00:00:00
All right, everybody. Welcome back to
00:00:01
the number one podcast in the world.
00:00:03
Your favorite podcast, the all-in
00:00:05
podcast with me again, the core four,
00:00:09
the original four, David Freeberg,
00:00:11
Jamal, Pololly, Hapatia, David Saxs are
00:00:13
here. And there is a lot going on in the
00:00:16
world. Gentlemen, how's everybody's week
00:00:17
going? Anybody got big plans for next
00:00:19
week?
00:00:20
>> Jal, your ship has finally come in. Your
00:00:22
invitation was not lost in the mail.
00:00:24
>> What? Really? I bet
00:00:27
>> you have been invited to Davos.
00:00:30
>> What? I got to get my guitar.
00:00:34
>> Oh, Davos.
00:00:37
I'm going to bring my guitar. Don't blow
00:00:39
it. And explain to the audience what's
00:00:40
happening here, Saxs.
00:00:42
>> What's happening?
00:00:43
>> Well, as it turns out, one of the houses
00:00:47
there is in need of content. So, they've
00:00:49
offered all in a stage to interview
00:00:51
people.
00:00:52
>> All right. So, we got stage microphone.
00:00:54
You're going
00:00:55
>> I'm going. Yeah,
00:00:56
>> President Trump is giving a major talk
00:00:59
there on Wednesday, I understand. Uh,
00:01:02
and so there is a stage and microphones.
00:01:05
So, I'm I canceled my ski trip in Japan
00:01:08
to go to Davos.
00:01:10
>> Even Jason is going
00:01:12
>> Even J.
00:01:14
>> Even JC is at Davos.
00:01:17
>> Even JC.
00:01:18
>> I mean, it's pretty funny. I was invited
00:01:21
to be part of that like um you probably
00:01:23
got this tuchimoth back in the day like
00:01:25
they're young leaders for $50,000 a
00:01:27
year. So we're going to be doing some
00:01:29
interviews and uh if you want to be
00:01:31
interviewed by me andor saxs at the USA
00:01:34
house, email jasonallin.com if you're
00:01:37
there, if you have ideas for speakers
00:01:38
and we're going to be booking in real
00:01:40
time.
00:01:40
>> I haven't been to Davos. I guess the way
00:01:42
it works is there's a bunch of houses.
00:01:43
So, countries have houses and then
00:01:45
companies sponsor houses
00:01:48
>> and there's stuff happening there.
00:01:50
There's like stages set up and there's
00:01:52
constant
00:01:54
interview. So, you know, I've gotten a
00:01:55
bunch of requests. Basically, everyone's
00:01:56
interviewing everyone else at Davos.
00:01:58
Does that make sense? I mean, it's like
00:02:00
all the attendees are just constantly
00:02:02
interviewing each other.
00:02:04
>> It's like the podcast circuit.
00:02:06
>> All these podcasters now have run out of
00:02:08
guests, so they just interview each
00:02:10
other in a giant circle. That's what it
00:02:12
is. This is literally going to be Yeah.
00:02:14
heads of state interviewing heads of
00:02:15
state.
00:02:16
>> Yes. Everyone's just interviewing
00:02:17
everybody.
00:02:18
>> Hey, welcome to the JD Vance show. I'm
00:02:20
JD Vance. With me on the show today is
00:02:23
Mandami. Welcome to the show.
00:02:25
Everybody's doing collabs there. The
00:02:26
snake has eaten its tail, but I think
00:02:28
we'll have a fun time. Me and Sachs are
00:02:29
going and we're going to we're going to
00:02:31
tear it up and have a good time. The USA
00:02:33
House, I understand, is like on a main
00:02:34
street there. And uh my understanding is
00:02:38
I was talking to the CEO of McKenzie
00:02:42
who's one of the partners I guess who
00:02:44
who sponsors a lot of the stuff at
00:02:46
Davos.
00:02:46
>> Look at you rubbing elbows with the
00:02:48
global elite talking texting with the
00:02:51
deep state. This is fantastic.
00:02:53
>> Yeah. No, I'm going it's a deep state.
00:02:54
It's my deep state era going into 2026.
00:02:56
And um there's supposedly what the vibe
00:03:00
is Saxs is people just kind of walk
00:03:04
around the main town and they'll just
00:03:07
pop into USA House and they network have
00:03:09
a have a coffee. They take a coffee and
00:03:12
then what we've got to do is have
00:03:13
producer Lisa say, "Hey, do you listen
00:03:16
to Allin? Hey, it's great to see you.
00:03:17
Would you like to talk to David and
00:03:18
Jason?" They're going to be sitting over
00:03:19
here and just me and David are going to
00:03:21
uh hold court. It's going to be fun. I'm
00:03:22
looking forward to it. We have kind of
00:03:25
like a little little man on the street.
00:03:27
>> We might, you know, I've done a little
00:03:30
uh vox pop in my deck and uh we might we
00:03:33
might get a wireless microphone and go
00:03:35
on the street and see what happens.
00:03:37
>> This is going to last 5 minutes until
00:03:39
people hear that Jake is is being
00:03:42
obnoxious and asking
00:03:44
>> question. You know, Jake, people don't
00:03:45
know this, but Jal does an incredible
00:03:47
Triumph the Insult comic dog impression.
00:03:50
>> Oh yeah, I do. I do.
00:03:51
>> Oh my god. If you went around.
00:03:54
>> Oh, dude.
00:03:55
>> Oh, yes. It looks like it's the prime
00:03:58
minister of Germany. I understand. You
00:04:01
turned off your nuclear at the right
00:04:03
time. How's the data center project
00:04:04
going? I heard the 15year-old Greta is
00:04:08
uh doing your energy conservation and
00:04:11
your strategy. How's that going for you?
00:04:13
>> It's not gonna last up again.
00:04:15
>> Yeah, we're gonna be detained at Davos.
00:04:18
All right. All right, I guess we got to
00:04:18
talk about what's going on in Iran.
00:04:22
Regime change could be happening. There
00:04:24
have been massive anti-regime protests
00:04:27
over the last month. As everybody
00:04:30
listening probably knows,
00:04:33
Iran has been ruled by an Islamic
00:04:34
dictator since the 1979
00:04:37
revolution. Ali Kumeni is uh in power
00:04:40
since 1989.
00:04:42
And if you want to understand why this
00:04:44
is happening, there's probably two data
00:04:46
points that you should know in the short
00:04:50
term uh last you know six seven years
00:04:53
inflation has been bonkers. If you think
00:04:55
you know 7 8 9% inflation during co was
00:05:00
acute and and you know 2.6 now people
00:05:03
complaining about uh take a look at this
00:05:05
chart boys. Uh it's it's been 30% on
00:05:09
average since 2019 due to sanctions.
00:05:11
Obviously, those things uh can work.
00:05:13
There's been food shortages, people in
00:05:15
the streets long-term. Here's a chart,
00:05:18
and this is from 2020.
00:05:21
So, you can add six years to the chart
00:05:22
you're seeing here. But, uh there's a
00:05:24
lot of young people in Iran, and the
00:05:27
populace is made up of a lot of 20somes
00:05:30
and 30somes. And they have Starlink and
00:05:33
they have access and VPNs. And so, they
00:05:36
want to be part of the future. They want
00:05:38
to modernize
00:05:40
sachs. This was a point of contention
00:05:43
last year. We were talking about
00:05:45
interventions
00:05:46
going on,
00:05:49
you know, foreign wars and your concerns
00:05:51
about that. This one is from the bottom
00:05:54
up. So I think that makes it quite
00:05:56
different. Yeah.
00:05:57
>> Well, look, this is a highly dynamic
00:05:59
situation. And I don't really want to
00:06:00
comment on something except to say that
00:06:02
I trust President Trump to make the
00:06:04
right decision and handle it. As I
00:06:07
understand it, the protests are either
00:06:11
fizzling out or being cracked down on at
00:06:13
this point. And I tend to think it's
00:06:15
dying down, but I'm not sure. And it's
00:06:17
it's a dynamic situation. I really Look,
00:06:19
the problem is whenever I comment on
00:06:20
something like this, it ends up being
00:06:22
Trump adviser David Sax says whatever.
00:06:25
>> Yeah. get clipped and
00:06:26
>> and the reality is I'm only involved on
00:06:28
two issues and this isn't one of them.
00:06:30
So I don't really think I should be
00:06:31
commenting.
00:06:32
>> Yeah, Freeberg, you've been talking
00:06:34
about this and uh I think it was part of
00:06:36
your predictions from the show last
00:06:38
week, the prediction show. Here's your
00:06:40
poly markets and then I'll let you give
00:06:42
your thoughts on it. Kani out as supreme
00:06:45
leader of Iran by January 31st.
00:06:49
that was up uh around 27% and now has
00:06:52
dropped to a 10% chance. And will the
00:06:55
regime fall before 2027? $2.6 million in
00:07:00
volume. 37% chance. It's been up there
00:07:03
as high as I think 50 some odd percent.
00:07:06
And this is before the end of the year.
00:07:08
So h obviously a breaking news type
00:07:10
situation by the time we tape on
00:07:12
Thursdays as everybody knows I'm out on
00:07:14
Fridays.
00:07:16
So this could be radically changing.
00:07:18
Just broad strokes. What are your
00:07:19
thoughts here, Freeberg?
00:07:20
>> I mean, I think it's inevitable that
00:07:22
there's a break in the country because
00:07:24
of the effect of sanctions. The average
00:07:27
income is about 200 bucks a month in
00:07:30
Iran. And the price of food is roughly
00:07:34
the same as the US, maybe a little bit
00:07:36
less than the US. I mean, there a combo
00:07:38
meal at McDonald's, I just pulled this
00:07:40
up in Tan is four bucks equivalent.
00:07:44
So again, if you're making $200 a month
00:07:46
and it's four bucks to go to McDonald's,
00:07:49
costs catch up pretty quickly. I think
00:07:52
that ultimately is what breaks civil
00:07:55
society is when people can't afford the
00:07:57
things that they need and people have no
00:08:00
choice but to stand up. and an
00:08:04
oppressive system, an oppressive regime
00:08:07
can keep people down for so long until
00:08:10
they're starving or they can't get
00:08:12
access to things like medical care. And
00:08:13
these are the sorts of things that
00:08:15
ultimately lead to these moments. So, it
00:08:17
seems like it's an inevitability. The
00:08:18
United States put a lot of pressure on
00:08:21
the regime in Iran and it seems to be
00:08:24
starting to break. The key question that
00:08:26
everyone's asking is Trump going to act
00:08:29
in supporting the revolution which
00:08:31
theoretically I would imagine would
00:08:33
involve attacking IRGC sites which are
00:08:35
the revolutionary guard that are sort of
00:08:38
the internal security force that
00:08:40
maintains the regime's control over the
00:08:42
people and if they take out IRGC sites
00:08:45
will that actually result in the people
00:08:46
being free and what's the transition
00:08:48
plan? This is obviously a very messy
00:08:50
situation. Reza Palavi is in Europe and
00:08:53
he said he's ready to come back and he
00:08:56
is the Sha's son and if he comes back
00:08:59
how are you going to give him influence
00:09:00
and control? This is the same question
00:09:02
that recently came up in Venezuela.
00:09:04
There is a very large infrastructure
00:09:06
that needs to be overseen of government
00:09:09
agencies and you know you can't bring an
00:09:12
outsider in and just plug them right in
00:09:13
to take over everything. It's a very
00:09:15
difficult transition and that's when
00:09:16
things fall apart when people steal
00:09:18
stuff when uh things get turned off. So
00:09:21
how do you maintain kind of the core
00:09:24
functioning of society without breaking
00:09:25
it by bringing someone new from the
00:09:26
outside? That's where this gets very
00:09:28
messy. So I I don't know what's ahead.
00:09:31
>> Yeah. And the strikes didn't happen last
00:09:33
night. Bessant announced some increased
00:09:36
sanctions. That always seems to be one
00:09:39
of the best ways to handle this is to
00:09:41
increase the economic pressure as you
00:09:42
pointed out Freeberg and for people who
00:09:45
don't who are not familiar Iran is a
00:09:48
large country. It's the second largest
00:09:49
in the Middle East behind Egypt I
00:09:52
believe and close to 100 million people
00:09:54
95 million people I think live in Iran.
00:09:56
Uh this would have a dramatic impact on
00:09:59
the region if there was a transition
00:10:01
here. Obviously, you've heard about uh
00:10:04
different Houthis and Hezbollah being
00:10:06
supported, funded, housed in Iran. So,
00:10:09
this would be quite dramatic, huh? If
00:10:11
this turned over, uh even if it's a 10
00:10:13
to 30% chance this were to happen, any
00:10:17
thoughts on what that would mean? You
00:10:20
know, we've been watching this
00:10:21
modernization of the Middle East and
00:10:23
just Saudi, UAE, Qatar, everybody having
00:10:26
a seat at the table, increasing
00:10:28
influence, increasing modernization in
00:10:30
those countries. What would this do in
00:10:33
the region?
00:10:35
It's really hard to tell. It's an
00:10:37
incredibly vibrant
00:10:39
people. If you look at the Iranian
00:10:41
diaspora, they're really a dynamic part
00:10:44
of every culture they join. If you know
00:10:46
Persians in LA or Persians, I mean,
00:10:48
they're
00:10:48
>> I mean, you and I played poker with the
00:10:49
diaspora in LA. These are the most
00:10:51
people in Westwood. They're they're the
00:10:53
greatest.
00:10:53
>> They're the greatest people.
00:10:54
>> They're shutting the club down. The last
00:10:56
people out at the game.
00:10:57
>> Yeah,
00:10:58
>> they're really great. The thing that I
00:10:59
would say is that I don't think that you
00:11:01
can paint the Middle East with the broad
00:11:02
brush here. It's a very different
00:11:05
culture than the other Middle East
00:11:06
countries. It's a fundamentally
00:11:07
different religion. It's a fundamentally
00:11:09
different language. So, I would just say
00:11:11
that I don't know what's actually going
00:11:12
on in Iran. There's been so much
00:11:14
information containment that I take
00:11:16
Sax's point of view which is I think the
00:11:18
only people in the United States right
00:11:19
now that have an accurate sense are
00:11:21
probably the military and intelligence
00:11:24
apparatus of the United States and the
00:11:26
rest of us are underreacting or
00:11:29
overreacting to small
00:11:33
pieces of information without really
00:11:35
knowing the context and the mosaic of
00:11:37
the whole. In a breaking news
00:11:39
environment, it's uh best to do some
00:11:42
research and uh yeah, be humble and
00:11:45
thoughtful by the way about your
00:11:46
positions. Yeah.
00:11:47
>> The crazy thing about this if you shift
00:11:49
away from Iran was specifically the
00:11:51
information warfare game is totally
00:11:53
different. So what did you have? You had
00:11:57
SpaceX enable Starlink over Iran
00:12:01
and then there was the attempt to use
00:12:03
that mechanism to get information out to
00:12:05
fill in the mosaic. Right. So
00:12:07
>> was what was happening 90%, was what was
00:12:10
happening 10%. Was there
00:12:11
counterrevolutions that were supportive
00:12:13
of Kmeni? None of us knew anything cuz
00:12:15
you would see these snippets and it was
00:12:17
very hard to actually triangulate. Then
00:12:19
you had this entire information channel
00:12:22
get shut down and you had all kinds of
00:12:24
blocking mechanisms that essentially
00:12:26
drove the packet loss down to like 80
00:12:28
90%. And it's just important to
00:12:29
understand that is the generation of
00:12:32
warfare and information that we are
00:12:35
going to see in every conflict going
00:12:36
forward. Especially when you have
00:12:37
something as ubiquitous as Starlink and
00:12:40
other things in the sky to help you get
00:12:41
the information out, you're just going
00:12:43
to see these tactics increase.
00:12:45
>> And I don't know if you guys ever saw
00:12:46
it. Anthony Bourdain, rest in peace, did
00:12:49
a really great parts unknown in 2013 or
00:12:53
>> Anthony Bourdain I've ever watched.
00:12:55
>> Yeah. If you want to see Iran, it looks
00:12:58
so amazing. Look at the Anthony Bourdain
00:13:00
parts unknown in Tyrron. It looks like a
00:13:03
party.
00:13:04
>> Well, yeah. And young people there.
00:13:05
>> Total vibe there.
00:13:06
>> Yeah. The young people are like really
00:13:09
living their life under this oppression
00:13:13
and you you really get the sense that
00:13:15
they're not much different than us or or
00:13:17
any other folks in the world. And the
00:13:19
the journalists who took him around were
00:13:20
later detained.
00:13:22
And I really respect Andy Berdane for
00:13:24
even doing that episode, man. They took
00:13:26
a lot of risk doing that.
00:13:27
>> Remember there was a period where one of
00:13:28
the most popular accounts on Instagram
00:13:30
was the rich kids of Tyrron,
00:13:32
>> right? If you follow them, you'd be
00:13:34
like, man, this looks like
00:13:36
>> LA or New York.
00:13:37
>> Yeah. Hong Kong. Yeah. London. Yeah.
00:13:39
Dubai.
00:13:41
>> Great potential there. We're rooting for
00:13:42
the people of Iran to have their
00:13:44
freedom. And uh yeah, I actually and
00:13:47
I'll say Saxs, I trust Trump
00:13:50
in his targeted neocon era. I'm trying
00:13:53
to phrase it properly here to not offend
00:13:55
anybody, but I think he's
00:13:57
>> doctrine.
00:13:58
>> Well, I mean, he he I think doesn't have
00:14:00
a problem using our military and the
00:14:03
force we have to
00:14:06
take a dictator out if it doesn't cause
00:14:09
World War II. And if two dictators
00:14:12
and two societies are freed in first
00:14:16
quarter of 2026, I mean, what does that
00:14:19
even mean for his legacy? This could be
00:14:20
the defining moment of his legacy. Yeah.
00:14:22
>> Means there's only a few of us left.
00:14:23
Jason
00:14:24
>> dictators. Yes. He'll be coming for you.
00:14:28
All right. Microsoft is going to pay its
00:14:30
own way on data centers. We've been
00:14:33
talking about this um you know energy
00:14:36
needs for AI data centers for a long
00:14:38
time now and uh there's been this theme
00:14:42
hey if the data centers are going to
00:14:44
take all this energy it's going to spike
00:14:46
local power consumption we saw a number
00:14:48
of data centers gentlemen maybe pull out
00:14:51
of projects where there was local push
00:14:54
back on them on Monday President Trump
00:14:58
our President Trump addressed this PR
00:15:01
crisis on truth social calling out
00:15:04
Microsoft and never want Americans to
00:15:06
pay higher electricity bills because of
00:15:08
data centers. Two words, data centers. I
00:15:10
added the last part. Microsoft will make
00:15:12
major changes beginning this week to
00:15:14
ensure that Americans don't pick up the
00:15:16
tab for their power consumption.
00:15:18
Microsoft President Brad Smith announced
00:15:21
they will pay higher electricity rates
00:15:24
where they are building data centers to
00:15:26
cover the cost of the new power
00:15:27
generation and grid upgrades. Seems like
00:15:29
a pretty simple idea. And they're also
00:15:32
going to pay to replenish water that it
00:15:34
draws from the reservoirs. That issue
00:15:35
has also been a little bit overblown.
00:15:37
Freeberg, you probably or actually
00:15:38
tomorrow, you probably know a lot about
00:15:39
that and you can explain the data center
00:15:41
recycling water issues and the
00:15:43
misperceptions.
00:15:45
And they're not Microsoft has announced
00:15:47
they're not going to accept any tax
00:15:49
breaks or electricity rate discounts. So
00:15:52
that era seems to have ended.
00:15:56
Chop, you're involved in a number of
00:15:58
data centers and obviously David Sachs,
00:15:59
you're involved in this as are AIS are.
00:16:01
and civil servants. So, Shabbath, why
00:16:03
don't you start us off here?
00:16:04
>> You guys can find the clip, but we
00:16:05
talked about this a few weeks ago that
00:16:08
these kinds of things were in the
00:16:09
offing. I really like it. It's a very
00:16:12
good first order set of things to do,
00:16:15
which is to step into a local area and
00:16:18
take all of these energy issues off the
00:16:20
table,
00:16:21
>> at least to the extent that you're
00:16:23
contributing to it.
00:16:24
>> The problem is that the data centers are
00:16:26
only part of the problem.
00:16:29
The reality is that we have a whole new
00:16:33
way of living that is drawing more and
00:16:36
more electrons. We are at a shortage for
00:16:39
what we need. The reaction of the
00:16:42
utilities is to now build which is the
00:16:45
right reaction. The problem is that for
00:16:47
the last 20 years they've been
00:16:49
underbuilding.
00:16:51
So as they catch up, even if you have
00:16:54
the data centers that are willing to pay
00:16:57
their fair share, rates will still go
00:17:00
up. So what do we need to do that is
00:17:03
beyond what Microsoft just announced? I
00:17:06
think all the hyperscalers should copy
00:17:08
what Microsoft did. I think it's great
00:17:09
that the president was able to get these
00:17:11
guys to the table to agree to it. What
00:17:13
is the next major thing? The next major
00:17:16
thing is when you actually create a
00:17:18
hundred or $200 billion tax equity
00:17:21
vehicle and you have them completely
00:17:24
subsidize and pay for
00:17:27
the electricity costs of homeowners. How
00:17:30
do you do that? You do that by paying
00:17:32
for them to get solar and storage. Why
00:17:35
would they do that? They would do that
00:17:37
for two reasons. Number one, and the
00:17:39
most important is that it will give them
00:17:41
a social license to operate throughout
00:17:43
the country. The second reason is that
00:17:46
the president preserved the ability to
00:17:49
make those kinds of investments and be
00:17:52
tax advantaged for doing it in the one
00:17:55
big beautiful bill. So if you put these
00:17:57
two things together, I think step one is
00:17:59
you go into a local area, you tell the
00:18:01
local residents, we'll pay for the
00:18:03
water, we'll make sure there's minimal
00:18:06
noise, and we'll make sure that we take
00:18:09
absolutely no discount. we pay our fair
00:18:10
share even if it means paying more than
00:18:12
you do for electricity. That's step one.
00:18:15
But now I think we need to go in with
00:18:17
step two. Here is a bunch of money that
00:18:20
we have allocated to go and fit your
00:18:22
house out with solar, with storage, with
00:18:25
next generation heat pumps, with a
00:18:28
modern set of infrastructure so that you
00:18:30
are totally resilient and now you are
00:18:32
completely ambivalent
00:18:34
to what the grid has to do in reaction
00:18:37
to all the demand that's coming.
00:18:39
>> Yeah. I had um Zack Dell from uh base
00:18:42
power on this week in startups I don't
00:18:44
know a year ago now and we were talking
00:18:46
about this and I said hey why wh why why
00:18:48
wouldn't you just and and what they do
00:18:49
is not solar because solar takes time
00:18:51
you got to rip up your roof there
00:18:53
there's some complications with solar
00:18:54
you need to have the space for it it's
00:18:56
expensive to install they just put a
00:18:57
battery like a little R2-D2 tube outside
00:18:59
your house they fill up that battery
00:19:01
when energy is cheap and plentiful and
00:19:04
they deploy it when it's expensive and
00:19:05
the grid has challenges and he said
00:19:08
those kind of deals are in the works or
00:19:09
the discussions were happening and that
00:19:11
was back then. So this is a really easy
00:19:13
win-win type situation. Shimath you're
00:19:16
describing Sachs this feels like
00:19:19
proactive now thoughtful ways to
00:19:22
communicate to the populace of hey the
00:19:25
AI boom is here and you have concerns
00:19:28
we're going to get ahead of them. So
00:19:29
have you been involved in any of these
00:19:31
discussions? Is are you talking with
00:19:32
Chris Wright and like overlapping in
00:19:34
terms of the um communication here or is
00:19:37
it just a free market solution?
00:19:38
>> Well, Jason, the the president's been
00:19:40
ahead of the curve on this issue really
00:19:41
since the beginning of the
00:19:42
administration. I don't know if you
00:19:43
recall, but he said that he was going to
00:19:45
make AI companies into the biggest power
00:19:47
companies because he understood that the
00:19:49
data centers that they needed required a
00:19:52
lot of power, but they were going to
00:19:54
stand up their own power generation and
00:19:56
they wouldn't just draw off the grid.
00:19:58
And so, I think this understanding has
00:20:00
always been there. When I've talked to
00:20:01
the hyperscalers, they also tell me that
00:20:04
their plan is not to draw from the grid.
00:20:06
It's to basically set up their own power
00:20:08
generation behind the meter. It's called
00:20:10
collocation. And in fact, I think
00:20:12
ultimately this will bring down rates
00:20:15
for residential consumers for two
00:20:18
reasons. One is that when the data
00:20:20
centers create their own power, they can
00:20:22
sell back or donate back to the grid
00:20:25
when they connect. They don't have to
00:20:26
connect to the grid, but once they do,
00:20:28
they can donate back. And then second,
00:20:31
there's a number of fixed costs in power
00:20:34
generation. It's not just variable,
00:20:36
right? There's these large fixed costs.
00:20:38
And so as you increase scale, those
00:20:41
fixed costs get amvertised over a
00:20:43
greater amount of supply. And that
00:20:44
brings down the variable rate, basically
00:20:46
the the metered rate for everybody. So
00:20:48
scale is good. And I think the deceptive
00:20:52
nature of the criticism here by like
00:20:54
Bernie Sanders and people like that is
00:20:56
what they say is well we just have to
00:20:57
shut down all the data centers period
00:20:59
when the real problem here is that he
00:21:02
and others like him have overregulated
00:21:05
power generation to death so that it's
00:21:07
too hard to set up net new power. Right?
00:21:10
I mean if power generation were easier
00:21:13
there wouldn't need to be a limit on
00:21:14
what the data centers could use. They
00:21:16
could just bring their own power. So
00:21:17
that is the obvious solution here and
00:21:20
it's good to see Microsoft make this
00:21:22
pledge and sort of formalize that. I
00:21:24
think all the other hyperscalers will do
00:21:26
that. Again, it was never part of their
00:21:28
plan, I think, to draw on the grid for
00:21:31
their power needs. They always, I think,
00:21:33
understood that they'd have to stand up
00:21:34
their own power. And the issue is just
00:21:36
regulations getting in the way of that.
00:21:38
And just one final point on this is that
00:21:40
there are a bunch of regulations by FK
00:21:44
for example that interfere with the
00:21:46
ability to do collocation. Collocation
00:21:48
is when you put a data center and the
00:21:50
power generation next to each other or
00:21:52
you do them together. And Chris Wright,
00:21:55
the secretary of energy has directed FK
00:21:57
to make a bunch of changes to make
00:21:59
behind the meter and collocation easier
00:22:02
so that these data centers can stand up
00:22:04
their own power. And the only reason
00:22:06
that hasn't happened is just because of
00:22:08
the usual bureaucratic delays. But that
00:22:10
is well on its way to happening.
00:22:12
>> All right.
00:22:13
>> Does that make sense?
00:22:14
>> Yeah, it makes total sense. And you
00:22:16
know, if we start thinking about
00:22:18
incentives, incentives obviously matter.
00:22:20
And I don't think a lot of people know
00:22:22
this, but and I think I talked about it
00:22:25
when we were talking about nuclear
00:22:26
freeird in France. the people who live
00:22:29
near the Avine uh I think is how it's
00:22:31
pronounced uh reactor they pay 0.1%
00:22:36
tax versus the 12% regional average and
00:22:40
so they and then I think the UK has also
00:22:42
talked about the sort of danger zone or
00:22:44
uh proposals and payments you can give
00:22:47
people a discount to incentivize them
00:22:50
and reward them giving them free local
00:22:52
electricity etc for living near a
00:22:54
nuclear power plant that hasn't come up
00:22:55
here in the United States and there's
00:22:57
been a lot of of FUD, fear, uncertainty,
00:23:00
and doubt Freeberg around these data
00:23:02
centers. People throwing around a lot of
00:23:03
talking points. I think you and I
00:23:05
discussed offline the the misperceptions
00:23:09
about water usage and that the water
00:23:11
usage is largely recycled in these data
00:23:13
centers. Um, if you know about that,
00:23:15
would you would you inform the audience
00:23:16
about that piece of
00:23:18
data?
00:23:20
>> Well, we got a lot of water. It just
00:23:22
goes around in a circle, so I don't
00:23:25
think that's an issue. uh but clean
00:23:26
water and the cost of clean water
00:23:28
increasing for a local population is the
00:23:32
misperception there.
00:23:34
>> The modern cooling systems these data
00:23:36
centers the water recirculates and
00:23:39
transports the heat out of the data
00:23:41
center. So it's not like the water is
00:23:43
used up. I guess there's a separate type
00:23:46
of evaporative cooling that does use up
00:23:47
some water, but modern data centers
00:23:49
don't use that. So, the water issue is
00:23:51
really a a total hoax, and it's really
00:23:53
kind of a subhoax of this larger
00:23:56
affordability issue. I'm not saying that
00:23:58
affordability isn't an issue, but it was
00:24:01
caused by Biden's 9% inflation, and now
00:24:04
Democrats are trying to make it an
00:24:05
issue. When it comes to the power for
00:24:07
data centers, again, this all comes back
00:24:08
to the fact that the regulations make it
00:24:11
too hard to generate net new power. So
00:24:14
again, scaling demand on its own not a
00:24:16
problem if you also scale supply of
00:24:19
electricity. In fact, it brings down
00:24:21
prices for everyone because scale
00:24:23
creates economies of scale.
00:24:25
>> Yeah. And 90% of that water is reused
00:24:28
and there's closed water loop systems.
00:24:30
And
00:24:30
>> here's my pitch. I think the president
00:24:32
should try to create a
00:24:34
>> three, four, 500 billion dollar tax
00:24:37
equity fund and help eliminate the
00:24:39
electricity costs of 50 to 100 million
00:24:42
American households.
00:24:44
>> Amazing.
00:24:45
>> Well, here's the let me let me give you
00:24:46
the math. So, we consume in this country
00:24:49
about 4 trillion kilowatt hours of
00:24:54
electricity. Average price is 18 cents a
00:24:56
kilowatt hour. So it's about call it
00:25:00
$750 billion of spend on electricity
00:25:03
every year. Onethird of that 250 billion
00:25:06
is residential consumption. 2/3 of that
00:25:10
500 billion is industrial and commercial
00:25:12
consumption.
00:25:13
Theoretically you could increase the
00:25:16
price on industrial and commercial
00:25:18
consumption by call it 50%. And make all
00:25:21
residential electricity in the United
00:25:22
States free. If you're a residential
00:25:24
user, you get a cap of free electricity
00:25:27
every month. And if you use more than
00:25:28
that cap, you get charged. But below
00:25:30
that cap, you're free based on whatever
00:25:33
square footage of your house, I don't
00:25:34
know, whatever. And then on the
00:25:37
commercial and industrial side, the
00:25:40
reason you would then have an incentive
00:25:42
to build private power systems would be
00:25:45
that you can bring your cost down. And
00:25:47
instead of centralizing all of this with
00:25:49
the utilities, what it can do is it can
00:25:51
force a market demand for industrial and
00:25:54
commercial users to build their own
00:25:56
power systems, which would increase
00:25:58
overall electricity supply in the United
00:25:59
States. The data centers are the tip of
00:26:01
the iceberg. But if you make this a
00:26:03
panindustrial problem, then all of the
00:26:06
industrial companies would have to take
00:26:07
this path. The problem is it doesn't
00:26:08
change the net consumption model. If you
00:26:10
actually go to solar and storage for
00:26:12
every 15 million homes, you take a
00:26:14
terowatt hour of demand off the grid.
00:26:17
That's an extra terowatt hour that you
00:26:18
don't need to build, but you can't build
00:26:20
that quickly. So, the reason why I like
00:26:22
solar and storage is you make these
00:26:24
folks so self-reliant. Now, all of a
00:26:27
sudden, we're actually catching up to
00:26:28
China faster than we would have
00:26:30
otherwise.
00:26:31
>> You're talking about residentials.
00:26:32
>> Yeah. Your idea, which is a good one,
00:26:34
the problem is they're still using grid
00:26:36
services,
00:26:37
>> right? Or they don't have to. That's the
00:26:38
point. Like if they end up the
00:26:40
industrial users. Well, the industrial
00:26:41
users will then invest in solar systems.
00:26:45
>> My point is today the homeowners are
00:26:47
using
00:26:49
>> there is no solution to not using.
00:26:51
>> Yeah. If the if the industrial price
00:26:54
goes up by 50% you've now created a
00:26:56
market force to drive them to make the
00:26:58
investment particularly if you if you
00:27:00
deregulated.
00:27:01
>> I understand the math but my point is
00:27:03
>> and you get this and you get this first
00:27:04
year capex depreciation. So they
00:27:06
actually get a benefit and instead of
00:27:08
putting all of the
00:27:09
>> guys you're talking through each other.
00:27:10
Chimat's point is that you're still
00:27:13
taxing the grid. His proposal adds
00:27:15
another layer to what you're saying. So
00:27:16
he's in agreement with you, Freeberg.
00:27:18
Hey, yeah, let's have the businesses pay
00:27:19
a little extra and and not or and let's
00:27:23
have them take off the grid to reduce
00:27:26
the grid. Well, there's 80 million
00:27:27
freestanding homes in the United States
00:27:29
and it's about 15k to put these battery
00:27:31
packs in like base power zooing. You can
00:27:33
probably get it down to 10. And if you
00:27:34
just do back back of the envelope math,
00:27:36
you're talking about a trillion dollars.
00:27:37
So basically for a hundred billion, you
00:27:39
could do 10% of the country. If you were
00:27:40
to do that over some time period, we
00:27:43
would have we would stop worrying about
00:27:45
the grid, I think, is Chimoth's point.
00:27:47
And you could do it with battery. You
00:27:48
could do solar.
00:27:49
>> Well, you would not stop worrying about
00:27:50
the grid. But Jason, just to refine what
00:27:52
you're saying because you're
00:27:53
directionally very right. The consumers
00:27:55
would feel less of these issues. And
00:27:57
instead of all of us worrying how to
00:28:00
underwrite terowatt hours to catch up to
00:28:02
China, we actually get a two for one.
00:28:05
The consumer homes don't have that
00:28:08
anxiety anymore. They don't have the
00:28:10
bill. And because they're generating
00:28:13
their own power, they're off the grid.
00:28:15
And now what that means is that extra
00:28:16
terowatt hour can actually go to the
00:28:19
commercial and industrial applications
00:28:21
including these data centers. And you're
00:28:23
right, Freeberg, we should raise their
00:28:24
tariffs. I just think it's a lot it's a
00:28:26
lot more complicated and a lot more
00:28:28
expensive to ask everyone more
00:28:29
complicated. Okay, listen. None of this
00:28:32
is free. None of it's free. However, we
00:28:34
have such an amazing opportunity with AI
00:28:37
that it makes sense to do this. That I
00:28:39
think is the big picture. AI is such a
00:28:41
huge opportunity. There's so much
00:28:42
invested. Why wouldn't you do this is
00:28:43
the question. And if we're want to live
00:28:45
in the age of abundance and we want to
00:28:46
bring the bottom half of the country up
00:28:48
and we want affordability, where do
00:28:50
people spend their money? food,
00:28:52
groceries, their rent, and their
00:28:54
electricity and the utilities. So, we if
00:28:56
we want to figure out a direct way to do
00:28:58
this, and for all the hippie- dippies
00:29:00
who care about the environment and clean
00:29:03
energy, this is a win there as well. And
00:29:05
it doesn't come out of Americans pockets
00:29:08
and their taxes. It comes out of
00:29:09
corporations which are printing money.
00:29:11
If you want to talk about redistribution
00:29:13
of wealth, this is a way for the great
00:29:16
American max corporations to give
00:29:19
something back to Americans. And you
00:29:20
talked about this, right, off maybe
00:29:21
three or four weeks ago that hey, maybe
00:29:23
there would be some way for great
00:29:25
corporations to do great things for
00:29:26
Americans. The fact that Americans don't
00:29:27
think about their water bill that much
00:29:29
is a is a mitzvah. It's a great thing.
00:29:31
Now, if they didn't have to think about
00:29:32
electricity, wow, amazing.
00:29:34
>> We will look back and I think that we
00:29:35
will want to have seen these big
00:29:38
companies who are unbelievably
00:29:40
profitable step up on behalf of American
00:29:43
homeowners.
00:29:44
>> Some might say obscenely profitable. I
00:29:46
just think I just think it's a it's a
00:29:48
great
00:29:50
>> mission to the moon style framing to say
00:29:52
what if we could make all residential
00:29:53
electricity free in the United States
00:29:55
>> and over the next decade if we can do
00:29:57
that not only do we help Americans with
00:30:00
their wallet but we actually can enable
00:30:04
a distributed investment scheme in
00:30:07
American energy production and we force
00:30:10
the corporations to step up and do their
00:30:12
part rather than centralize it. So I I
00:30:14
just like the framing of making this
00:30:15
whole thing free, making residential
00:30:17
electricity free in the US as a core
00:30:19
benefit.
00:30:19
>> The other thing is we've talked about
00:30:20
this, I've mentioned this a couple times
00:30:22
before.
00:30:23
I think the single biggest
00:30:27
dollar short, it's not clear when
00:30:31
that one will be able to make will be on
00:30:34
these utilities. Because if any version
00:30:36
of what we just talked about happens and
00:30:39
all of a sudden you have private
00:30:41
homeowners that are their own utility
00:30:43
and then Freeberg CNI being their own
00:30:46
power utility, what do the utilities do?
00:30:49
What does all this capex go to? How do
00:30:51
they pay back their bonds? What happens
00:30:53
to their rate base? This is a huge
00:30:56
economic question that I think will come
00:30:57
up if even a small modeicum of what we
00:31:00
just talked about materializes.
00:31:02
>> Yeah. and uh you know people having
00:31:05
their first x number of kilowatt hours a
00:31:07
year free. You know obviously you're not
00:31:09
going to have unlimited free. You know
00:31:12
that that's going to be pretty
00:31:14
transformative for America. It's
00:31:15
aspirational. We all like the idea. I
00:31:17
like it. Okay. Open AAI has struck
00:31:19
another compute deal. This one's worth
00:31:20
over 10 billion. OpenAI is buying
00:31:22
compute capacity from Cerebras. That's C
00:31:26
E R E B R A S. They committed to
00:31:28
purchase up to 750 megawatts over 3
00:31:31
years. Cerebrus like Rock makes
00:31:33
specialized chips for AI inference.
00:31:36
Cerebras is in talks to raise 1 billion
00:31:38
at a $22 billion valuation according to
00:31:41
reports and they're expected to IPO this
00:31:43
year potentially in the next couple of
00:31:45
months. Sam Waltman's an investor in the
00:31:46
company. So, uh he knows it well and
00:31:50
>> is he really stop?
00:31:50
>> I I mean it's in the notes. It's in the
00:31:52
notes.
00:31:53
>> You can't say this though if you don't
00:31:54
know if it's true.
00:31:55
>> It's in the notes. It's in the notes.
00:31:57
Take it out and post if it's not. I
00:31:59
reported by the misinformation. I don't
00:32:01
know. It could be information. Could be
00:32:03
misinformation. Shout out.
00:32:05
>> Okay.
00:32:05
>> To our friends that they information.
00:32:09
>> These were your competitors at Grock.
00:32:10
Yeah. Uh Chima,
00:32:11
>> they were contemporaries. Yeah.
00:32:13
>> They're fantastic. We both started at
00:32:15
the same time, we took slightly
00:32:17
different technical approaches. The big
00:32:18
difference that what Cerebra said
00:32:20
initially from the start, and this is my
00:32:22
friend Andrew Feldman, so I'll give him
00:32:23
a shout out. Very smart guy. If you see
00:32:25
a chip, what you actually see is a
00:32:26
wafer. And a wafer is full of little
00:32:29
chips, right? and you you literally tear
00:32:31
them off. That's why they're called
00:32:32
chips. Andrew was like, "No, I'm just
00:32:34
going to make one ginormous chip the
00:32:36
size of a wafer." And so if you look at
00:32:38
it, Nick, maybe you can find a picture
00:32:40
of it. These things are huge. And at the
00:32:44
time, people were like, I don't think
00:32:46
they really understood what the power of
00:32:48
what Cerebras was building and what
00:32:50
Andrew was building. And then the first
00:32:52
folks that really got on board were the
00:32:54
Emirates, so MGX and G42.
00:32:57
And you started to run these models. And
00:32:59
what you started to see was, man, their
00:33:00
inference is blazing fast. Again, back
00:33:02
to what we talked about last week
00:33:04
because when you have the compute and
00:33:05
the memory in the same place, physical
00:33:08
distances are now minimized and the
00:33:10
complexity is minimized. So, you just
00:33:11
have incredible speed. What I can tell
00:33:13
you is that OpenAI is aggressively
00:33:17
trying to diversify so that they have
00:33:20
multiple paths of inference available.
00:33:23
They have a huge deal with AMD. They
00:33:24
have a huge deal with Nvidia. They now
00:33:26
have a huge deal with Cerebras. If you
00:33:27
look at the trail of breadcrumbs, my
00:33:29
belief there's going to be a renaissance
00:33:31
in silicon. Young small teams building
00:33:35
decode silicon can make a fortune over
00:33:38
the next 10 to 20 years. It's a huge
00:33:40
opportunity. It's going to be like the
00:33:42
PC wars, Dell versus Compact versus all
00:33:46
of these companies. It's super exciting.
00:33:48
And congrats to Cerebras. They deserve
00:33:50
it.
00:33:51
>> Is there um any argument that compute
00:33:54
needs will level off in some way? will
00:33:56
have built so much capacity and the
00:33:58
software will get better. There's been
00:34:00
some talk about anthropic being resource
00:34:03
constrained as the contemporary to open
00:34:05
AAI and I think there's pretty much
00:34:07
uniformity amongst elite AI users that
00:34:10
claude is a much better product now than
00:34:13
OpenAI and the models are better, the
00:34:16
applications are better but they're
00:34:17
doing it with less. So could the
00:34:20
buildout be could it slow down? Is that
00:34:24
a scenario that's out there or is this
00:34:26
always going to be up and to the right
00:34:27
for the next five ten years? What's your
00:34:28
crystal ball saying? Sax, are you still
00:34:30
there?
00:34:31
>> I'm here.
00:34:32
>> Oh, okay.
00:34:33
>> Why is he on Why is this video off? Turn
00:34:35
it on.
00:34:35
>> I mean, you can turn it back on and then
00:34:37
when you talk, we'll just go back and
00:34:39
forth.
00:34:39
>> Sex still has a ways to go, I have to
00:34:41
say.
00:34:42
>> All right, there you go. All right. So,
00:34:43
anyway, uh Abbott,
00:34:45
>> this is your best internet.
00:34:47
>> Texas structure is uh
00:34:48
>> Oh my god. Sax is going to do the
00:34:51
Abbott. Abbott will send someone over
00:34:53
immediately. They're they're pretty
00:34:54
responsive in Texas.
00:34:55
>> My prediction is there'll be a big meme
00:34:57
by the end of this year called the Texas
00:34:58
Bounceback. And it's a bunch of
00:34:59
billionaires. They do a little jiggy as
00:35:01
they dance back from Texas back to
00:35:03
California.
00:35:04
>> No. No.
00:35:05
>> Ain't happening.
00:35:05
>> You're there for good, huh?
00:35:06
>> Well, here's the thing. So,
00:35:09
>> okay.
00:35:09
>> Well, maybe we should just talk about
00:35:10
BTA cuz this where this is going.
00:35:14
>> Well, I mean, listen, you move houses.
00:35:16
Move houses. You could have a little
00:35:17
internet issue. It's okay. Well, I mean,
00:35:19
I'd rather have an internet issue and
00:35:22
keep 100% of my money than
00:35:26
>> 5%
00:35:27
>> lose 5% plus 13.3 per year. And it's not
00:35:30
going to be a onetime tax. That's the
00:35:32
biggest lie.
00:35:33
>> It's 5% now, 5% later, 10% after that.
00:35:37
>> Yeah.
00:35:38
>> You know, it'll be an exit tax.
00:35:40
>> Yeah.
00:35:41
>> They're coming for all of it.
00:35:42
>> Yeah.
00:35:43
>> So, the internet can get fixed. The
00:35:45
internet, let's put this way. My
00:35:46
internet can get fixed a lot more easily
00:35:48
than California can.
00:35:49
>> What are the 10 states that
00:35:51
constitutionally ban asset taxes?
00:35:53
>> Yeah. So, it's direct and implicit in
00:35:56
those states constitutions or they have
00:35:58
an amendment to the constitution that
00:36:00
makes it um direct or implicit that you
00:36:02
can't do a wealth tax or an asset
00:36:04
section.
00:36:05
>> Which are they? Alaska, Florida, Nevada,
00:36:07
New Hampshire, South Dakota, Tennessee,
00:36:08
Texas.
00:36:09
>> According to Grock, only Texas
00:36:11
explicitly bans wealth taxes.
00:36:14
>> Yes, that is correct. But because of
00:36:17
some of the other state constitutions,
00:36:19
it's implicit. So Texas has in their
00:36:21
constitution an a prohibition on quote
00:36:24
tax on wealth or net worth. Washington
00:36:27
has a uniformity clause which treats
00:36:28
income as property which bans
00:36:30
non-uniform rates. Florida's
00:36:32
constitution bans any sort of personal
00:36:36
tax. Pennsylvania has a strict
00:36:38
uniformity clause which would make it
00:36:39
impossible to have graduated tax rates
00:36:41
or distinguished tax rates amongst
00:36:43
populations. Illinois has a strict
00:36:45
constitutional mandate for a flat
00:36:47
non-graduated tax rate. So you cannot do
00:36:51
uh a separation. Um and then asset
00:36:54
seizure is referred to as a civil asset
00:36:56
forfeite
00:36:58
which
00:37:00
is a separate legal issue but implies in
00:37:02
states like New Mexico, Nebraska, and
00:37:04
North Carolina,
00:37:06
you cannot actually have an asset taken
00:37:09
from you by the state. So there there's
00:37:12
a bunch of states that this would be
00:37:14
constitutionally protected against.
00:37:16
>> Freeberg, has your mind changed since
00:37:18
last week about whether this is going to
00:37:19
make the ballot?
00:37:20
>> I I don't think it's going to make the
00:37:22
ballot. I mean, look, I I think it's not
00:37:23
I'm not saying 100%. I'm saying slight
00:37:26
overweight that it's not going to get
00:37:27
there.
00:37:27
>> So nothing has changed in your
00:37:29
perspective.
00:37:30
>> I think we're going through the rolling
00:37:31
wakeup process right now, which is
00:37:33
people are waking up to the fact that
00:37:35
the asset seizure tax is an elimination
00:37:37
of private property rights. that
00:37:39
fundamentally what you're saying and I
00:37:40
wrote this in my tweet that private
00:37:42
property now becomes public property
00:37:44
because as soon as you give the
00:37:45
government the right to collect your
00:37:47
post tax assets through a legislative
00:37:50
vote, you are basically saying that you
00:37:53
no longer have private property because
00:37:54
at any point in the future the
00:37:56
government can vote to say I'm going to
00:37:58
take your private property which is
00:37:59
different than an income tax which is
00:38:01
when you earn something that you didn't
00:38:02
have before and they take a percentage
00:38:04
of your earnings of your income. The
00:38:06
statement now is after you've made your
00:38:08
income, it's now your private property.
00:38:11
They can come and take it. And so that
00:38:13
is a distinction that has never existed
00:38:15
in the United States. And I will make
00:38:17
the retort right now to property tax
00:38:19
because people always say to me, what
00:38:20
about property tax? A property tax is a
00:38:23
service fee on a particular specific
00:38:26
asset. The money that is collected
00:38:27
provides services for that asset to make
00:38:29
it more valuable. So you get roads,
00:38:31
infrastructure, policing, fire, schools,
00:38:34
all the stuff that comes with property
00:38:36
tax, make that asset more, and you have
00:38:38
the option at any point you want to sell
00:38:40
that property and stop paying that
00:38:41
property tax. You have the option at any
00:38:44
point to downgrade your property and get
00:38:46
a cheaper property and pay it lower. But
00:38:48
and here's the other important point
00:38:49
about property tax. It's uniform.
00:38:51
Uniform means that everyone pays the
00:38:53
same percentage, the same property tax
00:38:55
rate in a county. This asset seizure tax
00:38:58
that's being proposed is a demographic
00:39:01
tax, meaning that the state or the
00:39:04
legislature defines a specific group of
00:39:06
individuals. In this case, they're
00:39:07
saying anyone with a net worth over a
00:39:09
billion dollars and then they can go and
00:39:11
take assets from only that group. That
00:39:14
is nonuniform taxation. It means that
00:39:17
for the first time we're saying based on
00:39:18
the demographics of a person meaning
00:39:21
whatever you want to use to define that
00:39:23
person in this case their wealth you are
00:39:26
going to be treated differently and that
00:39:27
is different than an income tax because
00:39:28
remember when you have graduated income
00:39:31
tax rates and you say high earners t get
00:39:33
tax more what you're taxing is the
00:39:35
earnings not the individual. You're not
00:39:38
looking through to the individual to
00:39:39
determine whether or not they're
00:39:40
wealthy. All you're doing is looking at
00:39:42
the independent earnings amount that's
00:39:43
coming in. And so a uniformity clause is
00:39:46
supposed to protect people from being
00:39:49
demographically discriminated against.
00:39:51
And you may roll your hand and be like,
00:39:53
"Oh, who cares about the billionaires?
00:39:54
Eat the rich." That's great. But
00:39:56
fundamentally, you're giving the
00:39:57
government, the legislature, the ability
00:39:59
to in the future take any demographic
00:40:02
definition they want and go in and take
00:40:04
any percentage they want of after tax
00:40:06
property from you. That is why this is
00:40:08
so troubling. And we can harp all day
00:40:11
long about eat the rich and obviously
00:40:13
this group is is biased, but the general
00:40:16
population should be very much aware of
00:40:18
the fact that as soon as you give a
00:40:20
legislature the ability to discriminate
00:40:22
a group and take whatever% they want.
00:40:25
Yeah.
00:40:25
>> You've se and and it's over. You've
00:40:26
you're now what you've done is you've
00:40:28
made all private property public
00:40:30
property because the government is
00:40:31
simply giving you permission every year
00:40:32
to keep your stuff
00:40:33
>> and the government shouldn't even know.
00:40:34
It's like they're they're coming onto
00:40:36
your ranch and calculating how many
00:40:37
tractors you got. How you got an old
00:40:39
Corvette? How much is that worth? What's
00:40:40
what's your old roadster worth? Jewelry
00:40:43
worth.
00:40:43
>> How much moose is worth?
00:40:44
>> Moose is Yeah, they're going to take 5%
00:40:46
of moose.
00:40:47
>> Very valuable thorough bread there.
00:40:49
>> Absolutely is. There'll be a new job
00:40:51
category. Tax appraiser.
00:40:52
>> Tax appraisers. And then you don't know
00:40:54
whether the
00:40:55
>> knocking on your door. I'm here to walk
00:40:57
around your ranch and calculate
00:40:58
everything. I mean,
00:40:59
>> and it doesn't solve the geometric debt
00:41:02
problem, right? We have a problem where
00:41:04
every year if we keep funding things
00:41:05
with a deficit in California we're
00:41:07
looking at a 30 billion a year deficit.
00:41:08
We've got 500 billion of debt and we
00:41:10
have a nearly 1 trillion dollar pension
00:41:13
obligation that is not funded.
00:41:15
>> Yes,
00:41:16
>> that money is going to come from
00:41:17
somewhere or it is not going to get
00:41:19
paid. It is more likely that they're
00:41:21
going to do everything they possibly can
00:41:23
to get that money from somewhere rather
00:41:25
than not pay it. And the same is and the
00:41:27
same is true for all pension obligations
00:41:30
across the country. Illinois has a big
00:41:32
problem like this as well.
00:41:33
>> Well, can I can I take the other side of
00:41:35
that bet that bet you mentioned about it
00:41:37
not getting on the ballot,
00:41:38
>> please? Yeah, go for it.
00:41:40
>> Well, I I've never understood why this
00:41:42
wouldn't get on the ballot. And I've
00:41:44
never understood why once it's on the
00:41:45
ballot, it wouldn't pass, which is why I
00:41:48
left. So, let's take the first one of
00:41:50
these. In terms of it getting on the
00:41:52
ballot, you only need about 8 million
00:41:53
bucks to collect the signatures. 850,000
00:41:55
signatures. It's not that many in
00:41:57
California. There's definitely millions
00:41:59
of people in California who would love
00:42:01
to stick it to billionaires. So, they're
00:42:03
going to gather the signatures that SEIU
00:42:05
has the money. The only way that it
00:42:08
wouldn't therefore make the ballot is if
00:42:10
Gavin Newsome and the political machine
00:42:13
bribe the SEIU with enough political
00:42:16
benefits that they'll withdraw it. But
00:42:18
what the SEIU is asking for is whatever
00:42:20
it is, the $30 billion. And I don't know
00:42:23
if Gavin Newsome has that much money
00:42:26
laying around somewhere that he can just
00:42:28
give them. Furthermore, if you're the
00:42:31
guy running the SEIU, I understand his
00:42:32
name is Dave Rean.
00:42:34
>> Rean. Dave Rean,
00:42:35
>> you got to be looking at what's
00:42:37
happening on X right now and you got to
00:42:39
be gleeful. You got all these
00:42:40
billionaires are panic tweeting all day
00:42:43
long.
00:42:44
>> It's not all day long. I tweet in the
00:42:46
morning from the bathroom.
00:42:47
>> Well, we're all doing it.
00:42:49
>> Morning constitutional. I went on a base
00:42:51
tweeting spree this morning. So if
00:42:54
you're if you're this guy Rean, you're
00:42:57
like, "Oh my god, look how much leverage
00:42:59
I've got." You know, twist a pig's ear,
00:43:01
watch him squeal. He's twisted these
00:43:03
billionaires ears, and they're all
00:43:04
squealing.
00:43:06
>> So why wouldn't you increase your
00:43:07
leverage by spending the $8 million, put
00:43:09
it on the ballot, and then negotiate
00:43:11
with
00:43:11
>> Was that a Was that a deliverance
00:43:13
reference? I hope not.
00:43:15
>> No, it's just an expression. Hey man,
00:43:18
>> I don't know why your mind's going to
00:43:19
deliverance.
00:43:21
>> Squeal louder.
00:43:21
>> You need that deliverance on the brain.
00:43:23
>> I maybe I do.
00:43:25
>> Sax, I'll tell you why. So, I've
00:43:26
obviously been a believer I've been a
00:43:28
believer in the long cycle and I've said
00:43:30
this for a long time. We are going to
00:43:31
end up in either a socialist or some
00:43:33
sort of fascist. Either way, it's a
00:43:34
tyrannical system to get us out of the
00:43:37
death spiral that we've been in for some
00:43:39
time. So, that is true. But, I still
00:43:42
want to retain my sense of individual
00:43:44
agency. And I do think that those of us
00:43:46
who are in California who actually care
00:43:48
should retain some sense of agency
00:43:50
rather than suspend our um our ability
00:43:54
to have an influence in the outcome
00:43:56
here. I think we need to speak openly
00:43:57
and honestly about where this leads to.
00:44:00
Let people hear it. Let the people in
00:44:01
California decide. And frankly, if we've
00:44:03
done our job, we've spoken loudly, we've
00:44:06
spoken clearly, we've re revealed to
00:44:08
people where a private property seizure
00:44:11
tax leads to for everyone in this
00:44:13
country and the deletion of private
00:44:14
property rights in this country and they
00:44:16
still sign up to it,
00:44:18
>> then I'm out.
00:44:19
>> Yeah, I get it. And
00:44:20
>> if it was a centillionaire tax, she
00:44:22
would have been out.
00:44:23
>> I agree that we should fight it. I'm not
00:44:25
being fatalistic. I don't think the
00:44:26
outcome is predetermined, but I don't
00:44:29
understand why it wouldn't get on the
00:44:30
ballot because that that has nothing to
00:44:32
do with how persuasive you and the
00:44:34
opponents of BTA are. It's just about
00:44:37
whether SEIU, UHW will spend the
00:44:40
requisite amount of money, 8 million, 10
00:44:42
million, 12 million, whatever, to gather
00:44:43
the signatures. And I mean, we've heard
00:44:46
they have the money, right? So why
00:44:48
wouldn't they? It only increases their
00:44:50
leverage to demand more concessions.
00:44:52
They have $14 million to gather the
00:44:54
signatures, which the estimate was
00:44:55
they'll need somewhere between five and
00:44:57
15. So, they have the cash they need to
00:44:58
gather the signatures.
00:44:59
>> It's a good bet.
00:45:00
>> And they have roughly $10 million to run
00:45:02
an ad campaign. And their estimate is
00:45:03
they need between $50 and $100 million
00:45:05
to run an ad campaign.
00:45:06
>> Sounds like a good the next step will be
00:45:09
that they'll try and get this thing
00:45:11
signed up. Now, the polling data,
00:45:15
it shows that there's room for influence
00:45:17
sack. So, I do think that if people can
00:45:19
understand where this is headed and
00:45:21
look, if America wants to sign up to
00:45:23
this, Godspeed, man, like that's where
00:45:26
America's going to end up in the
00:45:27
socialist death spiral loophole. Like,
00:45:30
good luck. Have a good time. I'm going
00:45:33
to Terminus to start the foundation. I
00:45:35
don't know where the hell that is, but
00:45:37
I'm out.
00:45:38
>> You're out.
00:45:38
>> I'm out.
00:45:39
>> And in the meantime, all we can do is
00:45:40
speak truth to it and try and shine
00:45:42
light on it and see where it goes.
00:45:43
>> Hey, maybe 51st State Greenland. Maybe
00:45:45
we'll just do the first state.
00:45:47
>> Look, I'm not saying it's going to pass,
00:45:48
although I do think it's probably
00:45:51
slightly more likely than not to pass
00:45:54
once it's on the ballot. I just don't
00:45:55
understand why it's not going to be on
00:45:56
the ballot. And once it makes the ballot
00:45:58
in, let's say, April,
00:46:00
>> I think there's going to be a big freak
00:46:01
out and rush for the exits because
00:46:03
there's a lot of people
00:46:05
>> who, you know, this is my theory is I'm
00:46:07
going to beat the end of the park.
00:46:08
>> It's not people don't realize this. It's
00:46:10
not billionaires. I've received dozens
00:46:11
of texts, emails, calls from people,
00:46:13
founders, business leaders, CEOs that
00:46:16
are out
00:46:17
>> if in April this thing ends up on the
00:46:19
ballot because they're like writings on
00:46:21
the wall. If no politicians in
00:46:22
California are willing to stand up and
00:46:24
talk about private property rights and
00:46:26
no one's willing to say like this leads
00:46:28
to a death spiral for the state and
00:46:29
potentially for the country and no one's
00:46:31
going to say that, then it's only a
00:46:32
matter of time before this happens and
00:46:34
it's only a matter of time before it
00:46:35
hits me.
00:46:36
>> And so everyone is looking for a place.
00:46:38
>> Let me let me give you a data point on
00:46:39
that. Um there are other unions who
00:46:42
weren't part of this ballot initiative
00:46:44
who are preparing similar ones for 2028
00:46:47
and those ballot initiatives are going
00:46:49
to be more bulletproof. They're going to
00:46:50
be better lawyered. All that kind of
00:46:52
stuff. More likely to survive
00:46:54
constitutional challenges. The only
00:46:56
reason why there is political opposition
00:46:59
I believe to the BTA is because it was
00:47:01
done by only one union. the SEIU uh this
00:47:05
guy did it on his own and the loot all
00:47:08
the proceeds from this confiscation
00:47:12
would go almost all of it would go just
00:47:14
to this one union or its causes. So they
00:47:16
didn't cut in the other unions on the
00:47:19
loot. They didn't wet the other unions
00:47:21
beaks.
00:47:24
>> As a result of that, the other unions
00:47:26
are actually against it. And this is why
00:47:28
Newsome and the other politicians feel
00:47:30
relatively unconstrained in saying
00:47:32
they're opposed to it. And that's why I
00:47:34
think that if we defeat this in 26, it
00:47:37
doesn't mean it's dead for good. It just
00:47:38
means it's going to come back in a new
00:47:40
form in 28, but with much more
00:47:42
broad-based union support, all the
00:47:44
unions are going to do it together. So,
00:47:46
I just think this is inevitable. And I
00:47:48
think that, you know, for all the
00:47:49
founders and whether you're
00:47:51
>> pre-exit, postexit, or on your way to an
00:47:53
exit,
00:47:54
>> my advice would be that to quote Maya
00:47:57
Angelou, when a state shows you who they
00:47:59
are, believe them the first time.
00:48:02
>> This is the direction of travel in
00:48:04
California. And whether it's SEIU or
00:48:06
whatever they do,
00:48:08
this is where it's going.
00:48:10
>> They'd love to see something. Perhaps
00:48:11
you said something that resonated with
00:48:13
me, which is the next versions of this
00:48:15
will be better lawyered and more
00:48:18
bulletproof.
00:48:20
I've had a team of people looking at
00:48:22
this. The thing that is the biggest
00:48:26
weakness here is looking at the fact
00:48:30
that this is a wholly new tax that is
00:48:33
applied retroactively. And when you look
00:48:36
at the Supreme Court at the federal
00:48:37
level, the case law on this, this is the
00:48:40
strongest challenge that people will
00:48:42
have and this is where
00:48:44
there is a prepoundonderance of evidence
00:48:47
in the favor of people saying that this
00:48:49
is unjust and this is a taking and being
00:48:52
able to use the Supreme Court to bat
00:48:54
this back. Now, that'll take 5 and 10
00:48:57
years to litigate because it'll be there
00:48:59
drawing itself through the courts
00:49:00
forever. But when you look at the fact
00:49:02
that that will be the angle of attack
00:49:04
that people will take if this passes, I
00:49:08
100% agree with you Saxs. If this union
00:49:11
were smart enough, what they would have
00:49:13
done is say this is going to start Jan7.
00:49:17
It probably would make the ballot. It
00:49:20
probably would pass and they would get
00:49:23
all the loot and it would be very
00:49:26
difficult to legally challenge this
00:49:29
thing. It was a huge miscalculation by
00:49:31
that union. But in 28 or 30 or 32, this
00:49:35
will rear its ugly head. It will be
00:49:37
better architected and there will be no
00:49:39
way around it. And at that point, why
00:49:42
create an artificial line at one with
00:49:46
nine zeros after it? Why?
00:49:48
>> Why? And by the way, stupid go to 100
00:49:51
million. Get everybody.
00:49:52
>> Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.
00:49:54
Let's move that number up a little bit.
00:49:55
Let's get to Let's get it to 250. And if
00:49:58
what we're saying is right, then why
00:50:01
would it not happen at a national level?
00:50:03
>> Of course it will. Yes. They're going to
00:50:05
start chasing you around the country.
00:50:07
It's just
00:50:08
>> Well, because I'll tell you why. Because
00:50:10
we still have plenty of conservatives in
00:50:12
the rest of the country. California is
00:50:14
screwed. But we got to start stacking
00:50:17
sandbags around the rest of the states.
00:50:20
Freeberg, you said something that I
00:50:21
really liked in your post, which is it
00:50:23
begs the question, what will happen when
00:50:25
California goes BK and then they go to
00:50:28
the feds and it doesn't actually matter
00:50:33
who is in charge at that time. But let's
00:50:35
think about it. If Trump were in charge
00:50:36
for a second, California knocks and
00:50:38
says, "Hey, I need you to bail us out."
00:50:41
the deal that California would need to
00:50:43
do with the president for that to even
00:50:45
be palatable so that he could build a
00:50:47
coalition of Republicans around it. Man,
00:50:49
California will go through tremendous
00:50:52
pain
00:50:52
>> measures,
00:50:53
>> but then go through the other side. So
00:50:54
now imagine AOC's president, AOCC's
00:50:57
president.
00:50:57
>> So she says, I got to do this and then
00:51:00
when it goes to Congress,
00:51:03
how does this actually happen? This is
00:51:06
again where I think Sax is right. As
00:51:08
long as there is a 4951
00:51:12
kind of a balance,
00:51:14
I don't think anything can really happen
00:51:16
without meaningfully deep austerity in
00:51:18
California.
00:51:19
>> I think there's a way out for
00:51:21
>> now if the filibuster's gone by that
00:51:23
time.
00:51:23
>> Yeah.
00:51:24
>> And it's simple majority and then if
00:51:26
there's a Democrat in the oval plus a
00:51:29
Democratic Congress. Y
00:51:31
>> David, you're right because that is the
00:51:33
one shot on goal that they have a
00:51:34
two-year window to run that play at the
00:51:36
federal level and they will be able to
00:51:38
get it done.
00:51:38
>> Now ask yourself the question, what
00:51:40
happens to the citizens of Florida, the
00:51:42
citizens of Texas and the citizens of
00:51:45
North Dakota and the citizens of all
00:51:47
these states that pay federal taxes have
00:51:50
not had this problem in their state and
00:51:51
they're basically paying Alaska. Alaska
00:51:54
has a
00:51:55
>> surplus.
00:51:58
Why would all those citizens and this is
00:51:59
where the union starts to unravel and
00:52:01
that's where I get very concerned about
00:52:03
where this leads. As soon as you allow
00:52:05
this asset seizure tax to pass even on a
00:52:07
state level, the economic ramifications
00:52:10
or on a national level, the economic
00:52:11
ramifications are inevitable that some
00:52:14
states are going to have to bail out
00:52:16
other states and that's where things get
00:52:18
very ugly.
00:52:19
>> The bill will come to at some point.
00:52:20
There's a super easy out here for the
00:52:22
Democrats or people who are supporting
00:52:24
this. Just go after fraud first, taxes
00:52:26
second. That's got to be the mantra
00:52:28
going forward. We're going to eliminate
00:52:29
fraud and waste and then we'll have a
00:52:31
discussion about taxes. That's the only
00:52:33
way for them to find an escape hatch
00:52:35
here.
00:52:37
>> Okay. We have the moderates. You're
00:52:39
Yeah. I mean, like,
00:52:41
but just just some interesting stats
00:52:42
here. So, California collects roughly
00:52:45
double per capita
00:52:47
what Texas and Florida do. So,
00:52:50
California collects about $10,319
00:52:53
per taxpayer, whereas Texas 5,469.
00:52:56
Florida 4,914.
00:52:59
So, there's not an issue here of
00:53:01
California
00:53:03
not collecting enough taxes. The issue
00:53:05
is all on the spending. And on that
00:53:07
front, the California budget has doubled
00:53:10
over the past decade while the
00:53:12
population stayed flat. And in fact,
00:53:14
>> and services got worse. Service services
00:53:17
got worse. Test scores got worse. Crime
00:53:19
prevention and enforcement got worse.
00:53:22
>> Where's it going?
00:53:23
>> They let convicts out of jails.
00:53:25
Everything's gotten worse.
00:53:26
>> Where's the money going, Sachs? Say the
00:53:28
word.
00:53:28
>> It's going to these government worker
00:53:30
unions who have accumulated too much
00:53:33
political power. Look, you go all the
00:53:34
way back to FDR and he was opposed to
00:53:37
even though he was a for unions. He was
00:53:40
opposed to government workers unions
00:53:42
because he thought they would accumulate
00:53:44
too much political power and they elect
00:53:46
the politicians and then the politicians
00:53:48
are the ones paying them. So they just
00:53:50
end up extracting more and more and more
00:53:52
iteratively with every election cycle.
00:53:53
>> It's the same as an antitrust monopoly
00:53:55
in a corporation. It's the same ultimate
00:53:58
dynamics as having a monopoly in private
00:54:00
industry and corporations. It basically
00:54:02
gives you a monopoly on political power
00:54:04
and it gives you the ability to
00:54:05
monopolize assets. And that's
00:54:06
effectively where we are now. They're at
00:54:08
the point where one union is saying,
00:54:10
"I'm going to take the assets, hundred
00:54:11
billion dollars of assets from a small
00:54:14
minority of people in the state."
00:54:15
>> The reality is that a lot of it is the
00:54:18
pension obligations.
00:54:20
You can work for the state for 20 years,
00:54:23
retire in your 40s,
00:54:25
>> and you basically what you get like 90%
00:54:27
of your your wage for the rest of your
00:54:30
life. It doesn't work. It doesn't pencil
00:54:32
out. It's got to end.
00:54:34
>> They use your last year's W2. So, you
00:54:36
stuff it with overtime, your last year,
00:54:38
and you end up retiring with like 150%
00:54:41
of your annual salary for life. It
00:54:43
doesn't even apply to your spouse, too.
00:54:47
>> This was the promise that was given in
00:54:50
order to get the votes that have gotten
00:54:52
us to the point we're at today. Because
00:54:54
that is how the unions operate, right?
00:54:56
It is a system that drives political
00:54:58
influence by making these sorts of
00:55:02
benefits law and brings them to bear.
00:55:05
>> If the average retirement age is 50 and
00:55:07
your lifespan is 80, like this is way
00:55:10
this is not how it was intended. People
00:55:12
used to get these at 60 and they would
00:55:14
die at 68. It was like
00:55:17
>> for the state at 22 and you can retire
00:55:19
at 42. Actually, what a lot of people do
00:55:21
is they'll go then take a second
00:55:23
government job and they'll stack a
00:55:24
second pension. But yeah, you could
00:55:25
retire at 42 if you if you stuff it with
00:55:28
over. Yeah,
00:55:29
>> you can stuff it with overtime and and I
00:55:31
think it applies to your spouse as well.
00:55:33
Just fact check me on that. But
00:55:34
>> I know I'm aware of it in New York where
00:55:36
a little bit of this stuffing on the
00:55:37
margins do does occur. I've heard
00:55:39
>> I'm not against police officers and
00:55:42
teachers and and people getting
00:55:45
reasonable.
00:55:46
>> You you need to do superanuation funds.
00:55:48
You have to have people buying into the
00:55:50
market over time. And the government
00:55:52
shouldn't be managing this. It's just
00:55:54
the government is terrible at whatever
00:55:56
it does and there's too much for them to
00:55:58
do. Let it stand alone. Take it out.
00:56:01
Carve it out. You're you're forced to
00:56:03
put 12% into this or your employer puts
00:56:05
a little bit into it and then we'd have
00:56:07
a very happy society. More participation
00:56:09
in the market. It would solve so many
00:56:10
problems. Okay. I just want to hit one
00:56:12
last topic. Congratulations to Greenland
00:56:15
on uh accepting a very generous offer
00:56:17
from President Trump. We welcome you as
00:56:19
the 51st state. Maybe that'll be
00:56:22
happening any day now. US officials met
00:56:25
with reps from Denmark and Greenland at
00:56:27
the White House on Wednesday to discuss
00:56:29
how the US could take control of
00:56:31
Greenland.
00:56:33
This has been something Trump's been
00:56:34
talking about for years. And remember my
00:56:37
rule number one of President Trump. He
00:56:39
says a lot of things. One way or
00:56:40
another, we're going to get it March
00:56:42
4th, 2025. I need it for psychological
00:56:44
reasons to actually own it. 2021. He
00:56:48
said that we're going to do something
00:56:50
with Greenland, either the nice way or
00:56:52
the more difficult way. January 9th,
00:56:54
2026. Denmark doesn't seem to want to
00:56:58
play ball. They say they have a fun
00:57:00
fundamental disagreement about this.
00:57:02
That being said, there's only 50,000
00:57:05
people there and it's a Poly Market's
00:57:07
got it at 17% chance that we acquire it,
00:57:09
which is significant as a starting
00:57:12
point. 50,000 people getting a half
00:57:16
million or a million dollars each would
00:57:17
probably be a pretty good deal. It's a
00:57:19
very strategic piece of land.
00:57:22
If you look at what's happening with the
00:57:24
ice caps melting sacks and Russia
00:57:27
positioning a lot of their ships up in
00:57:30
the Arctic, there's a pretty clean shot
00:57:33
going past Greenland to the northeast of
00:57:36
America. So maybe you could just talk
00:57:37
about why this is and again you're not
00:57:39
speaking for the administration and it's
00:57:40
not your lane but why is Greenland so
00:57:43
important.
00:57:43
>> Well it is becoming more significant
00:57:45
from a national security standpoint as
00:57:47
those Arctic ISIS melt and you have new
00:57:51
shipping lanes that have opened up. So
00:57:52
it is important on on that dimension.
00:57:55
But look, American politicians have
00:57:57
wanted to acquire Greenland for a long
00:57:58
time. The great Secretary of State
00:58:00
William Seard wanted to acquire it. He
00:58:02
acquired Alaska. He wanted to get
00:58:03
Greenland to was unable to make that
00:58:05
deal. But FDR and Truman both were
00:58:08
interested in acquiring Greenland. It
00:58:10
didn't work out obviously. So this is an
00:58:12
old idea that's new again thanks to
00:58:14
President Trump. I think he makes a
00:58:16
great point. Why does it belong to the
00:58:18
Danes? You know, it's a small country in
00:58:21
Europe. It's not part of North America.
00:58:24
And I think if we can acquire it for
00:58:26
national security reasons and resource
00:58:27
reasons, we should. And I think the odds
00:58:30
of him pulling this off are much greater
00:58:31
than 17%. Chimath or Fberg, you have any
00:58:34
thoughts on the 51st state?
00:58:36
>> I don't know anything about it.
00:58:37
>> Well, they don't have to become a state
00:58:39
to be clear. No, they can become
00:58:42
>> Yeah. I mean, territory, whatever it is.
00:58:44
Yeah. Could be like a country club,
00:58:47
whatever. It's it's important that we
00:58:49
get get memberships.
00:58:51
>> This is a huge piece of real estate in
00:58:53
the Western Hemisphere. It doesn't
00:58:54
really make a ton of sense for Denmark
00:58:56
to own it.
00:58:58
>> It makes a lot more sense for it to be
00:59:00
part of the US. And
00:59:01
>> we're willing to pay for it. And I think
00:59:04
that we can make them an offer that they
00:59:06
can't refuse.
00:59:07
>> Absolutely. And it has
00:59:08
>> We're gonna send Luca Brazie over there.
00:59:10
>> I thought Luca Brazzy
00:59:12
off.
00:59:14
It's got a lot of railroads minerals.
00:59:17
There's a lot of oil offshore. Their big
00:59:19
export now is is fish obviously, but
00:59:22
this has lots of potential, Freeberg, in
00:59:25
terms of the resources. And um yeah, why
00:59:27
not get it done? Trump loves real
00:59:29
estate. We got him for another three
00:59:31
years. I say let President Trump cook
00:59:34
and if he wants to buy some other land,
00:59:35
I'm here for it. I love building the
00:59:37
empire. This is my favorite Trump.
00:59:40
>> Frag, you love this Trump or not.
00:59:42
>> The old adage is there's always a deal.
00:59:44
There's always a price
00:59:47
>> except when you're negotiating with the
00:59:49
government. So, I don't know how that's
00:59:50
going to go. My understanding, my
00:59:52
experience is that they do not want a
00:59:54
deal. They're not interested. There's a
00:59:58
whole bunch of national pride associated
00:59:59
with that. You can't break national
01:00:01
pride as we know as patriots of America.
01:00:04
It is very hard to fight national pride.
01:00:06
I don't know if the economics are really
01:00:07
going to play out, but security
01:00:10
guarantees, maybe other benefits for the
01:00:13
the great kingdom of Denmark. There
01:00:15
could be a strong alliance and
01:00:17
partnership for the United States.
01:00:19
>> I think it could be important
01:00:21
for the US to have a new frontier. You
01:00:23
know, maybe what we can do is send all
01:00:25
these progressive socialists
01:00:26
>> off to Greenland to tame this new
01:00:28
frontier.
01:00:29
>> I want to go send Mandami there and they
01:00:31
get that.
01:00:31
>> We need that. We need that spirit of the
01:00:34
frontier of of cowboys, of exploration.
01:00:37
>> Yes. That Mandami. He seems like a very
01:00:39
resilient, gritty guy. He'll come with
01:00:40
his whole crew, the socialist Roana. Let
01:00:42
him set up there. Let's see what
01:00:44
>> the idea of having what's called a
01:00:46
freedom province or freedom state or
01:00:48
freedom city,
01:00:50
>> economic free zone. Yeah.
01:00:52
>> Yeah. And and I do think if we if we are
01:00:55
looking down the barrel of socialism in
01:00:56
the United States, which I think
01:00:58
socially leads to a destruction of
01:01:00
individual liberties and a degradation
01:01:03
of the social fabric in America, before
01:01:05
that happens, it's important that those
01:01:09
who are on the other side and before
01:01:11
they get overwhelmed with the votes and
01:01:15
uh the elected officials that will fight
01:01:16
against them, before this all happens,
01:01:18
it's important to think about carving
01:01:20
out illegal territory And that legal
01:01:22
territory should allow for the
01:01:24
resurrection of the great American
01:01:26
Union, of the great American spirit. And
01:01:28
we should find a place within our sphere
01:01:31
of influence before we get overwhelmed
01:01:34
to set up
01:01:35
>> Texas, dude. It's called Texas. Remember
01:01:37
the Alamo. We're making our last stand
01:01:39
here.
01:01:40
>> Absolutely. The 50 calibers are up on
01:01:42
the ranch. I think it would be helpful
01:01:44
to get something that's that's federally
01:01:45
set up, Sachs, that you could have like
01:01:47
untouchable legislation that says this
01:01:50
is not to be touched, this is
01:01:52
pioneering, whatever it is.
01:01:53
>> Join the militia. We got a militia. And
01:01:56
maybe Greenland is the place, but it's
01:01:58
something that feels it's got to be
01:02:00
something that feels difficult,
01:02:02
something that feels open, something
01:02:03
that feels a little bit untouched, and
01:02:05
it's regionally encased with a set of
01:02:09
legislated
01:02:11
things like Guam or Puerto Rico or
01:02:13
something where you set set it up and
01:02:15
you're like, look, this is untouchable.
01:02:16
It takes a a big action to change it.
01:02:19
Something where people can have
01:02:21
protection against the uh the socialist
01:02:23
milu that's on the way. You know, it is
01:02:25
kind of interesting as I remember from
01:02:26
my high school history. I think the
01:02:28
frontier was officially over at by 1910.
01:02:31
I think that was meaning every longitude
01:02:35
basically had been fully exploritude and
01:02:38
longitude had been sort of settled. And
01:02:40
that is when the progressive era kind of
01:02:43
began. And I do kind of wonder whether
01:02:46
the frontier was this like escape valve
01:02:49
for pressure that builds up, you know,
01:02:52
resentments that build up in the
01:02:54
economy. People could always just go
01:02:56
west and become pioneers and find new
01:02:59
territory.
01:03:00
>> That's right.
01:03:00
>> And in a way, that's what America was
01:03:02
for Europe, right? I mean, Europe was
01:03:04
sort of this overcrowded place. it was
01:03:06
uh oppressive and people just left that
01:03:09
they could opt out by going to America
01:03:11
and settling over in what would become
01:03:13
the United States and I kind of wonder
01:03:16
whether maybe we need something like
01:03:17
that again
01:03:18
>> and by the way all the discontents so
01:03:21
they don't become democratic socialist
01:03:22
of America
01:03:23
>> and for a while the digital frontier
01:03:26
became that escape valve but now that's
01:03:28
being shut off and it's being closed
01:03:30
down and the place where it's been run
01:03:33
from is being subjugated
01:03:36
to the socialist. So the question is
01:03:37
what's next? I think it's a very good
01:03:39
question.
01:03:39
>> Well, the problem is that the the
01:03:41
socialists, they're not explorers.
01:03:44
They're not pioneers. They don't create
01:03:46
anything. They're not builders. What
01:03:48
they are is they're really good at
01:03:50
hijacking existing institutions.
01:03:52
>> Mhm.
01:03:53
>> And that's what they do is they take
01:03:55
things that were created by great people
01:03:58
and they subvert them and they seize
01:04:01
control. And that's what they're going
01:04:02
for is total control. first in
01:04:04
California and then in Washington. But I
01:04:06
do wonder whether the existence of some
01:04:09
sort of release valve might defer that
01:04:12
day, right? Because you get less
01:04:14
pressure building up in the system.
01:04:15
>> Yeah.
01:04:16
>> All right. Another amazing episode and
01:04:18
just want to give a shout out. Schmoff
01:04:20
did an amazing interview with my guy
01:04:22
Howard Lutnik.
01:04:24
>> That was fun, huh? Yet,
01:04:26
>> that was awesome. He was awesome.
01:04:27
>> Yeah, I'm really impressed by him. And
01:04:29
Freeberg on a bit of a heater here
01:04:33
today. We dropped an incredible
01:04:34
interview with FDA Commissioner Marty
01:04:37
Marie. Am I pronouncing correctly?
01:04:38
>> Carrie McCary. Great job there. And also
01:04:42
you're you got to hang out with your
01:04:44
childhood hero. We grew up on Howard
01:04:46
Stern on the East Coast, but you grew up
01:04:48
with Adam Corolla
01:04:50
and you got to interview him. You were
01:04:51
fanboy fanirling a little bit there at
01:04:53
the start, weren't you?
01:04:54
>> Well, it was great to I'd never met him,
01:04:56
so it was great to interview him. I
01:04:58
mean, he has a lot of interesting ideas.
01:05:00
I got a lot of texts about his uh coined
01:05:02
term gynofascism which I think some
01:05:06
people
01:05:06
>> explain to the audience what watch the
01:05:09
interview watch the interview we don't
01:05:11
want to get he was great you had to see
01:05:13
the start of this interview Javon
01:05:15
Freeberg's like Mr. Carella I used to
01:05:19
watch you and Dr. Drew uh talking on
01:05:22
Loveline and it really was formative in
01:05:24
my years as a broadcaster and now I too
01:05:27
am a broadcaster. It was really cute. It
01:05:29
was really cute.
01:05:30
>> I never said I'm a broadcaster. I would
01:05:32
never.
01:05:32
>> You were like
01:05:33
>> I would never I would never degrade
01:05:35
myself like that, Jacob.
01:05:38
>> I actually am doing random acts of
01:05:40
broadcasting. The sun never stops on the
01:05:41
All-In Empire.
01:05:43
And I also did a a fun CES interview
01:05:47
with the CEO of McKenzie, Bob
01:05:49
Sternfells. and uh Heymont from General
01:05:52
Catalyst and uh that's up on the feed.
01:05:55
So four four 1 2 3 four
01:05:59
interview shows waiting for you in your
01:06:01
feed and to the mainstream media trying
01:06:03
to keep up with this.
01:06:06
GFY
01:06:07
gfy
01:06:09
good for you have fun trying
01:06:10
>> you guys believe that Jake has been
01:06:12
invited to Davos.
01:06:14
>> I can't wait to see this.
01:06:15
>> I'm bringing my acoustic I'm going to
01:06:17
tear IT UP. WE'RE GOING to have fun. Did
01:06:19
you guys see me rage bait Twitter two
01:06:21
days ago?
01:06:22
>> What did you say?
01:06:22
>> No. What did you do?
01:06:23
>> I put this thing where
01:06:25
>> you showed your legs.
01:06:26
>> No. You remember when we did the
01:06:28
interview at the end summit where
01:06:29
Tulssey talked about the Obama
01:06:30
documents?
01:06:31
>> Yeah.
01:06:32
>> Well, this guy did a rant. I thought the
01:06:33
rant was great, but I just retweeted it
01:06:35
and people lost their mind. Basically,
01:06:39
he was calling for Obama's arrest.
01:06:42
>> God.
01:06:43
>> Oh gosh.
01:06:44
>> I said very casually, gosh, this is a
01:06:46
really under reportported story.
01:06:47
>> Oh, I saw that one. to be.
01:06:49
>> I'm wondering who that guy was, though.
01:06:50
I'm like,
01:06:53
>> did Nap make you take it down?
01:06:54
>> No, it's still up there. Still up there.
01:06:57
>> Wait, who is who is that streamer?
01:06:59
>> I don't know who he is.
01:07:02
>> Saying Obama.
01:07:04
>> Yeah, I don't
01:07:05
>> I think he's he's said he met
01:07:07
>> Did you guys watch Nick Shirley's new
01:07:09
video?
01:07:09
>> Oh, no.
01:07:10
>> He goes looking for himself.
01:07:12
>> Check this out.
01:07:13
>> There's these transportation companies.
01:07:15
They get $10 million a day in Minnesota.
01:07:19
>> A day. A day for non-emergency medical
01:07:22
transportation.
01:07:24
So the state will pay if you transport
01:07:27
someone that's autistic to Target to get
01:07:29
them groceries 50 bucks a ride. And
01:07:32
there's a website where the
01:07:33
transportation company gets to log into
01:07:36
the website and they're registered as
01:07:38
one of the transportation companies and
01:07:39
they're like, I took someone from this
01:07:41
place to Target. and you get and you
01:07:44
fill out all these forms and then you
01:07:45
get a check immediately
01:07:46
>> on the it's a trust system.
01:07:49
>> They never investigate. They don't
01:07:50
audit. They don't check. Nothing. So
01:07:52
Nick Shirley starts going around looking
01:07:54
for the transportation companies and
01:07:56
it's like a liquor store. He's like,
01:07:57
"Where's the where's the transportation
01:07:59
company?" Liquor store guys like there's
01:08:00
no transportation here. It's like a you
01:08:03
know a burrito place like a deli. Like
01:08:05
all of these places are folks
01:08:08
transportation companies. tens of
01:08:10
millions of dollars a week just being
01:08:12
given out. And by the way, this is not a
01:08:14
race thing. It does no one any good to
01:08:16
cast this as being a Somali thing. And
01:08:19
that I think is what's getting everyone
01:08:20
in trouble. The fact and it's and by the
01:08:22
way, it's what shuts off a lot of people
01:08:24
to actually being able to look at the
01:08:25
fraud. And it's not about the Somali
01:08:27
people. It's about the fact that fraud
01:08:29
is allowed by the government. And it's
01:08:32
about the fact that the government
01:08:33
either is implicit or complicit in this
01:08:36
fraud. And I think that that's what
01:08:38
people need to pay attention to and and
01:08:40
ignore all of the rattings about what
01:08:42
community or what group or who's doing
01:08:44
it and just focus on the fact that the
01:08:46
government lets this happen. If you
01:08:47
think about the state of California
01:08:48
spending $350 billion a year and you ask
01:08:51
yourself the question, are those
01:08:53
government agencies and the agents in
01:08:56
those agencies doing their job of making
01:08:58
sure that there's no fraud taking place?
01:08:59
There is no way anyone's going to raise
01:09:01
their hand and say yes. They're great
01:09:02
fiduciaries of taxpayer money. And
01:09:05
that's what we should all be paying
01:09:06
attention to and get out of the
01:09:08
political divide on all this and the
01:09:09
racism and all the and focus on
01:09:11
the fact that the government does this
01:09:12
All right, everybody. Another
01:09:14
amazing allin episodes. Thanks. Thank
01:09:16
you for tuning in.
01:09:18
Like, oh, by the way, guys, we hit a
01:09:20
million subs on uh YouTube. They sent me
01:09:22
a gorgeous plaque. I'm putting it up in
01:09:24
my office. It's amazing. And
01:09:27
>> at the million plaque, it's it's great.
01:09:29
The all the team autographed it and
01:09:32
wrote a really nice note. Yeah. Can I
01:09:33
say something?
01:09:34
>> Yeah. You're welcome.
01:09:35
>> You're welcome. Jamal would like to say
01:09:37
you're welcome.
01:09:41
>> You're welcome. All right. See you at
01:09:42
Davos. Kumbaya Davos. We'll see you
01:09:44
there.
01:09:46
>> We'll let your winners ride.
01:09:49
>> Rainman David.
01:09:54
>> We open sourced it to the fans and
01:09:56
they've just gone crazy with it.
01:10:06
Besties are gone.
01:10:09
>> That is my dog taking your driveways.
01:10:14
>> Oh man, my attacher will meet the place.
01:10:16
>> We should all just get a room and just
01:10:18
have one big huge orgy cuz they're all
01:10:20
just useless. It's like this like sexual
01:10:21
tension that we just need to release
01:10:23
somehow.
01:10:25
Wet your
01:10:26
wet your feet.
01:10:30
We need to get merch. I'm going all in.
01:10:39
I'm going all in.
