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Oh, good. You're here. Come on. This is the center of performance. Whenever there's a top performance in New
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Zealand, it all comes from here. That's Lisa Carrington. She's been doing that
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for days. That's the boys who got the hole in one in to Hey Finn, how's the performance going?
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>> Top tier. >> Nice. This is our generate room. In here, you'll find our top performers
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helping Kiwis maximize their Kiwi Saver investments. Get in here, Finn. Maximize. Generate. putting performance
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first. >> Dr. Carlina Tonger, welcome to my podcast. >> Thank you so much. I'm so excited to to
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be here. >> I'm so excited to have you here. We'll just get you closer closer to that
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microphone. >> Close. Yeah. >> So, um I got an email from your mom. >> My mama. Is she she?
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>> No, not >> so uh I've got part of it here. I edited it, but um it says Kadom, I am the mom
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of two-time world powerliffter Dr. Karina Tongatier, born and bred in South Oakland from a family of five. Karina
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started her powerlifting journey six years ago and stepped onto the world platform representing New Zealand in
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2023. I hope you would see the benefit in having her on your podcast to inspire others to have it all and not to have
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take one or the other academia or sport. Nami for your time, Joe. Proud mom. >> A
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>> I think that's the first time I've had an email where someone's used the word
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academia as well. >> Yeah, we're smart cookies. >> But um that email when I got that, I
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thought that's that says a lot because here you are. You're um a grown woman
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yourself. You're a doctor. Um you've got this career and stuff going on but your
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mom's still >> um yeah hovering around like your biggest fan. >> Yes.
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>> Taking care of business. >> Yes. Mom and dad, the whole family actually are uh helicopters in my life
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and ever present. Um I'm so blessed that I can have their support because you
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know it's very busy the sort of two paths that I've chosen. Uh, and so to
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have their support and have their sneaky emails to amazing people like you, uh, you know, it's it's so great.
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>> It was so cute. It was the cutest thing. So, I got that email, then I looked you
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up and I was like, "Oh, that's adorable." And I think I think it speaks
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volumes like the success that you've you've got in life now. um that sort of
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self-belief was probably installed in you at a at a young age from the way you were you were parented and you know that
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reflects now in emails that your mom's sending on your behalf >> even though you're how are you in your
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30s? >> Yeah, I'm 32. >> Yeah. So, no, this is not the first sort
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of um email or action of uh support and belief from mom. Uh they have been this way for my whole life.
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>> Oh my god, it's like equal parts like mortifying. You did what, mom? But also
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so cool. >> So cool. You know, I couldn't be, you know, the first thought was like, "Oh,
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that's like slightly embarrassing, but also it's the Dom Harvey podcast." So,
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thank you, Mom. Like, absolutely, I want this opportunity. >> Yeah. Once I once I Googled you, I was
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like, "Oh, [ __ ] Absolutely. I'd love to have her on. She's amazing." So, we're
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going to go through your whole story, but first of all, um I feel like we might need some almost like a like a a
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glossery section to, you know, because a lot of people won't know what you do and
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so we'll sort of break it down a little bit. >> So, you're the current world record
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holder for the squat. >> Okay. And you've got the World Games coming up in a couple of weeks.
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>> Exactly. >> Yes. What are the World Games? So the I mean I only just found out when I
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qualified last year, but the World Games is a multis-port event and it's supported by the IOC. So it's kind of
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connected to the Olympic Committee. Um I guess you could think of it as the sports that are not really at the
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Commonwealth Games and all the countries that are not at the Commonwealth Games.
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So there's uh 60 different sports and this is the first time that classic powerlifting will be in it. Uh so it's a
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first for us. We're very excited and we're kind of hoping that it is almost
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like a uh audition to get into the Olympics for our sport. Um yes, because we've got some heavy hitters in New
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Zealand. Uh not just myself. >> Yes. You're doing um incredible stuff on
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the world stage, but most people probably wouldn't know wouldn't know who
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you are or what you're doing. >> So So powerlifting uh what is it in simple terms?
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>> Yes. So it's uh three lifts. It's uh the squat, the bench, and the deadlift. So
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at no point does the bar go over your head. That's Olympic weightlifting what
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we see in the Olympics. Um so yeah, those three disciplines and you basically just lift as heavy as you can.
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So because the bar doesn't go over our head, we can generally lift much heavier
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weights. Um so you know my record squat is 231 kilos. So uh that's very proud of
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that and wanting to push it. But um that's pretty much powerlifting. It's a
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a very niche sport, but it's growing. It is growing. I guess like I've made it
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here so hopefully more people get to know about it. But um as with many sports New Zealand you know we are such
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a small country but we really stamp our mark on certain sports and we do the same in powerlifting. We're quite famous
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in powerlifting. >> So um yeah there's the three lifts for powerlifting as you said squat, bench
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and deadlift. Yes. >> And they take your weight for all of them and they combine them.
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>> Yes. And then you get a total uh uh total weight. Um and that is how you win
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at the end. Yes, I should have said that. >> Yeah. So squat you um I think most
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people probably know this, but just in case on your back down until your um thighs are parallel with the floor.
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>> Yes. And then up again. >> And then up again. And you get three tries of each. So you kind of work your
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way up through the competition. Um bench press is laying flat and obviously bringing the bar down and then back up.
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Um and then deadlift is just picking the the heavy thing off the ground. >> Yeah.
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>> What are the rules with bench? Like are you allowed to arch your back? >> Yes. So you you are allowed to arch. Um
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there's been recently some changes to try and make that less because I think
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people don't really like to see the arch. Um but mostly it's listening to
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commands. So you do have to press it and wait for someone to to to tell you to press it up. So you can miss commands
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and things like that. So there are little rules and nuances for having to follow and keep it to standard.
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>> And what are your personal best in all those three lifts? >> So my um I guess my gym personal best
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for a squat would be 238 kilos. >> What do you weigh? >> Uh so I'm in the 76 kilo weight class.
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So when I'm training I'm usually 78ish kilos. Um, so yeah, uh, but at competition 231 kilos and then my bench
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press is 132.5 kilos. >> Wow. >> And, uh, deadlift is 255 kilos. >> Just think about that squat for a
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second. So, it's basically three times your own body weight. >> Yes. >> Yeah. Yeah.
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>> Yeah. >> And and the bench again, what's your what's your personal best for the bench?
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>> 132.5 kilos, which is Yeah, it's it's pretty good. There's uh there's a a
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couple of girls who are crazy benches and they're sort of in the 150s and then
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uh and then they would be me. I would be right after them >> cuz I think most people that are
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listening to this, probably men in particular, probably know what their what their best bench is. So, it gives
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them something to compare to. >> Um don't cry. >> Do guys um do do you see some guys
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getting uh >> I don't know, like ego damage in the gym or you know what I mean?
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>> Yeah. Like recently I have because we used to be in a private gym where it was
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just powerlifters like just athletes and so we've moved into a more commercial
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area and um I regularly see men's egos not doing well when uh not even just me
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um training friends are also training. So um yeah I had uh gosh it was the first time this had ever happened. I was
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deadlifting and it was 160 kilos. It was that's very light for me. Um and someone
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just just came over out of the blue and tried to lift it. Um and I said to him before I was like, "Mate, you shouldn't
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do that. Uh you should probably like warm up before you try and lift something this heavy." And he he almost
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just he didn't break the floor. He almost passed out trying so hard. >> It was really awkward. But um yes.
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>> And is um mansplaining a thing in the gym or not so much anymore? Yeah, not uh
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not when you're in the safe zone of like a private athlete gym, but I think it
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still is a thing I'm experiencing uh at a semi-commercial gym. Um a bit of mansplaining going on, but they've
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learned to stop. >> Yeah. Not to not to f with you. >> Yeah. >> And um what is Sheffield? Like I've
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heard heaps of podcasts with you and you talk about Sheffield a lot. What is Sheffield?
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>> Yeah. Sheffield it's a it's a competition almost like a showcase. It's happened
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for three years now. So, it's quite new. But one of the biggest or well the biggest sponsor in um powerlifting SBD
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um they uh manufacture all the gear that we wear uh held this Sheffield event and
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it's in Sheffield in the UK and they invite uh 24 of the best lifters in the
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world. So, it's usually uh world champions versus world champions across weight classes whereas, you know, I'm in
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the under 76 weight class. So, I would compete against my own weight class. At Sheffield, I'm competing against world
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championship from 47 up to 84 plus uh weight classes. >> So, it's kind of like all the stars, all
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the best of the best. And um the the way you win is by beating your total world record by the highest percentage. So,
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it's it's also fun to watch for people. So, uh the it's kind of the first event
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where people actually uh travel to buy tickets for and really enjoy uh watching these powerlters. Um the first time I
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went, you know, being so new uh into the international space, I was just fangirling non-stop because they're like
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powerlifting celebrities. Um and now I'm going for the fourth time next year.
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>> When you go there, are you sort of like a rock star? >> You feel like it. Yeah, you really do
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feel like it. you get treated. It's not a professional sport, but they do treat
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us like professional athletes. You know, they fly us over. They have us in hotels. We're all eating together and um
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there's media and interviews and afterwards there's meet and greets and you're sort of like, "What the heck?"
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People want to meet me um and get autographs and it's it's a it's an
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amazing experience. >> When you say you eat together, what are you eating? Broccoli. Broccoli and
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boiled chicken. >> Yeah. Look, some people are eating air. Some people are on liquids cuz yeah, it's a weight
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cutting sport. So, um I'm one of the lucky ones that can keep eating actual food.
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>> That's amazing. Um and you've got a partner, Harry. >> He's he's um is he a UFC fighter?
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>> He is not a UFC fighter, but he that's his preferred like training method. Um
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he is a tradey and welding, but uh we've we've grown up together and been
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together since we were 15. So um he is yeah a massive massive massive support and um especially with the last sort of
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five months of me training much more and working less. Uh he's been a huge um
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part of keeping levelheaded and and getting through it. >> Yeah. You need a supportive partner
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because it's very timecon I mean you got this job this very very um you know high
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pressure job you're doing um and also this uh very time consuming sport as well.
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>> Yeah. Yeah. And I, you know, I do stop and think, oh my gosh, lucky that this
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is just working uh out so well and that he is so supportive because yeah, I do get home at sort of 8 at night and we
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just have a quick meal and go to bed because we've got to go to work tomorrow. Um, but he comes along and he
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loves it and he just wants nothing but for me to keep going and to keep pushing things. So, I'm very lucky.
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>> Yes. So, your partner, your family, um your job, and your training, and I'm
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guessing there's not much time for anything else. >> Yeah, that's that's 100% right. Um I
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might see a friend or two once or twice a year. Um and it's uh they understand. They
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understand. And when we do catch up, it's really nice. But there's not a lot
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of time for anything. Um, it's just the cost of of of getting gold. >> Um, and medicine and powerlifting, do
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they do they compete or compliment? >> I think in a lot of ways they complement
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especially in the type of medicine I'm doing. So, I'm in general practice. Uh,
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I'm a contractor. So, I can have a lot of control over what my schedule looks
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like. Um, and I have an amazing job uh with managers who are so supportive and and just want to see me go and sort of
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win these world titles and come back to work. So, I'm really really lucky. But I
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think they complement each other in the way that both of them can be extremely stressful. Um, and you can reach burnout
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with either of them, but you know, when I'm at work, I'm at work and seeing my
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patients and sort of taking on whatever stories are coming at me that day. Then the next day I know I'm going to go and
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lift heavy weights for 4 hours and sort of offload and that feels really good. So that that works out at the moment
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okay for me. >> And and which one there may not be a direct answer for this but which one um
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requires more discipline >> being a doctor or being an athlete. >> Yeah. Yeah. I think discipline the word
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that word being an athlete. Uh a lot of discipline goes into it. uh because I think when you get especially after a a
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few world championship events uh their motivation is not always there all year round and so all you can rely on is like
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routine and discipline and consistency. >> Um I'm not sure that I need to be that
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disciplined at work. >> It's just googling symptoms, isn't it? >> Googling symptoms and then um
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prescribing augmentum. >> Isn't that what >> Go ahead. you now have a medical degree.
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It it it requires other uh values and um skill sets at at um at work. But I think
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that's why it goes so well because they're two completely different things.
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But um at work, the other thing that sort of helps is, you know, I get reminded of of people's realities every
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time I'm at work. And so it I think that crosses over at sport where nothing is
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really that bad, >> you know. Um I I have experienced losses in sport, but um I think just having
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been around some like real actual grief and stress and hard times, it's sort of
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like, you know, there's always next year. >> Yeah. It's good perspective, right?
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>> Yeah. >> Yeah, it does. It brings you back down. >> Yeah. >> Well, I think that's the intro done. I
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think that paints a good picture about um who who you are and and what you do. Um so now we can go all the way back. So
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yeah, who who was young Kina? What is what are some of your earliest memories? >> Earliest memories I guess uh growing up
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my earliest memories are net a lot of net family. My parents were my coaches so they really have been super duper
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present in my life. Um just growing up with siblings every Saturday at the net courts we my parents were coaches they
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ran the net club and so sport is just a been a huge part in my life and has never left um it has changed but um it
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it's not that it's saved me from anything but I think in like a prophylactic way it helped me in so many
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ways to sort of get to where I am um in other areas of my life. >> Yeah. I mean, we started with this with
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the email from your mom, and it sounds like she's been that sort of like helicopter presence through your whole
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life, like you mentioned before, uh, her coaching your net team. I think I heard
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in another podcast you did like she was on the the school board. She was at your
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school ball like just watching. >> But you you never had the chance to get
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into any trouble, did you? >> No. I think that was the plan. They were just like, we're everywhere. Everywhere
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you turn around, you're like, "Okay, that's my mom." Um, and she was like
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that for for most of us. Um, and I think, yeah, it just kept us out of trouble. We didn't have time to do
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anything else but sport and school. Um, it was strict like it really was. Um, but on reflection, you know, uh, it
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worked out in the end and we had some, you know, awesome uh, experiences growing up. Uh, so, yeah, I am one of
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five and so my sisters and my youngest brother, um, everything we've done, we've done with our parents and
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I was they were pretty good at however they did it because like I uh always admired them and I never felt like oh
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walk over there you know don't drop me off at school or whatever you know I always wanted them around and I was
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happy and proud to have them around. So even though they were like helicopters that I I enjoyed their their teachings
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and their company and yeah >> did you get away with anything? >> No. Who was the naughtiest? What What
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was the naughtiest thing you did? >> You just not not a naughty kid at all?
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>> No. >> Who was the bad one of the siblings? >> Yeah, the oldest. Always. Always. That's
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why. So, I was like, "Okay, so don't do that and don't do that and don't do
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this." So, she taught me a lot of what not to do. So, she went through it all
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so that the rest of us didn't uh were not brave enough to uh push those boundaries. But yeah, I remember in high
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school I had this one goal of like I'm going to skip one day of school. I'm
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going to before I finish school, I'm going to I'm going to wag. Uh but I
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never did. >> I did not achieve that goal. >> Well, it served you well. Yeah. So,
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you're um you're um half moldy, half tongen, so your mum's moldy. >> Yes. And dad's tongen.
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>> Yes. >> Yeah. Um yeah. What does that heritage piece mean to you? Yeah, it is extremely
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important to me and es especially knowing that um I get to put us on a platform for the rest of the world and
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and show them a little bit of our culture. I think growing up my parents uh mom was from Ka and she moved to
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Oakland in around like 18 and dad lived in born and raised in Tonga and moved to
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New Zealand when he was 17. And so they moved away from their roots and kind of they built their own family within
00:19:07
Oakland. So I didn't have a lot of like blood relatives in the area, but we had
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this makeshift family of of a whole bunch of diverse people. Um, and so I think in that way like I we always me
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and my siblings always feel that we have more connections to be made to our culture, but at the same time like I I I
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know where I'm I'm from. I know where I get all my gifts from. Um, and I'm so
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happy to like put it on a world stage and let people know about it. >> How did how did they get it so right?
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I'm just thinking of like some previous podcast guests I've had like um I don't
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know if you know Matt Brown. He he started this foundation called She is not your rehab, which is phenomenal.
00:19:50
>> Um, so his his his parents la they came to New Zealand from Samoa for a better
00:19:55
life. his dad ended up with a factory job and you they they basic they basically their um their outgoings were
00:20:01
more than the goings each week and his dad developed an alcohol problem and >> um you know it just wasn't a great
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outcome for the kids. >> Um but I suppose everyone that comes from the islands to New Zealand comes
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because they want like a better life or better opportunity for the kids that they have or they're going to have.
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>> Um and it seems like like yeah for your family it's it's worked.
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>> Yeah. >> They've nailed it. >> Yes, I think so. I think it was just
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this like great combination of two people who uh had this picture of of what they wanted more for themselves and
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and they're so determined and they I've watched them work so hard. You know, I
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remember um as a really really young kid um dad when I was born was like working
00:20:44
at I think BP or Calteex or something and mom was working at a bar and then we've watched them go through banking
00:20:50
and become managers and we've watched what hard work looks like. Um and they
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wanted us to kind of skip those steps and like go to uni and and get get there as quick as possible. So there was a lot
00:21:00
of pressure to you know to to do be a doctor. Did you Did you want to be a doctor or
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were were you sort of told you have to be like a doctor or a lawyer or >> I think it was both. It was a bit of
00:21:14
both. Um like I've always been interested in health and sport and and um and fitness, but yes, the the the it
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was like doctor doctor. So, >> but I love my job. I love my job. So, you never had that self-doubt, that that
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thing, oh, you know, I'd like to be a doctor, but maybe I'm not smart enough,
00:21:34
maybe I'm not good enough, you know, whatever story you tell yourself. >> Yeah. I think the
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>> No, and and that >> that's so powerful that that's got to
00:21:43
come from the parenting they say. >> Yeah. Yeah. That's what I was just about
00:21:46
to say is it's definitely come from them in the way that they like uh the expectations they set, the uh way that
00:21:54
they even trained me in net ball and and uh in our sort of just general life, you
00:22:00
know, there's a lot of um at 10 years old, I'm being taught positive affirmations and like saying kind things
00:22:08
to myself and saying uh my goals out loud to myself and not just that I hope that it'll happen that this is what is
00:22:15
going to happen. And so I think when you're so young and that's what you're
00:22:18
already practicing, then it becomes second nature as you get older. Um, and that's not that to say that I don't have
00:22:26
doubts. You definitely get doubts. But when you've practiced that for so long
00:22:30
and it's really ingrained in your brain, it's much easier to sort of just let
00:22:34
negative doubts uh pass by. Um, so yeah, it was almost like pre-therapy, you know,
00:22:40
>> when I didn't know. >> That is so powerful. That's really So
00:22:43
you were how old? Like 10. Yeah. >> And what's Can you remember what they
00:22:47
like? Did you have them written down on like on a mirror or >> I we didn't the my my most vivid memory
00:22:53
is they were taking us for a nipple training and so it's me and other girls as well and they told us to go and sit
00:23:00
across the court and by ourselves and think of like three things that you're
00:23:05
going to do uh positively in the in the game on Saturday. So, I'm going to get
00:23:10
this many intercepts or I'm going to do this and and we just had to sit there
00:23:15
and say it and say it and say it and then they told us when you go home go stand in front of the mirror and say it
00:23:20
again. And so that just I had a lot of buy in, you know, a huge amount of buyin into what my parents were saying at that
00:23:28
time. So, I was doing it and I don't necessarily do it that way now, but it's
00:23:33
just sort of second nature because they had me doing it back then. >> Yes. I muscle a memory. Where did they
00:23:39
get it from? Were they into Tony Robbins or >> I Mom, where did you get it from?
00:23:45
>> That's that's Yeah. That's not something that you um instinctively know how to
00:23:50
do. Like it's it's a learned thing. That's that's so that's so powerful.
00:23:53
>> Yes. Yeah. And I I think it worked, you know, not just for me, but with these
00:23:57
girls. I was 10, but we played net together till we were 21, 22. And each and every one of us has been really
00:24:05
successful in our own rights and and doing well in life. And so I think yeah they they played a big part in all of
00:24:12
our lives. >> Oh, so you played net up until your 20s. How how come you gave the net away?
00:24:18
>> Just um when I started in the hospital could not be relied on for team sports
00:24:22
and and trainings. It was my love. I wanted to be a silver fern. Um >> were you all right? You're quite short,
00:24:31
eh? >> I'm so short. Um, I was decent. Um, and for a long time it was really really a
00:24:37
goal uh of mine to be a silver phone and I would always watch uh Tim was the the
00:24:43
main center. I was center at the time and she looks so short on on on TV. So I thought that's okay. She's short, I'm
00:24:51
short, like I can do this. And then we went to a game and she's like this much
00:24:56
taller than me and I was like oh I'm not going to do it. Tim part of George. Like she might may
00:25:02
look small on TV, but that's cuz she's standing next to Irene Van Dyke or
00:25:05
whoever it is. >> Yeah. So, yeah. >> So, you gave that away and replaced it
00:25:10
with a sport that requires 4 hours of training a day. >> I know, but hey, I've got some gold medals and
00:25:17
you know, it's worth it. >> So, you you leave school and then you go to med school and you you um you go to
00:25:22
Oakland University. Um >> you what was that like? cuz I'm guessing through like through through your your
00:25:29
um education um you never sort of felt like a minority because you go to school in South Oakland so you're surrounded by
00:25:34
people that that look like you or are like you >> then you go to med school. Um yeah. What
00:25:39
was that like? >> Yeah. No, you're so right about that because I you know I think I've been
00:25:43
asked before in a while in conversation whether you sort of experienced any I don't know racism or anything growing up
00:25:51
but you know I grew up in South Oakland so we we all look the same and there's
00:25:55
so many different people. Um, not really. But then you go to Oakland uh, uni and yes, you really do become a
00:26:02
minority and you're sort of one of maybe 20 in a class of 200 and something um,
00:26:07
that look like you and and you kind of just really uh, gather together. You you really Yeah, you do. You find your
00:26:16
tribe. Exactly. Um, and that takes you through to med school. So, uh, at uni they they do have their own little
00:26:23
cohorts and side groups. Um, you know, there's the uh map as at at Oakland Uni,
00:26:28
so that's modern Pacific Island. Um, and yeah, we just stuck together because we
00:26:34
have, you know, the same values came from the same like small places. Um, and it just made it made it much easier. So,
00:26:41
I didn't actually feel too out of place or or alone. >> How how hard or overwhelming is med
00:26:47
school? >> H, at the in and when you're in the in the moment of it, it feels extremely
00:26:53
overwhelming. I I remember so many tears and like sleepless nights of studying and um it it felt extremely difficult at
00:27:01
the time and I'd only say that because you go through life and then you realize
00:27:05
oh that wasn't so bad >> at the end of it. >> Yeah. I faced so many more challenges
00:27:10
since then but um and especially sort of my hospital colleagues you know as a student uh you would shadow some maybe
00:27:19
senior registars who are doing their last set of exams and they'd sort of just look at you and be like med
00:27:24
school's nothing like wait till you get here and you're oh my god what am I
00:27:30
doing but no it it it was challenging um yeah just the high high standards once you get into med the sort of pressure
00:27:39
between the your peers is less. But trying to get into med school, sort of like each man for themselves. And I
00:27:46
really wish there were way more spots than they are. I think a lot of people miss out on getting through to med
00:27:52
school just because we don't have enough spots. And >> we so need more doctors.
00:27:56
>> Need more doctors. >> Isn't there um is there a massive c between year one and year two? So you
00:28:00
study year one. Yeah. Like it goes from what to what? I think it goes from something like over a thousand or so to
00:28:06
200 like a maybe even a few thousand to 260 in my year. I think maybe it's at
00:28:13
300 now. But we know that there's in the next 5 years a whole bunch of uh at
00:28:18
least GPS going to retire and we don't have anyone to replace them. So it's uh
00:28:24
it's hard times now, but the future's looking pretty. >> And how many years? How many years does
00:28:30
it take? Uh the med school's six years and then you have to do two years as a
00:28:35
junior minimum uh to sort of get your registration and then you decide where to branch off to and what you want to
00:28:42
do. >> Where were you sort of in your in your class? >> Yeah. Oh, I don't even know. I have no
00:28:49
idea. I think if you don't really care unless you're at the top. So, uh I
00:28:54
wasn't at the top of that one. >> Who was at the top? That's why my dog
00:28:58
does. They're doing well. I think they're doing well. One's a pediatrician and the
00:29:05
other I think it's in cardiology or something like that. Yeah. >> Yeah. So, you graduate and then you
00:29:09
become a doctor. Um and then uh your first job is at Middlemore Hospital. >> Yes.
00:29:13
>> Why was that? Did you choose to go there or do you get like just placed
00:29:16
somewhere? >> Yeah. So, you you you can preference where you want to go and then the
00:29:21
hospitals look at your CV and decide whether they want you. Um but Middlemore Hospital I did my fourth year and sixth
00:29:29
year at med school there and then I worked there for three years as a junior. Um and it's just it's known as
00:29:38
sort of a baptism of fire. Uh a you get a lot of learning quickly. Um one of the
00:29:45
hardest places to work but once you work there then generally you can work anywhere else. That's what that's what
00:29:53
everybody says about Middlemore. Um, and having experienced it, you know, that's
00:29:57
very true. Uh, it was very overwhelming and and sometimes, well, a lot of the times you felt out of your depth and and
00:30:07
sometimes alone as well because staffing wasn't so or isn't so great. Um, but you
00:30:14
learn a lot. The people you're working with are amazing human beings. it kind
00:30:18
of attracts a certain type of people and so it's almost like Stockholm syndrome
00:30:23
like you you're you're traumatized from what's happening by the system but the
00:30:27
people and the patients that you love and is what keeps you going there or what makes students want to work there.
00:30:35
>> Yeah. >> What about your first day there? So you walk into Middlemore Hospital as your
00:30:39
first day. I can't imagine how nerve-wracking that is. You've done all this training, training, and I suppose
00:30:43
you've had placements or whatever beforehand, but >> you know, everyone remembers like going
00:30:47
to a new school for the first day or starting a new job. Um, but this is like next level first job stuff.
00:30:53
>> Yeah. Oh my gosh. Yes. And you feel like still a teenager. You really do. You
00:30:59
feel like a teenager uh who's suddenly been given this role. And when people
00:31:04
ask you things, you're sort of looking around like, "Wait, are you asking me? I
00:31:10
know. I've just been to at school for six years, but this seems like a big step. Um yeah, my first day was it was a
00:31:17
long day. So that's when you start at seven and finish at 10:00. Um and uh part of that shift or half of that shift
00:31:24
you'd be the only doctor on the junior doctor for like maybe four or five wards. Um and so that was cra that was
00:31:32
crazy overwhelming. It was uh uh probably the most stressful day because it was right at the beginning and I just
00:31:39
you walk through a ward and everybody wants a piece of you. Everybody needs something from you and we don't learn
00:31:46
how to cope with that uh when we're at med school. Uh that that sort of like
00:31:51
being pulled in all sorts of directions and not always knowing the answer. Um I definitely had to step out and have a
00:31:59
cry um during that shift because it was just yeah something that I'd never experienced before. Um and actually I
00:32:08
just there's the series um Diary of a Junior Doctor that just came out I think
00:32:13
a couple of months ago and it's really well done. It does. It's at Middlemore
00:32:17
Hospital and it follows some junior doctors and it's it's real um what they
00:32:22
show on there and it kind of brings back a lot of memories good and and bad. >> Yeah. Yeah. It must be quite triggering.
00:32:30
>> Yeah. It was surprisingly very triggering for uh for myself and and my colleagues as well. Some people couldn't
00:32:36
make it through the series because uh for a lot of people they left the hospital because of um how you know how
00:32:43
busy or how overwhelming. And I think when you're in general practice um you
00:32:49
you have a sort of the way that you're driven is to sort of stop people from
00:32:55
from getting to that point and and we're not so um >> uh I think in the hospital it's very
00:33:02
outcome driven. So you come in and I give you this treatment and then you go home and like fixed off you go. Um
00:33:10
whereas in general practice there's a bit of that but it's also okay. So how
00:33:14
do we take care of your health so that you don't end up needing to get to that
00:33:18
place. >> Yeah. >> So how long were you at Middlemore for? >> I was there for 3 years.
00:33:23
>> Right. >> What was the hardest day on the job? Is there one that stands out?
00:33:28
Um, I think the heart they have a theme and it's when you're a junior and your
00:33:35
seniors are busy in surgery, but there is some something like bad news or some kind of procedure that needs to be done
00:33:45
um by a senior, but you're all that there is and and so you're having to
00:33:51
sort of be talked on the phone through some steps of how to do something. And I guess like one I remember was delivering
00:33:59
some bad news about a scan to um to a man and his family. And that was def within my first couple of weeks and and
00:34:09
I was just on the phone with the senior like uh I don't even really understand
00:34:14
what the scan is showing. I don't know if I can then go and tell him this really bad news. But there was nothing
00:34:21
that could be done. And so just sort of trying to remove yourself from the situation because actually
00:34:29
I'm not the one receiving bad news. It's going to be much worse for him >> and stepping into a okay, I'm going to
00:34:36
try and be as compassionate as I can for this patient in this moment and just do
00:34:40
the best that I can. >> Does it does that um communication piece get any easier?
00:34:46
>> It does. Yeah, it does with confidence and >> it's >> some doctors are terrible at it. E You
00:34:52
must have seen like all you know all ends of the spectrum like some some some doctors incredibly intelligent and and
00:34:59
gifted at what they do but just no bedside manner. Yes, those uh yes, yeah, those people do exist and um it's a it's
00:35:08
a really important thing to me uh communication and uh building trust with patients uh getting them to feel uh like
00:35:18
they are in control of their health and making it sort of a combined like effort
00:35:23
that you and I are working together to get you to this place, not just I am telling you this this this this
00:35:30
>> um let's make this plan together and see what you think about it. Um, and I think
00:35:35
most a lot of us end up in general practice because we we get to do that. We get to uh build relationships with
00:35:43
our patients and see them for years and through their whole lives basically. Like I've been in general practice for
00:35:50
six years and I have already, you know, met my patient and then they've had a
00:35:53
baby and now their baby's four and and I, you know, saw that baby in a scan when it was not conceived but
00:36:02
>> on the scan. >> I see what you mean. It's these connections you build and then um yeah,
00:36:06
that that child's going to come to see you through their life and >> Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. And I think in the
00:36:11
back in the days like you would see that child have a baby and um I think that's
00:36:15
Yeah. Uh that's how general practice works best and it's really hard to even
00:36:22
do it that way in the current climate. >> Yeah. Can you remember the first time a
00:36:28
a patient or a family of a patient like yelled at you or abused you? >> Oh the
00:36:32
>> so many first. >> Yeah. Not the I can't remember the first but I do remember one that sticks out
00:36:38
pretty pretty clearly. Um and it was yeah it was felt you it feels very threatening um when it happens uh and in
00:36:48
general practice it's just you and them in a closed door so it's uh it can feel
00:36:53
pretty scary um but that sort of deescalation not that I don't think I've ever been
00:37:01
taught how to do it but um most of the time it's coming from a place for them
00:37:07
of not being heard or um being frustrated with a system. And I I don't think it's it was ever sort of me
00:37:17
personally, but if if we could just bring it down and talk human to human and get to the basis of what it is, um
00:37:25
then that sort of usually works. Um when people are, you know, not on high on drugs or anything like that when it's
00:37:32
just a normal angry person. >> Yeah. Yeah. Is is that a major issue, the drugs? Um I wouldn't say in general
00:37:39
practice I would say def like an ED for sure. You when I was working um in the hospital you would hear it all the time
00:37:45
especially on night shift you know there's security guards there's always
00:37:48
people around trying to stop um you know violence and uh huge alcohol and drugs.
00:37:53
Yeah. >> So during those minimal years how how often how often were you finishing your
00:37:58
shift and just going home and crying in the shower? >> Mhm. Oh no. I just cry in the toilet on
00:38:03
the shift. How often? >> I don't wait. >> How often? Like what is it? Once a week,
00:38:09
once a month. >> I think I think it was maybe once a run for me. Um I I runce.
00:38:16
>> Sorry. Once a three months. So every 3 months you change um your >> Well, that's not bad. Four times a year.
00:38:22
>> Yeah. Um um but I it's different for everyone. And I really did enjoy like the fastpac
00:38:32
move on to the next one, onto the next one. um uh sort of vibe of Middlemore Hospital. Um and I think it you know I
00:38:40
think I handled it it pretty well. Um it's just that the the reason why I left
00:38:47
was I liked everything. I enjoyed everything. Some people um will have a sort of uh I want to say run again
00:38:56
attachment or placement that they definitely don't like that they definitely don't want to do surgery or
00:39:01
definitely don't want to do mental health. And I literally loved every single run that I did and I couldn't see
00:39:06
myself just picking one and then and also being in the hospital for the rest of my life. So I get to do everything in
00:39:13
GP. >> Yeah. I suppose um you just a couple more on the middle more years. So in
00:39:17
that in that hospital environment I suppose it's quite transactional like you know you're just tuning through
00:39:21
patients all the time. Yeah. >> But are there any um any or many like patients or cases that stick with you
00:39:26
that you still think about to this day? M there's there's a couple and I think
00:39:34
um there ones that remind me of family members. >> Those are the ones that uh really stick
00:39:40
with me. Um, I was on a night shift once and one of the patients, he uh was having real trouble breathing overnight
00:39:49
and he didn't have any family with him and so we'd had to get um like ICU to
00:39:56
review him and put him on breathing apparatuses and it was just a hard night for him and I he did remind me of my dad
00:40:05
and so it was yeah it was quite um emotional like even just thinking about it now makes me emotional. But um
00:40:15
he was okay. Um but in the morning when I was about to go home, I'd finished my
00:40:20
shift. I just thought, you know, if his family comes to see him today and he's
00:40:26
completely hooked up. That's so scary. Um so I called his wife um and before I
00:40:34
went home just to let her know like this has happened overnight and he's hooked
00:40:38
up to a lot of things right now. So when you come like don't don't worry um or
00:40:43
don't be alarmed. And that just felt normal to me. Um but someone was sitting
00:40:48
next to me and said, "Oh my gosh, that's really nice that you just called his
00:40:52
wife to to let him know that." And I thought, was it like I was just sort of
00:40:57
trying to like let this family know that that he's having a rough time, but don't
00:41:04
be too alarmed when you come in and you see that all of this stuff has just arrived at his bedside. Um yeah, and it
00:41:12
really did ram it. He really did remind me of my dad. So yeah, even though that was like 5 years ago, it's still sort of
00:41:19
you still think about um patients and yeah, and care about them. That's beautiful. I I was thinking the same
00:41:24
thing. Is that sort of like a procedural thing or protocol or you just had the made the choice to phone the family and
00:41:30
let them know? >> Yeah, I just Yeah, I had just made the choice to let them know.
00:41:35
>> Um and yeah, because I had thought I would have been so so so scared if I
00:41:40
just turned up and and he looked like that. Um yeah, >> that's um next level duty of care, eh?
00:41:49
That's really cool. That's really sweet. Yeah. >> But yeah, th those are the ones that
00:41:54
stick >> that stick with you. Um, and I'm sure there's so many others. Uh, yeah.
00:42:02
>> When and when someone when someone dies on in that hospital environment and
00:42:06
you've been involved with them, like does that does it does that play on you
00:42:09
or do you just have to draw a line in the sand and you move on? >> Yeah, it's so quick in the hospital
00:42:14
environment. Um, and as soon it sounds so morbid, but as soon as that happens, then someone else has moved straight
00:42:22
into that room in that spot and then and now you need to look after that person.
00:42:27
Um, and so it is very quick and you kind of do move on. I think it it depends on
00:42:32
how much involvement you have with a patient. But things have to move pretty quickly.
00:42:37
>> Yeah. I suppose you just don't have time to dwell or mourn, eh? >> No.
00:42:41
>> Um, what was the most valuable lesson you learned from your time at Middlemore? M
00:42:48
um oh most valuable so many lessons from Middlemore Hospital um I think just my time at Middlemore
00:43:00
Hospital it you really or anyone's time at Middlemore Hospital you just learn so
00:43:06
much about the community that it serves and and how much struggle there is and how the difficulties that that patients
00:43:15
are going through and that you know if you say could you come in follow up in two weeks with me like that is a huge
00:43:24
thing to a lot of people that's not just something that you can pick pick up and
00:43:29
do and say yes absolutely to people don't have cars people don't have money
00:43:34
for appointments and you feel that so heavily when you're working in South Oakland um and so it's just learning all
00:43:41
of that stuff outside of your clinical expertise is that these are the these are your people and these are the type
00:43:47
of people that that you're working with and so uh keep all of that in mind and
00:43:54
and and be compassionate in the plans that you are making uh with these patients uh because it's really really
00:44:02
hard out there. Um I think that was the biggest thing. >> Yeah. Do do you think it changed you as
00:44:08
a p as a person at all? Like did it make you like more compassionate or more cynical or you know or tougher?
00:44:16
>> Yeah, I somehow all of that. It makes you all of that because you have to be
00:44:21
tough and you can't um break down every sad story that you hear, but you also
00:44:27
need to uh >> take all of that in into account, that whole person into account, not just
00:44:33
their symptoms. And you know, there's a lot of social work that goes into uh
00:44:38
being a doctor in South Oakland as well. So, it it makes you tough. It makes you
00:44:42
compassionate. It makes you uh uh understand more about what living in South Oakland is really like. I mean, I
00:44:50
live I have lived in South Oakland my whole life, so I do know. But, um I think especially for people who uh work
00:44:58
at Middlemore, but have never lived in South Oakland, that that's what they quickly learn.
00:45:04
And a lot of it's like a like the family environment you're bought into. Like not
00:45:06
everyone's lucky enough to be born into a family like yours where you've got
00:45:08
these incredible role models, you know, teaching you um you know uh visualiz visualization and things like that at
00:45:15
the age of 10. >> Like that's really it's really cool. >> Yes.
00:45:20
>> Yeah. And yeah, I mean that's just a testament to my parents and and and
00:45:26
what they w wanted for themselves because I know that that wasn't the upbringing that they had indiv as
00:45:32
individuals and so yeah they they made a different path for us. >> So why the switch from um Middlemore to
00:45:41
becoming a a GP which is like a family doctor, right? >> Um and how do you explain that? Is it is
00:45:46
it a is it a cruisier a cruisier lifestyle being a GP? Yeah, I think in hours in terms of hours, yes, because we
00:45:54
don't do night shifts and we don't do the long 15 hour shifts or two weeks in
00:45:59
a row. So, yes, it is lifestyle-wise. Um, there's it's the variety is huge.
00:46:06
Like, we're we're jacks of all trades really. We look after babies, elderly,
00:46:11
men's health, women's health, mental health. where I work is rural, so I
00:46:15
still get to do, you know, cut out some skin cancers and uh suture up some big lacerations. So, it's you get to do
00:46:22
everything. And I love that about GP. Um, and like I'd mentioned before, that's why I wanted to do it because I
00:46:29
couldn't tie myself to one specialty. I just I wanted to be involved in all parts of of a patient's life and do all
00:46:36
of that type of medicine. And so with that comes, you know, a level of uncertainty uh being out of the hospital
00:46:43
that you need to learn how to deal with. Um when juniors come out of the hospital
00:46:49
and they're training at our practice, you know, when I'm going through cases
00:46:53
with them, they're often sort of like, should we order this test, this test,
00:46:56
and another test and another test? I'm like, oh, from where? We're not in the hospital anymore.
00:47:04
That's we tests are not a big part of our of our job. It's a small part of our
00:47:10
job, but it's mostly getting the history and that's where you get all your
00:47:15
information from and sort of from all your studies and years. Pattern recognition,
00:47:21
>> figuring out what's it most likely to be, what would I what would I be [ __ ]
00:47:25
scared that it is, and I need to make sure it's not, and how do we meet in the
00:47:29
middle together um with not a lot of resources? Yeah. >> And some for some people uh they don't
00:47:36
want that that uncertainty is too much to to live with. >> Oh, how how was the co period for you?
00:47:43
Were you a GP during the the co years? >> I was just starting just started to
00:47:48
train literally the first year. So that the first uh co year was my introduction
00:47:53
to um general practice which was not general practice at all. So, you know, we're on telephones and hardly actually
00:48:01
seeing patients and being all masked up and the >> PPE, the the head to toe,
00:48:05
>> head to toe. Um, and then stripping down in a garage at home and >> Yes. And being, you know, so so so
00:48:12
worried that you're going to give it to someone that it's at home. And it was a
00:48:16
really scary scary time for everyone, for patients included. But um that was yeah that was my introduction to to G GP
00:48:26
practice was everyone wanting to know you know uh can I get tested because someone had CO at pack and save in Pukoy
00:48:33
and and I was also in Puko. >> Um oh this might seem like a dumb question. Um does your strength come in
00:48:42
handy or or does it not matter? Is it irrelevant? >> People think it comes in handy. They're
00:48:48
always like hey pick this box up. I'm like, "No, if you put it on a barbell,
00:48:52
maybe." Um, I don't >> I was thinking like in terms of I don't
00:48:54
know if you need to like roll a patient over for dressing or I don't know. I
00:48:58
don't know. >> I think it it is easier for me for sure. >> Um, yeah. What do you think uh people
00:49:05
misunderstand most about what GPS actually do? >> Yes. Well, someone just said, "All I do
00:49:11
is prescribe augmented or >> Oh, yeah. No, I'm just basically on on my G." Actually, no. Dr. Ellison Mcgru
00:49:18
is a wonderful doctor. Although she's a real sting with zopoclines. >> Ah, me too.
00:49:23
>> Really? Why? God, she's I'm like, "Oh, Dr. Ellison, I'm I'm I've got a flight
00:49:28
coming up. I don't want jet lag and I want a bit of sleep." She g me like five
00:49:32
of them. It's like, come on. >> She sounds like my girl. >> Yeah, Dr. Ellison.
00:49:37
>> Why are you guys I need someone like Michael Jackson's doctor somewhere in
00:49:40
between. >> So, Dr. Ellison's there. >> Dr. Conrad Murray's there. I need
00:49:44
someone. Just give me a few more zopies. I'm not going to misuse them. >> Look, but this is the thing. We don't
00:49:52
know. We We won't tell you, but do we really trust? I don't know. Um Yeah, I'm
00:49:59
pretty stingy. But then then patients on like uh it trains patients and they don't expect uh more than 10 or so from
00:50:06
me. >> Um biggest misunder Yeah, honestly, I think it is that we see coughs and colds
00:50:11
every single day and that it is pretty cruisy. Um if I had at least two coughs or cold calls a day, I would be so
00:50:19
happy. Like I would get a mental break. The general practice has changed so much. Um just with I guess rise in in
00:50:30
the way the life stresses that we have are causing such a rise in uh mental health issues, anxiety and depression.
00:50:38
And so we see a lot of that, a lot of complex things, you know, patients that have five medical problems with 15
00:50:47
medications and and so we're dealing with a lot more complexity um and things
00:50:52
that just need more than 15 minutes. This is such an outdated way of practicing. Um so I think that's what it
00:50:59
is is that actually we see so much more complex things in such a small amount of
00:51:05
time. Um, and we're just trying to trying to survive. >> Yeah. How how do you manage that?
00:51:12
Because you have like 15 minute blocks or 20-minute blocks or whatever they are, and you you know, you can give
00:51:16
someone some advice in that time really, but you can't you can't change their
00:51:20
entire life in that time, can you? >> Exactly. That's got to be hard. >> Yeah. Yeah. And I mean, we the the
00:51:25
reason why we're all running late is cuz we try to. That's the issue is that, you
00:51:31
know, we have 15minute blocks back to back. um by the time you've grabbed the
00:51:35
patient in 12 minutes has gone. Uh you're down to 12 and then you you need to be nice and how are you and how is
00:51:42
your day and you know if I met you a year ago how are the kids and and then you got 10 minutes. So it's um
00:51:50
impossible. It's not it's not safe. it doesn't give us a lot of time to
00:51:56
practice I think the best medicine um because you know a lot of the times I think I hear a lot of they'll just give
00:52:04
you a tablet I'm sick of just getting a medication or something like that um and
00:52:08
it's really mostly because we just don't have time to go through anything else
00:52:13
through the good lifestyle stuff the eating the sleeping seeing friends and all of that good stuff all of that we
00:52:20
sort of just assume that this person knows, okay, let's move on to the next step because we only have six more
00:52:26
minutes uh to go through this and by the way, they've got five more things on
00:52:29
their piece of paper to talk about. So, it's um really high pressure in that
00:52:34
sort of way. Um and again, people are struggling with uh finances and it's hard to convince people to come back or
00:52:41
book longer. Um you know, the odd time I and I understand that pressure. I understand that it's hard. Uh but I
00:52:48
guess it's just that we the patient and the doctor each need to have some humanity and realize that you know this
00:52:56
is why the days are going late and we're trying to give everyone an extra 5 minutes so by the lunchtime you are
00:53:03
going to be an hour late and it's just yeah it's hard to do that. >> Yeah, thanks for explaining that cuz I I
00:53:10
always wondered like if I've got a 9:30 appointment I'm like how can she be
00:53:13
running late? >> That one is hard. That one's hard to explain. Okay, that one is hard.
00:53:19
>> Um, what about burnout? [ __ ] it's it's a lot. E, it's quite funny cuz I thought
00:53:23
GP would be a lot slower pace of life than what Middlemore is. And I suppose it is in some ways, but comes with its
00:53:28
own sets of challenges. Is burnout an issue for >> for you or your peers? >> For definitely for for all of us um and
00:53:36
to because yes, we do we'll see 24 patients a day >> which is a big turnover. Yeah. even in
00:53:42
hospital uh terms. And then in between that there's, you know, I'm sure um
00:53:47
everyone who's listening has sent an email to their doctor asking questions.
00:53:51
So in the in between those patients, we're reading those and doing prescriptions and looking at blood test
00:53:56
results and all of that stuff. Um so it's it's burnout is happening more. I
00:54:02
see it more. I do I experience it at least twice a year. Um but usually it coincides with me going to a world
00:54:08
championship. So then I just go and lift some heavy weights for a week in another
00:54:12
country and come back. Um but I think I think I have been able to experience it a little bit less because I have my
00:54:21
lifting. I've got that that massive outlet. Um almost like other life that I
00:54:27
can just sort of like step out of GP, step into this other role that's really
00:54:32
fun and cool. >> Yeah. That must almost feel like like an alter ego in a way.
00:54:37
>> Yeah. Yes. Like you put that belt on, put the chalk on your hands, and you
00:54:40
become like a >> absolutelyavage. Yeah. I'm sure my teammates are listening to this like,
00:54:44
"Why is she talking so nice? She's like not nice to us." >> Really?
00:54:49
>> I'm not mean, but I'm I'm a I'm a hard ass. Yeah. Training.
00:54:54
>> Hard ass to who? Uh so we have a club um and we've got so I train with people who
00:55:00
also compete you know at um regional or national level and they're range from
00:55:06
like 18 year olds to uh sort of 40 year olds and so I you know I just I just keep them to standard you know make sure
00:55:14
that they're yeah keep them honest. Do you feel like um by the way we're going
00:55:20
to get to the sports stuff first, but we've just got a couple more on the academia side of things as your mom
00:55:24
would say. Um you do you think some of your patients could do with some of that sort of tough love that you do in the
00:55:30
gym? >> Yeah. Yes. It's a balance. Um and I >> I do give them some tough love. Um, one
00:55:39
of my patients introduced me, brought his wife with him, and the way he introduced me was, "This is my doctor.
00:55:46
She's really smiley, but she'll shoot you." I thought, "This is true. I won't shoot
00:55:54
you. I'll shoot you with the truth if you need it." >> Yeah. Yeah.
00:55:57
>> Wow. That's powerful. How How do you handle um How do you handle it when you
00:56:01
suspect a patient isn't telling you the truth or giving you the full picture? M
00:56:06
um sometimes you can it's like in a you're an investigator. That's what I
00:56:11
like about my job too is kind of >> you're interrogating people and trying
00:56:16
to make timelines fit and sometimes from the investigation you can hear that actually this doesn't really make sense
00:56:24
when I checked and you just ask again and they kind of uh know that oh you've
00:56:29
asked a couple of times now I should probably tell you the truth. Um, and it's not that they're doing it in a um
00:56:37
sinister way. It's just that it's hard to meet a stranger and tell them your
00:56:42
deepest, darkest secrets um within the first 10 minutes of meeting that person. So yeah, sometimes it just takes a few
00:56:51
uh consults to to get to it to build that trust. But yeah, you you we almost can't expect a patient to just give it
00:57:00
all to us because >> because we're the doctor. >> Also, I suppose sometimes like it's
00:57:05
embarrassing. There's a bit of shame like you know you you don't want to
00:57:08
admit how much you're drinking or how Yeah. what you're eating or Yeah. what
00:57:11
your diet looks like. It's embarrassing. >> Exactly. And I think uh one of the
00:57:15
things I've learned is that you just completely overshoot. So, how much do you drink? A lot. What? Like five
00:57:20
bottles a day? >> Oh, no. Not that much. Only three. No, just two. Okay. >> Oh, that's smart. That's smart. Um,
00:57:32
what recurring issues are you seeing more lately in your patients physically or mentally?
00:57:38
>> Yeah, a lot of anxiety. Lot of anxiety and depression. I would have We're lucky
00:57:44
and a lot of us will have this is where we can enroll patients into a program where they get 30 minute free sessions.
00:57:50
So I will have maybe three or four of those a day um to uh follow up people with their depression and anxiety. Um
00:57:58
that's a huge one. And then uh to for the sort of medical side of things, diabetes and heart failure and blood
00:58:07
pressure and cholesterol issues, that's sort of bread and butter GP stuff. Yeah.
00:58:13
A lot of Well, not that I am assessing it. a lot of ADHD um and questions about autism and uh people wondering about
00:58:21
that and that's that's hard too because the access to being able to get the
00:58:25
answers to that questions is almost non-existent >> publicly for patients. So yeah, a lot of
00:58:32
mental mental health. >> What's something um more people can do to take better care of their health?
00:58:37
Something that you wish everyone knew. Yeah, I think I wish everyone at school or somewhere
00:58:45
learned what we know is the basics and what you know is the basics, which would be, you know,
00:58:51
>> how to sleep well, how to eat well, and what does that look like? Because I get
00:58:56
some pretty like crazy answers when I really try to get down to it with some patients. You know, sometimes we'll go
00:59:03
through uh cholesterol and I'll be asking about diet and what are you eating and is there anything fried or
00:59:10
no, no, no, it's fine. It's fine. Uh do you eat butter? No, no, no. I only cook
00:59:14
with it. So, you know, and everything's cooked in butter. And and for them that's better than uh margarine or olive
00:59:23
oil uh because they nobody taught them. And I think that that gets missed a lot in probably school is the best place to
00:59:32
get uh to get that knowledge from. But I the basics of health and exercise, strength exercise, I um talk about that
00:59:39
a lot with my patients if anytime it can come up um for bone health, muscle health and and mental health as well. So
00:59:48
the I wish people I wish there not that it's the people's fault, but I wish
00:59:52
there was a way that people knew more about the basics of lifestyle things that they could do.
00:59:59
>> Um yeah, >> why don't we have more knowledge? The information is everywhere, right?
01:00:07
>> It's never been more accessible than what it is now. >> Yeah. There's too much information and
01:00:12
it's so hard to >> it's really hard for patients to divvy through all that information and know
01:00:19
what's >> one person's conspiracy post about seed oils um versus a um a uh evidence-based
01:00:30
fully qualified dietician's advice. So yes, there is really good advice out there, but it's um interpreting it and
01:00:37
that's what not many people know how to do. >> Is our health system broken in New
01:00:43
Zealand? >> I Yes, >> it it is. It's not working for our patients. um it's not set up to
01:00:54
allow us to deliver timely health care and because there's no time or there's
01:01:01
long wait lists then we can't deliver the care that people deserve and we try
01:01:06
to with what we have but um there's a there's a better way out there and there
01:01:12
are smart people smarter people than me who are thinking about those ways but you know in in GP itself the the model.
01:01:21
It It doesn't work and it's never going to work. And um we're just trying to fit
01:01:26
as much as We're doing 10-minute medicine basically, which is sounds crazy. >> Yeah, it's outrageous. It's like a speed
01:01:32
date. >> Yeah, that's crazy. Exactly. You wouldn't expect to know anything from a
01:01:38
speed date, but we Yeah. Somehow in these uh 10 15 minutes, we I'll learn as
01:01:44
much as I can about about my patient. M. So if the prime minister or the minister
01:01:49
of health was here right now and you had like a minute with them, like what would
01:01:52
you what would be the point that you want to emphasize? What would you want to tell them?
01:01:54
>> Wow. >> I think a big one that would target a lot of areas is getting more doctors
01:02:03
graduated and and opening up those seats. I would I would love for it not to be this sort of like prestigious job
01:02:11
anymore and just get more people in. uh you don't have to be like a rocket scientist to understand medicine and
01:02:19
pattern recognition. A lot more people can do this job than they allow uh through university and I think that's
01:02:27
going to take a while to grow these these doctors that we need >> but we just need them. We need them so
01:02:33
badly. >> Yeah. It's alarming, isn't it? >> Yeah. I know. Do you have any thoughts
01:02:38
on on AI or is there any thoughts of AI in medicine circles and the impact that's potentially going to have for
01:02:43
good or for bad? >> Yeah, I mean it's a I don't know if it's in your practice, but um some of the
01:02:48
doctors in my practice use it just to note. So, they don't really type notes
01:02:53
anymore. Uh AI is listening to the consult and uh puts it in some kind of report. Um so it's already being used in
01:03:01
that way to save time and the people who use it feel a lot uh that they have more
01:03:07
time but also that the cognitive fatigue is less is what is coming up that because they don't have to process the
01:03:15
information twice um that the energy levels are a little bit better um and so then burnout is a bit better um but in
01:03:23
the hospital I'm sure there are many many more ways that it can be used I just don't know of them but that's how
01:03:28
we're using it in GP. >> Well, it's an exciting time, eh? And if it makes the health outcomes better for
01:03:34
people, it's got to be good in the long run. >> Yeah. And I guess, you know, one a big
01:03:39
thing that people talk about is when I go to the doctor, they're just looking
01:03:41
and typing at the computer. And so, if AI can be typing uh the notes out for you, you actually get to see the
01:03:48
patient, the patient gets to see you. >> And we've heard from patients that it's
01:03:51
a little bit awkward because I've never seen you look at me so much. Um, but
01:03:56
that can only be good for for rapport. >> Although, yeah, if you're talking about
01:04:00
um intensely personal stuff, sometimes it's nice to have that conversation if
01:04:04
it's not direct eye contact. >> Yeah, >> it can be quite intimidating. Hey, um,
01:04:07
thanks for sharing all this stuff. We've been going for over an hour now, and we
01:04:10
haven't even got to the um the sport stuff. >> Oh, cool. >> It's all been academia.
01:04:14
>> Mom will be happy. >> So, okay. So, so while you're at med school, you're playing netball, you have
01:04:19
dreams of being a silver fern. Um, then you realize that they just can't coexist
01:04:23
together because of your schedule. and my height. >> Yeah, you meet big one there. You meet
01:04:30
Tim George and you realize that yeah, you're a shorty. >> So why why powerlifting of everything
01:04:36
you could have done? >> I so I just started going to the gym. So I also never used to go to the gym
01:04:41
because when you're playing net ball and you're in a few teams, you're just
01:04:44
training most days anyway. Um, so I joined a gym uh in my first year at the hospital and then I just sort of started
01:04:52
seeing uh on Instagram uh people women squatting like 170 kilos, 180 kilos and they looked really really strong and
01:05:03
they also were like super toned and like ripped and I thought I want to look like
01:05:07
that. I want to be that strong. So, um, I just got a PT to show me how to do the
01:05:13
movements and kind of just found out that I was like naturally very strong. Um, >> what is that? Is that is that tongen
01:05:21
genetics? >> I think Oh, I got to be careful with that answer. Both. It's both. It's tongen and moldy
01:05:28
genetics. >> But I was thinking about it this morning um when I had my run. Like I And I don't
01:05:35
know. I I don't know if this is right or wrong, but no, like no one's naturally
01:05:38
born naturally strong. Or are they? Do people just have natural strength? >> I think definitely genetic and you see
01:05:43
that in across other countries as well, but yes, uh Pacific Island Moldi is very
01:05:48
strong. Every time I talk about um the powerlifting and hope that it gets to the rest of New Zealand, I just have
01:05:56
this feeling that the the usurper is listening and like they're going to come
01:06:01
and and and be as strong as I am in my sport, which I welcome. Um but yeah, I think it's it's a I think it's a Kiwi
01:06:08
thing, too. >> Can you remember your first squat? >> Yes. >> What was it? Just the bar?
01:06:13
>> It was it was >> 20 kilo bar. >> Oh, just the bar. And then we worked up
01:06:18
to uh I think it was three a triple that 100. So that that was I thought that was
01:06:26
normal but my PT was like that's not normal. Um that's pretty strong. You
01:06:31
should have a look at the sport. Um and it just yeah went from there. As soon as
01:06:35
I started looking at the New Zealand records in my head I was planning okay I'm going to do this sport for a year
01:06:43
maybe two. um get top three in New Zealand and then I'm going to do my GP training and and that's it. That was a
01:06:50
fun time. So, it it didn't work out that way. I'm glad. >> So, did you get quite good quite
01:06:56
quickly? >> Yes. Yeah. And and uh that kind of happens to everyone. They at the
01:07:01
beginning, newbie gains, they're really fun. Um you just get strong quickly the
01:07:05
more you train. Uh but it did take a little while to get to to this level. So, it still took maybe like four years
01:07:12
to get to the level I'm at. >> And your first competition was in 2018.
01:07:17
>> Yes. >> Yeah. What are your recollections of that? >> Ah, it was it was really nerve-wracking
01:07:21
because you come from team sport and you're playing with your teammates and there's the crowd is your family. So,
01:07:30
you don't get that stage fright type of feeling. But in powerlifting, it's just
01:07:34
you in the center stage and the crowd is in front of you. and me the crowd was maybe 30 people, but it was still uh
01:07:42
really nerve-wracking to sort of think you're getting on a stage in front of
01:07:46
people to perform. Um, but as soon as you get your first squat, you get addicted. You should do a competition.
01:07:53
>> Absolutely not. Absolutely not. I haven't um I haven't I'm terrible with
01:07:57
leg day. I I have started doing um strength and conditioning again to >> um help with my running, but um
01:08:04
>> yeah, I can probably bench more than what I could squat at the moment. Okay.
01:08:08
>> I um I got the highest I ever got I had a personal trainer many years ago and um
01:08:11
he was big on legs. So I got up to three three plates. So 140 kilos all up. >> Nice.
01:08:17
>> Um I sh myself once. >> Hey that's the commitment. Uh >> have you ever done that? I push no like
01:08:26
on. So I got down parallel with the floor and then getting back up again. I pushed so hard like a a poo came out.
01:08:32
>> Well hey did you get make it all the way up? >> I did. That was the session over. So
01:08:38
then if I really want to get out of it, that's what I got to do. I'm going to
01:08:41
[ __ ] myself. >> There's a I on a regular basis talk to patients about poo. So this is fine.
01:08:47
>> Yeah, you're okay with it. It's not your first rodeo. Do you remember? Yeah. What
01:08:51
do you So um before you like when you're in a competition, what do you do? Like
01:08:54
um you hype do you listen to music to hype yourself up? Yeah. >> What's your pre-lift routine? M. So, you
01:09:01
are there's warm-ups obviously out back and it's kind of a funny um sport where
01:09:06
because you have it's weight class based and you have to make weight um you are
01:09:12
weight cutting and then you have like a one and a half hour window to rehydrate and and get some food in and and warm up
01:09:20
for your your first squat. So the it's I used to really enjoy that part was just
01:09:26
eating food and drinking um electrolytes or energy drinks um before you warm up and uh then yeah there's hype music
01:09:35
playing uh in in your earphones and you're kind of just some people uh want to talk and um have fun and things. I'm
01:09:43
I'm less the fun talkative type and more the like get out of my face just tell me
01:09:48
what I need to lift type. Um, so yeah, that's that's how how I lift and uh
01:09:54
yeah, >> game face on. >> Game face. >> What What are you listening to? JLo. You
01:09:59
like JLo, right? >> JLo. Uh, maybe in general I like JLo, but um for we go like a little bit meaner for um
01:10:08
for competitions. At first it controversial, but it was a lot of DMX um in the beginning and then it kind of
01:10:15
just changes as competition goes by. like you might have a song that makes you feel a certain way and can help you
01:10:21
emotionally get to that spot. Um, so yeah. Yeah, it changes all the time, but uh the better the noise cancelling
01:10:29
headphones the the the better. >> And then like do you have like steps that you go through in your head when
01:10:36
you go out to the bar or like what are you what are you focusing on? You focusing on your breathing like do you
01:10:41
have um like statements that you're repeating to yourself? >> Yeah. when you're new there that's going
01:10:46
through your head a lot you know you're trying to remember the calls that you
01:10:51
have to listen to and sort of you're trying to create your I guess your flow
01:10:56
uh now I don't really think about anything um because it's just it is flow
01:11:02
basically and there's not a lot of thinking going on but when uh things are on the line championships or podium
01:11:10
places again back to the uh positive selft talk a lot of affirmations going on and right before going on that there
01:11:18
may be something um this year I at Sheffield it was my third Sheffield and I uh came second and so before that was
01:11:27
before that final deadlift was uh I just kept saying like it's my time it's my
01:11:32
time it's my time it's my time and I'll just keep saying it until I get to that
01:11:36
bar um so yeah positive stuff >> that's so cool I I um read an interview
01:11:42
with you um way back and uh at this point you'd go to the bar and you'd you
01:11:46
look at the bar and you'd say you're mine. >> Yes. Yeah. I still do. Yeah. You're mine
01:11:52
or fight or Yeah. You're mine. That's a that's a a common one. >> Um what about drug testing? Is drug
01:11:59
testing big in your sport? >> Massive. >> Are drugs ripen the sport?
01:12:03
>> Not in our uh federation. So we are drug tested federation, a part of drug-free
01:12:08
sport New Zealand. Um, and I get tested in and out of competition. Like they knock on my door at 6 in the morning and
01:12:15
get me to pee. So, they are very drug tested. Um, but there's other uh federations that are not drug tested and
01:12:23
you'll probably be able to tell um uh a difference. Um, so yes, in our federation, super drug test controlled
01:12:32
and um people get very angry if anyone tests uh positive, which >> yeah, rightfully so. It almost never
01:12:39
happens with people at the top. It's kind of always people I don't know out
01:12:43
of the top 10. >> Do you remember your first um drug test? That must be quite confrontational.
01:12:48
>> It was so confrontational. It was so I was not expecting it because you know
01:12:54
with for people who don't know they need to see your urine leave your body. So
01:12:59
that's how close up and and personal it has to be. And that's it's really hard
01:13:04
to be in front of somebody. So the process can take ages. Um, but at least you know that this is the standard that
01:13:12
is being tested and you can feel very safe that people you're going against aren't cheating.
01:13:18
>> And you you're probably in a position um I mean you deal with feces and urine all
01:13:22
the time in your line of work. So it's probably less foreign to you than what
01:13:26
it is for some other people. But it's still awkward, right? >> Yeah, it's still awkward.
01:13:30
>> So there's a lady in the room with you. Yes. So you're just sitting on a toilet
01:13:33
>> and they're and if it's a little cubicle, they're literally like right
01:13:36
here just watching. >> I could never I couldn't go. >> You couldn't?
01:13:40
>> I could never go in that environment. >> It's really really hard. Yeah. Yeah.
01:13:43
It's so hard to um to stage fright um to pee in front of somebody and it is just
01:13:51
it is so awkward cuz they just like you know like hold everything up and and keep everything out of the way and it's
01:13:57
like okay hi what's your name again? It's awkward because they're just doing
01:14:02
a job as well. They don't want to watch someone pee. They're just doing a job.
01:14:06
>> And I think they're they usually this is sort of like a casual job for them too.
01:14:11
Like they they have normal jobs during the day and then they just uh sign up to do these tests every now and then. So
01:14:17
they are really just normal people. >> Yeah. So what does your diet look like?
01:14:21
So at at the point where we're recording this, you're two weeks out from a
01:14:25
competition. >> Um is this like an intense diet stage? M it is maybe the uh it's different for
01:14:33
everyone. I'm lucky that I sit fairly close to my weight class. So 2 3 months
01:14:39
out is just pretty um boring and clean in the way that there's enough protein
01:14:45
and carbs for fueling yourself. There's not a lot of fats. And then you know on
01:14:50
the weekend there is treat meal. Um and that's competition. So it's for me it's
01:14:56
a it's pretty standard. I've done it for years. It's It's normal. And usually
01:15:00
it's the people around me who care more that I'm not like having a piece of cake
01:15:04
or whatever. I I do uh look forward to the day where I can just do that. >> So So like an average day of eating.
01:15:14
>> Yeah. What does it look like? >> Yeah. So um in the morning I would have
01:15:18
like two eggs, three toast, honey on one toast, and coffee. And then I'd have
01:15:23
protein yogurt and protein powder and fruits for snack. And then lunch and dinner is very much the same. There'd be
01:15:29
a meat, veggies, lots of veggies, and um and a carb like potato or something like
01:15:35
that. >> And then um my snacks are basically the same, but it's the same every day. I I'm
01:15:41
a creature of habit. I love routine and I don't get bored of of the food that I
01:15:46
eat every single day, which helps a lot. Um, yeah, it's just it's pretty easy for
01:15:51
me to do. Yeah. But the sport, you know, with this sport, there's not a lot of
01:15:56
calorie burning in it. You know, we train for hours at a time, but we're quite literally just building muscle and
01:16:02
getting inflamed. And so, it's not like a sport maybe like running or CrossFit
01:16:07
where you have to really refuel a lot cuz actually the my expenditure is not that big.
01:16:15
>> And in terms of that treat meal or treat day you're talking about, >> Yeah. What's that?
01:16:18
>> I would I like to we like to cook so we'll usually cook something and then at
01:16:22
least that way I kind of know what's going on. So it would change like we might make ribs or might make a brisket
01:16:28
or um burgers and yeah. So uh I love food. >> So um we're doing this podcast in a
01:16:36
morning in the morning on a Friday. Uh you're at the gym this afternoon. >> What would that session this afternoon
01:16:41
look like? Like how many hours are you going to be there? Yeah, I will be there for maybe four and a half hours um
01:16:47
today. >> Wow. Um yes, today is a heavy day, so I've got a heavy squat and heavy bench
01:16:54
session and it just takes a lot longer to warm up to sort of those 200 kilo um areas and it just it takes a bit of time
01:17:03
and and rest. Um it doesn't feel like four hours, but by the time you get to
01:17:09
sort of 6:37 and you you left home at 1, you're sort of like, "Oh my god, I'm
01:17:15
still here. >> It's such a sacrifice." >> E >> like in terms of the training, like it's
01:17:21
it's massive. It's a massive commitment. >> Yeah. >> So So you go to the gym, so say a 4-hour
01:17:26
session or whatever it happens to be today. So your first lift, what is it like a a real light set to begin with?
01:17:32
How >> light? Yeah. I'll start with the bar. I always start with the bar just to uh you
01:17:37
know I guess it's more of a practice and keeping things uh the same. Um and then
01:17:43
you go like bar 70 kilos, 100 kilos, 130 kilos. Um and then you jump maybe 15 to
01:17:51
20 kilos until you get to 170 and then slow it down a bit um from there. You're
01:17:57
just doing one rep on each of those or >> uh maybe for today because it's a heavy
01:18:03
I'll do maybe three or four reps until I get to uh 180. I might do two and then
01:18:08
I'll slow it down um to match whatever I'm about to do. Um but yeah, uh it's pretty taxing pretty taxing on the
01:18:17
body. Um, I always feel bad because there's a lot of rest time and I never used to feel bad because I was at a
01:18:24
private gym, but now I feel I'm like, are people watching me and wondering why
01:18:29
I'm just sitting down doing uh supposedly nothing? Um, but there I promise I'm lifting weights.
01:18:36
>> How long how long is the break between >> Yeah, I tr I keep a timer now because
01:18:40
I'm so aware, but like 3 minutes. >> Oh, that's not bad. I've done I've done
01:18:46
longer at jets like I'll do a set very light weights, mind you. And then I'll
01:18:50
just sit there and scroll on my phone for 15 minutes. >> Oh, 15 minutes. Okay. Well, heavies.
01:18:55
Yes. When I'm working up to a heavy, like 10 minutes, probably. >> I reckon other people would be looking
01:19:01
like, "God, she's hogging all these weights and she's just sitting there."
01:19:06
>> Probably just hogging the area. Really? Just hogging that corner. I've got
01:19:09
because, you know, my gym bag is like this huge and it's full of all my equipment and gear and Yeah. I I mean I
01:19:16
also don't really tell people that who I like that I have a world championship or
01:19:23
two titles. So I I sometimes wonder if they're sort of like why does she have
01:19:27
so many things like why is she just doing this for a gym session? But they could also just not be thinking about me
01:19:33
at all. >> Do you when you've got a heavy lifting day like uh today do you get anxious
01:19:38
beforehand? Like are you nervous thinking about it now? >> Yeah, I get um excited. I I I just
01:19:45
really love lifting heavy weights and I love the the thought of, you know, what could I do today? What can I what am I
01:19:52
going to lift today? What's do I hope that I can lift today? Um so I get really excited and I sort of spend the
01:19:59
whole day just kind of trying to prepare for it. Um whether that be like rolling
01:20:04
out on the floor and stretching and just making sure that I really did sleep well
01:20:09
the night before and I'm just trying to line my whole life up for this one heavy
01:20:14
session. >> Wow. And do your patients know what you do? >> Some of them do. Yeah. My my my regulars
01:20:21
know. Um mostly like my elderly patients because they're so interested to know
01:20:26
and and more about you know their doctor. And so yeah, we've had a lot of hugs and a lot of celebrations the the
01:20:33
last couple of weeks um because I would have seen them before Worlds and then now they want to know what happened. So
01:20:38
they do know but I think then also a lot will be like >> oh my god I didn't know that she did
01:20:44
that. >> That's why I can never get in to see her. >> Yeah. Is your work quite good? Like at
01:20:50
the moment because you've got a big competition coming up you're down to two
01:20:53
days a week. Is your work quite understanding supportive? >> Absolutely. like very understanding. Um,
01:21:00
and that's just a part of why I love working there. And they would be the same for any anyone else. They're really
01:21:07
understanding with family commitments for the other GPS um, and for me. And I think it's just that it's so hard to to
01:21:14
to get GPS at the moment. And so I don't think it's selfish of them, but I I do
01:21:19
think they want to make sure that we're happy and want to stay working there. So
01:21:24
if you cut back to two days a week, um you only get paid for the the two. Yeah. >> Yeah.
01:21:30
>> Massive sacrifices you're making, eh, >> for this for for this um for the sport
01:21:34
where there's no sort of real financial incentive to speak on. >> Yeah. Yeah. I think it's more like I
01:21:42
feel I don't feel like I'm sacrificing things, but more that I'm just giving
01:21:47
extra things to be able to do um to be able to pursue this because it's it's
01:21:54
pretty rare that anyone in their life gets to pursue a world title in anything. And I think more than
01:22:02
anything, I feel really privileged that I have a job that would allow me to save
01:22:08
up enough to take 6 months of less work and not, you know, completely um well, not go into any debt or not worry too
01:22:17
much about money um and actually just do this for six months. So I think it's
01:22:22
more of you know I I give a lot but then I get a lot back and because of you know
01:22:28
the privilege that I have. >> Yeah. Even though it's very much a a niche and minority sport. What's that
01:22:35
like the first time you represent your country? >> Yeah. It's amazing. You know it's Kiwi
01:22:41
sport kids always want to wear the fern. Like we just grow up wanting to wear the
01:22:45
fern and so obsessed with a fern. Um, and so the first time I got my uniform, we have, I think, the best powerlifting
01:22:52
uniform. So, it's a just this big fern across um, our suits, I I just felt so
01:22:57
proud. And the first time I got to wear it was in New Zealand um, at a Commonwealth Championship. And so, that
01:23:04
was extremely special. Um, there's a lot in our sport, a lot of like t-shirt
01:23:09
swapping and suit swapping and it's taken me so long to be able to get to that place because I just even though I
01:23:15
have so many of them, I just they're mine. Like I I wanted to wear it for so
01:23:20
long and I work so hard for it. I find it so hard to think about switching, >> you know. Oh, I've had I haven't had him
01:23:26
on the podcast. He'd be a dream guest, though. But I believe Richie McCo was
01:23:30
like that. Apparently, he was a real real Scrooge with his jerseys. Really? >> Like swapping jerseys with opponents.
01:23:35
Yeah, he like ended up with like 148 of them. Chill out, Richie. Oh, you're the
01:23:40
same. E, that's so funny. >> Yeah, I just like I when I watch it and I watch people switching, I'm like,
01:23:46
that's so cool. And then people ask me, I'm like, I so sorry. Like I just I this
01:23:53
year was the first time I did it and and I'm I'm glad I did. I gave it to two
01:23:57
amazing amazing uh strong women and I'll probably wear one of their suits today
01:24:01
at my squat um session, but it took me a long time. >> Why why is the sport not um an Olympic
01:24:09
or come with game sport? >> I'm not actually sure. I know they've been trying for the longest time. I have
01:24:14
no idea why, but I think we're closer than ever with um being a part of the World Games to getting into the
01:24:20
Olympics. Um but yeah, I might have to be a cheerleader for one of my other friends uh by that time.
01:24:26
>> Yeah. Would you be keen to once your time's up, will you be keen to stay in
01:24:29
the sport as like a coach or a mentor or something? Do you think lifting will always be a part of your life? Yeah, I
01:24:34
think in some shape or form uh fitness will always be a part of my life and so strength will always be a part and I
01:24:41
have my best friend is still up and coming in the sport and so I think if we get to the Olympics she's going to go
01:24:48
and then I'll just be just uh >> be a carry-on luggage with her so that I
01:24:53
can go too. >> Yeah, strength training is good. E is it something that you try and like bang
01:24:58
into your patients? >> Yeah. um if it comes up um straight in there, you know, we're both doing like
01:25:05
body weightight squats and showing them how to do it. And especially with my elderly patients, um I have I inherited
01:25:13
a few who already go to the gym and so it's really cool to um introduce new exercises to them or talk to them about
01:25:19
their training. Um, I think strength training is, you know, not it's competitive for me, but in life, and I
01:25:28
see it every day, you know, when I go to get my 80-year-old patient, and if they
01:25:32
can get out of their chair without pushing, holy moly, that's amazing, you know, that's amazing strength. And
01:25:38
that's probably somebody who has in some shape or form been uh been exercising or
01:25:43
doing weights. And then maybe I see someone who's a bit younger and that it's really hard for them to get out of
01:25:51
the chair. Um, those are the things that I see in strength that maybe people who
01:25:56
are just going to the gym might not realize that that's what you're setting
01:26:00
yourself up for is for when you're 70, 80, you are walking fine. You're able to
01:26:06
be functional and you're able to lift things and do things. >> Yeah. There's this um incredible book I
01:26:11
like. It's by a guy called Dr. Peter Aier called outlive >> and it's basically that it's a really
01:26:16
long book but in a nutshell it's about reverse engineering aging. >> So he his sort of take is if you're 70
01:26:22
and you see yourself traveling somewhere and you want to be able to put a 15 kilo
01:26:26
suitcase in an overhead carrier then when you're 40 or 50 you need to be doing a lot more than that because it's
01:26:31
it's going to decline. >> Absolutely. Absolutely. He's like, if you want to be um you know, sightseeing
01:26:35
around Croatia, the old town of Croatia in your 60s or 70s, then you're going to
01:26:39
have to be able to run or walk like 10 kilometers when you're 30, 40, 50, whatever it is.
01:26:44
>> Exactly. >> It's a really good way of looking at it. But um yeah,
01:26:47
>> cuz there' be nothing worse than being old and being trapped in a body that
01:26:50
that you can't do the things you want it to do. >> Yeah. And it's really it is really
01:26:54
really sad. And you know, and my patients share that with me, you know, they always say, "Don't get old." And
01:26:59
I'm like, "Oh." when they're struggling to get old. Yes. Exactly. And they're showing me the
01:27:07
importance of how do you want to get old? Um and so yeah, I talk to them about strength a lot.
01:27:13
>> Yeah. >> What are your big goals in the sport before you're done?
01:27:17
>> Yeah. I I feel like I came in like hard and fast and then I did a whole bunch of
01:27:24
things really quickly and so sort of three and a half years at the top level has felt like maybe six years. So I feel
01:27:32
like I've been in it longer than I actually have. I have two world titles, one second. Um a big goal was to get on
01:27:40
the podium at Sheffield. You know that podium is taken from 12 female champions. So that
01:27:46
podium is important. um world games. I would love to podium and get one of their massive Olympic looking um uh
01:27:54
medals and then we've got Sheffield in in January again. And I just take it comp by comp. Every year I I'm like,
01:28:02
"Okay, I'm going to take it easy now." And then the drive just keeps turning up
01:28:07
and I'm like, "Oh gosh, I it just doesn't uh it's not stopping at the
01:28:12
moment." M >> does it piss you off that you're not a bigger deal in New Zealand
01:28:16
>> like that this I suppose the sport or you as an individual with your achievements doesn't get
01:28:22
>> like more of a light a light shone on it >> I I really wish that we were a bigger
01:28:27
deal and I mean I'm I'm one world champion we have another female world champion in New Zealand Eevee Coran and
01:28:34
and and so yeah people just don't know but the more I actually listen to sort
01:28:38
of like your podcast or sports oh sorry sports podcasts I the more I realized there are a lot of Kiwi World
01:28:44
Championships like in snowboarding and uh in cycling uh not not Olympic cycling BMX um just so many that I'd never heard
01:28:53
of and so it kind of makes me feel like oh okay >> they're famous overseas uh
01:28:59
>> famous in their own sort of like ecos and that's one thing I I love about this
01:29:03
platform and doing this podcast like I've got um episodes coming up with um Courtney Duncan who's uh like from um
01:29:09
the South Island and she's like one of the world's top motocross champs. Yes.
01:29:13
>> Um she reached out to me about coming on the podcast and you do the research and
01:29:16
it's like she's a big [ __ ] deal >> and you know most people would not have
01:29:20
heard of her. Same as Nico Pius got an episode with him coming up and he's won
01:29:23
like a couple of uh you know winter winter gold Olympic medals and most people probably aren't familiar with the
01:29:29
name and it's um it's nice to have this platform where you can give these people
01:29:33
a bit of attention. Oh, well, we appreciate it so much that you do because you're I see you as mainstream
01:29:38
and the the reach that you have with the the guests that you've already have and
01:29:42
then to get people like me and like those two that you just mentioned on can only be good for our sports to help them
01:29:48
grow. I mean, New Zealanders are so talented, you know, whether you're like Kiwi born uh Pacific Island Moldi, I
01:29:55
think we're very we punch above our weights in in many uh rooms that we enter.
01:30:00
>> Yeah, 100%. Yeah, there's um that's the thing. just highlights just how many how
01:30:04
many New Zealanders there are out there doing epic stuff. Yes. >> And it's really cool. Although you're
01:30:09
only here today because your mom made me do it. >> Hey. >> No, I'm kidding. Um Yeah. What is um
01:30:19
just this is a more broader answer to do with like every aspect of your life, but
01:30:23
what does success look like to you now? >> Not to others, but to you. >> Yeah.
01:30:28
Oh. Um, I guess success at a in a broader sense to me is being able to get yourself into a position
01:30:42
where you can truly do things that you love and enjoy. Not because you have to, but because maybe the work that you've
01:30:50
put in and the luck that you've had before has gotten you to a space where you can take 6 months of less work and
01:30:57
pursue a side passion and make that an athlete career for a little bit. I'm so
01:31:03
aware that just so many people cannot do that. And I think that that has brought
01:31:08
me so much joy and um and filled my cup so much that I've been able to do that.
01:31:15
I think that's the the successful part of of my story is getting to a place where I can do things that I really want
01:31:22
to do and I enjoy. >> I love that. And you got such a supportive partner and supportive
01:31:28
parents as we've mentioned more than once. >> Um what about your mental health? How's
01:31:33
your mental health been? I I know you've dealt with some burnout over the years.
01:31:36
>> Yeah. Mostly good. >> Mostly good. Yeah. I think um it's very
01:31:42
human to go through phases of periods where anxiety levels are higher or sleep is not good because something in your
01:31:50
life is not going well. And I think that's very human to experience those things. I've been really fortunate to
01:31:55
not experience prolonged uh levels of anxiety or or low mood. Um but >> uh I think yeah, thanks mom and dad.
01:32:05
like the stuff that they taught me as a kid uh unknowingly is what is what kept me um from not experiencing those things
01:32:13
for too long and being able to use some coping mechanisms to come out the other side. But I'm so aware of it because I
01:32:20
see it in in my work and I see it every day. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Um Yeah. Is there anything you
01:32:26
still struggle with today that people probably assume you've overcome? Um I think
01:32:38
in well something like nothing is perfect. My life is not perfect. It's been really good.
01:32:43
>> Um but the the line of work that we're in there's a lot of giving and a lot of
01:32:50
empathy and a lot of compassion and understanding and and even just wanting to know about your patients. And
01:32:56
sometimes that can really empty the tank for the rest of your your the other parts of your life. And so I know that
01:33:04
there are other part in when I'm not at work, it's not as easy actually for me
01:33:09
to be really empathetic or maybe ask how someone is feeling. Um because it almost
01:33:15
switched off when I left work because I needed to leave all of that that weight at work. And so it's not as easy to step
01:33:24
back into any type of role like that in my usual life. So I think that's when I
01:33:30
when I said that my teammates might think I'm a hard ass that that's where
01:33:34
it is coming from. And my family too, I think my family too would probably um understand that. So that's an area I
01:33:42
need to work on is how can I brings that empathy and compassion and communication
01:33:47
um into my life. >> It's hard. I I genuinely believe we we save our worst behavior for the people
01:33:54
that we love the most because, you know, they're always going to be there. >> But yeah, your um your boyfriend, he
01:34:00
must be like third third cab off the rank. You know, there's the energy that
01:34:04
you're expending with your job >> um and with your workouts and then when
01:34:08
you when you get home, it's like >> Yeah. >> I'm just out of words.
01:34:11
>> Yeah. Yeah. And it's you have to be so aware of it and so effortful in just
01:34:18
starting the conversation cuz once you once you start it then then it flows. But it's an effort like you it's not
01:34:26
>> a good effort a good investment. Um but it just doesn't flow as easy as it does
01:34:31
at work for some reason. >> Yeah, for sure. Well, I suppose at work you just switched on. It's what you have
01:34:36
to do. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> What are your best and worst habits? Um I think uh best habit, best habit.
01:34:45
Um >> I I can think of many possibilities like drive, discipline, commitment.
01:34:52
>> Oh, right. >> I don't know. I don't want to put words in your mouth.
01:34:54
>> I mean that Yeah. I think uh maybe the best habit is when of consistency.
01:35:00
um when I pick something up, uh being consistent in carrying it through and uh not just dropping it off because you
01:35:11
didn't get the result straight away. Uh I think anything that you do >> to get an outcome, you need to be
01:35:18
consistent with things. And that's huge in powerlifting is consistency. Uh when
01:35:22
you don't feel motivated, consistency will get you through training. Um, sometimes there is no drive, but if
01:35:27
you're consistent, you're going to training anyway. So, I think that's um
01:35:31
my biggest uh probably one of my biggest um habits, best habits. Yeah. >> Consistency and hard work. Hey, they're
01:35:38
so underrated as far as superpowers go. >> Yes. Yeah, >> they really are. What about worst habit?
01:35:44
>> Worst habit. >> Um, what's my worst habit? >> What would your mom say? Nothing.
01:35:50
There's nothing. >> Nothing. Absolutely. been perfect. No. Um maybe that I am a bit tough. I think
01:35:58
so. Maybe I'm a bit tough on people. Yes, I can be. I can be. Yeah. Yeah. >> In all aspects of your life
01:36:07
>> in in varying ways. Yeah. So, uh it can help at work to be a bit tough on
01:36:14
people. Um, but like you said, you save your worst habits for the people closest
01:36:18
to you. And >> I can I can be tough on on the people closest to me. And sometimes they just
01:36:25
might want uh support and they maybe they did not want a solution or they didn't want uh uh an opinion.
01:36:32
>> Are you a fixer? >> You're a fixer. Someone comes to you with a problem and they may just want
01:36:37
like an ear to listen to that you Okay. >> Sometimes. Yeah. I feel like I I feel
01:36:42
like that's mainly a guy thing. Guys want to be like a fixer. Like it seems sometimes your partner or whoever it
01:36:49
happens to be just wants, you know, wants you to be there to listen. >> Yeah. Yeah. So I've caught myself
01:36:53
recently just I want to say something and then I'm thinking, no, they don't
01:36:57
want to fix this. They just want to be heard. So zip it. >> Um and if you had to think of three
01:37:05
words that um family or friends would use to describe you, what do you think they would be?
01:37:10
Um I think it would yeah it would be uh determined >> um loyal I would hope and
01:37:25
um h what would a third one Maybe. Oh, I'm blanking. I'm like this. So like, oh my gosh, what would they say?
01:37:45
>> One word left. Determined. Loyal. They're both great words. >> Yeah. You happy with them?
01:37:50
>> I am happy with them cuz I that's what I I want to be. Um and I want I guess to
01:37:57
like exude to people around me. um loyal and h I think what I'm trying to think of
01:38:10
something that helps them. What about me helps them but just so I can sound like
01:38:15
a nice person. >> Well, you are a nice person. You are a nice person. You got goals. You got the
01:38:20
[ __ ] that you want to get done. >> Yeah. I mean I keep high achieving comes
01:38:24
to always comes to my mind because that's I'm a >> that's been the chapter of my life for
01:38:31
like the last maybe 20 years. >> Yeah. Yeah, but I suppose you're still
01:38:37
in that period where it's the you the selfish I don't know. I don't know if
01:38:40
selfish is the word, but the selfish era of your life, you know, where where you
01:38:43
you've got goals that you want to achieve for you, but yeah, I mean, maybe at some stage you'll want to be a mom
01:38:49
and that'll change or your parents are going to get older and you're going to
01:38:52
have a carer role there. >> Um, yeah. So, now's now's the time for
01:38:56
you to shine. Yeah, I think that's that's you've hit the nail on the head
01:39:01
with why I was finding it so hard to find a word because it does feel like that's the stage of my life is that I'm
01:39:09
hustling and and trying to do these things for me and and not finding a lot of time for anything outside of that.
01:39:16
But yes, I know that there are phases and stages of life and this is just one phase and
01:39:22
>> yeah, that time will come. This window will close. Yeah. >> You know, you have limited years as an
01:39:26
athlete, don't you? M >> how how close are you to being the best version of yourself?
01:39:32
>> I think um I don't know if we'd ever get to 100% but I would like to think that I am
01:39:44
closeish maybe 75%. Um cuz there's always work on and I think the best version of you changes
01:39:56
with the stages of your life. Like >> for me the best version of me is is like
01:40:01
going out and thriving in the world and and trying to set myself up for a future
01:40:06
so that I can thrive in that future. Um >> yeah, >> I love that answer so much. Yeah. Yeah.
01:40:14
I think you'll probably if you're always at 75 or 80% wherever you are in your
01:40:18
life, I think that's good. >> Yeah. >> Um I'm 52 now. When I was in my 20s, I
01:40:22
would have thought I would have seen someone that was 52 and I would have thought they've they've learned
01:40:26
everything. There is they're capped out. That's it. They've learned everything
01:40:29
they're going to learn. There's nothing more to do. >> This is the best that you've got.
01:40:33
>> And then you get here and your mom's sitting out there, she's probably
01:40:36
exactly the same. Like there's probably still things she's working on. And I
01:40:39
think that's a great way to live your life. >> Absolutely. like I'm watching my my
01:40:42
parents go through different phases of life and have new goals and different goals and working towards them. So, no,
01:40:49
it's not the end. And >> and what I'm trying to do is like set myself up so that, you know, I can also
01:40:55
do that is have new goals and try different things. And I don't think I'll
01:41:00
ever be sort of 100% in in GP, but I'll never leave because I love it. Um, but I
01:41:07
just I want to have other things going on and enjoy other things. How old are your parents now?
01:41:13
>> 55 and 54. I hope that's right. >> And they're both in good shape.
01:41:17
>> Yeah. Yeah. We um Mom works out a lot every day. She's in good shape. Um and
01:41:23
then dad has started, which is great. So, he sends me updates every day. Um I love that. Yeah. Yeah.
01:41:31
>> Now, yeah, they're probably scared of you. Your dad's probably scared. You're
01:41:34
going to be you're going to be Are you going to be the There's five kids, but
01:41:36
what's your role going to be when they get older? Are you going to be >> Oh, yes. Yes.
01:41:39
>> Are you going to be the bossy one or? >> Yeah, I'm the >> There are other bossy ones. Honestly, my
01:41:47
sister's a bossy. Um, more I'm going to be the the steadfast one. The one that
01:41:53
can make hard decisions and and keep everyone uh on the on track. >> Yeah.
01:42:00
>> I I reckon when Yeah. They're going to be scared of you when you get older.
01:42:03
>> I think a little bit of me now. >> And last one. Are you proud of yourself?
01:42:09
>> Yeah, I'm I am. I'm really proud of myself. Um and proud of everything and
01:42:14
everyone around me who helped me get to this to this point um and helped me do all these amazing things uh that I've
01:42:22
been able to experience. It's I'm so lucky. I live like a really cool life. I
01:42:26
I I feel really grateful um to even be here. This is so cool um chatting with you.
01:42:34
>> It's been great today. It's been wonderful. >> Thank you.
01:42:36
>> Yeah. Has it been enjoyable for you? >> Yeah, it has been. I was really, really,
01:42:39
really nervous. Um, but it was really nice to just Yeah, just chat. It felt really uh natural.
01:42:45
>> Yeah. Oh, that's cool. No, you you've done some [ __ ] >> And and uh
01:42:50
>> and there's more to do. >> 100%. I was going to say that. And
01:42:52
you're just getting started. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Thank you so much.
01:42:55
>> This has been great. Hey, good luck for the competition that's coming up and
01:42:58
good luck for whatever the future may bring. Dr. Kina Tongate.