00:00:00
I just got a haircut with a with a new
00:00:02
person she was like I'm like do what you
00:00:04
want this is what she did okay well let
00:00:06
me know who she is jamat and I will'll
00:00:08
go beat her up and get them get your
00:00:09
money back did she feather your bangs
00:00:11
and blow your hair up she did she gave
00:00:13
you a blow didn't she it's starting
00:00:15
already okay no but that's a blow dryer
00:00:17
just yes right she blow dry your hair at
00:00:19
the end she gave me a little yeah that's
00:00:21
not sustainable so you can't tell what
00:00:22
the quality of the haircuts like because
00:00:23
you're never going to do that again you
00:00:25
don't have the skill I've never
00:00:26
blowdried my hair in my life no I
00:00:28
understand that then this is why because
00:00:29
if you get the blow and it looks good in
00:00:30
the blow just say blowout please just
00:00:33
say blowout the forward why what are we
00:00:35
six just grow up you the way you're
00:00:38
saying it you're saying it to provoke a
00:00:39
reaction come on no I'm not such a liar
00:00:43
I love it tell us about what your rules
00:00:45
for blows are what I'm saying is if you
00:00:47
get a haircut and and you get a blow
00:00:50
it's very hard for you to know no but
00:00:53
I'm serious it's very hard for you to
00:00:55
know what it's going to look like the
00:00:57
next day when you take a shower and when
00:01:00
you don't you know blow it it's true oh
00:01:03
you're saying the self blow can't match
00:01:05
the stylus blow it's just important when
00:01:07
you get a haircut with a new stylist or
00:01:09
a hairdresser or a barer yes you cannot
00:01:12
let them blow you he's not happy with
00:01:14
the ending got it it was an unhappy
00:01:17
ending because when you blow yourself
00:01:20
shth which people have accused you of
00:01:21
blowing yourself on this very program
00:01:24
when you blow yourself it's not going to
00:01:25
come out the way it did it won't be as
00:01:28
fabulous every time I've blown myself
00:01:30
it's been
00:01:34
perfect let your winners
00:01:37
ride Rainman
00:01:41
David and instead we open source it to
00:01:44
the fans and they've just gone
00:01:46
[Music]
00:01:49
crazy all right everybody welcome back
00:01:51
to the all in podcast I'm your host jpow
00:01:55
from Japan here JP cutting turns in the
00:02:01
Seco and at Ean I and we have an
00:02:04
incredible lineup today as always the
00:02:07
chairman dictator chamath is here to
00:02:10
reign supreme how are you doing brother
00:02:13
good how are you what are you wearing
00:02:15
exactly I'm just wearing my kimono as I
00:02:18
want to do uh here on the all-in podcast
00:02:20
why are you speaking in Elizabethan
00:02:22
English I just decided in 2025 I'm going
00:02:25
to live my best life and I'm going to do
00:02:28
everything anybody ask me to do
00:02:30
something I'm saying yes oh I'm I'm GNA
00:02:33
ask you a bunch of stuff next weekend
00:02:34
then I got so many ideas I got a list
00:02:36
I'm gonna ask you to do all sorts of
00:02:37
it's epic I'm doing it yeah okay so uh
00:02:40
it's a and uh yeah I'm I'm over the moon
00:02:43
right now and then I'll be going to the
00:02:46
inauguration to see all my
00:02:48
friends and celebrate the big Trump
00:02:50
Victory and tape an episode there with
00:02:52
us of course David freeberg your
00:02:55
resident sulan of Science and not a
00:02:57
moment too soon we have so much to talk
00:02:58
about what's the background here
00:03:01
those are some dead trees
00:03:03
with ma Fuji in the background yeah
00:03:06
that's a c basically Jason cissa
00:03:08
landscape while you've been um
00:03:11
gallivanting and being a diletant your
00:03:13
original adopted home state is burning
00:03:15
to the ground ah yes I know about this I
00:03:19
got off the ski lift and I saw this
00:03:21
after I had posted like oh my life is
00:03:23
amazing and I was like oh my God you
00:03:25
know you can totally and everybody
00:03:27
replied like are you the and I'm like oh
00:03:31
my Lord this is unbelievable we'll
00:03:33
obviously talk about that so then you
00:03:36
promoted the Tweet yes I put $500 behind
00:03:39
it to boost to try to get my ratings up
00:03:41
no I actually literally deleted it
00:03:42
because I I posted a and I never do that
00:03:44
but I posted a video where I was like oh
00:03:45
my God it's incredible and I was like
00:03:47
you know what this is the wrong time for
00:03:49
it so a little Grace there folks and I
00:03:53
am so happy to have here on Allin Idol
00:03:58
the one the only my good friend cyan
00:04:01
banister no our good friend she's my
00:04:03
good friend before you guys met her so
00:04:05
sure she's ours but I've been friends
00:04:07
with her longer so my good friend Sayan
00:04:09
B and our good friend and our bestie
00:04:11
let's just leave it at that it doesn't
00:04:12
have to be a competition for who Sayan
00:04:14
likes best we'll ask her to rate at the
00:04:15
end of the episode say welcome to the
00:04:17
program yeah thanks for having me I
00:04:19
appreciate it it's nice to see everyone
00:04:22
Jason you want to tell people about
00:04:24
sence background yeah do an epic rant on
00:04:26
cence Epic I mean c and I fought in the
00:04:29
Clone worse together it was a long time
00:04:31
ago but uh she's a technologist
00:04:34
self-made individual who then decided
00:04:36
she would start writing small Angel
00:04:38
checks about 14 years ago literally the
00:04:41
same year I did and uh myself cyan
00:04:45
profoundly better than you let's just be
00:04:47
she's not incredible yes of course well
00:04:50
we'll get into it and uh cyan and I
00:04:53
would uh 14 years ago I guess we would
00:04:58
meet startup companies together and host
00:05:01
little events where we get together and
00:05:03
and take pitches and we invested in a
00:05:05
couple companies together and it worked
00:05:06
out very nicely for everyone involved so
00:05:10
yeah we're in a couple of companies
00:05:11
together yeah density density we were on
00:05:14
the board together for a little bit so
00:05:15
that was fun a little bit Yeah Yeah
00:05:17
Thumbtack Thumbtack actually Thumbtack
00:05:22
density and Uber I all discovered
00:05:25
through you what's which one was Uber I
00:05:27
got to check my oh I don't think I don't
00:05:30
think let me check my Google sheet here
00:05:31
I didn't know I invested in Uber let me
00:05:33
check I have to confirm that oh yeah I
00:05:34
did I but I uh at one of these events I
00:05:37
introduce Sayan to Uber that's true
00:05:38
right so found all three of those deals
00:05:41
at your event so that was really great
00:05:43
oh yeah well thanks that's a that's a
00:05:45
very nice let me try cyan is a prolific
00:05:48
angel investor correct I just said that
00:05:51
she was a part of Founders fund oh right
00:05:55
yeah she runs a seed fund called long
00:05:57
journey Ventures okay some of her hits
00:06:01
include SpaceX andil density Postmates
00:06:07
Niantic which is the makers of Pokemon
00:06:09
go
00:06:10
and Jason's favorite startup
00:06:13
Uber yeah it's been a good run it's been
00:06:15
a good run and also I'll just add a
00:06:17
wonderful human being and if you ever
00:06:20
had the chance to hang out and talk for
00:06:22
a couple of hours cyan would be one of
00:06:23
those people that you put right at the
00:06:25
top of the list I will Pro I will
00:06:26
promote sayan's interview with Tim
00:06:29
Ferris a couple weeks ago I randomly
00:06:31
turned it on I was in the car driving
00:06:33
home and then I stopped in my driveway
00:06:35
and kept listening I was just telling
00:06:36
cyan like it was a fantastic what was it
00:06:39
about two hours two and a half hour
00:06:40
interview three well it was four hours
00:06:42
he cut it to three and a half yeah and
00:06:44
then I had to drive again I listened to
00:06:46
the it's it and I was like excited to
00:06:47
get back to it which never happens for
00:06:49
me listening to long form interviews
00:06:50
like that like it was phenomenal so I
00:06:52
recommend it to everyone why did it hit
00:06:55
you so deeply couple things one C is an
00:06:57
incredible Storyteller like the the way
00:06:59
she describes her experiences her
00:07:02
history her life
00:07:04
beautiful she talks in kind of I think a
00:07:07
deep persuasive way about some of the
00:07:10
things that have shaped her her uh
00:07:12
business investing as well as kind of
00:07:14
spirituality which she mentioned earlier
00:07:16
which is not something that you'll
00:07:16
typically and you're like wait where did
00:07:18
this conversation just pivot to and then
00:07:19
you go down this whole other path with
00:07:21
her and you go on the journey with her I
00:07:22
just thought it was great so all over
00:07:24
the place it was great beautiful
00:07:26
recommend it to everyone to get to know
00:07:27
cyan oh thanks can I have you all is my
00:07:30
professional cheerleading squad from now
00:07:31
on this pretty awesome I don't like
00:07:33
talking about myself and this is great I
00:07:35
love it yeah well it's uh it's true
00:07:38
Sayan was voted most humble in our Angel
00:07:40
Investing group and I was a close second
00:07:42
so I almost won most humble in group
00:07:46
more work to do being humble I'm gonna
00:07:47
get you a t-shirt called the humblest no
00:07:50
no you have to borrow it from Cham he's
00:07:52
got he's had it for the last 10 years
00:07:54
seven or eight years ago Jason
00:07:56
approached C and I and said hey guys
00:07:58
Harvey WI has asked me to make a show
00:08:01
yes true story it's true story here's
00:08:04
how he asked me to do it in his room it
00:08:06
was really it's a true
00:08:07
story take it down and cyan myself and
00:08:10
Jason
00:08:11
went to some place in the city and we
00:08:14
taped a taped episode I have it what is
00:08:16
it called the first we taped the NBC
00:08:18
pilot for the accelerator or the
00:08:21
incubator so I had been
00:08:24
approached and did a pilot for NBC
00:08:27
called the acceler Ator and they spent
00:08:30
like a half million dollars on this and
00:08:32
you guys came on and it came out great
00:08:34
and it was just going to you know follow
00:08:35
me around ding it was very awkward
00:08:37
because afterwards they approached cyan
00:08:39
and I to do the show without when we
00:08:42
without Jason and so we had to we had to
00:08:47
decide who needs enemies we decided our
00:08:50
friendship was more important exactly I
00:08:52
don't know if I ever told you guys the
00:08:54
story but like literally they were like
00:08:56
figuring out where to put this and what
00:08:57
time slot they were like we're going to
00:08:58
do it in the summer sum because we're
00:08:59
trying to get some summer programming
00:09:01
going that's what we're going to test St
00:09:02
and then Harvey Weinstein turns out to
00:09:04
be an horrible monster and the whole
00:09:06
thing gets canceled and anything that
00:09:07
was anywhere within a hundred miles of
00:09:10
Harvey wiing got canceled including my
00:09:13
failed or forgotten reality TV show all
00:09:16
right let's get to more important things
00:09:19
there is an unbelievable tragedy
00:09:22
occurring in Los Angeles H as we're
00:09:25
speaking devastating wildfires basically
00:09:27
a formed to ring around La the most
00:09:30
destructive of which has been the
00:09:32
Palisades fire and which has stretched
00:09:35
into Malibu
00:09:37
obviously and 15,000 Acres or so have
00:09:41
been burned in that area thousands of
00:09:43
homes maybe 2,000 homes here are some
00:09:46
images they're just devastating and we
00:09:48
have a lot of friends in this area and
00:09:51
the area you're seeing on fire if you
00:09:53
don't know the Topography of Los Angeles
00:09:55
is north of Santa Monica you have
00:09:57
Palisades and then Malibu and obviously
00:10:00
east of the 405 you have things that
00:10:01
you've heard of like Bair and Brentwood
00:10:04
this area is part of a
00:10:07
mountain area called the Santa Monica
00:10:10
Mountains and they get very dry and
00:10:13
there's a phenomenon which we'll get
00:10:14
into called the Santa and winds that
00:10:17
blow really really strongly and a
00:10:20
perfect storm has happened where
00:10:22
thousands of homes and tragically five
00:10:24
lives and I'm sure there'll be more
00:10:27
unfortunately have burn down this video
00:10:30
of driving down
00:10:33
PCH if you've ever driven PCH the
00:10:35
Pacific Coast Highway these are 10 20
00:10:39
$50 million homes that are literally on
00:10:42
the Pacific Ocean the most coveted homes
00:10:45
in Los Angeles are not belir and
00:10:47
brenwood you might think that because
00:10:48
you hear them on TV but really if you
00:10:50
were an incredibly successful person you
00:10:53
would aspire to live in the Pacific
00:10:54
Palisades just west of bretwood and just
00:10:57
south of Malibu or Malibu many
00:10:59
celebrities live there many Executives
00:11:02
Etc and these homes are gone thousands
00:11:06
and thousands of homes it's this is
00:11:08
turned into the ultimate rosock test on
00:11:12
social media where people are projecting
00:11:14
into this tragedy which tragically
00:11:18
occurs every year to varying degrees and
00:11:20
maybe every 20 30 years it's an acute
00:11:23
situation we'll get into that in a
00:11:24
moment but looking at this
00:11:27
absolute just devast stating loss of
00:11:30
property and lives the lives could have
00:11:32
been a lot worse freeberg from a
00:11:35
scientific perspective maybe we'll start
00:11:37
there when you look at these wildfires
00:11:40
extreme weather global warming and you
00:11:43
look at this situation is that where
00:11:45
your mind goes or in this raw shck test
00:11:48
of how you feel about these kind of
00:11:51
tragedies and how you interpret it do
00:11:52
you go somewhere else the incompetence
00:11:54
of California's government
00:11:56
Dei Ukraine I mean everybody body is
00:11:59
superimposing on this natural disaster
00:12:02
whatever
00:12:03
their pet issues are where do you come
00:12:07
to when you look at this I don't think
00:12:10
that those are exclusive okay I think
00:12:13
that you can have had both incompetent
00:12:17
planning and execution by
00:12:21
leadership as well as have kind of
00:12:24
uncontrollable circumstances that
00:12:27
management and planning weren't
00:12:29
necessarily going to solve and I I'll
00:12:30
kind of talk about a couple of these
00:12:32
points real quick first of all like we
00:12:35
talked about when the hurricane hit a
00:12:37
couple of months ago remember and as you
00:12:39
guys know I have an office or facility
00:12:41
out in Nashville so we were exposed to
00:12:42
the flooding circumstances and we talked
00:12:44
about the the frequency of of that sort
00:12:47
of an event having been such a rare
00:12:49
occurrence becoming more common
00:12:52
similarly we're seeing more frequent
00:12:54
high high wind events in California
00:12:56
flooding events in California and hot
00:12:59
events in California if you look at this
00:13:01
link I sent out Nick in terms of the
00:13:03
total precipitation over this current
00:13:05
what's called rain
00:13:06
season the Southern California region is
00:13:09
basically at a you know call it 0% of
00:13:13
normal so this is Southern California
00:13:14
you can see that third column that's the
00:13:17
percent of normal rainfall that has been
00:13:19
experienced there's been zero rain in
00:13:22
these regions so everything is primed to
00:13:23
be very dry and then you get the Santa
00:13:26
Ana winds 100 mph winds no matter matter
00:13:29
how much underbrush you clear out no
00:13:31
matter how many trees you remove if
00:13:33
there's some Embers in the air there's a
00:13:35
100 mph wind that is going to create a
00:13:37
fire hurricane and a lot of homes are
00:13:39
going to get caught on fire so it's very
00:13:41
hard to kind of just pin the blame
00:13:43
solely on not doing underbrush clearing
00:13:45
not doing removal of trees those should
00:13:48
have happened they didn't happen that
00:13:50
was wrong that was bad policy but it
00:13:52
doesn't excuse the fact that there's a
00:13:54
natural event that happened here that
00:13:56
seems to be occurring with greater
00:13:58
frequency the I'll kind of pivot to if
00:14:00
we want to get there now maybe we'll
00:14:01
talk about that in a minute is kind of
00:14:02
the economic and the policy issues with
00:14:05
respect to the Department of Insurance
00:14:07
because okay let's get to that after we
00:14:09
go through maybe a little bit of the
00:14:10
quick reactions here I think that's
00:14:11
where that's where there's going to be
00:14:12
real pain and Devastation and that's the
00:14:14
biggest economic consequence is the role
00:14:16
that insurance has played in all this
00:14:18
stuff which we'll get to in a minute
00:14:19
yeah okay so chamath I think table
00:14:21
Stakes we all agree global warming
00:14:23
extreme weather depending on what degree
00:14:26
you believe in it there plays some
00:14:28
Factor here and this is something that
00:14:30
has reoccurred over and over again in
00:14:33
this specific re region but on social
00:14:36
media we're seeing a lot of other
00:14:38
interpretations of this event maybe your
00:14:40
thoughts on some of the other
00:14:41
interpretations and then where when you
00:14:43
look at it what do you start to think
00:14:46
about preventing this in the future or
00:14:48
maybe who's responsible what's your
00:14:50
general take on what we've seen the last
00:14:52
week I mean I'm not very sympathetic to
00:14:56
the there were 100 m hour winds not
00:14:59
because it's not true but there's been
00:15:03
enough modeling that we know that these
00:15:06
kinds of outlier weather events are
00:15:08
happening in greater and greater
00:15:11
frequency Nick maybe you can find this
00:15:13
and just put it up here but remember
00:15:15
that crazy apocalyptic video of that
00:15:18
exact same part of Southern California
00:15:21
in
00:15:22
2018 burning to the ground can we just
00:15:26
look at that all of us collectively
00:15:28
because that was six years ago this is
00:15:32
not like it was a distant memory from a
00:15:34
hundred years ago we knew in 2018 that
00:15:38
these Thea pass so this this idea that
00:15:42
we were just Lolly gagging around and
00:15:44
got caught off guard by 100 mph winds to
00:15:47
me is completely not an acceptable
00:15:49
answer we knew in 2018 that these things
00:15:52
could happen we knew across the rest of
00:15:55
the United States that these outlier
00:15:56
weather events were happening in greater
00:15:58
and greater frequenc
00:16:00
if you weren't sure you saw most of the
00:16:02
insurance companies try to dump Southern
00:16:05
California homes fire coverage three
00:16:07
months before this event happened so all
00:16:10
this data was in the realm of the
00:16:13
knowable and then when you doubleclick
00:16:16
and you get into a little bit more of
00:16:18
the details there's a level of
00:16:20
incompetence bordering on criminal
00:16:23
negligence here that we need to get to
00:16:24
the bottom of so I'll just give you a
00:16:26
couple of facts in the 19 50s the
00:16:30
average amount of Timber so wood that
00:16:33
was harvested in California was around 6
00:16:36
billion board feet per
00:16:38
year in the intervening 70 years that
00:16:41
shrank to about 1.5 billion board feet
00:16:45
and so you'd say okay well that's a 75%
00:16:49
reduction we must be making a very
00:16:51
explicit stance on conservation it turns
00:16:54
out that that's not entirely true
00:16:56
because what it left behind was near
00:16:59
nearly 163 million dead trees dead like
00:17:04
gone and so you would say well those
00:17:07
things should have been removed and the
00:17:10
problem is that then there's this
00:17:11
California Environmental Quality act
00:17:14
squa hopefully I'm pronouncing this
00:17:16
right and a whole bunch of these other
00:17:18
regulatory policies that limited the
00:17:21
ability of local governments and fire
00:17:23
management to clear these dead trees and
00:17:26
vegetation and I think that that's a
00:17:28
really big deal and when you double
00:17:30
click on that here's where you find the
00:17:32
real head
00:17:33
scratcher
00:17:35
okay multiple bills AB 2330 ab1
00:17:40
1951 AB
00:17:42
2639 all rejected by the Democrat
00:17:45
controlled legislator or worse vetoed by
00:17:48
Governor Nome that would have Exempted
00:17:50
these Wildfire prevention projects from
00:17:54
squa and other pering issues then there
00:17:56
were other bills to try to minimize the
00:17:59
risk of fires by burying power lines
00:18:01
underground SP 103 as an example went
00:18:05
nowhere didn't even get to the
00:18:07
governor's desk so I'm just a little bit
00:18:10
at a loss to explain these two bodies of
00:18:14
data one is everybody can see that these
00:18:17
events are happening Southern California
00:18:20
lived through this exact type of moment
00:18:23
just six years
00:18:25
ago all the bills that are meant to
00:18:28
prevent this
00:18:29
are blocked or
00:18:31
veto this is the ultimate expression of
00:18:34
negligence and
00:18:36
incompetence okay cyan you've uh heard
00:18:39
uh jamath and freeberg take here some
00:18:43
amount of incompetence some amount of
00:18:45
hey this keeps occurring and there might
00:18:47
be some global warming that is
00:18:48
contributing to it what do you take away
00:18:50
sure from the situation I agreee with
00:18:52
freedberg in moth you know it's it's a
00:18:55
it's a lot of everything but I also
00:18:58
think think that to add to the
00:19:00
prevention part you know other than
00:19:01
clearing out underbrush and and trees
00:19:04
and things like that you know we we
00:19:06
don't build things in the state of
00:19:09
California in a way that houses should
00:19:12
be built when you know that there are
00:19:13
fires like this so for example we have
00:19:15
more wooden roofs than we really should
00:19:17
have we should really evaluate our
00:19:19
materials that we're building things out
00:19:21
of but we also have you know down in
00:19:24
elag gundo you know this is a company
00:19:26
that I invested in Rain Maker we have
00:19:28
the ability now to Cloud seed and do
00:19:30
preventative measures to actually make a
00:19:33
region have more water and I don't
00:19:36
understand why we're not looking into
00:19:38
things like this that could have
00:19:40
prevented you know we knew that this
00:19:42
storm was coming we knew that these
00:19:43
winds were coming you know Southern
00:19:46
California shut power down I have a farm
00:19:49
down there we still don't have power
00:19:51
because they knew that most of these
00:19:53
fires are started by pg& or down power
00:19:55
lines and so they proactively shut
00:19:58
everybody down and we're still running
00:19:59
on generators and if you notice there's
00:20:01
no fires down there but they also have
00:20:03
100 m hour
00:20:05
winds yeah and you're not seeing it and
00:20:07
there's plenty of mountain ranges and
00:20:08
dryness there you know avocado Farms are
00:20:11
basically just sitting
00:20:13
fuel so I do think it's a combination of
00:20:16
all of those things and competence is
00:20:19
definitely one of
00:20:20
them yeah and I I actually lived right
00:20:24
next door to this area for a long time
00:20:25
in Brentwood and to your point about
00:20:27
roofs it seemed silly and a lot of
00:20:30
these can seem silly when you first
00:20:33
mention them which Trump looked let's
00:20:35
face it the way he says things sometimes
00:20:37
is very colorful and when he said listen
00:20:39
you're not raking like people in
00:20:40
wherever he said it Scandinavia Finland
00:20:42
are raking the forest and he was
00:20:44
absolutely 100% correct on that maybe it
00:20:47
sounded bombastic or silly when the way
00:20:49
he said it but the truth is in uh Tahoe
00:20:52
where we just were over the holidays
00:20:54
people are clearing underbrush when I
00:20:56
lived in Los Angeles people lived in the
00:20:58
Hollywood Hills would get a fine if they
00:21:00
didn't clear it but there are mountain
00:21:02
ranges that nobody owns and when you
00:21:04
showed that Suppa to pass that's the 405
00:21:06
going past the Getty Center that area
00:21:08
has got to be cleaned by the the city
00:21:10
and the government and maybe they
00:21:12
weren't doing it as much look at this
00:21:14
this is apocalyptic yeah so I I know
00:21:17
this passed very well because I would
00:21:18
drive through it J what what did
00:21:20
California learn from this what did gav
00:21:22
Nome Implement based on what happened
00:21:26
here what did the city of Los Angeles
00:21:29
based on what happened here I want to
00:21:30
just specifically know the answer to
00:21:32
those two questions yeah and I think
00:21:34
that's going to be a big part of this
00:21:36
breakdown after this happens because in
00:21:38
a lot of these cases you might lose a
00:21:40
home or two but you haven't had this
00:21:42
kind of wholesale destruction in a while
00:21:45
and uh when I lived in brenwood I had a
00:21:47
shake roof that's a fancy way of saying
00:21:49
uh shingles wood shingles and they would
00:21:51
bake in the Sun and I love this roof but
00:21:53
my neighbors who in brenwood were all 70
00:21:55
80 years old and I was right on Sunset
00:21:57
Boulevard and I could look up from my
00:21:58
house and see the place you just showed
00:22:00
which is the Getty Center and the and
00:22:02
the Sova pass on the 405 and the um and
00:22:05
Sunset
00:22:06
Boulevard I was only allowed cyan to
00:22:08
replace 30% of my roof at a time you
00:22:10
couldn't replace it and put shake roofs
00:22:12
on you could only like maintain it
00:22:14
because in 1961 there was the B A and
00:22:17
Brentwood fires and these fires you want
00:22:20
to talk about like in in in memory chath
00:22:23
this one jaaja Gabor and tons of
00:22:25
celebrities lost their homes as well
00:22:27
this one was started because of this
00:22:28
Santa Anna winds and somebody was just
00:22:31
burning a rubbish pile I think it was
00:22:32
some construction workers were burning
00:22:34
that they said to me the neighbors do
00:22:37
you know about the B air fire you know
00:22:38
about the Brentwood fire you got to get
00:22:39
rid of that shake roof you got to get
00:22:40
rid of that shake roof when my daughter
00:22:41
was born the the uh roofer said to me
00:22:45
let's put composits on I put composits
00:22:47
on and he said what do you want to do
00:22:47
with the sprinkler system and I said
00:22:49
there's a sprinkler system in my little
00:22:50
one story wrench house he said yeah I
00:22:52
said I've never seen it and he showed it
00:22:54
to me it was on the roof people were so
00:22:56
scared after that 62 fire they were
00:22:57
putting
00:22:59
these on the roof and now you cannot
00:23:00
have would roofs have been banned you
00:23:02
were grandfathered in I was part of that
00:23:05
but there was a lot of PTSD from that
00:23:07
and now I do think there's going to have
00:23:09
to be some lessons learned and let's get
00:23:11
to where some folks online are pointing
00:23:14
to maybe not having great priorities and
00:23:19
maybe focusing on things that are not as
00:23:21
important as the taxpaying citizens a
00:23:24
lot of tweets I don't know how people
00:23:26
feel about them about Dei about who's
00:23:29
running the fire department Etc did you
00:23:31
have any thoughts on that freedberg I'll
00:23:34
I mean look we we one of the things I
00:23:36
wanted to talk about was the doi's role
00:23:38
the Department of Insurance role in what
00:23:41
I think will ultimately
00:23:43
be creating a pretty significant
00:23:45
economic consequence here from this sort
00:23:47
of an
00:23:48
event I don't but I'll I'll answer your
00:23:51
question okay I don't think that the
00:23:55
mission of any public service organiz
00:23:58
ation should be to meet Dei metrics I
00:24:03
think the mission of that public service
00:24:05
organization should be to serve the
00:24:07
public and I think that those Dei
00:24:10
metrics should not be a priority when
00:24:14
serving the public is the objective the
00:24:17
best ability to serve the public should
00:24:19
be the objective and that's it and I'll
00:24:22
state that really clearly okay so
00:24:24
obviously the the fire chief and La is
00:24:27
getting a lot of attention whether or
00:24:29
not that prioritization of Dei metrics
00:24:34
took away from the interest and the
00:24:36
focus in preparing for major disasters I
00:24:38
don't know there have been some
00:24:39
interviews over the last day or two just
00:24:40
to be fair where she has claimed that
00:24:43
they asked for more money to to they
00:24:45
would not be able to be prepared for
00:24:47
major disasters if the budget cut took
00:24:49
place that was proposed by bass that
00:24:51
budget cut did take place and so the the
00:24:54
fire chief has said that she asked for
00:24:55
Budget to make this the preparation for
00:24:57
this ORD of event and she lost it and so
00:25:00
I don't want to just say hey she's to
00:25:01
blame she's to blame because she was
00:25:03
focused on Dei but I will separately say
00:25:05
that I think that creating Dei as a
00:25:07
mission for an organization that's
00:25:08
supposed to serve the public interest
00:25:09
makes no sense this is an important one
00:25:11
James Woods obviously the uh the famous
00:25:14
actor who lost his home in Pacific
00:25:16
Palisades has been going on a bit of a
00:25:18
rant about Christine Crowley she is LA's
00:25:22
fire chief she also happens to be a
00:25:24
lesbian and has made a priority and and
00:25:28
done a number of talks on trying to
00:25:30
increase diversity inside of the fire
00:25:33
department she also just with a bit of
00:25:35
research is one of the top performing
00:25:39
firefighters a paramedic an engineer a
00:25:41
fire inspector a captain a battalion
00:25:44
chief an assistant chief Fire Marshal
00:25:45
Deputy Chief and when she took the
00:25:47
firefighter exam in the late 90s she
00:25:49
scored in the top 50 out of 16,000 she
00:25:51
seems eminently qualified there has been
00:25:53
a massive pile on Attack on her and you
00:25:57
know how it is on x and other social
00:25:59
networks where people are really tweaked
00:26:02
about Dei that they're kind of putting
00:26:03
the blame on her what are your thoughts
00:26:06
of this Dei angle chouth I don't think
00:26:08
this is to blame okay if all of a sudden
00:26:11
because of
00:26:12
Dei 70% were physically incapable of
00:26:17
carrying out the task and that's why
00:26:19
these fires grew maybe you could make
00:26:21
the claim that it is a Dei problem I do
00:26:25
agree with freeberg that the thing that
00:26:28
these public institutions need to do a
00:26:32
better job of is being very clear about
00:26:35
what their Nord star is I think the
00:26:37
nordstar for the fire department is to
00:26:39
save people's lives and put out fires I
00:26:42
think the nordstar for the police
00:26:44
service should be to save people's lives
00:26:46
and to hold criminals responsible and
00:26:48
get them off the
00:26:50
streets and you should hire the people
00:26:52
that allow you to do that job the best
00:26:55
the thing to keep in mind is that there
00:26:57
were probably 20 or 30 people
00:26:59
interviewed to be fire chief it's not
00:27:02
her fault that she was
00:27:04
selected the real question is what was
00:27:07
she mandated to focus on once she got
00:27:09
the job and I think what you see in all
00:27:12
of these interviews is I don't think
00:27:13
that she all of a sudden after growing
00:27:15
up through the fire service had this Dei
00:27:17
bent I think typically what happens is
00:27:20
it becomes an Institutional
00:27:22
directive it guides your compensation it
00:27:25
guides your recognition and so you do it
00:27:27
it's sort of what Charli Monger says
00:27:29
show me the incentive and I'll show you
00:27:31
the outcome the entire public service is
00:27:34
riddled with this the entire private
00:27:36
service is riddled with this which is
00:27:38
that we've lost the script about what is
00:27:41
important so it's yet another example
00:27:44
she's probably quite a capable person
00:27:46
who if was just allowed to focus on
00:27:48
fighting fires and saving people's lives
00:27:51
would probably do a good job but if you
00:27:53
had to add all these other things that
00:27:55
are not Germaine to that task
00:27:58
then people will get frustrated and
00:27:59
projected onto her it seems like a lot
00:28:01
of projecting going on here jamath I
00:28:03
agree all of that said though I think
00:28:05
you got to go back to how did these
00:28:07
fires start yeah how did they grow out
00:28:09
of control and again I think that these
00:28:13
winds didn't come out of nowhere in the
00:28:15
sense that they caught everybody off
00:28:16
guard this has happened before that area
00:28:20
has gone through this exact moment yes
00:28:23
there were laws that were proposed they
00:28:25
were vetoed okay so that even if you
00:28:28
could have controlled it then you see
00:28:31
certain developers like Rick Caruso who
00:28:34
were able to protect the buildings that
00:28:36
he was responsible for because he took
00:28:39
proactive and protective measures could
00:28:42
those proactive and protective measures
00:28:44
not been taken more broadly through LA
00:28:46
county of course they could have why
00:28:48
were they not and here what we're seeing
00:28:51
on the screen is recuso Village let me
00:28:54
ask a very specific question how much
00:28:56
money and we know the answer to this how
00:28:58
much money did the government of
00:29:00
California
00:29:02
spend poorly as it turns out on
00:29:05
homelessness it was about $21 billion
00:29:08
and illegal immigrants I don't know what
00:29:10
the final number is there but I suspect
00:29:11
in the tens of billions if you I think
00:29:13
if you reappropriated those dollars to
00:29:15
these kinds of protective mechanisms in
00:29:17
these areas what would the outcome have
00:29:19
been maybe there still would have been a
00:29:21
fire maybe there would have been damaged
00:29:23
but it's hard for me to believe it would
00:29:24
have been as bad as it is right now yeah
00:29:27
I think what you're getting to here is
00:29:29
we can confirm lesbians didn't cause the
00:29:32
Santa and and a wins to cause these
00:29:35
fires obviously but there is an issue
00:29:37
that I think many people in the public
00:29:39
especially in California who voted for
00:29:41
this very leftist liberal ideology are
00:29:44
now starting to realize is hey wait a
00:29:46
second what are the priorities here cyan
00:29:49
what are we focused on and what should
00:29:51
we be focused on and it's very easy to
00:29:54
be focused on Dei and maybe things that
00:29:57
aren't important homelessness and move
00:30:00
budget there but at the same time they
00:30:02
wouldn't give her $17 million they cut
00:30:04
the the fire budget she tried to fight
00:30:06
it well that that's not clear now
00:30:08
there's now the counter narrative is
00:30:10
that she actually got an extra 50 Jason
00:30:12
okay so we're we're in a breaking news
00:30:14
environment so we'll see what the truth
00:30:17
winds up being here but Sayan I think
00:30:19
the point Remains the Same here which is
00:30:22
is prioritization and what we focus on
00:30:25
out of whack in California oh without a
00:30:27
doubt I think diversity is good unless
00:30:31
that's all you have and I'll just
00:30:32
simplify it like that but and I think
00:30:35
it's very sad that somebody could be
00:30:37
very qualified and be in a position and
00:30:38
we now have to question whether or not
00:30:40
they were hired because of
00:30:42
Dei and then it comes down to
00:30:44
prioritization like when you're dealing
00:30:46
with a organization like a fire
00:30:48
department whose main job is to protect
00:30:51
the public and put out fires and save
00:30:52
people any amount of time as we know is
00:30:55
a valuable precious resource that's
00:30:57
being spent
00:30:58
trying to roll out these programs or you
00:31:01
know it goes beyond just who you hire
00:31:04
it's even they the thought police of how
00:31:06
you think you know it's so pervasive
00:31:09
within an organization that you you are
00:31:12
you die from the bureaucracy of it and
00:31:14
if if anything went wrong with the EI it
00:31:17
was that they didn't have their their
00:31:19
eye on the prize of of fighting fires
00:31:22
and instead you know they're focusing on
00:31:23
something that truly doesn't matter so
00:31:25
you can be as diverse as you want to be
00:31:27
and not be able to put out of fire and
00:31:28
then it just really doesn't matter right
00:31:30
because you're not training people
00:31:31
you're not spending money on things that
00:31:33
matter you're not having the discussions
00:31:35
that matter and that's where I think
00:31:39
that does fall apart and it it has a
00:31:41
place there but you know I go back to
00:31:43
what chamama said though you know it
00:31:44
really comes down to prevention and
00:31:46
learning from our past we seem to have a
00:31:48
very short-term memory and we forget
00:31:50
very quickly because we rebuild and it
00:31:52
looks pretty again and everybody
00:31:54
forgets and we just don't have the
00:31:56
ability as a society really to think
00:31:58
long anymore and uh that's a real
00:32:01
problem and I think we should learn from
00:32:04
this fire I really hope that what comes
00:32:05
out of this is a shift in political
00:32:09
leanings in this in this state you know
00:32:11
I think more moderates are going to come
00:32:13
to their senses and um as we've seen
00:32:16
with the election and the outcome and I
00:32:18
think the state might shift some and we
00:32:20
might actually get some policies that
00:32:22
you're so right you're so right I mean
00:32:23
when are we going to get tired of all
00:32:26
this late stage progressivism it's like
00:32:29
these Litany of excuses the people that
00:32:31
are in charge have failed us yet again
00:32:34
exactly we have wasted so much money on
00:32:37
so many things that don't move the
00:32:39
needle and then the things that they
00:32:42
needed to do they didn't do and then
00:32:45
they point the finger at climate change
00:32:47
it's a joke at a certain point you have
00:32:49
to wonder are we using politics and and
00:32:53
the purpose of it to make people's lives
00:32:56
better and to have a high function
00:32:58
Society or is it a way to fge your
00:32:59
signal or to you know share your
00:33:01
opinions on things yeah and and I think
00:33:04
what people are starting to realize is
00:33:05
you know in an acute situation whether
00:33:07
it's our budget deficit whether it's
00:33:09
schools whether it's safety from climate
00:33:12
you know or non-climate induced
00:33:14
disasters you you do need to have
00:33:16
competence and this is the Rick Caruso
00:33:18
is such a competent executive that when
00:33:20
he ran for office there the fact that he
00:33:22
didn't get that job is just absolutely
00:33:24
crazy and the you saw the mayor come in
00:33:27
and she wouldn't even address she
00:33:30
wouldn't answer any questions from the
00:33:32
Press not even thoughts and prayers or
00:33:34
you know we're thinking of this or we're
00:33:35
going to get it done it it just seems
00:33:37
like we're hiring non-executives to work
00:33:39
in functions that should be high
00:33:42
performing Executives this is an
00:33:44
operational role let me maybe bring
00:33:46
something that ties these three things
00:33:48
together but it builds on critically
00:33:50
what cyan
00:33:52
said there are so many people here that
00:33:54
are good hardworking people that lost
00:33:56
their homes
00:33:58
for many of these folks it could
00:34:00
be the most single and only financially
00:34:05
securing asset that they
00:34:07
have for other
00:34:09
people those that are family age they
00:34:13
have kids now beyond the financial
00:34:15
damage that are totally displaced where
00:34:17
will these folks go there was a comment
00:34:20
by Adam Cora commentary where he said
00:34:24
the real test to science point will be
00:34:28
how they internalize and metabolize this
00:34:31
because it now affects them personally
00:34:33
and they have to go and wait 3 years to
00:34:35
BU building permits to rebuild now
00:34:37
that's assuming that they can even get a
00:34:39
reasonable amount of insurance coverage
00:34:42
which touches freeberg
00:34:43
point this is the real tragedy that is
00:34:46
the actual tragedy multiplied by 120,000
00:34:49
or 200,000
00:34:51
families and the real question is how
00:34:54
much of that was completely avoidable
00:34:56
and I think there is a reason amount of
00:34:58
it that could have been that's what
00:35:00
really sucks and that's where you cannot
00:35:03
take your finger off the scale and
00:35:05
forget and yeah when it lands on your
00:35:07
doorstep quite literally here they are
00:35:09
not going to be able having been in this
00:35:12
exact area I can tell you when you try
00:35:14
to pull a permit to do anything as I was
00:35:16
explaining with my roof the regulations
00:35:19
are deep and expensive and timec
00:35:23
consuming I don't believe the C we
00:35:25
talked about the California Coastal
00:35:27
Commission recent episode freeberg what
00:35:28
are the chances that the California
00:35:30
Coastal commission even allows these
00:35:32
people to build those homes in those
00:35:35
locations on PCH fredberg I was talking
00:35:38
to chamat about this earlier today
00:35:39
because the California Coastal
00:35:41
commission was created by the voters
00:35:43
directly in
00:35:45
1976 and that commission has Authority
00:35:49
that exceeds legislative action so um
00:35:53
you would have to basically go back my
00:35:55
understanding is you'd have to go back
00:35:56
to a state vote to resend the powers of
00:35:58
the California Coastal commission so
00:35:59
they have effective complete authority
00:36:03
over deciding what does or doesn't get
00:36:04
built on the coast because their
00:36:06
objective is to preserve the coast for
00:36:08
the use of the community and restore it
00:36:09
to its natural habitat so anytime
00:36:11
there's a request or a permit request it
00:36:13
can take two decades three decades
00:36:15
sometimes to get anything approved if
00:36:17
they ever approve it at all and so the
00:36:19
California Coastal commission any
00:36:21
property that touches the the the beach
00:36:23
front in California they have this kind
00:36:26
of you know God level authority over and
00:36:29
they're basically all political
00:36:30
appointees that sit on the commission to
00:36:32
my question freeberg what are the
00:36:33
chances they allow the millionaires on
00:36:37
Pacific Coast Highway in Malibu to
00:36:39
rebuild those homes or do you think they
00:36:41
slow roll it and those people are all
00:36:43
5060 70 years old they'll never be able
00:36:45
to rebuild their homes Cali just slow
00:36:47
roll this and say you know what nature
00:36:50
returned it to its natural state I think
00:36:51
we should talk about insurance this is a
00:36:53
great segue yeah yeah this perfect segue
00:36:55
yeah this is the key point I wanted to
00:36:56
say about insurance so going forward
00:36:58
yeah all of this property that sits in
00:37:01
climate sensitive zones or weather
00:37:04
sensitive zones whatever you want to
00:37:05
call it like we've talked about on the
00:37:07
coast of California of Florida and
00:37:09
hurricane centers and tornado centers
00:37:11
where the frequency of loss is going up
00:37:15
they're priced as if the frequency of
00:37:17
loss is what it used to be which is like
00:37:20
let's say you buy a home for a million
00:37:22
dollars and the probability of your home
00:37:24
getting wiped out by a natural disaster
00:37:26
is a one in a, your kind of situation so
00:37:29
you have a one in a thousand chance of
00:37:31
your home getting wiped out each year so
00:37:32
your price for insurance on that million
00:37:34
doll home should be about 10,000 bucks a
00:37:36
year one tenth of 1% so 10,000 bucks a
00:37:39
year for a million doll home sounds
00:37:40
expensive but it is what you have to pay
00:37:42
for homeowners insurance but now let's
00:37:44
say that the probability shifts to one
00:37:46
in 20 years so now you've got a one in
00:37:48
20 year probability of your home getting
00:37:50
wiped out are you going to pay 5% of
00:37:53
your home value no and uh if if you have
00:37:57
a $10 million home are you going to pay
00:37:59
$500,000 a year for property insurance
00:38:02
no now what's happened is the insurance
00:38:05
companies have these models they're
00:38:06
called cat models or catastrophe models
00:38:09
it used to be two companies one was
00:38:10
called RMS the other one was called
00:38:11
equat and I used to work in this
00:38:13
business so I know it pretty well and
00:38:14
then all the the companies started
00:38:16
building in-house models and now there's
00:38:17
startups that make models and these
00:38:19
models have shown that there are
00:38:20
increased probability of complete loss
00:38:22
in a region because of the increased
00:38:23
probability of these crazy weather
00:38:25
events happening and so the price of
00:38:27
insurance should go up here's the
00:38:28
problem there are 5050 State Insurance
00:38:30
Commissioners in the US in order to sell
00:38:32
insurance in a state you have to have
00:38:34
the insurance carrier and the policy
00:38:37
approved in that state and the states
00:38:39
determine what rate or what price you
00:38:41
can charge for insurance so the State
00:38:44
Insurance commissions have a couple of
00:38:45
goals number one is to keep all the
00:38:47
insurance companies solvent so they want
00:38:49
to you know check the financials of all
00:38:50
the insurance companies make sure
00:38:51
they're not writing too many policies
00:38:53
that they won't be able to pay out the
00:38:54
second thing is they want to make sure
00:38:56
that the insurance company aren't
00:38:57
ripping consumers off so they have
00:39:00
control over the rates and they don't
00:39:02
want the rates to go up too much in any
00:39:04
given year so they're controlling rates
00:39:06
and keeping them down and then the third
00:39:08
is they're supposed to make sure that
00:39:09
consumers have access to insurance and
00:39:11
the third is a very hard thing to do if
00:39:14
you're trying to keep companies solvent
00:39:15
you can't write too many policies and
00:39:17
you're saying hey you can't raise prices
00:39:19
and meanwhile the probability of losses
00:39:21
gone up so the insurance carriers are
00:39:22
like what choice do I have so earlier
00:39:25
this year a State Farm pulled out of
00:39:26
Palisades they stopped writing fire
00:39:28
insurance and Palisades they canel 1600
00:39:30
policies in the exact neighborhood that
00:39:33
just burned down what about the timing
00:39:34
of that freeberg that was three months
00:39:36
before six months before Happ six months
00:39:39
before but yeah but it's not it it seems
00:39:41
crazy but as you know in Tahoe a lot of
00:39:43
the policies have been cancelled in um
00:39:46
it's just crazy timing it's it's a crazy
00:39:48
coincidence and remember in Wine Country
00:39:50
we had a lot of wipeouts all of Santa
00:39:52
Rosa was burnt out a few years ago you
00:39:54
guys remember that and so they started
00:39:55
pulling out of there so aot lot of the
00:39:57
carriers are generally pulling out of
00:39:59
California because when they go up to
00:40:00
the DOI and they're like hey we need to
00:40:01
raise rates by we need to double the
00:40:03
price of insurance we need to Triple the
00:40:05
price of insurance this is now a one in
00:40:06
20 year event the Department of
00:40:08
Insurance says no no no we're not going
00:40:09
to let you charge that much to Consumers
00:40:11
and then the carrier is like okay we got
00:40:13
no choice and they exit the market here
00:40:15
you can see right here 1, 1600 policies
00:40:17
canceled this has been a big driver is
00:40:19
the Department of Insurance has made it
00:40:21
very difficult to find this free market
00:40:22
outcome but at the end of the day one of
00:40:26
three parties are going to end up eating
00:40:28
the cost of the change in probability of
00:40:31
loss that has occurred it's either the
00:40:32
homeowner because they're going to end
00:40:34
up losing the value of their home in a
00:40:35
loss or they're going to end up needing
00:40:36
to write down the value of their home
00:40:37
when they sell it to someone who will
00:40:39
take on that risk which means the price
00:40:41
has to come down or number two is the
00:40:43
insurers and there's not enough
00:40:44
Insurance Capital out there to cover all
00:40:46
these losses so all these insurers would
00:40:48
go bankrupt or the third is the taxpayer
00:40:50
one of those three is going to end up
00:40:51
eating the loss that's about you know
00:40:53
the answer you know the answer taxpayer
00:40:55
taxpayer yeah somebody is going to Lobby
00:40:57
somebody but hey we're sitting here chth
00:40:59
in the age of Doge and saying hey let's
00:41:02
make the government smaller in fact Dave
00:41:05
you and I were talking about at some
00:41:06
point Gangs of New York and the fire
00:41:08
departments being oh yeah totally great
00:41:11
crazy timing that we were talking about
00:41:12
that two or three weeks before this
00:41:13
happened but right you know when we look
00:41:16
at making government smaller well that
00:41:18
means that these kind of situations
00:41:19
would put citizens more on their own so
00:41:22
let's counterbalance what you think
00:41:24
chamath about who should be responsible
00:41:26
we all espouse I think free market
00:41:29
ideology on this program and as
00:41:30
Executives and in what we do every day
00:41:33
should the people who own these homes
00:41:35
going forward who decide to rebuild them
00:41:37
here have to pay you know 5 10% of their
00:41:41
value of home every year should their
00:41:42
home prices collapse because it's too
00:41:44
hard to build there and should the free
00:41:46
market take over this risk or should it
00:41:48
constantly be put on the other 329
00:41:50
million Americans who are going to have
00:41:52
to be the brunt of what happens to the
00:41:53
million people affected in this area
00:41:55
well I mean sh's a very strong word
00:41:58
the cap on the insurance reimbursement
00:42:01
is about 3 million is my understanding
00:42:03
David you can tell me if I'm wrong but I
00:42:04
think I think that's right the houses in
00:42:07
the Palisades are anywhere from call it
00:42:09
1 million on the low end to maybe 40 or
00:42:11
50 million on the high end average is
00:42:13
four and a half in that yeah I was about
00:42:15
to say there's nothing for a million
00:42:16
these days yeah it's got to be three or
00:42:18
four minimum right but the median is
00:42:19
probably more instructive which is
00:42:20
probably seven or eight million so yes
00:42:22
yeah my point is that folks will get
00:42:25
less than half their home value back
00:42:27
they're going to have to come up with
00:42:28
some amount of money to then rebuild but
00:42:31
the cost of rebuilding a 7,000 foot
00:42:34
house in the Pacific Palisades is
00:42:35
probably at least a thousand a square
00:42:36
foot so that's 7 million of cash exactly
00:42:39
so now so now all of a sudden these
00:42:40
people have to come up with a lot of
00:42:44
money exactly and that's post tax money
00:42:47
so you might as well double it because
00:42:48
California is just so egregiously
00:42:50
burdensome in terms of taxes so the
00:42:53
individual homeowner is not going to be
00:42:55
in a position to rebuild
00:43:00
I think that the liabilities of the
00:43:03
insurance claims are going to be so
00:43:04
massive that the state's going to look
00:43:06
to the federal government to build them
00:43:08
out my parents just got evacuated I
00:43:10
gotta call them and just there there's a
00:43:13
new
00:43:14
fire literally right uh there's a new
00:43:16
fire called Kenneth fire it just took
00:43:18
off and it's it's at their house so just
00:43:21
give me I'll be back okay no do your
00:43:23
thing oh wow gosh almighty we were
00:43:25
talking about hey maybe less government
00:43:28
hey maybe spending less now the same
00:43:30
group of people maybe who were saying
00:43:32
hey we need to spend less and reduce the
00:43:34
size of government or saying hey well
00:43:35
why isn't California more prepared well
00:43:37
being prepared obviously means more
00:43:39
money and and and more taxes so you have
00:43:42
now these two competing ideologies here
00:43:46
but to the question of who's responsible
00:43:48
it is economically going to make no
00:43:49
sense to rebuild unless you can get that
00:43:52
insurance it is a coveted place to live
00:43:54
but because of the construction costs
00:43:56
have gone abs abolutely
00:43:57
parabolic in California because of
00:44:00
regulations you're talking about $4
00:44:02
million in income to build a $7 million
00:44:04
house and maybe you're just better off
00:44:07
selling the lot for a million dollars
00:44:08
and letting it be somebody else's
00:44:10
problem going for and just taking the
00:44:11
two or three or four million dollar loss
00:44:13
who should pay for on a go forward
00:44:17
basis underwriting these homes yeah I
00:44:20
mean a lot of these people paid for I
00:44:22
was reading stories of 30 some odd years
00:44:24
into Insurance thinking that you know
00:44:27
house wouldn't burn down and then of
00:44:28
course it gets canceled two weeks before
00:44:30
their house burns down and then the one
00:44:31
time they need it they don't have it and
00:44:34
part of this is I mean a huge part of it
00:44:36
is uh what freedberg was talking about
00:44:38
are the regulators and so the free
00:44:40
market solution is the only solution if
00:44:42
you look at I have an investment in a
00:44:43
company called kin insurance and they
00:44:46
specialize in direct to
00:44:47
Consumer Insurance for areas that are
00:44:51
plagued with natural disaster so their
00:44:52
number one state out of the 11 that they
00:44:55
serve as Florida followed by
00:44:57
Texas which you know has tornadoes and
00:44:59
things like that and how they're able to
00:45:01
get into these places and do insurance
00:45:03
is the pricing is according to you know
00:45:06
the construction of your home and all of
00:45:07
these various things and also weather
00:45:09
models and using data science things
00:45:11
that are not allowed in California if
00:45:13
you can believe it or not so you're not
00:45:15
allowed to use a weather model to price
00:45:17
in you know your decision- making for
00:45:19
insurance in this state and that just
00:45:21
doesn't make a lot of sense you know you
00:45:23
should be rewarded if you put the
00:45:25
resources and time into your home home
00:45:27
to to make it weatherproof uh fireproof
00:45:31
fireproof I mean you know even
00:45:32
earthquake resistant right this is more
00:45:35
regulations that were layer on here to
00:45:38
try to create equality you know and and
00:45:42
the fact is it's now working against the
00:45:45
system in Tahoe to your point they gave
00:45:48
us explicit instructions around homes
00:45:50
put Stone and Pebbles around your home
00:45:53
cut the trees and bushes down around
00:45:54
your homes do this over here you know
00:45:57
your when you do that and if you do that
00:46:00
which might cost $10,000 a home you it
00:46:04
would keep these from jumping from one
00:46:06
to the other in most fire situations
00:46:08
freeberg your back is everything
00:46:10
okay uh it's not okay listening to your
00:46:13
you know 70 something year old parents
00:46:16
evacuate their home and try and pack
00:46:17
their cars with all their stuff in a
00:46:20
matter of minutes while a fire creeps on
00:46:22
their home is a pretty devastating thing
00:46:24
to listen to yeah but are they sayfe
00:46:26
they're trying to get out of the house
00:46:27
they're throwing everything in the car
00:46:29
there's evacu if I'm looking at the
00:46:31
video right now the fire is like right
00:46:33
by their house it's insane it's
00:46:35
literally like blocks away from their
00:46:37
house God this is nuts this is the house
00:46:39
I grew up in in La I'm so sorry oh man
00:46:42
gosh blocked away and I'm like you know
00:46:45
what do you say to them like throw all
00:46:47
the photo albums in the car is what I
00:46:48
said throw the photo like just grab the
00:46:50
frame photos my mom's trying to grab all
00:46:51
her like that's the number one thing
00:46:54
that everybody misses and is mentioned
00:46:56
and interview that I've seen is uh
00:46:59
photographs like grab all the photos
00:47:01
grab all the ALB she's like you know
00:47:03
she's grabbing her jewelry and stuff and
00:47:04
I'm like grab the photos like we're the
00:47:06
last generation that will be thinking
00:47:08
about this issue of grabbing the photos
00:47:10
yeah it's fascinating I just want to say
00:47:12
like you know as we wrap up this segment
00:47:14
you know obviously we're thinking about
00:47:15
everybody there this is
00:47:17
complex this is not the fault of a
00:47:19
lesbian firefighter or the Ukraine or
00:47:21
any of these other issues this is
00:47:23
leadership and nature and preparedness
00:47:26
so there are big issues around climate
00:47:28
change you want to believe him you don't
00:47:29
want to believe him fine put that aside
00:47:31
but I can tell you that when I saw Karen
00:47:33
bass get off that
00:47:36
flight play the clip Nick of Karen bass
00:47:38
here because it's a short enough clip
00:47:39
that we can play it here for the
00:47:40
audience I'm I'm assuming you all three
00:47:42
of you saw this clip of her being
00:47:46
absolutely unwilling to answer a single
00:47:49
goddamn question about what's going on
00:47:51
this is the opposite of leadership just
00:47:55
10 seconds of this AB an apology for
00:47:58
being abent while their homes were
00:48:00
burning do you regret cutting the fire
00:48:02
department budget by millions of dollars
00:48:04
Madam
00:48:06
mayor have you nothing to say today back
00:48:09
upate it have you absolutely nothing to
00:48:12
say to the citizens
00:48:14
today disgraceful she in shock I mean I
00:48:18
I have zero sympathy you took the
00:48:19
leadership job I don't give a if
00:48:21
you're in shock you're a leader you just
00:48:24
you you sold yourself as the leader that
00:48:26
you were to service these people and you
00:48:28
don't have the dignity the the the honor
00:48:31
to just answer the questions it is the
00:48:34
that is absolutely the worst leadership
00:48:37
I've ever seen Under Fire let me ask you
00:48:40
guys a question disgraceful what do we
00:48:42
do you fire them all and you vote for
00:48:45
Rick cruso you vote for executives who
00:48:48
know what the they're doing and know
00:48:49
what to do in a crisis because they've
00:48:51
been under Fire before because they've
00:48:53
run a business before because they've
00:48:54
seen hit the fan this person I don't
00:48:57
know her I don't know her history but
00:48:59
I'll be totally honest like I wouldn't
00:49:01
trust her literally to pick up my lunch
00:49:04
if she can't answer one or two goddamn
00:49:06
questions and give a plating answer to a
00:49:09
reporter hey it's an intense situation
00:49:11
we're working as hard as we can she
00:49:13
can't even say two goddamn words to the
00:49:16
people who voted her in and for anybody
00:49:17
who voted for this level of accomp
00:49:19
reminds me of exactly what we went
00:49:21
through in San Francisco and I was
00:49:22
living there in the Bay Area when you
00:49:24
put someone like chesa bu in or London
00:49:26
bre or this entire clown car Aaron Peter
00:49:30
all these disgraceful disg Marist
00:49:33
Marxist lunatics who would rather virtue
00:49:36
signal Dopey Dean Preston the whole lot
00:49:39
of them you vote them out and you vote
00:49:41
in Executives and it doesn't mean a
00:49:42
republican executive it doesn't mean a
00:49:44
Democrat executive it means an executive
00:49:46
who's run something in their life before
00:49:48
whether it's Bloomberg whether it's
00:49:50
Trump whether it's ruso it doesn't
00:49:52
matter their ideology it matters their
00:49:53
effectiveness and if you vote for
00:49:55
ineffective people you're going to get
00:49:57
situations like this over and over and
00:49:59
over again so use your brains and vote
00:50:01
for executives who've done something in
00:50:03
the world this is why I've changed my
00:50:05
position on rooting for Trump now I was
00:50:07
a never Trumper everybody knows that but
00:50:09
he put Executives around him this time
00:50:11
around and I am rooting for those
00:50:13
Executives to do what's right for the
00:50:14
American people and solve big problems
00:50:17
not make them worse it's infuriating Jam
00:50:21
what do you think I think we need to
00:50:23
have a wholesale replacement of the
00:50:26
people govern the state of California
00:50:28
it's just not working full stop and I
00:50:31
think that the citizens that live in
00:50:34
California need to do some real soul
00:50:36
searching it is beyond Party
00:50:40
politics so I think what has happened in
00:50:43
California is people vote for whatever
00:50:46
vessel has the name Democrat beside
00:50:49
their name or republican beside their
00:50:51
name and I think that you have to go
00:50:53
back to First principles and do a better
00:50:56
job of picking the people to represent
00:50:58
us because the people that are in
00:51:00
positions of power just don't
00:51:02
fundamentally know what they're doing
00:51:04
they're not
00:51:06
capable and the fact that then what we
00:51:09
have to deal with are sort of lies and
00:51:12
distractions to excuse incompetence I
00:51:16
think is
00:51:17
unacceptable I think we pay way too high
00:51:20
of a
00:51:21
price and like I said you are now
00:51:23
dealing with hundreds of thousands of
00:51:25
families whose entire lives have been
00:51:27
totally disrupted and ripped away and I
00:51:31
hope that we learned something from this
00:51:34
because we didn't learn from it eight
00:51:35
years
00:51:36
ago and we clearly didn't learn from it
00:51:39
when a different natural disaster in
00:51:41
North Carolina will we find out that
00:51:43
folks said hey guys is there an outlier
00:51:46
natural disaster event obviously it's
00:51:47
not going to be the same thing in North
00:51:49
Carolina but could a different form of
00:51:51
something happen here what could it be
00:51:53
are we prepared I'm sure we'll find out
00:51:55
that they didn't do that maybe they had
00:51:58
different meetings and they were about
00:52:00
other total distractions or things that
00:52:04
just didn't matter so this is what we
00:52:06
need to do we as a populace in this
00:52:09
state need a reset otherwise we deserve
00:52:12
what we get Bingo Sayan you agree yeah I
00:52:16
think I think Democrats need to reclaim
00:52:18
their party I think uh there's a lot
00:52:20
more strength in the middle and you know
00:52:23
they've let this woke ideology ology I
00:52:27
call it U woke
00:52:29
imperialism like a religion take over in
00:52:33
place of actually doing things that
00:52:36
matter to the people that elected them
00:52:38
that pay taxes that pay their you know
00:52:41
their paychecks and everything in
00:52:42
between and it's time that people really
00:52:44
look in the mirror I've got so many
00:52:45
moderates coming to me saying you know
00:52:48
people call me a Republican and I'm far
00:52:50
right and I'm a Nazi and I'm like yeah
00:52:52
welcome to the club you know it's at
00:52:54
some point you've got to stop letting
00:52:55
them run the board and and stand up and
00:52:58
say you know enough's enough you know
00:53:00
we're not building some Railway that's
00:53:02
never being built we're not solving
00:53:04
homelessness with billions and billions
00:53:06
of dollars we're not doing this stuff
00:53:08
anymore you know we do need real
00:53:10
Executives to your point
00:53:12
Jason you know to run things that
00:53:15
understand how things are how it works
00:53:17
and and you know the best use of funds
00:53:20
because right now it's it's it's
00:53:22
misappropriated it's a crisis of
00:53:24
competence I mean I think we all see it
00:53:26
these are in competent people by the way
00:53:27
it's not just it's not just the
00:53:29
leadership it's also legislative action
00:53:32
that's going to be needed to fix a lot
00:53:34
of the the policies the regulations the
00:53:37
way infrastructure operates in the state
00:53:39
and that requires three things to change
00:53:43
number one is the California State
00:53:44
Assembly number two is the California
00:53:46
state Senate and number three is to put
00:53:50
things in front of the voters that they
00:53:51
can vote on to make the wholesale change
00:53:53
needed to resend some of the bad
00:53:55
decisions that were made over over the
00:53:56
last three decades in the state that has
00:53:58
led us to this point and I think that
00:54:00
it's going to require just like what
00:54:02
happened recently in the National
00:54:04
politics a state politics organizational
00:54:07
effort to say let's take a look at the
00:54:09
composition of the State Assembly the
00:54:11
state senate and what are some of the
00:54:14
votes that need to be done by the
00:54:15
citizens to make the necessary changes
00:54:17
in the state to try and get the world's
00:54:19
fifth largest economy to start act
00:54:22
acting and looking like it because right
00:54:24
now it's sort of like a weirdly disabled
00:54:26
third world country typee operation with
00:54:29
the wealthiest resources on planet Earth
00:54:31
and it seems pretty up it's almost like
00:54:34
once people have it all that's when they
00:54:36
want to give it all up that seems to be
00:54:38
the moment that this state has just
00:54:39
passed now maybe it's time to go reclaim
00:54:41
it and build it back well said I mean
00:54:44
and as we said in the segment there are
00:54:47
so many common sense tactical strategic
00:54:50
things that these people could be doing
00:54:53
that they should be doing that they're
00:54:55
not and needs to be a full-blown
00:54:57
investigation you kind of alluded to
00:54:59
this earlier chamath but if there is if
00:55:02
this is dereliction of Duty then then we
00:55:04
need to look into this in a very deep
00:55:06
fashion and to the people of California
00:55:08
you have more power than you know my
00:55:10
friend who used to be on this podcast
00:55:11
once in a while he and I collaborated on
00:55:14
Chessa Boudin being taken out as this uh
00:55:17
da in in the Bay Area I know some other
00:55:19
people here were involved in it as well
00:55:22
and you can recall somebody so recall
00:55:25
these incompetent lunatics recall them
00:55:28
and replace it's scary but you can you
00:55:30
know they they they send all their
00:55:32
people after you they threaten you get
00:55:34
personal they I was signature number one
00:55:37
and I I had to deal with the Deluge of
00:55:39
that stuff but to be honest with you
00:55:40
I've never been happier to do something
00:55:43
and get civically engaged I think it's
00:55:45
so important that everybody starts
00:55:46
getting involved in their local
00:55:48
government and their state government
00:55:50
and the national government because you
00:55:51
can't just expect people to do the work
00:55:53
for you and expect it to turn out well
00:55:56
and I think that's kind of the mistake
00:55:58
that we all made if we want to take some
00:56:00
responsibility the tech industry as a
00:56:02
whole did not get as involved as we
00:56:05
ought to have in the past and I think we
00:56:07
should get more involved why was that
00:56:08
saying why why did for 20 years while we
00:56:11
were all in the Bay Area or other people
00:56:13
you know just were too busy building
00:56:15
companies bus building companies and I
00:56:17
remember if I remember correctly the
00:56:19
only person I I I remember getting
00:56:22
involved in local stuff was Ron Conway
00:56:24
yes and he would try to get everybody
00:56:27
involved and we were all just like you
00:56:28
know there's people who are smart that
00:56:30
do that sort of thing and they're going
00:56:32
to do their thing and they're running
00:56:33
stuff and we're just not going to get
00:56:35
involved and a lot of people would say
00:56:36
I'm not political I don't I don't do
00:56:38
politics I don't you know they didn't
00:56:41
get involved until it affected them kind
00:56:43
of like the houses burning down it
00:56:44
affects them and you know like they're
00:56:48
that saying that first they came for so
00:56:50
and so and I didn't speak up you know
00:56:52
that's what's happening here and uh you
00:56:54
know I just really think that
00:56:56
people need to realize it's now
00:56:58
affecting them and it's now time to make
00:56:59
a change and elect better leaders here's
00:57:02
a framing if you're paying 50% tax in
00:57:06
California you're a shareholder of an
00:57:08
organization known as California Inc
00:57:10
you're on the board of that company
00:57:11
you're paying the salaries of the people
00:57:13
there you have a say recall these people
00:57:16
start a recall of Nome start a recall of
00:57:18
Karen bass just do it I I'm not doing it
00:57:20
I don't have time for this I'm in Austin
00:57:22
but y'all in C who are still in
00:57:23
California start a page recall Nome
00:57:26
recoil bass and you have the power to do
00:57:28
it and you will succeed I guarantee it
00:57:31
now is the moment to strike there's
00:57:32
other news we should get to you know I
00:57:34
hate to say thoughts and prayers but
00:57:36
literally I've been thinking about this
00:57:39
you know all day long and I have a lot
00:57:41
of friends my friend Mark suster lost
00:57:43
his home I used to play cards with Jimmy
00:57:46
Woods and you know I just feel terrible
00:57:48
for everybody who's lost their homes and
00:57:50
then their kids and their schools are
00:57:51
burned down as well all those great
00:57:53
schools in Pacific Palisades are gone I
00:57:55
can see developers coming in being like
00:57:56
dude if I could buy all these lots for
00:57:58
80% off I will that's what's going to
00:58:00
happen they're going to sit on them yeah
00:58:02
they're going to just sit on them and
00:58:03
wait for people to forget like they did
00:58:04
in 1962 Caruso of the world will do that
00:58:07
yeah anyway yeah he should be running
00:58:10
the place probably I'll give you another
00:58:12
another California Department of
00:58:13
Insurance stat so after the California
00:58:15
Department of Insurance wouldn't allow
00:58:17
the rates to rise like they should from
00:58:19
a free market perspective they had to
00:58:21
set up their own insurance program
00:58:23
called the fair plan for homeowners it
00:58:25
has about 200 $ 120 million of capital
00:58:27
in it and then they bought about $5
00:58:29
billion of reinsurance they have about 6
00:58:32
billion of exposure in Pacific palates
00:58:34
alone this is a bankrupt just like I
00:58:36
told you guys about in Florida the state
00:58:38
insurance commission tries to step in
00:58:40
and fill the market Gap that they create
00:58:41
by regulating rates and then they don't
00:58:43
have enough Capital to actually fill the
00:58:45
Gap because the reason the rates want to
00:58:46
go up is because the thing costs more
00:58:49
than the state is willing to so they're
00:58:51
distorting it they're putting their
00:58:52
thumbs on the scale and they're
00:58:53
distorting it even more a bigger crat
00:58:56
they're driving real estate value up
00:58:58
because they're not allowing the cost of
00:59:00
insurance of that real estate to
00:59:02
naturally float and so by driving real
00:59:04
estate values up the economy looks good
00:59:06
they make property taxes income comes in
00:59:08
but at the end of the day the bill is
00:59:10
going to come due and in the case of
00:59:12
Florida and in the case of California
00:59:14
either the state government or the
00:59:16
federal government's going to step in
00:59:17
and pay the difference and at some point
00:59:19
taxpayers are going to look at the fact
00:59:21
that they're paying some percentage of
00:59:23
their income to support someone else's
00:59:25
home
00:59:26
and they're going to say enough is
00:59:27
enough and enough of these sorts of
00:59:29
events start to happen and then the
00:59:31
legislative change I think will happen
00:59:33
that says this it doesn't make sense we
00:59:36
have to make a change and I think we're
00:59:37
getting pretty close after the series of
00:59:39
events all right this has been an
00:59:41
absolutely fantastic discussion let's
00:59:44
move on to our next topic here Zuck just
00:59:46
fired meta's third party fact Checkers
00:59:48
and he is going to embrace the community
00:59:50
notes model from Twitter SLX which
00:59:55
predates Elon ownership of the platform
00:59:57
and is an open source project for those
00:59:59
folks who don't know on Tuesday made he
01:00:02
made the announcement on an Instagram
01:00:04
video he published a Blog with a bunch
01:00:06
of
01:00:07
details and he made the signal that he
01:00:12
was going to move the trust and safety
01:00:14
team out of California which he feels
01:00:16
maybe was too uh far to the left as we
01:00:19
were just discussing in the previous
01:00:21
story uh and move it to the great state
01:00:24
of Texas and
01:00:27
here's a quote from his comments in
01:00:30
recent years we've developed
01:00:31
increasingly complex systems to manage
01:00:33
content across our platforms partly in
01:00:36
response to societal and political
01:00:38
pressures to moderate content this
01:00:39
approach has gone too far if you
01:00:42
remember back in August Zuck sent a
01:00:43
letter to the house Judiciary Committee
01:00:45
explaining how the FBI and Biden
01:00:47
Administration have pressured Facebook
01:00:48
into censoring posts about Co and Hunter
01:00:51
Biden you'll also remember that
01:00:53
Zuckerberg has over 3 billion
01:00:56
members to his platform and had no
01:00:59
problem Banning Trump from the platform
01:01:01
after January 6th a lot to talk about in
01:01:05
this topic Sayan what's your general
01:01:07
take of Zuck going Maga how do you
01:01:12
interpret his I actually think change of
01:01:15
heart I actually think deep down inside
01:01:17
he always has been you know I I go back
01:01:19
to the beginning days of Facebook and
01:01:22
when there was social networks that were
01:01:24
competing which back at the time was my
01:01:26
space the only political party you could
01:01:27
be was Republican or Democrat and then
01:01:30
Along Came Facebook and he added this
01:01:32
third option called libertarian and I I
01:01:35
would like to go to the way back machine
01:01:36
at some point and find his profile
01:01:38
because his profile said he was a
01:01:40
Libertarian so when he started Facebook
01:01:42
you know that that's where he leaned so
01:01:45
I think he's always been a free speech
01:01:46
person I think he's always this has been
01:01:49
deep in his heart I think what happened
01:01:50
was he had enormous success they grew
01:01:52
very large and he had to become neutral
01:01:55
or he thought he did and so I think what
01:01:57
we're seeing with Zuck right now with
01:01:59
his change in his um you know even how
01:02:02
he appears with a gold chain and how
01:02:04
he's dressing and everything that he's
01:02:06
doing is him going back to his roots to
01:02:09
be more authentic because I think he
01:02:10
hasn't been authentic for a long time
01:02:11
and and that was a big critique that
01:02:13
people had of him you know they were
01:02:14
just like when he talks he's like a
01:02:16
robot and I think what we're seeing is
01:02:19
him coming out of his shell and I don't
01:02:20
know if fighting helped it or what
01:02:21
helped it but you know I I do think it's
01:02:24
the best thing to do all the platforms
01:02:26
need to do it and should embrace it and
01:02:29
um it can be gamed though Community
01:02:31
notes can be gamed we saw it with um I
01:02:34
saw a report that you know kamla's
01:02:36
campaign or or I don't know if they
01:02:38
directly work for her or what happened
01:02:40
but they did take over Community notes
01:02:42
on X and start manipulating them so you
01:02:45
have to be really careful you know how
01:02:47
you run a community but in in general
01:02:49
I'm all for it I think it's the right
01:02:51
move it's but one signal it's one system
01:02:53
for trying to get you the truth it's not
01:02:54
the only one fact in is another one and
01:02:57
having no system is another one chth
01:02:59
you're obviously an alumni you worked
01:03:01
side by side with Zuckerberg in the
01:03:02
pivotal years of building the Facebook
01:03:05
platform what's your take on what cyan
01:03:07
said and what do you attribute
01:03:10
Zuckerberg's massive 180 here I would
01:03:13
start by saying I think he's a
01:03:15
phenomenal businessman I mean I think
01:03:17
the the results speak for
01:03:19
itself but I also think that that is
01:03:22
exactly what explains the shift in many
01:03:25
ways he to make that shift I think it's
01:03:28
fair to say that in the Obama and Biden
01:03:31
administrations when the winds were
01:03:35
blowing towards censorship they were
01:03:37
part of that machinery and that was the
01:03:40
value maximizing function for Facebook
01:03:43
shareholders in that time because if you
01:03:45
pushed back against that it's not clear
01:03:47
what would have happened to Facebook in
01:03:49
other ways and so I think the
01:03:52
decision whether he morally agreed with
01:03:55
or not almost didn't matter it's the
01:03:58
leadership of the country in which I
01:03:59
operate is telling me it's going to go
01:04:01
this way I go that way once the Biden
01:04:04
and Obama administration sort of went to
01:04:06
the Wayside there's a very interesting
01:04:08
picture that Donald Trump put in his
01:04:10
book and I just I sent it to Nick and I
01:04:14
think it sort of explains the last
01:04:15
week's events relatively well so I'll
01:04:17
just read
01:04:19
it this is a picture of him sitting in
01:04:21
the oval and it says Mark Zuckerberg
01:04:23
would come to the Oval Office to see me
01:04:25
he would bring his very nice wife to
01:04:26
dinners be as nice as anyone could be
01:04:30
while always plotting to install
01:04:31
shameful lock boxes in a true plot
01:04:34
against the president in jcal all caps
01:04:37
okay shout out to the president he told
01:04:39
me that there was nobody like Trump on
01:04:41
Facebook but at the same time and for
01:04:43
whatever reason steered it against me we
01:04:46
are watching him closely and if he does
01:04:48
anything illegal this time he will spend
01:04:50
the rest of his life in prison as will
01:04:53
others who cheat in the 2024
01:04:54
presidential election now that's what he
01:04:56
put in the book and then he was asked
01:04:58
about this
01:04:59
quote at a recent press conference Nick
01:05:02
do you have the the link to that he's
01:05:04
colorful freeberg did you notice Donald
01:05:06
Trump a little bit
01:05:07
colorful essentially Trump was asked
01:05:11
about Zuckerberg's move to free speech
01:05:15
and he he was ENT he was asked you know
01:05:17
do you think it was because of
01:05:19
your threat and he goes yeah probably
01:05:23
well I watched their news conference and
01:05:25
uh I thought was a very good news
01:05:26
conference I think they've honestly I
01:05:28
think they've come a long way meta do
01:05:30
you think he's directly responding to
01:05:31
the threats that you have made to him in
01:05:33
the past probably
01:05:35
probably wow there it is but again the
01:05:38
the the the lens that I would put on
01:05:41
this is now the winds are blowing in a
01:05:43
different direction and I do think it's
01:05:44
the value maximizing function I think
01:05:47
Elon didn't make a value maximizing
01:05:49
function he made a moral decision he did
01:05:52
it when it was unpopular and where the
01:05:53
winds were clearly blowing in the
01:05:55
opposite direction
01:05:56
now that those winds have changed and
01:05:57
it's clear Trump one in early November
01:06:00
the decisions you make in January are
01:06:02
more reflective of the new conditions on
01:06:04
the field coming into the inauguration
01:06:06
but I do think it's the smart value
01:06:08
maximizing decision yet again for
01:06:10
Facebook shareholders and I think it
01:06:13
begets a broader
01:06:15
point I think the thing is when you see
01:06:17
Elon
01:06:18
operate he's a complete outlier in many
01:06:21
dimensions but I think the one dimension
01:06:23
where it matters the most is that he
01:06:25
acts
01:06:26
morally and in the best interests of
01:06:29
what he believes Humanity benefits from
01:06:32
he's always done it he was willing to
01:06:33
torch $44 billion when he bought Twitter
01:06:35
in order to do it and so he does these
01:06:38
things from his own perspective I don't
01:06:40
think there's any other CEO that leads
01:06:42
this way and I don't think they should
01:06:45
necessarily I do think that you know
01:06:47
Mark's a good person but his intimate
01:06:50
feelings should be known by his wife his
01:06:53
children his friends his family I think
01:06:55
we as shareholders have any right to
01:06:57
know necessarily Elon is different and I
01:07:00
think it creates an expectation that
01:07:01
maybe we'll get that from everybody else
01:07:04
but I wouldn't conflate everybody else
01:07:06
with him so I think that this is a smart
01:07:09
business decision it makes a ton of
01:07:11
sense and as you can see he was
01:07:13
basically told to do it so he complied
01:07:17
uh free your thoughts on
01:07:20
Zuckerberg making this decision if kamla
01:07:24
Harris had won
01:07:26
would he have released a statement or
01:07:28
added Dana White to the board of
01:07:30
Facebook probably not okay there you
01:07:33
have it folks pretty straightforward
01:07:35
here KLA wins he would not have done
01:07:37
this he is jumping in front of a
01:07:41
marching band and he is the band leader
01:07:43
now he's got his baton and uh he is a
01:07:46
front runner and if you open the
01:07:47
dictionary and you look it up but I mean
01:07:49
it's a smart business move I think if
01:07:51
you're a meta shareholder I think you're
01:07:52
happy to see it absolutely is there
01:07:55
anything wrong with it J or you're just
01:07:56
saying there's a tremendous amount wrong
01:07:58
with it it's called moral Integrity
01:08:00
having an ethical Compass having hoah
01:08:03
having an own sense of what's right and
01:08:06
wrong in the world which he does not
01:08:08
have in my estimation based on hisor
01:08:10
that's not fair that's not fair you
01:08:11
don't know because again what I'm saying
01:08:13
is I said based on my estimation no but
01:08:16
Jason no what I'm trying to say is Elon
01:08:19
shares who he is in a 360 Dee way with
01:08:22
the world so we know where he stands and
01:08:25
all I'm saying is what Mark does or
01:08:27
doesn't believe really isn't known to us
01:08:29
it's probably known to his wife and his
01:08:31
family and his board I doubt his board
01:08:33
even knows actually some of his close
01:08:35
confidence some of his confidence let me
01:08:37
be clear I'll even it's it's I'm I'm
01:08:39
happy you're challenging me on it I base
01:08:41
people on their actions his action was
01:08:44
to be the greatest censor in the history
01:08:46
of humanity there's no human being who
01:08:48
censored More Humans than him that was
01:08:50
his decision when it was a popular
01:08:51
decision whether it was
01:08:54
or po not popular Jason necessary for
01:08:57
maximizing his business in that moment
01:08:59
he do I disagree his business would have
01:09:02
been just as vibrant if he had a spine
01:09:05
and he just said this is what I believe
01:09:08
and I think he's over optimizing based
01:09:11
on what he thinks everybody else around
01:09:12
him wants and I don't know I didn't I've
01:09:14
never worked with him I don't know him
01:09:16
personally you're right on that front
01:09:18
but he banned Trump for two years the
01:09:20
president of the United States I said at
01:09:22
the time I don't know that you can give
01:09:23
a permanent brand ban to the president
01:09:25
United States when he had the
01:09:26
opportunity to reevaluate that decision
01:09:28
you know what he did he punted he
01:09:30
created a third- party organization to
01:09:32
make the decision for him and deflected
01:09:34
Zuck created the oversight board he's so
01:09:36
spineless he decided I'll create and
01:09:38
give $150 million to this board to make
01:09:41
these hard decisions for me instead of
01:09:43
me making the decision he has God voting
01:09:46
shares of that company chamath he
01:09:48
controls it with an Iron Fist and not
01:09:50
only does he control with an iron fist
01:09:51
he has put protetive prisions in that so
01:09:54
that his children could take that $3.3
01:09:56
billion platform and own it forever and
01:09:59
he punted to them and said I don't want
01:10:01
to make these decisions what I saw when
01:10:03
he did that was I don't want to be
01:10:04
blamed for these decisions and that is a
01:10:07
lack of courage and Morality In my
01:10:09
estimation Jason and then the second he
01:10:12
is threatened by Trump he makes the
01:10:14
opposite decision and if he's making his
01:10:16
decisions strictly on maximizing money I
01:10:19
don't respect that I think he should
01:10:21
make the decisions based on what he
01:10:22
think is is the moral what is the point
01:10:24
of being a billionaire or worth a 100
01:10:26
billion or 200 billion if you don't get
01:10:28
to say I have you money you I'm going to
01:10:31
do what I want and that's what I think
01:10:33
is the his moral failure and anybody
01:10:35
giving him his flowers or champing him
01:10:37
for this I think it's just political
01:10:40
expediency and I think it's disgraceful
01:10:42
that's my per that's my feeling sorry I
01:10:44
have my own opinion what about the fact
01:10:46
that he was dragged in front of Congress
01:10:49
many times over and people that could
01:10:51
put him behind bars told him to his face
01:10:54
many times and this all been kind of
01:10:56
been coming out over the last couple of
01:10:57
months that government officials were
01:10:59
directing him in a way that feels like
01:11:02
do this or you will be prosecuted to do
01:11:04
the following things to act the
01:11:06
following way and to moderate your
01:11:07
platform in a way that we are telling
01:11:09
you to moderate it or you will find
01:11:11
yourself behind bars do you not think
01:11:13
that there's some degree of inherit
01:11:14
complicit kind of role that certain
01:11:16
government officials and folks in power
01:11:18
had in driving some of those actions
01:11:20
that maybe he had to do it to survive
01:11:22
and to keep the company alive not to
01:11:24
mention a violation of our constitution
01:11:26
no not at all he could have just hired
01:11:28
lawyers and fought it he didn't put up
01:11:30
any fight the second they told him to
01:11:32
roll over and ban Trump he did it zero
01:11:35
fight from him he has no do you know
01:11:38
that for sure because I I just want to
01:11:40
make sure I ask I'm just basing on his
01:11:41
actions I'm like I told you at the
01:11:42
beginning B basing on his actions right
01:11:46
not going to jail for Banning Trump if
01:11:48
he didn't ban Trump or he gave him a
01:11:49
six-month suspension he would have been
01:11:52
just fine I'm just trying to get you to
01:11:53
take a fair point of view which means
01:11:55
like let's make sure you're thoughtful
01:11:56
about the fact that this is not a dumb
01:11:58
person or a person let's give give him
01:12:00
the benefit for a minute he he's not a
01:12:01
DB benefit of being a great business
01:12:03
executive I'm just saying let's assume
01:12:05
he's not dumb and let's say that as cyan
01:12:07
points out and as he's kind of
01:12:08
highlighted points in his history he
01:12:10
actually does have certain beliefs and
01:12:11
certain systems that he would love to
01:12:13
kind of embrace I've said this many
01:12:15
times before all of the founders of the
01:12:17
big tech companies were all big Free
01:12:19
Speech Advocates that was a big part of
01:12:20
the open internet and the movement of
01:12:22
the open internet when a lot of people
01:12:23
got involved and that was a big part for
01:12:24
him
01:12:25
and I don't know like you know if you
01:12:27
really think at some point he flipped
01:12:29
his switch and said I don't care about
01:12:30
the open internet I now want to have a
01:12:31
closed controlled internet or if he
01:12:33
recognized or was coerced into
01:12:35
controlling moderation on the platform
01:12:36
because of the reach that he had and he
01:12:38
said the only way I can have any degree
01:12:40
of openness is to do the following and I
01:12:41
will say that my experience is similar
01:12:43
in Google when Google had to exit China
01:12:46
they initially went to China with a
01:12:48
closed internet with a closed censored
01:12:49
model of search because that was the way
01:12:52
they had to survive to offer a business
01:12:54
in China they didn't morally agree with
01:12:56
it they didn't think it was ethically
01:12:57
correct did they launch that or did
01:12:58
Sergey kill the deal when Eric Schmidt
01:13:00
proposed it well that deal went live
01:13:02
there was a let me let me just make sure
01:13:04
I get this all correct no they didn't go
01:13:06
live Sergey Bren because of his
01:13:09
upbringing in Russia he went to the mat
01:13:12
and said on a moral basis we're not
01:13:13
going into China and I've talked to
01:13:15
Sergey about it he did not want to go in
01:13:17
there and compromise his own ethics
01:13:19
that's period full stop so I don't think
01:13:23
that the only outlier here you're not
01:13:25
right and I just want to make when did
01:13:28
it when did because the dragon it was
01:13:29
called project Dragon there was a
01:13:32
there's a long history to this okay
01:13:33
let's let cyan come in here I want to
01:13:34
make sure I get this right but go ahead
01:13:36
say obviously he's a brilliant
01:13:38
businessman but I do think Underneath It
01:13:39
All he is a human being and I think his
01:13:41
fighting in the arena and this fighting
01:13:43
stuff that he does actually did change
01:13:45
him and this happened long before the
01:13:48
first amendment stuff started to appear
01:13:50
you know I think or free speech I
01:13:52
shouldn't call it first amendment but I
01:13:54
do think that the government did
01:13:55
interfere and after January 20th we're
01:13:58
going to find out some interesting stuff
01:13:59
and we'll get to the bottom of you know
01:14:02
how did the
01:14:04
government pressure him to censor things
01:14:07
and I think he's getting in front of
01:14:08
that because it is going to come out and
01:14:11
I think that is a huge part of why he is
01:14:13
getting more involved is because it's
01:14:15
going to be revealed just how much the
01:14:17
government coerced him and and how much
01:14:21
he acquiesced is that sort of what
01:14:22
you're this is why I think the fighting
01:14:24
actually helped think he learned to stop
01:14:25
acquiescing W I actually think he put up
01:14:28
a fight that is where I started seeing
01:14:30
the change in him and started noticing
01:14:32
it and so did the you know he's
01:14:33
developed so many more fans and people
01:14:35
who are looking to him as a leader in a
01:14:37
different way now because he's actually
01:14:39
starting to express who he is and like
01:14:42
what kind of music he likes nobody ever
01:14:43
knew that they thought he was just a
01:14:45
robot he doesn't like music he he hired
01:14:47
a whole PR team to craft this is my
01:14:48
understanding but anyway again I don't I
01:14:51
don't know that much detail I don't I
01:14:52
don't I'm not involved in his personal
01:14:54
life like that but I just I always love
01:14:56
to give people the benefit of that I
01:14:57
guess that's just me uh and I and I do
01:14:59
think that uh people people can change
01:15:02
and I'm hoping that he is actually going
01:15:04
to stay on this side we we want more
01:15:07
leaders like him to believe in free
01:15:08
speech of course of course I mean listen
01:15:10
Reddit had by the way they all do and
01:15:13
I've never met a you know an internet
01:15:16
business executive who didn't come from
01:15:19
kind of the open internet philosophical
01:15:21
Doctrine by background that that was a
01:15:23
big motivator for all of us Because the
01:15:25
Internet took away the controls took
01:15:27
away the power took away the censorship
01:15:29
took away all these things that other
01:15:31
kind of communication systems had vested
01:15:33
in them and the internet through an open
01:15:35
protocol allowed anyone to share
01:15:37
anything with anyone else and obviously
01:15:39
laws and all this other stuff that's
01:15:41
happened since then has made that far
01:15:43
more difficult and I will re revisit our
01:15:45
conversation Jason Google's China with
01:15:47
censored search results was live for
01:15:49
four years before they canel it so they
01:15:51
launched in 2006 they censored results
01:15:54
they complied with the Chinese
01:15:55
government request and eventually in
01:15:57
2010 they killed it and you could argue
01:15:58
it was because of philosophical reasons
01:16:00
but fundamentally it never actually got
01:16:02
a lot of users in China there were more
01:16:04
users on BYU and Google had separately
01:16:06
made an investment in was the moment I
01:16:09
think it became if I remember correctly
01:16:12
this 20 years ago but I think I think it
01:16:13
was YouTube oh was it YouTube because
01:16:15
one of the other services they started
01:16:17
saying hey we need to know these
01:16:19
people's names who posted this who sent
01:16:21
this email we want full access into it
01:16:23
and that's where they drew the line
01:16:24
because it wasn't just the passive
01:16:25
search engine right it was actually like
01:16:27
Roundup dissidence like Yahoo famously
01:16:31
did Yahoo They yeah Google claimed there
01:16:33
was a hack that happened because on
01:16:35
their servers in China and so they were
01:16:37
just no longer comfortable operating
01:16:39
about this guys yeah however we got here
01:16:42
we're here yeah and we should all be
01:16:45
happy that we're here yeah exactly yeah
01:16:48
I'll take the win and we just kind of
01:16:50
move forward how about that I mean
01:16:51
taking the win is a good way world is a
01:16:53
better place because of his decision
01:16:55
yeah exactly I think we all agree on
01:16:57
that I mean what's the point of having
01:16:59
an open platform and you can say things
01:17:01
but why do you call them spineless like
01:17:02
why like why go after the guy why
01:17:04
because you can judge a person when
01:17:05
they're put under pressure to make the
01:17:07
right decision I think what Jason is
01:17:09
expressing is sort of what I was trying
01:17:11
to say and I probably said it poorly I
01:17:12
think there are some of us
01:17:15
who look at the way that Elon runs
01:17:19
himself in his companies okay as a sort
01:17:21
of world beating technology CEO
01:17:26
and then that sort of sets the
01:17:28
bar but I think that that bar is
01:17:30
impossible to
01:17:32
meet and I think part of it is because
01:17:34
of elon's Genius the other part of it is
01:17:36
his success the other part of it is his
01:17:38
influence but there's an element Jason a
01:17:40
fundamental moral risk-taking that he
01:17:43
takes that has been rewarded over and
01:17:46
over again that no other CEO has had to
01:17:49
make and when they have they've largely
01:17:51
failed and so I I understand where
01:17:53
you're coming from but I would give give
01:17:55
a lot of folks the benefit of the doubt
01:17:57
here and say it's not clear what they
01:17:59
believe then versus what they believe
01:18:01
now but the destination is very good and
01:18:04
we're in a better place for society and
01:18:06
hopefully we can maintain these Norms
01:18:09
independent of who's in charge after
01:18:11
Trump I am super happy he's making these
01:18:14
decisions I believe in freedom of speech
01:18:16
you know it's I think he's gonna have to
01:18:17
deal with advertisers next though I mean
01:18:19
that's one thing that X doesn't have to
01:18:20
deal with as much and that's going to be
01:18:22
the second problem he's going to have is
01:18:24
not the government but do advertisers
01:18:27
want to be next to some of the content
01:18:28
that's about to appear and when he loses
01:18:31
tens of billions of dollars in personal
01:18:32
net worth will he make the same
01:18:34
decisions we'll see but I can tell you
01:18:37
if KLA Harris had been voted in he would
01:18:40
double down on censorship instead of
01:18:42
taking this position I think he is
01:18:44
terrified of trump and having his
01:18:45
company broken up and he's doing this
01:18:47
strictly to appease Trump which I think
01:18:50
putting Dana White on the board is
01:18:52
another signal that's one of Trump's
01:18:53
good friends he's just trying get close
01:18:55
to the party he's trying to make up for
01:18:56
lost time for when he supported the
01:18:59
censorship of trump and other folks I I
01:19:02
I think he would make the opposite
01:19:03
decision but to your point we're here
01:19:05
I'm glad he's here J would you would you
01:19:07
meet Zuck in the Octagon that's the most
01:19:09
important question no of the day no
01:19:11
definitely not he's got he's he's 10 15
01:19:14
years younger than me he killed me not a
01:19:16
not a chance would I meet him in the
01:19:18
Octagon but I wish him well I wish him
01:19:20
well would you meet would you meet
01:19:21
Palmer lucky on the Octagon let's not
01:19:23
start that up again
01:19:26
just wondering just wondering I actually
01:19:27
literally challenged him he he wanted to
01:19:29
send the mountain he wanted to pick
01:19:32
somebody to fight for him Trey from
01:19:34
Founders fund and I said no uh unless
01:19:37
Trey was will I would you guys ever
01:19:39
watch the old TV show American
01:19:40
Gladiators I would like I would like you
01:19:43
and Palmer to have an American Gladiator
01:19:45
style tournament like maybe four or five
01:19:47
events and kind of get in put up a
01:19:50
million dollars for charity I'll totally
01:19:52
do
01:19:53
it we'll put up a million dollars each
01:19:55
for charity I'll do
01:19:57
it let's let's get you know let's get
01:20:00
the I think that this be let's something
01:20:03
super this would be more more exciting
01:20:05
than the accelerator I will tell you we
01:20:07
absolutely might get more ratings than
01:20:08
it yeah you could actually call it you
01:20:11
could call it American Gladiators it
01:20:12
would be a great there you go American
01:20:13
Gladiators the the CEO Edition business
01:20:16
to business Edition the're going sass
01:20:19
all right listen Nvidia going consumer
01:20:20
let's talk about it Nvidia made a big
01:20:23
announcement at CES this week they made
01:20:24
a lot of them one of them that was
01:20:26
particularly interesting was this $3,000
01:20:28
personal AI computer for researchers so
01:20:30
awesome it's called project digits and
01:20:34
it's essentially like um maybe Arduino
01:20:38
would be a way to look at this like a a
01:20:39
personal device but it's powerful enough
01:20:41
to run llms on they're also going after
01:20:44
physical AI like Robotics and
01:20:46
self-driving as we said here on the
01:20:49
award show a lot of people on the panel
01:20:50
were predicting this year would be the
01:20:52
year of Robotics and they announced that
01:20:54
they're going to have driver assistant
01:20:56
chips and maybe build worlds for people
01:20:59
to simulate which net net at the end of
01:21:02
the day I think freeberg puts them on
01:21:04
second would put autonomy Partners on
01:21:06
second or third base in terms of
01:21:08
creating technology by incorporating it
01:21:10
into the chips and into their stack so
01:21:13
cyan what do you think of these
01:21:15
announcements and some of the other ones
01:21:16
he made I know you were excited to talk
01:21:19
about this yeah I'm really excited to
01:21:20
talk about it because I think I've been
01:21:21
trying to figure out how they justify
01:21:23
their valuation
01:21:25
over the long run and you know I'm not a
01:21:27
public market person but I am fascinated
01:21:30
with Nvidia and uh you know there Cloud
01:21:33
GPU business is definitely a majority of
01:21:36
uh the revenue so I think a lot a lot of
01:21:39
what we're seeing is them trying to grow
01:21:40
into that and trying to expand in case
01:21:43
you know the Music Stops now I don't
01:21:45
actually think the music's going to
01:21:47
stop you know it's insane to me we
01:21:50
haven't even barely touched what AI is
01:21:53
going to do and change and all of the
01:21:55
various things that are going to come
01:21:56
from it and you know the early adopters
01:21:59
cannot use Claude without getting shut
01:22:01
down because of scaling issues and I
01:22:03
don't think those are artificially
01:22:04
created based on the type of investing
01:22:06
I'm doing and um so I'm very bullish on
01:22:10
Nvidia it is interesting it's an
01:22:12
interesting thing to go consumer and you
01:22:15
know the thing that really hit me was
01:22:18
the fact that uh he kind of declared
01:22:20
Tesla one of the most valuable companies
01:22:22
in the world in the long run
01:22:25
it's interesting that he got behind
01:22:27
oyota but at the same time you know I
01:22:30
don't think of a there's one single car
01:22:33
company out there that has the kind of
01:22:34
data that full self drive has and Tesla
01:22:37
has yeah um so if they enter the robo
01:22:39
taxi Market I actually think they should
01:22:41
buy Uber then it's kind of you should
01:22:43
think Tesla should buy Uber oh yeah I
01:22:45
think they should buy Uber well that
01:22:46
would be about 10% of Tesla's market cap
01:22:48
at this point if they paid a premium it
01:22:49
might be 15% so it would be very similar
01:22:51
hard but it's true like yeah it is true
01:22:54
yeah and then and then you launch that
01:22:56
Robo taxi service and you know maybe
01:22:59
there's some sort of secondary
01:23:01
aftermarket solution kind of like comma
01:23:03
AI or something like that that you can
01:23:04
do for people's
01:23:05
cars where you can actually get
01:23:07
anybody's car into the fleet and start
01:23:10
self-driving but it is true this is
01:23:12
going to be the largest breakout in
01:23:13
robotics we've ever seen if whmo is any
01:23:17
indicator and you know I I read
01:23:19
somewhere I think that Amazon or some
01:23:21
somebody was looking at it I don't know
01:23:23
what was going on with weo but um oh
01:23:26
lift Amazon was going to buy lift yeah
01:23:28
that makes no sense right like lot sense
01:23:30
to me sense would the point
01:23:33
be I do think you're correct I think
01:23:36
maybe delivery or something like that I
01:23:37
can't figure out what their play is
01:23:39
there well it's not and it's also not
01:23:40
Global but you know looking at the
01:23:42
Amazon and weo Tesla and Uber I think
01:23:46
weo plus Uber Amazon Plus Uber or Tesla
01:23:50
plus Uber defines who number one is
01:23:52
right because you'd have a global
01:23:53
footprint and for the 5 10 years maybe
01:23:55
10 years it takes to roll out taxis
01:23:58
globally you could have people D I mean
01:24:00
it's a really interesting thought
01:24:01
process you have your say imagine if
01:24:03
there was an inter St where they sold
01:24:06
less Teslas this year slightly than last
01:24:08
year you could just keep producing lots
01:24:10
of model wise and give them to the Uber
01:24:13
drivers keep reinforcement loaning going
01:24:16
while the taxis and regulations get set
01:24:19
and then you would be able to put
01:24:22
another instead of selling 1.8 million
01:24:24
Teslas you could sell 3 million Teslas 4
01:24:26
million Teslas to Uber drivers get all
01:24:28
that data and have the safety driver in
01:24:30
while each region decides if they want
01:24:33
Robo taxis where how Etc your thoughts
01:24:35
jamaath on nvidia's dipping their toe
01:24:39
into maybe taking the bottom 30% of the
01:24:41
stack of self-driving I don't have much
01:24:44
of an opinion on that to be honest I
01:24:45
think that sort of along the lines of
01:24:47
what I said on the prediction show I
01:24:49
think that way and Tesla are going to
01:24:51
run away with this market and I think
01:24:52
it's going to force a bunch of cons
01:24:54
validation in the traditional Auto
01:24:57
o I think the interesting thing is that
01:25:01
they really double down and created a
01:25:04
pretty decent test bench for robotics I
01:25:06
thought that was pretty interesting so I
01:25:07
think that
01:25:08
reinforces what a lot of smart people
01:25:10
including you know what freeberg and
01:25:12
Gavin also spoke about just in terms of
01:25:14
the long-term future for robots I think
01:25:17
that that was cool I was I was a little
01:25:20
confused by the lowend PC I don't
01:25:23
understand what the point of that
01:25:25
is maybe it like creates some crazy
01:25:28
deepin Market where you can buy GPU and
01:25:32
then contribut it to some distributed
01:25:33
Network and allow some distributed
01:25:35
workload to run on that I guess I don't
01:25:37
know I think it's a toy a hobbyist kind
01:25:41
of device that becomes like a bridge and
01:25:43
we see this often in technology where
01:25:45
somebody creates like even the original
01:25:48
PCS let's face it they were kind of like
01:25:49
toys and hobbyist devices arduinos and
01:25:52
the original drones
01:25:55
yeah I guess the point is a toy to do
01:25:57
what because if you're trying to do
01:25:59
inference like everything is telling us
01:26:02
that we are reaching the limits of
01:26:05
training and that's an LL though right
01:26:09
the point it's not yeah let me get to
01:26:12
yeah yeah so so in this world of AI that
01:26:14
we know it today there's training and
01:26:16
there's inference and right now we think
01:26:17
that there's training that's at a limit
01:26:20
and so now the market shifts to
01:26:21
inference so if you're going to buy this
01:26:25
jacked up personal computer what are you
01:26:27
going to use it for my suspicion is some
01:26:29
sort of test time compute use
01:26:32
case which is an inference use case but
01:26:35
it's not clear to me why that's a better
01:26:38
solution
01:26:40
than all of the AI accelerators plus
01:26:43
tensors that are now just prolifically
01:26:45
being exposed to the market whether it's
01:26:48
Amazon exposing what they've done
01:26:50
whether it's Google exposing what
01:26:51
they've done a whole Litany of startups
01:26:54
exposing what they've done so I was just
01:26:56
confused I don't really
01:26:59
know what the whole point is what do you
01:27:01
think about this the robotics thing was
01:27:04
interesting if the market develops in
01:27:06
the way that they think so we're talking
01:27:08
about maybe two or three different
01:27:09
pieces here freeberg which one do you
01:27:11
think is super interesting than the this
01:27:14
$3,000 sort of GPU for your desktop that
01:27:18
you attach to your computer you get to
01:27:19
play with things locally do you think
01:27:21
that's promising where would that go if
01:27:23
you had to guess so I think the bet he's
01:27:25
making is it's not just llms which is
01:27:29
predicting text but you know we've
01:27:31
talked a lot about Machine Vision
01:27:34
models graph neural Nets that that are
01:27:37
being used for weather forecasting
01:27:39
there's now these kind of genome
01:27:40
language models that are trying to
01:27:41
predict genomic output for Bio uh Tech
01:27:46
applications there's also going to be
01:27:48
kind of Real Time Machine Vision and
01:27:51
robotic response like we're working on
01:27:54
this at ohal and we're trying to figure
01:27:56
out what's the right kind of runtime
01:27:58
environment for these sorts of systems
01:28:00
that are going to be using a machine
01:28:01
vision and a robotic kind of response
01:28:03
type system and there's a lot of these
01:28:04
industrial applications that are
01:28:05
emerging let's say you're running a
01:28:07
robot in a warehouse do you really want
01:28:09
that robot in the warehouse to be
01:28:11
sending data to the cloud and waiting
01:28:13
for a model to run in the cloud and
01:28:15
getting a response the probability is
01:28:17
you want to have that at the edge of the
01:28:18
network you want to have something local
01:28:21
and I don't think he necessarily has a
01:28:23
strong point of view on what the types
01:28:24
of models and Industrial applications
01:28:26
will be but the bet he's making is that
01:28:28
the models are good enough and now the
01:28:30
chips are good enough that they can
01:28:32
actually
01:28:33
realize real-time responses using
01:28:36
Machine Vision using real-time input and
01:28:38
then respond quickly with a local model
01:28:40
running whatever that model is to drive
01:28:42
some output in the industrial setting
01:28:45
and that there'll be a lot of these
01:28:46
sorts of applications whether that's
01:28:47
making predictions for biotech research
01:28:50
or whether that's for running robots in
01:28:52
warehouses or building new research
01:28:54
models or maybe you could strap this PC
01:28:57
on the back of something like a car a
01:28:59
tractor a lawnmower a humanoid robot or
01:29:03
any other set of applications explain to
01:29:05
the audience freeberg why having the
01:29:07
computer at the edge is beneficial for
01:29:09
those folks who might not know if you're
01:29:11
taking in a lot of data and then you
01:29:13
have to run a lot of data in a model
01:29:15
it's a lot faster to to run that model
01:29:17
locally like when Tesla runs
01:29:19
self-driving it's not sending the video
01:29:21
images from your car to a server
01:29:24
a thousand miles away and then letting
01:29:26
the server decide how to drive your car
01:29:28
the car is running its model on what to
01:29:29
do with respect to the video imagery in
01:29:32
the car it's local because the ability
01:29:35
for all that data to get processed in
01:29:36
the car means that you don't have to
01:29:37
wait for the internet to transmit data
01:29:39
back and forth you don't have lag time
01:29:41
you don't have the 60 millisecond or 100
01:29:42
millisecond response time you don't have
01:29:44
it losing your phone connection and then
01:29:46
not knowing what to do exactly or or the
01:29:48
the connection drops or waiting for a
01:29:50
server to come online or server breaks
01:29:52
in the data center everything is local
01:29:54
so if you strap this like you know
01:29:56
Nvidia computer which is basically plug
01:29:58
andplay you don't have to have like
01:30:00
Hardware expertise you could strap it
01:30:01
onto the back of a humanoid robot or run
01:30:04
research applications locally so I think
01:30:06
that there's going to be some really
01:30:07
interesting use cases whether it becomes
01:30:10
a replacement for the Apple you know
01:30:12
Macintosh Pro Studio device whatever
01:30:15
maybe we'll see Mac Mini 4 yeah the Mac
01:30:18
Mini 4 but a lot of people have pointed
01:30:19
out that actually the the compute on
01:30:21
this thing for $3,000 knocks a lot of
01:30:23
Max out of the um out of the field I
01:30:26
just can't run an operating system in
01:30:27
the traditional sense Sam when we look
01:30:29
at startups I remember when you and I
01:30:31
started investing two of the driving
01:30:33
forces was free storage free bandwidth
01:30:35
and cloud computing it drove a lot of
01:30:38
ability to get a product to Market very
01:30:40
quickly effectively Etc what impact will
01:30:43
AI have on all these startups that are
01:30:46
being originating now in 2024
01:30:49
2025 look into your crystal wall and how
01:30:52
do you think they'll uh grow the
01:30:55
footprint of them how is this going to
01:30:57
accelerate the startup scene I actually
01:30:59
think we're going to see a Cambrian
01:31:01
explosion of creativity and and
01:31:03
development of different things and some
01:31:05
of them are going to be stupid ideas and
01:31:07
some of them are going to be great but I
01:31:08
think it's going to make our job
01:31:10
especially at the seed stage of
01:31:11
investing harder and
01:31:13
harder there's going to be so many
01:31:15
there's just going to be a lot of people
01:31:16
that have similar ideas at the same time
01:31:18
that can execute quickly and and do
01:31:20
things that break neck speeds that
01:31:22
they've never been able to do before and
01:31:24
um you know picking the winner is going
01:31:26
to be hard to figure out it's going to
01:31:28
be harder and harder yeah and it might
01:31:30
be that um you know I've been thinking
01:31:31
about this like do you in invest in
01:31:33
competitors which is something I never
01:31:35
used to do you know do you take a bet an
01:31:37
index an entire category that you're
01:31:39
interested in you know what is the
01:31:41
Approach at seed And precede because uh
01:31:44
I think of an idea and I'm like wow
01:31:45
that's really neat and then I go and
01:31:46
look out there and there's 30 people
01:31:48
working on it and that didn't used to be
01:31:50
the case and I think part of it is uh
01:31:53
We've really unlocked
01:31:54
a tool that allows people to do things
01:31:58
that would have been cost prohibitive or
01:32:01
gives them the ability to think gosh I
01:32:02
could be an entrepreneur and I can try
01:32:04
this and I could do
01:32:06
this so I'm seeing people experiment and
01:32:08
do all sorts of things as far as the
01:32:10
startups some of AI stuff is just a
01:32:13
feature you know it's just um table
01:32:16
Stakes at this point it's like you know
01:32:17
a chat or whatever and that doesn't
01:32:19
really matter but then you're seeing
01:32:20
people reimagine games and reimagine
01:32:24
you know even things down to your
01:32:26
kitchen appliance Etc uh so I just I do
01:32:30
think it's going to be very very
01:32:31
difficult and and I tend to set out a
01:32:33
lot of hype Cycles so I invested in
01:32:36
power and compute
01:32:39
lithography kind of all of the things
01:32:41
that are going to be underneath all of
01:32:43
this and so I'm not sure how much of it
01:32:45
I'm going to participate in until it
01:32:47
starts to get to a steady state and you
01:32:49
kind of can understand what's next
01:32:51
because the the rate of acceleration is
01:32:53
just so
01:32:56
great that it's just kind of unclear to
01:32:58
me sometimes you know especially when it
01:33:00
comes to these consumer applications
01:33:02
consumer facing things it's just uh
01:33:04
really hard well when we were picking
01:33:08
famously Uber you had to pick between
01:33:09
scar lift and Uber there were three
01:33:11
people doing it and it was pretty clear
01:33:13
who was the most qualified you know
01:33:15
amongst those three you now to your
01:33:16
point if you're want to be involved in
01:33:18
Tax Plus AI or legal plus AI you might
01:33:22
be looking at 50 companies oh 100 and it
01:33:25
was tradition in Silicon Valley to not
01:33:27
bet on competitors there were some
01:33:28
notable exceptions when you run an
01:33:30
accelerator like I do Tech Stars or why
01:33:31
combinator you aren't Bound by that
01:33:33
because 50% of the companies pivot
01:33:35
almost by Design so I think you just
01:33:38
have to I think at preed because people
01:33:42
pivot you just have to tell people like
01:33:43
listen we have a lot of pivoting going
01:33:44
on people are going to run into each
01:33:45
other I can't just bet on one thing
01:33:48
right in in a space but I think that's a
01:33:50
reasonable compromise if if all the
01:33:51
founders are going to keep pivoting to
01:33:53
others businesses how can the investors
01:33:55
even keep track of that it's like being
01:33:56
aircraft traffic control of 10 airports
01:33:59
at once it's just not feasible uh let's
01:34:02
goad you wouldn't think it but there's
01:34:03
still a lot of spreadsheet companies out
01:34:05
there you know you think you'd run out
01:34:07
of them but they're still out there you
01:34:08
know you look at and I think this is
01:34:10
where AI is really going to make a
01:34:12
difference like RFP proposals for
01:34:13
governments you know something that
01:34:15
takes like 30 days and it's manual and
01:34:17
you have to submit these horrible
01:34:19
documents you know you can ingest your
01:34:20
entire Corpus of you know all of your
01:34:23
previous bid bids and submit them at a
01:34:25
break neck speed now and win more
01:34:27
contracts that becomes like a National
01:34:29
Defense company at that point and and so
01:34:32
I think we're going to see a lot of
01:34:33
really interesting things where a lot of
01:34:36
Cru is going to disappear and and
01:34:39
that'll be a really interesting wave
01:34:41
that I'm I'm looking forward to yeah in
01:34:44
fact jamath has made a big bet there
01:34:45
with his time uh with his uh software
01:34:47
startup that he's created all right
01:34:49
let's end on the United States of
01:34:52
America growing from 50 to 60 or 70
01:34:56
States Trump has
01:34:58
been rattling off some ideas around this
01:35:02
chth what's your take on it I know we
01:35:04
got to get wrapped up here so we'll just
01:35:06
do a quick lightning round on it I mean
01:35:07
I thought it was really interesting and
01:35:10
I and I was just caught off guard at how
01:35:13
the media tried to portray it as Trump
01:35:16
being Trump goofy whatever colorful but
01:35:20
I think like what I've realized even
01:35:21
with the California fire thing the guy
01:35:24
has this preent way of he may not say it
01:35:27
in the way that it works for some people
01:35:29
but he's just really on top of this
01:35:31
stuff so I I just sent Nick a thing so I
01:35:34
I started to learn a little bit more
01:35:35
about why he wants to take over
01:35:37
Greenland and it really comes down to
01:35:40
one very basic idea here because of
01:35:43
climate change and other things the
01:35:45
Arctic ice shelf is melting and the more
01:35:48
and more it melts it opens up a shipping
01:35:51
Lane in the northern Passage for a lot
01:35:55
of critical goods and so if you had some
01:35:58
sort of strategic agreement with Canada
01:36:00
and Greenland you effectively have this
01:36:04
Monopoly control over something that
01:36:06
could become as important as the Panama
01:36:08
Canal and so I think if you look across
01:36:12
the
01:36:13
world the control of Maritime shipping
01:36:16
lanes becomes this really critical
01:36:19
strategic military and economic asset
01:36:23
and so the reason why he's trying to
01:36:25
find a way to initiate some sort of a
01:36:28
discussion between Greenland and Canada
01:36:30
is exactly this reason and I think it's
01:36:33
sort of like a bargaining Gambit the way
01:36:34
that he started but it's really smart
01:36:37
that he's trying to get this done for
01:36:38
for the United States of America because
01:36:41
meanwhile what you have is China
01:36:43
militarizing very aggressively Russia
01:36:45
militarizing very aggressively and what
01:36:47
you don't want to have happen is those
01:36:49
two countries take control of that
01:36:51
Northern passage as the ice sheet melts
01:36:54
so I just thought that was important
01:36:55
having a capable bu business executive
01:36:57
thinking about the future of business
01:36:59
and shipping and Logistics pretty pretty
01:37:01
big win and I just love the idea Sayan
01:37:04
you know what's smart I mean let's give
01:37:05
Trump credit what's so smart is like
01:37:07
somebody was doing this work yes got it
01:37:10
got it in front of him yeah and he was
01:37:12
smart enough to say hold on a second
01:37:14
this is really important let me tweet it
01:37:17
and then the way that he initiates it
01:37:18
though gets even more attention because
01:37:21
if he basically tweeted hey guys I have
01:37:24
this really interesting idea to gain
01:37:25
more leverage in a Northern Maritime
01:37:27
shipping Lane nobody would have paid
01:37:29
attention absolutely not nobody would
01:37:30
have and now we're all talking about it
01:37:32
and now there's an opportunity for
01:37:34
millions of people to understand why and
01:37:36
be supportive of it it's pretty smart
01:37:39
any thoughts on expanding the United
01:37:40
States to a couple more territories and
01:37:42
states I love it I I would love to have
01:37:44
60 States in our lifetime I mean let's
01:37:46
pick one in the Caribbean let's pick one
01:37:48
in Europe I think we should have an open
01:37:49
invitation but Jason that's not what
01:37:51
he's doing I think he's I know I'm being
01:37:53
a
01:37:54
this is very strategic this one but I'm
01:37:57
just thinking the next Domino I would
01:37:58
like to get Cuba maybe Portugal I don't
01:38:00
know who 80% of people say what do you
01:38:02
think in the country want to join join
01:38:05
it's very strategic if you look at the
01:38:06
Panama Canal I believe either end is
01:38:09
operated and controlled by China we are
01:38:12
at war with China whether we like to
01:38:13
admit it or not in my opinion and so
01:38:16
this is very
01:38:17
strategic he has a very strange way of
01:38:20
communicating as you pointed out but I
01:38:21
think it's brilliant and I actually
01:38:22
think
01:38:24
we should add to that I've always
01:38:25
thought that we should open up and add
01:38:27
more
01:38:29
States and extend that invitation you
01:38:31
know to Taiwan I would might be
01:38:33
controversial to even say
01:38:35
India but I do think that uh that we
01:38:39
there's a lot of countries out there and
01:38:41
people who really really resonate with
01:38:43
what it means to be an American and the
01:38:46
freedoms that come with our subscription
01:38:48
fees of this country and so um I do
01:38:52
think that it would be great for us to
01:38:53
expand and you know I don't know what
01:38:56
he's thinking or how who he's got behind
01:38:58
the scenes who motivated him to do it
01:38:59
but I'm I I really think it's a great
01:39:01
idea freeberg what do you think about
01:39:04
optin
01:39:05
imperialism uh and this incredible
01:39:08
concept of expanding our territories in
01:39:11
the 21st
01:39:13
century again I don't know how to read
01:39:15
it I have no inside information there's
01:39:17
clearly some posturing as we've heard
01:39:19
many times when Trump makes a
01:39:20
declaration like I'm going to put on
01:39:22
100% tariff on every that's imported or
01:39:24
I'm going to charge you 2,000 bucks
01:39:26
Mexico for every time you ship something
01:39:29
here or I want to do X or Y or Z it's
01:39:32
not the literal statement that matters
01:39:35
as much as kind of the the the vector
01:39:37
and the magnitude of the vector he's
01:39:38
clearly trying to um begin negotiating
01:39:41
for some change I I I don't know what
01:39:43
the ultimate kind of strategic endpoint
01:39:45
is meant to be here but clearly there's
01:39:47
something I think Cham might might have
01:39:49
a good good read on this and seems Seems
01:39:52
to make a lot of sense well we have a
01:39:54
military base there and we also protect
01:39:56
it and we we occupy it already which is
01:39:58
interesting right right we somewhat yeah
01:40:01
we somewhat abandoned all that in
01:40:02
Greenland but there is a lot of that
01:40:04
infrastructure still sitting around can
01:40:05
I ask you guys a question I I started I
01:40:07
listened to Lex freedman's interview the
01:40:08
totally off topic but I listened to Lex
01:40:11
freedman's interview with Graham Hancock
01:40:13
you guys ever heard of this guy yes have
01:40:16
you read any of his stuff or watch any
01:40:18
of his shows I have not no okay so he's
01:40:21
got this belief that there was this like
01:40:23
like ancient civilization on Earth not
01:40:26
like sci-fi futuristic but like an
01:40:28
advanced human civilization and that's
01:40:30
where the Great Pyramid of Giza was like
01:40:32
there was a smaller pyramid that was
01:40:34
built there and a lot of these other
01:40:35
kind of like
01:40:37
historical places were built and then
01:40:39
they were built on top of later but that
01:40:42
a lot of these like this Advanced
01:40:44
civilization was wiped out during um the
01:40:48
last ice age there was a a very rapid
01:40:50
kind of uh freeezing event that happened
01:40:52
over period of about 1200 years and
01:40:54
that's when this great kind of Ice Age
01:40:56
Era civilization was wiped out but what
01:40:59
I didn't realize and so I went down this
01:41:00
really crazy rabbit hole in the last
01:41:01
week on like how much of planet Earth
01:41:05
well how different planet Earth was just
01:41:07
12,000 years ago during the Ice Age have
01:41:09
you guys spent any time on this like I
01:41:11
just went down a similar rabbit hole
01:41:12
with the Grand Canyon it's like the
01:41:15
first of all like how the planet earth
01:41:16
has changed in such a short period of
01:41:18
time blows my mind but like the sea
01:41:21
level was 400t lower than it is today
01:41:25
just 12,000 years ago and there were
01:41:26
humans on Earth at the time and so all
01:41:29
of this this area that we look at as
01:41:32
like like Malta the island of Malta was
01:41:35
the southern tip of like a continental
01:41:37
stretch that went into Italy so it was
01:41:39
all part of one great land mass and
01:41:41
there's all this area that was actually
01:41:43
part of that land mass that now sits
01:41:45
under that ocean there and there's these
01:41:47
like like ruts in the ground for moving
01:41:50
stuff and buildings and all this other
01:41:52
crazy stuff and we have no idea like
01:41:54
what's actually under the ice in
01:41:55
Greenland what's under the ice in
01:41:57
Antarctica there's all these parts of
01:41:59
Earth where humans very likely had some
01:42:02
this is so off topic we could cut this
01:42:03
from the show I think it's incredible
01:42:05
and I it's so crazy that there's there's
01:42:08
all these parts of Earth and and
01:42:09
especially like in the oceans as we
01:42:11
start to kind of explore there's
01:42:12
actually like large humans potentially
01:42:14
Advanced civilizations that lived in
01:42:16
these areas not like flying around the
01:42:18
Atlanta stuff that it was actually like
01:42:20
an advanced civilization and then humans
01:42:22
lost a lot of this ability
01:42:23
when the this like period of freezing
01:42:26
happened over 1200 years and then a lot
01:42:28
of it was preserved in Legends and myths
01:42:30
that showed up in later kind of
01:42:32
archaeology and later how do you explain
01:42:34
the
01:42:35
pyramids I think he has a really I think
01:42:38
because we had Gavin explained it last
01:42:40
time say welcome to conspiracy quarter
01:42:42
so somebody sent me an email oh and he
01:42:44
said what they did was they flooded the
01:42:46
area and
01:42:48
they fled the Rocks up yes brilliant
01:42:51
I've heard this but you know what chath
01:42:52
and I were talking about this too cuz
01:42:53
when you remove all that crust because
01:42:55
we we actually were talking we just
01:42:56
didn't use guy in name it's just like
01:42:58
Uranus when you when you break away all
01:43:00
that crust what did they find in Uranus
01:43:03
freeberg mine mine was better mine was
01:43:06
better you got it you land did the joke
01:43:07
it's great it's great I got it oh we
01:43:09
finally got there folks this has been
01:43:12
another amazing episode of the all-in
01:43:13
podcast it's
01:43:16
different yeah I can't say anything
01:43:18
other than cyan you were great for a
01:43:21
first time out you got to the conspiracy
01:43:23
you rocked it you got to interject more
01:43:25
because it's it's a vibrant panel but
01:43:27
for a first time out very before you go
01:43:30
do you have an alternative expanation
01:43:31
for the pyramids Sayan yeah what UF I've
01:43:35
looked into I mean UFOs is the only only
01:43:37
one that I usually come back to because
01:43:39
you know if you look at putting logs
01:43:42
underneath and trying to roll them or
01:43:43
you look at flooding an area all of this
01:43:46
just doesn't make a whole lot of
01:43:48
sense and so and then you know the fact
01:43:51
that there are other civiliz that also
01:43:53
have pyramids that are stunning and
01:43:57
Feats of engineering as well uh things
01:44:00
like stonehinge Etc I mean there's just
01:44:02
things that defy explanation I don't
01:44:04
know if you ever tried to make a
01:44:05
catapult but it's really hard it's
01:44:07
really it's really
01:44:09
hard and so like I we just did not have
01:44:12
the technology or at least we can't find
01:44:15
any definitive way that it that it
01:44:17
happened and and so I do think there is
01:44:20
a possibility that there was a more
01:44:22
advanced civilization here or we were
01:44:24
visited and I I think about that a lot I
01:44:27
think it's mutants I'm going with the
01:44:28
X-Men Theory I think there were mutant
01:44:30
human beings who had the ability with
01:44:31
superpowers to build them it could be
01:44:32
that it could be that it could be we had
01:44:34
control of matter and Alchemy or
01:44:36
something like that who knows this is
01:44:39
this is what we've come to now we get
01:44:40
conspiracy corner at the end of every
01:44:41
program we try to figure out Unsolved
01:44:43
Mysteries welcome to Unsolved Mysteries
01:44:45
and uh oh just a little uh housekeeping
01:44:48
here as we wrap our friends our partners
01:44:51
dare I say at uh hly Market have done us
01:44:54
a solid freedberg check this out we
01:44:57
talked a little bit about our long um
01:45:01
debates here on the program so chath we
01:45:04
created a market here the Magnificent 7
01:45:07
shrinks below 30% of S&P 500 in 2025 44
01:45:11
44% chance is what uh people in the real
01:45:15
world are putting volume on that I see
01:45:17
$11,000 already in volume and then uh
01:45:20
freeberg you came up with one which was
01:45:22
Will uh we I guess we did this one
01:45:24
together but I think it should be really
01:45:26
under your name will US national debt
01:45:28
surpass 38 trillion in
01:45:30
2025 and then third uh talking about
01:45:32
immigration we got a lot of passion
01:45:34
around this topic Trump's team uh and
01:45:36
Trump himself said they're going to
01:45:37
deport 15 million Americans uh 15
01:45:40
million immigrants rather from America I
01:45:43
said hey let's uh create a market for
01:45:45
Will trump Deport 750,000 or more people
01:45:48
in
01:45:49
2025 38% chance for those of you who
01:45:51
don't know Obama think did 2 million
01:45:53
people in 8 years so this is not like a
01:45:56
partisan thing this is just a practical
01:45:57
thing so anyway go to poly market look
01:45:59
at the creators you'll see under that
01:46:01
tab that Allin has a bunch of markets
01:46:03
we're doing this in partnership with our
01:46:05
partners who've partnered with us in a
01:46:08
partnership at po Market # FC part bye
01:46:12
bye love you
01:46:14
guys everyone that was super fun rocket
01:46:17
science a thank
01:46:19
you let your winners ride
01:46:23
Rainman
01:46:26
David and instead we open source it to
01:46:29
the fans and they've just gone
01:46:31
crazy queen
01:46:33
[Music]
01:46:39
of Besties
01:46:42
are this my dog taking your
01:46:47
driveways oh man myit will meet me we
01:46:50
should all just get a room and just have
01:46:52
one Q Georgie cuz they're all this
01:46:54
useless it's like this like sexual
01:46:55
tension that they just need to release
01:46:57
[Music]
01:47:03
Som we need to get
01:47:08
[Music]
01:47:12
merch I'm going all in
