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thank you
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welcome Mr divio thank you very much for
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joining us today uh knowledge Edward and
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for the water in the economic Forum my
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pleasure thank you for letting me be
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here it's a pleasure to have you uh we'd
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love to start off I know you are an Alum
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of the University of Pennsylvania so
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welcome back thank you have you been
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back a lot since you graduated I
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wouldn't say a lot not as much as I
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would like to but it's going to be 30
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years since I graduated which I try not
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to tell too many people because well now
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it's on camera and now it's on camera
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right now so now I'm unfortunately
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dating myself which is uh not a good
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thing but it's uh it was it was
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certainly a cherished memory of mine to
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be a pen I enjoyed being there for the
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four years and it's hard to imagine that
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30 years have gone by but I'm proud to
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be able to come back and contribute in
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some respect to this very important
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event yeah and it's a pleasure having
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alumni come back obviously thank you to
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the campus I would love to start off
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talking about Krillin Mooring and uh
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why are you guys why your firm decided
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to enter India or do you work in India
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no I've been delighted to Kroll is a U.S
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based firm of about 550 lawyers now we
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have offices throughout the U.S but also
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throughout the Middle East and in Europe
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um and about my background I'm actually
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by background at Capital markets and M a
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lawyer with a particular focus on
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cross-border transactional work and I
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manage our Middle East and India
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practices I think the reason that we
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would focus on India is very simple and
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that is that our clients are focused on
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India when we have meetings with some of
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our Marquee clients which are among the
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Fortune 50 and 100 companies in the
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United States and their counterparts in
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Europe they would all list India as
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being one of their top two or three most
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important markets I'm a big believer in
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going where our clients go and what our
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clients want to focus on India that
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means we have to focus on India as well
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that in addition to the fact that India
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is just intrinsically an incredibly
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important and growing part of the world
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economy would make it critical that we
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as a major law firm with International
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reach would want to be present to the
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extent we can be and for our clients in
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India again we add some timelines to the
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Trends you've been saying you know when
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you say your Market clients who are
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looking to have an India strategy
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when has this when what are these
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timelines that you've been seeing when
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did this start happening and how
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strongly is this momentum going forward
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well it's certainly been happening for
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quite a number of years and I think the
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world economic downturn in 2008 kind of
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created a sort of disruption in the flow
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of things but I think that certainly
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over the past two years I've seen a
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dramatic increase in interest among some
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of our Global clients our firm
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represents a significant number of U.S
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government contractors and some
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household names that everyone would be
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familiar with not only the defense
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industry but also just in Government
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Contracting generally and then excuse me
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in particular in the past couple of
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years they've all been very very focused
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on India one of our clients which has a
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multiplicity of subsidiaries in every
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imaginable field one of the one of the
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largest companies in the United States
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has said that they have one ambition
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strategically by the end of 2012 and
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that's to have a certain number of
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strategic Sciences which they've ranked
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by tears and in tier one India ranks
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with one or two other countries I think
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that's very indicative of where a lot of
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the major multinational businesses that
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are based in the US or in Europe are
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looking yeah yeah so since your firm and
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you personally have been doing work
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related to India for the last couple of
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years or more
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share some of your perceptions for us on
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the Indian legal system as a whole now
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obviously India as a country especially
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when you compare to other fast growing
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economies in the world often is touted
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as you know strong democracy with
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vibrant institutions including you know
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Judiciary its legal system
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how do you view it
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um without exception India offers I
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think a degree of comfort that many
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other jurisdictions do not to let's say
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Western businesses that are either doing
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business in India or with Indian
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counterparts there is a widespread
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recognition I believe that the Indian
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legal system because of its Heritage its
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long tradition of Independence and it's
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a similarity for example uh to UK and
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some Western legal systems as well as
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the language familiarity which cannot be
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understated
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um and the and the the cultural comfort
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that I think the legal profession in
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India has dealing with Western clients
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are all significant contributing factors
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to why American and European uh
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companies for example find it more
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comfortable to work in India and with
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Indian law firms than they would in
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other parts of the world
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that is also
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enhanced by the fact that India I think
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in many respects is uniquely positioned
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to look both East and West when it comes
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to businesses and I think that in many
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respects India and Indian law firms can
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act as a bridge between not only India
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and the west but the west and the rest
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of Asia
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um having said that I think that you
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know not wanting to be in politic or on
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diplomatic I I do like to think that
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there are things that both Indian law
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firms and lawyers can learn from Western
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law firms and vice versa and I and I
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think that we are seeing some of those
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Trends uh emerge when I talk to our U.S
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clients for example they generally
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remain largely more comfortable if for
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example an American lawyer were to be
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involved in in the transaction or into
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the project and not simply go directly
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to Indian firms I think over good food
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which is good for me and so we are
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somewhat in a in a conflicted position
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in that sense but we we try to manage
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that correctly and always do what the
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client wants but I think it's indicative
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of the fact that there is still perhaps
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a ways to go for Indian lawyers and law
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firms to be more Western in their in
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their approach to things and to yeah
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us oh sure what would that imply what
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would that mean I think perhaps the most
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important thing for if I were to be
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presumptuous enough to give advice to
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Indian lawyers it would be to to try to
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think more the way Western clients think
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and to act more the way they expect
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their lawyers to act and and that their
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lawyers their successful lawyers do act
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in the West in terms of responsiveness
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getting back quickly for example on
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email when a western client says they
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need something they generally don't want
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to wait a day or two they very often
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don't want to wait more than an hour or
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two to get an answer I think that's one
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thing I think the efficiency of
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responding is also very important in
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terms of not necessarily having to crank
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out a voluminous memorandum on every
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topic but to be able to provide quick
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practical not academic not winded
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explanations when a client says I'm need
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to know can I do this or can I not do
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that or what are the ramifications to be
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able to respond swiftly and clearly and
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concisely is very important and I think
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also part of it is mindset there I have
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met and there are undoubtedly many other
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Indian lawyers who are very much
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business focused have have the kind of
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business Acumen not simply legal Acumen
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but business Acumen to stand in the
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shoes of their clients that many
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successful Western lawyers have and I
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think Western clients like that they
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want to be able to talk to a lawyer not
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simply as someone who knows the law but
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someone who can take that in a very
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practical and real way and apply it to
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their specific needs and maybe answer
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questions that the client itself hasn't
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even asked so if I can flip that around
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and ask you what have you seen in the
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way law firms are managed in in their
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some of the larger law firms or in the
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way the legal system works or in the way
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lawyers approach their work
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are there any lessons that you've seen
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that you can draw for the U.S lawyers or
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other lawyers around the world
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um well I do I do think that American
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lawyers and Western lawyers in
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particular need to understand uh that
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just because something works for for an
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American client or for an American
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client doing business in the United
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States or in Europe doesn't necessarily
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mean that that's the way it's going to
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work in India we need to be aware of the
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fact that India has its own traditions
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and its own ways of doing business and
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its own ways of dealing with legal
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issues so clearly for me
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working very closely with qualified
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Indian lawyers that I have chemistry
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with and that I feel comfortable with
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and that just as importantly feel
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comfortable with me is critical we are
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not going in to India
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in in some backdoor way that we know
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frankly other Western Law Firms have
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done
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um we would rather go in in tandem with
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qualified Indian lawyers when we have a
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legal issue for example or one of our
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clients has a legal issue my preferred
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way of handling it is to be an advisor
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to my client the same way I am anywhere
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else in the world but to acknowledge the
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fact that I will never understand the
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Indian legal system or the culture or
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the business Community or political
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context as well as a qualified Indian
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lawyer and I would rather than reach out
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to one of my counterparts at an Indian
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law firm and team up on providing a
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solution that the client will benefit
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from right
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if I can then quickly change tag and ask
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you about the regulatory hurdles that
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some of your clients have faced you know
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from your clients perspective especially
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the U.S companies that you're
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representing or helping out with in
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India what are some of let's say like
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the top three issues that they would
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want to see changes in
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without exception of breaking down of
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barriers on FDI
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would be very helpful right in various
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sectors the liberalization of some of
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those rules aware currently non-indian
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investors cannot participate or they can
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only participate with prior government
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approval or in a very restricted way I
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think
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um I can give you countless examples
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which you know which I which I'm not at
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Liberty to but Commerce examples where
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we have had to either back away from
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transactions or completely restructure
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them and or and spend a lot of time and
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money restructuring them in order to
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conform to some of these rules I think
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liberalization of the FDI regime is of
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critical importance to further work by
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U.S and European counterparts
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I think in increased adherence to
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transparency
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um and I don't simply mean that from
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um from a avoidance of improper uh
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conduct which you know is not in any way
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unique to India it's it's endemic
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throughout many countries including to
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some extent in the United States but uh
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the the certainty of dealing with a
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transparent business process that is
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fair and Equitable and open is
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incredibly important and then I think
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the Third Kind of flows from that which
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is a an increased efficiency and
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elimination of bureaucracy and dealing
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with business and legal processes would
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be very important yeah finally one
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element of the U.S sort of interaction
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within us the U.S and Indian legal
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systems other legal fraternities has
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been this uh emergence of what we call
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lpos legal process outsources yes the
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equivalent of bpos which have been
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around for much longer any quick
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thoughts or your perspective on where
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you see the legal process Outsourcing
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industry going and how you see that
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relationship between the U.S and Indian
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uh
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I guess legal entities growing forward I
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think it's an important attribute and a
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comparative advantage that American law
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firms have been slow to embrace because
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they view it I think is kind of a way of
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siphoning business away from it but I I
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just don't think that's the right way to
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look at it we've actually embraced this
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outside of India to some extent by
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opening up our offices in the Middle
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East where the cost structure for
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example is considerably lower right now
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that's a little bit easier for a law
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firm to embrace because those are our
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lawyers and so the revenue stays within
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the firm but as part of the overall way
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of doing things it fits squarely into
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what we're doing in India so for example
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when a client comes to us and says we
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have a major project in India they
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clearly want us to be involved in a very
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significant way but we will very often
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in addition to bringing in the Indian
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counterpart the Indian Law Firm or
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lawyer in order to handle the matters
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that we cannot legally handle will very
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often push a lot of the the elements of
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that transaction or project into the
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Indian firm which may take Revenue away
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from us in some respects but it keeps
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the overall budget in line and allows us
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to win the work and I'd rather win the
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work and give up some Revenue than not
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be able to do the project at all so I
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think that the comparative advantage is
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a is a tremendous asset that we have
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already gotten comfortable with in other
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parts of the world and I think that we
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will continue to do that and our clients
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will continue to insist on it when we
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deal with work in India and now beyond
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that of course there are things that
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could be done by Indian lpos that are
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not directly related to work in India
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and so by virtue of the high quality of
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and training of the lawyers there that
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you're going to see an increasing amount
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of that work being outsourced and I
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think that we would be comfortable with
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that I think we have a ways to go to
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embrace it ourselves and understand it I
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don't mean to suggest that Kroll is
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ahead of the curve I would say quite the
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opposite but I think that we have more
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flexibility maybe and and more
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willingness to do that than some law
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firms might sure well it's been a
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pleasure having you Mr dufio with us
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thank you again for sharing the time and
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we hope you enjoy the rest of the Forum
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thank you very much it's been a great
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pleasure thank you so much
