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atul thanks very much for joining us
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today explosion infrastructure is is
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often cited as a as a problem in India
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and many of the high-profile
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infrastructure issues like airports and
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roads in urban areas are often talked
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about what would you say is maybe one of
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the most important infrastructure
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stories it's not being talked about
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enough what I think one of the most
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important stories really has been the
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development of rural infrastructure in
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India India unlike China we really
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addressed it from the rule level first
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and then I've now moved to the urban
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level and in between urban centers so
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the development of highways at the rural
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level connectivity because really
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highways is all about connectivity if
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you don't have a road or sorry a rural
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road you can't get to a school you come
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here to a hospital you can give your
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produce to market so the government
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really for the last 10 years has been
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dealing with a lot of those issues at
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the bottom of the pyramid we're now
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seeing traction on happening at the top
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of top of it what would you say is the
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greatest impact of that lack of
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infrastructure in rural India which
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which sectors suffer the most well
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agriculture you know seventy percent of
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India's population is still directly
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involved with the agriculture and when
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you have the forty percent of
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perishables being lost because they
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cannot be taken to the market or the
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lack of a cold chain because of lack of
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connectivity that sector has really been
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hammered consistently the recognition
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that we need to fix that is really now
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gained a lot of currency in India so
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we're going to start seeing some
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significant traction over there what
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kinds of things do you think will change
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what will change is the ability for
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children to go to school rather than in
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some cases walking ten kilometers a day
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what it changes people getting to
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hospitals for medical attention much
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quicker you start seeing a lot of
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economic activity taking place at the
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rule level rather than pure migration to
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the urban centres which has its own
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problems so I think we're going to start
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seeing is significantly different Indian
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the next three four years and what kinds
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of things need to happen and do you
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think need to have need to happen in
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order for these these keys
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improvements to take place I mean other
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significant policy changes that are in
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the future or policy change policies are
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all in place okay it's the
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implementation which we are lacking in
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it's the ability of the governance issue
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that needs attention it's the systems
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that allow these programs to get rolled
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out that need attention there is a lot
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of attention now being given because the
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electorate has become very smart they're
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electing back representatives who have
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delivered on their promises so rather
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than voting purely on caste or religious
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lines as used to be in the past so
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you're seeing a significant shift in the
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way that the rural resident is really
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addressing his political mandate and
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that is really resulting in a lot of
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emphasis on delivery and I think you're
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going to see significant change now punj
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lloyd has in operations and 16 countries
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i think current including Singapore
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Thailand China and a number of others
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what lessons do you think can be learned
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from some of these other countries in
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terms of their infrastructure developing
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you mentioned China and you said that
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India's developed in a way that was sort
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of opposite to have China had what can
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India learn from from other countries
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that are not very much because the
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Indian model is the Indian model India
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has its own genius it has its own
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madness it's a rowdies democracy in the
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world it's the largest democracy in the
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world it's many countries within a
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country so many societies within a
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society many economic sections within
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their society the fact that india is a
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democracy is what sets it apart from
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china china has a command control
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economy where the president or the prime
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minister or the ruling elite will issue
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a diktat it will get done in india all
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right the debate starts after
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instructions are given okay it's just
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the nature of Damien ok also what
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happens is very often we miss successive
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generations of Technology so when we
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finally adopted we decide to reform a
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particular sector we go for
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best-in-class case in point our telecom
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density was extremely low they open it
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up for private sector participation and
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today our teledensity is among the
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highest in the world they grow they
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adding almost 100 million
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subscribers a year okay more than most
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countries have till nineteen eighty-two
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we had two television stations beaming
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black and white television okay
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basically agrarian based programs we had
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the asian games in 1982 the whole
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country are blanketed with color
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television okay similarly now on the
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highway side one of the biggest risks in
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financing a highway project is traffic
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the fact that india is willing to catch
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up okay that's not an issue so the
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financing of some of these projects has
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now become much easier than a lot of
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other countries have found so when you
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go to somebody and you say that you want
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to finance let's say a billion-dollar
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highway project you already have traffic
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data because really it's not a new
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alignment it's an existing two-lane
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being converted to an eight-lane so you
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already know how much you know a traffic
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of what category is traveling over that
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path so India is unique I don't think we
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can really learn a lesson from any other
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country because it is not like any other
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country then reaching back into its own
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passport can work in India learn rather
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quickly they catch up what what mistakes
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is a need to avoid in order to prevent
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growth what we need to really do is I
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think make the bureaucracy at the lowell
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that was much more efficient as i was
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saying is the systemic fix that we need
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this too many layers too many interested
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parties in delhi itself for example in
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new delhi you have three sets of
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government you have the left-hand
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governor who controls that controls the
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police and the Delhi Development
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Authority you have the mayor who
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controls the municipal corporation of
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delhi and you were chief minister
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controls the rest okay so now who's
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really in charge and that's true for
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almost every city in india so lot of
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that needs to be fixed and the promised
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i know i've been told is looking at that
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seriously to seeing as to what are the
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systemic changes that need to be brought
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in and that filters down to rural areas
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as well it is not beginning to because
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the focus of the government really is on
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inclusive growth the focus is not on the
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few people that meet the forbes
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billionaires list okay every year and
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the few new ones that come on in but the
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focus is really how do you make sure
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that the economic activity really
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percolates down to the lowest possible
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level
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every speech by the Prime Minister that
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talks about this is made corporate India
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very responsible to avoid concept that
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conspicuous conspicuous consumption and
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really see as to what they can do it w
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CSR if you had to prioritize
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infrastructure development in in rural
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areas what would you what would you say
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is most critical I would tell water okay
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and simply but because seventy percent
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of hospital beds in India filled with
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people suffering from waterborne disease
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alone and the Indian support system for
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an individual is his family and the
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village so when you have somebody
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transported from village to a class b
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town of a class a town he would
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typically be accompanied by at least
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five to six people so you have now seven
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to eight people being taken out of
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economic activity because of that one
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individual so it's a positive and it's a
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negative okay but that is I think the
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most significant fix that we need and
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what would you say would be sort of at
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the top of the agenda for urban areas
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urban areas I think planned growth is
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the big issue you know because India's I
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mean I had a friend for example who was
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listening from obviously sitting in the
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front seat of the car with a video
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camera and asked him what he was doing
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and he said if I ever tried to describe
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this traffic to anybody back home okay
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never understand it so I just gonna play
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back for them so I think we need planned
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rules we need really to have the kind of
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focus that New Delhi's getting on every
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city that really is the biggest
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challenge beyond you know improving
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roads are increasing their sizes are
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there are significant plans for
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development of public transportation yes
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new delhi for example has been building
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out this metro system it's gone at a
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record speed by 2018 we will have 450
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kilometres of track compared to London's
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foreign and eight London's has taken
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them over 100 years to build we've done
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we will do it in 12 based on that now
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Hyderabad Chennai Bombay Calcutta and a
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few other cities are all rolling out
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their mass transport systems
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what areas are your your is your company
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focusing on the most in terms of
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development be focused across the board
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we focus on urban infrastructure we
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focus on oil and gas we focus on
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petrochemicals we do a lot of offshore
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work in terms of pipelining platforms
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fabrication and erection we do a lot of
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work in the renewable space we've just
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commissioned the world's largest we to
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ethanol plant in the UK we have a large
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solar initiative that's planning out now
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and of course on the nuclear space were
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playing a significant role right now of
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course in an environment like India
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which you you've pointed out is very
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unique and and there are lots of
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bureaucratic hangups sometimes that
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gives rise to a lot of innovation have
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you seen examples that really struck you
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as innovative in terms of developing
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certain kinds of infrastructure for
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instance going back to the issue you
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raised about water in rural areas is
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anyone doing something that you think is
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pretty significant and interesting in
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that area the whole country is I mean as
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I mentioned earlier that if you read
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economic forecasts and The Economist's
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what India must have to achieve a six
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percent growth in terms of power and of
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the roads in terms of pores in terms of
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airports okay India has got none of that
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we're now talking about you know it's
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now starting but for the last 15 years
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the Indian economy we are now growing at
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over eight percent without any of that
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so the whole bunch of entrepreneurs are
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all so innovative that they found the
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solutions you had somebody talking about
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being a vendor for BMW for their gear
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boxes now they are actually supplying
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out of India on a just-in-time
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environment okay but they cannot predict
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when the next ship is going to come okay
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and how soon their goods are going to
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actually go out so they're dealing with
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best-in-class European or American or
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Japanese automotive manufacturing
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requirements right in a completely
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uncertain environment but they found a
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solution and this would be you know hold
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true for any number of industries in
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India so I think the innovativeness of
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the Indian okay is what sets him apart
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we just powers destroy in a really
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interesting project called lifeline
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express it might be familiar with that
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so if and what interested me about that
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was a you know medical infrastructure
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then was piggybacking on railroad
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infrastructure are there other examples
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like that where you think one form of
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infrastructure can be used to help
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expand another form that happens in
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India to a large extent we're that
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investors in a what is the largest
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hospital project in the world actually
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at that size it's a thousand 250 beds
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started up at one phase and we're now
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partnered with Duke University is there
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research partners in India but we have
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what we call medical outreach programs
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so you have these fully fitted buses
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okay that go into the villages and they
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spend weeks on end in the villages doing
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the initial screening of potential
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patients and you have people whether
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they're women with ganic problems or
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this men with cardiac problems or
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diabetes etc and with the screening
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happens in the most rural of rural areas
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you know so there is a lot of that that
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happens where you've got the best in
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class in the city actually reaching out
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to the extreme have-nots yoke and
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there's no charge is free and doctors
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volunteer to go down from the hospital
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and so these are called medical outreach
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initiatives there's a bunch of these
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that happen sort of a wheel and spoke
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approach kind of hmm interesting so
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looking looking ahead five or ten years
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where d envision India to be in terms of
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infrastructure given the current
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situation india i believe will look like
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a very different place physically okay
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over the next five years we will see
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roads which will be up to international
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standards you'll see a lot of power
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generation coming online you see a lot
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of transmission and distribution coming
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online airports are now being
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commissioned as i mentioned Delhi's got
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a world-class echoecho that's come up in
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36 months second largest in the world 78
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gates to Beijing's 80 you know that it's
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its largest space larger than terminal
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five or anything you were saying bombing
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under construction right now you're
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seeing chennai you're saying calculor
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all have been upgraded and you have 26
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new airports that have been built so
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India will look very very different in
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rural areas as well a jeweler or they
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lag do you think no I thought I don't
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think they will like because
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as I was explaining early the politician
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knows he has to deliver to his
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constituents his constituent is not the
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city his constituent is at the village
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level I was in Canada recently with one
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of our ministers and we were all
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laughing that his counterpart on the
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other side of the constituency of
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100,000 people the Indian ministers
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constituency was 1.8 million when over
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2000 villages in that in that
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constituency so that the electorate he
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has to address they are the people he
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needs to deliver to okay so you're going
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to start seeing a huge amount of
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pressure or there is already a huge
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amount of development happening at that
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level well thanks very much for speaking
00:14:07
with us since been a pleasure
