00:00:00
He's blaming everybody. And it's the same thing. Oh, it's vandals. It's this, it's that. It's him. He's just a
00:00:05
disaster. Hi everyone, this is Pippet from New York Magazine and the Fox Media Podcast
00:00:15
Network. I'm Carara Swisser live from the south of France. >> How are you? That's our entire French.
00:00:26
>> That's it. We're done. >> That's it. But we got a lot to get to today. There's so much going on,
00:00:31
including Green Watergate. Get it? Green Watergate. I told you this thing would blow up. President Trump says it will
00:00:37
be, he said, will begin fixing the seriously vandalized reflecting pool. Vandalized by him. Trump is claiming
00:00:42
without evidence. He's lying that vandals cut the 250 ft gash in the pool's new lining and poured corrosive
00:00:48
and destructive chemicals into the water. This is nonsense. There's cameras everywhere in Washington, just so you
00:00:53
know. He said multiple people have been arrested tied to the alleged destruction. This is just nonsense. One
00:00:58
of them was a former Olympian who was accused by the park police of destroying government product. He says, "You reach
00:01:03
down to touch a strip of peeling paint." I was down there, Scott, it was peeling
00:01:07
it. Nobody was touching it. Everyone was sort of shocked and amazed by how grotesque it was cuz you know, you go
00:01:14
down there. I've gone down there quite a bit and I've never really noticed the the skyiness of it. And it really is.
00:01:20
It's green. All this paint's peeling off. So, he's lying. And Trump, of course, should be accused of vandalizing
00:01:27
a lot of Washington, whether it was the East Wing or the the grass in front of the White House for his his uh his
00:01:34
party. You know, it's just ridiculous. But it's taking on a life of its own. It really is in terms of a of a
00:01:39
metaphorical thing. Or maybe you don't think that. >> No, I mean, the president is caught
00:01:43
between two straits of water. It's just >> And [laughter] >> we'll get to that in a minute.
00:01:49
>> I personally I think this is kind of a non story. America's turning 250 and we've managed to turn a reflecting pull
00:01:55
into a culture war. I just for God's sakes, just fix it and let's move on. I I don't I I kind of I you know they
00:02:03
they're lying and saying that it's sabotage and vandalism. It isn't. It's incompetence. It's a government project
00:02:08
turning into another government project. And the Democrats love to talk about I I
00:02:13
think we have bigger fish to fry. I I >> I would agree, but I don't think it's a
00:02:17
bad I think people get it in a second because it's again, as I told you, it's a symbol and it's also the the guy who
00:02:22
did it is another piece of griff >> 100%. Zero bid contract. Yeah. >> And it looks incompetent. It looks
00:02:28
incompetent. And you know, one of the jokes online was that, you know, Washington is now scar after as after he
00:02:34
took over uh took over on the Lion King. Um but uh but but there is more to that
00:02:40
because then you link it I think with Iran too which continues to be like a problem like here's you know they keep
00:02:47
going back and forth and that is the real problem. It is but it's symbolic of just complete idiocy like like really
00:02:54
stupid. We'll get to some other stupid things coming up, but um it talk a little bit about I know I noticed you
00:03:00
were talking about a lot online um the MOU, which seems the Iranians seem to have us by the shorthairs. That's what
00:03:08
it feels like to me. I don't know about you, but they they're not doing anything. They're just dragging us on, I
00:03:14
guess, and being rude to JD Mance, which I completely think they should be. Trump
00:03:20
has delivered on his promise of unconditional surrender. The problem is we're the ones unconditionally
00:03:28
surrendering, >> right? >> It is insane. Anyone who can do math, anyone who understands a memo of
00:03:34
understanding, anyone who can look at their activities in in my mind, it is just so incredibly clear and tragic what
00:03:41
is going on. The IRGC recognizes he's left. The midterms are coming up. It is a very unpopular war. He got no support
00:03:51
from the public, from Congress, from other nations. He underestimated the resilience of of of the missile systems.
00:03:59
>> He has handed them something more powerful than a nuclear weapon, and that is an ability to choke the corateed
00:04:04
artery of the global economy in the straight of Hormuz. They know we are out, >> right?
00:04:10
>> And they do. >> They all they have to do is delay an obuscation. >> It's just delay. every day that goes
00:04:15
back, it's less likely we're going to go back in with military action. >> No, he can't. He really can't.
00:04:21
>> They have to operate between uh humor them, agree to meet in Switzerland, don't get a deal done, they
00:04:29
have the perfect false flag, oh uh Israel's bombed Lebanon, you're not lead, you're not living up to your part
00:04:37
of the agreement. We're out. >> Right? >> They have no intention of giving anything back. And the only thing that's
00:04:44
going to come out of this besides Trump's Trump Trump's incompetence and JD Vance uh you know having about as
00:04:51
long a presidential run as Senator Gillibrand is that we are going to look back on this and recognize that one of
00:04:56
the greatest acts of diplomacy was the JCPOA >> right which was and Obama's saying so
00:05:02
he's doing a lot of press right now around it by the way the comparative >> we had Russia and China sign or they
00:05:08
were co-igners of the agreement we can't get Israel to sign this agreement much less European nations
00:05:14
We had limits at 3.7 enrichment. They're already at 60. There's no >> there's no constraints around nuclear
00:05:22
enrichment in the agreement. We He keeps saying all these [ __ ] threats or will we'll open the straight of
00:05:28
hormones. >> We'll get you. We'll get you. I know >> the straight of Hormuz would take to
00:05:33
keep it open would take two carrier strike forces, paratroopers and marines on the ground on Iranian soil. That is
00:05:39
not going to happen. The the net net here is the following. America comes out of this much weaker, Iran much stronger,
00:05:46
and we're going to look back and and realize that the JCPOA was one of the more impressive acts of diplomacy of the
00:05:53
last 50 years. >> Yep. Except they continue to deny it. It's really like it's the same thing
00:05:57
with the reflecting pool. And the reason why I'm harping on it, it's the same thing. It's the same kind of like, no,
00:06:03
this is what's happening. you know, you've seen all these communications from the White House, and we look, it
00:06:08
looks so ridiculous when it's the reflecting pool, but it's the same exact communications.
00:06:13
Um, you know, they're blaming the New York Times, they're blaming, you know, for the coverage, they're he's blaming
00:06:18
Obama, he's blaming everybody. And it's the same thing. Oh, it's vandals. It's this, it's that. It's him. He's just a
00:06:25
disaster. And again, I point to finally someone is starting to write about it. his mental state which seems demented
00:06:32
and we'll get into that a little bit more. Um, but the way he's sort of lashing out in this crazy way when it's
00:06:39
all his fault seems and of course blaming poor JD Vance. I mean, I never feel that sorry for that guy, but I got
00:06:45
to say he's been dragged. He's been he's been penced. I don't know what else to say. He's sort of stuck holding the bag
00:06:52
here and try having to defend it. And it's worse than when Kla Harris even lightly said, "I wouldn't change a thing
00:06:57
on the view." Right. sort of the same exact thing. So, I mean, it's disastrous for the Republicans in so many ways
00:07:04
because he doesn't have an out. So, my worry because I think he's he lashes out like arresting back Janine Piro
00:07:11
arresting people for this thing. This is like, let me tell you, Jean, I was down
00:07:15
there. I didn't touch the strip of paint, but it was stripping off by all by itself. Um, is going to be a
00:07:21
disaster. These people are soiling themselves in the most ridiculous of ways. And and in Iran, it's stay and
00:07:26
with the reflecting pool, it's just stupid. although costly to the fed to to us as taxpayers and the same thing with
00:07:32
the rest of the mess he's making. But um in this case it's disastrous. I mean really truly dis I don't know what how
00:07:39
anyone's going to get us out of this cuz we got two more years of this lunatic as
00:07:44
a >> I don't even know what would what could happen. He gets sidelined. What? I don't
00:07:50
know. Like he's not going anywhere even if he loses power. if Democrats take Congress have the power of of subpoena
00:07:56
and hopefully if they were to get back Senate at a minimum >> there'd be enough power to get in the
00:08:01
way of a lot of this stuff >> except that Iran will then develop a nuclear weapon. I feel like they now,
00:08:07
you know what I mean? Like that's where the worry I that's the only thing >> we all agree on. Iran cannot have a
00:08:13
nuclear weapon. But wow, we've given him a chance here. He's this is and then the
00:08:18
economy itself. Anyway, let's go on a quick break. We come back, resignations, feuds, and more. And we'll get into all
00:08:23
the European political drama. Support for this show [music] comes from Coher. As AI advances, one thing matters
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Support for the show comes from HIMS. Anyone who's ever tried to lose weight can tell you how hard it is. Because
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clinical study information, restrictions, visit hymns.com. Scott, we're back with big news here in
00:10:46
Europe. There's a lot going on. Uh Kier Starmer just announced he's stepping down as Britain's prime minister, giving
00:10:51
into mounting pressure from his own party. Uh Starmer said he'll stay in office until a new party leader is
00:10:56
selected and likely to be this guy named Andy Burnham, former mayor of Greater Manchester, very popular guy. Trump got
00:11:02
ahead of the announcement over the weekend, noting Star would step down and saying he had failed badly on
00:11:06
immigration energy policy. Also a lot of attacks from Elon Musk, by the way. Uh Starmer's resignation comes almost 10
00:11:13
years to the day since the Brexit vote. The UK has had six prime ministers in that time.
00:11:18
>> I love that. >> It's crazy. Um, talk a little bit about you live there. What has happened here?
00:11:24
Obviously, he was going to lose an election and he had won in a landslide in a very short time ago.
00:11:29
>> I think a lot of it comes down to economics and that is I mean, it's very strange.
00:11:35
Beitha, Mkos, and St. Barts and Hawaii are parts of those nations, but they're not. They're islands that have an
00:11:42
entirely different culture. I feel that way about London. I think Ireland's I think London's essentially an island in
00:11:47
the UK because if you look at the UK, seven out of 10 IPOs in the last 10 years are below the offering price. GDP
00:11:53
was supposed to take a 4 to 6% hit from Brexit, the second greatest own goal in geopolitical history behind our entry
00:11:58
into Iraq. You have now the UK as a whole has a lower average household income than Mississippi. And then
00:12:06
there's London, which is essentially where the richest people in the world park capital and have a European
00:12:12
lifestyle with actually without actually engaging in the UK economy. I mean, it's
00:12:16
just it's a very strange place since I have moved there after we have a new UK a new prime minister in several weeks.
00:12:24
I've been there four years. This will be my fifth prime minister. >> Fifth, right? You had conservatives.
00:12:29
There was a bunch of There was a conservative guy. There was Boris. >> It's It's not politics. It's speed
00:12:35
dating. It's beginning to feel like a LinkedIn jobs page. It's just so, you know, but without growth, until they
00:12:42
figure out a way, I thought they should do back itit. They should reintegrate into the European economy because
00:12:49
without growth, all of this gets harder and harder. And the weird the quagmire here or the not the quagmire, the enigma
00:12:55
is that the UK has all the underpinnings of a great democracy and economic growth
00:13:00
engine. It has incredible universities, rule of law, culture compounds. Everybody in the world
00:13:08
wants to or wouldn't mind the idea of living in the UK for a few years. It's a wonderful place. And yet they la Open
00:13:17
AAI, Anthropic, and SpaceX are going to raise 150 billion in fresh capital. The UK raised a total of 2 billion last year
00:13:22
in its entire IPO market. They just can't get out of their own way. and Brexit. And just to go to politics,
00:13:29
since World War II, no individual has done more harm to Britain in my view than Nigel Farage, who might be a prime
00:13:36
minister at some point. So I have stayed woefully ignorant to UK politics, but it
00:13:42
is difficult for me to understand how the foundation of success, how they continue to snatch defeat from the jaws
00:13:50
of victory here. And I got to think it's something, it's a got to be a big bold move. Even even the non-dom thing we
00:13:57
kicked out basically they chased a lot of billionaires out of the UK and I understand the sentiment. It's let's
00:14:03
tickle the middle class sensors of people who are angry but at the same time the treasury's gone down because a
00:14:08
lot of wealthy people are leaving and that reduces your tax base to you know provide for the NHS and these social
00:14:15
services. But this is I mean UK politics and then what do you have? You have the
00:14:21
rise of populism. They have had real problems. You know, to a certain extent, it's a metaphor for the West. You have
00:14:29
or when the West goes wrong, stagnant wages, housing shortages, immigration anxiety, and institutional distrust.
00:14:36
>> You also have a lot of meddling by Elon Musk in terms of of backing a bunch of
00:14:41
very violent people against immigrants. >> American export is political divisiveness,
00:14:45
>> right? Yeah. >> It's not Elon himself that's meddling quite a bit. >> Yeah. But then JD Vance comes over and
00:14:50
lectures them about free speech. It's like we shouldn't, you know, in my view, Americans should be here saying, "You're
00:14:56
our greatest ally. How can we help? What can we do together? How do we open more
00:15:00
free trade agreements?" Instead, >> instead Musk shows up and says, "Rise up, white people." Or or I mean,
00:15:07
essentially JD Vance comes over and waves his finger at him around free speech. And now they've got to figure
00:15:12
out a way to to to basically untangle the technology. They're new Britain's nuclear arsenal
00:15:20
runs on American technology and all of a sudden Europe is waking up and going what the [ __ ] we have become
00:15:26
conservatives the conservatives aren't popular either far kind of is it's like nobody's popular it's a really angry
00:15:33
nation but when you don't have growth people's prosperity goes down and they just get angrier and angrier so I I
00:15:39
again not to talk too much about money but they have got to figure out a way to get growth going Again,
00:15:48
>> when your growth grows, you have more money, you have more flexibility, you have more power abroad, you have more
00:15:54
you can't have a powerful nation that's shrinking its GDP. And again, I was in can when Brexit happened and the pound
00:16:00
crashed. It's cost them 8% of their GDP, which is like taking hundreds of billions of pounds into the street and
00:16:07
just lighting it on fire. >> Yeah, they may return to the I mean, it's interesting because Europe is
00:16:11
getting more and more unified. Speaking of which, Trump's latest feud is with one of his pals, basically his European
00:16:17
Marjgery Taylor Green, Italian Prime Minister Georgia Maloney. The spat started after Trump, this is so strange.
00:16:23
Again, I'm sorry, this guy's lost his mind. After Trump claimed Melani Maloney begged him for a Melania, oh man, begged
00:16:31
him for a photo last week's G7 summit in France. Maloney responded with a video on Instagram which was quite remarkable,
00:16:38
calling Trump's claims totally fabricated and saying, "Italia and I never beg." She also accused Trump of
00:16:43
being more accommodating to the enemies of the West than his own allies. Trump then doubled down, saying, "Maloney is
00:16:49
doing poorly in Italy with her level of popularity," which she fired back, "My popularity is none of your concern. I
00:16:54
suggest you focus on yours," pointing to his bad is lowering increasingly lowering popularity. Um, boy, this
00:17:01
woman, even though, let me just, let's be clear, she's anti-gay marriage. She's anti-trans. She's anti-immigrant. She's
00:17:07
not She's Marjorie Taylor Green essentially. This is the European version of her. And at the same time, I
00:17:13
I was like, "Go Georgia." Like, it was kind of interesting that he continues. Again, the sign of someone who is having
00:17:21
some cognitive problems. It seemed like to me, not this is you usually like this. He's always been an [ __ ] but
00:17:27
not this much of an [ __ ] Like, and and she just took it to him, which I found really. I mean, obviously it helps
00:17:35
her in Italy because he's not popular there. He's not popular anywhere in Europe now. And they were tight as ticks
00:17:40
if you recall, you know, >> but this is again, greatness is in the agency of others.
00:17:47
And European countries have been our strongest allies. We share same values, same democracies. We've worked together.
00:17:53
We've had incredible the postw World War II world was largely shaped by America and European values.
00:18:02
And Trump decides again he's figured out a way to manage to feud with and alienate feud with and alienate allies
00:18:10
while simultaneously praising adversaries. And we've spent 80 years developing these alliances. And Trump treats them
00:18:18
like some sort of fantasy football league. And Maloney to her credit she remains her popularity is actually
00:18:25
greater than most Western leaders and picking and then he decides to pick a fight with one of the few European
00:18:31
leaders who actually likes him and is this none of this >> she went at him on the pope too. She
00:18:38
doesn't much like his comments on the pope either. >> Yeah. Well, I mean come on criticizing
00:18:44
the pope is like if someone in Italy you just don't do >> you don't do that. None of this makes
00:18:49
any sense. Cara doesn't make any sense. None of it. I believe her. Believe the woman. [laughter] I totally believe her.
00:18:56
I believe her. >> She's such a creep. But this is interesting cuz she's a really cuz she's
00:19:00
really, if you actually look at a lot of her policies, they're pretty heinous in
00:19:03
terms of how she behaves. But she's sort of shifted. I mean, she used Trump to sort of get there and now she's cutting
00:19:11
him loose like like more than others. Actually, the others haven't been quite as critical of him. Uh Starmer certainly
00:19:19
hasn't. Right. Or any of them have. I don't know that the Germans have it. This she's really taken it to the wall.
00:19:25
>> Yeah. I think I think I think most of them have decided wait them out. It's a
00:19:28
smart move for me because she comes across as a leader and not afraid. And you know I
00:19:34
>> It's not good for her. We look terrible. Once again, by the way, it's really interesting to be in Europe because a
00:19:39
lot of people are saying, "You don't like Trump, do you?" To me, I'm like, "No."
00:19:44
>> Really? >> No. Yeah. A lot of the Europeans sort of test it when we were in Paris several
00:19:49
different times. Um like you're not a fan of Trump. I'm like hardly like hello lesbian family like no. Um and so they
00:19:58
asked several Europeans there's a tour guide at Eiffel Tower or whatever were sort of like poking to see um if we
00:20:05
liked him which obviously we look like an ad for not liking Trump. And anyway um let's go on a quick break. When we
00:20:12
come back, new details about how Mark Zuckerberg and Jeff Bezos tried to cozy up to Trump. This is an interesting
00:20:17
story. >> Support for Pivot [music] comes from the Freedom from Religion Foundation. Quick
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goleport.com/pivot. [music] Scott, we're back. President Trump took frequent jabs at Mark Zuckerberg and
00:23:12
Jeff Bezos as he tried to build ties with his administration. And that's according to a new book by New York
00:23:17
Times reporters Maggie Haberman and Jonathan Swan, who I'm going to have on the on podcast soon. The president told
00:23:23
guests stories about Zuckerberg and Bezos kissing his ass, which they were, saying, "You would not believe the texts
00:23:28
I got from these tech guys. I got to show you. Among them, Zuckerberg sent Trump a photo of a letter written by one
00:23:34
of his young children, which said they were looking forward to a golden age of America." Trump a rally slogan. Bezos
00:23:40
meanwhile reportedly told Trump that the Washington Post was one of his worst investments and that people there are
00:23:45
really terrible. Oh my god. I mean honestly and then of course they he was showing it to Elon too. They all made
00:23:52
fun of them and you know anyway it was kind of I mean by the way on the other side they insult him behind his back
00:23:59
too. But what what is the what has happened here from your perspective when you were reading sort of this stuff? I'm
00:24:06
not surprised by one bit of it whatsoever. Um, but I don't know if they'll get their reputations back. We
00:24:11
always thought Trump was a jerk, but this is really kind of >> Yeah. But it represents a flip that is
00:24:16
that is sort of represents something in my view kind of dark and that is politicians used to kiss the ass of
00:24:22
billionaires because billionaires had money and politicians wanted to get elected and it became kind of a
00:24:28
payfor-play thing because of Citizens United. But when you think about this, Bezos and Zuckerberg are worth hundreds
00:24:34
of billions of dollars, and yet they both still feel compelled to kiss the ass of an 80-year-old real estate
00:24:40
developer, >> right? Yeah. >> Capital always chases power, but Silicon Valley spent 20 years telling us
00:24:46
government didn't matter. And then everyone started flying to Washington. And what this signals around the dark part
00:24:54
is the following. If you're worth a quarter of a trillion dollars and still kissing the ass of the president, you're
00:25:02
not. This has moved from buying influence to renting protection. This is a transition for pay-forplay
00:25:09
democracy to something even worse. And that is a mob protection racket. >> Yeah. where if I want if I want to hold
00:25:16
on to my wealth, >> I got to start paying for protection because anybody that doesn't sign up
00:25:22
gets in his crosshairs and potentially you all of these guys Jamie Diamond is the only one I can tell of all these
00:25:30
like this power crew that hasn't kissed his ass and is actually willing to occasionally say the obvious and now the
00:25:37
government is suing JP Morgan. So it doesn't matter how powerful you are, you got to pay the mob. And this is what do
00:25:45
you have? You want a democracy where money can't buy influence or can't buy too much. Then you move to a democracy,
00:25:52
a quote unquote democracy or a kleptocracy where money buys everything. And now we're in, in my opinion, a
00:25:58
protection racket where Bezos and Zuckerberg got to like got to kiss the ring here. It's feeling very Russian.
00:26:04
>> They got to do they got to I feel like they're more powerful. Well, I don't even understand it. Like, I I don't I
00:26:11
don't know. I mean, they could wait him out. Like, they've got so much money. They could do so much damage to him.
00:26:17
>> I do think if the Democrats take Congress and we get about 18 or 24 months out, I think you're all of a
00:26:24
sudden going to see, as I say, these guys are going to grow testicles again. I think you're gonna see a switch
00:26:30
because I know they all tell you they can't stand him, >> but the smart play, I hate to say it,
00:26:36
the smart play is just to kiss his ass, >> I guess. But it's so g You don't have to
00:26:39
do it in a grot with your kids. Oh my god. Like my child wrote this to you. Do you know how much of a loser you look
00:26:46
like that you're pimping out your kids? And then Bezos, just sell the [ __ ] Washington Post if it's one of your
00:26:51
worst investments and people are >> I don't get that. We talked we've talked about I still don't understand why he
00:26:57
still that >> you know it's not just me who was interested there was a dozen people
00:27:00
wouldn't engage with any of them I've talked to every one of them wouldn't engage not once what what does he what
00:27:06
is he like like I don't know what's happening if he doesn't like it if it's the worst investments and people are
00:27:11
terrible and by the way Jeff they hate you um why not just get rid of it it's so weird
00:27:17
>> yeah I don't get that one I don't understand >> it doesn't give him power by the way
00:27:20
it's doing it did an amazing story on Tulsi Gabbard this week like It's done several amazing stories um around the
00:27:27
corruption and everything else. I mean, the news parts, the the editorial section is such weak sauce now, it's
00:27:33
really hard to read. Um but I agree. I don't understand it. I think I don't know when when they're sucking up to the
00:27:39
normal president. Do are we going to forgive them or do we care? No, they've sort of soiled themselves pretty
00:27:46
significantly. >> It feels very Russian in the sense that doesn't matter how rich you are,
00:27:51
>> you got to send Putin. You got to send him put in his vig and no matter where
00:27:55
you are, you might if you really piss him off, he's gonna put >> a neurotoxin on a doorork knob.
00:28:01
>> Yeah, but this guy wasn't going to do that. That's the thing. It's not like in
00:28:04
there I kind of see it cuz like that's kind of going out a window kind of thing. This is just something else.
00:28:10
>> Yeah. But I think I think these guys in a capitalist society begin to equate success and ego and influence just with
00:28:17
a number and that is your net worth. And I think they're very smart and they connect all the dots and see the matrix
00:28:24
around how to increase their net worth. And they've they've connected the dots here and say just kiss his ass. It's
00:28:30
just it's it's a really high ROI activity. >> They're so gross. They're just gross
00:28:35
that pimping out kids is just gross. Sorry. It's just gross. It's gross. Um in other Amazon news speak, this is
00:28:41
interesting. Amazon's movie studio is dumping an upcoming film about Sam Alman saying the project would be better
00:28:45
served than another studio. The decision comes as Amazon plans to invest $50 billion in OpenAI this year. The move
00:28:51
reportedly stunned the filmmakers. Very good filmmakers by the way. Andrew Garfield was in it. Um I am in the
00:28:57
script. I don't come off very well. I look like I'm too nice to Sam, but I don't care. Um since Amazon had already
00:29:02
spent about $40 million on the movie, tested it for markets that was working towards a release date. Um they I don't
00:29:08
know and they can't this is not getting picked up. Netflix passed apparently. A couple of different places passed. Um,
00:29:15
and it's, you know, it's it's a highlevel film. I I I read the script. Um, and I didn't like it. I thought it
00:29:22
was fictional in a lot of ways. They sort of painted Jeffrey as a party guy, which I'm not in my experience. And they
00:29:28
made that one guy who reh rebelled against Sam into a hero, and I don't think he was either. I thought it was
00:29:35
kind of broad and didn't I thought it was not a good script. Um, but there's of course the other ones coming out
00:29:40
about Mark Zuckerberg, the the sequel, The Social Reckoning, which we previously talked about, um, about
00:29:46
Francis Hogan and and that that whole situation that's coming out. That's that that is coming out. Um, with the guy
00:29:54
from the Bear, but uh, would you feel I don't know. I I don't know. I'm not surprised they got rid of it if they
00:29:59
just invested in Open AI, but it seems kind of dumb spending all that money. It's not much. 40 million. Who cares?
00:30:06
I'm not a conspiracy theorist, but we were well into the development or even production writer room of
00:30:16
our series on Netflix about big tech. That got the plug pulled. >> Oh, >> this has gotten the plug pulled.
00:30:21
>> Yeah. >> I think they've just decided that >> they don't want to be villains.
00:30:26
>> Yeah. And they don't It's not worth the risk. You piss off either powerful people or you piss off the president.
00:30:32
all these M&A all these regulatory concerns and quite frankly the American public seems to have soured on AI or it
00:30:38
could just be the following the story of Sam Alman isn't that interesting and it
00:30:42
it seemed more interesting 12 months ago than it is now so I think they'd you know think well let's just do season 4
00:30:48
of Euphoria I I don't I think they've done the math here and decided that stories about big tag
00:30:54
>> the gay hockey people seems popular >> yeah let's do let's do the women's hockey team incredibly well story 5 is
00:31:01
like killing a huge opening. By the way, to your credit, I meant to tell you, you've been talking about theaters and
00:31:06
I've been ship posting them. The best performing media stocks the last 12 months hasn't been meta or it hasn't
00:31:13
been it's been theaters. >> Alexat went to the theater. He did. He loved it. He's going again to watch a is
00:31:20
a is a trend again. >> Mhm. >> But anyways, back to quote unquote artificial, the name of this that
00:31:26
they've killed. I think they just do the math and go, >> "Okay, the story isn't interesting. It's
00:31:32
going to piss off potentially a lot of powerful people. Is this worth it?" And look, I saw this happen up close and
00:31:41
personal when I saw >> Tell us more about this plug pulling for you. Tell explain to the people what
00:31:45
your show was so people understand. So I h I connected with uh Rez Media who did
00:31:52
the morning show and then I had an we had an amazing showrunner Scott Burns from the Born Identity, incredibly
00:31:58
talented guy. We signed up Roseman Pike to play the lead character based on, you
00:32:02
know, loosely based or inspired by Cheryl Samberg. Uh it got we we did our pitch and it got bought in the room,
00:32:10
which never happens. And Netflix >> Netflix [clears throat] committed to the entire first season.
00:32:15
>> Wow. Finally. Oh my god. Finally, after a swing and a miss and being beaned in
00:32:19
the face about 10 times, uh, I got something going. Everything's going fine. Everything's going fine. Netflix
00:32:26
doesn't like the scripts. Uh, the showrunner leaves. Brosman has some family issues and just the wheels came
00:32:33
off the bus. And what probably happened is AAM's Razer probably just fell apart.
00:32:39
>> Mhm. Cuz Hollywood stuff tends to and they >> Well, not not when you get to this
00:32:43
stage. >> No, I know. I agree with you. They just That was Yeah. Right. Okay. >> And then so I immediately went to was
00:32:50
there some polit because okay meanwhile Netflix is making a bid for Warner Brothers and so I immedately go is
00:32:58
something else at foot here and then I talked to the that incredibly impressive woman at Netflix who runs all their
00:33:04
content and >> she was very straight with me. She said problems with the scripts, uh, you know,
00:33:11
family issues for the lead and this happens. And I believe that. I believe that's what happened. But then you see
00:33:18
this thing get the plug pulled. I think the creative community has basically said America is tired of hearing about
00:33:24
big tech and there's a ton of there's a ton of um second order risk around these
00:33:29
stories right now. >> Yeah, that could be it could be that what's doing well and what's not doing.
00:33:34
It'll be interesting to see how the social reckoning does, right? Uh although some people say it's a mess of
00:33:38
a script with Aaron Sorcin. I haven't seen it. Um but it's getting a big pu that's getting a big push and that's the
00:33:44
the second part of the Facebook story. It's a it's a it's an accompaniment to the social network. Um but this time
00:33:51
Sorcin and not Fincher is directing which we'll see how he does. Um but you're right. It's like do we want to
00:33:57
see more about these [ __ ] right? Like that kind of thing. I guess >> I still think the story of big tech is
00:34:02
the biggest story that's never been told. I still think someone's going to produce it. I think
00:34:06
>> I think Bezos and Musk and Cheryl Samberg and what I wanted and they agreed to in the first season was I
00:34:14
actually think Sher Samberg is one of the more interesting characters in big tech. I think she's actually in many
00:34:17
ways more interesting than Musk. And but when you hear about these people's lives, you just wouldn't believe it
00:34:24
unless you knew it was real. I think they're incredibly complex, interesting, strange people. petty
00:34:30
>> and the stories >> angry unhappy >> but again it's it really is and no one's told it that well it's the biggest story
00:34:37
that is yet to be people are obsess obsessed with succession news is a pimple on the elephant of big tech
00:34:43
>> right you're right >> this story really hasn't gonna be it's going to be theater and opera like that
00:34:49
I just have this feeling that there's going to be a theatrical show or in that regard right where it's going to be told
00:34:55
because I have a couple ones going and I don't think they'll ever get made. I just don't think they will. Both my
00:35:01
book, my memoir, and then another one with Brad Stone and I that we wrote years ago. We wrote the treatment four
00:35:07
years ago and it's moving but slowly. And the question is, do people want to watch unless you make it really like
00:35:13
succession worked because it was like fantastic cast, fantastic script, >> you know, rich people [ __ ] things up
00:35:20
really. I think it might have to wait a step to get to these people, but they will. They'll be gotten. They're amazing
00:35:25
characters in a terrible way. Um, speaking of uh things that are uh crashing to the ground, SpaceX hype is
00:35:33
crashing. As we tape on Monday, SpaceX shares are down to $167, down 17%, valuing the company at 2.2 trillion,
00:35:40
still enormous. The stock is still up 24% from the IPO price, but down over 16% from its peak. Uh, a lot of people
00:35:48
feel this is going to keep coming down. I don't know, but some people are buying. So, will it have the effect on
00:35:53
the upcoming IPOs? Um and and let's hear a question uh from a listener about Elon's shares and his impact on the
00:36:01
company and then we can answer all these questions. >> So if he tried to actually sell or
00:36:06
borrow against even a smaller percentage of it tomorrow, what happens to the price? If he dies or is incapacitated
00:36:13
tonight, what's the stock really worth the next morning? >> Zero. Zero. Like oh my god, that would
00:36:21
be look out [ __ ] below. But your thoughts? Well, my understanding is so there's a lot of nuance there. My
00:36:26
understanding is he's agreed to a self lock up of a year. So he hasn't sold he's not selling any shares,
00:36:31
>> but he could borrow against it. >> That's exactly right. And he can borrow way more than he would could ever
00:36:37
>> explain how rich people do that, Scott, for people that don't understand borrowing against your stock.
00:36:42
>> Okay. So the the ultimate wealth accumulation and income inequality strategy is the following. If you're
00:36:48
fortunate enough to have equity in a company that does really really well, it's called the buy, borrow, die
00:36:54
strategy. And that is Jeff Bezos owns $120 billion in Amazon shares. And to fund his lifestyle, he borrows against
00:37:02
it at very low interest rates. And then he puts a lot of it in trust. And when he dies, there's a step up in valuation.
00:37:07
So his kid don't kids don't have to pay taxes on it. Or when he actually starts selling, he decides he needs to spend
00:37:13
more time with his f with his dad in Florida such that he doesn't have to pay back the cost of the infrastructure of
00:37:19
the great state of Washington that built his $120 billion in fortune. And the greatest the greatest
00:37:26
distinction between the wealthy and the notw wealthy is the following. Are you an earner or are you an owner? And you
00:37:31
want to do everything you can whether it's tax-free investment vehicles, getting the money out of your hands,
00:37:37
auto automatic investment every month, you have to get to be an owner. Because the thing about owning stock or houses
00:37:43
or assets is they increase in value tax deferred. What do I mean by that? If you
00:37:49
make $100,000 a year, you're an asset increasing your wealth by 100,000, but you lose 30% of it in taxes. Whereas, if
00:37:56
your stocks go up $100,000, as long as you don't sell, there's no taxable event. Now, what should happen is that
00:38:03
we need new laws such that when you borrow against your assets, it creates a taxable event on the on the capital or
00:38:11
the asset you're borrowing against. Because what effectively has happened is the owners are just pulling away from
00:38:17
the earners. It's never sell your stock, let it keep going up, and borrow against
00:38:22
it for your lifestyle needs. And then you can take additional capital and start investing in other things and
00:38:27
diversifying. And we're going to have the last 20 30 years in America, we've been obsessed
00:38:33
with how to create wealth. Over the next 10 years, we're going to have a very important conversation around what do
00:38:37
you do and what is expected of wealth. >> Did that make any sense? >> Yes, it did. Okay. But now what's going
00:38:43
to happen with his stock? See, I mean, because let's assume he's not going to be incapacitated or dead or but he will
00:38:50
borrow against it if he needs the money. I mean, how much money does he actually
00:38:53
need if he wants to say fund a presidential election, for example? Um, >> he owns he's worth a trillion dollars.
00:39:01
He can he can go to JP Morgan and say, "Loan me 10 billion," >> right? >> And they're not going to ask him what
00:39:07
he's doing with it. And he could literally overwhelm the airwaves and and social media with his chosen candidates.
00:39:14
Is the stock going to go down? Okay, let me just be clear. or SpaceX trades at a
00:39:20
price to sales ratio. Well, let's let's do it the other way. Apple trades at 10 and a half times price to sales.
00:39:26
Alphabet 11, Tesla 16. Nvidia 39. By the way, all these companies growing faster
00:39:32
except for Tesla than SpaceX. SpaceX trades at 131. Meta, an amazing company, trades at 7.3. Amazon trades at 3.7.
00:39:41
>> So, >> Amazon 3.7 >> 3.7. >> Oh my god. 10 is usually the thing, right? 10 to 15, correct? 12.
00:39:49
>> Yeah, those are higher margin companies. Amazon's in a low margin business. I
00:39:53
think I think the the only stock in all of these that I would buy right now is Amazon because what you get is
00:39:59
>> you get a distant number two to SpaceX with the core business >> of the retail platform. And if you want
00:40:05
to talk about AI, the adjacent AI place to go after industrial robots of which Amazon has two and a half times the
00:40:11
total amount of America. >> If you're FedEx, you have to be worried too. Same thing. If I could go
00:40:16
[clears throat] if I could go short any category right now, it would be a basket
00:40:20
of the secondary eye players. And if I go go long any category, >> it would be uh GLP1s. I don't know if
00:40:26
you've seen what's coming out of the American clinical oncology gathering, but they're now saying that metastatic
00:40:32
cancers >> get cut in half the growth rates when people are on GLP1s. Anyway, also will
00:40:39
come down these foods, as you said, two years ago, you know, the the cuts in prices for Doritos and for all that
00:40:47
shitty food um is really quite significant. People there's now not enough cottage cheese around and yogurt
00:40:54
and things like, you know, it's really interesting like in terms of how people's tastes have shift because one
00:40:59
in eight Americans is on this drug at this point. >> I think it's going to be one in two.
00:41:04
>> I agree. I agree. You're going to I I my prediction is both of us are on GLP1s
00:41:09
some form or >> micro I'm going to start my cardiologist was like we're going to not have your
00:41:13
stroke ever again. We're going to give you a small amount. I'm going to do it. I haven't
00:41:17
>> They're talking about potential potential delay of dementia and Alzheimer. They're finding out
00:41:22
>> no my cardiologist was like abso [ __ ] we're doing it for you. >> They're just finding out all sorts of
00:41:28
there's never been an innovation that appears to have second order effects that are this positive. Usually find
00:41:33
externalities that are negative. You know, you get you blast someone with chemo enough, they get leukemia 20 years
00:41:39
later, right? There's big tech all sorts of externalities, the externalities of GLP-1,
00:41:46
uh, you know, and there there are issues around nausea, muscle loss, but the every time they do more research, they
00:41:53
keep finding out better and better. >> Yeah, I think this the biggest test case. It'll be interesting to see what
00:41:58
the neg there are some negative effects and stuff like that, but it's a little like a statin, you know, but one of the
00:42:04
things is people eating whole foods and craving things that protein protein related healthy proteins. Um, which is
00:42:12
really interesting. Anyway, we'll see. I I would agree with you. Um, you called this one very hard two years ago at
00:42:18
least if you recall. I remember this. I remember being struck by it. Anyway, SpaceX fair shares, good luck if you buy
00:42:25
them and let's not hope Elon dies or is incapacitated tonight because it is a lookout below for that stock. Correct. I
00:42:31
mean, let's just answer his question. If something happens to him, that price, >> even though SpaceX is a very fine
00:42:37
business, it's not a very fine business. It's just a telco in the sky essentially
00:42:42
without >> No, the meme the cult leader of the meme cannot >> that would be Yeah, that would be uh
00:42:49
>> Yeah, I I I I got to believe that would be disastrous for for Tesla and for SpaceX. He's Yeah, 100%.
00:42:56
>> He's the one. He's the key man. Anyway, one more quick break. We'll be back for
00:43:00
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One more time, gusto.com/pivot. [music] >> Okay, Scott, let's hear some wins and
00:46:28
fails. >> My win is uh tourists in the US uh for the World Cup. >> Oh, yeah. >> Uh yeah, I think international fans are
00:46:38
leaving the World Cup raving about America, our food. I mean, it's just hilarious. We love your Waffle House. I
00:46:45
mean, it's just like >> the >> Boston and this tartan the tartan army was delightful.
00:46:51
>> What what what the world is finding out is that America at its core distinctive
00:46:56
podcasters like us and and Trump [clears throat] Americans are generous, interesting,
00:47:02
wonderful people and it's an amazing culture and they're getting to see that and then Americans are getting to see
00:47:07
just how wonderful these nations are. And I, like I said, I think the World Cup is doing what the UN
00:47:14
initially envisioned it would do. I think it's bringing people together. These viral online videos show fans
00:47:18
excited about American food. Uh, our huge portions, Chipotle, Shake Shack, and many more. Visitors to to NYC were
00:47:26
able to be part of the legendary Nicks parade. The World Cup has attracted a projected 10 million visitors. Airbnb
00:47:33
searches and host cities jumped 80%. Year-on-year. Visitors are staying about 12 days, attending two matches, and
00:47:40
spending over $400 a day on average. Uh, New York City's tourism chief, Julie Coker, likened the boost to hosting as
00:47:48
many as eight Super Bowls in six weeks. I I just think the World Cup I think FIFA is one of the most corrupt
00:47:54
organizations in sport, but I think the World Cup is just incredible. >> It's the fans. It's the fans. They were
00:48:02
just the fans are delightful. But you see you see people in Kansas welcoming, you know, these people from Norway. You
00:48:08
see the Japanese. I I I just it really is I think we forget that generally speaking, these cultures are wonderful.
00:48:18
>> And we're not Trump. >> Yeah. Generally speaking, people want to get along. Generally, we're not that
00:48:23
divided. We just have the most profitable companies in the world trying to divide us.
00:48:27
>> And we have a president who's trying to divide us. is like I mean I think you
00:48:31
know what I'm struck by here is you get the feeling and this is just being in France for a short time is they really
00:48:38
>> want to like us like I you know what I mean like I had so many Europeans like
00:48:43
testing to see oh are you one of those people Americans and you're not and then they're like thrilled to have you there
00:48:50
one I have to say everyone's been really lovely everywhere we've gone and I do think there's a backlash happening Scott
00:48:56
I do people are like >> they're I'm tired of being angry at these [ __ ] I'm like, let's just get
00:49:01
rid of them. Let's just move along. And like, and you're right, the World Cup, I
00:49:06
I know you don't think as much as the Knicks, but I think the Knicks think like it's just there's a feeling. I
00:49:10
think you're absolutely right. I would agree with you. These and this is these people want to like us. They want to
00:49:15
like us in a lot of ways. So, >> my fail and this is indicative of of social media is that Poly Market is
00:49:23
flooding social media with fake trading videos. Uh there's a great I think the Wall Street Journal is doing a great
00:49:28
job. They did an analysis that found that Poly Market paid dozens of college age creators to post videos of fake
00:49:35
trades and fake wins on the platform. So one of the videos, for example, uh shows a young man that saying he won
00:49:43
$100,000 on a bet that Trump would say McDonald's in public, but in reality all the econom all all of the counts that
00:49:49
made the bet lost money. And to make these clips, >> they're gross. >> Poly market built copies of its website
00:49:57
and then told creators to make quote trades on those sites and hide that they were being paid by Poly Market.
00:50:03
>> Scary. By the way, I feel I should disclose that at Profy Markets, we have a data partnership with Kelshi. Gambling
00:50:10
and gaming for young men is really corrosive and I still can't resolve what to do about it because you don't want to
00:50:17
infantilize young people and it's a tough one. But at a minimum, these companies shouldn't be posting fake
00:50:24
social media posts that show someone winning when they didn't. It's just it's preying on their worst instincts. And
00:50:31
it's not it's disingenuous. >> Yeah. It's just just do your business if people want to use it. You don't have to
00:50:36
like >> And these are great businesses. But Poly Market's audience is 70% male and the
00:50:42
most common age demographic is 25 to 34. So again, it's young men and a plural and guess
00:50:48
>> can I use a comparison? You know those two when you were after Robin Hood for a
00:50:52
while and then the other people that you worked with? Public >> public.com. >> They seem like the Robin Hood people,
00:51:00
Poly Market people. I don't know. >> Well, they're especially aggressive and I have problems with all of it. I don't
00:51:05
I don't have moral clarity about all of it, quite frankly, any of it. But the deceptive marketing mostly affects young
00:51:12
men and and just evidence of who they're targeting. A plurality of Poly Markets display ads are on what site? I'll give
00:51:21
you a guess. Young men. They're trying to reach young men. >> Twitter. >> Pornhub.
00:51:28
>> Pornhub. Uhhuh. That makes sense. >> So this is, and again, I don't know if you can regulate this. They'll say it's
00:51:34
free speech. Everybody's making money. But this does feel like deceptive marketing.
00:51:40
Anyways, that's my fail. >> That's a good fail. That's I agree with you. I think you're I mean it is. It's
00:51:44
just Why do you have to trick people? Just you make a good >> great businesses. People love this
00:51:49
stuff. They love the prediction markets. The data is interesting. >> They just stupid. It's just con people.
00:51:56
Um, my fail is the the way the Republicans are continuing to attack James Telerico over his sexuality, which
00:52:04
is I think it's must be Trump mistook sis the word cisgendered for six genders or something. But Steven Miller is
00:52:10
particularly heinous in terms and especially cuz he's such a loathome creature. Um, uh, it's just it's
00:52:17
grotesque. It's really grotesque and weird and I hope it doesn't work. I fear it might. Uh, but this this idea of of
00:52:25
of accusing someone of being transgender and this so it continues and especially
00:52:31
Ted Cruz, I mean, honestly, I hate to say he should know better, but I guess he doesn't. But Miller and Cruz and a
00:52:38
lot of them are just grotesque. It's just gross. It's I've never seen anything like this. And it's really
00:52:44
hateful and cruel and, you know, and especially cuz these particular men are particularly lowome men at the same
00:52:51
time. And so I think that's just I just can't stand it. I I every time I see them do it and they keep doing it, they
00:52:57
must to be seeing some polling or something, but and they're also terrible people. Um it's just gross. Like we I
00:53:05
don't even under It's so it's a misogynist. It's transphobic. It's it's definitely uh it's all manner of
00:53:11
weirdness on these people's part. and just I again a bunch of people I cannot wait to see go away at some point
00:53:18
relatively soon and we never have to speak of them again. It's how I feel about a lot of these people. Um on the
00:53:24
positive side um I do I do um really thrilled to see Toy Story. It did so well. It's one of my favorite
00:53:31
>> movie franchises. I the third one I lost I lost it at the end of that one about
00:53:38
it's just it's about toys and it's about everything and this one is you know focused in on empathy focused in on all
00:53:46
the good things we've been talking about in this show and um I haven't seen it yet. I want I have my kids my little I
00:53:52
saw the other ones obviously with my older kids cuz it's been so long. This is the fifth one. And sometimes when you
00:53:57
get to five, you're like, "You got to be kidding, kids." So, you just want to sell toys. But the the reviews for this,
00:54:02
and I have not I want to see it in the theater. Speaking of which, um, and we're I've downloaded all of them here,
00:54:08
and I'm hoping to watch all four movies with the little ones and then take them to it. Um, I just feel like what a what
00:54:15
an astonishing franchise it's been, and it's just I dare you not to cry at almost any of them. [laughter] I just I
00:54:21
cry and I don't cry. Um that last the third one just killed me. Just killed me. Um and I don't know why. I just it's
00:54:29
just beautiful. And this one's about um stuff that start. It's about digital, but it doesn't demonize digital. It just
00:54:36
talks about play with kids and I and I'm very excited to see it. So, I'm really happy for the Pixar people for putting
00:54:43
out a great film and I'm excited to see it. >> Well, you know what my >> Go ahead. Sorry.
00:54:47
>> You know what my uh ex-wife said when I came home and found her [ __ ] Woody?
00:54:52
Oh no. >> She said she looked at me and said she said you have a friend in me. >> Oh my god. How could you do this to me?
00:55:02
>> Come on. That's easy. >> No. The worst. That is the I'm not going with you to this movie and you're not
00:55:09
getting near my children on this trip to Can. >> I can't. I'm pronouncing it right.
00:55:13
Can't. Anyway, [clears throat] can can I Thank you for ruining my beautiful gorgeous moment about children play and
00:55:20
everything else. I truly appreciate it. You are not allowed to go to this movie in any way. You've got to have your
00:55:25
friend in. >> All right, stop. Stop. Stop right now. >> Anyway, so Scott, I'm looking forward to
00:55:30
seeing you. I might see you at a party tonight. Maybe I won't see you at a party, but I want to ride on that.
00:55:35
>> You know, Toy Story 6 is about Andy's about [clears throat] I'm serious. >> Toy Story 6 is about Andy's mother's
00:55:43
toys, which coincidentally are also called Woody and Buzz. >> Oh my god. All right, we're Okay, you
00:55:48
have ruined my win. Those are so bad. Those are so bad. They're so bad. And they're so sad.
00:55:54
>> Turn on your cameras. Are the producers laughing? That's my limous test. >> They're afterwards. They'll go, "Uh,
00:56:00
Scott, do we really want to do this?" And we're going to So that's the way that's that's where Lar goes, uh, like
00:56:06
that. That's the voice. Anyway, I will see you in person at live. We're going to have lots of people there. It'll be
00:56:12
fun. I think it is sold out. Um, uh, we are and I am also doing a live interview
00:56:18
with Jim Bankoff and Meredith Levian, uh, from the New York Times. Oh, stop it. Stop [laughter] it.
00:56:25
>> I mean, that sounds really interesting. Yeah. >> What is NPR hosting that? >> Yeah. Uhuh. It's going to be great.
00:56:31
>> We're going to talk about the forestry service. >> Listen, Dirty [clears throat]
00:56:35
Dirty. >> Oh my god. I'm going to see Team Scotland at the at the Crane Club popup
00:56:39
on the PA tomorrow at midnight. Then I'm going to the Spotify party. Who wants to
00:56:43
roll with the dog? Who wants to roll with the dog? >> I will see you in a few days, Scott. And
00:56:48
we want to hear from you. Also, our listeners, send us your questions about business, tech, or whatever's on your
00:56:53
mind, including Scott's filthy, filthy brain this week. Go to nymag.com/pivot to submit a question for the show or
00:57:00
call 85551 uh pivot or elsewhere in the Karen Scott universe. This week on on with Caris
00:57:06
Fisher, I talked to Harvey Leven, founder of the Celebrity News Juggernaut TMZ, who I adore about its new
00:57:12
Washington DC bureau and expanded political coverage. Let's listen to a clip. >> I do want to just say one thing that,
00:57:18
you know, you're referring to this as, you know, politicians being a form of celebrities,
00:57:23
>> right? Yeah, you can. >> I don't I don't view it that way. Okay. >> Um I view it as pop culture. We cover
00:57:29
pop culture and pop culture can be a lot of things, you know. It can be sports, it can be entertainment and pop culture
00:57:36
is politics because a lot of the things that affect everybody emanates from Washington DC and um it emanates from
00:57:45
the courts, it emanates from Congress, from the president and it affects all of us. So they are an integral part of pop
00:57:54
culture. So to me it has never been a stretch. >> It's a really good interview. They tried
00:57:59
for years to do this. He's a great guy. And by the way, they're breaking some stories. I have to say that they really
00:58:04
are. They're like when they took those pictures of politicians during the shutdown like like Lindsey Graham with
00:58:10
his bubble wand at Disneyland. I think they're doing an excellent job. Reminds me of the old Washington Post which used
00:58:17
to do this kind of stuff. A mix of things. Anyway, he's great. I've known him for many, many years. I like Harvey
00:58:22
a lot. I think he's a really interesting entrepreneur in media. He's one of the OG ones. Okay, that's the show. Thanks
00:58:28
for listening to Pivot. Be sure to like and subscribe to our YouTube channel. We'll be back on Friday live from And
00:58:38
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