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Karin Burger - Silver Ferns Star Opens Up About Love & Life as a Professional Athlete

November 26, 2023 / 01:44:47

This episode features Karen Berger, a prominent New Zealand netball player, discussing her recent milestone of playing 50 games for the Silver Ferns, her journey from South Africa to New Zealand, and her experiences in high-performance sports.

Karen reflects on her recent match against Australia, where New Zealand won despite not securing the cup due to goal differentials. She shares how she discovered it was her milestone game only upon arrival at the venue, highlighting the pressures athletes face.

The conversation covers her early years in South Africa, her decision to move to New Zealand at 18, and the challenges she faced in establishing herself in netball. Karen emphasizes the importance of building a life outside of sports and the support from her family.

She also discusses her experiences with injuries, including a significant ankle injury that sidelined her during the Commonwealth Games, and how it shaped her perspective on health and nutrition.

Throughout the episode, Karen shares her thoughts on personal growth, relationships, and the balance between her athletic career and personal life, offering a candid look at the life of a professional athlete.

TL;DR

Karen Berger discusses her 50th game, journey from South Africa, and experiences in netball, including injuries and personal growth.

Episode

1:44:47

00:00:00

Karen Berger welcome to my podcast a

00:00:02

thanks for having me what a lovely day

00:00:05

it is 9:30 on a on a Monday morning

00:00:08

little bit of um behind the scenes here

00:00:09

so uh you and I have been going

00:00:11

backwards and forwards we set this up

00:00:12

maybe a month ago six weeks ago and I

00:00:16

assumed that you were going to be an

00:00:18

ockland for net wall but I I had no idea

00:00:21

the significance of the game so

00:00:23

yesterday afternoon it was um New

00:00:24

Zealand versus Australia and you guys

00:00:26

won congratulations and it was your it

00:00:28

was a milestone game it was your 50 game

00:00:30

yeah as a silver Fern and at the end

00:00:33

there was a presentation with a big

00:00:34

bunch of flowers and uh massive

00:00:36

highlights were were playing on the on

00:00:38

the video screen and here you are the

00:00:39

morning after oh gosh yeah it's been a

00:00:41

massive couple of months for us actually

00:00:44

to be honest a year um heaps a net ball

00:00:47

so it's just good to have finished on a

00:00:50

highlight that last night unfortunately

00:00:52

we didn't come away with the cup because

00:00:53

of the gold differentials but to be able

00:00:55

to win the last couple of games against

00:00:57

Aussie was amazing and I wasn't aware of

00:01:00

the Milestone and that it was happening

00:01:02

so um I pretty much found out when I

00:01:04

arrived at the game how are you not

00:01:06

aware um well you know like we don't

00:01:09

track how many games we play like we get

00:01:11

told oh great you've played so many

00:01:12

games so um I knew it was coming up at

00:01:15

some point because of the filming that

00:01:17

they' done prior so I just didn't know

00:01:19

when it was going to happen to be honest

00:01:21

I actually thought I missed it this year

00:01:23

um and I think I was watching the men's

00:01:25

game before ours and one of the um CA

00:01:28

people came up to me like oh

00:01:29

congratulations I was like um on what um

00:01:32

so yeah that's pretty much when I found

00:01:34

out but it's good to not know because

00:01:35

that just adds a bit of extra pressure

00:01:37

on you that you don't need need you know

00:01:39

celebrations and surprise afterwards

00:01:41

quite nice yeah but it must be a nice

00:01:43

time to I don't know maybe take a moment

00:01:46

to pause and reflect on where you've

00:01:47

come from because I I mean I before I

00:01:51

started researching for this chat I I

00:01:53

thought I knew the Caren Burger story I

00:01:55

thought talented netballer maybe got

00:01:57

shoulder tapped to come to New Zealand

00:01:59

and and sort of develop here but the the

00:02:02

actual story is quite different and

00:02:03

we'll get into this but you moved here

00:02:04

when you were 18 you weren't on anyone's

00:02:06

radar when it came to like high

00:02:08

performance sport yeah and you just like

00:02:10

grind and grafted away for many years

00:02:13

yeah um I think people quite often ask

00:02:16

me like why did you make like what made

00:02:19

you make the big move um and at that

00:02:21

point like when you're 18 you just want

00:02:22

to go do something you want to have fun

00:02:24

like any Adventure is a good Adventure

00:02:26

so Mom mentioned that she had family

00:02:28

here was actually here I um Dad had a

00:02:31

best friend over there or mom had family

00:02:33

here which I hadn't met at that point um

00:02:36

but I thought yeah why not and I just

00:02:38

came for a holiday for a gap Year and

00:02:40

that it's turned into 12 years um and I

00:02:44

think the Nets are good driving force

00:02:46

for me to want to keep to stay um but I

00:02:49

also started building a life outside of

00:02:50

that and I think that's what helped with

00:02:52

that grind uh didn't take well took me

00:02:55

up to seven years before I actually

00:02:56

pulled on that black dress so um and

00:02:59

again people ask me how how you lasted

00:03:01

that long or how you kept grinding but

00:03:03

if you've got stuff other stuff that you

00:03:05

can focus on and also not have all your

00:03:06

eggs in one basket that's just a part of

00:03:09

your life um so yeah I really started

00:03:11

building a life for myself in New

00:03:13

Zealand and that's why I could have

00:03:14

stayed and kep doing what I was doing

00:03:17

yeah yeah it's a good message and we'll

00:03:19

we'll dig really deep into into all that

00:03:21

as we get through first first of all I

00:03:22

just want to go back to last night a

00:03:23

little bit so so the day of a big game

00:03:25

like that New Zealand versus Australia

00:03:27

um what what does what does the day look

00:03:28

like so you get up in the morning yeah

00:03:31

game day is pretty much Groundhog Day to

00:03:33

be honest it was a bit of an earlier

00:03:35

game so we didn't have the as much

00:03:36

downtime as we usually do but we get up

00:03:39

in the morning we go to our Captain's

00:03:40

run that's mainly for our Shooters to

00:03:42

just go shoot um we've this last couple

00:03:45

of series we started because we've got a

00:03:47

lot of young ones in our team and we've

00:03:49

started dancing so you're 30 what's

00:03:52

what's a young one oh no we've got like

00:03:54

babies like 19 year olds like 20 21 year

00:03:57

olds like they're really babies um

00:04:00

so um we've started this dancing um so

00:04:03

cool and we just danced to start off

00:04:05

with the captain's run it just gets the

00:04:06

vibe going and that um yeah just some

00:04:09

fun and then the shooters get to shoot

00:04:11

so finish off our Captain's run go back

00:04:13

to the hotel pretty much eat and rest

00:04:15

and eat and rest and eat and rest until

00:04:17

we have to strap and get ready for the

00:04:19

game so it's a pretty chill day um but

00:04:23

yeah pretty much Groundhog Day for for

00:04:25

game days are you nervous the day of a

00:04:27

game um yes and no I don't think the

00:04:31

nerves kick in for me personally until

00:04:33

I'm actually out there on court

00:04:34

especially standing singing The Anthem

00:04:36

or sometimes in the changing room um and

00:04:39

it depends on the magnitude of the game

00:04:41

as well um but once that whistle goes

00:04:44

it's gone because then the adrenaline

00:04:46

kicks in and you're good to go so it's

00:04:47

just managing that stress beforehand so

00:04:49

it just doesn't override um your

00:04:52

performance and so what happened in the

00:04:55

series so the first two games Australia

00:04:57

um beat New Zealand quite convincing

00:05:00

by like sort of 10 points each game and

00:05:01

then the second two games you guys

00:05:03

turned it around completely they were

00:05:04

they were tight wins but they were still

00:05:05

wins yeah I think um a Home Advantage

00:05:08

counts quite a lot for the team whoever

00:05:10

and whoever's country it's played and

00:05:12

Australia had a massive um crowd like

00:05:15

two massive stadiums um and also they're

00:05:18

the reigning Champs I mean well deserved

00:05:20

they play amazing neet Ball but we also

00:05:22

knew that we can do better we're way

00:05:24

better than what we've been putting out

00:05:26

there so it's just good to have seen in

00:05:27

the last couple of games we started

00:05:29

clicking and then we had that eighth

00:05:30

player the crowd backing us as well so

00:05:33

we really just wanted to um put some

00:05:35

pride in that dress and um play for the

00:05:37

country because we've had massive

00:05:39

support which is amazing we're very

00:05:41

grateful for so we just want to put it

00:05:43

out there for the fans as well yeah it

00:05:45

must have been a strange uh feeling for

00:05:47

Australia last night because um they

00:05:49

just lost the game um the series was

00:05:51

tied to all and they won this Trophy and

00:05:55

must be really weird like losing a game

00:05:56

and then after giving it everything and

00:05:58

then winning it must feel like like a

00:05:59

bit of a hollow victory in way I know it

00:06:01

was an interesting Vibe cuz like even

00:06:03

though we lost we were quite excited and

00:06:06

happy because we'd won the game and

00:06:08

obviously they' lost their game but they

00:06:10

still won the cup and I think there's

00:06:12

the discussions are up there about

00:06:14

whether we add a fifth game yeah deci

00:06:17

makes sense yeah yeah but I mean like

00:06:19

they well deserved that win because

00:06:21

their goal differentials was a lot

00:06:22

higher and wi you going and that was the

00:06:25

nature of the of the cup so we need to

00:06:28

make sure next time if we do lose we

00:06:29

can't lose by heaps like that but yeah

00:06:32

hopefully on the cards we can add

00:06:33

another game and then make it a um tight

00:06:36

deciding game um but yeah that will just

00:06:39

add add to the time that we're away from

00:06:41

home as well and add to the load but

00:06:44

yeah I guess we get to do this because

00:06:46

we're fortunate enough to play in that

00:06:47

black dress so what's an extra game yeah

00:06:50

and then and then what happens after the

00:06:51

game uh as I said it's Monday morning

00:06:53

we're recording this at 9:30 you're

00:06:55

looking

00:06:56

amazing hasn't been an all nighter

00:06:58

clearly no no um luckily because it was

00:07:02

an early game last night quite a lot of

00:07:04

um the girls jumped on early flights to

00:07:06

go home like I've mentioned it's been a

00:07:08

massive um month for us um and also this

00:07:11

time these moms and the team have been

00:07:13

away from their kids for a while so

00:07:14

everybody just wanted to get home um so

00:07:17

pretty much most of the team jumped on

00:07:19

the on planes earlier to go home um a

00:07:21

couple of us stayed behind for some

00:07:23

other things but yeah usually after game

00:07:25

everybody's so tired just want to go

00:07:28

home have a really good feed and get

00:07:30

into bed cuz generally we've got late

00:07:32

games so we don't get to bed by like

00:07:34

until 11: wow I thought you'd be out for

00:07:37

like a team dinner or some celebratory

00:07:39

drinks or something is it not not like

00:07:41

that um sometimes it's like sometimes

00:07:43

yeah depends on the vibe um I think we

00:07:47

spend so much time together that having

00:07:50

an extra dinner is not necessarily what

00:07:52

everybody's wanting at that time

00:07:54

everybody just wants to get back to

00:07:55

their significant others and and their

00:07:57

family so um yeah I think we've seen

00:08:00

enough of each other this year to not

00:08:02

want to add to that yeah yeah well

00:08:04

speaking of significant others so um

00:08:07

you're sort of famously single um it

00:08:09

feels like it it's become like a I don't

00:08:12

know like a footnote in the in the Cen

00:08:14

bger story but um I believe there might

00:08:16

be there might be someone simmering oh

00:08:19

gosh uh now your your teammate and

00:08:21

friend Maya Wilson I I oh my God I

00:08:24

tapped into her for some um she's been

00:08:26

on the podcast previously and I tapped

00:08:27

into her for some info and she said well

00:08:30

I mean I I know the story that she told

00:08:31

me but obviously there's two sides story

00:08:33

every you look

00:08:34

embarrassed obviously there's two sides

00:08:37

through every story so I'm K to hear

00:08:38

your version of events um key words

00:08:41

Christ Church

00:08:42

coryland god um yeah oh gosh um I guess

00:08:49

yeah big 30 single um I'm a little bit

00:08:53

picky um I think it's with more with my

00:08:55

time more so than anything else um that

00:08:59

unless I really feel like there's

00:09:01

something or that I feel like I'm in the

00:09:04

right place personally quite often it's

00:09:06

not to do with other person but me as

00:09:07

well um I don't want to drain my energy

00:09:11

and I'm a firm believer of the right

00:09:12

person at the right time will happen so

00:09:14

I'll just wait for that to happen but

00:09:17

yeah um the team's always trying to play

00:09:20

Cupid um with me which is really cute uh

00:09:23

is it annoy is it is it cute or is it

00:09:25

annoying annoying sometimes uh no

00:09:28

they've only got my best interest at

00:09:30

heart um so I don't mind that um and I

00:09:33

guess I'm a big enough girl to be like

00:09:35

no stop now so um no it's really cute

00:09:39

but yeah gosh the latest one um yeah

00:09:44

it's just a uh we had a lady that was a

00:09:48

it's a massive netball supporter um and

00:09:50

she's beautiful she still sends me

00:09:51

messages it's really cool um and I think

00:09:55

she probably just asked in the team

00:09:56

who's single because she's got a son

00:09:58

then

00:10:00

that's also single so try to play

00:10:02

matchmaker there yeah that's probably as

00:10:06

far as I'll go the moment because that's

00:10:08

as far as it's gotten can I fill in some

00:10:10

of the some of the blanks according to

00:10:12

my award oh gosh yeah sure so apparently

00:10:14

you guys are in the lounge sitting as a

00:10:16

team and this this woman comes over and

00:10:18

she's like who's single who's single my

00:10:20

son's single which one of you guys are

00:10:21

single so it's like she just wanted a

00:10:24

netballer not necessarily zoning in on

00:10:26

Karen burger and then and then you made

00:10:29

you follow her son on Instagram and he's

00:10:31

a doctor or a radiologist well we

00:10:33

haven't followed each other but um oh I

00:10:35

heard there was a couple of DMS that

00:10:36

have gone big we've messaged yeah but um

00:10:39

again like busy schedule you know like

00:10:42

you mentioned he's a doctor so he's busy

00:10:44

as well but yeah it's I mean it's it's

00:10:47

one of those stories if it ends up if it

00:10:49

ends up I mean the chance is very slim

00:10:51

that it's it's going to end up being you

00:10:52

know your soulmate but in the event that

00:10:54

it is it's a hell of a meat

00:10:56

K look to be honest at this point point

00:10:59

the people how I meet people are quite

00:11:02

interesting um I'm not overly social um

00:11:06

and that's what my mom and my sister

00:11:07

always tells me you can't sit at home

00:11:09

and expect to meet the right guy so and

00:11:12

I'm also fussy about um social media I'm

00:11:16

old school in that way I like being

00:11:17

approached either in person um or just

00:11:20

not on social media but I know that's

00:11:23

the way things go these days so um it's

00:11:26

more so about how they approach me on

00:11:28

social media as as well which sometimes

00:11:30

can throw me off or not so how do you

00:11:32

mean what throws you off I think it's

00:11:34

how uh like if you go directly into my

00:11:38

looks or like that kind of stuff I don't

00:11:41

yeah if the first comment on a DM is

00:11:43

something superficial it's yeah yeah so

00:11:46

it's all about how you he talked to me

00:11:49

in the first instance as well whether

00:11:51

I'll give you that attention or not so

00:11:54

you you seem you seem incredibly um self

00:11:57

assured like where does this come from

00:11:59

I don't mean that in a in a negative way

00:12:01

either I think it's a good thing yeah um

00:12:04

it can be a good and a bad thing

00:12:06

sometimes um I'm guessing a lot of

00:12:09

people find it intimidating that's what

00:12:11

I've heard and I think that's probably

00:12:13

also why I probably am single at this

00:12:16

point um I've like heaps of my guy

00:12:19

friends tell me that I come across quite

00:12:21

intimidating which is like like I'm

00:12:23

really not um but yeah I think it's just

00:12:27

part of it has got to do with having

00:12:29

moved to New Zealand um at 18 and having

00:12:32

to you know just fight my own way and

00:12:34

find my own way and um being alone quite

00:12:37

often you just have to be comfortable

00:12:39

with yourself and spending that time

00:12:41

with yourself um I mean raised um by m

00:12:44

and dad in a way that we were able to go

00:12:47

out and do that kind of thing and just

00:12:48

want the most out of life and be self

00:12:51

assured in ourselves um and know who we

00:12:53

are and be happy with ourselves

00:12:55

regardless of what the outside world

00:12:57

sees or does so um yeah fortunate to

00:13:00

have had that upbringing um I mean the

00:13:02

person I was when I first moved to New

00:13:03

Zealand is completely different who I am

00:13:05

now um yeah I've I've heard you refer to

00:13:08

yourself as being sort of shy and

00:13:09

introverted yes very years ago but I

00:13:12

mean you go you go through a lot of

00:13:13

growing up in your 20s don't you yeah

00:13:14

I'm look to be honest I'm I would still

00:13:16

say I am shy

00:13:18

um uh yeah it's a bit of a a balance

00:13:22

thing for me I would still say I'm shy

00:13:24

at times um but definitely have grown up

00:13:27

quite a lot since I probably when I

00:13:29

first moved I would not have spoken

00:13:31

unless it was spoken to me I would just

00:13:33

like hide in the corners I wouldn't want

00:13:34

to do anything um whereas now I try and

00:13:37

put myself out there I've realized over

00:13:39

the last few year or like over the years

00:13:41

that I've been in New Zealand any

00:13:42

opportunity is a great opportunity so I

00:13:43

have to put myself out there even though

00:13:45

it puts me in an uncomfortable position

00:13:47

sometimes so um and that's worked well

00:13:49

for me so yeah well let's play enough

00:13:53

about your dating life we can we can

00:13:54

move move on but have you been in love

00:13:55

before have you had a relationship a

00:13:57

long-term relationship before yeah um I

00:13:59

mean when I was a lot a lot younger I

00:14:02

think since being in New Zealand I

00:14:04

haven't had a long-term relationship um

00:14:06

really but you moved here when you were

00:14:07

18 yeah I know that's single for a very

00:14:10

long time isn't it um no I've like

00:14:13

talked to people here and there but

00:14:15

never like I mentioned the time and

00:14:17

especially with Nall being so busy I

00:14:20

just never had the time to really um

00:14:22

want to spend that um on a significant

00:14:25

other I think I was really just focusing

00:14:27

on myself but yeah back in the day I had

00:14:30

at high school I had a a partner for

00:14:32

well boyfri for three years um yeah and

00:14:36

then before I moved to New Zealand I had

00:14:38

a long-distance relationship for about a

00:14:40

year or so and just ended up um having

00:14:43

to end that because he had a life in

00:14:44

South Africa I had life in New Zealand I

00:14:46

just didn't see that working or going

00:14:47

anywhere so yeah we ended that and yeah

00:14:51

ever since it's just been me grinding

00:14:53

away by myself so but the right person

00:14:56

will come at the right time 100% yeah um

00:14:58

something else Maya Wilson said us that

00:15:00

you she described you as a Shopaholic

00:15:02

and she said wherever she said um and

00:15:04

she even said um pretty much every city

00:15:07

you go to a Pat from in

00:15:08

Vago yeah apologies inago gosh um like

00:15:13

um because I am just me I don't have

00:15:16

kids to take care of I don't have a

00:15:17

partner or anything so pretty much the

00:15:19

money I have I can spend on myself so I

00:15:21

was like um I'm very big on budgeting

00:15:24

though like I know I spend um but I make

00:15:27

sure that I can spend the money that I

00:15:29

do spend um so this time around I took

00:15:33

an extra little hand luggage you would

00:15:35

have seen me coming in this morning with

00:15:37

my extra little um roller case yeah

00:15:39

there's chicken suitcase and carryon

00:15:41

yeah what did you buy yeah so the

00:15:43

carry-on was empty when I left um yeah I

00:15:47

oh gosh what I what did I buy um I

00:15:50

bought the shoes I'm wearing uh I bought

00:15:53

some boots uh I bought a dress I'm going

00:15:56

to the races in November in Christ

00:15:57

Church uh bought a summer

00:16:00

dress gosh I bought some face products

00:16:04

yeah anything and everything really God

00:16:07

you must be exhausted by the time the

00:16:08

game plays you Caren oh she's been

00:16:11

shopping all day that's my therapy

00:16:13

though like I even though I don't buy

00:16:15

anything it's just nice to get out of

00:16:16

the house um and just get amongst people

00:16:19

and in the shops and things uh it's just

00:16:22

my retail therapy yeah oh fair enough

00:16:25

yeah right say so let's go let's go all

00:16:27

the way back um um back into the early

00:16:29

days of Karen Burger so tell me about

00:16:32

South Africa where are you from you're

00:16:33

from like a small Country Town yeah um I

00:16:35

usually just say Cape Town but it's a

00:16:37

few hours away though yeah about a

00:16:39

three-hour drive but it's like

00:16:42

three-hour drive up the West Coast um

00:16:44

quite a small town um went to an even

00:16:48

smaller town from that town primary

00:16:51

school because Mom was my first grade um

00:16:54

teacher she's a the a teacher for the

00:16:56

first grades there um Prim Primary

00:16:58

School in a very small town slightly

00:17:00

bigger town for high school um but all

00:17:03

my sports and everything was pretty much

00:17:05

in Cape Town every weekend so um spent a

00:17:08

lot of time in that area um so I'm quite

00:17:11

familiar with that area as well what's

00:17:13

what's I've never been to South Africa

00:17:15

but um one thing one of the first things

00:17:17

that that gets sort of bought up is um

00:17:19

just how how violent and unsafe the

00:17:21

place is in terms of car jackings and

00:17:22

stuff is that your experience um I think

00:17:25

it get a bad R yeah yeah I think growing

00:17:28

up there um it's just you know what to

00:17:31

do and what not to do and I think if you

00:17:34

stick to those rules you're quite all

00:17:36

right sometimes you can be a bit unlucky

00:17:38

at times um but since living in New

00:17:41

Zealand I have realized how bad it can

00:17:44

get um and how amazing it can be um and

00:17:48

going back home I do real I definitely

00:17:51

notice it's ramped up in the last few

00:17:53

years as well um when I speak to my

00:17:55

family again I realize how South

00:17:57

Africans that live there just so used to

00:17:59

it that they don't necessarily know how

00:18:02

bad it can be um but for it's an amazing

00:18:05

place I love going there on holiday um

00:18:08

again if you go with the right people

00:18:09

and you know what to do and what not to

00:18:11

do it's it's all right it's all good um

00:18:15

but yeah it's definitely a sense of

00:18:16

having to look over your shoulder uh

00:18:19

quite often yeah although like and

00:18:20

saying that just while you were giving

00:18:22

that answer I mean you know new New

00:18:23

Zealand we're not entirely safe anymore

00:18:25

anyway are we there's you know Ram raids

00:18:27

all the time and yeah we got our own

00:18:29

issues I think every country has their

00:18:31

positives and negatives and like my

00:18:33

sister I know she loves the country

00:18:35

itself it's beautiful um and the people

00:18:38

like she's especially saying with the

00:18:40

Rugby World Cup at the moment it's

00:18:41

amazing how rugby can bring everybody

00:18:43

together and how um supportive everyone

00:18:46

is at the moment in The Vibes in South

00:18:47

Africa at the moment over there so it

00:18:49

definitely has its positives don't get

00:18:51

me wrong so it's not it's not the worst

00:18:53

country yeah well by the time this

00:18:55

podcast comes out it's going to be old

00:18:56

news but yeah theug World Cup final is

00:18:59

next weekend it's New Zealand South

00:19:00

Africa um one one country you were born

00:19:03

in it's been 18 years one country that

00:19:05

you've represented and Sport for the

00:19:06

last five years and spent 12 years and

00:19:08

who who are you who do you root for yeah

00:19:11

I've heard this quite often um over the

00:19:13

last couple of weeks um people keep

00:19:15

asking me that too um I think values

00:19:19

wise and morals wise um I can't justify

00:19:23

not am supporting the All Blacks I live

00:19:25

in a country I play for the country

00:19:28

represent the country I benefit from the

00:19:30

country so for that reason I would

00:19:33

support the All Blacks but um obviously

00:19:36

have that little piece of heart with

00:19:38

South Africa so I won't be gutted if

00:19:40

they do wi either it makes the game

00:19:42

quite fun because regardless of what the

00:19:44

outcome is you're going to be a happy

00:19:45

exactly I know we were watching we had

00:19:48

our training when South Africa was

00:19:49

playing their um semifinal um the other

00:19:53

day and it was such an intense game we

00:19:56

were just stra or like finishing at

00:19:58

tying our shoelaces and getting ready

00:19:59

and I think MAA or Tiana put up the

00:20:02

story um about us watching that last few

00:20:05

minutes of that game and how we

00:20:07

celebrated and everybody got in on it as

00:20:09

well like I mean they're not even South

00:20:10

African supporters but they um got into

00:20:13

it as well so yeah really felt the love

00:20:15

from the team there yeah well I I think

00:20:17

anyone just really likes watching like a

00:20:19

good game of rugby and um we've been

00:20:20

spoiled with him the last couple of

00:20:21

weeks in those quarterfinal games and

00:20:23

then that that game against England the

00:20:24

semi-final game that was just phenomenal

00:20:27

was remarkable South deserve to win it

00:20:29

was ex the performances out in the Rugby

00:20:31

World Cup has has been amazing so um

00:20:34

yeah it's been an exciting World Cup

00:20:36

yeah so what do you like in South Africa

00:20:38

as a as a young girl you were a high

00:20:40

jumper eh I was yeah well small town so

00:20:43

there wasn't many options to do in terms

00:20:46

of um sport uh but I try to do as much

00:20:49

as I possibly can um my two like main

00:20:53

ones were in the winter neat ball and in

00:20:55

the summer was high jump um but

00:20:58

gosh I played tennis I did a bit of

00:21:01

gymnastics if there was any dance

00:21:03

classes I would go do that um and I

00:21:05

think when I was about

00:21:07

14 uh I tore uh my cartilage in my knee

00:21:11

and I had to have an operation and at

00:21:13

that point mom was like right I know you

00:21:15

love doing all this stuff but I think

00:21:17

we're overdoing it a little bit with

00:21:19

your body you need to pick and choose

00:21:20

what you want to do so at that point I

00:21:21

was like right okay in the winter I'll

00:21:23

do neat ball in the summer I'll do um

00:21:25

high jump and I loved high jump it was

00:21:27

so good but it's a very individual sport

00:21:29

um anybody in athletics will probably be

00:21:31

able to tell you that it's a good

00:21:33

Community um don't get me wrong but you

00:21:36

when you're competing it's pretty much

00:21:37

you just you so I sort of L A little bit

00:21:41

more towards the netball the team sport

00:21:43

yeah how did how did you how did you

00:21:44

mess up your knee at the age of 14 like

00:21:46

um a cartilage tear that sounds like an

00:21:48

older person's injury doesn't it yeah I

00:21:50

know um well apparently according to the

00:21:52

doctor because of the high jump the

00:21:54

constant like landing and twisting on

00:21:56

the leg and then the the neet balls that

00:21:59

constant like jarring on the knees um

00:22:02

and I guess at that age you don't really

00:22:04

do much prehab rehab kind of stuff so um

00:22:08

which when you get older you sort of

00:22:10

regret a little bit but yeah I think

00:22:12

just overdoing it a little bit too much

00:22:14

on everything um and not managing myself

00:22:17

well enough at that age but yeah they're

00:22:20

holding up so far yeah oh listen you

00:22:22

played your 50th game for New Zealand

00:22:24

last night you're doing the old knes are

00:22:26

doing just fine so did they did they

00:22:28

operate at the time did they like scrape

00:22:30

you out clean you out yeah well funny

00:22:31

enough because at that age they were

00:22:32

like you're quite young we don't want to

00:22:34

take any of it out so they tried to just

00:22:36

Stitch it up and see if they can

00:22:38

obviously there's not much blood flow to

00:22:40

that area so it was going to be a risk

00:22:42

whether it was going to work or not but

00:22:44

it ended up working um but over the

00:22:46

years the last few years especially

00:22:49

they've got you know damage to them

00:22:51

again I've got a few tear here or there

00:22:53

but not significant enough for me to

00:22:55

have to do anything about it so it's

00:22:57

just managing them really yeah cuz I I

00:23:00

was knowing that you were coming around

00:23:01

today I watched the game last yesterday

00:23:03

afternoon under a different sort of lens

00:23:05

I guess and in particular like focusing

00:23:07

on you and um yeah there's there's a lot

00:23:09

of jumping around isn't

00:23:11

there and I was thinking about your

00:23:13

knees with every there's a lot of

00:23:15

impacts I mean it's it's remarkable that

00:23:17

you've that you've had and continue to

00:23:19

have the career that you have um given

00:23:21

this um this knee issue at the age of 14

00:23:24

that could have that could have spelled

00:23:25

the end of any sort of like dreams or

00:23:26

hope really couldn't it yeah well at

00:23:28

that time when it did happen the doctor

00:23:30

did say look um as little as much sport

00:23:34

like if at all going forward and I was

00:23:37

like well that's not happening I was

00:23:39

determined to be like no that's

00:23:40

definitely not me um so I guess you just

00:23:44

get back on the grin you just have to

00:23:45

listen to your body um sometimes you can

00:23:48

do things sometimes you can't and I

00:23:50

think that's where physios and doctors

00:23:51

come in quite well they know what every

00:23:53

individual is capable of doing or what

00:23:55

they can't do uh unfortunately the way I

00:23:57

I play is quite hard on my knees and my

00:24:00

ankles um but I'm going to do it for as

00:24:02

long as I can um as much as I can until

00:24:05

the body gives in and then I'll go and

00:24:08

enjoy the rest of my life yeah and I I

00:24:10

think um yeah one thing that the um the

00:24:12

well- meaning medical experts can't

00:24:14

necessarily take into account is um

00:24:16

probably someone's like will or

00:24:18

determination so they can say oh you you

00:24:21

probably shouldn't do sport but it's

00:24:22

like they don't know you as an as a

00:24:24

person or what your mindset is their

00:24:25

mind is an amazing thing um and it's

00:24:28

helped me at times or the worst of times

00:24:31

um in times when you think you literally

00:24:33

can't do it anymore um it's really

00:24:35

pulled me through so I think that's the

00:24:37

aspect of sport where you really have to

00:24:39

hone in at times um and it doesn't

00:24:41

matter how good you're doing if you're

00:24:43

on that High um the lows do come um so

00:24:47

it's just being preparing yourself

00:24:49

because it's a roller coaster it really

00:24:51

is um and to dig yourself out of that

00:24:53

and stay on that high is is it's a tough

00:24:56

one it's quite hard yeah we will get

00:24:58

into all that stuff because there

00:24:58

definitely has been um some adversity in

00:25:00

the Karen Burger story hasn't there um I

00:25:03

mean one thing that Springs to mind I

00:25:05

guess is um the Commonwealth Games last

00:25:06

year where you had like an ankle injury

00:25:08

um that must have been devastating we'll

00:25:09

get into that um but yeah so you're

00:25:12

growing up in South Africa you you're

00:25:13

good at nitb are you great at

00:25:16

nitb yeah well um yeah I mean I made it

00:25:20

into the rap teams yes um I was being

00:25:24

selected in those teams so I I was all

00:25:26

right I was good

00:25:28

um it's quite hard sometimes I I don't

00:25:31

like talking too much about um um my

00:25:34

performances but yeah I the year before

00:25:38

I decided to move over um I just played

00:25:42

uh the under 21s the protate um Squad

00:25:45

had just had their trials I think it was

00:25:47

in December um and I got selected in the

00:25:50

group to go into the final final

00:25:53

trials but at that point I was like

00:25:56

right do I stick it out here or do I go

00:25:59

for this opportunity in New Zealand not

00:26:01

much offering for me in New Zealand but

00:26:03

what would have been what would have

00:26:04

been an easier as the South African

00:26:06

netball team as good as the Silver ferns

00:26:08

or not would it I guess what I'm asking

00:26:10

is would it have been easier for you to

00:26:12

stand in your home country and make your

00:26:13

national team there it's tough I really

00:26:16

take my head off to the the players that

00:26:18

do play for South Africa because up

00:26:21

until recently it was not a paid

00:26:23

position um and I know people that

00:26:27

played in the South Afric or know of

00:26:29

people that were studying for years and

00:26:31

years and years because they just

00:26:33

weren't flexible the Unis aren't as

00:26:35

flexible to be able to allow you to go

00:26:37

do that you can't maintain a job

00:26:40

necessarily um if you want to go do that

00:26:42

so it's just the grind is a lot harder

00:26:45

um I really take my head off to those

00:26:47

people and I think personally for the my

00:26:50

with my personality and the person that

00:26:52

I am I probably wouldn't have kept

00:26:53

playing a i state in South Africa um I

00:26:56

would have wanted to make a living I

00:26:58

would have wanted to be able to support

00:26:59

my family I would have wanted to have a

00:27:01

successful life and it just sounds like

00:27:04

it's really hard most of those starting

00:27:05

lineup players for the pro tiers play

00:27:07

overseas they go and play domestically

00:27:09

in another country and that's two lives

00:27:11

you're asking them to have one life in

00:27:13

one country for half of the year and

00:27:15

then you having me to go back to your

00:27:16

home country so um yeah it's a tough one

00:27:20

so so as ni more professional here than

00:27:22

what it is in South Africa definitely

00:27:24

100% do you guys get paid okay a match

00:27:27

fee or a salary how does it work yeah

00:27:29

look um there's always going to be the

00:27:32

drive to want to be paid more but coming

00:27:35

from a country that don't get paid at

00:27:37

all um I know how amazing it is and even

00:27:41

from when I started to where we are now

00:27:43

there's been increases so I'm not

00:27:46

complaining obviously striving for more

00:27:48

but um I'm quite happy it's it's easier

00:27:52

when you are playing for both domestic

00:27:54

and international you can make a living

00:27:56

out of it it's a bit harder when you

00:27:59

don't have that International salary and

00:28:01

you're having to find a job that only

00:28:02

does half the year because the first

00:28:05

half of the year you're pretty much in

00:28:06

your domestic season so you're away from

00:28:08

work quite a lot so it's a little bit

00:28:11

harder so do does some of the does some

00:28:13

of the girls have jobs um I don't think

00:28:16

anybody in the ferns at the moment have

00:28:17

any jobs maybe some contract work here

00:28:19

or there just to take them over um but

00:28:23

domestically yes um there's a lot of

00:28:25

girls and and that's also how the

00:28:28

schedule for the domestic teams have to

00:28:30

adjust to allow those players to have a

00:28:32

job um because as great as it is to be

00:28:35

playing and being paid for netball they

00:28:37

still need to have a life outside of

00:28:39

netb and they still need that job so we

00:28:40

need to accommodate them as well yeah

00:28:42

absolutely okay so so so when does the

00:28:45

seed get planted about you moving to New

00:28:47

Zealand I I heard it was like a secret

00:28:49

from your dad yeah you bounc the idea of

00:28:51

your mom and it happened really quickly

00:28:54

look um I was in my last year of school

00:28:57

school um and around like June July I

00:29:02

think my uncle and Aunt who live here

00:29:03

it's Mom's cousin um they went to visit

00:29:06

they've been living in New Zealand for

00:29:08

more than 20 years now and we were in

00:29:10

Cape Town one day and mom was like right

00:29:12

well my cousins over from New Zealand

00:29:15

they're at the airport at the moment

00:29:16

they're literally just about to go back

00:29:18

to New Zealand let's just go say hi so

00:29:21

we went to the airport had a chat as

00:29:23

moms do you know they boast about their

00:29:26

kids and they me that I play netball and

00:29:29

um yeah my uncle was like oh well why

00:29:32

don't you send her over let her come

00:29:33

stay with us for a year I thought this

00:29:36

was a joke like we just went about life

00:29:39

for the next month or what started

00:29:41

applying for universities for the

00:29:43

following

00:29:44

year applied for some scholarships

00:29:46

because I would have needed a

00:29:47

scholarship um didn't hear anything from

00:29:50

the Unis you can and South Africa can

00:29:53

literally wait till the last minute

00:29:54

before you hear anything so by like o

00:29:57

October um I wasn't sure what was

00:29:59

happening the following year and then my

00:30:01

uncle messaged mom he was like no but

00:30:03

we're serious like are you sending her

00:30:05

over um and at that point we're like

00:30:07

right well we've got nothing to lose um

00:30:10

uh dad is a little bit harder to

00:30:12

convince sometimes with these big

00:30:13

decisions in life why because he's

00:30:15

protective or were you a daddy girl or

00:30:18

yeah well um oh he's just he loves

00:30:22

security and not necessarily taking too

00:30:26

many risks

00:30:27

um that's when Mom's a good balance for

00:30:30

him because Mom quite like taking those

00:30:32

risks um and so we knew it's was going

00:30:35

to take a while um to get dad across

00:30:37

that line but this is the funny thing

00:30:40

with Dad we're always like it starts out

00:30:42

with he would argue against it like

00:30:44

we'll say something and he'll completely

00:30:46

argue against it but the more you talk

00:30:47

about it eventually he just he just

00:30:49

listens he won't argue anymore he'll

00:30:52

just listen and then he gets to the

00:30:54

point where he starts agreeing and he

00:30:55

starts talking with so so um I think we

00:30:59

fast-tracked that process a little bit

00:31:01

um so we did all of that stuff in the

00:31:03

background did all the Visas and

00:31:04

everything that needed to be done and um

00:31:07

we started talking about it not that I

00:31:10

was going but that there's a possibility

00:31:12

that you know it might be quite nice and

00:31:15

I don't think we told him till about

00:31:17

like a month before I left like no this

00:31:18

is actually happening now and for that

00:31:21

first two or three years whenever mom

00:31:23

would miss me or I'd be homesick or

00:31:25

anything um he would just be like no you

00:31:28

wanted to send her there you guys

00:31:30

decided to do this so don't s and cry

00:31:32

about it now so but I mean he's one of

00:31:34

my biggest supporters now um like he

00:31:37

wouldn't want it any other way so he's

00:31:39

proud of me he supported me don't get me

00:31:41

wrong um he was a bit about two in two

00:31:44

minds about the whole thing but he

00:31:46

supported me regardless um and now that

00:31:49

you know there's some success story

00:31:51

behind it um yeah he's I guess he's

00:31:53

pretty proud yeah I mean well you look

00:31:55

you look back and um everything worked

00:31:57

out fine and it's working out fine but

00:31:59

um yeah as I alluded to before tough

00:32:02

[ __ ] grind tough grind so so so you

00:32:04

come here was you didn't have like laser

00:32:08

point focus on the silver FS you were

00:32:09

just here to have a good time and yeah

00:32:11

look to be honest um everybody's got a

00:32:14

dream it was never a goal it was a dream

00:32:17

um and with a dream you don't

00:32:18

necessarily think that it is um possible

00:32:21

so I was like it would be amazing to

00:32:23

play for the silver F but I never made

00:32:25

it a goal um

00:32:27

I've tried changing my mind over the or

00:32:30

my way of thinking over the years where

00:32:32

I don't like to um put too much

00:32:36

attention um on something that because

00:32:38

if it doesn't work I don't like that

00:32:41

disappointment feeling um but I've had

00:32:43

to change that because to reach those

00:32:44

high things you have to put a lot of

00:32:46

time and effort into it so at that point

00:32:48

I was like I'm just here I'm just trying

00:32:50

to enjoy my life um I joined a local

00:32:53

Club who to this day um like a family to

00:32:56

me the of supporters love them all um so

00:33:00

pretty much joined the local club and I

00:33:02

just played they gave me opportunities

00:33:04

they sent me to rap stuff like I my raw

00:33:07

skills coming over I was not the best

00:33:10

net baller I had so much to learn like

00:33:14

my club coach benched me at times I got

00:33:17

in put into second teams and I didn't

00:33:19

make it into um rep teams for years you

00:33:22

know it it it wasn't easy but I decided

00:33:26

to BU life for myself outside and have

00:33:28

other things to focus on I had studies

00:33:30

outside of of netball I tried to work

00:33:33

wherever I could I had to work um to

00:33:35

support myself um so yeah it was a it

00:33:39

was a really tough grind but along the

00:33:41

journey I met the most amazing people

00:33:43

that that I still talk to too this day

00:33:46

that um have meant a lot to me and have

00:33:48

helped me throughout that process so um

00:33:51

it's been a fun Journey yeah so what

00:33:54

those first couple of years look like

00:33:56

because like I'm a Imaging if I was in

00:33:57

your position you're on the other side

00:33:58

of the world you're so far away from

00:34:00

home every time there's some sort of

00:34:02

hurdle or obstacle or adversity you must

00:34:04

feel so homesick yeah um what were you

00:34:08

doing in those early years you found a

00:34:10

job yes well my first job was here on a

00:34:12

visitor's visa and you're not allowed to

00:34:14

work or do anything or study or anything

00:34:16

so I pretty much just enjoyed that year

00:34:19

just try to you know see what New

00:34:21

Zealand's like and just experience it um

00:34:24

and then I had this Sera sit down with

00:34:26

mom over

00:34:27

Skype um at the end of that year and

00:34:29

she's like right what's happening over

00:34:31

there are you enjoying it how what's

00:34:33

happening I was like Mom I'm really

00:34:35

enjoying it but at that moment in time I

00:34:37

knew what it was going to cost for me to

00:34:39

stay in New Zealand um and I'm like

00:34:42

we're not the wealthiest of families

00:34:45

like you know just an average Joe family

00:34:47

so I knew that if I wanted to stay I

00:34:49

would have had to go study and

00:34:50

international study cost is astronomical

00:34:54

um where especially in our eyes at that

00:34:56

time so so I was like Mom I really love

00:34:58

it here but I'm not going to put that on

00:35:00

you cuz I know it costs a lot and she's

00:35:02

like We're going to make this work

00:35:04

obviously they had to go um get some

00:35:08

money somewhere um put themselves in

00:35:10

debt a little bit and that's why to this

00:35:12

day I'm not doing what I do just for

00:35:14

myself I do it for my family as well

00:35:16

because they offered up so much for me

00:35:18

to be here and do what I do so at that

00:35:21

point I was like great I can go study I

00:35:23

was like we're going to make this work

00:35:24

so my first year of studies um I joined

00:35:27

the Institute of Sports and I was like I

00:35:29

need to work extremely hard because I

00:35:30

need a scholarship the next year I can't

00:35:32

let my mom and dad have to put up any

00:35:35

more money for me so I worked my butt

00:35:38

off to try and um get the best grades I

00:35:40

think I got distinction that year um and

00:35:43

I had to work as much as I possibly

00:35:45

could because I didn't want to ask them

00:35:46

for any more money because I um they

00:35:49

already spent too much money on me so I

00:35:51

had to work for the money I had um mean

00:35:54

I was working at meca on Sunday just to

00:35:57

afford my train tickets for the week um

00:35:59

going in and out of the Hut in

00:36:01

Wellington so um but it's character

00:36:03

building I mean I wouldn't take that

00:36:05

back for anything uh I learned a lot

00:36:08

about myself and what it cost to be

00:36:10

where I am um and then I guess after the

00:36:12

studies it just turned into work

00:36:14

placements um I built the right

00:36:16

connections the place where I studied

00:36:18

offered me a job so um yeah it was it

00:36:21

was a tough first five years in New

00:36:24

Zealand oh that's such a great story

00:36:27

that's such a great story talk about

00:36:29

um yeah I don't know added stress or

00:36:32

added motivation to make it work like

00:36:33

when you've got your parents with skin

00:36:35

in the game like that what did they they

00:36:36

mortgage the house get a bank loan what

00:36:38

did they um yeah they put more money on

00:36:40

their home loan they put put more money

00:36:42

on the mortgage and I think Dad um I

00:36:46

think he approached one of his mates or

00:36:48

something who's a massive supporter of

00:36:50

me too um and so I mean still paying

00:36:52

those off really yeah yeah it was a big

00:36:55

amount um

00:36:57

so and that's why whenever I can however

00:37:00

I can um I support whichever way

00:37:03

possible they they don't like asking for

00:37:06

help ever um but that's a great thing I

00:37:09

think I was talking to my mom this

00:37:10

morning as well our family are quite

00:37:12

tighten it and we're happy to help

00:37:14

wherever we can we never ask but we

00:37:16

always offer um and I'm quite fortunate

00:37:19

to be in that situation I know there's a

00:37:21

lot of people that don't have those kind

00:37:22

of family situations so yeah I love them

00:37:26

to bits

00:37:27

man that's a hell of a story wow that's

00:37:30

really really cool but also so much

00:37:31

pressure at that young age do you look

00:37:34

back now from the lens of a 30-year old

00:37:35

woman and think so I'm guessing then you

00:37:37

were 1920 like if you had your time

00:37:39

again you you'd probably be like don't

00:37:41

borrow the money oh my gosh I uh that's

00:37:44

why it's so amazing that those kind of

00:37:47

decisions only happen once um and again

00:37:50

it goes back to me the way things are

00:37:52

supposed to happen it will happen uh as

00:37:54

long as I put my best effort fo forward

00:37:57

and I do the best I can um whatever

00:38:00

needs to happen will happen so if I know

00:38:02

I've done I've given it my all and it

00:38:04

doesn't happen it wasn't supposed to um

00:38:07

and if whatever happens there's always

00:38:09

doors that open and closes so I love

00:38:13

opportunities I grab them or whenever

00:38:15

they come my way um whether they're good

00:38:18

or bad or whether they work out or not I

00:38:21

meet people along the way that then puts

00:38:23

me in other directions so that was an

00:38:26

opportunity that I grabbed that my um

00:38:28

Family helped me with um and it was

00:38:31

amazing This World Cup was in South

00:38:33

Africa in August July August um and this

00:38:36

was the first time um since leaving home

00:38:39

where I had my whole family that was

00:38:40

supporting me on the sidelines and there

00:38:42

were so vocal I think they probably

00:38:45

enjoyed the whole process or the whole

00:38:47

thing more than I did um and I think

00:38:49

that was important for me to to show

00:38:51

them my Thanksgiving and give back to

00:38:53

them as much as I possibly could um and

00:38:56

whenever they talk about coming to visit

00:38:58

to New Zealand um I'm like stoked

00:39:01

because they've only ever been here once

00:39:03

all of them um always trying and

00:39:05

convince them to move over but I know

00:39:07

it's a big move for them they got the

00:39:09

whole family so um that's a dream of

00:39:13

mine to have them all here um but we'll

00:39:16

see how that goes play like Karen we

00:39:18

can't afford it we gave you that

00:39:20

money yeah I know right so I was like I

00:39:23

need to find ways I need to make a

00:39:25

success I need to find ways to to help

00:39:28

them to support them because I know um a

00:39:32

lot of them are Keen my brother he's

00:39:33

very keen um to move over but um again

00:39:38

it's almost like a package deal um I'm

00:39:41

quite fortunate and sometimes I do feel

00:39:43

a little bit guilty being here because

00:39:46

I'm the one that left and I'm the one

00:39:48

that gets to benefit and enjoy the life

00:39:51

that I have now um and as much as they

00:39:53

all want to move they're all like but we

00:39:55

don't want to go without each each other

00:39:57

and so um at times I do feel a little

00:40:01

bit guilty for being here by myself but

00:40:04

um like my uncle who also made that big

00:40:06

move themselves like someone needs to

00:40:08

make that move to open the doors for

00:40:10

others so um why why do you can you

00:40:13

explain that or elaborate on that about

00:40:15

why do you why do you feel guilty um I

00:40:18

think it is because I mean they put so

00:40:21

much time and effort and money into me

00:40:24

being here and I get to enjoy it

00:40:27

um and I know if they could they'd move

00:40:30

tomorrow um but obviously there's like

00:40:34

the age with Mom and Dad's age coming to

00:40:37

play um money side definitely is massive

00:40:40

coming to play um and they've got

00:40:43

families now like I moved at a time

00:40:45

where it was just me and they supported

00:40:48

me to do that whereas they've all got

00:40:49

families to support so it's a big

00:40:52

decision it's so much harder for them to

00:40:54

be able to make that move um and it's

00:40:57

just that constant support from them to

00:40:58

be able to allow me to do this I'm quite

00:41:00

grateful that I get to be in this

00:41:02

position and even though they want to

00:41:04

they're not necessarily in a position

00:41:05

too so I'll try my best to do the most I

00:41:09

can to help support them to do that now

00:41:11

yeah and also you I mean you you say

00:41:13

you're the one that gets to enjoy it but

00:41:16

[ __ ] it wasn't an easy rad like it was

00:41:18

you were here seven years before you

00:41:19

made the silver ferns like were there

00:41:22

times where you thought about like

00:41:23

tapping out um and going back or not not

00:41:25

really the first three or four years um

00:41:30

because we're such a tight-knit family

00:41:31

and um whenever anything happens I'm

00:41:34

immediately on the phone to mom or my

00:41:36

sister um to talk through the through it

00:41:39

with them and because we're such a

00:41:42

tightnit

00:41:43

family I really missed that element of

00:41:46

it um and so whenever I missed home or

00:41:50

just needed somebody around me or things

00:41:52

just weren't going my way or things were

00:41:54

just too hard I did consider I was like

00:41:57

is this where I pull the plug is this

00:41:58

where I go home but then I just reminded

00:42:01

myself no they've put the time and

00:42:03

effort into me being here this isn't

00:42:05

going to be forever um I was determined

00:42:08

to do something with my life here um and

00:42:11

so I just suck it out or like sucked it

00:42:14

up and just kept going um with the

00:42:18

support obviously from them um and I

00:42:20

think it wasn't until I started playing

00:42:23

AZ leville and I started seeing the

00:42:25

results that I was like okay no I can I

00:42:28

think I can I can do this now you just

00:42:30

get enough enough of a taste of success

00:42:32

to know that you're on the right track

00:42:33

sort of thing exactly yeah what did you

00:42:36

have a plan B like you said you were

00:42:38

studying before what were you what were

00:42:40

you studying for well at that point I

00:42:41

just studied um uh towards a sports

00:42:44

science degree um but it was pretty much

00:42:48

just something to tick me over um and

00:42:50

keep the brain ticking over and it was

00:42:52

something that I was interested at that

00:42:53

time um but I'm gonna go back into

00:42:57

studies next year um I've discovered a

00:43:00

new interest in nutrition um which I

00:43:03

really love and I think that's the tough

00:43:05

thing about being a netballer is having

00:43:09

something else after netball and

00:43:11

preparing yourself for it as well

00:43:12

because the end is going to come it's

00:43:14

inevitable exactly and it's either going

00:43:15

to come if you're very lucky it's going

00:43:17

to come on your own terbs otherwise it's

00:43:18

you're going to be you're going to be

00:43:19

dumped or you going to be injured

00:43:21

exactly so that's why there's this

00:43:23

constant thing in the back of my mind I

00:43:25

need to work on that kind of stuff as

00:43:27

well and so but I also want to do

00:43:29

something that I enjoy and that I would

00:43:31

want to do I don't want to just have to

00:43:33

get up every morning and go do a job

00:43:34

because I have to I want to do it

00:43:36

because I love it and I want to and so

00:43:38

it took me a while to find something

00:43:40

that I'm actually interested in doing um

00:43:43

and it wasn't until my injury last year

00:43:45

that I got some downtime and I got to

00:43:48

reflect a little bit on things and Chang

00:43:50

a few things and how I do um like with

00:43:53

things about my own nutrition and that's

00:43:55

where that spark and started interesting

00:43:57

me about what nutrition and what how the

00:44:00

food supplements the body and and what

00:44:02

it does and so that's where I was like I

00:44:05

think this is something I can do um so

00:44:07

yeah I'm going back into studies next

00:44:08

year 30y old going back into studies

00:44:11

trying to do it Part Time mixing it with

00:44:13

neall as well so I don't know how you f

00:44:15

everything

00:44:16

in

00:44:18

um uh look because of the grind that I

00:44:21

did my first few years um I pretty much

00:44:25

got up in the morning 5:00 a.m. to go to

00:44:28

the gym um to make it to school on time

00:44:32

and then at lunchtimes I might do some

00:44:35

personal training sessions go back to

00:44:37

school after school I always had work um

00:44:41

trainings in the evening so my days were

00:44:43

very long back when I used to do the

00:44:45

grind so nothing is is too much for me

00:44:48

anymore um actually I feel guilty

00:44:52

sometimes when I'm sitting at home not

00:44:54

doing anything on a day off I'm like why

00:44:56

am I just sitting doing nothing I could

00:44:57

be doing something right now um but I

00:45:00

also want to try and get myself into the

00:45:02

mentality of I need to enjoy this while

00:45:03

I have it as well so yeah uh it's it's

00:45:08

easier now because of what I've been

00:45:10

through wow that's really

00:45:12

inspiring geez like yeah I

00:45:15

mean I mean the fact that you came here

00:45:17

and you worked you worked so hard to get

00:45:19

to where you are today it's really cool

00:45:21

like there must have been so many so

00:45:22

many points along the along the way

00:45:24

where you thought about giving up or you

00:45:25

wondered if you're on the right track

00:45:27

and um so much pressure on your

00:45:28

shoulders as well support system

00:45:31

honestly um I wouldn't have been able to

00:45:33

do it without the support system the

00:45:35

right people um to encourage you at

00:45:39

times um or the right people to tell you

00:45:43

when you're being um too much or when

00:45:46

you're not doing too much um especially

00:45:49

now and throughout my nickb career as

00:45:51

well um when you're just feeling a

00:45:53

little bit down yourself you just need

00:45:55

that support to system to be like no you

00:45:57

can do this or sometimes when you're at

00:45:59

the top you're like don't get too cocky

00:46:01

you know you've got to um you know take

00:46:05

the situation enjoy it while you can but

00:46:07

there's lows coming as well so um your

00:46:10

support system is massive yeah so you

00:46:12

made your silver fins debut uh September

00:46:15

2018 so like 5 years ago so before that

00:46:18

you were in the like the Central pulks

00:46:20

and those a andz teams yeah and then is

00:46:23

that when you sort of came in the frame

00:46:24

of the selectors yeah I um funny enough

00:46:28

how

00:46:29

I I played Biv which is the development

00:46:32

right or now it's the Indian our league

00:46:34

um under the franchise um in

00:46:38

2016 um had a really good year that year

00:46:41

for me personally and um because of the

00:46:45

great year I actually got invited to a

00:46:47

ferns trials this is without being in a

00:46:50

franchise um and I didn't know that was

00:46:52

possible but um I hadn't played for

00:46:54

South Africa so it's not like I was was

00:46:55

bound to having played with him and had

00:46:58

to sit out like four or five years so at

00:47:01

that point like no you're eligible so uh

00:47:04

I went to the ferns

00:47:06

trials and I think at that point a

00:47:09

franchise the pulse because why M matanu

00:47:12

was a big um influence or like a coach

00:47:16

for me at the pulse as well and so she

00:47:18

one day came up to me she's like you

00:47:20

know you're eligible for the fs and I

00:47:21

was like I wasn't even in the franchise

00:47:23

team at that point so I was like oh my

00:47:25

gosh I don't know this um but yeah so I

00:47:28

got invited to the fs trials just

00:47:29

experience I obviously saw it as nothing

00:47:31

else I just wanted to be out there

00:47:33

amongst the best um and then that's when

00:47:35

the pulse approached me because they put

00:47:37

up the argument well if the fs wanted to

00:47:40

sign gave you an opportunity to trial

00:47:42

for them for the country surely we

00:47:44

should be able to sign you as a domestic

00:47:46

player because at that point I was still

00:47:48

I was not a resident I was still on a

00:47:49

work visa um and so obviously they did

00:47:53

the the stuff up the top and um and

00:47:56

that's where I got my first contract so

00:47:58

I actually had a taste of of the ferns

00:48:00

before I I did franchise um but yeah

00:48:04

that's when it all started um and it was

00:48:06

a bit bit of a shock for me my first

00:48:08

year with the pulse because at that

00:48:10

point I'd been playing um you know

00:48:12

starting lineup getting heaps of court

00:48:14

time um and then I was behind the likes

00:48:16

of at that point Phoenix kataka and

00:48:18

Katrina R now um you know I had an

00:48:21

amazing team with K Kat L was on our

00:48:23

team Sarah Bayman from England and we

00:48:26

had an amazing team um and I was pretty

00:48:29

much

00:48:30

sidelined um so that was a big learning

00:48:33

curb for me is like suddenly I'm now on

00:48:35

the sideline um and I got so much

00:48:38

attention from why um and if you know

00:48:41

her she's she's quite a Stern um strong

00:48:44

personality who's that who's why why M

00:48:46

Manu um old so ferns coach player

00:48:49

herself um yeah she's wealth of

00:48:53

knowledge about n ball um made me a wing

00:48:57

defense and yeah yeah can't stop talking

00:49:01

about how amazing she is but so she gave

00:49:04

me so much attention and I thought oh my

00:49:06

gosh I don't think she likes me like her

00:49:09

training is always like Karen do this

00:49:10

Karen do that Karen what are you doing I

00:49:12

was like oh my gosh and I keep screwing

00:49:15

up I know is what it felt like so I was

00:49:17

like oh what am I doing right I'm never

00:49:19

going to get out there um and one day

00:49:23

Katrina came over to me oh she was gr

00:49:26

but now already um she came over to me

00:49:28

and she's like because it was a tough

00:49:30

training uh got a lot of yelling going

00:49:32

my way and she's like Karen um I know

00:49:35

it's hard but if she's giving you

00:49:37

attention it's because she sees

00:49:39

potential so that's a good thing when

00:49:41

she stops talking to you that's when you

00:49:43

have to worry and that's immediately

00:49:45

when I shifted my mindset I was like

00:49:47

great um so I just started grinding

00:49:49

extremely hard um the following year I

00:49:52

got invited again to the ferns trials

00:49:54

and it just happened happened by chance

00:49:56

that I was in a group we had to do a

00:49:58

drill where they needed a wing defense

00:50:00

and at that point I'd never played Wing

00:50:02

defense before um and they were like

00:50:05

great well you're the only person that

00:50:07

can do it right now so we'll just Chuck

00:50:08

you in there and they didn't move me out

00:50:10

of wing defense for that rest of the

00:50:12

trial so I was like great I see an

00:50:14

opportunity here so I went back to the

00:50:15

poll so we had this discussion about

00:50:17

what that was going to look like and

00:50:18

they're like okay we're going to try and

00:50:19

make you a wing defense and so that

00:50:22

following year I started getting my

00:50:24

starting line up at Wing de and yeah the

00:50:26

race his history from there to be honest

00:50:29

and then so you play your um Deb for the

00:50:31

silver F and you get sent off what um

00:50:34

yeah what what happened there I tried to

00:50:36

find the clip online I couldn't couldn't

00:50:37

find it anywhere which is probably lucky

00:50:39

for you how do you I mean so you come

00:50:42

you came to New Zealand 7 years earlier

00:50:44

you've been grinding away doing these

00:50:46

long days fitting everything in day and

00:50:48

night this this could have been the

00:50:49

beginning and the end of your honestly I

00:50:51

felt this was the end I was like I'm

00:50:55

this is me I'm done um adrenaline

00:50:58

pumping

00:51:00

inexperience um playing against a very

00:51:02

experienced

00:51:04

player um I didn't feel like the sendoff

00:51:08

was necessarily bad enough uh or the

00:51:12

what they sent me off for was B enough

00:51:14

but I knew the situation that got me to

00:51:17

that point um prior to the game starting

00:51:20

the umpires did tell us that if you're

00:51:22

on a warning you have to be extremely

00:51:23

careful and so yes the warning was

00:51:26

warranted probably went for a ball I

00:51:28

shouldn't have gone for um wasn't

00:51:31

playing rugby I was playing

00:51:32

netball um and so I was on the warning

00:51:36

and that's where the discipline comes in

00:51:38

the experience come in and um I just ran

00:51:41

a j a jump a pass and um Joe Haron

00:51:45

stepped into me to pass a ball and

00:51:47

obviously I landed on her so that cost

00:51:49

me my send off and it

00:51:51

was the fastest and the slowest 2

00:51:54

minutes of of my life I had to go sit on

00:51:57

the bench for two minutes and watch my

00:51:59

the rest of my team try and fight it out

00:52:01

there with six players on court I was

00:52:03

playing with Casey Copa at the time in

00:52:06

the circle we had to laugh about it

00:52:08

afterwards a few few months afterwards

00:52:11

not immediately that I left her alone in

00:52:13

the circle um but amazing coach nolene

00:52:17

put me back out there after my two

00:52:18

minutes she didn't replace me she made

00:52:21

me go back on there and fix my own

00:52:23

mistake there was only like 3 minutes to

00:52:24

go in the game anyway but yeah I had to

00:52:27

tail between the legs go back out on

00:52:30

court um yeah when you when you when

00:52:32

you're sent off and you're sitting on

00:52:33

that sideline bear in mind the the

00:52:35

significance of the the game you know

00:52:36

being your debut for the silver F how do

00:52:38

you not how do you how do you hold the

00:52:39

emotions on how do you not burst into

00:52:41

tears um adrenaline I think was keeping

00:52:44

me keeping me going um I think I went

00:52:48

back to the hotel the first thing I did

00:52:50

was Google whether anybody else had been

00:52:52

sent off because at that point like

00:52:55

red cards and send offs weren't like

00:52:58

necessarily such a big thing like

00:52:59

recently we've had a few more of those

00:53:01

happening but at that point it wasn't

00:53:03

really a thing and I was like oh thank

00:53:05

goodness Tim AATA um George or Bailey at

00:53:08

that point had been sent off in a World

00:53:10

Cup game and I was like okay it's okay

00:53:12

I'm not the only one but I was still

00:53:14

stressing out um and I didn't get any

00:53:17

communication from the coaches I was

00:53:19

like oh no this is me this is my career

00:53:21

over um had the worst sleep ever that

00:53:24

night um we had our one-on ones the next

00:53:26

morning and I got called in amazing

00:53:29

coach that noene is she sent me down and

00:53:31

she's like just trying to understand

00:53:32

what my thinking was around why I did

00:53:35

what I did and how it happened um talked

00:53:38

it through and she's like great well now

00:53:40

you've learned don't do that again and

00:53:43

um yeah the next tour I I got game time

00:53:47

I got starting lineup so yeah just

00:53:50

Testament to the coach that she is that

00:53:52

she's very big on players learning from

00:53:54

their mistakes if if you learn from your

00:53:56

mistakes I think she's happy it's when

00:53:58

you don't learn that's that's when

00:53:59

you're in trouble yeah I've I've I've

00:54:02

recently begun to embrace failure

00:54:04

because it's it's so important isn't it

00:54:06

it's like a stepping stone to success

00:54:07

but um and yeah in reflection I suppose

00:54:10

that would have been really mean just to

00:54:11

throw you out with the bath water yeah

00:54:13

you know on your first de Booth that's

00:54:14

good that they gave you another shot um

00:54:16

thank goodness but okay so so no one

00:54:19

says anything after the game um like

00:54:22

silence till the next day it's that

00:54:24

awkwardness because you know you did

00:54:26

wrong you know um and so they don't want

00:54:29

to justify it by being like no that was

00:54:32

like unlucky for you because you did

00:54:35

wrong you have to acknowledge that but I

00:54:38

did have the support from the players

00:54:39

that like it's okay it's not the end of

00:54:41

the world like don't worry about it so

00:54:44

um yeah it's Torn Between Two because

00:54:47

you need to acknowledge that you made a

00:54:48

mistake is that's how you learn from it

00:54:51

but getting that love from the players

00:54:53

was very much the thank goodness yeah

00:54:56

yeah yeah I mean you can look back and

00:54:57

laugh about it now with you 50 tests

00:54:59

under your under your belt I know I

00:55:01

don't hide from it I think um at the

00:55:05

start I was like I just don't want

00:55:06

anybody to mention it but it's like you

00:55:08

say you learn from your mistakes and

00:55:10

it's so important to learn from them so

00:55:12

I quite often mention it a lot of people

00:55:13

don't even know about it and I would

00:55:15

bring it up I was like well I have been

00:55:17

sent off and this is what I learned from

00:55:19

it so well I gave you till 55 minutes

00:55:22

before I bought it up in this chat you

00:55:25

went forthcoming with the

00:55:26

information um but so apart from so as

00:55:29

your um as your Recollections of your

00:55:31

first test day booth in New Zealand all

00:55:34

bad because of that or no no um to be

00:55:38

honest I can't really remember too much

00:55:40

about my first few games anyway so um my

00:55:44

key things I remember um are my first

00:55:48

starting lineup um game and my first

00:55:51

time playing against South Africa that's

00:55:54

the my key memories from my early days

00:55:56

on so I don't think I really remember

00:55:59

much about anything else um and then in

00:56:01

terms of the World Cup there was an

00:56:03

amazing experience I wasn't necessarily

00:56:05

on in the very last game but my

00:56:09

personally for me was at that point I

00:56:12

didn't hadn't had my family on the

00:56:14

sidelines since I left New Zealand uh or

00:56:17

for New Zealand so um I heard my mom I

00:56:20

think it was one I think we were playing

00:56:22

like against Botswana or something but I

00:56:25

would always remember that game because

00:56:28

I grew up with my family on the

00:56:29

sidelines wherever anybody had anything

00:56:32

I was like we've got this modern in our

00:56:33

family one for all and all for one so

00:56:35

wherever one went the other went so

00:56:37

whenever I had Sports tours they were on

00:56:39

the sideline I could always hear them

00:56:41

and in this specific game I think I went

00:56:43

up for an intercept or something and I

00:56:45

could vividly hear my mom's voice in the

00:56:47

crowd um and that's something I would

00:56:51

that that was my highlight of That World

00:56:54

Cup because was that something that will

00:56:56

stick with me and the fact that she made

00:56:58

the effort to come and watch me um and

00:57:01

to be there to support me was yeah

00:57:03

amazing oh what a story is that the 2019

00:57:06

World Cup yeah yeah where silver FS won

00:57:10

yes yeah that was an amazing campaign I

00:57:13

mean I'm fortunate enough to have been

00:57:15

in a team with amazing players Legends

00:57:17

of the game um Laura langman Maria fow

00:57:21

and um Casey Copa who are amazing

00:57:24

players

00:57:25

and the campaign it was a gring campaign

00:57:29

leading into that World Cup what we went

00:57:31

through physically and mentally prepared

00:57:33

us for that final and um yeah I think we

00:57:37

still to this day there was a December

00:57:39

camp that we we absolutely got smashed

00:57:42

in anything we go into ever since then

00:57:45

was like is it going to be like that

00:57:46

camp we compare everything to that camp

00:57:48

so um but loved it loved it and hate it

00:57:51

at the same time yeah yeah well what a

00:57:54

highlight so winning a World Cup what

00:57:56

are the other like standout moments or

00:57:58

highlights in your career do you think

00:58:00

um gosh uh obviously my first um game

00:58:06

against South Africa especially having a

00:58:09

starting lineup in that game as well um

00:58:12

I often quite get a quite often got

00:58:14

asked what it is like playing against my

00:58:17

home country um I didn't know any of the

00:58:21

players personally that were in the team

00:58:23

so I didn't have that personal

00:58:25

connection with them and I never played

00:58:27

in that team myself so I didn't have

00:58:30

that connection with them the only

00:58:31

connection I really have is the fact

00:58:33

that they are from my home country um

00:58:35

and that I could sometimes understand

00:58:37

what they were saying on court when they

00:58:39

were talking to each other it's got to

00:58:41

it's got to be so weird though with um

00:58:43

hearing the anthem though like you got

00:58:45

two anthems pregame that bring you

00:58:47

Goosebumps yeah I think that's probably

00:58:49

the the weirdest thing for me is

00:58:52

standing um in the black dress um facing

00:58:55

the opposition and trying to not sing

00:58:58

along to the South African Anthem um and

00:59:02

I didn't really like this is the thing

00:59:05

that I grew up not knowing how amazing

00:59:08

our Anthem really was until I moved here

00:59:10

and everyone so many new zealanders um

00:59:13

tell me about how they love the South

00:59:15

African Anthem and how beautiful it is

00:59:17

and it's not till you hear that kind of

00:59:19

thing I was like actually yes it is

00:59:21

really beautiful um so yeah new

00:59:25

appreciation for it but really H trying

00:59:27

to not sing along to it I mean I sing

00:59:29

along to it in my head but I suppose

00:59:32

it's that saying like absence makes the

00:59:33

heart grow fond R so the the longer you

00:59:36

are away from your birthplace the more

00:59:37

of a connection you feel to it perhaps I

00:59:39

don't know yeah I um it's just amazing

00:59:42

that the support recently as well and

00:59:44

going back and playing the World Cup

00:59:46

this year in South Africa as well um the

00:59:49

amount of support I get from from the

00:59:53

family and friends over there

00:59:55

I do feel like I can do more in terms of

00:59:57

my connection with back home um because

00:59:59

I left at such an early age not very

01:00:02

many people know how long I actually

01:00:05

lived in South Africa and so I don't

01:00:08

necessarily have that strong of a

01:00:09

connection with when I do go back there

01:00:12

um sometimes people are quite surprised

01:00:14

I was like oh my gosh you're South

01:00:15

African I was like yeah yes I am and I

01:00:18

spent quite a decent time there too so I

01:00:21

don't want to lose that that um side of

01:00:23

me because your accent is not that

01:00:25

strong is it I know so this is the funny

01:00:28

thing like when I go home I don't like

01:00:30

speaking English because obviously like

01:00:32

oh why what do you speak Africans

01:00:34

Africans yeah home language is Africans

01:00:37

and so growing up um obviously second

01:00:41

language is a mandatory thing in New

01:00:43

Zealand uh in South Africa especially

01:00:46

English because we've got so many

01:00:48

different languages got like 13

01:00:49

different languages so you have to have

01:00:51

a common one to actually understand each

01:00:53

other so um at school you've got your

01:00:56

main language which to me was Africans

01:00:58

um but we have to learn English from a

01:01:01

like young young age so I could speak it

01:01:04

I could understand it fluently all good

01:01:06

but I never used it because I grew up in

01:01:09

a like really small towns pretty much

01:01:11

just Africans only spoke Africans so my

01:01:13

first real like chucking in the deep end

01:01:16

was in New Zealand where I had to speak

01:01:18

it on a daily basis like that's probably

01:01:21

also why the combination of being

01:01:24

and that language barrier I wouldn't

01:01:26

really approach people or talk to people

01:01:28

because I was translating in my head

01:01:30

before I spoke whereas now whe whether

01:01:33

I'm Africans in Africans or English

01:01:35

environment I think in the language that

01:01:37

I'm speaking but back then I was

01:01:39

thinking in afri and I was like right I

01:01:41

need to translate and so it took me a

01:01:43

bit longer to reply to or respond to

01:01:45

people um like a buffering computer yeah

01:01:49

yeah and quite often use the wrong words

01:01:52

or tenses or stuff but um yeah so pretty

01:01:56

much just thrown in the deep end to have

01:01:58

to speak it on a daily basis and I think

01:02:00

that's where I picked it up because I my

01:02:02

first time using it that much was here

01:02:05

yeah well I'm I'm an idiot that can only

01:02:07

speak one one language and and and

01:02:09

that's English so so explain that to me

01:02:11

so you you're thinking in your head in

01:02:13

Africans and then you're then you're

01:02:15

trying to translate it before you say it

01:02:17

out loud yeah like I would think about

01:02:20

what I want to say before I say it like

01:02:22

so I would hear it and I like right this

01:02:26

is what I want to say and then I would

01:02:27

translate I was like okay now I need to

01:02:29

say it oh my God it's gonna take such a

01:02:32

long time to order a coffee or something

01:02:33

yeah but that was back then and so the

01:02:36

and that's why like fully immersing

01:02:38

yourself in that culture is the best way

01:02:41

to do it because now when I go home

01:02:44

predominantly I speak Africans um and

01:02:46

yes okay it takes me a couple of days to

01:02:48

not get stuck on Words uh but the moment

01:02:51

I'm in an Africans environment it just

01:02:52

flows and I just think African can't

01:02:54

speak up fors and then I come home to

01:02:56

new I've got so many homes and then I

01:02:59

come home to New Zealand um and then I

01:03:01

was like right couple of days to just

01:03:03

get the rain re regathered um and then

01:03:06

think English speak English yeah so so

01:03:08

when you play South Africa and you can

01:03:10

hear them speaking Africans what what

01:03:11

sort of things are they saying oh just

01:03:13

like stuff about um if something's not

01:03:15

working what they're going to do to fix

01:03:17

it right or um like well maybe on this

01:03:20

SC a past they're going to say what

01:03:21

they're going to do and I'll be like

01:03:22

right guys we need to do this cuz

01:03:23

they're doing this so um it's amazing

01:03:26

Intel isn't it yeah yeah I mean

01:03:28

obviously it's like you have to relay

01:03:30

that message quite quickly to the other

01:03:31

people so no time to do the translate no

01:03:34

no so quite often it's not really use

01:03:36

useful to know because it's not like you

01:03:37

can relay to the rest of the team in

01:03:39

that quick few seconds but yeah it's

01:03:41

quite interesting yeah and when you when

01:03:43

you play poorly how do how how quickly

01:03:45

do you bounce back or when something

01:03:46

goes wrong like we we touched upon

01:03:48

before the um the testday bo with the

01:03:50

sand off yeah um yeah what what for you

01:03:53

makes a good game and a bad game

01:03:55

I um last night for example your 50th

01:03:58

test match where you won against

01:03:59

Australia was that a good game

01:04:02

um I I would base it off a team effort

01:04:05

but also an individual effort and how I

01:04:07

helped my team I used to rate myself on

01:04:11

how much ball I got how many intercepts

01:04:12

I got um but when you start playing

01:04:15

International level it's so hard getting

01:04:17

ball and so if you get stuck on just um

01:04:20

that's the way I rate myself um I can

01:04:23

get down on myself quite harshly and I

01:04:25

was like no I still do a good job I

01:04:28

still need to tell myself I'm doing a

01:04:29

good job so like last night we didn't

01:04:31

get heaps a ball but we got ball and I

01:04:34

think to me it's about what I did for my

01:04:39

unit and how I contributed to my unit

01:04:42

obviously the best thing to know that

01:04:44

you did all right was the fact that you

01:04:46

stayed on court in the first instance

01:04:48

yes I didn't get set off again um but

01:04:52

yeah I think it's just how I helped my

01:04:56

unit and um the Kiwi style is very much

01:04:59

to be playing together and for each

01:05:02

other um so how I helped my unit to get

01:05:06

born that's that's and your style like

01:05:09

again amazing coach who knows what your

01:05:12

strength is and you would have seen in

01:05:14

the last couple of games she made

01:05:15

strategic changes to make a difference

01:05:18

um because she knows what every single

01:05:20

player offers and what their strengths

01:05:22

are and so that all she ever asks of you

01:05:25

to do is just bring your best and so

01:05:28

that's what I know I know what my

01:05:29

strengths are they constantly ask us

01:05:31

what's your strength how do we get the

01:05:32

best out of you and so I know what I

01:05:34

need to go do and as long as I do that

01:05:35

well then I then I'm happy and and do

01:05:38

you have like a like a post analysis or

01:05:40

anything with Dame noan and we yeah

01:05:43

really when does that take place so you

01:05:44

just finished the four game series well

01:05:47

not necessarily after the four games

01:05:49

usually we have a series debrief um yes

01:05:52

like we had one after the English series

01:05:54

especially going into another series we

01:05:55

had to do that what's the goods the bads

01:05:58

what we need to work on all that kind of

01:06:00

stuff and then we took it into the next

01:06:01

series so because we don't have anything

01:06:03

else on for the rest of the year it's

01:06:05

not necessarily such a big Focus for us

01:06:08

um we've only got one coming up next

01:06:10

January but I'm sure there will be

01:06:12

things that because we also finished on

01:06:14

a high and things were going quite well

01:06:15

there's obviously a lot a bit less to

01:06:17

have to worry about and focus on um but

01:06:20

yeah no we do have a team debrief after

01:06:23

the series to know what we did well what

01:06:25

we need to keep doing and what we need

01:06:27

to change to to be better yeah you and

01:06:30

Dame noene must have a special

01:06:31

relationship because she's been your

01:06:32

your coach through your entire time at

01:06:34

the the silver FS five years yeah she's

01:06:37

um it's like I've been with under here

01:06:40

for so long and still like who was that

01:06:43

I can't remember who I was talking to

01:06:45

the other day another experienced player

01:06:46

but we were saying it's

01:06:48

still I wouldn't say intimidating but

01:06:51

the aura and the person that she is you

01:06:54

it's out of respect that you still fear

01:06:57

her um and it's it's a good way good yes

01:07:01

we absolutely have so much respect for

01:07:03

her um um and like and again the kind of

01:07:08

coach that she is uh if you play hard

01:07:12

and you play well you will get your

01:07:14

opportunities you get feedback you get

01:07:16

told what you do well and what you need

01:07:18

to work on so you're always clear on

01:07:19

what you need to fix or what she wants

01:07:22

you to do um and that Clarity means a

01:07:24

lot for us as players um so yeah uh I

01:07:31

want to say I've got a really good

01:07:32

relationship with her but um so much

01:07:35

respect for her and um the coach that

01:07:38

she is I mean she's done amazing things

01:07:41

that um it's that still that respect and

01:07:44

fear kind of thing you know yeah it's an

01:07:47

interesting interesting relationship and

01:07:49

interesting relationship um from her

01:07:50

perspective to the players as well like

01:07:52

when you've got someone like you who

01:07:54

she's uh worked with and selected since

01:07:56

you were 25 and you're 30 now I mean if

01:07:58

she's around long enough there's going

01:08:00

to you know eventually maybe become a

01:08:02

time where she's going to make a hard

01:08:03

decision about you 100% And um like but

01:08:07

that's the great environment that we

01:08:09

have in our team as well we've got so

01:08:11

many young ones coming through and the

01:08:13

coach at she is if you do the job and

01:08:15

you do it really well you'll be out

01:08:17

there and you'll be selected um and for

01:08:21

us as older players or more experienced

01:08:24

is rephrase by the way by I'm sitting

01:08:27

here I'm [ __ ] 50 I'm old like you're

01:08:30

you're Sports old but you're still very

01:08:32

young in life uh I keep telling myself

01:08:35

that um but yeah for our more

01:08:37

experienced players we need those young

01:08:40

ones nipping at our heels to make us

01:08:42

better players um just like when I first

01:08:45

came in and Katrina um R was playing you

01:08:48

know she was the more experienced player

01:08:50

and we were battling for that Bib and so

01:08:52

she was having to go hard because I was

01:08:54

nipping at her heels whereas I had to go

01:08:57

hard because she had experience over me

01:08:59

so um it's it's an exciting time to know

01:09:02

we've got so many young ones coming

01:09:04

through and to have that competition is

01:09:05

a good thing it's a it's hard but it's

01:09:08

really good yeah and now um the

01:09:11

Birmingham Commonwealth Games last year

01:09:13

um I know you were you were very excited

01:09:15

about this and then you had like a foot

01:09:17

injury an ankle injury yeah my first big

01:09:20

injury um how long were you out for six

01:09:23

months yeah so you missed the missed the

01:09:24

the Commonwealth Games and the the girls

01:09:26

won uh bronze uh yes bronze yeah yeah um

01:09:30

yeah I how was that would take us back

01:09:32

to the point of the

01:09:33

injury I think I have a a an idea that

01:09:37

I'd been playing with it for the

01:09:39

domestic season it just progressively

01:09:41

got worse and worse um but I mean we

01:09:45

were doing the scans and the things

01:09:46

we're doing the necessary things but

01:09:48

nothing was showing up um but I was like

01:09:51

anti-inflammatories painkillers good to

01:09:54

go um check some quarter Zone in there

01:09:58

gosh um so yeah I it was our very last

01:10:02

game we didn't have a good season that

01:10:03

year with the tactics um but our very

01:10:06

last game I remember was against the

01:10:09

pulse at um Christ Church Arena went up

01:10:12

for an intercept against T and I landed

01:10:15

really hard um and at that point uh the

01:10:19

painkillers didn't want to work anymore

01:10:22

um so I was hobbling it was only 3

01:10:24

minutes left to go in the game I'm the

01:10:25

kind of player unless you're going to

01:10:26

sub me off I'm not going off by my own

01:10:29

um will so um coach wasn't calling it so

01:10:32

I was pretty much just hobbling for the

01:10:34

three minutes on court um and then they

01:10:37

put me because the selections were

01:10:38

coming up for com games and all that

01:10:40

kind of stuff or com games are coming up

01:10:42

they put me in a moon boot precautionary

01:10:45

and while they were doing all the tests

01:10:46

and stuff um and I'd gone for my

01:10:50

skin uh I was in the gym I was ready to

01:10:54

go that morning when I got the news I

01:10:55

went to the gym was still my moon boot

01:10:57

it was pretty much took it off to go do

01:10:59

some lifts and then I got a message from

01:11:02

the physio that said um we got the scans

01:11:05

back and it doesn't look promising um

01:11:08

but and and he immediately he was like

01:11:11

um yeah it looks like you might have a

01:11:14

freter my brain refusing to accept it

01:11:17

was like okay I might be out for a

01:11:20

couple of weeks this is it's all right I

01:11:21

can do this it's fine so immediately put

01:11:24

my boot backck on and I ring him and I

01:11:25

was like what does this mean two weeks

01:11:28

three weeks what am I doing he was like

01:11:31

no this no this doesn't look like this

01:11:34

is going to be an operation and I was

01:11:36

like whoa whoa whoa I after the games

01:11:39

hold up hold up I've been playing with

01:11:41

painkillers for the last season I think

01:11:43

I can stick it through I like if this is

01:11:45

on me because he was like it's a freter

01:11:47

I was like this is if it's on me like if

01:11:49

I'm willing to take painkillers can I

01:11:51

just stick it through can I just go

01:11:53

really hard and he's like probably not

01:11:55

because it will eventually snap or

01:11:57

whatever or like you know with noses

01:12:01

always if you're not 100% you're adding

01:12:03

to the load of other players so I

01:12:05

completely understood at that point that

01:12:08

that just I wasn't going to be okay so

01:12:09

in other words it would have been like

01:12:10

selfish for you to be playing because

01:12:12

you're not playing to your potential yes

01:12:14

did you did you remind them that Richie

01:12:15

mcco won the 2011 World Cup with a

01:12:17

broken [ __ ] foot well the other thing

01:12:19

was that you know our trainings are

01:12:21

really brutal and so so if you are

01:12:25

nursing an injury you can't be in all

01:12:27

the trainings which mean you're adding

01:12:29

to load with other players they're

01:12:30

having to make up for your load and

01:12:32

trainings just so that you can play a

01:12:34

game and that's unfair that's a good way

01:12:35

of looking at it I never thought about

01:12:36

framing it that way but that's a great

01:12:38

way looking at it it's kind of it's

01:12:39

almost more selfish in a way exactly so

01:12:42

I got that call um and he said well go

01:12:44

to the doctors and just get the

01:12:46

confirmation that that is what it is and

01:12:48

I was still saying in the drive over I

01:12:49

was like no they had it wrong it's not

01:12:51

what it is but un fortunately the doctor

01:12:54

told me yep you can see the little line

01:12:56

right there it's like the tiniest little

01:12:58

fracture and the tiniest little bone in

01:13:00

my foot and I was like this is so

01:13:02

stupid um but yeah I went back out after

01:13:05

I got the news got in the car and I

01:13:06

immediately rang mom and I just bowed my

01:13:09

eyes out I was like this is that H it

01:13:12

was the worst um but I gave myself

01:13:15

myself a day or two to Sul about it and

01:13:17

cry about it and I was like I need to

01:13:19

get on with it it's not the end of the

01:13:21

world other people have had injuries

01:13:22

it's fine

01:13:24

um so I pretty much scheduled my surgery

01:13:27

for a couple weeks after that um went

01:13:29

straight into surgery I was like Silver

01:13:30

Lining at that point I hadn't seen my

01:13:32

family for about three or four years so

01:13:35

I was like I'm booking a holiday to go

01:13:36

home so I got to go home and see my

01:13:39

family it was hard

01:13:43

um I I want to say I supported the girls

01:13:46

which I did in my heart I did but it was

01:13:49

really hard to watch um so even any com

01:13:53

games so whenever at home um there was

01:13:57

any like doesn't matter what sport it

01:13:59

was um I didn't want to be in the room

01:14:01

when it was on the TV so I would just

01:14:03

leave and my family was massive

01:14:05

supporter so they watched all the games

01:14:08

and they um they got but annoyed at me

01:14:10

that I don't want to watch the games

01:14:11

with them but I was like no you guys can

01:14:13

really watch but I'm going to go to my

01:14:15

room like I I can't my heart hurting

01:14:18

yeah um I did end up watching their

01:14:21

final game though their bronze game so

01:14:23

so I master up the carriage I was like

01:14:25

no I need to at least watch this one for

01:14:27

them so um yeah it it was an experience

01:14:31

that uh I know I need to take better

01:14:33

care of my body after that it was six

01:14:36

months I had a downtime I was like this

01:14:38

is a perfect opportunity for me to look

01:14:40

at what I need to work on what I can do

01:14:43

better um how to take care of my body

01:14:45

better so I enjoyed my six months off as

01:14:49

bad as it was not going to com games I

01:14:52

enjoyed it I learned a lot of about

01:14:53

myself did you what were the key

01:14:55

takeaways you reckon um well gosh I

01:15:00

think um smarter not harder harder is

01:15:03

not always the

01:15:04

answer um and I think at that

01:15:09

point uh it was I didn't like listening

01:15:13

to the doctors in the physios when they

01:15:14

told me something because I was like no

01:15:16

I can do this like don't tell me um

01:15:20

you're so determined but you know what

01:15:22

it's um

01:15:23

it's a it's a superpow in a way because

01:15:26

it's like this Dogg determination a cur

01:15:29

because I mean that that's where I was

01:15:33

like no even if it's the smallest niggle

01:15:35

I need to mention it because it can turn

01:15:37

into something big um and so need to

01:15:40

take better care of my body need to

01:15:42

acknowledge that doctors and physios

01:15:44

know more than I do so if they tell you

01:15:47

not to do something you don't do it um

01:15:50

so that was a key learning and obviously

01:15:52

harder is not always the answer you can

01:15:54

be smarter about it um but then life

01:15:56

outside of nightball as well um you know

01:16:00

when things are going well you don't

01:16:01

really want to change too much in the

01:16:02

routines and things that you do but the

01:16:05

six months that I had I was like perfect

01:16:07

opportunity to experiment a little bit

01:16:09

so I experimented in my diet and how I

01:16:12

did things as well and um I've been

01:16:15

lactose free for ages at that point for

01:16:18

a few years um and then I decided to go

01:16:20

gluten-free as well I had a grumbly

01:16:22

tummy for years and years and I just let

01:16:24

it be um and then I went gluten-free and

01:16:27

it's been amazing um and challenge

01:16:30

myself with no oh my gosh and my as well

01:16:32

tell you I'm really really big Sweet

01:16:35

Tooth um she used to be my roomie and

01:16:38

she always tells me I was the worst

01:16:39

roomy to be amongst because I was so bad

01:16:42

with my Treats but I started challenging

01:16:45

myself to stay away from treats as well

01:16:47

so and um the difference not necessarily

01:16:50

that I just saw but felt in my body was

01:16:52

quite interesting and so I was

01:16:54

interested in behind the science of food

01:16:56

and why it did the the things that it

01:16:58

did and what it did so that's where my

01:17:01

interest in nutrition started coming in

01:17:03

so I had a plan of what I wanted to do

01:17:05

after eightball so it was a good six

01:17:07

months yeah a lot of learnings that's

01:17:11

that's really awesome it's it's um I

01:17:13

feel like you just have this natural

01:17:14

ability in any situation there is always

01:17:17

a silver lining isn't there or there's

01:17:18

an upside um but sometimes it's very

01:17:20

difficult to find or see that even if

01:17:22

you search um very very hard but it

01:17:25

seems like you managed to find that with

01:17:26

the Commonwealth Games situation

01:17:28

relatively quickly that's the best way

01:17:31

to get out of your funk um is to try and

01:17:34

see the good things in life um sometimes

01:17:38

it's a bit harder sometimes you need

01:17:41

that support um and you need that

01:17:44

somebody to pull you through uh but I

01:17:47

think you have to look at it like that

01:17:49

otherwise you're just going to get stay

01:17:50

stuck in that mentality of you know the

01:17:53

world is against me so no well good for

01:17:56

you and do do you have like a sports

01:17:57

psychologist or anything in the team or

01:17:59

yeah we do have a sports psychologist um

01:18:02

Rodney um yeah we we can use him we can

01:18:06

utilize him again this is where in the

01:18:08

past I was like I don't need that you

01:18:10

know I like why would I want to do that

01:18:12

I'm happy I'm I'm good to go but it's um

01:18:17

learning skills about yourself and how

01:18:19

to be a better athlete is quite good in

01:18:22

that perspective so um yes we do have

01:18:25

somebody to help us to go to um which is

01:18:28

quite nice we're quite fortunate I get

01:18:30

the feeling you don't have too much to

01:18:31

do with Rodney did you lean on him

01:18:34

during that um the Commonwealth Games

01:18:35

time or it was quite funny I was I was

01:18:38

um I was laughing because when I heard

01:18:41

the news this was the Friday I think I

01:18:43

heard the news and I told myself I'm

01:18:46

going to give myself the weekend to sulk

01:18:49

but I got in touch because they were

01:18:50

like we think it's important that you do

01:18:52

get in touch with Rod

01:18:53

so I messaged rod and I was like Rod I

01:18:55

need to talk to you um but I'm taking

01:18:59

this weekend for myself um at that point

01:19:02

I thought he'd knew like you know

01:19:03

because when like they've got the

01:19:06

structure up there so they tend to share

01:19:08

that you know this person's out or

01:19:10

whatever so I thought he knew about my

01:19:11

injury and so the Monday when we

01:19:13

scheduled the Skype or the Microsoft or

01:19:16

teams meeting whatever um he was like

01:19:20

right Karen what what's going on and

01:19:23

he hadn't heard about my injury so he

01:19:26

thought I was going through like this

01:19:27

massive life crisis and I was like

01:19:29

depressed and like going through this

01:19:32

massive ordeal and he was like ready

01:19:34

he's like I had my books ready I had my

01:19:36

questions ready I was like Rod I'm I'm

01:19:38

just injured I'm just not going to com

01:19:39

games and he's like oh okay I thought

01:19:42

you were going through it and I was like

01:19:43

no no no it's just you know I'm I'm

01:19:46

having to deal with this now and I've

01:19:47

never dealt with this before I don't

01:19:49

know I don't you you shouldn't be down

01:19:51

playing this though this is a this is a

01:19:52

big piece of adversity you went through

01:19:54

yeah um I I think that's um a good and a

01:19:59

bad thing about me um is that whether I

01:20:02

had success or a tough time I don't

01:20:05

necessarily acknowledge it for what it

01:20:07

is I like I'm not great with the touchy

01:20:12

feely kind of stuff and I think that's

01:20:15

why also i' Rod knows this that's why I

01:20:18

also avoid him because I don't like

01:20:20

getting into that touchy Fey stuff and I

01:20:23

hate crying in front of people even

01:20:24

though like I do I can cry easily if I

01:20:28

am emotional I hate crying in front of

01:20:31

people do you why is that I don't know I

01:20:33

don't know whether it's a vulnerable

01:20:35

thing or vulnerability is um yeah I used

01:20:39

to be I used to have massive massive

01:20:41

walls up and I've um been trying to get

01:20:43

better the last few years to sort of

01:20:45

like tear them down a little bit because

01:20:46

I know like vulnerability is like

01:20:47

another sort of superpower are you um

01:20:50

yeah I get the feeling you've got walls

01:20:52

up

01:20:53

um do you or is that unfair prob no no

01:20:57

that's probably a that's probably fair I

01:20:59

think uh my circle is quite small um and

01:21:04

I can mention with my time um who I give

01:21:06

my time to um is

01:21:10

limited um you got [ __ ] to do I do I do

01:21:14

um but also um I do like I trust people

01:21:18

until you give me reason not to um but

01:21:21

when it comes to my personal tight-knit

01:21:23

thing it yeah I don't have many people

01:21:26

that I have that close to me um so yeah

01:21:30

I I guess I do have walls but once once

01:21:32

you're in you're in you're in you're in

01:21:34

that inner circle geez I feel like it be

01:21:36

a it's a it's a a long way borrowing to

01:21:39

get into that in a circle though wasn't

01:21:40

it seems like you you've mentioned your

01:21:42

family a few times like you're really

01:21:43

close to them so I'm guessing they and

01:21:44

you're in a circle but that I mean um

01:21:47

your technolog is good with teams and

01:21:49

zoom and FaceTime and whatever but it's

01:21:51

that's still a long way away yeah um and

01:21:54

I think recently in the last few

01:21:58

years it's gotten more real about not

01:22:02

having that support system immediate

01:22:04

support system around me

01:22:07

um but I try not like I don't want that

01:22:11

to be the reason for me to suddenly

01:22:12

start looking for you know a significant

01:22:15

other or trying to I think I was quite

01:22:18

social I tried to be quite social at the

01:22:20

start or earlier in this year and it

01:22:22

drained me so much cuz I was like I need

01:22:24

more people around me I need to build my

01:22:27

you know my circle but it drained me so

01:22:30

much and it it actually was to my

01:22:32

detriment and I was like I don't need

01:22:35

this I'm happy with myself um and but it

01:22:39

does it does get lonely it really does

01:22:42

get lonely sometimes um but it's it's

01:22:46

not forever and I know I've got the

01:22:48

right people around me when I need them

01:22:51

um so

01:22:53

yeah yeah good for you and how's your

01:22:55

how's your mental health been over the

01:22:56

years has it been pretty good mostly

01:22:58

good well yes again like I try you're

01:23:01

not just sweeping everything under the

01:23:03

rug Rod might tell you I do

01:23:06

sometimes Rod wouldn't no you've only

01:23:09

had two meetings with them in five years

01:23:11

avoidance avoidance avoidance is key

01:23:15

yeah no um now you seem pretty good like

01:23:17

the I mean this is the first time we've

01:23:19

met and we've been chatting for like an

01:23:20

hour or 20 now and you just I get the

01:23:23

the definite impression of someone

01:23:24

that's um just relentlessly optimistic

01:23:27

and positive and glass half full I think

01:23:30

I'm fortunate to have the ability to

01:23:34

most of the time 90% of the time when I

01:23:37

don't When Something's Happened to me

01:23:39

that I don't like or it's a bad if I

01:23:41

can't do anything about it I just switch

01:23:42

off from it I like I can't do anything

01:23:45

about it there's no point of stressing

01:23:46

about it so I'm fortunate enough to have

01:23:49

that ability to just switch it off and

01:23:51

be like no I'm not not going to worry

01:23:53

myself about that and so that keeps me

01:23:55

in a good positive mindset but um it's

01:23:58

not always like that it definitely isn't

01:24:00

yeah that's a good way to approach

01:24:01

things though because you everyone will

01:24:03

tell you don't worry about the things

01:24:04

that are out of your control but it's

01:24:05

easier said than done isn't it 100% And

01:24:08

I think I'm sometimes guilty of that

01:24:10

because I've got like a a sister that is

01:24:14

very much a worry wart like she takes on

01:24:17

the world's problems um and so she's

01:24:20

just like this mess of mother at heart

01:24:22

and so she is very big on worrying and

01:24:25

like caring for others and so my advice

01:24:28

to her would always be like why like why

01:24:30

are you doing this so but that's her

01:24:32

personality and that is who she is so

01:24:33

it's so much harder for someone like

01:24:35

that to just be able to switch off um so

01:24:38

that's why I said at the start I'm

01:24:40

fortunate to have that ability to be

01:24:42

able to do that but it can be at a

01:24:45

detriment to myself sometimes as well

01:24:47

because sometimes you do need to feel

01:24:50

those things and you do need to work

01:24:51

through them and not pile them up so

01:24:54

yeah working on that aspect of it I feel

01:24:58

like you're always gonna have something

01:24:59

that you're that you're working

01:25:00

on you have to it's that constant

01:25:02

Improvement trying to be a better person

01:25:04

every day you have to yeah yeah oh it's

01:25:07

inspiring it's inspiring and what what's

01:25:08

your inner voice like are you mostly

01:25:10

kind to yourself because I I know if

01:25:11

you're um I I don't know I've probably

01:25:14

over the years had um sort of like a

01:25:16

perfectionism complex and it's like it's

01:25:19

it sounds it can be a good thing but it

01:25:21

can also be a bad as well yeah you most

01:25:23

mostly kind to yourself or you quite

01:25:25

hard on yourself I think probably more

01:25:28

leaning towards being hard on myself but

01:25:30

I think that is expected of a person

01:25:33

like high performing athletes that's the

01:25:36

mentality that we have as well that

01:25:38

doesn't matter how good you are you can

01:25:39

always be better um and so um that's

01:25:44

where I have to say in the last couple

01:25:45

of years my specifically my sister but

01:25:48

also my mom have come in to play really

01:25:51

well and reminding me that what I've

01:25:54

have done and how far I have come and

01:25:56

how good I am um because I'm

01:26:00

always uh downplaying things that I do

01:26:04

um and I I started this uh or I try um

01:26:10

Jay galard he started this itang concept

01:26:13

about tall poppy syndrome and that um

01:26:17

we're too humble sometimes and I come

01:26:20

from a history of

01:26:22

I hate Cockiness and arrogance I cannot

01:26:25

stand it um and but it's that fine line

01:26:29

of acknowledging when you are doing well

01:26:31

and being proud of yourself and

01:26:33

celebrating that and so that's what I'm

01:26:35

trying to work on myself a little bit

01:26:37

more is celebrating myself and being

01:26:39

proud of myself a little bit more rather

01:26:41

than always like downplaying or being

01:26:43

harsh on myself and my sister's been

01:26:45

really good that voice in the background

01:26:47

for me because I know they'll be very

01:26:49

open and honest with me when I'm not

01:26:50

doing something well when I need to do

01:26:52

to be better so coming from them that

01:26:54

support and be like no you are doing

01:26:56

really well don't be so down on yourself

01:26:58

is quite good yeah and I think I think

01:27:00

there's a difference between being um

01:27:02

being proud of yourself and being able

01:27:03

to acknowledge what you've done and

01:27:04

thinking that your [ __ ] doesn't stink

01:27:06

you know what I mean is um toal puppy a

01:27:08

big thing in South Africa as well it's a

01:27:10

massive thing here in newon no I don't

01:27:12

think so yeah well not that I would say

01:27:15

it is no um I think that it's pretty

01:27:20

much a thing here but

01:27:22

I love that about New Zealand as well I

01:27:24

love the humble side um it's just having

01:27:28

that fine line of being humble but

01:27:32

celebrating the good things as well and

01:27:35

I think that's where that's where I

01:27:37

would like to see it go is that we do

01:27:39

celebrate and not just um ourselves but

01:27:42

each other and I think that's more

01:27:44

important because if you get that

01:27:45

celebration from others you're more

01:27:47

inclined to do it for yourself too yeah

01:27:50

you don't want to be that person and be

01:27:51

like Oh I'm I'm so good or I'm doing

01:27:53

this but when the people around you are

01:27:55

doing it for you you be like oh yeah

01:27:57

maybe I am doing well you are you are

01:28:01

and I feel like today of all days is um

01:28:02

is a time where you should pause and

01:28:04

reflect on what you've done I mean you

01:28:06

just finished the series against

01:28:07

Australia you've played 50 games for New

01:28:09

Zealand um and the road that you took to

01:28:11

get here it's um it's incredible it's a

01:28:14

hell of a journey thank you so you you

01:28:16

do deserve to pet yourself on the bo

01:28:18

yeah we had um Wendy Fu who is an

01:28:21

amazing um player down in the South

01:28:23

Island um Southland she um she got 15

01:28:27

minutes out on court um in the black

01:28:30

dress um and she came into our camp

01:28:33

before our inago game um because we're

01:28:35

trying to connect with our player past

01:28:38

players uh and she had a chat about how

01:28:42

she wished it could have been more and

01:28:44

how she relished the few minutes that

01:28:46

she had out on Court and so when you

01:28:49

hear something like that it just reminds

01:28:51

you that you know it's every second out

01:28:55

there every moment in that black dress

01:28:57

is a absolute privilege and an honor and

01:28:59

you need to relish that moment for as

01:29:01

long as you can because you don't know

01:29:02

how long it's going to last so I think

01:29:05

after having that chat with her and now

01:29:07

being able to celebrate my 50

01:29:10

games yeah it it's hard when it's about

01:29:13

me when I'm celebrating other people's

01:29:15

50th I'm was like this is amazing you've

01:29:17

played so many games but when it's about

01:29:19

me it's like gosh you just can't believe

01:29:22

almost so it's hard to celebrate it's

01:29:25

really cool and I've heard you reference

01:29:26

the black dress um a few times of the

01:29:30

same way that the old blacks mentioned

01:29:31

the black Jersey do you get like um a

01:29:33

new black dress each game we um get a

01:29:36

new one every year so our year runs um

01:29:40

August till September um so you pretty

01:29:43

much get a new allocation whenever you

01:29:45

get selected in the squad you get your

01:29:47

two dresses um two dresses a year two

01:29:50

dresses a year so you don't we wash it

01:29:53

we wash it every night and we don't put

01:29:56

it in the washing machine either no no

01:29:58

you hand wash it in your bathroom and

01:30:01

then you ring it dry and then you yeah

01:30:04

is that out of necessity because you

01:30:06

have to you we've only got two dresses

01:30:08

so if it goes out in the wash and it

01:30:10

doesn't come back or the washing machine

01:30:12

does something to it you know whatever

01:30:14

if it goes missing it's yeah you're

01:30:16

screwed yeah yeah so um yeah we have to

01:30:18

take very good care of our two dresses

01:30:21

cuz the old blacks get like a they they

01:30:23

get um a jersey presented before each

01:30:25

game and it's got like black black

01:30:27

embroidery with um who they're playing

01:30:29

in the date and stuff really really so

01:30:32

from your five years you've got like 10

01:30:33

dresses yeah yeah pretty much yeah oh

01:30:37

well actually correction for Pinnacle

01:30:40

events there'll be a separate dress for

01:30:42

a pinnacle event so for com games you

01:30:45

would have had your allocation for the

01:30:46

year but com games had its specific

01:30:48

dress and World Cup had its specific

01:30:50

dress so every now and then you get four

01:30:52

dresses the year um but I mean it just

01:30:56

makes that dress for me not that

01:30:58

obviously the old black JY won't be more

01:31:00

special but it makes that physical dress

01:31:03

so much more special because I know all

01:31:05

my games all my Blood Sweat and Tears

01:31:07

was in that specific dress so handing

01:31:11

what I do with that dress means so much

01:31:13

more to me um

01:31:16

yeah that's cool what what what do you

01:31:18

think you'll do with them at the end of

01:31:19

your career I've you seem so humble I

01:31:21

can't imagine you ever framing them and

01:31:22

having them in a oh yeah well so I've

01:31:26

held on to one dress and then

01:31:28

one um if I had someone really special

01:31:32

to me that year that meant a lot for me

01:31:35

um I would give that dress to that

01:31:37

special person so I've held on to at

01:31:38

least one of each allocation same with

01:31:40

my franchise dresses I've got so many of

01:31:43

them as well um and we after our last

01:31:48

World Cup uh Gina krton and T sby Ricket

01:31:51

they um um had a contact in the South

01:31:53

Island they had this massive frame um

01:31:55

and they framed their dresses and with

01:31:58

big collage of photos of themselves

01:32:00

playing and the metal looks

01:32:03

amazing um and as amazing as it looks I

01:32:06

was like what am I going to do with this

01:32:08

like I don't want to put it up in my

01:32:09

house like but then I thought about it

01:32:12

okay it's cool though I know so I've

01:32:15

thought about it and I think um one day

01:32:18

when I have my own big house I want my

01:32:22

own Little Gym setup my room with my gym

01:32:25

set up and um I will

01:32:27

frame uh I don't know if I can frame all

01:32:30

of them because there'll be too many of

01:32:31

them but I'll frame my key ones and I'll

01:32:33

try and put them up and that will be my

01:32:35

memorabilia gym SL JY workout room so

01:32:40

hopefully that's the plan one day with

01:32:41

them yeah I like it oh that's a good

01:32:43

plan um and you turned 30 in April this

01:32:45

year which is a a big milestone birthday

01:32:48

um yes how yeah how how did that make

01:32:50

you feel because it's um as we touched

01:32:53

upon before on the bigest scheme of life

01:32:54

you're still very very young yeah I know

01:32:57

actually apparently I'm 24 because my

01:32:59

sister's got this mentality right she's

01:33:00

a year older than me she's got this

01:33:03

mentality if you tell yourself you're a

01:33:05

certain age that's the age that you are

01:33:07

so she keeps telling herself she's 25

01:33:10

and so back when I was home the last

01:33:13

time I was like oh guys no I can't do it

01:33:15

like I'm 30 and she's like you can't be

01:33:17

30 I'm 25 so that means you're

01:33:20

24 um but no I um it's a good way to

01:33:23

look at it but your ankle disagrees I

01:33:25

know I know um no you're only as old as

01:33:29

you feel and what you make of it so

01:33:32

um yeah I have to remind myself

01:33:35

sometimes that I'm 30 definitely

01:33:38

definitely believable that you're 24

01:33:39

aren't you aren't you busy doing Tik

01:33:41

toks like

01:33:43

pregame uh yeah it's just a bit of fun

01:33:46

you know you sometimes I cringe in

01:33:49

myself watching that but it's out of

01:33:51

your comfort zone you have to do some

01:33:53

fun stuff sometimes so um it takes your

01:33:56

mind off the seriousness exactly and um

01:34:00

I guess with I don't know my young

01:34:03

personality sometimes I've got heaps of

01:34:05

friends my age and then I've also got

01:34:07

heaps of like young young young friends

01:34:09

as well um so depending on my vibe the

01:34:13

day depends on who I hang out with as

01:34:15

well so um yeah I don't necessarily feel

01:34:19

dirty sometimes I like go gosh I can't

01:34:22

believe I am um but I just try and

01:34:25

remind myself like I've got so many more

01:34:27

years ahead of me and just because I'm

01:34:28

30 like who cares yeah and I'll tell you

01:34:32

something you from um the perspective of

01:34:34

being 50 now um You you I I still feel

01:34:38

young in my mind like you you still feel

01:34:41

young in your mind your mind doesn't

01:34:42

really sort of age necessarily like you

01:34:44

evolve and you change of course but your

01:34:46

mind doesn't really change and I feel

01:34:47

like yeah if you put that out there like

01:34:49

that aura of like I'm young young and

01:34:51

I'm still like you know people like a

01:34:54

lot of people don't believe I'm 30 until

01:34:56

I tell them I'm 30 so again it's as

01:34:59

you're as old as you feel and why like

01:35:02

why does age matter anyway you know it's

01:35:05

what you do with it yeah but I suppose

01:35:07

from a like a a high performance

01:35:08

sporting pers perspective you you must

01:35:10

be aware that you're probably closer to

01:35:12

the end than the start yes which is like

01:35:16

sad yeah is it yeah cuz I'm like I know

01:35:19

I've been in it for like five years is

01:35:21

but I also feel like I just started the

01:35:24

other day and I know how quickly time

01:35:26

goes by so um

01:35:31

bodywise I feel like I want to push for

01:35:33

another world cup which is four years

01:35:36

away um I wouldn't want to finish but

01:35:39

depending on how the body and I would

01:35:41

want to go out on my own terms as well

01:35:43

so um definitely aiming for another four

01:35:46

years and knowing how quickly time goes

01:35:48

by I want to try and enjoy it as much as

01:35:50

I can um so but hopefully the body can

01:35:54

hold out longer who knows yeah would

01:35:55

that be the dream four more years and

01:35:57

then finish on your own terms at 34

01:35:59

chapter closed well it depends on what

01:36:01

goes on on my life outside you know um

01:36:05

we've got like a few Ms and the team

01:36:07

who' probably have a different

01:36:08

perspective of what netball looks like

01:36:11

for them um and then you get young ones

01:36:13

who' got no idea you know very much

01:36:15

starting their Journey so I think for me

01:36:18

I've made Nick ball my priority for so

01:36:21

long

01:36:21

I know I need to start focusing on life

01:36:23

outside of netball a little bit more and

01:36:26

so I can't make those calls just yet at

01:36:29

the moment in terms of performance I

01:36:30

want to push for another four years you

01:36:32

never know I might get to 34 still be

01:36:34

single still only have netball so I

01:36:36

might want to push for longer or at that

01:36:38

point I might have a partner I might

01:36:40

want to settle down so you never know

01:36:42

yeah do do do you want to find a partner

01:36:44

or do you think you're quite happy on

01:36:45

your own I feel like Society puts a lot

01:36:46

of pressure on people especially when

01:36:47

you get to a certain age that you should

01:36:49

have a partner um you did mention before

01:36:51

just in passing that you're lonely

01:36:53

sometimes there's nothing wrong with I

01:36:55

don't think with being alone but being

01:36:57

lonely is not great yeah

01:36:59

um yeah uh it's very it's not very often

01:37:03

that I do feel lonely I think the only

01:37:05

times I do would probably be when you

01:37:08

want that that person or that like IM

01:37:12

like that hug or that person to go to or

01:37:14

just that that comfort that you don't

01:37:16

necessarily have because I don't have my

01:37:17

immediate family around me or you know

01:37:20

when you go to events

01:37:21

you don't have that plus one to go with

01:37:24

um so there's very few times that I do

01:37:28

feel lonely and so I'm not willing to

01:37:30

offer up uh

01:37:33

or yeah I'm want I'm wanting the right

01:37:37

person in the right time I'm not willing

01:37:39

to offer up my time and unnecessary

01:37:42

effort um for those few moments that I

01:37:45

feel

01:37:46

lonely if if you if you go out with

01:37:49

someone how how long do you give it

01:37:50

before you know like before you know if

01:37:52

there's a spark there or not uh I'm a

01:37:54

feeling person um like obviously have to

01:37:59

be attracted to some degree to that

01:38:01

person but I'm very much a feeling

01:38:03

person um and I can I can probably tell

01:38:07

within the first few dates um whether I

01:38:11

can see it going anywhere um but I

01:38:14

always try and give things the benefit

01:38:16

of the doubt and I try and you know see

01:38:19

where it goes um so yeah I think feeling

01:38:24

wise because I'm a feeling person quite

01:38:25

quickly first few dayses that's quite

01:38:27

generous I thought I expected you to say

01:38:29

like first few minutes almost like it

01:38:32

seems like you're you're a lady that

01:38:34

doesn't want to waste a minute of time

01:38:35

that you got yeah but I'm also

01:38:39

um uh like that benefit of Doubt kind of

01:38:42

thing like the person I am when you

01:38:45

first meet me might not necessarily be

01:38:47

the true meet because you know you might

01:38:48

be nervous or was something going on or

01:38:50

whatever so do try and give it actually

01:38:54

that time and effort because you don't

01:38:56

want to be like n n n and dismiss it too

01:38:59

quickly something yeah so I'm

01:39:02

also like give it the time that it needs

01:39:05

and just like just like Dame noan gave

01:39:07

you the time you need after your first

01:39:09

test exactly bad first impression but

01:39:12

you you came good yeah exactly and like

01:39:15

I mean who knows I know nothing about

01:39:17

like you know love and that kind of

01:39:20

stuff I'm like

01:39:21

some people say it's love at first sight

01:39:23

others say it's something you develop

01:39:25

and you build into I'm like who knows I

01:39:28

think everybody's different so I'm just

01:39:30

winging it yeah are you are you

01:39:32

religious I am yes I grew up Christian

01:39:35

so got those values behind me as well

01:39:39

um but yeah and I think that's also

01:39:42

shaped me into the person I am as well

01:39:45

the way I think and the way I do things

01:39:47

as well um but I know there's a wide

01:39:50

world out there and I I I definitely

01:39:52

don't judge I'm not you know you do you

01:39:55

I'll do me happy with that kind of thing

01:39:57

you know so as long as I get along with

01:39:59

you and I you know connect with you

01:40:02

that's what what's important to me when

01:40:03

I like build friendships or

01:40:05

relationships so um but yeah very big

01:40:08

growing up that was a big aspect of my

01:40:10

life and and shaped me in the in my

01:40:13

values and morals and and how I think

01:40:15

about things yeah and now you live in a

01:40:16

city called Christ's

01:40:19

Church yeah a more religious sounding

01:40:23

place oh it's cool oh no I wondered

01:40:25

because I've read a few interviews with

01:40:26

you and you you use some phras phrases

01:40:28

like um Bliss quite a bit and um you you

01:40:32

talk about your Creator and stuff so I

01:40:33

thought and you just seem like a good a

01:40:36

good person as well so I thought maybe

01:40:38

there's some religious backing there

01:40:40

yeah yeah um but like also acknowledging

01:40:43

you know um there's a lot of other

01:40:46

people that that NE aren't necessarily

01:40:48

and I think when you are like yes I'm

01:40:50

religious people can be like oh like are

01:40:52

you judgy all that kind of stuff don't

01:40:54

don't try and RAM it down my throat yeah

01:40:56

yeah so I think I'm very big on that

01:40:58

like that's not my role to do at all um

01:41:02

it's fine for you yeah that's cool and

01:41:05

could you could you date someone shorter

01:41:06

than

01:41:07

you I'm asking for a couple of friends

01:41:09

who may not be

01:41:11

as what's your height your 12 um incen

01:41:14

is 184 yeah so

01:41:19

um I actually I went on a few dates with

01:41:22

a with a guy that was shorter than me

01:41:25

and um beautiful guy like gentleman

01:41:28

absolutely green flags like lovely

01:41:32

um and we still joke about it because

01:41:34

we're still in touch like just because

01:41:36

it didn't work out doesn't mean like I

01:41:37

still enjoy company yeah um and we still

01:41:41

joke about it but I'm like it's nothing

01:41:44

to do with the person and I think that's

01:41:48

sometimes hard to explain to them I am

01:41:51

tall so I come across big and I like

01:41:55

feeling small and I I would like to feel

01:41:57

small so um it's probably more so a

01:42:01

personal um is issue I'm dealing with

01:42:05

that I'd probably want my partner to be

01:42:07

taller than me yes are are you quite

01:42:10

self-conscious of your height no no I'm

01:42:12

not um used to be at school I hated it I

01:42:16

also used to never yeah I never wore

01:42:19

heels um um oh my gosh I like my

01:42:22

wardrobe is full of heels now I don't

01:42:24

care I wear heels ever like platforms

01:42:26

I'm always wearing platform shoes um no

01:42:30

not anymore I I love my height now I

01:42:33

absolutely enjoy it um a lot hard of

01:42:37

finding a guy that's taller than me

01:42:38

though especially when I love wearing

01:42:40

heels but again it's I know if the right

01:42:44

person comes along and I have th that

01:42:46

feeling towards them and they happen to

01:42:48

be shorter than me oh cross that bridge

01:42:51

when we get there you need to you need

01:42:53

to start hanging out at breaker's

01:42:54

training

01:42:55

camp gosh oh I know Ron's always like

01:42:59

you need to find yourself an athlete and

01:43:00

I was like well yes and no I'm sure

01:43:03

there's tall people that's not athletes

01:43:05

yeah hey well I'm really excited to see

01:43:06

what the future um brings for you and

01:43:08

I'm really excited to hear that your

01:43:10

goal is to keep playing for as long as

01:43:12

your body allows because you've got so

01:43:14

much to give and I can't thank you

01:43:16

enough for coming over today the morning

01:43:18

after your 50th game for the silver F

01:43:20

it's been great to finally meet you oh

01:43:21

gosh back to normal life you know thank

01:43:23

you so much for having me I always love

01:43:25

having a bit of a chat and um because

01:43:29

when you have these kind of discussions

01:43:30

with people sometimes you realize or

01:43:33

notice things about yourself you didn't

01:43:35

before because people tend to ask you

01:43:37

questions you might not have thought

01:43:38

about or have voiced out in the open so

01:43:41

um I love having these chats you learned

01:43:43

so much about yourself as well has has

01:43:45

there been anything that you can think

01:43:46

of from this chat or is it sort of like

01:43:47

on the flight home later today that

01:43:49

you're probably on the flight

01:43:51

yeah I'll be

01:43:52

thinking what I like did I make myself

01:43:57

look really

01:43:58

stupid oh no absolutely not absolutely

01:44:01

not if in these conversations if

01:44:03

anyone's going to make themselves look

01:44:04

stupid it's likely to be me oh god um I

01:44:06

always go into these chats um assuming

01:44:08

I'm the dumbest person in the room and

01:44:10

it's uh I think it's a good way to go

01:44:11

about it um Karen burer you are a great

01:44:14

New Zealander oh thank you can I can we

01:44:17

call you a New Zealander you're newand I

01:44:19

yeah like 12 years you know I've pretty

01:44:22

much that's why I'm always saying I'm

01:44:23

going home wherever I'm going I'm going

01:44:25

home so I'm fortunate um and blessed to

01:44:28

have so many homes um so I definitely

01:44:31

call New Zealand home as well yeah yeah

01:44:33

cool hey best of luck for the future

01:44:35

awesome thank

01:44:37

[Music]

01:44:45

you

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Episode Highlights

Journey to New Zealand
Karen shares her journey from South Africa to New Zealand, emphasizing the importance of building a life outside of netball.
“I think the Nets are a good driving force for me.”
@ 02m 46s
November 26, 2023
Dating Life Insights
Karen discusses her dating life, emphasizing her focus on self-discovery and timing in relationships.
“The right person at the right time will happen.”
@ 09m 12s
November 26, 2023
Overcoming Adversity
Despite a knee injury at 14, her determination led to a successful sports career.
“I was determined to be like no, that’s definitely not me.”
@ 23m 39s
November 26, 2023
The Power of Mindset
She emphasizes the importance of mindset in overcoming challenges in sports.
“The mind is an amazing thing.”
@ 24m 24s
November 26, 2023
Overcoming Guilt
The speaker discusses feelings of guilt for leaving family behind while pursuing their dreams.
“I need to find ways to help them”
@ 39m 25s
November 26, 2023
Learning from Mistakes
The speaker emphasizes the importance of learning from failures in their career.
“If you learn from your mistakes, I think she’s happy”
@ 53m 54s
November 26, 2023
World Cup Memories
A poignant moment hearing my mom's voice during a game.
“I could vividly hear my mom's voice in the crowd.”
@ 56m 45s
November 26, 2023
Injury and Its Impact
Discussing the emotional toll of a serious injury and missing the Commonwealth Games.
“I was like, this is so stupid.”
@ 01h 13m 02s
November 26, 2023
Finding Opportunity in Adversity
After a six-month downtime, I learned to take better care of my body.
“It was a perfect opportunity to experiment a little bit.”
@ 01h 16m 07s
November 26, 2023
The Importance of Support
Having a sports psychologist can help athletes navigate tough times.
“Learning skills about yourself is quite good in that perspective.”
@ 01h 18m 17s
November 26, 2023
Celebrating Achievements
Reflecting on her journey after playing 50 games for New Zealand.
“You need to relish that moment for as long as you can.”
@ 01h 28m 55s
November 26, 2023
Loneliness vs. Being Alone
Navigating the pressures of society regarding relationships. 'Being alone is fine, but being lonely is not great.'
“Being alone is fine, but being lonely is not great.”
@ 01h 36m 57s
November 26, 2023

Episode Quotes

The right person at the right time will happen.
Karin Burger - Silver Ferns Star Opens Up About Love & Life as a Professional Athlete
The mind is an amazing thing.
Karin Burger - Silver Ferns Star Opens Up About Love & Life as a Professional Athlete
I was determined to do something with my life here.
Karin Burger - Silver Ferns Star Opens Up About Love & Life as a Professional Athlete
It’s amazing that the support recently as well.
Karin Burger - Silver Ferns Star Opens Up About Love & Life as a Professional Athlete
Vulnerability is like another sort of superpower.
Karin Burger - Silver Ferns Star Opens Up About Love & Life as a Professional Athlete
Being alone is fine, but being lonely is not great.
Karin Burger - Silver Ferns Star Opens Up About Love & Life as a Professional Athlete

Key Moments

Dating Insights09:12
Rugby Unity18:41
Knee Injury23:39
Emotional Reaction1:13:02
Nutrition Experimentation1:16:15
Vulnerability as Strength1:20:47
Celebrating Milestones1:28:16
Loneliness1:36:57

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