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I'm Samir Nur Muhammad, a professor of
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management at Warden, and I'm joined
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here today by Reggie Love, uh, former
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special assistant to President Barack
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Obama. Reggie's here to talk about his
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new book, uh, Power Forward: My
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Presidential Education. Reggie, welcome
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back to Warden. It's a pleasure to have
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you here, Samir. Thank you for having
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me. I I appreciate you bringing me on
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today. I heard about your book a few
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weeks ago when it was featured in USA
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Today. And after reading the book, I
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just came away thinking that you're such
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a sponge. Whether you know you're around
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Coach K, who's like the most winningness
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coach in college basketball history, or
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President Barack Obama, or any other
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leader, you just seem to suck up
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knowledge and reflect on your
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experiences. Where did that ability come
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from? Uh, you know, that that's a great
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question. I I will I always say that um
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I was a younger brother growing up and
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so my brother Richard, he's uh four
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years older than me. And uh the thing
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that I always learned that if if I
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didn't want to get a spanking or if I
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didn't want to get grounded, it's like
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do the things that he didn't do. And so
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uh uh that's really where it started.
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But I mean, look, I think I just was
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fortunate enough to uh to spend so much
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time with two guys who took the time to
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to mentor me. uh you know in so many
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scenarios um you can work with people uh
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that you know that aren't necessarily as
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invested in the development of the
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people that are are around them and you
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know and I was lucky enough in which you
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know I think coach Kay uh is is uh the
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epitome of what uh collegiate athlet
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athletics should represent and how he
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grows young men uh into into you know
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into men into productive members of of
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the community whether or not that's
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basketball players players or analysts
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or lawyers or hedge fund managers. Uh if
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you look at the pedigree of of of of
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professions of people who've come uh
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from coach Kate's uh toutelage, it's
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pretty it's pretty impress impressive.
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And and the president as well. Um I I I
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think that that's something that's
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really, you know, an amazing uh
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attribute that he has. Uh, you know, I
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think that sometimes you work for guys
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in politics and they try to figure out
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how to convince their staff to stay as
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long as possible. Um, but in the
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scenario working for him, even when I
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left, uh, you know, I think he, you
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know, even said to me, you know, look, I
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think you're going to go on to do great
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things and, you know, any support that I
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can give you in your development, you
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know, I'm there for you. So I I'm I I
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more I'm just lucky uh that people have
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been willing to put uh you know inputs
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in and uh in and mentorship into me
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versus uh uh vice versa. Yeah. So you
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know one thing that really stood out in
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the book too was your your decision to
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go work for the then Senator uh Barack
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Obama before he became the national icon
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that he is of course today. Um when we
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think about our students here at Warden
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especially, we think about a lot of
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them. they have these, you know, really
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established paths in front of them. And
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it really stood out to me that you kind
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of chose this more unconventional route.
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Did you ever doubt that decision? And if
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you ever did, what did you kind of say
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to yourself to to ensure that, you know,
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you were on the right path and you
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really believed in it? Yeah, I you know,
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um there's a there's a couple funny
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sayings. I think the first one is um you
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know my college football coach used to
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tell me this is look uh you know you're
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going to make uh you're going to make
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the wrong play often um but if you make
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the wrong play uh full speed you know
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that's better than uh making the right
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play going 50%. Um and I think that's
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like a very telling uh uh element
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because we spend so much time trying to
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get everything exactly right. It's like
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I want every piece of data that I can
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get before I decide to make a decision.
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And until I get all of those data sets
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out there, I'm not going to take a
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decision. And so, you know, uh you know,
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it's like uh uh the running back who
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runs into the wrong hole, if he's
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running full speed, even if it's the
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wrong hole, sometimes he pops out. Uh
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but if he's running in the right hole
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and he's running half speed, he gets
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like a concussion.
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Um, so look, when I made the decision to
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go work for then Senator Obama, I I
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there were a couple of things that were
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going on for me. Um, one, I kind of said
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to myself, look, um, I'm 23. My my
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hopefully my my runway is relatively
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long. uh if I if I make the wrong
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decision today, you know, I've got a lot
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more time in order to recorrect that
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that uh that wrong decision uh versus
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doing something that's a little less
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risky or has less downside uh for a
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significant amount of time and in which
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you come out of it and you know, you
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haven't had a a bad experience, but you
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haven't you know, you h you haven't
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gotten away from sort of the mean. Um,
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so you know, I think when you're young,
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I think you got to have a happy a
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healthy appetite for risk. Um, I don't
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think that necess it was I don't think
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it was a huge risk in the sense of, you
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know, uh, I think my decisions were
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between going to work at Goldman Sachs
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and going to go work for a guy whose
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known name they could pronounce. And and
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I really thought that both uh both jobs
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were going to be a win for me because,
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you know, either I would go to finance
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and and learn and, you know, have an
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opportunity to have a great earning
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potential or I would go work for someone
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that I really admired and respected and
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and someone who I thought that I could
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grow and learn from as well. Um but I
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and and the other and the other piece of
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it too is that I I did feel a little I
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wasn't 100 100% sure that I was ready to
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stop playing sports. I'd spent a lot of
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time like playing football. I I kind of
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thought I would always be like a
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professional athlete. That was sort of,
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you know, you know, that was like the I
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thought that was the end zone for me.
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And um uh and when that didn't happen or
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when I realized that that wasn't
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necessarily the best use of of of my
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time, I I was sad about it, you know,
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and I wasn't like super super happy that
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I'd been training and playing for, you
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know, a decade and a half and that it
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was going to come to an end. Um, but you
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know, I think it was it was definitely
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uh you know, it was definitely the right
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decision. I want to touch on the subject
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of race because it's something that
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comes up in the book. And you know, your
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book revealed that there were those in
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the African-American community that were
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some of Obama's harshest critics,
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especially early on in the campaign. Um,
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you know, you said something that they
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saw him as not black enough. Yeah. And
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it and it really struck me. And to you,
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what does not black enough mean for
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those climbing the corporate ladder
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today? And and what kind of information
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did you get from the president that are,
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you know, people in the African-American
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community here at Warden or even other
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minorities can use to kind of think
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about that experience and and kind of
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figure out how to travail some of those
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challenges that they face. Yeah. I mean,
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that's like a I I write that um chapter
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and it's like, you know, uh it says all
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layups aren't easy. Um and that is the
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example I use mainly because uh the the
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the the premise behind it is that you
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know you don't want to take uh the thing
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that's in front of you that's for
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granted right um but as a as a as a
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culture and as a society look I think
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race is something that's so very very
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prevalent and I think it varies from you
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know uh from politics to corporate
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settings to um uh to sports to growing
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up as a you know, as me as a young
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African-American in the South. Um yeah,
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I think it's something that is it's a
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delicate issue. Um the biggest things
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that I always say is that uh as a as an
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African-American um I feel like I have
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more opportunity today uh than my
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parents and grandparents ever had. Um
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did I ever feel like I have every single
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opportunity available to me? No, not so
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much. And you know, and I think I think
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the biggest thing that I try to do,
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which you know, may be wrong or maybe
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right, is that I try to spend less time
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uh focusing on the things that I don't
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have and more time focusing on the
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opportunities and things that are in
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front of me. Uh, and sometimes that's
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like hard to do because uh, you know, I
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remember growing up I went to a small
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private school, you know, Providence Day
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and I remember then like the tuition was
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like it was like $16,000 a year and I
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was like where who can afford this? and
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and uh you know I had my parents like
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were very middle class and uh they
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didn't have a Lexus or a Mercedes or a
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big house or any of those things and um
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and
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you know and it would have been very
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easy for me to say you know look this
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isn't fair or you know you know I want
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what they have or you know but I think
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that at the same time there were like
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people who lived in the neighborhood
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that I lived in that had half of what we
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had uh so
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it's when you look at race as a whole um
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and I think and race and you can go for
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race and can be substituted with gender
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with sexuality
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u with uh you know socioeconomics
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uh I don't think that I I don't think
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that there's like a silver bullet or a
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silver there's no cure all for the
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different ways that we're viewed. I
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think we just as a culture and a
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community, we need to have open hearts
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and open minds as we continue to grow
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that, you know, everyone out there has a
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story to be told, has value to be added
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to whether or not it's a business or to
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the creative process, to the university,
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to an organization. Uh, and you know, if
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we continue to try to do that, I think
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we grow as a country. So, what's one
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lesson that you want our students and
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alumni to take away from from your book
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and your experiences? Yeah. Um
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I I think the the biggest lesson out
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there uh that I that I um
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that I write about is um so when I was
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when I played at Duke, I was a very um I
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was a utility player. Everyone thinks
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that I was like the star because I was a
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captain at for the Duke basketball team.
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I was like I was a captain as a senior,
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but when I was a freshman, I was a
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walk-on. I never thought I was going to
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get on the court. Um, and
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there is value to be had in like in the
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small things. You know, every every um
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scenario that you're in is not going to
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always be uh exactly how you envision it
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or exactly what you want it to be. Um,
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when I played at Duke, I would have much
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rather been like JJ Reic or Shane Badier
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and like national player of the year and
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leading scorer, but I never was. But I
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got I feel like I got just as much value
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as having been a role player there as
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the guys who were superstars. And um and
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the same way when I worked on the
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campaign and in the White House, I was
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never like a chief of staff or
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legislative director. Um, but I feel
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like I learned uh just as much and had
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just as a significant experience for me
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personally to have been there just as a
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personal aid and not the guy who's like
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writing the legislation or deciding
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who's going to go in to kill Bin Laden
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or any of those things. So, you know, I
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think sometimes, you know, there's a
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there there's a lot of value to be had
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in things that don't necessarily seem as
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sexy and as cool as as you may want them
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to be.
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[Music]
