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broy Kane welcome to my podcast well it's an honor to be back for the second
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time and you've really glowed up Dom you know physically mentally and the Pod so
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you know last time we were in that studio the studio yeah yeah because last time you were one of my um very early
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guests on the podcast like maybe the first 10 or first 15 guests and I rented a studio
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specifically um yeah lots big changes for both of us since then I know so what's oh now I was trying to pinpoint
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it today um when did when did we become friends do you mean like but do when do you think um when we became friends in
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terms of when the Friendship blossomed when was the blossoming of the Friendship yeah was it at that first
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podcast we did was that sort of we hadn't run together before then had we no no and I think we just started
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connecting because we were doing on similar paths in terms of independent podcasts um and I think I think I was
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quite a good sounding board to you you're very good very good and then we then we started doing our sounding board
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running yeah and then that's when it was like well this is a great way to fill
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time we've got a three-hour run and I don't think even even when we have three
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hour runs we stop for ear do we no no well no not at all um we've done a lot
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of a lot of long runs um yeah you're here today because um you got this amazing new book out um Brody Kane woman
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interrupted when when interrupted interesting uninterrupted sorry when when you when you see the physical book
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and the cover and stuff how do you feel like you burst him with pride I at the moment I'm actually still kind of like
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oh gosh there it is um I feel like when you you would know um it's a big effort
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getting a book out and I almost like I'm like I hope I can remember everything to
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to you about because you spend so much time on it that when you go through that last edit you're like I don't want to
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hear about myself for quite some time and you almost shut it out like you kind I don't know whether you did that I I
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just sort of like P pushed it away and now I'm like oh yeah gosh okay and even
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when you uh shared a story about uh one of the chapters I was like oh yeah okay now this isn't set in stone in book form
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so it's like it's a really proud feeling though to to write a book it's an ego
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project doesn't it let's be honest well it's it's not not a great payday but
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it's um yeah something something tangible so regard whatever happens to you in the future you've got this um
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sort of archive of your of of your life yeah and I mean that's not a it's not a
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memoir it's not a uh it's not a hello I was born today and here I am today it's
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not a it's not a um story about a particular particular life event that's
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changed me forever cuz that's not the case it's just like hey team I've had a
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pretty chocker life some of it's been pretty cool some of it's been quite
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clumsy But ultimately all of it has led me to the person I am today and there's
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sort of some lessons and kind of not some lessons along the way I I um yeah I really love that you talk about the um
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the clumsiness and the the the mess um life a highlights real book would not be exciting I I don't know you know it
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would be exciting but like life is [ __ ] ugly yeah and time and I think you know I one of the things that I have
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found really important in I guess not only just your your personal life but in my in
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my professional life as well now more so really in the past few years since sort
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of being um self-employed is that what people value out of what I do is is is is me is is being real
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and I've never really known how to be anything other than that you know and I
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I think though that I've been able to Relish in that more when I haven't had a
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boss you know yeah no but like everyone has um everyone has feal incidents allal
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yes everyone everyone shits themselves or nearly shits themselves but everyone also has that moment like do I do I tell
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anyone about this or not and you've had the opportunity to write a book and you've shared it in the book
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there's we've spent a lot of hours running and a lot of hours talking and
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and there's things about you that I um that I that I did not know that I now
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know like um you having a shower poo in Paris that gets a whole chapter early on
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I feel like that's that's a good way to open the book because it's like if you
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if you're tapping out now then it's not the book for you also you're a smoker I
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never knew you were a smoker oh yeah in my 20s like just a casual smoker yeah I mean isn't it funny that that's the way
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that describe ourselves in order to make ourselves feel better but yes I smoked in my 20s I actually I actually smoked a
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little bit when I was a teenager too at high school though I remember we would buy Rollies for a dollar and no sorry
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Rollies for 50 cents and taes for a dollar um like singles yeah from from I don't know some kid out on the field and
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um and so yeah like I I did when I was traveling you know I would I would smoke on my Oe when I'd go to Barley I'd smoke
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because they were like $2 and you were like I might as well take up smoking while I'm in barley um yeah so I de I
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debled I debled with siggies when when you when when the Poo incident in the shower happened in Paris last year did
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you take up smoking no I but of all the places you should it should really be Europe shouldn't it cuz people still
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it's still very fashionable over there French make it look so nice but I but
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yeah I I um no the Poo the Poo incident I mean do we do you do we share that with the people or or do we what do you
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think they could be a book maybe that's a book [ __ ] I don't know I'm I'm like I
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know some people find it really offputting some sometimes I do these podcasts and and be a Fe and people find
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that really offputting for the the YouTube thing the the the feal thing though like everyone shits well the
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thing is um one of the story there's two [ __ ] stories in the book I actually
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wanted to I actually wanted to call the book AET and the share in Paris because I just thought that that would sort of
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like lure people in but then it was also kind of too similar to that someone shattered our wedding podcast or
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something like that but um that's right I get tended to a true crime podcast
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yeah but no I you know there's two in there and one one story though that I do
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roll out quite often in my keynote speeches is when I shat in the jungle in brunai when I was in the Army so that's
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in there too but that's sort of a that's an old regular cuz that's a that's a
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repper as well um and look you know better out than in and I've always I've
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grown up with like I've I enjy Pooh humor so I find farts funny a fart to me
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is never not funny um and and I and I have you know like a bit of irritable bowel syndrome so I'm a regular [ __ ]
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full [ __ ] so speak I think it's good to share by the way on on that the last
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couple of long runs we've been on I've had um I've had severe running farts and
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uh you you you've never said anything or acknowledged it do you know Pro who we
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ran with the other day am I getting away with these or are you just ch not to humiliate me I I thought that the other
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day to be honest I thought that there was a couple and I wasn't sure whether
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it was your shoe creaking on the okay but yeah no but someone Almost got away with that yeah but but I I I'm not
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offended by that I'm like go off Dom like you get that out okay yeah oh another thing in the book that I didn't
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know about you the um the stuck tampon incident but I then again I I I mean how would you bring it up on a three-hour
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run D you won't believe what happened to me yeah that's not do you know that what
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what's horrible about that is you actually it's it is your worst nightmare
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because you hear about toxic shock syndrome um and I think though at the time that that happened and and you
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speak to women and it's really common but you but you kind of think how how you try and figure out how that's
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logistically possible to do that but I you feel like a you feel like a like you feel a bit yuck and you feel a
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little bit embarrassed and at that particular point in time I was that was that was like almost in the middle of
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sort of unraveling with burnout but not being able to deal with it cuz I was about to jump on a plane to go and do
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like you know a job of a lifetime but I was I was putting off you know like the body was going nuts um I'd left the temp
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on in but I was going to Paris the next day and it was just when I look back at that
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I'm like oh my gosh no wonder you no wonder you did suffer burnout because all of these things were
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happening no wonder you lodged a bloody tampon up there and forgot about it you know like these are all signs of things
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that you're just like just doing too much pushing yourself too hard yeah 100%
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I think I remember you around that time you had a lot going on and me and M M we
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talked about going to business with you like a podcast business and you were like not today not this year but the
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being like being being a male I've got I've got very limited understanding
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about like anything menstrual but surely it's like one in one out you put one in
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you put it out replace it you you would think so but I don't even I can't even I couldn't the worst
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thing was when the doctor was like that is there is a tampon up there i' I'd
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removed one cuz she was about to do a um a h what was she like almost like a cical smear thing um which is super
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Pleasant there's like this thing that you it's like a I call it a duck beak
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that's the shape of it and it goes in up your um vagina and then they open it up
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which is super lovely as you can imagine um and then they scrape your bloody cervix Divine experience and so she was
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about to do that so I'd gone and at this this time as well I was going through
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you this this really big bleed um so I was going to see what all that was about and yeah I so I'd gone to
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remove one and then then she puts the duck up she's like there's a ton in
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there and I just I was like oh my God I don't know how long it I don't know how
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long it have been in there and and and when I went to go get the blood tests for for because we didn't know it I was
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showing signs of an early infection so I was jumping on that plane to the rugby w
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c up the next day so I just sort of fell apart pants down in tears with this poor
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amazing doctor that I go to and she was like oh my God it's okay I was like no
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it's not it's not okay and then of course yeah I had to go and get the Bloods and do an ultrasound and all this
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you know I went to the hospital on my way to the airport the next day to go and see what was wrong with my bits it's
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a it's a frantic story in the book it's like in a 4-Hour window between going to
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the going to the hospital and going to the and and then there's the 30 hour flight and then that's that's when you p
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in the shower Paris it's a hell of a couple of days hey it was a lot well it
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was like both both ends were like telling me something weren't they they were like mate you need to slow down so
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but yeah I mean it's not what exactly what you want to do when you go to Paris
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are you not really the city of romance really [ __ ] in the shower but hey it's a
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good story yeah sh there's so much to get through um I am mindful of the time
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though because um you have you have podcast length shamed me in the past what did you I told you I had a podcast
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with Justin Marshall that went for just under 3 hours and you're like oh Dom no
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one needs that much Justin Marshall well no one needs that much anyone Dom no one
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needs no one is no one who who who would you listen to for three hours like if you not not your own guest
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who's something who's someone I would go and listen to someone on stage maybe I'd
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go and listen to someone like Obama or David and Ur or something on stage but I don't know I mean look if you want me
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for three sweet is but I don't think that's what the people want they might I
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don't know no but don't you think don't you think like you know people people
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can listen to a podcast if you're going on a long run listen for an hour and
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then listen to the two hours another time you know pause it do you know what you you [ __ ] you do you march the
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beat of your own drum pal like you do I'm here for you I will not judge you for how long our podcast goes okay cool
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all right well let's go way back um so you I've never met your dad M um but
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I've met your mom I love your mom m and joy um um incredible backstory I had no
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idea so so they were together they you you there's a big age gap between you
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and your brother so they together they went married though no so yeah they were your dad was an alcoholic yeah so they
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um they were I I guess I mean I don't know what it was what it would have been
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called back then but they were hooking up right so they were they were seeing each other um and then Mom got pregnant
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and she was she she had had an abortion prior to um to that to that to getting pregnant this time um and she made the
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decision that she wanted to to keep the child and um yeah Dad was so she must have been 20 21 and dad would have been
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33 33 34 and yeah she told him that she was going to kick the baby and and he he was that was in a period of
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his life where he was very much drinking a lot and he was you know his nickname's
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Maz which is short for Mustang cuz he used to drive a Mustang um was his name not maray oh no no his name is muray but
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he but M came from well M I guess is also other marri not that don't drive Mustangs I suppose but um I didn't
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really think about that but no I've always I've always got it from Mustang
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but no you're right M anyway so yeah so he so he he was not just didn't have he
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was not it was not something that he wanted to be involved with so um Mom raised my brother AJ for first six six
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and a half years of his life as a Solo solo mom in the 70s ' 80s both 70s yeah
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AJ was born in 1976 right um so yeah they um she you know she did it hard and they didn't have a lot of money and she
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was you know there was a she was at one point she was um a cleaner but she was also a lifeguard and a swim coach and
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used to go he was her little mate used to go everywhere with her so um and then what happened was uh dad realized and
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it's it's in the book about the sort of Turning Point had' gone to you know he'd
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gone to a mate's funeral and it turned up and he was in the ding bats you know
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like which we would probably now refer to as like coming off the back of a bender um and went to a went to a mate's
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dad's funeral and just went back to the ship after the funeral they had what' he say he had a
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beautiful silk shirt on but he had eggs spilled all down it from smashing back some you know some food to try and soak
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it up before the funeral and he went back to the boat that he was working on and open the fridge and there was a beer
00:15:48
in there and he smashed it like I mean smashed it drink not not smashed the glass drunk it and that was to be the
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last drop of alcohol that he ever had and so that was I guess 30 what am I 38 40 40 years ago um and then he turned
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his life around a bit at age 42 you know like started again got off the booze um wanted to be back
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involved in AJ's life and then after a bit of time of just hanging out with AJ
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wanted to sort of start taking M out for catch-ups and that as well and then then
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they got back together so the rekindled it's it's it's a wonderful story yeah
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like what was the uh the Catalyst was it his mate's funeral or had he just did he
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get bored of being I think I think it was the the funeral that just it was like you're a sack of [ __ ] like this
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can't go on um and yeah going in and just having that last bear and being like I can't I can't do this anymore and
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and and he he speaks of other you know he had other people around him that had that had died or something bad had
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happened to and he just sort of realized that the it yeah but as you would know and I know very well we will have those
00:17:03
second ship moments and then for a week later you might be good and then you're
00:17:07
like oh it's a sunny day yeah so you crack into it again to make that commitment and stick
00:17:13
with it for four decades or whatever is incredible but but he by he is he was an
00:17:18
alcoholic like he was his life was unring and he drunk so much all the time so it was destroying his life um not
00:17:30
just not just once a not just on a Sunday afternoon down at swashi or this was we can't be too judgmental Miss 11
00:17:37
bottles of gin during lockdown yes no that's true yeah and you know like he he
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is always aware of cuz I have an addictive personality right so I'm always aware of that as well 100% in ter
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in terms of I reckon yeah that lockdown changed added you know drinking patterns
00:17:57
that are not healthy you you had your reasons you we'll get to that okay I'm
00:18:01
just I'm just playing with you and then um you were conce so they got back together and you were conceived in
00:18:07
Singapore on a on the way to do they have a one like a night's accommodation
00:18:11
or was it like an airport airport toilet do you know what I actually haven't
00:18:16
asked them that I was the stop it's a key piece of information I I to be fair
00:18:20
I have well actually no because the yarn always was that I was conceived in barley but then I think they were like
00:18:27
doing the mess and no it was I I I I look I you can you can ask if you like I don't entirely need to know the
00:18:35
intricacies of seed re Arrangement I'm very grateful for seed Arrangement cuz
00:18:40
I'm here yeah but I've got suppl supplementary questions like do they have a night at the marina SS which is a
00:18:46
beautiful hotel or was it a 4-Hour stopover and it was like an airplane toilet was it actually midair the year
00:18:53
was 1985 that that it must have happened soar Marina Marina sand is there look look I yeah key piece of information I
00:19:02
can't give you I'm sorry yeah so then um I didn't realize your appearance um
00:19:07
split up so late in the pieace so that they only split up like eight years ago 2016 yeah yeah yeah why why they just
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outgrow each other or I think you know not wanting to speak for either of them or or or sort of but
00:19:23
also it's it is something that we talk about but um I think their lives just got a bit different in
00:19:31
terms of where they both wanted to be but that also stopped talking to each other in that kind of way where with in
00:19:41
the way that they were always so good at doing that they were they were good friends they were a good team and a few
00:19:49
pretty stressful things in their lives I think also contributed to it like um Mom
00:19:58
there the yeah he went through bladder cancer um and then he finished work and so bear in mind as well mu had always he
00:20:08
had always worked on the on the adura the the inter Islander Fury pretty much almost as long as I was alive and but he
00:20:17
always worked on on ships and so a lot of his half of his life was not at home and so then I think when when he stopped
00:20:26
working and went through the cancer and then mom got ceremoniously sacked by the
00:20:30
government when she was on environment canbury so they went from like two jobs to nothing and so there was Financial
00:20:38
strain and and a you know just big and the cancer and these big stresses which again I you know it's not from my point
00:20:49
of view in terms of I don't think they ever fell out of love it just they just
00:20:53
stopped talking and and and stop being teammates um but in saying that um I think that's a really really tough
00:21:02
decision to make at that age because you know they when when you're that when you're
00:21:08
in like Mom was in her 60s early 60s dad was in his 70s when you split uh at that
00:21:15
age you know you think about not only the emotional ramifications but it you know hard financially when every you
00:21:22
know you get half and you get half and it's not a massive amount so I actually
00:21:27
I dare say that there probably a lot of marriages out there that stay together probably because that the thought of
00:21:33
that alone is is hard to do that I'd agree with that also because you you know you're old you're like H I'll just
00:21:39
I'll just wait it out I can't stand the S of him but I'll just I you know you're
00:21:43
how long 20 years that be ick yeah and so but I I really as as as hard as it was and it was it was hard cuz I guess
00:21:53
we were like you know me and AJ were adults and we we we've they had been there as this amazing unit for us and it
00:22:00
was like oh come on guys really but ultimately what a brave decision to in the end identify that they were living
00:22:09
two different lives and that it wasn't going to work absolutely yeah the path of
00:22:16
least resistance would be just to stay together and you know carry on being like mildly unhappy I guess yeah um yeah
00:22:23
but I like I I've never met your dad so I don't know much about him but I you
00:22:27
took he was up here the other week you took to the Warriors so that looks like a close relationship and your mom
00:22:31
incredibly close relationship you live together yeah I I think I there's not a
00:22:37
day that goes by that I'm not so you know overwhelmingly grateful for those two
00:22:47
and you know sure I live in a different city to M now but like that guy has just
00:22:54
been been absolutely in love with me since the day I was born and you know we always joke I could do no wrong it's
00:23:02
pretty pretty accurate the truth you know um and and and what I love about muz is that he is he's like one of the
00:23:11
OG like he is such a feminist he's probably more feminist than I am and he's he's got a really
00:23:18
beautiful social conscience and he gets [ __ ] like he's he you know he's not I mean what is he 80
00:23:28
he'll be 82 this year he you know he he's he's something else he's passionate
00:23:34
about music like he's you could ask him anything about music from the 50s and
00:23:38
the 60s he you know he'd call himself he's an old bodgy you loves Elvis and but he you know he'll often
00:23:46
joke and be like when are you when are you sheers or when are you ladies going to realize that the root of all fuckups
00:23:53
in this world is because of us when are you going to when are you going to sort that out you know and and and I'm like
00:23:59
you know you said it not me you know and so he's he's he's probably you know
00:24:05
before the term was bastardized dad was you'd probably say was a woke woke old
00:24:09
dude cuz he he he believes in social justice and he's he's fantastic so I
00:24:15
I've been very lucky to be raised by that and the values that he grew up with
00:24:20
with his family um and so we you know we have you know the Warriors and yeah he's
00:24:27
just he loves Warriors we we chat on the phone all the time and debrief and who will you know he will often vent his
00:24:37
political frustrations and I'm like all right M you know sometimes I'll wind
00:24:40
them up deliberately um but yeah great great discussions with him yeah I can see I can see that um with that
00:24:46
description I can see that part of um him and you yeah um you loves loves loves a cause loves a passionate cause
00:24:54
but also I can see a lot of your lot of your M and you as well like um yeah so she she had the the record at the time
00:24:59
for swimming the [ __ ] straight oldest woman to swim the [ __ ] straight she she
00:25:02
was 40 yeah so this happened when you were 10 yes 10 and and I and I suppose I think um if you see when you're a kid if
00:25:09
you see your mom do something amazing like that it makes you realize that you can you can do amazing things too I
00:25:13
don't know it makes the things that would otherwise seem impossible seem possible and I wonder if that's where
00:25:18
you get your toughness from well it's funny isn't it cuz she um she was a good
00:25:22
swimmer and and a good surf Lifesaver and um she would she would do all of that stuff competitively but it was it was
00:25:31
funny cuz she I think I was I was about 6 months old when she did her first Coast to Coast so that was kind of her
00:25:39
first dabble into endurance uh events and so I was a little kid when she was pumping out Iron
00:25:46
Man like doing an Iron Man um and so I mean I don't I don't have lots of
00:25:52
memories of that but like what a legend and and she yeah she so the actual first
00:25:59
time she swam part of the [ __ ] STP she was 16 so she she paced for a guy called
00:26:05
Perry cam camon who I believe might have been the first guy to go north to south
00:26:10
or you know very early days so she paced with him and so she swam a good chunk of
00:26:16
it back then and always said to herself you know I must go back and do that and then her and she turned 40 so her
00:26:24
birthday is in September she turned 40 her and her best mate Russell for drun a bottle of whiskey and we're like it's
00:26:31
time and so yeah it was March not the same night though no no that would that I don't know if that would work would it
00:26:38
but yeah she so then yeah March the following year she swam the thing and and which is it's nuts by the way is it
00:26:45
nut what is it like 20 to 30ks depending on the roof yeah the the sh like if you
00:26:50
were which you couldn't I don't think you know the shortest to shortest is 21
00:26:54
right but I think she did 29 or 30 something yeah like way over like a 10 hour swim it's crazy yeah I know she was
00:27:02
10 hours 52 in the water finished in the dark like that that's crazy and you fly
00:27:08
over it or you or you're on the in Islander and you're like that is [ __ ]
00:27:14
ginormous that is crazy you know yeah it's B fling yeah you make the joke in
00:27:18
there that your dad um Jud was roll on the inter island he he crossed the coook straight many times yes yes hundreds of
00:27:24
times and actually he he did and but he also rode he was the Sur Lifesaver as well and he was in the one of the boat
00:27:30
Crews for North Beach and they actually rode across the Cook Strait one year as well that was those classic like I think
00:27:37
that was in the 70s cuz they had those massive handlebar mustache I don't know
00:27:41
if they rode actually that's another key I don't know if they rode over on their
00:27:43
speed in their Speedos that would be a good story wouldn't it imagine rowing
00:27:48
across the Cook Street in your Budgy Smugglers that would be amazing oh oh so just that just triggered a thought um I
00:27:55
caught up with a M of mine over the weekend who used to work with you and said oh he said if you get on to talking
00:28:00
about her love life ask her about the guy the guy that she was seeing for a couple of months that used to wear
00:28:03
Speedos around the house all the time no he said you were dating some guy and they're just like you were fling
00:28:10
with some other girls and this guy would just like rock around the house in Speedos wait is this Andy has he has he
00:28:17
got two stories merged maybe he does maybe there's nothing used to rock no I know I know
00:28:23
that I'm thinking about the time that if he's talking about the time that we
00:28:27
lived at home Street was there a guy that we lived with that was in Speedos my love I don't
00:28:34
I I don't have that many reging dating stories I feel a story there it would
00:28:39
come to you I mean I you know grew up doing surfly savings so there was lots of speedos in my life but no I can't I
00:28:45
can't remember that I can't place that um sounds like your mom was your mom was
00:28:49
um quite was and and still is quite quite tough on you and the respect that if you're bitching about your health
00:28:55
issues she's like oh you going on about that sort of she's you can see what
00:29:01
where where your sort of um toughness comes from eh comes from the way you were raised and I suppose also the
00:29:07
genetic thing as well yeah I think um she is so tough like she is just made of like you know I even watched when I took
00:29:17
her for her first ice bath right which they're quite intense well the first time you do it your
00:29:24
hyperventilated she smashed out two minutes and then the second time she got in she just did three and a half minutes
00:29:30
and and she's going but she but she's just like so tough do you know what though I I feel
00:29:41
like I feel like she's she's allowed herself a softer side in more recent
00:29:46
years and I but I always joke with her because when I was about 11 I was at waku primary and and because we always
00:29:54
take used to take the piss out of her cuz she'd she's the she is the kind of
00:29:57
like like walk it off it's that walk it off frame of mine right so I remember I
00:30:02
was at I was at primary school we were running around I was running someone was chasing me there was a hula hoop on the
00:30:09
concrete and my foot touched the hula hoop and I slipped and I landed on my side and unbeknown to me at the time my
00:30:18
pelvis went and so it hurt as you can imagine so I'm on tears and all that and they
00:30:24
ring mom to come pick me up and she comes to pick me up and and I'm like sort of struggling to walk at this point
00:30:31
and she she like get in the car get in the car get in the car you know gets me home I'm
00:30:37
like you'll be fine we'll just get some ice I was like I don't know where where
00:30:41
am I icing she get legs up legs up and then she's like look I've got to go out
00:30:47
so she had to go out I couldn't walk dad gets home and he's like oh for fact's
00:30:53
sake Joe she's clearly in a lot of pain right and because he's he's got the rule
00:30:58
is's the soft and yeah yeah so they took me into the hospital sure enough i'
00:31:01
fractured my pelvis so we always say that like whenever she says walk it off it's like now do we just want to think
00:31:09
about that should we just assess that so she yeah she is tough she has instilled
00:31:14
toughness in me um and I think a element of that probably generational too isn't
00:31:19
it that kind of they just they just triggered a story about um my mom so I I only know this through family but I was
00:31:26
two her at the time my older sister was four and she fell off a stool and had a sore arm and she wouldn't stop crying so
00:31:32
Mom ended up giving her I don't even know if I can say this anymore but what's called a Chinese B yeah on the
00:31:38
and it turns out then Auntie Robin came around who's a nurse and she was like oh
00:31:41
we should probably get some get this checked and turned out mom mom gave Bridget like a Chinese burn on her
00:31:46
broken wrist oh my God yeah they just sort of is that like just toughen up mentality but I I think that Mom doesn't
00:31:57
necessarily like she is I I I I almost think sometimes she's too much of that on
00:32:03
herself but I think she really like her her caring nature to everyone is is unreal and and just amazing but I I do
00:32:13
like I actually like sometimes I can be a bit like dramatic or a bit sensitive cuz I am that as well but I like that I
00:32:21
I like that kind of I think it's for me anyway that kind of like no [ __ ] approach I think has absolutely has its
00:32:31
place and and You' you've got it like personality wise but also physicality
00:32:35
wise it's like you've done the Kepler challenge twice which is a 60k mountain
00:32:38
run which is no joke um you know you you you piss out marathons like that no big
00:32:44
they're no big deal and you know you have this this physical and mental toughness to you and and I think that
00:32:49
yeah that that I am grateful that I I have I've watched her do all of her amazing things and but the similarity I
00:32:56
love is that I kind of have almost fallen in love with them in the same age bracket that she did you know and I
00:33:02
think the our our bodies are pretty amazing things and I would I would say that as a woman I I don't know like we
00:33:12
are so damn hard on ourselves we you know there's always that kind of running
00:33:18
joke that when you're you know 15 you're unhappy with your body and then five
00:33:24
years later you look at a photo back and you're like you looked amazing and when
00:33:27
when you're 25 and you look at a photo when you were 20 you look you're like
00:33:31
you look amazing and it goes on and on and on right and until you're like trying to be like mate you know sort
00:33:38
sort your brain out like you're not defined by that but also you look [ __ ] great then now and so I think
00:33:46
what I'm trying to get to to peace with and I I dare say I dare say you'll never
00:33:52
land at full piece but trying to actually appreciate what I can do physically and that that is my body and
00:34:00
you know and my mind doing that um is something that particularly training for the
00:34:07
marathon that we're we're both embarking on I I think I'm like embracing it more
00:34:14
but It's Tricky it is tricky to you can you can think that you're tough and all that but if you're mean on
00:34:20
your mean on your body or mean on mean on your body image it just seems to be a bit of a waste of time but I think that
00:34:26
that also was that kind of cycle of growing up with with that being something that we all think is so
00:34:30
important that went off on quite a tangent but no no it's it's very true
00:34:34
like the the weekend just gone you and I went out and we ran 31 32 km and it's
00:34:39
like I was standing in the shower after that thinking [ __ ] that's cool that's a
00:34:43
we just yeah we just did a massive massive run yeah like it was no big deal and it's a privilege right we're lucky
00:34:49
that AB we really lucky that we can do that and so yeah I often often think that that kind of that toughness
00:34:58
you that toughness can sometimes make you a bit too hard on yourself I think like you sort of yeah I think that you
00:35:05
need to try and balance that out and go yeah we just ran 31k like you're awesome
00:35:11
like that is awesome most people don't do that like give yourself a bloody fed
00:35:16
on the bed you know absolutely there there is a little bit of that in in your book there there's bits where you talk
00:35:21
about how proud you are of yourself and that that made me uh proud of you reading that I think that's really cool
00:35:27
it's funny as we we we don't like to we're we're a bunch of people us new
00:35:32
zealanders where we've we're trying to navigate celebrating success but we are
00:35:37
aware of tall poppy syndrome and and also to a degree when you're out on your
00:35:42
own and striving for something there's impostor syndrome as well that that comes into play and so
00:35:51
you you you don't want to do it in a way cuz ultimately as well it's that balance
00:35:57
of also being extremely aware of um of your privilege and how lucky you are that you have been
00:36:05
raised by wonderful parents who've taught you exceptional values who put importance in your education who
00:36:12
supported you through everything that you've done and that you have you have
00:36:17
lived a life that you are very privileged and very you know like not saying I haven't worked hard but I I
00:36:23
like to I like to be aware o of of that side of it as well But ultimately being proud of being uh I
00:36:32
guess a 38- year old woman who is is doing it all you know I'm a team of one
00:36:37
and and you I've got my wonderful family and friends but ultimately like you know
00:36:43
you're the I'm the driving force behind my own brand and it's really challenging
00:36:49
so I think it's it's more about spending time reflecting I think and I think I
00:36:56
talked about that in the book and what ended up happening last year which I think was a culmination of you know
00:37:03
nearly four years of you know being made redundant and then figuring out who you
00:37:09
are and what what the next few years are going to look like is that you're so I I
00:37:14
was so um just like dying to be successful and and like thinking I have to prove everything and successful at
00:37:26
everything and so so you don't um stop and smell the roses that you know that's
00:37:32
a great old saying that is actually really really important is that you just go from as self-employed you just go oh
00:37:40
cool great I've written a book right what's the next thing I've got to do
00:37:43
right okay we've done that we've had a great year what what's what's the next
00:37:46
year look like where do we want to be with the podcast okay we're running this
00:37:49
Marathon you know like you're just going oh I finished that TV show right what's
00:37:53
the next thing I need to do what should I and so it's it becomes this kind of
00:37:57
like cycle of just you're never stopping to reflect on the last thing you did at
00:38:01
all and that's what I think most people need to do and it doesn't even need to
00:38:06
be it doesn't even need to be big things it's like I went for a great walk with
00:38:10
my mates today and that was so good or I went and had a sauner and I sweeted out
00:38:16
and just had an hour to myself you know like we just churn churn and churn and churn and so and I I think a lot of that
00:38:25
on the independent journey is because you you're fearful where the next dollar
00:38:28
is going to come from So you you're reluctant to say no to opportunities but
00:38:32
um my my partner Ash who you know like she she did a 4 and a2k run around the park yesterday and she was just buzzing
00:38:38
after that she's like I'm so proud of myself and it um makes me feel sad when
00:38:42
she does that because for me to have the same level of self-pride I I need to go
00:38:47
out on a 30k run with you yeah you know and I wish I wish I had that level where
00:38:52
it's like um you know little things could give me that sort of yeah but I think you cuz you're quite hard on on
00:38:57
yourself aren't you well I think I think yeah well you are as well well you are
00:39:02
too but no it's I guess it's that kind of like highly functional highly competitive within
00:39:09
yourself high expectations it it's hard to know like when to when to switch that off you know
00:39:18
but I I reckon now I'm I'm getting way better at it like I just like I I reckon
00:39:23
I'm getting just I don't know like [ __ ] I love a good lie on the LIE on the
00:39:28
couch with a track pant on and just slothing out and I and I love days where I don't have to say a word you know that
00:39:35
was never used to I used to be like I'm [ __ ] so busy and woo look at me go
00:39:40
you know like oh my gosh I've got to go to this and oh and now it's like yuck
00:39:45
man you know like get home get home put the trackpants on absolutely sloth out I
00:39:54
love it I love it so much good well you deserve it hey when you work hard you you deserve that sort of reset um we
00:40:02
we'll get to how you became an independent um it's it's a [ __ ] horrible story but you did a lot of cool
00:40:07
stuff beforehand so so you're at school you you always wanted to be a journalist
00:40:12
then U but then you dabble in the Army for a little bit I feel like that comes that comes back to your mom as well like
00:40:17
you just having this thirst for doing hard stuff yeah yeah well the the Army was random though cuz it was like so
00:40:24
some recruitments came hot dudes hot guys yeah hot army guys came to Rango High School I was like oh what's going
00:40:31
on here and they were like yeah we're having a week you know they were having
00:40:34
a week in at buron military camp where you could go and experience it and I was like oh that sounds fun July school
00:40:41
holidays and so I went along to that I had not like I had no there was nothing remotely about me that had even thought
00:40:50
ever about the Army and even when I went to the thing I was like oh this is fun you know and it was like I remember it
00:40:57
was a exactly like the movies just getting you were just like oh we're getting yelled at you know um this is
00:41:02
great and then you then you go to Radio and you got even more yelling yeah yeah and then and then you know you were
00:41:08
crawling through the mud and all that like this is [ __ ] great and then but then they were like we we think you'd be
00:41:14
great so I was like okay and so I I went to the went to the next stage which is going to like be trying and be selected
00:41:22
as an officer Cadet to go to officer Cadet School in Wu so I went to the the next stage of that which was at trenum
00:41:31
and then I got into that and then I got in and then it was like [ __ ] so instead
00:41:34
of having one last kind of Summer before uni I went to Wu for all of January and
00:41:41
all of February and did my basic training and it was crazy yeah the um you you talk in the book about how wodu
00:41:48
is like your Roman Empire how often do you think about wodu now is it like daily I Reon I think about the at my
00:41:53
time in the Army it would definitely be a Roman Empire a there's so many parts
00:41:59
of your experience in the army that like transferred a life and like what one thing I noticed when when we meet for a
00:42:09
run you're never late yeah I hate being late and and if I'm late I'm if if I'm
00:42:15
late I actually I I get Flappy if I'm if I'm like and then I'll R I'm like God guys
00:42:24
sorry I'm so [ __ ] sorry I'm actually going to be about 3 minutes late and I'm
00:42:27
so sorry like I I lose I lose my mind um and so I don't like being late um I mean
00:42:34
this is I always my my room is always squared away that's a sort of an army turn like I I I'm someone that pretty
00:42:43
much always has my [ __ ] squared away always wake up make the bed bang it's
00:42:48
first first thing I do and you had to do that when you were in the arm it was like up you got made your bed out to the
00:42:54
shower so I don't I don't tend to I mean I I like I I think it's like everything has its place right and
00:43:03
I don't like to [ __ ] around um so even like I'm like right even if I am slothing out on the couch
00:43:10
it's like right how long have I got here oh yeah I'm going to 1400 hours yeah but then you know so it so
00:43:17
and it just it just teaches you good self-discipline you know just to be yeah on time um I guess no that's a lie I was
00:43:26
going to say say presentable I was like that's not always true um but just being
00:43:31
a person that has your [ __ ] sorted um you really had to learn you had to have everything sorted in there
00:43:38
you know and that was from your socks to your polish on your boots to you know um
00:43:44
making sure that you were marching properly to you know being out in the field and looking out looking out for
00:43:50
your section mates and stuff like that so it was it was amaz amazing experience and gosh you know why do yeah it's such
00:43:58
a it's such a fascinating place it just you know people drive on that you know
00:44:04
the the desert road and I don't think many people think too much of it just like gosh look at this would you but I
00:44:12
go and I'm like I remember when we went on the uni MOG 2 hours that way and then
00:44:17
we got out of the unimogs and the pissing rain and we started to dig our holes and in the rain and we were C
00:44:23
crying and oh it's sucked you know and like yeah you just it's a massive
00:44:28
massive piece of land that that we have that I have spent a lot of time on so I do think about it a lot it's it's quite
00:44:34
a quite a Jack the position between um military life and the Pampered media life yeah yeah it's very very different
00:44:42
you know you're dealing with um I suppose the most unprecipitated was at radio live and so
00:44:58
that was like this Plucky little battler of a radio station that was in the basement of all the other like it
00:45:05
literally had the all the other stations you know actually that was in um the brick building on ponsonby road remember
00:45:13
that was where morm and and the breeze were and you guys had were in the back entrance and it used to like you know
00:45:22
leak and stuff and it was a small team and actually there was wasn't actually
00:45:27
room for a great deal of egos to be honest in that first you know like it was like we mucked in you know um but
00:45:35
yeah it is a it's a very very different life because no one is yeah you you you
00:45:42
are all equal in the Army there's no there's no Behavior you you you can't
00:45:51
argue your way out of anything you know like rules are rules so um yeah it's not
00:45:57
a just like you know I like to think that talking is is one of my strengths and commanding a room but if it's not my
00:46:03
place to [ __ ] command the room it's not my place to command the room at least you want to do some extra PRI 100%
00:46:09
100% you are you are yeah oh gosh yeah it's so yeah there is no Divas or shining stars in the Army so was it at
00:46:19
radio live where you you did your your first interview with Dan and Richie was that R life yeah well actually that was
00:46:25
um I was I was at University then so I was in fourth year doing journalism at um Canterbury oh so you're like a train
00:46:33
knee oh my God yeah and so I had just started working with I just this was how I got got in CU you I I started working
00:46:42
at radio works doing like cooking sausages which you know we all loved cooking s sausages at Harvey Norman or
00:46:51
browny's Mattress Direct um and you know it would be a Saturday and a Sunday and
00:46:56
you'd be hung over us [ __ ] by the way how how no listener has ever died of
00:47:01
food poisoning except well I mean it's Sizzlers can you die a I think I'm
00:47:05
pretty sure they pre-cooked within an inch of their life aren't they yeah but
00:47:09
whenever you get like a radio station barbecue out of the lock up there's cockroach true oh true I didn't think of
00:47:14
that I was just thinking of the sausages here it's never cleaned properly someone's being paid $18 an hour they're
00:47:19
not cleaning the barbecue after the activation no no you're right and so yeah so that was sort of like how I
00:47:25
started getting into the you know actually getting a foot into the door of the of the building and then I and then
00:47:30
I struck up a you know a conversation with um Matthew py who was the Christ Church journalist for radio live and so
00:47:38
I would just go along to things with him or just like piss to him and then I remember just doing enough of that and
00:47:43
just seeing how he used to write stories and file voice reports and that to the point where he was going away for a week
00:47:50
and they were like do you want to fill in I was like yeah and so I did and then I remember one of the days was the All
00:47:57
Blacks were at the Heritage Hotel in Christ and could I go to the could I go to the press conference and that and it
00:48:04
was like oh my God yes and I was like oh my God what am I going to wear like never mind like what am I wearing what
00:48:11
are we wearing and and so yeah and I and that was when that was like Peak Richie
00:48:16
and Dan you know and I just remember just being so like my pets were just my I had sweat dropping down my back I was
00:48:26
just so sweaty and overwhelmed but just desperately trying to just be demure you
00:48:34
know how to imagine because you you seem so comfortable were you not you're not
00:48:38
big then you were just like crippled with fear or you just wanted to do a good job and I think no I wasn't
00:48:44
crippled with fear I was just were you like acting as a journalist like what would a journalist acting you know you
00:48:50
weren't being bro Kane you were just being like what would a what would a good journalist do in this situation I
00:48:54
think in the early days you and well in that in that circumstance I think I felt
00:49:00
like that's a very malale dominated space as well I can't I do not remember
00:49:05
if there was another woman journalist there but I'm 99.9% positive there wasn't and I just think I felt
00:49:12
overwhelmed like I not not that I would I mean to be fair if you go to like no it's a bit different now but you they're
00:49:20
intimidating places um male sport press conferences you know there's a lot of
00:49:25
swinging dicks around like wanting to out ask the most important question so they're actually they can be kind of
00:49:32
lame places at the best of times Al so it wasn't like a one-on-one was it like
00:49:36
a oh no I did have one-on ones but I just was like it's the environment you're talking about it's a lion's den
00:49:42
it's awful you know and so I mean think I mean I I couldn't give a [ __ ] like if
00:49:48
I went to something now on the or even when I was working on breakfast and things like when I worked on breakfast
00:49:53
and even Stephen Shar I had to go and be the dick that ask the silly questions cuz we were being wacky and or like you
00:50:00
know being funny so so you had to learn pretty much to not judge the stink eye that some of those senior men presenters
00:50:10
might give you um I when I was at the edge we'd have to go along to some of those things and you'd have your
00:50:16
different objectives like we'd want to get something F like a funny question
00:50:20
and answer out yeah you'd put your hand up you'd ask a silly question um and all
00:50:25
these like reports like um you know people have been doing it for 30 years that you could hear them
00:50:31
like yeah under their breath yeah because you're not asking a quick question about the rotation selection
00:50:37
policy for the next test or whatever yeah and I think but do you know what I mean I think A lot's changed now CU
00:50:42
you've got wonderful um color injection by the likes of you know Crowd Goes Wild
00:50:49
for instance so so actually that that all now personality based reporting has its place which is great and and I like
00:50:57
to think that um we were part of that in the early days of seven sharp and as much as seven
00:51:03
sharp got an absolute flogging that was a turning point in terms of of instead of just being let's
00:51:13
just report the news or let's just stand and do a piece to camera it was about
00:51:19
telling a story in a different way and the person the reporter being able to show their personality with the talent
00:51:30
so so that has and and I'm not saying it was just seven shot but I but I think
00:51:35
that that and and as I say like Crowd Goes Wild and places like that have paid the way for that to be um more than
00:51:44
normal now you know what I me retrained expectations yeah okay since we're on
00:51:47
there let's talk about seven sh for a bit so um yes so seven shops still on N
00:51:52
it's with um Jeremy and Hillary yeah um when when you started like previous to
00:51:57
that had been like the mark sainsbury show whatever it was called close yeah and then uh and then yeah seven shout
00:52:04
came along so the main so you were sort of out and about and it was I was out and about it was Greg rest in peace um
00:52:11
Jesse Mulligan Alis Moore yeah yeah and so what the project ended up sort of becoming was what sort of you guys did
00:52:19
in the beginning but I think again this is when TV was still very big like compared to what it is now I think
00:52:25
people just hadn't seen something like this before like a lighthearted sort of
00:52:29
light-hearted current affairs at seven this is the thing right you know that was when I guess if you think back to
00:52:38
then that was probably almost a real pressure point of when the the hunger to maintain those ratings of an era that we
00:52:50
were actually probably not fully aware at the time growing out of was it was the pressure to win that audience and
00:52:59
the pressure to hold on to people um was something that was hugely being fought over right and
00:53:10
so TV andz at the time were looking at ways to I guess yeah freshen up what was happening at 7:00 and I think that um
00:53:21
like closeup you know and remember what was before closeup homes you know like so you'd had these these massive like
00:53:30
Flagship shows that had been on for a long time um but there was an there was an appetite within within to to sort of
00:53:40
change that I guess one of the arguments is is do people want 90 minutes of hard
00:53:47
news at the end of the day and the answer today is no they absolutely do not um and so the idea being let's give
00:53:55
them something that's you you know at 7:00 maybe they're still cooking dinner
00:53:58
for the kids maybe they're you know maybe they're cooking for themselves
00:54:01
with a glass of wine and it's something that's just easier to to digest you know
00:54:07
um but gosh we coped a we we just that was the first time I reckon everyone's
00:54:12
including the O like you know most people in the media industry I reckon prior to them weren't too like everyone
00:54:18
sort of didn't say much about each other everyone just sort of stayed out of each
00:54:21
other's way that was open slather everyone had an opinion on it you know about that show and working on it was
00:54:29
like quite wild e cuz you were like oh my God I work on the most hated show in New Zealand right now was it that I
00:54:35
forgot about I remember the show but I I forgot any of the sort of I know it didn't last all that long um but yeah
00:54:42
was it where were we at with social media at this point Facebook yes Twitter right oh okay let say no more what was
00:54:49
it that bad was it that severe yeah and and and you had sort of the goofball roll in a way like you were you were
00:54:55
doing a stick yeah and I I I don't I don't actually know yeah it was it was I
00:55:00
mean the presenters coped up hiding as well because whether the whether their on air
00:55:07
chemistry was what was right whether the writing who was you know like there was
00:55:12
always criticism about the writing or the the way that the jokes were being put together with the versus the stories
00:55:18
that were being shared was all everything everything everyone had a criticism about everything
00:55:24
um but I I I look back and I go yeah I I think we we were trying too hard I I definitely think it was like and
00:55:34
especially when you have a whole you have a bunch of people that haven't done
00:55:38
that before so you know you're putting a group of people that are from news backgrounds into that but you we did we
00:55:47
and that was when that was you're right there was like Facebook Twitter you did
00:55:50
read everything you did read everything you know so um but you know it it's yeah
00:55:57
it's a it's a show that has Evol certainly you know evolved and then there's been you know many different
00:56:04
Changers and presenters with you know even remember when Mike and Mike hosking and Tony Street were the presenters you
00:56:09
know it's sort of like become this thing and gosh we know that the the the landscape of of mainstream media is
00:56:19
so crazy at the moment that I don't even know if you could even I don't even know
00:56:24
what will be around in the next 5 years like it's Wild Well the the yeah the
00:56:27
thing is it just doesn't have that key factor anymore you you know you could
00:56:31
put it that that show on excuse me now and it's just not the the the mess audience to care but but you you talk in
00:56:38
your book about um you've got a saying um called pit of despair uh which is like your your LS in life like mentally
00:56:44
and physically was was that a p topar do you know it's not no it was hard I'll
00:56:49
tell you what it's hard I I was my first on air role and uh like being in front of the camera
00:56:57
and a big opportunity yeah and I was down in Christ Church and I was in the Christ Church Newsroom um but the this
00:57:06
is two years after the February Quake so the crush Newsroom at that time was you
00:57:11
know a makeshift office over in Addington and so I was extremely grateful that I had we worked with that
00:57:17
amazing Christ Church Newsroom but I was on my own and a essentially a a a junior
00:57:24
when it came to television reporting and I just had no support and that was really hard and
00:57:35
um so I had support within The Newsroom but I didn't have I didn't have the
00:57:40
support from my superiors um so it was it was hard and you were you know you just sort of felt like you were on your
00:57:47
own and you also felt like you were set up to fail at times um but ultimately then you sort of you just went oh well
00:57:55
okay um I can't get a hold of so and so can't get this story approved I'll just
00:58:00
go and do it anyway you know like so there was there was an element of that but I had heaps of fun though like you
00:58:07
know it got to spoon Richie MC spoon Richie mcco he spooned you technically he did he spooned me on the mountain on
00:58:13
a mountain in a sleeping bag in a sleeping bag years before Jimma yes exactly and then and then I got to meet
00:58:20
Bruno Mars that year what id Sheeran as well ID Sheeran um you know and so I just I think that that was like a year
00:58:29
that I learned a lot in a in a way that possibly yeah like pushed into a really difficult
00:58:37
position but like toughened me up you know which I think you needed to be you know you needed to be to be in that
00:58:46
industry you've got to be tough and I think that I think that in in two ways
00:58:52
it made me tough it made me I believe cynical enough like I was you know I had this sense of of of the bigger picture
00:59:01
of of the media but it was a you know probably a good level of that and it was probably good that that got in there
00:59:06
right in that relatively early in that in that sort of time at TV andz but it kind of been like you look
00:59:13
back now and you can take you know there good memories from it you know like like
00:59:17
Richie and Bruno and ID um but also like bad memories as well and it must have been really tough at the time like like
00:59:23
were you what did that look like were you going home and crying at the end of the day or I was just it was just like
00:59:28
you just you mad at the criticism or sad oh you're just frustrated you know and I
00:59:34
actually think what it did was it really uh really knocked knocked my confidence
00:59:40
so when you felt like you didn't have support you didn't know whether what you
00:59:43
were doing was good bad like average you know and you were putting yourself out there as well and just I don't know I I
00:59:54
feel like one of the things that I I think I talk about it in in there um it's a thing like lucky I'm doing an
01:00:02
audio lucky I'm doing an audio book so I remember everything I talk about but
01:00:06
actually one of the things that I think that actually was quite a common feeling within my time in
01:00:15
most of the media organizations that I worked in is that I never quite felt like I was good enough either actually
01:00:22
that is in the book yeah this um this made me sad when I was reading it yeah yeah this is Paige and um CU I know you
01:00:28
pretty well but um yeah I suppose I've never I don't know CU we're going out on
01:00:32
runs I've never SE I've never seen that vulnerable side of you that's the bit I
01:00:37
highlighted um my confidence had been knocked massively for for my whole career I had this lingering toxic
01:00:43
feeling that I was not anyone's favorite yeah it's [ __ ] heartbreaking yeah
01:00:47
it's sad um anyone's favorite believing that people liked me enough but no one
01:00:52
really thinks I'm the best of the best it left me feeling so vulnerable like
01:00:56
any gig could be taken away at any moment my insecurities are at odds with the Public Image that I project the
01:01:01
truth is I often haven't I often haven't felt that confident myself you see other
01:01:06
people getting the opportunities you've missed out on and it's hard not to feel
01:01:09
um like something about you isn't good enough yeah it's bloody sad and I I
01:01:15
think it's real honest though yeah yeah how do you feel hearing that bad well I I I I I can feel it I I can
01:01:25
feel it because I and and let me be really really clear I like I have loved all my
01:01:32
jobs um and I like I've my my memories are you know I always go to positives as
01:01:41
well but when you're actually like digging into your emotions and and I think sometimes when you're you know
01:01:48
when I'm out on this solo path and you're trying to I guess reason with yourself or or like ask yourself why do
01:01:58
you feel this way or why do you always think you have to do this and then do that or or be the best at this or why
01:02:04
are you worried about what other people are thinking and I think it comes back to that I think it comes back to
01:02:11
um there being always that competitive person in me but particularly in my TV career I always felt like because
01:02:26
and I I say this in a way that's I'm not just your I'm not your normal and I
01:02:34
that's a bad way to describe this but like I'm not safe I'm not nice I'm not
01:02:43
skinny I'm not this and so I'm not like I'm bit rough around the edges you know
01:02:50
bit vulgar but but but you know but all these all these things that you weren't
01:02:57
really well none of the none of the main people at the time were allowed to be there yeah I think more so with women as
01:03:04
well the top guys we'll get to Paul Holmes but yeah polarizing same as Henry
01:03:09
hosking um in terms of like polarizing women here the dupy Allen's probably one
01:03:14
of the only one of the few you can sort of think of really it just wasn't it
01:03:18
wasn't a woman in the media's place you you're supposed to like be pretty yeah
01:03:22
smile be a good girl be the nice well was the like for so many it it was being the nice I mean being the the Glad what
01:03:31
is it bad mad happy and glad so bad mad is the guy you know like the the the villain often where you know you don't
01:03:40
want the villainous woman oh my God but I but I I think that um that is that is also um you know you have you have times
01:03:52
where you feel like [ __ ] because people have made you feel like [ __ ] and there
01:03:58
is an element of toxicity to those workplaces whereby and I I can't speak for it now
01:04:07
but you were in a job that everyone wanted and so you should be grateful to be here you are lucky anyone would want
01:04:17
your you know there are journalists lining up for these jobs so buckle up and you know do your job and do your
01:04:24
best and and and I I sometimes I sometimes liken a relationship a a a job in the media is
01:04:34
sometimes a bit like a it can be quite a um like quite a toxic relationship that
01:04:42
when you're in the thick of it you don't really see it but when you're out of it
01:04:47
and away from it that's when you see it and I had a lot of toxic relationships
01:04:52
in in in my job which which led me to never think that I was the best to never think that I was quite good enough
01:04:59
because because people made you feel that way that doesn't just come out of nothing um and so I hope I hope that
01:05:06
some of that has changed I don't think it has necessarily but I I think that
01:05:11
there is a lot of there's a lot of bad behavior from people that are supposed
01:05:15
to be nurturing people and and teaching people um and looking out for them I I I
01:05:21
don't like that side of it so I've never I I I haven't talked about it as much
01:05:25
like this so openly before but it it it hurts me when when I think about those times and it hurts me to think that
01:05:37
there are people still being treated like [ __ ] in their jobs um cuz that's we
01:05:42
should be past that well all I'm basing this on is um JJ who recently finished
01:05:48
um a 30-year career and um that's how it has been for her um and her recent experience
01:05:56
kind of like um you know you need us we don't need you yeah or you here's the
01:06:01
door if you're not happy and you're you're you're you're actually and and and and that will be
01:06:09
drilled into you that we have made you we have made you because without this big square box or this speaker where
01:06:19
would you be so there's there's almost no like hey you're really talented we're
01:06:25
grateful to have you and and you're helping us make this this product you're
01:06:29
just you're used for the betterment of something else um yeah I don't think
01:06:34
anyone gets out gets out the other side with um a really healthy self-esteem yeah it takes ages takes ages to build
01:06:41
it back up um but look I I want to make it yeah like it it it was there were times it was really really hard but also
01:06:49
[ __ ] I had a good time and I can tell you though as well hand on heart the reason that you get through all of that
01:06:56
like the reason that you can you can um like dust yourself off and go back the next day is the thrill of the job
01:07:06
and the people you work with so up here might be terrible but around you is the best damn family you could possibly have
01:07:15
like everyone is in the trenches with you in those in those jobs and and you can use that sound cuz you've been in
01:07:21
the trenches yeah and so you just like you are you know whether it's the you
01:07:25
know you're you you've been working far too many hours than you should and
01:07:29
you're at the toor warehouse buying a pair of undies and and um and a of pants
01:07:36
because I had to go down to do a breaking news story and I'm like holding up this giant P of undies to the
01:07:42
cameraman Jason Hull like just to embarrass I'm like Jason should I get these ones you know he's like oh my God
01:07:47
you know there's just these like little pockets of just your camaraderie is is
01:07:52
just so what keeps you there just the people you work with yeah cuz it's um it's notoriously poor pay uh for most
01:08:01
people most people in radio like if you're stick around long enough and you're persistent and successful the
01:08:05
money gets insanely good but for most people it's bad but it's like what
01:08:11
attracts those people to the industry this is largely off here roles I'm talking about is is that fun environment
01:08:16
that you're talking about yeah and I think um you know it's been really it's
01:08:21
been really hard as well as as someone that still is is in the media indry but kind of in a different way and and
01:08:28
knowing knowing how good the people are in in those jobs and and you know we've
01:08:34
lost some some amazing people have lost jobs this year last year but like like this year's been horrific in terms of
01:08:43
news Hub and fairgo and Sunday and and there's there's to be more and and I and
01:08:50
what I what I hate um again like because I'm so so grateful for all of those jobs
01:08:57
they were all amazing jobs what I'm sing by as well is the um is the is the change in relationship
01:09:06
between the media and the public that really saddens me and I think obviously that very much started to unravel pretty
01:09:13
quickly during Co and so so I I I look at it and go [ __ ] you know we we are losing so many good journalism
01:09:23
journalists we are losing so so much important content but that so that saddens me but
01:09:30
on the other side as well what saddens me even more is that the the relationship with the public has never
01:09:36
been as bad the trust you made yeah and it just I hate that and I'm really worried about that for the future I'm
01:09:46
worried about um the fourth of State the erosion of the fourth estate but also that just people don't trust the media
01:09:55
anymore I think it's really worrying because with the rise of social media and Ai and things like that who the
01:10:03
[ __ ] going to know what's real and what's not anymore and and yes I'm not
01:10:07
saying that like when I say the media gosh that's you know but there there's
01:10:12
so much there's so much problematic there is so much problematic um wi with with with the media um and
01:10:21
sometimes the media pisses me off because I'm like oh gosh you wonder why people don't trust you but but but
01:10:27
ultimately I go back to all those people that work in there they all want good things for the P they all just want to
01:10:37
do good things by the public otherwise they wouldn't be there yeah so yeah so it's it's sad and it's
01:10:44
worrying and so um I don't know I don't have the answers to that that's just me
01:10:49
just throwing out a a grim a grim reality no nobody does but it's it's just Evol so quickly and but it will
01:10:57
reshape itself and reincarnate into something different but nobody knows how quite how that's going to look I guess
01:11:02
yeah I think you're right I think you're right I think that we're in a point at
01:11:05
the moment aren't we where it's like there's just an oversaturation of
01:11:09
everything everyone's angry at the everyone's angry and you know the the level of distrust is huge
01:11:19
but maybe it will sort itself out you know but what all these people um like at newshub and TV instead of been going
01:11:27
through with these mess redundancies um I suppose the the plus side of that if there is any is they all had each other
01:11:34
so you could see an image of Patty go and Mike McRoberts and Samantha Hayes and 100 of their colleagues all leaving
01:11:41
the TV3 building and walking to the pub around the corner when this happened to you in February 2020 right at the
01:11:48
beginning of the just before the pandemic kicked off you were you were on your [ __ ] own it was you and you and
01:11:54
your co-host Dave yeah um yes unceremoniously sacked after a couple of years that is is that the pet of
01:12:02
dispear was that the pet dispair do you know in in the initially it was just such a shock that
01:12:10
I think the first sort of week or two it was kind of like it was so out of the blue that it was almost comical it was
01:12:18
like God okay but the the pit of despair actually came when cuz at that time even
01:12:27
though there had been some Co cases and stuff overseas no one none no one had any idea what was coming it wasn't until
01:12:35
it was became apparent that like I was also supposed to be on Dancing With the Stars that year um so I was like oh it's
01:12:41
all good like okay that's fine I'm going to lose my job but I'm still going to go
01:12:46
and get to do Dancing with the Stars and then then of course you know like then we go into lockdown and things and then
01:12:54
you just see in those first couple of weeks of lockdown like a whole bunch of like I'm pretty sure radio sport got
01:13:00
guested all the wonderful journals that like bow got gased and it was like holy [ __ ] you know there was pay freezes or
01:13:07
pay cuts and everything and I was like there is no way there's no way I'm going
01:13:13
to get a job anywhere there'll be no jobs to get so probably and then dancing
01:13:17
got canned and I was like Wicked what the [ __ ] am I going to do um you know so
01:13:24
that was probably that was that was why I bought 11 bottles of gin for lockdown why do you go a dozen 11's a really
01:13:30
random number no I think I no truth be told we got six I ran out and then we managed to figure out
01:13:39
there was a person doing booze delivery so it was like 2 two one yeah um yeah the amazing thing about that that awful
01:13:47
thing to go through and the timing couldn't have been any worse but redundancy like that feels really
01:13:50
personal even though it's not so yeah you were doing the hson Christ Church um
01:13:55
they I was working with John on Ben at the edge and the hits had like poached them over um rumor has it in the
01:14:01
industry they were paying them like a a lot of money so they thought we need to like get them on as much markets as
01:14:06
possible so they act some of the local shows so you were just like um Cog and a will yeah collateral damage whatever you
01:14:13
want to whatever you want to call it so it's nothing personal but it's hard not
01:14:16
to take it personally it's funny you say that though that was Allison Moore said
01:14:19
that to me straight away she was sort of my um she's been made she's had a fair
01:14:25
share of redundancies in in pretty public ones too she was like the you you have to nip that in the bud like you
01:14:31
cannot take it personally it is not personal so I I think that was I I think I did that but again that played that
01:14:40
part and just being like and then I you know it's not like they fought for me
01:14:45
for anything else it's not like anyone else went hey we've got a job for you
01:14:50
Brody you know there's none of that yeah which goes back to that um that the book
01:14:56
feel like you're anyone's favorite or anyone's like going into B for you and
01:14:59
that's taken that has taken ages to get over you know like even in that first year of you know you miss out on
01:15:10
things or you're not you know you're you're trying to like it's great cuz
01:15:15
you've you know I got to the point where it's like right you now have the
01:15:18
opportunity to build up your brand build up yourself on your terms which is awesome right that is so fantastic but
01:15:30
with that comes like you know you you see opportunities that you want but you weren't even asked or you didn't even
01:15:37
get to audition or you didn't you know you weren't anything and and and it's
01:15:42
hard not to think I'm I am well look I'm I'm down in Christ Church no one no one
01:15:48
gives a [ __ ] I mean it's so I mean it's so well as me but you you're in such an
01:15:52
an industry that it is driven by ego and is driven by how relevant you are it's
01:15:57
it's you know it is all these things that you you're that you that keep you
01:16:02
going to work every day so when you think that no one wants you you're like right what do I need to do now you know
01:16:08
you start to think about those backup careers which which is absolutely also 100% fine like I've always said to
01:16:18
myself what would you like to do if you're no longer relevant or no one gives a [ __ ] about what you've got to
01:16:23
say anymore or you know you just the jobs dry up like you have to you have to be realistic that that that is a thing
01:16:30
and that's okay too like I'm okay with that yeah but if you've got like 10 15
01:16:34
years however many years invested in this this thing that's where your skill
01:16:37
set is and your value is it is where your skill set and your value is but ultimately some sometimes someone might
01:16:42
just say some the the PE I don't know the wonderful people that listen to my
01:16:47
podcasts and come and hear me speak or you know Watch the watch the shows that I'm going to be on and whatnot might
01:16:53
just go she had nothing you've always got a you always have a shelf life I think but you but in saying
01:17:00
that you will do everything in your power to to you know to extend that shelf life
01:17:08
so that you're like a you know what is it non perishable oh that's good you're you
01:17:14
know you want to be a non-p perishable no one wants to be an avocado no no no one wants to be an avocado no yeah no
01:17:20
one wants to be a carrot that goes just shriveled in the fridge you know you want a can of spaghetti if you you want
01:17:26
to be a bloody tin of tomatoes or or a bag of bloody spiral pasta so okay so February 2020 um you
01:17:36
made redundant uh July 15 2020 what's that bro Kane media limited how good how good yeah so so um I
01:17:46
suppose you sort of accidentally fall into this it sounds like um you're at home in lockdown so you and your mom
01:17:50
start doing like live Facebook interviews or live Instagram interviews yeah yeah the Jo bro show The JO bro
01:17:57
show and yeah you have everyone's locked down so you managed to get some good
01:18:00
people on Lisa carington Joseph Parker so on and so forth and then did that give you the idea to launch kiwi y as a
01:18:07
podcast so we so I me and Caitlyn and Gracie had been doing girls on top when when we were working at nzme and then
01:18:17
when I got made redundant we stepped away and relaunched and rebranded to the girls
01:18:26
uninterrupted and so that was so we so we that we fired that up must have only had a month downtime between being you
01:18:33
know being girls on top inz me and the girls uninterrupted well do do you want to talk you don't talk about the name
01:18:38
change in the book do I not I don't do you don't you maybe I skip that oh but
01:18:43
did did um that Enz me wanted to keep the name or look I think that one we'll
01:18:47
just leave in the documents that were signed okay but yeah okay you you couldn't take the we rebranded we
01:18:56
renamed the podcast started a fresh and it's been um it's it's incredibly
01:19:00
successful like you've got a mass of following you you did Live Events last year and you sell these things out you
01:19:04
guys have done a [ __ ] great job thank you that's incredible so so that's your
01:19:08
first podcast then you and then you launch your second one kiwi and that was um my very dear friend Braden had said
01:19:14
to me because it was like what I've got a bit of time what are we doing what is
01:19:18
if we start broe media what the [ __ ] does that mean like and so in the early days it was like well like he had said
01:19:24
to me you are a really good interviewer and and girls uninterrupted is one particular style of you but you
01:19:33
should do something that showcases your interviewing skills and your rapport with people thus kiwi Yan was born um
01:19:40
and yeah of course in those first like that was all almost all were were via zoom and and things like that but that
01:19:49
was how that one got off the ground and then you're like well I've got two
01:19:52
podcasts now so that's clearly a podcast Network work and then um it was just I
01:19:58
was just trying all sorts of things out like you know um I remember my friend Laura Hayden accidentally bought a bar
01:20:05
leaner on trade me but Click by now but it was in Christ Church so we were just like okay and this was must have been
01:20:14
when we were in level two and I was like let's try and Pitch out this travel
01:20:17
story like let's get your barer up to Oakland you know and let's talk to all
01:20:23
the tourah operators and let's make all this cool content cuz we were trying to
01:20:27
like just figure out ways for me to try and show my showcase myself and my skills without anything behind me to to
01:20:36
elevate that just you all I you know you only had your your your your social media platforms right so yeah so we were
01:20:45
doing things like that so we managed to like convince you know we got up the country at a van that we got sign
01:20:49
written and we went up the country and we filmed it all and put it all up and it it was very cool so we were just
01:20:56
trialing all these things um but the but yeah the podcasts were just sort of hissing along um but it was
01:21:03
all me like I was doing the everything in the in the podcast so recording editing
01:21:11
Distributing um yeah all of the all of the tasks all of the all of the tasks it's and it's a lot to take on uh like
01:21:20
learning learning to buy a roadcast a pro which is the thing I've got here and
01:21:25
what gear to buy when when I when I thought about doing a podcast um a mutual friend of ours Wendy Petri had
01:21:30
just started doing one um so I sent her a DM saying oh I see you got a podcast like um yeah how did you know what to do
01:21:36
and so she sent me she said I didn't know so I asked bro so then she sent me
01:21:42
like the the flow chart or whatever from you yeah yeah yeah um yeah it's it's a
01:21:47
lot so now if anyone else ask me I always try and help them if I can because you know yeah and but I mean you
01:21:54
fig that out on your own though like you you realize if you if you're out there
01:21:57
and you're independent no one's coming to help you you need to make [ __ ] happen
01:22:00
Yeah we actually we actually I do need to credit we have these wonderful uh the wonderful girls from the raw Collective
01:22:06
helped us um in those early days of the girls un interrupted and that but and so
01:22:13
so full credit to to them for helping us CU there was lots of stuff that we didn't know but you luckily managed to
01:22:18
get the road Caster before lockdown set all of that up and and then I mean I you
01:22:23
know I had I'd been able to edit and stuff and radio and my time in radio and
01:22:28
that but it's just all the like there's so much to it um but also I from day one
01:22:35
I I made sure that I made my life easy for myself I was like I was live on the radio live on the television that's as
01:22:42
live I don't want to overedit it I don't want to overproduce so the the products
01:22:47
that I still put out it almost hardly edited at all just for that very reason that it was like well the more editing
01:22:52
it's going to be on me but so yeah like you know we're in a good place now with
01:22:56
podcasting like it's never been a bigger or sexier medium than what it is now but
01:23:01
when you started in February 2020 doing kiwis you I I'm guessing for you it was
01:23:07
like a a branding exercise to keep your name out there rather than thinking I'm
01:23:11
going to make so much money by sponsoring this it's funny he because I like if you think about it I'm pretty
01:23:16
sure podcast are like 20 like podcasts have been around for 20 years so when people say New Media I'm like that's not
01:23:22
new they have been around for a long time but B Us in New Zealand sometimes we're a bit slow to the uptake right but
01:23:29
um I think now I always saw an opportunity there and I love long form but yeah I guess in the immediate in the
01:23:39
immediate um decision-making process it was like showcasing my talent and skills
01:23:44
in an outward manner so that someone somewhere would hire me for whatever it might be like with and you know like
01:23:51
whether someone wanted me to help them with their podcast or host their podcast or like so it was I was trying to just
01:23:58
everything that I was trying to do in the podcast space or filming stuff or Ming was like trying to be like hey guys
01:24:05
I'm here and I'm available still got it some ZB would go oh Bry Kane she does a
01:24:11
good interview that well I mean yeah yeah no no but like he be I don't know um I don't think they' I don't think I'd
01:24:23
ever be the fing for Mike hosing put it that way you know like but no no I think I I guess to a degree there
01:24:31
there's an element of you wanting to show that yes you are out there doing that in in a different way but
01:24:37
ultimately it was it was it wasn't it wasn't like I and I actually think I did
01:24:41
actually H up ZB at one point I was looking for freelancing stuff and that so I shouldn't laugh um but no you know
01:24:48
no one wanted you in those first couple of years like no I'd had no no work from
01:24:55
any um from any of the big players and so that again that's still a bit of a
01:25:01
knock to your confidence cuz you're like [ __ ] I actually and this is you know you
01:25:04
actually do you start to think oh maybe I am like even today like I I like to think that I I think you have to be
01:25:12
aware of your talents right because you need to focus on utilizing those but you
01:25:19
sometimes you're like [ __ ] maybe I'm not maybe I'm not maybe maybe yeah maybe I'm
01:25:23
not think I am not on the money here but so that would that would happen but um but yeah I don't know where we were
01:25:31
going where I was going with that but um it was all just trying [ __ ] out man like
01:25:37
it was like does this work n well I'll do this I'll do this um and you know and
01:25:42
when we went and filmed Brody's roie with Barry the barer and Laura the Explorer you know I you know I'm going
01:25:49
right this is going to lead to something someone's tourism New Zealand's going to
01:25:51
pick this up look at this great content Tumbleweed you know or right I'm I've
01:25:57
said yes to this so maybe it will lead to something else and so but you just had to just like keep going in all these
01:26:04
different ways and maybe it'll lead to something and maybe it won't but but but
01:26:09
even if it doesn't you you're creating this um this this brand and this company
01:26:14
and you must look back now having done it um all on your own and be [ __ ] proud of it you know what I mean if if
01:26:20
if you're at a radio station and you know you have a good survey there's
01:26:23
other things that go into it they can credit it on the promotions or the music cycle or whatever it happens to be but
01:26:30
you have done all this and I think that that comes back to that um opening yourself up to allowing
01:26:38
yourself to be proud because in these up until yeah the end of last year I don't think I'd done that
01:26:46
anywhere near enough I think you're just like so driven by what you perceive
01:26:52
success to be and what you think you need to be doing to get that success that you aren't stopping and being proud
01:27:00
of yourself and there's so many moments in those in those first three years that
01:27:05
I should have been and even when I look at it now it's like you decided to go
01:27:09
out on your own in the middle of lockdown you know in a and you had to ride out um two years you know two years
01:27:19
of of it being very similar in nature um and and you know and in a very changing
01:27:25
media landscape and an an economic economic landscape and all of that um that you did that and then you move
01:27:33
cities and then you did eventually go on Dancing With the Stars and then you know
01:27:37
and and so you just sometimes I think I'm not patient enough actually probably
01:27:42
you know you want it all now and actually it's like just wait you know it's all going to happen um it's hard at
01:27:50
the time and I feel like in the independence Journey I'm like two years years behind you so it's been
01:27:55
interesting picking your brains CU I feel like you well you know because of when you started and when I started
01:28:00
you're always going to be two years ahead of me um so it's inspiring seeing
01:28:03
how how good things are going for you but you do have to be patient he yeah yeah yeah I I
01:28:09
think I I don't know I I I wonder whether now there's you know with with
01:28:16
um Tik Tok social media access to um to to to the messes to the audience the masses but you know like a bigger bigger
01:28:28
audience is such an easier thing now that I feel like generally The Thirst for that has has grown massively and I I
01:28:40
don't necessarily think that that's that healthy um like you know we always used
01:28:47
to how did how did you find out about the best little cafe you know or um a really good hairdresser or word of mouth
01:28:55
and I still think I'm a little bit old school in and thinking that and and I
01:29:02
you couldn't I don't think you should think like this because it wouldn't be
01:29:05
smart to in terms of a business sense but if you've got if you've got something good and that is worthy and
01:29:13
and in any in anything if it's good if you put in the effort people will come
01:29:21
it just it it is it's how much time have you got how how how finan like how financially backed are you or or
01:29:28
whatever and and so the people will come the the reputation will help if you're
01:29:36
doing the thing right but I think now we all go I could get well he's they're
01:29:41
getting a million views or that's got x amount of listeners or that's number one
01:29:46
on the charts or [ __ ] you know and so one of my other favorite sayings is comparison is the thief of joy and so if
01:29:53
you're constantly worrying about what everyone else is doing you're not worrying about what you're doing and so
01:29:58
I've made massive Headway with that this year of not worrying about um I mean you
01:30:04
you you need to be aware right you need to be aware of of what people around you
01:30:08
are doing but not so much comparing yourself self to to what others are doing so it's that balance of being like
01:30:16
okay we're in New Zealand you might not have X amount of listeners but you've
01:30:20
got this amount of listeners and they listen every single week every single week there is this beautiful community
01:30:28
that listen to what you've got to say that is amazing and so actually stopping
01:30:33
and being grateful for that being grateful for what you've done to to earn this beautiful following a beautiful
01:30:42
Community um instead of going always looking up you know always looking at what else some someone else has so
01:30:50
that's been a massive learning this year so what would your advice me to um anyone that's thinking about starting a
01:30:55
podcast especially given how crowded the market seems to be now well put it this
01:30:59
way if you're a man and you think you've got something to say about sports at the
01:31:02
moment I I say good luck to you I say it's if you're a man in general it's
01:31:07
getting crowded in there boys getting crowded in there it's a sweaty room I I
01:31:13
love that about the the podcasting Market though it's like um yeah anyone can go to rock shop and buy a guitar it
01:31:18
doesn't mean you're going to be [ __ ] Ed cheering yeah and and and yeah and that
01:31:23
you're right Lu you're actually right it's what I love that's that's the that is what is
01:31:28
brilliant about it isn't it it's like but it's also what's wrong with it it's
01:31:32
like everyone can get a microphone Wicked on the downside though everyone can get a microphone Wicked no but you
01:31:40
know what I mean like I I say that I say that tongue and cheek but you know there
01:31:46
there are there are you're right though Dom you if you want to give something a crack like
01:31:53
anything though if you want to give something a crack and you're really passionate about it
01:31:57
[ __ ] go man like absolutely do it um you will not regret it like you'll never
01:32:04
regret trying something that you want to do um so that that is absolutely what would my advice would be if You' if
01:32:11
you've got the love if you feel like you've got something to say if you you
01:32:16
know if you can finded a little spot on the market that might not be there do it
01:32:21
cuz you'll never regret even if it goes wrong or even if it doesn't work out um you
01:32:27
gave it a crack just like anything I would say I love that jeez see look it's
01:32:33
been an hour 32 already this this is how it happens F that's fine what's
01:32:38
happening out there can you guys start the meeting without me okay all good all good oh I'm I'm
01:32:49
sounding important like I've got another meeting you are sounding important like
01:32:52
you've got another meeting get the meeting wait no like CEO's still in here I'm um yeah I'm um I'm in your
01:33:00
I'm in your slip stream I'm setting up um JJ and I are sitting a company called
01:33:03
pod lab uh so we've got a meeting for that oh my God exciting yeah it is exciting but it's terrifying as well it
01:33:09
is terrifying it is terrifying but I always come back to um the the privilege and the honor and
01:33:18
the and and how lucky we are to be able to make these decisions and and I I always I I like if I get all in my head
01:33:26
or I'm flapping about stressed about something or you know being dramatic or
01:33:34
oh I always remind myself of that I'm like you are so lucky you are so lucky
01:33:41
that you had those parents that you had that upbringing that you had that love and care and that you still have that
01:33:47
now and you have amazing people in your life that support you that will have your back no matter what
01:33:54
that is something that cannot be taken for granted so while I have spoken about you know what what in my in in my
01:34:04
experience has been tough I am acutely aware that my life and and I and I hope that this is portrayed in the book that
01:34:13
it is a life well- lived because I've been given the opportunity to and I will
01:34:18
never take that for granted yeah and just if you if you work hard even if if you're not necessarily the most talented
01:34:25
I hope that's not a mean thing to say I think I'm speaking about myself as much
01:34:28
as you if you work hard and you're resilient um just how much you can achieve and we got to remind ourselves
01:34:34
that not we don't all we don't fit in a mold but no does not does the world like
01:34:41
so there's a there's enough there's enough space out there for us there's
01:34:46
enough space for more than one female presenter on a radio show there's space for all of us
01:34:56
and I think that that was not what I grew up with in my in the early days of my career there wasn't space for all of
01:35:05
you you know but there is space you just got to find it and just really hustle in
01:35:11
there you know so you you know I I talk about poos a lot that's not going to be for some for
01:35:18
some people I'm I'm I'm not going to be what Everyone likes I'm there are people
01:35:24
that will not have made it this far there are people that are just not like me I am completely at peace with that
01:35:31
cuz I don't like everyone so I can't expect everyone to like me but the the
01:35:35
people that are still listening are the some of the people that will read your book and um yeah you are very much an
01:35:40
open book and um yeah you talk in quite a bit of depth about uh your 2010 abortion um which is something you
01:35:50
talked about publicly a couple of years ago as well you wrote like an open an open in peace you mentioned earlier on
01:35:55
that your mom had an abortion well early on um also to do with this when you tell
01:36:00
your dad like Dad you're not going to like this but you didn't tell him at the
01:36:02
time but you tell him when the piece was about to come out yeah [ __ ] his reaction
01:36:06
was amazing oh my God I know and that that goes back to what I was saying about him earlier you know um he is yeah
01:36:13
he he's an amazing supporter obviously of mine um I think one of the reasons I
01:36:21
didn't tell him is because of this shame that you carry when you're going through that process
01:36:30
and it's a shame that sits deep within you and you don't really you don't
01:36:35
want people to know why would you want people to know that that something that Society has told us is shameful which we
01:36:43
now know thank goodness but there's a massive percentage of the global population that still thinks it is but
01:36:49
we know now that it's not shameful and and and unfortunately though it's
01:36:56
terrifying because people that don't agree with um pro-choice often a very nasty or say very horrible things to
01:37:06
people about that yeah under the under the umbrella of religion right and so so it's scary it it's no no one wants to be
01:37:15
called a murderer or no one wants to be no one wants people to just think that you're disgusting or
01:37:24
foul or you horrible human you monster no one wants people to think like that but but I think that um so so that whole
01:37:34
shame that that women um have carried for [ __ ] however many years that that makes you not want to
01:37:45
tell your dad because you're you're you're embarrassed so you don't want to
01:37:50
tell you want your dad to know all the good bits about you you know yeah um and and at the time it it took me a
01:37:57
few days to even think that I would tell Mom you know because I was embarrassed and just felt like a [ __ ] now fast
01:38:08
forward 2024 we love [ __ ] we we are and we Embrace and like we ride at dawn as
01:38:15
[ __ ] like you know we've the even that word has been taken back give that back
01:38:19
to us give that back that's ours you know um um and so when I did yeah of course when it was like oh [ __ ] it's
01:38:29
going to be on the front page of the herald on Sunday Jesus Christ I been you know I need to tell dead um but he was
01:38:36
like I you know I I then I felt bad that I hadn't told him you know but he and I
01:38:43
sort of explained that but he's like good on you girl I'm proud of you why
01:38:49
why did you expect any different like from what you've told me about M no no
01:38:53
as I say I don't think it's it's not it's not that you're worried about how
01:38:58
they'll react it's it's what you're holding on to yeah you don't want you
01:39:03
don't want to tell them because you think you've done something wrong so
01:39:06
it's more on on on your own emotions yeah you know so so so yeah so you don't
01:39:13
want them to judge you cuz you know up until like people because that's it's
01:39:17
it's what people do people judge you people have judged you for having an abortion even though they don't know you
01:39:24
or they don't have anything to do with you or your circumstances whatever so so
01:39:29
I think you just didn't want to bring them into that yes that was 2010 um One
01:39:34
Night One Night Stand from someone you met at Danny Duan after the radio War he not Danny D let no it was an Irish guy
01:39:41
Australian guy no Australian guy not at Denny Duan not at Denny duan's but I do
01:39:46
believe just a few bars down not d i really whatever maybe foxes actually okay so and actually I just did
01:39:55
I say in the book that I'd won the I'd just won journalist of the year yeah you
01:39:58
do men that yeah yeah um so yeah bang on Jero that night um so that must have been a chaotic so yeah how old at the
01:40:06
time late 20s 2010 so 25 yeah okay so it just wasn't did did you ever think about
01:40:15
keeping the no no no not not there was not one moment there was not one moment that that that was that that that I even
01:40:26
thought that that would be I didn't I it wasn't I just knew that that was not
01:40:31
what I wanted to do at all um so but but still um getting the procedure like do you feel do you feel guilt at the time
01:40:40
or yeah you're you're pretty low like the whole um it's just you yeah it's
01:40:48
just your hatred towards yourself is extreme um this is my experience because if you look at my
01:40:59
experience and actually and I I had a one night stand but I took the emergency contraception peill um 24 hours
01:41:09
later um so yes I'd had unprotected sex but i' what I'd thought had had taken the ne
01:41:19
the ne necessary uh measures to like sort that out um there's even shame in getting the emergency C oh my God just
01:41:30
shame hello there I'm just coming to let you know that I've had sex and I need your help yes that's
01:41:39
right does anyone else in the chemist want to know I had sex last night just getting the emergency pill you know like
01:41:45
yeah um but no so um it's a very it's a it's a it's a grim time for me and feeling like I I felt
01:41:57
like like a [ __ ] and and and that was in a time when that was a you know you that was a bad
01:42:03
word word to to use um I felt um just yuck just like embarrassed and just like I'd done something
01:42:20
wrong you know not not interestingly though when I say that I didn't think I'd done something wrong by making my
01:42:28
decision that I did but by I felt like I had [ __ ] up um in life that that was you know
01:42:39
that that was something that you know like I don't know what would you liken it to that's that it's
01:42:46
not you've you've just done something you've just done a a life thing that
01:42:49
everyone does and that's happened to have happened but you feel like broken a
01:42:53
LW well [ __ ] if you don't go through the process at that time you would have
01:42:57
because it was still um under the Crimes Act but was it no so when I say that I mean yes yes if you an abortion we we
01:43:06
only changed the abortion laws um was it 2020 because it was still under the Crimes Act unless you had you had to
01:43:15
have it signed off by two doctors by two doctors who you had to tell that you couldn't mentally like that you weren't
01:43:22
mentally capable so that that only change relatively recently which is archaic and wild um so it was such a
01:43:32
such a shameful thing and as I say isn't it fascinating that we I can sit here
01:43:37
and even though I'm still mildly uncomfortable cuz I know that how like foul and vile people are about abortions
01:43:47
that's the only reason I'm like oh gosh there'll be someone watching this and'll
01:43:50
be like you [ __ ] filthy [ __ ] um but but we couldn't have talked like this
01:43:56
back then I didn't want to talk like this back then I don't want anyone to
01:43:59
know so the only reason I well one of the reasons I decided to talk about it though fast forwarding to 2020 was
01:44:09
because of Ro v Wade in in America and it was like okay all right we we're not doing
01:44:18
this we're not doing this we have to stand up for women everywhere everywhere
01:44:25
um and so even when I when I yelled at the protesters at Christ Church hospital in 20 I think that might have been even
01:44:34
2020 um you know there's so many women out there that have felt the same way I
01:44:40
have felt for whatever their circumstances and I guess actually I've I've I've talked
01:44:48
around um to actually a really simple answer Dom that I've reached now it's personal and it's private and it's
01:44:57
my body and it's other women's body bodies and it's no one else's [ __ ]
01:45:02
business but somehow over the course of history we have allowed ourselves to be involved in the business of women and
01:45:09
the med and their most one of their most difficult decisions that they have to make and we are diving into their
01:45:16
privacy and that's disgusting not what they're doing you know and so how dare
01:45:22
we have allowed this to go on for so long so if people want to like now go off call me the most horrific name you
01:45:31
want I couldn't give a [ __ ] this is the hell Dion I will stand up for the rights
01:45:36
of women and their reproductive systems and I will not I will not care about what that means sharing my experience I
01:45:44
don't care what you have to say but if I can make any other woman feel comfortable about doing something that
01:45:49
they are entitled to do that is no one else's business because it's the most
01:45:53
private personal matter themselves then that's fine I will do that that was so
01:45:59
articulate oh thank you jeez the um this is going to be good for the algorithm the comments are going to honestly
01:46:06
nothing like an angry smelly little man sitting in his angry little man that'll
01:46:11
be like are you murderous [ __ ] you know like I come at me mate give it to me I
01:46:16
can't imagine the emotional uh turmoil that you or any other woman goes through
01:46:20
that has has opted to G the bo so the last thing you need is you know the the shame of other people being placed upon
01:46:27
you you know what I mean um that's just not fair I yeah it's just it's a very
01:46:34
again like ultimately it's a it's a woman's decision to make it's got
01:46:38
nothing to do with anyone else and you know again you know on the on the if people the great news is if you don't
01:46:47
believe in abortion based on your religious beliefs that's fine don't have
01:46:53
one but I'm not religious and so I don't hold those same beliefs that you do if
01:47:00
you don't want to have one I'm not going to judge you for that but I I don't
01:47:04
believe in God or Jesus but I would never go and stand outside a church with a sign deliberately to upset or bestow
01:47:19
that on on on those people who choose to go and do that M um and look you know we
01:47:25
we all as I said we all have we all have the hills that we're going to die on and
01:47:29
that is one of mine you know like you can't you can't fight every cause you
01:47:34
can't you can't be involved in every in everything but you have to decide which
01:47:39
which are the ones that you are um and that is one of mine that is one of mine I think that's a great one and it's well
01:47:46
articulated thanks for sharing that no you're welcome yeah um man there's so
01:47:52
much to talk about with you oh okay we do we'll do one more we'll talk about
01:47:55
reality TV for a little bit um so Dancing with the Stars you finished you finished second and Dancing with the
01:47:59
Stars yes um you look back on that on that now likees does it would you have liked to have win are you you super
01:48:06
proud of like finishing second a lot of it's a lot of it sort of out of not even
01:48:10
about the dancing isn't it a lot of it sort of well I mean you so I mean we raised I think it was like 30 I raised
01:48:18
$35,000 for assistance dogs New Zealand which I'm now a very proud board member
01:48:24
of um you know so the the awareness that those Charities got was huge 100% like all the Charities are so it means so
01:48:33
much to them because they're being mentioned on National Television every week so it's so cool that you and you I
01:48:40
must say though that is when you have to remind yourself of why you are there um
01:48:46
when you're having a absolute meltdown be like I can't do it we're not going to
01:48:51
be able to do it every day you're crying every day um but yeah like n like I
01:48:58
don't I don't I don't wish I won in fact a lot of people are like oh you won
01:49:04
didn't you and I'm like no you know or sometimes I'm just like I don't answer
01:49:08
them I'm like well I guess so you know got well I mean this is the thing I do
01:49:14
talk about this what is you know like there's there's winning statistically
01:49:19
right there's you've you've won the Olympics you've won a gold medal you've
01:49:24
you've won the um under 19 double ski You've Won things on paper statistically
01:49:32
but I like to talk about the the greater meaning of winning to to I guess us everyday people you know where where
01:49:41
that statistic doesn't necessarily matter so did I win that day [ __ ] yeah I
01:49:47
I got to wear the hottest little gold dress teeny tiny I looked mint I got to dance to my favorite musician one of my
01:49:58
favorite musicians Tina Turner I got to dance to Proud Mary I got to live out a dream so that is winning right like that
01:50:07
like it doesn't get much better than that the whole people people still now send me videos like you know like Proud
01:50:14
Mary might be playing at the um I don't know poora Bay pub and so someone on a Saturday night sends it and
01:50:22
they're dancing like like the dancers that I did and like the dance that Tina
01:50:27
do people still send me there so to know that PE that that had such a cool impact
01:50:32
on people who were following me cuz I was like from day one I was like if I make the final I'm dancing to Tina
01:50:37
Turner and I drove in to dance training and every single morning now I'm not I'm
01:50:44
not spiritual super spiritual and I'm not like um you know I don't know what I
01:50:51
think about manifesting but if there was something I did manifest you know it was
01:50:55
that cuz I would listen to that song every morning in the car on the way to dancing like your hype song oh yeah yeah
01:51:02
yeah yeah so um but it was hard it was one of the hardest things we've ever done actually the whole Dancing with the
01:51:07
Stars experience yeah um J did it a few years ago and there like everyone everyone's um in Physio and Osteo and
01:51:15
everyone's broken it's a lot he yeah was that what you mean it was hard physically or uh you know what no not NE
01:51:23
no not the the physicality I was good with I had just finished training for the coast to coast and um so I was so
01:51:33
fit like obscenely fit so while it was hard on different elements of your body cuz different muscles and stuff it it
01:51:41
was actually the it was the mental challenge for me to be honest and it was um being so far out of your comfort zone
01:51:50
for such an extended period of time so you know I often talk about this we as adults you know we we we we work hard
01:51:58
you know we we're all you know we're working to pay a mortgage to like you
01:52:02
know I mean let's not go into the the system that we all live by which often
01:52:07
we're like why the [ __ ] are we doing all us but UL ultimately like we're working
01:52:11
hard so that we can pay our mortgage so that we can live in the house and you know just and provide for look after my
01:52:17
M well she would hate me saying that because she's very proud but you know like you know you're doing all these
01:52:21
things for the greater good of [ __ ] yeah um where was I going with that no I've come back I've come back so because
01:52:29
we live these lives we don't tend to spend too much time outside of our comfort zone because
01:52:39
life is tough so you you know for for probably a lot of Right Reasons want to make sure that you're not making things
01:52:47
hard on yourself right but I think that there has to be an element of of putting
01:52:53
yourself out of your comfort zone feeling like taking a risk or um being scared or all of that and that dancing
01:53:03
10 weeks of like the show was six weeks but we danced we got to practice for a few weeks beforehand like that was that
01:53:10
was an example of that of just just constantly being like I don't know what I'm doing I can't do this and
01:53:18
but you have to right you have to learn you have to learn it you have to learn it to go on show and do it so and it was
01:53:24
just a cycle every week but every week and you almost weren't really getting
01:53:30
used to the fact that you were um getting better at it you were just like right here we go again right we've just
01:53:36
get rid of the cha it's time for the tango and you're like oh my God you know
01:53:39
so it was just this hard challenging task of learning to do something that you didn't really know how to do but you had
01:53:48
to do it and then yeah yeah and you would you would have um in some way had an advantage over some of the other
01:53:54
contestants in the respect that like live TV wasn't the scary aspect for you that's like another layer of
01:54:01
complexity I think for some other people that have never been on potentially TV before or live TV I had actually thought
01:54:07
about that but you Pro I don't I do you know what's funny is I actually yeah cuz you're right because
01:54:15
when I had to do about a month after the final I was asked to MC the um Tanya Dalton Foundation Award a big fundraiser
01:54:25
that they that they have once a year and they asked if I could if onri and I would do the dance and I was like yeah
01:54:32
sure great and yes that was in front of like I don't know maybe 500 people four
01:54:39
500 people and that was way more terrifying because you could you could see the people um but I tell you I had
01:54:46
the same cycle every week like I would um I would always [ __ ] up the dress rehearsal always and then I'd be like oh
01:54:56
[ __ ] and then I'd come out and and and do a good job of the of the actual one
01:55:01
right under pressure so the last yeah the last Hara before the actual one I would always [ __ ] up and I remember with
01:55:08
the it's it happened with with Proud Mary and cuz I was wearing um I was originally the gold dress that I'm
01:55:16
wearing in it I was originally supposed to wear this other one but it looked Naf
01:55:20
and so I then was going to wear the same one is the is is um Nera and Phoebe who
01:55:26
are professional dancers like I can't wear the same thing as them for God's
01:55:29
sake but I ended up having to and it was so teeny tiny that in the like When the
01:55:35
Beat Drops and I rip the black dress off that gold dress was so tiny that I felt
01:55:40
like I had nothing on so I went and looked down well that's I'm already a
01:55:44
beat off the thing so I was like trying to catch up and I i' promised myself
01:55:49
that I'd enjoy it and I just felt like I was just catching up the whole time so
01:55:53
at the end of it I said to Enrique [ __ ] I've [ __ ] it up again and he's like
01:55:57
and what happens every other when we when we [ __ ] up the dress reheal what happens I'm like oh we have a good time
01:56:02
in the he's like exactly so that was part if you hadn't [ __ ] it up I would
01:56:06
have worried about you well that's good advice God he's a great guy he yeah you
01:56:11
do you still see him now I do you know it's a strange feeling he when you do a
01:56:14
show like that and it's your whole bubble and then suddenly it's not we we
01:56:18
were good like in the initial aftermath we were good at catching up and and I was even doing a few lessons um he is
01:56:26
we're both we message all the time and we joke about the fact that we haven't
01:56:30
seen each other I don't have we seen each other this year I don't know he is
01:56:33
traveling so much as well with dancing which is amazing with Amy um but we we're constantly in touch cuz I miss him
01:56:40
and I miss it you know um and I just wish that I could have just like just morphed into a fabulous dancer and just
01:56:48
you know but every everyone on this show always says oh I'm going to keep up the
01:56:52
dancing it's hard it's hard why would you if you got no one to perform to or
01:56:57
no yeah yeah I know so um but no he yeah he's great yeah he was JJ's dance and
01:57:04
she was on and for years afterwards he' just like Bowl around on a Saturday afternoon or whatever and if there was
01:57:09
kitset Furniture there for some reason we had a lot of kitset furniture he'd
01:57:13
just like take it upon himself to build to build that's a good human yeah a great human he's really good at it oh
01:57:18
he's he's such a fantastic so yeah we've we've as I say this year we've been both
01:57:23
of us by our own admission have been [ __ ] but I think every time he's like
01:57:27
home for a period of time I'm not and then he's just like again like recently
01:57:31
I said we need to catch up I'm just going to London but then I'm back here
01:57:34
and I'm like well I'm not here there you know it's just that classic thing right
01:57:38
do you do you have like 5ye goals or threee goal are you a goal Setter at all or like what do you want in the
01:57:44
future do you know that I kind of yes or no um I don't know one thing I'd love to do is
01:57:55
live in Mount [ __ ] that I don't know whether that's a goal or like I just I would love to live
01:58:04
there and and work from there I want to live by like I mean I you know I want to
01:58:09
live by the beach I want to I want to have a have a a life where lifestyle is well I guess yeah lifestyle is really
01:58:22
important like the the things that you that make you happy that fill your cup I want to and the beach and a beach
01:58:29
lifestyle gives that to me so that I don't know if that's a goal or a want or
01:58:34
a a dream or a dream yeah what's the difference between a dream and a goal a
01:58:38
goal is realistic right I don't know um I would love to I I have to say at the
01:58:45
moment it's hard isn't it CU I I used to think that I was probably like a goal
01:58:51
sitter and a 5e and a 10 year but what I found amazing but also really hard to get um used to is the nature of this job
01:59:02
um is not knowing what a year looks like like I would say that I don't know like 50 to 60% of what
01:59:13
I have done this year I wouldn't have known that I was doing it in January so
01:59:19
yeah you just never know what doors are going to present themselves yeah um yeah I don't know I'd just like to
01:59:26
I'd like to constantly be um I would like to think that if I am to stay in the work that I'm doing that I respect
01:59:38
and understand and appreciate its evolving nature and I'd like to think that if I think it's time for me to get
01:59:46
off that I would if I don't think I can evolve with it are you allowed to say
01:59:49
are you allowed to say get off what girls like girls get off girls get off girls get off you allowed to say
01:59:55
that name oh I don't know am I oh girls on top oh sorry I yeah girls get off
02:00:01
they're amazing girls with all six toys to yeah yeah yeah yeah girls you let
02:00:04
girls are let to get off of course um well I think I think like whatever you do you're going to be good at and I
02:00:10
think you're in the inviable position now with there's probably a lot of
02:00:12
people in media um that are like insecure about their jobs and positions given the changing nature of the
02:00:17
industry that would like um love to have like a personal brand but it takes years
02:00:22
to build it up right yeah I I think that when you like if if I look at when when
02:00:28
I got made redundant anyone I've spoken to that's been made redundant has never said I
02:00:36
wish I didn't you know um had SE it at the time though had said it at the time
02:00:42
but you're almost forced to make a choice that at times you maybe should have made for yourself without that
02:00:49
being forced upon you but you're always grateful in the long run that it that it
02:00:54
happened actually um to be you know to be frank as well I I guess I'll be careful how I word this but a little bit
02:01:03
similar when when something happens like burnout that you I think it's you know you shouldn't get yourself
02:01:12
to that point but if you do I think it's some really valuable lessons so sometimes the best lessons come from
02:01:17
when something bad happens to you and and look again again I want to reiterate losing a job and and suffering burnout
02:01:25
I'm not trying to diminish my stuff cuz my stuff's my stuff but you know um
02:01:30
there are and there there are people doing it a lot tougher than I am but if I am owning the the challenges in my
02:01:38
life those things have definitely um taught me some pretty valuable lessons and I'm still learning every day and you
02:01:50
know there are I have still have my vulnerable moments and that all usually depend on how tired I am like I'm pretty
02:01:56
tired right now you know I I am in a in a not really sustainable period of Mahi but I know that that's got a an end
02:02:07
point but that's the nature of it you know and and and I just would like to I'd just like
02:02:14
to keep being happy at what I do you know and at the moment everything I'm doing makes me really happy
02:02:22
um and I think that that's really important and I think that maybe when you are at peace with that and you're
02:02:27
really happy with what you're doing that is in fact when you're performing at
02:02:31
your best when you're not sort of worried about what the next thing is if you're sort of content with where you
02:02:37
are with stuff which is I think possibly you know like with with my with signing
02:02:42
a commercial partnership with stuff with the podcast I feel this weight off my shoulders that I am working with people
02:02:49
now and I'm not just sort of alone and in that kind of space so there's a real
02:02:54
feeling this year of of being able to actually like soak it all up and you know a good friend of mine Mark kryal
02:03:03
who lost his job this year on the Sunday program he always used to say drink it while it's fizzy and I you know can't
02:03:10
argue with that either um so you you know you got to soak up all the good stuff I'm you know I've got a [ __ ]
02:03:17
great life you know I can run with we can run I can go and do a marathon I can do a podcast that people love with my
02:03:27
best mates I can go and speak at the beef and lamb long ladies lunch and Gore and and make people laugh and bring
02:03:35
people joy and no I'm not um operating on someone's brain or you know putting a valve on someone's heart
02:03:44
and that's also really important to remind my I remind myself of that I go mate you are not you know you are not
02:03:51
doing anything that like if you have a day off you know your your your job isn't crucial and I
02:03:58
think that's important to remind yourself that these are just microphones and we are just talking in them we are
02:04:05
not changing or saving the world and I think that sometimes we need to hear that we need to remind ourselves that
02:04:12
and I'd like to think I'm doing that but in saying that celebrating doing
02:04:17
something that you love at the same time I love that I think that's a good place
02:04:21
to end it um Brody G woman uninterrupted it's a it's a hell of a book um it's bloody
02:04:28
cool and thank you and it's it's a an absolute privilege to call you a friend
02:04:33
well and look I I we we we have some great runs I love that you run with me even though you're really fast CU that's
02:04:40
a that's a measure of a good running pal is that pace doesn't matter and um and
02:04:46
your support is is really valuable to me too so thank you and thanks for having me on basically told you you had you had
02:04:51
do so you didn't say we had to go for 2 hours and 5 minutes oh [ __ ] oh my God I
02:04:57
can never give you [ __ ] ever again about your long podcast I wonder if the thing
02:05:02
I like about this it's like um people will listen till they get bored people
02:05:05
that love you will see the length of this and they'll be like yes 2 hours of
02:05:08
bro can I wonder if Justin Marshall will said to me oh no one needs 2 hours five
02:05:12
of no I wouldn't I wouldn't have I wouldn't have thought they did either
02:05:16
but you know we'll see yeah you're inspiring and you're lovely and thank
02:05:20
you so much for coming on my podcast again my absolute pleasure