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it was very interesting going to sax's kid's birthday party um freeburg and i were there for about two
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or three hours sac showed up for the last half hour i think i was there for i think i was
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there for two hours and didn't see sex and then i saw him on my way out the door but he had some youtubers there who were pretty cool yeah papa jake and
00:00:17
logan thank you jake what's great yeah you know they have seven million followers on youtube eat your heart out
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jkl how many times bigger is papa jake than you business and podcasting on youtube
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is a new concept uh long form and long form is not what the algorithm
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is designed for it's obviously designed for short form and people getting to completion so getting to completion on a 90 minute video are we talking about
00:00:42
love making again sorry welcome jesus when i say completion i it's not
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this we need an hr department at all in yeah i prefer the short form format for that too
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these are called open folks let your winners ride [Music]
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rain man [Music] david source it to the fans and they've
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just gone crazy with them
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hey everybody welcome to another episode of the all-in podcast it's episode 56.
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we've made it past 55 the show of the band is still together coming to you every friday night far too late because
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the rain man obsesses over every edit in the podcast with us again the all in
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scorsese himself david rain man sax and the queen of quinoa the sultan of
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science david friedberg is here and
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with a power sweater that cost me no turtleneck turtleneck i'm sorry
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a power turtleneck that cost more than your mortgage payment this month the
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dictator himself chamath paulie hoppetea i'm j cal it was a pretty incredible
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week i think we have to pander to the cryptocurrency crowd because that's just making ratings go through the roof here
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i am absolutely inspired by what we saw this week with the constitution dao forming in about a week and going from
00:02:14
one or two million to 46 million dollars raised through a dow if you don't know
00:02:20
what these decentralized autonomous organizations are it's basically analogous to a corporate structure
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but that's written in code so you can get a group of people together typically in the discord then you create a smart
00:02:34
contract they collect in a wallet a bunch of eth or it's typically eth right now
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and then you get some kind of governance written into the dao where people get voting power
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they brought this together to bid on one of 13 copies of the original constitution
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of the united states and it was a very controversial moment last night
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when 80 of the money was raised in the last 48 hours and there was this crazy auction going back and forth
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with two representatives of sotheby's on the phone it hit 41 million dollars
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everybody thought that the dow had won which would have mean would have meant that almost 20 000 people who
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participated in this would then vote on what to do with this 41 million dollar offer coin desk
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incorrectly uh reported that the dow won and then the dao announced that they had
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in fact not some other statistics uh their twitter has 36 000 followers
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the group reported they needed 14 million to participate 30 million to be competitive and 40 million to have a great chance of winning they raised like
00:03:42
i think six or seven million while they were on the air you know when the auction had started
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and the only uh downside to all of this is that there were huge gas fees uh people
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were spending 30 40 50 bucks to donate 200 which was the average
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size of these yeah they should have done it on solana all right so here we go talking our own
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book again now we got somebody's going to clip this out there's a lot of looks here we go jimoth
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what are you gonna do with your copy of the constitution you know what's so funny are you going to auction it back to the
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deck what are you going to burn it and make an nft out of it so it's it's funny uh i did buy
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something at these auctions uh yesterdays quite unique uh i will i will not
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comment on what it was but was it that turtleneck no but uh banksy
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oh no no i didn't i didn't no no no no no no but uh i i did so but i watched these
00:04:39
auctions closely i guess is what i'm trying to say and i was surprised that the u.s constitution for sold so little
00:04:45
you know for a basically like the magna carta of the best startup that's ever been created
00:04:51
well but there's 13 of them right so on a market cap basis on a market cap basis you got to multiply by 13. yeah great 13
00:04:58
times 40 is still one of the originals it was the printing after the original was signed we have a 22 we've created a
00:05:03
22 trillion dollar a year startup that keeps compounding by 45 a year i would have thought these things would be worth
00:05:09
you know a couple hundred million each well there's a lot of there's a lot of u.s memorabilia but yeah i mean
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but what i don't understand it means the u.s constitution david is not as it's not worth as much as it used to be
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that's well you know you got other you got you got the yeah there's a lot of documents you got
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the declaration of independence you got you know the gettysburg address there's i'm a dozen the tea party memo i
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actually think citizens united technically guys the citizens united if it was written not one time
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in one document uh by the supreme court that would be worth much more than 40 million because it's basically
00:05:44
invalidated most of the constitution well here's one of the interesting things that happened here david wait
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david acknowledge that what i just said is true i don't even understand what you just said but i just said if you had printed
00:05:55
the citizens united verdict from the supreme court on a piece of paper that would be worth more than 40 million
00:06:01
it was it was like democracy 2.0 is what you're saying i don't understand why people are getting so swept up in this thing it's kind of my me neither me
00:06:07
neither that's dead what you guys are missing is this is a a critical moment in the history of cryptocurrencies
00:06:13
because the first three major use cases of cryptocurrency were kind of you had money transfer which is not as
00:06:20
good as paypal or venmo or many other solutions oh jason i think what you said store of
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value hold on let me finish store value which is like who cares there's plenty to store value and then nfts got
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interesting but these dows are absolutely game-changing the ability to have 47 million dollars show up and be
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prepared to be deployed in 48 hours what are you saying ico you ever hear
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from illegal and they've been banned and people are being how is down any different i mean because dows have governance gaos have
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governance and it's a programmable government it's just a programmable corporate entity it is cheap
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if these things transfer ownership interest they will be regulated like securities of course that is a very
00:07:02
important point and in this particular model the idea was it would all be kind of part of a non-profit and it would not
00:07:08
be kind of there were donations in fact but there were donations and so as soon as these dials which they should and it's an incredibly powerful tool if it
00:07:15
does actually become a security instrument then it changes everything and it is going to be that
00:07:22
my whole thing is like it's one thing to do that outside the us first right and then it'll be crypto xus crypto
00:07:27
investments that are going to drive this and that's why the u.s is going to be left behind here's what you're missing these dows
00:07:33
are pushing the envelope in the same way airbnb and uber did in terms of you know bending the rules about ride sharing or
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renting your extra room these dows are kind of breaking securities laws they were telling people we're buying the
00:07:45
constitution people who donated thought they were buying part of it or not
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so okay but here's the thing if they bend the rules like this what they
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showed to the sec is that there is a huge appetite for people to quickly form
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groups of capital at low dollar amounts to do something important or interesting in the world and americans now have a
00:08:07
taste of that they're going to continue to have a taste of it and i think it's accreditation laws to change i disagree
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i think that what it showed is that this is yet another explanation of fractionalized ownership that demand
00:08:22
existed well before dowse totally it's it exists today it'll exist tomorrow a dow was just yet another on-ramp but
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much like most fractional ownerships are terrible financial trades for crappy
00:08:35
assets so was this so said differently if you're going to spend the time to open uh a robin hood or e-trade account
00:08:42
it still matters whether you buy a share of lycos or a share of google right okay and so whether you do a dow or whether
00:08:49
you have an llc to me it's irrelevant the underlying asset didn't make any sense had zero
00:08:56
chance in my opinion of any meaningful appreciation and so if you really want to make something work and if you want
00:09:02
to prove the dao then i would have hoped that they would have actually asked a few smart people
00:09:07
hey guys people who buy art people who know crypto what are some assets that i should own because if this thing does
00:09:13
appreciate i wonder if you'll do more to prove the questions that you just beat them out on the so obviously the value
00:09:19
is greater than what the dow thought it was jason you're the reason why an accredited investor this is
00:09:24
non-accredited investors who are doing this i know and that that on sophistication was clear the stupidest
00:09:29
thing you can do if you enter an auction okay is to declare how you're going to be an underbidder so like it's basically
00:09:36
saying hey guys you know here's my top tick and i'm willing to be and i can and so now you force these guys to be the
00:09:42
underbidder at a dollar over there that's fine that's a mechanical issue sax what do you think well i wonder i i
00:09:50
wonder if the reason why they chose this particular type of asset is because it's collectible and therefore it's
00:09:56
explicitly excluded from the securities laws so basically you know that maybe maybe they're limited in terms of what
00:10:01
they can go after because they don't want to be a security but until but but if that's the case then it does limit i
00:10:09
think the applicability of daos right because what you want is is to create corporations that are programmable that
00:10:15
you can have shareholder votes through the tokens yes things like that and you know basically a digital version of what
00:10:21
they do analog in the real world with you know share certification shareholder meetings and stuff like that that nobody
00:10:27
ever attends yeah that no but nobody ever attends these shoulder meetings and you know i get these notices of votes
00:10:33
that are to be held nobody ever feels yeah exactly no one fills that stuff out well and people have super share super
00:10:38
voting and so you feel like you have no say but in this case you do have a say
00:10:45
imagine somebody had 10 000 acres of rainforest or a national potential
00:10:50
national park and all of a sudden you pop up a dow and if the sec says you know what
00:10:55
500 or less you can back their money however you want hold on let me finish and they take that 500
00:11:00
and you get a million people to put 500 in which is completely conceivable somebody could buy 500 million dollars
00:11:07
worth of national forests and say i'm gonna make this into a public trust to protect the environment this is uh on
00:11:14
the brink of changing the world icos you could've done the exact same governance they had no governance that
00:11:20
was missing hold on icos were for the benefit of the scumbags who did those grips and ran
00:11:26
away with the money this is an organization with a predetermined governance structure this is like
00:11:32
creating a new country or a new format for an llc that's what you're missing okay are you done
00:11:38
yes what you're missing you're painting the optimistic scenario of what these things could do and you're
00:11:44
correct but what's always happened in the history of humanity is these scenarios have resolved to people
00:11:52
figuring out ways to scam other people to make money sure sure while this one looks all true
00:11:59
let me finish without interrupting thank you but just like you know this looks like a great altruistic action we're going to
00:12:05
go out and buy the uss constitution u.s constitution the next deal will end up being some shitty art piece that's worth
00:12:12
a hundred grand of chamath points out they'll buy it for 10 million and everyone will lose their ass and the next 500 will look the same and that's
00:12:17
why we have securities regulators and securities laws because in the past when these sorts of structures that weren't
00:12:23
digitally governed and all this sort of stuff and people would go around and they would put together pools of money from other people and promise them the
00:12:28
world and then they would turn around and steal their money and walk away we created securities regulators that could
00:12:34
oversee and not have independent governance but have distributed governance across a regulatory system to
00:12:40
make sure that this doesn't happen and that's the slippery slope of where this goes i'll say one more thing about the structure of this particular dao which i
00:12:46
know can be resolved but it creates a problem in that everyone is betting or
00:12:52
investing a fixed dollar amount without knowing how much equity they're getting and so when you say hey i'm going to put
00:12:58
in 500 and there's currently 10 million dollars or let's say there's 10 000 in this thing it's like hey okay i've got 5
00:13:05
ownership in this thing if the next guy shows up and puts in ten thousand dollars you now have two and a half percent ownership in this thing and
00:13:11
you've inflated the value of the thing you're buying and that's effectively what happened in the structure of this particular dow where the more money
00:13:17
people put in the more they were paying and the less they were owning and you couldn't adjust that the correct
00:13:23
structure in the future for people that do care about equity and ownership will be i want to buy one percent and i'm willing to pay a max of 500 to buy that
00:13:30
one percent and with that rule engine which i know can be built into daos people can then structure what they're willing to bid and how much they're
00:13:36
willing to participate in and the dow as a whole can resolve what it's willing to pay to go buy an asset and everyone can feel like they know what they're getting
00:13:42
as they get into these things and then the third problem with this particular dow is we saw and i know it's kind of the first big one like this was the
00:13:47
obvious point that these guys were showing the world how much they were about to go bid on this asset and if you
00:13:53
take 46 million dollars and you divide it by 1.13 or which you know remember
00:13:58
there's a 13 buyer's premium on this asset they showed everyone what they're going to pay and of course they lost at
00:14:03
a dollar over they were the they were the under bidder i'll say something else the only fractionalized asset that has
00:14:09
ever been proven to appreciate reliably are stocks
00:14:15
every other fractionalized asset where you take something and then you divvy it up
00:14:20
generally has been a trash burger you need to either own the whole thing yourself
00:14:26
or if you're going to own it with a bunch of other people the only thing that's reliable are equities now that's
00:14:32
just a historical artifact for how money has been made so i appreciate jason what you're saying
00:14:37
which is i think actually you care about the structure because i think it has huge implications
00:14:43
to people pursuing wealth creation for themselves for people participating in private markets but i do think that
00:14:49
you're overblowing this one example because i don't think this showed any of that i think that
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this showed how unreliable and and useless ethereum is as a transactional
00:15:00
layer for these things you know the fact that these poor people now have money stuck in a dow that they can't get out
00:15:06
of because they would the gas fees would negate their contribution so that didn't deserve all the bumps in the room one
00:15:11
second please you gotta hold on it didn't prove governance because as david said we had this inflationary
00:15:17
outcome where all of a sudden i didn't know the equity that i owned the transparency worked against them
00:15:24
because you're bidding on an asset where you were clear about the threshold max price you could pay so you had no pricing power and you had no uh opacity
00:15:31
in in your bidding strategy so so i i think that this was a pr lark and
00:15:37
in fact they said it started out as a joke and it took on a head of steam and so i think they felt like they had to
00:15:42
execute what i would say is there are going to be some really amazing examples of dows this proved
00:15:48
none of those things that the amazing ones will prove in my opinion and this will invite regulatory scrutiny faster
00:15:54
than it will keep it away right you will see you know more of these scenarios where people get screwed out of money like
00:16:00
they did in this particular case and i know a lot of everyone that participated in this dow i know that there's altruistic reasons who do they sue who
00:16:06
do they sue the people who do they sue who do they go after now that they lost the 200 that they contributed
00:16:12
yeah i mean there's there's there's no structure and i think that's part of the regulatory you know how do they get the
00:16:17
money back i can't respond who's the person
00:16:27
i could have actually bid for them and actually won that [ __ ] thing for half the price you know what i mean
00:16:33
if you got anything you want to chime in no i mean well i don't know i would like to give a closing yeah why don't you go
00:16:40
for it all right number one you're all speaking like a bunch of rich accredited investors uh we need to think about
00:16:47
people who do not uh get to participate and what i see in my day job is people
00:16:53
go to an equity crowdfunding site it's too arduous to allow non-accredited investors to invest it takes months and
00:16:59
it's tons of paperwork so then what happens is the best deal flow which goes to the people who are on this podcast who are already rich we get to sweep up
00:17:07
all the best deals because people who are founders and who have opportunities in corporations do not bother doing
00:17:13
equity crowdfunding because the sec in their wisdom to try to protect people and they have good intent to your point
00:17:19
freedberg has made it so arduous and painful for people that they then don't
00:17:24
do it the founders i'm talking about this then keeps people down and when we were all poor we got to spend our money
00:17:30
gambling or doing whatever we want with it but we all would have wanted to have when we were non-accredited the ability
00:17:37
to place a bet on a startup and y'all are forgetting that and what's going on
00:17:44
all of what you're saying in terms of the problems here are absolutely accurate and valid and those are what
00:17:49
you need you need to identify through projects like this the gas fees are a problem so people can move this to
00:17:54
solana you need to find out that they don't know how to do bidding and maybe they shouldn't say how much has been raised so that they can come in and bid
00:18:01
more intelligently and maybe they do need to pick a better target but this is two hundred dollars per person they're
00:18:06
you guys are acting like these people are gonna lose their shirts we agree with you i agree with you i think you agree with me i agree a thousand percent
00:18:13
i'm a free markets guy i would love for there to be no regulation and everyone will come in and the problem is society
00:18:18
won't let that happen and that's the point i'm trying to make it other societies have other societies
00:18:24
if you're in the uk if you're in australia you can go gamble and you can go bet on startups there are different
00:18:29
accreditation laws we have antiquated ones that unite the united states regulatory regime will
00:18:35
be invoked because people will lose money and individuals will raise their hand and say i put money into a dow that
00:18:41
i lost my ass on and enough thousands of people do that and then elizabeth warren and aoc will get on their you know their
00:18:48
horse and they'll say let's let's fix this problem bernie sanders will say this is unfair the billionaires are
00:18:53
taking the money from people and so i agree with you we should let people take risks we should let people lose money we
00:18:58
should drop all the regulatory burden my point is really that i think structurally what's going to happen is
00:19:04
there are going to be more of these things that are going to show up that will rip people off and that will heighten regulatory interest and people
00:19:09
will come along and they'll start to clamp down on the stuff and that's that's my point okay i also think this example has nothing to do with what
00:19:15
you're talking about i think what you're talking about jkl is laudable and we should all want that because i think
00:19:20
that the broader number of people that get to participate in the wealth creation in tech the better
00:19:26
but there are different ways of doing that i don't think we have to run full force and embrace the dao as the only
00:19:31
way that that happens and i think that structurally the the demo the democratic norms inside
00:19:38
of a dao in many ways make it much harder to govern inside a regulatory framework and
00:19:44
it does set up a very binary decision by the sec and u.s regulators which unfortunately
00:19:50
they're not going to go and be supportive of because the binary decision to support them would effectively negate
00:19:57
their oversight that's right yeah they got jobs to keep too they have jobs to keep and mortgages to pay i
00:20:04
think it's a cynical and accurate prediction that they will fight it but what you may not be aware of is that
00:20:10
there is in the startup act from years ago they did allow equity crowdfunding they put a lot of throttling on it and
00:20:16
now they're going to let you get accredited through taking a course or like kind of having a driver's license
00:20:22
or a gun permit so it is conceivable that the next time a dow happens and they're trying to buy you but can you stop
00:20:28
conflating these things together we've had iterations in the crowdfunding rules you're just trying to
00:20:34
tag this with a doubt can you just separate it wait hold on a second can i just ask you a question can you please
00:20:40
just describe and acknowledge that the crowdfunding rules have iteratively evolved in the absence of yes okay so
00:20:48
just separate the two they're not the same thing they are two sides of the same coin because the taos allow a
00:20:54
global participation in this and the capital can be formed instantly this was done in days that's what's so powerful
00:21:01
about it it it costs tens of thousands to hundreds of thousands because they're doing equity crowdfunding this costs
00:21:07
nothing because it was for a an ethereal superficial asset with a name that
00:21:12
people recognized let me hold on a second now let me replace the us constitution
00:21:18
with i don't know jason you just sent a deal a day ago what was the name of it let's just call it acme.com sure
00:21:26
now what are people supposed to do it's not a known asset they are not known founders there may be turbulent
00:21:32
issues inside the company that are still being hammered out what are these people supposed to do how are they entering a
00:21:38
small bet place a small map do some research vote on it do collective research in a discord you're looking you have a bunch
00:21:44
of researchers working for you you defended the gm you have a team your team does research
00:21:51
and they're smart people and they get paid very well you were praising the coverage that wall street
00:21:57
bets did on gme on this podcast 40 episodes ago you were saying how it was incredible
00:22:03
because they were analyzing public companies who were governed by securities law they can't do that without private company
00:22:10
yes because there are no rules that govern disclosure gamestop had very strict disclosure
00:22:16
rules because they were public that was what allowed wall street bets to understand what was going on under
00:22:22
the hood of gamestop it was the disclosure of the funds that the secs forced you to make that allowed people
00:22:28
to understand the long and the short book that was building against it if if that was in the private markets that
00:22:34
data is not obligated to be provided in the in the wild wall street bets would have had no idea
00:22:41
so um i i think you're actually proving the opposite of what you intend which is it's the regulatory framework that
00:22:46
allowed the retail gme position to happen great david and then uh yeah can i translate what jkl saying i think what
00:22:53
jkl is saying is that we need to create some space here for innovation so that entrepreneurs can work out the kinks of
00:23:00
these dowels so that one day jay cal can run a syndicate on a blockchain and fundraise that way isn't that what
00:23:06
you're saying jkl or anybody i mean here's what i'll say you know when we do a syndicate amongst accreditation
00:23:11
your book here in a weird way but i don't know i didn't mention the syndicate i didn't mention the syndicate.com once except for the icos
00:23:17
as competitors to your syndicates but now you're all on the dow train icos i
00:23:23
uh i thought were too big so i think you could solve this problem by looking at the bet size that people are allowed to
00:23:28
make so you can just say hey the upper limit is 5k so now you've basically taken the individual cratering well
00:23:34
because if you wanted to create a regulatory environment well because it would not get rid of the risk so you created a minimus exception
00:23:41
so honestly guys the first 100 percent worth in one percent of another's
00:23:47
okay so make it a percent of net worth no the first thing principle of portfolio construction is you need to be concentrated in the things you know and
00:23:54
you need to stay away from the things you don't if you cap the upside on the amount you can invest what are people
00:23:59
supposed to do peanut butter around 50 bets and you know what will happen jason most of those will be losers because the
00:24:04
mortality rate in startups is super high and they'll end up with basically nothing how do they do in vegas how do
00:24:10
they do betting about how to invest i mean i think what we're saying is that is that i mean this is where i actually
00:24:16
agree is that the regulators should carve out enough room so that innovation can continue around this concept of
00:24:22
dallas because who knows what they could become one day and we shouldn't we shouldn't kill this thing hold on
00:24:28
we haven't killed anything because nothing exists and there are no rules about dallas the regulators haven't said anything i think we all agree that
00:24:34
crowdfunding rules should get much more expansive that makes sense and with that
00:24:40
private companies should disclose more that makes sense right we all agree with that so that you can have more
00:24:45
disclosure and public available data so jason to your point communities can get into a discord like
00:24:50
today if you said hey guys let's go and analyze a late stage investment in stripe what do you do
00:24:56
blather on about it and just talk at each other there are no disclosures
00:25:02
answer this question so now yeah so now are you supposed to are you supposed to enter carda or some other third-party
00:25:08
platform and buy it at 120 billion how do you underwrite that very simple very simple in the startup dow concept we're talking
00:25:15
about here you would do exactly what angel investors do which is say hey okay we had let's say this constitution now was to
00:25:21
invest in startups okay 20 000 people put 200 in each we have a 40 million pool okay we're all going to submit
00:25:27
ideas and then we're going to ask and invite those founders to come pitch the dow on a zoom and we'll all vote on
00:25:34
which ones we like best and instead of you know a venture capital firm getting access to this now those 20 000 people
00:25:41
could say you know what we're going to make 20 uh half million dollar bets and then we're going to pour the 30 million
00:25:46
into the winners of that and that is just what i do for a living or any other angel investor early stage investor does
00:25:51
you invite founders to come and pitch you and you place an intelligent bet just like people bet on the knicks or sadly on the jets and lose their money
00:25:57
all the time and i like david's idea of saying hey maybe for the next two years we'll have a dow
00:26:03
exception where you can raise you know from a thousand up to 5 000 people up to 10 million
00:26:10
dollars and you just have to file that you're not a felon and we have some basic framework to experiment with this
00:26:16
because you could buy you know a building that was going to be torn down like some movie theater for a
00:26:21
community you could do non-profit stuff there's all kinds of beautiful things you could do with this instant capital formation
00:26:28
and government structure that is programmable okay well it does relate to capital formation in the startup
00:26:33
ecosystem here's what i'll say um you made a great point about uber and lyft pushing the boundaries and forcing the
00:26:38
regulators to react yes you know why that happened it's because uber and lyft
00:26:43
worked yes and it was successful and was not successful and so maybe if it is
00:26:52
there's an on-ramp but i would say that the energy is better served in not focusing on a pr lark
00:26:59
and probably just focusing on trying to improve the crowdfunding laws writ large which are already on the books and can
00:27:05
be iterated upon versus an entire new body of regulation where nobody even has any idea what a starting point should be
00:27:13
i think it's really i think it'd be very hard to get get those crowdfunding laws expanded with under the current regime
00:27:18
it's sort of a minor miracle that they even got what they got several years ago right wasn't that what well it happened
00:27:23
under obama when the 2008 yes the jobs act was in 2008 with the market crashing we said nobody's starting companies
00:27:30
we're screwed here we need to get the economy going again so we're just going
00:27:36
to allow more capital formation and so the 99 rule for llcs went to 250 and
00:27:42
they just kind of loosened things a little bit and now their the mandate is the sec has to have a certification test
00:27:48
for people to do private market investing and also people who work at vc firms right we have people who work for us who are not accredited they don't get
00:27:55
to participate but they get an exception if they work at a venture firm etcetera so it's just it's probably
00:28:00
simultaneously true that this thing was massively over hyped while also being the case that it's a
00:28:07
worthwhile experiment that may lead to you know useful innovation in the future what i
00:28:13
always look at when i see new technologies doing something is i just imagine if it 10x and what that would look like and if it
00:28:19
worked and then i just 10x it one more time so what we're going to see i predict is this 40 million dollar will
00:28:25
turn into a 400 million one in the next two years and then a 4 billion one in the next 10 and people are going to do
00:28:30
something extraordinary they're going to do something so otherworldly changing what if a million people or 10 million
00:28:37
people around the globe decided they were going to put money in to do a solar farm or something that would help
00:28:42
society you can already do that jkl i mean that's like like a manager can friction someone's gotta someone's gotta
00:28:48
manage it jacob's fantasizing about how big a sink it's gonna be yeah
00:28:54
my syndicate is too large right now i can't accommodate everybody and it's also because of the law you
00:28:59
could get bigger right well no the problem is you can only have 250 people in it that's the problem
00:29:05
to death yeah we beat it to death okay anyway i'm obsessed with it fentanyl debts in the us are reaching a crisis
00:29:10
point is that really what we're talking about i mean we talked about it in the chat
00:29:15
you're deliberately trying to like avoid the biggest news today of the the biggest trend
00:29:21
i get it we're gonna that's just a weird trick i'm just going straight down through the docket but if you want to jump the fence okay
00:29:28
not guilty of all charges it happened within half an hour of us beginning to record this podcast i don't
00:29:34
know i'm trying to keep the friedberg ratio up we had a nice strong emotional moment from freedberg he obviously is
00:29:39
going to have something to say about fentanyl and science but okay he's going to walk off the show now to talk when you start talking podcast
00:29:44
i'm not going to walk over the show you did last week you walked off you walked off and went you got a beverage you left for like five minutes ago i had to go
00:29:50
pee all right fine i mean because i wanted to be during politics a kyle written house was founded that's usually when i take my break yeah exactly
00:29:57
a third of the audience kyle written house found not guilty of all charges a 12-person jury
00:30:02
in the kyle written house trial reached the decision uh after over 26 hours of
00:30:07
deliberation he shot three people uh he killed two of them and he was found not guilty he was
00:30:13
17 at the time of the shooting he was charged with killing the two men and a third during the protest in
00:30:20
kenosha wisconsin in august of 2020. this was during the protests uh over the
00:30:25
police shooting of jacob blake he claims he traveled from illinois with an ar-15
00:30:31
style rifle to help protect businesses and provide first aid
00:30:37
he did not cross state lines with the rifle that's one of the many inaccuracies that have been reported by
00:30:43
the media over and over again because his dad lived there i guess he was in his dad lived in kenosha i think he went to school in kenosha he worked in
00:30:49
kenosha you gotta understand like this is they're a few minutes apart where from his mother's house and they got and
00:30:55
he never he never carried the gun across state lines the gun was bought from by a friend who
00:31:00
was 18 who could possess it and it was kept at his house which is in kenosha got it he was apparently in kenosha
00:31:06
earlier that day um and you know cleaning up graffiti at the school and checking out the downtown
00:31:13
and then you know obviously when he went out that night then he got the gun but he didn't transport it across state lines
00:31:19
so that that's i think one of the multiple what do you think what is your most important insight into
00:31:24
this case and what it represents for american society and uh the justice
00:31:30
system sex well i think that the cases become a little bit of a rorschach test of how
00:31:36
you see america i mean there's clearly a a group of people in the i'd say the
00:31:41
mate dominated the mainstream media announced percolated down to celebrities and figures from lebron james to
00:31:47
to um i'm spacing but there's a lot of like celebrities who've come out
00:31:53
putting forward this view that america that this trial somehow is um that that calgary house and white
00:31:59
supremacists and that this not guilty verdict is an example of white supremacy in america somehow that became the
00:32:05
narrative and um so that i think it's become i think there's
00:32:10
like a couple levels to it one is the trial itself and what you think about the legal case i don't think that is that complicated or
00:32:17
interesting you have here that the state was required to prove beyond a reasonable doubt
00:32:23
that rittenhouse did not act reasonably in self-defense when three violent attackers came
00:32:30
charging towards him that was i think a pretty tough case to make one of them had a gun too i mean this
00:32:35
was right and so all of them had long criminal histories the first one who attacked him was daring him to what said that he was
00:32:43
gonna kill rittenhouse the second one was bashing him over the head with a skateboard the third one was rushing
00:32:48
towards him when rittenhouse was on the ground had a gun trained on him looked like he was gonna bring it to his head
00:32:53
kind of execution style i mean all these i think cases if you saw the video from i mean
00:32:58
for the first time it seemed pretty clear that he had a strong claim of self-defense so i don't
00:33:04
think the case itself was that legally interesting the question is why it got blown up into being this like huge thing
00:33:11
and it's really because the media wanted this so badly to be to feed into this narrative of somehow
00:33:18
that this is you know a white supremacist violent attacker who was a vigilante who crossed eight lines with
00:33:24
this ar-15 to go seek out trouble um to confront people at the protest
00:33:30
and you know that case that that narrative just completely fell apart at the trial
00:33:36
you know it's he didn't cross state lines for you know in that way he didn't you know with the
00:33:41
gun when he went to this protest he went there
00:33:47
it's interesting i mean he was a cadet an emt cadet he was kind of in this like junior firefighter
00:33:53
program i'm not saying that he showed good judgment i think it was poor judgment for him to try and insert himself into that situation but i don't
00:34:00
think he went there to kill anyone or to get into a confrontation he brought a first aid kit
00:34:05
for you know for better or worse he thought he was going to help people and so any event
00:34:11
the story really is about the media constructing this narrative that fell apart so quickly as soon as
00:34:19
all the facts came out freeburg yeah i think the i read that there was
00:34:24
um an analysis of the media and how they tried to portray this and
00:34:30
that i think i'll build on what david said which is was really concerning like the there was they really wanted this to
00:34:38
be a white kid who killed black people during a blm protest which was
00:34:45
as it turned out the furthest from the truth i'll just tell you my experience when i first saw it that's what i thought i had read
00:34:51
and i'll be really honest with you initially i was incredibly biased and my i had a
00:34:57
violent reaction inside me of anger towards this kid because my thought was my god this white
00:35:03
kid showed up at a black lives matter alley and killed you know three of of of my brothers you know like
00:35:10
literally that's how i'm feeling i was so angry because they didn't really give the facts
00:35:17
there was an example where in germany it got so out of hand that the articles were written that kyle rittenhouse had
00:35:23
actually killed three black men or two black men and and i think that that's very dangerous
00:35:28
because we need to have the truth and the facts so we can really figure out what's going on so that we can address
00:35:35
what's broken we can hold people accountable and then we can
00:35:40
move forward together and heal it but this like is the opposite of healing it just froths people up
00:35:47
to make a lot of judgments with misinformation and i think that that's very unfair i didn't
00:35:52
to be honest with you after i saw the facts i stopped paying attention to this case because i literally exhaled
00:36:00
i would have been much more hurt and i would have probably paid more attention
00:36:07
if this wasn't white on white violence quite honestly right right and i think people
00:36:12
i think we've heard from a lot of people over when written house's testimony kind of went viral and started getting reported
00:36:18
on there were a lot of people out there who were surprised to learn that all the victims were white that
00:36:25
this was an example of white on white violence because it had been portrayed by the media as some sort of racial
00:36:30
episode and um and it wasn't and it shows how the media is fueling this polarization
00:36:37
and rage in our society by concocting these narratives which aren't true it's really that that i think is the
00:36:43
dangerous thing i don't i didn't follow the case to know whether this kid was right or wrong but i do think if the media uses these
00:36:50
opportunities to not just tell the facts and then race baits people on both of
00:36:56
the left and the right and gets them frothed up they're doing a real disservice to america because i think it
00:37:01
takes good people and it puts them in a state like me for a while at the beginning where i'm i was
00:37:07
really angry and i didn't know how i felt and that's and i'm a lucid
00:37:12
person you know ninety nine point nine nine nine percent yeah and so it just goes to show you how
00:37:19
dangerous this stuff is when they can take a narrative and run with it and then there's no accountability for it
00:37:24
um and we really have to stop and and check ourselves it just speaks to this ongoing fact pattern where
00:37:30
the media is at a point where they are at a very much a low point in their trustworthiness
00:37:36
their ability to fact check their ability to stick to the truth um i think it's been undone
00:37:43
just this past week you know i think elon even tweeted out like you know he in exasperation he said where can i find
00:37:51
like thoughtful news right he was asking twitter like what websites and and
00:37:56
the the question wasn't that bad but if you read the answers it was
00:38:01
really sad nobody had a good answer you know one person was like oh there's a browser extension that will show you
00:38:08
how you know how much lying is happening inside the article and i thought to myself my god
00:38:14
like there are browser extensions like a lyometer you know like this is insanity that that in 2021 that's what we are
00:38:22
faced with which is very smart people all of us everybody listening normal people just
00:38:28
you know out on the street we can all come to the right conclusion with given the facts and we're not given the facts anymore
00:38:35
jake how do you think we're missing something here because um you you i know you you thought that this
00:38:42
whole uh written house thing was crazy right which it was but are we missing an interview
00:38:47
i think uh first off violent protests
00:38:53
and violence is immoral and all of these protests whether it's blm on the left on
00:38:58
the right they should all be non-violent there's a reason why martin luther king and gandhi you know said that's the rules if you
00:39:04
want to come to the protest you have to be nonviolent and then i think the rhetoric that was created during the trump era and that he exacerbated and
00:39:11
that he caused uh from a lot of his policies and the way he spoke as the leader of the free world in our country
00:39:17
than polarized things i blame him for a lot of that and if you put a bunch of people who are on the far extremes into
00:39:24
a situation like this and then you insert guns and you insert young people who have not developed
00:39:30
their frontal lobes who do not have long term thinking which a 17 year old does not your long term and freebird will
00:39:35
back me up on this in terms of science long-term thinking is something that develops in humans into their early 20s
00:39:42
and so young people with guns in a violent situation with trump on tv during this time
00:39:48
both good people on both sides whatever you know the borders all that stuff that he was stirring the pot on all of that
00:39:54
eventually resolves to somebody's going to get killed whether it's on january 6 or it's a blm protest and that is why he
00:40:01
had such a failure of leadership while he was so disgusting and horrible and loathsome because he was taking all of
00:40:07
this heat and rhetoric up up and the person who winds up suffering in this are these stupid kids and their really
00:40:14
dumb parents and mother who allow them to go to a protest and she could have stopped him with a gun
00:40:19
somebody needs to stop these kids from going to a protest with a gun and i think there's a very difficult question
00:40:25
here that can be asked and it probably is true i think that it was an open and shut case david that
00:40:31
i mean i saw the video as well chamoth the guy puts a gun on him what are you gonna do you've got a gun this guy's pointing a gun at you whoever fires
00:40:37
first survives it is self-defense and that's kind of undeniable i i think
00:40:43
but i would hope that the number of people that really focus on this case look at the innumerable number of cases
00:40:50
of black and brown people that have been killed the ahmad arbory trial is going on right now yes i'm sorry but i've seen
00:40:55
one article in the mont arbore for every 50 about kyle rittenhouse yeah i just really hope ahmad arbory gets his fair
00:41:01
trial and we're going to tell you straight up and let me say again brianna taylor not a single thing has still been done okay so
00:41:08
i'm not that sympathetic to all of this talk right now because there are a lot of black and
00:41:14
brown men and women who have been killed in this country where none of you guys care as much oh i care that was exactly
00:41:21
where i was about to get to the question i was about to ask you to mouth is if kyle rittenhouse had been a black man
00:41:28
and he had shot those three people what would the outcome of this trial have been would it have been the same justice system and i i don't think that anybody
00:41:34
can answer that question and say it would have been fair justice i don't think it would have been i think the chance would be very low it means
00:41:40
the situation would have been just just you saying it makes me want to cry okay it would not i didn't say for that
00:41:45
reason but i it is the truth and i think that's what you know we in this country race is
00:41:51
something that is our biggest weak point and we need to get well i mean leadership to work on a hypothetical
00:41:58
injustice we don't know because that's a hypothetical that we can't know the answer to right now and you're ignoring
00:42:03
the justice the injustice that's right in front of your face which is that this was a political prosecution from the beginning fueled by a media narrative
00:42:10
that was completely bogus this is why i think david is right and we have to go to this root cause issue that we can all
00:42:15
fix yeah you know we can't we we shouldn't debate these hypotheticals because they're hurtful like even now
00:42:20
like you see me i'm emotional i can't think straight so let's get the hypothetical off the table because david you're right it's a hypothetical i mean
00:42:26
this case probably should never this case had never been broad i mean as soon as you see the video if you look up the definition of self-defense okay
00:42:33
you you just have to have a reasonable belief that your life is in danger and then
00:42:39
you're allowed to use force and you know written house was running away these guys were attacking him they were
00:42:45
chasing after him they had a gun trained on him they were bashing him on the head of the skateboard i don't know how any prosecutor looks at this and says we
00:42:51
need to prosecute this so the case should never have been brought and then the media fuels this thing no but this
00:42:56
is what i'm saying that's the thing that we can all change which is our reaction to that media portrayal the media can be
00:43:02
held accountable for how they lie but how well people are you don't trust them and
00:43:07
they're tuning them out and they're going and finding their own answers i mean this has been my point like i think we all get tuned up to what the media
00:43:14
quote-unquote is and it's insane i think that's like yesteryear's news i
00:43:19
mean those those guys have lost credibility you can see it in all the peer research and all the gallup
00:43:24
research that um what used to be called and it's still by a lot of people called the mainstream media it's no longer
00:43:31
mainstream and it's become kind of outskirt where people are finding their their sources of information is direct
00:43:38
from the source from people that they know to be reliable trustworthy speakers of the truth and speakers of facts and
00:43:44
they're getting them direct through social media platforms and other systems of self-publication and that the idea of
00:43:50
having centralized media systems that get to have their own editorial and narrative over whatever facts quote they
00:43:56
may be kind of gathering and presenting to us that's an old school way of doing things and i don't think we have to worry about it too much anymore
00:44:02
whether or not individuals will resolve to truth seeking or motion seeking is the big question for the 21st century
00:44:09
because as we've seen the media that the things that we do click on are the things that we already believe and that confirm our bias and that create an
00:44:16
emotional incentive versus the things that may be not what we believe and not what we want to hear but may actually be factual and
00:44:24
that's the big kind of challenging question here i think it's less about these evil media people and it's more about where are individuals going to
00:44:30
make choices yeah i mean i'd say alternative media voices have never been more important and you
00:44:36
know you can get a lot of them on sub stack people like glenn greenwald matt antonio garcia martinez call in the
00:44:42
cullen app barry weiss i mean they all have a
00:44:48
podcast by the way i couldn't help notice that
00:44:53
the same week that this written house narrative collapsed the whole steele dossier narrative collapsed okay you had
00:45:00
and i don't want to get too political and drag it back to the trump thing but you had you know john durham who's the special prosecutor unraveling this whole
00:45:06
phony fake steel dossier with multiple indictments and you now have retractions by the
00:45:12
washington post and other major publications and that whole narrative that fueled like an entire year of media
00:45:19
coverage is completely collapsing and it's just another example of you know the media running with these narratives
00:45:26
that turn out to be completely i hate to use the word fake but i mean it is i mean it's things in the dossier
00:45:32
were fake but paul manafort's commenting again i would encourage everyone to stop using the term the media or even the term
00:45:37
mainstream media and just recognize that there are specific outlets that are on their way downtown
00:45:42
yeah these are content companies that need ratings they used to be the monopoly and they're no longer
00:45:48
and you know they're like yesteryear's news and it's just um you know it's like complaining about you know whatever pick any industry
00:45:54
that's been disrupted but they are and will be further disrupted by kind of direct to source
00:45:59
fat gathering the big ultimate question is what are consumers going to choose um and that's the thing that scares me the
00:46:04
most to be honest i i think that they can go either way you can either find better truth seeking or you can find
00:46:10
better emotion more emotion seeking and that that's going to cause more polarization and more ugly [ __ ] well look it's it's happening right now
00:46:16
you're right that the let's call it the corporate media the big media corporations their prestige and esteem
00:46:23
and the eyes of american people have no and their credibility has never been lower it's gone new york times and cnn
00:46:28
absolutely everyone's gone and people should be questioning them and stop listening to them and you have to
00:46:33
diversify your information diet and you've got to be subscribed to some alternative journalists on places like
00:46:38
sub stack but here's the thing that concerns me you know you've got the media narrative being dictated by msnbc and then it
00:46:46
trickles down to lebron james and chelsea handler sorry that was the name that i forgot earlier who they were
00:46:51
perpetuating this white supremacist narrative around cal written house by the way there was they looked at his phone his text messages everything there
00:46:58
is no connection there's no proof whatsoever of a connection between him and white supremacy was completely made
00:47:04
up by the media and yet these major figures in our culture who have this outsized impact we're tweeting about
00:47:10
this and so the problem is you know like people like us diversify our information diet but there are large
00:47:16
parts of the country that are just receiving this information and it gets basically passed down from the media to
00:47:22
hollywood to the culture yeah and it's a photographer from tucker carlson to scott baio to the pillow guy it is
00:47:28
fueling trump it is fueling tremendous divisiveness and polarization in our culture and i would say that you know jc
00:47:34
brought up trump and he was a polarizing figure but i don't think he's the root cause of this polarization i think he is
00:47:41
a reaction to it i think he is the manifestation of it is a manifestation of it and ultimately the root cause is
00:47:47
the complete deterioration and collapse of journalistic standards in the media in the major mainstream uh corporate
00:47:54
media i'll disagree i think trump's responsible for his own behavior and i've made this point in the past which
00:47:59
is sex i don't know if it you make it sound and other people make it sound like in a directed editorial initiative
00:48:06
to take things in a direction and i think that the reaction process is really about what do consumers want to
00:48:12
consume what they choose to consume is what they sell more of and what they produce more of and that's the cycle
00:48:17
that's driving this and you know that doesn't mean that these folks are not complicit or not making good kind of ethical decisions that could actually be
00:48:24
argued either way but at the end of the day they're businesses that are selling content and if consumers want content of
00:48:30
one form they're gonna choose that form okay look i i think you have a point that once a publication goes in a
00:48:35
certain direction and starts getting subscribers there's some positive reinforcement there that has them keep pushing that direction that being said i
00:48:41
don't think this is commercial in nature primarily i think what's going on is fundamentally ideological you saw
00:48:48
for example the new york times they ran out barry weiss i've seen him run out of multiplayer no you're wrong on this thing
00:48:54
because they wanted subscription no no you're wrong sex when the new york times did this they realized fox picked a side
00:49:00
msnbc picks side and they they benefited from that by picking a side in the trump era so the new york times picked a side
00:49:06
they went msnbc side and they got rid of the right because the right people drove away the anti-trump
00:49:13
subscription so i think freeberg's right on this one i will say another thing to build on what you were saying before saks about the media's responsibility
00:49:19
here we also have to think about the the cable news media's responsibility when
00:49:25
they put these protests on wall to wall and they send people there
00:49:30
that then inspires people to go there and you know when you do this wall-to-wall coverage across five networks
00:49:36
and you obsess over something people are going to obsess over it and they see people out there rioting and people
00:49:42
model other people's behavior and i think they need to think like how much coverage do we
00:49:47
exactly have to give right now even now they're bringing out the national guard in anticipation of
00:49:52
possibly riots and protests in research well in reaction no i don't know if it's
00:49:58
gonna induce it but but in in reaction to this verdict in the ringhouse trial they're bringing out the troops to basically quell any you know riot before
00:50:05
it gets started but why would that riot even happen because the people have been fed this narrative that is completely
00:50:12
bogus and in that sense the media has been incredibly irresponsible and they're playing with fire they really
00:50:18
are i'll say it again and we've fallen into the same trap look how much time we've just been talking about kyle written now i mentioned the mod arbory
00:50:25
and we've just glossed over it is his trial being it's happening right no no
00:50:30
but is it on video because that is another major issue here is when the trials are on video
00:50:35
they should never do tv again on these trials there's never again i mean it really does in the courtroom but do not
00:50:41
put it on tv like veranos is not allowing uh video in the courtroom and it's not getting covered to this extent
00:50:48
and i think the video in the courtroom does drive this makes it a circus breaking news
00:50:53
citadel ceo ken griffin outbid a group of crypto investors for a copy of the us constitution according to
00:50:59
the wall street journal saying oh my god we knew somebody was trolling before this but now
00:51:06
exactly i mean he was the central villain basically in that whole robin hood fiasco for payment for overflow and
00:51:12
now he outbid the crypto crowd he is going to be enemy number one basically there is no more sophisticated market
00:51:18
participant than ken griffin and on a silver platter this group of people unfortunately
00:51:25
showed them their strategy and showed them exactly how to become beyond christ
00:51:30
right you put one dollar on top of their basement what ken griffin knows ken griffin knows that now this is an object of interest that people are basically
00:51:36
willing to pay anything for bingo he's going to buy it now and in one year he'll sell it for twice as much it's a valuable asset
00:51:43
but by the way i want to make a point on this i disagree by the way he's uh he's a buyer he is not a seller he's going to
00:51:48
hold okay but look markets don't work with this much transparency markets only
00:51:53
work when people have different information than other people that are participating in the market no no no no
00:51:58
no no no no no no no if everyone said everything that everyone else was gonna do same data but it's ruining really what everyone else needs different
00:52:04
opinions but if everyone knew everyone else's opinion on what something is worth the market doesn't work and that's the problem here yeah so here's what i
00:52:11
value an asset at and now if you know that you know how to play against me in the market and i hope that's what i said
00:52:17
yeah exactly and one thing one thing i'll take note of that that i kind of realized yesterday when i was thinking
00:52:23
about this which is this like transparency in markets leads to this inflationary problem
00:52:28
why do you think everything that the government buys inflates because everyone already knows what the
00:52:34
government is going to spend on that thing when the government enters into a market like health care or education or
00:52:40
defense the amount that they're going to spend is published in a bill and congress says
00:52:45
here's your authorized budget here's how much you're going to spend so there is no natural market force that says a bid
00:52:51
and an ask what are you willing to pay and is there a walk away price there is no walk away price when the government
00:52:56
is is told to go spend some amount of money and as a result the price of everything inflates to that walk away to
00:53:03
that price to that budget can i build on that it's and that's by the way that's that's in my opinion based on everything
00:53:08
i've looked at the primary reason for the increase in education costs because the government funds all the student loans the increase in health care um the
00:53:16
increase in defense all of it is because the government is the customer and they tell the person that servicing them up
00:53:22
front they tell the market what they're willing to pay and so the market just inflates to that amount and it's uh it's
00:53:27
it's really the reason why the way that we budget things in the government as opposed to saying look this is the roi
00:53:33
metric or this is the irr metric you need to be shooting for with this government spending it's all based on a fixed dollar amount of a budget that
00:53:40
says here's how much you should go spend so look it's it's as i said it's actually worse than that because then the procurement process is is not is the
00:53:47
furthest thing from a free market where you essentially have these licensed people that are allowed to provide services and so if you actually have
00:53:54
the key critical input to making something possible you have to get bundled in through contractors and
00:53:59
subcontractors and general contractors who each take their five and ten percent and then that's what you would that's
00:54:05
when you have like you know and their hourly costs all balloon just a little bit just a little bit just a little bit and suddenly the balloon cost of
00:54:12
everything matches exactly the button so the perfect example of this is the space program there was a there was a there
00:54:17
was a rant by bernie sanders yesterday basically saying how could we have allowed jeff bezos mr
00:54:24
bezos and mr musk to basically take over our national space program we need to
00:54:29
test by his program we need to take it back and then somebody hold on
00:54:35
and then somebody thought he went somebody thoughtfully went back and actually looked because again as david
00:54:42
said everything is transparently published they went back and they actually counted
00:54:47
how much money nasa spent in like the last seven or eight years and the number was 360 odd
00:54:53
billion dollars yeah and then they counted how much money uh spacex had spent and it was you know if
00:55:00
you counted revenue between seven and 11 billion totally totally and so you have this incredible disparity which speaks
00:55:07
to this this guy space shuttle after the space shuttle was retired nasa didn't even have a way to get to space until spacex had the
00:55:14
rockets i mean uh and think about how many people died on the space what bernie is saying which is what's i think
00:55:19
scary to me is if you take the difference between 360 billion and seven so 300 and you know 53 billion dollars
00:55:27
and divided by the number of people in the united states you're basically talking about a thousand per
00:55:33
thousand dollars a person would you and i sit around a table and give bernie sanders a thousand dollars
00:55:39
out of our own pocket i don't know to go and basically implement a uh a half-assed space program no it's
00:55:46
unbelievable i'd rather give elon musk 10 cents which or one cent which is the the equivalent alternative or obviously
00:55:52
this raises a really serious issue which is who is the better capital allocator of society private markets or the
00:55:59
government and let me give you an example so today the house is voting out that reconciliation bill they've got it
00:56:05
they're spending 2.1 trillion this is one example does one example that caught my eye is they've got 2.5 billion
00:56:12
dollars going to tree equity whatever that is i'm sorry trading quality equity tree
00:56:18
equity this is like tree equity i i think it might mean that like some communities
00:56:24
i think it means that some some communities have more trees than others they gotta rectify that i don't know i mean this is like the jump the shark
00:56:29
moment for the word equity because i think now everything is equity but but you know what what struck me about this
00:56:36
2.5 billion dollar number okay is that like craft ventures which i've been doing for the last four years we've
00:56:42
raised and will be deploying a total of about two billion over call it five years into hundreds of startups that you
00:56:49
know will pave the way for the next generation of the economy so two billion versus two and a half billion as one
00:56:55
line item that's just a footnote that's an asterisk in this bill i mean what is the better capital allocation decision
00:57:01
and what people have to understand is you know all this uh money that gets spent gets sucked out of the private
00:57:08
economy somehow it either you know comes from taxes or gets added to the the uh
00:57:13
national debt but either way it comes out of the private economy and resources
00:57:19
that could be allocated to the next generation of of innovative companies right
00:57:24
squandering the money like that on all these programs that no one even knows what they do
00:57:30
uh when we're almost 30 trillion in debt is just unbelievable okay the one percent are
00:57:37
going to be going to space and taking away the moon from the other 99
00:57:42
here roll the clip unbelievably this bill would provide and authorize some 10
00:57:48
billion dollars in taxpayer money to jeff bezos the second wealthiest person in america
00:57:55
for his space race with elon musk the wealthiest person
00:58:00
in america this is beyond laughable and i will be introducing an amendment
00:58:07
to strike this provision frankly it is not acceptable it's not an
00:58:12
issue that we have discussed terribly much but it is not acceptable that the two wealthiest people in this
00:58:19
country mr musk and mr bezos take control of our space efforts to return
00:58:24
to the moon and maybe even the extraordinary accomplishment of getting to the moon this is not
00:58:31
something for two billionaires to be directing this is something for the american people
00:58:37
to be determining yeah all the people have to be able to go to the moon before two people can go to the moon is that the idea yeah if there was a go to the
00:58:44
moon dao it would get more [ __ ] good call back look at you this freaking hacks
00:58:51
people would just plow money into it go to the moon down and give it all to elon musk it'd be so more people would do that than would vote to support the
00:58:57
senate bill additionally i would like to report that stalling does not work at my lake house
00:59:03
and amazon prime takes three to four days at my beach house on the cape and that these two companies are oppressing
00:59:09
the three percent of the top three percent which i am not part of the one percent and some people
00:59:15
don't have enough trees in my community there's only small trees
00:59:21
and we want the redwoods from san francisco why do they or the hippies get the redwoods that are much taller do you
00:59:27
guys remember uh one of our very earliest pods i made a statement which is
00:59:32
equity is this danger word that the progressive left uses to steal power yes
00:59:37
that we should feel unsafe we should always want equality but not equity because equity is zero sum right you
00:59:44
know a cap table once you give somebody else equity it's dilutive to everybody else but equality is infinite you can
00:59:51
have unbounded equality yes and when i hear these guys talk about this stuff it's so scary the second thing is i'm a
00:59:57
little confused by what bernie's saying because on the one hand he wants to cancel the american government's effective you
01:00:04
know support of these programs on the other hand he wants us to take back the
01:00:10
responsibility for it but i think he must realize that it would cost 50 times
01:00:15
more or a hundred times more he's he's not he's not he's not spending sensitive in
01:00:21
case you haven't noticed i also think this is like virtue signaling like he was attacking bezos about like
01:00:27
minimum wage and then bezos came over the top and like doubled it and then gave people college education that was
01:00:32
bernie sanders platform for president was like give people free college and give people like a better 15 minimum
01:00:37
wage bezos has done more for bernie's platform than anybody he should be thinking
01:00:43
he should be telling people all companies should be asking like amazon no no but also actually to your point can i build on that amazon is now doing
01:00:50
more to actually unwind duopolies and monopolies in markets than the
01:00:56
government and the ftc is you know see this thing that amazon is now doing in the uk with visa where they basically
01:01:02
shut visa off and people are speculating now that it's a step in this direction of amazon you
01:01:08
know in amazon domestically in the united states they just did this big deal with a firm
01:01:14
and so they are looking at and they there's a rumor that they may switch the amazon credit card off of visa rails and
01:01:19
put them on mastercard rails but this is another example jason to your point of like you know bernie in the left
01:01:25
progressive left would probably rail against the duopoly practices of visa and mastercard they can't get
01:01:31
anything done jeff bezos has actually done more than a button presses a button and has done
01:01:36
more now here's another one to build on yours who's doing i mean bernie sanders cares about global warming it's like one
01:01:42
of his key issues who's donated more to bur to global warning than jeff bezos nobody nobody who's doing a hundred
01:01:48
thousand electric vehicles for his delivery fleet jeff bezos jeff bezos took bernie sanders platform that he
01:01:54
failed to get into office on and he made it amazon's platform here's a third example nick you tweeted this out nick
01:02:00
or you can find this thing that i tweeted out but it was a little meme and it was it was um it was basically um
01:02:06
tobey maguire and kristen dust right there's a meme famous upside down quit you know they're looking at each other
01:02:13
and basically the joke is like you know every time you protested at you know to shut down a nuclear plant
01:02:19
the resulting effect 40 years later was another 100 megatons of co2 was put into the air and it just goes to yet again
01:02:26
another example of we virtue signal nuclear reactors and nuclear power we go
01:02:31
and we get them all shut down it turned out that we ingested or we we uh put out as a result an enormous amount of more
01:02:38
co2 than had to be put and then and now who's helping to step in and solve it another private citizen bill gates look
01:02:43
if it weren't for these private companies we couldn't even get astronauts to space anymore impossible i mean like the government has actually
01:02:49
lost the capacity to do that impossible it would it would have been impossible and who are we up against for space i mean
01:02:57
china not just china just just china russia it's such a dichotomy between and this
01:03:03
is like a recurring theme of the show between what the private sector and specifically
01:03:08
and and not like the fortune 500 not those old stodgy companies are in the process of being disrupted but what the
01:03:14
sort of entrepreneurial economy is able to accomplish versus like how
01:03:20
stultified and calcified and incompetent the government's become
01:03:26
i mean to your point freeburg i think sam altman uh led this the fusion energy startup
01:03:33
healing like 500 million dollar round i mean by the time these nitwits you know in
01:03:40
these political office figure these things out we're going to have fusion reactors aren't we
01:03:45
is that real science is that coming close what do you think rubert i mean bill gates just did this uh
01:03:52
what is it called terrapower announcement this week um he's got a company that he's been funding for years
01:03:57
and they're building a 500 megawatt um uh fusion plant in um
01:04:05
uh wyoming i think yeah in wyoming yes in wyoming and he got 2 billion from the
01:04:10
government and 2 billion that was funded by the company and its shareholders which i think is majority
01:04:15
owned by bill gates but it certainly uh feels and seems to me i mean look this one like we've said
01:04:21
a lot of these infrastructure deals these big infrastructure deals for things like power and next-gen manufacturing and
01:04:27
whatnot you know could use the could benefit from the boost of you know government
01:04:32
subsidies or you know government shared costs to get these things off the ground over time as you get scale and
01:04:38
reproducibility of them the cost per unit comes way way way way down um and so you know it seems to be the
01:04:44
case that there are enough of these programs i think i know of at least half a dozen nuclear power companies that are
01:04:50
you know in advanced stages of doing um you know first installation design right
01:04:56
now and so it seems like this is going to be a reality i think it would be an incredible um boom to
01:05:02
uh to clean energy in the united states and globally if we can get more of these built i mean was the staff china's building 150 nuclear power plants yeah
01:05:08
they've commissioned 150 nuclear power plants i mean it's a no-brainer that that's what we need um in the 21st
01:05:14
century it's the best renewable source a very small footprint very reliable it can run 24 7. uh doesn't depend on some
01:05:22
you know sun or wind or what have you so you can plug it into a grid and so the government literally does not need to get involved in this aside from writing
01:05:28
a check and just chopping it up fifty-fifty split the pot with bill i think there's an important role that the government can and should play here
01:05:35
which is you know if we want to talk about what infrastructure this country needs i've said it on the last couple of shows we don't need yesteryears
01:05:40
infrastructure we don't need last century's infrastructure new bridges and you know toll bridges or whatever nonsense
01:05:46
is uh you know going to get inflated as a result of this recent infrastructure but what we need is next gen infrastructure and not charging stations
01:05:53
because the free market's already there doing that um and you know not internet because the free market's already there giving everyone internet we see a
01:05:59
thousand examples of that what we need is the stuff that the free market cannot afford to fund and stand up like
01:06:04
next-gen nuclear power stations like biomanufacturing like large-scale on-demand 3d printing systems these are
01:06:10
the sorts of infrastructure programs that the united states and our workforce could benefit from government subsidies
01:06:16
to help the private force the private markets get stood up and as these things get stood up and the flywheel gets going
01:06:22
and cash starts getting generated they can sell fund and they can grow and they can install more of these and the costs come down for the next one the things
01:06:28
where the government is the only customer the only person buying the cost will only go up on over time whereas the
01:06:34
things that the private market is building the cost will go down over time and in some of these cases where there's a big kind of hurdle to get over the
01:06:40
first build or the first build cycle you know the government has an important role to play i think and so you know
01:06:47
look i mean it's clearly not going to happen with this current infrastructure build there's a few nuggets in there that might be useful and helpful
01:06:53
but generally speaking you're right i mean over time we want the cost of things to come down not go up and so we
01:06:58
need the private market to play a critical role in being the majority driver you know of these kind of systems
01:07:05
all right seems like a good place to end pete davidson is now dating kim kardashian
01:07:11
how jealous are you jamal i'm not jealous what are you talking about a great
01:07:16
i am i am shocked that pete davidson has dated some of the most incredible the famous
01:07:22
popular women oh so you aren't jealous okay well i'm a little curious
01:07:27
i gotta say i'm a little curious i mean if you put a picture of pete i mean there's gotta be something happening there let's just put it out there he's
01:07:33
got the kevorka i'm gonna send you a link to an article i don't know what an article okay as i'm gonna remember that from seinfeld where um kramer was like
01:07:40
you know dating all these beautiful women and it's because he explained he had the kevorka he's got a better finishing move yeah this is an article
01:07:46
that went viral this week emily ratajkowski how do you pronounce her name yeah breaks down breaks down why
01:07:52
women find pete davidson so attractive and so this was like you know i saw it all over twitter this week but it was
01:07:58
all about you know what is the answer just give me the headlines i don't know it's some he's got
01:08:04
uh super charming he's vulnerable he's lovely his fingernail polish is awesome
01:08:10
he looks good he has a good relationship with his mom i mean i just think he comes across as a good guy might be the
01:08:16
appeal um also they want to take care of him i think because he's got like his dad you
01:08:21
guys are missing a more subtle non-obvious i don't know what you're talking about
01:08:27
do explain maybe you could expand i'm just guessing it's a family this is a family
01:08:32
show it's a family show oh my god uh no it's gonna take care of them that's what i heard from a woman said
01:08:39
they want to like remember him but yeah i mean also kim kardashian i i
01:08:45
think you know she just got the gen z i think she was probably going the way
01:08:50
of paris hilton like maybe aging out of her uh you know uh celebrity and now she went kanye
01:08:57
kind of gen x right and now she's going down to gen z she's got a whole new i mean i hate to be cynical about it but
01:09:03
i i also you know saying this but um
01:09:09
i was a little short donda but i've listened to donda now a couple times and my god
01:09:15
is it guys pretty [ __ ] good i mean kanye west is one of legitimately one of
01:09:20
the most incredible artists of of all time i mean the way his mind grows the music the
01:09:26
beats it's outrageous i think if you give don that like two or three shots
01:09:32
i was into late registration college dropout and 808 and heartbreaks
01:09:37
amazing my dark twisted fantasy was probably one of the best albums i've ever created well see that's the thing is i think ridiculous with his later
01:09:42
work like i didn't get into my beautiful dark christopher fantasy until i had listened to it ten times
01:09:55
what are you guys talking about i haven't listened to any of this david do you know he's like is that like paul
01:10:00
anka danny's like yeah wow saks do you listen to music actually
01:10:06
this is exactly what's your favorite artist what's your favorite like if we found like if we listen to like your like your workout tracks so like on your
01:10:12
like on on on barry manilow i like guy apple like what are you listening to like spotify like what do you like
01:10:19
tucker caulson no music i don't listen to music when i work out the only thing
01:10:25
the only time i really listen to music is when i'm like in a car or on a plane or whatever but do you have music for
01:10:30
example like download it on your phone like if he said pull out your phone huh yeah i do you should
01:10:36
give a couple names here yeah top three yeah honestly it's gonna be recent hits cause i just download what my kids tell
01:10:41
me to download i understand just give me a couple albums that you've downloaded okay so
01:10:47
where's um recently added okay so it looks to me like i recently added khalid
01:10:55
yes okay good uh there's a gaga song
01:11:00
uh kid leroy and miley cyrus okay okay killer roy and justin bieber great
01:11:05
dozier cat my kid's like she's great she's great tick tock queen yeah see my
01:11:10
kids keep me current you know you think i'm like she's great here's what i'm doing for my kids this is my new parenting strategy
01:11:17
i was let they love listening to the 80s playlist on spotify but now i was like what who are like great seminal artists
01:11:23
so i have them doing tom petty david bowie talking heads and bob marley and i
01:11:28
get the whole greatest hits album and i explain to them every song and they're like totally getting into it so
01:11:33
basically i actually know what great music is you're being self-indulgent you're focused on yourself and you're trying to make them a loser no i'm
01:11:40
trying to get them to understand what actually really is you want your kids to walk into school and when somebody else is like hey do you like doja cat they're
01:11:47
like no but have you listened to tom petty and the heartbreakers i've been doing i've been playing my kids my favorite artists and they and he's
01:11:53
become their favorite artist aphex twin you guys don't know who he is yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah what about orbeez
01:12:00
james album richard d james album is probably one of the best albums of all time and i play and my kids go friggin
01:12:06
nuts for it now and they asked for it non-stop and i'm like oh my god i love you you're my kids it's the best thing
01:12:11
i'm trying to get my kids into the my favorite movies and that's just too hard because movies
01:12:17
everybody they were so too slow about this yeah getting
01:12:24
they can't watch movies they're too slow they can't watch movies they only watch a marvel movie they can't even watch the original star wars or raiders who lost
01:12:30
art anything where the scene doesn't cut every one and a half seconds they can't watch it it's like rage of the lost stock you're going to love this they're
01:12:36
like this is so boring i'm like raiders of the lost ark hello boom are boring because they're like chris is
01:12:41
terrible i remember watching his character development they they want to cut the first act how did you guys draw
01:12:48
jaws would be like unwatchable kids he loved it did you guys ever watch like
01:12:54
amc and you watch the old school movies of the 30s and 40s they are impossible to watch like they are so it's like
01:13:00
watching a play you know it's like gotten more and more kind of um short form as we've kind of
01:13:06
aged but you know that's like oh no what happened oh ok
01:13:14
just came and took it from hockey you don't take the biscuit hockey you
01:13:19
eating dog food you don't need a biscuit bad hockey you know those biscuits are cashmere they're really expensive all
01:13:25
right i'm gonna i'm gonna go get my booster shot i'll see you guys later all right everybody this has been another exciting amazing episode of the all-in
01:13:32
podcast for really gonna get search your cookies for the dictator finance champion and the
01:13:40
sultan of science david freeburg we'll see you all next time sexy people have a wonderful time with suarez he came by
01:13:47
last night i'm hosting miami mayor francis suarez tonight we're doing a cocktail reception fundraiser for him
01:13:53
hung out with him and we got huge turnout i mean i tweeted this thing and we're going to have
01:13:59
i think at least 60 people at the reception at least 20 people for dinner
01:14:04
you're letting randos in your house from twitter have security oh they have to pay five dimes yeah yeah they have to
01:14:10
pay but also like we kind of check everybody out one of your enemies one of your enemies will pay five dimes just to
01:14:15
get in your house i think basically like buzzfeed paid to get in there i'd be careful we have to know who they are we've got
01:14:21
the background there's a lot of people i mean look if we wanted to let everybody in there were at least 100 people who replied to my tweet saying i can't dm
01:14:29
you but i want to go and open your dms for a day oh you can do that yeah francis came by
01:14:36
yesterday with this team he was in top form he looks great he's excited about the next term all right we'll see you
01:14:41
all next time bye bye [Music]
01:14:52
we open source it to the fans and they've just gone crazy [Music]
01:15:04
besties [Music]
01:15:18
it's like this like sexual tension that they just need to release
01:15:28
we need to get back [Music]
