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awesome hi everyone my name is adina i'm
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the ceo of divi homes it's a pleasure to
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meet y'all
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thank you for being here
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[Music]
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all right so while they're pulling that
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up i will just kick it off and get
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started because we're about three hours
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behind at this point um
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my passions are at the the crossroads of
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finance housing and and inequality and
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trying to solve all of these
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i'll get into what my company does at
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the very end of the presentation that's
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not what i really want to focus on
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but i want to start off with a little
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story that i think explains why this is
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so important to me
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um
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when it was about the 1980s my mom
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decided to go on a little road trip with
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her friends and she was in israel and
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she was backpacking and she was
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hitchhiking and a man picked her up
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she got into that car
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fell in love and got pregnant that man
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is my my dad my mom and dad quickly got
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married immigrated back to the u.s and
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found themselves very young 21 and 24
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pregnant and trying to figure out what
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they were going to do with their life
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they couldn't get a mortgage to buy a
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house and settle down and be able to
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raise a family but they were fortunate
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enough to find a woman who gave them
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seller financing on their house
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so this woman financed the purchase of
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the house to let my parents pay an
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installment and in that house they had
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three additional kids i'm the third of
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four
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and then eventually we're able to get a
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mortgage take cash out of that house and
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use the cash that they took out to pay
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for all four kids to go to college
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and i tell you this because to me this
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is the heart of the american dream which
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is being able to provide a better life
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for your children than what you actually
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have
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and so so much of what we're going to be
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talking about here is why that american
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dream has disappeared for so many
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americans and what we at dibby are doing
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to try to address that so let's dive in
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i have these bright blue slides the goal
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is to just give you the takeaway so you
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don't have to figure it out i try to
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stick to uh one chart per slide to keep
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it super simple and i'll explain it but
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this is the the takeaway that you should
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get from the next couple of data points
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i'm going to give you which is wealth
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inequality is rising across america
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i think you all know this chart which is
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that 99
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of wealth
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is owned by the top 50 and the bottom 50
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percent only owned one percent of wealth
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here in the united states so this this
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chart shows distribution of wealth by
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what your your
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um household income is so the top 10
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percent of owners uh sorry the top 10
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percent own 76 percent of wealth the
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next 40 on 23 of wealth you sum that up
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99 of wealth is owned by the top 50
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and what's even more interesting is that
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the rich are getting richer while the
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poor kind of stay at the same level of
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income and so what this chart actually
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shows is income percentiles so on the
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x-axis the zero is if you're at the very
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bottom end of the income spectrum at 100
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you're at the top end and then the blue
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line is how much income or family
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household wealth you had in 1963 almost
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50 years ago
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and the yellow line
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shows how much wealth you have today so
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if you were in the top one percent
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your household wealth was on average two
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million dollars 50 years ago
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today it's about 10 million or a 5x
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growth
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and if you were in the bottom 50th
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percentile you haven't seen your
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household income change almost at all
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and so you might be asking okay why is
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this the case is it that wealthy people
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are making more in salary i i would say
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while there are some salary
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differentials the main driver is asset
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appreciation access to assets when i say
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assets i'm going to use that pretty
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liberally it can mean stocks it can mean
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housing it can mean small businesses
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direct investments but all of that i'm
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going to group together as investments
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in assets
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and so you can see this is a really
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simple chart where i took what were the
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20-year returns by income as well as
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asset and you can see that household
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income has not appreciated much in the
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last 20 years whereas the s p 500 as
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well as if you owned equity in your home
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you'd see an increase in your value of
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over a hundred percent
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you want to see something even crazier
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you get leverage on your home equity
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which is something that most of you some
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of you might get get uh leverage against
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your equity that you mess in the stock
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market but most of you aren't
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um you can actually lever up your home
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equity right and so you can take out
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debt that's cheap because it's backed
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and guaranteed by the government
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eighty percent leverage at what has been
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almost three percent cost of capital
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no one else can get that sort of cost of
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capital at that sort of leverage um
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you're forced to amortize so you build
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up savings in the property and a house
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has dual utility you cannot live in the
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s p 500 you can live in a home
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and so if we click on um and so the
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takeaway has to be those who own assets
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are more likely to have a higher net
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worth and so this is a chart that i sold
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from the new york times so credit goes
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to them but if you look on the left hand
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side the blue bars all of the bars kind
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of sum up to 100 going across so the
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blue bars is the percent of family so
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bottom 50 percentile of income earners
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50
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50 to 80th percentile 30
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so on
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and what this is saying is that the
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bottom 50 percent of
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families and households own one percent
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of overall equities in the market and
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when you look at directly held stocks so
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stocks in the stock market they own zero
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percent right and if you look at the top
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one percent of
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of of income earners
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they own 38 of overall equities which
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includes like retirement accounts and
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everything remember i said that big
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asset class
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and they own 51
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of all directly held stocks
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so if you ask why are the rich getting
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richer it is because they own assets
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assets compound over time there's also a
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ton of tax benefits around owning assets
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long-term capital gains which i'm sure
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you all know
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um another way to look at this which i
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think is really interesting is your net
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worth
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um
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by renter versus homeowner homeowners on
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average have 75 times
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the net worth of a renter this is all
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census data it's all publicly available
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i'm happy to share it
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and i think what is is so interesting
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here is that i'm not saying the answer
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is home ownership
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you want to invest in crypto great you
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want to put your money into the s p 500
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even better however the majority of
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americans as you just saw on this slide
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don't invest in equities as much right
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it's just hard to conceptualize whereas
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a house is actually pretty easy to
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conceptualize
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and because the debt amortizes you're
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forced to save over time it's highly
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illiquid it's hard to take your money
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out of it it is what makes a great
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investment and so when you look at why
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this chart is so high it's not because
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homeowners are saving a tremendous
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amount more right it's they're saving
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they're putting money into the equity of
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the home they're being forced to in
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their payments
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so despite the benefits of home
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ownership it is starting to become
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fundamentally inaccessible
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so this is a chart really simple of of
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average home prices there's a bunch of
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different ways you
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different sources you can measure home
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prices but you can see that at the
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bottom of the recession which was
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actually 2012 for home prices the
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average home price in america was 163
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000
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um and that today it's closer to 338
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thousand dollars that's a 200 percent
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increase in ten years at the same time
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real median income has only increased
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from about fifty seven thousand dollars
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to sixty seven thousand dollars
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um so what has caused prices for homes
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to increase so dramatically if i do i'm
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pretty sure that none of this is new
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news you all have been seeing how much
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home prices have have risen for those of
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you who have bought uh while interest
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rates are three were still three percent
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good on you because that is probably the
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lowest they're going to be in a really
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really long time
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but here's the quick history which is um
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from 2000 to 2008 we were building on
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average one and a half billion homes
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that's our million homes a year not
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billion gosh
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one and a half million homes a year and
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that equated to roughly four to five
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months of inventory
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months of inventory mean that if if
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there were no more homes that were put
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on the market how long would it take to
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sell all those homes four to five months
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and that's generally considered a
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balanced real estate market
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then what happened the global financial
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crisis there was a mass number of
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foreclosures the market was completely
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flooded and all of a sudden you could
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buy an existing home that was going into
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foreclosure for 163 000
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and so builders who had to pay for labor
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for lumber right to actually build a
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house couldn't build a house for that
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cheap
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the the cheapest that a home builder can
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build the home is roughly 200 000
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all in cost right and so if you can sit
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there and you're like i can only build a
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house for two hundred thousand dollars
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which means i have to sell it for more
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than two hundred thousand dollars well i
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can't compete with existing foreclosure
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inventory so homebuilders stopped
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building they went from building 1.5
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uh million a year down to about 750
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000 homes a year after that and it
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stayed like that until about 2015
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and at that point a lot of the inventory
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that came from foreclosures were
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absorbed and they started actually
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rebuilding again but they didn't rebuild
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at the same rate that they had prior
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we're rebuilding right now we're
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building probably new inventories one
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point i'd say 1.2 million
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annually and so then this massive thing
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happened which is which is covid and all
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of a sudden everyone went from living in
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their studio apartment to saying i need
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a backyard i need extra room for child
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care and i need an office and there was
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this mass spike in demand after years of
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not building enough inventory and so
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what happens when demand starts to spike
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and there's not a lot of supply while
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home prices took off which you can kind
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of see right over here is that little
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spiky part at the very end
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and what's amazing is that it's actually
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just gotten incredibly harder not just
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because home prices are getting more
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expensive but because of the impact that
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that has in terms of how much you
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actually need to save to buy a home so
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the left-hand chart shows
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the yellow bar is your average down
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payment and you can see that that's
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grown roughly 2x at the same time median
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income in the last 20 years hasn't gone
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up so on an absolute dollar basis you
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now need to save 2x the amount that you
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would have had to save back in 2000 so
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one it's down payment is an issue
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the second issue is that post global
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financial crisis rightly so the
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government tightened underwriting
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requirements they said you know what
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turns out when you cause a global
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worldwide recession we should maybe
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change how we're doing things and so
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they pulled back and said we're going to
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make you have a higher fico in order to
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be able to purchase a home which is
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probably the right answer but also
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pretty painful because people don't wake
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up one day
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they're like i no longer need a home
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right and so if you take a look at this
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the average fico for home buyers is well
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above what the average fico is for the
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general population and anyone who's
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under 45 years is even lower because
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fico cures over time and so what does
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this all come together and say is that
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um unless you you know have the ability
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to save 2x the amount
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unless you are above average in terms of
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fico when you're starting off your life
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in a starter home you're going to
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struggle to actually be able to buy a
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home
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now this chart seems a little confusing
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but i think it's really important to
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look at and understand so i'll walk you
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through it so what this chart shows is
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is mortgage rates three percent six
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percent nine percent we were at three
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percent call it a year ago we're at i
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think five and a half percent right now
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is roughly where the 30-year fixed is
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and then nine percent who knows maybe
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hopefully not in the future and that
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says what is your mortgage tax and
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insurance payments what you have to
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include for a 400 000 home which is
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roughly average home price and i know a
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little different in miami but this is
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kind of across the u.s
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and then i said how much income do you
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need
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in order to get that mortgage and you
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can see that your income that you need
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goes from about 94 000 of household
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income up to about 160 000 of household
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income
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and then i said how many households
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could qualify for that because there's
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data on on how much income households
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make across the u.s they're 126 million
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households in the us and you can see
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that historically almost 40 percent uh
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sorry 30 percent of households actually
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could afford a mortgage where we were
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before and that number today has gone
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down to now 22
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and will go down to about less than 15
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percent of people who can actually get a
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mortgage on a home this is insane
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so over here i kind of i like to just
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overly simplify things so i kind of put
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it here which is a ten thousand dollar
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increase in home prices means one
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million fewer families can own a home
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or a one percent increase in mortgage
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rates mean five million families can
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actually own a home so we're in a little
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bit of a tough situation here
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um so when i started divi the goal was
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to help solve wealth inequality by
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giving americans access to assets this
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is the sole goal the purpose what i
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really believe in
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um which is that access to assets and
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compounding
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uh wealth in something that you cannot
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easily pull your money out of and you
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just leave it there is the way that we
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can help people generate wealth for
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their families for their children for
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their next generation
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um so the way divi works is very similar
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to a mortgage except it's not a mortgage
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uh you come to our website you apply we
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give you a budget so we might say hey
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you're approved for 500 000 home in
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miami go out shopping you shop with your
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realtor the same way you would with a
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mortgage and when you're ready to buy a
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home you just let us know what home you
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choose we say great we put out an all
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quick close offer for you so you can
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compete with every other investor offer
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that's out there we'll take care of it
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for you
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because we know how to bid on these
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homes
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we then take care of the inspections we
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cover all closing costs all fees
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everything we head to closing and you
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commit either one to two percent down
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which is about a tenth of a usual down
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payment down payments are ten to twenty
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percent we say one to two percent and
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that's your initial equity in the home
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you own that that is yours and then you
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move in you make one monthly payment
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part rent part equity the same way a
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mortgage is principal and interest
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and the equity piece builds up your
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percent ownership we let you build up to
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10 percent over the course of three
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years at any point in time you can get a
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mortgage or refinance and take us out or
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you can cash out your equity and walk
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away hopefully with tens of thousands of
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dollars saved up
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so that is how we work
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we operate in 16 metros our biggest ones
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are georgia texas and florida florida's
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a big one up in tampa
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the average income of our customers is
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about a 50 000 to 150 000 household
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income uh 50 of our customers are people
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of color and 80 of our transactions are
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female female-led
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and so i think the most important thing
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is are we successful in our mission and
00:15:21
what we're trying to do um so 51 of divi
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customers who have come to the end of
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their three year lease have been able to
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buy back their home probably another 20
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on top of it aren't yet ready for
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mortgage and so we just let them build
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more equity over time and about 30
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percent of people turn over which is
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completely fine sometimes you have an
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extra kid or two and you need a bigger
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home and that's that's okay we actually
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love that people can cash out their
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money uh and continue moving on
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um over here we have what i think is one
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of the more powerful thing which is the
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average renter savings versus the
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average savings that a divi customer has
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in their home we're almost 25 times the
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savings that the average renter has and
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this is because they are building up
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equity in their property over time
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um
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over here just to show we're growing
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quickly and we're doing it profitably
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actually i think this is super important
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is you can sit here and say that you're
00:16:12
building a mission oriented company you
00:16:14
have to show scale
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you have to show growth and you have to
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show the people there is adoption and
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you're actually having an impact and so
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this year alone will deploy over a
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billion dollars of capital we measure a
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margin as the rent that we collect less
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home costs less interest so it's like a
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true
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profit all-in margin um where we're
00:16:31
almost probably going to be at about 25
00:16:33
all in profit margin
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um and now i think we have yeah thank
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you um
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uh i think that there is a video but i
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don't know if they're showing it so we
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can we can maybe go to q a for running
00:16:46
close on time okay cool thank you
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i know that friberg's
00:16:58
going to talk to you about consumer
00:16:59
credit but let me just tee up something
00:17:01
before um
00:17:02
there's a tweet i just want to read it
00:17:04
to you and maybe
00:17:06
we can use this as a jumping-off point
00:17:07
blackstone calls homes almost as
00:17:09
unaffordable
00:17:11
as a 2007 peak they just said that today
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yeah um his name is joe ziddle who's a i
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guess a senior partner there um but he
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believes a crash is unlikely due to a
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major difference which is that most
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owners
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aren't using their homes like an atm
00:17:26
like they did back then yeah um can you
00:17:29
explain
00:17:30
um sort of the broader state of housing
00:17:33
actually and sure uh why some people
00:17:35
feel like we're actually
00:17:37
okay right at the brink of a crisis
00:17:39
again and some people don't
00:17:41
okay yeah interesting so the global
00:17:44
financial crisis is very different than
00:17:45
this because it was obviously a
00:17:47
housing-led crisis where we had people
00:17:49
overextend and they didn't have enough
00:17:51
equity that was built up in their house
00:17:53
to cushion a decline in home prices i'd
00:17:55
say that this is a very different
00:17:57
situation today and i'd say that because
00:18:00
one we don't have a lot of supply
00:18:02
and so fundamentally when you're
00:18:04
thinking about pricing supply and demand
00:18:05
dynamics number one we don't have a lot
00:18:07
of supply now what you can probably
00:18:09
argue is there is an equilibrium point
00:18:11
meaning
00:18:13
interest rates are increasing which is
00:18:14
starting to stifle some demand don't get
00:18:16
me wrong we're actually seeing that a
00:18:17
bit in the market
00:18:19
and then there's new home built that are
00:18:21
coming online and at some point there's
00:18:22
going to be enough inventory coming
00:18:24
online
00:18:25
that there's going to be enough supply
00:18:27
and a decrease enough in demand that it
00:18:29
will impact home prices now i don't know
00:18:31
that that's going to be in the next six
00:18:32
months i actually think it's going to be
00:18:33
more like 12 to 18 months and i don't
00:18:35
think that it means that there's going
00:18:37
to be a mass fall off like it was in the
00:18:39
global financial crisis
00:18:40
but it will slow down the price
00:18:43
of which homes are growing out how much
00:18:44
of this is just the like
00:18:47
miscast housing policy that a lot of
00:18:50
states and cities have i'll give you an
00:18:51
example of where i live i just got an
00:18:53
you know an email from our mayor and
00:18:56
basically what it said is like in the
00:18:57
state of california now they've
00:18:59
basically said you need to have a
00:19:00
certain amount of housing density
00:19:02
they're trying to figure out how to do
00:19:03
it they're not going to build high-rises
00:19:05
because those aren't allowed then they
00:19:07
you know you allow these adus to get
00:19:08
built that qualify and it's all
00:19:10
gamesmanship because
00:19:12
as far as i can read it the nimbyism of
00:19:15
not wanting to have high density homes
00:19:18
and that seems to be a very just
00:19:19
american phenomenon
00:19:21
well i actually think that it's a little
00:19:23
bit that the markets just react slower
00:19:25
like this isn't the houses aren't equity
00:19:28
markets they don't just you can't just
00:19:29
buy and sell rapidly it's like oh i want
00:19:31
to build an entire community of homes
00:19:33
five years i'm going to have to now plan
00:19:35
in order to get the government licensing
00:19:37
the regulation the permits to actually
00:19:39
build
00:19:40
and so you see a problem you're like oh
00:19:43
home prices are increasing and then it's
00:19:44
like
00:19:45
five years later you can actually do
00:19:47
something to actually impact it and by
00:19:49
then the entire market has like
00:19:51
completely changed and we've rush
00:19:53
invaded ukraine and covid took over and
00:19:55
there's a global pandemic and so
00:19:57
i think the bigger issue is that the
00:19:59
housing market
00:20:00
can't react as quick to keep up with
00:20:03
public equity markets
00:20:05
and a lot of that is because the
00:20:06
government highly regulates the building
00:20:09
of homes which takes a tremendous amount
00:20:10
of time and especially right now where
00:20:12
builders are like
00:20:14
i think that most builders miss their q1
00:20:16
numbers how many houses they were
00:20:18
actually going to build by almost 60
00:20:20
which was mostly supply chain so even
00:20:22
when they rush it
00:20:24
a lot of other factors are impacting it
00:20:26
and then what do you think about the
00:20:28
because i've talked about this a little
00:20:29
bit on the pot because it's something
00:20:30
that's really i think poorly understood
00:20:33
but important in my opinion where fannie
00:20:35
mae and freddie change the upper bounds
00:20:37
of mortgage of mortgages where you know
00:20:39
you can you they can be conforming now
00:20:41
at like a million dollars whereas before
00:20:43
they used to be considered jumbos and
00:20:44
yeah anyways the reason i'm asking this
00:20:46
question is i feel like there's a lot of
00:20:48
financialization in engineering here in
00:20:50
the housing market
00:20:53
that
00:20:54
is poorly understood
00:20:55
that in some ways tricks consumers to
00:20:58
getting in a little bit over their ski
00:20:59
tips and then in a moment like this
00:21:01
where rates rise their jobs a little bit
00:21:03
more insecure this is when all of the
00:21:05
parade of terribles happened yeah so we
00:21:07
just added a wonderful woman uh her name
00:21:09
is kimberly johnson's as actually her
00:21:10
first independent she was the ceo of
00:21:12
fannie mae and i brought her on to like
00:21:13
fully understand as much of this as
00:21:15
possible
00:21:16
um so the last time the government
00:21:19
changed the underwriting criteria it led
00:21:22
to the global financial crisis so if you
00:21:24
ask them if they're like really excited
00:21:25
to do it another time they're like no no
00:21:27
we we learned our lesson once um so i'd
00:21:30
say that they're actually because
00:21:32
they've been under conservatorship so
00:21:33
most of fannie mae's operations have
00:21:35
been very dictated by the government um
00:21:38
they're not actually taking probably the
00:21:40
level of risk that they should in this
00:21:41
current market and what i mean by that
00:21:43
is if home prices go up by 30 percent
00:21:47
the what actually qualifies as a
00:21:49
conventional mortgage needs to go up by
00:21:51
30 percent
00:21:53
um but that is such a massive change for
00:21:56
government to make because they're so
00:21:58
shell-shocked i think
00:21:59
from having made a change before and it
00:22:01
having such a negative ripple effect so
00:22:03
when i you know spoke to kimberly her
00:22:05
her response was no no we're not here to
00:22:08
start making these changes to make it
00:22:09
easier for consumers to get a home
00:22:11
that's your job
00:22:12
you disrupt us you do that i'm not here
00:22:15
to take risk
00:22:16
but you but they felt the government
00:22:18
just felt like they still like i
00:22:21
they felt like that was just a natural
00:22:23
change that had to happen
00:22:25
raising the the upper bound yeah i mean
00:22:27
of course everyone is what's actually
00:22:29
even crazier is i'm waiting for them to
00:22:31
actually raise the debt to income ratio
00:22:33
because of what i showed you earlier
00:22:35
which is if your income is not
00:22:36
increasing
00:22:38
and mortgage rates are going up and home
00:22:40
values are going up you now need to
00:22:41
spend a larger percentage of your income
00:22:44
on housing that's it's
00:22:46
that's a lending change right but isn't
00:22:48
that up to the individual banks they
00:22:49
could change they put overlays on top of
00:22:51
fannie mae's requirements but fannie mae
00:22:53
because they actually put so when the
00:22:55
global financial crisis happened there
00:22:56
were such uh very high fees and
00:22:58
penalties that went for banks that
00:23:00
didn't have really strict overlays that
00:23:02
actually had a ton of defaults and so
00:23:03
now banks are super nervous
00:23:05
to lend to people and actually take risk
00:23:08
that they actually follow fannie mae's
00:23:10
guidelines very strictly and actually
00:23:12
put overlays on top of it so they
00:23:13
actually are more conservative a lot of
00:23:15
times than what the underwriting
00:23:16
requirements are
00:23:18
and so in order for them to actually
00:23:20
start to take risk i think fannie mae
00:23:21
would have to encourage and they'd have
00:23:23
to do it in such a way that they don't
00:23:24
penalize yesterday we had uh bill gurley
00:23:27
and brad gershner on if you saw that
00:23:28
panel didn't hear about it now okay yeah
00:23:32
so you did see it or not okay okay um
00:23:36
we looked at all of assets being
00:23:38
inflated yeah uh from
00:23:41
used cars to nfts and everything in
00:23:44
between
00:23:45
uh and we've now seen compression and we
00:23:47
talked about this on the pod in every
00:23:49
single sector yeah
00:23:51
except
00:23:52
housing yep and so we're all sitting
00:23:54
here wondering what are the chances
00:23:57
that housing collapses i was talking to
00:24:00
um my pal uh palmer backstage remember
00:24:03
new bestie
00:24:06
interestingly we went backstage and no
00:24:08
no no don't ruin it every week no we
00:24:10
just sat there we had a great
00:24:11
conversation about ten different things
00:24:12
it was pretty interesting um
00:24:14
so
00:24:15
what are the chances
00:24:17
and we were talking about the chances of
00:24:18
a collapse he said oh maybe it's 30
00:24:20
chance this real estate collapse we're
00:24:21
watching your talk 30 chance maybe the
00:24:23
the real estate market collapse
00:24:25
what are the chances in your mind being
00:24:27
so close to it that we will see housing
00:24:30
collapse and this be a bubble look
00:24:32
there's there's no question that housing
00:24:35
growth is going to slow down
00:24:37
if you look down but i'm asking you guys
00:24:40
price prices pricing new homes prices
00:24:42
pricing the growth will slow now whether
00:24:44
it goes negative or not i think is more
00:24:46
a matter of what the economy does over
00:24:49
the next 24 months
00:24:51
um but i actually think that what we
00:24:52
will definitively see which we have seen
00:24:54
i'd say in the last two weeks we've seen
00:24:56
a slow down um in the in the rate of
00:24:59
growth for homes um now the global
00:25:02
financial crisis was very different than
00:25:04
than what we're seeing today and if you
00:25:06
anybody
00:25:07
bottom of the the stock market for the
00:25:09
global financial crisis
00:25:11
3909 bottom of housing prices june of
00:25:14
2012. three years later
00:25:17
why because the housing market moves so
00:25:19
slowly compared to the equities market
00:25:22
and so it is not surprising that housing
00:25:24
is going to be the last thing that's
00:25:25
going to actually start to to compress
00:25:28
in terms of people people live there for
00:25:29
a while they can afford their mortgages
00:25:31
then their income drops and they can't
00:25:32
afford their mortgages then they get
00:25:33
foreclosed then it's six months later
00:25:36
the stock market drop and you're like i
00:25:37
should sell my home that's going to take
00:25:38
30 days then i have to find someone oh
00:25:40
that's going to take another 30 days oh
00:25:42
then i have to wait till they move in
00:25:43
that's another 30 days and so it's three
00:25:44
months before you can like
00:25:46
make a trade i think you can't log on to
00:25:48
your robin hood account and be like yeah
00:25:50
i know the market's thinking let's get
00:25:51
rid of our house can i can i
00:25:53
shift the conversation for a second um
00:25:55
you're a founder of a unicorn yeah
00:25:58
raised the big round yeah
00:26:00
uh congratulations thank you
00:26:02
uh
00:26:04
time to write
00:26:05
so well this is what i was just gonna
00:26:07
ask you can you talk to us about your
00:26:09
mindset in this moment now
00:26:12
in terms of your valuation in terms of
00:26:14
your cash in terms of your burn in terms
00:26:15
of your employees
00:26:17
what's what's sort of front of mind what
00:26:19
are you doing same different
00:26:21
yeah um i'd say so we raised um a 200
00:26:26
million round from tiger uh it was
00:26:28
preempted um
00:26:29
back about six months ago or maybe even
00:26:32
nine months ago at this point
00:26:34
um
00:26:35
and i think that it's actually
00:26:36
interesting because i listen to you guys
00:26:37
on the pod um the besties and i think
00:26:40
that
00:26:41
you know for me as a founder when i was
00:26:43
going through that moment i was like
00:26:44
well
00:26:45
[ __ ] man it's a black friday sale like
00:26:47
i can raise a ton of cash i'm getting
00:26:49
preempted left and right and so i
00:26:51
actually think
00:26:52
that founders
00:26:54
like obviously i should have played the
00:26:56
game that i played which is like why
00:26:58
wouldn't i raise a ton of capital and
00:27:00
take less dilution there was nothing
00:27:02
that was the right chess move at that
00:27:04
point in time and now kind of to your
00:27:06
point
00:27:08
and by the way it's not founders fault
00:27:09
that the market got overheated
00:27:11
you guys gave us the terms you did the
00:27:13
rational thing
00:27:14
[Music]
00:27:16
by the way don't point it yet you did
00:27:18
the right no no you did the rational
00:27:19
thing rational yeah completely and so
00:27:22
but now but now now you have to just now
00:27:24
i'd say look divvy we make i don't know
00:27:27
we haven't probably put out there but
00:27:28
hundreds of millions of dollars in
00:27:29
revenue i burn
00:27:31
less than
00:27:32
i don't know five
00:27:35
to ten million a month to less than five
00:27:37
million a month um we have 300 employees
00:27:40
and do i think you have to be
00:27:41
conservative yes do i think you had to
00:27:43
be conservative along the entire way of
00:27:45
building a company yes every second i
00:27:48
thought my company can die at any moment
00:27:51
right a hundred percent
00:27:52
and i run my company like that my cup
00:27:54
they
00:27:55
my employees joke they're like you're
00:27:56
the most frugal person ever like every
00:27:58
single time it's awesome we need to
00:27:59
spend it i'm like
00:28:04
thank you yeah that's awesome do you um
00:28:06
do you rely on your late stage investors
00:28:08
in moments like this to like help you
00:28:10
navigate or how do you do it do you rely
00:28:11
on your early stage
00:28:13
first of all i don't think you rely on
00:28:14
investors ever yeah
00:28:16
no i don't mean that offensively i think
00:28:18
that some investors are great but no
00:28:19
one's building this company with you
00:28:21
i am building this company
00:28:23
with my employees
00:28:25
but ain't nobody else there with me and
00:28:27
so when times get tough um it is on you
00:28:30
to make sure you can have a path to
00:28:32
casual profitability if you can actually
00:28:34
raise another round of capital um but
00:28:36
you try to support your employees and
00:28:38
work together to kind of weather through
00:28:39
this but i don't expect any of my
00:28:42
investors to show up with a hail mary
00:28:44
and
00:28:45
um i think that it's on me to run a
00:28:46
really
00:28:47
strong profitable business and so any
00:28:50
changes from
00:28:51
june to now or not really just kind of
00:28:53
stay the course
00:28:54
get to the cashflow break even um like
00:28:57
meaning nothing to accelerate it or
00:28:59
so i think we plan out a bunch of
00:29:01
different cases so we always have the
00:29:03
base case target case and then what i
00:29:05
call the off ramp which is cash flow
00:29:08
positive
00:29:09
and every week my cfo ceo and i get on a
00:29:12
call and we just say how's the market
00:29:14
doing how do we feel do we want to
00:29:16
switch from our base to our target case
00:29:18
do we want to go down the off-ramp path
00:29:20
nope this week feels the same the all-in
00:29:22
podcast didn't change our sentiment and
00:29:24
we continue on on monday morning as
00:29:27
planned we're all in sentiment index i
00:29:29
like it
00:29:31
it's it's great to um to have you here
00:29:33
and i had had you on my podcast earlier
00:29:35
and i had told you like god i thought
00:29:37
this was gonna be the most boring
00:29:38
podcast and it was one of the best of
00:29:39
the year
00:29:40
uh you are uh
00:29:42
thank you i don't know if that's a
00:29:44
complimentary tell us how you really
00:29:46
feel yeah you know it was like a boring
00:29:47
topic and and uh you you actually do it
00:29:49
again please tell us
00:29:52
like a really boring topic but a great
00:29:54
guest and you made it really really um
00:29:57
both really educational i think the
00:29:59
audience they're still fully until right
00:30:01
now
00:30:03
wow
00:30:04
wait uh
00:30:07
day one i do have as we're heading
00:30:09
towards ending i do have an intro oh
00:30:13
because i thought we were all getting i
00:30:15
tried this it didn't work
00:30:16
well i thought we were all gonna get
00:30:18
interest anyone
00:30:22
[Applause]
00:30:27
which i feel like i should give which is
00:30:29
um are y'all ready for it
00:30:33
i'm in miami chilling with the besties
00:30:35
on this stage in a minefield of testes
00:30:41
j cal kindly invited me to share my
00:30:43
passion so here goes in true all in
00:30:46
fashion i play the housing long game as
00:30:49
the stock market will jitter but solving
00:30:51
inequality is less flashy than almost
00:30:54
buying twitter
00:30:55
i'm the rent to own leader in the prop
00:30:57
tech arena i'd like to reintroduce
00:30:59
myself my name is adina
00:31:01
[Applause]
00:31:08
[Applause]
00:31:13
[Music]
00:31:23
and they've just gone crazy with them
00:31:29
[Music]
00:31:44
we should all just get a room and just
00:31:46
have one big huge orgy because they're
00:31:47
all just useless it's like this like
00:31:49
sexual tension but they just need to
00:31:50
release
00:31:51
[Music]
00:31:55
your feet
00:31:56
[Music]
00:31:57
we need to get
00:32:01
[Music]
