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What really matters, what really matters is first of all the environment you came from. Yeah.
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If you came from a loving supportive environment, you're much less likely to re-offend than if you
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re-offend than if you came from a dysfunctional uh violent or um uh uh chaotic environment as a child.
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Secondly, when you're in prison, if you've got strong support from your family, that same family which
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which which supported you when you were young, even though you may have deviated and and and broken the law and
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gone to jail as I did. If you've got strong family support when you're in jail,
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that's a big help. That's a big help. Mhm. Um and when I was in prison, I was in prison at a time when there
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were lots and lots of middle-class drug offenders like me who came from good environments, who broke
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the law. Well, we all had good backup. You know, I mean, I had my family backing me up. I had my dad and my mum
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visiting me regularly. Um I had my brothers and sisters visiting me. I had my friends visiting.
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And I had them doing stuff for me, running in errands for me, helping me with my when I was doing studies. Mum
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typed out my my MA, you know, I had all that kind of support. And then, the third thing is support when you get out.
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>> Mhm. You've got to have those same people who visiting you when you're
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when you're in jail, they're standing for you and helping you when you get out. Mhm. And I was really
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lucky in that respect. And also, it wasn't just my family. You see, I had Bill Hodge
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and Professor Bill Hodge and Professor Bernard Brown both in the law faculty at court at
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Auckland University who backed me when I got out, you know? So, I had really strong support when I got out and
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that some research that was done by Jared Gilbert and Bean Ellie and and and me.