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[Music]
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welcome I'm Stu fredman I'm a faculty
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member at the Wharton School and we're
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here today with Kevin and Hannah soln
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who are going to be speaking with us
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about their incredible story uh which is
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captured in their wonderful book called
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The Power of half it's a story of how
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this family decided to sell their
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mansion in Atlanta and donate the
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proceeds of that sale after moving to a
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house half the value uh to the hunger
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project in uh in support of uh
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development work in
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Ghana welcome Kevin welcome Hannah
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thanks so much for being here today yeah
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great to see you why did you do this
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um well this one day I was um riding in
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the car with my dad and um we stopped at
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a really familiar stoplight and I looked
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to my left and I saw a homeless man
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holding up a sign said Homeless please
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help really typical scene that You'
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pretty much see anywhere and then um I
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looked to my right and I saw a man in a
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Mercedes Coupe and I kind of toggled
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back and forth between the halves and
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the have knots of the situation and I
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said to my dad you know Dad if that man
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in the Mercedes didn't have such a nice
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car then the man over here the homeless
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man could have a meal and my dad thought
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about it for a second and then he said
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yeah but you know if we didn't have such
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a nice car then that man could have a
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meal so that night when we went home we
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kind of talked to my mom and brother
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about it um my mom kind of in a fit of
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frustration said well what do you want
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to do you want to sell the house and I
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said yeah that is what I want to do um
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so that is what we
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did wow now that must have been uh a
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very difficult decision for you uh as a
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family to make and and as you tell so
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compellingly in the in the book uh it it
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really was quite a struggle for you to
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come up with a way to decide how to do
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that as a family and it and it really
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did transform your family in terms of uh
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you're having to identify what matters
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most to you and where you where you're
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going to invest your your your resources
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so tell us about the the process of
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decision-making that led you to actually
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go through with this impulsive idea well
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you know we spent a lot of time in our
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in all of our lives thinking about how
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do I invest money to make more money but
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we our family had never really spent a
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lot of time thinking about how do we
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invest money in order to make change in
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the world and to make a difference and
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so that was a process that we sort of
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had to invent as we went forward with
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this and what we did was we'd get
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together basically every Sunday over
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bagels and coffee and as a forsome you
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know the the two kids and the two adults
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we would research we would go through
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you know discussions about a series of
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issues in the world ranging from sexism
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to lack of Education to lack of water to
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Poverty to really start to understand
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our values first and figure out okay how
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did we want to actually invest our money
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and it was a process that my wife
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essentially invented as we went through
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this and and um by the end of close to a
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year of discussing researching and then
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voting and that's you know an important
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part of this was we voted one person one
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vote and I can get into that yes um you
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know but but we decided you know we
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wanted to work in Africa because in part
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because we were working we were already
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working in the US a lot um we wanted to
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you as a family were already doing work
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here yes yes and and it was and you know
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that was um you know we decided we
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wanted to work in Africa we wanted to
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work with an organization that was very
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entrepreneurial we wanted to work with
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an organization that was very Grassroots
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anyway there were a whole series of
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criteria that we that our year of
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research took us to and the hunger
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project was the organization we decided
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to work with now you said uh one person
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one vote that that's uh one of the more
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striking aspects of the story is your
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decision ultimately as parents to create
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a kind of collective decisionmaking
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where each of the four of you had equal
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voice yeah it was crazy wasn't it I mean
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I mean you know I I when I think about
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what we did you know there there's um
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there's an irrationality to selling your
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house and giving away half of it there's
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all there's possibly something that's
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more irrational about saying okay I'm
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going to let the hormonal teenagers have
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exactly the same same say as the adults
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but you know my wife really insisted on
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this and it was fascinating because it
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was the it's probably the most important
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thing that we did um what what she said
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was you know look who's selling their
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house all four of us you know granted we
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we bought the house but the kids are
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giving up their rooms they're giving up
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their backyard they're moving just as we
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are and so you know to not make this a
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family project in which each family
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member has a say um you know would be
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would be Miss that point and so what we
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did was rather than two parents two kids
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we completely flattened the hierarchy
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one person one vote and it was it was
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possibly the most empowering thing that
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ever happened for these kids well I
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certainly read your book as one of uh a
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family kind of discovering its values
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and how how you wanted to live together
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uh now and in the future uh and and how
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you built trust and relationships uh
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that that you didn't have before in the
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same way in the same depth what was that
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like for you Hannah uh as as one of the
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two children involved in this in terms
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of uh having a greater say and greater
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sense of responsibility was it difficult
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was it fun was it I I mean first of all
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it was unbelievably empowering to have
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you know as much say as your parents in
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in a decision this big um and you know
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we were doing the research together and
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it was it was cool because you know not
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not saying that our that our um opinions
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didn't matter before but um they
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definitely became more important and um
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our parents really did start listening
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to us and when we would have family
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conversations what you said was
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important and what you said really did
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matter so um I mean first of all it was
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just extremely empowering but you know
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as this process went went along I
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realized that I trust my parents more I
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trusted my brother more um we we really
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started um not only were we living in a
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smaller space but we were really um we
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were really connecting over this project
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and and I I did start to realize you
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know Joe isn't really you know your
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brother my brother sorry um isn't really
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into poverty poverty related issues he
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doesn't really like going to you know
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the soup kitchen or the food bank like I
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like but he actually you know likes
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going to the Humane Society or likes he
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does sometimes like going to the food
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bank so you know it's kind of cool to
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see you know what he does like what he
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doesn't like and kind of um me figuring
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out his passions as he's figuring them
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out and kind of um sharing that
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experience together well I'm sure that
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there might be some parents out there
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who are thinking hm equal uh votes to
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children in a family uh that doesn't
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quite square with our values and how we
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operate and I'm sure you must have met
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with some ambivalence in in your
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yourselves about about moving to that
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model I I was nervous about it when Joan
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first brought it up I I actually didn't
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love the idea um in part because I
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worried about how we would wall it off
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not so much in this project but okay how
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do I let my kids have a say over where
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we invest $800,000 which is what we
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ended up
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doing and then at the same time be able
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to turn around and say no you can't use
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the car or no you no you have to do your
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homework before you go out with your
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friends and I wondered where the
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boundary would be so did it become
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harder to draw those limits actually the
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amazing thing is that as we empowered
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the kids to make important decisions
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they stepped up in other areas of their
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lives and so and so you know Hannah
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talked about the empowerment piece
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what's fascinating to me is that you
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know these days first of all the lines
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of communication have become you know we
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went we essentially went from dialup to
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broadband on the lines of communication
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and and if you think about um the fact
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that now I know you know if Hannah's
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going to do something or does do
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something we talk about it and I can
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trust her more to make better decisions
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about those things like when she's going
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to drive the car so I don't even have to
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tell her most of the time but when I do
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she does respect that because she
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understands where I'm coming from
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because she knows me better or she knows
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Joan better you know my wife is this is
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this accurate would you say oh
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definitely I mean I I have no problem um
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you know talking to my parents openly
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you know um telling them things that
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probably most teenagers wouldn't tell
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their parents or sometimes we don't want
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to hear right um but I think that in
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general um our family is just more open
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now and and really have something in
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common and so you you go through this
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process of making a decision ultimately
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to to work with the hunger project and
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then travel to Ghana I I know that
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you've been there at least once
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um tell us about what it was like to uh
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to be there among the people that you
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were working with and uh what you
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encountered there and what you learned
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well when you when you go over to Ghana
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you know with the hunger project um the
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hunger project does no Hands-On work
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they are they really believe in the
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Africans they really believe that um
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that these communities are are kind of
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you know the people in these communities
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are really the change agent of their own
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future and and can really um impact
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their own future so um when we went
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there we really did no Hands-On work I
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was expecting to you know build a well
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or kind of you know what I used to think
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a mission trip was you know and maybe
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build uh paint a church or build a
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school I I really didn't know um and it
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was shocking to me that when I was there
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I was really there to just talk to the
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people and to connect with them and to
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say I believe in you and this work that
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you're doing is really going to change
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your life and in fact I've come 5,000
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miles to see the work that you're doing
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and to see and to see the work that
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you're doing to um change your community
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um and that's really empowering for them
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knowing that we stand behind them and
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that we um are there for them no matter
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what um but also I you know we we went
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to um the opening of a primary school um
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went to the opening of a cmal and this
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is just my favorite part of the whole
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trip was you know seeing how excited
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these people were over this cornmeal you
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know something I'd never even thought
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about you know and I had never even seen
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a cornmeal so being there was so cool
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and these people were so excited and the
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reason that there were so excited was
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because um it meant that their kids
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mainly girls didn't have to walk six
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miles roundt trip to get their corn
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milled anymore but could instead go to
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school and get an education and when I
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was leaving um my dad told me that that
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this cornmeal cost the same amount as
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Joe's braces and it was just astounding
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to me um that I was now seeing that
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community and an ed I mean education in
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a community cost the same amount as
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teeth Beauty something that we pay for
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in this country um and at that moment I
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really did know that that I was doing
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the right thing with my money and and
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really um making a difference in those
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communities one of the important themes
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of the the episode in the book that's
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about your your time and Ghana is how
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you learned that you couldn't really do
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things for people there or even to get
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involved directly in any sort of the the
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the dayto day was was really to be
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intrusive and instead that your primary
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role is as you said it to be supportive
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and to demonstrate your belief in them
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and to show that you investing in them
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and and really to stand back then to to
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to allow them to uh to flourish uh you
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know in in the light of your uh your
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support yeah you know what's so funny is
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you know we're we're here on the Wharton
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Network so I can talk about this in in
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this context but but when I think about
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this it's if if as a boss yeah every
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time one of your employees didn't do
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something the way you would do it if you
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would go back in and do it that exact
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way what would your employee learn learn
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when would that employee learn and how
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you know not very much and not very
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quickly and certainly be disincentive
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right to do great work on their own you
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know why do we go overseas and then
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assume that the that the parameters are
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different that we should go over there
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and we should do the work for these poor
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people in the developing worlds because
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we have more money therefore we're
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smarter nonsense you know but yet we
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take this Paradigm and we completely
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shift it because we've gone to someplace
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with less resources than we have well
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the courses that I teach you are about
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leadership and in particular leadership
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from the point of view of the whole
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person and your your case so well
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illustrates the core ideas of the work
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that we're doing here in in in this
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course workor and and what you just
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described is very much uh an important
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aspect of what it means to lead in the
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modern world to to empower others to get
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things done and to the people on the
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ground who have the answers and who have
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the motivation or need the support
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you're you're providing that and
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stepping back back but it really was a
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struggle both as a parent as well as uh
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as as as a charitable philanthropist you
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know actually if you think about it we
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did the same thing at home that we're
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now we've been asked to do over in
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Africa you know which is Empower people
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to build their own Futures and what's
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fascinating is that that you know that
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that old saying if you give a man a fish
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he'll eat for day you teach a man to
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fish leave for a lifetime well the
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hunger Project's perspective is the man
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already knows how to fish MH the man
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doesn't the man doesn't have the
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resources to be able to to fish the man
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could probably teach you how to fish and
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by the way if you really want success
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the man almost always has to be a woman
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and the hunger projects focuses very
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much on women's empowerment wow why is
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that because because if you give a man
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$10 or a man earns $10 the first thing
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you'll do is smoke some cigarettes drink
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a few coca-colas maybe go out for a beer
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with his friends and then come back with
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a few bucks what the woman will do is
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make sure the school fees are paid for
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first primarily for her daughter as well
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cuz the son's already usually taken care
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of and then make sure the household is
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taken care of and then if there's
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something left over you know then then
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we'll have a
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conversation now this is uh a truly
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remarkable example of U of giving and
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and of sacrifice but I I know that you
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have said extremely eloquently in the
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book and other conversations we've had
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about how uh the return to you
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personally Kevin and to your family was
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much greater than the cost could you say
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a little bit more about that I it's to
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me it it's amazing how we set out to do
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a little bit of good in the world and
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what what it's done for our family for
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our little Community has just completely
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been transformative you know we have at
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a time when our teenagers are supposed
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to be going in every direction our
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family has never been closer that you
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know there's a trust level Among Us
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there's a connectedness Among Us there's
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a currency that that we have that um we
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never had before and um and and I you
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know I think we it's almost like we we
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we Rec we realized that you know we gave
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a little bit but what we've gotten out
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of this has far surpassed that yeah and
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when I think about you know what I miss
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about the old house people always ask me
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you know do you miss do you miss having
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the cool house of course I the elevator
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to your bedroom exactly I mean it was so
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cool when people would come over and say
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come on let's go ride the elevator it's
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my birthday please please um but when I
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think about it um you know giving up the
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house is helping 40,000 villagers in
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Ghana and and has helped our family grow
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closer and have trust in one another and
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I would make that trade any day but it's
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really important and and Hannah you
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should talk to this I think that we
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don't expect anybody else to sell their
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house right you know I mean do you want
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to talk about that a little yeah sure I
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mean obviously we don't expect anyone to
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sell their house especially in this
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tough economy um and and we understand
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that we understand that you know people
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don't have the resour to do that all the
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time but um but we do think that
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everyone has more than enough of
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something in their lives um that they
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can afford to give away half of and that
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can be time you know maybe if you watch
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six hours of TV a week maybe you cut
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that down to three and then you spend
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those three hours um you know at at a at
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a children's shelter or um maybe you um
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decide to take half of your vacation
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that you would normally take and and use
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that time or that money to maybe donate
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to the Ronald McDonald House or visit
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kids in a cancer kids in a Cancer Clinic
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it's really all about finding you know
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that one thing in your life whether it's
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time Talent OR treasure um that you can
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afford to give away half of and the and
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the real key to it is yes if you can get
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together with your family or your dorm
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or your community or your sorority your
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fraternity and do it collectively then
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you get that power that really comes
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from the interconnectedness of your of
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your intentional actions and that's
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where the that's where you know that's
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where the the personal gain comes in and
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you didn't know that that was coming
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that that was sort of an unintended
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byproduct of this amazing uh impulse
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that you had to to try to heal the
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broken world as as some would say it's
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it healed our world I'll tell you that
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much but you're right I mean it's you
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know it's one of those things that if
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you had said okay you know predict the
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future where you by the end of this
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project what's what's going to what's
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the world going to be like for you um I
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wouldn't have told you that our family
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would be that much closer you know I
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would have said well maybe we can you
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know we can help some people and in in
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the developing World build themselves a
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better future and what we ended up doing
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was yes doing that but also building
00:17:34
ourselves a better future which is
00:17:36
really great you you must encounter a
00:17:38
great deal of uh skepticism about people
00:17:42
saying well you could afford to do that
00:17:43
and what you've downsized to is a lot
00:17:45
more than what most people have anyway
00:17:47
so um how do you respond to those kinds
00:17:52
of criticisms and and also the notion of
00:17:55
uh overseas support as opposed to
00:17:58
helping the the many many people here in
00:18:00
America who uh who could also benefit
00:18:02
from philanthropic giving well first of
00:18:05
all this doesn't have to be about money
00:18:07
at all um and that's kind of one of the
00:18:09
main things is that you don't have to
00:18:11
have a lot of money to do a half project
00:18:13
it's all about finding anything in your
00:18:15
life that you can afford to give away
00:18:16
half of whether that's the clothes in
00:18:18
your closet or the amount of time you do
00:18:20
blank or you know how much money you
00:18:22
have it doesn't matter and it's all
00:18:24
about um finding that thing it doesn't
00:18:27
have to be money um but also you know um
00:18:29
the reason that we decided to work
00:18:30
overseas is really um for for three main
00:18:34
reasons and the first reason is um we
00:18:36
were already doing a lot of um community
00:18:39
of a lot of work locally you know I work
00:18:41
at um Cafe 458 which is an Atlanta
00:18:43
restaurant for homeless men um my dad is
00:18:45
on the board of habitat my brother loves
00:18:47
the Humane Society my mom and I work at
00:18:48
the food bank and we we felt like we
00:18:50
were involved in our local community and
00:18:52
also we wanted to work globally but at
00:18:54
the same time we did increase the amount
00:18:56
of work that we were doing locally um
00:18:59
the second reason is we wanted to um to
00:19:01
work in a place where where our money
00:19:03
would would really be um effective we
00:19:05
wanted to watch um the project kind of
00:19:08
progress um see how the villagers were
00:19:11
benefiting from it and really kind of be
00:19:13
able to see what's what um the
00:19:15
improvements that that have been made um
00:19:19
and then also the third reason is there
00:19:20
really is no Safety Net in places like
00:19:22
Gana Africa they don't have the luxury
00:19:25
of having a soup kitchen down the street
00:19:26
or or a food pantry you know two blocks
00:19:29
away they don't even have health care
00:19:30
for tens of miles so um we really wanted
00:19:33
to work in a place where we're going to
00:19:34
make the most impact
00:19:36
mhm and and to get to your question
00:19:39
about um about others reactions yeah you
00:19:43
know we are we are very aware that um
00:19:47
that PE that people in this country are
00:19:49
hurting and we're not insensitive to
00:19:50
that and as Hannah said we did we've
00:19:52
increased both the number of dollars and
00:19:53
the number of hours that we've spent in
00:19:55
our local community um you know during
00:19:58
this whole process and and and you know
00:20:01
one of the cool things about doing a
00:20:03
half project is you know when we teach
00:20:06
this when we go into inner city schools
00:20:08
and we talk about this is that because
00:20:10
it doesn't take any resources you know
00:20:13
other than you know other than the ones
00:20:15
you have available including time you
00:20:17
know and is so great for your personal
00:20:20
Community right that we think it's
00:20:23
actually very helpful for people who are
00:20:25
under Financial stress to actually Focus
00:20:28
outside themselves and to recognize that
00:20:31
there is a bonding experience that they
00:20:33
can have you know look if a family can
00:20:36
bring themselves closer together by
00:20:39
giving a little bit of what they have
00:20:41
you know out into the world you know
00:20:43
look there's a reason why um there's a
00:20:47
reason why the lower income brackets are
00:20:50
the most charitable when you look at
00:20:52
statistic percentage Bas it's it's
00:20:54
because they recognize what it's like to
00:20:55
be that close you know so so how has
00:20:59
this changed your your future outlook uh
00:21:02
I'd like to hear from both of you on
00:21:03
this Kevin you were a a Wall Street
00:21:05
Journal editor and a successful writer
00:21:07
an
00:21:08
entrepreneur um this this this project
00:21:10
now is probably taking up a good deal of
00:21:12
your time and energy and opening up all
00:21:14
kinds of new opportunities for you how
00:21:16
has how how's your professional identity
00:21:19
changed as a result of this
00:21:21
transformative experience well I I think
00:21:24
what's happened in my personal life in
00:21:27
my professional life really is is that
00:21:29
is that I've gone from being you know
00:21:31
just a writer and an entrepreneur to
00:21:33
actually being an evangelist because
00:21:35
we've stumbled across something that
00:21:36
really has become um you know very
00:21:39
powerful for for our family and for the
00:21:41
world and so we want to tell that story
00:21:44
we want people to hear it because we
00:21:45
think it can do great things with their
00:21:47
own communities and so um that's really
00:21:50
where I where I have
00:21:52
transitioned um how about you Hannah
00:21:54
well I'm a junior in high school right
00:21:55
now so um and I want to be a nurse um
00:21:59
and I was definitely inspired by the
00:22:00
nurses in Ghana and just seeing um how
00:22:03
much of an impact that they have on
00:22:04
their communities um but I think that
00:22:07
you know as for the future I think I'll
00:22:09
always find half projects to do half is
00:22:11
such a measurable number you know so
00:22:13
often in our lives we say I wish I could
00:22:15
do more you know but more there's really
00:22:17
nothing to the word more um but you know
00:22:20
with with half it's so measurable and
00:22:21
you can track it and um so I think that
00:22:24
I'll be doing half projects you know for
00:22:25
my whole life could you give us an
00:22:27
update on what's happening in Ghana with
00:22:30
uh the results of your I would say early
00:22:33
results of your Investments there yeah
00:22:35
the the way the hunger project works is
00:22:37
they run a five-year program that helps
00:22:38
villagers move from poverty to
00:22:40
self-reliance and we're in year two with
00:22:43
one of the sets of villages and we're in
00:22:45
year one with the uh with the other sets
00:22:48
of set of villages and so they will be
00:22:50
they will be going for the next 3 to 5
00:22:52
years um three to four years I guess and
00:22:55
um and they are they are on the path to
00:22:59
self-reliance which is a really
00:23:02
considerable thing for these communities
00:23:04
that have traditionally been hand out
00:23:06
communities um and we'll go back over
00:23:09
there very soon and spend more time in
00:23:11
The Villages and meeting with the people
00:23:13
and supporting them and dancing very
00:23:15
badly and you know doing all the things
00:23:18
that we do when we're on and and how's
00:23:20
Joseph doing and why don't you to give
00:23:21
us the update on how your younger
00:23:23
brother family skeptic Joseph is great
00:23:26
um he's kind of he's definitely on board
00:23:28
with the project now he loves the
00:23:30
project um loves um going to Ghana and
00:23:33
so um when we go this summer he's just
00:23:35
really excited about that um but he was
00:23:36
very skeptical at first right he kept
00:23:38
thinking if I if I read it correctly
00:23:40
well how's this going to affect me right
00:23:42
how is this going to benefit me but um
00:23:44
yeah and he he wasn't on board at all um
00:23:47
kind of wanted it to really benefit him
00:23:50
um and didn't really care what we did as
00:23:52
long as it you know really helped him um
00:23:56
but um you know through the project uh
00:23:58
he's got been more empowered and he um
00:24:01
he loves the project now he I think that
00:24:03
one of the greatest Parts um for him was
00:24:07
we when we we went to Ghana they have
00:24:08
the men kind of have this handshake that
00:24:10
they do and and the second that we got
00:24:13
there um Joe learned the handshake and
00:24:16
then kind of connected with all of the
00:24:18
the other guys in Ghana so um that was a
00:24:20
really cool thing for him and he I think
00:24:22
really enjoyed the trip um just by
00:24:24
starting off like that and um you know
00:24:27
he's um he he doing really well I what
00:24:29
do you want to say about him no I mean
00:24:31
Joseph is Joseph actually is a
00:24:32
fascinating character in this play
00:24:33
because he's um he we like to joke that
00:24:36
he is our he's our own peer review
00:24:37
committee you know if we can't get it
00:24:39
through Joseph we haven't thought it
00:24:41
through well enough and it's actually a
00:24:43
very important role you know that
00:24:45
organizationally you know we have to we
00:24:47
have to make sure that we have thought
00:24:49
through our you know what we're doing on
00:24:51
this project well enough to get it past
00:24:54
josephh and um and if we don't he'll
00:24:56
call us on it and he'll call us hard on
00:24:58
it and um and sometimes to the point
00:25:01
where you want to strangle him a little
00:25:02
bit but most of the time he's right and
00:25:06
um and so he's helped us I think in a
00:25:08
lot of ways really focus our thinking
00:25:10
yeah it it doesn't seem like you would
00:25:12
have gotten to where you would have had
00:25:15
he not been the voice of
00:25:17
descent that was empowered to speak
00:25:20
about you know what the the problems
00:25:22
were with your design and forcing you to
00:25:24
adjust continually along the way yeah he
00:25:26
definitely slowed down the process a lot
00:25:28
um I don't think we would have um it I
00:25:31
don't think it would have taken us a
00:25:32
year to decide on an organization if it
00:25:34
wasn't for Joe and he um you know he
00:25:36
always asks why are we doing this again
00:25:38
how is this helping um you know what if
00:25:40
this fails what are we going to do um
00:25:43
and so he he really did have an
00:25:44
important role and he um he constantly
00:25:47
was saying okay this doesn't make sense
00:25:50
guys just slow down because this doesn't
00:25:51
make sense so um when when everybody
00:25:53
else was kind of on a roll and we're
00:25:55
like okay this is what we're doing and
00:25:56
this is the charity that we're working
00:25:57
with this is how much money we're giving
00:25:59
away he was saying whoa whoa whoa I
00:26:00
don't get it I don't get it so we it it
00:26:02
did Force us to slow down and kind of
00:26:04
rethink what we were doing and and make
00:26:06
sure that it did get past Joe well this
00:26:08
is a story that has so many inspiring
00:26:11
ideas and uh illustrations of great
00:26:14
leadership and uh I'm thrilled that you
00:26:16
took the time to visit us today and to
00:26:18
to share your story if people want to
00:26:20
learn more about the work that you are
00:26:22
doing now and and in the future and how
00:26:25
they can adopt some of these ideas and
00:26:27
principles what they do go to the
00:26:29
powerof half.com and they can find they
00:26:32
can keep they can get updated on our
00:26:34
work and you know see where we're going
00:26:36
and also they we're we're about to
00:26:38
launch a uh a program of 52 weeks of
00:26:41
halves so that they can create their
00:26:43
people can create their own half Project
00:26:45
based on uh some ideas that we throw out
00:26:47
there excellent well we'll look forward
00:26:50
to that and to to more from from your
00:26:53
your family and uh and all the people
00:26:55
that you're touching thank you so much
00:26:56
for being here today Kevin Hannah it's
00:26:58
been a real pleasure thank you
