00:00:00
[Music]
00:00:27
Dr Nick Gill welcome to my podcast
00:00:29
thanks for having me mate oh mate I'm so
00:00:31
pleased we made this happen um you and I
00:00:33
have only only met a couple of times you
00:00:35
you you messaged me out of the blue um
00:00:38
maybe two years ago about you know I
00:00:40
think you saw on Instagram I had some
00:00:41
knee issues and you messaged me and we
00:00:44
had a session together um and uh toong
00:00:46
it which was really nice of you yeah no
00:00:49
I thought I might be able to help you a
00:00:50
little bit mate and you're a mad Runner
00:00:52
so yeah we got a bit in common yeah as
00:00:55
are you as well as being the old Black's
00:00:57
um strength and conditioning coach you
00:00:58
you dabble and iron events and Triathlon
00:01:01
and yeah devil yeah devil I sort of do
00:01:03
one a year I try to to keep myself
00:01:05
honest so yeah I love it yeah so exactly
00:01:08
what is um a strength and conditioning
00:01:12
coach yeah well it's changed a bit since
00:01:14
I started um when I started it
00:01:17
was you know you you help players or
00:01:20
athletes get strong you made sure they
00:01:22
were fit um and it was very much writing
00:01:25
a program um for each person each player
00:01:28
um now it's obviously evolved the
00:01:30
athletes are more professional they they
00:01:33
know more they've got more knowledge um
00:01:36
and the expectations as a professional
00:01:39
has has gone through the roof so um I'm
00:01:42
sort of I don't know um I'm I'm
00:01:45
responsible for ensuring that the
00:01:47
players and the team are ready to rock
00:01:49
and roll come Saturday night for a test
00:01:51
match so you know that includes you know
00:01:54
I I lead a team of of a nutritionist
00:01:56
doctor physios Sports scientists um and
00:02:01
as a group we sort of look after all the
00:02:03
details that come into performance so
00:02:06
what you eat uh what you don't eat um
00:02:09
you know sleep education um how much
00:02:11
you're lifting in the gym how fast
00:02:12
you're lifting in the gym how much
00:02:14
running you're doing on the field all
00:02:15
that so there's a lot of information
00:02:18
there's a lot of things we do in a day
00:02:20
um to lead to a performance and I sort
00:02:22
of oversee that stuff so you s like the
00:02:24
personal trainer for all the All Blacks
00:02:27
yep yeah [ __ ] it's a big job and you've
00:02:30
been doing it for such a long time like
00:02:31
you um I think Colin Mees was kep no you
00:02:35
started in um 2008 so there's a 2007
00:02:39
you're at the Chiefs for 5 years yep and
00:02:41
then you start in two so this's the 2007
00:02:44
World Cup which um Richie was Captain
00:02:47
and uh Graham Henry was coach then you
00:02:49
start the year after that yeah who was
00:02:51
the previous strength and conditioning
00:02:53
guy uh Graham low he was from the blues
00:02:55
um and I actually helped Lo out in 04
00:02:58
with the All Blacks but um yeah he he
00:03:01
left and went to one of the America's
00:03:03
Cup teams yeah so the position would
00:03:06
became vacant so a few of us threw our
00:03:08
names in the head and yeah I was lucky
00:03:10
enough to be picked how how have you um
00:03:14
how have you kept the job for so long
00:03:15
this be because you think every time
00:03:17
there's there's a coaching change the um
00:03:19
the thing would be to stamp your mark
00:03:21
and uh get your own sort of team of Key
00:03:24
Personnel around you is it just love and
00:03:26
support of the players yeah yeah I'm not
00:03:29
sure I'm like a cockroach I suppose I'm
00:03:31
hard to get rid of um but but I'd like
00:03:34
to think that um I've kept my job cuz
00:03:37
I'm I'm doing I'm doing a good job um
00:03:40
and I think if you know I remember
00:03:42
Graham Henry said to me um after my
00:03:45
second year he said um no news is good
00:03:48
news and that you know there was no
00:03:49
feedback in a negative um which means
00:03:51
you're doing a good job and and I think
00:03:54
the players are the key here like um you
00:03:56
know the I I sort of I'm the in between
00:03:59
the coach and the players and and I
00:04:01
suppose um you know if the players feel
00:04:04
like you're helping them be better then
00:04:06
they want to keep you there um and
00:04:08
likewise the coaches I've sort of there
00:04:10
has been some transitions of coaches and
00:04:12
um I've been lucky enough to carry on
00:04:14
through those those different coaching
00:04:15
groups um and but there's a lot of us
00:04:18
that have carried on um to a point and
00:04:21
and so you know we did have a a period
00:04:23
of time we were very
00:04:25
successful um and so you know tend not
00:04:27
to make too many changes when things are
00:04:29
going well
00:04:30
yeah if it ain't broke um but so do all
00:04:32
the Super Rugby teams have their own snc
00:04:36
100% so so the the the sort
00:04:39
of uh the structure of our staff and the
00:04:41
All Blacks is pretty similar to the
00:04:42
structure of a super rugby team so all
00:04:45
Super Rugby teams have a couple of
00:04:46
physios a doctor a nutritionist Sports
00:04:49
scientists in Tunes um so it's very very
00:04:52
similar across any professional sporting
00:04:54
team to be fair um you have a team of
00:04:57
people that are responsible for the
00:04:58
physical performance and
00:05:00
of the of the athletes yeah so um Scott
00:05:03
Robertson's becoming um the old black
00:05:05
coach this year very very successful
00:05:07
with the Crusaders um you must have been
00:05:09
thinking oh I'm going to get the ass yep
00:05:13
yeah 100% 100% I was actually I actually
00:05:16
stopped on on my way home from the tour
00:05:18
at the end of 2022 I stopped off in
00:05:20
Chicago to start talking to people over
00:05:22
the year to to look at a job in American
00:05:24
sport so it was very much um what do I
00:05:28
do do I wait do I not
00:05:30
um yeah so a lot of lot of uncertainty
00:05:32
for sure and but you you've signed on
00:05:35
you're there for the next we while yep
00:05:37
yep no s so lucky enough to carry on um
00:05:39
and and actually uh really excited like
00:05:43
really excited really grateful that that
00:05:45
I'm carrying on again um I love the team
00:05:48
um love the team love what I do and um
00:05:52
yeah as I said it's sort of
00:05:54
um um I seem to be sticking around a bit
00:05:57
and um and hopefully I can stick around
00:05:59
for for a bit longer yeah what's your
00:06:01
test count what is it
00:06:03
2002 212
00:06:06
yeah yeah yeah what are the biggest
00:06:08
changes between when you started in 2007
00:06:11
and
00:06:11
now oh loads of changes yeah there
00:06:14
change there there's massive changes
00:06:16
like um Rugby's only been professional
00:06:19
since 96 so it's only been 28 years or
00:06:21
something since players first became
00:06:23
professional and got paid okay money but
00:06:25
also were expected to train and prepare
00:06:28
full-time and and so you know I started
00:06:31
in rugby in 2000 uh down in Hamilton
00:06:34
down in W and you know everyone had
00:06:36
full-time jobs and You' train morning
00:06:38
and night and and and you'd play Club
00:06:40
rugby and it was all sort of very very
00:06:43
amateurish um so you know we were still
00:06:46
having fish and chips in the change room
00:06:47
after training on a Tuesday night you
00:06:49
know it was sort of still very much
00:06:51
didn't matter what you ate sort of thing
00:06:53
now days you know athletes are fueling
00:06:55
to Perfection they're counting their
00:06:57
calories they're counting their their
00:06:58
macros so how much protein they're
00:07:00
having in each meal they're making sure
00:07:02
they're going to bed at the right time
00:07:04
to get enough quality sleep um and they
00:07:08
love training you know like 200 even
00:07:11
back in 2008 like athletes the players
00:07:14
weren't necessar loving training um
00:07:18
nowadays you know they love it so much
00:07:20
you have to try and pull them back a bit
00:07:21
you know from doing too much so it's
00:07:23
lots of changes like players have gone
00:07:25
from I think the average size prop for
00:07:27
the All Blacks this year might be a
00:07:29
around I don't I
00:07:30
know 133 kilos average size prop when I
00:07:34
started was 112 kilos so the size of the
00:07:37
players gone through the roof um and
00:07:40
they're as fit as fast and stronger so
00:07:44
you know the the needs of the of of the
00:07:47
in the game the the physical demands in
00:07:49
the game are just just keep changing
00:07:51
keep evolving and yeah so there's lots
00:07:53
of lots of change there's there's so
00:07:56
much to get into um with you today I'm
00:07:58
so excited about it because um you like
00:07:59
you you've seen so much like you've been
00:08:02
around for such a long time but one
00:08:03
thing which I I never
00:08:05
really um never really considered or
00:08:07
even thought about with you and your job
00:08:09
until um I started you know thinking
00:08:12
about this chat is um the personal
00:08:14
sacrifice involved yeah you're you're a
00:08:16
family man you've got your wife um Mel
00:08:18
and your daughters Olivier and Grace and
00:08:20
just the amount of time that you must
00:08:22
have to spend away from them yeah it's
00:08:24
um it's definitely probably one of the
00:08:28
most challenging parts of the gig um
00:08:30
it's time away cuzz you know you you're
00:08:32
winter you spent you spend the time in
00:08:35
the hotel with the team um traveling the
00:08:38
world with the team and so you're sort
00:08:39
of only home when there's not a game on
00:08:42
and so I think this year I think we've
00:08:43
got 14 tests 15 tests and I think I'm
00:08:46
home for about 5 weeks out of 5 months
00:08:49
something like that wow um so now it is
00:08:51
tough it's very tough to get the balance
00:08:53
um balance between time away time at
00:08:56
home when you are home being present
00:08:58
when you're away not burning the candle
00:09:00
and doing too much so then when you do
00:09:01
get home you're cooked um it's it's not
00:09:04
easy definitely not easy um and and M
00:09:08
will always keep trying to pull me into
00:09:09
line and and and check me um you know so
00:09:14
yeah it's definitely a challenge always
00:09:16
how how old are the girls now girls have
00:09:18
left home now 23 and 19 okay a swe
00:09:21
you're it's way it's way different now
00:09:23
that they're not home and it was
00:09:25
probably it was harder when they were
00:09:26
really young and then it was harder when
00:09:28
they were old um easy being away when
00:09:30
they're older but you're you're so tight
00:09:32
that you miss them more cuz you're cuz
00:09:34
you're you know your friends you're
00:09:36
you're really close when they're younger
00:09:37
it's hard on Mel cuz she's going do
00:09:39
anything by herself so yeah it's um yeah
00:09:42
they're not home anymore so M will
00:09:43
travel a bit and then what about the
00:09:45
offseason it's like during the Super
00:09:48
Rugby when um when all the the All
00:09:50
Blacks are in the Super Rugby teams with
00:09:52
their own snc guy yeah what's your role
00:09:54
then so um is that when you're train for
00:09:57
your own Iron Man
00:09:59
yeah a little bit Yeah it allows me to
00:10:02
do some of that stuff um but I'm still
00:10:04
busy still busy like we're planning
00:10:05
campaigns um we're monitoring and
00:10:08
tracking players you know I was on I was
00:10:10
on zooms yesterday for about 9 hours um
00:10:13
you know with various groups of the old
00:10:15
blacks um with staff from from the super
00:10:18
clubs um with players so you're sort of
00:10:22
non-stop talking and communicating and
00:10:24
sharing ideas cuz the All Blacks don't
00:10:27
just start um 10 days out from from
00:10:30
playing England we're sort of we're
00:10:31
going from the time the players start
00:10:33
playing in February we're we're tracking
00:10:35
we're having conversations we're
00:10:37
watching them play we're watching them
00:10:38
train um you know we're helping the
00:10:40
Medical Teams um around decision- making
00:10:43
around injuries and things so it's it's
00:10:44
sort of non-stop but it's just not
00:10:46
full-time it's probably 3 days a week
00:10:48
four days a week um and you're at home
00:10:50
so I work from home during the offseason
00:10:53
so that makes up for all that time being
00:10:54
away and then this might be a dumb
00:10:57
question but it's just something I I was
00:10:58
thinking about the last few days so do
00:11:00
you um before the before any tour do you
00:11:03
have to go away and like inspect the
00:11:05
hotels and the environments you're going
00:11:06
to be in or is there someone else that
00:11:08
does a Ricky yeah so our manager does a
00:11:10
Ricky so um Shand he's he's moved on but
00:11:14
that's what Shand used to do and now
00:11:16
moose P mland from denan does that um so
00:11:20
travels to all the new hotels or hotels
00:11:22
and Fields we haven't been to before so
00:11:25
um yeah we get all that Intel early um
00:11:28
you often need choices to be made which
00:11:30
will come down to you know he'll ring me
00:11:32
up to say hey there's this hotel there's
00:11:34
this field there's this gym here's a
00:11:36
travel time here's the distances here's
00:11:38
the quality so we make decisions that
00:11:41
are based on performance what's going to
00:11:43
be the best thing for the performance
00:11:44
and the preparation for the team and and
00:11:46
then we make those decisions and we lock
00:11:48
it in so yeah that all that that stuff
00:11:50
all happens in you know February March
00:11:51
April May cuz it's a lot of gear you
00:11:53
guys need you can't just go to a a Jets
00:11:55
can you no but we do yeah % 100% like if
00:12:00
it if it means not getting a bus for 20
00:12:02
minutes to go across a city um you know
00:12:05
like we we used to start the Heritage up
00:12:07
on Hobson Street there um and we'd go to
00:12:09
the gym across the road which I think
00:12:11
was a Jets um or Anytime Fitness it was
00:12:14
a 24-hour gym we' just pop over there it
00:12:16
was easy no bus no trip um so as long as
00:12:19
we're not compromising on what we want
00:12:21
to do um if it's the if it's the easiest
00:12:25
thing to do and it's really still going
00:12:26
to be effective then we jump at that
00:12:27
stuff so yeah it's only been the last
00:12:29
maybe seven or eight years that we get
00:12:31
to get go into high performance gyms
00:12:33
pretty much where we go um but again so
00:12:35
long as it's not a big bus trip away so
00:12:39
when do you like when do you do your own
00:12:41
personal training like you're your Iron
00:12:43
Man events do you just sort of try and
00:12:44
do them outside of all black season 100%
00:12:47
yeah I can't do anything during all
00:12:48
black season I sort of I took it over in
00:12:50
all black season just to stay healthy
00:12:52
and to sleep well to eat well to look
00:12:55
after my own stress I'll just have my
00:12:56
own sort of plan um and I just took it
00:12:59
over in the all black season and then
00:13:01
once all black season's finished it's
00:13:02
summertime in New Zealand and get on my
00:13:05
bike and go for some runs and do some
00:13:07
crazy swimming and yeah you mad about it
00:13:10
eh I love it actually um towards the end
00:13:13
I've got some Instagram questions but
00:13:14
someone wanted to wanted me to ask you
00:13:17
about the time you had to run backwards
00:13:18
around M [ __ ] during a half Iron Man
00:13:20
yeah man met driller e far out um was it
00:13:24
a cramp or yeah yeah yeah no I'm a I'm a
00:13:28
I'm a um I'm a horrible cramper um and
00:13:31
I'm pretty competitive so that IR that
00:13:34
half Iron Man I wasn't very prepared for
00:13:36
and and I had a mate doing it and and I
00:13:39
just went out a bit hard on the swim bit
00:13:40
hard on the bike cuz I'm pretty good on
00:13:42
the bike and but my running's my my
00:13:45
Archilles heel and um got off the bike
00:13:47
and oh legs don't feel too good and
00:13:49
first time around the mount going
00:13:51
downhill just quads locked up so I
00:13:54
didn't want to stop cuz my mate was
00:13:55
behind me and I didn't want him to beat
00:13:56
me and anyway he ended up passing me and
00:13:59
the only way I could get around the
00:14:00
mount was walking backwards down the
00:14:02
hills so otherwise the quads would lock
00:14:05
up and I couldn't move so I figured out
00:14:07
during the run that I could walk
00:14:09
backwards down the hills and I wouldn't
00:14:10
crap so then I cramp so then I'd I'd jog
00:14:12
the flats and then walked backwards down
00:14:13
the hill so yeah yeah it was a tough old
00:14:16
day um do do you have a favorite Stadium
00:14:19
I I was reading an interview with um
00:14:21
Aaron Smith and he he says his favorite
00:14:23
stadium is um the one in Wales and
00:14:25
that's cuz he had a particularly good
00:14:27
game there couple of memorable tries it
00:14:29
was a big win what what about you what's
00:14:30
a memorable stadium for you um I I've
00:14:34
probably got three um oh probably four
00:14:38
Around the World Eden Park love Eden
00:14:39
Park um Eden Park special it's our home
00:14:42
home away from home it's our Fortress um
00:14:45
there's always an amazing crowd and
00:14:46
atmosphere love Eden Park like Aaron
00:14:50
Smith um the Millennium Stadium in
00:14:53
Cardiff is is pretty special the roof
00:14:55
comes in you know 80 90,000 crazy
00:14:59
Welshman singing um it's special um and
00:15:02
it's just down the road from the hotel
00:15:04
so you sort of you're right in the mix
00:15:06
so it's pretty it's pretty cool um
00:15:08
setup um twickingham is is an amazing
00:15:12
place to play you know essentially the
00:15:14
the home of rugby um and love going up
00:15:18
there because English are are quite uh
00:15:21
cocky around their rugby and it's a
00:15:24
pretty special place to go and win um
00:15:27
and then the last one would be
00:15:30
probably any of the old stadiums in
00:15:32
South Africa you know the the old
00:15:35
stadiums that are just these fortresses
00:15:37
that where they built with brick the the
00:15:40
stands go vertical and the the South
00:15:45
African Crowds Are just nasty like they
00:15:47
just love their rugby so much you know
00:15:50
you're driving in on a bus to the ground
00:15:52
and there's there's all sorts going on
00:15:54
outside in the in the car parks with the
00:15:56
with the barbecues of the BR um
00:15:59
and the passion of the South Africans is
00:16:01
just huge so going over there and and
00:16:04
trying to win is Pretty Tough so when
00:16:06
you do win it's really special oh that's
00:16:09
cool yeah wow what they're just such
00:16:11
crazy experiences you've had it's really
00:16:14
cool and and your um I've seen so many
00:16:16
photos of you with the um the the water
00:16:18
the water boy vest on is is that your is
00:16:21
that your viewing platform for for all
00:16:24
the games you've been on all the tests
00:16:25
like just on the sideline yeah it has
00:16:27
been um I wasn't sure if that was going
00:16:29
to continue but I'm carrying on in that
00:16:31
in that role which is awesome I love
00:16:32
being on the park like I've been to a
00:16:35
few games um super rby games in the last
00:16:38
I don't know 10 years or so excuse me
00:16:40
and um and watching a game from the
00:16:43
stand I enjoy but compared to being on
00:16:45
the sideline it just doesn't compare
00:16:47
it's it's pretty exciting being on the
00:16:49
sideline like you you feel like you're
00:16:52
involved in the game without being
00:16:53
involved you know I'm pretty competitive
00:16:55
so I like us performing I like being
00:16:58
part of the performance even though I
00:16:59
have a really really small role um so
00:17:01
yeah know I'm always on the side running
00:17:03
water and running messages so I sort of
00:17:04
have ear piece on between the coach and
00:17:07
the players so sometimes the players
00:17:09
will ask me a question to ask the coach
00:17:11
and vice versa um so there's you know
00:17:14
message delivery which is pretty pretty
00:17:16
important and it makes you feel really
00:17:18
really part of it yeah 100% like what
00:17:21
what's sort of messaging what are you
00:17:22
talking about but do you well there's
00:17:24
been many messages in my time but um you
00:17:27
know like it could be it could as simple
00:17:29
as um um the front pods not marked in a
00:17:33
line out so I might I might deliver that
00:17:36
to the to the line out leader and
00:17:39
normally the line out leader say yeah
00:17:40
yeah we we've seen that um so there's
00:17:42
often a suggestion or or or or something
00:17:46
to communicate and it's of more often
00:17:48
not the players already all over it
00:17:50
likewise Bowden Barrett might just say
00:17:53
hey Gilly can you check with f um but is
00:17:57
um is the Back Field clear you know cuz
00:17:59
maybe he's not seen it quick enough um
00:18:02
and so it's it's it's almost like
00:18:04
there's a it's not a dialogue but
00:18:06
there's these windows or messages
00:18:08
sometimes there's no messages like if
00:18:09
the team are handling everything in
00:18:11
front of them um and seeing
00:18:14
opportunities and in control there's
00:18:16
nothing there's no messages um other
00:18:18
than pets on the back you know but if
00:18:21
there's things that aren't quite going
00:18:22
right and there's opportunities
00:18:24
elsewhere the coaches might see it and
00:18:26
communicate that yeah on the um I was
00:18:29
reading Richie's book yesterday the open
00:18:31
side and you get a sentence in the
00:18:33
chapter about the 2011 Rugby World Cup
00:18:35
final um the sentence say trainer Nick
00:18:38
Gill gives us the call to get back on
00:18:40
track keep getting up so is that just is
00:18:42
that just you like ging up the ging up
00:18:44
the guys yeah motivating them yeah but
00:18:47
of both like um like I'll be screaming
00:18:49
from the sideline so it won't be a
00:18:51
message from the coaches but I'll be
00:18:52
screaming from the sideline like and a
00:18:54
few of the players asked me to um you
00:18:56
know like an AR s or say Gilly keep
00:18:58
getting stuck into me and in what way
00:19:01
what do you mean oh like if he's slow to
00:19:03
his feet like he's he's made a big
00:19:04
tackle or he's made a good run and he's
00:19:06
slow to his feet and he starts walking
00:19:09
if he hears me he it it makes him switch
00:19:12
back on and so he'll often ask me to
00:19:15
just get stuck into me if I'm looking a
00:19:16
bit slow um Aaron Smith used to be the
00:19:19
same keep encouraging us from the
00:19:21
sideline so whilst it sounds silly um
00:19:24
and sometimes it feels a little bit like
00:19:26
I'm not achieving much um some of the
00:19:28
players enjoy the noise cuz they all
00:19:30
they hear from the crowd is the is the
00:19:32
is the yoing they don't necessarily hear
00:19:33
anything specific so if they can hear
00:19:35
something specific cuz they close to me
00:19:37
then then I think that's useful um also
00:19:40
you you've been around for a while and
00:19:41
you know all these guys intimately so
00:19:43
you're not like just a dude in the crowd
00:19:44
yelling stuff out yeah yeah yeah yeah
00:19:46
and it's yeah exactly and and I don't I
00:19:48
don't yell at everyone like some people
00:19:49
just want to tell me to shut up so so
00:19:52
it's more more some players will say hey
00:19:54
can you can you keep yelling at me Gilly
00:19:56
or can you keep reminding me the first
00:19:58
first steps or something like that so um
00:20:01
and I do that in training too with some
00:20:02
of them you know some of them need some
00:20:04
help so if it's just me being annoying
00:20:06
annoying noise in the air then that's
00:20:08
that's good well I found that
00:20:10
interesting like the fact that it gets a
00:20:11
mention in Richie's book like it
00:20:13
obviously you the messaging or the
00:20:17
timing or whatever it happened to be
00:20:18
obviously meant something to them yeah
00:20:19
good yeah that's that's good to know
00:20:21
yeah that was um [ __ ] that was a
00:20:23
memorable game like from a just from a
00:20:25
fan perspective what was it like what do
00:20:28
you really collections of that whole
00:20:29
tournament because you're flicking
00:20:30
through Richie's book there's like a
00:20:31
photo of um on the back page of all you
00:20:33
guys on stage afterwards and it's like
00:20:35
Aaron crud in there and I'd forgotten
00:20:36
about Aaron cruden like at the start of
00:20:38
the tournament he was in the the stand
00:20:40
in Wellington drinking beers and then
00:20:41
he's called into the team and then
00:20:43
there's Steven Donald and py weeper and
00:20:46
Rich's broken foot I know well it sort
00:20:48
of felt like we couldn't catch a break
00:20:50
like there a tournament each week
00:20:52
something had happened like there'd be a
00:20:54
would there be another injury there'd be
00:20:55
another loss of someone or um you I
00:20:58
think we're into our fourth or fifth 10
00:21:00
you know Steven Donal got called in from
00:21:02
White baiting and you know DC went down
00:21:05
with with a groin um I remember that day
00:21:07
vividly like we had a meeting straight
00:21:09
after training to say what had happened
00:21:11
um and it was very much a just you just
00:21:14
got to keep tracking ledge we'll figure
00:21:15
it out um and you know I mean I have I
00:21:19
have quite a few memories but the the
00:21:21
most significant one for me was
00:21:23
um I remember going onto the field it
00:21:26
was 8 was it 87 he it was 87 the scho um
00:21:31
and it was like 10 minutes to go and it
00:21:33
was just This ferocious Battle of
00:21:35
halfway cuz it was just a penalty kick
00:21:37
to decide the game and we had Andy Ellis
00:21:40
Richie
00:21:42
mcco Steven
00:21:45
Donald um and I want to say was it
00:21:48
Kieran Reed I just remember um there was
00:21:52
a stoppage and I ran on and the four of
00:21:55
them the four sort of senior players or
00:21:58
leaders that were still on the field um
00:22:00
for the last 5 or 6 minutes come
00:22:02
together and you could just see in their
00:22:04
eyes they were calm there was no Panic I
00:22:07
remember Andy Alis actually Andy was
00:22:08
really impressive um just been really
00:22:11
calm with the plan what we were going to
00:22:14
do and um I came off from that little
00:22:16
huddle thinking we got this you know and
00:22:20
and it was sort of you know there was
00:22:21
still 5 minutes it was still so tight it
00:22:24
was just one mistake one infringement
00:22:26
and um and I just I just thought that
00:22:28
the players making decisions being calm
00:22:31
Under Pressure um you know in a pinnacle
00:22:34
moment um and the biggest game of some
00:22:37
of their lives and so um that was
00:22:39
probably the thing I remember most of
00:22:40
them on the in the game um and then
00:22:43
after the game the coolest thing was
00:22:45
sitting around on the floor in the Eden
00:22:47
Park changing room and just everyone
00:22:50
just sitting around just going
00:22:52
wow having a beer and just like wow like
00:22:55
not a lot was being said to be fair it
00:22:57
was quiet but it was just just
00:22:59
reflective and sort of I don't know
00:23:01
special real special yeah yeah I suppose
00:23:04
it's funny in an environment like that
00:23:05
because the players are [ __ ]
00:23:07
exhausted cuz they've given everything
00:23:08
but you're not exhausted you're just
00:23:10
ready to party but I m I'm emotionally
00:23:12
exhausted I tell you what tell and and
00:23:15
and the weeks are tough like um like the
00:23:18
week for the staff is is tough cuz it's
00:23:20
we work really hard and so yes we're not
00:23:23
out on the test match but um we've put a
00:23:25
whole lot of work into the week and so
00:23:27
you do get to the end of the game and
00:23:29
you are emotionally naked and you are
00:23:32
like holy okay we're going to do it
00:23:34
again tomorrow and then you start again
00:23:36
tomorrow you know so it's um yeah we
00:23:38
don't have the physical exhaustion but I
00:23:40
think there's also you know we do have
00:23:41
the emotional stress and and and and
00:23:44
fatigue that comes with the the whole
00:23:45
gig yeah and what was up with Richie's
00:23:48
foot he it was like a broken foot right
00:23:50
yeah he had I think he had a fracture of
00:23:51
some bone and Deb Robinson our doctor at
00:23:54
the time love Deb she's an awesome doc
00:23:56
um and she was just real calm and her
00:23:58
and Richard worked together at the
00:23:59
Crusaders a lot so everyone trusted Deb
00:24:03
and Deb was just like look he'll be fine
00:24:05
to play but that's it and so hands off
00:24:09
Gilly I want to say I want to say it was
00:24:11
like three or four weeks I can't
00:24:12
remember how many games or how many
00:24:14
weeks he didn't do a lot of training in
00:24:16
um but he did bare minimal to get ready
00:24:18
for the game um and that was just
00:24:20
because you know as soon as you put to
00:24:22
put put some work into the foot it got
00:24:24
sore so you go into the game with it not
00:24:26
being too sore and he was tough enough
00:24:28
to play with a bit of pain um yeah
00:24:32
immense effort to be fair but um you
00:24:34
know he was that important to the team
00:24:37
that everyone was okay with that yeah
00:24:40
that was that a was that a big night
00:24:41
after that at the time I was living in
00:24:43
um a subb called westm just R the corner
00:24:44
for Marley Williams and uh I saw Zack
00:24:47
Guilford rolling out of there about 88
00:24:48
or 9 in the morning yeah no um it was a
00:24:50
big few days I think yeah I wouldn't say
00:24:53
a big night it was a big few days
00:24:55
probably a probably a solid week to be
00:24:57
fair cuz I think we went on some a tour
00:24:59
around New Zealand and I actually
00:25:01
remember I got a cool photo of it
00:25:02
actually we were traveling to Christ
00:25:03
Church to take the World Cup down to
00:25:04
Christ Church and um we landed in Christ
00:25:08
Church I think we landed in Christ
00:25:09
Church had to wait like an hour to get
00:25:12
on the bus to go to the to parade and um
00:25:15
I've got this photo of Graham Henry
00:25:17
asleep cuddled up on the floor in this
00:25:20
holding pin like a it was like a tent um
00:25:23
with the World Cup he was just asleep
00:25:25
cuddling this world cup you know and um
00:25:27
so that was sort of three or four days
00:25:28
after we'd won um so again another
00:25:30
memory of a long time ago that's that's
00:25:33
amazing I I you know you just can't
00:25:35
imagine the pressure he was under like
00:25:37
the fact that he um survived and kept
00:25:39
his job after 20 2007 when the the
00:25:43
tradition in the past had been to like
00:25:45
you know gas a coach that doesn't win
00:25:47
the World Cup the fact that he survived
00:25:50
and then won the World Cup in 2011 it's
00:25:52
remarkable oh it was it's a it's a cool
00:25:54
story cuz um he's a great coach I loved
00:25:56
working with with t um
00:25:58
and the environment they'd learned a lot
00:26:00
on the fouryear soccer before I think
00:26:02
and so he he was definitely that was
00:26:04
definitely the right decision and hence
00:26:06
we we we won the cup so um yeah know it
00:26:10
was he did well didn't he to survive oh
00:26:12
yeah he really did yeah um I there was a
00:26:15
rumor that um Owen and Ben Frank went to
00:26:17
the gym like the next day after the
00:26:19
World Cup final is is an urban legend or
00:26:21
is that true no no it's true you know
00:26:24
it's
00:26:24
true well it's it's strange isn't it but
00:26:27
it actually um it it just speaks volumes
00:26:30
of what those two are like they they
00:26:32
love lifting T they don't necessarily
00:26:34
like
00:26:34
partying um you know and and they were
00:26:38
like particularly Owen but been as been
00:26:40
as well they were they were a little bit
00:26:43
ahead of their time when it came to
00:26:44
professionalism um they learned a lot
00:26:46
from Brad Thorn you know Brad Thorn was
00:26:48
very professional he'd been a pro for a
00:26:50
long time when he came into the All
00:26:51
Blacks and and and Owen and been carried
00:26:54
on that professionalism where what you
00:26:57
ate was important you know you know you
00:26:59
you go to a team dinner they'd still
00:27:00
take a protein shake you know they
00:27:02
they'd carry around their own food and
00:27:03
meals and they were very professional
00:27:06
and and their commitment to their bodies
00:27:07
was huge um and so they were great role
00:27:11
models but going to the gym the after
00:27:13
winning the whe cut final yeah that's
00:27:15
something else not quite sure about that
00:27:18
so you weren't there with them no no
00:27:21
chance mate no chance um are you bread
00:27:23
Thor since you mentioned him so was he
00:27:25
in the O before you started what was I
00:27:27
remember a story of about him like say
00:27:28
he was he was selected for the All
00:27:30
Blacks and then he he declined initially
00:27:31
right didn't he went back to the enl for
00:27:34
yeah no he he was in and out a couple of
00:27:35
times um so when I started he was in the
00:27:38
All Blacks in 08 so I I I can't remember
00:27:41
if he was in the 2007 World Cup um I
00:27:43
don't think so um but yeah he came and
00:27:46
then he went and then he came back um
00:27:48
and so you know and
00:27:51
he uh he just he he was so cool like
00:27:55
what I loved about Brad was
00:27:58
obviously in Australia as a young pro
00:28:00
who'd been doing it for a while he just
00:28:02
was was just so simple in his
00:28:05
preparation he lifted exactly the same
00:28:07
every single week he even had the same
00:28:09
pre-match meal every week which was so
00:28:11
different he to have a banana sandwich
00:28:13
that was his pre-match meal you know
00:28:14
like there's all this amazing food and
00:28:16
it was a banana sandwich was all he'd
00:28:18
have um and cans of lemonade after the
00:28:21
game you know so again lots of players
00:28:24
learn a lot from him um and I think
00:28:27
that's what happens now days
00:28:29
professionalism is is is growing and and
00:28:31
we have more and more people living the
00:28:34
lives of professional athletes than we
00:28:36
used to have and so as new younger
00:28:39
players come in they they see what's
00:28:40
around them and it's almost like the the
00:28:43
the learning is so organic by seeing
00:28:45
what the you know the senior players are
00:28:48
doing they understand what's required
00:28:49
now they might not have been doing some
00:28:51
of that stuff when they're in their Club
00:28:52
but now that's like all this an
00:28:53
expectation all these Le leaders and
00:28:55
Senior players are doing it so I'll do
00:28:57
it too
00:28:58
yeah and does that become um a problem
00:29:00
for you in the respect that you're not
00:29:02
having to put the boot up people or tell
00:29:04
them to do their training you're having
00:29:05
to pull people back I'm thinking like um
00:29:08
yeah Michael Jordan and Kobe Bryant you
00:29:10
if you read their books it's like they
00:29:12
they were trying to train three times a
00:29:13
day to get one ahead on yeah is that the
00:29:15
same sort of thing yeah absolutely now
00:29:17
like there's um there's athletes there's
00:29:19
there's all blacks that um you know will
00:29:22
will do so much more than many others in
00:29:26
the squad you know like a TJ panar is a
00:29:28
classic example he'll do he'll do an
00:29:30
extra session most days that others
00:29:32
won't um and it's just a matter of
00:29:34
trying to educate and Coach some of that
00:29:37
intent or energy so um I don't disagree
00:29:40
with some of it and and so it's a matter
00:29:42
of working with the athlete right
00:29:43
collaborating on
00:29:45
okay we we've got to a point where
00:29:47
you're in this condition Aaron Smith
00:29:49
you're doing this tread walk every
00:29:51
morning cool how does it work how does
00:29:53
it fit into the allback schedule what
00:29:55
are we getting out of it do we do it
00:29:57
every single week do we pull back later
00:29:58
on in the year so it's very much a coach
00:30:01
athlete relationship where we're sort of
00:30:03
collaborating so um yeah that's probably
00:30:07
a big shift to having to put my boot up
00:30:09
people's butt um I don't really have to
00:30:11
motivate too many people they all black
00:30:12
Jersy motivates everyone so a that's
00:30:15
Goosebump stuff yeah the Aaron walk uh
00:30:18
the Aon Smith treadmill thing you're
00:30:19
talking about um I bought this up before
00:30:21
we came to the podcast room I heard you
00:30:23
on another podcast talking about the see
00:30:24
every every morning Aaron Smith would do
00:30:27
put the tread on an incline of 15 and do
00:30:30
like a 2 km walk on that which feels
00:30:32
like you're walking up a steep hill very
00:30:34
quickly as well like uh 10 minutes per
00:30:36
kilometer pace which is a brisk walk
00:30:38
what's the um what's the benefit in that
00:30:40
that any one of us can get oh I think um
00:30:43
you know we all know what it feels like
00:30:44
to go up a hill okay it's hard work um
00:30:47
and in in rugby in particular um we do
00:30:51
enough running um generally speaking if
00:30:54
the program's right we we getting enough
00:30:55
running in and and we we have to keep
00:30:58
finding ways to keep improving our
00:31:00
fitness without improving the risk of in
00:31:02
increasing the risk of injury so
00:31:04
something like a treadmill walk will
00:31:05
improve your calf and Le strength your
00:31:07
aerobic fitness but there's no impact so
00:31:11
good on the joints um great for strength
00:31:14
in the legs so when you think about how
00:31:16
that transfers to running on the park um
00:31:19
it means that you're probably going to
00:31:20
be more efficient in your running you're
00:31:22
probably going to go longer into the
00:31:23
game and there's no extra risk from
00:31:27
doing too much
00:31:28
um running so that's the logic we do the
00:31:30
same with bikes what bikes we'll jump on
00:31:32
the bikes we'll do some high intensity
00:31:34
stuff on bikes to get some more energy
00:31:37
energy system development or metabolic
00:31:39
training done without increased risk of
00:31:41
soft tiser injury so you know that's the
00:31:43
balancing actors being the fittest team
00:31:45
in the world and the healthiest team in
00:31:47
the world with no soft tissue injuries
00:31:49
I've heard you talking about what bites
00:31:51
a lot another podcast you're a massive
00:31:53
fan of them I love you're in love with
00:31:55
them I did one this morning before I
00:31:57
came to see you so I sort of I'm I'm on
00:31:59
one most days at the moment um I got a
00:32:01
bit of a sore shoulder and sore foot so
00:32:03
I'm just looking after myself and trying
00:32:04
to stay fit by by heading the W bike in
00:32:06
the garage but no that cool piece what
00:32:10
what what do you do what does an average
00:32:11
day look like for you in terms of
00:32:12
Fitness I'll try and do an hour or
00:32:14
something every day when I'm working um
00:32:17
and then when I'm when I'm in my summer
00:32:19
mode I'll be basically preparing for
00:32:21
Iron Man so you know it be 2 to 3 to 5
00:32:24
hours a day depending on sort of the
00:32:26
schedule but yeah I'll all Swim Bike Run
00:32:29
um through my week when I'm with the All
00:32:31
Blacks just depending on where we are
00:32:32
and what's at the hotel and things so
00:32:34
just try and fit into my day do it first
00:32:35
thing don't leave it to the end of the
00:32:37
day start my day with it and um yeah
00:32:41
just just makes you feel good he
00:32:42
physical activity I I started flicking
00:32:44
through your book yesterday you put a
00:32:45
book out four or five years ago um
00:32:47
Health yourself um which is a great book
00:32:50
by the way but it's um feels like it's
00:32:52
aimed at people that don't do any sort
00:32:54
of movement at all which is alarming
00:32:57
yeah yeah no definitely makes you feel
00:32:58
good like I think um you know
00:33:01
it's if if I'm at all ever feeling tired
00:33:05
or flat and energy I know the best thing
00:33:08
for me is to exercise um that's what
00:33:09
I've learned and about myself and I dare
00:33:12
say most people um would be the same if
00:33:15
they actually tried it um it's not
00:33:18
necessarily about threshing yourself but
00:33:20
but doing some exercise off some form
00:33:23
you know moving a little bit will make
00:33:24
you feel like if if I don't exercise I
00:33:27
get TI
00:33:28
um which seems ironic and contradictory
00:33:31
but if I exercise I feel like I've got
00:33:33
way more energy to do loads more in my
00:33:35
day um and so yeah I think it's
00:33:38
massively important yeah I I couldn't
00:33:41
agree anymore and I feel like it's it's
00:33:42
just been through like potentially your
00:33:44
career with the old blacks that we've um
00:33:45
learned like the mental health benefits
00:33:47
of exercise um as much as the physical
00:33:50
you know it's 100% like some some people
00:33:54
like some guys in the old blacks will
00:33:55
train I think for their mental health m
00:33:57
to deal with the stress and the pressure
00:33:59
of of performance um you know exercise
00:34:04
helps them deal with it and so that's
00:34:06
why when I say have to pull people back
00:34:07
it's not necessarily all because they're
00:34:08
trying to be the best physical version
00:34:10
of them themselves but I think there's a
00:34:12
combination of it it helps with
00:34:14
confidence it helps with mood it helps
00:34:15
with sleep um likewise things like saers
00:34:19
and Ice baths
00:34:20
like um all those things help with mood
00:34:24
and and confidence so um it's all a big
00:34:27
part part of that Health performance
00:34:29
puzzle um you know we we're sort of
00:34:31
rebranding our group at the moment our
00:34:33
health and performance group and you
00:34:35
know we sort of we're talking about
00:34:37
performance through health is sort of
00:34:39
our Mantra and you know if we think
00:34:41
about it all of us are trying to perform
00:34:43
in our day-to-day lives um and it's way
00:34:47
easier to perform if you're healthy um
00:34:49
and so we tend to We tend to put things
00:34:51
around the wrong way but um you look
00:34:53
after your health and and your your mind
00:34:56
um through exercise and you're
00:34:58
performing anything you choose to
00:34:59
perform in yeah but you you weren't
00:35:01
always this way in the beginning of your
00:35:03
book um you talk about going down too
00:35:05
and being like a a bit of a fatty 20
00:35:08
kilos were you were you a stocky 20
00:35:10
kilos overweight though or were you yeah
00:35:13
probably you know what do they call it
00:35:15
nowadays they have the is it the the the
00:35:18
the fresher few or the fresher 15 the
00:35:20
fresher 15 something like that and um
00:35:23
and and it's definitely there was a case
00:35:25
when I was down there in the '90s it was
00:35:27
very much the I went down there as
00:35:29
skinny a skinny young man and after a
00:35:32
year I was a I was a chubby young man um
00:35:35
so eating poorly drinking too much um
00:35:38
not exercising and um how can how can
00:35:40
you not exercise when you're doing like
00:35:42
a fitness degree well it's cold it's
00:35:45
dark it's cold and dark and no when I
00:35:48
say not exercise I might you know I
00:35:50
might have ran twice a week and got on
00:35:51
my bike once a week but but doesn't make
00:35:54
up for everything you're eating and
00:35:55
drinking so um the balance is wrong um
00:35:58
but I think you know I was actually
00:36:00
surprised when I finished my degree and
00:36:02
I knew nothing about training or
00:36:04
nutrition and um and so that's why I
00:36:06
wrote the book CU I feel like it's
00:36:07
really hard to find the knowledge in a
00:36:09
simply an easily digestible form U for
00:36:12
most people and yeah it is complicated
00:36:16
when you trying to figure out what you
00:36:17
should and shouldn't be eating um
00:36:19
likewise what exercise you should and
00:36:20
shouldn't be doing um so yeah it took me
00:36:23
a while to learn that about myself you
00:36:25
know and I was trained in that stuff um
00:36:27
I reckon I turned the corner when I was
00:36:28
about
00:36:30
24 um I realized that if I ate a bit
00:36:34
less or a bit cleaner and exercised a
00:36:36
bit more consistently I'd one feel
00:36:39
better have more energy and and lose
00:36:41
some body fat um you know and I'd been
00:36:43
studying for nearly eight years at that
00:36:45
stage um was that when you were in
00:36:46
Australia doing your PhD or was this
00:36:48
poos I just got home from from Australia
00:36:50
doing my PhD and I was working in in
00:36:52
Hamilton teaching so I was actually
00:36:54
teaching exercise physiology and um and
00:36:58
I was still exercising daily but eating
00:37:01
way too much and so I was just getting
00:37:03
tired um cuz I had the balance wrong and
00:37:06
I was still too heavy so once I just
00:37:08
sort of figured out my Nutrition a
00:37:10
little bit by experimenting a little bit
00:37:12
I I learned so much and and I think
00:37:15
that's probably what most people need to
00:37:16
do is experiment a little bit more and
00:37:18
find out what works for them yeah CU
00:37:20
you're in your late 40s now and as we've
00:37:22
established you do Iron Men so you're in
00:37:24
you're in good shape um what are your
00:37:26
your vices though or guil Pleasures your
00:37:29
chocolate wine oh yeah all of the above
00:37:33
um no I I I've basically I I had um I
00:37:36
had some eggs this morning before I came
00:37:38
here and and I just got off the W bike
00:37:40
and my wife said Mel said you want some
00:37:42
Poached Eggs I said I love some she said
00:37:43
you want some bread I said no thanks she
00:37:45
said that's a bit strange why aren't you
00:37:47
having bread I said cuz I'd rather have
00:37:48
chocolate when I go home tonight and so
00:37:50
that's sort of what I've learned is that
00:37:52
I'll I'll I'll save my carbs for the
00:37:54
carbs I like um you know whether that's
00:37:56
a cold be or or a couple of rows of
00:37:59
chocolate um um I'd sort of I've sort of
00:38:02
learned where to spend my calories I
00:38:05
suppose um because I think I think it's
00:38:08
important to get a balance of what what
00:38:10
makes you happy as well so I enjoy a a
00:38:13
beer or a wine or some chocolate don't
00:38:16
necessarily enjoy toast you know I can
00:38:18
do without it same as rice like so I've
00:38:20
sort of gone down that track of
00:38:21
restricting some of the carbs I don't
00:38:23
need and having the ones I like eating
00:38:25
smarter being smarter just more
00:38:27
conscious in your decision making that's
00:38:29
all yeah um yeah like making some
00:38:31
sacrifices and compromise so I can I can
00:38:34
enjoy things are you are you in better
00:38:37
shape now than what you were in your
00:38:40
20s um right now no um I've had a year
00:38:44
off Iron Man um but probably the last 10
00:38:47
years yeah definitely the bit bit way
00:38:49
better shape than I was in my 20s um
00:38:51
yeah like um I want to sort of probably
00:38:55
like yourself Dom I want to defy age a
00:38:56
little bit I want to keep I want to keep
00:38:58
keep being being better physically and
00:39:01
looking after my body you only got one
00:39:03
so look after it um I'm definitely
00:39:06
spending a bit more time and energy um
00:39:09
you know
00:39:10
stretching eating better um not being so
00:39:14
strung up on running hard but running
00:39:17
consistently slowly um same as on the
00:39:20
bike I don't thresh myself so much on
00:39:22
the bike I'll just be on the bike um so
00:39:24
I think um yeah this time next year be
00:39:27
in way better shape than I my I was in
00:39:29
my 20s yeah have you do you know um the
00:39:32
work of um Peter arer or his book outli
00:39:35
yeah yeah it's a bloody great book
00:39:37
awesome book oh incredible so it's Bas
00:39:38
for anyone that hasn't read it it's
00:39:39
about um basically reverse engineering
00:39:42
your aging so work out what you want to
00:39:43
be like when you're 70 or 80 and work
00:39:45
back so for him it's like he wants to be
00:39:47
able to you lift a suitcase on an
00:39:49
overhead you know compartment and a a
00:39:51
plane or a train absolutely and better
00:39:53
walk around train stations and it's like
00:39:55
if you want to do that at 70 or 80 you
00:39:57
got doing more than running a a 5k park
00:39:59
run when you're 30 100% um yeah it was
00:40:02
just a different way of looking at it
00:40:03
and I I found it really really exciting
00:40:05
yeah well it's it's not until you start
00:40:07
getting older that those things you
00:40:09
don't think about that stuff but you
00:40:11
know how how often most of us lift
00:40:14
something above our head most of us
00:40:16
don't do it anymore you know unless
00:40:18
we're in a job that requires that so
00:40:20
that when you do get older you haven't
00:40:21
lifted stuff above your head for 15 20
00:40:24
years of course you can't do it anymore
00:40:25
so it's all about function isn't it it's
00:40:27
all about maintaining good function and
00:40:29
the things you want to do um yeah g I
00:40:32
haven't thought about what I want to do
00:40:33
when I'm 70 or 80 but I'd love to keep
00:40:35
doing Iron Man and it might not be
00:40:37
yearly it might be every 3 or four years
00:40:39
I do a race but um I don't want to stop
00:40:41
doing it but I do know that as I've got
00:40:43
older I I've had to start doing strength
00:40:46
training again you know like um oh did
00:40:48
you stop for a while did you oh yeah
00:40:50
yeah no I stopped for a bit cuz I just
00:40:52
wanted to swim bike run more um and then
00:40:55
I started getting a few niggles you know
00:40:57
started getting a few this sounds very
00:40:58
familiar by way started getting a few
00:41:00
aches and pains and like struggling to
00:41:02
do things that I used to be able to do
00:41:04
when I was younger like lift something
00:41:05
above my head so I've realized um
00:41:07
probably the last four or five years
00:41:09
that I and I know and gee I know all
00:41:12
this stuff right that's what I do his
00:41:13
job and I've done for a long time but
00:41:15
but but um practicing What You Preach is
00:41:18
a different story so I've I've actually
00:41:20
really had to strip things back and go
00:41:21
actually I need to stretch more I need
00:41:24
to get massage more often and I need to
00:41:26
do some strength training you know not
00:41:28
daily but but every couple of days I
00:41:29
need to be doing something that is
00:41:32
increasing or working on my range of
00:41:34
motion and and in ways I don't do in
00:41:37
Swim Bike Run and adding resistance um
00:41:40
and it's it makes you feel it makes me
00:41:43
feel less old if that makes sense yeah
00:41:47
yeah you can completely cuz I'm I'm I'm
00:41:49
probably much the same I think that's
00:41:50
how I got a knee injury if I'm being
00:41:51
completely honest with myself um but
00:41:54
I've started going to the gym again and
00:41:56
it's um only maybe 2 or 3 weeks of doing
00:41:58
it on a regular basis and you start to
00:42:00
you don't start to look good necessarily
00:42:02
but you start to feel good you feel
00:42:04
stronger it doesn't take long no it
00:42:05
doesn't take long and it's just about
00:42:07
consistency and it's about just just not
00:42:09
necessarily woring about how much weight
00:42:11
you're lifting but but but improving
00:42:13
your movements um in your function so
00:42:15
that when you are older it's all good
00:42:16
but you're actually you like I can I can
00:42:20
run for 2 hours no problem and probably
00:42:22
not use my glutes at all and you know if
00:42:25
you spend 10 years doing that all of a
00:42:27
sudden you start developing knee pain
00:42:30
because you haven't been using your
00:42:31
glutes for 10 years and all of a sudden
00:42:32
you're you're collapsing your knees are
00:42:34
collapsing inwards and now you've got a
00:42:37
cartilage problem and so you know it's
00:42:39
almost like we just need to be doing
00:42:41
things to keep the body I don't know um
00:42:45
healthy you know healthy to do whatever
00:42:46
is you want to do so uh that's something
00:42:49
that I've learned the last we while just
00:42:50
with myself is I got to do do a little
00:42:52
bit more of that yeah should should
00:42:53
everybody be doing some weights with
00:42:55
some resistant stuff even 100% like the
00:42:57
World Health Organization now like it
00:42:59
used to be back in the day 20 30 years
00:43:01
ago 20 or 30 minutes of aerobic exercise
00:43:04
you know a week three times that used to
00:43:07
be the the World Health organization's
00:43:09
guidelines on being healthy um now it's
00:43:14
got some vigorous exercise in there it's
00:43:16
got some aerobic exercise in there it's
00:43:17
got resistance training um because gone
00:43:20
on the days of older people not doing
00:43:22
weights cuz it's bad for you it's
00:43:24
actually the science the literature the
00:43:26
studies are out there that show show you
00:43:28
can still be super strong and healthy by
00:43:30
lifting weights as you age and in fact
00:43:33
it it reverses the impact of Aging you
00:43:35
know by being strong you're
00:43:37
strengthening ligaments um tendons
00:43:39
muscles and bones and so you want to
00:43:42
stay healthy for longer you got to be
00:43:44
lifting weights and or using resistance
00:43:48
through movement okay so doesn't doesn't
00:43:51
mean you go to the gym and you're
00:43:52
squatting 200 kilos it means that you're
00:43:54
you're performing a squat movement with
00:43:57
some weight that's more than your body
00:43:58
weight through good range I've had um
00:44:02
Arch jelly on the podcast twice now he's
00:44:04
um 101 almost 102 he was the coach of
00:44:07
like John Walker the 1500 meter runner
00:44:09
in the 70s and ' 80s he still does like
00:44:11
100 squats a day there you go just here
00:44:14
you go yeah it's um I was reading a cool
00:44:17
book the other day actually called iy
00:44:18
guy have you read the book iy guy
00:44:20
oh no I've I've got it on um on my
00:44:23
Kindle I haven't really I just finished
00:44:25
it the other day and it was it was very
00:44:27
like um you know they they basically
00:44:29
spend a lot of time talking to the
00:44:31
oldest people in the world and their
00:44:32
secrets to a long and healthy life and
00:44:35
couple of things came out of it which
00:44:37
doesn't surprise anyone but um you know
00:44:39
move more and eat till you're 70% full
00:44:44
it was as simple as that that was some
00:44:46
of their and and eat real food versus
00:44:48
crappy processed stuff so um really
00:44:51
simple stuff and you know squatting 100
00:44:54
squats a day like that doesn't sound
00:44:55
like a lot but you know most people
00:44:57
couldn't do that just with body weight
00:44:59
like they wouldn't be a to walk the next
00:45:01
day or if they did they'd be average
00:45:03
squats yeah okay so for anyone that's
00:45:05
listening to this that doesn't do
00:45:06
anything at the moment in terms of
00:45:07
resistance like how could you start like
00:45:10
a bunch of press-ups a day some situps
00:45:12
some squats yeah I mean I think the big
00:45:15
bang for buck would be um Mobility
00:45:18
through your hips so it could be the
00:45:19
world's greatest stretch like a yo yoga
00:45:21
pose to open up your hips it would be
00:45:25
some squat patterns based on your range
00:45:26
of motion um for example most people
00:45:30
couldn't get thighs parallel so I'd lift
00:45:32
your heels up on some bits of wood or
00:45:34
something so you can get full range
00:45:36
through your hips um so i' be doing
00:45:38
squats calf raisers you know especially
00:45:41
for endurance athletes like common
00:45:43
injury for endurance athletes as AR
00:45:44
kelles and calves um so we get those
00:45:47
strong and keep them strong so just body
00:45:49
weight calf raisers in your house you
00:45:50
don't need to go to a gym um press-ups
00:45:52
are great but um you know most of us
00:45:55
don't need to do more in front of us
00:45:57
most of us do plenty of stuff in front
00:45:59
of us we need to do more through our
00:46:01
back um so back hips glutes could be as
00:46:05
simple as some um banded glute
00:46:07
activations through through sort of um
00:46:10
Abduction of the of the leg um so yeah
00:46:13
it doesn't have it's not complicated
00:46:14
it's simple stuff um but just mainly
00:46:17
switching things on and going through
00:46:19
full range and adding resistance as able
00:46:22
that's good stuff it's worth pointing
00:46:23
out um you were here before I was I was
00:46:26
next still grabbing your coffee and when
00:46:27
I arrived back at my apartment front
00:46:29
door you were doing Cal phasers on the
00:46:30
steps yeah well you just always always
00:46:34
looking to get little well no well sort
00:46:36
of I truth be known I um I was visiting
00:46:40
my nephew on the weekend and um and
00:46:43
we're at the house and and he's nearly 3
00:46:46
2 and a half um and I was trying to hide
00:46:49
from around the island bench I was on my
00:46:51
hands and knees crawling around the
00:46:52
floor trying to hide from him and um I
00:46:55
got a bit excited crawled a bit fast and
00:46:57
then I was like oh and um and I've done
00:47:01
something to my foot I think I've
00:47:02
strained my plan of faser or something
00:47:04
so now all I was do on was I wasn't car
00:47:07
racing I was trying to stretch out my
00:47:08
foot to see if it was still sore so it
00:47:10
is sore so I'll be on the bike a bit
00:47:12
more the next week or so I think well
00:47:14
that's a really embarrassing story but
00:47:15
thanks thanks for your honesty um I I
00:47:18
think that's the reason why you want to
00:47:19
keep um keep moving is you get older you
00:47:21
want to be able to get down on the floor
00:47:22
and play with kids right you don't want
00:47:24
to lose that playfulness 100% like
00:47:26
that's um I was a bit I was a bit
00:47:27
embarrassed that I'd hurt myself
00:47:29
crawling around the floor so I don't
00:47:31
know whether that means I need to
00:47:32
practice crawling a bit more or or be a
00:47:34
bit slow when I C but um that's exactly
00:47:36
it like it brought me so much joy you
00:47:38
know like so you don't want to not be
00:47:41
able to do that so yeah it's a it's a
00:47:43
it's a great example of of staying on
00:47:45
top of your function yeah I love that I
00:47:47
thanks for that knowledge I'm sure a lot
00:47:48
of people can get a lot out of it um can
00:47:51
we talk about some individual players
00:47:53
you can no comment these if you want um
00:47:56
but I've heard you talking about rich
00:47:57
here and you've described him as quite
00:47:59
weak and
00:48:01
slow have I mean he's like he's
00:48:05
remarkable we know he has 148 test
00:48:07
matches um arguably the greatest all
00:48:09
black of all time he's gone on to do
00:48:12
like insane Adventure races and
00:48:14
endurance events um does he find it
00:48:17
funny when you refer to him as week week
00:48:18
and slow or have you had an interaction
00:48:20
with him about it yeah does he tell you
00:48:23
off don't know no he hasn't told me off
00:48:25
yet um I don't know how he feels about
00:48:27
it but I don't think he can deny it
00:48:29
either so it is fact what do you mean
00:48:31
weak and slow what do you mean well
00:48:33
Richie when I met Richie um he hated the
00:48:36
gym I absolutely hated the gym um you
00:48:39
know and we talk about things how things
00:48:41
have changed like um Richie didn't
00:48:44
believe that JY work improved his
00:48:48
performance and when he was younger I
00:48:50
probably wouldn't disagree with them
00:48:52
okay um and and this is one of those
00:48:54
things where you know you you're
00:48:56
learning about you're learning about
00:48:58
athletes you're learning about the game
00:49:00
and and how you play and how you respond
00:49:02
to how you play but um he wasn't very
00:49:04
strong in the gym he hated the gym and
00:49:07
even even my first year like he would
00:49:09
come once a week you know it was sort of
00:49:11
like he'd come if you felt like it um
00:49:15
and over time um through my education
00:49:18
with him and Steve Hansen's education
00:49:20
with him was like well if you want to
00:49:22
get faster you need to get stronger
00:49:24
you're actually getting slower as you
00:49:25
get older and you play such a physical
00:49:28
game that if you don't go to the gym and
00:49:30
get stronger you'll keep getting hurt
00:49:32
and so once Richie bought into the fact
00:49:35
that hey this might help me stay the
00:49:37
same speed I am or get me faster and it
00:49:39
might make me healthier for longer and
00:49:41
play more test matches than he B into it
00:49:45
um and so um he wasn't super strong but
00:49:48
he's you know he's like you and I Dom
00:49:50
he's a slow he was pretty much a slow
00:49:52
twitch athlete um he he couldn't jump
00:49:55
high he couldn't run fast he wasn't slow
00:49:58
but he just wasn't explosive right um
00:50:01
but like any like compared to any other
00:50:03
player on the field he never slowed down
00:50:05
so his endurance his aerobic ability was
00:50:08
second to none for the size of him and
00:50:11
so you know and and how I always
00:50:14
explained it to people is that at the
00:50:16
start of the game he might be slower
00:50:18
than I don't know um um all of the
00:50:21
lucies and all of the backs on the park
00:50:23
he might be the slowest one there maybe
00:50:25
um but the end of the game he was
00:50:28
running faster than all of them because
00:50:30
he never fatigued you know and so that's
00:50:33
what you know that's what you deal with
00:50:34
you deal with what of your strengths his
00:50:36
strengths were running faster than El at
00:50:38
the end of the game when it mattered and
00:50:39
how many games the All Blacks win in the
00:50:41
last 10 minutes when he was on the park
00:50:43
so many how many would he make that
00:50:46
decisive tackle or turnover when he was
00:50:48
on the park in the last 10 minutes many
00:50:50
test um so he had aerobic strengths but
00:50:54
Jim and speed weren't his strengths yeah
00:50:57
poor Richie I've also had um DG Allen
00:50:59
and Simone Mayer on the the podcast and
00:51:01
they've done Adventure races with them
00:51:03
they both described them as
00:51:05
clumsy I think that's we were talking
00:51:08
about doing adventure races where you're
00:51:09
like traversing rivers in the middle of
00:51:11
the night and stuff like that but it
00:51:12
feels like everyone's having a go Richie
00:51:14
yeah well you know cuz he's pretty
00:51:16
perfect is he he was a pretty perfect
00:51:17
Skipper so he needs to be brought down a
00:51:19
pig to Poppy syndr maybe but but that's
00:51:22
why I just try to qualify those
00:51:23
statements is that he had strengths that
00:51:25
no one else had
00:51:27
and and so those those comments I make
00:51:29
are are tongue and cheek you know and
00:51:32
and it's very much a matter of well you
00:51:34
know the number of games he won because
00:51:36
of the strength he had aerobically um
00:51:38
were were so many so yeah he he was a
00:51:41
little bit like conred Smith conr Smith
00:51:43
was the same not strong not fast but
00:51:46
just ran all day um and again he'd be
00:51:49
the one running past people at the end
00:51:51
of a game cuz he never got tired um he
00:51:54
might not have had the the the speed um
00:51:57
as he as he grew into his all black
00:51:59
career but um he had the endurance and
00:52:02
that that that set him apart and spw so
00:52:07
he turns up to the gym you're like
00:52:08
there's nothing I can do with you you're
00:52:10
perfect well no not really because um he
00:52:12
he wasn't that quick over over 10 20
00:52:14
meters either like um he was a a a big
00:52:19
lean aerobic athlete as well he was very
00:52:21
fit um but he had he had knee injury
00:52:24
knee issues and stuff so we were pretty
00:52:26
restricted with him but he was never
00:52:28
extremely fast not when he was in the
00:52:29
All Blacks um is that what you needed to
00:52:32
do get him faster oh we need to get him
00:52:34
healthy first and then try to work on a
00:52:35
bit of explosiveness but um you know he
00:52:38
was he was more of a specimen you know
00:52:40
his his skill set was probably being
00:52:42
able to stay strong and a tackle and
00:52:44
offload and that's what we saw him do
00:52:46
all the time it wasn't him necessarily
00:52:48
running around people because of his
00:52:50
speed it would be running through people
00:52:52
and then offloading and setting other
00:52:53
people up and that's what he did right
00:52:55
um you know so so aerobically very fit
00:52:59
um big big and strong but not explosive
00:53:02
yeah Dan
00:53:03
car he was strong strong explosive agile
00:53:07
fit um yeah probably probably not quite
00:53:11
as quick and fit as B um but very
00:53:14
explosive and great feet right and that
00:53:16
was you know he would he would use his
00:53:18
feet and dance around people and just
00:53:20
amazing skill set so he' dance around
00:53:21
one or two people and then put a grubber
00:53:23
and reather and score a try like he just
00:53:25
had an amazing mixture that was pretty
00:53:28
hard probably for people to defend cuz
00:53:30
he could step you he could run around
00:53:32
you he could kick over top or or beside
00:53:34
you and um so he would have been hell of
00:53:37
a person to try and defend but
00:53:38
physically like a good athlete real good
00:53:40
athlete rounded athlete yeah I've heard
00:53:43
you talk about um bow and Barrett quite
00:53:44
a bit like in ter in terms of almost
00:53:46
being like a freak in some ways yeah
00:53:48
well
00:53:50
um
00:53:51
um like we do a fitness test called a
00:53:54
Bronco which is a shuttle test and
00:53:57
um you know he he's like a explain
00:54:00
explain him like he's like a a big 737
00:54:03
like a big jet you know going down the
00:54:04
runway he sort of he'll go through the
00:54:06
fitness test and everyone else is
00:54:07
slowing down and he's getting faster you
00:54:09
know he's like building up his speed
00:54:11
into the test um so he's still got the
00:54:14
record for the best time in that test um
00:54:17
equal with Cam royard now um for minutes
00:54:20
12 but um super fit and super quick um
00:54:26
especially in open space um obviously
00:54:29
getting older and and prob maybe not as
00:54:32
quick as he used to be but um it's still
00:54:33
super fast um but yeah he he was very um
00:54:38
yeah he had a sort of
00:54:40
a he had an amazing ability to run fast
00:54:43
often and recover recover well so his
00:54:45
endurance of his speed was good um but
00:54:47
he also could go all day um G the number
00:54:50
of times he'd come on off the bench in
00:54:52
the early days of his career and just
00:54:53
run around people and run run from the
00:54:55
back field and try to win a game was was
00:54:57
massive and he's still doing that oh
00:55:00
yeah I made of mine uh when you saw on
00:55:02
Instagram that you were coming in wanted
00:55:03
me to ask you about um Fletcher Fletcher
00:55:06
new yeah uh like a squat or a bench
00:55:09
press like yeah squat yeah did two I
00:55:11
think he might have 280 or something in
00:55:12
January yeah yeah first of all as a
00:55:14
strength and conditioning guy like um
00:55:16
how do you feel about numbers and
00:55:17
records and things like that is it a
00:55:19
distraction that's un unnecessary yeah
00:55:21
it it is a little bit for me like when I
00:55:23
was younger like we used to chase
00:55:24
numbers we used to we used to Pride like
00:55:27
an ego thing in a way well almost like a
00:55:30
h it qualifies that you're doing a good
00:55:32
job you're like if if if if your team
00:55:34
your players are strong and they fit and
00:55:37
they're lean um and on my way up here I
00:55:39
Was preparing myself for a talk I got to
00:55:41
give tomorrow around the stuff but um
00:55:44
you know like having big numbers in the
00:55:46
gym and big numbers on paper and and
00:55:50
good body weights and good skin folds
00:55:51
that doesn't win a game you know like so
00:55:54
that's what I've learned over time is
00:55:55
that there is a balance yes we want
00:55:57
everyone to be in great shape and be
00:55:58
healthy but actually we need to win
00:56:01
right we want to win the whole point of
00:56:02
it is to win and so um you've got to get
00:56:06
the balance so I don't chase numbers
00:56:08
anywhere near as much as I used to with
00:56:09
the with the team I like setting new
00:56:12
standards for the lad so the World Cup
00:56:13
last year we had the last three weeks
00:56:15
the quarterfinal semi-final final last
00:56:17
year we we probably had 60% of the squad
00:56:23
hit a record in one of the movements
00:56:25
Okay so so the guys were peing
00:56:27
physically in the last three weeks of
00:56:29
the World Cup and does that mean we win
00:56:32
the World Cup now that it put us a good
00:56:34
place to win the World Cup yet but you
00:56:36
know like the numbers are a little bit
00:56:38
about just constantly looking for those
00:56:40
improvements but they don't make you the
00:56:42
best rugby player in the world right
00:56:44
okay and that's sort of what I've learn
00:56:45
the likes of Richie have taught me that
00:56:47
the likes of Conrad have taught me that
00:56:49
you might you might have the best
00:56:50
numbers in the gym as a midfielder
00:56:52
doesn't mean you're going to be the best
00:56:53
player on the park on Saturday and so
00:56:55
and that and that's that's really clear
00:56:57
over time we we see that the best
00:56:59
players don't have the best numbers all
00:57:00
the time sometimes the best players
00:57:02
still have the best numbers but not all
00:57:04
the time you can be the best player on
00:57:05
the park and have average
00:57:08
numbers so so flet and you did he do a
00:57:11
massive bench or something massive squat
00:57:13
280 massive 280 kilo squat yeah 280
00:57:17
kilos so how many how many 20 kilo
00:57:19
plates is that well 20 Kil bar 20 kilo
00:57:22
bar so then you take 260 that's
00:57:25
what plates each side the bars the bars
00:57:27
Bend IN you know it's you got guys
00:57:29
either side so the the bars Bend IN so
00:57:31
much the plates want to fall off you
00:57:32
know like it's it's crazy weight um
00:57:35
there's a few people around New Zealand
00:57:36
doing that sort of weight now and um
00:57:38
it's freakish it's scary um I think a
00:57:41
Safa M might have benched 220 or
00:57:43
something in in the Hurricanes gym
00:57:45
sessions um so there's some freakishly
00:57:47
strong people out there now um we've
00:57:50
always had strongish people but um you
00:57:53
know years and years of training the gym
00:57:55
and starting earlier means that we're
00:57:56
probably getting bigger and stronger um
00:57:59
people coming through and um yeah but
00:58:02
again it doesn't mean you're the best
00:58:04
prop in the team you know you can have
00:58:06
you know you can we we we've I've got
00:58:08
plenty of examples in in the All Blacks
00:58:10
over the last couple of years that um
00:58:12
the strongest player isn't the best
00:58:14
player on the park um but being stronger
00:58:16
could help you be better yeah yep so so
00:58:19
who like who's your boss who do you
00:58:20
answer to Is it the coach or is there
00:58:23
someone been or was it the team manager
00:58:25
or so yeah razor is probably my my my my
00:58:29
point of call um there's sort of a group
00:58:31
of us there's there's four of us that
00:58:33
sort of five of us that sort of uh meet
00:58:35
to discuss you know bigger things around
00:58:37
the team so I represent my group of
00:58:39
Staff like the health and performance
00:58:41
team and there's five of us that meet
00:58:42
but but Razer is probably the the big
00:58:44
dog back in the last year but the boss
00:58:47
was Fuzzy before that it was Steve
00:58:49
Hansen was my boss so um yeah it's razor
00:58:53
the razor the one cuz you you seem to a
00:58:56
really good relationship with the
00:58:57
players like I've seen some clips on
00:58:58
YouTube from the official Channel and
00:59:00
you know you're you're kind of broy with
00:59:03
the team I I don't know if it's cuz the
00:59:04
cameras are there but there's a clip and
00:59:06
you're giving Dane Kohl's of all
00:59:07
people's shirt and um so I'm
00:59:11
guessing I don't know I I'd imagine like
00:59:14
from the coach's perspective it's more
00:59:15
of a standoff relationship like a
00:59:16
teacher and student but you're sort of
00:59:18
like a conduit in the middle so you'd
00:59:20
see a lot of these guys maybe relate to
00:59:22
them on a on a different level to what
00:59:24
the coaches do so do do you then go back
00:59:26
and so if you think one of the players
00:59:27
is off like you mentally or they've got
00:59:29
some [ __ ] going on do you then you
00:59:31
report it to to whoever the coach
00:59:33
happens to be or what do you do with
00:59:34
that information that's a good question
00:59:36
mate um I think
00:59:42
um yes I I like having good
00:59:45
relationships with the players but it's
00:59:47
um it's more depends on the player and
00:59:49
depends on The Who and um it's not about
00:59:53
I'm not selective and who I become
00:59:55
friends with or anything but but on
00:59:57
mates with a few of the boys it's just
00:59:58
sort of what happens when you've been
00:59:59
through so much together um like um you
01:00:02
know I've worked with lik a semi white
01:00:04
loock for um I want to say 14 years or
01:00:08
something so you know like he takes me
01:00:09
hunting so it's sort of like it's a
01:00:12
respectful relationship um you know and
01:00:15
and when he comes home from Japan and he
01:00:17
and he goes out on the farm I'll
01:00:19
probably go see him and grab one of his
01:00:20
Lambs out of the freezer you know sort
01:00:22
of so you build that relationship over
01:00:24
time um and over that time you build
01:00:26
trust and honesty and and if sometimes
01:00:30
I'll be saying things to me and I'll be
01:00:31
saying things to them that that don't go
01:00:33
any further than our relationship um and
01:00:36
and and likewise there'll be some
01:00:38
players in the group that need to kick
01:00:39
up the butt and you got to be stuned
01:00:41
with and other players you need to wrap
01:00:42
your arm around and be be a bit cuddly
01:00:43
with so you sort of take your time
01:00:45
trying to understand that and build
01:00:47
relationships and and I think trust is
01:00:50
massive um you know like I feel like if
01:00:54
I'm if I've done a good job with
01:00:56
connecting with players um and they
01:00:59
trust me then it almost gets to a point
01:01:01
of no matter what I say they'll do um I
01:01:05
remember would it be last year leading
01:01:07
up to the World Cup we had a test match
01:01:09
here and Pete Gallagher the Physio and I
01:01:12
were we at a gym session and it was just
01:01:13
going real good like the guys were
01:01:15
lifting they were engaged they were
01:01:17
energized everyone was busy everyone's
01:01:19
doing exactly what they needed to do and
01:01:21
I said to Pete you know like I felt at
01:01:23
that time that we could have told the
01:01:25
boys we're going to cancel the gym
01:01:26
session you're going to go jump off the
01:01:27
Harbor Bridge for cold water immersion
01:01:30
and and I and I said to them they trust
01:01:33
us that much they'd probably go and do
01:01:34
it you know like there'd be no questions
01:01:37
and so I think that's the sort of where
01:01:39
you're trying to get to with your with
01:01:40
your relationship is is the trust so
01:01:42
that then they can come to you as well
01:01:43
to say I don't like this it doesn't make
01:01:46
me feel good on Saturday or can we
01:01:48
change this or hey Gil I want to do a
01:01:50
bit more you like you sort of you want
01:01:52
to be approachable and have trust um so
01:01:54
that's that's where the relationships go
01:01:57
but some things go to coaches or doctors
01:02:00
or physios um and some things won't um
01:02:02
and I suppose there a fine line there
01:02:04
yeah how how have you found your
01:02:06
relationship with the players has
01:02:07
changed as you've got older cuz when um
01:02:10
when you first started I'm guessing you
01:02:11
were the same age as some of the senior
01:02:13
players now you're old as
01:02:16
[ __ ] you're still younger than me
01:02:19
but I'm think I've had rexit on the
01:02:22
podcast and he was the media Le AET uh
01:02:24
manager when when Jonah Mania blew up um
01:02:27
so he was he was old then and he said
01:02:29
Jonah was quite playful with him and
01:02:30
would tackle him from behind in the
01:02:31
hallway of the hotel and stuff um have
01:02:34
you noticed that like yeah 100% like
01:02:37
yeah when I started with Team it
01:02:39
was yeah was 31 or something or so I was
01:02:42
younger than Brad Thorne from memory I
01:02:43
think I was a year younger than Brad
01:02:44
Thorn so it was very different um you're
01:02:47
the same age um you're probably more a
01:02:50
brother than a father whereas now I'm
01:02:52
sort of 20 or 30 years older than some
01:02:55
of them so it's probably more a father
01:02:57
Mentor type role but um you I think
01:03:01
because I've been around for a while
01:03:03
there's probably a bit more instant
01:03:04
trust um as in he must know what he's
01:03:07
talking about um so I don't have to earn
01:03:09
that as much as I felt like I needed to
01:03:11
earn it when I was the same age as them
01:03:12
who's this who's this young punk telling
01:03:14
me what to do um and so I think that has
01:03:17
changed a bit um you you've got
01:03:19
credibility there's no dat yeah yeah I
01:03:21
think so that helps build that trust a
01:03:23
bit quicker um and but I doesn't change
01:03:26
your approach your approach is still you
01:03:27
know you're an all black um my job is to
01:03:31
help you be a great all black and how
01:03:33
can we do that together you know and so
01:03:35
that's and it is a together thing it's
01:03:37
um it's not a do as I say which is what
01:03:39
I used to be like when I was younger you
01:03:41
know I'm the boss do what I say I don't
01:03:43
do that at all it's more hey how are we
01:03:45
going to help you be better and and I
01:03:47
think that's a really important part of
01:03:48
the role in the relationship I think as
01:03:50
you get older you learn there yeah
01:03:52
better ways to communicate and get your
01:03:53
messaging through oh without doubt you
01:03:56
sort of you know like um I'm starting to
01:03:59
get gray and I'm starting to lose hair
01:04:01
and it's sort of like you get a bit
01:04:03
wiser you know and well I hope it's
01:04:05
wiser um yeah it's it's sort of like I
01:04:08
remember talking to a player uh Baron
01:04:10
ker remember Baron Kell yeah of course
01:04:13
yeah you would yeah he would have been
01:04:14
at the Chiefs when you were there yeah
01:04:15
so he was at the Chiefs and and he was
01:04:17
leaving and he took me out for a coffee
01:04:18
to give me some wise words cuz he was an
01:04:20
older player and being an all black and
01:04:23
you know and I remember him saying that
01:04:25
you know he felt as a as a as a as an
01:04:27
older player that he didn't get fitter
01:04:30
he just got smarter you know like he
01:04:32
felt that he didn't get fitter on the
01:04:35
field um but he chose better running
01:04:37
lines and he read the game better and
01:04:39
and and I remember him saying that to me
01:04:41
and why I'm bringing that up is because
01:04:42
it sort of it it actually makes sense in
01:04:45
my role now is it's actually you don't
01:04:48
necessarily get better at what you do
01:04:51
but you learn more effective ways of
01:04:53
achieving the outcome um through
01:04:55
communication and
01:04:56
relationships yeah he um yeah Barron
01:04:59
he's he's been in the news a bit lately
01:05:01
he's had some alcohol trouble and some
01:05:03
domestic violent stuff
01:05:06
um what what's it like when you're in
01:05:08
that um environment and there is some
01:05:10
some Scandal like I'm thinking some of
01:05:11
the stuff you went through you would
01:05:12
have been there when Steven Donald had a
01:05:14
bad game and was getting death
01:05:15
threats uh there was the Mark T stuff in
01:05:18
the World Cup last year where he got
01:05:20
stood down for a game the Aaron Smith
01:05:22
stuff um you you I mean what's it like
01:05:25
when you're in that when these things
01:05:26
happen is it tough you must you must
01:05:29
feel the pain a bit yourself yeah know
01:05:30
it's tough It's like it's it's tough cuz
01:05:32
you you care right you care for the
01:05:34
first of all you care for the the
01:05:35
athlete the player the person um so it
01:05:38
is tough and you sort of you sometimes
01:05:41
you roll your eye your your eyes and
01:05:43
think oh man what the [ __ ] were you
01:05:44
doing what are you up to mate you know
01:05:46
and and but but we all make mistakes and
01:05:48
I think that's the that's the that's the
01:05:50
thing about the team is it's it is a
01:05:52
family and you sort
01:05:54
of you you you need to know that there's
01:05:57
some things that are okay and some
01:05:58
things that aren't and if you do
01:05:59
something that's not okay then you need
01:06:01
to be held accountable for it um like in
01:06:03
any family or relationship um be held
01:06:06
accountable and then it's really your
01:06:08
actions that follow that will that will
01:06:10
help you out of the hole you've dug
01:06:11
yourself and so now there's a lot of
01:06:13
care I think um you know because we're
01:06:16
we we're all human and we all make
01:06:18
mistakes but the Scandal year like often
01:06:21
it's always blowing way out of
01:06:22
proportion um not always but often it is
01:06:25
um
01:06:26
you know and that's the joy of the media
01:06:28
isn't it they need something scandalous
01:06:29
to write about sometimes and um yeah you
01:06:32
just feel for the for the heat that
01:06:34
comes on sometimes yeah absolutely yeah
01:06:36
um I who who are some of the biggest
01:06:39
pranksters on the
01:06:40
team um C Reese who was missing last
01:06:43
year because he hit a um ACL um of his
01:06:47
knee um but he's a he is a he's a crazy
01:06:51
funny we man um so he he's hilarious
01:06:56
um at the moment um who else would be
01:06:59
reasonably funny um or Richie mang Anon
01:07:03
L Brown they pretty funny characters
01:07:06
um yeah so they'd be the ones at the
01:07:08
moment um but there's always you know
01:07:11
like I remember the the M nonos you know
01:07:14
I remember I remember him asking me one
01:07:17
day Gilly can you show us how to do a
01:07:18
chin up how to do it properly and we're
01:07:21
we're in a we're in a public gym like I
01:07:23
would have been I would have been 3 too
01:07:25
I was a I was I was naive I was young I
01:07:28
was I wasn't wise enough to be up to it
01:07:30
but I get up on this on this bar and
01:07:32
show show him and the boys how to do a
01:07:34
proper
01:07:35
CH so I'm hanging up there I'm into
01:07:37
about the third rep and then he just
01:07:39
pulls my pants
01:07:41
down so so um starkus starkus I don't
01:07:45
know how many people saw it but
01:07:48
gee pretty embarrassing moment you
01:07:50
you're hanging up with the above and and
01:07:52
he just laughed I fell for that um man
01:07:54
used he used to be a big prankster you
01:07:56
know like um I remember it might have
01:07:59
been my first year on the team we were
01:08:00
sitting at an airport um having some
01:08:03
Japanese and there was six of us and he
01:08:05
said okay who will eat all that chili
01:08:08
powder for 100 bucks and he's no chance
01:08:11
no chance we're about to get on a long
01:08:12
haul flight to South Africa I think
01:08:15
again young young family not much
01:08:19
money he said 200 bucks I said everyone
01:08:22
else said no no no he said 400 bucks
01:08:24
cash whoever wants it to eat that and I
01:08:27
said
01:08:29
yep so I just was thinking about the
01:08:31
money right not about the 15h hour
01:08:33
flight we had to get on so I I had this
01:08:36
and then he just as I said yep he said
01:08:38
no water no water so I poured all this
01:08:43
chili powder in my mouth and I had to
01:08:45
try and swallow it and I wasn't allowed
01:08:46
to drink a glass of water and fair
01:08:48
enough toor he gives me $400 cash had
01:08:51
$400 cash in his pocket but yeah um so
01:08:53
he was probably the biggest pranks of
01:08:55
that I've dealt with amazing God good
01:08:57
memories he good stories cool cool fun
01:09:00
I've heard you say there are some
01:09:01
players that you just don't go go to um
01:09:03
go near before a game because they're in
01:09:05
um fight
01:09:07
mode I suppose everyone has like a
01:09:09
different sort of like pre-match I think
01:09:11
the context of it you were saying some
01:09:13
that are joking around and want a yarn
01:09:15
and others that you just like know just
01:09:16
to give them this oh yeah yeah no
01:09:18
definitely um yeah like some I think
01:09:21
it's it' be the same in many sports
01:09:23
where some athlet um want to really
01:09:26
relax and just just be normal and not
01:09:29
build the game up in their head too much
01:09:32
um and then they'll have a point in time
01:09:33
in their buildup where they switch in
01:09:35
and and everyone's so different um and a
01:09:39
good example would be you know you're
01:09:42
you're you're on the bus to the game for
01:09:45
example and some guys will want to chat
01:09:47
and relax and some guys will be wanting
01:09:49
to listen to death metal you know and be
01:09:52
wanting to just get really aggressive
01:09:54
and fight up two hour out from a game
01:09:56
and so in time people experiment with
01:10:00
their own preparation and um and so some
01:10:04
people like a joke like some people will
01:10:05
come out on the field before the game so
01:10:07
I'm out on the field getting the team
01:10:08
ready and some will come out and and
01:10:11
crack a joke with me like they're like
01:10:14
totally relaxed and they're just there
01:10:15
enjoying the moment laughing um and some
01:10:19
will be like frown bed eye eyes and and
01:10:24
not wanting to talk or make ey contact
01:10:25
they're just in their zone so you sort
01:10:28
of got to figure out who's where cuz you
01:10:30
don't want to make a joke with someone
01:10:31
who's mentally really in the moment um
01:10:35
some kickers some kickers will will tell
01:10:38
the guy good delivering the kicking tea
01:10:41
when you come out with the kicking tea I
01:10:42
want a
01:10:43
joke you need to come out with a joke
01:10:46
and so some kickers will be wanting to
01:10:48
relax before they take the big kick
01:10:51
versus the feeling the pressure of the
01:10:53
kicking te and you must make this kick
01:10:55
so everyone's really different um and
01:10:57
again it's like anything it's about
01:10:59
understanding the the nuances between
01:11:01
the individuals as to to know how to
01:11:04
behave or or how to to help yeah you
01:11:06
must have learned so much about the
01:11:07
human
01:11:08
psyche we still learning plenty but yeah
01:11:11
it's it's fascinating to watch you know
01:11:13
and and be be be part of that you know
01:11:16
some guys are so relaxed they could fall
01:11:18
asleep you know like and some are so
01:11:21
angry they're just so focused cuz it's
01:11:23
about aggression and um so I I mean I
01:11:26
remember Richie way back in the day 2008
01:11:29
I think we metet at ockland airport
01:11:31
early we were flying to Cape Town to
01:11:32
play the spring box we' had an average
01:11:34
year the year before um and he kicked
01:11:38
all the staff out of this room at the
01:11:40
airport and just had the players in
01:11:41
there and we had no idea was talking to
01:11:42
them about and anyway he walks out of
01:11:45
this meeting to board this you know
01:11:46
24-hour
01:11:48
flight and he walks like he's got big
01:11:50
watermelons under his armpits you know
01:11:52
he big and tough walk that he gets going
01:11:54
and he he just made no eye contact with
01:11:57
anyone and I remember him being like
01:11:58
that the whole week like he hardly spoke
01:12:01
he was like from the moment we left um
01:12:04
to go to Cape Town he wanted and was
01:12:07
demanding a performance and and and so
01:12:10
that was the whole week and so there's
01:12:12
no joking around with that guy you know
01:12:14
he was he was on a mission and and
01:12:16
whereas a m nonu would would would want
01:12:18
a little bit of a laugh you know like
01:12:20
and so yeah so everyone's very different
01:12:22
but but it's something that the players
01:12:25
are constantly having to learn you how
01:12:27
do they deal with pressure how do they
01:12:29
perform under pressure and so we've had
01:12:31
Gilbert and OA with us for a long long
01:12:32
time and and now we've got K Evans with
01:12:34
us and a massive part of it like let's
01:12:37
face it um you know I'd Pride the All
01:12:41
Blacks on being the fittest team on the
01:12:42
planet like we've always tried to be the
01:12:44
fittest team on the planet and tried to
01:12:45
finish over top of teams um so that's
01:12:48
always been something that's important
01:12:50
for us but but nowadays teams are so
01:12:53
equal in terms of their physical ability
01:12:55
like the the teams are all big they're
01:12:56
all strong they're all professional
01:12:58
they're all lean they're all fast um you
01:13:01
know often the big moments come down to
01:13:03
that you know and and Performing Under
01:13:05
Pressure yeah making the right decision
01:13:08
executing your skill set under huge
01:13:10
pressure is is really the difference
01:13:12
between good teams and average teams um
01:13:15
so so I think the more we develop that
01:13:18
part of the the the mental space the the
01:13:21
better we will'll be yeah actually yeah
01:13:23
the Richie story you told us before
01:13:26
um don't know where I heard this it was
01:13:28
either maybe in Dan's movie or Richie's
01:13:30
movie but I think Dan said he never had
01:13:32
a a conversation with Richie while they
01:13:34
were playing together in the All Blacks
01:13:35
about anything other than than rugby
01:13:37
100% yeah oh 100% like Richie was so
01:13:41
driven and everything was about code oh
01:13:43
100% I mean that's why he was so good
01:13:46
right that's why great leader amazing
01:13:48
player like rugby rugby rug I'd be the
01:13:51
same I'd probably have very little
01:13:54
conversation with them out side of rugby
01:13:55
until his later years when you know he
01:13:57
was started like he loved his cycling
01:13:59
loved his running you know that's why
01:14:00
he's kicked on with that like he used
01:14:02
to he was one of the players who would
01:14:04
have a different program in his bye
01:14:06
because he wanted to run up the Port
01:14:07
Hills or he wanted to bike up the Port
01:14:09
Hills so it was a different training
01:14:10
program you know Andrew Hall wanted to
01:14:13
dock a thousand sheep and Tony Woodcock
01:14:15
wanted a um um herd cattle or deer you
01:14:19
know so everyone was a bit different
01:14:20
back then so no I would agree with DC on
01:14:23
that there wasn't much outside 40 it's
01:14:26
it's amazing cuz I remember there was a
01:14:27
story I think maybe in 2010 where Richie
01:14:31
had a partner this is pre gimmer and he
01:14:33
broke up with here because he wanted to
01:14:34
focus on his rugby and I remember
01:14:35
thinking at the time that was a good
01:14:37
excuse to get out of a relationship but
01:14:39
the the more you hear about the guy you
01:14:40
think it was probably 100% true I mean
01:14:44
that's but but you know you look at you
01:14:46
look at Olympic sports or Endurance
01:14:48
Sports like Iron Man or any other sport
01:14:50
that requires a high level of commitment
01:14:53
often the very best are very Centric and
01:14:58
very single single-minded or or focused
01:15:01
and he was he was that like it was and
01:15:04
we still see it in players nowadays
01:15:06
probably not as much but but people have
01:15:08
got some some players have got a bit
01:15:10
more stuff going outside of rugby um
01:15:12
terms of balance um but you know look at
01:15:15
Olympic athletes endurance athletes and
01:15:17
nothing else matters but training and
01:15:19
Performing and competing um and that's
01:15:21
what makes them special yeah actually on
01:15:23
on that year you you worked with um
01:15:26
Hamish Bond and Eric Murray for a while
01:15:29
uh yeah double gold medalist how many
01:15:31
that God how many races did they have
01:15:33
unbeaten oh it was a lot phenomenal like
01:15:35
80 or something it was amazing yeah what
01:15:37
was your what was your work with them
01:15:39
well I was their strength coach pretty
01:15:40
much so that would come in I was in
01:15:41
Hamilton and started off with doing
01:15:44
doing stuff with New Zealand Ry back
01:15:45
with the everon Dell twins um back at
01:15:48
car Georgia um back in early 2000s and
01:15:51
I'd go out to carero Lake and we'd do
01:15:53
stuff out there and then
01:15:55
then they started coming into the W
01:15:58
Stadium because we had a good gym there
01:15:59
with the w and Chiefs rugby team and so
01:16:01
they'd come in so I would have had 15 to
01:16:03
20 rowers coming out to see us um back
01:16:06
then
01:16:07
um and you know sort of mixed depending
01:16:10
on the coach and the program and the
01:16:12
athletes um yeah so I'm still working
01:16:15
with Bondi with America's Cup now you
01:16:17
know so um we reached out to him um to
01:16:20
get him involved in Team New Zealand and
01:16:22
he he he he took it on and so did Dall
01:16:25
and I actually I actually reached out to
01:16:27
Conrad Smith and Richie um mcco to trial
01:16:31
for Team New Zealand um because no way
01:16:35
imagine Richie being in Team New Zealand
01:16:37
because the engines were so big so
01:16:40
unreal yeah and they love cycling right
01:16:42
so we we did we did inquire with them
01:16:44
early doors to say whether that see if
01:16:45
they would be interested and they both
01:16:48
sort of had a little glint in their in
01:16:49
the in their eyes and they eventually
01:16:53
sort of shied away from but but they had
01:16:55
probably the physiology to give it a
01:16:57
good nudge um but DG and hus have have
01:17:01
taken on and they're going through going
01:17:03
in Leaps and Bounds with Team New
01:17:04
Zealand now so that's great yeah well um
01:17:07
any overall takeaways about what makes
01:17:08
the greats great not just in rugby I
01:17:11
guess but also you know the other sports
01:17:12
people you've worked with oh gee like
01:17:15
like like I said just before like I
01:17:17
think um just focus dedication um
01:17:20
commitment like all massively important
01:17:22
we all know that like um and and I think
01:17:26
um always trying
01:17:29
to I don't want to say Seek Improvement
01:17:32
but understand that there's it's not all
01:17:34
physical and and there's a big mental
01:17:36
component to Performance um you know and
01:17:39
and every Sport's different but um you
01:17:41
know getting that balance right between
01:17:43
mental and physical is massive and and I
01:17:45
think something that's massive for me
01:17:47
and we've already touched on domas
01:17:49
looking after your body like um the best
01:17:51
athletes the ones that
01:17:53
endure um and don't just achieve once
01:17:56
but achieve year upon year you know um
01:18:00
and accumulate amazing performances over
01:18:02
a long career the other ones that
01:18:03
generally look after their body we only
01:18:05
got one and so you know we talked about
01:18:07
strength training and and looking after
01:18:10
the things that you might think are not
01:18:12
important when you're young become
01:18:14
really really important as you get older
01:18:16
and you know the the greats in any sport
01:18:18
are generally the ones that are still
01:18:20
performing at the top of their sport you
01:18:22
know in their 30s you know and and and
01:18:25
if you've if you've managed to be able
01:18:26
to do that generally you've looked after
01:18:28
your body and being a professional yeah
01:18:30
that's great have have you got like a a
01:18:32
a trophy room at home a souvenir room a
01:18:35
man cave anything like that no I um I
01:18:39
thought I wanted one I thought I like
01:18:41
I've got loads of photos and jues and
01:18:44
special things um but no I've got I've
01:18:47
got on a bookshelf in our spare room so
01:18:50
I hardly go into it um has World Cup
01:18:53
medals and 100 test sort of
01:18:57
um um plaque and that's sort of it um I
01:19:02
think one day I might um but you'd have
01:19:04
to be selective about what you have like
01:19:06
you've been around for such a long time
01:19:08
yeah well I think I mean everyone you
01:19:09
love been involved in and it would be
01:19:11
hard but I think I'd probably give SK a
01:19:13
big photo collage of some sort but yeah
01:19:15
at the moment I have nothing done yeah
01:19:17
just it's all tucked away or yeah maybe
01:19:19
for a rainy day so so four more years
01:19:21
with the All Blacks is that is that it
01:19:24
absolutely or you reassess then yeah who
01:19:27
knows mate I um I think for me and my
01:19:30
family as long as I keep loving what I'm
01:19:32
doing um me as long as I'm loving it but
01:19:35
but just as importantly if not more
01:19:37
importantly as long as I'm still helping
01:19:39
the athletes perform on Saturday if if I
01:19:41
feel like I'm still contributing still
01:19:44
doing a great job and people want me
01:19:47
there then then I'll stay as long as I'm
01:19:49
wanted um cuz I love it I love the team
01:19:52
um I don't know much different now it's
01:19:54
been so long so um yeah at the moment I
01:19:57
have no plans but um yeah I um yeah as
01:20:01
long as I'm still loving it and
01:20:02
contributing then I'll I'll stack stick
01:20:04
around yeah has there been anyone ever
01:20:06
that's been in the old black
01:20:07
organization as long as what you have
01:20:10
yeah we did have like Gilbert Anoka has
01:20:12
who's obviously left last year um I
01:20:15
think he had I think he'd been part-time
01:20:17
early doors um early 2000s um and then
01:20:21
probably fulltime when when Graham Henry
01:20:23
came on board at 2004 so he'd been
01:20:25
around for 20 plus years um Darren Shand
01:20:27
had done 20 years um I think our physio
01:20:32
um Pete Gallagher did about 15 or 16
01:20:35
years so uh or might be more than that
01:20:37
17 18 years so there's been a few um and
01:20:41
so I'm I'm sort of the longest standing
01:20:43
at the moment um because of all the
01:20:45
changes um so yeah um yeah it's been a
01:20:50
while hell of in the things I was just a
01:20:52
b of wrap up then I remember we've got
01:20:54
some Instagram question SK through so
01:20:56
we'll just do this quick fire um
01:20:58
thoughts on Tik Tok and social media
01:21:00
giving people Fitness hacks yeah I I I
01:21:03
think the um it's a it's a dangerous
01:21:05
place to to learn from I think um
01:21:08
because anyone can post anything so I
01:21:09
think the only thing I'd say is is check
01:21:12
the credibility experiences and
01:21:14
qualifications of people you listen to
01:21:15
is all I could probably say um I mean my
01:21:19
platforms you know rugby ready race
01:21:21
ready endurance which is about to pop
01:21:22
out like we're going to have some great
01:21:24
stuff on there but we're qualified and
01:21:26
we know what we're doing we got
01:21:27
experience behind us so so I think you
01:21:29
just got to be be balanced with what
01:21:31
what you're taking for gospel and what
01:21:33
you're sort of you know is just out
01:21:34
there is rubbish yeah um how does he
01:21:37
deal with the tough
01:21:39
loss a tough any losses like I'll always
01:21:42
reflect on my own contribution for the
01:21:44
week and um look for any things that we
01:21:48
could have done different or better to
01:21:50
help us perform better and not have lost
01:21:53
so so you you or loss like as much as
01:21:55
what the players do oh 100% like if if
01:21:58
we lose and I've got some guys that have
01:22:01
to do some extra running after the game
01:22:03
they I take it out on them yeah like I
01:22:04
hate losing so um you know I I try to C
01:22:08
it a bit more than I used to I used to
01:22:09
get really dark on it but um yeah I sort
01:22:12
of we get to a point where you're dark
01:22:15
for a couple hours the next day you're
01:22:17
travel to the next place and you're dark
01:22:19
and you're just like how how did that
01:22:22
happen um and so then but come Monday
01:22:25
you're you're back on back on board and
01:22:27
you're positive and you're up and you're
01:22:28
just trying to get the next one right
01:22:30
yeah you have to draw a line in the sand
01:22:31
and move on 100% everyone talks about it
01:22:33
it's it's it's when it means a lot it's
01:22:36
hard to it's hard to move on from um
01:22:38
when it means a lot like I still haven't
01:22:40
got over the world cup loss you know
01:22:41
like I from last year oh 100% well you
01:22:44
lost in the final there was a great it
01:22:45
was a great game though in the final
01:22:46
right but we lost mate like so final
01:22:48
heard Al though M I have not got over
01:22:50
there like like uh like we I was looking
01:22:53
there's a couple of documentaries about
01:22:54
to out on Nar Plus on the World Cup and
01:22:57
I had to stop watching it cuz I keep
01:22:59
getting tears you know I keep like
01:23:00
tearing up it means that much so yeah
01:23:02
it's not easy to move on from A Loss
01:23:03
doesn't matter who the loss is against
01:23:05
and there's no oh it's okay we lost the
01:23:08
spring box in the World Cup finals it's
01:23:10
not okay we should have won that game so
01:23:12
yeah I haven't moved
01:23:13
on Jesus on on the Jes it's not not even
01:23:17
your first road to go come on you've won
01:23:19
a couple you lost a couple don't worry
01:23:21
about it um on the on the flip side of
01:23:23
that the the game in the World Cup last
01:23:25
year a few weeks earlier against Ireland
01:23:27
where the All Blacks played out of their
01:23:29
skin um yeah you must just be over the
01:23:33
moon at a game like that oh that was
01:23:35
special yeah that was special for lots
01:23:36
of reasons like
01:23:38
um you know I think we' we dropped Mark
01:23:42
tiia um you know that's right CU he he
01:23:44
went out with something never sort of
01:23:46
came out what exactly happened but he
01:23:47
went out and caught up with some friends
01:23:48
y had a late night had a late night got
01:23:50
got dropped from the team so that was a
01:23:52
big call um he was he he was one of our
01:23:55
best players um so we're going to the
01:23:58
game and and I think that they' given us
01:24:00
a tickle up a few times the last few
01:24:02
years so there was a lot of lot of
01:24:04
baggage I suppose um and and they were
01:24:08
talking it up and they were the best
01:24:09
team in the world and I mean the last s
01:24:12
minutes um it's the longest period of
01:24:14
play in history of International Rugby I
01:24:15
think it was 7 minutes 50 seconds I
01:24:17
think we defended for um and I watched
01:24:21
it the other day and um and wow like so
01:24:24
proud like so proud like everyone stuck
01:24:26
to the tuck stuck to their game everyone
01:24:28
trusted one another no one was giving
01:24:31
away or trying to infringe to to stop
01:24:33
them attacking like there just the
01:24:35
confidence was just huge so no massive
01:24:38
game and talk about happy like you you
01:24:41
see it on all the replays of the footage
01:24:43
like just so much relief and happiness
01:24:45
cuz if you lose that game you go home
01:24:47
right and and all the players families
01:24:49
have just arrived so you know they turn
01:24:51
up to France it's like oh okay um we
01:24:54
going home
01:24:56
tomorrow yeah the last thing any of
01:24:58
those plant wanted take their kids to
01:24:59
Disneyland in Paris or for two weeks
01:25:02
exactly um favorite all black you've
01:25:04
worked with oh I can't there's not one
01:25:07
um there's not one like um it's actually
01:25:10
really hard to to talk about the
01:25:12
favorites um yeah I I think I think I
01:25:17
love working with all of them and it's
01:25:18
it's sort of I've never been asked that
01:25:20
question before Tom that's a hard one um
01:25:22
like I enjoy I enjoy
01:25:25
um athletes any all black that wants to
01:25:28
be a better all black and are proactive
01:25:31
and being better like they the they're
01:25:32
the ones I love working with from a
01:25:34
professional perspective um you know the
01:25:36
ones that want to learn and be better
01:25:37
and and go back to their club and be
01:25:39
better at their club and then come back
01:25:41
to us and be better with us and they're
01:25:43
the ones that you sort of just love
01:25:45
working with because they are open um
01:25:48
they're committed and um they they have
01:25:52
a growth mindset you know and that's you
01:25:53
just as a coach that's what you love
01:25:55
working with you love working with
01:25:56
people that want to be better so so you
01:25:58
you're not annoyed by players that
01:26:00
question why they're doing things oh I
01:26:02
love it no way and I love it like people
01:26:05
if if an athlete comes up to me if a
01:26:06
player comes up to me and says Gilly why
01:26:07
are we doing this and I explain to them
01:26:10
and I and and and they still question me
01:26:12
and then I haven't got my explanation
01:26:14
right like um so education is massive
01:26:17
like educating people is massive because
01:26:19
um at the end of the day it's about
01:26:21
winning on Saturday and helping them be
01:26:22
the best they can be on Saturday and if
01:26:24
they've questions I love it yeah love it
01:26:26
and highest and lowest points of your
01:26:30
career World Cup last year low point no
01:26:34
well no it's not it's not no um low low
01:26:38
point will be a couple of low points
01:26:39
losing to the lions like drawing the LI
01:26:41
series um that sucked
01:26:45
um um losing to Ireland and New Zealand
01:26:48
that series was was tough um you know
01:26:52
just just yeah they were they were tough
01:26:54
losses
01:26:55
um because they were series they weren't
01:26:57
just one-offs um and highlights G
01:27:00
highlight easy two 25 World Cup 211
01:27:03
World Cup um and the game um in
01:27:10
Johannesburg um
01:27:12
2022 to savan Foster's career wow that
01:27:17
game like I've never seen so many tear
01:27:20
like more teers in that game during the
01:27:22
game and immediately after then ever
01:27:24
seen in an all black Jersey like it was
01:27:27
so powerful like um you know when you
01:27:29
the game's not finished and you look
01:27:30
over at the bench and you got Aaron
01:27:32
Smith Sammy Kane and they're on the
01:27:35
bench they've done their part and
01:27:37
they've got tears and the game hasn't
01:27:38
even finished um yeah hugely I get
01:27:42
tingly talking about it it was just
01:27:43
massive you know and then the leaders
01:27:46
sort of stepping up you know and and
01:27:49
sort of saying that he's our coach um
01:27:53
yeah pretty powerful moment and Sport
01:27:55
you know and and unless you in there you
01:27:57
probably wouldn't have felt that from TV
01:27:59
but yeah hugely emotional game
01:28:02
that any performance-enhancing drugs in
01:28:05
rugby I think there is in some countries
01:28:08
yeah um and and I think in some levels
01:28:12
like I think there's a probably a lot of
01:28:13
performance-enhancing drugs probably the
01:28:16
same in in most sport whether that's
01:28:18
Olympic sport or or just weekend warrior
01:28:21
sport I think there's a lot more drugs
01:28:23
in the recreational users than the the
01:28:26
professionals 100% if it's not being
01:28:28
tested because the professionals get
01:28:29
tested all the time so it's pretty hard
01:28:31
um um so I mean I when I was in
01:28:34
Australia um in the '90s playing Club
01:28:36
rugby and there was loads of drugs in
01:28:38
Australian rugby back then um at the low
01:28:41
levels Club footy probably the same in
01:28:43
any other country um but in in in rugby
01:28:48
and specifically in Internationals um
01:28:50
the testing is pretty vigorous um
01:28:53
there's some tell tals someone goes
01:28:55
comes onto the scene and they're just
01:28:56
this amazing physique and and they're
01:28:58
amazing for 18 months and then they
01:29:00
disappear there's some telltale signs
01:29:02
there um likewise if someone disappears
01:29:04
for a year with a big injury and then
01:29:06
comes back in the shape of their life
01:29:07
well there's some signs there too but um
01:29:10
plenty of suspicions but um athletes in
01:29:12
New Zealand just we get tested all the
01:29:15
time like every week there's people
01:29:17
getting drug tested in the All Blacks um
01:29:19
random um so yeah there's none in rugby
01:29:22
in New Zealand that I'm aware of at the
01:29:24
level also it's so so frowned upon here
01:29:26
and there's so much shame that's bought
01:29:29
around with u um a negative test I don't
01:29:31
know if anyone would even bother with
01:29:33
they like the the rewards um are minimal
01:29:36
in you know in comparison to the
01:29:39
consequences 100% yeah 100% um okay so
01:29:43
tell us about um race ready endurance
01:29:45
this is like your new side hustle as if
01:29:47
you need a new side Hustle No I I I sort
01:29:49
of thanks for asking actually Dom
01:29:52
because it's I'm pretty I'm pretty
01:29:53
excited about it so
01:29:55
um I've been helping lots of endurance
01:29:57
athletes for a long time um and around
01:30:01
strength training and and and looking
01:30:03
after their body and and I suppose
01:30:06
enabling them to improve performance um
01:30:09
and performance through health of their
01:30:10
body right so um we've decided Loretta
01:30:14
um down in Tanga myself and Tyler back
01:30:18
in
01:30:19
Canada we're going to launch the next
01:30:21
month um race ready endurance which is
01:30:23
basically
01:30:24
Ally a portal for people to get any help
01:30:27
in their strength training whether
01:30:29
that's around Rehabilitation sore knees
01:30:32
injuries um but also coaching for
01:30:35
whatever event that they might want
01:30:36
coaching it could be could be Mom and
01:30:38
Dad wanting to get off the couch and run
01:30:40
10K their first 10K we'll be able to
01:30:42
help you um could be an Iron Man athlete
01:30:44
wanting to qualify for cona will help
01:30:46
you um so yeah we're just going through
01:30:48
the final details of of what it's going
01:30:50
to look like but um excited we got heaps
01:30:53
of cool people we've helped in the past
01:30:55
that have sort of provided us with
01:30:57
plenty of endorsement and support you
01:30:59
know you've mentioned a few of them
01:31:00
heish dogall um so we've got plenty of
01:31:04
people that have said hey you know what
01:31:06
we do is beneficial um yeah so it's
01:31:09
exciting we're going to have plenty
01:31:10
educational material on there to try and
01:31:12
dispel some of the myths out there um
01:31:14
around strength training and health um
01:31:17
and yeah so looking forward to it so
01:31:19
race ready endurance um will be our
01:31:21
Instagram handle so yeah get in touch
01:31:23
and we we'll um we'll reach out I'll get
01:31:25
i'll get a link in the description here
01:31:26
but yeah I couldn't think of a better
01:31:27
thing um for you to be doing like as I
01:31:30
mentioned at the beginning of this like
01:31:31
you reached out um to me about my knee
01:31:34
um never asked for any sort of like
01:31:36
Financial reward or compensation like
01:31:38
you just legitimately could see that I
01:31:40
enjoyed running and wanted to help me
01:31:41
get better well I think that's the key
01:31:43
right the key is um like as we
01:31:45
especially that I want to say that sort
01:31:47
of the 30y old plus like um most of us
01:31:51
think we can train like we did when we
01:31:52
were 20 and you can't and and I think
01:31:54
that we can we can keep exercising and
01:31:57
be healthy for a long long time if we
01:31:59
just do the right stuff um and the
01:32:01
biggest thing is is trying to help
01:32:03
people I just want to help people um a
01:32:05
lot of knowledge and experience I just
01:32:06
want to pass on to people and it doesn't
01:32:08
have to cost a lot of money or any money
01:32:10
um and that's the cool thing is that we
01:32:12
got enough people enough resources
01:32:14
around that um whether that's q&as
01:32:17
whether that's questions on Instagram
01:32:18
whether that's just some some free
01:32:20
educational material we'll be throwing
01:32:22
lots of stuff out there to help people
01:32:23
of all AG
01:32:24
um to try and stay race ready for
01:32:27
endurance performance whether that's
01:32:29
Swim Bike Run whether it's kaying um
01:32:32
swimming life life saving whatever it is
01:32:35
um we want to help I love that oh you're
01:32:37
going to be great all right Dr
01:32:40
nickg does everyone call you doctor did
01:32:42
you write do you write when you travel
01:32:43
do you write doctor on your departa card
01:32:45
no no no cuz I'm I'm not a medical
01:32:48
doctor but um no no I don't use that at
01:32:50
all anymore I think when you first get
01:32:52
your doctorate um you use it as often as
01:32:54
you can for about 2
01:32:56
years and and then it just disappears I
01:32:59
I don't even put letters after my name
01:33:00
anymore it's just Gilly as far as I'm
01:33:01
concerned so no no doctor than if I was
01:33:04
you'd be making all the OBS call me
01:33:07
Doc thanks yeah all right hey thank you
01:33:10
so much for your time man it's been so
01:33:12
awesome to sit down and pick your brains
01:33:14
um what a career and uh still going four
01:33:16
more years to go in the current role
01:33:18
brilliant thanks for having me Dom
01:33:19
cheers mate
01:33:23
oh
01:33:24
[Music]
