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our guest today is principal Linda quiet
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women who is the principal of Strawberry
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Mansion High School in North
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Philadelphia principal Wayman thank you
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so much for joining us today and joining
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me in interviewing her is my friend and
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colleague Marie Christine Bala Bennion
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who is a Wharton alum and also the
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founder of nurture networks in San
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Francisco
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MC thank you for joining us in this
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conversation thank you for having me so
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a principal women of very first question
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I've been very curious about is how did
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you get inspired to become a teacher was
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it a person or a situation that led you
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into teaching well it was actually a
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situation I went to Simon I don't want
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it in your hands cause I went to high
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school here in Philadelphia and the high
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school was not a very good one and so
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when I was there I would always talk
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about I was always wanting to my mother
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as a mom but I'm not learning anything
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they're not teaching me anything mom and
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so she said well I want to understand
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that you had already gone to great
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schools up to grade 8 and you decided to
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go to the school in the neighborhood so
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why is the school so terrible I said
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mommy had to come and see it we're not
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learning anything and so I went to
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college thinking that first I was going
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to go into criminal justice and then
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when I was there in college I realized
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that I was not prepared for college and
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it was so hard for me there and a lot of
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my friends were also come from falling
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off you actually failed out of school
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and that's when I decided that I wanted
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to go back to be a teacher because I
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never wanted anyone else to go to
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college the way I did and that's all
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became a teacher how did you end up at
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Strawberry Mansion
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oh well again I was assistant
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superintendent high schools and it was
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my job to find the principal that would
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take over story of magic after the
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merger or three schools Strawberry
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Mansion is a very sits in a very
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dangerous neighborhood and so after two
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national searches I could not find a
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principal and so I looked at all 52
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other principals and said while just
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move someone out of their school to
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Strawberry Mansion and that yielded one
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Kennedy and our broader into the office
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and I said I have to move you to
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Strawberry Mansion and she lifted up our
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shirt and displayed a small device and I
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said what is that she said it's a heart
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monitor she said I will go but it may
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kill me and so I was right back to where
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I started and so one day I was walking
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into the school district building and I
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was so depressed about it because I
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could not find a principal I was very
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scared or frightened for the kids the
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community and I actually heard a voice
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and a voice said you go and I actually
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stopped and I said and I even sent me go
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I actually said it out loud because it
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was just that the boys was just that
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clear and I said you go make oh and so I
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actually went back to the office and I
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thought about it as I was walking to my
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office I thought oh my goodness this is
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why I can't find the principal I am the
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principal in the next era Zond and
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that's how I got just where you're
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managing yep so it sounded like you were
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actually quite terrified yourself of how
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rough some of these rival neighborhoods
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had become what gave you the courage the
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resolve to make a positive difference I
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think I just cared enough um and
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everyone didn't think I was crazy they
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say why would you go in there there's
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nothing you can do that why would you
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leave the job to go there and then I
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realized that I had been through some of
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these experiences before it was my first
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time being a principal I realized I knew
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the community and and I realized I
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always did have courage to address
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difficult situations and so I thought
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about I was a person if I was prepared
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for it the most of any back of fine and
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so I just took a deep breath and went in
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there and realize when I got there and
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what I saw was so unbelievably terrible
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that it will take someone not not saying
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that I was special but least someone
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decay
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good enough to try to fix it and that's
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why I thought I mean I didn't go in
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thinking I could do it I wouldn't
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thinking that I had to do it mmm there
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had to do it so you described it as a
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really difficult situation can you tell
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us exactly what the situation was and
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how did you deal with it
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wow that's a big question but it was so
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many things like from the beginning this
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to school right on down to the school
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schedule wasn't correct the classes they
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were rostering the kids to was not
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correct
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the students refused to go in the
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classroom at all just wouldn't go in the
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room at all I couldn't understand why
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they wouldn't go in the room and it was
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because the teachers didn't want him in
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the room actually
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be honest with you and the only reason
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why I would say that is because they
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told me the story and they say woman's
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eye so god you have to go to class to
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get your work then you cannot walk the
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halls and they said well there's no need
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to do that and I said well why that's it
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what it gave me my packet I said what
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packet listen miss Wayman you got more
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Monday you pick up your pack in the work
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can you bring it back on Friday
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and I would get your grade so it's no
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need to go I gotta believe it so to me
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so it was the students who had low
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expectations it was a staff that had no
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expectations and when I finally figured
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out what it was it was that everybody in
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the building had no hope everybody
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expected to be that way nobody expected
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anything different so the students just
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went along with what they expected so it
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was just one that but the biggest thing
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was the level of violence that was in
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the school the mass of fights threats
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against the teachers threats against the
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support staff the drug issues I'm
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bringing drugs into the building it was
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just a lot everything you can imagine
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what's happening or at one time but it
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was because they expect they did not
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expect anything else no one did so the
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kids just went along with their
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expectation hmm
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so it sounds like you walked into an
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environment of hostility and
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unfortunately resigned hope how did you
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go about trying to spark that within the
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teachers within the students and did you
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start to see patterns of influence
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positive influence start to emerge
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absolutely well I think I went in with a
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very open mind and the first thing I
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talked about with the staff is about my
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expectations about what was going to
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happen here about how we were going to
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create an environment for these students
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no matter how that you know no matter
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what how they felt about the students
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abilities we were going to create the
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best environment possible so I talked to
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the staff about that and I said to them
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we'll listen I understand have a lot of
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challenges I understand all the problems
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I've heard them all I've researched them
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all you've told me them all but now
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again so what now what so what now what
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but we have to do something and if you
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don't think this is the place for you
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then you have to go somewhere else and
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so that's how I start the conversation
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then after that I told them about you
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know they would tell me things the
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things they're not supposed to do
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because of their contract and we're not
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doing that and so I actually researched
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the contract and I found ways to say oh
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the contract doesn't say you can't do
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that this is what the contract says so I
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had to teach them about their own
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contract right so it was about getting
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my own knowledge they try to figure out
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how to go around the system and then I
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just talked to the students about what I
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expected and I did telling this time the
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story once it was just so out of control
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and they came into the auditorium I had
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never seen anybody enter auditorium that
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way jumping over the seats running
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around I just I couldn't see anything
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like that and so finally I had to tell
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them his story about this is my house
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it's not your house one day I wanted to
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be our house but today is mine I don't
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tell you what to do it your house
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and you don't tend to do it mine you
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follow the rules in your house and you
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want to follow the rules in my house and
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I had to have that conversation with
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them and then it's going to look at me
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crazy and like oh how can we make to
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this because some things my mother's not
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going to allow her house either and I
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said I'm not going to allow them in here
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either and that's what it was like I
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have not heart-to-heart conversation
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with everyone you can leave you don't
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have to stay but you're going to follow
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the rules we said here and that's where
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it started with rules and consequences
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that's where it started hmm in order to
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bring about change in such a difficult
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situation
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you obviously need leadership skills
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what skills did you find you needed the
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most and how did you develop them in
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yourself if someone asked me to number
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one skill that I had to have it was
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courage you considered a skill I
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considered a skill it was courage
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because there is no way that I could
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have make any change there if I was
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afraid to talk to anyone about anything
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and that was pretty much the problem no
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one had ever told adults in the building
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where they was they couldn't could not
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do so courage is one so so if you talk
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about courage as a skill it's something
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that improves with practice can you
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explain how you develop that among
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everything yourself
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I think what I do is I I focus on
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learning about a lot of different things
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and I study and I research a lot of
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things before I even start
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I'm not going to approach anybody with
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something I don't know for sure
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and so I research it and I study it and
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I teach myself about all kinds of things
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so that when I'm speaking to people
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about things that I'm well versed enough
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in the matter that it takes my fear away
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because sometimes when you're fearful
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because you just don't know enough and
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so that's pretty much you know that's
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actually how I got it you know I took
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the same type of um same type of pattern
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when I went to Ted I was I was totally
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afraid of it
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but I studied and I learned and I
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practiced so that's usually what I do to
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get rid of of my fear I mean give it a
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fee to develop my cart my garbage it
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takes quite of a lot of courage just to
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dream and it sounds like you were the
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first amongst your teachers to paint the
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vision of success this is what that
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dream looks like they saw it they had
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the reactions that you you had done your
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research to debunk or to help them
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navigate the change to do at any point
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start to feel any overwhelming sense
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that this may be above the cut this may
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be too much to handle this may be more
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than one person can accomplish alone and
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when you had that moment how did you
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move through it and just get stuff done
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well actually I had that moment actually
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before the school even opened as we're
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reading about Strawberry Mansion all of
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the crime and the violence then before
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the school doors open in September I had
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that moment and so I contacted people to
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help me that I knew that I thought could
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help me I knew I needed help there's no
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way I could have done it and I knew I
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needed unconventional help so actually I
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contacted a attorney general's office um
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and I said to them I'm going to need
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help and I didn't know really what I was
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why I contacted them I just figured it
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was it was just so violent so much
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violence in that area that I was going
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to need some people that was going to be
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different and maybe they had some sort
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of program I had no idea what they were
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going to do and they came out one of
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these active directory um came out to
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speak to me about what we can do to try
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to make strawberry interstate because
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they were already in that area doing
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some surveillance work and so he put in
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a program for me and when I will again
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when I realized I was over my head is
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when we had an assembly program that he
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had bought in on non-violence and the
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program was about the Columbine shooting
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well believe it or not was about the
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caliban shooting and how that was
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inappropriate and I really didn't know
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where they were going with this program
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going on violence but the one thing that
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really made me actually cry was when it
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was some sort of simulation of the
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shooting in Colorado it was like they
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were actually in this video shooting
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people and all of my students are rubbed
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into laughter oh my gosh I was in shock
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and I stood there in tears
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this is myself oh my god if they find
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this funny yeah then what am I going to
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do and so I called them all to the room
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a group of local group of students as I
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need to know I need to know why you find
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that funny and he's it to me we see that
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every day
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hmm you thought that was something miss
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Wayman that's nothing compared to what
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we see every day and every night and
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that's when I said oh my god this is
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going to be a challenge this is going to
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be a challenge because these students
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they are just scarred and I'm going to
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have to get some healing done and if
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only way I could figure that out was to
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provide some hope and to do that I had
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to provide them with other experiences
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to counteract what they've already seen
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and that's what I started out doing what
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other experiences help them heal or oh
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just taking them out of the community I
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had to get them out of the community and
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see something different especially when
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you have 11 12th graders who lived down
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the street from the Philadelphia Zoo and
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never been to the zoo never been to the
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zoo live right down the street so we
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took trips everywhere to every college
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campus you could imagine we've taken
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them to every every place the kids
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wanted to go we raised money and took
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them there even when they didn't want to
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go we brought in a bunch of mentors we
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got trauma training from certain people
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from different people we anybody that
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wanted to come in and volunteer we
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allowed them to they were a special
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program it without even just one child
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so we had to teach them that people were
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in
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in them and they were invested in them
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and they were not in this world alone
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because they didn't know that they
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didn't know it so through the
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experiences and different people working
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with them they begin to see themselves
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like oh okay okay okay maybe I can see
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something different maybe I can't do
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something different and that's how we
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started was that a journey of self
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acceptance for them and do you feel that
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that would have been possible without
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the unconditional love that you speak of
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that invited them to try these new
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experiences I think with snn for them
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realizing that they would have to
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embrace perseverance that all of things
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that have happened to them were never
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going to go away did they would have
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their and they had to learn to live with
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it and move past it and the only way for
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them to do that was to constantly keep
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telling them that I love them if nobody
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ever told you I love you and you can do
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it and you want to yes all of these
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horrible things have always already
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happened to you and miss Wayman can't
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take them away and so I say the same
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thing to them so what now what what can
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we do together to get past this and so
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realizing letting them is self accepting
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that this is my experience this is my
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journey I can't change the journey but I
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can live with the journey and I use it
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to push me forward and I think that's
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what we have installed in the children
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that you have to Waddle in your despair
00:17:08
you can use it to push it forward what
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are the biggest challenges your students
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face today and how are you helping them
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overcome them
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Wow there's still so many you know that
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the stories you hear just awful awful
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stories so again the one thing we try to
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instill in them again is a set of core
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values of just guys listen you always
00:17:35
want to need someone to help you there's
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nothing wrong with
00:17:38
handout you eat the other one with
00:17:40
asking for assistance understanding
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perseverance understand you got to stay
00:17:44
focused understand there are a lot of
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things that are going to stand in your
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way
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and so what we constantly do to be
00:17:50
honest with you is just keep talking to
00:17:52
them it really is that's really the only
00:17:56
thing you can do is show them
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experiences and talk to them and let
00:18:00
them see and hear a different way so I
00:18:02
hope I answered your question but that's
00:18:04
pretty much what we do on a daily basis
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it is oh and it's exhausting it's
00:18:10
exhausting trying to get them but this
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is the way you have to look at it the
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way you're looking at it it's not really
00:18:15
healthy for you and it's difficult and I
00:18:19
just talked to my young men about a lot
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of things about the law about staying on
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task about minding your business staying
00:18:26
focused but it's just talking and
00:18:29
experiences that's our biggest thing at
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Strawberry Mansion
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what can we show them different I hope I
00:18:35
answered your question it's a great
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question and and as our communities can
00:18:40
easily define our own perceptions of
00:18:42
ourselves and you bring them into these
00:18:45
new experiences that allow them to
00:18:47
question is that really me is that my
00:18:50
identity has that changed the dynamic
00:18:52
between the community within the school
00:18:55
and beyond the school and is our the
00:18:58
positive is the positive impact of that
00:19:00
starting to show throughout the wider
00:19:02
community the school environment you
00:19:07
just wouldn't know it it's just so
00:19:10
different and so it is you know every
00:19:12
before I even got here I received an
00:19:14
email from one of my teachers and she
00:19:16
said you know most women we just our
00:19:18
town hall may not speak about a lot
00:19:20
about Tahoe media we have time for the
00:19:21
kids are sitting talking that question
00:19:23
and she said you know MS Wayman it was
00:19:26
just so beautiful to see them today so
00:19:28
much growth um in them and how they even
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interact with each other in auditorium
00:19:33
how they're able to run their own
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performances now we don't have to do it
00:19:36
anymore
00:19:37
and they were so well behaved and she
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was saying I wish that you know more
00:19:41
schools in Philadelphia were realized
00:19:43
the importance of these programs and so
00:19:45
I know it is prayer within the school
00:19:47
outside the community also when we left
00:19:51
it when the other day we had election
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day we were all leaving my staff and I
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there were all the people from the polls
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were outside and one gentleman stood up
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and said listen guys we have to get
00:20:00
these kids the staff around them apart
00:20:02
we're to thank these people because
00:20:04
because of them we don't have that
00:20:06
confusion that we used to have on the
00:20:09
way home from school
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you can keep your business open we have
00:20:12
to thank these people so I know it's
00:20:14
starting to spread but it's a long
00:20:17
journey but it that felt good to realize
00:20:20
the people for the community had noticed
00:20:22
how hard we're working oh you did I
00:20:26
think we could probably keep talking
00:20:29
with you all day but I think we have
00:20:30
time for last couple of questions so
00:20:32
maybe I'll ask one and then I'll leave
00:20:35
it to emcee to ask the final one what do
00:20:38
you think other leaders and the
00:20:40
education world can learn from your
00:20:43
experience well the one thing they have
00:20:51
to learn from my experiences they have
00:20:53
to lead there are a lot of school
00:20:56
leaders who do not realize that it is
00:20:59
their job to lead that they wait for
00:21:02
someone else to come in and do it for
00:21:04
them you get all these stories about
00:21:05
what central office is supposed to do
00:21:07
Norma see here and I'm going to wait no
00:21:09
no what happens in your school depends
00:21:13
on your leadership you are in control or
00:21:16
what happens in that building it's all
00:21:18
your in within your control and a lot of
00:21:22
school that is really that I've come
00:21:24
across
00:21:24
don't really understand that it's their
00:21:27
role they really think they play second
00:21:30
fiddle to this big organization like all
00:21:32
central offices are going to come run a
00:21:34
school for them and had to teach them
00:21:36
that central office is support they've
00:21:39
got the leadership they're in control
00:21:41
what happens you get the last question
00:21:44
sure so so building on that given that
00:21:48
you give so much of yourself to leave
00:21:51
how do you refuel yourself so that you
00:21:54
can welcome give the generosity and
00:21:56
welcome the recognition of that general
00:21:58
city and continue to leave it even
00:22:00
harder with stronger heart Wow well
00:22:03
really I the way I I actually realized
00:22:07
myself and get renewed in this business
00:22:09
is that I tell myself that because I'm
00:22:14
working this horn and because I believe
00:22:17
in what I'm doing that I get the
00:22:19
opportunity to save somebody's life and
00:22:21
so saving their life knowing that how
00:22:24
important this work is and that if I
00:22:26
didn't do it it could be it could turn
00:22:29
out bad for someone so I take great
00:22:31
pride in
00:22:32
Linda you're helping to save someone's
00:22:35
life so I do exercise I try to eat good
00:22:38
but just knowing that I hope one more
00:22:41
person escape poverty
00:22:44
especially when you come a poverty
00:22:46
yourself feel real good you feel real
00:22:50
good principle women thank you thank you
00:22:53
very much for speaking with knowledge at
00:22:54
Wharton thank you very much thank you
00:22:56
guys I appreciate you ask me to put here
00:22:58
I appreciate
00:23:15
you
