00:00:00
I think Patel is all of the incompetence with none of the stature or bravado. I just think he looks stupid.
00:00:13
Let's get into today's news. Scott, FBI Director Cash Patel just filed a $250
00:00:19
million defamation suit against The Atlantic over an article he called a quote hit piece. It was not a hit piece.
00:00:25
The Atlantic is calling the suit meritless. The story is based on interviews with more than two dozen
00:00:30
current and former officials about Patel's time at the FBI. It alleges excessive drinking, frequent absences,
00:00:36
and erratic freakouts, including over computer signin. There were reportedly multiple times over the past year where
00:00:43
Patel's security detail had trouble waking him because he appeared to be intoxicated. One incident involved a
00:00:48
request for breaching equipment, the kind a SWAT team use, uh, after Patel was unreachable behind locked doors. it.
00:00:56
This is all true, everybody. It's repulsive when you read it. So, what do you think's happening here? What's going
00:01:01
on? And as to the lawsuit, >> look, I I think The Atlantic, my sense is this is thoughtful reporting and his
00:01:09
It seems like his drinking is sort of an open secret. It's not about alcoholism
00:01:14
in my view. It's incompetence. I I don't doubt that the alcohol hurts them. But
00:01:18
generally speaking, this is an incompetent person >> who has lacks judgment, doesn't show up
00:01:24
for work on time, >> panics, you know, he's so skittish. He thinks that he thinks that he's not um
00:01:32
that he's being fired. I don't mind you drinking during the week night if you
00:01:35
work for me, but be at work the next morning. And if you're not drinking and
00:01:39
you don't show up at work, it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter why you aren't
00:01:41
showing up for work. This guy doesn't appear to be showing up. >> Right. Right. totally focused on this
00:01:46
was alleging that drinking had a lot to do with it is he drinks so much he drinks to excess that he doesn't he's
00:01:51
also it creates a national security risk which is I think why all these people are leaking right it's not because
00:01:56
>> they dislike him but he also is a huge national security risk he's also abusing
00:02:02
his privileges very Christine gnome here right this is the version of Christy Gnome and obviously it's sort of who's
00:02:09
going to Christy who's going to take him down right >> well I like the idea him and Axather
00:02:14
They're now referred to as the liquor cabinet. That's a good one. >> Yeah, there was a good one. They said a
00:02:20
defense secretary, uh, FBI head and a lead prosecutor go into a bar. Oh, wait. That happens every day. It was for
00:02:29
Janine Pro is the other one they were talking about. This group is really kind of just like so not in control of
00:02:36
themselves. Let me just say the LA the one thing that really was the most disturbing in that entire story was that
00:02:41
he then will try to do something to please Trump. like try to prosecute people who prosecuted January 6th people
00:02:48
or do election denial. He's going to try to serve up like a little a little mouse
00:02:53
to Trump in order to save his job. And the only thing that Trump hates is drinking cuz his brother was an
00:03:00
alcoholic and died. Um but it'll be interesting if Trump will not fire him because of this piece, if that makes
00:03:07
sense. >> Yeah. My first girlfriend was um Mexican and an alcoholic and I she used to order
00:03:14
drinks called um and I asked her what her favorite book was and she said tequila mockingb bird.
00:03:20
>> Oh my god. Okay. Well, anyway, do you think Trump will fire him? >> Very good, isn't it?
00:03:26
>> I think Trump's going to fire he's going to fire a couple of these people.
00:03:29
>> Three guys walking into a bar. An alcoholic, a priest, and a child molester.
00:03:32
>> And that's just the first guy. >> All right. All right. I need your
00:03:38
thoughts on whether Trump's going to fire him. All right, we're done with the
00:03:41
drunk jokes. Go ahead. >> Is he going to fire? >> Okay. According according to Okay.
00:03:46
>> What did you just What did you just really >> Okay, go ahead. >> Everything. Um I no longer think for
00:03:54
myself. Um so, get this. According to according to Kelsey, there's now a something like a 70 or 80% chance that
00:04:05
um Patel is fired by June 1st. The other one that just blew my mind, which I would take the over under on or whatever
00:04:11
you call it, >> that there's about a 70% chance that Trump is impeached by January 1st.
00:04:17
>> Oh, >> no. That Trump is impeached. >> Oh, wow. So these markets are saying
00:04:21
these markets are predicting that um the wheels are coming off uh the bus here which you know I find uh really unlikely
00:04:30
here. >> What does Scott Galloway think? Not Cali. >> Oh, Patel's out. But I've thought that
00:04:35
for a while. I think he reflects poorly. I I think Hagath the president likes because when He Hagsth gets up on stage
00:04:45
he is so strident. He's very handsome. I think that uh Trump really values aesthetics. He's indignant. He's back in
00:04:53
their face. I think Trump really likes that. And he's very resolute. Trump doesn't like thoughtfulness. He
00:05:01
likes someone who's resolute. And I think he kind of likes that sort of brazen, arrogant approach. I think Patel
00:05:09
is all of the incompetence with none of the stature or bravado. I just think he looks stupid
00:05:15
>> and he's making the Trump administration look stupid. And also it it feels like
00:05:19
and I mean you know this better than me but it feels like everyone at the FBI is
00:05:24
dying to get on the phone with a reporter and [ __ ] post Patel. Uh it just seems like the whole I mean there's
00:05:33
there's been such an I think the two biggest brand erosions over the last 12
00:05:36
months have been number one the brand US number two the brand AI. If you think about what's happened to that brand in
00:05:42
the last 12 months, it's gone from 70 to 80% people being optimistic to like now
00:05:46
it's one in 10 are optimistic. But the the brand of the FBI, I would argue the Gmen, you know, the X-Files,
00:05:56
um, these were pe these were people that put on suits but knew how to handle a firearm. We're very measured. We're all
00:06:03
about serving in the agency of others. We're optimized for security, not for
00:06:08
performance. or not for attention. This was a great job with a ton of prestige and I think Cash Patel has literally
00:06:14
trashed this brand. >> He's turned it into a Joey bag of donuts. >> Y
00:06:19
>> uh you know, two for one coyote ugly MMA meets, you know, it's like a it's like a
00:06:25
bar fight minus the charm. >> Yep. All right. All right. Well, he's out. I agree with you.
00:06:29
>> What are your thoughts? >> I think he's going I think this was a
00:06:31
beautiful piece of reporting and I think they're going to go through the cabinet
00:06:35
with next is Lutnik and his corruption, right? that's going to and his like thirsty attention seeking. Anyway, we'll
00:06:42
see. I think there's there's it's a moment now, especially after Swallwall.
00:06:46
It's a moment for all of them. >> How does the head of the FBI have their
00:06:50
email hacked by an Iranian group? Right. >> How does that happen? >> He's drunk.
00:06:55
>> How does that happen? >> Cuz he's drunk. Cuz he's drinking too
00:06:57
much. Cuz he's an idiot. Well, idiot and drunk. He's stupid. You remember the
00:07:01
line from Minimal House? Don't How can you? Although that was done by Dean Wormer, but going through life stupid
00:07:08
and drunk is not is no way to live or something like that. Anyway, that's >> when someone asked me if when someone
00:07:13
asked me if I ever drink in the morning, I'm like, "No, cuz I don't wake up till
00:07:16
noon." >> Oh my god. Okay, enough with the drinking drugs. Iran is threatening to
00:07:20
retaliate after the US military seized an Iranian flagged um cargo ship trying to bypass the blockade in the Straight
00:07:26
of Hormuz. Iran is calling it an act of piracy. Meanwhile, JD Vance, Steve Whit,
00:07:31
and Jared Kushner are headed back to P Pakistan for more peace talks, though it's unclear if Iran will even show up.
00:07:37
Uh, first JD wasn't going, then he was going, and Trump was saying all manner
00:07:41
of things. Trump's, of course, is once again threatening to take out Iran's
00:07:44
power plants and bridges, which I know it feels like Groundhog Day, but he's
00:07:48
doing it again. The ceasefire is due to end this week. Um, I'll also note energy
00:07:53
secretary Chris Wright thinks gas prices might stay above $3 until 2027, though Trump is saying that's totally wrong.
00:08:00
California was six. It was crazy. It was six or in the mid sixes, which is because they have more taxes there
00:08:07
obviously. But, um, any thoughts what's happening here? Because it seems like
00:08:11
again still they still haven't gotten their act together. This gang that can't
00:08:14
shoot straight. There's so many things that are bubbling up in terms of incompetence and
00:08:20
institutions in a general approach to government that took immense resources that Americans have taken for granted.
00:08:27
And one of those things is our incredible diplomatic core. We gutted the diplomats. We gutted the
00:08:32
anti-terrorist group. So when you have these summits or peace talks, 95 to 98% of the work is done
00:08:40
done before the person lands on the ground. And that's the problem is 0% has
00:08:45
been done here. He might as well. He This is the most It is so easy to predict nothing is going to come out of
00:08:51
this. And I was uh you know I I've been saying that masculinity a decent proxy
00:08:56
for masculinity is are you optimizing for attention versus service? If so, that's the opposite of masculinity. That
00:09:03
defines this ridiculous trip to Pakistan. There's been no diplomatic work done. He's going to land. He's
00:09:09
going to make an indignant speech. He's going to look for a Tik Tok moment that
00:09:12
he attempts to make him look make himself look presidential. He'll make further irresponsible, incendiary,
00:09:18
unnecessary comments. He'll leave and nothing will have happened. And you know, the the only other what I've been
00:09:26
thinking a lot about lately is kind of the winners and losers here. Initially, China is a loser because of
00:09:32
the the security threat around not having the free flow of energy. They are such a big winner long term because I
00:09:38
was thinking about how does the world structurally change on the demand side. You got to think that in addition to the
00:09:43
economic costs of the Straits of Hormuz being um sequestered or blocked, every nation in the world must be thinking,
00:09:51
you know, we don't want to be dependent upon [ __ ] straits that can be controlled by the IRGC or by Trump.
00:09:57
>> By the way, there's there's a couple there's a really good online um thing that was about there's
00:10:03
not just the straits of Hormuz. There's an area near China that 40% of the shipping goes through. There's a number
00:10:08
of places around the world where this happens. the straight of Malikica or Singapore, the Sewish Canal.
00:10:14
>> Right. Exactly. >> Freedom of navigation. Again, see above things we've taken for
00:10:19
granted. Freedom of navigation was something that had been embraced by the entire world that said everyone's going
00:10:26
to pay more. Everyone's going to have insecure energy policy if we don't
00:10:29
enforce freedom of navigation around the world. But you got to think that every nation is thinking not only
00:10:34
economically, but from a defense standpoint, we need to have energy security. What is all roads and energy
00:10:40
security lead to one place? Renewables. And let's talk about renewables. The
00:10:45
advanced manufacturing and long-term thinking of China. Get this. What is the global share that China controls of
00:10:52
windmill production? Any guesses? >> No, probably a lot. All of it. >> A lot. Correct. 60%.
00:10:59
>> Mhm. >> The percentage of EVs sold glo globally? >> China. >> 70%.
00:11:04
>> Yeah. >> China. the percentage of solar panels produced in the world
00:11:10
>> drones >> 80% in China. >> So while we're sending diplomatic
00:11:16
missions and Canada's announcing they're divorcing from us because we're an
00:11:20
absentee irresponsible player in the marriage, China is using advanced manufacturing to say, "Okay, long-term
00:11:26
everyone's going to start investing in renewables and we're going to be the
00:11:29
place they come to buy it all." And they're not only offering the manufacturing and the products, they're
00:11:33
offering safe distribution. They're offering financing for these things and they're saying you can count on us. So
00:11:40
if you don't want to be subject to the IRGC or President Trump's whims that
00:11:44
day, enter into an economic relationship with China. >> Yeah, I agree. I agree. Anyway, it's a
00:11:50
real it's it's just this is this is not good from a political point of view,
00:11:54
from a world point of view. And a lot of like there's a lot of very high level
00:11:58
people predicting a real collapse of lots of of countries in terms of because of the slowdowns and the problems that
00:12:07
they're just on the edge. I mean the UAE was asking for some money. This is they
00:12:12
have to solve this yesterday. They shouldn't have done it in the first place but now they have to solve it
00:12:16
yesterday because there's a lot of other c all these countries are interconnected. Whether you like it or
00:12:21
not MAGA folks, this is how it works. And you're going to you're going to see
00:12:26
collapses all around if the UAE is asking for what what do they want? They need money is really because of the
00:12:31
situation. All these luxury brands throughout the Middle East and that's just small small ball. It's like all
00:12:37
these countries are dependent on this. And so he is reordering the world for sure, but not in the way that favors the
00:12:44
United States. Uh and of course they're sending this team of Wickoff. Steve Wickoff. Honestly, this is not our best
00:12:51
and brightest with Jared Kushner, Steve Wickoff, and JD Vance. >> If you want to understand what's going
00:12:55
to happen to negotiate with Wickoff, just ask how is he going to get his kids rich? Like what? That's essentially what
00:13:00
is driving >> such a negotiations. But you brought up something you brought up something
00:13:04
really important and that it's the UAE and something that really shocked me. I
00:13:07
was looking at analysis of projectiles that have come out of Iran. Do you realize that Iran has shot more
00:13:13
projectiles at the UAE than Israel? And you know, the UAE really is a model of what it means to not be the IRGC.
00:13:23
It's they they have built an unbelievable modern economy. They respect alliances. They in many ways are
00:13:30
trying to be more progressive around around civil rights. They have made real progress around um uh around women's
00:13:38
rights. They are everything that the IRGC is not. And it's interesting that of all the nations
00:13:45
um the IRGC has decided to go after the UAE u most aggressively. That really surprised me. More projectiles into the
00:13:52
UAE than Israel. >> But they're asking they said they're going to be forced to use Chinese money
00:13:57
or other currencies if they don't they don't get a financial lifeline. This is
00:14:00
just and that's just one country. There's so many that are just going to
00:14:03
be affected. And then let me just say lots and lots of people live daytoday in this country and cannot afford these
00:14:11
prices, these gas prices. And so with Chris Wright just half-hazardly saying, I'll stay above three and it's even
00:14:17
above three. It's above four in DC. It's above like give me a [ __ ] break. It
00:14:21
was six in in this is just these cavalier [ __ ] And then that that smiling idiot Kevin Hassid gets on and
00:14:29
acts like it's no big deal. There's something really broken about these people that is just doesn't understand
00:14:35
the implications of anything they do. Anyway, uh we have to go on a quick break. When we come back, we'll talk
00:14:40
about Joe Rogan's influence on executive orders. Support for this show comes from
00:14:45
Vanta. If you're a business owner, you might have noticed that risk and regulation are on the rise. Customers
00:14:50
now want proof of security before they commit, and earning that trust is critical to closing deals. But the
00:14:55
process can be expensive, complex, and time inensive. Vanta says that's the challenge they're here to solve. Vanta
00:15:02
automates your compliance process to bring compliance, risk, and customer trust together in one AI powered
00:15:07
platform. So whether you're prepping for a sock 2 or running an enterprise GRC
00:15:12
program, Vant keeps you secure and keeps your deals moving. Vant automates the process of achieving and maintaining
00:15:17
compliance with over 35 security and privacy frameworks. This helps companies get compliant fast and remain compliant,
00:15:24
opening doors to major growth opportunities and freeing up valuable time. Vantis says companies like Ramp
00:15:29
and Writers spend 82% less time on audits with Vant. That's not just faster compliance, it's more time to scale. So,
00:15:36
if you're tired of sifting through old audits and spreadsheets, you can get a
00:15:40
system that's always working in the background, keeping you compliant, reducing risk, and helping your business
00:15:44
scale fast and with confidence. You can get started at vanta.com/pivot. That's v- na.com/pivot.v
00:15:52
vanta.com/pivot. Support for this show comes from Framer. Running a business is pretty tough,
00:16:00
especially if you're a perfectionist and any and every little mistake on your
00:16:03
website just drives you insane. Framer is your shortcut to fixing those problems. Framer is an enterprisegrade
00:16:09
noode website builder used by teams at companies like Perplexity and Miro to move faster. With real-time
00:16:15
collaboration and robust CMS with everything you need for great SEO, not to mention advanced analytics that
00:16:22
include integrated AB testing, your designers and marketers are empowered to build and maximize your.com from day
00:16:28
one. So whether you want to launch a new site, test a few landing pages, or migrate your full.com, Kramer has
00:16:34
programs for startups, scaleups, and large enterprises to make going from an idea to live site as easy and fast as
00:16:40
possible. Learn how you can get more out of your.com from a framer specialist. Or
00:16:44
get started building for free today at framer.com/pivot for 30% off a Framer Pro annual plan.
00:16:50
That's framer.com/pivot for 30% off. framer.com/pivot. Rules and restrictions apply.
00:17:00
Scott, we're back with more news. Trump signed an executive order fast-tracking
00:17:03
FDA review of psychedelic drugs like psilocybin and I think it's ibogane for
00:17:08
mental health treatment all thanks to a text from Joe Rogan. Rogan texted Trump about Ibagain research in reducing
00:17:14
opioid addiction. And the president immediately replied, "Sounds great. Do you want FDA approval? Let's do it." The
00:17:19
order directs the FDA to expedite review of the breakthrough therapy and encourage data sharing between the
00:17:24
health and veterans affairs department. Um, you know, honestly, this look, Rogan's been turning on Trump and this
00:17:32
was a gimme to Joe Rogan. I I as you know, I talk about psych use of psychedelics in this series. It's very
00:17:39
promising, but certainly shouldn't be expedited cuz some some podcaster who has very not the best information
00:17:47
because they need to do the safety checks if these things are going to be good for people. Um, but if I mean, what
00:17:54
would you text Trump for? what would you like if you could? But this is how it's
00:17:58
done in this country. He texts him, he wants him back. It's the most thirsty
00:18:03
and thirsty way to get Rogan's approval. And Rogan is dumb enough to take it and
00:18:09
then shift on these things that he cared about allegedly war and um the Epstein things. So the whole thing is just
00:18:17
demented. I thought this was the most demented thing given how important this psychedelic research should be taken
00:18:24
throughout this country. your thoughts? >> Well, I gain is is the there's real
00:18:30
potential here. A Stanford study found a single Ibagane dose reduced veterans disability ratings from 30.2 to 5.1 with
00:18:37
effects sustained at least a month out. >> Almost nine and 10 participants
00:18:41
experienced um a reduction in PTSD symptoms. Nine and 10 uh decrease in depression. 8 and 10 reducing anxiety.
00:18:50
So, this has real potential. This is this is a great move, but here's the problem. This is
00:18:56
>> they've been running they've been running this for a year. They could have
00:18:59
done this a year ago, but go ahead. Go ahead. >> Well, okay. So, I'm a big believer in
00:19:04
prison reform. I think they're we're the most incarcerated nation in the world.
00:19:07
And I think that a hugely accreative move would be uh early prison release and a review of of people who are
00:19:16
currently incarcerated. And when the Trump administration decides that it would be great to have the Kardashian on
00:19:21
boards and she she takes this on as an issue, they then get a pardon. >> He does these things, but he doesn't for
00:19:29
political reasons and they're not systemic in nature. And when it comes to the when it comes to taking something
00:19:34
from a class 2 or class one drug, >> I want someone who has domain expertise.
00:19:38
I want correct double blind tests. I think the again another thing we have taken for granted here is the good
00:19:45
people at the CDC, our FDA, uh, double blind studies, doctors with actual credentials. I mean, they do they do a
00:19:53
really good job. It's been a huge, uh, benefit to us economically. The drugs
00:19:58
you take are, you know, they they do mistakes, but you can feel fairly certain that if you take something
00:20:03
that's FDA approved, it's approved for >> it's also too slow. absolutely too slow
00:20:08
on these therapies, but they're still early. And the fact that this very not
00:20:14
smart podcaster who's very lovely in some ways and nutty in some ways and but
00:20:18
doesn't operate in a factual environment all the time is getting to get this
00:20:24
because he's was mean to Trump and was turning on him and then for the next couple of months he'll be nice to Trump,
00:20:30
right? The whole thing is just grotesque in the This is not how we need >> health policy.
00:20:36
>> This is not health policy. That's correct. It's not legal policy. It's
00:20:41
it's it's purely political. And for Rogan to get used like this on an important issue, maybe if it's important
00:20:46
to him, he should demand that Trump not not just cuz he can go to the Oval Office and hug Trump, but it's just just
00:20:53
oh god, it could hurt veterans if it's not done correctly. The whole Yay. Just
00:21:00
And it's, by the way, it's also going to take this. >> It's also going to take forever anyway.
00:21:05
>> Let's play the game. Let's be increasingly mean and grow our platform
00:21:09
10x. And then what is the one thing you want from Trump? What is the one policy you would want from Trump?
00:21:14
>> $25 minimum wage. >> Oh, I love that. >> Universal health. >> I love that.
00:21:21
>> Child care. Universal child care. All those things. Any of those. >> Check. Check. Check.
00:21:26
>> Mhm. What about you? Besides, >> besides like a missile, >> um, uh, I would want
00:21:37
mandatory national service. >> Oh, I like that. >> Um, distribution of GLP1 to any
00:21:44
household with less than $50,000 >> in household income >> with good medical stuff attached to it,
00:21:51
nutritional. >> That's right. and uh incremental like you said, singlepayer
00:21:58
um health coverage and oh gosh, I could I could I mean >> I could go on and lower the estate tax
00:22:05
exemption to 1 million. There's going to be $72 trillion in wealth passed on.
00:22:09
We're not a dynastic population. We're meritocratic population and we need to
00:22:13
tax >> inherited wealth. >> Really? >> Anyways, I got about another 15.
00:22:17
>> Okay. Well, there we go. We're not We don't have his I know. Actually, I could
00:22:20
probably get Trump's cell phone. >> Let's get on it. Let's be a pain in the
00:22:23
ass. >> I'm serious. Why don't we do an experiment? Say, "This is Scott
00:22:26
Galloway. I would like you to do an executive order on Young Men or whatever the [ __ ] you want. I'm going to get his
00:22:31
cell phone. You're going to text him." Okay, you're doing it. >> I think it's getting I think it's
00:22:35
getting the wiring information of someone in his family and sending a few million dollars. I'm serious. I think
00:22:41
there's a direct pipeline. I've heard >> I've heard from cred credible resources
00:22:46
around around specific things around pardons and trying to get funding for certain things that there's an entire
00:22:53
infrastructure consultants who launder the money get it to the Trump administration and you get [ __ ] passed.
00:22:59
This is and to be clear what they would say is this has always been going on. We're just more we're less we're more
00:23:05
transparent about it. >> No, not like this. I'm going to get his number. You're going to text him. Okay.
00:23:10
That's what we're doing this week. Okay. Um, >> I was invited to the UFC fight at the
00:23:14
White House. >> You need to go. You need to go. You need to say yes. I just
00:23:17
>> You need to cidle up to him and like >> pet him. >> I don't like watching young men beat
00:23:22
each other up. >> I don't look at that part. Just go pet Trump. That's what you need to do and
00:23:26
get universal healthcare for everybody. >> You need to do it. You need to go in
00:23:30
there. I They're not inviting me. Even though Did you hear about this study?
00:23:34
This this thing, >> the influencers. >> Oh. Oh, it's really interesting. So,
00:23:40
there's a poll that Ipsos did um about influencers essentially and um I am the
00:23:46
most purple. I first of all, I'm in the top influencers, which is weird. I'm up
00:23:50
there with Candace Owen and Tucker Carlson and all manner of people, but I'm the most purple.
00:23:56
>> You're the most centrist. >> Yes. I don't think the word is I think
00:24:00
it's independent. Like I I don't know cuz they don't all agree, right? But in
00:24:05
terms of impact shock, I'm shocked that I was even in these lists, but independence love Swissard. It's weird.
00:24:12
It's so weird. But it's good. Good. That's very exciting. >> Which means that I should be at the OC
00:24:17
fight cuz I'd actually enjoy it. But you need to go. >> You're an influencer. We got to take you
00:24:21
to Coachella and just have you take pictures and not enjoy the music. >> I'm surprised you didn't go to
00:24:24
Coachella. But listen, this is what you have to do. You have to take one for the
00:24:28
team or you're going to You also have to text Trump because he's not taking my
00:24:31
texts even though I am the person who's the most represents the independents
00:24:35
apparently, which is ridiculous cuz I'm really liberal. >> Influence. >> Yeah, but I'm really liberal, which is
00:24:40
kind of funny. Um, all right. The NSA is using Anthropics uh mythos even after the Department of Defense called the
00:24:47
company a supply chain risk. Um, Anthropic CEO Dario Emodi met with the White House officials on Friday to work
00:24:54
towards a compromise to bring the company's technology back to government use. Both sides described the meeting as
00:24:58
productive. However, when President Trump was asked about Emod's visit, he said he had no idea about the meeting.
00:25:03
He was meeting with Susie Wilds. If a compromise is reached would likely exclude the Pentagon because Pett Heath
00:25:09
is a [ __ ] and so is Emil Michael who works for him. Um, so it's again it's
00:25:15
like everyone everyone I have talked to in the other departments think the HEG thing is insane and that they want to
00:25:23
use it because it's a better model. So the NSA wants to use it um and everything else. And it's just it's kind
00:25:29
of ridiculous that Amodi has to go hat in hand to deal with these children. And by the way, over at Open AI, more kind
00:25:36
of problems. The company lost three executives on Friday. The leader of the defunct Sora, the VP of Open AI for
00:25:42
science, who used to work for Twitter, Kevin Wild, and the company's CTO for
00:25:47
B2B applications. Um, so they're losing there's a lot of it's more it's more um
00:25:54
dramatic than Google back in the day or Twitter. It just it's really quite a
00:25:58
dramatic little company. Um, so any thoughts on anthropic or open AI again? >> Well, you know, history or the world
00:26:08
hates a vacuum and one of the biggest vacuums or voids right now that's creating chaos is the vacuum around
00:26:13
regulation and guardrails around AI. And when Dario Emote, who is supposed to be
00:26:19
head of a private company charged with just using every tool in his toolkit possible to create leverage and margin
00:26:25
for shareholders, gets so worried about something that he pulls it back and I'm
00:26:29
not, you know, and says he's only going to give it to JP Morgan and Apple, you
00:26:32
know, the good guys. Um, and you'd like to think he's sincere about it and he's
00:26:38
generally concerned, but he shouldn't be making those calls. If we're trusting or
00:26:43
hoping that the US and existential threats are going to be dependent upon the kindness and wisdom of CEOs, we are
00:26:48
[ __ ] because these people have so many incentives and pressure to just deliver
00:26:54
value. >> I was with some people and they're like, "Amod's good." I'm like, "It's a low
00:26:57
[ __ ] bar." And I don't still don't want him to decide. And still, you know,
00:27:02
even at this point anyway, But in the one of millions of text chains that get copied on between you
00:27:08
and Rom, I was going to suggest to Rahm and any other Democratic presidential candidate, I was actually going to uh
00:27:15
for some reason I think John Oaf is and you wrote about this is giving off real presidential energy right now. But I
00:27:20
think the opportunity among a Democratic candidate right now quite frankly is to
00:27:24
have a very thoughtful get some academics together and have a very thoughtful 10page or less summarized in a one or
00:27:31
two page cover um summary is uh regulation for AI. Do you realize no one's even proposing what it would mean?
00:27:41
What does it look like? How do you regulate it? What is it about security? Is it about privacy? Is it about how do
00:27:48
you thread the needle between regulation and also m letting our thoroughbreds run
00:27:52
such that China does not get out ahead of us which is a legitimate concern. Who running for president i.e. You know,
00:27:59
everyone has put out anything thoughtful that has said, I mean, Senator Warner has put out something with Senator Holly
00:28:07
about retraining and trying to support job destruction, but no one has really put out a thoughtful, you know, 3, five,
00:28:14
12point plan on this is what we should implement immediately in by executive order that lets the economic growth run
00:28:22
mostly. It'll cost some economic growth, but gives people some level of certainty
00:28:27
that the government has some feel around the risks here and outlines them. But there's nothing right now. It's just the
00:28:34
wild west. And that vacuum is being filled by a bunch of arguments, virtue signaling, false signals, comms
00:28:41
releases, press releases. So the vacuum is being filled by chaos around something that people aren't sure. Is it
00:28:49
a big threat? Is it is it not? And it really hurts the industry cuz see above >> it's gone from nine and 10 people being
00:28:55
optimistic about this to one in 10. >> Yeah, they've really [ __ ] it up. And
00:28:58
it's not the fault of like me complaining that I I got that from one of them. It's like it's cuz you're so
00:29:04
negative. I'm like get the [ __ ] out of here. Like it's not our fault. You I
00:29:08
said that. That's what I actually said. >> I'm an influencer. >> I'm in a big in the indies agree with
00:29:13
you're right. It's worse by the way. >> Influencer. >> But um it was so weird.
00:29:19
Anyway, um it's just they have done it to themselves. They've done it to
00:29:24
themselves because they're so and you know what drove me crazy then you get not this this isn't isn't an AI company
00:29:31
but it's all stuck in there Palanteer posting its manifesto on X over the weekend which one outlet it was points
00:29:37
from Alex Karps the CEO's book the technological republic one outlet likened it to the ramblings of a comic
00:29:43
book villain and the points include postwar neutering of Germany and Japan must be undone I mean it's already been
00:29:49
undone you dumbass we should applaud those who attempt to build where the market failed to act and we must resist
00:29:56
shallow temptation of vacant and hollow pluralism. The whole thing is just so I need them to shut up. I need all the AI
00:30:04
people to shut up even the good ones and just like like put in good things in place because they literally have they
00:30:11
keep shooting themselves in the foot about a technology that's possibly dangerous, possibly amazing and
00:30:18
everybody hates it, right? Everyone who's normal hates it, not them. And then they blame us for that. So
00:30:25
>> yeah, I don't get it. I know I I consider myself an influencer, but I
00:30:28
suffer from paranoia. I believe that nobody is following me. >> Can I ask you if you went in there to
00:30:33
them? They said, "Scott Galloway, we need we need you to fix this. What would
00:30:39
be your first three moves? Mr. Brand, we're having you in. We're paying you a
00:30:43
bajillion dollars." Because they have >> Yeah. The AI companies are like, "Look,
00:30:47
>> AI >> people [ __ ] hate us." >> Yeah. I'd want to I'd want to
00:30:50
>> three things >> I'd want to assemble a list of technologists, ethicists, and economic
00:30:56
adviserss. And I'd want I would demand a 30-day uh period where no model, no
00:31:01
updated model is ever released without thorough review that that AB tests the [ __ ] out of the thing in terms of
00:31:06
existential risks. And it has if the FD if it takes [ __ ] a decade to get a drug through the FDA,
00:31:13
>> right? Exactly. >> Why wouldn't we mandate that the government gets to play with any new
00:31:17
model for 30 days? >> Mhm. and then says, "We have found that this could absolutely hack the NSA or
00:31:23
even our nuclear launch codes." >> So, you need to tweak the following
00:31:27
things. We're going to assemble a blue ribbon panel. Anyone on this panel >> will be paid a lot of money, have
00:31:33
tremendous prestige, and by the way, for 3 years, there's a sunshine period, and
00:31:36
you cannot go on the board of any of these companies because we don't want you trading off speaking engagements in
00:31:42
and stock options for security. But at a minimum, we should have a 30-day screening blue, you know, blue ribbon
00:31:50
panel that includes Europeans, that includes G6 nations, that includes stock market analysts and say, "Okay, there
00:31:56
has to be a balance between safety and economic growth." Instead, it's just
00:32:00
like put it out there and see what happens. >> I know. What from a marketing, if you
00:32:05
were doing an ad, what would it be? We know we suck or what? >> What what's the message
00:32:11
>> for for >> for the AI companies? Oh, but here's the bottom line, Cara.
00:32:17
The markets love a winner. The the worst thing that's happening to Sam Alman
00:32:21
right now is he's proving himself to be a not a great CEO and he's let Anthropic
00:32:26
literally leaprog him. The markets are immoral. Open uh Anthropic is going to get out at a trillion dollar plus
00:32:32
valuation because it is executing like no one's business and Co-work is on fire. They are doing such a great job. I
00:32:40
think Daario is managing his brand fairly well. I think if I were Daario and I think he's going to do this given
00:32:46
that he god I can't imagine has much on his own plate. I would I would almost I
00:32:51
don't want to say circumvent the government but I would be putting together an industry consortium across
00:32:56
all of them and saying these are our recommendations. >> Yeah. >> And even critics trying to thoughtful.
00:33:03
>> Yeah. I will >> I would also offer a bunch of LLMs for free to researchers and academics and
00:33:08
say have at it. We think this could cure cancer. Have at it. >> Yeah, I have to say I I do like I I
00:33:14
think he's messaging well, but he never comes up with solutions. Like he just
00:33:18
tells us it's all falling apart. So, you know, David Saxs went after him this
00:33:21
week for being too negative. And I don't think he is. I just think he while he's
00:33:26
offering these scary scenarios, he needs to say, "Okay, here's what we can do."
00:33:30
Like, he doesn't do that enough. That's my that's my that's what I would say
00:33:34
about him. >> But why wouldn't they why would they coordin I mean, they have a lot of
00:33:37
money. Why wouldn't they take, I don't know, a billion dollars and start a
00:33:40
center of Berkeley and say this center is going to be focused on >> on um incurable diseases and we're going
00:33:49
to we're going to give them all the models for free. We're going to get we're going to give them compute
00:33:53
inference. And a lot of people would say no, it's the profit motive, but just
00:33:57
from a I don't want to sound a perception standpoint, but why wouldn't you say we're we're we're starting a
00:34:03
center for diplomatic prevention of conflict using AI? >> They could just do so many interesting
00:34:09
things concerned about the >> but yeah, their their brand is really bad. And listen, Dario is going to be
00:34:15
dragged down with the rest of them if they don't do something about it. >> Every journey is the same from Anakin
00:34:19
Skywalker to Darth Vader. We think they're the ones that are going to save us, that they should be president. And
00:34:24
then we find out like the rest of them, their job is to do do and say whatever will get their share price
00:34:29
>> of clay, feet of clay. >> There you go. It's a it's the villain's
00:34:34
journey. They always end up a Bond villain. And I like Dario. I don't know him personally, but I think he's made a
00:34:39
series of really good moves. He's clearly an outstanding CEO. But here's
00:34:43
an easy prediction. in 24 months we'll hate him too >> because we we will fall into the trap of
00:34:49
believing that these people are responsible for our well-being. >> They're not. They're responsible for
00:34:54
shareholder value and that comes at a cost and when no one's home see above that void.
00:34:59
>> Yeah, but brand declines. >> Who is proposing anything resembling AI
00:35:02
regulation right now? >> Well, they say it and then they it's a one-off kind of thing. Anyway, they do
00:35:07
say it. They do say it. >> What would you do? What would you want to see? I would I would put I think
00:35:12
that's I actually hadn't thought about it, but I would not not ads saying how
00:35:16
good we are. I would have an well I you know I had a back and forth with Dario's
00:35:21
people. I'm going to see him this week. Um but one of the one of the things I
00:35:25
said is you're doing all these soft interviews. Do some [ __ ] hard ones. Like and I was of course pitching for me
00:35:30
but you know like get out there and do some like do a lot. And it doesn't have
00:35:35
to just be him. It has to be a lot of people. like instead we're doing you know Sam Alman's sort of had a series of
00:35:42
bad interviews but it's got to be a broader discussion among a lot more people right and demand that your
00:35:47
critics are right in front of you and don't wilt when a critic says something
00:35:52
um instead of like they just they just they just don't want bad news and it doesn't matter people hate them they
00:35:58
really hate them and so look at the polls look at young people I mean it's just the brand destruction is going to
00:36:05
take them all down and and there's so any promising things with AI? I mean, look what happened to Reese Witherspoon
00:36:10
this week. I got slammed cuz I said, "What was she saying?" That was cuz they
00:36:14
thought she was being paid by Chad GPT or Charles Porch or whatever it happened to be. But did you see all that like cuz
00:36:20
she was saying women need to >> I didn't understand why she got so much
00:36:23
hate for that >> cuz they thought it was an ad. I think that they and maybe it was. I don't
00:36:27
really care. What she was saying was accurate. It doesn't I mean they said she's bought and paid for and she must
00:36:32
be getting money cuz she has Blackstone money through the whatever. Honestly, it
00:36:37
was so innocuous and people cuz she does books and so all the people it just was
00:36:43
it was innocuous what she said. Seriously innocuous and I got slammed for I wasn't really even defending her.
00:36:48
I'm like, what is she saying that's so weird? Even again, even if she was paid,
00:36:53
I don't think it was the message was the a bad one. But I guess and then everybody's like, well, I'm not going to
00:36:59
use AI. So there. And I'm like, well, don't then. What do you want? But if you
00:37:03
if you care about where it's going, you need it's like in the early internet,
00:37:07
there were all these people who said, I'm not using the web. I'm like, knock
00:37:11
yourself out. But it's it's happening, my friends. Don't turn on that flash
00:37:15
that electric light. I I don't care. It's just Anyway, it's a bad there's a
00:37:20
lot of rage. There's the rage at her was in insane I thought. Anyway, um let's go
00:37:26
on a quick break. When we come back, uh why Netflix stock plummeted after its latest earnings. I'm eager to hear what
00:37:32
you have to say, Scott. Support for the show comes from Delete Me. Delete Me makes it easy, quick, and safe to remove
00:37:38
your personal data online at a time when surveillance and data breaches are common enough to make everyone
00:37:43
vulnerable. You don't have to be a public figure to be at risk of having your personal information stolen by bad
00:37:48
actors. The terrifying reality is that we're all susceptible and the impact of
00:37:52
identity theft can be devastating. Delete Me can help you protect your personal privacy or the privacy of your
00:37:57
business from doxing attacks before sensitive information can be exploited. I have used Delete Me for a while. I
00:38:03
think it's really important to be aware of what's out there about you is really
00:38:07
surprising. Even someone like me who spends a lot of time protecting their privacy, how much information is out
00:38:12
there, how much of it is bad, and how much is being compiled together? You really have to fight hard to keep your
00:38:17
privacy. And Delete Me is an excellent tool. Last year, the New York Times wire cutter named Delete Meir their top pick
00:38:22
for data removal services. Not a surprise. So, what are you waiting for? Take control of your data and keep your
00:38:28
private life private by signing up for Delete Me, now at a special discount for our listeners. Get 20% off your DeleteMe
00:38:33
plan when you go to joindeleteme.com/pivot and use the promo code pivot at checkout. The only way to get 20% off is
00:38:40
to go to joindeleteme.com/pivot and enter the code pivot at checkout. That's joined me.com/pivot.
00:38:46
Code pivot. Support for this show comes from Shipstation. When your company is growing fast, order fulfillment can make
00:38:54
or break your success. ShipStation's intelligence-driven platform brings order management, rate shopping,
00:38:59
inventory and returns, warehouse systems, and comprehensive analytics all in one place. And it can save customers
00:39:05
15 hours per week on fulfillment. With ShipStation, everything you need to manage getting your product to customers
00:39:10
is in one place. You can connect to over 200 sales channels. And instead of 5 to
00:39:15
seven disconnected tools, you've got one. And you can also set up time-saving
00:39:19
automations. Ship Station picks the best carrier, finds you the best rate, prints
00:39:22
labels in bulk, and sends tracking updates. Done. Their data shows that sharing tracking details can cut
00:39:28
customer service inquiries by 12%. Returns management can give you data on what's coming back and why, and
00:39:33
analytics can show you where you're saving and where to optimize. Try Shipstation free for 60 days with full
00:39:39
access to all features. No credit card needed. Go to shipstation.com and use the code pivot for 60 days for free. 60
00:39:46
days gives you plenty of time to see exactly how much time and money you're saving on every shipment. That's
00:39:51
shipstation.com code pivot. shipstation.com codepivot. Scott, we're back with more news.
00:40:00
Netflix is out with its first earnings report since walking away from the Warner Brothers deal back in February.
00:40:04
The company beat expectations on revenue and earnings driven by membership growth, ad sales, and higher
00:40:10
subscription prices, plus that $2.8 billion breakup fee. Thanks, uh, Ellison's. Thanks Paramount. But the Q2
00:40:16
forecast was below analyst expectations. It sent shares down 10%. The earnings also came with a few announcements. A
00:40:24
deeper push into AI and the launch of a Tik Tok-like vertical video feed within the app. They're trying to do a lot
00:40:30
more. AI makes total sense in that regard. And notably Netflix co-founder and chairman of the board Reed Hastings
00:40:36
is leaving the company when his term expires in June. He wants to do a lot of other things. Um talk first about the
00:40:42
earnings. We're going to get into the Netflix's podcast plans in a in just a
00:40:46
second. Um, I can go over what they're doing, but why don't you talk about the
00:40:50
earnings himself? And by the way, can I just take a moment? I met Reed Hastings right at the beginning of this company
00:40:55
and I have known him for a long time. I got to say an amazing entrepreneur. What
00:41:00
he did and shifted deserves enormous credit and he was the real engine. And Ted is doing a great job. So is Bella
00:41:07
Bajaria. So are the new people there. But Reed Hastings is a one is a generational uh entrepreneur and
00:41:14
congratulations on your tenure. >> Yeah, agreed. Uh look, the earnings were
00:41:19
uh fantastic. Their revenue was up 16% year-over-year, beating expectations. Their earnings uh was nearly double what
00:41:28
analysts expected. There was a bit of a sugar high though because of the $3 billion termination fee from the
00:41:34
collapse Warner Brothers deal. What shocked me was the ad tier now drives over 60% of new signups in ad supported
00:41:41
markets. And >> uh they're they're on track to hit $3 billion in ad revenue this year. So now
00:41:48
they're becoming a big media player, ad supported media player with a business
00:41:51
that barely even existed two years ago. And the fullear guidance held at about 51 to 52 billion, but uh Q2 guidance of
00:42:00
13% growth came in below what the bulls wanted to see. So I think that I guess I
00:42:06
I looked at these earnings. I mean this is the weird and the beautiful thing about the market. If I'd seen these
00:42:10
earnings before the market's reaction, I would have guessed the market would be
00:42:13
flat to up. So I don't know if they're taking Reed's departure as a signal this
00:42:17
is no longer a growth company or that that just some air was coming out of the stock. Um I don't get it. I don't you
00:42:25
know I there was some speculation that Reed was leaving because of the botched Warner Brothers deal. I think that's
00:42:29
[ __ ] But I think like you said, he just wants to do different things. >> He has a lot of
00:42:34
>> the stock was up 18% year to date heading into the print. Now it's just up
00:42:38
7% but that's not bad. The I did meet with Ted Sarandos two years ago and I told him I thought they should launch a
00:42:45
Tik Tok competitor because the long tale of Netflix content doesn't get viewed
00:42:51
very much. >> Yeah. And I thought have an open-source opportunity for artists and creators to
00:42:56
slice it up and it would be incredible marketing and I think they could have a viable competitor to Tik Tok
00:43:01
>> and at that point by the way >> it looks like they're getting into the
00:43:06
business. um they're launching a Tik Tok style vertical video feed this month and
00:43:12
YouTube has 13% of all US TV viewing versus Netflix at 9% but YouTube shorts has grown 186% in 15 months with shorts
00:43:22
on connected TV accounting for part of their growth and then Meta recently announced that Reals for TV
00:43:29
uh they're doing Reels for TV where users can watch short form content on television and Reels already has a 50
00:43:37
billion ion dollar annual run rate in ad revenue. That's more revenue than WBD
00:43:40
and NBC Universal combined. And basically everyone now, 95% of consumers now watch some some form of short form
00:43:47
video. >> Cara Swisser, don't you? >> Oh, I I I hate to admit it, most of
00:43:52
people ask me what my media sources were, and I used to say the FT and the Economist to sound smart. The bottom
00:43:56
line is I'm getting most of my content from short form video right now. >> Me, too. Me too.
00:44:00
>> And time spent watching video content on social media has more than doubled since
00:44:04
the pandemic. and Meta's revenues have nearly tripled and Tik Toks have grown
00:44:08
10fold. So I think that what what Netflix has is they have proprietary content. So proprietary content that's
00:44:17
not user generated but useredited. What could you do? There's some been some amazing Netflix content that never
00:44:24
bubbles up and never gets seen. Put it out and say, "Guys, have at it. Slice it
00:44:30
into twominute things. Create new stories. Add in different effects. add in different humor, different subtitles,
00:44:36
have added I my what I pitched what I pitched um uh uh Ted, I'm like, start something called Net Vibes and basically
00:44:45
say it's a Tik Tok competitor with all the proprietary content of the longtail
00:44:48
stuff >> and 90% that gets 2% of your viewership time. >> Why did you just give away that great
00:44:54
name? That was really good. You're talented. >> That was good. You said two very smart
00:44:59
things today. It's >> I have to tell you, >> it's because I was under I was under the
00:45:02
influence. Anyways, but Ted just sort of rolled his eyes and said, "Why would we
00:45:06
do that when Tik Tok is such a great marketing engine for us right now?" But
00:45:10
it looks like they're saying, "Okay, we no longer we need we need a growth
00:45:14
story." I think this is a great idea. I think they're doing it. And with the
00:45:19
case of Netflix, the second mouse may get the cheese here. I think it's a great idea for
00:45:22
>> Oh, interesting. All right. So, I'm going to let me just tell you the second
00:45:25
thing is they're going all in on podcast, which is interesting. Um, and I have a lot of information about this
00:45:31
because I immediately started looking into it. Netflix has announced five more shows coming to its platforms. These are
00:45:36
exclusive shows, including a new weekly interview show with Brian Williams. Hulu
00:45:40
has also announced four more podcasts, including Handsome and three others based on TV shows. Hulu's um is not as
00:45:47
strict um as Netflix. Netflix requires the shows to forego YouTube entirely and Hulu does not, it looks like. Um, so
00:45:56
this is really interesting. So I asked what the deals were and someone said deal structure looks like this. Episodic
00:46:01
fee lowend of 25k an episode averaging average range 50 to 75k an episodes higher celeb for celeb talent. Uh
00:46:10
production budget on top 6 to 12 month initial terms with 206 to 52 episodes depending on term length ownership
00:46:19
Netflix but sometimes they are given um uh revision rights reversion rights excuse me. So, IP maybe if they're
00:46:28
making them. Um, I wasn't tremendously impressed with the choices they made. I
00:46:34
like Brian Williams, but it seems like they should really go for a much more um younger demo, I guess, or more online
00:46:42
demo, influencer demo, but that was just me. Um, what are your thoughts here? What do you think? That's a lot of
00:46:48
money. 50, you know, if you got $50,000 an episode, that's that's a buttload of
00:46:52
money. 2.5 million. Well, we've been talking in our own book, but it doesn't
00:46:56
mean I don't believe it. Every political cycle, there's a technology uh Obama
00:47:03
weaponized search, um Trump, Facebook, I would say the second one was about social. A lot of people would say this
00:47:10
is now these midterms are going to be the AI midterms with a ton of misinformation. But I think in general,
00:47:15
this election or the last election was really the podcast election. And do you remember that graph that showed that
00:47:21
newspapers were getting 30% of all ad revenue but they only had 8% readership and the internet was getting 10% of
00:47:27
revenue but had 50% of all time. Those two tend to calibrate and the fastest growing ads supported medium in the
00:47:35
nation is not meta or alphabet. It's podcasting >> u >> which is video casting really but go
00:47:41
ahead >> it's it's television with a lower cost of means of production. It's 80% of
00:47:47
>> a closer relationship with fans that you have you can't leave that out. It's not
00:47:51
just because it's cheap >> and it's not starched. It's it's not
00:47:54
it's not a handsome guy saying save content for 22 minutes and then showing a video about a butterfly garden. It's
00:48:00
just it's people who are willing and some people like the conspiracy [ __ ] and
00:48:05
some people want people calling heth a drunk. it. And sometimes people are just so [ __ ] talented that they bubble up
00:48:14
past the means of production that have sequestered some of this talent. Anyways, podcasting, you know, the
00:48:20
Golden Globes now has it as as a category. Um, we're up Pivot is up 25 or 30% this year. Propy Media is up 46%
00:48:31
this year. Podcasts are growing like crazy. And what's what's even more interesting is the the chaser effects
00:48:39
are the following. The average age of a Fox viewer is 69, CNN 67, CNBC 64. The average podcast listener is 34.
00:48:49
And when you're 34, it means you're you're buying houses, cars, getting
00:48:54
kids, which are very expensive, and dogs. So this is this is quote unquote the core demographic. So in and in
00:49:01
addition as evidenced by the fact that the easiest guest for Cara Swisser and Scott Galloway to get on their show is
00:49:08
someone running for president. >> Yeah. >> Anyone who's thinking quote unquote not
00:49:14
going to make the decision in a year or two year with their family. Yeah. >> They're calling us and they want to come
00:49:20
on because they're running for president because >> because the what's interesting is that
00:49:25
you know I don't know if you found this but on property they don't perform that
00:49:28
well. I find that really interesting. >> Buddha judge did great. I'll tell you
00:49:32
that Nome did well. >> He's exceptional. >> Newsome did well. That's not true. It's
00:49:37
not true. Some of them do well. It dep I'm going to I'm going to pay attention
00:49:40
to what does well, which is >> I find on average politicians don't score nearly as well as some of the
00:49:45
other guests we have. But anyways, audience >> the in terms of downloads or viewership.
00:49:50
But my point is the new people actually listen to the ads. The other innovation that no traditional media company wanted
00:49:58
to do because they decided their talent was too precious is host readovers. That
00:50:02
gets if you do a if you just do an insert ad on YouTube or just an insert ad, you get between three and 10 bucks
00:50:07
CPMs. You reading over an ad, you talking about your Chevy Bolt and how much you like it, which you really do.
00:50:13
That gets a CPM of 45 or 50 bucks. Chevy, >> the media company at General Motors is
00:50:19
like they're they're allocating more and more money. And now these things finally
00:50:23
have the scale. So Netflix is could be the new Netflix is late on short form video. They're late on podcast, but when
00:50:32
you have direct relationship with 80% of households, you can play catchup pretty
00:50:38
fast. One of the things that drives me crazy with the media reporters when they were talking about the Vox thing, I was
00:50:43
like, "You all don't get where the money is now, where the voices are, where the
00:50:49
like it just drives me crazy cuz they're living in a different world." Like when
00:50:53
I not all of them, by the way, but but when I I've been doing a lot of press
00:50:57
for this scene, I'm think and I'm like they're like, "Oh, is Vox trying to, you
00:51:01
know, just save itself?" I'm like, "No, it has valuable a thing that's valuable,
00:51:06
you idiots." And so, you know, and and the same thing with these deals. They
00:51:10
were sort of pooing. I'm like, you don't understand what's happening here. And I
00:51:14
can't say it enough. Just sitting at a table in on a street in San Francisco
00:51:19
with my son, the kind of pe the people that stopped people that stop me on the street now, it's really astonishing like
00:51:27
nothing I've ever done. And it's it's and most of people Scott tell me thank
00:51:32
you for doing what you and Scott are doing or thank you for doing that interview. They thank you for your
00:51:38
content. That never happened to me before in my life. So I don't know how you feel about that. But you got to
00:51:43
figure out >> the most rewarding thing about it. I mean look the the money's great but the
00:51:49
most rewarding thing about it is that when people come up to you they start speaking to you as if they're they're
00:51:56
your friend. And it's really nice. People feel a parasocial they have a parasocial relationship with you and
00:52:02
they're they feel good about you. I think it's because you're physically in
00:52:06
their ears often times so it creates intimacy and also you're talking to them
00:52:11
as they're doing something quite personal. They're walking the dog, they're doing the dishes, it's their
00:52:15
morning routine. But I think the most rewarding thing about being a podcaster like if you get to a certain point, it's
00:52:21
a little bit like the NBA. The analogy I use is that when I rode crew at UCLA, there's been 2,000 people
00:52:28
who have rode crew. 10 10 went to the Olympics. So what is that like a.5% not even.5% went to the Olympics? It's
00:52:39
it's.1% of podcasters are self-sustaining economically. So you are five times more
00:52:46
likely to go to the Olympics if you wrote at UCLA than have a successful podcast. This is a difficult business,
00:52:52
but once you get once you get to break even, the economics here are incredible because there's what do we have? We have
00:52:59
we have three producers. We have we outsource our ad sales to to um to Vox and this is a $15 million business
00:53:09
growing to 25 probably in the next 24 months. Like just do the math. This is an incredibly this is creates as much
00:53:16
IBIDA. Pivot will probably create as much IBIDA as one of the most successful shows on MS now or Fox or anywhere else.
00:53:24
It won't be as big topline, but the IBITA margins are just incredibly dramatic, but hands down the most
00:53:30
rewarding thing from a host standpoint. >> It's the relationship with fans.
00:53:34
>> These really lovely people come up to you and they start talking to you about
00:53:37
their kids. >> Yeah. And it's all >> I mean, maybe they do that.
00:53:41
>> Maybe they do that. >> I've never had it happen my whole career. I have had a long and pretty
00:53:45
like well-known prayer. But I'll tell you, a very famous author was on my plane today and he texted he had my
00:53:52
number. He texted me just thank you for what you're doing. And I he he didn't
00:53:56
want to say hi because he felt like he was bothering me, which he wasn't. >> But but what I'll say is we have we have
00:54:01
a responsibility and I think our responsibility I'm trying to live up to this is the medium is creating good
00:54:07
vibes. I think mostly because, and I do think this is true of most podcasts, when you go on cable TV, and this
00:54:14
happened to me when I went on Pierce Morgan or a couple times when I've gone
00:54:17
on Fox, they're trying to engage a little bit and call out culture and create antagonism. I have found the vast
00:54:23
majority of podcasters when I go on their podcast, even if they disagree with me, even if they're conservative,
00:54:29
they're trying to present you in a fair and positive light. And I think as podcasters we have an obligation to
00:54:35
maintain that cultural zeitgeist to be to show some grace to even if you disagree with people. We're not in the
00:54:42
business of calling them out. You want a thoughtful nuance conversation. Let them
00:54:45
run with their >> views. It's okay to disagree and it's okay to push back. I do think you have
00:54:50
to informational and like let's hear this person is what I'm trying to do and
00:54:54
like what your goal isn't to make them look stupid, >> right? Your your goal is to have a
00:55:00
thoughtful discourse such that your listeners your listeners learn, but also to demonstrate the people from different
00:55:06
sides of the political spectrum, >> but you don't >> can demonstrate some grace towards each
00:55:10
other. >> I agree. I agree with you. All right, Scott. One more quick break. We'll be
00:55:14
back for wins and fails. Support for this show comes from Bowling Branch. As the years go by, sleep just becomes that
00:55:21
much more important. And not just any kind of sleep, quality sleep. Thankfully, the sheets made by Bolan
00:55:27
Branch can help you get the RM sleep you desperately need. Bolan Branch bedding is designed for exactly that kind of
00:55:33
rest. From their signature organic cotton sheets to plush pillows, breathable blankets, and temperature
00:55:38
regulating comforters, everything is made to create a bed that truly supports good sleep. It's incredibly soft,
00:55:43
breathable, and built to get better over time. This is sleep you don't compromise
00:55:47
on. I was lucky to get some items from Bowling Branch, and I have to say, I love them. I got a waffle blanket that I
00:55:52
love. It's so soft. It's breathable. It's just wonderful. And especially as
00:55:56
we go into summer, it's really nice to have a breathable yet warm yet not too
00:56:00
warm blanket. Upgrade your sleep with Bowl and Branch. Get 15% off your first order plus free shipping at
00:56:07
bolandbranch.com/pivot with code pivot. That's bowl and branch. B O L A N D R A C.com/pivot.
00:56:16
Code pivot to unlock 15% off. It's completely worth it. Exclusions apply. Okay, Scott, we're going to do some wins
00:56:24
and fails. I'm gonna I'm gonna go first if you don't mind. I already talked
00:56:26
about Palunteer's stupid manifesto. But two people um Ron Conway, a really well-known figure in Silicon Valley who
00:56:33
I like very much. He was the one that was pushing back on he's been I just really like him. He and I have had lots
00:56:40
of beefs over the years, but he's a really legendary venture capitalist. He announced he had a cancer. He's not
00:56:44
giving specifics about it. Um and he's fighting it. He's given so much money to
00:56:49
medical stuff in San Francisco. incredibly generous and unusual for a lot of these VCs who just only think
00:56:55
about themselves, but Ron's a very civic-minded person in San Francisco. Um, and people have different views with
00:57:01
him, but I I really adore him and uh he's he's struggling with some cancer
00:57:06
and he wrote me a series of very joyful texts over the weekend. I love you. Thank you so much. cuz I wrote him a
00:57:13
note and I just hope he he has all the he has all the money and to to do and all the connections and science because
00:57:19
he's done so much fundraising. Um I hope for the best for him. And then second
00:57:25
one is um so that's a fail for mine and same thing is uh Senator Warner's
00:57:29
daughter died. Uh she had juvenile diabetes and a series of health issues. And I both Scott and I love talking to
00:57:37
him. We find him very thoughtful. Um and so I just we are my condolences go to him. Um she's 36 years old and again
00:57:45
struggled with um struggled with juvenile diabetes and ensuing bunches of issues. Um and my win um is this
00:57:54
Atlantic piece. It's a little bit of a dunker, but everyone is getting on board
00:57:59
with this idea that maybe the tech billionaires aren't here to help us, which I think um is is a is a narrative
00:58:05
I've tried to get through a little bit. Um, but I thought that this guy Noah
00:58:10
Holly, who was responsible for Fargo and a bunch of other things I love online, he's been writing for The Atlantic, and
00:58:16
I just really, really enjoy his work. Um, but I really, uh, let me just read two quotes from this piece in the
00:58:25
Atlantic. Uh, it's called What I Learned about Billionaires at Jeff Bezos's
00:58:28
private retreat. These guys are having their own retreats. That Bezos's is called Campfire. And it's it's a
00:58:35
devastating piece actually, and I think very true. unfair. Um, this is the hubris of accomplishment. To be declared
00:58:41
a genius at one thing is to begin to believe you are a genius at everything. It's not that the wealthy become evil.
00:58:48
It's that their environment stops teaching them the things that non-wealthy people are forced to learn
00:58:53
simply by living in a world that pushes back. When when you can buy your way out
00:58:58
of any mistake, when you can fire anyone who disagrees with you. When your social
00:59:01
circle consists entirely of people who need something from you. The basic mechanism by which humans learn that
00:59:08
other people are real goes dark. Fantastic piece, Noah Holly. I recommend it. It's beautifully written and
00:59:16
incredibly fair. And um so anyway, yours >> I'm just gonna I'm just paring your
00:59:23
comments. I did not know that about Ron Conway and I'm sorry to hear that. Ron
00:59:28
invested uh in two of my companies back in the 90s when I was playing in traffic
00:59:32
and starting e-commerce companies. He invested he was one of my first investors in Red Envelope and one of my
00:59:38
first investors in my e-commerce incubator, Brand Farm. >> I didn't know that. Wow.
00:59:42
>> Yeah. And I'll say this about Ron. You know, you have good investors and you
00:59:47
have bad investors. And Ron uh I would just describe as incredibly supportive no matter what was going on was
00:59:56
emotionally and financially just like really on the side of entrepreneurs and uh
01:00:01
>> I'm sorry to hear that and I share I share your warm wishes. Also share
01:00:06
>> your condolences and sympathies with Senator Warner. Obviously every parent's
01:00:10
>> worst nightmare. I'm not I I know Senator Warner. I would consider myself
01:00:15
friendly but I'm not close friends with him. But I have a close friend who's
01:00:18
very close with Senator Warner and the senator has been approached by any number of people on a regular basis uh
01:00:24
about running for president and a lot of people felt that he brought the gravitas, the credentials and quite
01:00:30
frankly the kind of mo the moderate positioning that they thought would be uh a great candidate for president and
01:00:37
uh what I have heard is that he he never ever ever seriously concern considered it because he was always very focused on
01:00:43
his family. Uh, so he is that guy, not the one who was performative. Oh, I'm
01:00:48
going to check with my family. He was oftentimes people wanted to draft him, but he was always kind of uh family
01:00:54
first. Anyways, share your share your uh condolences. My my win is much more boring. I just wanted to talk a little
01:01:01
bit about Reed Hastings and just the incredible tenure uh 99 to 2023, founded in 1997. So, he's there 30
01:01:12
years. So you want to talk about uh from a startup to global giant. >> In 2000 they had 300,000 subscribers.
01:01:20
>> This year they'll have 300 million. >> The revenue went from the revenue went
01:01:25
from three billion in 2011. This year it will do 45 billion. >> Terms of market value. They rejected a
01:01:32
$50 million acquisition offer in 2000. This year they'll they're now worth
01:01:36
about 400 billion. um one of the largest value creations in tech history in terms
01:01:42
of business transformation. Talk about the mother of all, you know, big ball pivots from DVD rentals to
01:01:49
streaming in 2007, from streaming to original content, House of Cards, and then he's gone from the US to 190 plus
01:01:57
countries globally. Their profitability, tons of losses in the 2000s, multi-billions in annual profits. And
01:02:04
then the cultural impact uh that people don't talk enough about was that Netflix
01:02:09
deck they put out on their culture. They talk about freedom and responsibility, no vacation limits, high performance
01:02:16
culture. And the thing I did actually take something from them. They stated out loud that they wanted to be a
01:02:21
company known for exceptional compensation. And I' I've tried to adopt the same thing. I've always tried to pay
01:02:27
my people more than market or I shouldn't say it's the last 10 years. Uh
01:02:31
but this company um they took a DVD by mail startup. They pivoted into streaming. They scaled it
01:02:37
globally and they turned it into a half a trillion dollar media platform. 30 years, 1,000x
01:02:44
user growth, 15x revenue growth, and you know, redefined or defined the category.
01:02:53
I I would argue one of the top five to 10 tech CEO careers of the last 30 years. And you know what? He did it with
01:02:58
a lot of grace. He was never in >> absolutely >> he was never scandal. Never [ __ ] posting
01:03:03
other people. Never >> found drunk driving. Never >> shitty tweets he had to erase or delete
01:03:12
>> attention on himself. I have I can I just add that I've had him on stage many
01:03:17
times but I have to say of all the people I would rather spend time with Reed Hastings and I know Hollywood all
01:03:23
hates their miss system but it's not their fault that they found a way to do
01:03:27
a different system. It's Hollywood's fault for having a bad economic system
01:03:31
that was no longer sustainable. They like to sort of blame Netflix. I think that's unfair. Um they they do what they
01:03:37
do. That's what they make. And I don't think they're diminishing it. You just
01:03:40
you don't have to watch it if you don't like it in that regard. And I think they
01:03:43
put out a lot of great content. Actually, they put a lot of silly content, too. But I got to tell you,
01:03:48
what a he's a [ __ ] class act. He's So is Ron. They're class acts. All these
01:03:54
guys you're talking about. and he clearly imprinted really solid DNA. The co-c now, Greg Peters and Ted Sandos. I
01:04:01
don't know Greg, but I know Ted, but they're both have a reputation for being
01:04:05
not only very intelligent, but very decent men. >> So Netflix, a great company, great
01:04:10
leadership, and this guy historic run is is historic. So my win is the tenure of
01:04:16
>> of Reed Hastings. By the way, one of the things I was thinking about, Scott, was
01:04:20
you talked about that is the decency and we started with the incompetence like a
01:04:23
cash patelling sick of these incompetents and these like look at me performative [ __ ]
01:04:31
liars. Like I don't know what else to say, but I was watching Obama and Mandami thing. Uh they were promoting
01:04:38
universal free child care and singing wheels on the bus. Did you see that video?
01:04:43
>> It was it was it was very it was very likable, human humane. It was really
01:04:48
nice. >> Yes, it was so nice. I was like enough of that the other [ __ ] the cash patells
01:04:53
and more of that. More wheels on the bus. That's all I have to say. Anyway, we want to hear from you. Send us your
01:04:58
questions about business tech or whatever's on your mind. Go to nymag.com/pivot
01:05:03
to submit a question for the show or call 85551 pivot. Elsewhere in the Karen Scott universe, this week on On with
01:05:09
Caris Wisher, I spoke with comedian Nikki Glazer uh who is a new stand-up special called Good Girl coming out
01:05:15
Friday on Hulu. She talked about uh how overcoming fear pushes her to be the best. Let's listen to a clip.
01:05:22
>> I love fear. I run into fear. Picture fear as like a wall that you have to run
01:05:25
into. And so I was I kind of go into that of like I know that my self-esteem is built upon doing things that are hard
01:05:33
and conquering them. So I know that on the other side of doing this horribly uncomfortable thing is uh is me feeling
01:05:40
better about myself. >> It's a great interview. Scott, you reminded me of you a little bit. It was
01:05:43
interesting. I was I was talking to her. It was interesting. I think >> I like her because it's dirty.
01:05:47
>> She's also dirty. She talked about that. Anyway, uh the the show is called Good
01:05:52
Girl and uh she's not always good in the show, but actually she is. It's a she's
01:05:56
a really talented comic. I like her a lot and very thoughtful and very funny. That's the most important part. Uh okay,
01:06:02
that's the show. Let's thanks for listening to Pivot and be sure to like
01:06:05
and subscribe to our YouTube channel. We'll be back on Friday.