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our guest today is principal Linda quiet women who is the principal of Strawberry
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Mansion High School in North Philadelphia principal Wayman thank you so much for joining us today and joining
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me in interviewing her is my friend and colleague Marie Christine Bala Bennion who is a Wharton alum and also the
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founder of nurture networks in San Francisco MC thank you for joining us in this
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conversation thank you for having me so a principal women of very first question
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I've been very curious about is how did you get inspired to become a teacher was
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it a person or a situation that led you into teaching well it was actually a situation I went to Simon I don't want
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it in your hands cause I went to high school here in Philadelphia and the high school was not a very good one and so
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when I was there I would always talk about I was always wanting to my mother as a mom but I'm not learning anything
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they're not teaching me anything mom and so she said well I want to understand
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that you had already gone to great schools up to grade 8 and you decided to go to the school in the neighborhood so
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why is the school so terrible I said mommy had to come and see it we're not learning anything and so I went to
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college thinking that first I was going to go into criminal justice and then when I was there in college I realized
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that I was not prepared for college and it was so hard for me there and a lot of
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my friends were also come from falling off you actually failed out of school and that's when I decided that I wanted
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to go back to be a teacher because I never wanted anyone else to go to college the way I did and that's all
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became a teacher how did you end up at Strawberry Mansion oh well again I was assistant
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superintendent high schools and it was my job to find the principal that would take over story of magic after the
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merger or three schools Strawberry Mansion is a very sits in a very dangerous neighborhood and so after two
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national searches I could not find a principal and so I looked at all 52 other principals and said while just
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move someone out of their school to Strawberry Mansion and that yielded one Kennedy and our broader into the office
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and I said I have to move you to Strawberry Mansion and she lifted up our shirt and displayed a small device and I
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said what is that she said it's a heart monitor she said I will go but it may
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kill me and so I was right back to where I started and so one day I was walking into the school district building and I
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was so depressed about it because I could not find a principal I was very scared or frightened for the kids the
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community and I actually heard a voice and a voice said you go and I actually stopped and I said and I even sent me go
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I actually said it out loud because it was just that the boys was just that clear and I said you go make oh and so I
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actually went back to the office and I thought about it as I was walking to my office I thought oh my goodness this is
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why I can't find the principal I am the principal in the next era Zond and that's how I got just where you're
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managing yep so it sounded like you were actually quite terrified yourself of how
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rough some of these rival neighborhoods had become what gave you the courage the
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resolve to make a positive difference I think I just cared enough um and everyone didn't think I was crazy they
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say why would you go in there there's nothing you can do that why would you leave the job to go there and then I
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realized that I had been through some of these experiences before it was my first
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time being a principal I realized I knew the community and and I realized I always did have courage to address
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difficult situations and so I thought about I was a person if I was prepared for it the most of any back of fine and
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so I just took a deep breath and went in there and realize when I got there and what I saw was so unbelievably terrible
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that it will take someone not not saying that I was special but least someone decay
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good enough to try to fix it and that's why I thought I mean I didn't go in
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thinking I could do it I wouldn't thinking that I had to do it mmm there had to do it so you described it as a
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really difficult situation can you tell us exactly what the situation was and how did you deal with it
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wow that's a big question but it was so many things like from the beginning this
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to school right on down to the school schedule wasn't correct the classes they
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were rostering the kids to was not correct the students refused to go in the classroom at all just wouldn't go in the
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room at all I couldn't understand why they wouldn't go in the room and it was
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because the teachers didn't want him in the room actually be honest with you and the only reason
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why I would say that is because they told me the story and they say woman's eye so god you have to go to class to
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get your work then you cannot walk the halls and they said well there's no need
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to do that and I said well why that's it what it gave me my packet I said what
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packet listen miss Wayman you got more Monday you pick up your pack in the work can you bring it back on Friday
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and I would get your grade so it's no need to go I gotta believe it so to me
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so it was the students who had low expectations it was a staff that had no expectations and when I finally figured
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out what it was it was that everybody in the building had no hope everybody expected to be that way nobody expected
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anything different so the students just went along with what they expected so it
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was just one that but the biggest thing was the level of violence that was in the school the mass of fights threats
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against the teachers threats against the support staff the drug issues I'm bringing drugs into the building it was
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just a lot everything you can imagine what's happening or at one time but it
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was because they expect they did not expect anything else no one did so the kids just went along with their
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expectation hmm so it sounds like you walked into an environment of hostility and
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unfortunately resigned hope how did you go about trying to spark that within the
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teachers within the students and did you start to see patterns of influence positive influence start to emerge
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absolutely well I think I went in with a very open mind and the first thing I talked about with the staff is about my
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expectations about what was going to happen here about how we were going to create an environment for these students
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no matter how that you know no matter what how they felt about the students abilities we were going to create the
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best environment possible so I talked to the staff about that and I said to them
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we'll listen I understand have a lot of challenges I understand all the problems
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I've heard them all I've researched them all you've told me them all but now
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again so what now what so what now what but we have to do something and if you don't think this is the place for you
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then you have to go somewhere else and so that's how I start the conversation
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then after that I told them about you know they would tell me things the things they're not supposed to do
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because of their contract and we're not doing that and so I actually researched
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the contract and I found ways to say oh the contract doesn't say you can't do
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that this is what the contract says so I had to teach them about their own contract right so it was about getting
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my own knowledge they try to figure out how to go around the system and then I just talked to the students about what I
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expected and I did telling this time the story once it was just so out of control
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and they came into the auditorium I had never seen anybody enter auditorium that
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way jumping over the seats running around I just I couldn't see anything like that and so finally I had to tell
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them his story about this is my house it's not your house one day I wanted to
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be our house but today is mine I don't tell you what to do it your house and you don't tend to do it mine you
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follow the rules in your house and you want to follow the rules in my house and I had to have that conversation with
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them and then it's going to look at me crazy and like oh how can we make to this because some things my mother's not
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going to allow her house either and I said I'm not going to allow them in here
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either and that's what it was like I have not heart-to-heart conversation with everyone you can leave you don't
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have to stay but you're going to follow the rules we said here and that's where
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it started with rules and consequences that's where it started hmm in order to
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bring about change in such a difficult situation you obviously need leadership skills
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what skills did you find you needed the most and how did you develop them in yourself if someone asked me to number
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one skill that I had to have it was courage you considered a skill I considered a skill it was courage
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because there is no way that I could have make any change there if I was afraid to talk to anyone about anything
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and that was pretty much the problem no one had ever told adults in the building
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where they was they couldn't could not do so courage is one so so if you talk
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about courage as a skill it's something that improves with practice can you explain how you develop that among
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everything yourself I think what I do is I I focus on learning about a lot of different things
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and I study and I research a lot of things before I even start I'm not going to approach anybody with
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something I don't know for sure and so I research it and I study it and I teach myself about all kinds of things
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so that when I'm speaking to people about things that I'm well versed enough
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in the matter that it takes my fear away because sometimes when you're fearful
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because you just don't know enough and so that's pretty much you know that's
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actually how I got it you know I took the same type of um same type of pattern when I went to Ted I was I was totally
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afraid of it but I studied and I learned and I practiced so that's usually what I do to
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get rid of of my fear I mean give it a fee to develop my cart my garbage it takes quite of a lot of courage just to
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dream and it sounds like you were the first amongst your teachers to paint the vision of success this is what that
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dream looks like they saw it they had the reactions that you you had done your research to debunk or to help them
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navigate the change to do at any point start to feel any overwhelming sense that this may be above the cut this may
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be too much to handle this may be more than one person can accomplish alone and when you had that moment how did you
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move through it and just get stuff done well actually I had that moment actually
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before the school even opened as we're reading about Strawberry Mansion all of
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the crime and the violence then before the school doors open in September I had that moment and so I contacted people to
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help me that I knew that I thought could help me I knew I needed help there's no
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way I could have done it and I knew I needed unconventional help so actually I contacted a attorney general's office um
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and I said to them I'm going to need help and I didn't know really what I was
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why I contacted them I just figured it was it was just so violent so much violence in that area that I was going
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to need some people that was going to be different and maybe they had some sort of program I had no idea what they were
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going to do and they came out one of these active directory um came out to speak to me about what we can do to try
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to make strawberry interstate because they were already in that area doing some surveillance work and so he put in
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a program for me and when I will again when I realized I was over my head is when we had an assembly program that he
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had bought in on non-violence and the program was about the Columbine shooting well believe it or not was about the
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caliban shooting and how that was inappropriate and I really didn't know where they were going with this program
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going on violence but the one thing that really made me actually cry was when it
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was some sort of simulation of the shooting in Colorado it was like they were actually in this video shooting
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people and all of my students are rubbed into laughter oh my gosh I was in shock
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and I stood there in tears this is myself oh my god if they find this funny yeah then what am I going to
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do and so I called them all to the room a group of local group of students as I need to know I need to know why you find
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that funny and he's it to me we see that every day hmm you thought that was something miss
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Wayman that's nothing compared to what we see every day and every night and that's when I said oh my god this is
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going to be a challenge this is going to be a challenge because these students they are just scarred and I'm going to
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have to get some healing done and if only way I could figure that out was to provide some hope and to do that I had
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to provide them with other experiences to counteract what they've already seen
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and that's what I started out doing what other experiences help them heal or oh
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just taking them out of the community I had to get them out of the community and
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see something different especially when you have 11 12th graders who lived down the street from the Philadelphia Zoo and
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never been to the zoo never been to the zoo live right down the street so we took trips everywhere to every college
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campus you could imagine we've taken them to every every place the kids wanted to go we raised money and took
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them there even when they didn't want to go we brought in a bunch of mentors we
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got trauma training from certain people from different people we anybody that wanted to come in and volunteer we
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allowed them to they were a special program it without even just one child so we had to teach them that people were
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in in them and they were invested in them and they were not in this world alone because they didn't know that they
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didn't know it so through the experiences and different people working with them they begin to see themselves
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like oh okay okay okay maybe I can see something different maybe I can't do something different and that's how we
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started was that a journey of self acceptance for them and do you feel that that would have been possible without
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the unconditional love that you speak of that invited them to try these new experiences I think with snn for them
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realizing that they would have to embrace perseverance that all of things that have happened to them were never
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going to go away did they would have their and they had to learn to live with it and move past it and the only way for
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them to do that was to constantly keep telling them that I love them if nobody ever told you I love you and you can do
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it and you want to yes all of these horrible things have always already happened to you and miss Wayman can't
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take them away and so I say the same thing to them so what now what what can we do together to get past this and so
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realizing letting them is self accepting that this is my experience this is my journey I can't change the journey but I
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can live with the journey and I use it to push me forward and I think that's
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what we have installed in the children that you have to Waddle in your despair you can use it to push it forward what
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are the biggest challenges your students face today and how are you helping them
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overcome them Wow there's still so many you know that the stories you hear just awful awful
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stories so again the one thing we try to instill in them again is a set of core values of just guys listen you always
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want to need someone to help you there's nothing wrong with handout you eat the other one with
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asking for assistance understanding perseverance understand you got to stay focused understand there are a lot of
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things that are going to stand in your way and so what we constantly do to be honest with you is just keep talking to
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them it really is that's really the only thing you can do is show them experiences and talk to them and let
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them see and hear a different way so I hope I answered your question but that's
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pretty much what we do on a daily basis it is oh and it's exhausting it's
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exhausting trying to get them but this is the way you have to look at it the way you're looking at it it's not really
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healthy for you and it's difficult and I just talked to my young men about a lot
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of things about the law about staying on task about minding your business staying
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focused but it's just talking and experiences that's our biggest thing at
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Strawberry Mansion what can we show them different I hope I answered your question it's a great
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question and and as our communities can easily define our own perceptions of ourselves and you bring them into these
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new experiences that allow them to question is that really me is that my identity has that changed the dynamic
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between the community within the school and beyond the school and is our the positive is the positive impact of that
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starting to show throughout the wider community the school environment you just wouldn't know it it's just so
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different and so it is you know every before I even got here I received an email from one of my teachers and she
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said you know most women we just our town hall may not speak about a lot about Tahoe media we have time for the
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kids are sitting talking that question and she said you know MS Wayman it was just so beautiful to see them today so
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much growth um in them and how they even interact with each other in auditorium how they're able to run their own
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performances now we don't have to do it anymore and they were so well behaved and she
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was saying I wish that you know more schools in Philadelphia were realized the importance of these programs and so
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I know it is prayer within the school outside the community also when we left it when the other day we had election
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day we were all leaving my staff and I there were all the people from the polls were outside and one gentleman stood up
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and said listen guys we have to get these kids the staff around them apart we're to thank these people because
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because of them we don't have that confusion that we used to have on the way home from school
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you can keep your business open we have to thank these people so I know it's
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starting to spread but it's a long journey but it that felt good to realize the people for the community had noticed
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how hard we're working oh you did I think we could probably keep talking with you all day but I think we have
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time for last couple of questions so maybe I'll ask one and then I'll leave
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it to emcee to ask the final one what do you think other leaders and the education world can learn from your
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experience well the one thing they have to learn from my experiences they have to lead there are a lot of school
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leaders who do not realize that it is their job to lead that they wait for someone else to come in and do it for
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them you get all these stories about what central office is supposed to do Norma see here and I'm going to wait no
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no what happens in your school depends on your leadership you are in control or what happens in that building it's all
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your in within your control and a lot of school that is really that I've come
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across don't really understand that it's their role they really think they play second
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fiddle to this big organization like all central offices are going to come run a
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school for them and had to teach them that central office is support they've
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got the leadership they're in control what happens you get the last question
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sure so so building on that given that you give so much of yourself to leave how do you refuel yourself so that you
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can welcome give the generosity and welcome the recognition of that general city and continue to leave it even
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harder with stronger heart Wow well really I the way I I actually realized myself and get renewed in this business
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is that I tell myself that because I'm working this horn and because I believe
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in what I'm doing that I get the opportunity to save somebody's life and
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so saving their life knowing that how important this work is and that if I didn't do it it could be it could turn
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out bad for someone so I take great pride in Linda you're helping to save someone's
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life so I do exercise I try to eat good but just knowing that I hope one more person escape poverty
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especially when you come a poverty yourself feel real good you feel real good principle women thank you thank you
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very much for speaking with knowledge at Wharton thank you very much thank you guys I appreciate you ask me to put here
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I appreciate you