00:00:00
The internet doesn't have a speech problem. It has an accountability problem. And our fetishization for free
00:00:05
speech and anonymity has resulted in a total lack of accountability. We've got a lot to get to today, so
00:00:16
let's dig in. We we there's so much news. Scott even participated in the group chat. He was like, there's so much
00:00:21
news. But actually, his selections were correct. But because the first one is something I think I was a little was I
00:00:27
surprised Comcast is spinning off NBC Universal and Sky into a separate publicly traded company. The new NBC
00:00:33
Universal will include NBC, the Universal Film Studio, theme parks and Sky. This is the the satellite service
00:00:39
they have in in the in Europe. Comcast keeps Exfinity Internet and Wireless. So it's back to square one. I guess the
00:00:47
market liked it. Comcast shares jumped 21% in pre-market trading Monday morning. It's not a total clean bait.
00:00:53
Comcast will hold a roughly 20% stake in the new NBC Universal. I think they still have a big stake in MS now, too.
00:01:00
Um, and the deal is expected to close with in about a year. There's a catch, though. Analysts say, well, the spin-off
00:01:05
gives NBC Universal more freedom to do deals. It leaves Comcast broadband business more exposed at a time when
00:01:11
cable is already under pressure. So, talk about this. The people they're putting in place are very good
00:01:16
executives. Um, but does NBC now now remerge with MS now or what in the You need to explain this to me. I really
00:01:24
didn't quite understand why they're doing it now. Uh, what the troubles they're seeking. I know they had looked
00:01:30
at uh buying Warner at one point. Um, so could Netflix buy NBC Universal? Um, what what there's a lot there. There's a
00:01:39
lot at those studios. So thoughts. >> So this is why companies conglomerate. The board who decides to see his
00:01:46
compensation hires a firm called Towers Parent- because compensation is the hardest part and one of the most
00:01:52
important things that a board does. And because boards don't want to do any work, they pay this firm, Towers Parent,
00:01:57
$200 or $300,000, and they come in with a survey. And the survey says on a scale
00:02:01
of 0 to 100, 50 being the average compensation, and they look at the industry and the size of the business.
00:02:08
And so if you're running a bank that does 10 billion a year in business and 50% might be three million a year. But
00:02:15
if you're running a bank that does 80 mill 80 billion in business or whatever, then the average compensation is 20
00:02:20
million. So the incentives and also the ego and the also the testosterone and the and the and the penis and the
00:02:28
midlife crisis all lead >> incentives for the CEO to get bigger and bigger and bigger. And sometimes there
00:02:36
are real synergies around different businesses, but almost always not. Typically what happens is you end up
00:02:42
with a Frankenstein. And so the market, it gets to a point where the you have these Frankensteines of businesses that
00:02:48
had no synergy. And what the market >> can I change the metan has a tendency to do is it looks at the
00:02:56
shittiest business because it says there's no synergy here. And it says, "Okay, New York Times, you own 17% of
00:03:02
the Boston Red Sox and the seventh tallest building in America." >> This is previously.
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>> This is how much the building is worth. This is how much the Boston Red Sox are
00:03:10
worth. But instead, we're going to look at your shittiest business, your regional newspapers, which traded four
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to five times, and we're going to assign that multiple to the entire business because they don't give you any credit
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for the for the stuff that's working really well. So the dispositions the disposition of assets becomes accretive
00:03:29
to shareholders and in this case you have a media business that's strong and growing while the connectivity business
00:03:35
is shrinking and what they do is shareholders assign the multiple on the connectivity business to the strong and
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growing business. Last quarter the media division get this reported a 40% increase in revenue to nearly 12 billion
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for the quarter. Theme parks grew 24%. Media >> grew 61% and studios grew 21% and over
00:03:56
the same business over the same period >> the connectivity division shrunk revenues 3%.
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>> So what you have >> connectivity that's not as >> that's right residential connectivity
00:04:08
shrunk about 4% while business connectivity grew 6%. So what happens is if you split these things apart, you
00:04:15
have one company, the connectivity business, which is a mature business that's in structural decline but still
00:04:20
spends off a ton of cash. And then you have a growth business when it becomes a pure play growth business gets a much
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higher multiple and the result is a stock that was up 25% based on these two companies.
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>> Two companies. So what happens to each of them? Is there like look you have MS
00:04:37
they they split off MS now and now it's trying to create its own little new division and doing well for what it is
00:04:44
right it actually has seen some growth under uh those executives and then you have the media business that has by the
00:04:50
way there's some fine executives at the media part like >> Don Donna Langley it's a very smart
00:04:56
group of people whenever I meet them I'm always so impressed um but they weren't
00:05:00
able to participate in the Warner thing for example and I know it was frustrating because they were actually
00:05:06
the natural owner for that. You know, I was like, >> of all the things I was like, Paramount,
00:05:11
they're a bunch of incompetence. Netflix is going to is too big and going to get
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in trouble. Comcast was the perfect buyer for that, you know, in terms of quality people and the theme parks and
00:05:21
everything else. Um, so what what happens here? And the other thing just just for as a sidlight the other two
00:05:27
things. Could Netflix come in and do something here? I think it's too much. Um Disney CFO has signaled they intend
00:05:34
to keep the linear and streaming businesses together for now. They don't they don't own a cable division and not
00:05:39
split it off. So they're keeping those together, the studios and the streaming and everything else. So, is the strategy
00:05:46
seems like it's the same strategy if they're going to hold on to uh NBC, Universal, Film Studio, theme parks, and
00:05:54
Sky, right? So, they're So, that's a little connectivity, I guess. But thoughts on that? What what what happens
00:06:01
to each of these parts? What happens to the cable parts? And then what happens to the I mean could like Elon come in
00:06:07
and buy the cable parts for Starlink or there were rumors of him buying one of the uh the phone service businesses.
00:06:14
>> Well well I mean it's scary but with a $2 trillion market cap there's very little he couldn't buy right now. Um so
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Versant their stock is down 21% since the spin-off. I don't know what happens. Okay, first
00:06:29
off, Disney for the time being is holding on to its cable assets. That means they no one's offered the price
00:06:35
they want. It it will make sense for them to shed that business because the parks, the IRL business, the parks is an
00:06:41
unbelievable business. So, this is all a long-winded way of saying I'm not sure what they're going to do, but they have
00:06:45
simplified and created pure plays because here's the bottom line. If you put yourself in the shoes of an
00:06:50
investor, they don't need the Roberts family to diversify for them. CEOs love diversification. Why? Okay, my
00:06:58
connectivity business is down, but my parks were up 24%. In other words, >> right? Yeah,
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>> they sleep better at night because they can grow six, eight, 10% a year and not
00:07:08
worry that, oh [ __ ] I got a problem at MSNBC. Whereas, this is the thing though,
00:07:13
investors, I don't need you to diversify for me. I can buy Versant stock if I think it's really cheap. I can buy the
00:07:20
parks business stock if I think it's a grower and I want growth. But CEO's incentive and compensation and quite
00:07:28
frankly wanting to sleep at night and be bigger and better leads to an elomeration or a conglomeration that
00:07:35
eventually the stock market throws up on. And that's what's happened here. And you know what the next really there's a
00:07:42
stock right now that if it broke up it would triple. You know what that company is?
00:07:46
>> What is >> I'll give you a hint. I went to their dinner last Sunday night. >> I don't know. What is it? Maybe you've
00:07:53
mentioned it before. >> I'll give you another hint. The um VR but only Subscale.
00:08:00
>> Oh, Snapchat. >> If Snap spun their spectacles group, the stock would triple or quadruple.
00:08:08
>> Oh, interesting. Yeah, >> that is the most that is the greatest unlock spectacles though.
00:08:13
>> Well, that's the problem. It's a single It's a dual class shareholder and Evan
00:08:16
controls the company. >> Yeah, he loves them spectacles. Do you realize that? I think Meta gets about
00:08:21
$400 in market cap per user. Uh, Snap gets 17. >> Wow. Yeah, you're right. He should get
00:08:28
rid of the spectacles. >> If they spun and did a deal with Shia or something. If they spun the Spectacles
00:08:33
group and it was just a pure play social media platform, rocket ship. >> Get this. Do you know how much the stock
00:08:39
>> I like that idea. >> Do you know how much the stock is off the last 5 years? >> A lot. A lot. Yeah.
00:08:44
>> 93%. >> Yeah. It's crazy. >> 93%. Oh, I like that little >> pure play 500 million people a day
00:08:52
social media network that has the most attractive user base for advertisers in history that is people under the age of
00:08:57
25 >> is still inventive. >> You get rid of this weeping sore called the spectacles unit that is subscale
00:09:04
>> rocket ship. >> What happens to each of these? So what there's there's Versent obviously um
00:09:11
Warner is his own little nightmare although there's rumors that CNN will get spun off um with Rob Bont and the
00:09:18
California attorney general. But what happens to each of these divisions? >> Well, I think I think the media parks
00:09:24
business has real synergy because if you put out a Harry Potter film, you can have a Harry Potter ride, right?
00:09:29
>> Yeah. Right. Right. Exactly. >> The connectivity business should be indeed. >> Yes, they do indeed.
00:09:34
>> They just get focused. Now, in terms of Versa and the cable assets, those are
00:09:37
declining businesses, but those can be amazing businesses. You go yellow pages, and that was this is the weakest flex in
00:09:43
the world. I was on the board of the world's largest yellow pages company, and all we did was just go around the
00:09:47
world >> and buy other yellow pages companies and basically hold on to the salespeople,
00:09:53
get rid of everybody else and their cash machines. >> And that's what you're going to see. It
00:09:58
doesn't make CN CNN should go into Versant and ABC should sell their [ __ ] They need to consolidate the backend on
00:10:06
these these cable properties and that's what they'll do and they'll still be good businesses. They'll just be in
00:10:10
decline. >> Yeah, that's absolutely right. They could buy they could be the largest uh
00:10:14
small player, right? The like it it'll do well. It'll do well for a long time. >> Well, they're hugely profitable
00:10:19
businesses. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It'll be interesting. I wonder if they'll bring Versant back.
00:10:23
Will they? Why would you Why would you want them? >> No, I don't think so. Again, the story
00:10:29
has to be clean, right? I I mean, Alphabets learned their lesson. They're going to spin Whimo. Whimo is already
00:10:34
spent. I guess it's an independent company. >> Why didn't Sky stay with the cable
00:10:38
business? >> That's a correct question. I don't know. >> That was the one that stuck in my head.
00:10:42
So, it'll be interesting. Yeah, because they do. You're right. Theme Parks, the film studio, NBC. I'm not sure where
00:10:47
that fits in exact. A broadcast network. >> I guess it just Why not? Probably doesn't cost that much. It's a good
00:10:54
>> Comcast and Hurst are the most underrated management teams in media. >> I would agree. They're just very smart
00:10:59
people who consistently do the right thing for shareholders. They're aggressive. They're smart and they're
00:11:05
totally under the radar. Like they they don't want they don't want their their CEOs getting in trouble or making
00:11:12
earnings doing >> they also couldn't play in the Warner thing. I remember I went to the Wicked
00:11:15
premiere and I ran into a bunch of them and they were like, "We are the obvious right owner." I was like, "Oh, I know
00:11:21
but you're not getting it cuz Richie Rich over there and the crazies at Netflix can't you can't beat them,
00:11:27
right? You can't beat either of those companies, but I think this does give them a cleaner shot at buying stuff up.
00:11:33
You know, there's all kinds of things for sale like Lionsgate. There's a man there's all manner of stuff for sale in
00:11:38
Hollywood. So, we'll see what happens. You're going to see a lot of M&A, as Scott Galloway says. Uh, anyway,
00:11:43
interesting move by Brian Roberts, who I really like a lot. I have to say he's a
00:11:47
classy guy. Everyone over there is classy. They're a classy gang. They're very competent.
00:11:52
>> They're from Philadelphia, which means they've killed people. That's all I know.
00:11:56
I'm sorry. Anyone who's anyone any family that is self-made billionaires in Philadelphia, there's definitely people
00:12:02
buried in the foundation of a building of that sky tower. >> You know why I have a good feeling for
00:12:05
Brian Roberts is because I was working for Murdoch and then I went over to Comcast and it was such a pleasure. Let
00:12:10
me just tell you it was I went it was such a different personality. Although Rupert was more fun at a party. Anyway,
00:12:16
let's go on a quick break. When we come back, why Open AI might delay its IPO. We're all tech this week.
00:12:23
>> Support for the show comes from Upwork. A big life hack is finally admitting to
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That's upwork.com/pivot to connect with top talent ready to help your business grow. That's
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upw.com/pivot. upwork.com/pivot. >> Scott, we're back. Open is reportedly considering delaying its IPO until next
00:13:31
year. According to the New York Times, the company has been planning to go public as soon as the third or fourth
00:13:35
quarter this year. Valuation appears to be one of the sticking points. Sam Alman
00:13:39
is reportedly holding out for a $1 trillion when they all want this. The company was valued at $850 billion back
00:13:45
in March, 850 billion. There's also some hesitation in light of SpaceX IPO, which
00:13:50
is sort of bumpy, which has been trending downward after the sky-high debut, though it's doing a little better
00:13:55
as we record. News of the possible delay led to a a tech selloff, stock selloff with shares of Oracle, Core Weave, and
00:14:02
Soft Bank all falling. Um, and there's a possibility that Anthropic is breathing
00:14:07
down their neck that they may delay, too. There was some chatter about that. So, is it important for them to wait? As
00:14:14
you talked about, the money is getting sucked out of the system. And their financials leaked a few weeks ago with
00:14:19
losses increasing nearly 8x in 2025 and spending hitting $34 billion. It's not the greatest story in the world. And of
00:14:27
course, they've got Enthropic right in front of them. Not breathing down their neck right in front of them. They're
00:14:31
riding behind it. I think this is not systemic or I think this is uh an individual thing and that is I I believe
00:14:39
the anthropic is still going to get out. This is what I call the great flipping and that is
00:14:44
>> flipping. Is that a word you made up? Is that a vulgar word you made up? >> Flipping. Yeah, there you go.
00:14:49
>> There you go. In the Lincoln bedroom tonight. >> Sound like a sex act, doesn't it?
00:14:52
>> There you go. >> Flipping. What would that be? >> Well, I feel as if I need to use my safe
00:14:56
word right now. >> Mhm. >> Maybe. Anyways, the the great flipping >> I laugh at that every time. You've said
00:15:04
it hundreds of times to me and I laugh every time. Go ahead. >> Um, so Q4 of 2025, OpenAI is the
00:15:12
dominant leader. Right now, Anthropic is the We've never seen Avis overtake Herz
00:15:16
this fast. This isn't even Pepsi overtaking Coke. It's like RCA one morning is the market leader.
00:15:23
>> RCA. >> And I think Anthropic gets out. But I think open AI if they were going to have
00:15:28
to show their wares or open their cupboards there was just going to be evidence everywhere that Anthropic is
00:15:37
eating their lunch. And I talked to a lot of CEOs about AI and the comp a company I'm an investor in section talks
00:15:43
it does all this helps companies upscale around AI. what they're seeing is the following is quote unquote blame the
00:15:50
model and everyone's blaming open AI and swapping them out for anthropic believing they're going to get a much
00:15:56
greater ROI. So I think that basically if when we look back on the great draw down that
00:16:02
will be AI valuations that is I think going to happen in the next 12 months. This will be seen as a real crack that
00:16:11
that it kind of was a signal of what's to come. >> Is it smart to wait? You talked about
00:16:16
the sort of lack of cap. There's not enough money here essentially. >> I don't I I if they could get out, they
00:16:21
would. I I think what I think what this says is the CFO talked to the banker and
00:16:26
the banker said, "Okay, there's no wallpapering over this. Your business has lost a ton of momentum." And then
00:16:32
you combine it with the second thing that is different than Anthropic. Alman has taken the Amazon and Netflix fake it
00:16:40
until you make it, spend more money than anyone else and your stock will go up. He's taken that to an extreme that is
00:16:46
too much and that is if you look at how much money they are burning. I think with the S1's and they would be they
00:16:53
would be side by side immediately. Everyone would be comparing Anthropic and Open AAI's financials against each
00:17:00
other. >> Yeah. >> And I think what you would see is the following. Not only has OpenAI massively
00:17:06
lost momentum against Anthropic, it is also operating much more promiscuously with cash. And that is despite
00:17:16
Anthropic's massive investments and massive losses, it's projecting that it'll break even by 2030. And Sam
00:17:23
Alman's whole thing is, oh no, I'm committing to a trillion dollars in capex because the future there's only
00:17:28
one winner. And I think the market I I think the S1 side by side would show a company that is losing momentum and is
00:17:36
spending way too much money and losing too much money. And I think the bankers have come back and said
00:17:42
>> they don't want the comparison. >> Well, this is what's going to happen in the next 6 months. This is going to be
00:17:46
the great exit from cost. This is going to be the great reduction in spending and capex
00:17:53
commitments by open AI. they are going to massively decrease their expenditure and capex commitments
00:18:01
because I think >> Oracle, it hits a lot of them. It hits all of them, right? >> Still an amazing company. It's still
00:18:07
growing really fast. But the the amount of money they were committing to in terms of capex has gotten out of
00:18:15
control. And then you couple that with a reversal in momentum. I think Goldman and JP Morgan and the CFO have said to
00:18:21
Sam, uh, this is going to be hard. So, so then what do they do if is it is it if Anthropic gets out at over a
00:18:28
trillion, they've got to meet that, right? Speaking of dick measuring contests, they kind of want that number.
00:18:34
Can they actually get out then in 2027? >> Oh, I think I think this is a cost story
00:18:40
and that is I think they're just going to have to reduce their >> clean up. They got to clean it up.
00:18:44
>> Yeah. Because Okay, say they get out at 700 and not a trillion, that's still pretty good. I mean,
00:18:49
>> yeah, >> at some point at some point they're going to need to raise capital in the
00:18:53
public markets, I think. >> Or maybe could they raise in the private markets? The weird thing is I wonder if
00:18:58
TBG and the private equity firms that got a 16 or 17% pick, which is really or guaranteed return, which is really
00:19:05
unusual in the private markets. I wonder if they would still do that deal today because the reversal in fortunes here
00:19:12
has been like nothing I've ever seen in business without a scandal. And so >> weird question, does it get bought?
00:19:18
>> There's so few players that could buy it. I mean, it's a handful of companies
00:19:22
that could afford to buy it. It's one of the big tech companies or SpaceX. That's
00:19:26
it. There's maybe five. >> There was all this online plotting that Elon did sort of bought made sure the
00:19:32
SpaceX IPO was too big and then failed a little bit to stop them. Just so you know, there was a conspiracy.
00:19:38
>> Well, if the next round see rather than do a down round, uh what Altman did was
00:19:42
he he he offered >> he guaranteed it. Yeah, he offered these these terms that typically you don't
00:19:47
agree to, I a guaranteed return because he wanted the headline number to be whatever it was 850 billion or whatever.
00:19:53
>> Yeah. >> But at some point if they start running into a cash crunch, which I don't think
00:19:57
they will. The bottom line, I think the second half of 2026 is about Sam Alman rationalizing the expense side of the
00:20:05
business and their capex uh commitments because it's still growing like crazy. >> Drop it goes out, doesn't delay, goes
00:20:10
out. If I were Dario, I'd want to be like, I'm on top, [ __ ] I'm going public. >> Yeah. Yeah. Right away. Yeah. They've
00:20:17
got to It's a momentum story for them. Absolutely. >> And they have a great story. I think the
00:20:21
S1 is going to look really good for Anthropic. >> Yeah. In comparison. I mean, what's
00:20:25
really interesting is how kind of pissy the open people are about the story Daario gets over and over again. I mean,
00:20:33
he can be imperious himself and, you know, a little bit self-righteous, which is interesting, but uh I think he's got
00:20:38
the better story. He does. And a lot of this is narrative and it actually be good for anthropic for not to have them
00:20:45
there. Although, you know, looking better than open AI is a good thing for them, right? Presumably,
00:20:51
>> this is the CFO and JP Morgan and Goldman Sachs said, uh, you don't want these numbers public right now.
00:20:57
>> Yeah. Yeah. Yep. Absolutely. And by the way, the perception to the ones that did
00:21:01
go public wasn't great. Um, all right. We'll see what happens. Interesting story. very interesting developing
00:21:05
story, but it will impact companies like Oracle and other ones. You saw that draw
00:21:10
just a a small draw down of their shares uh because they have so many commitments
00:21:15
all around the board. All right, Scott, let's go on a quick break. When we come back, we'll discuss Pete Buddha Judge
00:21:20
getting targeted. >> Support for the show comes from ODO. There's an endless supply of software
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at odo.com. That's odo.com. >> Uh Scott, we're back. I want to talk about a story that came out over the
00:22:20
weekend about Pete Buddha Judge's family. Buddha Judge says police showed up at his house after an anonymous tip
00:22:25
claimed his four-year-old twins were at risk. CPS investigated the claim and the
00:22:29
Michigan State Police later confirmed the report was completely fabricated. Uh while the incident was being
00:22:34
investigated, Buddha Judge was not allowed to be alone with his four-year-old children for 24 hours, and
00:22:39
they were interviewed by authorities without either parent present. The incident happened during Pride Month,
00:22:44
right after the family posted of Father's Day uh photos online. Uh I was I this was terrifying to someone like
00:22:51
myself. This was like it was just some tip that was called in about another tip of something Pete allegedly. It was all
00:22:57
nonsense from but they had to because their authorities and he's a well-known person. They had to actually investigate
00:23:04
which is their job. I think they felt sick to do it but uh turned out to be all false. Uh it's a it's a version of
00:23:11
swatting but more nefarious >> swarming >> swarming or whatever. uh and you know
00:23:16
he's polling well for the 2028 presidential run. This is just I can't imagine I know I know them pretty well.
00:23:23
I know especially Chaston uh uh you know this is the fear they have as gay parents and something I've discussed
00:23:31
with them. You know this is the fear this is this sort of weird feeling people have about gay parenting that is
00:23:38
just it's I don't even want to call it gay parenting just parenting um but that they get stuck with. Um they are
00:23:43
wonderful parents and these kids are lovely. Uh and for them to have to go through this just sent a chill when I
00:23:50
read his piece and he's not someone who usually is particularly dramatic but he was furious about what happened as he
00:23:57
should have been. Any any thoughts on this? >> I don't think this is a gay thing. I
00:24:01
think this is stochastic terrorism. I I know a couple I know a couple a straight
00:24:06
couple in the Midwest and Child Protective Services showed up at their door one day and said, "We need we're
00:24:10
from Child Protective Services. we need to speak to your children. They had no idea what was going on. Uh, by the way,
00:24:17
the whole neighborhood found out about it. There's no way you recover from that. No, no matter how innocent you are
00:24:22
proven, that's on your Wikipedia page. >> If you're ever on trial for anything, the prosecutor can ask, "Weren't Child
00:24:28
Protective Services called to your house?" And when I go through TSA, I immediately feel guilty. I immediately
00:24:33
like, "Oh, where's that joint in my p? I've done something wrong." when they when you see your suitcase go to the go
00:24:38
to the part of the the the part where they they investigate it, you immediately feel guilty. How does a
00:24:44
four-year-old not remember that strangers who you're supposed to speak to who have the authority to separate
00:24:51
you from your parents start asking these types of questions? How do you not somewhere in your brain think are mommy
00:24:59
and daddy not good people? >> Right? How do you 100% >> how do the parents, the community, their
00:25:05
reputation and the kids >> ever recover from that? >> Yeah. >> Ever. >> I agree.
00:25:10
>> And this is the problem. This is a result of the fetishization and anonymity being linked to
00:25:19
shareholder value. And that is democracy depends upon disagreement but also accountability.
00:25:28
And when the loudest voices face no consequences, the most thoughtful ones log off in
00:25:34
fear. And what happens here is the following. Child protective services, their heart is in the right place.
00:25:41
They're trying to encourage people to to to bubble up real instances of child abuse.
00:25:46
>> Yeah. Because they usually miss a lot of them, right? You know, that's >> that's right. But here's the problem,
00:25:51
and here's what needs to be done. The fix isn't to end anonymity. It's smarter than that. The solution is verified yet
00:25:59
anonymous credentiing and that is online. There should be a digital stamp that proves you are a unique human being
00:26:05
without revealing which human you are. When you call child protective services and as it ended up so the family I was
00:26:14
referencing, you know what it ended up? Two months later they found out one of their daughters was in a beef with
00:26:21
another girl in the same high school. And the girl, the rival girl called. >> Wow.
00:26:28
>> This happens all over. But here's the problem. The family faces no consequence.
00:26:35
So if you call child protective services, we're going to guarantee your anonymity,
00:26:40
but after investigation, if we find out there's no evidence, guess what? >> We're going to investigate you.
00:26:47
>> I agree. I was I was like, who are these people who did this? And you know, swatting is bad. Swatting is dangerous
00:26:54
because there's guns involved like with kids and everything else. And to me, it's so heinous the idea of it. U
00:27:00
swatting is when you call in that there's some terrible thing happening at the house and then you know SWAT teams
00:27:05
come in as they should when cuz they never know, right? And so this is such an abuse of a system that's already
00:27:12
broken, right? It's already a problematic system. They don't catch enough child abuse and sometimes kids
00:27:18
don't get checked on. And you read those stories over and over again. But in this
00:27:22
case, what what sick [ __ ] would think of this thing? Like what sick [ __ ] would
00:27:27
make this stuff up? That to me, and I would like to find them. And you know what I do to them, but I think the
00:27:33
authorities really need to have a system. And the thing is, you don't want to discourage people from telling on
00:27:39
real issues of abuse, right? That's the thing. It's a it's just I I was so upset
00:27:44
by this. But the bigger issue is the following. That same architecture, anonymous, consequence-free,
00:27:51
u infinitely scalable uh online platforms. They let bots flood elections, radicalize millions, and make
00:27:59
public service a target sport. And the bottom line is this is where the right gets it wrong and the left gets it
00:28:05
wrong. The internet doesn't have a speech problem. It has an accountability problem. And our fetishization for free
00:28:13
speech and anonymity has resulted in a total lack of accountability. If you believe the kids across the street are
00:28:19
being abused and child protective services shows up and they find out, oh, you misunderstood the situation, you're
00:28:26
still not liable. You didn't do anything wrong. Your your reasons were valid. But
00:28:30
if it finds out you're just a homophobic [ __ ] weirdo or your your daughter has
00:28:37
had a beef with the other with with another girl in the high school, >> there should be consequences.
00:28:42
>> There's consequences >> there. I think Pete was talking about that. I know they're worried about this
00:28:46
these issues as gay parents as we all are because I was always worried about I've been it's just sticks in the back
00:28:53
of your mind. If it prevents him from running, which is really I hope it doesn't. That's what I hope it doesn't.
00:29:00
I mean, because let me just say, they're wonderful parents. They're wonderful people and they're wonderful parents.
00:29:06
>> Yeah. But what do you say to the kids? And there's these strange people in suits saying, "We need you to go stay."
00:29:12
>> Yeah. The whole thing is >> like, what do you say to your kids? Like a fouryear-old, what do you say to them?
00:29:18
>> I wouldn't even I don't even want to think about it. It was so upsetting. Anyway, uh Pete uh and and Chest, we're
00:29:24
so sorry. This is just this is disgusting and this is not how you behave towards people who are decent,
00:29:30
great parents. And uh whoever did this, I hope they find you and I hope you have
00:29:34
some sort of reckoning. As of this recording, by the way, we're going to move on. House Speaker Mike Johnson says
00:29:39
he's sending the landmark housing bill to the White House days after Trump abruptly canled the signing ceremony for
00:29:43
that bill. Interesting move. The bill, which passed both houses of Congress with overwhelming bipartisan support,
00:29:48
aims to and also would be a win for Trump, aims to bring down housing costs, expand home ownership, and boost
00:29:54
construction. But Trump says he won't sign it into law until Congress passes his Save America Act, which would
00:29:59
require a photo ID to vote and effectively end mail-in voting. By the way, the Supreme Court just upheld a
00:30:05
Mississippi law for late arriving mail-in ballots, a blow to the Trump administration's efforts to queer the
00:30:11
election, which is what they're trying to do. Uh, and the housing bill can still become law even if Trump doesn't
00:30:17
sign it. So, it's technical. If he doesn't sign it, it can become law. if he vetos it, I believe they have the
00:30:23
votes to overcome his veto. So, they're kind of putting him in a position. Uh, under the Constitution, the president
00:30:29
doesn't sign a bill within 10 days, it becomes law without his signature. And again, Congress can override this one.
00:30:35
And so, it was interesting that Johnson did this. He obviously knows it's a good
00:30:39
thing for to have this on the Republican record or at least take credit for it, even though it's kind of bipartisan. Uh,
00:30:46
thoughts on that? Housing is one of the biggest problems in America. Whether it's I was reading this morning that
00:30:52
Finland took an opposite route. Instead of focusing on mental health or veterans
00:30:56
affairs for the homeless, they just focus on housing. They're like, just build cheap housing and get people in
00:31:02
housing. And it ends up that housing is a weird form of birth control that every
00:31:06
10% increase in housing prices, birth rates go down 1%. It reduces people coupling. It reduces birth rates. It
00:31:14
reduces self-esteem. you know, housing, affordable housing is really important. And what we have here
00:31:21
is again the incumbents once they've owned homes make it more and more difficult for new permits. It's gone way
00:31:27
too far. Uh Congress, to their credit, recognized it. This bill attempts to get rid of NIMI legislation and proposed
00:31:35
Yimi legislation, credits, more credits, more federal sponsorship for communities
00:31:41
that have more housing. This is I actually thought the bill itself when you read it is pretty weak sauce but
00:31:48
it's a very strong symbolic >> movement in the right direction. And in addition,
00:31:55
>> when does the last time Congress voted 358 to 32 on anything, >> right? Right.
00:32:01
>> So this makes all sorts of sense. Trump getting in the way of this was just stupid. And again, it's veto proof. So I
00:32:09
I think this is a win. >> What does he do? What does he do? Sign? He's got to sign it and take credit,
00:32:13
right? >> Yeah, I think so. I I >> He should. But he's going to He's still going to try everything possible. This
00:32:17
Save Act that's not going to pass, President Trump. It's not It's not happening.
00:32:22
>> So why does he keep doing this? >> Oh [ __ ] I I mean, you're asking me to get into this guy's brain. I would have
00:32:28
thought he would, if I were advising him, I would say, "Oh my god, put on >> put on a put put on a tool belt like
00:32:35
you're on a construction site and and run around and take credit for this thing. take credit for
00:32:42
>> housing. This is this is a big big issue for Americans, >> right? You know, instead he's obsessed
00:32:47
with, you know, now he wants to build a golf course and put trees in front of the White House. He's just obsessed with
00:32:52
all these weird obsessive things around the DC area to preserve his legacy, which seems more interest to him. He
00:32:59
went and visited. It was pouring rain yesterday and he was out at Hannes Point where he wants to put in a a golf course
00:33:04
of some sort. Uh there is a golf course there, but he wants to improve it. Um, and then putting maple trees around
00:33:10
Lafayette Square, all this stuff. And then of course touting his really loser, uh, American State Fair, whatever, that
00:33:17
was nobody went to. Um, he just seems all obsessed with that kind of stuff and not something that is, even if it's
00:33:24
symbolically, even symbolically, it's important to to I don't get this. This is this guy. I
00:33:30
think he's terrified that things are going to go very badly after November. And so it seems to he's going to self
00:33:37
soothe with maple trees. >> There you go. Self >> soo. >> Self soo. Right. But he should take
00:33:42
credit for this one and he won't. Um all right, Scott, we'll be uh we're going to
00:33:45
have one more quick break. We'll be back for wins and fails. Okay, Scott, we're going to do some wins and fails. I think
00:33:50
I shall go first. There were so many failed choices. The grift watch of the Trump mining deal in Kazakhstan with Don
00:33:56
and Eric Stand profit along with uh Lutnik's Lutnik family. Um the what's happening in Venezuela is really
00:34:02
depressing watching them try to find people. So many people have died. But I'm going to be a little personal here.
00:34:07
There's two people who died this week uh who I know very well and were very impactful on my life. One was uh Malik
00:34:14
uh one of the very early tech bloggers. Uh someone who had worked very like me in regular media. Um but then sort of
00:34:21
spun off and started doing a really fascinating kind of bloggy and yet fully reported uh attitude uh attitudinal
00:34:29
stuff back way back in the day an excellent reporter. He also did events. He did parties and I really I got a lot
00:34:35
of inspiration from M who was one of the most jolly fellows. Uh I just really enjoyed we thought a lot about a lot of
00:34:41
things but what an amazing impact he had on early tech journalism when it was a lot more help you know a lot more
00:34:48
hopeful in a lot of ways but he actually did call people on things very early very wonderful guy um he had uh you know
00:34:56
he had shifted to becoming a venture capitalist I didn't go that direction um but just a really wonderful and he's
00:35:03
getting much deserved um praise from all of us who are around then and He struggled with heart issues for a long
00:35:10
long time and uh was uh just a really wonderful guy. The other one was my assistant. I don't have an assistant but
00:35:16
I did for many years. Ed Dailyaly also died. Um another he had also had health problems with around diabetes and
00:35:23
everything else and just a tremendous important part of the growth of my businesses in the beginning of them and
00:35:31
worked for me for a long time was an invaluable help and you know the kind of person you don't hear about. thought he
00:35:36
wasn't a reporter, but did so much stuff to really build the businesses Walt and
00:35:41
I built. Um, and just was a wonderful guy and was wonderful to my kids. Uh, especi Louis and Alex took them on
00:35:48
camping trips with his partner Mark and just just a one one of these hardworking
00:35:53
really wonderful people who who helped so many people and uh just really sad. I'm sorry he Louie just went to see him
00:36:00
recently. So, I'm glad that happened. but really big impact on my life and uh just a tremendously huge-hearted person.
00:36:08
Uh so that is my fail. Um although I I I also my heart goes out the people in Venezuela and everything else. Um and my
00:36:16
win is the Supreme Court just rejected Trump's attempt to get $5 million verdict in the Eene Carol sexual abuse
00:36:22
case toss out. This is the end of the road for him. Now I think he's gonna I just texted Robbie Kaplan. Let me see if
00:36:28
she wrote back. but uh who is the lawyer in the case. Um we'll see where it goes.
00:36:34
Uh on the smaller verdict, he has to pay the 5 million. There is the 80 I think 85 million $80 million verdict that is
00:36:41
still being disputed. Uh but he has to give her the 5 million. Um and which I just kind of love. Uh and now he is very
00:36:48
firmly what he is accused of he did. Um and he can't take it any further. Uh and
00:36:53
we'll see on the second part of which is a defam had defamation related to this case. Um, anyway, good for Eugene Carol
00:37:01
and pay up Donald Trump you for what you did to her. And I just felt that it was
00:37:06
like today is the day that the Supreme Court kicks Trump in the teeth a little bit after giving him a lot of wins on
00:37:12
immigration. Uh, which were that the Haitian particularly the Haitian ruling was really terrible for really
00:37:18
hardworking people in this country. Um, in any case, uh, congratulations to Eugene Carol.
00:37:23
>> Nice. So, uh, okay. So, my fail is uh I can't get over well, you could argue it's a win for uh
00:37:34
broadcast news, but there were two really illuminating interviews uh this weekend. The first was John Carl from
00:37:41
ABC News interviewed Senator Todd Young and uh along with Senator Mark Kelly. >> I saw that.
00:37:49
>> And they talked about how President Trump accused Mark Kelly of sedition. Senator Kelly flew combat missions and
00:37:58
also flew the space shuttle at 20,000 [ __ ] miles an hour. I mean, there are few things more patriotic or than than
00:38:05
the actions of Senator Mark Kelly. And uh and they asked I I appreciate John Carl calling Senator Todd Young out in
00:38:14
front and say how come you didn't do you agree with this? And of course, Senator
00:38:18
Todd Young broke into song about he texted Senator Kelly to make sure he was all
00:38:25
right, but he didn't say a [ __ ] word. >> He didn't. >> And at some point, I'm waiting for
00:38:31
people before they are, you know, lose their primary. At NYU, we have we have a second year,
00:38:39
which is really a waste of money. It's such that we can charge the kids 140,000, not 70. And we teach all these
00:38:44
electives like sustainability and leadership and ethics. Let me save you $7,000 on the leadership course of any
00:38:50
major university. Do the right thing even when it's hard. There you just save $7,000. And we bring
00:38:57
in a formally important person to talk about what a [ __ ] amazing person they are and how the world was against them,
00:39:02
but they did the right thing. And we call it a leadership course. Thank you for your $7,000 in student debt.
00:39:08
There is such a lack of leadership on the most obvious issues. And I don't understand the calculus from a senator
00:39:16
who I believe is a probably a good man and respects his fellow colleague coming out and saying it is wrong to accuse
00:39:26
Senator Kelly, an American hero and patriot of sedition. That is just beyond the line. And in the same time,
00:39:35
um, Ryan Nobles, who was an outstanding standin for Kristen Welker, who I also think is wonderful. on Meet the Press
00:39:44
basically kind of got in the face of Senator Roger Marshall and asked him to site a single example of where voter
00:39:51
fraud has influenced an election. >> He did a great job >> and I thought he I watched it. I'm like
00:39:57
go and and of course this guy just went into blather and and >> doctors need to be trusted by I was like
00:40:04
what in the [ __ ] are you talking about? pilots need to be and it's like but there's no problem here planes crash
00:40:13
there there is no >> no one has ever been able to provide evidence that a single election has been
00:40:18
influenced much less decided by voter fraud >> this guy's been all over the TV the Dr.
00:40:24
Roger from Ganzas, the senator, and he's doing the same song and dance everywhere. I don't know why. Maybe he's
00:40:30
in a tough fight. I don't know. It's weird. He does this a lot. He's just done this a lot.
00:40:35
>> Well, I understand that the only way you can do good is to get elected. But at
00:40:38
some point, they've got to recognize that, you know, this guy is coming is becoming a lame tradan, as you would
00:40:45
say. And at some point, they're going to show something resembling leadership. And I can't I can't swear the calculus
00:40:52
of a senator coming out and saying Senator Kelly is an American hero >> here. Exactly. I don't get it. It's the
00:40:58
same thing when they when Fox News was broadcasting from that American States thing which looks like a like the fire
00:41:03
festival and they're like look at all the people and I'm like there's nobody behind you. Like how do they do that?
00:41:09
Peter Ducey, how did you manage to do that? Oh, everyone's having fun here and there's 26 people there. And it was so
00:41:16
weird. I don't get it. Like when are they going to give? when are they going to give? When do you think they're going
00:41:21
to give on? Same thing with this guy. It's like, you know, don't believe your lion eyes kind of thing. I don't know.
00:41:27
>> Anyways, I guess it's sort of a win for for uh ABC and NBC News. And these these
00:41:34
programs still matter despite the declining audiences. They do are still really relevant. And specifically, it
00:41:41
just strikes me at some point senators who are elected to six-year terms at some point are going to begin to
00:41:47
understand that, >> okay, with the definition of quoteunquote leadership. My my win is
00:41:52
that Bill Maher was awarded the um um >> Mark Twain Award, >> the Mark Twain Award, and I thought it
00:42:00
was really fitting that it was at the Kennedy Center. Uh, but look, I have said this. Something I don't like about
00:42:07
myself is I have been way too influenced by comments in social media, which I think are so [ __ ] corrosive because
00:42:14
they start influencing me to say this type of thing and not this type of thing. And I've tried really hard in the
00:42:20
last couple years to say, "I'm going to say what I mean, mean what I say, and I don't care what the comments are." There
00:42:26
are very few posts that get as much blowback as when I say the following and I mean it. Bill Maher is a hero of mine.
00:42:36
And I think if you were to take every political pundit and have at zero say I don't know who the craziest right-wing
00:42:42
person is and on 100 be the craziest left-wing person. If I had to identify someone who was exactly at 50, it would
00:42:48
be Bill Maher. And evidence that he is a centrist is that everyone appears to hate the guy publicly. And then every
00:42:56
podcast I go on, the hosts when I follow up and say, "Is there anything I can do
00:43:00
to help you?" They ask me, "Can I can I introduce him to someone at Bill Maher?"
00:43:04
>> Oh, interesting. >> The guy has been in the business for 33 years. He is fearless. He is funny. His
00:43:10
contribution isn't defending the idea that people uh who disagree should be allowed in the same room. is that the
00:43:17
weirdest thing is that it's so remarkable. And today that is remarkable. And he he didn't build an
00:43:22
audience by telling people what they wanted to hear. He built one by telling everyone something they didn't want to
00:43:28
hear. He literally pisses off everybody. >> Yeah. Which is why he gets a blow. I
00:43:31
mean, he does he does seek out like his earlier stuff on Islam and stuff like that. So he he is who he is. And I do
00:43:38
I'm always fascinated by how much I get blowback on your behalf, which is interesting. um or why are you on that
00:43:45
show when I go on? I I it's a really interesting discussion and I don't I don't lump him in with all the others
00:43:51
who I do find somewhat heinous in that regard and I agree. I think he deserve that. I think he's very funny. I think
00:43:57
he I don't always agree with him. That's for sure. Um but it really is >> that's the point.
00:44:03
>> Yeah. I I don't find it um I don't know. He attracts an unusual amount of eye. He
00:44:08
really does. >> We'll get push back on this. I when I say he's a role model mine there are few
00:44:14
like when I gradu I was trying to think when I graduated from college when I got
00:44:17
my first bonus check when I sold my first business there are moments in your life you remember professionally
00:44:22
>> one of those biggest moments for me was three or four years ago during co when
00:44:26
Susan Bennett called me and said we'd like you to be on Bill Marcus it's the only show my dad watches
00:44:31
>> Susan's a producer for having >> a producer >> terrific producer >> and I think the guy is is fearless and
00:44:38
he he brings to light the notion that free speech isn't isn't tested by popular opinions. It's tested by the
00:44:44
people who piss you off. And and he does that. And he's an equal opportunity um agitator. And uh he was one of the
00:44:54
last people in television willing to to make both sides equally uncomfortable. I
00:44:59
mean, he's really an independent voice. And I don't think it his contribution will be remembered as changing minds. It
00:45:05
was proving that you can disagree without deciding the other person is evil. and his legacy, although he's a
00:45:12
great comedian, I don't think his legacy is comedy. It's defending the proposition that democracy requires
00:45:17
conversation, not just conviction. And we have lost so much of that. I don't know him. I I sort of know him, but
00:45:23
don't know him well. But the people he surrounds himself with, here's some things about Bill Maher. He has this big
00:45:28
rant on how he doesn't have kids and married. >> Yeah. >> Everyone around him has been working
00:45:34
with him for 20 years. >> Yeah. the woman in makeup, the guy who brings you to your COVID test,
00:45:40
>> his producers. I think he's a very loyal man. >> I think he shows up. I think he works
00:45:44
very hard. I think he's unafraid. I think he's a great role model for people who, like me, want to be centrist,
00:45:50
distinct of the the hate you get because you piss off everybody. I thought he is
00:45:55
an outstanding >> recipient for the Mark Twain Prize. Anyways, my >> I would agree. My win is the unafraid,
00:46:03
courageous uh believer in free speech that pisses off everybody and everybody wants to be
00:46:09
on his show after 33 years. And that is Bill Maher. >> Good for you. Good for you. You do care
00:46:14
about comments, Scott. You're never going to not care about comments. Never. >> Well, I'm addicted to the affirmation of
00:46:20
others here. It's really pathetic. >> It's not pathetic. You're It's not pathetic. You'll give yourself a hard
00:46:25
time. It does get to you. It gets It doesn't get to me as much as it gets to you, but it gets to me, too. I mean, I
00:46:30
think it's uh I think you will it's okay for it to hurt. I have to tell you that
00:46:37
>> shaming is a very popular a very powerful feeling because until about 50 years ago, if you were shamed and
00:46:44
expuned from the tribe, it meant you were going to starve or beaten by a bear in 72 hours or less.
00:46:48
>> Well, you're not going to get eaten by a bear. >> Yeah, I don't think so. >> You're vulgar, but you're not getting
00:46:52
eaten by a bear. But no, I agree with you. I think Bill deserved that award. And I know people, you know, we often
00:46:58
disagree. We really do. Listen, if you don't like Bill Maher, don't watch him. I don't know what else to say. That's my
00:47:03
feeling. It's like that's what I say to people. And by the way, you know, people
00:47:05
in my family, my one of my kids was like, "Why are you going on his show?" And I'm like, "You know what? It's none
00:47:09
of your [ __ ] business." I am cuz I like I like going on it. I enjoy the show. So,
00:47:14
>> I'm going I'm going I'm going on later. I'm going on I think July 29th. I'm going to take my I'm going to take
00:47:19
Bayata and I'm going to take my both my sons and >> I never take them all to anything. And I
00:47:24
said, "This is important to me. I want you to come with me." >> Anyway, uh good ones. Good ones for you.
00:47:28
That was a good one. Um, can I do one more brief fail and I don't want any I just want to say Scott Weiner is a
00:47:35
friend of mine and what happened to him in San Francisco last week was heinous. Like I don't usually mind criticism
00:47:40
around uh of Israel and I think it's really important for and I don't think every criticism in Israel is
00:47:47
anti-semitic but what happened to him and he has been a supporter of all manner of things in San Francisco he's
00:47:55
was anti-semitic was really truly and strange and that kind of that really shouldn't I feel terrible for Scott for
00:48:05
because he's been you know there's lots of things you could disagree has got on but not what they were yelling at him
00:48:10
about. And so it had a real tinge of real hatred. And I that is a real that really repulsed me in a way that I
00:48:19
usually am okay with some critic with criticism of all manner of countries and stuff like that. And so just that cannot
00:48:26
be tolerated by the Democrats. That cannot be tolerated that kind of behavior. So I would just want to say
00:48:32
that but I feel bad for Scott who's been a really um hardworking public servant.
00:48:37
Anyway, um, all right. So, that's the show. Um, congratulations to Bill Maher. We want to hear from you. Send us your
00:48:44
questions about business, tech, or whatever is on your mind. Go to nymag.com/pivot
00:48:49
to submit a question for the show or call 855-51 pivot. Elsewhere in the Karen Scott
00:48:53
universe, this week on I just spoke to Jim Bankov, the CEO of Vox Media, and Meredith uh Copit Levian, president and
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CEO of the New York Times at K Lions, uh, which was really fun. We talked about the ways they adapted to a
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changing media landscape and the effects of AI on publishing and it was a great session and thanks to UTA for hosting us
00:49:13
uh and keeping it quiet. Let's listen to a clip. The leverage is even the LLMs will need an information ecosystem with
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high quality independently produced verified information. If they don't have it their products will not ultimately be
00:49:32
good either. We all want to live in a society where quality information is available and I believe they do too and
00:49:38
I think that's leverage. >> I believe they do too. >> I think that they the they're these are
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information companies. These are information tools and I think information at a certain point for you
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to have a healthy functioning democracy you have to have high quality information and people have to be able
00:49:58
to identify the difference. This was a really good uh discussion and we had a little testiness around some a couple of
00:50:05
things but uh they it was great. It was a really interesting discussion about media and where it's going and Meredith
00:50:10
both Scott and I have huge regard for her and that Jim Bankoff guy is nice too. Um
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>> so you want a little known fact about the CEO of New York Times. >> No, let me tell.
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>> He's got a dreamy boyfriend. He's a tall drink of lemonade. Have you met him?
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>> Yes, I have. >> I went up to her and I'm like that dude's so handsome. And she looked
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around and she's like I know. He's like literally like I I'll take my masculinity to go. Jesus Christ.
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>> She's I I love everything about Meredith. I think she's a great uh executive. She's a great parent. Um
00:50:38
>> she's really she's she's all that in a bag of chips, as they say. So, so lucky
00:50:43
for him to have her. Okay. Uh that's the show. Thanks for listening to Pivot and
00:50:47
be sure to like and subscribe to our YouTube channel. We'll be back on Friday.