00:00:00
This guy said something so terrible and grotesque at the White House. This is where this woman used to live. You
00:00:04
[ __ ] Like, back off. >> Hi everyone, this is Pivot from the Vox Media Podcast Network. I'm Cara Swisser
00:00:16
>> and I'm Scott Galloway. >> Oh, do we have a lot to talk about. Wow. President Trump celebrated his 80th
00:00:22
birthday ringside with this USC Freedom 250 where fighters compete in front of a
00:00:25
crowd of 4,300 with the actual White House as a backdrop as a marketing thing. There's a lot of marketing going
00:00:31
on whether it was Bud Light or or whatever. FA Meta had did something very laudable. They were giving these glasses
00:00:37
to blind service members. I think their their brand took a hit for being associated with it. Anyway, the guest
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list reads like a who's hoops of power, tech, and money. Zuckerberg was there who was a big who is a big fan and I
00:00:48
this is the only thing I genuinely like about him. I'm glad he's committed to that. Whatever. Um Joe Rogan was there
00:00:55
as you said cabinet secretary centers. Lindsey Graham looked very happy surrounded by muscled men. Of course
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Paramount CEO David Ellison was in the audience as the event streamed exclusive behind a Paramount plus payw wall.
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Nothing says the people like a payw wall. We'll talk about that more in a minute because, you know, again, this
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one fighter grabbed and took this cheap shot at Michelle Obama, which is part of
00:01:15
a conspiracy theory among the right and they think they seem to be obsessed with
00:01:19
her and and the Obamas. Um, now UFC CEO Dana White later told Time magazine, "Everyone knows my position on free
00:01:26
speech, but I hate that kind of nonsense." I don't think you need to defend free speech, Dana. It's just
00:01:32
Can't you just say this is like horrible? Like they they always have to like find some dumb excuse. That's a
00:01:37
that's a I think that's a good I think that was a a good comment from him. Like >> I guess it's the least he could do.
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>> But we we disagree on this because I actually think well we're going to I think the event was a win for the White
00:01:48
House. Um >> I know >> to sink to that dumb moment which will get a lot of play. But um I look I think
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that essentially just the way Tucker Carlson is trying to shore up the Nick Fuentes manosphere part of the party.
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There's still a large segment of America that wants to embrace some form of masculinity and feels like it's been
00:02:11
shoved aside. And I feel the same way about masculinity that David feels about the border. And that is if progressives
00:02:17
don't enforce the border, fascists will. And if Democrats can can't come up with
00:02:22
some sort of symbolism or role models that demonstrate strength and service as masculinity, then the Republicans sort
00:02:29
of fill that hole with violence and misogyny, which is exactly what they're doing. And uh unfortunately it not only
00:02:36
highlights this performative weird dominant misogynistic form of masculinity that is just
00:02:42
in my opinion the absolutely the terrible role model for young men. It highlights to me that Democrats haven't
00:02:49
been able to identify anything around an aspirational viewpoint around masculinity.
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>> Uh I'm going to push back. Trump is down 10% among young men over the past few
00:02:58
months. It's way they're way down on >> not because of this event. No, I'm just saying it's just I think this version
00:03:03
masculinity, you know what a better version were the Knicks. The way they were and I'm not I'm taking away the
00:03:08
owner who I don't particularly like, but I thought they display, you know, a lot
00:03:12
of like a support of women. If you notice, there was a lot of mothers, there was a lot of sisters, there was a
00:03:18
lot of >> they they always talk about, you know, the the guy um the main guy Brunson was,
00:03:24
you know, he gave up a big pile of money to have other people on the team, including Cat Farl Anthony.
00:03:30
>> He wants a ring. He wants a ring. >> He wants a ring. Of course. But it's like it just shows like
00:03:34
>> that >> the difference of the watch parties was really rather significant. And so if you
00:03:41
want a version of masculinity, that's a version of masculinity that is very sporty, very masculine. It it did a lot
00:03:47
to heal the male loneliness epidemic. Have you seen people out in the street like that? Men out in the street like
00:03:52
that? >> Absolutely love it. >> Yeah. >> I don't think there's any there's any way to to not highlight the Knicks,
00:03:59
their players. New York, what have you. Um, again, I look, I I think that event and the
00:04:07
pageantry and the fly over, I think there's a large segment of America that likes that stuff. I I I like a flyover,
00:04:14
by the way. I didn't I'm not saying I don't like a flyover. I think the I think there are ways into this that are
00:04:19
very very clear that you can support things. I think it's um here this is Monica Hess in the Washington Post. I
00:04:25
think she did a great job and she also is a big supporter of MMA, by the way. She likes it. The problem isn't the
00:04:30
fighting on the lawn. People who love the UFC have had to sit through decades of presidents inviting poets and chists
00:04:36
and opera singers to the White House. And the turnabout is fair play. The problem with Sunday's broadcast wasn't
00:04:41
the fighting. The problem was the tonally incoherent emulsion of patriotism and blood lust. History and
00:04:47
by this crap an event happening for the people but tucked behind a paramount play payw wall. I think that exactly
00:04:55
that's what it felt like. It felt like, and by the way, all the all the cheap seats, they were they were stuck in that
00:05:00
one area of of um they weren't at the White House, which was um uh this is what she also wrote. What do we make of
00:05:08
this other than this is America? Bring me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses advertising Bud Light and trucks
00:05:13
in loud we trust. Bring me your ring girls dressed skimpily in sequin stars and stripes and your men with
00:05:18
cauliflower ears and a bunch of sailors dancing to YMCA. I just it it there was such an I don't know. I I I I do
00:05:26
contrast these things. I also contrast the World Cup, too, which looks wonderful and diverse and interesting
00:05:31
and the the crowds are I don't know. It's just there is a way to appeal and I think Democrats should embrace it. But
00:05:38
this was grotesque and and it was it and it and it was it got the center of attention will be this idiot. This idiot
00:05:47
who's had his head hit too many times calling making an incredibly misogynistic. It's
00:05:53
racist. It's anti. It's just like gross. And nobody no man doing anything. That's
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what it is. That's what it is. Agreed. Anyway, we can >> Yeah, look, her her comments, her
00:06:04
assessment is really really impressive. And I do agree the World Cup and the Knicks are better. Look, at the end of
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the day, just politically, Cara, it was a total distraction and occupied uh the news cycle from the fact that we
00:06:18
have a shitty memo of understanding on something actually a lot more important. >> We won't get to that. Yes. So just from
00:06:24
just from a distraction standpoint, it was I think it was a whim. I if they hadn't had that event, the media would
00:06:32
have been much more focused on something that has much larger implications from the world and that is Donald Trump were
00:06:37
walked into a you know a car dealership demanding a Ferrari and is leaving with a Camry because he's figured out he has
00:06:42
bad credit >> that he's overpaying for. Yeah. That we're just giving them everything
00:06:47
>> at a minimum. And they probably wasn't strategic planning the timing, but I think that I I think anything that
00:06:54
distracts from this memo even if it's a terrible statement. I get it. I get it. Well, we've got a lot to talk. We're
00:07:00
going to talk about that. The Trump administration, by the way, is fighting with Anthropic again. And SpaceX, of
00:07:05
course, went public. That seems like a 100 years ago. But, you know, speaking of Paramount with it got Justice
00:07:10
Department approval, the word the merger has just cleared a key hurdle. The DH says its review found the roughly $ 110
00:07:17
billion deal is unlikely to harm competition for consumer or consumers removing a major federal obstacle. The
00:07:22
deal isn't done yet, though. The state attorney general, including Californians, are still reviewing the
00:07:26
transaction and could challenge it. Uh David Ellison said the merger remains on track to close by September. He's got to
00:07:32
because after that a so-called ticking fee would kick in, making the acquisition more expensive. European
00:07:37
regulators are still weighing approval. What's interesting to me is the Justice Department apparently shut down its
00:07:43
investigation into Paramount's bid to buy Warner Brothers before career staffers even had a chance to weigh in.
00:07:49
And those lawyers weren't just skeptical of the deal. They were actually leaning
00:07:53
towards recommending the DOJ sue to block it, arguing that combining two of Hollywood's biggest studios would be bad
00:08:00
for competition. But with the Ellison's and Trump, the fix apparently was in. We
00:08:06
we'll get to the Roku deal which actually Fox just bought Roku but these mergers are just coming fast and furious
00:08:12
and I think no one was surprised by this. It's a question of if the states or European Union can slow this thing
00:08:18
down but are you you were concerned with Netscape with higher prices? Um how do you feel at this
00:08:24
>> Netflix with higher prices? >> Yeah. The the reality is if the economists I talked to say that it's
00:08:29
hard to say these guys have a monopoly. When you look at the fact that the combined viewership still won't rival
00:08:36
um uh YouTube's when you look at the revenue, it's nowhere near what the revenue is for, you know, the media
00:08:42
companies, the tech media companies we talk about. So, you can accuse them of overpaying. I had chilling down my spine
00:08:47
over the weekend when I read that Mark Thompson is being considered as kind of the manager they need to come in for CBS
00:08:56
News. >> The only one actually the others who they mentioned said no, but go ahead.
00:09:01
>> It just all of a sudden it sent a chill down my spine. I'm like, what? The Ellison's own CNN? I It's like it hadn't
00:09:06
fully down hadn't fully dawned on me. But from a straight >> from a straight regulatory standpoint,
00:09:12
>> Yeah. there was really no, in my opinion, valid reason uh to block it. Um and and by the way,
00:09:19
I've switched on that. I was worried about the consolidation of media, but when you include competitors around
00:09:24
watch time, revenues, there wasn't there really wasn't an economic argument. Now,
00:09:30
the in terms of mergers, you're going to see a flurry of them because anyone who's thinking maybe we'd like to buy
00:09:37
companies, they're like, "Let's do it while the doing is good >> because If you get a Democratic
00:09:43
administration in there, you're going to have much more scrutiny around these mergers.
00:09:47
>> Yeah. >> And I mean, you already see it. You already see you already see attorney
00:09:50
generals, AGs in blue states getting much more excised about this merger than the federal guys, but it's it's going
00:09:59
through and it'll be really interesting to see what kind of the the first moves are or ramifications of a of this
00:10:06
consolidated company. Well, >> they've got that debt to deal with. Because you know I I've just recently
00:10:11
interviewed a whole bunch of big media company just media people and they're all like this debt is [ __ ] ridicul.
00:10:16
They most of them are very much focused on the debt and the math of the situation. I think they'll have to make
00:10:22
enormous cuts and you know a lot of the rest speaking of distraction a lot of the rest is a distraction with the CNN
00:10:28
thing. I well you know my feelings on that anyway. Um let's go on. I mean I'm leaving um as soon as I can. Um okay.
00:10:35
>> So you're out you're out of CNN. >> Yes. Yes. Yeah. >> You've been trying to talk me into doing
00:10:39
[ __ ] at CNN for 24 months. >> That was before. You're not listening to me. Do you ever do you invest in a
00:10:44
relationship? I've been saying it publicly for >> Well, that's why that's why lesbians
00:10:48
have the highest rates of divorce because both of them are listening. >> Yes. >> It's important that in a relationship
00:10:53
that the man not listen a lot. That is key to the survival. >> That is key to the survival of our
00:10:59
relationship is a lot of [ __ ] I just runs right right over my head. >> Let me try to outline it. I don't want
00:11:04
to work for the Ellis and I don't want to work for their handpicked minions because I think they're incompetent.
00:11:09
That is what I've said over and over again. And I I like I love working with the people at Cena and I very much like
00:11:15
Mark Thompson. >> Yeah, I like him too. Smart guy >> and I hope they put him in charge cuz I
00:11:20
think he would do a great job. I just don't see any way that these people make good decisions and I don't trust them.
00:11:25
That's it. They just I just don't I don't want to I don't want to work for tech people. Um, you know, they're more
00:11:30
than they can, you know, I don't know. There's there's just I don't I'm I'm just not staying. I'm just There's lots
00:11:36
of places to go. I don't like you. I think TV's great, but it's not that great like to put up with this [ __ ]
00:11:41
Like, I don't That's one thing. Um I like, you know, I like making that series. Um I just, you know, I don't
00:11:49
except if I owned it. If they want to buy it, they can buy [ __ ] off me if they
00:11:52
feel like it. Um but other but I don't want to be I don't want them to own something. I don't think see I would
00:11:58
argue for Cara Swisser if they gave you an agreement to work at CNN and said yeah look we're just these this this is
00:12:05
the editor this is who's in charge of your stories why wouldn't you you you don't think
00:12:11
you'd be able to fashion an agreement >> I don't think they would do that I don't
00:12:14
think they would do that like they would pay me every time a person I don't like
00:12:18
talks to me I guess but no at this moment no way they're behaving right now and this by the way this whole like
00:12:24
>> pull a Leslie stall demand a day because he'll protect CNN from these evil. >> I am not I don't think I have that power
00:12:31
to do it. Anyway, I uh there's lots of other options and I I'm on under contract with them until um the end of
00:12:37
the year and I'm hoping they'll let me out early cuz I don't want to affiliate with them. That's all. I left I left
00:12:42
Murdoch, too. It's not This is not a new fresh thing for Cara Swisser to flounce
00:12:46
out and do better. No one cares, but it says something. >> I just want everyone to know I'm I'm I'm
00:12:53
absolutely a [ __ ] An expensive [ __ ] So, Ellison's, you have my number. >> Oh. Oh, I heard about that. Let's not
00:12:59
get into that issue. >> You've had You have my number. >> Yeah, they called you. I know that. I
00:13:03
was defending you on that, by the way. I appreciate that. >> I had your number. You don't We don't
00:13:07
need TV at this point, honestly. Anyway, um let's go on a >> We are TV with much better economics.
00:13:14
>> It's just It's like a headache and then I have to see them. >> Makeup's not as good and was not as
00:13:17
attractive as Stephanie Rule or Arya Milbur, but we are TV. >> Anyway, let's go on a quick break. When
00:13:23
we come back, Fox is buying Roku. Support for this show comes from Netswuite. When the competition is
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00:15:02
That's atio.com/pivot. Fox Corporation is buying Roku in a $22 billion deal that could reshape how
00:15:11
Americans watch TV. It's a big play for advertising based television. Just so you know, Fox gets access to over 100
00:15:17
million households worldwide. Lots of people use this, combining its live news, sports, and Tuby streaming service
00:15:22
with Roku's massive platform. The combined company would become the third largest player in US television by share
00:15:28
of viewing, putting real pressure on the likes of YouTube and Netflix. It's I I've always liked Roku. Roku will
00:15:34
operate under the Fox umbrella with Roku founder Anthony Wood, who's a really interesting person, joining Fox's board
00:15:39
in a subordinate role. That's interesting. Fox's shareholder own about 73% of the combined companies with Roku
00:15:46
shareholders holding the remaining 27. And the deal still needs a sign off from both shareholder groups and regulators.
00:15:52
Um, uh, it's interesting because they deliver all the networks into living rooms, you know, they're like it's
00:15:58
almost like a cable company in a weird way. Um, I use I think I'm using my Roku in Brooklyn like because I didn't want
00:16:04
to get the cable bundle or something like that. I haven't hooked it up yet, but I I've always liked Roku. I don't
00:16:10
use it that much, but I thought I thought Anthony did a nice job. And I'm just curious, you know, he can't get any
00:16:16
bigger presumably is why he's selling. >> I think it's a great move. I I I something I didn't see happening coming.
00:16:22
And the moment I looked at it, I'm like, this makes all sorts of industrial logic.
00:16:26
>> Who else could have bought Roku just before you move on from that? Who else? Well, there's the there's the obvious
00:16:32
like there's the obvious Warner Brothers, Paramount, um Disney. Um I mean th this is an they
00:16:40
have assets that are that are incredibly important. They have I mean they have a
00:16:48
ton of firstparty data. They they have firstparty data across 100 million households which is a really strategic
00:16:55
asset. It gives Fox a direct viewer relationship. The cable and broadcast never offered advertisers, right? So,
00:17:02
cuz you had the cable company in the way. Um, Fox is projects 400 million in run rate cost synergies.
00:17:08
>> They needed this. They needed this. >> It's a really savvy. I thought, oh my god, the sun is down.
00:17:15
>> Makes a lot of sense. What's interesting is they actually sold their shares at in
00:17:19
Roku at 58 bucks a share to fund their acquisition of Tuby and now they're buying back in at 160.
00:17:24
Fox owned roughly 73% of the combined company. Um, >> yeah. No, no, no. But wait, uh, yeah, I
00:17:31
just said, but they had had shares before. >> Yeah. So, my understanding is that, um,
00:17:36
Fox actually they they had Roku shares in March of 2020 >> and they sold them at 58 bucks a share
00:17:44
>> to fund their half a billion dollar TBI acquisition. >> Yeah. Which has been very helpful to
00:17:48
them. So look, this is a company that's making a big bold bet recognizing their core business is in structural decline.
00:17:56
I think it's really like I I think the folks at Fox are really smart. >> Yeah, this is a smart move. I thought
00:18:01
that that's ex I'm like, huh, but it is a big bet on advertising based versions of this, right? Because Roku is
00:18:07
advertising based and it's not subscriptionbased. So, >> but but here's the thing. If you look at
00:18:12
the trends, subscription has been eating into subscription streaming has been eating into linear advertising supported
00:18:19
TV for the last 20 years. In 2024, it's stopped gaining share. >> It's like 50/50 right now. So,
00:18:28
>> I mean, for example, I don't know if our listeners know this, they can watch Pivot or ProfG Markets on Roku. It's
00:18:36
available. We have a channel on Roku. Um uh and it it gets huge huge viewership. I mean the company Roku is
00:18:46
probably the most >> a significant revenue generator. >> Oh no, it's it's I we launched
00:18:53
two months ago but my attitude is if you you look at enterprise value just and I'll try to be transparent about where
00:18:59
we're trying to build the propy markets and where we're trying to build a pivot.
00:19:03
If you're the way you increase enterprise value and increase the multiple on your IBIDA is one by right
00:19:09
now adding subscription revenue which we're doing on Substack and two having alternative distribution and
00:19:15
differentiating your media mix or your revenue mix. So what starts small I think we'll do you
00:19:22
know 100 or 300 grand in revenue from Roku or advertising on Roku by serving all of our pods on Roku. But what you
00:19:31
want is when you if you ultimately are thinking about enterprise value, it's a multiple of your profits and your
00:19:38
growth. But what increases the multiple is how enduring that revenue is, i.e. as
00:19:43
much subscription revenue as possible and also a diversified set of revenue streams.
00:19:48
>> Right. Yeah. I see. So my attitude is while it's been an effort to reformat our content and put it on Roku, it's
00:19:55
absolutely worth it because what you want to say to a potential investor or acquirer is look at all these different
00:20:00
points of distribution and types of revenue mix that create a more, you know, a more enduring a more enduring
00:20:08
company. But just to get back to Roku, 4.7 billion in total net revenue, up 15% year-over-year.
00:20:15
uh platform revenue of 4.1 billion that's up 18% gross profit of two billion up 15%.
00:20:22
Uh last year was their first gap profitable year. The company reported net income of 80 million in Q4 alone. So
00:20:30
it's kind of hit that >> tipping point. >> Yeah. >> And again >> sustainable profit.
00:20:35
>> Over a 100 million households have Roku by at the end of 2025. and device hardware still runs at negative gross
00:20:44
margin, but they sell hardware at a loss to capture platform users. I would argue
00:20:47
that Roku is arguably the most important media company that people have never heard of.
00:20:53
>> Now, let me just point to one other person, Analie Sud, a young woman, uh, chief executive officer of Tubi. She she
00:21:00
this is a free ad supported streaming service they have, and she was the previous CEO of Vimeo, but she's
00:21:07
expanded the user base. I think it's 100 million users and it's the most watchfree TV streaming service. It's
00:21:13
very quirky and you can find all manner of stuff on there. Um, but I think the two of them are very savvy. They're both
00:21:20
incredibly smart. Like that's the thing. And I think one of the things, you know,
00:21:25
Lachlan Murdoch I just think was born into his job. But one of the things I just interviewed uh Peter Turnin for my
00:21:31
podcast today, another smart former Fox executives. One thing that Rupert's been
00:21:35
good at is executives. like they're very sharp um and uh and you should listen to
00:21:41
churnin one because I think it was a great interview but you know just really smart executives and this is the case
00:21:47
anyway very smart you can also by the way watch us on YouTube by the way we're very promiscuous the entire Scott and
00:21:55
Cara are very promiscuous um anyway uh let's move on to the other one we like this deal um SpaceX uh of course this
00:22:03
seems like a hundred years ago officially public and is uh One, Scott Galloway predicted it did indeed close
00:22:09
up on its first day of trading. And you had said it was going to be about 20% and not more, which is interesting. It
00:22:13
was 19 something%. Shares are at a high of 177 at the time of this taping after the company's public debut on Friday,
00:22:21
making the current market cap, 2.32 trillion. You thought it might be a scooch under under two. Um, his first
00:22:28
day on the market, over 500 million shares traded hands. A lot of movement here. Um Elon himself of course crossed
00:22:34
the milestone thanks to the pot becoming the world's first trillionaire. There were some notable buyers. Gina
00:22:39
Reinhardt, Australia's richest person bought over a billion dollar stake in the company and Kathy Woods Arc
00:22:44
Investment bought more than $500 million worth of stock. So go through if there's
00:22:48
anything surprising there because uh venture and also venture funding for US space technology firms excluding SpaceX
00:22:53
jumped $7.5 billion in 2025 from 2.5 billion the previous years. probably we'll see if that goes anywhere because
00:23:01
it's a that's also a money can be a money furnace u as you the word you use but any thoughts on where it is right
00:23:07
now >> I thought that the bankers and and Musk and look I I think the most significant
00:23:15
thing here is that this we've never seen such engineered manufactured scarcity there was tens of billions of dollars of
00:23:24
demand for this IPO that has never existed for an IPO for. And then you combine it with the fact that unlike
00:23:31
other IPOs that went public on the NASDAQ, it didn't have to float more than 10%, it only floated 5%.
00:23:38
>> Yeah. Very scarcity as you said. >> So you've just created manufacturer scarcity. Now to be fair, it's up again
00:23:44
today. So this has created a level of excitement in the market. I do think you you have to highlight the positives here
00:23:53
and that is I never want to be someone that demonizes success. There are 14 new billionaires in Texas that you've never
00:24:00
heard of. Those people will give money away. They will start new businesses. Something that's uniquely American is
00:24:06
that we continue to produce companies like this and entrepreneurs like Elon Musk. It's going to create a lot of
00:24:13
economic growth. You're going to see a surge in philanthropy from Berkeley to the University of Texas. It inspires a
00:24:20
lot of people. I it is there's a lot of positives here and we're seeing venture funding increasing in you know space
00:24:29
related um projects. So there there's there's a a lot to like here. You know I don't like the manufactured scarcity and
00:24:39
the what I'll call the overlying narrative of sort of like the hero's journey here
00:24:44
>> and the numbers at certain businesses are not great. >> Yeah. look this from a valuation
00:24:48
standpoint and this is this is what Musk has always been able to do is to create
00:24:54
this this uh narrative over numbers that's like no one else in history. Um so but right now the stock is trading
00:25:03
30% above the IPO price. Um, and then he has also again, and I'm I go back to governance, there's all these different
00:25:11
lockups. Like if you trade on a certain platform and you bought shares through direct share purchase on a certain
00:25:16
platform, they technically don't have a lockup, but but they if they sell their shares, they can't trade on the platform
00:25:24
before, which is like a soft lock up. >> There's certain uh criteria around when
00:25:29
you can sell if the stock is up a certain amount, etc. To be fair, Elon's locked himself up. I doubt he's planning
00:25:36
to sell. He'll just borrow against his stock. But what they've effectively done, which you're not supposed to do,
00:25:40
is they've created different class of classes of shares, which you're not supposed to do. So again, I find that
00:25:48
this is this is really inspiring and important and going to be great for economic growth on certain levels. I
00:25:56
also believe that this entire sector is going to have not a collapse but a pretty serious draw down when people
00:26:03
after two or three earnings calls are forced to justify anything resembling a future that involves the kind of
00:26:08
earnings built into this thing >> right and then the rush to space technology firm same thing they're going
00:26:13
to overinvest which is normal like I would assume presumably >> and that and quite frankly that's one of
00:26:18
the great things about America because we overinvested in the internet and the technology survived and a lot of those
00:26:22
companies came back and that investment was good but you didn't want to one of the one of the investors
00:26:27
overinvesting initially.com. Yeah. >> Yeah. So, but I said somebody called me and I said this on pivot. Someone called
00:26:34
me and said I I have allocation. Should I take it? And I said take it and trade out on the first trade.
00:26:38
>> If you buy it and trade out, you don't do as most people don't do as well except in certain cases, right? This
00:26:45
there were all these like really interesting statistics of buying and selling um that were not good in the
00:26:51
long run over over time. It's just you got to hit the exact right one or you lose mo money most of the time.
00:26:58
>> This was different because so first off uh trading out trading out you you get
00:27:04
short-term capital gains at a higher rate. So there's a lot of evidence that shows that just generally with investing
00:27:12
you're better off just buying and trying to never sell. It's just trading trading
00:27:16
is a difficult is a difficult game. I thought and I said this I said they are going to manufacture a 20% pop. The
00:27:24
bankers >> exactly >> and everyone are figuring out a way to create a supply demand imbalance that
00:27:30
will exactly peg this at a 20% pop. What's impressive and punctures that theory is that it's up another 11%
00:27:37
today. And the thing that also just the thing that deserves a nod is the best VC
00:27:42
in the world is not Andre Horowitz or whoever initially funded SpaceX. How >> do I respond? Well, it's in my opinion,
00:27:49
it's Uncle Sam. And that SpaceX investors and the banks taking SpaceX public should remember
00:27:55
>> that we would not be here today without grants from the federal government. In
00:27:59
2008, SpaceX was on the verge of bankruptcy >> and would likely have run out of money
00:28:03
if not for a grant from NASA. >> Yep. >> And the golden law, >> same thing with Tesla.
00:28:08
>> And the golden law of stupidity here, Trump is trying to cut NASA's funding by
00:28:12
more than 20% this year. >> Same with mRNA technology. Same with the government is one of the greatest
00:28:18
investors of all time if you could think about it that way. best VC in history whether it's medical research for our
00:28:23
universities or electric charging stations would what you know and they would argue back well they're going to
00:28:30
get their bite they're going to get enormous return through tax revenues >> possibly
00:28:34
>> the the big debate this will will stir is in America we've been talking about
00:28:41
for decades now what's dominated the conversation is how you create wealth the conversation that is superseding
00:28:49
that is what you should do with wealth once you have it. And so right now Elon Musk could buy all of Manhattan, every
00:28:58
building, every condo, every park with his that's how much money he has right now. And whether or not this level of
00:29:06
concentration of power which comes in a capitalist society for money presents a risk. And I'm of the mind
00:29:13
that I think it's important that eventually and I I'm in favor of of eventually having trillionaires, but we
00:29:20
should have guardrails over the power and progressive taxation, which we don't have right now.
00:29:24
>> Can I just say one thing I'm going to push back on and that you you've created
00:29:27
all these rich people are going to give to charity. If you look at the statistics, I don't think they're going
00:29:31
to be charitable. I don't think they're going to do good things. I just don't I don't think this class I don't think
00:29:35
Elon Musk has had a very good record. So, I just I I'm not expecting these people to be I think they're going to be
00:29:41
on an ongoing quest for more money and more power and more consolidation. So, I'm not impressed with their charitable
00:29:48
uh thoughts. And I'm I'm glad they're creating jobs, but they would immediately cut you if they had to.
00:29:53
That's I just don't think they have that in them. >> You're talking about Okay. But I I think
00:29:58
we need to parse that. And that is if you look at billionaires and their wives, the wives have hands
00:30:06
down been more philanthropic. And it doesn't and and the the quote unquote billionaire masters of the
00:30:12
universe have not acquitted themselves well on a lot of levels. But there's just no doubt this type of
00:30:18
wealth creation event is going to result in a surge in philanthropy. It just does. That would be great
00:30:24
>> because you're going to have a lot of people who wake up and have $20 million
00:30:30
and think, I'm going to give 2 million bucks to the local food bank or I'm going to give 50,000. I I talked to, you
00:30:36
know, I'm I'm involved with the University of California. They're all revising their
00:30:41
>> giving goals up for next year because of the IPOs coming down the and they have
00:30:45
so many alumni. I'm not talking about Elon Musk. I think it would be you could you could make a
00:30:52
credible argument that he's not the most philanthropic person. I get that and you
00:30:55
can definitely make an argument that McKenzie Scott and Melinda French Gates are more philanthropic than their
00:31:01
husbands. But when you see these types of liquidity events, local philanthropies surge in terms of in
00:31:08
terms of uh uh money. There's look there's for all of SpaceX's problems and income inequality, there isn't a nation
00:31:16
on Earth that wouldn't kill to have those problems. I I would agree. I just think it's going to go into political
00:31:21
activism in a way that could be deletarious to most of us. That's where it's going. It's not going to helping a
00:31:28
kid. >> Let's be clear. Elon Musk, in my view, can probably decide who the next president is.
00:31:34
>> Yeah, that's correct. >> He spent $250 million and had influence on the election. Maybe
00:31:42
he didn't decide it, but he had influence on it. You think what happens if he decides to put 2.5% of his net
00:31:49
worth or 25 billion or 100 times what he spent >> last time and he's a freight train
00:31:57
>> and also to be to be fair are we comfortable and I he deserves credit. One of the one of the things that
00:32:04
doesn't get he doesn't get enough credit for is he has turned off Starlink for Russia and it is it has put Russia at a
00:32:12
severe disadvantage to Ukraine and I think that is a wonderful thing and he deserves credit for it. Having said that
00:32:18
he changes his mind. >> Well that's exactly right. Having said that is should that power reside in a
00:32:24
private citizen that has no government or electoral oversight? >> No it should not.
00:32:29
>> Look it's a ton of economic growth. The banks made a [ __ ] ton of money. You have
00:32:33
a lot of people. 4,000 people became millionaires on Friday. >> I get it. I hope they're better better
00:32:39
at it. I just think I'm not even Musk is one thing, but I'm worried about others
00:32:44
that aren't quite so broad. I just like I always whenever I see a box, I think the Ulings the Eul.
00:32:51
I don't know how to pronounce it, but they're like huge givers to crazy right-wing causes. And so I just am
00:32:56
like, "Oh god, the boxes, the this, the that." Anyway, I I just hope that they um that they
00:33:02
>> the Citizens United problem. I hope that they're charitable. That's that's what I
00:33:06
hope. Anyway, let's go on a quick break. When we come back, we'll talk about the
00:33:10
Trump administration coming for Anthropic. Yet again, >> support for this show comes from Delete
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00:35:05
Scott, we're back with more news. Anthropic has had 90 minutes to take down its most powerful models. Methos
00:35:10
and Fable, which is mythos, but the public version of it. On Friday, at the request of the government, who cited a
00:35:16
national security threat, the Trump administration issued an order barring all foreign nationals from having
00:35:20
access, including Anthropic's own non US employees, including there, a lot of them at the top, essentially forcing the
00:35:26
company to take it offline. The decision was really made after a conversation with Amazon's an uh Andy Jasse, who told
00:35:32
officials, researchers, and his company got fable to provide information to be used in cyber attacks. Enthropic went uh
00:35:37
sent staff to Washington, meet with the White House official to try to fix the dispute. I am sorry. I just think
00:35:42
they're waiting for an excuse here um to get Anthropic. Um I think maybe Jasse might have said this, but the minute
00:35:49
they could, they jumped on Anthropic. And uh and of course, Anthropic's making the argument that every other model can
00:35:56
do this, too. Um and they're just cherry-picking. Um, by the way, um, uh, the company is also being sued for its
00:36:04
$200 a month AI plans with consumers alleging it oversold the usage allowances it offered. Um, so, uh, so
00:36:12
that's that. And then, by the way, a coalition of states attorney generals have opened an investigation into Open
00:36:17
AI. The company was served with a subpoena seeking, uh, documents related to its activities and impact on users,
00:36:23
including activity related to minors and seniors handling of health data and company policies. Early this month,
00:36:29
Florida became the first state to file a lawsuit against OpenAI and Sam Alman alleging uh the two uh knowing uh
00:36:36
released an unsafe product. Um that's an interesting that's a separate thing, but
00:36:41
this anthropic attack by the White House is really interesting. Uh of course they
00:36:45
were just waiting for something to come at them as usual. David Saxs just lies and wait.
00:36:51
>> I had mixed emotions here because I I think it's a good thing. I'd like to think that the government's involvement
00:36:59
in acting crisply around the threats of AI is overdue. So I applaud the government moving in crisply and saying
00:37:07
we need to shut this down until we understand it better. I I applaud that. The problem is I don't trust these
00:37:13
people. I don't know what their motivations are. I don't know if they're generally concerned about the
00:37:18
well-being. the answer is >> of society or if this is just politically motivated trying to shut
00:37:23
down one company because you have political donors at the other. >> Yeah. >> And supposedly I just got off
00:37:31
>> I just had Ian Bremer on the pod talking about Iran. He said at the G7 meeting
00:37:36
the shutdown of anthropic was a bigger topic than the memo of understanding in Iran because if you're a foreign company
00:37:43
and you've deeply integrated anthropic into your your your workflow and all of a sudden it's turned off. Uh you know it
00:37:53
it's like okay does this mean the government has a kill switch for AI that when whoever it is is angry at them just
00:38:02
turns it off. >> That's right. So this is again this all comes down to the same [ __ ] thing.
00:38:08
You don't trust these people, you know. >> And why isn't there a congressional like
00:38:12
that everybody has to live by? Why what does Andy make to have a conversation? I'd like to hear from Andy [ __ ] Jasse
00:38:18
right now. What did he say? Why does he like why did he's they're an investor in
00:38:22
Anthropic, by the way, so I'm not sure I even trust that story. >> I don't even know if I trust the Jasse
00:38:27
part of the story. I'd like him to speak out um publicly about it. But yeah, I agree. I don't trust these [ __ ] And
00:38:33
I think they're doing it to kneecap Daario cuz he's been a nuisance for them. >> Yeah. He's not their chosen. He's the
00:38:40
one that said no on self-healing or you know on on weapons or privacy violations. So he's on their [ __ ] list.
00:38:47
>> And you know I love the idea, but Daario and Anthropic would say perhaps correctly that these same jailbreaks or
00:38:54
things that the reason why they shut down are available on other models. >> Right.
00:38:58
>> So again, they're not a perfect company. I get that they've been sued for overall
00:39:02
allowances. I just think there's going to be they are in the front and they are not going along with this
00:39:07
administration. So, you're going to see all manner of nonsense attacking them and some of it, you know, it, you know,
00:39:13
I don't think they're perfect. I don't think, you know, I think he can be a little bit, you know, righteous, but at
00:39:18
least it's righteous for the right things on some level. And I just think this is, as I said, this is not about
00:39:25
national security. This is about a beef and a rumble between different Silicon Valley interests. That's it seems to be
00:39:32
>> we we need we need a panel or a regulatory body that's bipartisan with experts, economists, philosophers who
00:39:40
say, "Okay, maybe it shouldn't take 10 years to release an AI model for the public similar to the way it does for
00:39:46
drugs." But we need 30 days in an institution or an agency represented by that briefs Congress that says, "Okay,
00:39:55
before you release anything, it's got to go through this 30, 60, 90day screening
00:39:59
where we bang the [ __ ] out of it." And everyone is subject to the same regulatory approval. And that kind of
00:40:05
regulatory certainty is good for the economy. It's good for companies. They want to know what rules they're playing
00:40:11
by. They don't want to have to think, Jesus Christ, I got to go to a [ __ ] UFC fight or fear that they're going to
00:40:16
turn off my, you know, my next version of this product. But supposedly, it's created chaos abroad because a lot of
00:40:24
companies >> Sure is. Yeah. >> And even defense departments and NATO members decide to use anthropic into
00:40:31
their scenario planning or or to figure out when to turn off and on power that runs into hospitals. And all of a sudden
00:40:38
they've got to go, okay, you mean one one guy based on criteria we can't figure out has has again a kill switch
00:40:46
on an important technology. >> But to me, if you read David Sax's stupid excuses, he's such a pompous ass.
00:40:51
And I just trust none of this. They do not care about all of us. They care about this Silicon Valley beep. And you
00:40:58
can feel like the hand of others here. It just it's just you don't trust them. Like you said, I think you put your nose
00:41:04
on it. Now, what's more serious are these lawsuits, you know, in terms of how good their product is and whether
00:41:10
it's accurate or not. I just you that's to me where some of the real issues are going to come with all these companies,
00:41:17
all the social media companies, everybody else. It's impact whether it's data centers or miners or bad health
00:41:22
stuff or bad data, but unsafe products is actually where I think the action is. This is also I think this is headed one
00:41:29
way and that is it'll it'll probably result in the administration putting all sorts of restrictions on like Chinese
00:41:38
openweight models trying to come into the US and disrupt what is becoming an increasingly difficult case to justify
00:41:44
the ROI on these these token expenditures. And so this is this is this is again going to take on its own
00:41:53
sort of tariff feel and geopolit it helps a company like Mistl out of France um who is not subject to the same things
00:42:00
although supposedly that's inferior technology. I'll be very cur I wouldn't be surprised at all if all of a sudden
00:42:06
Trump decides these Chinese that American firms can't use these openweight models coming out of China.
00:42:11
But this is the next big political football I think is who and how gets to use American AI firms and what AI what
00:42:19
AI models are allowed into the US. >> Yeah. Yeah. Perhaps I do think these safety things are are building with
00:42:26
parents and everyone else. I just do I think that as you said the brand AI has gotten so many hits. It's almost like
00:42:31
this idiot who got hit in the head and said racist and misogynistic things at the UFC fight. It just is getting it is
00:42:38
getting a bad rep and it there's going to be legal implications I think cuz I think people are upset and angry and
00:42:44
it's not as Mr. Wonderful uh says about his data centers the Chinese fault. It's
00:42:49
your own. All right. Uh Scott, one more quick break. We'll be back for wins and fails.
00:42:56
Support for this show comes from Teleport. In the AI era, one of the biggest questions is how to contain agent
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All investing is subject to risk. Vanguard Marketing Corporation distributor. >> Okay, Scott, let's hear some wins and
00:45:01
fails. Would you like me to go first? >> You go first, Cara. >> This is I'm going to do a win and a fail
00:45:06
together because one of the things around this UFC thing is Meta's used opportunity to do PR for itself, which
00:45:14
fine, I don't really care. Around this giving blind veterans these glasses, right? These glasses that help them
00:45:20
navigate. I think this is a great thing. I don't care if it's a PR thing. I don't
00:45:24
care any manner of it. I do think I I I know and Amanda was actually telling me this is really helpful for people who
00:45:31
have disabilities like blindness, these glasses. I think all of them, not just metas, but everybody's not these Ray-B
00:45:38
band ones, but I suspect Apple will have a lot of utility for people who are blind. I think it's very exciting and I
00:45:43
think it's a good thing. Look, I don't mind if you use PR for doing that. I I get it and it's fine and it helps people
00:45:51
and I and I law I give it law. This was an effort pushed by Dina Powell who they
00:45:55
just hired and good effort and they should do a lot of these things. Nonpartisan would be great. They don't
00:46:00
have to just mob up with Trump all the time. They should go with everybody to do these things to help people. And
00:46:06
again, I don't care if they get a PR win off of it. That's fine by me. What I think is that them being do doing it
00:46:13
during this UFC fight took the focus off the veterans in that way. You know what
00:46:18
I mean? Because it just is like god didn't you expect that something terrible would happen here? And so I as
00:46:25
I said I really do admire Marks like of MMA. It's kind of like the one of the most human things about him. But um but
00:46:33
it just was like here's something that's for good and then you get this this idiot say something and create all
00:46:40
manner of problems for them. Um so it was it was a good attempt and then it got drowned out. Something good got
00:46:46
drowned out. And again I don't even mind if you tried Ivanka Trump out. I just I
00:46:51
don't love it but whatever for these kind of things but if it helps these veterans a good thing. I just think it
00:46:57
got in the way of what the veterans they were trying to do for veterans which I think is a real thing. Um, but they
00:47:02
should do a lot more nonpartisan things that helps the rest of us. Um, but any, you know, as they say, anything Trump
00:47:08
touches turns to [ __ ] And that's I felt that my dad's a was a veteran. I have a
00:47:14
lot of family members who are veterans. I wanted to be a veteran. As I always say, I would have been being I would
00:47:18
have been an admiral about to be fired by Trump right now if that if I had had my career choice. Um, but it was I I I
00:47:26
really felt bad that this was got sucked up into this ridiculous nonsense at the
00:47:31
White House with UFC. Thank you. >> I just the vision of you being an admiral. I don't
00:47:35
>> It would be an excellent admiral. >> Yeah. >> I would. By the way, Dana White's on the
00:47:39
board of Meta, too, just so you're aware. >> Yeah. Okay. Do you have Was that a win
00:47:44
and a fail? >> That's win and fail because I was like, "Gh, here's something good." And here it
00:47:49
got sullied and the story as usual went off onto another way. And I don't blame the media for it. I don't blame this guy
00:47:56
said something so terrible and grotesque at the White House. This is where this woman used to live. You [ __ ] Like,
00:48:02
back off. Like, and say you're sorry. Say you're [ __ ] sorry for that piece of [ __ ] Anyway, go ahead.
00:48:08
>> My win here is um uh the social media ban in the UK. >> Oh, yes. Britain just announced the
00:48:16
world's strictest teen social media law going further than Australia, the country that uh inspired all of this. Uh
00:48:23
Prime Minister Kier Starmer announced Monday that Tik Tok, Instagram, YouTube, Snapchat, Facebook, and X will be banned
00:48:29
from offering services to under 16s. As someone who has a 15-year-old in the house, I can tell you that I think the
00:48:36
most negative anxietyinducing thing in our household is our uh uh 15year-old's usage of social
00:48:51
media. And people say, "Well, that's a parenting thing." No, they they pay for the tube with their
00:48:58
phone. If you tell them not to use social media, they're isolated from their friends and become more depressed.
00:49:04
This needs to be a collective ban. And that's what the prime minister here did. There is no reason, no justification for
00:49:13
anyone under the age of 16 being on any social media platform. Some people will say, "What about YouTube?" Fine. Put out
00:49:19
a kids, put out a kids version of YouTube. I'm down with that. But this goes into effect in spring of 2027.
00:49:27
um overnight it curfews and infinite scroll limits under consideration uh or excuse me overnight curfews and
00:49:36
infinite scroll limits are under consideration. Liability falls on platforms not on children or parents. Uh
00:49:43
it's consistent with Australia's approach which finds companies up to 50 million for non-compliance. It needs to
00:49:50
be a percentage of revenues I would argue. And then uh Britain's existing online safety act has already cut visits
00:49:57
to porn sites by a third and raised the share of children encountering age checks online from 30% to 47%.
00:50:05
Spain Spain, Greece, Si Slovenia, and France are already pursuing similar bounds. And Australia's 2020 December
00:50:13
2025 laws officially triggered a global cascade. And in a study of 18 to 24 year
00:50:17
olds found out that not using social media for one week significantly reduced symptoms of anxiety by 16%, depression
00:50:27
by 25% and insomnia by 15%. This isn't just a win for uh teen mental health. This is
00:50:36
this is a win for democracy. The more time you spend on social media, the less you believe in democracy. You know, can
00:50:43
I one thing you point if they had gone and tried to make a safe product like that's you know what they're going to
00:50:48
do? They're going to say it's not going to work in Australia. It's not going to work. That's their argument. It's never
00:50:52
about the thing. It's never about that. This is delotterious. And by the way, speaking of which, that movie is coming
00:50:58
out, The Social Reckoning, which is the part two of the social network. Jeremy um what's his name? Guy Strong from
00:51:06
Succession is playing Mark Zuckerberg. As I noted last week, why do they never talk about the thing? They just say how
00:51:13
it doesn't work and how it does this and this and that, but they never want to talk about the thing, which is, are you
00:51:19
hurting people with your unsafe products? But go ahead. >> Yeah, but again, I I I don't think we
00:51:24
should fall into the trap of believing that the owners of McDonald's or Ford are going to figure out are going to
00:51:32
focus on anything other than what car do Americans want to drive? What's the design?
00:51:37
>> Fair. and we don't give a [ __ ] that it gives you diabetes. We just want basically a food orgasm in your mouth.
00:51:43
It's up to us as voters, and we have done this to implement to appoint really smart people who decide to devote their
00:51:51
lives to government and regulatory concerns to protect the well-being of the of of the Commonwealth. If we're
00:51:59
waiting on these companies to start thinking about the safety and harms of their product, good [ __ ] luck. True,
00:52:06
but look at the cost we've paid for obesity and fat like this. Like why do we keep doing this to ourselves? That's
00:52:12
the thing. >> I I I agree. But when you say we doing it to ourselves, the voters, I guess
00:52:17
>> the capitalist system is companies are rapacious, engage in full body contact,
00:52:23
violence, not worried about other people, worried about >> getting a product that commands margin.
00:52:29
And quite frankly, that works as long as you have regulatory bodies ensuring that
00:52:35
opiates don't gut, you know, small towns in Appalachia. We can ask the question,
00:52:41
we can all hope for a guy who's in charge of AI with hush tones who just adopted a baby boy and he's concerned
00:52:49
about AI and this really attractive woman who says we need to do better and we we are open to regulation. They're
00:52:56
all [ __ ] [ __ ] And we have built a wh house and the wh house works. But you have to have a cop.
00:53:05
>> Can I quote you on that? We have built a wh house and the wh house works. Go ahead.
00:53:09
>> The wh house works. >> That's your next book. The wh house works. But go ahead.
00:53:13
>> Well, it's funny. I was just in a wedding in Amsterdam and the rosewood there used to be an orphanage and then a
00:53:18
and then a wh house and I thought, well, that's a pipeline. Um, >> oh my god, I can't believe you just said
00:53:24
>> I think I know that hotel. My point is I I get mad at us. They're doing their job
00:53:29
>> and we keep we keep trying to shame them into thinking about the safety of their
00:53:34
product. >> You're right. >> You don't think you think McDonald's is just going to decide we need to have
00:53:39
salads? It's just the right thing to do. >> Didn't work. >> Yeah. Well, I mean, anyways, we need we
00:53:46
need economic incentives and regulations that punish these people and create disincentives. But my win,
00:53:52
>> Prime Minister Kier Starmer, >> I like it. >> My fail. I just spent the most wonderful
00:53:56
week in um uh Northern Europe. I was in um Stockholm and then I was in Amsterdam.
00:54:04
And Sweden is growing. It's kind of the non-European eur European country. It's growing 2 and a half%. It is actually
00:54:12
produced despite having the population of North Carolina, it's produced companies including King, CLA, Spotify,
00:54:19
Ericson. Um it they they produce a ton of unicorns. >> Very clever. >> And they have the industrial might or
00:54:29
productivity of Germany with the some of the innovation of Silicon Valley and and
00:54:35
the social policies of Bernie Sanders. >> Yeah. >> And then you go to Amsterdam where they
00:54:40
have become kind of the ground zero for data centers in Europe. They have ASML. If Nvidia is the picks and shovels, ASML
00:54:49
makes the picks and shovels. Productivity is up 2 and a half%. The economy is strong there. These are some
00:54:54
of the wealthiest countries in the nation. And they settle an argument, and this is my fail. America has tried to
00:55:02
convince its population that you can't have billionaires and universal healthcare. [ __ ]
00:55:08
>> Yes. Thank you. These companies prove you can have really wealthy people >> and you can have universal prek and you
00:55:17
can have child services. And I spent some time with the the founder and then the people running Spotify this weekend
00:55:23
and they all they were all in the valley. They all moved back to Sweden where they are paying much higher taxes
00:55:29
and they're fine to do it because they trust that the government is going to spend their money well. They trust that
00:55:34
being able to ride a bike to work and have a kid with special needs is going to be taken care of. And they have an I
00:55:42
did not see a single homeless person, by the way, in Stockholm. Granted, that's probably not indicative of all of
00:55:48
Sweden. And granted, do they have problems with immigration and and uh housing prices that bring, you know,
00:55:54
that follow prosperity? 100%. But we need to stop in America believing that there's a myth that inequality
00:56:03
that inequality and billionaires and unicorns demand a rapacious lack of a safety.
00:56:10
>> Yeah, I said the same thing about Korea when I was there. They're healthier. Oh
00:56:13
my god, it's so universal healthcare for one, but the other stuff I agree with you. Great one.
00:56:18
>> Anyways, I love I had such a nice time. I was so blown away. I'm glad >> by Sweden and um my my I was actually at
00:56:27
my best friend's son's wedding, Jack Markman. This incredibly impressive young man that reminds me of my he's
00:56:33
like the mini me of my friend. And I had time I spent I did myself a favor. I spent I went early and I left late and I
00:56:40
spent time in both of those places. They are such incredibly >> they are fun >> lovely places and
00:56:46
>> I'm glad you went. >> Anyways, they trust that their governments are going to spend their
00:56:50
money correctly. They trust each other. They trust uh there's also really strong
00:56:55
governance such that they attract foreign investment because they know they're not going to get [ __ ] by a
00:57:00
corrupt government or a corrupt policy. >> Just convicted in Norway the princes I
00:57:04
think steps up. I saw that. I mean they just look when you do bad things you get
00:57:09
no matter where you are you get not all the time. >> Okay. Prince Andrew >> I know I agree with you on that one. I
00:57:15
don't even >> I mean >> I agree but heading that direction is heading >> but he was removed and they kicked him
00:57:20
out of >> they they defrocked him or whatever the [ __ ] they did he's being investigated
00:57:25
finally but you're right 100% fair point. >> He'll pay a bigger price than any of
00:57:29
those billionaires on that island. >> That's true. That is true. >> Anyways, my fail is this false
00:57:34
dichotomy. We've talked Americans into believing that you can't have billionaires and really robust
00:57:39
capitalism and growth and not have universal health care and childare. You absolutely can. And the Netherlands and
00:57:46
Sweden produce that or prove that in spades. >> Yep. And in America, you don't have to
00:57:50
insult a very impressive black woman in order to feel like more like a man. You in fact act like an
00:57:56
>> idiot. What a [ __ ] idiot. >> And by the way, Michelle Obama does demonstrate more masculinity, service,
00:58:01
strength >> than that dude. You know, anyway, I I can't even I saw that and I thought,
00:58:08
Jesus Christ, thank you. What? What the? Like what? What? Does that guy have daughters?
00:58:16
>> I don't like Okay. >> Any of them. >> Are you going to wait for some [ __ ] idiot to start saying stupid [ __ ] about
00:58:21
your daughter? >> Yeah. I just Anyways, >> we don't like them. >> Swisser over. >> Thank you. By the way, I like MMA, but
00:58:30
[ __ ] that guy. Anyway, and by the way, Dina White, say something stronger. Like
00:58:34
even stronger. Like kick that [ __ ] out. Okay, we want to hear from you. Send us your questions about business,
00:58:40
tech, or whatever's on your mind. Go to nymag.com/pivot. Send a question for the show or call
00:58:45
85551 pivot. Elsewhere in the Karen Scott universe. This week on On, I spoke to Peter Chernan, one of the producers
00:58:52
of the hit film Back Rooms. He talked this legendary uh media executive, entertainment media executive. He talked
00:58:59
about how studios are rushing to sign YouTubers and why that's a mistake. Let's listen to a clip. Every single
00:59:05
meeting in Hollywood over the last 10 days has been find me my YouTuber. That's not the smartest thing on earth.
00:59:12
You know, it's no different than saying find me a sequel to something else. You know, it's worth noting we spent three
00:59:18
years on this project. You know, we spent period of time chasing it. We spent a long time working on the script.
00:59:24
We spent another year on production. Um, and you know, it's not just saying bet on a YouTuber. It's not just saying bet
00:59:31
on some. It's betting on a very specific piece of content and betting on a very specific piece of talent.
00:59:37
>> He is a class act and so smart. Anyway, that's the show. Thanks for listening to
00:59:42
Pivot and be sure to like and subscribe to our YouTube channel. We'll be back on
00:59:46
Friday.