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Paxardi, welcome to my podcast. Thank you for having me, mate. It's so I we were talking before. Um yeah, I thought
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this is the first time we've met, but you said we've met. We had a brief runin
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where you in where I entered your world. So I did I did radio for like 6 months and then I got fired. Um and we had a
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brief conversation at like some kind of event, but this was like I want to say nine years ago, right? Yeah. I was I was
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going to ask you about that cuz I remember um Yeah, radio companies own a whole lot
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of stations. So I was on one station, you were on another station called George FM. You were doing the breakfast
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show with um my friend Clint Roberts and Cara Rickard and it was Yeah. It was a very short short stint. Were you were
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Were you fired? I thought you just didn't like it or it didn't agree with
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you. It was both. It was both. It was both. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We we it was the producer of the show needed to shake up
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like I don't know the details of why I got hired, but the producer of the show
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came to a stand-up show and saw me do what I do, which is standup. and I did it well and just made
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an kind of in the- moment decision that he was just going to hire me. And that's
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probably not the best way to hire a breakfast radio host. It's probably um better to hire the person that's been
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grinding away, figuring out the craft, learning how to be a good radio host rather
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than at that time the 24 year old who's just like working on their standup. And
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I kind of got thrown. But at that point, when you're a standup, when someone
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says, "Hey, here's an opportunity for you to get paid consistently." Like, of
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course, I'm not going to say no. Um, and in that situation, there's only two ways
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it could go. Either it goes incredibly and I just have this hidden talent for radio or it's a train wreck because I
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haven't worked on my craft for the last whatever six, five, whatever years that
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other people have. Um, and it turned out to be the latter. It was a train wreck.
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But isn't it funny how everything does uh work out for a reason in the way it's
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supposed to? Like your your career's been fire since then. Like it's it's not
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like, "Oh, that was it. That the radio was the chance." Yeah. It's been [ __ ]
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since then. Yeah. I guess I guess it like it kind of boils down to how the individual allows that thing to manifest
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itself in their life. Like I could have got really doom and gloom and really down on myself and stopped pushing as
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hard and made assumptions that like maybe I'm not meant to be in this industry and blah blah blah. That's a
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that's a trajectory that could have been very possible, you know, but for whatever reason, a
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combination of my upbringing, a combination of just my desire to be quote unquote successful, a combination
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of having a supportive wife and a and a supportive team or like system around me. I was able to just understand that
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it was a bad time in my career. There were good parts about it, like I really enjoyed working with Clint. I really
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enjoyed working with Cara. But it's okay. you push that aside. Don't dwell
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on it. Learn from it as much as you can and just move on. And you say, "My career was fire from
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that point." And that's a very kind thing to say. And in a in a macro from a
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macro perspective, I guess that's true to a degree, but that doesn't mean that
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from that point till now there wasn't other downs. There were other downs as
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well, but it's just about having that. It's so much easier said than done, but
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having that mentality of like just allowing it to happen, putting it aside, and just moving on. Yeah. Oh, yeah. No.
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Well, I mean, growth is never linear, is it? It's not like I left your GFM and
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then it's just been up up. Um, not at all. But yeah, like to to time stamp this from from what there's,
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by the way, there's so much to get into in this chat. Um, but we're diving
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straight in with some of it. So, you did you got you decided you wanted to do comedy. You did that for a couple of
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years. You were earning like 30 grand a year or something. There was a couple of
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years where it was less. Then there was a moment where you're you're a dad of
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two. Um I think your youngest was a newborn baby and you wanted to go to they wanted you you as a family you want
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to go to Butterfly Creek. Yes. Uh why do you know this? I've listen I've done a
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lot of research. You have I said this in an interview somewhere in a podcast. Yeah. Oh wow. And then um and then you
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realized, oh I I can't afford this. I need to get a job. So you went and studied at Teachers College for a year.
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Yes. Oh, two years. Two years. Yeah. So the first year was I was doing comedy at
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the same time. And then the second year of teachers college, I was like, I'm
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done. I need I want I need to get good grades. I need to like nail this. So I put comedy aside and and really like
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knuckle down and try to and I did well at university. Yeah. For that one year. And it was your wife that said, I can
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tell you, you know, the fire's not burning. You need to go back to what you love. And I suppose the Georgia where
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I'm going with this and the the George FM thing came a short time after that.
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Yes. Yeah. So what happened was Yeah. You're bang on at at the end of that year. My wife said like, "You're sad,
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aren't you?" And I was like, "No, no, you know, trying to keep up the facade."
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I'm like, "No, it's good. It's good. I'm, you know, I'll be a teacher and
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it's a consistent paycheck." And I actually genuinely enjoyed teaching. And
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it kind of makes sense because there are a lot of transferable skills when, you know, um, stand up to teaching. Like
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teaching is a level of performance. Like you have to learn how to hold a room of
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people's attention using performance skills while at the same time conveying
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information, right? So like there's a lot of crossover. So it made sense that
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I was good at teaching and enjoyed it. But it wasn't standup. And my wife was
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like, I can tell. So I went back and it was really it was it was a really bizarre experience. And honestly to this
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day, if you ask me like Pax, can you can you explain to me what happened? I still
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can't really explain to you what happened. But I came back after one year in 2020. No, sorry.
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2014. Zero standup in 2014. Not a single bit of standup. Nothing. Just go to uni,
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get good grades as the best grades I could possibly get, and be a dad and be a husband. Then in 2015, I go back to
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standup. And all of a sudden, like my ability on stage just went boom like that. I just all of us something clicked
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where like I felt so much more comfortable on stage. Um I kind of knew who I was more
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on stage and I don't really know what happened. It could be that just that one
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year of maturing allowed me to be a more comfortable comedian. That one year of like just going to uni, paying bills,
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just being like just a solid dad and like having to deal with life may maybe made me a better comedian. I don't know.
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But I came back in 2015 and I was a better comedian than I ever was in the years before. And it was at that time I
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didn't know what was going on, but I just rode the wave. And even now I'm
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like can't really tell you what happened. It just happened. Unreal. Yeah. Maybe it's getting out of that
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sort of comedy bubble for a period of time. M maybe and just living. And then in 2016, I did I did the comedy
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gala and I did a bit where I I talked about how I pretended to be Tongen to get away from the terrorist jokes and
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that bit exploded and that yeah it kind of changed my career. And then from there I got on George which wasn't a
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good experience but still a learning experience. Um and and television yeah from there the wave just kind of kept
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going. Yeah, man. We get to drill down into all of this. I'm so excited. How
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How much time have you got? It's like 9:00 a.m. now. You got to pick your kids
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up at 3:00. I got I got to pick my mom up from the airport at around midday. Okay. But I've got We're good. We got a
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couple of hours. Um like that. Cool. Okay. Um I got you a little present. Do you want it now or at the
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end? I'm going to give it to you now. That's very kind. I I know. I don't
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think a podcast host has ever given me a present. Um, can I open it? Yes. Yeah. And a lot of thoughts gone into this,
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but it's not weird to open it. No. No. And I I don't want you to pretend. I I
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want your natural reaction, you know. Okay. Maybe it's a good present. Maybe
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it misses the mark. I don't know. No, no, that's okay. Would you like me to be
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honest if it misses the mark? Yes, completely. Oh, no way. This is so good. Oh, this is so cool.
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You know that Ellen DeGeneres is one of my favorite comics ever. Yeah, I found it so I've heard it in a couple of chats
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and it's so random, but it's really random, but I love this is really cool.
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It's in in pristine condition as well. Yeah. New York Times bestseller. That came out in 1996. So, how old were
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you in 96? Five. Five. Yeah. Yeah. So why yeah why so whenever people think of Ellen they think of um the the talk show
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host that be kind to each other do the dance and she's real mean behind the scenes but there was a lot of Ellen
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there was a lot of Ellen before that. So you Yes. So Ellen was like one of your early sort of influences before you knew
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you wanted to do comedy. Ellen Ellen I just I just even even when I got into comedy like I loved Ellen. I still do. I
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still do. I I even in the context of the talk show, like when people think of her
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in the in the context of the talk show, I think people use language that imply that it's a little bit corny, but I
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think if you watch it from a real critical perspective in terms of comedy, she's actually razor sharp. Like her
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ability to maneuver relatively mundane situations and still get clear, consistent laughs
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from the audience who, to be fair, are there because they love Ellen. So, it's
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a little bit easier, but she's still razor sharp. But the Ellen of the 80s and early 90s, the HBO specials are
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still to this day some of my favorite specials and are just like it's such good standup and such funny, clever,
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well-written standup that Yeah, I just I just I just loved it. I And I still do.
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It's not something that was in the past. It still is. I'll still every now and
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then go back and watch one of her specials just cuz I love it. Well, she's really clever as well. And a lot of
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people won't even remember this, but um so she had a like a a Seinfeld style
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show. Yes. What's it called? Was it called Allan? It was called Alan. Right.
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And she came and and I think she was a bookshop owner called Buy the Book or something like that. Yes. And she she
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came out in one of those episodes and it was like a a a pivotal moment. It's like
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is her career going to survive coming out? And you look back now under the 2025 lens and it seems crazy. Yeah. But
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I mean that was a real It's so interesting to think that that was a genuine um for her that was something that was
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like a genuine deep fear of like I'm going to do this because I I need to but
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it could be the end of my career. But you're right like you think back now and
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you're like at one point she was the most famous person on the planet. I would say like 2010 to 20 I don't know
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15 like there was kind of no one more famous than Ellen. So from that context yeah you're right. It is. It is bizarre.
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But yeah, you would look at me and you would look at my standup or you would look at the things that I've done and
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you wouldn't assume that Ellen is like one of my favorites of all time, but yeah, she is. So, this is a very cool
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gift. Thank you very much. Oh, no worries. You're welcome. I appreciate you being here today. Yeah. Yeah. No, I
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appreciate it. Who else? Who else would you You'd be too young for like sort of
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standup comedy Eddie Murphy, like Delirious. And I was too young. I was too young for it release, but I but I
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did absorb it. Like do you you remember C4? Yes. C4. For those who don't remember C4, I
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assume most do, but for those who don't remember C4, it was it was literally
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channel 4, but it was called C4. And it would it was a combination of like music, but also like edgier television
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shows. Clark Gayford was doing a show on it. Clark Gayford had a show on it. Yes.
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And uh C4 like at like 11:30 or 12 would play like comedy specials. And I remember one time my parents
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uh left me with my granddad and they went out with friends or I don't know they went out somewhere to get dinner
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with friends or something and it was just me and my granddad. And my granddad is like pretty irresponsible when it
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comes to like looking after kids. Not in a not in any way that put me in danger,
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but like I could just like have ice cream for dinner and like just do whatever and hang around. And so I just
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stayed up and watched TV with him. and Eddie Murphy Delirious came on and I was like maybe 12, 13 and I was like
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mesmerized by this man in a leather jumpsuit making people laugh. I was like why is the why is the nutty professor
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like what is he doing? Why is this why is the nutty professor telling people drugs? Um and my grandfather doesn't
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doesn't understand English that well. So all the stuff that's like not appropriate for a 12-year-old it was
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going over his head. So, I was kind of like in this weird safety pocket of like being able to watch Eddie Murphy
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Delirious. Um, and that was that was also a pivotal moment for me where I saw stand up for the first time and it like
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hit me. And then after that, I didn't really think about standup, but the but
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the I guess you could say the seed was planted like that moment was put was planted where later when I reacquainted
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myself with standup by discovering Ellen Specials and other standup products. I was like, "Oh yeah, this thing." And
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then fell in love with it as like a teenager, older teenager. Yeah. Yeah. It's funny how the seed gets
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planted on these things, eh? And then how it manifests. What would you be doing otherwise? I really wanted to be
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an architect. That's what I wanted to do. My my mom somewhere in her house still has like a clear file folder of
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all these houses I designed as like a 10 to 14 year old. Yeah, that's what I
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wanted to do. Yeah. I feel like I, you know, you're talking about your granddad. Um, and now you just mentioned
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your mom. I I feel like I kind of know them. I don't know how much I do because
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I I I hand on heart, this wasn't even on my radar, but you you've done this two
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seasons of this amazing TV show called Raised by Refugees. Yeah. Thank you, man. For anyone that's got Neon. Um you
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can watch it on Neon. It's kind of like um a little bit of Meet the Goldbergs, a
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little bit of Everybody Hates Chris, which is a Chris Rock show that I know you like as well. Um little bit of I
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tried to inject a little bit of Malcolm in the middle in there. Um I can see that. Yeah, but that's very kind of you.
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Um but this this is a great show. I I want it. So, it's based on your upbringing and your family dynamic.
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Yeah. What percentage is um like fact and what percentage is fiction? It's a
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really good question. I never wanted to I never wanted to imply to the audience that this is
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like a moment for moment recreation. It's loosely based on on my life, but there is a lot of stuff in there that is
00:15:08
that unfolds exactly the way it unfolded in real life. And the kind of ironic thing, I want to say the sad thing, but
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it's not it's it's not sad. I The interesting thing is that the stuff
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that's the saddest is usually the stuff that's the most accurate. The stuff
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that's the funnest and the silliest and and kind of pulls the laughter out is
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the stuff that I've made up to entertain the audience. other stuff that hurts the
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characters is usually the stuff that I've just taken from real life and put it in which is a sad truth but
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um it's also not sad because it allowed me to make a television show. Yeah. Is
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it like the Shakespeare? What's the Shakespeare quote? It's something like
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tragedy plus time equals comedy or something. I don't know if that's Shakespeare. Maybe it is
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Shakespeare. I don't know. Maybe it's Chris Rock. I don't know. Um okay. So
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yeah. Yeah. So there's there's a story line in um Raised by Refugees where you
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have a wet dream and Yes. you end up putting your your your sheets your soiled sheets in the in the freezer. Um
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that that didn't happen. Uh that I did soil my sheets in my younger years and I
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did hide my soiled sheets somewhere but it wasn't the the freezer was again an
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element to make it funnier. Um it was yeah you take things essentially what you do is you take things that happened
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in real life and because you got to fill a 25minute episode you heighten it and heighten it and heighten it. So the
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version that happened is a lot more mundane. I also it also on in that episode it collides with Guyfork's day
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that didn't happen in real life. That's just a funny that you add that to make
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it kind of heightened. So yeah you take the thing that happened in real life what actually happened is a little more
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mundane and a little more run-of-the-mill. you saw your sheets, you hide them, your parents catch you,
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they have a chat with you, you move on with your life in the in the show, you got to heighten it um to
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to entertain, I guess, and and make it funny and and and um keep the story moving as as quickly as it possibly can.
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Oh, just never let the truth get in the way of a good story. Yeah, exactly. Add some tags to it. Um also, did your
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parents actually did have a chat with you like a like a puberty chat? They didn't just let it go. That's what
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Michael We never had any discussion at all. But in the in the episode, uh, the chat is a bit of a train wreck and it
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was also a train wreck in real life. Like it was truly the most uncomfortable situation I've ever had. And so that
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yeah, I tried to recreate that in the episode, but um, yeah, go watch it if you want to. Oh yeah, it's it's
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wonderful. And there's two seasons of it. Raised by refugees on Neon for anyone that hasn't. How had I never
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heard of it? Have I been living under a rock? Should I have heard of it? Uh, I don't know if you should have heard of
00:17:51
it. I mean, there is like a rabid fan base, but I would I Yeah, I don't think
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it's crazy to say that it's like somewhat of a niche show. Um, but there's defin I definitely have It
00:18:01
definitely has um a largeish fan base that loves it. But I wouldn't call my show mainstream by any by any stretch.
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Did it do well though? Did it perform well? Season 1 definitely performed well. Um, and season two was fine. It
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wasn't bad. It wasn't. It was Yeah, it was not good enough for a season 3.
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Exactly. Yeah. The the the lack of a season 3 tells you the qual the the quality of viewership of of season 2,
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but I think um um season two, ironically, even though season one did better than season two, and I don't know
00:18:32
if you've seen season two, and it's fine if you haven't. Two episodes of it last
00:18:35
night. Yeah, season two is the one that um I really tried to push emotionally. M
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um it once you get to episode five and four four five and six um it goes to places that it was even hard for me to
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write. Um and I think that maybe that's kind of more commercial like less commercially viable
00:18:57
because season one was it season one touched on things that matter but in a more kind of fun for the whole family
00:19:06
broader way that everyone can kind of feel connected to it. And I tried to do that with season 2, but also pushed
00:19:12
myself to go to places that for me and my family really hurt and still really hurt, but um I think is important to
00:19:21
share and kind of like needs to be shared. So maybe that was part of it that season 2 was a little less
00:19:28
commercially kind of leaned less to the commercial side and more to like the dramatic side, but there's still people
00:19:34
that really um loved it and have let me know that they love it. But yeah, no season 3.
00:19:39
Well, I was I was surprised. I loved it. I loved it. Very kind, man. Okay. Um, yeah, since we're there, let's talk
00:19:45
about the um the early years. So, first of all, earliest memories. You're you're
00:19:48
a Kiwi kid through and through. Born and raised in NZ. Yeah, man. Earliest Oh, far out. Earliest
00:19:55
memory. My earliest memory is growing up in Massie. Um, being So, something crazy
00:20:04
happened when I was a kid. uh that wasn't in the show because it was what what what I'm about to talk
00:20:12
about is was much earlier than when the show was set. But my entire family ended
00:20:16
up on the same street. So it was me, which is kind of a show in itself, but it was my my parents and and me, my
00:20:23
grandparents were next door to us. My great uncle lived up the road and then my dad's brother, so my uncle lived
00:20:30
further up the road. So like five four families and then my great auntie just lived around the corner. So, we were all
00:20:36
on one road, which were like was a shock to all the white people that lived on that road, but all these like in the,
00:20:42
you know, in the early '9s, all these Iranian people showing up was a bit of a
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shock. We had like a goat in the backyard and everyone was like, "What is going on?"
00:20:53
Um um but my earliest memory was waking up in the morning and just get like putting on my clothes
00:21:01
and I'm like six at the time, five, and just walking out of the house and walking up the road to my great uncle's
00:21:09
house because my c my dad's cousin, my great uncle's son was not much older
00:21:14
than me and just playing Double Dragon on his Seeker Master System. That's my
00:21:18
earliest memory. Yeah, that's a great foundation memory. Yeah. Yeah, it's
00:21:23
cool. Yeah. I don't think I can't remember the last time anyone asked me
00:21:25
for my earliest memory, but that Yeah, that's the that's as far back as I can
00:21:29
go. Yeah. So, your your parents, they came to New Zealand as refugees with $27. Yes. Um Iranian dad, Pakistani mom.
00:21:36
Yes. So, you you paraphrasing here very much so. So, your your dad was sort of um forced to leave Iran because life was
00:21:43
getting very difficult. So, he went to Pakistan. Yes. Um met your mom who was a nurse. So stalk kind of stalked her in a
00:21:51
way. Yeah. They got himself admitted to hospital just to slide in there. Yeah. So was staying in and then they came to
00:21:59
New Zealand as refugees. Was staying in Pakistan not an option. So I think the real issue was my dad's parents and
00:22:06
great aunties and uncles came to Pakistan were like we have to get out of here. Like this is not a country that we
00:22:10
feel safe in or comfortable in. And so my dad started the asylum process where he said we don't want to stay here, but
00:22:17
we also can't go back to um Iran because we'll probably be shot immediately. Um and it's we can't be
00:22:25
here because my parents can't speak the language at all. They'll just be in
00:22:28
their apartment day in and day out and they'll lose their minds. Um and so he
00:22:34
started the asylum process and the only two countries that accepted him were America and New Zealand. no one
00:22:41
else all the European countries he got denied not for any particular reason just you know countries have quotas you
00:22:47
can't just get accepted to every country that's not how being a refugee works you
00:22:50
know so it was only America and New Zealand and for whatever reason even to this day my dad doesn't really know why
00:22:57
he just chose New Zealand and he said I want to go there could they speak English at the time or was there no no
00:23:02
they couldn't speak English and my dad pushed himself to learn Punjabi because
00:23:09
my they they went to um Lahore which is the within the region of Punjab in Pakistan. So Punjab is one of the few
00:23:17
reg one of the few states in the world that crosses two countries Pakistan and and India and so he was in the Punjabi
00:23:24
part of Pakistan and he pushed himself to learn some Punjabi and my dad even still speak some some of it today. Um
00:23:31
but no no no English no um no Punjabi other than my dad having like conversational level. Yeah. So what
00:23:39
about you? So you're you're they they become refugees in New Zealand. You're
00:23:42
born a year later. Um where where do you learn English? Are they are they trying
00:23:46
to speak English in the house? No, no, no. Farsy was my first language. So Farsy is the language of Iran. Farsy was
00:23:51
my first language because my mom had left her entire family and moved to New Zealand with her whole Iranian side of
00:24:00
the family, her in-laws. She had to learn Farsy because no one no one speaks English other than my dad and my uncle
00:24:06
kind of scraping together English. Obviously now they're fluent, but that's
00:24:10
what 30 years later. So yeah, Farsy was my first language. I mean, I remember, this is not my earliest memory, but it's
00:24:17
pretty close to my earliest memory. I remember going to school and not understanding anyone and being like,
00:24:22
what is going on? But I was born here, but Farsy was the only language I really knew. And I remember the first year of
00:24:28
primary school being like, I don't know what anyone's saying. And I remember
00:24:32
that thought. I remember that thought going like, what am I supposed to do? like the honestly it was like Charlie
00:24:39
Brown like the teacher literally sounded like wa to me and I was like I I don't
00:24:44
know what to do and it took me like a year I would say by the third year of primary school
00:24:51
I was like good I was good to go I was like fluent and and which is incredible that kids like pick it up that quickly
00:24:59
but um yeah the first year was really tough the second year was a bit better and then by the third year I was I was
00:25:04
sweet. Yeah, I've had a couple of other um refugees on the podcast. I had this
00:25:08
guy Don Ha who was a refugee from um Vietnam and then Hong Kong came to New Zealand when he was seven um and another
00:25:14
guy called Abas Nazari who's from Afghanistan and was part of that um the Tampa thing that Australia didn't want.
00:25:20
And um both both every every member of both those families has done exceptionally well. Yeah.
00:25:27
And and it just seems like it's it's um it's incredible and it's inspiring, but it seems
00:25:33
heartbreaking at the same time. Like especially for the the the parents, like you come here, you're stripped of your
00:25:38
identity and everything, you know, and you basically got to start start new. It's must be very very difficult as an
00:25:44
adult. Well, sometimes I think to myself like how did my like now my uncle is a lecturer at university in Wellington.
00:25:52
My dad is like a successful businessman and like very recently sold all his businesses for an amount of money that
00:26:00
most people will never see. And I think to myself and that's not to brag. That's
00:26:04
I mean I missed the boat on that. I I was I was raised by like struggling refugee parents. He made his money when
00:26:10
I left. I was like 19 and was like I'm going to go become a standup and that's
00:26:14
when he hit it financially. I was like great. Um I don't get to reap any of that. Um but but I sometimes reflect
00:26:22
back and I go like what like it's incredible. You come here with you don't
00:26:26
know the language and you and you have lit you have a couple hundred bucks cash in your pocket. You don't know the
00:26:33
systems. You don't know the infrastructure. You don't know the protocol. Like when you go to a
00:26:38
restaurant, you don't exactly know how to act yet. Like do I go up to the person? Do I just sit down straight
00:26:43
away? Do I Yes, there's some shared values in all countries, but everything's a little bit different, you
00:26:47
know? And so to go from that to then like successful lecturer, successful business operator, this that it's like
00:26:55
sometimes I think like how I don't know if I'd be because I think I think about
00:26:59
myself as like this privileged like born in New Zealand, raised in New Zealand, understand New Zealand culture and
00:27:04
systems very well. this is where I feel comfortable when I go back when I go to other countries for work like LA or
00:27:11
Sydney or whatever to do standup or or television stuff like after a week all I want to do
00:27:17
is come here because here is where I feel like I I I'm the most comfortable and I think to myself if I was in that
00:27:24
situation I don't know if I would be as successful as them how like how did they
00:27:29
do it and I and I the only thing I can really put my finger on is especially especially for my family, but
00:27:36
this probably applies to a lot of refugee families from all different walks of life and different
00:27:40
backgrounds. There is a deep desire to not be seen as a burden because you come to a country not as a financial as a as
00:27:50
a economic migrant because an economic migrant comes with intrinsic things to offer. I have money to spend in your
00:27:57
economy. I have university degrees that I can use here to then keep things moving in terms of like my contribution
00:28:04
to society etc etc. When you come here as a refugee the country is saying we'll
00:28:10
take you on. And so I think there is a burning desire to prove to everyone even though you don't know their names and
00:28:17
they don't know you and you've never had a conversation with the person you're
00:28:19
walking past but you want to prove to them internally I am not a burden on this country. I know you gave me a shot,
00:28:25
but I will I promise you I will contribute. And I think that's the thing that drives a lot of refugee families.
00:28:34
And this is not everyone cuz I don't want to make a blanket statement, but there is a large number of refugee
00:28:39
families that do to varying degrees make something of themselves. Punch above their weight. For sure. Yes. Yeah. Did
00:28:45
you Yeah. So your dad made his fortune um in Godfree. Yes. God. How many stores did he have? He had at one point he had
00:28:53
four. Damn. It's such an unusual business. Like it is. It is. How many How often are people buying vacuum
00:28:59
cleaners? Way more than you'd think. And they're all they're all old and retired
00:29:02
and have way too much money. So, they come to a spec like a boutique vacuum cleaner store and we're selling them
00:29:08
$25,000 vacuum cleaners. It's ridiculous. I was even on the floor selling. I was like a little 14-year-old
00:29:15
salesman cuz my dad was like, "I'm not hiring someone. You work." Um, and so I
00:29:19
was like out there selling vacuum cleaners. Did you um I mean obviously now as as a as a man with your own kids,
00:29:26
you must have more of appreciation of the sacrifices your parents made and just how difficult things were for them.
00:29:32
As as a kid, when you reflect on that, yeah, what did you think of it? Did did you think did you think about it at all
00:29:38
or No, not at all. I just wanted to buy Yu-Gi-Oh cards and like, you know, and like just
00:29:46
Yeah. Yeah. and just go skateboarding with my mates. You don't think about it.
00:29:50
Eh, and And um but the signs are obvious. Like there was a time when my dad really wanted to get a degree. He
00:29:58
didn't need to cuz he was making okay money. He had like a couple he had he was a Tyler and then drove taxis at
00:30:06
night. Um and but on the weekends would also manage a KFC. Um Oh, three jobs. Yeah. Yeah. And
00:30:14
just out of necessity or to to try and get out of necessity, but also the the deep the hustle is deep.
00:30:21
All all the migrants and all the children of migrants and refugees listening to this will know exactly what
00:30:26
I mean. The hustle is deep. You could sit down, look at my dad's finances back
00:30:31
then and go, if he dropped one of those jobs, he'd still probably be fine. Not
00:30:36
like living lavish, but fine. You know, pay the bills, have a little bit extra for, you know, doing fun stuff every now
00:30:42
and then, but that's not good enough. You know, the the hustle to like get ahead is really strong. Um, and at one
00:30:50
point he decided, I need to get a degree. I don't feel like someone who's
00:30:54
respected in society if I don't have a degree. So, he dropped all his jobs and
00:30:58
he went to uni and he got an electrical engineering degree. And we I would come home from school and one piece of
00:31:05
furniture would be gone. And then I would come home from school a couple of days later, another piece of furniture
00:31:09
would be gone. Until we literally had no furniture in the house. And that's cuz
00:31:13
my dad was studying and my mom was Do you remember Avon? She was doing Yeah. Yeah. She was doing Avon, you know, and
00:31:21
we would love it cuz we'd get the Avon thing and we'd find the smelly page, the
00:31:24
page where you like rub your wrist on the thing and smell your wrist. Oh my god, that's a blast from the past. Yeah.
00:31:29
So, she was doing Avon just to like keep us afloat, but we were just selling pieces of furniture off and in the
00:31:33
tradein exchange just to like survive and you know, so the the signs are there, but as a kid, you don't even
00:31:41
think about it. You're just like, "Oh, I got basketball training now. Bye." You
00:31:44
know, it's inspirational. Hey, it's insp it's so inspiring. It's the main reason
00:31:49
why I work so hard now is because I'm like, who are you to not work hard, you
00:31:53
know? Like, how can you not work hard when your parents went through that? Your uncle
00:31:58
went through that, your grandp Man, my grand my dad, my granddad just kind of like mowed lawns and trimmed people's
00:32:04
trees like a madman until he had enough to buy a house. And he bought a house off that, you know. And granted the
00:32:11
house prices were different but the achievement is not any less impressive you know and so when I think like who
00:32:17
are who are you to complain to go like I don't want to do anything today it's
00:32:21
like it's the thing that it's it's the desire to want to be good at excellent
00:32:28
at what I do combined with this knowledge of like the the lack of excuses that I
00:32:34
should have relative to like not just my parents but all the people out there that have that have that have given
00:32:40
given up everything to God, all the different numerous countries and have made something of themselves. Yeah.
00:32:45
When did you when did you first feel different? Was it was it at school when you when you realized you you couldn't
00:32:51
understand what you what people were saying or I think I first I think I first felt different when
00:33:01
um I remember we were lining it was my second year of primary school and my first year I I definitely felt different
00:33:07
cuz I couldn't understand everyone but that was that it was too much to deal
00:33:12
with mentally to kind of think of the specifics. I was just kind of like trying to get through each day.
00:33:18
and kind of just copying everyone else so that I'm kind of on the on the same
00:33:22
path. But the moment I felt really different was um um we were in my second year of primary school, we were in line,
00:33:29
you know, when the classic line up to go into the library and you don't go in
00:33:32
until everyone's like behaving. And we were in line to go into the library and
00:33:36
a boy in the back, I forgot his name, but a boy in the back yelled, "Oh, what
00:33:40
smells like curry? It must be packs." And I was like, "Do I?" And I it I
00:33:45
really rocked me for the rest of the day. And everyone everyone laughed when he said that. And then everyone kept
00:33:54
doing the gag throughout the rest of the day. Like they would walk past me and go, "Oh, something smells like curry."
00:33:58
And would walk past me again. and we were like six, seven, you know, like um and it didn't I wasn't like I wasn't
00:34:07
torn apart or I wasn't it wasn't my world wasn't falling apart but it was
00:34:12
just the first moment where I was like right I'm different and people are making note of it and like making it
00:34:22
something that needs to be expressed. I think that's that's the thing about
00:34:27
bigotry, right? is that it's not really a thing until someone decides to express
00:34:31
it. If you don't express it, then no one really cares. We're all just like,
00:34:35
"Yeah, we're just intrinsically the same. You eat, I eat, you [ __ ] I [ __ ]
00:34:39
We all do the same thing until someone decides it you they need to express your difference." Um, uh, that's the only
00:34:47
time. So there, that's kind of the first memory. That's a horrible story. That's
00:34:50
that's heartbreaking. That stuff's really damaging, eh? Like, uh, yeah. Well, it's why I'm a comedian, dog.
00:34:59
That's why I need the approval of a room of strangers to make myself feel good
00:35:02
about myself. Yeah. Um, what about your your your parents' parenting style? This is
00:35:09
probably not something you even thought about until you became a parent yourself. Yeah. Um, in terms of like I
00:35:13
thought about it a lot now in terms of like discipline growing up and the the vulnerability that they showed you and
00:35:19
things like that. Was there a bunch of that? Did you ever even see your dad when you were growing up? No, not
00:35:24
really. And it's something we've spoken about, me and my dad. And he and he
00:35:27
keeps apologizing about it. And I keep telling him like, "Thank you for apologizing, but also like I get it,
00:35:33
man. Like, you had to do what you had to do. And it's and it's not your fault.
00:35:38
You weren't doing it with the intention of not seeing your kids. You were doing
00:35:42
it so that your kids could live a life where where they could have access to the world really. Um, but still he feels
00:35:52
bad about it. And that's Hey, I don't want to, you know, I don't want to force
00:35:55
him to not feel bad about it. It's his feelings and if he feels that, he feels
00:35:58
that. But we've spoken about it and it is what it is. And my parents were they were pretty stock stand I
00:36:06
don't want to say stock standard, but they were pretty quintessential migrant
00:36:10
or refugee parents. Like they did struggle a little bit with with um being vulnerable like emotionally, but
00:36:19
you know, I don't know. I think that's Kiwi parents as well. Yeah, I think
00:36:22
Yeah. of that of that generation. Yes. I I was just about to say like I I I don't
00:36:26
think that's solely unique to migrant parents. I think that generation kind of all struggled with with um with
00:36:35
being vulnerable because that was just kind of the time like back then it was like parents aren't your friends, man.
00:36:41
They're your parents and they they either discipline you or tell you how to live or like pay for things for you and
00:36:48
that's kind of it really. And this new age kind of movement of like parents kind of forming a friendship with their
00:36:55
kids while at the same time parenting is so new. And like my parents are like, "What are you doing? Like why are you
00:37:00
playing card games with your kids? You're not meant to play with your kids." And you're like, "You can't you
00:37:05
could have like hung out with me, you know, to play with your kids." Yeah. Yeah. Um but it's not their fault. They
00:37:12
were just doing what they knew, you know, and it is what it is. But also my dad was trying to deal with like intense
00:37:19
trauma and the way he knew how to deal with intense trauma was go work and not think about it because if you know some
00:37:29
of the things that my dad has seen I hope no one ever sees it. Um it's harrowing and it's stuff of nightmares.
00:37:39
my grand I would you know and I say this with the utmost love and respect for my
00:37:44
grandfather but like when I would stay over at my grandparents house there were nights where I would hear him scream in
00:37:48
his sleep and I you know I don't I don't think it's fair to get into the details
00:37:53
without them know like knowing that I'm sharing the details I don't think that's
00:37:56
cuz it's their story and I don't want to be the one sharing the details but that
00:38:00
yeah it was harrowing stuff that they have to deal with mentally and they still kind of are dealing with so as an
00:38:06
adult with perspective I can So, yes, you weren't around, but also I get it,
00:38:12
man. I understand. And it's not your fault. You know, you did everything you
00:38:15
had to do to get through and live a productive life. And, you know, now he's
00:38:19
like, like I said, he's still dealing with that stuff, but is relatively happy. You know, he bought his boat and
00:38:25
he goes fishing with his mates and he, you know, he has his dogs and he plays golf now and
00:38:31
enjoying the fruits of his Yeah. He's reaping the Yeah. Yeah. He's reaping the
00:38:34
rewards. He still he told us that he was going to retire after selling the the the shops and then um bought another
00:38:42
business cuz he just can't sit down. And so if you know if you live if you live
00:38:46
anywhere in uh in the Northland Fangad area, go to um go to flooring designs if you need any flooring needs. Oh, they I
00:38:55
thought they were in Christ Church. No, they're all over the place. Oh, no. They've moved to they've moved to
00:38:59
Northland to be closer to their grandkids. So they want to be closer to their grandkids. So they moved to Fare
00:39:06
um so that so that they can interact with their grandkids more frequently. And yeah. When when do you think your
00:39:13
parents um have been like most proud and most disappointed of you? Wow, what a question. Uh most
00:39:23
proud. Most proud. I mean, this sounds crazy, but I think they were the most proud when I
00:39:31
was able to afford a house. They when I was when I hit the financial markers that I think that's
00:39:37
when they're the most proud. Um I suppose it's a tangible measure of success. It is. It is a tangible measure
00:39:43
of success and it show. It's like the literal fruits of of my hard work. um they are very proud when I when when
00:39:51
the creative things are done when are made but it's so far from what they know
00:39:57
you know like you know even when they were growing up in Pakistan and Iran respectively that wasn't something that
00:40:04
anyone aspired to do to be an entertainer um well it's just not in the you know it's just not in not an
00:40:13
option right it's not there it's not so it's hard it's hard for them to like
00:40:18
really be like really proud of of that stuff. Even though they tell me that they're proud, and that's really nice to
00:40:24
hear, I think what they're really proud of is like the the forward movement of
00:40:29
like life, you know? I can pay for a house, I can do this, I can do that. Um, when were they most disappointed?
00:40:40
I think when my mom found out that I had a girlfriend and and knew that I would pash her at
00:40:51
lunchtime is when she was the most How old? What age? 16 15 16 Oh, yeah. Yeah. Why? Why was
00:40:59
she so disappointed about that? It's just not what we do. It's just not what
00:41:03
we do. It's just like to her that means I'm also dealing drugs and I'm in a
00:41:09
gang. It's a gateway. It's just to her that's a gateway to like I'm going to now be
00:41:15
running the mafia, you know? So like yeah, it's not like in a vacuum that action is not that bad,
00:41:22
but that's not how it works in someone like my mom's head. It's like I've lost
00:41:26
my son. He's a he's a he's a bad person now. And obviously that's not true but
00:41:32
you know again the context that they come from there is no girlfriend boyfriend there is no
00:41:38
um yeah there is none of that. So yeah I think that was when she was the most disappointed and she confronted me about
00:41:43
it. And I think when my dad was the most disappointed was when I asked him if I could park the car
00:41:51
in the garage and my mate was there and I was clearly trying to impress my mate and so
00:41:58
I drove the car too fast towards the garage and I took the whole side of the garage off and my dad had quit like at
00:42:05
that point my dad had quit smoking for like I think 3 weeks and when that happened I just saw him like pull out a
00:42:12
cigarette had an emergency one in the back pocket. He was so stressed. He was so angry. Um
00:42:19
then I just destroyed the garage cuz I wanted to look cool and drive the car fast. Have they um Yeah. Do they like
00:42:25
seeing themselves albeit exaggerated versions of themselves on TV and raised by refugees? My mom does
00:42:32
because to be fair to my mom, she has a great she's a beautiful singing voice
00:42:37
and really loves the idea of the arts and like being creative but like became a nurse because you know she just wanted
00:42:44
to have a stable job and just be a respected member of society. Um but deep down always wanted to be a performer. So
00:42:52
for my mom it's a little more exciting. Um, my dad doesn't like it because he's
00:42:58
like, I've spent all these years trying to like assimilate and forget like these
00:43:03
hard time the early hard times in New Zealand. And I'm like, yeah, cool, man.
00:43:08
I'm going to make a show for my financial gain and the entertainment of the country.
00:43:13
I suppose if um if it's based on your life, you must feel like everyone's
00:43:18
watching it. Like it's Friends or something like that. Like, oh my god, everywhere I go, everyone's looking at
00:43:22
me. Yeah, I heard you tell a story about your mom and there was um it reminded me
00:43:25
of my my own mom. Like um my mom will say to me, "Oh, I bought a auto ticket
00:43:29
and yeah, the guy at the kiosk in the mall. He he he listens to your podcast."
00:43:33
Exactly. I'm like, "How did how did it get on to that in the car?" My mom will
00:43:37
just walk into stores and just announce, "Does anyone know society?" And you're
00:43:42
like, "What are you doing?" And she's like, "Here he is. This is my son." And
00:43:47
you're like, "Oh." Um, and she recently she went back to work. She she left
00:43:53
work. Um, but she went back to work recently just cuz she wanted something to do and was like a bit bored. So, she
00:43:58
wanted to go back to nursing. And she really loved it. Actually, she loved going back to nursing. But she went back
00:44:03
to nursing at a time when my star was kind of rising. And so, she found out that all the other nurses um knew who I
00:44:12
was. And so, she would walk into that hospital with like such a strut and be like, "Yes, I am Pax's mother.
00:44:18
It's so nice about living vicariously through It's nice. Yeah. I I think my
00:44:23
mom really enjoys it. Like I said, because deep down the idea of being a performer or like a singer was something
00:44:30
she loved, the idea of Yeah. But my dad's like, "Why couldn't you have just
00:44:34
been an accountant?" Anytime anyone wants him to be part of any kind of media thing, he's
00:44:40
like, "No, no way." But my mom's like, "Yeah, I' I'd be interested." My mom
00:44:45
actually makes a cameo um in if you if you keep watching season 2 also no pressure but if you will keep watching
00:44:51
season 2 my mom appears in one of the later episodes cuz I was like mom do you want to make a cameo? She was like yes
00:44:56
straight away. But my dad was like absolutely not. I could not give two shits about your show cuz he he or they
00:45:04
wanted um you to be a doctor. Of course. Yeah. Respectable. Oh yeah. Yeah. A doctor. And if not a doctor like a uh
00:45:13
you know pharmacist and if not a something in medicine you know something like my mom was like can you work in the
00:45:23
medical aisle of the Woolworths just something in medicine I was like there's not a mom there's not a
00:45:31
specific person that works in the medicine aisle of everyone just kind of she's like no no they just wanted
00:45:38
something they just wanted something. They were really banking on cuz I was I really got into basketball and played
00:45:44
volleyball and was like pretty sporty at high school. They were hoping I'd become
00:45:47
a physio or something like that, but it didn't work out. Yeah. So, your parents
00:45:52
um two kids, two sons. Two sons. Um now you're a dad yourself, two kids. Two
00:45:56
daughters. Two daughters. Um how are you how are you doing better and and in which ways are you doing worse than what
00:46:01
they did? I uh doing better, I think. Um and and again, this is no slight on my parents
00:46:08
or anyone from the generation before because we're all just doing the best we
00:46:13
can and dealing with what we know. Oh, you right now you'll be [ __ ] up your
00:46:16
kids and uh 100% 100%. You're going to go to therapy in like 15 years and be
00:46:21
like, "My dad played so much Monopoly Gal with me. My dad played so much Uno
00:46:26
with me and I don't know how to deal with it." Um my dad was so present. Yeah, he was
00:46:31
so Why couldn't he just play on his phone like other dads? Yeah, he came to every net game. I don't know what to do.
00:46:37
He was so needy. Um I How am I doing better? I think what I'm trying to do better but don't know
00:46:46
if I'm doing better is explaining things. So there was a real culture and you probably
00:46:54
experienced this as well. I don't think this is specific to migrant culture, but
00:46:58
there was a real culture of like a parent telling you what to do. We say why and they say that it's just because.
00:47:04
Just because. That's how we do it. And you go what? I'm trying to me and my
00:47:09
wife something we're really focusing on is having really clear conversation about why do we not do this? Like when
00:47:17
you know when my I wasn't allowed to do have sleepovers. people were allowed to
00:47:22
sleep at our house, but I wasn't allowed to go to anyone else's house. And we're
00:47:26
re we're replicating that. We're doing that as well with our kids. We're
00:47:29
saying, "You're not allowed to sleep over at anyone's house, but they if they
00:47:32
want to come and hang out here and have a sleepover over at our house and their parents are okay with it, 100% all
00:47:38
good." And my my kids are like, "Why?" And I remember my parents would just
00:47:41
say, "Because that's what we that's our culture. That's what we do." And I'm
00:47:44
like, "That's not good enough." Now we're trying to explore why because I
00:47:50
don't know those parents and even if I do form a relationship with them, I don't know who's coming in and out of
00:47:55
their house and I can't trust the people that are coming in and out of their
00:47:58
house. I don't It's not that I don't trust you. It's I don't trust the envir
00:48:03
I don't have control over the environment. When you get to a certain age and I have faith in your ability to
00:48:10
put to look after yourself, say 13, 14, 15, then we can have a conversation. But
00:48:16
right now, you're too young and it is my responsibility to look after you. That's
00:48:20
my like biggest job right now. And they go, it's still annoying, but okay, Dad.
00:48:26
You know, I'm not going to pretend like this doesn't annoy me, but okay, we get
00:48:31
we get why you're not letting us do this thing. M and it's not perfect. They
00:48:35
still get frustrated. They still find it annoying. But I feel like it's a step
00:48:40
I'm trying to take where I never ever just go, we don't do this. Why? Just
00:48:45
cuz. I need to like explore it with them. And I feel like that's kind of the
00:48:49
basis of like forming a relationship with your kids where you there's open dialogue where I'm being honest with
00:48:55
you. So hopefully, and I don't know if it will work perfectly this way, but hopefully
00:49:00
you will be honest with me. And you go, "Something's happened, Dad." and I go,
00:49:03
"Great. Talk to me. I'm only here to help you regardless of what's happened."
00:49:08
That's the idea. I don't know if it will perfectly unfold like that, but that's
00:49:12
the idea. You just I think I think um every generation does the best they can with the tools and the resources they
00:49:17
have available at the time. And then and then the next generation will look at us
00:49:20
and go, "What were they up to?" And you'll go like, "Hey man, I was just
00:49:24
watching Instagram videos and trying to like figure it out. What do you want from me?" Yeah. Oh, that's cool. So,
00:49:31
yes, it's your home life. two two daughters who are primary school age now. Great great age. Hey, good age. And
00:49:37
fun age. So you see they still love you, but you can do fun stuff with them like
00:49:41
go play soccer or watch cool movies and stuff. Yeah. Do do they Yeah. What do they sort of know or understand about
00:49:47
what you do for a job? Now they kind of get it all. Now they kind of fully understand that like daddy
00:49:53
is a is a goes on stage. He makes people laugh. He also like writes scripts and hosts events and they kind of get the
00:50:01
whole picture now. So much so that they're now trying to form what they want to do when they grow up.
00:50:07
Um, which is really cool having those conver having those honest conversations and them being like really asking me
00:50:14
like can you tell us like what it actually is like to be a performer and a comedian and a writer and all this stuff
00:50:19
and I can honestly tell them like hey sometimes it's awesome and sometimes it
00:50:23
sucks and here's why it sucks and here's why it's awesome and you actually get to
00:50:27
like dive into the nitty-gritty and watch their wheels turn and go ah interesting. So, it's not just all fun.
00:50:32
Like, I get to watch Daddy on this TV show and it looks really fun, but that doesn't mean that the job's just fun.
00:50:37
That's really cool and and and and interesting to watch those wheels turn. And now they're trying to figure out
00:50:42
what they want to do when they grow up. Um, and we're really trying to tell we
00:50:47
keep telling them like, "Don't worry about that. Just be a kid. Like, you
00:50:50
don't have to worry about that stuff." But they themselves just keep coming
00:50:53
back to it and going like, "But what if I did this?" You be like, "Yeah, yeah,
00:50:57
that's here's what would be cool about it. here's what potentially isn't cool
00:51:00
about it. But again, stop thinking about that and they go, "Okay." And then they
00:51:03
come back to it. It's It's so interesting. So, say you're out somewhere with them, like Butterfly
00:51:07
Creek or Rainbow's E. And And now I'm going to Butterfly Creek every week.
00:51:12
Money's good. Yeah. Money's good. Twice a week. Yeah. Twice a week. Yeah. Um, so say strangers come up to
00:51:22
you now. Um, do do they get a kick out of that or are they annoyed by it? I think they're mostly annoyed by it.
00:51:30
Yeah, I think they're mostly annoyed by it. Um I think they What's interesting is that
00:51:39
the reason they're annoyed by it is because um it can at times sometimes it's super
00:51:46
brief and like someone's like, "Hey man, I really love that thing you do." And I
00:51:50
go, "Cool. Thank you, man." Um and then sometimes it can really take a chunk out
00:51:54
of your time. Um because some a lot of people want to chat, you know, because they're excited
00:52:00
to see you and so they want to talk and that's okay. Like I um I think I think I'm quite gracious
00:52:09
and like I'm um cool with like interacting with people that want to that have enjoyed something I've
00:52:15
created. Um, and none of my kids say that it's annoying, but I just can feel
00:52:19
it that like, you know, they're kind of standing there being like, "All right,
00:52:23
like we're we're at Butterfly Creek." Like, "Come on, I want to see the
00:52:27
butterflies. I haven't seen them in three days." Yeah. Um, but man, they're
00:52:32
such good kids. They never complain about it. Um, but yeah, I think it I think it does annoy them. So, if you're
00:52:37
out there and you want to and you want to um tell me that you like something I do, if you see my kids with me, try and
00:52:44
keep it brief. And but even if you keep it brief, I will interact with you. I'll
00:52:48
say hi. I'll take a photo. If I'm not with my kids, it's more of a green light
00:52:52
to be like, "Hey, I want to talk about this thing you did and tell you how much
00:52:55
I like it." That's more okay. And if I'm in a rush and if I need to go somewhere,
00:52:58
I'll tell you and just be honest with you. But yeah, with my kids, I I much more appreciate it when people are uh uh
00:53:05
quick um about it cuz I've had um Kieran Reed, former black captain, on the podcast, and he he said with his kids,
00:53:12
like if he's out at say Bunnings or somewhere and people come up and they want to chat rugby and it's it's quite
00:53:17
quite annoying and he said he has to take his kids to the the shitty play parks in Christ Church rather than the
00:53:21
Margaret Mayhe one, which is really cool for that reason. Oh, you Yeah. Oh, you've got an interaction with Kieran
00:53:27
Reed. I heard this on a I do have an interaction part of your standup comedy would have been I heard a Kieran Reed
00:53:32
joke. Yes. Would you like me to tell it? Yeah. Go on. It's great. And he would
00:53:36
have enjoyed it. I think he enjoyed it. Yeah. Yeah. I think he enjoyed it. He I said I said I was doing an interview
00:53:41
with Karen Reed. This is in my radio years or half a year. My radio half a year. Um and I said to Karen, um, "Hey
00:53:51
man, did you get burnt this summer?" And he and this was at the end of the interview and I was like, "Hey, just a
00:53:56
quick question before you go, Kieran. Did you get burnt this summer?" And he
00:53:58
said, "No, no, no, I didn't." And I said, "Oh, yeah, true. Probably because
00:54:02
you've been in Richie Mccle's [Laughter] Shadow." And I think he enjoyed it. It's one of
00:54:10
the It's one of the best oneliner gags I've ever written. Um, the All Blacks
00:54:15
didn't like it, though. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, you Yeah. You did um You did a thing,
00:54:19
eh? Like a like an awkward stand-up comedy routine just for the All Blacks. Yes. It wasn't that awkward. It started
00:54:25
off awkward, but um at the moment like a conference room in a in a hotel. A tiny
00:54:30
conference room the size of this room and I just stood there with no microphone and just told jokes to a room
00:54:37
of all blacks sitting cross-legged on the ground. It was really weird. They were all like sitting like with their
00:54:43
legs crossing their arms crossed like they were like like I was a guest speaker at their primary school and they
00:54:49
all just kind of listened attentively. It was really bizarre but they laughed. It the beginning of it was hard because
00:54:56
of the weird environment. But once I got my rhythm um then they started laughing
00:55:01
and it was actually all good. Yeah. But it was weird. Yeah. It's so intimidating. It was intimidating and I
00:55:09
Yeah. I I cuz I just made the assumption that it would just be like in a bigger conference room. They're going to have
00:55:14
seats and I get to kind of be at the like a more traditional stage seating environment, but it was more just like
00:55:22
just stand in a room while they sit there. It was really bizarre, but um but still
00:55:28
cool that I got to do stand up for the All Blacks. It was still It was still a really cool experience. Yeah. Amazing. I
00:55:33
would never Yeah. I would I if I if they asked me to do it again and it was the same environment, I'd probably still say
00:55:39
yes. Yeah. Um yeah, I heard you tell a joke about that and and you're like, "Oh, you didn't know who they were, but
00:55:46
you were like, "Oh, you recognize some of the faces from the scandal." Like,
00:55:49
"Oh, there's a paraplegic toilet guy. There's Dick Fit Guy." Um and that was
00:55:54
true cuz I'm not a rugby fan. I just know like the huge names like Richie Mccau and like, you know, Dan Carter. I
00:56:00
just know I don't know the nitty-gritty like who's the this guy for the All
00:56:03
Blacks. I don't know. Yeah. Um, so yeah, I definitely was like just I was registering scandals rather than names.
00:56:10
Yeah, for sure. But when when you construct a joke like that, are you like, "Oh, [ __ ] This is going to get
00:56:14
back to them." And no, no, because like you're like, "Man, if you think like
00:56:19
that as a comedian, there's there's there's hurdles everywhere then, you
00:56:24
know? You just got to like as long as you know that you're not crossing a line
00:56:27
and you're not saying something that feels unfair, then man, you just got to
00:56:33
let it fly and um trust that you have the best intentions and you don't have
00:56:37
any intentions to truly hurt anyone's feelings. If those intentions exist, then man, just go. Like otherwise, you
00:56:45
can't say anything because then there's hurdles at every turn, you know? Yeah.
00:56:48
And there's no malice. No malice. And and the dickpick did happen and the paraphlegic toilet did. I didn't do it,
00:56:54
man. I didn't do it. All right. I um So, back to your home life. So, dad of two. Yeah. Um your wife
00:57:04
uh spent most of her childhood in Vanuatu, but was born in Canada. Yes. Speaks five languages. She's a lawyer.
00:57:10
Yes. How did you guys get together? It's quite So, you got got together when you
00:57:15
were Well, you got married when you were 20 and she was 27. I was 21 and she was
00:57:19
27. 27. Yeah. That's quite a big age gap at at that. Yeah. Yeah. And she regrets
00:57:23
it. She regrets it. Were you What were you like at that? You must have been quite
00:57:27
um quite self-aware or quite mature. I think I was mature. We met we met um because we're both members of the Bahigh
00:57:36
faith. And so I went and hung out with some Bahigh youth in Deneden where she was studying and she was there and she
00:57:43
kind of hung out with us just cuz she had nothing better to do. And that's how
00:57:46
we got to know each other. And I was like, "Hey, like we should keep hanging
00:57:50
out." And she was like, "Okay." And I was like, "Huh?" Cuz I thought she was
00:57:54
going to be like, "This is a cute 21-year-old. Like, I'm not going to."
00:57:58
But she said, "Yeah, let's keep hanging out." And I think I was mature in many
00:58:03
ways, but also in many ways, I was just a 21-year-old boy. And I think when we got married,
00:58:10
I think that reality hit my wife like a ton of bricks. Like, yes, he's mature.
00:58:14
like maybe intellectually he's mature and like um you know in certain way like
00:58:20
he's eloquent and like all of these things that like an older guy would have
00:58:24
but then in many ways yeah I was just a 21-year-old like emotionally a little bit immature and
00:58:31
you know all these different things that kind of are pretty typical of a 21-year-old and so it meant the
00:58:37
beginning of our marriage was like quite rocky um and it took me a while it took
00:58:41
me it took like four or five years to become like a good husband, which Yeah. I I heard you I've heard you say in a
00:58:47
couple of other interviews that the quote is, "I was objectively a bad husband for the first 5 years." Yeah.
00:58:52
What um has she heard you say that? And what does she say about it? She says, "Yeah,
00:58:57
the chance to go, "No, Pax, no. No, she says she's honest." And I and I want
00:59:01
that. I want that honesty. Like she goes, "Yeah, you were." But also, you
00:59:05
know, like she she must have seen something in you, the way like a like a growth potential or future potential or
00:59:11
something. Yeah. She she and she says that as well. Well, she says like there were these qualities that I saw that I
00:59:16
knew were the foundation for like a really great husband. And I hope I'm not going
00:59:24
to say that I have fulfilled those things, but I hope I'm continuously fulfilling those
00:59:30
promisual promises, you know. Um, but that doesn't mean that like the first four years were just all bad. We still
00:59:37
like loved each other and had fun and like, you know, go get food and joke and go on holiday and all the great stuff
00:59:43
about marriage. Just intertwined with me not knowing how to be emotionally available or me not understanding what
00:59:51
it means that a household is a twoperson job where you have to take responsibility together to make that
00:59:57
household work. And that's all stuff typical of a 21-year-old boy, you know,
01:00:01
like um and that's all stuff I had to learn the hard way. And it meant that my
01:00:05
wife had to kind of walk through the fire with me. It also doesn't mean that
01:00:09
she was perfect. Like she also admits that there were things that she could have done better to help me better. And
01:00:14
you know, she kind of admits that she was a little too hard on me sometimes or or whatever it was. And so because it's
01:00:20
a two-way street and she's able to accept her shortcomings makes it a lot easier to accept that there was a chunk
01:00:27
of time where I really didn't know what I was doing. But that's okay. That's
01:00:30
that's the truth. And as long as the truth isn't something that splits you
01:00:35
apart, it's okay to face it together, you know. Yeah. So, what were you doing
01:00:39
when you met? Had you started comedy at that point? Were you studying? What were
01:00:42
you It's absurd that she married me because I hadn't done anything. I All I
01:00:47
All I was was a guy that wanted to be a comedian. I wasn't even a comedian yet.
01:00:51
I wasn't anything. Well, I suppose that's an ambition in itself. Yes, it is
01:00:56
an ambition. But yeah, I mean, it's incredible for her to have that faith in
01:01:00
me. And she wasn't even like, "I'll marry you, but only if you like make
01:01:05
comedy a hobby and actually get a proper job." She was like, "Yeah, yeah, cool.
01:01:08
Be a comedian." And I was, now when I think back, I'm like, "What in the
01:01:12
world?" Like, who would do that? You know, it's it's it's wild. But like you
01:01:18
say, she must have seen something in me. She must have seen the dollar signs from
01:01:22
back then. She must have seen the TV shows from back then. That's a high-risisk gamble. Oh man, it's a high
01:01:28
risk. Playing the long game. Oh man, it's a big gamble. It's a big gamble and
01:01:31
it p it paid off. But um but yeah, when I think back it's like pretty incredible
01:01:37
that she was like cool. Um which is part of the reason why like uh um I value her so much, you know? How
01:01:49
how did it pay off? How much is natural talent and how much is hard work? How much is natural talent and how much
01:01:57
is hard work? I think it's what's the cliche that that uh I don't know what the cliche is, but
01:02:05
there's something about like hard work. Oh, hard work beats talent when talent
01:02:08
doesn't work hard. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's true.
01:02:13
But I think in this specific context of like standup and kind of like entertainment and and all of that kind
01:02:20
of stuff, I think talent kind of has a bigger impact because it's so vibe based. Like you can be an
01:02:29
incredible write, you can be an incredible writer of jokes, but if there isn't that intrinsic talent when you
01:02:36
walk on stage and there's something that people like, it's really hard to get
01:02:41
those jokes to to get across, you know? So, I think I think in this game it's
01:02:46
more 50/50. It's more kind of even. You need the hard work, but the talent plays
01:02:51
a big role in it. Um uh but in saying that, that cliche does apply. Like if you have no hard work,
01:02:59
you will just be this talented guy that just kind of like flounders. Um yeah, but I don't know. I think it's different
01:03:07
for everyone. It's hard to say. It's hard to say that there's like a hard and
01:03:10
fast rule, you know? There are some people that there are some people that are lazy as [ __ ] but because thing like
01:03:16
timing is perfect and they're incredibly talented and the right person sees them
01:03:20
at the right time and blah blah blah, something happens and then the momentum just rolls, you know, and that just
01:03:26
happens sometimes. Yeah, I'm I'm sure he he isn't lazy. I'm sure this is just
01:03:31
part of his magic, but Chappelle looks like the laziest comedian around. Yeah. Yeah. I I I understand how that look
01:03:38
like how it looks like he's lazy, but I think like I I think he's like incredibly hardworking from the
01:03:43
perspective of like when you don't see him when he's at home, I think he's just
01:03:48
constantly like writing in his head and constantly coming up with bits and constantly like doing standup in places
01:03:54
where no one even knows he's doing it, you know? It's not televised. It's not
01:03:57
on social media. He's just out there trying to grind. Um I think there is an element of like I
01:04:05
think the hard work in standup is just how long are you willing to eat [ __ ] and
01:04:10
not eat [ __ ] as in not do well on stage. I mean that might be part of it, but eat
01:04:14
[ __ ] as in like man there is just a long ass period where you got to do gigs where no one pays you. You got to do
01:04:20
gigs where there's like eight people in the crowd. You got to do gigs where it's
01:04:23
like the dude will will give you a ride to the gig but then can't give your ride
01:04:28
home so then you got to use your pay. Literally the taxi is the cost of the paycheck. Like you got to it's just that
01:04:33
for years and years and years. And I think that's the hard work in standup as
01:04:38
well as the writing and the creating, but it's the just like walking through the mud for like
01:04:46
years until you start to know what you're doing on stage and get genuinely good and you like know who you are and
01:04:54
your craft is is a level where it's undeniable. When you walk on stage, people go, "Oh yeah, that person's good
01:04:59
at what they do." And that's when the momentum starts to kick in. I think
01:05:02
that's I think that's the hard work. So, your first time on stage 2011 at RAW,
01:05:08
which is um like an like an amateur night, first time as night at uh the classic in Queen Street. Yes, it was it
01:05:14
was part of the Raw Comedy Quest as well. It my first time on stage was a heat for the Raw Comedy Quest, which is
01:05:20
a competition for rookie comedians. Um and the final you, if you get it, if you make it to the final, you get to do a
01:05:27
big kind of big showcase show. Um, and the winner gets to do um, Last Laughs, I think it is, that a year after at the
01:05:37
Comedy Festival, which is like at Sky City Theater, which is crazy at that point in your career. It's crazy. So,
01:05:42
yeah, my my first gig was a Heat um, for the Raw Comedy Quest and and I made it to the semis and then made it to the
01:05:50
final. So, my third gig was at a final of of the Raw Comedy Quest in front of like 400 people. How was that first
01:05:57
experience on stage? Yeah, I believe you aced it. It went really well. Yes. Yeah,
01:06:02
I aced it. Were you Were you nervous as hell or you were? Yeah. Oh [ __ ] I suppose everyone is. Oh, [ __ ]
01:06:07
bricks, man. Yeah, most people are. I think if if you're not, you're going to
01:06:11
be a mass murderer. I think you're a psychopath. Some some nerves are healthy, isn't it?
01:06:16
Yeah. Oh, some Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Nerves are really needed. Like, no nerves is like not helpful because you you it
01:06:22
means you don't it means your body's not kicking itself into gear to do the
01:06:26
thing, you know? Um, but yeah, man, I was I was [ __ ] myself. Um, but yeah, did really well. And then the semi did
01:06:33
really I did really well throughout the competition and then Scott gave me a gig
01:06:37
where it was no longer part of a competition. It was just a it was just a gig at the classic. It's not a
01:06:43
competition. There aren't heaps of people there to support their buddies. Tickets aren't five bucks. They're like
01:06:48
$35 now. Everyone's there because they want to watch good comedy and they've
01:06:53
got a babysitter and they've paid 35 bucks each for a ticket and they've had
01:06:57
to pay for parking and I tanked in that context of like a real gig. This is a real gig now. It's not like a kumbaya
01:07:06
support everyone gig. I tanked hard. Fourth gig I tanked. Yeah. What does what does tanking hard mean exactly? How
01:07:13
does that look? Yeah. No one laughs. and you panic and you start talking faster for no reason and you start sweating and
01:07:19
you start forgetting your jokes because you start thinking about the fact that you're tanking so the jokes go out of
01:07:23
the head and it's a train wreck. Yeah, that's what it looks like. It's a train
01:07:27
wreck. Yeah. Cuz I suppose like you've been doing it 14 years now so you've got all the tools
01:07:32
in the toolbox. So you you you've got the muscle memory where you can draw upon something that's going to get you
01:07:37
out of a sticky situation. Um but yeah, what do you what do you do back then? Do
01:07:41
you just like call the SE early? Are people do people start heckling? What happens? No, people don't start heckling
01:07:46
because I think I think the MC set me up pretty well. I can't remember who the
01:07:49
host was at the time, but the host did kind of tell the audience that like, you know, this is a new comic and like, you
01:07:56
know, show him a lot of love. He's he's he was in the final of the Raw Comedy
01:07:59
Quest, but you know, he's early in his journey. So, it does set up the audience
01:08:03
a little bit to not be so mean, but also the audience is not going to give you a
01:08:07
fake laugh. If they don't think you're funny, they're not going to laugh. But
01:08:11
um it it was also set up so that they're not like horrific to you. But yeah, like like you say now I
01:08:17
have now I have like close to six hours of material. Back then I had six jokes in total. So
01:08:27
if three of them don't work, it's it's game over. It's going to be
01:08:32
Yeah. It's going to be a long 10 minutes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It wasn't even 10 minutes. It was like seven seven
01:08:37
minutes. Yeah. So that 7 minutes felt like an eternity. It felt like I was up there for like 35 minutes. Well, after
01:08:43
that, why do you So that was quite early in your career. Yeah. Why do you keep going after that? Just cuz you've got
01:08:49
enough feedback from the earlier sets that you do have something. I think if I I think if I consistently bombed after
01:08:56
that, I probably would have quit. But that I after that gig, I I went up again and did okay and then went up again and
01:09:03
did quite well. Then went up again and did really averely. And so the the gigs that came after that was a was a mixed
01:09:11
bag of pretty good and pretty average. And so I kept seeing glimmers of like something that worked well. Um if I just
01:09:20
tanked over and over and over and over again for like 4 months, I think I would have packed it up and been like, "All
01:09:25
right, I tried it. I'm not a standup and I'll just go do like I probably would
01:09:31
have just went to uni and become an architect like I wanted to as a 12 13 14 year old but because they just kept
01:09:37
there were just pockets of like oh I can do this it just kept motivating me and then kind of a year
01:09:43
in Ursula Carlson gave me a really great piece of advice and this was before Ursula had popped like now Ursula's like
01:09:51
she's in a movie I watched her last week in a movie with Amy Schumer. Yeah, she's
01:09:55
hu she's she's so family. She's on a massive Hollywood Netflix movie and
01:10:00
sells out like theaters all over the world and she's such a huge name now. And Ursula was really kind to me early
01:10:07
in my career before Ursula had really popped but was still building a really solid audience like was a great comic
01:10:14
had a had a fan base that really loved her but wasn't the Ursa we know yet but
01:10:19
was really kind to me and like she took me on tour a couple of time like I opened for her in a few places and um
01:10:26
she was really supportive of me which I still even to this day even though I don't really talk to her anymore other
01:10:30
than if we cross paths um I I still really appreciate Okay. Um, but she gave me a piece of advice and said that like
01:10:40
you if you want to do this, like legit, if you want to legit do this, you have to see this as a
01:10:48
marathon. A gig not going well cannot be something that you care about because if
01:10:54
you're going to do this for real, you're going to do tens of thousands of gigs
01:10:58
and you have to see it as just one piece of a humongous puzzle. And that piece of
01:11:05
advice that Ursula gave me really put everything into perspective very early into my career where I went care about
01:11:11
every gig, but once the gig is done, take from it what you can and that's it.
01:11:16
Move on and keep going. And that was like a pivotal. It's kind of, you know,
01:11:20
every now and then something will happen in your journey that kind of becomes a foundational piece for you. That was one
01:11:26
of those moments. I don't even know if she knows. I don't even know if she reme
01:11:29
she probably doesn't even remember telling me this in the green room of the classic, but I remember uh it not only
01:11:34
do I remember it, it's a piece of advice that like is kind of one one of my foundational kind of modes of operation.
01:11:41
Um yeah, it's a great piece of advice actually for most things in life, isn't
01:11:45
it? Yeah, I think it applies to everything. Yeah. Yeah. Don't get too up yourself. Don't get too down on yourself
01:11:49
either. It's wonderful. Yeah. When when did you when did you first realize you
01:11:53
could probably make a living from it? Was that after you So you started in 2011. So we're sort of in 2011ish now.
01:12:00
So then you had that break and you went to teachers college. Yes. Was it after you came back that you sort of thought,
01:12:05
"Oh, this might work." Or was it 2016 when you won that the joke of the year
01:12:09
thing? Yes. Yeah. I think it was I think it was 2016 when I did the gala and and won one Yeah. the Comedy Guild's
01:12:19
best gag award and then gained real legitimate attention from the the entities of the
01:12:28
entertainment industry. You know, that's when radio came knocking. That's when
01:12:32
kind of Seven Days kind of came knocking and said, "Hey, would like to make you a
01:12:36
comedian that appears regularly or semi-regularly." you know, that's when
01:12:42
um auditions started to to kind of pop up and I ended up appearing in like a bunch of ads and that's kind of the
01:12:48
moment where I was like, "Oh yeah, this this could actually be a thing."
01:12:53
Um but yeah, before that I I always there was something in me that always knew that something was going to happen
01:13:01
that allowed me to do this as a career. I don't know why I had unearned confidence. I just did. But there but if
01:13:08
I think back now I yeah there was absolutely a world in which that gala set doesn't happen and I just kind of
01:13:15
trudge along and then kind of pack it up and and and get a job. But that reality
01:13:22
is a reality for every comedian. It's, you know, there are moments that become
01:13:26
kind of those fork in the road moments and the possibility of packing it up is there for everyone until that fork in
01:13:34
the road happens where you really establish yourself and the industry not only trusts you but wants to work with
01:13:41
you, you know. [Music] Um, there were other moments as well. I don't want to I don't want to say that
01:13:48
like that was the only moment but it was a big piece of the puzzle and then with
01:13:52
a combination of other moments happening at the same time it all kind of came together. But yeah, yeah, you can't just
01:13:58
um you base a career on a moment like look at the the hog tour girl. Yeah. Yeah. But I suppose you had like um you
01:14:05
know four or five years experience before that. Um so you you know you weren't like a one hit wonder. No, no. I
01:14:11
And I didn't see myself as a one hit wonder, but I also recognized that sometimes you do need a moment to really
01:14:16
like show like to tell the world, hey, I do this and I'm actually quite good at
01:14:21
it, you know. Um, and sometimes those moments are really helpful. Um, and yeah, that was it for me. Some people
01:14:27
some people don't have that moment. Some people just are comedians that just keep
01:14:32
grinding, keep grinding, keep putting together a body of work and then eventually that body of work gets
01:14:37
recognized. Like it doesn't have to be that way, but it's not it's not it's
01:14:40
it's helpful. Yeah. I suppose you just hope if you are going to have that moment, it does
01:14:45
happen when you've got, you know, like a bit of experience behind you like you
01:14:47
did have. Um Yes. So what was that joke exactly? Uh so this is you pretending to
01:14:51
be Tongan, which is one of the one of the story arcs in um raised by refugees. So this is a true thing. Yes. Yeah.
01:14:59
Primary school age intermediate. Like end of primary school, beginning of intermediate. Yeah. In real life, I kept
01:15:06
up the sherad for like three years. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. In the show because it's a show, it's one day because you
01:15:12
can't, you know, you have 25 minutes an episode. But um yeah, in real life it
01:15:16
was 3 years of pretending to be Tong. And so I dropped because 9/11 happened being Middle Eastern of any kind was
01:15:23
like really bad. Um but Pakistani was still okay cuz Pakistani was more just like Apoo from The Simpsons and you know
01:15:29
it was more chill. um not cool but chill. Um so if I told everyone that I was full tongen, no one
01:15:38
would believe me. I'm too skinny and hairy. But um but um it was believable that I'm half
01:15:45
Pakistani, half Tongan. So I dropped the Iranian to get rid of the Middle Eastern
01:15:50
stigma with 911 and added Tongen. And it was it was fine. Like I I was able to keep up the sherad. Uh man, there was
01:15:58
some there were there were definitely moments where the other tongans were like, "Are we sure he's give us your
01:16:04
best chance?" Yeah, especially on like the on like the league like when we play
01:16:08
like a game of league and like they pass me the ball and like I don't know what
01:16:12
like I'm like running around in a circle, they're like is he to win? So yeah, there were definitely
01:16:18
moments where like there were there were holes in my argument, but yeah, I just kind of it was more out it was out of
01:16:24
survival really with with the reflection of hindsight. Why was why why did that hit the spot? Why was that joke so
01:16:29
successful? I think it just kind of like connected with a really broad spectrum of people.
01:16:37
I think white people loved it because they know that guy. They've all every white person to a degree has interacted
01:16:45
with like a Vietnamese dude or a Pakistani dude or an Indian dude who wants to act like the coolest ethnicity
01:16:52
at the school. Whether it's like the Filipino kids or the island boys or the
01:16:56
Maldi boys or the white boys, we all know that one e that one kid who decides he's just going to assimilate into the
01:17:03
coolest ethnicity. Then the Pacific Islanders, you know, loved it for obvious reasons because I'm shouting out
01:17:11
their culture and I'm making references to things that they all truly understand. And then the South Asian
01:17:16
community loved it because they all have a cousin or they are the person that had
01:17:20
to had to code switch. And so I think what it did was it's one of those rare
01:17:25
bits that just landed with everyone and everyone was like I connect to this bit in one way or another from whatever
01:17:31
perspective it is, you know, and it and it and it was a moment in time where social media wasn't this kind of now
01:17:41
social media is inundated with standup. Now it's just an ocean of standup and
01:17:46
the only way to stand out now is to post consistent like over and over and over again. It's really rare for one bit to
01:17:55
be posted and to change your career. You know, I've had I've had bits that
01:17:59
I've posted now that have like over 5 million views, but it doesn't change
01:18:03
your career because that's kind of the norm now for people to go viral. Back
01:18:07
then for a bit of standup to I think that bit got to close to 2 million. Back then, a bit of standup going to 2
01:18:14
million was like unheard of. This is pre- Tik Tok, eh? Pre- Tik Tok, pre- Instagram reels, pre all of it. Back
01:18:20
then, Instagram was still just the platform for photos. Videos weren't really a thing on Instagram. So, it was
01:18:26
YouTube and Facebook and it got close to 2 million views on Facebook and then like close to 100,000 views on YouTube.
01:18:32
And that for a standup was like, oh, this doesn't happen. Um, so it was a different time as well. It was a
01:18:38
different environment, a different online environment where one piece of standup can go viral and change
01:18:45
everything. Whereas now it's just not that. Yeah. [ __ ] Was that an exciting
01:18:50
time? It was crazy, dude. It was crazy. I like Yeah, it was it was really exciting, but
01:19:00
also a little bit nerve-wracking cuz I'm like it's all coming at once now and
01:19:03
like you better not screw it up, Pax. You know that thought. It's inevitable
01:19:07
for that thought to pop into your head because now all of a sudden everyone wants to work with you. You know,
01:19:12
producers are hitting you up going like, "Hey, we want to pitch a show and we
01:19:15
want you to be the host and this and that." And you have to learn to like you
01:19:19
can't say yes to everything cuz not everything is the right fit for you. But
01:19:22
you want everything in your body wants to say yes to everything, you know, but you can't because it could be wrong for
01:19:28
you. And radio was that it wasn't right for me to go on George F wasn't right.
01:19:33
that audience didn't like me because I wasn't who they connected with. I didn't
01:19:37
really like dance music. That's crazy. You can't be a host of Georgia fem and
01:19:42
not like dance music. You know what I mean? But you're not thinking critically
01:19:47
like that. And so thankfully radio didn't ruin my career. Um it was just a kind of hurdle in the road or a bump in
01:19:55
the road. But yeah, it was it was really exciting and also a little bit nerve-wracking to
01:20:00
go like, "All right, I got to manage this correctly now. Um, and thankfully, you know, my wife is
01:20:06
a smart person, so I was able to talk to her and I had a good management team and
01:20:10
and we were able to traverse it and now I'm here, you know. Yeah. Must been exciting for you as a couple because
01:20:15
it's like she she believed in you, you believed in yourself and finally it was
01:20:19
validated by a a broader sector of society. Yes. Yeah, it was exciting. I think the predominant thing that was
01:20:27
exciting was the potential of like income because we were really scraping through and I was getting to the point
01:20:33
because I quit in 2014 then came back and then this happened end of 2016 and I was getting to the point where I was
01:20:39
like all right I've come back and I am like better at standup now but it's
01:20:43
still tough man and like I don't know if this I still questioning whether this
01:20:46
was the right choice. Um, yeah. And so that kind of came at a time where I was like on the border. I was still kind of
01:20:53
deciding and that kind of again fork in the road set me on a path where like now
01:20:59
I'm here and you know still doing standup and and lucky enough to have the opportunity to make television and and
01:21:05
be on television. Yeah. And so many ads two degrees. What's the what's the other
01:21:09
one at um I was trying to think about on my run this morning the the line is um something so good you won't want to
01:21:15
leave. Fletcher living. Fletcher living. What's the What's the line? I don't
01:21:19
remember. It was so long ago, but that was one of those ones where like I did it years ago and it just kept rolling
01:21:24
over. So, you get paid You get paid a check every year. Yeah. Yeah. I just get paid a check every year. It's over now.
01:21:29
It's done now. But there was like this period where it just ke they just kept
01:21:33
giving me money. How's this so good or You won't stop living so good. You won't
01:21:37
want to leave. Yeah. You won't want to leave. But it's distinct. Yeah. Yeah. I
01:21:41
mean, I've been told I have a very distinct voice which has helped me in this ad space. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it's
01:21:46
all kind of it's all kind of happening right now. Oh. Oh, one thing. Um, this
01:21:51
has joged a memory talking about Georgie F before and not fitting in with the the
01:21:54
audience. You you've never drunk, eh? You've never been a drinker? Never. I've
01:21:58
never had alcohol. Like a relig that must have taken a lot of strength of character especially during those peer
01:22:04
pressure years. Oh man. And I went to high school in Hamilton. So yeah, that was the main activity.
01:22:11
That was the main Yeah. Like I um Yeah, I'm probably the same. Like the first
01:22:15
few times I drunk, I [ __ ] hated it. It was [ __ ] And I felt sick the next day and it was awful. But uh I I
01:22:20
desperately wanted to fit in. Yeah. Yeah. I I mean I I was actually talking to my wife about this two days ago cuz
01:22:27
she was telling me cuz she grew up in Vanuatu. It's a very different culture
01:22:31
obviously, but there's still a drinking culture there. And so she was telling me
01:22:34
about how there was three. So we're both bahigh and in the Bahigh faith drinking
01:22:39
is um is not allowed or not is not permissible. Um and but that doesn't mean that there are lots of bahigh out
01:22:47
there who go through their younger years and are still peer pe peer pressured into trying alcohol. Um and that doesn't
01:22:55
you know in in the Bahigh faith the concept of your spiritual journey as your spiritual journey is very strong. So
01:23:02
there's no level of like hey you need to be judged or like you're going to go to
01:23:06
hell or anything like that. It's just, you know, you you do it and and if if
01:23:10
it's something that you you deem as a mistake, then you move on from it and whatever. But my wife was sharing with
01:23:17
me how like there was three or four occasions where she got pe pe pe pe pe pe pe pe pe pe pe pe pe pe pe pe pe pe
01:23:20
pe peer pressured into or felt the peer pressure of wanting to fit in and and ended up drinking and and I was like,
01:23:26
"Yeah, I mean that's that feels like something that should have happened to
01:23:31
me." Like I went to high school and my dad, you know, at 14 years old, he sold up
01:23:36
his businesses or he sold his um h sorry not businesses, house and started a business in Hamilton and we moved down
01:23:45
there. And so my last four years of high school were in Hamilton. You would think
01:23:49
that of course I end up at some point getting peer pressured into drinking. It didn't happen once. And when I think
01:23:56
back to it, I'm like that's crazy. How did that even happen? I don't even know.
01:24:00
M I just was like I just made a stand and and decided I'm not going to do it and I
01:24:07
don't need it to feel cool or feel accepted and I stuck to it and it just and it was fine. Yeah. What is it like
01:24:14
internal strength of character or fear of your parents or I think it was a combination of both. I think it was a
01:24:19
combination of fear of repercussions from my parents but also a strong understanding of who I
01:24:28
am but also honestly I think the binge drinking which is not this is not new information it's not like this we we've
01:24:36
all seen it especially in those younger years but I think the binge drinking honestly helped in my resolve because
01:24:44
when you see people doing the most imbecillic things and like hurting themselves. And you know, every now and
01:24:51
then a mate has to get rushed to hospital cuz their liver kind of screws out, you know, like it kind of
01:24:58
contributes to you going maybe I'm not missing out on anything, you know, and
01:25:02
like maybe it's fine. And I would go to parties and everyone's drunk around me
01:25:05
and I would just be like, nah, I'm not going to do it. And just stick to it.
01:25:09
Also, like to be fair to the people that I went to high school with, I relatively
01:25:14
had a pretty supportive group of friends like you know um my closest friend was Savinta he was a Sri
01:25:23
Lankan guy we put on the basketball team together we we were the we he was my closest friend and he never really like
01:25:29
pushed he was never like you should drink man he was like yeah be pax doesn't drink and that's sweet I
01:25:34
remember there was one moment where I thought to myself maybe I should drink because maybe it will make me cooler and
01:25:41
my friend Brena who I think she's still she's you know she has a her great job
01:25:47
in Hamilton. I think she's still in Hamilton. I'm pretty sure I haven't
01:25:51
spoken to her in a couple maybe a few years now, but shout if Brena's listening, shout out to Brena. Um she
01:25:57
was a good friend of mine in high school and I remember I was thinking about doing it and she was like, "Don't do it.
01:26:02
What's wrong? No, don't do it. You don't drink. Like, you're not supposed to.
01:26:06
That's not what you're supposed to do at this point. You're supposed to You've
01:26:09
been not drinking for like 3 and 1/2 years. Don't do it now." And when I
01:26:13
think back, I'm like, "Oh, that's actually awesome." I was lucky enough to
01:26:17
have an environment of mostly people who were actually really supportive of that.
01:26:24
Um, and that's not the case for a lot of people. Yeah, that's what you need, eh?
01:26:27
People that have absolutely got your best interest at heart. Yeah, it's so cool. Have you got a good friend group?
01:26:32
And are you good at um the vulnerability part of it? Like, no. No, I'm really
01:26:36
bad. I don't know if I have a good friend group. I have pockets of friends. Yeah, I have a friend group that, you
01:26:43
know, my wife and I are friends with. I have a friend group that's more like
01:26:46
industry based. Um, I have a friend group that's like more like childhood friends/cousin/b brother. Like we're all
01:26:54
kind of in that group, but um yeah, I don't I'm not great at vulnerability and it's it's not good. I
01:27:01
think it's I think comedy has kind of made it worse because you learn to just
01:27:06
deal with things with gags and you don't really know. I a friend of mine who's
01:27:10
who's a who's I I really cherish her friendship and um is a writer who's a really talented
01:27:17
writer and director and actor and um Hannah Hannah Marshall um who's been in
01:27:23
a bunch of different things. She sent me a text the other day and I don't know if
01:27:27
Hannah will see this. She might, she might not. But um she sent me a text the other day because we hung out and we we
01:27:34
just got um coffee together at one point and that was partly because we're friends, but partly to talk business
01:27:39
like industry stuff as well. Um and we had a really like meaningful conversation about like self-confidence
01:27:46
and having confidence in your own ability. And she text she sent me a text that was really
01:27:53
vulnerable and was was her expressing her appreciation of me always showing or telling her how much how talented I
01:28:02
think she is or expressing to her that I think she's a really talented person and
01:28:07
she just wanted to like text me and say that she was really appreciative of that. And that text made me so
01:28:13
uncomfortable and I haven't actually said this to her but I pushed myself. I
01:28:18
really pushed myself to just send her a reply that was vulnerable in return. I didn't want to make a gag. I didn't want
01:28:26
to undercut it with like comedy. I didn't want to push it aside and pretend like it didn't happen. I just took it
01:28:34
in. I absorbed it. I accepted it. And then I sent her back a text that also just reciprocated that vulnerability and
01:28:40
said I and was in the realm of I really appreciate my friendship with you and I and I respect you and thank you for
01:28:49
sending me that text and and I'll always have your back. These are not the words
01:28:53
that I said, but it's like an approximation of what I said and I really challenged myself and pushed
01:28:57
myself to be like, Pax, don't do a gag. Just accept it, take it in, and be vulnerable back because you need to do
01:29:03
this. You need to stop doing it. And I don't know why it was like three day or
01:29:07
maybe no maybe a week ago now. I just had a moment where I was like, man, sometimes you just got to let it be and
01:29:13
like let it be real. Thanks for sharing that. I mean, you've been very open today. Do you find it
01:29:18
more comfortable talking like to an audience or in front of a microphone than you one oneonone? Yeah. Yes. I I
01:29:25
the same. I I feel way more comfortable being vulnerable when I know it's like
01:29:28
there's a performance element to it, which is so screwed up, man. It's cooked. It's so screwed up. But like you
01:29:35
got to start somewhere, right? And those moments where a friend texts you and you
01:29:38
just be vulnerable back, I guess is those little wins where you're trying to
01:29:42
break out of that like status quo. But yeah, I with if if there weren't microphones here, I'd just be asking you
01:29:49
like Yeah. So like um how what kind of car you drive, man. Yeah. But I think being aware of um your deficiencies when
01:29:57
it comes to that sort of stuff is a good start. It's health It's the healthier
01:30:00
place to be than to just pretend it doesn't exist. Yeah. It means you got things to work on. How how has your
01:30:04
mental health been over the years? I think my mental health has been, man, I'm so lucky. I'm so
01:30:13
fortunate to have like a really supportive family structure. I'm not going, you know, like everyone,
01:30:21
you have your down days, you have your up days, you have your days where you just feel really confused, you have your
01:30:25
days where you feel really like on top of the world. Um I think something that has really
01:30:32
helped me stay on top of my mental health has been and I'm not it's not just because I'm a Bahai but I think the
01:30:40
the the fact that I'm a Bahai uh and someone who has a spiritual practice has
01:30:46
really helped with that because it has forced me to build in things like meditation. It's forced me to build in
01:30:55
things like prayer which is a form of meditation. It's forced me to build in
01:30:59
things like reflection. So like one of the teachings of the Bahigh faith is that in whatever shape or form or
01:31:05
whatever point in the day you do it, you have to it's called bringing yourself to
01:31:09
account. And all it is is you take a moment to reflect on your day. How were you? What did you do? What did you say?
01:31:15
Who did you interact with? And think about how you can improve the next day. That is a teaching of the Bahigh faith,
01:31:20
a a practice of the Bahai faith. And that's probably something that's shared
01:31:23
across many spiritual practices. Um, but having that inbuilt has really helped me
01:31:29
stay on top of my mental health in this crazy crazy industry. Um, I'm not pretending like it's
01:31:36
perfect. I'm not pretending like I've just like skipped through life ly da.
01:31:40
It's great man. There are some days where you like like everyone you feel screwed up. But having that inbuilt
01:31:48
spiritual practice has really been like a guide and like there are days where I feel really weird and I just go it's
01:31:54
okay Pax just continue your spiritual practice and you feel it kind of center you doesn't fix it it's not like a magic
01:32:00
pill that just fixes everything but you get centered again you understand that like this physical existence is not
01:32:06
everything that you believe in something further than the physical existence and
01:32:10
those things kind of like bring you back and spiritual practice isn't right for
01:32:14
everyone but um it's been good for me and so that's kind of the thing that's
01:32:18
like helped me over the years. Yeah. Because you'll know this this industry is wild and it's sometimes
01:32:27
really promoting and really pushes you to focus on the self. You you you me. I'm number one. What's happening with
01:32:35
me? Do I get this gig? Am I doing this this role on TV? Why am I not doing this? It's all how do I promote myself?
01:32:43
It's all you, you. And what the spiritual practice has done is it's forced me to let go of me and think
01:32:50
about others. And I think that's like a really healthy way to be. Yeah. Well,
01:32:54
thanks for sharing that. Yeah, you're right. This industry can be incredibly
01:32:58
toxic cuz you're forced to to make yourself be liked by people that you don't even [ __ ] know. Yes. Exactly.
01:33:03
It's not normal. Exactly. It's not normal. It's not normal. It's really
01:33:06
obscure. Um, and so to have a way to like regground myself feels really I feel really lucky. And lots of people have
01:33:15
ways to regground themselves in their own ways. And this is the way that's um
01:33:18
kind of worked for me. Yeah. Yeah. Are there three words that family or friends would use to describe you if they were
01:33:25
here today? Oh man, I don't know. You'd have to ask them far out. Three words that What
01:33:32
would you like them to be? Say it's your funeral. And but it took a real morbid twist.
01:33:38
Yeah. Say you're dead. Hey Pax, you're dead in the ground. And you and you died because you
01:33:45
slipped on a curb. You died on stage. You died. No one was laughing. And then you slipped and you hit your head and
01:33:53
you died. You What What three words would you like them to be? Generous. selfless
01:34:11
and committed. That's what I would like them to be. I would like people to to
01:34:16
think of me and I try this is what I try to do to be someone that is thoughtful of other people that doesn't always put
01:34:23
myself first that is generous with my time and with my and with my resources that I'm always trying to help other
01:34:31
people like I always make an effort when there's like a newer comedian in the
01:34:35
green room and that I know that they're not making that much money they're still
01:34:40
in the grind and I know that they got to get an Uber home if my house is on the way or Even if it's a little bit out of
01:34:45
the way, I'll try and offer be like, "Hey man, like would you like a ride
01:34:48
home so you don't have to spend that 35 bucks on an Uber or you don't have to be
01:34:52
in a bus for an hour and 25 minutes to get to your house that's 15 minutes away, you know, like or I'll try and
01:34:58
like if anyone has any piece of advice, I will try and take the time to spend as
01:35:03
much time with them exploring the question that they have about the industry."
01:35:09
as many opportunities when people say, "Hey, we have this opportunity for you
01:35:13
to speak to a group of people that want to be in the industry. Like, would you we don't have any we have 200 bucks to
01:35:19
give you or we have a we have a gift voucher to give you. Would you be able to give an hour of your time?" I try
01:35:24
with every ounce of my energy to make that work, you know? So, I would hope that people would would say that I was
01:35:31
that I was generous and not self-centered, but also really committed to what I do and committed to being good
01:35:38
at what I do. Well, the three great words to um strive towards. Yeah. Yeah. I'd like to think so, but also but also
01:35:46
committed not just to my industry, but also to my wife and to my kids and to my family and to my brother and also to my
01:35:52
industry, to all of it. Yeah. Yeah. I I I would think that those are three pretty good words. Do people explain me
01:35:59
with those three words? [ __ ] man. I don't know this [ __ ] He's a titus.
01:36:05
Selfish. He's a piece of [ __ ] Maniac. And last one. Last one. Are you proud of
01:36:10
yourself? Am I You know, Dom, I find it really difficult to stop and celebrate myself.
01:36:23
M I find it really hard especially even when I get a massive win when when when the producer at the
01:36:32
production company that was making Raised by Refugees with me called me and said hey it's green lit we're making the
01:36:39
show. I was like awesome. And then I hung up the phone and I went into my office and immediately started to figure
01:36:46
out what the show was and how I wanted to write it. No, I have a real difficulty with celebrating myself and
01:36:52
it's not good. Um, and it's not healthy. And you know, but going back to your
01:36:57
question of like how is your mental health? That's probably one of the things that I need to work on the most
01:37:02
is like being okay with like celebrating myself. So, am I proud of myself? Like,
01:37:07
if I stop right now and think back to all the things I've achieved in my career and all the things that I've
01:37:13
done. Yeah, man. I'm really I'm really proud of myself. And I can't sometimes I
01:37:17
can't believe that I'm I'm here, but uh it's not something I tell myself
01:37:24
really ever. And um that's not great, but um like you said, as long as you're
01:37:31
conscious of it, maybe it's something I can work on and be better at rather than
01:37:36
just constantly being like, "Okay, what's next? What's next?" Yeah.
01:37:42
Well, I'm proud of you. Thanks, man. It's been It's been great today. And
01:37:45
you've you've been incredibly selfless with your time as well. It's been cool.
01:37:48
It's been a really cool conversation. Yes. And I can't thank you enough. It's
01:37:51
been nice to finally connect on a deeper level. Yeah. Yeah. No, I I I I really enjoy it. And um like like you say, I I
01:37:57
probably wouldn't be this vulnerable if there wasn't microphones. But still, it
01:38:00
it doesn't change the fact that it happened, you know, and that we did have a a vulnerable conversation and a and an
01:38:06
open conversation. So, yeah, I I appreciate it and I really enjoy and thank you for this. This is genuinely
01:38:10
such a good gift. I was kind of nervous to have to pretend that it was cool. Like, wow, a DVD of Airbud. What? Do you
01:38:19
ever seen that movie with a dog is good at basketball? No. It sounds amazing. Yeah. Yeah. I was going to be like, "Oh,
01:38:24
no." But um No, this is this is a this is a great gift. When does this come
01:38:28
out, this podcast? Um I'll put it out in time so we can promote your uh crowdwork
01:38:34
show for the Comedy Fest. Yeah. I I completely forgot that that that's the main reason why I'm here, but we'll do
01:38:39
that in the front bit. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Great. Oh, thanks. Thanks so much for coming on my podcast, mate. You're a
01:38:44
great New Zealander. Thank you, man. Thank you for having me. I really appreciate it.