00:00:00
a major resignation now an editor at the
00:00:03
New York Times showing up for work as a
00:00:06
Centrist that an American newspaper
00:00:07
should not require bravery she's saying
00:00:10
no one should be allowed to criticize me
00:00:13
please welcome Barry Wise anyone that
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departs from wol Orthodoxy gets a lot
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more heat a new consensus has emerged in
00:00:20
the Press but perhaps especially at this
00:00:23
paper if you don't have the right views
00:00:25
everything is caveat edited triple
00:00:29
quadruple amount of times should it take
00:00:32
courage to say that those who praise the
00:00:34
pristine Subways of Russia are not
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journalists but propagandist should it
00:00:40
take courage to just say in public I
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[Music]
00:00:47
disagree join me in welcoming Barry
00:00:49
Weiss to the
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[Applause]
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stage hi Barry
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Barry thanks for being here thanks for
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having me thanks for the cool weather
00:01:04
really appreciate it yes um Barry made
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headlines in I'm going to give you a
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little introduction even though most
00:01:10
everyone here knows who you are but you
00:01:11
made headlines in 2020 when you left the
00:01:13
New York Times criticizing it stance on
00:01:15
free speech and diversity of thought and
00:01:18
since then you've launched the Free
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Press congrats I know a lot of folks
00:01:21
here are
00:01:24
subscribers um and the the Free Press
00:01:27
declares itself a a free press for free
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people honest independent and fearless I
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think we all respect and admire you for
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your fiercely independent thinking and
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direct and honest takes on current
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events and social issues we feel like
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you're a kindred kindred spirit yes a
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besty I wish
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um so this may be an audition let's see
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well I don't know if you guys can handle
00:01:53
having a woman in I'm not sure no no we
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can just not
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sex so um look I want to start with a
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very broad General um question that you
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can take in any direction you want
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what's going on in America what are the
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two sides because it seems like a lot of
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what
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has as we've been hearing a lot about
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and I think we're going to hear more
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about throughout this
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conference there are polarizing forces
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at play and the PO the polls kind of get
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defined differently but is there a
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unifying thesis here um there's the
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notion of populists and elitists is are
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there elitists that say I'm an elitist
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there's uh corporate and government
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folks vers pocket square says you're El
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yes uh my pocket square keeps slipping
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um there's the conservatives versus the
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Liberals I mean what what what is the
00:02:47
divide in the United States and what is
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causing the polarity what how would you
00:02:50
think about the polarity that's emerged
00:02:52
I think there's two ways broadly that I
00:02:54
would answer that and obviously besties
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push back on me as I know David sack
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surely will um what one way to think
00:03:01
about it and I think Martin gurri has
00:03:03
written about this absolutely
00:03:04
brilliantly in his book The Revolt of
00:03:06
the public probably the most important
00:03:07
book written in the last 25 years read
00:03:10
it if you haven't strip press published
00:03:12
it say it again Martin gur's book it's
00:03:14
called the Revolt of the public and
00:03:16
broadly would he prophesied without
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using the words Donald Trump or BLM or
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any of the phenomenon that have reshaped
00:03:23
American political life over the past
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several decades is the sort of um call
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it the ren ades versus The Establishment
00:03:31
or The Outsiders versus the Insiders if
00:03:34
you want to understand how it can be
00:03:37
that Dick Cheney and kamla Harris are on
00:03:40
one side and Donald Trump and Tulsi
00:03:43
Gabbert and Robert F Kennedy whatever
00:03:45
you think of any of those people are on
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the other that's how you have to
00:03:48
understand that I think another way that
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I've been thinking about a lot though is
00:03:53
is sort of like there are three sides
00:03:54
that I see that are emerging and I think
00:03:56
the Free Press is trying to position
00:03:58
itself in what I believe is the broad
00:04:00
self-silencing
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majority piece of the pie which is to
00:04:04
say there's a woke left there's
00:04:06
increasingly a woke right and then
00:04:09
there's the normal people and the normal
00:04:12
PE I mean this is what people come up I
00:04:13
went to a thing for my daughter's new
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preschool yesterday and there were some
00:04:17
Free Press readers and they didn't come
00:04:19
up to me to talk about any particular
00:04:20
piece they just said thank you for being
00:04:22
normal and normal was the adjective that
00:04:24
almost all of them used and so I think
00:04:27
that that's also something that's
00:04:29
happening where you know I'm sure has
00:04:32
has has already been discussed at this
00:04:33
conference we have this Horseshoe in
00:04:35
which the left the identitarian sort of
00:04:38
anti-liberal left illiberal left sounds
00:04:41
eerily similar at times to the
00:04:43
illiberalism of the right and they sort
00:04:46
of are in this dance with each other and
00:04:48
the rest of us are feeling like when did
00:04:50
everything get so crazy and is there a
00:04:53
return to normaly and I'm not saying a
00:04:55
return to normaly in the sense of like
00:04:58
returning to some kind of like
00:04:59
neoliberal consensus I just mean a
00:05:02
return to the things that I think many
00:05:04
of us still believe are just basic
00:05:07
common sensical American values that
00:05:09
right now feel Under Siege let's talk
00:05:11
about the media's role in this you and I
00:05:14
have been career journalists um editors
00:05:17
and so when we were coming up they would
00:05:20
take your piece whatever you wrote and
00:05:22
just say well this is an opinion they'd
00:05:24
strike it out and say who are you
00:05:25
attributing this to there was a very
00:05:27
thoughtful process and then something
00:05:29
happened economically with link baiting
00:05:32
and maybe trying to get more clicks and
00:05:34
then this very strange thing happened
00:05:37
when Donald Trump got elected that I
00:05:39
think you and I both witnessed which was
00:05:41
journalists who
00:05:43
were you know thought of themselves as
00:05:46
independent and storytellers who would
00:05:48
just present the facts to an audience
00:05:50
then saw themselves um as part of the
00:05:53
resistance and that they had to stop
00:05:55
this individual um because they believed
00:05:57
he was Hitler and and the marketing when
00:05:59
you went to the guardian or the
00:06:01
Washington Post or the New York Times at
00:06:03
the bottom of the New York at the bottom
00:06:05
of a trump story would say if you want
00:06:06
us to hold truth to power and stop Trump
00:06:09
give us your credit card yeah and this
00:06:12
seemed like just bizarre moment maybe
00:06:15
you could just talk about that Paradigm
00:06:17
shifting because it happened during the
00:06:19
economic turmoil as well when journalism
00:06:22
got gutted I think it's deeper than I
00:06:25
think the the roots of this are deeper
00:06:27
than Trump we actually have a piece
00:06:28
we're running tomorrow afternoon called
00:06:30
when we started lying that's sort of a
00:06:33
view from someone that was in the Middle
00:06:35
East Bureau of the AP and seeing the
00:06:37
roots of this back in 20052 2006 and
00:06:40
what that piece argues and I think it's
00:06:42
exactly put is people don't really
00:06:45
understand that the fundamental job
00:06:47
description of mainstream journalism has
00:06:50
changed it used to be that the job of
00:06:53
Journalism and I still believe that this
00:06:55
is the job is to hold up a mirror to the
00:06:57
world as it actually is so people can
00:07:00
make sensible rational decisions about
00:07:03
where to send their kids to school about
00:07:04
where to live about who to vote for
00:07:06
about all of the things that are
00:07:07
important in this life tell the story
00:07:11
about reality as plainly and as
00:07:13
truthfully as you can that is plainly no
00:07:16
longer the goal I think of many main
00:07:19
mainstream I should put in quotes
00:07:21
American journalists the job description
00:07:23
as they see it is to Usher You toward
00:07:26
the correct political position that's it
00:07:29
and once you begin to understand that
00:07:31
things that seem crazy like wait how did
00:07:34
they not tell me about the hunter lap
00:07:36
Biden laptop story or why did they tell
00:07:38
me that the thing that I saw with my own
00:07:40
eyes which is the obvious mental decline
00:07:42
of the president of the United States
00:07:45
which is relevant to every single person
00:07:48
in this country and in the world was a
00:07:50
lie and once you start to understand
00:07:53
that you understand the misconstrual of
00:07:56
certain stories you understand the
00:07:58
absolute silence around others and
00:08:01
frankly that's why we're all here like
00:08:03
it's given this tremendous opportunity
00:08:06
for people who crave that thing that
00:08:10
journalism used to do the truth can you
00:08:13
well can you the truth yeah can you just
00:08:15
double yeah the truth just double click
00:08:17
into that like it's not like there's
00:08:18
like some Grand cabal of people that
00:08:21
decide let's obfuscate Biden fine let's
00:08:24
Elevate this so what does it what does
00:08:27
it actually mean day-to-day like how how
00:08:29
is it happening okay is it the money is
00:08:31
it the incentives what is happening
00:08:33
there's a few things that happened the
00:08:34
first as Jason was alluding to is that
00:08:36
the economic model changed it used to be
00:08:39
that if you ran a piece in the New York
00:08:41
Times your fear was you were going to
00:08:43
piss off The Advertiser that was running
00:08:45
next to the story once the business
00:08:47
model shifted you no longer were as
00:08:50
concerned about although you still are
00:08:52
to some extent about enraging you know
00:08:54
Proctor and Gamble you're worried about
00:08:57
enraging the reader right this is the
00:08:59
phenomenon that so many people have
00:09:00
talked about which is which is audience
00:09:02
capture which is as you know the
00:09:04
individual sub stalker is as susceptible
00:09:06
to this as the New York Times none of us
00:09:08
are free from that phenomenon either
00:09:09
people respond to your article and say
00:09:11
that was stupid or that pissed me off
00:09:14
and then you feel pressure to change
00:09:15
unsubscribe or unsubscribe no so think
00:09:18
about this Accord and and I I think that
00:09:21
these are public figures but um
00:09:23
something like 95 to 98% of readers at
00:09:26
the New York Times and I'm choosing that
00:09:28
only CU it's the experience I know most
00:09:29
intimately regard themselves as liberals
00:09:31
or progressives so if you write and I'm
00:09:36
thinking about my wife who writes about
00:09:38
in her book how she after the violent
00:09:42
rioting that happened in places like
00:09:44
Kenosha she was a business reporter went
00:09:46
and reported on those stories and found
00:09:48
that the story was unbelievably
00:09:50
complicated that many of these business
00:09:51
owners were minority small business
00:09:54
owners they did not have insurance they
00:09:55
were absolutely devastated by what
00:09:57
happened and you know what happened she
00:09:59
brought was an excellent story back to
00:10:01
her editors and they said let's wait
00:10:03
until after the election to run this so
00:10:05
that's the kind of thing that would
00:10:07
happen a lot and no there's not like
00:10:10
some secret cabal meeting that happens
00:10:12
where it says let's make sure that we
00:10:15
lie to our readers about Joe Biden's
00:10:17
mental state it's the exact same
00:10:20
phenomenon that everyone here feels in
00:10:22
any Social Scene or company or
00:10:25
institution that they're a part of which
00:10:27
is that human beings are social animals
00:10:29
and if you look at the kinds of people
00:10:31
that work at the New York Times They
00:10:33
went to the same 10 boarding schools or
00:10:35
fancy schools and the same 10 colleges
00:10:37
and they marinated in the same set of
00:10:39
ideas and they want their kids to go to
00:10:40
the same schools in Brooklyn Heights or
00:10:42
the upper west side and that creates
00:10:45
this very particular group thinking
00:10:46
phenomenon let me add one thing which is
00:10:48
that was always there the thing that I
00:10:51
think has changed a lot in the past
00:10:54
let's call it 20 years is that the very
00:10:57
places that used to be feeders to the
00:10:59
New York Times were no longer feeding in
00:11:01
sort of your standard Center left
00:11:03
liberal Democrat they were feeding in a
00:11:06
kind of person who believed in something
00:11:09
like Revolution and believed that their
00:11:12
job was to Fu that inside the New York
00:11:15
Times oh but how does that say more
00:11:18
about what does that what do you mean
00:11:19
well what I mean by that is that they
00:11:21
did not you could look at the values of
00:11:23
the New York Times and sorry okay wait
00:11:25
just go back a step so the people in the
00:11:27
New York Times are fancy basically is
00:11:29
what you're saying I'm not saying their
00:11:30
fanciness is sort of beside the point
00:11:33
point is that there was an archetype
00:11:34
yeah of course and then that archetype
00:11:36
shifted right and is that because the
00:11:38
feeder schools changed or is that
00:11:39
because what they were taught at those
00:11:40
schools changed it's because wokeness
00:11:42
happened to American liberalism and the
00:11:45
people that were speaking the language
00:11:48
of
00:11:49
progressivism all of a sudden
00:11:51
transformed the notion of what let's say
00:11:54
social justice was right all of a sudden
00:11:57
social justice wasn't about doing good
00:11:59
by the poor it was actually about a kind
00:12:02
of neoism and a resegregate all of a
00:12:06
sudden progressivism wasn't actually
00:12:08
about human flourishing and progress it
00:12:11
was about you know ensuring equality of
00:12:15
outcome rather than equality of
00:12:17
opportunity and I don't think that the
00:12:19
sort of that transformation which some
00:12:22
people have said oh wokeness has peaked
00:12:24
it's over it cannot be overstated the
00:12:26
thing that began at the margins and at
00:12:28
the fr
00:12:29
has moved into the center of American
00:12:33
institutional life and that is the story
00:12:36
of the transformation of the New York
00:12:37
Times and it's the story of the
00:12:38
transformation of Harvard and so many
00:12:40
other places where people all of a
00:12:42
sudden turned around and thought when
00:12:45
did everything get so insane is it a
00:12:47
story that ends in socialism as it has
00:12:49
in past lives I think that you know I'm
00:12:52
an optimist this is America and I think
00:12:55
that there's an unbelievable push back
00:12:57
to this phenomenon
00:12:59
but the push back I
00:13:03
believe we uh we we have Elon here this
00:13:07
afternoon right the push back and this
00:13:10
is where I guess I'm more of a radical
00:13:12
than a reformer I think I began at the
00:13:13
New York Times as a reformer believing
00:13:15
that I could make a difference and I God
00:13:17
Bless the people who are still trying to
00:13:19
do that I think there's a role for both
00:13:21
I think what has made me more of a
00:13:23
radical not politically but just in
00:13:25
terms of my posture has been that I've
00:13:29
become someone who believes that the way
00:13:30
to change those institutions is not to
00:13:33
give money to those places or join the
00:13:35
board of them or delude yourself with
00:13:36
the idea that you can transform them
00:13:38
from within it's to build new things and
00:13:40
in building new things and creating
00:13:42
competition it forces the other people
00:13:44
to to to change J give a voice to the
00:13:50
people if you if you wouldn't mind give
00:13:52
a voice to the people that want to Buck
00:13:56
the trend that want to be able to
00:13:59
respond to the statement that they are
00:14:00
morally bankrupt if they identify that
00:14:04
this is not the right path what what's
00:14:07
the conversation that and this is
00:14:08
happening with everyone I know in
00:14:10
schools in workplaces it's not just the
00:14:12
institution of the New York Times it's
00:14:13
all institutions okay it starts with
00:14:15
something very
00:14:17
simple give up the heroin needle of
00:14:20
prestige rip it out of your arm
00:14:23
immediately stop poisoning yourself your
00:14:27
families and your children with the
00:14:30
bankrupt notion that them getting into
00:14:32
Harvard or Yale is more important than
00:14:35
inculcating in them a sense of Love of
00:14:38
family of country and of all of the
00:14:40
things we used to think were
00:14:45
normal that to that that isn't clapping
00:14:48
cuz he went to Stanford
00:14:50
but to
00:14:52
me to me that it begins with that
00:14:55
because I I find myself in these
00:14:57
baffling conversations with people where
00:14:59
they say thank you for what you do I'm
00:15:01
so grateful for the Free Press I'm so
00:15:03
grateful I'm like yeah and we're talking
00:15:04
it's great I'm like where do your kids
00:15:06
go to school and then and then they name
00:15:08
a place that's like the center of the
00:15:11
Mind virus and I'm like why would you do
00:15:15
that well that Al Alca was all filled up
00:15:18
yeah they reach their capacities up
00:15:20
right so to me it's sort of the
00:15:22
beginning of wisdom begins with that and
00:15:25
with the confidence that Prestige and
00:15:28
honor
00:15:29
is not something that is granted to you
00:15:32
by institutions that have allowed
00:15:34
themselves to be corrupted by morally
00:15:37
bankrupt people you you and your values
00:15:41
they're lucky to have you right that's
00:15:43
what I think like the fundamental
00:15:45
posture needs to change let's um talk
00:15:48
about the new stuff we're all building
00:15:50
the go direct movement all these new
00:15:52
brands you're one of them we're one of
00:15:54
them I suppose are we going to talk
00:15:55
about founder mode and are you guys
00:15:56
going to explain to me what that is I
00:15:57
mean cocaine I no in your no bar it's
00:16:00
cocaine really yeah founder Mode's
00:16:01
cocaine yeah it's good we have actually
00:16:03
the good I've never done founder mode I
00:16:05
can only guess but no my guy's got the
00:16:07
best founder modes I put some in your
00:16:09
green room thank you so much yeah yeah
00:16:11
um if you need more let me know um so I
00:16:14
want to I think I've been doing founder
00:16:16
mode if founder mode means like working
00:16:18
till you collapse every night for three
00:16:20
no no that just means being committed
00:16:21
and trying to build a business yeah
00:16:22
we're talking about cocaine founder mode
00:16:24
being a
00:16:25
deal it's back um yeah but let's
00:16:29
seriously talk about
00:16:33
um it's so funny back baby it's back woo
00:16:37
it's going to be a great show um so I
00:16:40
want to talk to you about uh the new
00:16:41
stuff that's being built um obviously
00:16:44
you have your subscription based
00:16:45
business doing wonderfully we've got the
00:16:47
information we've got all in um and then
00:16:50
you have you know everybody who got
00:16:52
kicked off of um you know broadcast
00:16:55
television um or what you know for
00:16:59
whatever reasons they left Don Lemon
00:17:00
Megan Kelly uh what's that Catherine
00:17:04
harage yeah it's fantastic yeah so tons
00:17:07
of long tail there but um this group is
00:17:10
also susceptible to the same things as
00:17:12
you pointed out and and perhaps in some
00:17:14
ways more susceptible because they've
00:17:17
got a less subscriber base less brand so
00:17:21
Fox News is going to be fine New York
00:17:23
Times is going to be fine but as we saw
00:17:24
this past week uh the Russians put $10
00:17:27
million into a little slush fund and
00:17:29
then gave it to start with no no I'm not
00:17:32
talking to saxs I'm talking to uh to to
00:17:34
Barry he's talking to sa through Barry
00:17:37
thank God I'm not managing these people
00:17:38
well no no I'm just curious what you're
00:17:40
I mean these are obviously you know as
00:17:41
the Russians would call them the usful
00:17:43
idiots but they're they didn't even know
00:17:44
they were getting millions of dollars
00:17:46
they didn't ask where it was coming from
00:17:49
um obviously you didn't take that money
00:17:51
we didn't get offered that money
00:17:52
unfortunately otherwise you would have
00:17:53
taken it yeah we would have sec we would
00:17:55
have secured that bag immediately free
00:17:57
money from the Russi
00:18:00
we're like the scene in The Matrix where
00:18:01
Neo's dodging the bullets in one nicks's
00:18:03
leg that's the Russian money cuz it was
00:18:05
flying everywhere and Jal was trying to
00:18:07
jump into the bullets and you know
00:18:10
trying to collect them and it's like
00:18:11
it's all we can do to just we wanted to
00:18:13
get that uh that sweet sweet money but
00:18:16
what was your your what's your take on
00:18:18
this cuz you had some strong feelings
00:18:20
when uh I think Tucker went um and did
00:18:23
his what you thought was propaganda for
00:18:26
Putin um and so let's talk about
00:18:29
you know how susceptible in your mind um
00:18:33
these voices are to being bought and
00:18:36
paid for apparently to me it's less
00:18:38
about allegedly being bought and paid
00:18:40
for I think what it is is there's a
00:18:44
really really understandable risk that
00:18:47
once you sort of eject yourself from the
00:18:50
Matrix or whatever the right metaphor is
00:18:51
stop taking the blue the blue pale T
00:18:54
it's like once you see one lie all of a
00:18:57
sudden the it comes a world of lies and
00:19:00
what's to stop you sort of from falling
00:19:02
down the rabbit hole and I'll give you
00:19:04
an example there's certain people I
00:19:05
don't want to name them who like I so
00:19:08
admired and I felt like they were really
00:19:12
precient on stand on standing up against
00:19:14
sort of the neo-racism from the left
00:19:16
let's say and then all of a sudden I
00:19:18
turn around and they're basically
00:19:20
talking about how Bill Gates is like
00:19:21
putting 5G chips in our brain and I
00:19:23
think to myself how did that happen and
00:19:26
I think the way that it happened is an
00:19:28
really understandable human impulse
00:19:30
which is these people lied to me about
00:19:34
this thing therefore everything they say
00:19:37
is untrue or these PE or or the Overton
00:19:42
window has been narrowed so so tightly
00:19:46
that I'm just going to fling it open to
00:19:49
I don't know someone that says that
00:19:50
Churchill is a villain and the Nazis may
00:19:54
have had a point so that's what I think
00:19:57
is is actually
00:19:59
happening more broadly and I think the I
00:20:03
feel often times at the Free Press like
00:20:04
we're dancing on the edge of a knife
00:20:06
which is to say on one side you have
00:20:09
these institutions that have the poor
00:20:12
gatekeeping but at least it's I mean
00:20:14
they have gatekeeping they have fact
00:20:16
Checkers they have this whole system
00:20:18
right that's corrupt but at least it was
00:20:20
supposed to work at one point and then
00:20:22
you have kind of the Wild West world and
00:20:24
the wild west world has everything and
00:20:27
so you know can see Alex Jones right
00:20:31
alongside you know a a fantastic
00:20:33
journalist like Megan Kelly and how are
00:20:36
you supposed to know who is who right
00:20:39
and so that's the challenge I think of
00:20:41
the new Wild West world and what we're
00:20:44
desperately trying to do at the Free
00:20:46
Press is to be the bridge and what I
00:20:49
mean by that is to marry the standards
00:20:52
that you would once expect from a place
00:20:54
like the Washington Post or the New York
00:20:56
Times in other words everything is
00:20:59
rigorously fact checked when we get
00:21:01
something wrong we publicly correct it
00:21:03
like all of those old rules but Maring
00:21:05
them to the sort of political freedom of
00:21:07
the new world can you take us into an
00:21:09
instance where a contributor because you
00:21:11
have a lot of freelance contributors or
00:21:12
just you know important people will want
00:21:15
to publish now in the Free Press which I
00:21:16
think is a really good sign for you um
00:21:18
that you're doing something meaningful
00:21:20
um that they submit something and you're
00:21:21
like okay this is not actually reporting
00:21:25
this is your opinion on a
00:21:27
conspiracy and we need to maybe get some
00:21:30
facts in here to boister this opinion of
00:21:33
yours because I mean these dopes
00:21:36
accepted $100,000 who never asked it so
00:21:38
then people are going to take their
00:21:39
opinion on Ukraine and and look at that
00:21:41
as factual when they don't even question
00:21:43
who gave them $100,000 an episode I mean
00:21:46
you the these people are obviously
00:21:49
idiots SLC corrupt what do you think I
00:21:51
wish I had read more about this
00:21:52
particular story well it's infuriating
00:21:55
because if somebody were to drop
00:21:56
$100,000 on you to publish the Free
00:21:59
Press on another website you'd say
00:22:00
where's the money coming from correct
00:22:02
yeah I mean why are we getting free
00:22:04
money yeah we don't get free money
00:22:06
probably because I'm too stupid to get
00:22:08
free money but no no it's the opposite
00:22:09
you're too smart so they wouldn't offer
00:22:10
it maybe I mean I the the scenario
00:22:14
you're asking me to go into that happens
00:22:16
every single day in other words we're in
00:22:18
a really excellent position where we
00:22:21
turn down the majority of things that
00:22:23
are submitted to us and and I think the
00:22:25
thing that's really heartening is what
00:22:27
are readers reward is the very thing
00:22:31
that we were founded to get in other
00:22:33
words when I left the New York Times the
00:22:35
Free Press Barry weiss subs.com and it
00:22:38
began as a reactionary product honestly
00:22:40
like now it's transformed itself but it
00:22:43
began as me being so pissed that they
00:22:46
were ignoring and lying about so much
00:22:49
and those were the stories that I ran
00:22:50
sort of headlong into mostly
00:22:53
institutional capture in the areas of
00:22:54
law and medicine and education but just
00:22:57
to choose an example a few hours ago we
00:22:59
you know we sent Leon Woodhouse an
00:23:01
amazing reporter I saw as everyone here
00:23:04
did that the Third Precinct in
00:23:05
Minneapolis during the BLM protest and
00:23:08
rioting burned to the ground and the
00:23:10
cops abandoned that station and I
00:23:12
wondered what do the cops in the third
00:23:15
precinct what do the small business
00:23:17
owners there what do they think about
00:23:18
Tim Walls now that is a natural story
00:23:21
that in a normal time the New York Times
00:23:24
would report on immediately when he was
00:23:26
chosen but they didn't and so we sent
00:23:28
Lon and he interviewed two dozen police
00:23:31
officers and small business owners and
00:23:33
that is the kind of thing that our
00:23:35
readers want they want new information
00:23:38
soberly presented and brilliantly
00:23:40
written they want really high quality
00:23:43
things and to me that's one of the
00:23:45
things about building the business has
00:23:46
been the most heartening David saaks has
00:23:47
not said a
00:23:50
word well let me uh found let me I can
00:23:53
actually let me let me uh agree with a
00:23:55
few things you said um so first of all I
00:23:58
agree with you that the mainstream media
00:24:00
is not just biased it's just like all
00:24:03
propaganda all the time and the turning
00:24:05
point for me in realizing this was Co I
00:24:08
think before covid I realized that yeah
00:24:10
you know the media the MRE media is
00:24:12
largely consists of liberals so they're
00:24:14
going to have a liberal bias what we saw
00:24:16
during covid was that they were even
00:24:18
lying about science right it wasn't just
00:24:20
politics it's like everything you know
00:24:23
we were told that um the pandemic was a
00:24:25
pandemic of the unvaccinated even though
00:24:27
even if you got the what they were
00:24:29
calling the vaccine it didn't actually
00:24:30
stop the spread you go on and on that
00:24:33
you know we had to basically do social
00:24:34
distancing except when the Riots of 2020
00:24:37
happened then you're allowed to go
00:24:38
outside and actually participate because
00:24:40
it's a social justice cause so therefore
00:24:42
the health changes I mean it was like on
00:24:44
and on church but you can go to a
00:24:45
protest right right so no surfing so it
00:24:48
was like for me it became so obvious
00:24:50
that uh that the media is just again it
00:24:52
goes Way Beyond bias you know it's like
00:24:54
it's just all wrong now at the same time
00:24:57
I think that
00:24:58
you do raise a good point which is once
00:25:00
you're outside the world of The Prestige
00:25:03
media yeah you are kind of on your own
00:25:06
you're on you're on Independent
00:25:07
platforms I use x to try and figure out
00:25:11
you know who I should listen to and the
00:25:13
way I do it is I compare who said what
00:25:17
compared to what actually happened so
00:25:19
like who ended up being right about the
00:25:22
issues and then I will follow them more
00:25:24
and I will def follow the people who are
00:25:26
wrong it's really simple for example on
00:25:29
the issue of Ukraine the number one
00:25:31
quoted Source in the mainstream media is
00:25:34
a think tank called The Institute for
00:25:36
the study of War it's basically a a
00:25:39
neocon funded Think Tank who are the
00:25:42
relatives of Victoria new newand who is
00:25:44
the architect of our policy in Ukraine
00:25:47
everything they've written over the past
00:25:48
two and a half years about Ukraine has
00:25:50
been proven wrong they said that the
00:25:51
summer counter offensive last summer was
00:25:53
going to be a giant Victory it ended up
00:25:55
being a disaster sorry these are her
00:25:57
relatives yourself relatives and the the
00:25:59
mainstream media the New York Times so
00:26:01
on quotes
00:26:02
isw it's if you go look at the the
00:26:05
citations it is the single most sighted
00:26:09
Authority by the mainstream media and
00:26:12
they are consistently wrong who is right
00:26:14
about the Sumer counter offensive well I
00:26:16
was for
00:26:19
example while we're handing out credit
00:26:22
and I and I and I and I certainly didn't
00:26:23
need to be paid by the Russians I just
00:26:25
figured out what the truth was okay jcal
00:26:28
uh so you know you you you bring up you
00:26:31
bring up these you know these um stories
00:26:34
about Russian influence or whatever the
00:26:36
real influence operation in this country
00:26:38
is by the mainstream media they're the
00:26:40
ones who are spreading disinformation
00:26:43
about the war in Ukraine and so many
00:26:44
other issues on a scale that dwarfs what
00:26:47
any of these like handful of podcasters
00:26:49
that most people have never heard of uh
00:26:51
can ever hope to accomplish so in any
00:26:54
event I agree with you when's the
00:26:55
foreign policy panel at this conference
00:26:58
and can I join it well yeah we're going
00:27:00
to do shimer and s m shimer and saxs on
00:27:04
saxs on M shimer well look I would um
00:27:07
well we're having yeah John Mir shimer
00:27:08
and Jeffrey Sachs are speaking tomorrow
00:27:11
so they're doing a Tay T but yeah if you
00:27:13
want to stick around and we could have
00:27:14
maybe you and John we can work that I
00:27:17
have a I have a question you got you've
00:27:18
got some time right now right now you me
00:27:21
no no go go on last um last year this
00:27:24
would be like a many hours conversation
00:27:26
well last year one of the most popular
00:27:29
things that come out of this was a talk
00:27:31
about regulatory capture by Bill Gurley
00:27:33
and you mentioned that the first thing
00:27:35
Bill
00:27:37
Gurley that's cheering for Bill and not
00:27:39
regulatory capture cheering for bill um
00:27:42
he's great but you said that when you
00:27:43
left the times you threw yourself sort
00:27:45
of like head first into the into the
00:27:48
regulatory capture of the law and
00:27:50
medicine and whatnot uh what did you
00:27:52
learn I would say regulatory capture I
00:27:53
would say ideological capture
00:27:55
ideological capture okay so what did you
00:27:56
learn
00:27:58
I mean we've published so much on this
00:28:00
but but basically the way in which
00:28:03
institutions intended for one purpose
00:28:05
have come to serve another another one
00:28:08
or another God and you know in the case
00:28:11
of medicine which I would think would be
00:28:14
maybe the most alarming in the law um
00:28:17
not actually intending I mean the
00:28:21
purpose of medicine is to do no harm and
00:28:23
yet all of a sudden in many hospitals
00:28:26
and and medical schools across the
00:28:28
country people were being told to do
00:28:31
something very different to meet out
00:28:33
care based on race to you know to
00:28:36
shuffle young teenage girls especially
00:28:40
toward
00:28:41
irreversible changes in their bodies and
00:28:44
and things of that nature so a lot of it
00:28:46
comes back to the fundamental theme we
00:28:49
we've been sort of been circling in this
00:28:50
conversation which is that ideological
00:28:53
change that's happened um and I think
00:28:56
just to go back to where where we began
00:28:58
this conversation it's like where did
00:29:00
all this come from I I don't think it's
00:29:01
possible to understand these changes and
00:29:04
like the Rebel Alliance maybe that's
00:29:06
risen up against it without talking
00:29:09
about technology and and the reality
00:29:12
that we like 20 years ago 30 years ago I
00:29:16
would have just left the New York Times
00:29:17
and and just maybe opened a diner done
00:29:20
done something completely different this
00:29:21
this would not have been available to me
00:29:23
and it's kind of
00:29:25
unbelievable what's what's been made
00:29:27
Poss I by technology I mean I'm not
00:29:30
someone who I've never managed a person
00:29:32
in my life I never raised money in my
00:29:34
life I never imagin I'd be an
00:29:35
entrepreneur I can barely log into
00:29:37
substack and now I have a company with
00:29:39
50 full-time employees it's unbelievable
00:29:42
that's amazing yeah congratulations
00:29:43
that's founder mode and I that's the
00:29:46
real founder mode and and and I I would
00:29:48
just add that you know what the truth is
00:29:50
on any particular issue is not always
00:29:53
obvious it's a process to figure it out
00:29:56
and so we have to have these
00:29:57
alternatives in order to debate the
00:29:59
issues and then arrive at the truth and
00:30:01
you again compare what people said to
00:30:03
what actually happens and you try to
00:30:05
figure out who you can trust and the
00:30:07
good news is that today we have these
00:30:09
Alternatives we have alternative media
00:30:11
of which you're a major part all in PO
00:30:13
is a major part and I think these
00:30:15
alternatives are building in reaction to
00:30:18
basically the corruption of the
00:30:19
mainstream media which I think you're
00:30:20
spot on about I think that the the
00:30:23
challenge at least I'll say for the Free
00:30:25
Press is there are a lot of people out
00:30:28
there who their goal and they're doing
00:30:30
it beautifully is to make a lot of money
00:30:33
really quickly and to be very
00:30:36
influential as oneman bands what we are
00:30:39
trying to do is something much more
00:30:41
long-term we are trying in an age where
00:30:44
no one trusts institutions anymore and
00:30:46
they only trust individuals and
00:30:48
influencers to stealthily build an
00:30:51
institution and what that requires is a
00:30:53
kind of discipline to give up and we do
00:30:57
a lot of things that would really stuff
00:31:00
our pockets in the short term not the
00:31:02
Russians but other things um for the
00:31:05
sake of building what is to us the thing
00:31:08
of the most value which is trust with
00:31:11
the audience and they I believe see us
00:31:15
doing that and see us publishing things
00:31:17
that might enrage them that they might
00:31:20
disagree with that might provoke them
00:31:21
and we think that that's just a part of
00:31:23
that that is fundamental to our mission
00:31:26
it's great ladies and gentlemen Harry
00:31:28
Weiss thank you
00:31:31
[Music]
00:31:32
[Applause]
