00:00:00
big tall guy with a big like a Stson hat and a coat. He'd always take me up these
00:00:04
stairs. He threw me off. >> Did you want to be a firefighter when you were little?
00:00:06
>> And my dream was always to be in the fire brigades. >> There's a scar on the left hand side.
00:00:09
>> The motorbike hit me in the back. Broke my femur. I wouldn't be here again
00:00:12
today. I used to have nightmares up until that point. I woke up and there I was intensive care.
00:00:16
>> How did you overcome the stutter? >> I had to basically learn to respe again.
00:00:20
I could barely start a sentence without stammering over something. >> Have you ever walked into a job and
00:00:24
thought to yourself, "Shit, this could be it." >> You don't think of it like that?
00:00:27
>> You've never experienced a PTSD or anything like that? He had been down
00:00:29
there for eight days and we found him. >> Did you ever struggle silently? >> Um, no.
00:00:34
>> Tony Scott. Scotty, welcome to my podcast. >> Thanks, Tom. Thank you,
00:00:39
>> mate. It's it's great to have you here. You um you pumped up my tires before we
00:00:42
came in. We we went and got a coffee together. You gave me a gift. Um you were you were telling me how often you
00:00:48
listen to the podcast. So, it's great to have you here as a guest. >> Oh, thanks, mate. you uh for my drive
00:00:53
down once a week. You know, I've got a list almost as long as my arm now of uh
00:00:57
ones I've gone through and people that I think I want to listen to. So, yeah,
00:01:01
it's a great time. My three-hour drive is is a two-thirds taken up with your
00:01:04
podcast. So, >> Oh, that means a lot. I really appreciate that. So, you're part of the
00:01:08
New Zealand Fire Service. You're a lifer as well. This is this has been the only
00:01:12
job you've done >> almost. Yeah. I left school was a salesman in a hardware shop and only
00:01:17
hung up for a little while. Um and then I got an opportunity um to work for myself um driving a truck. Um and then
00:01:24
but my dream was always to be in the fire brigade. So um got the opportunity when I was 21 to become full-time. Um I
00:01:30
was a volunteer from 17. Um so I've had about two or three jobs before I got
00:01:34
into being this but 33 years full-time to this point. Um actually work for the airport company but um I am partner the
00:01:41
foreign emergency in the far north as well. >> Yes. So what's your what's your role at
00:01:45
the airport? How long you been doing that? Um, I'm a crew chief, which is, uh, I've got a crew of 15 below me. Um,
00:01:52
two officers below me and then my crew. Uh, I've been a crew chief since 2018, I
00:01:58
think I was. I made up to that. Um, so yeah, we run for watches. Um, we cover the airport 24/7. It covers uh, I'd like
00:02:06
to say as soon as you enter the airport premises and as you take off, we cover you that whole time from any minor
00:02:12
emergency or or major um, and when you land in your back. So, um we have a huge pride in in looking after the people
00:02:19
that pass through our port. Um u my guys uh um you know just have a huge immense
00:02:25
amount of pride of of of wanting to help people. You know >> what what does an average day look like
00:02:30
at the airport? >> A lot of routine uh day shift uh you know we get to work um briefing well
00:02:37
first of all we check all the equipment gets checked um and then um briefings and then training. Um, our training
00:02:43
varies each day. Um, and just our routine checking equipment. Um, there's your daily checks and there's your
00:02:50
weekly checks. Um, and then there's everything in between. Like for my role,
00:02:54
there's a lot of meetings and stuff. So, I'm taking that. Um, and then we Yeah,
00:03:00
there's calls in between that that throw things back and forth, but we have like
00:03:04
um all year, you know, we have things we have to achieve like different um repeat
00:03:09
certain kind of um skills and bases. So it's amazing when you have a crew so big
00:03:15
that you miss people and you have to go back and do that kind of thing again. So
00:03:18
yeah, so this that would be that and calls same with the night shifts um goes through the same system, but the calls
00:03:24
just change today. So you can just, you know, you can have the best plans laid out what you're going to do on a day,
00:03:29
but it can always change as well. >> What's the worst day at the office out
00:03:33
there? What does that look like? >> Too many meetings. No. Um um I don't know that because of the crew
00:03:41
and this probably goes across all fire bri brigades um because of the crew you might go through some have some bad
00:03:49
experiences but you just sit at the mess table and you talk about it you know like you you're with your other family
00:03:54
so um [ __ ] day I don't know it's always a good I just love going to work you
00:03:59
know I think my partner Heather you know she can't understand why I've had a job
00:04:03
the same job for so long you know but um I love being at home I love being at my
00:04:07
other home which is which is there and you know really care about the guys that I've got working for me, guys and girls
00:04:11
that I've got working for me. So yeah, it's um I don't know. It's not a [ __ ]
00:04:15
day really. >> Is is it a cushy job out there or are you dealing with some you know big
00:04:20
emergency stuff? >> Um it's not a cushy job. Um you know like people assume you know you go to a party
00:04:29
and what do you for a job? I work at the airport. Oh, when the last plane crash.
00:04:33
So, yeah. Um, but >> well, not naively. That that's what I sort of thought. I thought maybe it's
00:04:37
like being a bomb disposal expert in New Zealand where maybe there's like three
00:04:40
or four things that happen a year. >> No, no. So, so every emergency. So, think from literally a cut finger
00:04:47
through to a full card. Think of all the buildings we have on the airport. They have um fire alarm. I mean, foreign
00:04:52
emergency come out to us almost every day and we work with them alongside them every day. We work alongside St. on uh
00:04:58
we work with police uh with maritime um with our with our marine craft. We've
00:05:02
got you've seen we've done just recently with um working with Eagle. We've done
00:05:05
some awesome rescues on the harbor with Coast Guard. Um so, you know, any one day you could have nothing in the day.
00:05:12
It's very rare. Um and then you get the big jobs and then when you get a really
00:05:15
successful job, this the whole shift lifts, you know, and it's just really awesome. and but that comes down to the
00:05:21
guys training and and their dedication to running through the drills, running through the skills and looking after
00:05:27
each other and and that and it's um it's an awesome thing. But um yeah, so we're
00:05:32
just busy in like I said to you before, think of like we have 12,000 odd people that work on the airport and they are
00:05:39
our community. Then we have anywhere between 80 to 100,000 people a day travel through our port. Now put that
00:05:46
into a Hamilton or a New Plymouth or that and what fire brigade they have, what ambulance service they have and
00:05:53
then look at the kind of work we could do from that. So, but we don't do that
00:05:57
alone. We're backed up, like I said, by fire emergency and by St. John and everyone else.
00:06:02
>> As a man, is your is your job safer now than what it's been for earlier chapters
00:06:06
of your career >> as a as a man? As a human being? >> Yeah. >> Well, I mean, like, let me rephrase that
00:06:14
another way. So your partner Heather, like does she worry less about you going to work now than
00:06:17
>> I suppose. Yeah, because I sit in a bigger seat maybe. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
00:06:20
>> Are you more a desk jockey now? >> I I do get to respond to to call. You
00:06:24
know, it's taking me a long time to adjust because you want to be out there doing the job and I get to do right on
00:06:30
the on the other trucks a little bit and but like you know, it's not my time
00:06:34
anymore. I've got 10 years left in my career. Um, and now it's my time to let
00:06:39
the other guys come through in that whole succession thing. And I have to let go and and um, and it's really
00:06:45
important that we leave their job in a better place than what we got it, you know, and yeah, it's um, but yeah, she's
00:06:52
she's a bit happier that I probably sitting in that thing. Um, yeah, cuz the
00:06:55
guys will put themselves out there if they if they have to, you know. >> This this is going to be a great chat.
00:06:59
There's a lot to unpack the the early parts of your career and also um you're
00:07:03
the architect of the um the annual Sky Tower climb which is iconic in terms of charity fundraisers. Um so we'll get
00:07:10
into all that. So lots of kids say they want to be firefighters. It's like um
00:07:13
yeah kids want to be like a firefighter or a cop or an all black or a black cat what whatever it happens to be. Um was
00:07:21
that you? >> Did you want to be a firefighter when you were little? >> It was uh for different reasons when I
00:07:26
was little. when I got older um to teenage years um mom had some friends of the family that were in the brigade um
00:07:32
and the job definitely became appealing days off um this that you could actually
00:07:37
do it for career um but I was um I was actually quite a bad teenager um and uh there's a guy Don Scott uh who was an
00:07:46
Oakland firefighter um who was a good friend of the family not any relation um and I remember I sat down chat with him
00:07:52
and he was really firm with me and he was like man if you want to get there, you're going to have to be good at
00:07:58
school. Um, not really like not academically massive at school, but be good, stay out of trouble. And I
00:08:05
remember this time I was hanging with mates and we were about to get in a pile of trouble and I decided not to do it.
00:08:10
And then you get to a point in pathway and I chose not to do it and they did it and they got in trouble and um they're
00:08:16
all good now but they they reflect back at that they remember that and they reflect back and go wow man I'm so glad
00:08:22
that you didn't do what we did and and and went down that path and and you know
00:08:27
years later I did a course in in PI here and he was taking it and we got to have
00:08:33
a reflection at the end of the course um we'll say a bit and I just said look and
00:08:37
these were all chiefs that were in the room and I said Look guys, when you go back to your communities, you don't know
00:08:42
how much of a presence you have in your community. People look up to you. And I and and I looked at Don and I said, um,
00:08:48
that man there when I was a teenager gave me some guidance and I wouldn't be
00:08:51
where I'm standing where I'm am now. And I wouldn't have achieved the things I
00:08:55
have achieved now if he hadn't have had that talk with me in the years. And afterwards, he walked to me. He goes,
00:09:00
"Man, I never had any idea that I had that kind of effect on you, you know."
00:09:04
And I said, "Mate, you just" And I got two other guys, mom, one of mom's
00:09:08
friends that was a his doctor, uh her boss is a doctor, um who's retired now,
00:09:12
and another one, Colin and Jeff. And man, um cuz my mom and dad broke up when I was little and didn't really have a
00:09:19
father figure at home. And um man, without those guys in my life, you know, um and keep me on a straight and narrow,
00:09:26
um I just wouldn't be where I am now today. And you know, I I hate to think what I'd be doing, you know.
00:09:33
Why why were you an angry teen? Was it absence of a father? Was it boredom? No, >> just mate crowd.
00:09:39
>> Yeah, probably just just, you know, we just >> we just did fun things that were dumb
00:09:44
[ __ ] Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And and that was before it's where we had bikes,
00:09:47
you know, we weren't even driving, you know, and just >> like the kids on Stranger Things.
00:09:51
>> Well, but like we lived in Tim. I was growing up that point in my life in Tims
00:09:55
and you know, we would either be swimming all day and up the valley or and staying up really late. I remember
00:10:00
one time, you know, I was driving, my mom was petrified. I was probably about 10:30 on a school night. I still hadn't
00:10:05
come home and so she sent Colin um Colin and Jeff out to find me. It's like bling
00:10:10
huts turning up in this Cina. I never forget it. We're eing on the wolf and they found us, man. Picked me up by the
00:10:16
air and they dragged me into the car and and uh you know and that was incredibly
00:10:20
embarrassing in front of all my mates, you know, and but um you know, I reflect back and I fish with um Jeff and I just
00:10:26
love my time with those two now. And um yeah, they had such an influence on my upbringing, you know, but they just I
00:10:32
you know, they know it. They know they have. But yeah, >> um it's funny you say someone picked up
00:10:37
by the year. Um I had a math teacher that would do that as well. And you look back now, um there's no way any adult
00:10:43
would survive that like, you know, there'd be investigations and inquiries, but it's probably the the sort of tough
00:10:49
love that I needed at the time. >> Oh, and Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. Yeah. >> Um what what was the trouble you were
00:10:55
talking about? Did you want to elaborate on that? Oh, look, they were um in in our teens, the guys were touching into
00:11:00
um you know, marijuana, different stuff that they were doing and and and I knew that if I have any of that against my
00:11:05
name. Um you know, they wanted to go off and take some of this and I just said, "Look, that's going to lead to harder
00:11:09
stuff." I actually went back to boarding school. Um I got to 14 and um you know I
00:11:16
was getting like oh the other like and it's little things like we're in the
00:11:19
science class and remember those buns and burners you used to get in science and we missed out on a buns and burner
00:11:24
and you know how they had those little pipes with the with the loop that goes between the thing and then you know one
00:11:29
of the boys are like just light the end of the pipe and and like nothing will happen. It's like and that sound like a
00:11:34
good idea. So you turn the gas on and then the other kid I don't know why I did it. We had a little flame like this
00:11:40
off the end of it. Then all of a sudden someone just whacked the lever and this flame shot right across the classroom
00:11:46
and it was just complete silence and there three of us are sitting there and then it's like outside and then um you
00:11:52
know I'm in front of the headm's office and it's just it just was continuous
00:11:55
stuff and then mom sat me down at home one time and I was going to ask her to go back to boarding school and then she
00:12:02
said I'm sending you back to boarding school and I went and my first I went back for fourth form. I'm sorry I'm
00:12:08
talking old school. um fourth form and fifth form. My first turn back and fourth form, I got 13 of the cane. Um
00:12:15
different instances of swearing late for class, not doing my homework. Um different things. The rest of my time at
00:12:21
boarding school, I got one, you know, and then definitely made me, you know, and and um I'm not a for not a fan of
00:12:28
corporal punishment. It worked for me. Um but yeah, um and I've got some lifetime friends from that school, uh
00:12:36
St. Peters and Cambridge. It was a very small school when I went there. People go, "My god, that's an amazing school."
00:12:41
And it is now, but it's so different to when we were there. And we just all weekend, you know, after we played
00:12:46
sport, we'd go back and get cleaned up, go play more sport, and you just got to
00:12:50
hang with everybody and just run around and it was um but yeah, that really straightened me out and and uh but one
00:12:56
of the weirdest things was I remember careers week at boarding school and I put down I wanted to be a firefighter
00:13:01
and they were mortified. Hey, like you know, no, you had to be like a a doctor or you your parents didn't send you to
00:13:07
boarding school to become a firefighter. Yet, one of the guys in the top class, I
00:13:10
wasn't in the top class. He's uh he's a um an officer in the in a Roaroo. He was
00:13:15
a trainer for a long long time, but he keeps in contact with me. So, yeah. >> Isn't that funny? The school was trying
00:13:21
to talk you out of it like it was um beneath. not so much talk out of it, but it was not what I don't think they
00:13:27
expected people to want to do that kind of thing. But honestly, if I could do my
00:13:31
career all over again, I'd 100% do it again. I wouldn't I wouldn't do anything
00:13:34
else. >> Um, if from the picture you've painted of um a young Scotty, Tony Scott, it
00:13:39
sounds it sounds like you weren't a bad kid. You were just I don't know, bored,
00:13:42
reckless. >> I don't know. Like it's it's all fairly harmless stuff, but it um
00:13:49
>> Yeah. Could could you could you have imagined back then that one day you'd
00:13:52
you know grow up and get a Queen's service medal? >> No, not at all. >> Could anyone at school imagine that?
00:13:57
>> Definitely not. No, no, no, no, no. Definitely not. It's uh that was um
00:14:03
again you talk about um being silly and mom had a vauil viva and again Tims and um I thought it was a rally driver and I
00:14:10
dinged her car. Not badly, just a little ding. But mom was really angry like really really angry with me and you know
00:14:16
when I did get that was announced and you know friends do that really well. um she came down to government house with
00:14:23
the family and she was there and you know like I think as a kid you want to make your parents proud you know and um
00:14:29
you know sitting in that room listening to all those other people what they'd
00:14:31
achieved and what they' done made you really proud to be New Zealander but for
00:14:35
mom that was just um that was the best man that was I could I was yeah it was awesome be able to do that for her not
00:14:42
for her but it was awesome that she was there to see it you know >> yeah we'll get into that in more detail
00:14:46
later cuz I can tell how much it means to you so you started with the fire service at 18 Um what was it that first
00:14:52
pulled you towards that world? >> Um again like Tims was that was a real pivotal time. Um I had a after school
00:14:58
job um and you know in this in a small town that has a volunteer brigade the siren goes up and you so you're aware of
00:15:06
what's going on. I had a lot of friends uh like people that work the m school
00:15:10
job their husbands were in the brigade. Um and then 16 was the age to join. Um, and I got the 16 went in and then
00:15:18
apparently they the rates to 18 and it's like so so deflated. But in the floods
00:15:24
and things when it was a non-fire thing, they'd let me come out with them and and
00:15:28
um, you know, help them mop up stuff and and that kind of thing. And I just I just liked that part of it. Then um, 87
00:15:35
crash happened and um, I couldn't get a job in teams when when I left school.
00:15:40
Um, and so I came to Aland and one of the guys at um I was working with said, "Oh, they've lowered the age again back
00:15:46
to I don't think it was 16, but around the 17 mark." So him and I went to Glenn
00:15:50
Eden and we joined as volunteers there and um that's where it started. So So
00:15:55
yeah, but I I just and I I I did it because that was a chance to be able to do what I wanted to do, but my goal was
00:16:02
always to become full-time if I could. >> I I just noticed maybe it's the lights
00:16:07
in the studio. We've been hanging out for a little bit this morning and I I only noticed it now in the studio, but
00:16:11
there's a scar on the left hand side of your face, too. >> Is that from the line of duty?
00:16:15
>> No. Uh we moved to Tahiti when I was nine. My um um remarried. I got uh and
00:16:21
um he was a um been taken to to Tahiti to be a boat builder >> and um uh we were there for a year and
00:16:29
um uh we just moved out of town into a house and all I remember was um looking at a big outboard motor in this big
00:16:37
window and I hopped off this um probably it felt like the height of this table and I hopped onto this gravel area and
00:16:43
that's all I remember and apparently what happened was um this is after school um was This guy was on a on a
00:16:50
trail bike and they're on the opposite sides of the road in Tahiti and um he
00:16:54
was changing his reserve tank and he pulled the handlebars too far to the right and I was just in the wrong place
00:16:58
at the wrong time. Motorbike hit me in the back. Um broke my feur, took out my spleen as the bike went under me. The
00:17:05
pipe went across my face and my arm. Um they couldn't actually operate on my leg
00:17:09
um for 3 months until my burns had healed cuz in the in the in in the tropics. So, I had a horseshoe thing on
00:17:17
my knee which pulled my bones apart to keep it a thing. But the thing about that uh event was um it was so serious.
00:17:24
Um I was rushed into hospital and it's the first of my couple of life uh near
00:17:29
life death experiences. Um if it wasn't cuz Tahiti is a French naval base >> and if it wasn't for three naval
00:17:36
surgeons that were visiting the hospital at the time that gowned up and operated
00:17:39
on me, I wouldn't be here again today from that. But um yeah, that was um and
00:17:45
the weirdest thing I used to have nightmares up until that point of uh um and it was this big tall guy with a
00:17:55
big like a Stson hat and a and a coat. And he'd always take me up these stairs
00:17:59
and then um most times I'd wake up when he took me into this stairwell, but once
00:18:04
or twice I'd get to the top of the building and then I'd wake up. But this
00:18:07
time I thought, "Fuck it. I'm just going to go the whole way." and I and he threw
00:18:10
me off and and I went through the awning of the um of the that hit the road and then I woke up and there I was in
00:18:17
intensive care and my mom and my stepfather and that were all with me. Um yeah 3 months 3 and a half months I
00:18:22
spent in hospital in Tahiti but from that it was major trauma and um I had a really really bad stutter um from that
00:18:31
and I had a whole lot of other problems. I had to basically learn to respe again.
00:18:36
So in Tims I was in speech therapy um and that going through and uh I remember the ladies always telling
00:18:44
me you know 200 words a minute Rob Moldon speaks perfectly. Um he was the model that was the um but you know I
00:18:53
knew I had to be able to speak because if I wanted to be in the fire brigade I had to be able to talk on the radios and
00:18:58
do all that and not have a stutter. And all my friends that have known me for a long time will know that I could barely
00:19:04
start a sentence without stammering over something. So, um, that King Speech movie for me, I just I just bore every
00:19:11
time I watch that movie. It's so it's so emotional because, um, you know, as a
00:19:15
kid, you're getting teased, um, you know, all that kind of thing for your stuttering and and stuff like that. So,
00:19:21
to to to get through that and to and I love public speaking. I can hundreds of thousands of people and talk. It doesn't
00:19:28
frighten me in the least, but definitely get nerves before you go out and do it.
00:19:32
But I really enjoy it and and to come from to come from that to that, you know, it's it's been one of my probably
00:19:40
the biggest achievements um personally um to do that. But it's um yeah, it was
00:19:44
um was there was a lot of trauma involved in in that part of it. Yeah. >> How how did you overcome the stutter
00:19:53
>> that just practice and determination, right? >> Yeah. and just concentrating on starting
00:19:58
certain and there's even if you ask me which ones they were I can't but sometimes I know that when I bring guys
00:20:05
to attention I have to I have to say another word before I do it but it's so
00:20:09
said in my mind I just do it automatically I don't it just it just sets but mom would always uh said ever
00:20:15
since the accident you do everything too fast you eat too fast you drive too you
00:20:18
do everything too fast yeah it's like my life just sped up you know so yeah >> that that accident at the age of nine
00:20:24
that sounds very traumatic and I think For a lot of people, it could change their relationship with risk or fear.
00:20:28
Obviously, it didn't for you. Why do you think that is? >> Um, >> and you picked an occupation where
00:20:34
you're literally walking towards danger. >> But you don't think of it though, you
00:20:37
know, like like uh I remember as a volunteer, one some of my first fires I went to and I was I was
00:20:44
boarding with my uncle and auntie and you know you know you're trained to do
00:20:48
this, right? So, so um and but the first fire race you got into and you know put
00:20:52
out and and I was so excited when I got home to tell them all about it and they're both sitting there stunned
00:20:56
looking at me going but someone's house burnt down. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But but
00:21:00
you you know and and but you just don't think about it like you don't um and and
00:21:04
it's not to afterwards you probably look at it and go, "Wow, that was pretty
00:21:07
dangerous." Um or something happened. But but it's um yeah, but you you know
00:21:12
the training that they you get given, you know, and and as an officer too, you you have to do that risk assessment and
00:21:19
make sure you're not putting your guys into what you would deem um any risk that would be, you know, that there's
00:21:26
not enough gain for, you know, >> have you ever walked into a job and thought to yourself, [ __ ] this could be
00:21:30
it? >> No, you don't think of it like that. No, >> you think but afterwards you think,
00:21:37
"Wow, that could have >> I've seen like gas cylinders and things,
00:21:40
oh [ __ ] that was dangerous." But but like um but you know um or yeah, like I said, don't think about it, you
00:21:49
know, like it's um but yeah, lot of little things and it's um yeah. >> What um experience? So you've had almost
00:21:58
40 years. Does that make you calmer or just more like more aware of what could go wrong?
00:22:04
Um it's definitely painted a picture and like definitely things you know you can
00:22:09
think about things a lot better like for your dynamic risk assessments you know when you're looking at things and at the
00:22:15
airport you know when we go out and we have events and got my crews working and and and the way that we that we layer
00:22:21
things now I really only talk to the officers um so we're you know we we're
00:22:25
and and and everything we do is dynamic and evolving so so it's like if you try
00:22:30
one thing it doesn't work you know you move in same up north when we're at the
00:22:34
big wildfires and things um or an event like that, you know, you're working with
00:22:38
other crews. It's it's a it's a continual discussion until you've
00:22:42
resolved a situation basically. You know, >> when is is there a moment that you have
00:22:47
been most fearful of dying in the line of duty? >> No, no, no. Just um No, not at all. No.
00:22:53
Um um no because like with work at work um there hasn't really been anything um
00:23:03
no not work things outside of work I've ever had that that thought um but um but
00:23:08
no not that and and um even the like currently I'm in a wildland you know up
00:23:13
in the north and and I like because you know the danger of it I I think and there's not again I would never put
00:23:21
myself or um my crew in that in that line of danger, you know, like for something like if you had to answer like
00:23:28
the way I look at it is if if I lose somebody like my crew, I've got to answer to their family, you know, like
00:23:34
um and or my people, but you just wouldn't do it. I just can't see. Yeah.
00:23:40
No, it's all >> um being a a first responder to things like um like road accidents or fatal crashes.
00:23:49
Um no doubt you've seen things that most of us will never see and could never
00:23:53
imagine. Um yeah, what's that like? >> Um for me personally, when I did that um
00:24:04
and we had a bit of um I just shut off. It's it's um like it's just a job. Um
00:24:10
that's how I deal with it. Um and if if it's something um I've been really
00:24:17
fortunate that when I had children that I never had to deal with children. I know that some of the guys um that is
00:24:23
difficult. Um and um like I've had people my own age of you know and but like I said the way I deal with it is is
00:24:33
like shut off you know and if I have to look there's so many things put in place
00:24:36
these stages is so awesome that um if you get back and you know you need to talk they've got so many things in place
00:24:43
that you can do that um the mess table like I said before is probably one of the best place and you can see if
00:24:48
someone's not not themselves um and you have that chat. Um but it's um yeah I
00:24:54
like for me I just it's just a a thing I've got where I can do that. Um yeah I haven't really been affected too
00:25:03
badly. No >> I've had a couple of other members of the New Zealand Fire Service on the
00:25:08
podcast. Um Steve Divine former and um Joseph Sullivan gold medalist and um >> they they both speak of the black humor
00:25:14
involved and as a a coping mechanism. Yeah. Is that relatable? >> Yeah 100%. Yeah. Yeah. It's um yeah very
00:25:21
much and and it goes for the whole medical industry I think. Um but yeah yeah yeah very much so and that's very
00:25:26
in house what we um talk about like that but yeah yeah it is and it really helps
00:25:30
you know and there's always you know there's groups within groups um of your
00:25:36
friends and you know like it's so not uncommon to get a a phone call after you
00:25:41
know of something and hey mate even from personal perspective you know like you come to work and you're just not you and
00:25:47
mate the boys will phone bro you all right you know like and everyone's just
00:25:50
checking in on everyone you know it's it's it's really awesome What what stays
00:25:54
with you longer in this job? Is it the wins or the losses? >> Oh, the wins, I think.
00:26:00
>> Really? >> Yeah. um you know it's um I mean for us at the airport it's a medical
00:26:04
perspective and like I said to you earlier about some of the um it's helping people at their worst and giving
00:26:10
them a little bit of hope and and a bit of light you know and when I was more riding the vehicles and you have that
00:26:16
frontline experience with them uh it it's um it gives well for me it's a
00:26:22
happiness thing like I just really enjoy being able to give someone some comfort
00:26:26
now being a boss listening to the guys on the radio knowing that they're doing
00:26:30
a really a job makes me proud like a dad, you know, like and it's um that's
00:26:33
the sort of um feeling I get now. And and even when I hear the boys like in town and that doing good work, you know,
00:26:40
and you know who they are and and it's just like that's so awesome that they're
00:26:43
doing awesome, you know, and you hear them do something really awesome. It's
00:26:46
um it gives us a lot of pride as well, you know, throughout the service >> and um you know, you always want to hear
00:26:52
the good things of things, you know, >> when you're in a um like chaotic or
00:26:57
stressful or dynamic environment, like um how do you like how do you keep people calm? What do you do?
00:27:02
>> You've got to be calm for a start. And and um you know, we have these guys out
00:27:05
from New York and um I had Chief Hayden out. He was um at the time one of the divisional commanders that was in the
00:27:12
basement of the tower. Um, and you know, he we had a lot of like like a lot of one-on-one time and and he said to me,
00:27:19
you know, like you you you couldn't train for that, you know. Um, and but he
00:27:23
said the main thing, Scotty, was to to while we're thinking about what we're
00:27:28
going to do, we've got to remain calm in front of the men because the men see you
00:27:32
not calm, they're not going to be calm, >> you know. So, um, so that's one thing I
00:27:36
took from him. >> But it's, you know, taking that deep breath, giving it some thought, um, you
00:27:41
know, and and and just coming up with the decision. go for it. You can always change like if you come up with a plan
00:27:46
and it doesn't work, you can change the plan, you know, it doesn't mean you're
00:27:49
wrong. But I've I've been to a summit where um we got to be with um you know,
00:27:55
medical professionals um um like the SAS and different um overseas um organizations. And the same thing, it's
00:28:03
it's about having a reset. It's when you start to get overwhelmed, and this is
00:28:07
anything in life, you know, just what what have you got that you can do a reset with? um and then start again, you
00:28:13
know, and it's um otherwise you get overwhelmed and that's when you don't
00:28:16
actually realize what you're doing. So, yeah, that's probably the biggest thing
00:28:20
I just got to keep cool. Yeah. As soon as you lose your call, you you make rash decisions and they're often the wrong
00:28:24
decisions, right? >> Yeah, absolutely. >> What would you tell a young firefighter
00:28:29
about protecting their mental health from day one? talk to you. Um, so on a crew, um, you
00:28:38
know, have a senior person. Um, you have mentors, you have, um, people you can really, um, you know, there's people
00:28:44
that you you get along with, but some people that you can really go to, talk to them. Um, then, you know, talk to
00:28:52
professionals. Look, it's it's not when it years ago, it was a [ __ ] thing. You
00:28:57
know, you didn't talk to someone about, you know, you didn't go and get help,
00:29:00
you didn't go and do this. 100%. But it's not. It's absolutely not. You know,
00:29:05
like um and um you know, you need and this goes for anyone in life. You you you need to a I know your friends aren't
00:29:12
trained professionals, but at least open up to them, you know. Um and then like in our workplace, we've got people that
00:29:18
can that can help train to help. But outside of your workplace, you know, your doctor, those things, you've got to
00:29:23
do that, you know. >> It's important. >> In your early days, what was the
00:29:27
culture, if there was any culture at all about talking about hard stuff >> over a beer? afterwards. Um
00:29:34
>> stories really important. Um storytelling is is uh around again the mess table or afterwards or just having
00:29:42
it fun. But you know sharing the experiences and stories and how people dealt with those things and and it just
00:29:47
you know it it plants seeds in people's heads um to what cuz what we've done for
00:29:52
years is the same thing. It just evolves. Everything changes. you know, makeups of things change, but but and
00:29:58
our tactics can change, but but things stay the same and yeah, it's just telling stories and and for people to
00:30:05
understand where they can go. >> Did you ever struggle silently? >> Um, no. Not not not at work.
00:30:12
>> Um, no. >> Was there ever a moment where you you thought to yourself, actually, I'm not
00:30:18
okay. I'm not not doing okay here. >> Not work-wise. Um, I mean, we're both
00:30:22
worth that in life, right? um you know, different um but no, I'm I'm just so
00:30:26
busy and I love being active and I've got tons of friends and and um I'm
00:30:31
always really busy and I think keeping busy is a good thing. So yeah, that's
00:30:34
what I like to do. I just and it just keeps me um >> yeah, I just want to keep going.
00:30:41
>> Have you had to unlearn anything about toughness? and learn anything. You
00:30:48
>> think about more about I suppose like being open and vulnerable about things
00:30:52
and talking about things where maybe here 30 30 40 years ago it just wasn't a
00:30:56
thing. >> Um I mean I've opened up a couple of mates about a few things over the years.
00:31:02
Um and that again it's more on a personal basis than than anything I've done with work. But it's um yeah um fam,
00:31:10
friends and family. I I talk to Heather a lot about you know different things. Um but yeah, but it's weird, you know,
00:31:17
you can you can do something and and your mind's amazing. It just blanks it out completely like gone. And then
00:31:22
someone say, "Oh, you said that to me ever many years ago." Or did I don't
00:31:26
even remember it anymore, you know, like it's not little file in the diary. It's
00:31:30
gone, you know. But yeah, >> it's a very helpful um coping mechanism, I guess. So you're not you've never
00:31:38
experienced sort of PTSD or anything like that. You don't shut your eyes at night and have any sort of intrusive
00:31:42
thoughts. Uh, no, not really. Um, we we got to do um a body recovery once in the
00:31:48
harbor. Um, we was out of work. Um, and I remember um sadly it was a it was an event where um a friend of mine was
00:31:55
diving with a with a with a young guy and they got separated and and the young guy drowned and um the Navy and had gone
00:32:03
looking for this right out the man of our head so the visibility is sort of like this. Uh, and um we had a dive unit
00:32:09
at work when I first started, but it had been disbanded and another guy and myself um got asked if we'd go and have
00:32:15
a dive and we found him. Um and um I didn't think it affected me very much at
00:32:20
the time. Um and um um I again really spoke to Heather about it more than anything. Um and I didn't
00:32:28
get anyone to help me, but just talking to her was good. Um but um yeah, the the
00:32:32
guy um I mean people said, "Oh, you're a little bit different for a while." and
00:32:36
and and so if it was if it was anything um was that but um he had been down there for 8 days and we found him um um
00:32:44
so um but it just seemed again like the whole shut off mechanism but the one thing that I will say when we got there
00:32:51
um we had all the best laid intentions so we had um this little thing that you wear on your arm that was going to
00:32:56
inflate it cuz it was going to be a it's a crime scene technically so we were
00:33:00
going to mark him and let the police come back and get him and take him away and u we inflated this thing and it
00:33:05
tangled and and we realized we couldn't leave him there. So, um, you know, we we we
00:33:10
took him we had to take him to the surface and then and it was really rough. Like the waves were big and we
00:33:14
had to literally tie him to a rock or the coast guard came and and then but it was so I suppose a nice way for me was
00:33:22
uh and for the guy that was with me, Mark, um that we were able to give something back to the family um that
00:33:28
they could put him cuz the rumors had it before we went in that oh you've been
00:33:32
washed out, he's gone up the coast, you're never going to see him again, you
00:33:34
know that. So to be able to hand him back to the family for them to be be able to be buried and that was a really
00:33:40
cool um thing and we got invited to the funeral too which was really really nice
00:33:44
and it was a I suppose for me a little bit of closure for that part of it as well which was quite nice. So, um, yeah,
00:33:50
it was, um, it was definitely something for that. But, yeah. >> So, when that's your day at the office
00:33:57
and you you go home, um, to your partner, Heather, um, what do you are you emotionally shut off?
00:34:04
>> When she asks how your day was, you just go, "Yeah, good." >> She gives me a list of what you got to
00:34:08
do around the house. No, it's um, so I spend my four days in Oakuckland. So,
00:34:14
um, but look, I'm going home at the end of my set. Um, and depending, you know,
00:34:18
because she works three days a week. Um, so she might be home when I get home. Otherwise, like, um, like today she'll
00:34:24
be, she's a nurse, so she'll be at work and I'll get home and then, but um, but
00:34:28
we just spoke before, um, we meet up today. So, um, and we talked, you know, end of the day and she tells me about
00:34:35
what's happened at home or what's happened to her thing there. But, um, we
00:34:39
got a big property up up home, a couple of acres. So, um, you know, she has her part that she loves to do and I've got
00:34:45
all my chores and things that I've got to do, which I I do enjoy doing actually.
00:34:49
>> Um, but so, um, yeah, we do get our in the evenings, you know, we we talk a
00:34:54
lot. We talk a lot about all sorts of things, you know, like but she's when we
00:34:57
get to it, she's a massive part of the events. So, a lot of our time is talking
00:35:01
about what we're doing, um, leading to one one finishes, one starts. So, yeah.
00:35:06
>> Yeah. because she's a nurse and also she's your long-term partner. She's
00:35:09
probably quite empathetic and also good at spotting your [ __ ] >> So, if you try and um put some walls up,
00:35:14
>> what's wrong with you now? What? Why don't you use it? Yeah, I'm fine. I'm
00:35:17
fine. I'm really I'm fine. No, you're not. Yeah, I am. So, I'm good.
00:35:20
>> Have you ever had any therapy or anything? Mandatory counseling as part
00:35:24
of the job. >> Um I haven't actually. Um I've thought about it. um in one of the um cuz I live
00:35:34
in a small town, I rung this number and I think they contracted out to someone and it was someone in my Toastmasters
00:35:41
group and I went I'm not going to go see them, you know, like like um you know
00:35:45
what I mean? I was like, "No, okay, I'll give it a miss." Um but it's um and it
00:35:49
wasn't really I was thinking, "Oh, I should do that." But no, I didn't do it
00:35:52
in the end, you know, like it's um >> Yeah. >> So, uh you've got two kids who are
00:35:58
adults now, Charlotte and Harry. >> Yeah. Uh yeah. What what was it like going into life and death situations
00:36:04
with with them as young kids at home? >> Like I said, I said before, you just
00:36:09
don't think about the incident. I mean, unlike some of my colleagues and friends, you know, we haven't had um a
00:36:14
lot of those. I mean defin my son but um yeah you don't think about it you know
00:36:19
and I don't think anyone thinks about it you know like um you know like even when
00:36:24
Derek was you know my our friend in Tamahi you know he didn't wasn't thinking about that when he was outside
00:36:30
and you just you just don't think that job's dangerous sometimes at the most
00:36:35
>> you know I'm sure the boys that out at Amway you know didn't think that was
00:36:39
dangerous either what they were doing and then they got the landslide you know so
00:36:43
>> um you just don't think about those things you Yeah. >> Um with the Sky Tower Challenge, which
00:36:49
is um you're the architect of, and we'll get to that shortly, but um part of the
00:36:53
reason for that, as well as a a fundraising initiative, is to um acknowledge the firefighters that have
00:36:57
been lost, and there's um I think around 60 in New Zealand that have been lost in
00:37:01
line of duty. >> We we're gaining the list is quite complex. So, we we we take some off
00:37:07
sometimes because we really have to research that they were line of duty deaths. So, it's actually two events. So
00:37:12
the the May one is the is the charity run for leukemia. Oh sorry blood cancer New Zealand now. Um and in September we
00:37:19
do the memorial event which is like an ANZAC day for firefighters. So that's
00:37:22
the we do that one and they are both now at Sky City. Didn't start that way. We
00:37:26
had another building for it but yeah. So they're two separate events but very
00:37:30
special and very very different. Yeah. >> Yeah. Oh you've mentored a lot of
00:37:33
younger firefighters. How how can you tell if someone's cut out for this work
00:37:37
or not? My my analogy for that is would you stop in the rain to change a tire for
00:37:43
someone? Um and if you have those values um and um and have and for me it's a
00:37:50
pride thing watching someone come in and have immense pride in what they do. Um and you know for some people they join
00:37:56
it's just a job um and they just want to come for the paycheck. Um or um you know
00:38:02
in a volunteer sense maybe just come to wear a uniform. Um, you know, I've worked alongside some fantastic
00:38:07
volunteers and some fantastic permanent firefighters and a lot of pride, a lot of passion. Um, huge long careers. I
00:38:14
mean, you don't have to do a long career either. You know, we have got some fantastic guys that have done four or
00:38:17
five years. Um, and they just and sadly, um, our line of work in a professional sense doesn't always pay a lot of money
00:38:25
and some guys have some amazing skills and go off and do other amazing things as well. Joe Sullivan is a classic
00:38:30
example, you know. Um and um you know the golf do some other amazing things and so you're not always set in your
00:38:36
thing but um yeah looking at those um core values coming down and you know we look at things like teamwork and and
00:38:44
when we're recruiting and and and those things and they really play out you know
00:38:48
when when you you get them onto a crew and you just um I love watching the youngsters come on on now and and um
00:38:55
watching their enthusiasm and and and they want to learn and stuff like that and it's um it's really encouraging man
00:39:01
to see right now. Yeah. >> [ __ ] You just love it, don't you? >> I do.
00:39:05
>> Yeah. What What separates a good firefighter from a great one? >> Good question. Um,
00:39:12
>> is it all from the neck up? >> It's It's a whole lot of things. It's,
00:39:17
you know, you got to look after each other. Um, like I said, that pride, um, yeah, um, being there for one another,
00:39:28
you know. Um it's not an individual thing. Um you know um I mean I mean there are things that happen that
00:39:34
someone puts their neck out on on their own but you know there's always someone
00:39:39
behind you know like even that go back to the tanker fire you know like when when Roy went under the tanker there was
00:39:44
dozen guys involved in that you know looking up making sure that he could get in and do that job and we were almost
00:39:49
doing that thing you know >> I vaguely remember that story. Do you want do you want to out man right by
00:39:53
Rainbow? >> Yeah it's correct. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> So who was it? Roy
00:39:56
>> Kennedy. Yeah Roy Kennedy. um and he went under the tanker to get the little
00:40:00
girl that was trapped under there. But there was a number of guys on on deliveries holding the fire back while
00:40:06
you know they went under to do that. So you know it's not a oneperson thing and
00:40:10
I don't um think that any of the rescues that happen with the service you know
00:40:15
there's always someone else doing something and it's just you're that guy
00:40:18
that takes the grab or you're that guy that does their job. Um, and it's um,
00:40:22
but it's a team thing and and um, I I I did a I was in New York one time where
00:40:27
they had what they call metal day and just this blows your mind. This is like only in America story kind of thing. And
00:40:33
um, but talk about pride. So their firehouses like so let's just say um, uh, Parnell, let's use them for example.
00:40:40
Um, one of their guys got put up for for an award for rescue or it could be in a
00:40:44
pair or whatever. the whole house turns out, the whole fight and and then each each like the five barers have this they
00:40:51
set up a whole like hall for a party afterwards and they celebrate their successes, you know, and and um we don't
00:40:59
do that well here in in this country. We don't do it at all. But but um they it's
00:41:06
called medal day and they and they honor the top 63 rescues of the year. I mean,
00:41:10
think of that. Like that's just phenomenal. But, you know, there's instances like I heard of an incident.
00:41:14
It was down the white somewhere. I don't know what brigade it was, but you know,
00:41:17
there's some girl hanging on to a pillar of a um of a bridge and there's a
00:41:22
youngster and he's a really good swimmer. Um and he says to the chief, I can get her chief. And he looks at her
00:41:29
and he obviously did a wrist on Amic or something. Kid swims out, gets the girl,
00:41:32
swims back. I mean, that's just phenomenal, you know, like and to me that needs recognizing. Um we don't I
00:41:38
mean there's bravery awards for that. That's not part of the fire brigade. We
00:41:42
don't do that well. Um but but um I I I sometimes think some guys do some outstanding stuff. Um and I just think
00:41:50
we need to recognize some of them. Um and um but um yeah, but like I said, there's a lot more behind those things
00:41:57
than just that usually that one person, you know. There's um yeah, the guy on
00:42:01
the pump, you know, there's everyone around that's doing the job. It's not
00:42:05
just the guy inside, you know. Yeah, it's definitely more a team sport than an individual rockstar attention sort of
00:42:11
thing, isn't it? >> Yeah. When I was getting in, you know, you had to play rugby, either be on the
00:42:14
military forces, you know, they're looking for those attributes of um you being part of a team, you know.
00:42:22
>> Yeah. Um yeah, I suppose when you started it was like hyper masculine, uh
00:42:26
like you talk about just before, you know, the rugby and the the beer drinking. Um what did being a man mean
00:42:31
when you joined and has that changed? >> Yes. Um I was really a boy really like there
00:42:40
wasn't I know it didn't seem to be a lot of youngsters get in cuz I was just I
00:42:44
was last couple of weeks of being 21 I got in at the airport and I remember this old mar at the table
00:42:51
go when were you born son um 1970 I was on a job 1970 oh okay like this sitting at the table like this and I remember
00:42:57
years later um doing some paperwork for um this guy started and and I started in
00:43:03
9 uh 92 too. And I said to him, "So, when you born?" He goes, "I'm 94." And
00:43:09
and the whole thing came back to me. Oh my god. kidding, you know, and now half my crew weren't even born when I got in
00:43:15
the job, you know, like um but yeah, it was um like like I remember um like uh as a kid, you know, these guys all
00:43:24
smoked, they all like as a kid, you look at big mustaches, rough, you know, like
00:43:29
and but they were always so lovely to you as a as a kid, but they would have been men's men. like that would have
00:43:34
been hard like like um and um you know like things that went on at fire stations in those days like um you know
00:43:41
like I mean just men's men's world and you know when Barry started you know
00:43:45
break first woman and and now like I've got two women on my crew and on our station there's five and there's women
00:43:53
throughout the service and I mean that just that's evolved you know in time and
00:43:57
and um and our diversity and um yeah it's yeah it's way different place.
00:44:03
>> Yeah. Yeah. Well, there's even a a female firefighter calendar for this
00:44:06
year for 2026, which is awesome, right? >> Yeah. Yeah. >> It's really cool. You mentioned the
00:44:10
story before about the girl um hanging off the bridge. Um >> I only heard that. I I don't know what
00:44:14
the facts and that about that. I It was something I heard. I don't know if how
00:44:17
much that was. Yeah. >> Have you or um your team like you personally been involved in any
00:44:24
incidents where you know you were responsible for saving a life? >> Yeah. like um like our guys big part of
00:44:30
it marine for for work you know like um um you know like I said we work with Eagle I mean this other night there was
00:44:36
a a risk at 1:30 in the morning where a boat had sunk and and the call went out that these guys had life jackets they
00:44:42
had their phones they had that they made the call they were hanging on to chili bins the eagle was above them and the
00:44:48
hovercraft came in and picked them all up you know so um I remember once we were flying um the hovercraft flies uh
00:44:55
we're doing some training uh in the evening and we're coming back from only
00:44:58
hunger and um I'm in the right hand seat um on the on the radar and it and it was
00:45:03
still light and I remember glancing to my right and seeing a head in the water and I went stop turn around turn around
00:45:08
turn around and we turn around and I kid you not this guy was walking he was the
00:45:13
water was up to here he had mullet nets and everything on his um thing oblivious
00:45:17
swan dry on everything I got photo on my phone um completely oblivious to the danger incoming tide he was still at
00:45:25
least a nautical mile from the um from the coast and we came back, we picked him up, pulled all his gear onto the um
00:45:31
onto the hovercraft, flew him back onto the beach where his family was. I don't
00:45:35
think he would have made it back, you know. So So um >> was he scared or no?
00:45:38
>> No, man. God was completely oblivious to like he was just happy just walking back
00:45:42
to the beach, you know, like like he was had put his nets out and everything completely oblivious to what danger he
00:45:48
was in, you know, and and then then that that harbor is an amazing harbor. It's,
00:45:53
you know, full of um food and, you know, like a lot of people, but it's a completely d It moves so quick, you
00:45:59
know, like it's um and there's been all sorts of um things we've done. Yeah.
00:46:04
Guys have done some amazing work out there um with our marine stuff and like I said with our medical work, too, you
00:46:10
know, like we have such a short response time and the successes we have out there
00:46:14
too. Um really good buzz. So that's our line of work that we do and we're really
00:46:19
good for that. >> Yeah. When when you scoop up a a person like that old mate with the swany on, um
00:46:25
what's what's your demeanor like? What's his demeanor like? Is he is he grateful
00:46:29
or confused? >> He's a little bit Yeah, that day. And we you know, rather than you know, getting
00:46:34
angry with him and everything, you know, you just got to try and you know, slowly
00:46:37
talk to him. Hey, mate, you know, that was u not the best move, mate. You know, and oh, you know, and then you know, and
00:46:43
then you know, I think his wife was pretty upset with him when we got back to to to more trouble with her. Yeah, I
00:46:48
think. And you know, you can like leave it with her and probably get dealt with a home, but but like um you know, like
00:46:54
um it you know, we had another incident where um these two guys had um made a raft out of two kayaks and then
00:47:04
but the only one had sunk and and and the only this is crazy, but the only they didn't have radios or anything, but
00:47:11
someone was outside having a cigarette on a deck like Green Bay somewhere and heard them calling, put the call out and
00:47:16
then you know we we found them um uh they were hypothermic um all that sort of thing. So so you know like it's um
00:47:24
you have these great successes but some real luck as well with it and and it's
00:47:28
um yeah they probably been our big biggest successes from from where I work now >> when you um absolutely absolutely
00:47:37
unequivocally save someone's life is it a bond for life or is it something transactional and then the next day it's
00:47:43
just another day at the office? You mean when the crew? >> Yeah. Yeah. For you guys like the like
00:47:50
when when you when you and when it's absolutely clear that you've saved someone's life like it's
00:47:55
>> it's definitely a high going through the station, you know, on on the on the
00:47:58
crew. It's a real buzz, you know, like um you know, and and that lasts a while
00:48:03
and and um you know, then that's a story that's talked about, you know, like we
00:48:06
often talk about different things um from the years and different people and what they've done and and and stuff.
00:48:13
Again, it's that storytelling, you know, that's really important. >> Yeah. So, um, but yeah, definitely a
00:48:18
high, massive high, you know, and you can see the everyone's just like that next level. It's pretty cool.
00:48:24
>> Oh, there's no no greater you no greater pat on the back than that. E, like
00:48:29
knowing that you've been responsible for keeping someone here, >> I think, you know, like the couple of
00:48:33
times it's happened for me, um, you know, like you're doing CPR on someone
00:48:37
and they wake up and they literally talk to you and you just think, "Wow." Um,
00:48:41
and then you meet their family. You don't say anything, you know, like but you just it's just that whole like wow,
00:48:46
you know, you you're able to they're able to be back with their family again
00:48:50
and that's a neat feeling. Um and you just yeah that's a real thing that will
00:48:54
live with you forever you know like it's uh it's neat you know and I know a lot
00:48:58
of people have done it you know like it's um it's neat and and now our colleague our friends boys are going and
00:49:03
girls are going to these calls and getting those successes and and and I know that and if all the [ __ ] stuff that
00:49:09
they see and they see a lot more [ __ ] stuff than we do um you know those little wins are are um are good you know
00:49:17
>> you've um you've done this for so long and you're so like okay you've got all
00:49:20
these stories and it's just It's so hard to get them out of you. Like you just dropped the C CPR thing
00:49:25
before. Like 99% of people listening to this would would have never performed CPR on on another human being.
00:49:32
>> Um and it's just something something you do. So you you you're performing that on
00:49:37
someone. >> Um is it touch and go like at times like you think they may have gone?
00:49:43
>> Yeah. And when the St. And when St. on turn up and put in those amazing drugs
00:49:46
into them and you think there's no way we're going to get this and then they
00:49:49
just and they're back and and it's um but you know like advancements and in
00:49:54
and things as well is is phenomenal but now high performance CPR which is a little bit quicker than what we were
00:50:00
doing before and um you know it's just phenomenal what you can do and now defibrillators everywhere um and they've
00:50:08
just been a big thing and and like with what the airport does really really well
00:50:13
is that all our defibs that we carry click into the ones. So if someone grabs one off the off the wall and and and
00:50:20
uses it and I think the last half dozen successes we've had have all been because someone's pulled one off
00:50:27
the wall and and and started and you can't get them wrong. The thing won't
00:50:31
let you do anything wrong, but we can just plug in and carry on. >> Um so um that's um yeah, they've been a
00:50:37
huge thing, you know. It's um and and they're in supermarkets now and everywhere, you know, which is just
00:50:42
awesome. just not our ones, but yeah, they >> Yeah. Yeah. We're getting um I'm on the
00:50:46
Body Corp at my apartment and there's been, you know, emails going backwards
00:50:49
and forwards about anyone. They're only worth a couple of grand e they're fairly
00:50:52
inexpensive now and they're great lifesavers. >> Yeah. And and like there's a previous
00:50:57
boss we had like they have a life on them, you know, shelf life. And he he took them all. I don't know where he was
00:51:03
taking them. Um but they'd gone and he was going to give them to someone else
00:51:06
if they could be recycled or whatever. in the boot of his car. He's at the um
00:51:11
squash club that he plays at and someone had had a runs to the boot of his car, grabs one of these defibrillators out of
00:51:18
the car, comes back and someone used it and saved this guy's life, you know, and
00:51:22
it's just like, wow, look about, you know, little lucky being in the right place at the right time and having all
00:51:27
those things done, you know. So, yeah, pretty cool how that just makes a big difference to this world, you know.
00:51:33
when you and your team have been responsible for saving someone's life. What's the uh the reaction like
00:51:38
afterwards? Do they you often get sent box of Dunkin Donuts or a thank you card or
00:51:44
>> Definitely thank yous. Definitely the thank yous. And um I like to um I like
00:51:49
to get some food. Um no, no, no. For the table does, cuz you know, like sitting around together eating um like you know
00:51:56
how you try and get the family to eat every night and and everyone to be together? Well, that's us. Um, and so
00:52:03
the best like if if there's a recognition and there's any kind of form of money, the guys will buy food and put
00:52:08
it on the table for everyone to enjoy together. And that's the what that's our
00:52:12
custom. That's what we do. And so when they don't do that, I'll do that. I will
00:52:16
go and get some food and put it on the table and we'll sit and we'll enjoy that
00:52:20
success by eating together and and being together. And I think that's really
00:52:24
really important, you know. >> Well, thanks for sharing these stories. Um, should we talk about the Sky Tower
00:52:30
challenge for a bit? Yeah, man. >> So, you launched this in 200 >> five. So, there's a little bit of a
00:52:36
backstory to it before that. So, uh I think it's about 02 or 03. There was this guy at work called Regan Bridge. Um
00:52:44
barrel of a man. Um he was a actually end up being a strong man. He was like just legs like massive. And and the Sky
00:52:52
Tower was really new. Um and a come uh an event come they had this run in the Sky Tower and he went along and again
00:52:59
around the mess table he's like I'm going to go to the Sky Tower run. Oh
00:53:02
that's really cool. And he and he goes and does it and he ends up getting a time to be asked to be in the elite race
00:53:08
the next year. And um he told us about it. He goes but you know what I'm going
00:53:11
to wear my gear and I thought oo something about that just appealed to me. And um then the next literally a
00:53:19
year comes we're at the mess table again and he's doing this run and I thought I
00:53:22
haven't done any training. I'm not going to go. Anyway, he goes and does it. Um
00:53:26
and at that stage there was a couple of firefighters turning up to do it and then he left and I went along the next
00:53:32
year and there was um I was one of nine guys that got there and we were a wave there was like waves of um guys you know
00:53:40
elites and works different things and we were a wave of nine and um went and did
00:53:45
it and we just wore our gear not many masks like that just wore packs and we just turned up with our own gear and we
00:53:50
and and and we ran it and then I started going to love this the internet was a new thing in those Um, and I did the
00:53:56
search and this event came up in Seattle. Uh, there were about 800 firefighters and it was for leukemia and
00:54:03
um, and I thought, I should want to go to that. And so again at the mess table I'm like, hey, I found this the stair
00:54:08
climb in Seattle. Um, I want to go and like four other boys like hey we'll come. Okay. Um, and then we I wrote to
00:54:16
them and said, "Do you take international firefighters?" And it was actually the next week and they went,
00:54:20
"Are you coming next week?" And no, no, no, no. We'll come next year. And in
00:54:24
that year um we because it was America and we just didn't want to fund raise
00:54:31
for an overseas. So we said look do you mind if we fundra for our leukemia but um we come to your event. Yeah look one
00:54:38
big family no problem. And I remember um we did like a ton of stuff to fund raise
00:54:43
for our airs. We did a ton of stuff to fund raise for um for them. I remember the week before we left for Seattle, I
00:54:50
dropped in and uh then lean blood cancer was literally one lady who was the CO or
00:54:56
the pinch charge and a couple of part- timerrs and I dropped three and a half grand off and she said, "You got to come
00:55:01
back for a cup of tea, you know, and we have a chat afterwards and anyway, we go
00:55:04
to Seattle, I see this event and uh we just make so many friends and we had a blast. There's they're building 69
00:55:11
stories. You do a set of change halfway up. Um it was really into like really cool event and so I came back all all
00:55:18
pumped and then this guy Paul Reichen from this company gives me a call. He goes, "Oh Scotty, bad news." Um oh
00:55:24
that's right. There was one in between that. So from the from the nine of us I
00:55:29
wrote an article in what was called the Star magazine and I got 44 guys to turn up the following time. Not a fundraiser.
00:55:35
We just ran in this wave. I got a bit of gear. Did all that. But that in between
00:55:38
the next one when I've been to Seattle, get this phone call to say really sorry,
00:55:43
but this guy said he's ending the event. There's no more a run. And and so I'm at
00:55:47
home with her and I'm and I'm I said I'm going to write a proposal. And she just
00:55:53
laughs at me. I don't write anything. Um and she's like um she's like so I'm
00:55:57
going to go into Sky City and I'm going to present this um the proposal and I'm
00:56:00
going to see if I'll do a standalone firefighter event. And you know, often in life, there's that one person that
00:56:06
and if they said no, none of this ever would have happened. So, I had this two-page proposal, which is pretty much
00:56:11
photos. Um, and um, Sally Woods was was then the tower manager, and I remember sitting in front of her, and I said,
00:56:17
"Look, would you consider a standalone firefighter event?" And she goes, "Yes,
00:56:21
Scotty, I would I would consider it. Yes, we will do it." I just think she liked firefighters personally, but but
00:56:26
uh, so then the next year we had 88 firefighters. We did this event. Um, we raised 17.5,000. We just thought that
00:56:33
was the bomb, man. Like, we were so excited. Leukemia was excited. The next year we ran, we had 132ish firefighters.
00:56:42
We raised 34 grand. Pie here turns up with 17 1.5 grand that they raised on their own. And it just kept snowballing
00:56:49
um along from that. Um, do you want me to carry on or Yeah. Yeah. and and um and it got up to the point where we got
00:56:56
to um we're in our ninth year and we'd raised 482,000 I think and um like our our dining table
00:57:06
at home is would have to be the event planning central of the world and he just like yeah we should something
00:57:12
really big for the 10th year we should raise a million dollars and I went hey we just raised $48 how we going to raise
00:57:18
a million dollars next year you know and then with all my driving I'm thinking
00:57:22
about it I'm thinking about it and I think you know what a cup of coffee a day if everyone in the event did a cup
00:57:28
of coffee a day and I was like sometimes it would almost be a million dollars. So
00:57:33
we put this at the 9th dinner we put out this challenge which got accepted like a
00:57:38
proper moldy challenge um and it got accepted and um so it started for the next year and we got to on the night
00:57:46
we're at 8 like 90,000 or something and and I and then there was a call after the event
00:57:53
cuz there's money comes in after the event and there's a call after the event
00:57:56
to go out for one more weekend and have a crack and we got to 9:15 and I really believe that people were a bit
00:58:01
optimistic whether we'd do that in that year and um it was the following year
00:58:06
and nothing had been put out and I remember after the event finishes we go I'm with the girls and we're putting
00:58:11
labels on all the awards and everything and getting all everything ready and we're at $998,000
00:58:17
you know and the girls are like Scotty you got to stand up tonight and you got to like ask everyone for five bucks and
00:58:22
I went no it'll come in this tonight's to enjoy um we're not going to do that
00:58:27
and then someone's refreshing their phone and and they're like it's there
00:58:31
it's there a million And I have to tell you, man, I had to walk out of the room
00:58:35
where we were and just go in the hallway for a few minutes and have a moment because uh never ever did I ever think
00:58:41
that I would create an event that would raise a million dollars, you know. And then from that m from that year on
00:58:46
besides 2020 where it was 890 in co um we ra we've raised a million dollars and
00:58:52
then to last year when we raised $2 million you know um and um you know like it's so humbling and and um yeah it's
00:59:00
just it's just phenomenal where the events come from 17 1.5 grand to raising
00:59:04
2 million 32,000 last year. Um, and just when you're out there fundraising, the
00:59:11
people that give, you know, like, um, this little girl last week, you know, like she went to put some money in my
00:59:16
bucket with her $5 and she gave it a kiss and put it in the bucket. Like, look away, you know, and oh my god,
00:59:22
that's dirty. You can't kiss that money. Like, like it's um and and then, you
00:59:26
know, and it's just and the little things like um and this is how modern we're getting, right? cuz we got a
00:59:31
little tappy machine thing and and the little kids coming up with mom and dad's
00:59:35
card and then they'll say how much and they say well how much can you afford
00:59:39
you know like we only want what you can give you know like and it's like and
00:59:43
then they'll talk to you about it and then or the kids will come up and put money in their buck and I'll always stop
00:59:48
them and we always give a high five and always do their thing but always explain
00:59:51
to them what they're giving their money for, you know, and how it's helping
00:59:55
people. And then it's really cool cuz you see the parents explaining to them
00:59:58
why the the firefighters are doing that and why we're doing that, you know. So,
01:00:02
it's pretty cool. >> That's a great story. >> It's really cool. Um Yeah. You must feel
01:00:09
just immense. I I I can tell. I don't even need to ask this. The pride is immense, isn't it?
01:00:14
>> Yeah. >> So, the Sky Tower. Yeah. Um it's 1,13 steps. >> I've counted them
01:00:20
>> in full in full gear, which is what 25ks. >> It varies. So for what we say normally um now it's
01:00:30
about 22 24 kilos um air even weighs 2 kilos when you start you don't feel the
01:00:34
two the 2 kilo difference so 70% of the event would run that on air of course you got a mask on then we have a steel
01:00:43
category and that you can think he for this one so um for a long time in the transitional the steel cylinders weigh
01:00:50
um they weigh almost 18 kilos the whole pack compared to nine you know, double the weight, right? And so when it's one
01:00:56
of these cylinders was in the row, everyone, I don't want that cylinder. I don't want, you know, and then and then
01:01:02
and then someone would wear one and you people in in the line before they start,
01:01:05
man, you're wearing a steel cylinder, bro, that's hard. Like, you know, like
01:01:09
like this. And Heather goes to me, what's with these steel cylinders? Like they weigh twice as much. We should make
01:01:14
a category for this for this thing. And and and so now we have this thing called
01:01:18
firefighter steel and it's sold out. like a hundred of them wear these steel
01:01:22
cylinders like and it's just and they're like again like I say they're carrying
01:01:26
only 30 kilos up and and you know like you know like running like stairs the harder you train and you get fitter they
01:01:34
don't get any easier you know and and um so pulling sometimes up there with um
01:01:39
with those with that much weight then we have rural so um we've got them turning
01:01:44
up with I I call them pajamas they've got the because you know there's a lot
01:01:47
thinner but they wear these big hose packs And um we had chainsaws for a while without the chains on. Um but um
01:01:54
yeah um and but it was really hard to get like the packs were 500 bucks to buy and now I can just get hose packs for
01:02:01
free. Um and so the poor and they're horrible. They just dig into your shoulders and but they're so talk about
01:02:08
pride man. They just and they hump these things up. So they got their category. Um and yeah so yeah it it varies between
01:02:16
from 22 to 30 kilos. How many climbers on the biggest year? >> Uh last year we had 11,100 and this year
01:02:23
we sold out in 11 minutes. We got 1,200 this year. That's that's almost 10% of
01:02:27
the whole service at one event. >> Oh, so you have to cap it now. >> Oh yeah, man. We capped it for the last
01:02:32
not eight years. >> Yeah. And and um and we turned away 200 people. >> So So um it's it's immensely popular. Um
01:02:40
I think because it's almost turned into a bit of a reunion as well. like you
01:02:44
know you've got firefighters from the deep south catching up with their mates
01:02:47
from the far north and in between and you know it's like you look at the day
01:02:53
and out of the 21 days we've done it I think half a day of rain touchwood um
01:02:58
and uh you know it's just a festival like we're celebrating people that have made
01:03:05
it we're celebrating people that haven't made it um and it's just a sea of color
01:03:09
in the street and and just people get just catching up with people and it and and it's just creat created its own
01:03:14
vibe. And it's um and it's really immensely um rewarding for myself and the crew
01:03:21
that work with me to see everyone get that out of it after the day. And it makes us want to do it more and more,
01:03:28
you know. >> And the charity all the way through has been um Leukemia and Blood Cancer New
01:03:33
Zealand. >> Yep. Which just recently changed to Blood Cancer New Zealand. Um people um
01:03:38
there's more blood cancers than than leukemia. But yes, they have. And $18.2
01:03:42
$2 million to date that they've received from the event. >> Unbelievable. What why why did you go
01:03:48
with that? >> Um that's what it was in the States when I saw it. And weirdly enough, we've done
01:03:53
some charity work for the Burns Foundation and um you know, I should be the first person wanting to give to the
01:03:59
Burns, but you know, only so many a year, thank goodness, have to spend that time in middle more um when the Burns
01:04:06
units, but eight people a day get diagnosed with a with a blood cancer. Um and um like my grandmother passed um and
01:04:14
that wasn't the reason why I did it in any any way. She was in her like 80s and
01:04:19
you know sometimes there's a reason that we pass and the time and that was her
01:04:23
time, right? um but um that you know there but it just seemed the right thing to do because it
01:04:31
affected so many New Zealanders and I'm a real um advocate for cancers because
01:04:36
sadly for us in the job and I've lost a heap of friends in the job now to cancer
01:04:41
and cancer nine different cancers get firefighters and if you've done more than 25 years your risk of getting
01:04:46
cancer you know prostates leukemia bowel cancer there's so many um and that's why
01:04:52
I love doing stuff for the cancer foundation and all the different cancers because um it affects my my friends and
01:04:59
that so much and you know one and then it hits home and again really really hard and um one of my boys um who wasn't
01:05:07
a um always the best at attendance at work um but um he went sick you know and my boy Ethan who' come into the station
01:05:16
you know we're like uncles and he was 8 years old and then we he was a regular
01:05:20
visitor to us at the station um Ethan sick Oh yeah, Ethan. And and he was off for the whole four days, which was
01:05:26
unusual for this guy. And then I was driving home and I get a phone call, Ethan's passed away. And I went, "Oh,
01:05:31
what?" And then it was my Lloyd leukemia. And it was like an 8 day fight and he's gone. Um and um it's just like,
01:05:38
wow. And that one hit a close to home, you know, and um and that and now my rookie um she's 20 um on Christmas Eve
01:05:46
just got told that her uncle Dan um you know, has been diagnosed with with leukemia. And um that's another one
01:05:53
that's hitting close to home. But you it's just like so just you know and and
01:05:57
every year you get guys will say oh I'm doing it for this I'm doing it for this
01:06:01
and and um you know so it's one that just always keeps cropping up and they're not all you know the cool thing
01:06:07
not cool thing one thing about blood cancers is they don't they're not all
01:06:12
fatal. Okay, you can work with blood cancers, you know. Um but it's but it's
01:06:16
really awesome that um the money we raise goes to advocacy and 100% of the money we raise. um the charity only
01:06:23
holds the money and they've got it and they could and but they are working with
01:06:27
the Milligan Foundation which is these guys are doing these stem cell things and that's amazing the work they're
01:06:32
doing down there and a little bit of money going to help them now which is um really really cool and and um yeah I
01:06:38
think that at some point there'll be a cure to a degree >> um but you know that's why I'm so
01:06:43
passionate about it that's why I'm so passionate about um the cancers you know
01:06:48
and yeah it doesn't take me much if you ask me to help someone with cancer be
01:06:52
straight out there. You know, >> I could see you getting emotional then. It means it means a lot to you and you
01:06:58
wear your hat on your sleeve. Have you always been that way or you find that sort of crept up on you in your in your
01:07:02
50s? >> No, man. I'm I'm an idiot when it comes to like um you know, like I love
01:07:06
watching those reels when someone helps somebody and I always give, you know, no, it's just dust, nothing, nothing.
01:07:11
It's all It's all good. Um but yeah, I do um yeah, sometimes it just Yeah, does
01:07:18
does get you. Um and um you know I just love helping people and and it's just
01:07:24
and then you know even when you're out collecting you just get like this this
01:07:27
lady yesterday you know she went to put 20 bucks um and she goes what's it for?
01:07:31
And I saw it's for blood cancer New Zealand. Oh my husband's got lemia 50.
01:07:35
It's just like wow you know like and and and and just you just just get some
01:07:40
amazing stories from people and had this one old boy one day just hold me on the
01:07:45
hand and he and he goes they do this for me. And I said, "What do you mean do
01:07:49
this for you?" Well, I've had leukemia and I got helped. And he didn't know who
01:07:53
I was, you know? So, for me, that was so cool. Like, yeah, they raised all this money and they and they help us and they
01:07:58
did this and they've come and talked to us and it's like I didn't tell him who
01:08:02
it was and was it was a real nice moment, you know, like it's um it's cool.
01:08:07
>> It's powerful. E, did you ever imagine when you started this that it would
01:08:10
still be going 20 years later and be as big as what it is? >> No. No, not at all. Like um and No, not
01:08:16
at all. And now, you know, we've got successions. The amount what we've invested into this event, um, you know,
01:08:23
like for example, I tell you, the guys wear the air, right? And we borrow all these air packs and we use them four
01:08:30
times in the day. We've had to build compressor systems that can fill 120 cylinders an hour cylinders an hour. a
01:08:37
big fire. You're lucky if you fling 30 an hour, you know, like um so it's just
01:08:41
massive what um yeah, what we've had to invest, but it's just it's just a
01:08:47
snowball that keeps just getting bigger and bigger and bigger and um yeah, hard to explain, but it's immensely um you
01:08:54
know, and and I just want to also say that I might lead it, but I've just got
01:08:59
this awesome team around me um who are even more passionate what I am um and they just love it. and and my team that
01:09:06
helped me in the day and that's like 60 strong. There's a hardcore team around
01:09:09
me and then the wider group. If you try and get on the team, it's almost like
01:09:14
you got to have approval to get in. Like there's like a like a waiting list to
01:09:18
get in. It's a phenomenal, you know, like these guys and my cousin who's like
01:09:22
my brother, his wife runs the top and and um and Jody and and to get into the team, you guys Jod's approval, you know,
01:09:31
like like it's you know, and it's it's really cool, but they're so tight and
01:09:35
then and then one year I'm like, "Oh, I'm going to bring some more people in
01:09:37
to give you guys, no, we don't want a break. No, we're good. We're okay." You
01:09:40
know, like, okay. >> How much of your everyone gets the same amount of time, right? 24 hours in a
01:09:45
day, 7 days a week. How much of your e extracurricular time does this take up? >> Oh, a lot.
01:09:50
>> Yeah. >> Um, so Sky, the May event, 7 months of my of the year, not not every day. Um,
01:09:57
and you know, there'd be a phone call to um to Jay Dan at the moment who's my
01:10:02
contact at lemia on that one. Um, you know, then memorial overlap that when we did the calendar that over overlapped
01:10:10
that um, you know, there's always something going on behind it. But I've
01:10:15
got to be active, you know. Then there's the farm and then there's my fishing if
01:10:18
I can get out fishing. There's always something going on, you know, like it's
01:10:21
um, >> Yeah. >> Are you an active relaxer? >> 100%. >> Yeah, I'm the same. I'm just no good at
01:10:27
binge watching TV shows. E, I've got to be >> a picky blind through co was my was my
01:10:32
uh, was my out, man. I just watched it one after another and then it got to the point where like 2:00 in the morning and
01:10:36
I'll be going to work the next day and like no one more episode, one more episode, you know, like but besides
01:10:40
that, >> do you think you might have um undiagnosed ADHD? >> I listened to someone you did the other
01:10:46
day. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. >> We're that lost generation. It was it was just not a not a not a thing. But um
01:10:54
I don't know. I I kind of I kind of like who I am. Like I like that I that I'm
01:10:59
busy and I'm doing stuff all the time. >> Yeah. >> Um Yeah. you received the Queen's
01:11:03
service medal in 2016. How much of that was because of your work with the fire service and how much was it because of
01:11:09
the um the Sky Tower challenge? >> So, um you don't get told exactly although when they read it out so a lot
01:11:16
of it was run the Sky Tower. Yeah. And it was service to the community. >> Um so that was pretty much Yeah. Yeah.
01:11:22
And and in 16 Yeah. Um Yeah. Yeah. It was it was that and the memorial and the calendar and you know the different
01:11:31
things that I was doing. Yeah. >> How was that initially? Was that all We talked before about how it's um a team
01:11:36
thing and there's no sort of individual um stars. How did the individual attention or the spotlight being on you
01:11:42
sit with you at least initially? Oh, it's it's very humbling like cuz you get
01:11:46
a letter to say that um you know or you've been put up for it and and then you have to say that you want it um and
01:11:53
and so you write back and then um and then you got to keep a secret you know like and then they they put it in the
01:11:58
paper and it gets announced and then it's a little while before but um I tell
01:12:03
you they do that part so well down in government house you know they make you feel so special and like fins I think we
01:12:10
could take we took there was Heather and the kids and and Heather's mom and and
01:12:14
my mom, we all went down and and it was um was and we went for a couple days, you know, and was an awesome um
01:12:20
experience. And then my best friend at the time was living in Wellington, so I he came as to the uh investor show as
01:12:27
well. And then we all went out to dinner that night um as a on as a group. And it's just really neat to be around real
01:12:33
close friends and family um for that. and and um but yeah just well um everyone was just really proud and and
01:12:39
it's and it's lovely to to be recognized for that and and um like you hear of
01:12:43
guys going oh you know do you accept it but like what it takes to I'm trying to
01:12:47
put someone forward for an award now and it was denied the first time so I'm
01:12:53
really making and it's really hard like it's not as you like you read them and
01:12:57
you think oh they must get them out like lollies but they don't you know like
01:13:01
like it's what those and what you see on those things is very little to what
01:13:06
they've actually really done and and um like you've just got to experience
01:13:11
hearing what some of these people done. It makes you immensely proud to be a New
01:13:14
Zealander like like um >> um you know people give their life to something or an organization and you
01:13:20
know in this country a lot of these people wouldn't get things if people didn't help you know and it might not be
01:13:26
Yeah. just just wouldn't you wouldn't have what it has. >> Yeah. Yeah. That's one thing I love
01:13:30
about doing this podcast which I've been doing for four years now. Um, I mean
01:13:34
there's there's famous people that you can have on and everyone knows who they
01:13:37
are. Um, but then it's just made me aware of how many New Zealanders are out
01:13:41
there doing incredible stuff that you never would have heard about. >> That's cool. Who Okay, so you get the
01:13:47
letter and you told to keep it a secret. Who do you tell? You tell Heather. >> Yeah. Did she open the letter before me?
01:13:53
She was crying cuz it has it cuz it's quite official and I think she might have thought I was in trouble or
01:13:57
something. But um but but like um Yeah. So, you get that. And um I told No, I didn't tell. I told mom only a few days
01:14:04
before um before it was to be announced cuz it was it was a Queen's birthday
01:14:09
one. Um they do New Year's and they do Queen's birthday. Um so, yeah, it was um
01:14:14
yeah, and I just told no one else. Just really didn't tell anyone. Um so, um and
01:14:18
waited for it. Yeah, that was cool when it when it came out. And and my flat mates, Oakland flat, they gave me a lot
01:14:24
of [ __ ] about it, which was cool. It was just really goodarted stuff. Yeah. Oh, you you've got a flat on on base at
01:14:31
Oakland airport. Um, sounds like a like a middle-aged frat house. >> Yeah. Heather, this thing's going to
01:14:36
come to Oakland just party the whole time. It's it's not quite like that, but
01:14:40
yeah, it it works well for us and for a lot of us guys now. Um, we moved out of town um and we commute back to Oakland.
01:14:47
So, it's worked really well. Got a couple of fence boys with us as well and um yeah, works well.
01:14:53
>> Um that award, the Queen Service Medal, did it mean more to you or your family?
01:14:58
Um, good point. Actually, I mean, cuz how Charlotte would have been probably late
01:15:07
teens, early Yeah. Yeah. Late teens and Harry was only like maybe just a teenager and um had to get him a suit to
01:15:14
to go down. It was pretty cool. Um, yeah, they were like I mean, yeah. Sh they're both super stoked the whole
01:15:20
whole way through. Um, I suppose you don't think about it so much anymore, you know. Um uh but yeah, I know for
01:15:30
Heather and for mom and and that yeah, she's and my I got this I had he's
01:15:35
passed away now, but my my real gruff uncle. Um and um he was real hard on me like all way growing up. I remember him
01:15:42
having a moment with me like really proud of your son, really proud of you, which was from him was like really
01:15:47
massive for me, you know. So that was pretty cool. But it's um and it's um
01:15:51
Yeah. Yeah. And then even and again someone brings it up and you know QSM and it's like oh it's Yeah. And and it
01:15:57
is and it's it's a huge honor to have and um I mean and I wear it um they give
01:16:02
you so with my service I I I wear it each day with with my thing. So um yeah I'm I'm really proud of it.
01:16:09
>> Do you lean into it? Do you use the letters after your name on an email to
01:16:13
sign off or >> No. >> Oh come on. >> Too much [ __ ] from your cooworkers.
01:16:17
>> Yeah. Yeah. It's um like it has its place I think. And and you know like I
01:16:21
ironically was in the terminal of a day and so Graeme Henry walks past you know and and and um like um you know I had a
01:16:28
we chat with him and but you know like I know that there's a time and a place
01:16:31
that you called him by those those titles and and that thing but it's Yeah. >> That's really cool. Yeah. Early on in
01:16:39
the chat you mentioned um your your dad being absent from a young age. Is is he still around?
01:16:44
>> Um Sad passed away last year. Um he was in the States for probably the last 30
01:16:48
years of his life. Um, and I was adopted as well. So, and I know my whole family.
01:16:52
So, um, my, um, my birth father lives on the barrier on the island and I've met
01:16:56
him. Um, and, um, but my, um, so I call I call mom that raised me mom and my birth mother ma'am. Um, and, um, so
01:17:07
there's that, um, distinction. But, um, yeah, he we were still really close. Um,
01:17:12
and you know, we'd keep in touch and when I'd go to the States, I'd hope to
01:17:16
go and see him. Um there was a time that he was just not there for a bit. Um but
01:17:21
um yeah um and and sadly he passed with cancer in the in the end. Um but um yeah
01:17:27
we were in touch right to the end. >> Yeah. >> What did he make of the uh the medal?
01:17:31
>> Oh yeah. He was like he just had all these photos you know you go visit him
01:17:35
and like it's like and cuz I was his only only child and you know he's immensely immensely proud like he would
01:17:41
always uh get really emotional with me about it too. Yeah. That actually cracks my bit but yeah. Yeah. real. Um, he was
01:17:47
they all are already. Mom is is proud as well, but he was real proud. Yeah. >> Did Did he Did he ever apologize for
01:17:53
being an absent dad or did he need to? >> Uh, yeah, he did. Um, yeah. Yeah, he did. Um,
01:18:03
yeah. And you know, he had like my memories, he would spoil me. Um he he did this thing like I think was it 201
01:18:11
17 or 18 I was going through the states and I stopped to catch up with him and um I remember when I was 14 you know
01:18:17
Commodore 64 was the big thing and the floppy disc drive was the and and and and he pulled this letter out that that
01:18:23
I'd written to him um convincing him why I needed to have a floppy disc drive
01:18:27
rather than a tape drive for my Commodore 64 and it was such [ __ ] that I'd written in this letter and and he
01:18:34
pulled the act letter out and he actually when he's passed his his partner sent it all all those things
01:18:38
back to me. So, I've kept them. But, um but I was I was trying to convince it
01:18:42
was for my homework, but it was for the games I wanted to play on the um on the thing. And um
01:18:47
>> for anyone of a certain age that's listening to this, they won't know what
01:18:49
we're talking about. >> I know. I know, man. These things are huge. And you know, they couldn't do
01:18:54
jack [ __ ] I know. >> I know. Yeah. And we only use them on rainy days like my son that plays gaming
01:18:59
all the time. But it's um but yeah, it was um Yeah, they didn't. and and um but
01:19:03
he yeah we did some I mean as you get older you know like he he is my my dad but he was just a really
01:19:11
good friend you know like and it was neat like I would just go and spend three or four days with him and we would
01:19:17
just go from literally cafe to cafe or go somewhere and sit and have another coffee or and just talk and that's all
01:19:23
we do and and you know like I always say you just want to it's better to see
01:19:27
someone alive than in a box you know and and um if you can spend as much time with people and just talk to them and
01:19:33
and um you know, you got to have those memories um for when they're gone, you
01:19:36
know. >> Yeah. Oh, did you end up did the letter work? Did you end up getting the
01:19:40
Commodore 64 computer? >> I think I did. >> Yeah. Did you maybe your proposals are
01:19:45
better than what you thought was the one to the Sky Tower? The one to your dad? >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Maybe I did.
01:19:50
>> Maybe you're quite the wordsmith. >> Yeah. It's um I got the leather jacket
01:19:54
too when when the leather jackets were called as well. I got that. Yeah. >> And this has been a great conversation
01:20:00
today. Well, um, what do you hope younger firefighters take from your generation?
01:20:07
>> Um, our traditions. Um, um, yeah, our traditions where never forget where we've come from. And like I know
01:20:23
firefighters hate change. Um but sometime um but I like to use it the word evolve rather than um change. So
01:20:32
you know like um I was joking the other day when I started you know the breathing apparatus that we were used
01:20:38
seriously had to like this big it was like a line with this big knob thing that you clicked and it went click and
01:20:45
went into positive mode and and would would go and it'll be a a plus which means it was in positive air. I mean now
01:20:52
we have um we have like computers that can tell the board how much air you've
01:20:57
got and um you know thermal imaging cameras that used to be this big that are now tiny you know um I mean the
01:21:04
advancements and the acknowledge and the technology that's coming into the job I
01:21:08
mean the trucks are just computers on wheels you know um there um and to a point where it's leaving me behind a
01:21:15
little bit you know like like um you know like everything's computerized um and uh sometimes Um so yeah, we evolve,
01:21:23
everything evolves, but um you know, like we've got to remember um all those
01:21:28
guys that walk before us and and what they did and and um you know, things change, but some of the things uh the
01:21:35
science and the and the basics stay the same, you know, and you got to pass on those skills. And that's skills can be
01:21:41
really passed on like I've said before about storytelling and and and uh you
01:21:44
know I learned so much from around listening to older boys talk about what they did when they went into a certain
01:21:50
situation and sometimes you get yourself in that situation and you think oh that
01:21:53
Arthur said that or someone said that and you try it and it works you know and it's um and the other thing about the
01:21:59
younger guys is to you know I hope that the older guys are teaching the younger guys you know I remember being a young
01:22:05
guy and um been in a situation where they they pull you from the back and say here and then they start showing you um
01:22:12
what to do or this to do or or um you know giving someone an opportunity not taking the lead all the time and giving
01:22:19
someone an opportunity to to to learn and and to go from there and and it's um
01:22:23
but you got to like I suppose in a way um I know you can come in if you're all
01:22:27
bullshy the boys are like not going to say anything you know like and but it's
01:22:31
um yeah those are the things I'd like to see and I see it happening with where we
01:22:36
are and I know it happens within the services as Well, you know, and and it's
01:22:39
and you just get someone that's en energetic um and they want to learn and they want to understand and all you want
01:22:45
to do is give them all that knowledge, you know, and because they're going to
01:22:48
walk in your steps after you, you know, and and and it makes you when you hear them do something really amazing, it
01:22:53
just makes you feel really proud. >> If a um young man or woman, say 19, 20
01:22:58
years old, walked up to you and said, "I want to join." What would you tell them
01:23:01
they're signing up for? >> Well, for me, an awesome career. I make when I was selling the calendar I go
01:23:07
through cafes and the moms and you know my son or my daughter wants to become what I got to do and you know I remember
01:23:14
um you know and and they don't want to hear this but you go oh you know they
01:23:17
really want to be around 20 you know like have a little life experience um you know to get in and and um because I
01:23:25
when I was a volunteer at you know 17 18 and I was about 19 and I was at an event
01:23:30
and there was a 17 year old there and I was saying something and I and I must have scoffed And my then officer goes,
01:23:36
"That was you two years ago." You know, and it's like and and and it's
01:23:41
then that you learn that, you know, you're just a boy or a kid growing up in
01:23:45
a man's world, you know, and and um and and it's like I remember trying to go
01:23:50
for promotion when I was younger and the guys interviewing you going, "How you
01:23:54
going to deal with older older people?" And you have an answer. And even to the
01:23:58
final time when I got promoted, I had this panel in front of me and they're talking to me and they're going, "How
01:24:02
you going to deal?" I said, "I got gray hair now. What do you mean older people?
01:24:05
Like like um you know, yeah, you know, I'm old like what do you what do you mean? You know, like and they just all
01:24:09
laugh, you know, and it's just like, man. Um but it is, you know, cuz you get
01:24:14
that push back, you know. Um you talk to guys in other services and you're a new
01:24:18
officer and and they'll try you, you know, they'll they'll push you to see
01:24:23
where you're and it's like kids, kids are the same. Just push your parents
01:24:26
boundaries. >> That's it. They want to know where the boundary is, you know, and you go from
01:24:29
there. And it's um and it's just you know that give and take you know you
01:24:33
look after the crew they look after you you know and it's having that um there
01:24:37
that you can't be who you are without them as well you know so >> what what is expectation versus reality
01:24:44
with this job from an outsers's perspective I can tell you what I think a firefighter is and you probably have
01:24:49
the same perception and then you get in there and you realize it's something
01:24:51
completely different. Yeah, it's um yeah, I know what you're saying. Um and
01:24:58
you know, you get people, oh, it's easy, your job's easy, you just get water on
01:25:01
fires, you know, and it's like, yeah, not quite that easy, but um but you know, it um
01:25:10
it's a it definitely is a career, you know. It's uh um and like I said before,
01:25:15
you know, whether you do this career or this job for a few years or you really make it your career. Um things have
01:25:21
changed a lot and people have changed a lot where when we started there was age limits.
01:25:27
You had to be 18 to 27. Uh airport was 22 to 30 >> and you were a day outside that don't
01:25:33
ever apply. Um retire at 65 gone. Um you know um and now you can stay on longer.
01:25:39
Um not that we do. Um but you know that starting age we can we can hire guys at 40 now you know and um there's a lot
01:25:47
more balance in that you know people have tried a few careers um and in some cases had a huge career like very um
01:25:53
well-paying careers and they've come to this job because they want to be with
01:25:57
their family or I never missed a school trip ever you know like I was able to get time off to go all my kids trips and
01:26:03
and and stuff like that it was awesome um and um why do I love it so much um and that from that respect Um yeah, it's
01:26:12
just um I don't know, it's hard to say. It's it's like I'm always home, you know. I I
01:26:19
go from home to home. >> Um and um I got a really big crew. I mean, a lot of these guys are just four
01:26:25
guys on a station, but I mean I've got um you know, 13 on duty, 16 on a crew.
01:26:31
Um and you know you live and breathe like at the moment you know like you know what's going on in all their lives
01:26:37
you know um and you know all their kids come in and you're that uncle and and um
01:26:42
you know we had a big family day Sunday where they all came the whole everyone's
01:26:47
family came and we had big lunch together and um you know everyone got all the kids got to play and um you know
01:26:52
it's it's cool and you and to the point that you watch guys join you watch them
01:26:57
meet someone you watch them get married have a family. You watch those kids grow
01:27:01
up. I even I've even had um as a volunteer uh a friend of mine. I held um Steve in my in my arms as a as a few
01:27:11
days old and he was my rookie about 2 years ago. He wasn't my rookie. Um, so
01:27:15
you know, you have the whole, in fact, I I can't find the photo, but I kept telling him we had an under the sea
01:27:21
party in the flat we had out west and his mom came as a beach ball and he was inside the beach ball in the thing, you
01:27:28
know, like um so yeah, it's um you know, so you have that evolution of these
01:27:33
kids, these babies, and then they become they they they work with you, you know,
01:27:36
and it's that's really cool. and and like where I am now, we got a third
01:27:40
generation um working with us and and you see it all through the services, you know, where um granddad, dad, daughter
01:27:48
um you know, it's pretty cool. >> Intergenerational >> 100%. >> Yes. So, you're 55 now. You're you're
01:27:53
the old cut off age. >> Uh yeah, 65 was it was 55 now 65. Yeah. So, I would have only had 10 years to
01:28:00
go. Yeah. And I sort of have here. >> When are you going to when are you going
01:28:03
to stop? >> You know, we've been talking about this. me and a couple of the boys. Um um I
01:28:08
reckon I'm going to go to 67 at my birthday at 67 and then I'm going to I'm
01:28:13
going to go. Yeah, it'll be unless something happens. We go through medicals every two years and so um every
01:28:19
medical I go for I thought this could be me, you know, but I'd be happy if it was
01:28:23
um um I mean I've just had the best career. Um so I would be really more than happy and I just keep doing other
01:28:30
stuff, you know. >> Yeah. 67. Um, will you blow out the candles with your with your mouth or
01:28:36
with a hose? >> You know, um, I can't remember what age Heather was at the time, but um, I think
01:28:42
she's in her 30s and I put I did this dump thing and put 30 candles in your cake and lit them. What a mistake that
01:28:48
was. Destroyed the cake. The heat that came off that off those candles. Now I know why you put the three in the one,
01:28:54
right? And you just like two candles. >> Cuz by the time you get to candle number
01:28:57
30, number one is waxing all over the >> just the worst. Yeah. Yeah. So, >> when do you think you've been your
01:29:04
happiest? >> Oh, good question. Uh, I like to say I'm always happy. Um, like
01:29:13
>> half full kind of guy, eh? >> Yeah, I just got heaps of friends. Um,
01:29:17
that's something that mom always says to me. You just talk to everybody, you
01:29:21
know, like and I'm Yep. And but look, I value my wealth on my friendship. Um,
01:29:26
and you know, I've just got so many friends. I just feel incredibly wealthy like that. And uh you know I remember
01:29:36
one of my mates pranking me on on New Year's Day and he phones me up and he's
01:29:39
like, "Bro, I'm in Ter. Can can you come and get me?" And I went, "Yeah." And I
01:29:44
was about to hop in the car. No, no, no, no, just kidding, bro. Off the road. Can
01:29:46
you come and get me? But you know, how far would you go for a mate? you know, like and and I know my close friends, we
01:29:53
would all do that for each other, you know, and and um like Heather would hate, you know, she hates how someone
01:29:58
rings and you always drop something for someone. And I got really ill in in '05
01:30:03
and and um I was in hospital for a long time again and I was in the Wakadi brigade then as a volunteer as well as
01:30:09
being at work. And every night they all came to the house and they made sure here they had the firewood stack, they
01:30:14
had this, they had that, they and I think that's when she saw that kind of brotherhood to a degree and and um yeah,
01:30:22
she saw that and and then um that was pretty and we always look after each other, you know, and like um you know,
01:30:28
I've had guys up at home get ill and you know, we got a fund and so we'll just go
01:30:33
get like um we don't have Uber Eats at home, but like we would get like vouchers and they just get they can get
01:30:38
meals delivered. um you know, prep meals and make sure that they're all okay and
01:30:42
and we always looking out for each other, you know, like um and from a from a if someone gets hurt or something like
01:30:49
that, you know. >> Yeah. Well, you reap what you sew, don't you? For the most part.
01:30:53
>> Yeah. True. >> There are people that take advantage of you, but generally you find in life
01:30:57
>> don't last long in our job. They don't last long in our job. If you give and
01:31:00
don't take um if you take a give, sorry, then yeah, you don't last. >> Yeah. The All Blacks have this famous no
01:31:06
[ __ ] policy. I'm guessing it's the same sort of thing. even if it's
01:31:09
unwritten uh with the fire service. >> Yeah, I think you'd get pulled aside by
01:31:12
someone, you know, and and have that chat. It's um Yeah. >> What would you say your best and worst
01:31:18
habits are? >> Um probably taking on too much is be um >> Do you struggle to say no to things?
01:31:26
>> Yeah, pretty much. Um, and I'm getting better at it as I'm getting on and I
01:31:30
have this kind of kind of philosophy of like the shelf these projects on and and
01:31:35
I'm getting better at like um like when the calendar ended um like with the one
01:31:39
I was involved with um and it it it freed some time up. I was like oh I got some time to do something else. So, so,
01:31:46
so like um not being able to do that um have having yeah not overcommitting and it's getting well getting easier on
01:31:55
trying really hard not to take on too much more. >> Um when I had Steve Hansen on the
01:32:01
podcast, he's got a theory that um uh generally a person's best habit is also
01:32:05
their worst habit. >> Um yeah, maybe that's true with you. >> Yeah. Yeah. Good point. Um
01:32:11
>> you're such a giver um it's the your best quality but also your worst
01:32:15
quality. Yeah. Yeah. Probably right actually. >> Yeah. >> What are you most afraid of?
01:32:22
>> Man, what I'm most afraid of? Um, >> what you do for a job is what most of us
01:32:27
are a worst fear. I was just talking to the lady outside and she said that Hannah um
01:32:33
McQueen um does a thing and so some she's someone I'd love to talk to because um you know I don't want to I
01:32:39
suppose what I'm most afraid of is when I retire as a I've I've got enough save
01:32:44
that we can I don't want to live a lavish lifestyle but I want to know that I can go and get a bottle of milk and
01:32:48
and and a loaf of bread without um without having to worry about things you know and uh so I suppose
01:32:56
um having being making sure that myself and my family are secure when I finish work
01:33:02
because I don't want to be one of those guys that works cuz I have to work really hard cuz I've got nothing, you
01:33:06
know? Um I want to just do a couple of days a week and help some mates out or do something and for and more help some
01:33:12
mates out to keep out of Heather's here, I think. Um and keep her happy than
01:33:16
thing what I mean, you know, and do fishing and be able to afford what I want to do after I've worked for so
01:33:20
long. And that's probably the biggest thing. >> So you're 10 12 years away from
01:33:24
retirement age. Is is that a real concern? Is it >> concerned that look look I feel like I'm
01:33:29
doing enough and and it's weird like you know when you you talk about that generate thing and and we were on a
01:33:35
different sort of scheme and it's only now just starting to like flourish but
01:33:39
but it but it's things like um and one of dad's friends that I catch up with
01:33:43
twice a year you know and I got him he's a really was a senior accountant when he
01:33:47
was working and you know I sat with him and he said you have to have this much money and then it will pay this much
01:33:52
back and but he's one of these guys that likes to invest and I'm like Oh, I can't
01:33:56
see it. I'm not sure about that. And I'm a bricks and mortar guy, but then I
01:34:00
don't want to have tenants and oh, you know, like I I don't worry about it, but
01:34:05
it but it's one of those things where I just want to um yeah, I just want to
01:34:09
know I've got which I think I will, but but it's just it's just interesting. And
01:34:13
now I'm in a position where what do I do to make it better, you know, like like
01:34:17
and and it's um and there's honestly there's some neat people at the moment
01:34:21
that can give some really good advice, but you know, you can get advice, but it's with your take or not, you know.
01:34:26
>> Yeah. Well, I I you mentioned Generate before. They've been my show sponsor for
01:34:29
three years now. Generate Kiwi Saver, they do an amazing job. >> Can't speak highly enough. I've got my
01:34:34
partner into them. I've got my mom into them, the rest of my family. That's how
01:34:37
much I believe in them. Do you have any regrets? >> Oh, yeah. Oh, probably financial wins.
01:34:44
But but but but um uh regrets. Um I mean there's little things in life, I suppose, um that you could have done
01:34:53
that may have changed, you know, the pathway pathway pathway you take. Um not big ones. Um I mean, yeah, there would
01:35:00
be like hindsight, you know, like with maybe selling the house and not buying that one or doing that. On any regrets,
01:35:06
probably really minor in the third world problem, not a um not a anything serious.
01:35:12
Yeah. Um, yeah, it that's, um, it's a worry about the financial thing. I mean,
01:35:18
it's been a life of service. You've done so much for so for so many others. Um,
01:35:22
it would be a reasonable expectation that you'd been financially secure when
01:35:25
you retire. >> I will be. No, look, don't get me wrong. I I it's something that we love to talk
01:35:29
about. Um, you know, like subjects that you talk about. No, I I just want to like with what I've got, I just want to
01:35:35
make sure I've got enough. And I am like you say about going to talk to someone
01:35:40
that's someone who I will go and talk. But um I only heard the other day that
01:35:43
um she's not doing she's doing something different now. She's not actually um
01:35:46
doing that anymore. But but there's plenty of people I think my cousin even um gives that kind of advice. So, I'm
01:35:52
just going to go and that's something I am going to go and do and and um you
01:35:55
know like just I just want to want to be um yeah just it's interesting cuz you
01:36:01
just see it getting better and then every now and again like you look at your super and someone's invested it and
01:36:06
then that goes down and think oh you know but it'll be fine it'll be fine.
01:36:10
>> Um what three words would um your kids or Heather use to describe you? >> So they were talking about you behind
01:36:16
your back. probably stubborn like you know like >> no words no but you always do what you
01:36:22
want to do like she's like here the go don't worry you'll always do what you
01:36:24
want to she's in in a good way you know um um >> you say okay so it's your funeral so
01:36:30
they're only saying nice words what would be um >> generous yeah absolutely generous um
01:36:35
loyal I think like I'm really loyal to my friends um and kind um you know like
01:36:41
um where I can be yeah definitely those things um but probably um my giving side
01:36:48
I think people would maybe remember me for like helping out and looking after people and that kind of thing.
01:36:54
>> Yeah. >> Loyal, generous and kind. They're great words. >> Thanks. Yeah.
01:36:58
>> Yeah. Really cool words. Are you proud of yourself? >> I am. Um and with Yeah. Um like I like
01:37:06
if I died today, I'd feel that my glass is full. You know, I would feel that um
01:37:11
I haven't left anything unturned. Um I'm not afraid of passing away or anything
01:37:15
like that. Um, like it would be um, yeah, just really happy. Um, yeah, I I've done most things I want to do in in
01:37:26
life. Now I'm just building on those things now, you know, just we go from there.
01:37:31
>> Scotty, this has been a great chat. >> Thanks, man. >> Yeah. How's it been for you?
01:37:35
>> Yeah, good. Good. I was looking forward to it and I I was wondering what you'd
01:37:38
found on me. It's uh, in your in your thing, but it's uh, it's awesome. Yeah,
01:37:42
it's been good. >> Yeah. Well, I really appreciate you coming in today. No, thanks.
01:37:45
>> Um and yeah, thanks for everything you've done uh with um you know the New
01:37:50
Zealand Fire Service and uh also for the you know um Leukemia and Blood Cancer Foundation. Incredible stuff, mate.
01:37:57
>> No, it's uh it's good, mate. Thanks. Thanks. Thanks. And thanks what you do
01:38:00
and um I'll continue to listen to your uh to your podcast on the way down. It
01:38:06
just gives me two hours of definitely enjoyment each eight days when I drive back.
01:38:11
>> That's going to be so unpleasant for you listening to this episode.
01:38:13
>> I might not listen to this one. I'll just I'll just go I'll just get the
01:38:17
[ __ ] from the guys and they say, "Oh, you shouldn't have said that. You should
01:38:19
whatever." >> Oh yeah, morning morning tea shout is definitely going to be on you when this
01:38:23
one comes out. >> Yeah, for sure. I have only told one besides Heather and someone I've only
01:38:27
told one other person that I'm going to be on this. So yeah, be it'll be a
01:38:31
surprise when it comes out. >> Oh, you're a great New Zealander. Thanks, mate. Appreciate it.