:19:23
whoever it happens to be. Um, but it's
00:19:25
really is interesting. And you're right,
00:19:27
this country looked like when I saw all
00:19:29
those crowds, all those people, I was
00:19:31
like, "Oh, this guy's absolute toast in
00:19:34
the way people are handling it." And
00:19:36
they just they just were sick and tired
00:19:38
of corruption and fascism. And this this
00:19:40
is a country which has suffered at the
00:19:42
hands of fascists and different
00:19:44
difficult uh leaders for a long time.
00:19:46
So, what's our excuse? That's what I
00:19:48
say. Um anyway, let's take a quick
00:19:51
break. When we come back, Eric Swallwell
00:19:53
ends his campaign for governor of
00:19:54
California. What a mess.
00:19:56
>> Support for this show comes from
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00:21:05
Scott, we're back. Representative Eric
00:21:07
Swallwell of California says he is
00:21:10
resigning from Congress and has
00:21:12
suspended his campaign already for
00:21:14
California governor amid multiple
00:21:17
allegations of rape, sexual assault, and
00:21:19
misconduct. In a post on X, Wall said he
00:21:22
is quote deeply sorry for mistakes in
00:21:25
judgment I've made in my past and said
00:21:27
he would fight the quote false
00:21:29
allegations unquote. The allegations
00:21:31
triggered swift political fallout with
00:21:33
Swallwell losing nearly all of his
00:21:35
endorsements within 24 hours. The
00:21:38
governor's race remains crowded with
00:21:40
other leading Democrats being
00:21:42
billionaire Tommy Styer and former
00:21:44
representative Katie Porter. Just so
00:21:46
you're clear, this was started online by
00:21:48
someone named Miss Frazzled um who was
00:21:51
who had done a interview with Swallwell
00:21:53
and then had gotten a lot of incoming
00:21:55
about his behavior which is was very
00:21:57
well known across the spectrum. I did
00:22:00
not. But I I I think a lot of people
00:22:02
within politics knew about him the same
00:22:04
way I think many people knew about
00:22:06
Gonzalez. Like there's there's a lot of
00:22:08
men in politics that people know their
00:22:12
behavior. And I think this was pretty
00:22:13
well known, which is incredible that he
00:22:16
he walked into this um race with a bomb
00:22:19
strapped to his chest. He had to have
00:22:21
known. Or maybe he doesn't think he did
00:22:23
anything. That's what he seems to do. So
00:22:25
any thoughts on this? You could often
00:22:27
you could possibly see Kla Harris come
00:22:29
back in. I don't know. I don't I don't
00:22:31
What do you think about this? Steve
00:22:33
Hilton was ahead, just so you know. What
00:22:35
do you think's going to happen here?
00:22:36
>> Well, there's two things and that is its
00:22:38
impacts its impact on the governor's
00:22:40
race and then what this says about the
00:22:41
dynamic of of potential or accusations
00:22:45
of misconduct and how we're supposed to
00:22:47
evaluate that. So, I'll go in that
00:22:49
order. Uh I think this probably is going
00:22:52
to make Tom Star governor. I think that
00:22:55
California is still a heavily Democratic
00:22:57
state. I think if if the Democratic
00:23:00
if the Democrats consolidate to one or
00:23:03
two leaders and that person gets into
00:23:04
the general after the jungle primary,
00:23:07
what do you call I think the Democrat's
00:23:08
going to win and I think Starr has the
00:23:09
money. I think the next shoe to drop, I
00:23:11
think Speaker Pelosi was waiting till
00:23:14
there was some something resembling an
00:23:16
emerging leader here. I think it's Tom
00:23:18
Starr. I think she will endorse him. I
00:23:19
think he will
00:23:20
>> Roana already has. So is Gene Fonda,
00:23:22
interestingly. I think he will be one of
00:23:24
the two top candidates. He has the
00:23:26
money. The unions don't like him, but
00:23:28
money is more important than unions even
00:23:29
in California. I think I think with with
00:23:32
Swallwell dropping out in a
00:23:33
consolidation across the Democrats, I
00:23:36
think this is probably the moment that
00:23:37
we'll look back on and say this is how
00:23:39
Styer became governor. Now,
00:23:41
>> to the second issue, and we face this
00:23:44
all the time on boards.
00:23:46
>> When a senior level person has sex with
00:23:48
somebody and then that person accuses
00:23:50
them of harassment or conduct, sometimes
00:23:52
they're [ __ ] cases and
00:23:54
opportunistic. Other times there's a
00:23:56
power imbalance that the person takes
00:23:58
advantage of. My view on this [ __ ] is
00:24:00
the following. We We're not here and I
00:24:03
hate the Democratic Party for having
00:24:05
purity tests around people having sex. I
00:24:07
think when when Al Franken or whoever
00:24:11
gets run out of run out of dodge such
00:24:13
that Chris and Jill can have
00:24:14
>> terrible but go ahead
00:24:15
>> can have a sevenminute run for
00:24:17
presidency or people have extrammarital
00:24:19
affairs that in my view you know okay be
00:24:24
careful who you judge on this [ __ ] but
00:24:26
if you are and this is true on boards if
00:24:29
you once you are above a certain level
00:24:31
of power as a general not a general as a
00:24:35
red line you [ __ ] anybody who works
00:24:37
here, you're out. It creates too much
00:24:41
risk. So for me, the question is I if if
00:24:44
law enforcement needs to get involved
00:24:45
and decide if there was a crime here,
00:24:47
and sexual assault is obviously a very
00:24:48
serious crime,
00:24:49
>> needs to be investigated,
00:24:50
>> then have it investigated. But before
00:24:52
that even happens, if it's did you have
00:24:54
sex with a staffer as an elected
00:24:56
representative, if the answer is yes,
00:24:59
then you are out. If you're the
00:25:02
Secretary of Homeland Security and
00:25:04
you're [ __ ] your number two, then you
00:25:06
are out. If you're the attorney general
00:25:08
in Georgia investigating an important
00:25:11
case against the president and you are
00:25:12
[ __ ] your number two, then you are
00:25:15
out. The staffers are there to [ __ ] each
00:25:18
other, not the elected representative
00:25:19
who has power over them because all
00:25:21
you're doing is injecting risk into the
00:25:23
entire organization and there is a power
00:25:26
imbalance. So whether or not he's guilty
00:25:28
of sexual assault, the crime, the legal
00:25:31
authorities should investigate that. But
00:25:33
he should be out before that if he was
00:25:36
engaging in sexual relationships with
00:25:38
the staffers. There needs to be a clear
00:25:41
line here. There's too much of a power
00:25:43
imbalance.
00:25:44
>> What's interesting is how many people
00:25:46
knew about it, right? He's texted me to
00:25:48
he's wanted to come on the podcast and I
00:25:50
wrote back. I'm like, I'm waiting until
00:25:51
there's two left and then I'll think
00:25:53
about who we're going to, you know, I
00:25:54
think there's there was so many people
00:25:56
in this jungle
00:25:57
>> primary teams with us trying to get on.
00:25:59
>> Yeah, exactly. They were all every one
00:26:01
of them, every every candidate in
00:26:02
primaries, whether it's Iowa or Texas or
00:26:05
wherever, they're all trying to get on
00:26:06
these things. But I was like, well,
00:26:08
let's just wait till there's two, which
00:26:09
is what I told him. Um, but I did I did
00:26:13
think I was surprised to find out. And
00:26:15
by the way, kudos to the people online
00:26:18
who actually handled it rather well. It
00:26:20
was it was until nobody no credible
00:26:23
journalist from a major media
00:26:25
organization would look into it. Now, it
00:26:27
was broken. It was broken online by this
00:26:29
Miss Frazzled who did had done an
00:26:31
interview with him and then had a lot of
00:26:33
incoming. But she covers education. Like
00:26:36
that's the thing. And and I think a lot
00:26:38
of the political reporters had some
00:26:40
sense of this from what I could
00:26:41
understand. Um but it was broken by the
00:26:44
Chronicle and CNN. Um Pam Brown did a
00:26:47
report on it. I was sort of flumxed by
00:26:51
one, why would you run when this many
00:26:54
things were you would be aware of things
00:26:57
you did and then two why nobody in media
00:26:59
had started to look at it because same
00:27:01
thing with Tony Gonzalez too like a lot
00:27:04
of the and there's more than that in
00:27:05
Congress that I don't think that you
00:27:07
should be on a hunt for this stuff
00:27:09
necessarily but this was really well
00:27:11
known now in hindsight like I think it
00:27:14
was kind of healthy for the Democratic
00:27:16
party to speak out right to like people
00:27:19
to even if they were friends with him or
00:27:22
had endorsed him. I thought that was
00:27:24
relatively healthy response from the
00:27:26
Democratic party for lots of reasons and
00:27:29
there should be an investigation. That's
00:27:30
exactly what every single party in this
00:27:33
deserves and the public should expect.
00:27:35
And that that that was the only part I
00:27:37
was sort of like really it was I mean I
00:27:39
had no I I was s not surp I guess I'm
00:27:43
not surprised any time by anything but I
00:27:45
was amazed by how many people within
00:27:47
these parties both of them know this
00:27:50
stuff pretty well. That always surprises
00:27:53
me. I don't know about you.
00:27:54
>> Look I think we need I mean there's just
00:27:57
need structural reform or this will
00:27:59
continue to happen. We need Citizens
00:28:00
United to go away. We need Jeremy to go
00:28:02
away. We need to pay representative
00:28:05
Swallwell and the other representatives
00:28:08
five to ten times more than they're
00:28:09
getting paid now such that they can do
00:28:11
their job and not have to compromise
00:28:13
themselves and start trading stocks. I
00:28:16
heard Ro Connell, one of my heroes, is
00:28:18
actually outperforming the S&P all of a
00:28:20
sudden. We need structural reform and
00:28:23
part of that structural reform is very
00:28:25
clear lines. And that is if you are a
00:28:27
powerful senator or congressperson, the
00:28:30
moment someone comes to work,
00:28:31
>> say any, not powerful, any
00:28:33
>> any 100% any any person elected to
00:28:36
federal office,
00:28:38
it's awesome to be you. You're going to
00:28:40
go, you have the best rap at a bar. What
00:28:43
do you do? Oh, I'm the I'm the elected
00:28:45
congressperson from the great state of
00:28:47
California. Wow, I would really like to
00:28:49
have sex with you.
00:28:52
Wow. You sir, we'll we'll find a
00:28:55
reservation for you. Sir, let us escort
00:28:57
you to your plane and circumvent
00:28:59
security. Sir, let us be let can you be
00:29:02
our honored guest? Can you be the
00:29:04
commencement speaker at your former high
00:29:05
school? It is awesome to be an elected
00:29:09
federal official. One of the few
00:29:12
downsides is that anyone who works for
00:29:15
you that you have power over their
00:29:18
livelihood, you cannot have sex with.
00:29:22
Simple, cut and dry. No story, no
00:29:25
context dependent. If you decide you
00:29:27
have feelings for each other, then one
00:29:29
of you needs to resign and pursue the
00:29:31
relationship because it creates way too
00:29:35
much risk, distraction from the
00:29:38
important work they do. And guess what?
00:29:40
I I'm sympathetic. And by the I don't
00:29:42
I'm not one of these people that doesn't
00:29:43
believe in intraoffice romance. If you
00:29:46
get a bunch of people in a close and
00:29:47
tense environment, they're going to
00:29:48
start having sex. It's the senior level
00:29:51
people that have power that don't get to
00:29:53
do it. The young people have at it. As
00:29:55
long as it's consensual, as long as no
00:29:58
one feels pressured, that's what young
00:30:00
people are supposed to be doing.
00:30:01
>> This case has more than that. This is
00:30:03
not just
00:30:03
>> that's not this. I agree with you.
00:30:05
>> Right. So, I mean, that's an that's it's
00:30:07
it's a problem for him. Let's have some
00:30:09
common sense laws. Yeah.
00:30:11
>> Or common sense norms and standards. All
00:30:14
right.
00:30:14
>> When you have this kind of power
00:30:17
imbalance, you are injecting risk and
00:30:20
your fly is up and locked. You take it
00:30:22
off campus. You want to have
00:30:24
extrammarital affairs. You want to have
00:30:25
orgies. You want to have sex with people
00:30:27
the same sex as you while passing anti-
00:30:30
or homophobic laws. Fine. It's a it's a
00:30:33
lack of character, but you don't get
00:30:34
expelled from Congress. You abuse your
00:30:37
power dynamic and inject the entire
00:30:39
office to risk. You're out. Make it
00:30:42
simpler for them. No gray area,
00:30:44
>> I guess. I don't know. We'll see what
00:30:46
happens here. It's not a great story.
00:30:48
Anyway, Treasury Secretary Scott Bessant
00:30:50
met with the country's top bank
00:30:51
executives last week along with Fed
00:30:53
Chair Jerome Powell, warning them about
00:30:55
Anthropic's new Mythos model. Bessent
00:30:58
raised concerns about cyber security,
00:30:59
making sure banks are aware of the risk,
00:31:01
taking precautions. Anthropic itself has
00:31:03
been sounding the alarm saying mythos is
00:31:05
so powerful uh it's potentially danger
00:31:07
it's not been released to the public
00:31:08
yet. Instead they're keeping it to a
00:31:10
small group of companies to test to find
00:31:11
v it finds vulnerabilities in all manner
00:31:14
of places. This Bessant meeting appears
00:31:16
to be separate from the Pentagon's clash
00:31:18
with anthropic which is still playing
00:31:19
out in court. Um, you know, this is
00:31:22
really a problem where the as these as
00:31:26
these models continue to evolve in terms
00:31:29
of uh staying too far ahead of the
00:31:31
defense. The offense is much stronger
00:31:34
than the defense. Um, and of course,
00:31:36
Bessant uh is talking to banks about
00:31:38
using it, but also at the same time
00:31:40
using it to protect themselves. What a
00:31:42
mess. What a mess. Another mess.
00:31:45
>> Yeah. I don't have a I find that the
00:31:48
worst thing to do right now is to be a
00:31:50
cabinet memory going on and trying to
00:31:52
trying to defend these policies. I don't
00:31:56
I
00:31:57
>> I think it is the government's interest
00:31:58
to help companies figure out as these
00:32:01
see one might start to regulate these
00:32:03
things in terms of the way we do
00:32:05
everything else nuclear arms etc etc
00:32:08
development of of important technologies
00:32:11
and if it's going to be dangerous to
00:32:12
companies and let everyone in the back
00:32:14
and take everybody's money it seems I
00:32:16
don't know B I mean Bessence is doing
00:32:19
the right thing here but it's just
00:32:20
ridiculous that they have that the
00:32:22
Pentagon is then mooring with Anthropic
00:32:24
which came forward which companies
00:32:26
usually don't in this case. Often
00:32:27
companies keep it to themselves until a
00:32:29
disaster. All right, Scott, let's go on
00:32:31
a quick break. When we come back, Sam
00:32:32
Alton's home gets targeted in multiple
00:32:35
attacks.
00:32:36
>> Support for the show comes from
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out there, the ones whose job is to help
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All investing is subject to risk.
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distributor.
00:33:32
Scott, we're back with more news. Sam
00:33:33
Alman's home was targeted twice over the
00:33:35
weekend. Once with a suspect throwing a
00:33:37
Molotov cocktail and the second time
00:33:38
with a car stopping, firing a gun at the
00:33:40
residence. Lives in San Francisco. The
00:33:42
subject in the first suspect in the
00:33:44
first attack was later found at the Open
00:33:46
AI headquarters threatening to burn down
00:33:48
the building. Probably has some mental
00:33:50
problems. Sam Alman responded to the
00:33:52
first attack in a blog post saying he
00:33:53
emphasized with anti-technology
00:33:55
sentiments and clearly technology isn't
00:33:57
always good for everyone. In the post,
00:33:59
Sam Alman noted that the incident came a
00:34:02
few days after an incendiary article was
00:34:04
published about him and the New Yorker
00:34:06
raising questions about his
00:34:07
trustworthiness. He shouldn't blame the
00:34:08
article. It was an excellent article by
00:34:11
uh Ronan Pharaoh. that's not what caused
00:34:12
it. Uh but nearly a third of young
00:34:14
adults say AI makes them angry. These
00:34:16
are new polls. Um you know this is
00:34:18
unfortunately where it leads these and
00:34:20
and to blame using the word incendiary
00:34:23
was really unfortunate on Alman's
00:34:25
behalf. Um but there is you know this is
00:34:29
I hate to blame someone for what's
00:34:30
happening here because anyone that uses
00:34:32
violence is should be widely derided um
00:34:35
by everybody. But it still is this is
00:34:38
how it goes. I used to say this to them.
00:34:40
If you don't if you don't do something
00:34:41
about this, you're going to have to
00:34:42
armor plate your tester unfortunately
00:34:44
cuz people start to get really
00:34:48
pro violent is what where it often leads
00:34:51
to. Your thoughts?
00:34:53
>> I just think there I mean speaking of
00:34:56
red lines here, we just can't we can't
00:34:59
in any way justify we have to move
00:35:01
swiftly against any violence against any
00:35:03
citizen. And
00:35:05
>> you know I'm not a fan of Sam Alman. I
00:35:07
think big tech has done tremendous
00:35:08
damage and these CEOs have done
00:35:10
tremendous damage to the United States
00:35:13
and most importantly to our youth
00:35:15
ripping at the fabric of America. We
00:35:17
have to have zero tolerance for violence
00:35:19
against them in any fashion. And um you
00:35:23
know I don't like Sam Alman. I I think
00:35:25
he's I I we were talking about this off
00:35:27
mic earlier when you were on my podcast.
00:35:29
I think there are few people who have
00:35:31
seen such a 180 in their brand in such a
00:35:33
short side of uh span of time.
00:35:36
Effectively the brand march of tech
00:35:38
executives is they're very likable.
00:35:40
They're very charming. We need to do
00:35:42
better. She should run for president.
00:35:44
Oh, I love her book. Lean in. And then
00:35:46
over time we find out that they make a
00:35:48
bunch of incremental decisions that are
00:35:49
bad for America such that they can get
00:35:51
richer and richer and eventually they
00:35:53
turn into a bond villain. That march is
00:35:54
usually about a 7 to 10 year march. For
00:35:57
Sam Alman was 18 months. Remember Sam
00:35:59
was the more thoughtful guy with the
00:36:01
hush tones like
00:36:03
>> there are really really we are very
00:36:05
concerned about some of the implications
00:36:07
of AI and we need oh senator I don't I
00:36:10
don't own any now but go ahead
00:36:12
>> I don't own any equity in yeah
00:36:14
>> in open AI oh what a guy this nice young
00:36:17
gay man in t-shirts who seems to be the
00:36:20
caring tech CEO okay I just want to go
00:36:23
on record of saying this guy's going to
00:36:25
this guy will say say or do anything to
00:36:27
make more money That's why they go into
00:36:29
this business. There are easier ways to
00:36:31
find self-satisfaction than running a
00:36:34
tech company right now. You're there for
00:36:36
the money. You get tremendous pressure
00:36:38
and obligation to represent your
00:36:39
shareholders. You want to win. It is a
00:36:42
thunderdome. It is easy to understand
00:36:43
why they get there. The real failure is
00:36:45
there's abs fuckingutely no regulation
00:36:47
on these individuals. And so when people
00:36:51
start coming at them, like I don't like
00:36:54
it when people start yelling insults
00:36:56
verbally at JD Vance. I I think there
00:36:59
has to be a level of civility and safety
00:37:01
such that we work things out at a
00:37:02
government level. And I know there's a
00:37:04
lot of people who disagree with my views
00:37:06
on Israel. People don't assault me
00:37:08
verbally on the street. I feel like I'm
00:37:12
poking the bear here. I think it's
00:37:14
important. I saw Senator John Ton in
00:37:16
Nantucket. I went up to him and I
00:37:18
thanked him for his service. I don't
00:37:20
agree. I disagree with almost everything
00:37:22
he does and I immediately disclosed I'm
00:37:24
a Democrat, but I said we're both
00:37:26
Americans. I we one of the hallmarks of
00:37:30
a progressive society that we all want
00:37:32
to live in is we recognize we're all
00:37:34
Americans and as long as we're operating
00:37:36
with the within the confines of the law,
00:37:38
which quite frankly Sam Alman is, and
00:37:39
that's the problem is there aren't any
00:37:41
laws,
00:37:42
>> he deserves to live
00:37:44
>> in peace and safety.
00:37:46
>> Yeah. Let me say he shouldn't have
00:37:47
blamed the article for it. This was a
00:37:49
rarely well-reported article. It did
00:37:50
not. Suddenly people don't hate Sam
00:37:52
Alman because of this article. They have
00:37:54
these feelings and unstable people act
00:37:56
on them because of a perceived uh
00:37:59
rapaciousness by tech companies. And so
00:38:01
>> it's probably a mentally ill young man.
00:38:03
>> That's correct. That's
00:38:04
>> who read about Sam Alman.
00:38:06
>> Yeah.
00:38:06
>> You know the the guy who killed John.
00:38:09
Crazy people are drawn. They believe
00:38:11
that in a in a historic act of violence,
00:38:15
it will restore or give them social
00:38:18
capital. That's why they do it there. I
00:38:21
don't know anything about this
00:38:22
individual, but there's a very good
00:38:24
chance it's someone who's isolated and
00:38:26
is hoping to gain social capital through
00:38:29
what they see is a heroic act of
00:38:31
violence. And the FBI and our security
00:38:34
apparatus need need to ensure that that
00:38:38
famous people can walk the streets and
00:38:41
have some semblance. My old home I
00:38:43
bought a home in San Francisco
00:38:46
and I bought it for $720,000 and two
00:38:49
years later I wanted to move to New York
00:38:51
and I sold it for $950,000 and thought I
00:38:53
was a [ __ ] real estate genius. That
00:38:55
home ended up being next to the home
00:38:57
where ultimately it's no longer there
00:38:59
now. So, you don't need to look up the
00:39:00
address, but it ended up being the home
00:39:02
next to where Mark Zuckerberg lived in
00:39:04
San Francisco in the neighborhood you
00:39:05
live in.
00:39:05
>> My neighborhood.
00:39:06
>> And now my home
00:39:08
>> is where his security detail lived.
00:39:11
>> Oh, yeah.
00:39:11
>> Because he had they basically started
00:39:13
blocking off the block. So, after that
00:39:16
election in the Netherlands, and I love
00:39:17
this, the prime minister stepped down
00:39:20
and then got on his bike and rode away.
00:39:23
I mean, I'm like, they they win. They
00:39:26
win.
00:39:28
He doesn't need the beast. He He doesn't
00:39:30
need it. He doesn't need his kids
00:39:31
escorted to school.
00:39:33
>> I have been unfortunately seeing the the
00:39:36
need for it. They do need it. It's
00:39:38
really crazy. But one of the things was
00:39:40
I was like, we got to deal with what's
00:39:42
happening here. You're going to have
00:39:43
crazy people attracted to you. It's
00:39:45
going to happen because it's inevitable.
00:39:47
And with just the enormous wealth, the
00:39:49
same thing. It's really creates real
00:39:52
problems. But you should not. Whoever
00:39:53
did these things are considering it. We
00:39:55
you are horrible people to that's how
00:39:57
you you deal with problems. There's lots
00:39:59
of ways to deal with problems and even
00:40:00
if you feel desperate you should seek
00:40:02
help.
00:40:03
>> The anger needs to be funneled towards
00:40:06
the ballot booth.
00:40:07
>> That's right.
00:40:08
>> And that is I need people who will keep
00:40:11
these people in check. I need people
00:40:13
that when Jeff Bezos or or Elon Musk
00:40:17
peace out to Florida and Texas that
00:40:19
there are elected representatives who
00:40:21
will figure out a way to tax the
00:40:22
earnings they accreted from the great
00:40:24
states of Washington and from
00:40:26
California. I need people who will
00:40:29
ensure that social media is gated. There
00:40:32
is no reason people under the age of 16.
00:40:34
But be clear folks, if you're waiting on
00:40:35
the better angels or these tech
00:40:37
executives to show up, don't hold your
00:40:38
breath. And then when they take
00:40:40
advantage of the system and it create
00:40:42
massive wealth,
00:40:44
>> that is not a cause for violence.
00:40:46
>> We do have to acknowledge there is an
00:40:47
huge I get yelled at for not stopping
00:40:50
Elon Musk before and I I I get like more
00:40:53
than yelled at like threatened. So I
00:40:55
don't know what to say. It's not the way
00:40:56
to handle these things. Anyway, uh
00:40:59
lastly, a quick grabag of other topics
00:41:01
I'd like to hit. Over a thousand
00:41:03
Hollywood heavyweights have released a
00:41:04
letter opposing Paramount's acquisition
00:41:06
of Warner Brothers Discovery, saying the
00:41:07
deal would harm the industry. Paramount
00:41:09
uh responded to the letter by saying,
00:41:11
"We hear and understand the concerns of
00:41:13
some in our creative community have
00:41:14
raised and respect the commitment to
00:41:16
protecting and expanding creativity.
00:41:18
This transaction brings together um
00:41:20
uniquely brings together complimentary
00:41:22
strengths to create a company that can
00:41:23
greenlight more projects, back bold
00:41:25
ideas, support talent across multiple
00:41:27
stages of their careers, and bring
00:41:28
stories to audiences of truly global
00:41:30
scale while strengthening competition by
00:41:32
ensuring multiple scale players in
00:41:34
investing and creative talent." Uh he
00:41:37
they also said they're going to they
00:41:38
have they continue their commitment to
00:41:40
increasing output to a minimum of 30
00:41:42
high-quality feature films with full
00:41:44
theatrical releases, continuing to
00:41:46
license content and brands. Um and he
00:41:49
they said we understand the concerns.
00:41:51
We're going to do what we say. Scott and
00:41:53
I do not believe them, but they they're
00:41:55
reestablishing their commitment to it.
00:41:57
Reaction, where's this going? Also,
00:41:59
Europe is looking like it's going to
00:42:00
possibly block part of it. Slow going.
00:42:03
They'll eventually get it through. What
00:42:04
is the greatest movie of all time?
00:42:06
Obi-Wan Jedi Obi-Wan Kenobi feels a
00:42:08
disturbance in the forest cuz the planet
00:42:10
of Aldderon is killed by a space laser
00:42:12
and millions of people screamed. If this
00:42:14
deal goes through, you're going to hear
00:42:16
millions of people in the creative
00:42:17
community scream because this is going
00:42:19
to be the most destructive
00:42:21
uh force of human capital in the
00:42:24
creative community we've ever seen.
00:42:26
There is no way they can justify this
00:42:27
price if they don't implement the AI
00:42:30
that they believe will give them the
00:42:32
efficiencies they need to justify this
00:42:34
price. So, I've been saying this for 3
00:42:36
months. Why the where the [ __ ] are the
00:42:38
unions?
00:42:39
>> So, if
00:42:40
>> this should have gone the way they were
00:42:41
going to do it, which was spin off CNN
00:42:44
and spin off the studios and then maybe
00:42:47
do acquisitions of pieces of it that
00:42:49
made economic sense. This is
00:42:51
>> they're too [ __ ] late. Too [ __ ]
00:42:53
late.
00:42:53
>> This letter should have come out. They
00:42:55
should have said to Ellison and and also
00:42:58
the Gulf States and the people financing
00:43:00
this deal,
00:43:01
>> the day this goes through, you are not
00:43:03
going to get a single piece of content
00:43:05
made.
00:43:06
>> This is unworkable for us.
00:43:09
>> Yep. Yep. Absolutely. And next one. Elon
00:43:12
Musk gave $10 million to two major
00:43:14
Republican super PACs at the end of last
00:43:15
year according to campign finance
00:43:17
disclosure. Then the FDC investigated ad
00:43:19
firms that had steered clear of Twitter
00:43:21
as they are allowed to do and those firm
00:43:23
just settled to make it all go away. I
00:43:26
just this is rid he's been using the FCC
00:43:28
the FTC in all manner of ways including
00:43:31
Marco Rubio around the center for
00:43:33
countering digital hate in order to get
00:43:35
his beasts won that he can't win in
00:43:37
court. Uh and the FTC does this and
00:43:39
these firms finally just settled even
00:43:41
though it's within their right not to
00:43:42
not to advertise on a at a Nazi porn
00:43:45
bar. But quick thoughts.
00:43:48
>> This goes back to the same thing. That's
00:43:49
two things you need. You need structural
00:43:51
reform. He's allowed to do this. Until
00:43:53
we get rid of Citizens United,
00:43:54
billionaires are going to continue to
00:43:56
control more and more. Billionaires and
00:43:57
corporations are going to continue to to
00:44:00
leak or we're going to continue to leak
00:44:02
capital from labor and the middle class
00:44:04
and consumers to billionaires and
00:44:06
corporations because of their ability to
00:44:08
strategically weaponize government. 300
00:44:11
people now are responsible for a fifth
00:44:13
of all tax spending. And guess what?
00:44:15
They can deploy it wherever they need it
00:44:16
strategically. The best ROI in history.
00:44:19
I've said this personally. I give a
00:44:20
little bit of money to politicians. I'm
00:44:22
shocked. I don't mind that they're
00:44:24
[ __ ] What shocked me is what cheap
00:44:25
horses they are.
00:44:26
>> When I You don't expect the FTC and the
00:44:29
FCC.
00:44:29
>> I don't ask for anything. But my point
00:44:31
is,
00:44:31
>> but I'm saying usually those agencies
00:44:33
didn't do this and now they look this
00:44:36
has been going on for a while. These
00:44:38
guys are more brazen about it and quite
00:44:39
frankly more efficient about it. There
00:44:41
needs to be an absolute restriction.
00:44:43
Until Citizens United is overturned,
00:44:46
we're going to have more and more of
00:44:48
this. Also, until this this straight
00:44:51
corruption, it used to be more opaque.
00:44:55
But I'm I'm I've said if I had someone
00:44:58
in prison who I wanted out, I think for
00:45:01
between$1 and3 million through a third
00:45:03
party, I could get them out within 24
00:45:05
months.
00:45:06
>> Yeah. the head of the FTC and the head
00:45:07
of the FCC really are are are creatures
00:45:10
of these of Elon Musk essentially and
00:45:12
others. Um, and a federal judge has
00:45:15
dismissed President Trump's. He doesn't
00:45:17
always win $10 billion lawsuit against
00:45:18
the Wall Street Journal which claimed
00:45:20
the paper defamed Trump with a story
00:45:22
saying he had sent the birthday card to
00:45:23
Jeffrey Epstein. Uh, the courts keep
00:45:26
pushing back at Trump and all, you know,
00:45:28
in this case the journal fought as
00:45:29
opposed to CBS and settled or or other
00:45:33
other ABC CBS settled. So, uh, it looks
00:45:36
like the journal has the real victory
00:45:37
here. Um, you know, I think good thing.
00:45:40
I mean, what a stupid he does all these
00:45:42
stupid nuisance cases and loses them.
00:45:45
>> We've been really weak on government
00:45:46
corruption. The one the silver lining
00:45:50
here, the thing that's holding is first
00:45:52
amendment. It does feel like both Trump
00:45:54
appointees and appointees before Trump
00:45:56
are saying free free speech is paramount
00:45:59
and we're yeah, we're going to throw
00:46:01
this out. The problem is is enough suits
00:46:04
creates a chill. I was talking to a
00:46:05
producer of a of a very popular show and
00:46:07
they said, "We're checking everything
00:46:09
now, double, triple checking, and
00:46:11
occasionally when something's on the
00:46:12
margin, we don't print it cuz we're
00:46:14
we're freaked out." So, but it does
00:46:16
appear when they these things do go to
00:46:18
court, they are universally swatted
00:46:20
away.
00:46:21
>> Swatted away. Absolutely. Well, we'll
00:46:23
see where that goes. He doesn't have
00:46:24
much time. Trump does not have much
00:46:26
time. All right, Scott, one more quick
00:46:28
break. We'll be back for wins and fails.
00:46:31
Okay, Scott, let's hear some wins and
00:46:32
fails. Would you like to go first?
00:46:34
>> I'll go first. So, my win is Cara
00:46:36
Swisser Wants to Live Forever. I was
00:46:39
pleasantly surprised. I really shocked.
00:46:41
>> I I knew you would do a good job, but I
00:46:43
was really surprised, quite frankly, at
00:46:44
the production values. It feels
00:46:46
cinematic, the colors, the
00:46:47
cinematography.
00:46:49
>> It was It felt very rich, for lack of a
00:46:52
better word. It felt like an, you know
00:46:53
what I felt like? I thought that could
00:46:55
have easily been an original scripted
00:46:57
series on Apple TV. It felt very,
00:47:00
>> for lack of a better, just felt very
00:47:01
rich. So, congratulations. I I think
00:47:04
it's nice for you. I know you spent a
00:47:05
lot of time on it
00:47:07
>> and I really I've only seen the first
00:47:08
episode, but I really enjoyed it. Um,
00:47:11
>> and it airs Saturday night at 10:00.
00:47:13
When does it air?
00:47:14
>> 9. Saturday night at 9.
00:47:15
>> Unless JD Vance does
00:47:17
go every week.
00:47:19
>> That made me so happy.
00:47:20
>> I know it.
00:47:21
>> I'm like, "Oh my god." I turned it on. I
00:47:22
turned it on because I want I want you
00:47:24
to have good numbers. And And I turned
00:47:26
on both TVs. I don't know if they count
00:47:28
them twice. And then I see JD Vance. I'm
00:47:31
like, "This has to be." I'm like, "I'd
00:47:34
love to see Cara's face when she saw JD
00:47:35
Vance at her in her hour
00:47:37
>> slot." We laughed. You know, we had an
00:47:38
extra cop. We had a party. We were
00:47:40
having a party in DC. Tammy had it ran
00:47:42
it. Um, and we had a copy of the show,
00:47:45
so we were able to show it to people.
00:47:47
But first, we're like, "Oh, fuck." And
00:47:48
it just The thing is CNN had a picture
00:47:50
of a door. Did you see that? For an
00:47:52
hour. There was the door that JD Vance
00:47:55
was behind. And so it was just the door
00:47:58
>> where he came out and said, "We've got
00:47:59
nothing accomplished."
00:48:01
>> Yeah.
00:48:01
>> I know. Yeah.
00:48:02
>> Yeah. No. So that's my
00:48:04
>> Thank you, sweetie.
00:48:05
>> That's my win. My fail out. It's not
00:48:07
even a It's not even a fail. I have two
00:48:08
wins.
00:48:10
>> Look, the election in in Hungary is so
00:48:15
huge and so wonderful on a lot of
00:48:16
levels. But my win is Victor Orban. I I
00:48:19
I if a fascist who ruled for 16 years
00:48:24
can concede an election, so can we. So
00:48:28
can we. And think about what we have
00:48:30
done in this country. If you had a team,
00:48:33
a basketball team and a head coach and
00:48:35
they lost 68 to72 and then the head
00:48:38
coach refused to shake the hand, told
00:48:41
his team, "We won the game," told the
00:48:45
media we won the game, refused to show
00:48:47
up for the the medal ceremony or
00:48:49
whatever it was, would you decide to
00:48:51
make that guy the head of the league?
00:48:54
I if we can't have the peaceful transfer
00:48:57
of power, none of this other [ __ ]
00:49:00
matters. And Victor Orban, who I'm not a
00:49:03
fan of,
00:49:04
>> who I am not a fan of.
00:49:06
>> Yeah.
00:49:06
>> Understood. Understood. He said his
00:49:10
>> for now he's only 62. So, okay.
00:49:13
>> But he said, Orban said he congra he
00:49:16
called to congratulate Maguar. Is that
00:49:19
his name?
00:49:20
>> Maguar.
00:49:20
>> And he wrote Orban said the
00:49:22
responsibility and possibility of
00:49:24
governing was not given to us. I mean, a
00:49:29
simple line, a simple line, this guy
00:49:33
showed more fidelity to democracy
00:49:36
than not only our corrupt president, but
00:49:40
so many of the people who want to be a
00:49:43
judge are willing to do right now. So,
00:49:46
it's a strange win, but my win goes to
00:49:49
Victor Orban for conceding an election.
00:49:53
I am so thrilled for the Hungarian
00:49:55
people. It is an inspiration. the way
00:49:58
they have. And it also, quite frankly,
00:50:00
it bodess really well for us because we
00:50:02
are a lot more connected.
00:50:04
>> That's right. Than people believe.
00:50:06
>> You have to. Let's see. JD, when you
00:50:07
lose the presidency, you better act like
00:50:09
that. Anyway, uh I have a failed I
00:50:12
usually like when women say their peace,
00:50:15
but I thought two women this week
00:50:16
weren't so great. Melania Trump made a
00:50:18
rare speech to talk about
00:50:20
>> God, that was weird.
00:50:22
>> It had so much what the [ __ ] [ __ ] It
00:50:25
was what the hell? Why is she talking
00:50:26
about this? There m we thought there was
00:50:28
a story and then there just cuz she's
00:50:30
mad about it. She doesn't She's like I
00:50:33
was not a paid escort or sex trafficked,
00:50:36
you know, and it's like well like I
00:50:38
think she wants to make it clear she
00:50:40
isn't a prostitute. That's what or a se
00:50:43
sex
00:50:43
>> we all prostitutes at some point.
00:50:45
>> I know. I was like, "Well, you still you
00:50:47
like, okay, so you went through a
00:50:48
marriage broker kind of thing." Like,
00:50:50
she didn't do that, but you know, I
00:50:52
think she wants to doesn't want to. I
00:50:54
don't know what she was doing. I
00:50:56
thought, what in the actual [ __ ] is
00:50:58
happening here? And you know, they say
00:50:59
Trump didn't know, but there's such like
00:51:01
I was like, what is happening? And why
00:51:03
is Epstein back?
00:51:05
>> Like, oh, good. Let's talk about
00:51:07
Epstein. And then I think she like
00:51:09
crapped on those surviv the real
00:51:11
survivors who really did suffer because
00:51:13
you know just to get her little piece
00:51:14
out there and what a selfish uh person
00:51:18
she was. Well she is what am I talking
00:51:19
about? And then this strange profile of
00:51:21
Lawrence Sanchez in the New York Times
00:51:23
which Katie Kirk had the best reaction
00:51:25
is were you forced to do this assignment
00:51:27
to the writer Amy Chosk. I I didn't know
00:51:29
why she she was telling me how happy she
00:51:31
is which is great but I don't know what
00:51:33
it was there for. There was nothing to
00:51:35
hang it on. I guess the mech gala. I'm
00:51:37
not sure. But it was like so tonedeaf.
00:51:40
Like I'm really happy. And in our $230
00:51:42
million house in Florida, we talk do
00:51:45
gratitude to each other every morning.
00:51:47
Just more of this sort of performative
00:51:50
romance with Bezos is so icky. I just
00:51:53
find it I just didn't understand it.
00:51:54
>> Cara, do you remember that line from
00:51:56
broadcast news? It's it's one of the
00:51:57
greatest lines in movie history where
00:51:59
William Hurt says to Albert Brooks,
00:52:02
"What happens when your real life
00:52:04
exceeds your wildest dreams?" And Albert
00:52:06
Brooks turns and says, "Keep it to
00:52:08
yourself."
00:52:09
>> Keep it to yourself.
00:52:10
>> My dad,
00:52:12
>> I've been thinking, you know, I I love
00:52:14
this statement and I use it as a one of
00:52:16
the definitions of masculinity. Are you
00:52:18
optimizing for attention or service?
00:52:20
>> Mhm.
00:52:21
>> And Lawrence Sanchez, from everything
00:52:22
I've heard, is a really nice woman.
00:52:25
People who know her say wonderful things
00:52:27
about her. You have an amazing life.
00:52:30
Keep it to your [ __ ] self. Talking
00:52:33
about your amazing life in virtue
00:52:35
signaling. I It's like I have a buddy
00:52:37
who is so successful, such a good
00:52:39
friend, such a good citizen, and he's a
00:52:42
[ __ ] disaster when it comes to his
00:52:44
relationships. And I said to him, I
00:52:45
said, "Don't you have any really good
00:52:48
friends that can tell you what they
00:52:50
think of what you're doing? Who saves
00:52:52
you from yourself?"
00:52:54
>> Nobody here. She's got the money if she
00:52:56
and this is the same thing with Lauren.
00:52:58
It's like
00:52:59
>> don't you have any friends to say to
00:53:00
you, go girl, have an amazing life. Do
00:53:03
good things with your money.
00:53:05
>> Be take care of your parents. Take care
00:53:06
of your community. Give money away. You
00:53:09
don't need articles in the New York
00:53:10
Times talking about what a spiritual
00:53:13
wonderful person you are and how
00:53:14
wonderful your relationship is. There's
00:53:16
no way. It's just going to make you look
00:53:18
like an [ __ ] Like, don't that's my
00:53:20
question, Carrot. Don't these people
00:53:22
have friends? Especially as the ex-wife
00:53:24
of Jeff Bezos just gave $70 million to
00:53:26
Meals on Wheels and never said a word
00:53:28
about herself. I mean,
00:53:29
>> about the mugs they have or hunk or
00:53:32
>> honk.
00:53:35
>> She needs friends.
00:53:37
>> I Well, she has friends. She has the
00:53:38
wrong friends. Lauren, call us up. We'll
00:53:40
help you. We'll bring you back down to
00:53:42
earth. But I don't think she cares. I
00:53:43
think she she could do so much good and
00:53:46
instead she's I just don't know.
00:53:48
>> It's something I I struggle with. My dad
00:53:50
told me just be I I started to get some
00:53:52
success before he passed away. And the
00:53:55
last thing he said to me that really
00:53:56
stuck with me was he said, "The key to
00:53:58
happiness in America is to be rich and
00:54:02
anonymous." And he said to me, he said,
00:54:04
he said, "Son, I'm worried." Uh, he
00:54:07
goes, "I'm really happy that you've
00:54:08
achieved your the former. I'm worried
00:54:10
about the latter."
00:54:11
>> Oh, smart.
00:54:13
>> You don't appreciate the value of
00:54:14
anonymity.
00:54:15
>> Well, too bad. Too late. Um, but I if
00:54:18
you ever do an interview about us
00:54:19
cuddling and doing gratitude, I'll
00:54:21
[ __ ] kill you.
00:54:21
>> I gave her a mug.
00:54:23
>> Okay.
00:54:23
>> I gave her a mug that said that said you
00:54:26
look like Rachel Matt's accountant.
00:54:30
>> I gave you
00:54:30
>> Rachel Matto mechanic. That's That's
00:54:32
your fashion.
00:54:33
>> We'll see you next Tuesday. Mug.
00:54:35
>> Uh, my win on the other hand, we
00:54:37
adorable.
00:54:38
>> I know. We're adorable. Aren't
00:54:39
>> we adorbs?
00:54:40
>> Adorbs. Um, my win is another outspoken
00:54:43
woman hacks is final season. I saw the
00:54:46
first episode. So good. Jean Smart,
00:54:49
Hannah Ein Bender, the whole freaking
00:54:51
cast. It's about a woman who talks out
00:54:53
loud and is so wonderful. I just love
00:54:56
it. Love it. Love it. And I just I
00:54:58
recommend everybody watch this last
00:54:59
season. The the whole team there is
00:55:01
spectacular. There's not they and they
00:55:03
all share in the wonderfulness and I
00:55:06
have to say it's very sweet. It's about
00:55:08
a family. It's about Anyway, Jean Smart
00:55:10
is really a woman I'd like to have keep
00:55:13
talking. And by the way, her speech in
00:55:15
last season was so precient about
00:55:17
companies trying to quiet uh uh uh
00:55:20
performers and comedians and stuff like
00:55:21
that. So, I thought that was amazing.
00:55:23
So, please watch it. It's worth it. It's
00:55:24
on HBO Max. Um
00:55:26
>> my favorite one of my favorite lines.
00:55:28
They're going to name a street after
00:55:29
you. It'll probably be a dead end with
00:55:30
an abortion clinic on it.
00:55:33
>> Just beautiful writing. Um anyway, those
00:55:36
those are the kind of things I I think
00:55:38
you should pay attention because it'll
00:55:39
make you laugh out loud. We want to hear
00:55:41
from you. Send us your questions about
00:55:42
business, tech, or whatever's on your
00:55:43
mind. Go to nymag.com/pivot
00:55:45
to submit a question for the show or
00:55:47
call 85551 pivot. And elsewhere in the
00:55:49
Karen Scott universe. This week on on, I
00:55:51
talked uh more about my CNN series,
00:55:53
Caris Wisher Wants to Live forever on
00:55:55
the topic of longevity. I talked to a
00:55:57
panel of experts, including journalist
00:55:58
Katie Kirk. She talked about why people
00:56:00
seem more inclined to trust dubious
00:56:02
wellness claims than doctors. Obviously,
00:56:04
Katie was really well known for being
00:56:05
one of the first people to call
00:56:06
attention to colon cancer. She had a her
00:56:08
husband died of this and she had a
00:56:10
colonosby on on camera. Speaking of
00:56:12
power broadcast news back then, it was
00:56:14
really important to bringing down uh
00:56:16
cancer rates. Really amazing thing she
00:56:18
did and continues to do. Let's listen to
00:56:20
a clip. People want answers and honestly
00:56:24
they they often don't like the answers
00:56:26
that they get. You know, they want to
00:56:28
believe they you know, my joints hurt. I
00:56:31
want to believe that collagen is going
00:56:33
to make me less achy when I get up in
00:56:35
the morning. I want to believe that I'm
00:56:37
going to be more flexible with collagen,
00:56:40
you know, and so I think that that that
00:56:43
people, you know, are grasping for ways
00:56:47
to feel better and I think there is a
00:56:49
lot of suffering out there. Really smart
00:56:52
voice on all this. Okay, that's the
00:56:54
show. Thanks for listening to Pivot and
00:56:55
be sure to like and subscribe to our
00:56:56
YouTube channel. We'll be back on
00:56:58
Friday.
