00:00:00
Before we let Lou go, well, I want to mention before I go, I want to say something nice about David Spade. Tags are
00:00:06
different because tags are they're like extra farts. They're just like, you know what
00:00:12
I mean? Just people if they really liked a joke, they would just they take a long break of applause. And I was like, what
00:00:18
the am I supposed to do? I'm standing there and they're applauding. They've they've shut down my show.
00:00:26
Louis CK. Um, I don't want to brag, but I kind of gave him a start. No, I hired him as my headwriter on the ill- fated
00:00:34
or great show, whatever you think about it. Dana Carvey show, the much discussed Dana Carvey show
00:00:41
because it's it it had its place in history. So, it was fun to see him because it's
00:00:48
been so long and he was talking about how nervous he was. He never seemed nervous to me, but uh it was it was a
00:00:55
new thing and watching Co Bear and Carell and all that. Oh, he was nervous on your show when he
00:01:01
was writing. Yeah. Yeah. It's like 1996. He's like, you know, right out of high school or something
00:01:07
like Yeah. early 20s or whatever he was, but um it was interesting um to arguably one of the best out there. I mean, for standup, for just straight standups, he's in the discussion.
00:01:21
We do break that down a lot. It's and I found it interesting just to get into like his methodology of what what
00:01:28
he likes to introduce very uncomfortable premises or Oh yeah. and gets the audience on their heels a little bit and then he deconstructs
00:01:39
it gets them really laughing shames them for laughing at the previous one. I mean it is highlevel standup. That's great.
00:01:46
The things he was saying about his opener and how he was challenging him and so it's so
00:01:51
interesting. I will say that because we talked pretty much just straight comedy the whole time like breaking down
00:01:57
everything and how the performance and the joke and he's such a wordssmith. But I I was I could have gone on we
00:02:04
could do him again easily because we went on and on and on. Yeah. He's he's a scientist about it and
00:02:10
he loves it. He also has a book out Ingram which is a real book. It's not a comedy book. It's
00:02:15
not his life as a comic. Ingram is a kind of a bleak riveting riveting story about a young person's journey leaving leaving leaving
00:02:27
their home at such a young age and everything they go through. Um, so and it's written, you know, in
00:02:33
the world of John Steinbeck or or Mark Twain. It's it's it's Leave it to Louis to write this great book with great reviews. Yeah. I mean, it's it was I watched I read the first
00:02:45
chapter and I'm like would never know it was Louie. It would just this is a wellwritten interesting
00:02:51
Yeah. riveting book. Yeah. Uh well, there's Ingram and there's Louis and uh he's got he's doing comedy
00:02:57
all over. So, uh you know him and here he is. Bad news. Dana could make it. Oh, no. I know. Look at these two. You look just the same. Yeah, he doesn't. He looks good.
00:03:14
How old were you when I Hey, exc for the podcast. No, it's already started. Go ahead.
00:03:19
It's always starting. Yeah. We have nothing. We have no notes. We have no questions. We have no statements.
00:03:25
Good. It's called Carrying the Podcast with Louis C. K. Yeah. I have a really nice thing to say to
00:03:30
you. Yeah. Let's start with really nice thing to say. Yeah, we start. Yeah. We're It's always on. Always always rolling.
00:03:35
So, I thought this was kind of sweet and you would hear it would like it. So, I read the first chapter, Ingram.
00:03:41
Yeah. I'm like, "Holy holy shit." I mean, what's going on here? Like, and my wife
00:03:47
is a reader. Like, doesn't all fiction reads everything. Everything. So, I said, "Honey, will you read this first chapter?" I just went and did a couple things. She goes, "It's incredible. I I just
00:03:59
ordered the book." Wow. Is that great? Cuz I thought, "Wow, I can give Louis an honest compliment. No kissing. This is exactly what happened." and I'll put her on the phone if I have to. But I
00:04:11
thought, you know, and I talked to Dennis about it and he goes, "Grace sake, is the C
00:04:16
can't turning into the next Steinbeck over here." I didn't talk to Dennis, but I have to say I was a little shocked, too. I Louis has a book called Ingram. Yeah, Ingram.
00:04:27
And uh I just read the first chapter because Dana was talking about it. Yeah, you sent me the book and uh I was
00:04:34
astonished that it's one more different move that listen, comedians write books.
00:04:40
Sure, I wrote a book about my life. I wrote a book about stupid books. Mine's wacky and stupid. Exactly. We'd think u a 5-year-old could do mine.
00:04:48
But it was even from the first paragraph, I'm like, "Okay, this is I wouldn't know who did this." You know what I mean? It's not like, "Oh, this is
00:04:54
typical." So, it's just like a writer writing a great book. the fact that our little character, our guy,
00:05:01
you get so attached because all this stuff's happening and he's just describing it,
00:05:07
you know, he's not emotional or, you know, Yeah. And it's so it's getting you in a different way where you're
00:05:13
invested already like what is going to happen to this little person? Yeah. You know, so
00:05:19
um it's amazing. I I would love to think I could do that, but I can't. I hope the second chapter is as good.
00:05:26
It really falls apart. Well, I don't know. I mean, the art of it of just just the sentence construction. So, you
00:05:33
you've got your narrative in a way, you've got your story, and then it's like without giving it away. Yeah.
00:05:38
How how will I describe his dad walking by? Yeah. You know, and I guess you're just it's a
00:05:44
discipline and you're just really going and when you get it, you're high as a kite, right? Well, one sentence.
00:05:50
Yeah. It um I had never done this before. I've written fiction. and I've written short stories which I've never done anything with. It's what I really want to do when I was a kid, you know, more than anything. And um
00:06:02
and so I just started doing it last few years. And this thing came because I just wanted to hear I read a lot of American fiction. Mhm. Like Flannry O' Conor, uh Mark Twain and
00:06:15
you know, uh Faulner, guys like that, but also like you know uh what's her name? Um the the mocking bird. I'm really bad with names. Oh, Tequila Mockingbird.
00:06:27
Bombbeck. I'm kidding. Susan Mockingbird. Yeah, Susan Mockingbird. Why don't we know her name? Susan Mockingbird uh was uh um No, Har Har Har Har Har Har
00:06:39
Har Har Har Har Har Har Har Har Har Har Har Har Har Har Harper Harper Lee. Harper Lee. Yeah. So anyway, there's this thing about the American voice like the way
00:06:44
that Americans that there's an eloquence to it. Also, I read a lot about Abraham Lincoln and like he was like educated by
00:06:51
somebody who knew two things more than him, right? But he there's this way that American like soil speaks and I wanted to feel
00:06:58
that voice somehow. I wanted to see do I have that in me? You know, I was raised here. I was a boy in America and I
00:07:05
started to write this kid's this kid started talking to me and I cared about him and I wanted to
00:07:10
see what I felt like writing him was a way of taking care of him. Yeah. But these terrible things kept happening
00:07:16
to him and I would just go a rough [ __ ] Why am I doing this? Yeah, I wish I had I wish I had another way, but the way I can take care of him is to give as honest and accurate an
00:07:29
account of how what he's feeling and how he's seeing it. And I kept being impressed that he's uh just sees it and
00:07:37
he reflects on it. Yeah. And he he's poetic about it, even sometimes humorous about it. Mhm. And uh he just processes what's happening to him and he he he says when
00:07:48
it hurts, but he doesn't complain when it hurts. You know what I mean? Yeah. He just tries to do better next time.
00:07:54
Very old school. I'm fascinated by uh a lot of things. You know, I went to state
00:07:59
college, but yeah, I didn't go to any college. The uh over me. Yeah. Who else didn't go to college? That's a
00:08:06
genius. All comedians. Chris Rock, the power of the spoken word. So we have all this uh media coming out all different kinds. Yeah. But I'd gone a few years ago and I went
00:08:17
to the Lincoln Memorial. We're inside and I just looked up. I read the Gettysburg address and I just had tears coming down.
00:08:23
The power of the spoken word is still number one with the bullet. I'm Casey Kasem. There's still nothing more
00:08:29
powerful. Sorry. The written American the original American word. So that's why I can't
00:08:35
imagine the satisfaction and I assume you've gotten a lot of feedback on accomplishing that. You know, it's a
00:08:42
it's quite an achievement. Well, I got I was sort of anxious as I read it wrote it that I would not finish
00:08:47
it. I knew that there was a whole story to tell. I knew it was a book. After about
00:08:52
three days, I was like, "This is a book. I got to tell a long story here." I didn't know where it was going. I didn't
00:08:58
Oh, you didn't have it like mapped out like a movie. No, I didn't do that. that I just would sit down every day and go, "So, what
00:09:03
happened?" And he's getting farther away from the house. So, what happened? Like, does he compare? Okay. So, you're speaking to the book in
00:09:09
real time. Yeah. So, what happened today? What happened today? And what happened now? And then there was points where I kind
00:09:15
of felt like that's part one. Like it just hit me. That's part one and we're going to later or maybe we're
00:09:23
going to right after, but something has shifted, right? And I would feel his voice start
00:09:28
to get more eloquent as he got older, which in a sense doesn't make sense because it's all in past tense. The one
00:09:36
thing that kept me feeling okay about it was that it was all in the past tense. So I'm like, well, he's not dead
00:09:41
and you control. You're still the puppet master. I I never feel that way though with fiction.
00:09:47
You feel like it's driving you. I feel like I've got a responsibility to report what sort of the story. I feel like I can't do this. It won't
00:09:53
make any sense right here. Right. Well, it's kind of like carving a a sculpture. It's like the rock is
00:09:58
there. You can you can try to find something in it, but it's not up to you what's really there. You know what I mean? In a sense, that's a little bit
00:10:04
I think one of the hard parts if you if with ADD uh prevalent is like you get to an idea and you go 25 pages like god
00:10:12
should I have this other idea, you know? Yeah. God, maybe I'll go to this other idea. So, stick to one thing for that
00:10:18
long of times. I didn't think I could do that, but I've done a lot of work over the last few years on myself and on my what's going on in here. So, I've got a
00:10:29
calmer spirit. So, I'm more able I wrote another book after this one. I want to be able to keep going. How long does it take for this spirit?
00:10:36
Yeah, it's right. It's good. Well, that that's that's the whole thing. That's what Jesus said to his disciples.
00:10:43
Peace be with you. Peace I give you. Peace. Peace. He said absolutely. I don't remember that quote. Yeah, he
00:10:48
talked a lot. Peace be with you. Which movie did he say that? The one with, you know, what's his name?
00:10:56
Melvin Gibson. Melvin Gibson's coming out with the resurrection. He's going to find
00:11:01
Yeah. Yeah. Well, that he that's a nice thing about Did you go to church when you're a kid or do you still
00:11:06
Lutheran laps Lutheran? Now I'm a Catholic. So cath I grew up in Catholic church and and you'd turn to your neighbors and
00:11:13
say, "Peace be with you." Yes. And I always liked that part of it. That was that is my current favorite part.
00:11:19
Yeah. Because I realize that is the greatest gift. You raise shake hands with somebody next to you.
00:11:24
Yeah. You shake hands. You say something kind of old and funny feeling. Peace be with you. You don't
00:11:29
say that in real life. No. When you're leaving the farmers market to the valley to the valley.
00:11:35
You connect when they give money tightens up. Yeah. They go put a quarter in and Dana goes,
00:11:40
"Yeah, I don't like this part." Yeah. You get you foster more empathy. You become a better person. You know, you're just fostering these teachings from 2,000 years ago.
00:11:50
Yeah. You don't agree though. You seem a little against. No, I got lost a little bit ago. Johnny. Yeah. He's still on Ingram. How do you spell
00:11:57
that name? I still I'm like I G. No, I Ingram was his name. That's right. That's right. Now is a spoken Didn't Shatner do a spoken
00:12:08
word album on Ingram? It's going to come out later. I hope so. Yeah. I would want that like a you know interpretation. like the gray
00:12:15
highway, whatever he called the gray arms. The hard gray road. The hard gray road.
00:12:21
Arm swinging like tools in the shed in the wind. Possibly something like that, right? That was his dad. Yeah.
00:12:26
Yeah. What makes me thought Did it make you go back to your own childhood? Because we all I mean he had a really that silver
00:12:33
spoon easy childhood. Where'd you grow up? I'm the Joe Dirt guy. I'm Arizona. He had he had some rough and But were you Joe Dirt or just I was a little bit like that. Even Ingram reminded me of that a little bit.
00:12:43
It's starting from sort of nothing and then parents are gone, you know, in the I don't want to give the whole movie book
00:12:48
away, but um I grew up in Arizona, you know, middle lower whatever. Dad left, so we had three boys. Mom just trying to work and two jobs to keep us uh around, but trying to be home, but
00:13:02
also how much do you pay a babysitter? That's how much he's making. But yeah, once a dad splits on a dime, there's
00:13:08
really no plan. It's just are you guys good? That's what my mom was raised us alone. My dad left when I
00:13:15
was 10. Okay. And my mom worked. My dad didn't contribute. Yeah. Anything. Exactly. Either way. So my mom was like, "All right, guys.
00:13:26
Four kids." And she's like, "Wow, I got a microwave." That was the big move. We got a microwave.
00:13:31
And there's a lean cuisine in the shed. Yes. So fight over that. Yeah. That's on the good night.
00:13:37
Hot dogs are 30 seconds each. I remember her telling us that's how you figure out how long to microwave anything.
00:13:44
You just microw hot dogs 30 seconds. So if it looks like two, make it 60. You know what I mean? Like the size of a hot dog was the unit. That's nice. And she came home at 7:00 and sometimes
00:13:57
I'd want to make her something, you know, but I was alone and I I grew up in a suburb so we just own the kids just
00:14:04
own the streets. You just went out. Yeah. Nobody knew where you were. Yeah. Child support was optional back
00:14:09
then. Yes. There's only one thing worse. A lot of people passed on it. Yeah. It's weird, isn't it, that they were like
00:14:14
My dad took a hard pass. There is one thing worse than the dad leaving. Yeah. What's that?
00:14:19
Dad stays. Stays. And yes, it is definitely. I'm not I'm glad my dad wasn't around.
00:14:25
Yeah, you did. I'm glad he wasn't around. Did you ever reconcile with him or he uh for like a few minutes? Yeah.
00:14:33
Oh, okay. Yeah, we had like a 12minute conversation that felt like I I'll take that. That's good.
00:14:38
He's like, "We good here." Yeah, that's Yeah, sure. All right, so this one, Dana, this is
00:14:44
Pura. This is uh sort of a new move here. I know. Re-imagining the future of fragrance. Interesting, right? It's the smart home fragrance brand that's uh redefining how people
00:14:57
scent their spaces. So, this is an app control diffuser, right? And it's got premium clean safe fragrances. So you just you pick one
00:15:07
and you pick intensity and you can throw it when you want as strong as you want. Cuz you know
00:15:14
sometimes you go into a house and you go this house is like an old person's house. Or you go in and you go, "Oh, they like
00:15:21
to party." Or whatever. You go into yours and it's like lots of hair products. It's like oh
00:15:27
spray. Uh yeah, straightening irons. I mean, you you need pure. I'll be honest. You can personalize it for your environment or your car and it can be a gift.
00:15:40
Yeah. I mean, you tell someone, "Hey, let's up that car. Let's up that house." But some people want that because they go, "Listen, my car, I bought it. I don't love the smell." And uh let's fix it,
00:15:53
you know? And this is Or maybe you just want new car smell, right? Forever. I'm sure they can do that with
00:15:59
smart sensing technology. I hear it's like sleeping with sort of a noise behind you or something like puts you in a better mood, that kind of thing. Uh the promo details are uh November 1st to
00:16:11
the 31st and uh get a few you get a free Pura set when you subscribe. Smarter Sense starts with a free Pura diffuser.
00:16:22
You did that pretty well. I know. I said it really well. I just thought of it. you thought of it. For a limited time, you can get a free set
00:16:28
when you subscribe to two cents monthly for a year. I'm saying the word scent. It's kind of nice because you can customize your experience with the app control tech they've got and enjoy
00:16:40
premium longl lasting scents in a sleek modern device. Just in time Oh, just in time for holiday hosting. So, it's going to smell like the Christmas tree. People over, you can tweak it a bit.
00:16:51
That's a good idea. It's like having music. It's something like that. Yeah. Yeah. background music backgrounds.
00:16:57
Yeah, that's that's what I said. Um, subscribe to a festive scent now. Easily swap it out later. This exclusive deal won't last. Shop now at purap.com.
00:17:10
What about you? You're cute. Yeah, he's tough dad. Grew up dad. Tough dad. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
00:17:15
Uh, he uh Yeah. Saw some stuff. Yeah. Uhhuh. And I I just was I was I I got for better or for worse I got a Disney face when I was younger.
00:17:27
That's how you survived. I was a Disney face. So I'd go on stage and I have shaky hair and I'd be all
00:17:32
these voices and laugh my ass off and no one and people would go, "Well, you had a great child." I mean, look at you, you
00:17:38
know, it was all just an illusion. Of course it was. But uh it's it goes to some pretty dark
00:17:43
places. Same. Yeah. Same. Yeah. Yeah. So yeah, being a boy is uh I mean that's the one I know and I know it's tricky. Yeah. And you're a little alone in it. There
00:17:54
there is a cultural thing of like you do you do this, you know, for boys, it's on you, at least for for our generation,
00:18:01
maybe my generation, like this is on you. And uh I I did have a great mom. My mom was a fantastic person. And she was
00:18:07
very she was raising four kids by herself while working. So there was she had limits that were
00:18:14
just there. But she was a great friend, especially in adulthood like later. Yeah, she was the best phone call I would ever have. I still She's the voice I reach
00:18:25
to. I think that, you know, the word heroes tossed off a lot, but a single mom working full-time with four kids and making it through. Yeah. Just getting everyone through. The
00:18:36
sacrifice of that, her life is just on the way deep. No dating, no fun. Forget it. Forget that. Just are you okay? Hey, do you have a food? Do we leave an apple? Are you
00:18:47
That's it. And then a little humor. Always a little humor. She was always like, "Hey, I remember once I was going
00:18:53
off to school and I was in a lot of trouble. I had just caused a lot of problems and I was going to school to
00:18:59
face them." And my mom said to me on the way out the door, "Hey, don't let them get you down
00:19:05
that bad. We love you here at home. You're loved." Jeez, what a That's how she sent me out the door. Like, this isn't the end of the world.
00:19:12
Like, go face it, but a little smart, but [ __ ] them. Really smart thing to say
00:19:19
to a kid. I was scared to stress my mom out. So, you know, like do something wrong in
00:19:24
school or bad grades. Yeah. I was getting good grades and I'm like, I got to keep this [ __ ] up cuz she gets so happy.
00:19:30
I couldn't do it. I had terrible grades and I had a a period of just doing a lot
00:19:36
of drugs and I I I stressed her out a lot. It hurt to to see her how stressed out she
00:19:42
was. Did you tell her I will be a millionaire soon? I never just relax her a little bit.
00:19:47
But I did. I did. She did get to see it happen. And that's the greatest unbelievable because it's all I would give 100% of it to my
00:19:54
mom. Like I would never have gotten through that. Anyone who comes from nothing and then becomes gets on TV and makes a lot of
00:20:01
money. It's it's like a fever dream. It's almost like did it really is it really did it happen?
00:20:06
You mean for the family? The family, my siblings or myself? The likelihood of it. You know, I would tell
00:20:12
I get laughed out of the room and when I started doing standup, you know, the neighbors would go, "Well, whatever you
00:20:17
really end up doing, this will kind of help your confidence." You know, there was nobody in my high school, nobody has
00:20:22
ever gotten on TV. It's like not even option. Not even. Do you remember when we were working on
00:20:28
your show, there was mean the Dana Carvey show? Dana Carvey show. Let's get into that. ABC Tuesdays at 9:30.
00:20:35
Perfect time slot. How do we fumble that home run? Yes. So that that there we had auditions for
00:20:43
cast members and a guy named Carrie Prussa auditioned and he was a wonderful I don't know where he is now but he did one of his he
00:20:50
did characters for us. He just stood in the room and there was like five of us and one of his characters was my uncle
00:20:56
when I told him I was auditioning for this show. And his uncle goes, "You ain't never going to be on no Dana. Those are professional actors that you
00:21:06
ain't never going to be on." And we almost wanted to give it to him because of that based on that
00:21:14
guy. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But you know, but yeah, being so being a boy is it is it's it's I feel like Ingram is like me without my mom in a sense or a mom that
00:21:25
was just so inundated and so he the heaviness on a person. Yeah. That she just couldn't she couldn't just had to get the mom part got to me even in chapter one.
00:21:36
Yeah. I haven't got to the part where he's on Star Search, but it takes I know it's where it's headed.
00:21:42
That took me by surprise. That's where it's going. So predictable. This is This is Ingram's like yada I did it. I made it.
00:21:50
Yeah. I want to hear more about the show. When you guys started, who found who? Did you find Louis? So my goal was go meet Louie. So we met
00:21:58
at Brilstein Gay, right? And uh he was a freshfaced kid, I guess. Who was handling you? I was writing I wasn't with Bril. I was writing on Conan. Okay.
00:22:10
And then I was on Conan for two years and it just burnt me right out. I remember you saying this hard.
00:22:15
It was just too hard. It was because every show they treated it like it was SNL every night. Like it was every
00:22:20
night. I could imagine. Yeah. So I was like old when it was over and I was 25. Yeah. Daily shows are beating because you guys did a lot of bits and sketches. It's just like [ __ ] It's not. And the show was for those two years
00:22:32
that I was there. It was just hated. It was You got the hated ones. Yes. And so yeah,
00:22:38
it just was hard hard. And then I went and wrote for Letterman for a short while because
00:22:44
he I wanted to be on there as a standup and I basically got told if you write on the show then maybe they'll if you take
00:22:50
the writing job maybe they'll So I did it and uh was that wasn't a good experience for me and then uh and
00:22:56
then you guys started your show. Yeah. So I you were great and you super prankster but think of my point of view.
00:23:02
So I have this show there's for a reason it's a disaster in a way but I wanted out even before it started. It was way
00:23:08
too I remember that. Yeah. I was ready to go. It was just like cuz Heather Morgan would come in
00:23:14
and pitching me sketches. I go I'm what? What? I was just fighting for parts on SNL. Now I'm in my own show.
00:23:21
Well, I didn't know I had Steve Carell and Steven Cor who I adored. And the first day I rehearsed with them, I said,
00:23:27
"I must be Rusty." Right. I must be Rusty cuz How so? Cuz you cuz they were just so
00:23:33
Yeah. They were quick. 10 years younger, no kids. They were just like like and brilliant, you know.
00:23:38
I must be rusty. But so I'm sitting back in life and I go, "Oh, Carell's oh Coar. Oh, they're
00:23:47
Yeah, they're hungry. That's what the odds. Two guys, cast members and their their movie stars are
00:23:53
incredible. He's got a show and everything and like, oh, oh, Louie. Oh, I almost almost blushed. Oh my goodness, Louie.
00:24:04
Louis became the greatest standup potentially. Well, I I hate because I do I He's a nice guy, but I'm tell We were here with Andrew Santino. He's this, you know. Yeah, it's a nice kid. I do. I like
00:24:15
that. He's funny, too. Casually as a throwaway go, well, Louis the greatest stand up. That's nice. I'm just telling you I hear that. It's
00:24:22
fun to hear, but Well, it feels good to hear. Does it? Okay. Cuz I don't want it to come off like
00:24:27
I respect Griffin or something Santino. He's good. He's really good. No, you just said it like it was just I don't
00:24:33
know that we can talk about that but it is sort of interesting that story. I know you told a lot
00:24:40
you started being honest on stage. Yeah. And then it just went from there. Well, I want to say though about your
00:24:46
show, the Dana Carvey show, Taco Bell Dana Carve. The Taco Bell sometimes the Mountain Dew
00:24:51
Dana Car Taco Bell. Talk about I Yeah, Jimmy Kimmel. We were losing everybody. Yeah, it wasn't like that. I think actually the press was reporting
00:25:03
that we were losing Yeah. sponsors even though we we we engineered it that way. We got PepsiCo to sponsor
00:25:10
the show and we asked them to put a different one of their brands on every week. So, we were shift. It was our idea,
00:25:18
but the press was like, "Oh, I guess Taco Bell bailed." No, we switched on purpose. We had it planned,
00:25:23
but we the idea was to get a company that a parent company that would let us have a different sponsor every week.
00:25:28
Um, but anyway, for me, I was very young. I was way over my head for the job that I was the headwriter of the
00:25:34
show. I don't think so. And I had no idea how to stressful. It was so stress. It was the most
00:25:40
stressful time in my life in my 58 prime time show. I'm sorry. That was the most stressful job I ever
00:25:46
had. But and it I was all of that stress melts away. I'm left with a massive education I got from it. But but working with you was a big deal for
00:25:57
me. You were legend. How old were you when we did the show? 61. No. Uh I was I was 40.
00:26:05
Isn't that funny that we 41? We were younger than all of us. We were way younger. 40 is another is light
00:26:12
years for me. Oh. Oh yeah. Yeah. And you were the But I loved working with you because you were uh you had this great deep
00:26:19
traditional um background of comedy and you were a purebred. You're just you're just a you know um Hall of Fame guy. You're great at what you do.
00:26:30
Thank you. And you still are. And uh were we recording? Yeah. Just want to make sure. We just found a clip. Go ahead.
00:26:35
So good. But and you're very kind and you were very generous with sharing your history and stories about where you'd been. And I remember one time because I was still doing standup when I was on
00:26:46
that show. Yeah. And I did my second shot on the Letterman show. And I just sort of left
00:26:52
work and ran over and did Letterman and I came back to work and uh the next day you said uh weren't you on Letterman last night? And I was like yes sir. like I was just sort of like a guy that works
00:27:05
there. You weren't you on the David Letterman show last night? And I said, "Yeah." And how did it go? And I said,
00:27:10
"It was good." And uh so you said, "I want to see it." And you went and got someone to get a
00:27:16
tape of it. And he and I sat in the office, just the two of us. Oh, and you watch it together. And he watched He said, "I want to watch
00:27:22
it." And he watched we watched it and I I was proud of the set. Sure. And Dana stood next to the TV and he pointed at the TV afterwards and he said, "Do you understand that when I
00:27:33
stood when I was out there doing what you're doing being a standup and uh if you had a set like that back in whatever
00:27:40
the 70s or 80s, yeah, superstar, you would have been a huge never to look back again star after like a you'd be you'd walk everywhere. You'd
00:27:50
walk in they give you standing ovation. You'd be the next guy. So I was right. Well, it took a long time. a decade, which is okay. It's actually better that way. But uh but anyway, that just meant
00:28:02
so much to me. Well, I'm I'm glad to hear that. I um It's true. Those are building blocks
00:28:08
that story. I learned a lot from you. I still I quote things you told me. Like I I once pitched a joke to him.
00:28:15
It was when we were doing my favorite bit we ever did on the show, which was Tom Broka uh
00:28:20
recording several versions of Richard sketches. I was just Gerald Ford. Yes, Gerald for is dead tonight. He was attacked by a circus lion in a convenience store. So that was the joke.
00:28:32
Oh, that was the the joke was he was uh preparing in case he died. Yeah. Yes. In case he died, all the contingency
00:28:44
today. He was mauled to death by a mountain lion in a convenience store. And so we did it in the first take. In the second take, I approached the desk
00:28:55
and said to him, "Just put a pause between Mountain Lion and In a Convenience Store."
00:29:00
That was a good note. And he did it and it got two laughs. And I just sitting back there just doing
00:29:06
my job. Dana goes like this to me and brings me over and he goes, "You bought me an extra laugh." Do you understand how
00:29:13
powerful that is? You bought me an extra laugh. That's big. You're valuable. That was meaningful to me. And I say I I repeat that to young comics all the time
00:29:23
about timing and about the class of the moment, everything. I like I do like helping younger
00:29:30
comedians. I enjoy it. I mean with Carell and Coar, you know, um same same kind of thing. I They were such gentlemen married. They're kind of
00:29:40
conservative in that way in their real lives. Yes. And so sweet and earnest and uh and then
00:29:46
obviously so talented. I also loved Heather Morgan. I loved her. She was so strange and enigmatic. I
00:29:53
put her in a movie after we did that show and I loved her. I don't know where she is now, but she was like a groundling
00:29:58
person. The ground. She was so funny. We had her as was it Pat Nixon in a cell or something.
00:30:04
So her thing was we did was first ladies as dogs. Yes. And I think you can see it on YouTube or whatever, but it's her dress. It's not biting on that dress first
00:30:15
ladies. all the first ladies, but then she would find a dog that they were like and she do them as dogs and it was
00:30:22
[ __ ] genius. Yeah. Brilliant. You know, it's funny you're saying about that double laugh. Like I mean Nate
00:30:28
Burgati comes to mind, but when you're watching and you have an audience that's really in your vibe and they're laughing
00:30:34
at setups like you're getting extra stuff on your way to your big part. Yeah. It's great when you get a good crowd and
00:30:41
you're on your game. There's nothing like a joke turning into three. That's right.
00:30:46
And then some tags. Tags are tricky to me. That's different. Tags are different because tags are they're like extra farts. They're just like, you know what I mean? Just
00:31:00
It's just a little How much more How much more can we fart this out until the audience? And some some audiences you can't fart
00:31:06
that much. No, you can't because they they they barely buy the punch line and you go, "Here's right. I
00:31:11
used to have nine tags. I'm bailing right now because they didn't buy this part. No. Right. And and sometimes it's it's
00:31:17
like when Muhammad Ali punched out George Foreman. Uh he there was this an incredible one
00:31:22
punch and George starts falling and he and he had the next punch cocked but he never threw it. That's right. He knew he's going down.
00:31:28
He watched him go down. But he and he kept it because otherwise he would have it would have been like
00:31:34
tags. Yeah. But I like a thing I've been doing on stage recently. I'm on tour again now is
00:31:40
there. It's almost like a pre-tag. It's like they haven't laughed yet, but I'm gonna stop here.
00:31:46
Or like, "This is a bad idea to say this, so I'm gonna say it and then stop talking."
00:31:52
It's interesting if you say something. I'll give you an examp. And then I I don't know, whatever. It'll be out there. I don't care. Um I'm talking about the hard what's the
00:32:04
worst thing that can happen to you. Like it's a subject about what's the worst thing. Such a Louis CK. What's the worst thing?
00:32:10
Yeah, but it's already funny. So, well, because it's somebody that told me always prepare for the worst,
00:32:15
right? Which means you have to first decide what's the worst. What's the worst? Yeah. And so, the bit I had been doing
00:32:22
was that for me it's about it would be getting my somebody torturing my balls. And it's a long bit that I'm not going
00:32:28
to repeat here about ball torture. And it's all easy laughs. It's just huge. Daniel Craig had it in Casino Royale, I
00:32:36
believe. seated in the chair naked and they Yeah. And the ball just all ball just jokes about ball torture.
00:32:41
Yeah. And but one night I was doing it and I said I'm about to say for me the worst
00:32:47
would be someone torturing my balls and I and I just said for me the worst well besides one of my daughters dying and having to tell the other one that she's dead. Yes.
00:32:58
And then I just stopped talking and the place just went Yeah. And I just waited and there's whispering awkwardness.
00:33:09
One guy shrieks laughing and everyone looks at him and I'm just watching the room. I'm just watching highwire [ __ ] man. It's so interesting to watch a room
00:33:22
change like that and then go, "Okay, you done? All right, now the ball stuff." And it still kills. It doesn't hurt. The the ball stuff is just the ball stuff. We all forget it happened, but there's a
00:33:34
moment in the pause is the more interesting part. It's really something. I've done charity events where right
00:33:40
before me's a terminal patient in a wheelchair and I and I thought, "Oh man, it's over." And they need the release of course so bad when I go up that it's
00:33:52
actually, you know, cuz you live in the world with that. So it's like you're if you're being funny, you
00:33:58
live in the world where people get hurt and where there's tragedy. It's all in the same world. So if you if you toss
00:34:05
the salad a little bit more and let these things be next to each other more. It's Are you kind of I mean I don't know
00:34:11
where you're It just seems like are you even more playful with the form because you already broke it in the early knots.
00:34:18
There were there are so many things we have to talk about that nobody had ever talked about and made it work. like the
00:34:24
guy who makes the the uh the latte and you walk away and that word gum comes in your head, right? Like
00:34:30
I I watched that in awe like how did he land this? How did he make it? Okay, so you broke all that. So now it seems like
00:34:37
you're a spali with standup and playful with it because you already have your iconic. So is it more fun in a way to to dance outside the lines? So it's the more you
00:34:48
do it, the more you the spectrum grows of what you can see what is possible. And I as long as you keep trying, as
00:34:55
long as you're willing to be uncomfortable, as long as you're willing to have discomfort in the room. So if you always go for what you know
00:35:01
works, that's going to get narrower till one day you're going to go like, I can't do this anymore. You're bored. That's my act. Go ahead.
00:35:07
It's natural. If I have a second of silence, I go cra. Well, also one second. One second of silence. That's well also you don't you've got trained
00:35:18
audiences sometimes they yell out when I have a pause and it's it's the toughest thing because
00:35:24
yes you want those things you're trying or you want to just you need a two beats not just one you
00:35:30
need two before something and they get in there and you're that's the worst because when they you feel that it makes you go faster
00:35:36
yeah and that's throws it off but that's the like I had a young guy open for me Dan Dosimo very funny young
00:35:44
kid who I saw on Tik Tok Okay. And wanted to uh um it's the only thing I look at in these apps is standup cuz I don't know everybody out there anymore and I saw this new voice. I'd never
00:35:56
heard of him before and uh he's from Chicago and I was going there to play the Chicago theaters actually just a
00:36:01
couple weeks ago. So I asked him come do five minutes at the top of the show and it's interesting to take a guy who's just really a
00:36:07
beginner and make him open a 3500 seat theater like in a major concert. So I watched all of his sets and I I
00:36:14
gave him a challenge. I said, "Do a different set every night. You're doing three three nights." And he said, "I'll do it."
00:36:20
God to work with Louie, my [ __ ] is [ __ ] fast. So, first show he's really killed. I
00:36:25
said, "Great. Show me something else tomorrow." Second show, second show he did 10 minutes. Killed. Second, third
00:36:31
show I said, "You're only doing five." And I again, I want it different. And the crowd was tougher the third show.
00:36:37
And I saw him and I saw him go up there like, "This has been going great." And I saw him go, "Whoops." And then right
00:36:44
before the end, he went to a bit I'd seen before. And so did you spank him? I can't. You look so hopeful.
00:36:55
Was he grounded during your set? Did you spank him? Well, sometimes, you know, if you say
00:37:00
something really that would have been a good character for you, a guy who always goes there with every information.
00:37:05
Did you spank him with very little energy toward it? Did you Did you spank him? Yeah. Did you spank him guy? in case
00:37:12
you're into it, too. Did you make it? You go. Oh, you did. Yeah. What's my catchphrase? But I'm
00:37:17
fascinated. You're up there. Oh, so let me just finish with Dan. So, he I asked him what happened.
00:37:23
Why'd you go to him? Good question. He said there was a moment I felt I dropped the I felt the energy drop. I
00:37:29
felt Oh, and you're here. You're watching. It's high pressure. Y I said that's this is that moment is
00:37:35
everything. that panic, getting past that panic without doing without servicing it by doing something safe is going to be your whole thing
00:37:46
is if you can get past it and go, I'm still going to do something that's not necessarily a great idea
00:37:54
because this guy big guy is watching me. [ __ ] Yeah. [ __ ] him. I got to do this thing. It's
00:37:59
important to me. Yeah. That's going to make all the difference for you. I one thing that I found out about myself is I'm just completely
00:38:06
different in a small room because I I can do one man sketches. I do the world's first sociopath in ancient
00:38:12
times, you know. Hey, where's Steve? I don't know. What's that arm coming out of the ground? It's Steve.
00:38:18
I hit him with a rock. Am I weird? I don't know. There's only 39 of us on the planet, so you might want to tamp that
00:38:24
down. Well, sometimes I leave the tent at night and I scratch myself with bushes. Oh, that's strange. You're
00:38:30
weird, aren't you? So, I can't do that in 3,000 seats or a corporate date, but in a small room. And then what happens to me if the audience is not laughing?
00:38:41
Yeah. I love it. Because I'm doing some I'm doing You mean in a small room? Yeah. Because I can sense I see them not
00:38:48
laughing and I'm doing the most ridiculous thing and that makes me laugh. But this is, you know, 50 years
00:38:53
in, you know. It's so funny when they don't laugh. It's hilarious when they don't laugh. Yeah,
00:38:59
it's [ __ ] It's the only funny thing in the world. But is an unludience. It's hysterically funny. Louis CK plays the silence throws a party at the hotel. You know,
00:39:10
when you do a thing and they're just sitting there, you're just like, "That's the best." But you're doing it unfamous, all this
00:39:16
stuff. And then you're doing it famous. Yeah. On purpose. You know, Dennis Miller, you know, and we love. Yes.
00:39:21
Uh so was my favorite. Still is one of the top guys out there. And uh no doubt he's such a wordssmith. And so I was opening for him. Great. And he saw me. He says, "Why don't you come on the road?" Same thing. It's like
00:39:32
a huge deal. So I do it and then uh he goes, "You're from when he saw me, I had done different stuff." And he goes, "What happened?" And I go,
00:39:43
"Oh." He goes, "Where were the was the stuff I saw?" And I go, "Well, I had done a couple road gigs that I wasn't
00:39:49
killing." Mhm. And they said, "You gotta some of your stuff is a little weird." And so I
00:39:56
tweaked it to think it would be stuff that would do better. And he's like, "Jesus, dude." He goes, "I liked you for that." Yeah. He goes, "Do that." He goes, he goes,
00:40:07
"Fuck that. Go back to that. And if it doesn't work, then you're not supposed to be a stand up, but don't try to second guess it."
00:40:13
That's very good advice. He goes, "Because this isn't making you laugh." No. It was the greatest. I was like, "Yeah."
00:40:19
And he's like, "Just whatever you were doing, whatever your thought process was, just keep doing those type of jokes
00:40:25
and if they don't work, then it's just not working." But that's the stuff that I like. Yeah.
00:40:30
And if you can get through that, like you say, you push through it, it somehow catches on. Mhm. It was such a great
00:40:37
advice because you then you're audiences come with expectations, but they they drop them in a hot second when they see you do doing something interesting. They go, "Well, I want to
00:40:49
hear some jokes." And then they see you being like, "Well, I don't know what that guy's doing, but I'm in. I'm in
00:40:54
a weird joke where you don't get I always go like, what is what is this guy doing?" Well, the thing is there's so much
00:41:00
potential in a moment on stage that beside beyond the one laugh that if you don't get if if you're willing if you
00:41:06
can detach emotionally or you don't put your ego in it, right, that's the the most dangerous thing for a comic is like, I don't like the way I feel when they're not laughing. Yeah,
00:41:17
because it's like being a scientist and you put in some whatever and then it doesn't and you go, "Wait, but why isn't
00:41:24
it changing into ammonia?" Like you you should just be studying what happens. And for me, like
00:41:31
if I put something out there that confuses them or upsets them, I've just changed the chemistry in the
00:41:36
room. That means I have a whole bunch of other things I can do now that are beyond that moment. uh that different
00:41:43
laughs, laughs that feel different because they came after discomfort or after confusion. Yeah.
00:41:49
Instead of just like 50 years I feel I'm comedy class. You should do a master's class. I mean, but
00:41:55
that that's amazing. I'm I'm really curious of the first time you leapt to a giant room. Did you have
00:42:03
to fight harder for being this authentic in each moment? Because Louis K's here,
00:42:08
the big big rooms. Well, the first early big rooms, it's pretty quiet for 10 minutes when there's 20. It takes longer to You mean really big room? Really, really?
00:42:19
Well, whatever. The first room where you're a little intimidated like maybe you had to try a little harder to be your authentic.
00:42:24
Well, the very very first time I did a theater was I opened for Jerry Seinfeld when I was 19
00:42:30
and he I got to open for him in a club in Boston and he liked me so he took me to some like thousand seat theaters. It was
00:42:37
before he had his show, but he was already a big deal. Yeah. Yeah. and he took me to like five gigs and I a huge education for me.
00:42:43
Yeah, Jerry, he's a Jerry's something else. He's a guy to study as far as a a writer. Can I give you
00:42:50
this one Jerry Seinfeld thing I love to do? He has a new album out. It's an LP. Yeah.
00:42:55
And it's called Paper Clips. Why? Sorry, I just like that joke. I don't know why. I did it for Jerry. Paper Clips Why? With a big smile. Anyway, so
00:43:06
go ahead. So, you're good. Yeah. Do you have to work on pauses and stuff if it's a big big room?
00:43:11
Yeah. So, I learned this from Jerry. So, I did I opened for him and I'm just a 19-year-old been doing comedy for like two years or one almost and I'm just doing my stuff. And this it
00:43:23
was the 80s and there was more there was people used to talk about applause breaks back then, you know, it was a thing then.
00:43:28
That's what you wanted. So there was like people if they really liked a joke they would just they take a long break of
00:43:34
applause and I was like what the [ __ ] am I supposed to do? I'm standing there and they're applauding. They've just they've shut
00:43:40
down my show like it has nothing to do. I love the physicality. Yeah. It's just like
00:43:47
Yeah. It's like 3 minutes into the set. So I asked Jerry, "What do I do?" And he said, "Stay in the bits. Stay in the
00:43:53
moments to keep inhabiting the moment that got you that that applause." Right? If you're like angry and the bit is
00:44:00
about anger and they're applauding, just stay in that. Stay in that and carry it to the next moment.
00:44:06
Still the bit in their heads, too. They're like, you don't just drop it. No. And I think about that now because a
00:44:11
lot of the bits I'm doing in this tour are more about a feeling than words. They're more about
00:44:18
uh conveying a a ridiculous emotion, but it's real to me. Mhm. So, uh I keep when they they get they're
00:44:26
laughing and I look at them sometimes like why are you laughing at this and that you if you stick with it you see it you feel it start to actually rise the laughter starts to
00:44:38
turn into and you can feel it changing and stuff and it's because of your attitude in forming it your body language.
00:44:43
Yeah. Because you're still in it. You don't just go like anyway that's that. A lot of comedians have a habit of dropping their eyes down to their feet
00:44:49
between bits anyway. I've done it. You know, sometimes I have a yellow pad and I have my stuff and I just write stay there.
00:44:56
That's great. And for me, if I'm just say I'm doing Joe Biden or something, just stay there.
00:45:02
If they love it, it'll be 15 minutes. That's right. Doesn't matter. That's my new idea in my head is when
00:45:08
I'm in a bit, I want to be thinking I This is what I came here to talk about, right? This one. Yeah. Yeah. I'm just here.
00:45:14
This is it. So that's in the big rooms like because some of the bigger ones it feels like you have to pump a lot of gas
00:45:21
into the room before you can light it and there's a lag. But if you keep your timing and you keep
00:45:28
your they find you they find they find your timing. They do because also you are one get you
00:45:36
think you're 35 against 3500 against one but they each think they're one to one.
00:45:42
Yeah. So, you have to know that your perception is distorted. Yeah. People used to say, "How is it
00:45:48
going on TV with 20 million people watching?" I go, "It's probably two at a time." Yes. And they're all watching one guy
00:45:54
and they're just in a room with two people. It's not that big of a deal. On SNL, you're just trying to get that audience to laugh. You're, you know, not
00:46:00
always cognizant. One thing I was interesting uh found interesting watching you over the years is that you do have a toolkit.
00:46:06
Like you have a lot of physicality. You do a lot of actouts. You have certain voices that you'll use and you also have
00:46:13
which everyone has is some you have a certain occasionally you'll just let out a big smile and a
00:46:20
big laugh, you know. Sure. And I talked with Jerry about that that all the greats have that moment to
00:46:25
signal to the audience or or to actually just let out release. Yes. But you have a lot of little moves you
00:46:31
do that are Louis CK moves that are little act outs. Are you aware of these? Some some of them I would try to get rid
00:46:37
of. Try really. Yeah. Just change. Yeah. Like I have a voice I try to get off of. I have a voice that when I hear it, I go get out. What is it? Is it sort of It's this guy. And he's and he's trying
00:46:50
to explain and he starts cracking cuz he doesn't think you're getting it. Oh. And then he's really upset, but inside he's going like, "What are you doing?
00:47:01
Stop it." So, and maybe it's an age thing. I'm trying to be this guy. Open the throat. I go on with hot tea. I open my throat.
00:47:09
Yeah. I'm talking like this and I'm talking. I'm a human being and I'm talking. I'm in the moment.
00:47:15
I'm not chasing a moment or running away from one. I'm in it. And if I start to feel like
00:47:20
I'm chasing, I go, "Okay." Okay. All right. Get back into it. Take a second. Anything.
00:47:26
I got a question about your It's interesting ticket master thing. When did you go from
00:47:32
I always thought it was so interesting. You got to be the first guy to do it. Were you sort of Everything's run from Louis CK. Everything's run from emails.
00:47:39
It just you didn't need anyone after a while, right? And did did you get any blowback from ticket places or did you
00:47:45
just say no more ticket master? I'm just going to Well, it was back when the first thing I did was sell my own special on my
00:47:51
website. Oh, that was a big deal. Yeah, because I was doing a special each year.
00:47:56
I was filling uh theaters. I was I was only doing standup at the time and um I was loving it. It was like the height for me and I could do two hours. It was crazy.
00:48:09
And uh and I could fill any place I asked to play and I saw so I wanted to do a special
00:48:16
and no one was doing them. Sometimes that happened back then. There was no Netflix then and HBO had quit it. They
00:48:23
were just like we don't lag. Yeah. You don't want to go to comedy. You don't want to go to something too small. No. And it was there was nothing around.
00:48:29
And I thought, well, I'm I'm one of the top guys. Like, it's I'm some people's favorite. Yeah. So, like, whatever. I'm in the ALDS. I'm in the Division League series. Fair. Yeah. Fair statement.
00:48:40
And uh so, uh how do I use that leverage? Uh well, what would happen if I sold it myself? What if I created a whole a store for one product and sold this thing by
00:48:52
myself? Yeah. And I got I hired some guys that do that and they interviewed me about
00:48:58
how I wanted the store to look. And I thought about all the things I hated about shopping for things like having to put in on your address
00:49:04
and make you make them your best friend. I said just tell them they can buy it and I'll they'll never hear from me again
00:49:09
and just drop your email if you want to hear from me, you know. And uh so we I did it and it made a [ __ ] ton of money
00:49:15
right away. And then I had all these emails and so I was able to when I toured al I was able to blast out and sell tickets and then I started looking at things like ticket master and you
00:49:29
know the fact that a lot of my tickets were getting sold for like $1,000 on StubHub and stuff
00:49:35
and that was a drag. Um, and people on ticket master were paying like $12 on top for extra fees and the tickets were a lot. And I I always charged less than
00:49:45
other comedians. I used to look at what is Kathy Griffin and and Jim Gaffigan's price and go a
00:49:52
little under. That was my smart that's how I priced my tickets all people. A little under those folks.
00:49:58
Um because I respect those two. Yeah. And I thought I just want to be an easy ticket to buy. That's all.
00:50:04
Yeah. So, uh, but that made me more easy to scalp, like it was a better investment. So, my fans Anyway, this is a long story. I don't want to because it's so interesting to me that
00:50:16
that happened. And that's what Theo has been talking about when we were doing this movie. He's like, why don't we do like Louie and we just
00:50:22
you just buy it. I think it's a good idea. It works. If you already have a following, which you guys obviously have,
00:50:27
but um it's risky. And I go I don't think people have done it. Maybe they've done it with movies. I go, should we be the
00:50:33
first? I mean, I go, let's watch someone [ __ ] it up and then go, oh, here's what they did wrong. Now we do it.
00:50:39
That's right. But to be first is tricky to do. It is. It can be. And I I had confidence
00:50:44
cuz I was I was selling so well and because I had an audience that wanted to see me. But then I started thinking about how Ticketmaster has the emails of
00:50:52
everybody who buys your tickets. They have the those those are the Glengary leads, you know, like they have
00:50:57
Yeah. the emails and they can contact everyone who has seen you, but you can't. And so we found a ticket company called Eix who would do exactly what Ticket
00:51:09
Master did for $12 and they charged like 50ents and they make it white label which means it looks like it's your company. And so we we decided let's just
00:51:21
do that. But then we learned that ticket master has a large uh monopoly on this stuff and that they pay theaters to not use other they pay him a premium to not use that [ __ ]
00:51:34
which is smart for them to do and I didn't have a problem with ticket master they just they had a lot of power
00:51:39
and I just so I created an alternative we our tickets were way cheaper and we hired people who were ex scalpers to
00:51:46
keep our stuff off the secondary market. It cost a lot of money to do this. So, I made like a quarter that tour of what I
00:51:54
would have made. But you put it in place and it was fun. It was so fun to do this. And I never had a I never was
00:52:00
anti- a ticket master. I'm a capitalist at heart. You weren't full Pearl Jam. No, I just was like, let's see if
00:52:07
there's another way. And um and sometimes we would find a room that didn't have a ticket master partnership
00:52:13
and we would engage them and then they call us back and say ticket master found out we were doing but we made that room a bunch of
00:52:19
money. So do you four wall rooms? I mean you rent I did back then but now I just don't have that kind of leverage now.
00:52:25
Now I just I use ticket master. I let them charge what you know I just I'm just one of the guys now.
00:52:31
That's what program did eventually just it's too it's too much overwhelming. Yeah. And you don't have the time to do
00:52:36
it. That's the thing, the the money, the money aspect show business and then the
00:52:41
the fun, you know, and like they'll go, "Well, we got you this much to play this casino or whatever." And then I go there and the
00:52:48
tickets are like way overpriced. Too much. And then there's a few empty seats. You're like, "No, I want a cheaper."
00:52:54
They they don't. We live in different parallel universes. I'm going to tell you, Dana, something
00:53:00
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00:53:52
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00:54:06
time offer. So don't miss out. Claim your extra 15% savings today. The thing that also impressed me was
00:54:12
when you went to FX and they're like, Lou, you know, make a show for us. Genius. And comedians will quote this.
00:54:19
What what do you have to pay me? What's the least amount you'll pay me where I just go make the show and hand it to
00:54:25
you? Is that correct? Yeah, more or less. I mean, John Langraph, who ran, he still runs FX. He
00:54:30
it was a dialogue with him. So, he was like, I'll give you 150,000. First, it was like, I'll give you 100,000 to do a
00:54:37
pilot. And I said, the only way I'm doing that is if I hand you a DVD. You wire me 100
00:54:42
grand and I'll hand you a DVD. We don't talk between those two things. He's like, done. So, we did it. I handed him a DVD. They went nuts for it. They had a bunch of
00:54:54
note. I had a notes call and then after the notes call I called him. I said I'm I'm not doing that. I'm not taking
00:54:59
notes. I did the whole call. I didn't listen to one. Everything a comedian would hate. You just said no. Well, because I had this the power I had
00:55:08
was joyful. In other words, stand up. Yes. Cuz he said he would say, well, you know, it's standard practice. And I'd
00:55:13
say it should be it's smart of you to give notes, but I don't feel like it, so let's just not do the show. I'll give
00:55:19
you back the $100,000. It always ended with let's not just let's just not do it. Here's the money.
00:55:24
I don't feel like it. I think you're really doing the right thing. I don't I'm not and he was like okay. But then
00:55:29
when we went to series he he wanted to do the show for very low again and I would say well give me more. And he'd say okay but I got to ask the boss for that money. I'm giving you checks I can
00:55:42
write at my desk right and no one asks. But if you want more money you need more
00:55:48
interference. So he kept me he was a that guy's a brilliant guy. So he was became an ally.
00:55:53
That's right. And he also when I pitched to give him credit when I pitched the show when I went there he was like I want you to do a show and I said I don't
00:56:00
really need a TV series. I was on the road. Yeah. And I said maybe a sketch show. And he
00:56:05
said I don't want a sketch show. And he said I want you to do a show about your family, the stuff you talk about on stage. And I said I don't I I would sell
00:56:12
that for a lot more money somewhere else. That's what I said to him. And he said, "Why don't what if you do a show that feels like sketches but has a
00:56:19
central theme of your life?" Yeah. And I said, "Uh, that reminded me of Annie Hall. There's like animation." And I said, and he goes, "If you want to make Annie Hall the TV show, I'm happy
00:56:31
to have you do that." So he he he helped me come up with what the show was. Yeah. And that that became an iconic what we
00:56:39
did. Yeah. Their currency is ratings. It's also awards. They all for them. It's all awards. they
00:56:44
want to be awards and it just gets it. It can do be a show that's does nothing but it wins and they love
00:56:50
it. That was another thing when that show came out and uh big deal. It was like it was I I don't I using the term loosely is it was Woody Allen level
00:57:00
of of writing and humanity and your character, you know. I don't know what what's your favorite Woody Allen movie.
00:57:06
It's a nonie is a huge one. So crimes and misdemeanors. He he has a bunch tied for first. Crimes and misdemeanors, husbands
00:57:13
and wives, Annie uh what's uh Hannah and her sisters beautiful. Um and then the early ones, Take the Money and Run and is hysterically funny.
00:57:25
Yeah, for sure. Um there's one in Bananas. I mean, [ __ ] I love all of them. Well, every few
00:57:30
years Paul and I will just sort of go through Woody, you know, Zelic, the one where sort of ahead of it time.
00:57:36
Zelic. Zelic. He's turns into like he's a chameleon and what do you call it? uh bananas.
00:57:42
He's in a court. It's a courtroom scene, right? He does the whole Yeah. But there's this one part where he says to the He goes to the judge, "This trial
00:57:50
is a mockery and a sham. Do you know that?" He says, "Do you know that there's not one homosexual on this
00:57:55
jury?" And the judge says, "Yes, there is." And he goes, "Oh, which one is it? The big guy at the end of
00:58:01
there's a movie that's kind of a you you'll you'll know it when I tell you, but it's something in the modern era
00:58:07
that I makes me feel so good." And it's a Woody movie and it's a touchstone for my wife and I
00:58:12
that we will revisit it and that's Midnight in Paris. I didn't see it. Holy [ __ ]
00:58:19
Wait, is it does he fly through the air with Goldie Horn? No, that's some other It's like 2014.
00:58:24
Midnight Express. What happened with it is that he finally found the best surrogate Woody. So Woody
00:58:30
can't play the part. So we put Owen Wilson in. Oh, he would be good. Yeah, we sort of had the same kind of rhythm.
00:58:37
Maybe we could just live here in Paris, you know, but it's it's it's a really fun if you're ever bored. Midnight,
00:58:44
check it out. Yeah, definitely should. Yeah, I I I like the guest. Before we let go, well, I want to
00:58:49
mention before I go, I want to say something nice about David Spade and please. Okay, so I was a comedian in New York and the bottom fell out of comedy like all in
00:59:00
one day. Like all the clubs were closing like 90 90. It was 90. This was 1992. Cable TV had come in and usurped everything but all the clubs closed. Everyone was and every so SNL had a big changeover of
00:59:15
writers and staff uh cast. Mhm. And so they were coming to see everybody at Catch Rising Star. All the comedians were getting seen and I did a a showcase
00:59:26
and it was uh David Tell was on it, Laura Kitinger, Jannine Goff, Jay Moore. Um, I mean a
00:59:33
bunch of people uh got seen that night and I was put on first and I hated that I was on first, but there it was. The club owner was the very didn't like me very much. John Stewart was hosting the
00:59:44
show and so this is like I got no I can't pay the rent. Like this is I need I just
00:59:50
want a writing job. I'll take anything. But this felt like the last train leaving for comedy for a lot of us. So,
00:59:58
um, we're going to do the the show starts cuz it's late. They're not there. No SNL people are there. And the show
01:00:05
starts and, uh, and he goes, "You're going on first." I'm like, "They're not going to see me. They're not here." And
01:00:11
he goes, "Too bad." Well, you know, John Stewart stretched as long as he could to kind of set the table,
01:00:17
try to get someone to be in the room on. There's an empty table. Okay. That there's no people to watch.
01:00:23
It's like pointless to go on. Yeah. No one's going to see me. Oh. And so finally Stuart looks at me
01:00:28
and goes like this. I'm sorry. And he brings me on and I start doing my set for no reason now because I mean I'm happy to there's an audience there but there's nobody. And then they come in while I'm on
01:00:43
stage. The like 12 people. Jim Downey. Oh. The whole bunch of them come in talking
01:00:51
and I'm like this is [ __ ] hell. David is in the group. I don't know David at the time. Didn't know him. Maybe a hello once in a while, a little bit. But he saw me and I saw him do
01:01:03
this. Oh. Oh, this guy. Come here. Sit down. He made them all sit down and said, "Yeah, watch him. Watch this guy." He settled this table down and he made them watch
01:01:14
me. And I didn't get the job. But the next day, Jim Downey called Robert Smeiggel
01:01:21
and said, "I'm not going to hire this guy, but you should." And he gave me the I got the other last train going, which
01:01:26
was Conan. Oh, it did work out something. Yeah. So, I appreciate it. Thank you. Cuz that must have If that's the J Mo,
01:01:33
of course. I'm glad I did some something right. Yeah. The whimsy. J Moore. God. And Kiteer.
01:01:39
Yeah. Cuz she did a year or two. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That was a big night. You hosted four times. Yeah. You hosted four times. Hosted four
01:01:45
times. You're traveling the world. I just thought this this is something that comedians talk about okay recently about
01:01:50
you and I think Jerry mentioned this um just again hey imagine this u he said it the family trip the family trip and you
01:02:01
get the kids in the luggage and you put the wife in and then you walk around the car and that's your vacation that's your vacation
01:02:07
so that is the walk from the car to your door yeah that's just such a wellobserved moment and it was done so I it just
01:02:14
sticks with me and the recent one which blew my mind. I guess I saw a YouTube or something was that you did this bit
01:02:21
about Goodwill Hunting. I guess you hear about that because it was like oh no what he can't what is he this movie's
01:02:27
for 30 and and yet it was completely relevant and it was so funny the physicality of the hand you're doing him
01:02:34
typing. Oh yeah. Yeah. Him him typing the movie and just doing going I'm like a really tough guy but
01:02:39
I'm I'm amazing. I'm a genius and I beat up everybody but I beat everybody up. It's
01:02:44
incredible. Yeah. And that's just funny seeing that and doing just a slightly altered. You get such a long bit. I watched it
01:02:50
before you came over this morning and you get so much out of it. Thanks. There's a lot. Thanks. I still watch your clips. Instagram is
01:02:57
good because they come in like you said watching standups. You'll see new ones but you're on there so I see these bits
01:03:04
and I was trying to remember them to go when he comes in. I got to say this but there's too many. So it's always
01:03:11
good to see one I haven't seen. Yeah. And I'm like, "This guy's still bit." I'm trying to sum up your advice. It's a little bit like the emotional warfare of
01:03:21
standup. Like if you're in a kitchen and had a drink in you with friends. Yeah. That voice back there is not really and
01:03:27
you're kind of telling a story. That's right. That's not there. No, you're not future tripping pastor.
01:03:33
You're just And so to take that, but have 20,000 look at you or or or 300 and emotionally calm that down and just be centered. Well, it's a it's saying this to yourself about every moment. There's
01:03:45
there's um this feels new and jittery, but it's okay. This isn't the last moment. Get comfortable and there's potential in this moment. Yeah. And uh and it's you're it's going to
01:03:59
pass and don't don't and savor it no matter what it is. So, I I I feel that way in life and on stage has been helping me a lot. I was asked this once on one of these
01:04:10
type of podcasts. How do you How do you turn someone on? How do you turn someone on? Yeah. I don't know how. Well, whatever you guys are doing right now is working.
01:04:24
All right. Do you need a blanket or how do you turn I thought it sounds like a riddle. I thought it was a riddle.
01:04:29
I just said to them, uh, turn yourself on. And they go, no one's ever said that. I like that. Yeah. Turn yourself on. Sometimes I do
01:04:37
try to find a way out of the boredom and the tedium of standup to get excited and whether I'm altering something or
01:04:44
stepping outside whatever I'm doing to make myself feel joyful because sometimes you don't get
01:04:50
sometimes I do think that there's a like there's a phenomenon that happens to me sometimes I shoot two shows to do
01:04:57
a special and the first show I'm just too I got too much adrenaline and the crowd's dry
01:05:02
so I really struggle. Yeah. And then a second show it I just feel great. They've been out already. They're later
01:05:08
crowded. They're looser and it's wonderful. I go back and look at them when I edit it. I end up using the first show more
01:05:15
because the first show I'm like on edge and I'm not happy and that's funnier. I'd rather watch a comedian who's really
01:05:22
not comfortable. We we as comedians want to be like we just want to be like that's me.
01:05:27
Hey man, it's going great up here. But that's not fun. It's not fun to watch for standup. It's not fun to watch
01:05:33
somebody who's in the pocket and feeling really great. It's fun to watch somebody who's like, I don't know how to explain
01:05:39
this to you and I kind of hate you a little right now and I want to go home. I'd rather watch that.
01:05:44
Okay, it's great. I'm going to do a set tonight and apply all these techniques. Good. And there's going to be a giant I've
01:05:50
already made a little text. There's going to be a huge picture of you at the comedy store behind me and I go, "This
01:05:56
is the guy who told me to do this set." And when I'm when I they take me off in handcuffs. Yeah. Yeah. I go, "Oh,
01:06:01
that's very interesting." Well, God, that's fascinating. And no wonder you're still at the top of your whatever
01:06:07
the Istanbul improv. I'm looking at Dana all these places. I'm going to Yes. Crazy. Yeah. My accent. Have you been there before? India. Almost going to India. The valley. Never been to India. Never been to
01:06:17
Turkey. I've been to Athens is and uh Bucharest. Some of the places I've been to and they they all speak English.
01:06:23
They all the stand up standup in English is all over the world now. It's a big thing. Yeah. I play a lot internationally.
01:06:30
Will my stuff about Ralph's work? I don't we if you explain what Ralph's is. Yes.
01:06:36
Oh, you got to give it a little of that first. Just a little. Yeah. Supermarket.
01:06:41
Now we're in. Do you mind if I get a selfie? Oh, no. Sorry. Um Well, can you come back in like a few
01:06:47
months again or whatever you want. We're really happy to be here. I could do it for another two hours. That was really fun.
01:06:53
Thank you, Louis. Great to see you. You're Louis CK. You're David Spade. Yep. And I wrote a book. It's on.
01:06:59
Oh, Ingram. Go. Yeah. Do you have that book? Can we hold it up? Ingram is the book. You have the Ingram book? Yeah. Let's
01:07:06
hold that up. We can cut this part cuz I The cover is really cool. And the the texture of the cover. I like it. Did
01:07:13
they show that to They I Book people are so different than TV people cuz TV like you're like you
01:07:18
guys don't know what the [ __ ] you're doing and they ask stupid questions, but book people are smarter than me.
01:07:24
So like I got an email from this woman saying like I went through the book yesterday. like she went through the whole book. She's like, "I think that
01:07:30
your original strategy for commas in the book was better than what the editor the editor did and I want to restore it."
01:07:36
And I wrote back to her and said, "I got to be really honest with you. I don't know what the [ __ ] you're talking about. Uh, do whatever you think is best." So,
01:07:42
the cover they they I showed them a cover of Grapes of Wrath that I really liked, a vintage version,
01:07:48
and I said, "This is the vibe." And they they just they came up with this. So, well, it's all how it's done, and it
01:07:54
just it just looks really cool. Feels good. The book is Ingram. Here you go. Here we go. The gentleman joins us. Louis CK. He's be at the Comedy Store tonight at the Ice House Tuesday.
01:08:05
Thursday he'll be at Sir Lasserot in Fresno. But right now he's got a new bestseller. Louis CK. It's called Ingram,
01:08:13
funnily enough. But anyway, that is see all how that's faded. I don't It's a Photoshop thing or
01:08:19
someone painted it. Yeah, it does kind of draw you in. So that's another Well, that's full circle what we
01:08:25
wanted to talk about. This is uh your your latest achievement. Have you had enough compliments or is the pouch full?
01:08:31
A little more. Please reveal more. But it is it's impressive. Is that And um when I finish it, I'm going to
01:08:36
call you. Good. When you're in I hope so. I talked to Dino today on the way here. He's my buddy. I love
01:08:42
I know he's there's only one Dino. Yeah. All right. Hey guys, if you're loving this podcast, which you are, be sure to click follow on your favorite podcast app. Give us a
01:08:57
review, fivestar rating, and maybe even share an episode that you've loved with a friend.
01:09:02
If you're watching this episode on YouTube, please subscribe. We're on video now. Fly on the Wall is presented by Odyssey,
01:09:08
an executive produced by Dana Carvey and David Spade, Heather Santoro, and Greg Holtzman. Mattie Sprung Kaiser and Leah
01:09:16
Reese Dennis of Odyssey. Our senior producer is Greg Holtzman and the show is produced and edited by Phil Sweet
01:09:23
Tech. Booking by Cultivated Entertainment. Special thanks to Patrick Fogerty, Evan Cox, Mora Curran, Melissa
01:09:32
Wester, Hillary Schuff, Eric Donnelly, Colin Gainner, Sean Cherry, Kurt Courtourtney, and Lauren Vieiraa. Reach out with us. Any questions to be asked and answered on the show, you can
01:09:44
email us at flyinthewally.com. That's audacy.com.