00:00:00
And then the last line is Cara Swisser had cracked the case. Like I'm [ __ ] like Encyclopedia Brown, but the case of
00:00:06
the make it [ __ ] stop you two. And so I got dragged into their ridiculous drama.
00:00:16
Hi everyone, this is Pivot from New York Magazine and the Vox Media Podcast Network. I'm Carara Swisser
00:00:22
and I'm Scott Galloway. Scott, I just want to tell you my mother-in-law agrees with you. She's a
00:00:28
psychologist. And you remember I said she was going to be mad at you um about your therapy uh rant the other day.
00:00:34
Well, it's it turns out she agrees with you. Go on. I would like to tell you it's
00:00:40
incredible. So, I'm going to just read it to you cuz she's so thoughtful about everything. And she goes, "My thought is
00:00:45
I agree with Scott on every point he makes. I know you were joking about your mother-in-law coming after him. I
00:00:52
listened to that part about therapy twice to make sure I heard understood what he was saying. He was a little too
00:00:57
strong at first, maybe understandable to me because of the off criticisms from people who didn't get or even read his
00:01:02
book. And he has good points about the therapy industrial complex, too. Anyone who listens to Scott knows he isn't
00:01:09
blaming women, and that criticism is [ __ ] The interpersonal therapy we think of as discovering and addressing
00:01:15
unconscious conflicts and deep hurts can be helpful in freeing people to be their fuller selves, working through and
00:01:21
accepting loss, disappointments, etc. And so she goes on um and she said certainly as Scott also points out
00:01:27
therapy is of this kind is not even remotely available to the vast majority of people. She agrees with you everyone.
00:01:34
And the last thing she said um I don't believe Scott is saying that the competent ethical therapists are overselling the benefits of therapy or
00:01:41
thinking that structural economic vulnerabilities, insecure food, housing, income, chronically inexperienced trauma
00:01:47
are healed through talk therapies. But as the other marketed efforts, uh, unscrupulous practitioners may and do
00:01:53
take advantage of struggling people. And I'm sure Scott would agree that health care, including mental health care, needs to be broadly affordable and
00:02:00
available, not just for the wellto-do. Boom. There you go. you're now getting married
00:02:05
to Amanda because Yeah, I'm trying to think like um because I know you were upset by the by
00:02:11
the therapeutic response and well well hearing that my my instincts
00:02:16
or my muscle memory is to come up with a a snarky comment but the reality is and you should pass this along to your
00:02:21
mother-in-law. I really needed to hear that because when you just constantly getting comments on Tik Tok, I mean the
00:02:27
reviews of the book have been 98% positive, but when you get a significant number of Tik Toks and reals in your
00:02:33
feed from people who clearly haven't read the book saying this guy has a pipeline to the red pill, I like to
00:02:39
think of myself as an offer from the red pill. And that and the thing that really hurts is
00:02:44
here's another man blaming women. And I'm like, oh my god, I'm not blaming women anyways. So, please pass along or
00:02:51
I trust your mother-in-law is listening to this. It I I needed to hear that. It feels really good. So, thank you.
00:02:57
No problem. I mean, I think what was she's an avid listener, Pivot, and I think I think as I was thinking of it, I
00:03:03
thought a therapist would be mad, but you know, people are much more thoughtful. And I think what you're dealing with is people that just do
00:03:09
these 5-second takes, like hot takes on Scott Galloway. And I get that from people about you, and I'm like, no,
00:03:15
that's not true. like that's not what the the blaming women thing I have gotten from a lot of people and I'm like that you didn't read it then you didn't
00:03:22
read it then that's my usually my well what's interesting is that and if
00:03:27
you look at big tech algorithms and if you look at headlines we do a lot of AB testing around titles to see what
00:03:33
YouTube YouTube title or thumbnail will get garner the most headlines or the most downloads the the one trend that is
00:03:41
overwhelmingly clear the more incendiary negative comments ments are words and
00:03:46
titles, the more clicks. And also, they did an analysis, inflammatory,
00:03:53
negative commentary uh in headlines, in the media is up 140%.
00:03:58
It's true. It's true. You know, if someone wants to say in reviewing a book, this is what he gets right and what he gets wrong, that's not
00:04:05
nearly as powerful as, I can't stand this misogynist. Yeah. I mean, it's just
00:04:11
it's just every algorithm and profit incentive is to be as over-the-top and
00:04:17
quite frankly not over the top positive. I, you know, to say I just love love love this. Uh, no, say why this is, you
00:04:26
know, why this is dangerous. You know, I I I nearly almost got in a fist fight. Someone said, "Oh, he's sort of like Jordan Peterson. Like he's the
00:04:32
anti-fucking Jordan Peterson." I'm like, they're they're adj they're in the same category. But Jordan Peterson, I think,
00:04:38
is quite ne I mean, I know you like parts of his stuff, but I was like, couldn't be more different. Anyway,
00:04:44
anyway, thank you. Thank you for coming to my defense. Thank you for protecting me. I appreciate it. When we walk down the
00:04:50
street, I need you to walk on the street side to protect me from splashes from carriages. With my shiv, I shall shiv people, but I
00:04:56
have issue. You cheated on me with Oprah. Um, you go ahead. I I didn't know she'd fall in love with
00:05:03
me, Cara. I I didn't It wasn't planned. We met. Did it started innocent?
00:05:09
Let's listen. I think she did a little bit. This was a very strange little uh thing she put up. I think it was on Instagram. Let's listen to what she said
00:05:16
about you. Scott Galloway has written a book called Notes on Being a Man. You know, he's a
00:05:22
great podcaster and one of the thought leaders of our time. And I think he has
00:05:27
his finger, his thumb, his whole hand on the pulse of what's happening with men
00:05:34
in our society today. So Scott, you had your whole hand on men. That was interesting to hear.
00:05:40
Yeah. And then my forearm and then my full my full torso is is on the scale.
00:05:46
You were upset. Not upset when you left. You were sort of equivocal, I would say.
00:05:51
Yeah. Well, let me just say I'm really enjoying this podcast so far, but when I left Oprah, I don't know about you, I have trouble processing stuff in the
00:05:57
moment. People say, "How'd it go?" I'm like, "I'm not sure." I walked out of there. First off, the, you know, Oprah
00:06:03
herself individually is clearly a genius. But she surrounds herself with
00:06:09
real pros. And you could tell they spent a month recruiting the audience. They had these videos, the lighting, the the
00:06:17
venue. I mean, these people give really good TV. And I walked out of there and I maybe even have called you and I'm like
00:06:23
I have no idea how that work. I did. I was sort of like oh that's too bad. You didn't have a good time. I usually walk out of things and go I
00:06:29
killed it once again. Yet again. I was right.
00:06:34
Hello. Fantastic. Beautiful. That reminds me so much when I knew my I
00:06:40
of course I got to turn this back to me. I remember I took my, you know, in in
00:06:45
Delray Beach, Florida, every weekend is on the sidelines of a soccer game and my son was so excited he got put in goal.
00:06:51
He wanted to be a goalie. And within like I barely even like they kicked off the ball and there was a goal on him and
00:06:57
then another goal and I was texting his mom going, "Oh my god, another goal." And finally she said, "Stop it. Stop it." And I'm like, "Oh my god, he is
00:07:04
going to be so traumatized." Like it was like 11 to one. Yeah. And at one point I went to the
00:07:10
coach and like can you just get him out of goal? I was it was one of the most painful 90 minutes I've ever spent.
00:07:15
We walk off the field and I'm trying to think about okay how do I be in reinforcement? I put my arm around him
00:07:21
like so how'd it go out there and he's like great. Did you see the save I made? He made one save.
00:07:26
I love that's fantastic. I'm like this kid's going to be fine. He did great out there. Yeah, you would focus on the 11. Yeah.
00:07:32
Well, good for him. That's good. Anyway, you were great. I watched the whole thing. I've decided she's making you into the new uh whatever her person, you
00:07:40
know, she like she so far her record's not great. I like the Nate guy who does the decorating. But Dr. Phil and Dr. I
00:07:47
tolerate Dr. Phil asked me to come down to Dallas actually. I think they saw me. That's not happening. You may not go.
00:07:53
He's a terrible person. He follows around ice raids and uses. No, that's not good. Yeah, that's not good.
00:07:58
His company just You know Oprah? She feel you know actually who I owe is Gail King set me
00:08:04
up with Oprah. So Gail King is is really generous and nice and she is you're perfect for Oprah. I mean
00:08:10
I do I met her at Cheryl Samberg's house at at one of these things that Cheryl put together and she uh I didn't know
00:08:16
what a vision board was and it was it was a moment because I wasn't fully in the Oprah camp.
00:08:21
She looks great. But I have to say she's like she's like a a tractor beam. like she she touches
00:08:27
your arm and she goes, you know, and I apologize for not knowing what it was. And I said, I'm sorry, I didn't know
00:08:33
what a vision board was. And then she touched me on the arm and she put her hand in front of my face and she goes,
00:08:38
"That's cuz you have a vision board in your hair and did this." She has that she has that Bill Clinton
00:08:44
magnetism where you get the sense you meet her and she's like, "Oh my god, this woman really likes me." And the fastest way
00:08:50
to get someone to like you is to like them. So you're immediately like, "Oh, she really likes me." which makes me
00:08:56
like her. She has that Bill Clinton. She just touches the arm like uh looks
00:09:01
you right in the sheer beam. I was like, "Oh, no. I'm being Opra." Anyway, you were great. Of course. Well, you're
00:09:07
getting fame and fortune from my mother-in-law and Oprah. Uh I am Swiss is in the news. I'm in the news with I'm a swizzle
00:09:13
stick. You're a swizzle stick. Yeah. The New York Times referred to the Olivia Nudie Ryan Liza drama as a
00:09:19
cocktail of cockami with a swizzle stick of Carara Swisser. Uh, give us the cliff notes. Like, give the
00:09:25
list back super quick. Olivia Niy had a digital affair with Ryan with RFK Jr.
00:09:31
Wasn't it more than digital? Uh, I don't know that she says digital. He's denying it completely. He's a big
00:09:37
Does that mean online or fingers? I don't know, Scott. It's pictures, I think. I don't know. I don't know. Here.
00:09:42
You're dragging me into this. I don't want to know about it. So, here's the It was not good for a What hotels did they check into?
00:09:49
What did they wear? I get it. Listen, it's none of our beeswax, but it was wrong for a journalist to do this and
00:09:55
then not disclose it since she was covering the presidential campaign and he was a candidate, right? Kind of an issue. This it's fine if you're, you
00:10:01
know, an episode of Scandal, but not if you're living in the real world. Anyway, I found out about it through means
00:10:08
nothing to do with Ryan, nothing to do with her, and Ryan is her ex ex her fiance. They were getting
00:10:14
married. They were getting married. Oh, yeah. I wasn't even told by him that they broke up. Um uh in any case, I found out
00:10:22
and it was through other means because it was getting out and I was worried about this and the minute I found out I
00:10:28
knew I had to tell New York Magazine and I was hoping that Olivia would do that and I was hoping
00:10:34
or Ryan or one of them would would do it, but nobody did it. And so I called
00:10:40
um I I confirmed it. I made sure it was accurate and did reporting on it. And
00:10:45
then I um and then I told David Haskell. It's the only person I told at Vox. Uh
00:10:50
later I did talk to Jim Bankov, but it but I well thought the editor was the right way to handle it and I didn't want business involved.
00:10:57
And you told me and I had no idea what No. No, I didn't. Exactly. I had because I wanted him out.
00:11:03
Um so, so anyway, that was later. I actually told you later. So I told them and I said, "You need to talk to Olivia.
00:11:08
She can't cover the presidential campaign if this is true." And I said, "You need to investigate and you need to
00:11:14
uh figure this out and and then disclose it to our audience." And that's all I said. I moved on and I've been dragged
00:11:20
back in one because Olivia has put me in her book um calling me her mentor and essentially I ratted her out, but I I
00:11:27
didn't I did the right thing. Um and then Ryan has now has doing a ser in
00:11:32
retaliation for her book which got very badly reviewed um deservedly I will say
00:11:38
uh having read it. Um I um I I she should have written it and put in a
00:11:43
drawer. That's how I feel about this book. Like written it and put it in a way. Feels like Kla Harris's book.
00:11:49
Yeah. No, Kla Harris's is really good in comparison, but I would agree with you on that too. Um so, uh so he's started
00:11:55
to write a series on his Substack trying to attract readers. I don't know what he's doing. I've told him I think it's
00:12:01
he should have written one piece if he felt he had to and moved on, but he's decided to do this. And in this newest
00:12:07
episode of like the really grotesque Pwick papers as I like to call it um as
00:12:13
someone told me um he has put me at the he has all these hot kickers at the end and the last kicker is a well-known
00:12:21
journalist just texted me three letters RFK and then the last line is Cara
00:12:26
Swisser had cracked the case like I'm [ __ ] like Encyclopedia Brown but the case of the make it [ __ ] stop you two
00:12:33
and so I got dragged into their ridiculous drama. Thank you. That's it. So, a couple things. One,
00:12:39
um I I teach a course on crisis management, and there's only three things you have to remember, but they're really hard and people end up not doing
00:12:45
it. The first is you have to acknowledge the problem. If she had just come out and said, "Uh, I'm human. The heart
00:12:52
sometimes override overrides the brain, as it does to a lot of men, uh, and a lot of women. I [ __ ] up here." Uh, and
00:13:00
then two, take responsibility. My fault. I'm not going to accuse my, you know, my
00:13:05
fiance or even RFK. This is on me. And then third, overcorrect. And I'm not
00:13:10
entirely sure how you do other than other than showing contrition. You just try to overcorrect. She's done none of
00:13:18
that. And the And then one of the many damaging things about this is like I don't know that many emerging journalists. I She caught my eye cuz I
00:13:24
thought her work on Biden and other people was fantastic. She is clearly a rare talent and she has really shot
00:13:30
herself in the foot here. And if you look at the damage done in crisis, it's typically not the detonation, the crisis
00:13:36
itself, it's the shrapnel. And the shrapnel is your attempt to cover up,
00:13:42
excuse it, not take accountability for it. That's when people get really angry. And the other kind of sad
00:13:49
thing about this, and it does represent a dual standard and sexism in our society, it's almost like we kind of expect RFK
00:13:56
Jr. just to be a pretty low character human being. But the reality is it just
00:14:02
how Olivia handled this sort of plays into the worst cartoon of women not
00:14:08
having control over their emotions in a professional context. And I'm not saying I don't think that's I don't think
00:14:14
that's reality. I don't think they have any less or more control than men. I I've never bought Oh, there's so many
00:14:19
people out there saying women are better managers. I'm like, well, show me the data. I don't think they're any better or any worse. Actually, it's probably
00:14:24
not true. They're probably better relationally and better managers. But anyways, this just plays into this trope
00:14:30
of how it feels like it's setting women back like 2 minutes on the cosmic clock of women's progress.
00:14:36
Agree cuz she just looks terrible here. Yeah. And she keeps doubling down and he does too. And the whole I I literally I
00:14:43
hate being a side character in this. And I hate that now they're using like now now they made me a character which I'm
00:14:49
like I just did the right thing and I'd like to leave please. Like make it [ __ ] stop. But but it's I'm sorry. And the book's
00:14:55
not selling, by the way. It's not like I don't know how many how many substacks he's selling either, but I it's the
00:15:02
whole thing is just not a good look for journalists. It's not a good look you write for women. Uh it's just it makes
00:15:07
us look like [ __ ] idiots. Like instead of we made a mistake and we're going to tell the audience
00:15:12
Exactly. Right. You know that it's as if they don't have friends because a good friend with any reasonable perspective
00:15:19
would have sat her down and said, "This is exactly what you do. I [ __ ] up next. Don't talk about it.
00:15:26
Don't write books about it. Don't go on Don't go on Morning Joe or Substack interviews and try and position it that
00:15:32
it was your fiance's fault and drag other people into it. Just I [ __ ] up. I take responsibility
00:15:39
next. I'm going to continue. If New York Magazine doesn't want me around, I'm going to continue to try and make a living as a journalist.
00:15:45
She'll see. I always thought the way she corrected is by doing good work again. Just doing good work. Work right through it. That's exactly
00:15:51
right. Good work. not about you. Like we're through it and not about this scandal cuz she's just digging herself
00:15:56
unless you did a different deeper and deeper. Yeah, I would recommend reading the reviews cuz I thought even though
00:16:02
everyone's like, "Oh, they're so mean." I'm like, "No, no, they're quite kind. It's what the editor should have done." Like especially Becca Rothfeld, who I
00:16:08
think is amazing at the um at at the Washington Post did a great review. I thought it was incredibly fair. Um these
00:16:16
people actually said it was it was lack of honesty. Anyway, I again I don't want to talk. It's one of these topics I'm
00:16:22
like, let's [ __ ] move on from this. Stop like stop doing the all of you stop doing the [ __ ] fan dance and leave me
00:16:28
out of it because I'm a swizzle stick. Anyway, um we've got a lot to get to, including what's going on these Trump
00:16:34
accounts for kids, uh and why investors are worried about a crypto winter. Things are going bad with Bitcoin. But
00:16:41
first, Anthropic is exploring an IPO as early as next year, according to the Financial Times, tapping the law firm
00:16:47
that advised on Google's and LinkedIn's IPOs. That's interesting, though. The official word from Anthropic is that it
00:16:52
hasn't decided when or if it will go public, but it feels like it is. Anthropic is also reportedly pursuing a private funding round that would value
00:16:58
it at above $300 billion. Anthropic CEO uh Daario Amodi was at New York Times
00:17:04
Dealbook Summit on Wednesday. While he didn't talk about the IPO directly, he did discuss the risks at play with all
00:17:09
this AI spending. Uh let's listen. When the timing of the economic value is is uncertain, there's an inherent risk
00:17:16
of of underreacting or overextension. And because the companies are competing
00:17:21
with each other and frankly we genuinely need to compete with you know our authoritarian adversaries um uh there
00:17:28
there's there's kind of a lot of pressure to push things. So I think there's some amount of irreducible risk
00:17:34
here and I absolutely don't want to deny this but at the same time is that I
00:17:39
think there are some players who are not managing that risk well. I like him a lot. I have to say I like
00:17:44
his product. I like the way he talks about safety. I talked about him last week when David Saxs uh was insulting
00:17:51
the company for talking about safety as if there was some thing. Um what do you um I'm going to add on one more thing
00:17:56
and speaking of other AI players, Sam Alman is clearly feeling the heat from Google Anthropic and others. He told employees this week that the company was
00:18:03
declaring a code red to improve chat GPT delaying other products in the process like an advertising product. So um do we
00:18:10
do you think we see an anthropic IPO before an OpenAI IPO and how talk about the bubble fears? I know you're a fan of
00:18:17
Anthropic as a product as Claude. Um, but talk a little bit about this. I really think Daario is one of the people
00:18:23
I appreciate because he I don't always agree with him on everything, but at least he's he seems to be telling the
00:18:29
truth. That's I know it's that's like a it's like the lowest bar of all time, but he's positioned himself really well as
00:18:35
sort of the more measured, honest, less cheerleading. You know, he even said he even acknowledged that this is
00:18:42
probably going to, at least in the short and medium term, destroy a lot of jobs. and he offered up the notion that maybe
00:18:48
the exceptional market share or uh increases in shareholder value should be taxed to help pay for some of the
00:18:54
retraining and he's been pretty I feel like he's a pretty honest broker here
00:18:59
and he's been a nice a little bit of a nice antidote to Sam Alman who I think is a little bit overexposed
00:19:05
and Anthropic's positioning is a little bit different it it has a much smaller consumer footprint no mass market
00:19:11
product like a chat GPT it primarily is in the business of enterprise APIs and
00:19:17
it's really deeply integrated into finance, legal, healthcare, super strong partnerships with Amazon.
00:19:23
And so they're trying to position themselves as sort of high trust enterprise first LLM provider. And I
00:19:29
like that positioning because in my experience, and I'm biased because I
00:19:34
like B2B, but B2B typically is more consistent. If a company signs an
00:19:40
enterprise or a sitewide license, they tend to not consumers are fickle on the
00:19:45
upside. Something can get hot. You don't even know why. Like why is you know libu
00:19:51
like explain to me the logic behind that. But they're positioning themselves. But go ahead. they're positioning
00:19:57
themselves as um sort of the enterprise AI and it's you know open AI is sort of
00:20:04
universal AI platform and anthropic is sort of enterprise safety and reliability leader and I think that's a
00:20:10
really good positioning and it sounds basic um and they have the trade-off is they
00:20:15
have slower consumer adoption and less cultural buzz but um some of the things they have tried to do is reduce
00:20:22
hallucination rates better model control better governance better regulator regy comfort,
00:20:27
better safety. I mean, again, and they stepped on, I mean, it sounds basic, but they basically stepped on
00:20:32
Open AI and said, "We're thinking about going public, and they've got a ton of attention." Uh, so I I think this was a
00:20:40
really smart move. Did settle with copyright, shareholders, if you remember. That's right. He's trying to Yeah.
00:20:45
Right. Right. too. So, you know, whereas chat GBT is about subscriptions and API usage and
00:20:51
enterprise licenses and integration fees through Microsofts and Azure, Anthropic is really about API usage and enterprise
00:20:58
contracts with long-term commitments and also cloud partnerships. So, I like it's also priced premium relative to
00:21:04
competitors. It's and marketed as a safer alternative for regulated Open AI. Now, uh you know this I've
00:21:11
always talked about this idea of what if it becomes Netscape, right? this is my fear and not Google. And that
00:21:18
feels like that feels like Google's gonna stay Google or or or whatever it happens to be. Which one's going to have
00:21:23
the IPO first? You know, the honest answers, I don't know. It comes down, it's a lot about um
00:21:29
the cap table, your shareholders. Um but you got to think that OpenAI's
00:21:35
bankers are saying, "Let's file tomorrow. Let's go." Wouldn't it be good if they went together? Wouldn't Would it be a bad
00:21:40
thing? What would be the best thing for both companies is if one goes out and rockets and gives everyone a chance to
00:21:46
breathe and then institutional investors look at the 80% first trade up on Xfirm
00:21:52
and pile into Y. I don't think they want to go public too close to each other because they'll soak up all of the quote
00:21:58
unquote uh LLM IPO capital, right? And there's worry at the same time among investors. I think Anthropics
00:22:05
should probably go fast. That's what I would do. Well, it's it it is quote it's an instance where they quite frankly can
00:22:13
establish a leadership position because open AI right now is pretty dominant in almost every you know I mean open AI is
00:22:20
trying to become a full operating system for AI with consumer and enterprise ubiquity. Yeah. and and even
00:22:26
anthropic is trying to focus on enterprise and also the safety and uh
00:22:31
more nod to the regulatory environment of different of different um verticals in enterprise
00:22:37
open is doing too much stuff that's what I feel like I'm like turducken we have a turducken problem here like and maybe
00:22:43
just focus on the product itself I I don't know I always worry when they're oh we're going to do this and now we're
00:22:48
opening a store and selling t-shirts and why by the way we hired Johnny I was like great but can you say no no to
00:22:54
something Like that's, you know, being very disciplined. Anyway, we'll see what happens. Uh, that was a great interview.
00:22:59
I recommend it. And our favorite Canadian, Andrew Ross Circin, had a good day yesterday. Did a bunch of really good interviews. He's great, isn't he?
00:23:05
Yeah, he did a great job. And he was he had a little more teeth, Andrew. I appreciate it. You were a little more te
00:23:10
toothy with people, which is great. Uh, I thought they were great and very uh insightful interviews. Um, another
00:23:17
story. The latest bids are in for Warner Brothers Discovery. Netflix has come back with a mostly cash offer after leaning uh on its stock for the initial
00:23:24
bid, but the stock has been a little bit down actually. Paramount is also putting together an allcash bid financed by
00:23:30
Apollo and some Middle Eastern sovereign wealth funds despite denying that involvement a few weeks ago. That'll
00:23:35
tell you everything you need to know about these people. And Comcast has reportedly made a cash and stock bid that would merge NBC Universal with
00:23:42
Warner Brothers Discovery. Up next, Warner Brothers would either accept one of the offers or move to a third round
00:23:47
of bids or break itself up like it was going to. Um, one thing that I find really particularly disturbing is that
00:23:54
well, first of all, um, the Paramount bid has a $5 billion breakup thing because they're so confident in their
00:24:00
closeness with Trump and White House officials and some Republicans already raising antitrust concerns about
00:24:05
Netflix. They're they're part of their main strategy is Trump loves us and
00:24:10
we'll do whatever it takes. uh which is really horrible. I I you know whatever
00:24:16
that's their strategy. It's so non-economic what they're doing here. And then involving the Saudis is really
00:24:21
I can't believe that that they would be big in any any foreign country would be
00:24:26
a big investor in owning this much of news and entertainment. I find that troubling. I don't mind them owning the
00:24:33
golf things, but this is a whole another story. Uh your thoughts? Emerson Junior High School, ninth grade.
00:24:39
We had the ninth grade prom. Oh dear. Buckle up. Where's Ann?
00:24:44
Where's Where's Anne? And you know, you have your route. You have your pattern.
00:24:50
Yeah. And how you walk to school. And my junior high school was not a hallmark. There were just certain routes you
00:24:56
didn't go down because there'd be a kid there that got used to sort of beating you up or or asking you for money. Were you beaten up?
00:25:02
Oh, I was pulled into bathrooms in and beaten. Yeah. No, it wasn't. Not me. I mean, not a lot, but uh yeah, a lot of
00:25:10
a lot of that. Um, and by the way, I'm I'm not going to in a weird way, I think some of it was probably good. You learn
00:25:15
negotiation skills and and adversity. Don't break my face. Yeah. There's a reason my nose goes to
00:25:20
the right. Anyways, I can't wait to see how this relates. Going from going from home economics to
00:25:26
Spanish class, me and my best friend Brett Jarvis would pass Kelly Mayhew and
00:25:31
Lynn Sugamura. And Lynn was this beautiful, intelligent u 14-year-old. And we neither of us had
00:25:38
dates. And I just yelled out as Lynn was passing me by, "Lynn, will you go to prom with me?" And they both laughed.
00:25:44
And the next day, she cornered me outside and said, "Were you serious about me going to prom?" And I'm like, "You don't have a date?" I mean, Lynn
00:25:50
was beautiful. And she said, "No." I'm like, "Yeah, yeah. Will you go to the prom with me?" And she said, "Yes." And then immediata.
00:26:00
And within like uh the next day, she's like, "Five guys have asked me to the prom in the last day." So once people
00:26:07
knew Lynn was actually going to go to the prom. Oh. And would go with Scott Galloway,
00:26:13
all of a sudden everyone decided to bid for Lynn Sugamore at the prom. Wow. Okay. All right. I can see it.
00:26:19
Okay. By the way, why do I understand this? She left the dance. She left the dance with Ashley Tucker. Broke my heart.
00:26:26
Oh, but she went with you. Yeah, she did go. You got her a cor. Okay. Oh, yeah. The big thing we wrap around
00:26:31
and and like a tuxedo that I didn't know how to put on. Um, and I didn't know how to tie. Anyway, back to Warner Brothers.
00:26:38
I got this wrong. I thought the Ellison's were going to show up with the biggest bank and get this done. And it
00:26:44
appears what has happened is that Ted Sarandos and the Roberts family have
00:26:50
said, you know, these assets kind of are singular. We should pull out our pencils. And it's like to a certain
00:26:56
extent and this is one of the failures managers make and that is they typically don't appreciate an employes value until
00:27:03
about the day after they leave right and that is they think of they have a tendency to look at people through the
00:27:08
lens of which they entered the organization rather than saying if you really want to know what someone is worth imagine they're leaving
00:27:14
and what you would pay them and the same thing's happening here and that is there are a set of assets and also you know
00:27:21
streaming platform and uh HBO Which, by the way, HBO still is the premier
00:27:28
the premier draw for talent. Whenever I've been involved in any type of
00:27:33
Hollywood thing or series, if if the producer, the actors could pick the distribution platform of all of them,
00:27:40
they would pick HBO. Mhm. Talent loves HBO. Anyways, and also with Warner, there's just some singular
00:27:46
aspect. Yeah, they decided, what the [ __ ] I'm getting in here. and everyone's showing up
00:27:51
with what I would argue it seems right now kind of an irrational amount of money. And I think it's like, well,
00:27:58
okay, except for Comcast, our stocks are up. Netflix on a on a balance sheet level makes a lot of sense because they
00:28:04
have so much freaking money and shareholder value right now. But I am surprised and and I got this wrong. I
00:28:11
thought the Ellison's were going to walk away with this. Here's what I find offensive is that the their whole strategy is we're friends
00:28:16
with Trump. Here's I did talk to someone from Comcast. I'm like, you know what? Just [ __ ] sue them and win. Like
00:28:23
because by the way, Trump the last time tried to stop the AT&T merger, remember
00:28:29
with um with Warner? They lost. Trump has maybe seven, eight months left on
00:28:35
this thing that he has any real power, right? If he loses the that last election, they just very troubling for
00:28:42
the for the Republicans. And so to me, I'd lean into Yeah. your your your entire strategy is we're
00:28:48
friends with the president and we're we can we can make a stupid rush hour four forum because we're big [ __ ] suckups
00:28:54
and by the way let's drag in some people from let's drag in some people from the Middle East who shouldn't be in this in
00:29:00
this thing at all and they lied about it they denied it and they're there like this group of people is the sketchiest
00:29:07
group of people you could think of by the way the best owner probably is Comcast on on a on basic level if I had
00:29:15
to pick and then spin off the news things into Versent or whatever you want to do. Netflix is definitely is
00:29:21
frightening for both Paramount and Comcast because they would own everything as you know. So I there are
00:29:26
antirust concerns. At the same time the the doing this non-economically because
00:29:32
you're pals with the president is about the most non-c capitalist thing I can think of. And
00:29:38
100%. It's like really, you know, I I I hate to say this, but you know, just cuz your
00:29:44
dad is friends with the president doesn't mean you get to own everything. Like, sorry. Like, and I I feel like the
00:29:49
others are better are better suited. Now, I get the Warner people are going to want to take the best deal. Um, but
00:29:55
if they keep larding this Donald Trump's my best friend, it's going to bite them so hard uh later. That's my feeling. I I
00:30:03
mean, I I don't know. We'll see. We'll see what happens. We'll see. Let me let me just break it. I find it's all quite
00:30:09
confusing. So, I just want to give a bit of a a breakdown or an unpack of what's going on around the bids.
00:30:14
Paramount has made five bids so far, all cash. And this is the interesting part with a $5 billion breakup fee, which is
00:30:21
them saying, "Trust us, we're butt buddies with the president. This will go through. No one
00:30:27
else is going to offer a $5 billion." That's I think that's probably the largest breakup fee I've ever That was a tell to me. That was like, you're not going to win this.
00:30:33
We're on the inside track. Yeah. Yeah, but it also is we're insecure and they're also looking to buy the
00:30:38
entire business and they argue a spin-off would be a taxable event. And the stock, by the way, when they announced all this was down 7%. Netflix
00:30:45
has submitted two mostly cash bids. That's obviously attractive. They're looking to spin off the cable networks.
00:30:50
The stock again fell 5% yesterday. By the way, folks, the reason stocks fall when they get into the M&A race as the
00:30:57
on top acquirer is that twothirds of acquisitions do not pay off. Comcast has
00:31:03
also submitted two bids which are a mixture of cash and stock like Netflix. They would also spin off the cable
00:31:08
networks and their stock was up about 1%. Or put another way, Paramount has submitted the best and most aggressive
00:31:15
bid on the table, which doesn't mean it won't be bested, but so far they look like they're in the lead. Now, let's
00:31:20
talk briefly about what each company would get from Warner Brothers, why they're attractive. Paramount's looking
00:31:26
to absorb Warner's streaming subscribers. And combined a Paramount Warner streaming service would have
00:31:31
about 200 million subscribers, making it roughly even with Disney, but still behind Netflix at 300 million.
00:31:37
Yeah, they got to get it. They would also, the combined entity would be the most watched broadcast network and two of the five legacy film
00:31:44
studios and eventually possibly even Tik Tok with the Ellison's. Netflix wants
00:31:49
Warner Brothers uh content studio and subscribers by absorbing by absorbing
00:31:55
kind of the high-end content. You know, things like The Sopranos, Game of Thrones, The Wires, Harry Potter, DC Comics. Netflix could
00:32:02
force some subscribers to switch over. And Warner also holds rights in various markets for near for almost every sports
00:32:08
league, which would bolster Netflix's entrance into live sports. Netflix, though looks at this and
00:32:14
thinks, you know, we've done really well staying focused. you might be overpaying and as a result Netflix shares fell 6%
00:32:21
uh on Wednesday and then Comcast wants Warner subscribers. Uh but mostly it's
00:32:27
IP. One of Comcast's biggest long-term weaknesses is a lack of modern IP. They've got lots of legacy hits, films
00:32:33
like ET, King Kong, Jaws, but nothing on the scale of Disney, like a Marvel or Star Wars or Pixar or
00:32:40
also for its parks and Yeah. Harry Potter, Game of Thrones and theme parks are also one of
00:32:45
Comcast's most profitable businesses. This acquisition would give them a lot of IP for, you know, Game of Thrones
00:32:50
ride, right? So, this is I I find this fascinating. I got this wrong. I thought the Ellison's were going to walk away. It appears that
00:32:57
that everyone wants to take Lin Sugamura to the junior prom. Okay, we'll end on that. Let me just say if I was comp
00:33:04
bring it on to Trump. That's what I would say. Go ahead. And by the way, let me make a little point here and it's someone I happen to like, but the person
00:33:11
who the lawyer the general counsel for Paramount here is Megan Delrahee who was the person who lost the case for the
00:33:18
Trump ad. He was at the Justice Department and he was so he's the one doing this. So, it's a really
00:33:25
interesting situation. Sorry, Megan, but uh call return my call. Anyway, um he
00:33:31
won't because he's probably scared of Niss's being mad at him, but he's a he's a very smart guy, but he didn't win that case. So, push back on this guy. Don't
00:33:38
like pu just push back. It there's you might be able to win by pushing back. It's enough. Um it's enough saying
00:33:44
daddy's friend daddy's friend is going to help us. Um okay, Scott, let's go on a quick break. When we come back very
00:33:50
quickly, we're going to talk about Michael Dell's $6 billion donation for so-called Trump accounts.
00:33:55
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00:34:58
Scott, we're back. Techmobile Michael Dell and his wife Susan Dell have pledged $6.25 billion to fund 25 million
00:35:04
Trump accounts for kids. The donation will extend the reach of the new child investment accounts beyond the pool made eligible by the big beautiful bill. Now,
00:35:12
most children uh 10 and under who were born prior to the qualifying federal date will receive just $250.
00:35:18
Um, I I don't know what you think of this. I feel like why don't we just tax Mel Goodell properly as his fair share
00:35:25
and then decide where to put the money, including towards kids. This is symbolic. He did one of those White
00:35:31
House things calling it Trump accounts. The whole thing feels rather grotesque to me, but go for it. Yeah, I think the
00:35:38
Dell's Look, I I think if you give $6 billion to try and inspire saving and
00:35:44
investing in the markets for kids, I think they deserve praise for this. I I I realize I buy into the notion of what
00:35:52
Anon Giridas says that if we're just relying on the generosity of billionaires, they get to dictate social policy, not our elected leaders. And
00:35:59
you're right, we should have a progressive tax structure such that we could figure out a long-term solution. Uh, but I I I really find the criticism
00:36:06
of the Dells unfair and really unproductive because at some point
00:36:11
billionaires just say, "Okay, you win. I'm just not giving anymore." I I don't think it's I I I think they should be
00:36:18
praised for this type of philanthropy. I feel like it's it's the company man giving out company, you know, you know,
00:36:25
company towns, they're run by one oligarch essentially in a lot of places. I'm going to let I'm going to let three
00:36:30
people go to college and I'll decide. meanwhile keeping everybody down. Like I I just I'm sorry. That's
00:36:36
But do you think they're I think the system is [ __ ] up. I agree that we need structural reform, but I don't I
00:36:42
don't think the Dells are trying to keep anybody down. I don't think it's just like why don't you just get taxed normally and let our
00:36:48
our structural issue I get that. But I this whole like performative calling them Trump accounts, you didn't have to
00:36:54
call it that. I agree. Like it's just like gross. It's just gross. If you want to give money, give money the way
00:36:59
Mackenzie Scott does it. I'm sorry. By the way, Mackenzie Scott gave $40 million to a teen um suicide prevention
00:37:07
uh charity I'm involved with. And I I don't know her, so I in no way do I want to in any in any way say that I was in
00:37:13
any way had anything to do with this. She might be listening to you, but she is well, three years ago, who
00:37:18
was my person of the year? Mackenzie Scott. I got to say that's that's who I want billionaires to be. There's just no
00:37:23
denying that when these the female side of the partnership gets divorced from
00:37:29
these these 100 billionaires, they immediately start giving money away. Yeah. I mean, there is there does appear to be
00:37:36
a difference in the way men and women approach their wealth. Yeah. And I would argue one is much healthier.
00:37:42
Anyways, the I love the idea in theory and that is I think one of the
00:37:48
advantages that China has over the US is they think in 50-year increments. And I believe social security is totally
00:37:54
unsustainable and because it's so popular because of the age of Congress and old people keep voting that I think
00:38:00
we need to do similar to what Australia did and other places do. I would give $7,000 to every baby born. That's 40 billion.
00:38:08
And then and then basically not let them touch it until they were 65 and it's a million bucks. And then within 30 years
00:38:15
when you saw the end of social security because we no longer need it, interest rates would come down and pay for the program. So, I would want something on a
00:38:22
bigger scale. Australia has something super return. I forget what it's called. But this stuff, I like it. I think we
00:38:29
need something bigger and bolder that has a structural shift to get rid of social security in the long term such
00:38:35
that interest rates start coming down in the medium term. These all sound great, but honestly, this is just for sucking up another suck
00:38:40
up to Trump. That's what I feel like. Anyway, uh on to crypto. I don't think it's the best way to do it. That's all. And again, it's not capitalism as I see
00:38:47
it, but uh let's go on to crypto. Bitcoin remains turbulent despite the crypto president being in office, down
00:38:52
30% from its peak at one point this week. Bitcoin and other crypto assets have endured bigger drops, losing as
00:38:58
much as 80% of value and then turning around as we know. But the market appears spooked and worried about a crypto winter. Billionaire Michael
00:39:05
Sailor's firm Strategy, which pioneered selling corporate debt to buy Bitcoin, announced it raised $1.4 billion to
00:39:11
ensure meet future payments. Harvard who had gotten at the wrong time. The school increased its Bitcoin investments to
00:39:17
$500 million last quarter, potentially leading to a 14% loss. Um, very briefly,
00:39:22
let's do this real quick. What What do you think about this? This is an ongoing story we really need to be paying
00:39:27
attention to. I like to call balls and strikes and I talk a lot about my personal finances to hopefully um educate people and I like
00:39:34
to call out my losses as my fails. I have not had any Bitcoin exposure and then a few months ago I said, "Fuck, I
00:39:40
need some exposure. I bought one of these Bitcoin Treasury stocks at 14 bucks a share.
00:39:45
It think it closed today or at $5.50. So, I've had my stock I got in at
00:39:51
exactly me and Harvard got in exactly the wrong time. Call you Harvard. But having said that, I'm actually
00:39:57
thinking about adding to the position because essentially Bitcoin is an incredibly volatile asset.
00:40:04
It and that's what young people like about it or young people think this system's rigged. that have invented their own asset classes, but it's off
00:40:11
roughly 25% from its peak in October. It's down 12% in the last month, but it's essentially flat from where it
00:40:17
started at the beginning of the year, and it's the result of kind of a d-risking trade that has been ripping
00:40:23
through the markets. And Bitcoin is an especially risky asset. It's a bit of a canary in the coal mine regarding how
00:40:32
risk sentiment, risk on, Bitcoin goes off, up, risk off, Bitcoin goes down.
00:40:37
Very good point. It's three times more volatile than the S&P 500. Retail participation in crypto
00:40:42
is roughly two times that of US stocks. And the top 100 Bitcoin holders control about 15% of total supply.
00:40:48
That's incredible. Did you see the military is getting like regular like like privates are getting into Bitcoin.
00:40:55
That made me like, okay, this reminds me. Oh, young man. Risk aggressive. The risk aggressive brain trade and all that
00:41:02
stuff. Day traders. I felt like oh uhoh. Yeah. Actually, I think the next big one I think Bitcoin is going to have oxygen
00:41:09
taken out of it because I think the next Bitcoin, the next crypto is going to be prediction markets.
00:41:14
But anyways, this also people use So, here's a stat. 18 to 34 year olds make
00:41:20
up 51% of all crypto holders. Adults 45 and older make up just 22%. So, it's the
00:41:26
opposite of stocks. And male users are about twothirds of all crypto owners. And 73% of male holders uh report active
00:41:33
trading versus just 48% of women. I folks at some point we have to acknowledge generally speaking women are
00:41:39
different than men. Yes. The way they approach philanthropy investing every you know when you talked about that a couple of months ago you
00:41:45
were investing I thought I should maybe and then I didn't. I thought too volatile for Cara Swisser. I'm going to keep my I'm going to sit on my pile of
00:41:52
money and I didn't. So a friend of mine named Eric Jackson who's sort of this he's this really interesting
00:41:57
I love investor nice guy. Um he and I became friendly back when I started L2. He's
00:42:04
like pounding the table saying that this is an incredible buying opportunity and
00:42:09
it's not financial advice, but I'm going to ask Scaramucci. Ouch. Scaramucci, where's
00:42:14
the Look, you live by the sword, you die by the sword. So, yeah, it's off 25% in 60
00:42:19
days, but that takes it back to where it was at the beginning of the year. And uh I'm actually thinking about adding. I do
00:42:25
think I don't like these shitcoins, but I do think Bitcoin has become a legitimate asset class. We'll consider it, Scott. Probably not.
00:42:33
You know what? For me, it's a divers it's a diversification play. Although it's not as diversified as people would like to believe. It's probably pretty
00:42:39
correlated to the NASDAQ. But it's been this is a highly levered asset. So, when
00:42:44
things are good, everything's very good. And when things get the sentiment turns against it, it gets especially it's kind
00:42:50
of the tail of the whip of risk aggressive investing. Uh I would argue though that the new crypto and I've been
00:42:56
thinking a lot about this is going to be these prediction markets. Oh, that's a really smart. We'll talk about that more. That that's an interesting I agree with you. All right,
00:43:02
Scott, let's go on a quick break. When we come back, we'll talk about Costco coming after the Trump administration. Speaking of like that, we've had enough.
00:43:08
Scott, we're back with more news. Costco has sued the US government for a full refund on tariffs that is paid if the Supreme Court rules them illegal. The
00:43:15
complaint argues that the Trump administration misused emergency powers to implement tariffs. Two lower courts have already ruled that Trump exceeded
00:43:21
his authority. Uh I love Costco. I love Costco every bit of Costco. And I love how they're just like, "Yeah, we're
00:43:28
liberal and that's the way we're going to stay." And same thing with there's several companies like that, like Patagonia and others. And they do rather
00:43:34
well, both of them. Um, what do you uh what do you think of this? This is really interesting. I feel like it's
00:43:40
time to fight back. It's time to like, that's enough, my friend. That's enough of your antics, your ridiculous taco
00:43:45
antics. If Hobby Lobby wants to take a more conservative approach to their business or if Target doesn't want to uh
00:43:52
sell merchandise celebrating Pride, consumers have the right to boycott them, they have the right to do that. I
00:43:57
think private enterprise, unless it's it's discriminating against your your consu your customers or your employees,
00:44:04
I think private enterprise gets to do what it wants. Yeah. And Chick-fil-A has always been known as
00:44:09
being more conservative. You don't like Chick-fil-A, don't eat a Chick-fil-A. I got that from you. So, as
00:44:14
long as you're not discriminating based on, you know, employees or customers, and I think companies should have
00:44:21
companies now, unfortunately, for many of them, get positioned politically whether they want to or not. The smart
00:44:27
ones try to stay out of that mess. That's correct. But you're going to have Trump, a guy
00:44:32
who left a trail of unpaid subcontractors and bankrupt casinos,
00:44:38
tell Costco how to run business. I mean, Costco, Costco's one of the most impressive retail companies in the last
00:44:44
100 years. I love that they're suing him, though. Like, you know what? And do do you realize that only I think it's only 2% of the revenues come from
00:44:50
membership? Basically, Costco is we sell you everything at our cost and then you pay us whatever it is, our 180 bucks a
00:44:57
year, and that's where we make all our money is membership. It's only 2% of the revenues, but it's like half their
00:45:02
operating profits. And the model is so genius. It's so simple, but it's fun to shop. It's also a great It's also
00:45:08
a great product. Like I don't just think like if it was kind of a shitty product you and you have to drag your way through it. It's actually so much fun to
00:45:15
go to a Costco and they have good hot dogs. But it's the only place where I go in for paper towels and I leave with a kayak, a
00:45:22
gallon of salsa, and a financial 900 croissants. No, I leave with a kayak. I need peanut
00:45:27
butter. I got to buy this kayak. Um where's your kayak? I love kayaking.
00:45:33
Yeah. Do you have a kayak? No, I've been kaying. That's the closest I think I've came to death. My buddy
00:45:39
Doug Telture at Berkeley decided we should go kayaking and I took one lesson in the pool at
00:45:45
the flippy kind of kayak or the flat kayak. Oh, no, no, no. The hardcore like down a
00:45:50
river kayak. That is that is And I went down the American River and it had rained and I flipped over
00:45:58
immediately and started hitting my head almost unconscious. No. And um
00:46:04
Wow. And you were in one of those little skirts, things like that. Oh, you got to do a wet exit. If you don't get out fast, you can drown.
00:46:10
I know. It's true. Oh my god. Anyways, Doug Teltra almost killed me. No. Got caught in an Eddie, as they say.
00:46:16
I like I like getting gas at Costco. I like to save 11 cents and wait half an hour. Um,
00:46:21
I love Costco. Good for Costco. There should be more of this. Get get in there.
00:46:27
Get up your lawyers. When I was joking about Margie Taylor Green, she has the energy of a woman who returns a
00:46:32
halfeaten rotisserie chicken to Costco. Love that. Okay, so just so you know, but Costco,
00:46:38
like Nordstrom, has basically no matter what people return or how stupid it is,
00:46:44
take it back. You could you could literally show up and hand them the ashes of your broken dreams and they'll
00:46:49
still refund you. I mean, it's like it's uh By the way, one I I can't help
00:46:56
this. One of my favorite retail stories is about Nordstrom. Okay. And this guy uh every year they have an
00:47:02
annual meeting. They bring all the managers and they're supposed to tell the most outrageous customer service story for a prize.
00:47:07
Yeah. And one guy stood up and said, "Old man shows up brought brings tires we bought
00:47:13
at the store and they're bald and asked for a a refund and we gave it to them."
00:47:18
And someone stood up and said, "We refund you [ __ ] all the time." He's like, "We don't sell tires." And it ends
00:47:24
up, it's the most lovely story. It was an old man struggling with dementia and he showed up with tires and obviously
00:47:30
didn't know where he was and the manager came down and gave him a $50 certificate and said, "We're taking these backs. Here's the certificate. Can we call your
00:47:37
daughter?" Can you imagine how loyal you are to Nordstrom? If you that family got to get I spent time a lot of time with the
00:47:43
Nordstroms back in the day. The original Nordstrom Pico I used to go to the one in Pico. I used to Nordstrom was where
00:47:49
the rich people and it had a piano player. Yeah, it had but you know the one in Seattle, one of the the original
00:47:54
that's where it was founded. Yeah, I spent a lot of time with the Nordstrom. I loved dealing with them. I have to say they were just love I went
00:48:00
up to visit Jeff Bezos and I was like gh and then I visited the Nordstrom like yay that was my day. Um and then over to
00:48:07
Microsoft which wasn't a pleasant place and got yelled at by Steve Bomber. See that was my life back then. And uh
00:48:12
anyway uh all right Scott one more quick break. We'll be back for predictions. Okay Scott let's hear predictions. We've
00:48:19
been saying predicty stuff, but um by the way, another lawsuit I predict New
00:48:24
York Times just sued the Pentagon for infringing on First Amendment rights of being able to cover stuff. There's going
00:48:30
to be a lot more lawsuits again by companies now against Trump. That's my prediction. Everyone's like, "That's
00:48:36
[ __ ] enough, dude." I call it the this [ __ ] guy situation. This [ __ ] guy. I'm gonna sue him. Anyway, sorry.
00:48:42
Go ahead. when I was living at home with my mother and had no nothing going on when I was like 24.
00:48:49
Um, by the way, I was one of those men I talk about all the time. I used to go to Nordstrom and cosplay someone who had
00:48:55
their [ __ ] together. You just feel like when you're in there, you must have your act together. Yeah. Cuz you're buying like $90
00:49:01
sweaters and you're like, I must have my act together. I'm a Nordstrom. Yeah. And yeah, it was or my favorite was
00:49:08
I would go into the fragrance section and just take every fragrance and I would it was like a chemical ambush. I'd
00:49:14
start seeing my ancestors and my credit score at the same time. Oh, fragrance masking.
00:49:19
All right. My prediction is the following. Uh Heg Seth Patel and RFK are out within the next 30 days. I think
00:49:26
Trump has absolutely no loyalty. His administration is tanking. He's going to have to face potential, you know,
00:49:34
allegations of war crimes. The economy sucks. Uh tariffs aren't working. And
00:49:40
so Patel headset and no, I think he's going to I think he's going to do one fell swoop. I think he's going to within like a week of each other, I
00:49:46
think. And a lot of presidents have done this. Presidents usually kind of go a year, two years, and they say, "Okay, it's
00:49:52
time to calibrate." And they let some people go. Uh I think Patel has got sort of an
00:49:57
internal re vault on his hand. ton of ton of former and current FBI professionals are saying this is
00:50:04
dangerous. We we are focusing on the wrong things and this organization which is one of the most competent, professional and effective organizations
00:50:10
in history has been essentially neutered and then I think he's he's going to find
00:50:16
I I think he's why not do three at once and uh Haggath Patel RFK I think are all
00:50:23
out with not interesting. I'm gonna go with Gnome. I think he likes Yeah, maybe. Okay,
00:50:30
I'll go three of the four. That's a good one. Well, RFK would be great because he's paid no price. All these other people
00:50:35
have paid a price, including Cara Swizzlestick. Well, okay. And I mean, it's hard to pick which one is your favorite. How
00:50:41
about the guy who took $50,000 in cash in a paper make him the head of Homeland Security. That's what it'll do. That's a Doritos
00:50:48
bag or whatever the [ __ ] you Anyway. Okay, that's a great predict. I like it. I like that. Stick with that. I like it.
00:50:53
I think you're right. All right, we want to hear from you. Just send us your questions about business, tech, or whatever is on your
00:50:58
mind. Go to or go to nymag.com/pivot to submit a question for the show or call 85551 pivot. Elsewhere in the Cara
00:51:05
and Scott universe this week on ProfG Conversations, Scott spoke with Anne Applebomb, one of my favorite staff writer at the Atlantic about the
00:51:12
business interests driving US-Russia negotiations, European power, and America's slide into kleptocracy. Let's
00:51:18
listen to a clip. What's disturbing about this episode is that it shows
00:51:24
something very ugly about this administration. Namely,
00:51:29
um, and it raises a question, you know, in whose name are they conducting American foreign policy? Is this for the
00:51:37
security and prosperity of America and our allies? Or is this something that's happening on behalf of companies, maybe
00:51:45
even some involving the family of Trump or of Whit um who are hoping to make
00:51:52
money out of this negotiation? You think? Yeah. Yeah. There you go. Anyway, I like I love Ann. That was a
00:51:58
great interview, by the way. Okay, that's the show. Thanks for listening to Pivot and be sure to like and subscribe to our YouTube channel. We'll be back
00:52:04
next week. Uh, by the way, happy birthday to Dr. Jeffrey Swisser. He's 65. Scott
00:52:10
J. Swish. J Swish. D Swish. Medicare. Jeff, go for it. Scott, read us out.
00:52:15
Today's show was produced by Larara Neon, Zoe Marcus, Taylor Griffin, and Kate Gallagher. Learn Todd in this
00:52:20
episode. Manola Moreno edited the video. Thanks also to Drew Bros, Miss Smith, and Dan Shalon, the shot Kuras, Vox
00:52:26
Media's executive producer podcast. Make sure to follow Pivot on your favorite podcast platform. Thank you for listening to Pivot from New York
00:52:32
Magazine and Vox Media. You can subscribe to the magazine at nymag.com/pod. We'll be back next week for another
00:52:38
breakdown of all things tech and business. Cara, have a great rest of the week and weekend.