00:00:00
Oh, good. You're here. Come on. This is
00:00:03
the center of performance. Whenever
00:00:05
there's a top performance in New
00:00:06
Zealand, it all comes from here. That's
00:00:08
Lisa Carrington. She's been doing that
00:00:10
for days. That's the boys who got the
00:00:12
hole in one in to
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Hey Finn, how's the performance going?
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>> Top tier.
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>> Nice. This is our generate room. In
00:00:21
here, you'll find our top performers
00:00:22
helping Kiwis maximize their Kiwi Saver
00:00:24
investments. Get in here, Finn.
00:00:26
Maximize. Generate. putting performance
00:00:29
first.
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>> Dr. Carlina Tonger, welcome to my
00:00:38
podcast.
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>> Thank you so much. I'm so excited to to
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be here.
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>> I'm so excited to have you here. We'll
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just get you closer closer to that
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microphone.
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>> Close. Yeah.
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>> So, um I got an email from your mom.
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>> My mama. Is she she?
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>> No, not
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>> so uh I've got part of it here. I edited
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it, but um it says Kadom, I am the mom
00:01:02
of two-time world powerliffter Dr.
00:01:04
Karina Tongatier, born and bred in South
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Oakland from a family of five. Karina
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started her powerlifting journey six
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years ago and stepped onto the world
00:01:13
platform representing New Zealand in
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2023. I hope you would see the benefit
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in having her on your podcast to inspire
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others to have it all and not to have
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take one or the other academia or sport.
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Nami for your time, Joe. Proud mom.
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>> A
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>> I think that's the first time I've had
00:01:31
an email where someone's used the word
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academia as well.
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>> Yeah,
00:01:36
we're smart cookies.
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>> But um that email when I got that, I
00:01:39
thought that's that says a lot because
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here you are. You're um a grown woman
00:01:42
yourself. You're a doctor. Um you've got
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this career and stuff going on but your
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mom's still
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>> um yeah hovering around like your
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biggest fan.
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>> Yes.
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>> Taking care of business.
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>> Yes. Mom and dad, the whole family
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actually are uh helicopters in my life
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and ever present. Um I'm so blessed that
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I can have their support because you
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know it's very busy the sort of two
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paths that I've chosen. Uh, and so to
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have their support and have their sneaky
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emails to amazing people like you, uh,
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you know, it's it's so great.
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>> It was so cute. It was the cutest thing.
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So, I got that email, then I looked you
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up and I was like, "Oh, that's
00:02:21
adorable." And I think I think it speaks
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volumes like the success that you've
00:02:24
you've got in life now. um that sort of
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self-belief was probably installed in
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you at a at a young age from the way you
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were you were parented and you know that
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reflects now in emails that your mom's
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sending on your behalf
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>> even though you're how are you in your
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30s?
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>> Yeah, I'm 32.
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>> Yeah. So, no, this is not the first sort
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of um email or action of uh support and
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belief from mom. Uh they have been this
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way for my whole life.
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>> Oh my god, it's like equal parts like
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mortifying. You did what, mom? But also
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so cool.
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>> So cool. You know, I couldn't be, you
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know, the first thought was like, "Oh,
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that's like slightly embarrassing, but
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also it's the Dom Harvey podcast." So,
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thank you, Mom. Like, absolutely, I want
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this opportunity.
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>> Yeah. Once I once I Googled you, I was
00:03:13
like, "Oh, [ __ ] Absolutely. I'd love to
00:03:15
have her on. She's amazing." So, we're
00:03:17
going to go through your whole story,
00:03:18
but first of all, um I feel like we
00:03:20
might need some almost like a like a a
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glossery section to, you know, because a
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lot of people won't know what you do and
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so we'll sort of break it down a little
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bit.
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>> So, you're the current world record
00:03:30
holder for the squat.
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>> Okay. And you've got the World Games
00:03:34
coming up in a couple of weeks.
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>> Exactly.
00:03:36
>> Yes. What are the World Games? So the I
00:03:38
mean I only just found out when I
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qualified last year, but the World Games
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is a multis-port event and it's
00:03:43
supported by the IOC. So it's kind of
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connected to the Olympic Committee. Um I
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guess you could think of it as the
00:03:50
sports that are not really at the
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Commonwealth Games and all the countries
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that are not at the Commonwealth Games.
00:03:54
So there's uh 60 different sports and
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this is the first time that classic
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powerlifting will be in it. Uh so it's a
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first for us. We're very excited and
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we're kind of hoping that it is almost
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like a uh audition to get into the
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Olympics for our sport. Um yes, because
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we've got some heavy hitters in New
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Zealand. Uh not just myself.
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>> Yes. You're doing um incredible stuff on
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the world stage, but most people
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probably wouldn't know wouldn't know who
00:04:20
you are or what you're doing.
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>> So So powerlifting uh what is it in
00:04:24
simple terms?
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>> Yes. So it's uh three lifts. It's uh the
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squat, the bench, and the deadlift. So
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at no point does the bar go over your
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head. That's Olympic weightlifting what
00:04:35
we see in the Olympics. Um so yeah,
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those three disciplines and you
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basically just lift as heavy as you can.
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So because the bar doesn't go over our
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head, we can generally lift much heavier
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weights. Um so you know my record squat
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is 231 kilos. So uh that's very proud of
00:04:53
that and wanting to push it. But um
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that's pretty much powerlifting. It's a
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a very niche sport, but it's growing. It
00:05:00
is growing. I guess like I've made it
00:05:02
here so hopefully more people get to
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know about it. But um as with many
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sports New Zealand you know we are such
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a small country but we really stamp our
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mark on certain sports and we do the
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same in powerlifting. We're quite famous
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in powerlifting.
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>> So um yeah there's the three lifts for
00:05:21
powerlifting as you said squat, bench
00:05:23
and deadlift. Yes.
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>> And they take your weight for all of
00:05:26
them and they combine them.
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>> Yes. And then you get a total uh uh
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total weight. Um and that is how you win
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at the end. Yes, I should have said
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that.
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>> Yeah. So squat you um I think most
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people probably know this, but just in
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case on your back down until your um
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thighs are parallel with the floor.
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>> Yes. And then up again.
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>> And then up again. And you get three
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tries of each. So you kind of work your
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way up through the competition. Um bench
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press is laying flat and obviously
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bringing the bar down and then back up.
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Um and then deadlift is just picking the
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the heavy thing off the ground.
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>> Yeah.
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>> What are the rules with bench? Like are
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you allowed to arch your back?
00:06:04
>> Yes. So you you are allowed to arch. Um
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there's been recently some changes to
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try and make that less because I think
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people don't really like to see the
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arch. Um but mostly it's listening to
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commands. So you do have to press it and
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wait for someone to to to tell you to
00:06:20
press it up. So you can miss commands
00:06:21
and things like that. So there are
00:06:23
little rules and nuances for having to
00:06:26
follow and keep it to standard.
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>> And what are your personal best in all
00:06:30
those three lifts?
00:06:31
>> So my um I guess my gym personal best
00:06:34
for a squat would be 238 kilos.
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>> What do you weigh?
00:06:39
>> Uh so I'm in the 76 kilo weight class.
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So when I'm training I'm usually 78ish
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kilos. Um, so yeah, uh, but at
00:06:47
competition 231 kilos and then my bench
00:06:51
press is 132.5 kilos.
00:06:54
>> Wow.
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>> And, uh, deadlift is 255 kilos.
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>> Just think about that squat for a
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second. So, it's basically three times
00:07:03
your own body weight.
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>> Yes.
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>> Yeah. Yeah.
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>> Yeah.
00:07:06
>> And and the bench again, what's your
00:07:07
what's your personal best for the bench?
00:07:09
>> 132.5 kilos, which is Yeah, it's it's
00:07:12
pretty good. There's uh there's a a
00:07:14
couple of girls who are crazy benches
00:07:16
and they're sort of in the 150s and then
00:07:18
uh and then they would be me. I would be
00:07:20
right after them
00:07:21
>> cuz I think most people that are
00:07:23
listening to this, probably men in
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particular, probably know what their
00:07:26
what their best bench is. So, it gives
00:07:28
them something to compare to.
00:07:29
>> Um don't cry.
00:07:33
>> Do guys um do do you see some guys
00:07:36
getting uh
00:07:37
>> I don't know, like ego damage in the gym
00:07:39
or you know what I mean?
00:07:41
>> Yeah. Like recently I have because we
00:07:43
used to be in a private gym where it was
00:07:45
just powerlifters like just athletes and
00:07:48
so we've moved into a more commercial
00:07:50
area and um I regularly see men's egos
00:07:56
not doing well when uh not even just me
00:08:00
um training friends are also training.
00:08:02
So um yeah I had uh gosh it was the
00:08:05
first time this had ever happened. I was
00:08:06
deadlifting and it was 160 kilos. It was
00:08:10
that's very light for me. Um and someone
00:08:14
just just came over out of the blue and
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tried to lift it. Um and I said to him
00:08:19
before I was like, "Mate, you shouldn't
00:08:21
do that. Uh you should probably like
00:08:22
warm up before you try and lift
00:08:24
something this heavy." And he he almost
00:08:27
just he didn't break the floor. He
00:08:29
almost passed out trying so hard.
00:08:32
>> It was really awkward. But um yes.
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>> And is um mansplaining a thing in the
00:08:37
gym or not so much anymore? Yeah, not uh
00:08:40
not when you're in the safe zone of like
00:08:42
a private athlete gym, but I think it
00:08:44
still is a thing I'm experiencing uh at
00:08:46
a semi-commercial gym. Um a bit of
00:08:49
mansplaining going on, but they've
00:08:51
learned to stop.
00:08:53
>> Yeah. Not to not to f with you.
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>> Yeah.
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>> And um what is Sheffield? Like I've
00:08:58
heard heaps of podcasts with you and you
00:08:59
talk about Sheffield a lot. What is
00:09:01
Sheffield?
00:09:01
>> Yeah. Sheffield it's a it's a
00:09:04
competition
00:09:05
almost like a showcase. It's happened
00:09:08
for three years now. So, it's quite new.
00:09:10
But one of the biggest or well the
00:09:13
biggest sponsor in um powerlifting SBD
00:09:16
um they uh manufacture all the gear that
00:09:20
we wear uh held this Sheffield event and
00:09:23
it's in Sheffield in the UK and they
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invite uh 24 of the best lifters in the
00:09:29
world. So, it's usually uh world
00:09:31
champions versus world champions across
00:09:33
weight classes whereas, you know, I'm in
00:09:34
the under 76 weight class. So, I would
00:09:37
compete against my own weight class. At
00:09:38
Sheffield, I'm competing against world
00:09:40
championship from 47 up to 84 plus uh
00:09:44
weight classes.
00:09:45
>> So, it's kind of like all the stars, all
00:09:47
the best of the best. And um the the way
00:09:50
you win is by beating your total world
00:09:52
record by the highest percentage. So,
00:09:54
it's it's also fun to watch for people.
00:09:57
So, uh the it's kind of the first event
00:09:59
where people actually uh travel to buy
00:10:02
tickets for and really enjoy uh watching
00:10:06
these powerlters. Um the first time I
00:10:08
went, you know, being so new uh into the
00:10:11
international space, I was just
00:10:13
fangirling non-stop because they're like
00:10:15
powerlifting celebrities. Um and now I'm
00:10:17
going for the fourth time next year.
00:10:20
>> When you go there, are you sort of like
00:10:21
a rock star?
00:10:22
>> You feel like it. Yeah, you really do
00:10:24
feel like it. you get treated. It's not
00:10:27
a professional sport, but they do treat
00:10:28
us like professional athletes. You know,
00:10:30
they fly us over. They have us in
00:10:32
hotels. We're all eating together and um
00:10:34
there's media and interviews and
00:10:36
afterwards there's meet and greets and
00:10:38
you're sort of like, "What the heck?"
00:10:40
People want to meet me um and get
00:10:42
autographs and it's it's a it's an
00:10:45
amazing experience.
00:10:47
>> When you say you eat together, what are
00:10:48
you eating? Broccoli. Broccoli and
00:10:50
boiled chicken.
00:10:51
>> Yeah. Look, some people are eating air.
00:10:53
Some people
00:10:55
are on liquids cuz yeah, it's a weight
00:10:57
cutting sport. So, um I'm one of the
00:11:00
lucky ones that can keep eating actual
00:11:02
food.
00:11:04
>> That's amazing. Um and you've got a
00:11:07
partner, Harry.
00:11:08
>> He's he's um is he a UFC fighter?
00:11:10
>> He is not a UFC fighter, but he that's
00:11:13
his preferred like training method. Um
00:11:16
he is a tradey and welding, but uh we've
00:11:20
we've grown up together and been
00:11:22
together since we were 15. So um he is
00:11:26
yeah a massive massive massive support
00:11:29
and um especially with the last sort of
00:11:31
five months of me training much more and
00:11:34
working less. Uh he's been a huge um
00:11:36
part of keeping levelheaded and and
00:11:40
getting through it.
00:11:41
>> Yeah. You need a supportive partner
00:11:43
because it's very timecon I mean you got
00:11:44
this job this very very um you know high
00:11:47
pressure job you're doing um and also
00:11:49
this uh very time consuming sport as
00:11:51
well.
00:11:52
>> Yeah. Yeah. And I, you know, I do stop
00:11:54
and think, oh my gosh, lucky that this
00:11:57
is just working uh out so well and that
00:12:00
he is so supportive because yeah, I do
00:12:02
get home at sort of 8 at night and we
00:12:06
just have a quick meal and go to bed
00:12:08
because we've got to go to work
00:12:09
tomorrow. Um, but he comes along and he
00:12:12
loves it and he just wants nothing but
00:12:16
for me to keep going and to keep pushing
00:12:18
things. So, I'm very lucky.
00:12:21
>> Yes. So, your partner, your family, um
00:12:23
your job, and your training, and I'm
00:12:26
guessing there's not much time for
00:12:27
anything else.
00:12:28
>> Yeah, that's that's 100% right. Um I
00:12:33
might see a friend or two once or twice
00:12:36
a year. Um
00:12:39
and it's uh they understand. They
00:12:40
understand. And when we do catch up,
00:12:42
it's really nice. But there's not a lot
00:12:44
of time for anything. Um, it's just the
00:12:48
cost of of of getting gold.
00:12:53
>> Um, and medicine and powerlifting, do
00:12:55
they do they compete or compliment?
00:12:58
>> I think in a lot of ways they complement
00:13:02
especially in the type of medicine I'm
00:13:05
doing. So, I'm in general practice. Uh,
00:13:08
I'm a contractor. So, I can have a lot
00:13:10
of control over what my schedule looks
00:13:12
like. Um, and I have an amazing job uh
00:13:15
with managers who are so supportive and
00:13:17
and just want to see me go and sort of
00:13:19
win these world titles and come back to
00:13:21
work. So, I'm really really lucky. But I
00:13:24
think they complement each other in the
00:13:27
way that both of them can be extremely
00:13:30
stressful. Um, and you can reach burnout
00:13:33
with either of them, but you know, when
00:13:35
I'm at work, I'm at work and seeing my
00:13:37
patients and sort of taking on whatever
00:13:40
stories are coming at me that day. Then
00:13:42
the next day I know I'm going to go and
00:13:43
lift heavy weights for 4 hours and sort
00:13:45
of offload and that feels really good.
00:13:48
So that that works out at the moment
00:13:50
okay for me.
00:13:52
>> And and which one there may not be a
00:13:54
direct answer for this but which one um
00:13:55
requires more discipline
00:13:57
>> being a doctor or being an athlete.
00:13:58
>> Yeah. Yeah. I think discipline the word
00:14:02
that word being an athlete. Uh a lot of
00:14:05
discipline goes into it. uh because I
00:14:08
think when you get especially after a a
00:14:11
few world championship events uh their
00:14:15
motivation is not always there all year
00:14:17
round and so all you can rely on is like
00:14:19
routine and discipline and consistency.
00:14:22
>> Um I'm not sure that I need to be that
00:14:24
disciplined at work.
00:14:28
>> It's just googling symptoms, isn't it?
00:14:30
>> Googling symptoms and then um
00:14:32
prescribing augmentum.
00:14:34
>> Isn't that what
00:14:35
>> Go ahead. you now have a medical degree.
00:14:41
It it it requires other uh values and um
00:14:45
skill sets at at um at work. But I think
00:14:48
that's why it goes so well because
00:14:49
they're two completely different things.
00:14:51
But um at work, the other thing that
00:14:54
sort of helps is, you know, I get
00:14:56
reminded of of people's realities every
00:14:58
time I'm at work. And so it I think that
00:15:01
crosses over at sport where nothing is
00:15:03
really that bad,
00:15:05
>> you know. Um I I have experienced losses
00:15:08
in sport, but um I think just having
00:15:11
been around some like real actual grief
00:15:15
and stress and hard times, it's sort of
00:15:17
like, you know, there's always next
00:15:19
year.
00:15:21
>> Yeah. It's good perspective, right?
00:15:22
>> Yeah.
00:15:23
>> Yeah, it does. It brings you back down.
00:15:25
>> Yeah.
00:15:26
>> Well, I think that's the intro done. I
00:15:28
think that paints a good picture about
00:15:29
um who who you are and and what you do.
00:15:33
Um so now we can go all the way back. So
00:15:35
yeah, who who was young Kina? What is
00:15:37
what are some of your earliest memories?
00:15:39
>> Earliest memories I guess uh growing up
00:15:42
my earliest memories are net a lot of
00:15:45
net family. My parents were my coaches
00:15:48
so they really have been super duper
00:15:51
present in my life. Um just growing up
00:15:54
with siblings every Saturday at the net
00:15:56
courts we my parents were coaches they
00:15:58
ran the net club and so sport is just a
00:16:02
been a huge part in my life and has
00:16:04
never left um it has changed but um it
00:16:08
it's not that it's saved me from
00:16:11
anything but I think in like a
00:16:12
prophylactic way it helped me in so many
00:16:15
ways to sort of get to where I am um in
00:16:18
other areas of my life.
00:16:21
>> Yeah. I mean, we started with this with
00:16:23
the email from your mom, and it sounds
00:16:24
like she's been that sort of like
00:16:26
helicopter presence through your whole
00:16:27
life, like you mentioned before, uh, her
00:16:30
coaching your net team. I think I heard
00:16:31
in another podcast you did like she was
00:16:33
on the the school board. She was at your
00:16:36
school ball like just watching.
00:16:39
>> But you you never had the chance to get
00:16:40
into any trouble, did you?
00:16:42
>> No. I think that was the plan. They were
00:16:44
just like, we're everywhere. Everywhere
00:16:46
you turn around, you're like, "Okay,
00:16:48
that's my mom." Um, and she was like
00:16:50
that for for most of us. Um, and I
00:16:53
think, yeah, it just kept us out of
00:16:54
trouble. We didn't have time to do
00:16:56
anything else but sport and school. Um,
00:16:59
it was strict like it really was. Um,
00:17:02
but on reflection, you know, uh, it
00:17:05
worked out in the end and we had some,
00:17:07
you know, awesome uh, experiences
00:17:10
growing up. Uh, so, yeah, I am one of
00:17:12
five and so my sisters and my youngest
00:17:14
brother, um, everything we've done,
00:17:16
we've done with our parents and
00:17:19
I was they were pretty good at however
00:17:21
they did it because like I uh always
00:17:24
admired them and I never felt like oh
00:17:27
walk over there you know don't drop me
00:17:28
off at school or whatever you know I
00:17:30
always wanted them around and I was
00:17:32
happy and proud to have them around. So
00:17:34
even though they were like helicopters
00:17:36
that I I enjoyed their their teachings
00:17:39
and their company and yeah
00:17:42
>> did you get away with anything?
00:17:44
>> No. Who was the naughtiest? What What
00:17:47
was the naughtiest thing you did?
00:17:49
>> You just not not a naughty kid at all?
00:17:52
>> No.
00:17:52
>> Who was the bad one of the siblings?
00:17:53
>> Yeah, the oldest. Always. Always. That's
00:17:56
why. So, I was like, "Okay, so don't do
00:17:57
that and don't do that and don't do
00:17:58
this." So, she taught me a lot of what
00:18:00
not to do. So, she went through it all
00:18:03
so that the rest of us didn't uh were
00:18:05
not brave enough to uh push those
00:18:07
boundaries. But yeah, I remember in high
00:18:10
school I had this one goal of like I'm
00:18:12
going to skip one day of school. I'm
00:18:14
going to before I finish school, I'm
00:18:16
going to I'm going to wag. Uh but I
00:18:18
never did.
00:18:20
>> I did not achieve that goal.
00:18:23
>> Well, it served you well. Yeah. So,
00:18:25
you're um you're um half moldy, half
00:18:27
tongen, so your mum's moldy.
00:18:29
>> Yes. And dad's tongen.
00:18:30
>> Yes.
00:18:31
>> Yeah. Um yeah. What does that heritage
00:18:33
piece mean to you? Yeah, it is extremely
00:18:36
important to me and es especially
00:18:39
knowing that um I get to put us on a
00:18:42
platform for the rest of the world and
00:18:44
and show them a little bit of our
00:18:46
culture. I think growing up my parents
00:18:50
uh mom was from Ka and she moved to
00:18:53
Oakland in around like 18 and dad lived
00:18:56
in born and raised in Tonga and moved to
00:18:59
New Zealand when he was 17. And so they
00:19:02
moved away from their roots and kind of
00:19:05
they built their own family within
00:19:07
Oakland. So I didn't have a lot of like
00:19:10
blood relatives in the area, but we had
00:19:13
this makeshift family of of a whole
00:19:15
bunch of diverse people. Um, and so I
00:19:18
think in that way like I we always me
00:19:21
and my siblings always feel that we have
00:19:24
more connections to be made to our
00:19:26
culture, but at the same time like I I I
00:19:29
know where I'm I'm from. I know where I
00:19:31
get all my gifts from. Um, and I'm so
00:19:35
happy to like put it on a world stage
00:19:37
and let people know about it.
00:19:41
>> How did how did they get it so right?
00:19:42
I'm just thinking of like some previous
00:19:43
podcast guests I've had like um I don't
00:19:45
know if you know Matt Brown. He he
00:19:47
started this foundation called She is
00:19:48
not your rehab, which is phenomenal.
00:19:50
>> Um, so his his his parents la they came
00:19:53
to New Zealand from Samoa for a better
00:19:55
life. his dad ended up with a factory
00:19:57
job and you they they basic they
00:20:00
basically their um their outgoings were
00:20:01
more than the goings each week and his
00:20:03
dad developed an alcohol problem and
00:20:05
>> um you know it just wasn't a great
00:20:07
outcome for the kids.
00:20:09
>> Um but I suppose everyone that comes
00:20:10
from the islands to New Zealand comes
00:20:12
because they want like a better life or
00:20:14
better opportunity for the kids that
00:20:15
they have or they're going to have.
00:20:17
>> Um and it seems like like yeah for your
00:20:19
family it's it's worked.
00:20:20
>> Yeah.
00:20:21
>> They've nailed it.
00:20:22
>> Yes, I think so. I think it was just
00:20:24
this like great combination of two
00:20:26
people who uh had this picture of of
00:20:30
what they wanted more for themselves and
00:20:32
and they're so determined and they I've
00:20:35
watched them work so hard. You know, I
00:20:37
remember um as a really really young kid
00:20:41
um dad when I was born was like working
00:20:44
at I think BP or Calteex or something
00:20:46
and mom was working at a bar and then
00:20:48
we've watched them go through banking
00:20:50
and become managers and we've watched
00:20:52
what hard work looks like. Um and they
00:20:54
wanted us to kind of skip those steps
00:20:56
and like go to uni and and get get there
00:20:58
as quick as possible. So there was a lot
00:21:00
of pressure to you know to to do be a
00:21:04
doctor.
00:21:06
Did you Did you want to be a doctor or
00:21:08
were were you sort of told you have to
00:21:09
be like a doctor or a lawyer or
00:21:12
>> I think it was both. It was a bit of
00:21:14
both. Um like I've always been
00:21:16
interested in health and sport and and
00:21:19
um and fitness, but yes, the the the it
00:21:22
was like doctor doctor. So,
00:21:25
>> but I love my job. I love my job. So,
00:21:28
you never had that self-doubt, that that
00:21:29
thing, oh, you know, I'd like to be a
00:21:32
doctor, but maybe I'm not smart enough,
00:21:34
maybe I'm not good enough, you know,
00:21:35
whatever story you tell yourself.
00:21:37
>> Yeah. I think the
00:21:40
>> No, and and that
00:21:42
>> that's so powerful that that's got to
00:21:43
come from the parenting they say.
00:21:45
>> Yeah. Yeah. That's what I was just about
00:21:46
to say is it's definitely come from them
00:21:49
in the way that they like uh the
00:21:51
expectations they set, the uh way that
00:21:54
they even trained me in net ball and and
00:21:58
uh in our sort of just general life, you
00:22:00
know, there's a lot of um at 10 years
00:22:03
old, I'm being taught positive
00:22:05
affirmations and like saying kind things
00:22:08
to myself and saying uh my goals out
00:22:10
loud to myself and not just that I hope
00:22:13
that it'll happen that this is what is
00:22:15
going to happen. And so I think when
00:22:17
you're so young and that's what you're
00:22:18
already practicing, then it becomes
00:22:20
second nature as you get older. Um, and
00:22:23
that's not that to say that I don't have
00:22:26
doubts. You definitely get doubts. But
00:22:28
when you've practiced that for so long
00:22:30
and it's really ingrained in your brain,
00:22:33
it's much easier to sort of just let
00:22:34
negative doubts uh pass by. Um, so yeah,
00:22:37
it was almost like pre-therapy, you
00:22:39
know,
00:22:40
>> when I didn't know.
00:22:41
>> That is so powerful. That's really So
00:22:43
you were how old? Like 10. Yeah.
00:22:45
>> And what's Can you remember what they
00:22:47
like? Did you have them written down on
00:22:48
like on a mirror or
00:22:50
>> I we didn't the my my most vivid memory
00:22:53
is they were taking us for a nipple
00:22:55
training and so it's me and other girls
00:22:57
as well and they told us to go and sit
00:23:00
across the court and by ourselves and
00:23:03
think of like three things that you're
00:23:05
going to do uh positively in the in the
00:23:08
game on Saturday. So, I'm going to get
00:23:10
this many intercepts or I'm going to do
00:23:12
this and and we just had to sit there
00:23:15
and say it and say it and say it and
00:23:16
then they told us when you go home go
00:23:18
stand in front of the mirror and say it
00:23:20
again. And so that just I had a lot of
00:23:23
buy in, you know, a huge amount of buyin
00:23:26
into what my parents were saying at that
00:23:28
time. So, I was doing it and I don't
00:23:31
necessarily do it that way now, but it's
00:23:33
just sort of second nature because they
00:23:35
had me doing it back then.
00:23:37
>> Yes. I muscle a memory. Where did they
00:23:39
get it from? Were they into Tony Robbins
00:23:41
or
00:23:42
>> I Mom, where did you get it from?
00:23:45
>> That's that's Yeah. That's not something
00:23:47
that you um instinctively know how to
00:23:50
do. Like it's it's a learned thing.
00:23:51
That's that's so that's so powerful.
00:23:53
>> Yes. Yeah. And I I think it worked, you
00:23:55
know, not just for me, but with these
00:23:57
girls. I was 10, but we played net
00:24:00
together till we were 21, 22. And each
00:24:03
and every one of us has been really
00:24:05
successful in our own rights and and
00:24:07
doing well in life. And so I think yeah
00:24:10
they they played a big part in all of
00:24:12
our lives.
00:24:13
>> Oh, so you played net up until your 20s.
00:24:16
How how come you gave the net away?
00:24:18
>> Just um when I started in the hospital
00:24:20
could not be relied on for team sports
00:24:22
and and trainings. It was my love. I
00:24:25
wanted to be a silver fern. Um
00:24:29
>> were you all right? You're quite short,
00:24:31
eh?
00:24:31
>> I'm so short. Um, I was decent. Um, and
00:24:35
for a long time it was really really a
00:24:37
goal uh of mine to be a silver phone and
00:24:40
I would always watch uh Tim was the the
00:24:43
main center. I was center at the time
00:24:46
and she looks so short on on on TV. So I
00:24:49
thought that's okay. She's short, I'm
00:24:51
short, like I can do this. And then we
00:24:54
went to a game and she's like this much
00:24:56
taller than me and I was like oh I'm not
00:24:59
going to do it.
00:25:01
Tim part of George. Like she might may
00:25:02
look small on TV, but that's cuz she's
00:25:03
standing next to Irene Van Dyke or
00:25:05
whoever it is.
00:25:07
>> Yeah. So, yeah.
00:25:08
>> So, you gave that away and replaced it
00:25:10
with a sport that requires 4 hours of
00:25:11
training a day.
00:25:12
>> I know,
00:25:15
but hey, I've got some gold medals and
00:25:17
you know, it's worth it.
00:25:19
>> So, you you leave school and then you go
00:25:20
to med school and you you um you go to
00:25:22
Oakland University. Um
00:25:25
>> you what was that like? cuz I'm guessing
00:25:26
through like through through your your
00:25:29
um education um you never sort of felt
00:25:31
like a minority because you go to school
00:25:32
in South Oakland so you're surrounded by
00:25:34
people that that look like you or are
00:25:36
like you
00:25:37
>> then you go to med school. Um yeah. What
00:25:39
was that like?
00:25:40
>> Yeah. No, you're so right about that
00:25:41
because I you know I think I've been
00:25:43
asked before in a while in conversation
00:25:46
whether you sort of experienced any I
00:25:49
don't know racism or anything growing up
00:25:51
but you know I grew up in South Oakland
00:25:53
so we we all look the same and there's
00:25:55
so many different people. Um, not
00:25:56
really. But then you go to Oakland uh,
00:25:59
uni and yes, you really do become a
00:26:02
minority and you're sort of one of maybe
00:26:04
20 in a class of 200 and something um,
00:26:07
that look like you and and you kind of
00:26:10
just really uh, gather together. You you
00:26:14
really Yeah, you do. You find your
00:26:16
tribe. Exactly. Um, and that takes you
00:26:18
through to med school. So, uh, at uni
00:26:21
they they do have their own little
00:26:23
cohorts and side groups. Um, you know,
00:26:25
there's the uh map as at at Oakland Uni,
00:26:28
so that's modern Pacific Island. Um, and
00:26:31
yeah, we just stuck together because we
00:26:34
have, you know, the same values came
00:26:36
from the same like small places. Um, and
00:26:39
it just made it made it much easier. So,
00:26:41
I didn't actually feel too out of place
00:26:43
or or alone.
00:26:45
>> How how hard or overwhelming is med
00:26:47
school?
00:26:48
>> H, at the in and when you're in the in
00:26:51
the moment of it, it feels extremely
00:26:53
overwhelming. I I remember so many tears
00:26:56
and like sleepless nights of studying
00:26:58
and um it it felt extremely difficult at
00:27:01
the time and I'd only say that because
00:27:03
you go through life and then you realize
00:27:05
oh that wasn't so bad
00:27:08
>> at the end of it.
00:27:08
>> Yeah. I faced so many more challenges
00:27:10
since then but um and especially sort of
00:27:14
my hospital colleagues you know as a
00:27:16
student uh you would shadow some maybe
00:27:19
senior registars who are doing their
00:27:21
last set of exams and they'd sort of
00:27:23
just look at you and be like med
00:27:24
school's nothing like wait till you get
00:27:26
here and you're oh my god what am I
00:27:30
doing but no it it it was challenging um
00:27:33
yeah just the high high standards once
00:27:37
you get into med the sort of pressure
00:27:39
between the your peers is less. But
00:27:42
trying to get into med school, sort of
00:27:44
like each man for themselves. And I
00:27:46
really wish there were way more spots
00:27:48
than they are. I think a lot of people
00:27:50
miss out on getting through to med
00:27:52
school just because we don't have enough
00:27:53
spots. And
00:27:54
>> we so need more doctors.
00:27:56
>> Need more doctors.
00:27:57
>> Isn't there um is there a massive c
00:27:59
between year one and year two? So you
00:28:00
study year one. Yeah. Like it goes from
00:28:02
what to what? I think it goes from
00:28:04
something like over a thousand or so to
00:28:06
200 like a maybe even a few thousand to
00:28:09
260 in my year. I think maybe it's at
00:28:13
300 now. But we know that there's in the
00:28:16
next 5 years a whole bunch of uh at
00:28:18
least GPS going to retire and we don't
00:28:21
have anyone to replace them. So it's uh
00:28:24
it's hard times now, but the future's
00:28:27
looking pretty.
00:28:29
>> And how many years? How many years does
00:28:30
it take? Uh the med school's six years
00:28:33
and then you have to do two years as a
00:28:35
junior minimum uh to sort of get your
00:28:38
registration and then you decide where
00:28:41
to branch off to and what you want to
00:28:42
do.
00:28:44
>> Where were you sort of in your in your
00:28:46
class?
00:28:46
>> Yeah. Oh, I don't even know. I have no
00:28:49
idea. I think if you don't really care
00:28:51
unless you're at the top. So, uh I
00:28:54
wasn't at the top of that one.
00:28:56
>> Who was at the top? That's why my dog
00:28:58
does.
00:29:01
They're doing well. I think they're
00:29:03
doing well. One's a pediatrician and the
00:29:05
other I think it's in cardiology or
00:29:06
something like that. Yeah.
00:29:07
>> Yeah. So, you graduate and then you
00:29:09
become a doctor. Um and then uh your
00:29:11
first job is at Middlemore Hospital.
00:29:13
>> Yes.
00:29:13
>> Why was that? Did you choose to go there
00:29:15
or do you get like just placed
00:29:16
somewhere?
00:29:17
>> Yeah. So, you you you can preference
00:29:19
where you want to go and then the
00:29:21
hospitals look at your CV and decide
00:29:24
whether they want you. Um but Middlemore
00:29:26
Hospital I did my fourth year and sixth
00:29:29
year at med school there and then I
00:29:31
worked there for three years as a
00:29:33
junior. Um and it's just it's known as
00:29:38
sort of a baptism of fire. Uh a you get
00:29:42
a lot of learning quickly. Um one of the
00:29:45
hardest places to work but once you work
00:29:48
there then generally you can work
00:29:51
anywhere else. That's what that's what
00:29:53
everybody says about Middlemore. Um, and
00:29:56
having experienced it, you know, that's
00:29:57
very true. Uh, it was very overwhelming
00:30:02
and and sometimes, well, a lot of the
00:30:04
times you felt out of your depth and and
00:30:07
sometimes alone as well because staffing
00:30:10
wasn't so or isn't so great. Um, but you
00:30:14
learn a lot. The people you're working
00:30:16
with are amazing human beings. it kind
00:30:18
of attracts a certain type of people and
00:30:20
so it's almost like Stockholm syndrome
00:30:23
like you you're you're traumatized from
00:30:25
what's happening by the system but the
00:30:27
people and the patients that you love
00:30:29
and is what keeps you going there or
00:30:31
what makes students want to work there.
00:30:35
>> Yeah.
00:30:36
>> What about your first day there? So you
00:30:38
walk into Middlemore Hospital as your
00:30:39
first day. I can't imagine how
00:30:40
nerve-wracking that is. You've done all
00:30:41
this training, training, and I suppose
00:30:43
you've had placements or whatever
00:30:45
beforehand, but
00:30:46
>> you know, everyone remembers like going
00:30:47
to a new school for the first day or
00:30:49
starting a new job. Um, but this is like
00:30:51
next level first job stuff.
00:30:53
>> Yeah. Oh my gosh. Yes. And you feel like
00:30:56
still a teenager. You really do. You
00:30:59
feel like a teenager uh who's suddenly
00:31:01
been given this role. And when people
00:31:04
ask you things, you're sort of looking
00:31:06
around like, "Wait, are you asking me? I
00:31:10
know. I've just been to at school for
00:31:12
six years, but this seems like a big
00:31:14
step. Um yeah, my first day was it was a
00:31:17
long day. So that's when you start at
00:31:19
seven and finish at 10:00. Um and uh
00:31:22
part of that shift or half of that shift
00:31:24
you'd be the only doctor on the junior
00:31:26
doctor for like maybe four or five
00:31:28
wards. Um and so that was cra that was
00:31:32
crazy overwhelming. It was uh uh
00:31:34
probably the most stressful day because
00:31:36
it was right at the beginning and I just
00:31:39
you walk through a ward and everybody
00:31:41
wants a piece of you. Everybody needs
00:31:43
something from you and we don't learn
00:31:46
how to cope with that uh when we're at
00:31:49
med school. Uh that that sort of like
00:31:51
being pulled in all sorts of directions
00:31:54
and not always knowing the answer. Um I
00:31:57
definitely had to step out and have a
00:31:59
cry um during that shift because it was
00:32:02
just yeah something that I'd never
00:32:04
experienced before. Um and actually I
00:32:08
just there's the series um Diary of a
00:32:10
Junior Doctor that just came out I think
00:32:13
a couple of months ago and it's really
00:32:15
well done. It does. It's at Middlemore
00:32:17
Hospital and it follows some junior
00:32:19
doctors and it's it's real um what they
00:32:22
show on there and it kind of brings back
00:32:24
a lot of memories good and and bad.
00:32:28
>> Yeah. Yeah. It must be quite triggering.
00:32:30
>> Yeah. It was surprisingly very
00:32:32
triggering for uh for myself and and my
00:32:34
colleagues as well. Some people couldn't
00:32:36
make it through the series because uh
00:32:39
for a lot of people they left the
00:32:40
hospital because of um how you know how
00:32:43
busy or how overwhelming. And I think
00:32:46
when you're in general practice um you
00:32:49
you have a sort of the way that you're
00:32:52
driven is to sort of stop people from
00:32:55
from getting to that point and and we're
00:32:57
not so um
00:33:00
>> uh I think in the hospital it's very
00:33:02
outcome driven. So you come in and I
00:33:05
give you this treatment and then you go
00:33:06
home and like fixed off you go. Um
00:33:10
whereas in general practice there's a
00:33:12
bit of that but it's also okay. So how
00:33:14
do we take care of your health so that
00:33:16
you don't end up needing to get to that
00:33:18
place.
00:33:19
>> Yeah.
00:33:19
>> So how long were you at Middlemore for?
00:33:21
>> I was there for 3 years.
00:33:23
>> Right.
00:33:23
>> What was the hardest day on the job? Is
00:33:25
there one that stands out?
00:33:28
Um, I think the heart they have a theme
00:33:31
and it's when you're a junior and your
00:33:35
seniors are busy in surgery, but there
00:33:39
is some something like bad news or some
00:33:42
kind of procedure that needs to be done
00:33:45
um by a senior, but you're all that
00:33:48
there is and and so you're having to
00:33:51
sort of be talked on the phone through
00:33:52
some steps of how to do something. And I
00:33:56
guess like one I remember was delivering
00:33:59
some bad news about a scan to um to a
00:34:03
man and his family. And that was def
00:34:06
within my first couple of weeks and and
00:34:09
I was just on the phone with the senior
00:34:12
like uh I don't even really understand
00:34:14
what the scan is showing. I don't know
00:34:16
if I can then go and tell him this
00:34:19
really bad news. But there was nothing
00:34:21
that could be done. And so just sort of
00:34:24
trying to remove yourself from the
00:34:27
situation because actually
00:34:29
I'm not the one receiving bad news. It's
00:34:31
going to be much worse for him
00:34:33
>> and stepping into a okay, I'm going to
00:34:36
try and be as compassionate as I can for
00:34:38
this patient in this moment and just do
00:34:40
the best that I can.
00:34:42
>> Does it does that um communication piece
00:34:44
get any easier?
00:34:46
>> It does. Yeah, it does with confidence
00:34:48
and
00:34:49
>> it's
00:34:50
>> some doctors are terrible at it. E You
00:34:52
must have seen like all you know all
00:34:54
ends of the spectrum like some some some
00:34:57
doctors incredibly intelligent and and
00:34:59
gifted at what they do but just no
00:35:00
bedside manner. Yes, those uh yes, yeah,
00:35:04
those people do exist and um it's a it's
00:35:08
a really important thing to me uh
00:35:10
communication and uh building trust with
00:35:13
patients uh getting them to feel uh like
00:35:18
they are in control of their health and
00:35:20
making it sort of a combined like effort
00:35:23
that you and I are working together to
00:35:26
get you to this place, not just I am
00:35:28
telling you this this this this
00:35:30
>> um let's make this plan together and see
00:35:32
what you think about it. Um, and I think
00:35:35
most a lot of us end up in general
00:35:37
practice because we we get to do that.
00:35:40
We get to uh build relationships with
00:35:43
our patients and see them for years and
00:35:45
through their whole lives basically.
00:35:48
Like I've been in general practice for
00:35:50
six years and I have already, you know,
00:35:52
met my patient and then they've had a
00:35:53
baby and now their baby's four and and
00:35:55
I, you know, saw that baby in a scan
00:35:58
when it was not conceived but
00:36:02
>> on the scan.
00:36:03
>> I see what you mean. It's these
00:36:04
connections you build and then um yeah,
00:36:06
that that child's going to come to see
00:36:07
you through their life and
00:36:09
>> Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. And I think in the
00:36:11
back in the days like you would see that
00:36:13
child have a baby and um I think that's
00:36:15
Yeah. Uh that's how general practice
00:36:19
works best and it's really hard to even
00:36:22
do it that way in the current climate.
00:36:25
>> Yeah. Can you remember the first time a
00:36:28
a patient or a family of a patient like
00:36:29
yelled at you or abused you?
00:36:31
>> Oh the
00:36:32
>> so many first.
00:36:33
>> Yeah. Not the I can't remember the first
00:36:35
but I do remember one that sticks out
00:36:38
pretty pretty clearly. Um and it was
00:36:41
yeah it was felt you it feels very
00:36:44
threatening um when it happens uh and in
00:36:48
general practice it's just you and them
00:36:50
in a closed door so it's uh it can feel
00:36:53
pretty scary um but that sort of
00:36:58
deescalation
00:36:59
not that I don't think I've ever been
00:37:01
taught how to do it but um most of the
00:37:05
time it's coming from a place for them
00:37:07
of not being heard or um being
00:37:11
frustrated with a system. And I I don't
00:37:14
think it's it was ever sort of me
00:37:17
personally, but if if we could just
00:37:20
bring it down and talk human to human
00:37:23
and get to the basis of what it is, um
00:37:25
then that sort of usually works. Um when
00:37:28
people are, you know, not on high on
00:37:30
drugs or anything like that when it's
00:37:32
just a normal angry person.
00:37:34
>> Yeah. Yeah. Is is that a major issue,
00:37:36
the drugs? Um I wouldn't say in general
00:37:39
practice I would say def like an ED for
00:37:41
sure. You when I was working um in the
00:37:43
hospital you would hear it all the time
00:37:45
especially on night shift you know
00:37:46
there's security guards there's always
00:37:48
people around trying to stop um you know
00:37:50
violence and uh huge alcohol and drugs.
00:37:53
Yeah.
00:37:55
>> So during those minimal years how how
00:37:57
often how often were you finishing your
00:37:58
shift and just going home and crying in
00:38:00
the shower?
00:38:01
>> Mhm. Oh no. I just cry in the toilet on
00:38:03
the shift.
00:38:05
How often?
00:38:06
>> I don't wait.
00:38:07
>> How often? Like what is it? Once a week,
00:38:09
once a month.
00:38:10
>> I think I think it was maybe once a run
00:38:13
for me. Um I I runce.
00:38:16
>> Sorry. Once a three months. So every 3
00:38:19
months you change um your
00:38:20
>> Well, that's not bad. Four times a year.
00:38:22
>> Yeah. Um
00:38:25
um but I it's different for everyone.
00:38:28
And I really did enjoy like the fastpac
00:38:32
move on to the next one, onto the next
00:38:33
one. um uh sort of vibe of Middlemore
00:38:36
Hospital. Um and I think it you know I
00:38:40
think I handled it it pretty well. Um
00:38:45
it's just that the the reason why I left
00:38:47
was I liked everything. I enjoyed
00:38:50
everything. Some people um will have a
00:38:54
sort of uh I want to say run again
00:38:56
attachment or placement that they
00:38:58
definitely don't like that they
00:38:59
definitely don't want to do surgery or
00:39:01
definitely don't want to do mental
00:39:02
health. And I literally loved every
00:39:04
single run that I did and I couldn't see
00:39:06
myself just picking one and then and
00:39:09
also being in the hospital for the rest
00:39:10
of my life. So I get to do everything in
00:39:13
GP.
00:39:14
>> Yeah. I suppose um you just a couple
00:39:15
more on the middle more years. So in
00:39:17
that in that hospital environment I
00:39:18
suppose it's quite transactional like
00:39:20
you know you're just tuning through
00:39:21
patients all the time. Yeah.
00:39:22
>> But are there any um any or many like
00:39:24
patients or cases that stick with you
00:39:26
that you still think about to this day?
00:39:28
M there's there's a couple and I think
00:39:34
um there ones that remind me of family
00:39:37
members.
00:39:38
>> Those are the ones that uh really stick
00:39:40
with me. Um, I was on a night shift once
00:39:43
and one of the patients, he uh was
00:39:47
having real trouble breathing overnight
00:39:49
and he didn't have any family with him
00:39:51
and so we'd had to get um like ICU to
00:39:56
review him and put him on breathing
00:39:58
apparatuses and it was just a hard night
00:40:01
for him and I he did remind me of my dad
00:40:05
and so it was yeah it was quite um
00:40:08
emotional like even just thinking about
00:40:11
it now makes me emotional. But um
00:40:15
he was okay. Um but in the morning when
00:40:18
I was about to go home, I'd finished my
00:40:20
shift. I just thought, you know, if his
00:40:22
family comes to see him today and he's
00:40:26
completely hooked up. That's so scary.
00:40:29
Um so I called his wife um and before I
00:40:34
went home just to let her know like this
00:40:36
has happened overnight and he's hooked
00:40:38
up to a lot of things right now. So when
00:40:40
you come like don't don't worry um or
00:40:43
don't be alarmed. And that just felt
00:40:45
normal to me. Um but someone was sitting
00:40:48
next to me and said, "Oh my gosh, that's
00:40:51
really nice that you just called his
00:40:52
wife to to let him know that." And I
00:40:54
thought, was it like I was just sort of
00:40:57
trying to like let this family know that
00:41:00
that he's having a rough time, but don't
00:41:04
be too alarmed when you come in and you
00:41:06
see that all of this stuff has just
00:41:08
arrived at his bedside. Um yeah, and it
00:41:12
really did ram it. He really did remind
00:41:14
me of my dad. So yeah, even though that
00:41:17
was like 5 years ago, it's still sort of
00:41:19
you still think about um patients and
00:41:21
yeah, and care about them. That's
00:41:23
beautiful. I I was thinking the same
00:41:24
thing. Is that sort of like a procedural
00:41:26
thing or protocol or you just had the
00:41:29
made the choice to phone the family and
00:41:30
let them know?
00:41:31
>> Yeah, I just Yeah, I had just made the
00:41:33
choice to let them know.
00:41:35
>> Um and yeah, because I had thought I
00:41:38
would have been so so so scared if I
00:41:40
just turned up and and he looked like
00:41:43
that. Um yeah,
00:41:47
>> that's um next level duty of care, eh?
00:41:49
That's really cool. That's really sweet.
00:41:52
Yeah.
00:41:52
>> But yeah, th those are the ones that
00:41:54
stick
00:41:55
>> that stick with you. Um, and I'm sure
00:41:58
there's so many others. Uh, yeah.
00:42:02
>> When and when someone when someone dies
00:42:04
on in that hospital environment and
00:42:06
you've been involved with them, like
00:42:07
does that does it does that play on you
00:42:09
or do you just have to draw a line in
00:42:10
the sand and you move on?
00:42:12
>> Yeah, it's so quick in the hospital
00:42:14
environment. Um, and as soon it sounds
00:42:19
so morbid, but as soon as that happens,
00:42:20
then someone else has moved straight
00:42:22
into that room in that spot and then and
00:42:25
now you need to look after that person.
00:42:27
Um, and so it is very quick and you kind
00:42:29
of do move on. I think it it depends on
00:42:32
how much involvement you have with a
00:42:33
patient. But things have to move pretty
00:42:36
quickly.
00:42:37
>> Yeah. I suppose you just don't have time
00:42:38
to dwell or mourn, eh?
00:42:40
>> No.
00:42:41
>> Um, what was the most valuable lesson
00:42:43
you learned from your time at
00:42:44
Middlemore? M
00:42:48
um oh most valuable
00:42:53
so many lessons from Middlemore Hospital
00:42:56
um
00:42:58
I think just my time at Middlemore
00:43:00
Hospital it you really or anyone's time
00:43:03
at Middlemore Hospital you just learn so
00:43:06
much about the community that it serves
00:43:08
and and how much struggle there is and
00:43:12
how the difficulties that that patients
00:43:15
are going through and that you know if
00:43:18
you say could you come in follow up in
00:43:22
two weeks with me like that is a huge
00:43:24
thing to a lot of people that's not just
00:43:27
something that you can pick pick up and
00:43:29
do and say yes absolutely to people
00:43:31
don't have cars people don't have money
00:43:34
for appointments and you feel that so
00:43:36
heavily when you're working in South
00:43:38
Oakland um and so it's just learning all
00:43:41
of that stuff outside of your clinical
00:43:43
expertise is that these are the these
00:43:46
are your people and these are the type
00:43:47
of people that that you're working with
00:43:50
and so uh keep all of that in mind and
00:43:54
and and be compassionate in the plans
00:43:57
that you are making uh with these
00:43:59
patients uh because it's really really
00:44:02
hard out there. Um I think that was the
00:44:05
biggest thing.
00:44:06
>> Yeah. Do do you think it changed you as
00:44:08
a p as a person at all? Like did it make
00:44:11
you like more compassionate or more
00:44:13
cynical or you know or tougher?
00:44:16
>> Yeah, I somehow all of that. It makes
00:44:19
you all of that because you have to be
00:44:21
tough and you can't um break down every
00:44:25
sad story that you hear, but you also
00:44:27
need to uh
00:44:29
>> take all of that in into account, that
00:44:31
whole person into account, not just
00:44:33
their symptoms. And you know, there's a
00:44:36
lot of social work that goes into uh
00:44:38
being a doctor in South Oakland as well.
00:44:40
So, it it makes you tough. It makes you
00:44:42
compassionate. It makes you uh uh
00:44:46
understand more about what living in
00:44:49
South Oakland is really like. I mean, I
00:44:50
live I have lived in South Oakland my
00:44:52
whole life, so I do know. But, um I
00:44:56
think especially for people who uh work
00:44:58
at Middlemore, but have never lived in
00:45:00
South Oakland, that that's what they
00:45:01
quickly learn.
00:45:04
And a lot of it's like a like the family
00:45:05
environment you're bought into. Like not
00:45:06
everyone's lucky enough to be born into
00:45:07
a family like yours where you've got
00:45:08
these incredible role models, you know,
00:45:10
teaching you um you know uh visualiz
00:45:14
visualization and things like that at
00:45:15
the age of 10.
00:45:17
>> Like that's really it's really cool.
00:45:19
>> Yes.
00:45:20
>> Yeah. And yeah, I mean that's just a
00:45:23
testament to my parents and and and
00:45:26
what they w wanted for themselves
00:45:28
because I know that that wasn't the
00:45:30
upbringing that they had indiv as
00:45:32
individuals and so yeah they they made a
00:45:36
different path for us.
00:45:38
>> So why the switch from um Middlemore to
00:45:41
becoming a a GP which is like a family
00:45:43
doctor, right?
00:45:44
>> Um and how do you explain that? Is it is
00:45:46
it a is it a cruisier a cruisier
00:45:48
lifestyle being a GP? Yeah, I think in
00:45:51
hours in terms of hours, yes, because we
00:45:54
don't do night shifts and we don't do
00:45:56
the long 15 hour shifts or two weeks in
00:45:59
a row. So, yes, it is lifestyle-wise.
00:46:02
Um, there's it's the variety is huge.
00:46:06
Like, we're we're jacks of all trades
00:46:07
really. We look after babies, elderly,
00:46:11
men's health, women's health, mental
00:46:13
health. where I work is rural, so I
00:46:15
still get to do, you know, cut out some
00:46:17
skin cancers and uh suture up some big
00:46:20
lacerations. So, it's you get to do
00:46:22
everything. And I love that about GP.
00:46:24
Um, and like I'd mentioned before,
00:46:27
that's why I wanted to do it because I
00:46:29
couldn't tie myself to one specialty. I
00:46:31
just I wanted to be involved in all
00:46:33
parts of of a patient's life and do all
00:46:36
of that type of medicine. And so with
00:46:38
that comes, you know, a level of
00:46:41
uncertainty uh being out of the hospital
00:46:43
that you need to learn how to deal with.
00:46:47
Um when juniors come out of the hospital
00:46:49
and they're training at our practice,
00:46:51
you know, when I'm going through cases
00:46:53
with them, they're often sort of like,
00:46:55
should we order this test, this test,
00:46:56
and another test and another test? I'm
00:46:58
like, oh, from where?
00:47:02
We're not in the hospital anymore.
00:47:04
That's we tests are not a big part of
00:47:07
our of our job. It's a small part of our
00:47:10
job, but it's mostly getting the history
00:47:13
and that's where you get all your
00:47:15
information from and sort of from all
00:47:18
your studies and years. Pattern
00:47:20
recognition,
00:47:21
>> figuring out what's it most likely to
00:47:23
be, what would I what would I be [ __ ]
00:47:25
scared that it is, and I need to make
00:47:27
sure it's not, and how do we meet in the
00:47:29
middle together um with not a lot of
00:47:32
resources? Yeah.
00:47:34
>> And some for some people uh they don't
00:47:36
want that that uncertainty is too much
00:47:38
to to live with.
00:47:41
>> Oh, how how was the co period for you?
00:47:43
Were you a GP during the the co years?
00:47:46
>> I was just starting just started to
00:47:48
train literally the first year. So that
00:47:50
the first uh co year was my introduction
00:47:53
to um general practice which was not
00:47:56
general practice at all. So, you know,
00:47:58
we're on telephones and hardly actually
00:48:01
seeing patients and being all masked up
00:48:03
and the
00:48:03
>> PPE, the the head to toe,
00:48:05
>> head to toe. Um, and then stripping down
00:48:08
in a garage at home and
00:48:10
>> Yes. And being, you know, so so so
00:48:12
worried that you're going to give it to
00:48:14
someone that it's at home. And it was a
00:48:16
really scary scary time for everyone,
00:48:19
for patients included. But um that was
00:48:22
yeah that was my introduction to to G GP
00:48:26
practice was everyone wanting to know
00:48:28
you know uh can I get tested because
00:48:30
someone had CO at pack and save in Pukoy
00:48:33
and and I was also in Puko.
00:48:37
>> Um oh this might seem like a dumb
00:48:39
question. Um does your strength come in
00:48:42
handy or or does it not matter? Is it
00:48:44
irrelevant?
00:48:46
>> People think it comes in handy. They're
00:48:48
always like hey pick this box up. I'm
00:48:49
like, "No, if you put it on a barbell,
00:48:52
maybe." Um, I don't
00:48:53
>> I was thinking like in terms of I don't
00:48:54
know if you need to like roll a patient
00:48:56
over for dressing or I don't know. I
00:48:58
don't know.
00:48:58
>> I think it it is easier for me for sure.
00:49:02
>> Um, yeah. What do you think uh people
00:49:05
misunderstand most about what GPS
00:49:07
actually do?
00:49:09
>> Yes. Well, someone just said, "All I do
00:49:11
is prescribe augmented or
00:49:14
>> Oh, yeah. No, I'm just basically on on
00:49:16
my G." Actually, no. Dr. Ellison Mcgru
00:49:18
is a wonderful doctor. Although she's a
00:49:20
real sting with zopoclines.
00:49:22
>> Ah, me too.
00:49:23
>> Really? Why? God, she's I'm like, "Oh,
00:49:27
Dr. Ellison, I'm I'm I've got a flight
00:49:28
coming up. I don't want jet lag and I
00:49:30
want a bit of sleep." She g me like five
00:49:32
of them. It's like, come on.
00:49:33
>> She sounds like my girl.
00:49:35
>> Yeah, Dr. Ellison.
00:49:37
>> Why are you guys I need someone like
00:49:38
Michael Jackson's doctor somewhere in
00:49:40
between.
00:49:41
>> So, Dr. Ellison's there.
00:49:43
>> Dr. Conrad Murray's there. I need
00:49:44
someone. Just give me a few more zopies.
00:49:47
I'm not going to misuse them.
00:49:50
>> Look, but this is the thing. We don't
00:49:52
know. We We won't tell you, but do we
00:49:55
really trust? I don't know. Um Yeah, I'm
00:49:59
pretty stingy. But then then patients on
00:50:01
like uh it trains patients and they
00:50:03
don't expect uh more than 10 or so from
00:50:06
me.
00:50:07
>> Um biggest misunder Yeah, honestly, I
00:50:09
think it is that we see coughs and colds
00:50:11
every single day and that it is pretty
00:50:13
cruisy. Um if I had at least two coughs
00:50:18
or cold calls a day, I would be so
00:50:19
happy. Like I would get a mental break.
00:50:22
The general practice has changed so
00:50:25
much. Um just with I guess rise in in
00:50:30
the way the life stresses that we have
00:50:33
are causing such a rise in uh mental
00:50:35
health issues, anxiety and depression.
00:50:38
And so we see a lot of that, a lot of
00:50:41
complex things, you know, patients that
00:50:44
have five medical problems with 15
00:50:47
medications and and so we're dealing
00:50:49
with a lot more complexity um and things
00:50:52
that just need more than 15 minutes.
00:50:55
This is such an outdated way of
00:50:57
practicing. Um so I think that's what it
00:50:59
is is that actually we see so much more
00:51:02
complex things in such a small amount of
00:51:05
time. Um, and we're just trying to
00:51:07
trying to survive.
00:51:11
>> Yeah. How how do you manage that?
00:51:12
Because you have like 15 minute blocks
00:51:13
or 20-minute blocks or whatever they
00:51:14
are, and you you know, you can give
00:51:16
someone some advice in that time really,
00:51:18
but you can't you can't change their
00:51:20
entire life in that time, can you?
00:51:21
>> Exactly. That's got to be hard.
00:51:22
>> Yeah. Yeah. And I mean, we the the
00:51:25
reason why we're all running late is cuz
00:51:27
we try to. That's the issue is that, you
00:51:31
know, we have 15minute blocks back to
00:51:33
back. um by the time you've grabbed the
00:51:35
patient in 12 minutes has gone. Uh
00:51:38
you're down to 12 and then you you need
00:51:40
to be nice and how are you and how is
00:51:42
your day and you know if I met you a
00:51:44
year ago how are the kids and and then
00:51:47
you got 10 minutes. So it's um
00:51:50
impossible. It's not it's not safe. it
00:51:53
doesn't give us a lot of time to
00:51:56
practice I think the best medicine um
00:51:59
because you know a lot of the times I
00:52:02
think I hear a lot of they'll just give
00:52:04
you a tablet I'm sick of just getting a
00:52:05
medication or something like that um and
00:52:08
it's really mostly because we just don't
00:52:10
have time to go through anything else
00:52:13
through the good lifestyle stuff the
00:52:15
eating the sleeping seeing friends and
00:52:17
all of that good stuff all of that we
00:52:20
sort of just assume that this person
00:52:22
knows, okay, let's move on to the next
00:52:24
step because we only have six more
00:52:26
minutes uh to go through this and by the
00:52:28
way, they've got five more things on
00:52:29
their piece of paper to talk about. So,
00:52:32
it's um really high pressure in that
00:52:34
sort of way. Um and again, people are
00:52:37
struggling with uh finances and it's
00:52:39
hard to convince people to come back or
00:52:41
book longer. Um you know, the odd time I
00:52:45
and I understand that pressure. I
00:52:46
understand that it's hard. Uh but I
00:52:48
guess it's just that we the patient and
00:52:51
the doctor each need to have some
00:52:53
humanity and realize that you know this
00:52:56
is why the days are going late and we're
00:52:58
trying to give everyone an extra 5
00:53:00
minutes so by the lunchtime you are
00:53:03
going to be an hour late and it's just
00:53:06
yeah it's hard to do that.
00:53:08
>> Yeah, thanks for explaining that cuz I I
00:53:10
always wondered like if I've got a 9:30
00:53:12
appointment I'm like how can she be
00:53:13
running late?
00:53:14
>> That one is hard. That one's hard to
00:53:15
explain. Okay, that one is hard.
00:53:19
>> Um, what about burnout? [ __ ] it's it's
00:53:21
a lot. E, it's quite funny cuz I thought
00:53:23
GP would be a lot slower pace of life
00:53:25
than what Middlemore is. And I suppose
00:53:26
it is in some ways, but comes with its
00:53:28
own sets of challenges. Is burnout an
00:53:30
issue for
00:53:31
>> for you or your peers?
00:53:32
>> For definitely for for all of us um and
00:53:36
to because yes, we do we'll see 24
00:53:39
patients a day
00:53:40
>> which is a big turnover. Yeah. even in
00:53:42
hospital uh terms. And then in between
00:53:44
that there's, you know, I'm sure um
00:53:47
everyone who's listening has sent an
00:53:49
email to their doctor asking questions.
00:53:51
So in the in between those patients,
00:53:53
we're reading those and doing
00:53:54
prescriptions and looking at blood test
00:53:56
results and all of that stuff. Um so
00:53:59
it's it's burnout is happening more. I
00:54:02
see it more. I do I experience it at
00:54:04
least twice a year. Um but usually it
00:54:07
coincides with me going to a world
00:54:08
championship. So then I just go and lift
00:54:10
some heavy weights for a week in another
00:54:12
country and come back. Um but I think I
00:54:17
think I have been able to experience it
00:54:19
a little bit less because I have my
00:54:21
lifting. I've got that that massive
00:54:24
outlet. Um almost like other life that I
00:54:27
can just sort of like step out of GP,
00:54:30
step into this other role that's really
00:54:32
fun and cool.
00:54:34
>> Yeah. That must almost feel like like an
00:54:35
alter ego in a way.
00:54:37
>> Yeah. Yes. Like you put that belt on,
00:54:39
put the chalk on your hands, and you
00:54:40
become like a
00:54:41
>> absolutelyavage. Yeah. I'm sure my
00:54:43
teammates are listening to this like,
00:54:44
"Why is she talking so nice? She's like
00:54:47
not nice to us."
00:54:48
>> Really?
00:54:49
>> I'm not mean, but I'm I'm a I'm a hard
00:54:52
ass. Yeah. Training.
00:54:54
>> Hard ass to who? Uh so we have a club um
00:54:57
and we've got so I train with people who
00:55:00
also compete you know at um regional or
00:55:03
national level and they're range from
00:55:06
like 18 year olds to uh sort of 40 year
00:55:09
olds and so I you know I just I just
00:55:12
keep them to standard you know make sure
00:55:14
that they're yeah keep them honest. Do
00:55:17
you feel like um by the way we're going
00:55:20
to get to the sports stuff first, but
00:55:21
we've just got a couple more on the
00:55:22
academia side of things as your mom
00:55:24
would say. Um you do you think some of
00:55:27
your patients could do with some of that
00:55:28
sort of tough love that you do in the
00:55:30
gym?
00:55:30
>> Yeah. Yes. It's a balance. Um and I
00:55:35
>> I do give them some tough love. Um, one
00:55:39
of my patients introduced me, brought
00:55:41
his wife with him, and the way he
00:55:44
introduced me was, "This is my doctor.
00:55:46
She's really smiley, but she'll shoot
00:55:48
you."
00:55:51
I thought, "This is true. I won't shoot
00:55:54
you. I'll shoot you with the truth if
00:55:56
you need it."
00:55:56
>> Yeah. Yeah.
00:55:57
>> Wow. That's powerful. How How do you
00:56:00
handle um How do you handle it when you
00:56:01
suspect a patient isn't telling you the
00:56:03
truth or giving you the full picture? M
00:56:06
um sometimes you can it's like in a
00:56:10
you're an investigator. That's what I
00:56:11
like about my job too is kind of
00:56:14
>> you're interrogating people and trying
00:56:16
to make timelines fit and sometimes from
00:56:20
the investigation you can hear that
00:56:22
actually this doesn't really make sense
00:56:24
when I checked and you just ask again
00:56:26
and they kind of uh know that oh you've
00:56:29
asked a couple of times now I should
00:56:32
probably tell you the truth. Um, and
00:56:34
it's not that they're doing it in a um
00:56:37
sinister way. It's just that it's hard
00:56:40
to meet a stranger and tell them your
00:56:42
deepest, darkest secrets um within the
00:56:45
first 10 minutes of meeting that person.
00:56:48
So yeah, sometimes it just takes a few
00:56:51
uh consults to to get to it to build
00:56:54
that trust. But yeah, you you we almost
00:56:56
can't expect a patient to just give it
00:57:00
all to us because
00:57:01
>> because we're the doctor.
00:57:03
>> Also, I suppose sometimes like it's
00:57:05
embarrassing. There's a bit of shame
00:57:06
like you know you you don't want to
00:57:08
admit how much you're drinking or how
00:57:10
Yeah. what you're eating or Yeah. what
00:57:11
your diet looks like. It's embarrassing.
00:57:13
>> Exactly. And I think uh one of the
00:57:15
things I've learned is that you just
00:57:16
completely overshoot. So, how much do
00:57:18
you drink? A lot. What? Like five
00:57:20
bottles a day?
00:57:21
>> Oh, no. Not that much. Only three.
00:57:25
No, just two. Okay.
00:57:28
>> Oh, that's smart. That's smart. Um,
00:57:32
what recurring issues are you seeing
00:57:33
more lately in your patients physically
00:57:35
or mentally?
00:57:38
>> Yeah, a lot of anxiety. Lot of anxiety
00:57:40
and depression. I would have We're lucky
00:57:44
and a lot of us will have this is where
00:57:46
we can enroll patients into a program
00:57:48
where they get 30 minute free sessions.
00:57:50
So I will have maybe three or four of
00:57:52
those a day um to uh follow up people
00:57:56
with their depression and anxiety. Um
00:57:58
that's a huge one. And then uh to for
00:58:02
the sort of medical side of things,
00:58:05
diabetes and heart failure and blood
00:58:07
pressure and cholesterol issues, that's
00:58:10
sort of bread and butter GP stuff. Yeah.
00:58:13
A lot of Well, not that I am assessing
00:58:15
it. a lot of ADHD um and questions about
00:58:18
autism and uh people wondering about
00:58:21
that and that's that's hard too because
00:58:23
the access to being able to get the
00:58:25
answers to that questions is almost
00:58:27
non-existent
00:58:29
>> publicly for patients. So yeah, a lot of
00:58:32
mental mental health.
00:58:34
>> What's something um more people can do
00:58:36
to take better care of their health?
00:58:37
Something that you wish everyone knew.
00:58:38
Yeah, I think I wish everyone at school
00:58:43
or somewhere
00:58:45
learned what we know is the basics and
00:58:47
what you know is the basics, which would
00:58:50
be, you know,
00:58:51
>> how to sleep well, how to eat well, and
00:58:54
what does that look like? Because I get
00:58:56
some pretty like crazy answers when I
00:58:59
really try to get down to it with some
00:59:01
patients. You know, sometimes we'll go
00:59:03
through uh cholesterol and I'll be
00:59:06
asking about diet and what are you
00:59:08
eating and is there anything fried or
00:59:10
no, no, no, it's fine. It's fine. Uh do
00:59:12
you eat butter? No, no, no. I only cook
00:59:14
with it. So, you know, and everything's
00:59:18
cooked in butter. And and for them
00:59:20
that's better than uh margarine or olive
00:59:23
oil uh because they nobody taught them.
00:59:26
And I think that that gets missed a lot
00:59:28
in probably school is the best place to
00:59:32
get uh to get that knowledge from. But I
00:59:34
the basics of health and exercise,
00:59:37
strength exercise, I um talk about that
00:59:39
a lot with my patients if anytime it can
00:59:42
come up um for bone health, muscle
00:59:45
health and and mental health as well. So
00:59:48
the I wish people I wish there not that
00:59:51
it's the people's fault, but I wish
00:59:52
there was a way that people knew more
00:59:54
about the basics of lifestyle things
00:59:57
that they could do.
00:59:59
>> Um yeah,
01:00:03
>> why don't we have more knowledge? The
01:00:05
information is everywhere, right?
01:00:07
>> It's never been more accessible than
01:00:09
what it is now.
01:00:09
>> Yeah. There's too much information and
01:00:12
it's so hard to
01:00:13
>> it's really hard for patients to divvy
01:00:16
through all that information and know
01:00:19
what's
01:00:20
>> one person's conspiracy post about seed
01:00:24
oils um versus a um a uh evidence-based
01:00:30
fully qualified dietician's advice. So
01:00:32
yes, there is really good advice out
01:00:34
there, but it's um interpreting it and
01:00:37
that's what not many people know how to
01:00:40
do.
01:00:41
>> Is our health system broken in New
01:00:43
Zealand?
01:00:45
>> I Yes,
01:00:48
>> it it is. It's not working for our
01:00:50
patients. um it's not set up to
01:00:54
allow us to deliver timely health care
01:00:58
and because there's no time or there's
01:01:01
long wait lists then we can't deliver
01:01:03
the care that people deserve and we try
01:01:06
to with what we have but um there's a
01:01:10
there's a better way out there and there
01:01:12
are smart people smarter people than me
01:01:14
who are thinking about those ways but
01:01:17
you know in in GP itself the the model.
01:01:21
It It doesn't work and it's never going
01:01:23
to work. And um we're just trying to fit
01:01:26
as much as We're doing 10-minute
01:01:28
medicine basically, which is sounds
01:01:29
crazy.
01:01:31
>> Yeah, it's outrageous. It's like a speed
01:01:32
date.
01:01:33
>> Yeah, that's crazy. Exactly. You
01:01:36
wouldn't expect to know anything from a
01:01:38
speed date, but we Yeah. Somehow in
01:01:41
these uh 10 15 minutes, we I'll learn as
01:01:44
much as I can about about my patient. M.
01:01:47
So if the prime minister or the minister
01:01:49
of health was here right now and you had
01:01:50
like a minute with them, like what would
01:01:52
you what would be the point that you
01:01:53
want to emphasize? What would you want
01:01:54
to tell them?
01:01:54
>> Wow.
01:01:56
>> I think a big one that would target a
01:01:59
lot of areas is getting more doctors
01:02:03
graduated and and opening up those
01:02:05
seats. I would I would love for it not
01:02:08
to be this sort of like prestigious job
01:02:11
anymore and just get more people in. uh
01:02:15
you don't have to be like a rocket
01:02:17
scientist to understand medicine and
01:02:19
pattern recognition. A lot more people
01:02:21
can do this job than they allow uh
01:02:24
through university and I think that's
01:02:27
going to take a while to grow these
01:02:29
these doctors that we need
01:02:31
>> but we just need them. We need them so
01:02:33
badly.
01:02:35
>> Yeah. It's alarming, isn't it?
01:02:36
>> Yeah. I know. Do you have any thoughts
01:02:38
on on AI or is there any thoughts of AI
01:02:40
in medicine circles and the impact
01:02:41
that's potentially going to have for
01:02:43
good or for bad?
01:02:44
>> Yeah, I mean it's a I don't know if it's
01:02:46
in your practice, but um some of the
01:02:48
doctors in my practice use it just to
01:02:50
note. So, they don't really type notes
01:02:53
anymore. Uh AI is listening to the
01:02:55
consult and uh puts it in some kind of
01:02:58
report. Um so it's already being used in
01:03:01
that way to save time and the people who
01:03:03
use it feel a lot uh that they have more
01:03:07
time but also that the cognitive fatigue
01:03:10
is less is what is coming up that
01:03:13
because they don't have to process the
01:03:15
information twice um that the energy
01:03:18
levels are a little bit better um and so
01:03:20
then burnout is a bit better um but in
01:03:23
the hospital I'm sure there are many
01:03:25
many more ways that it can be used I
01:03:26
just don't know of them but that's how
01:03:28
we're using it in GP.
01:03:30
>> Well, it's an exciting time, eh? And if
01:03:32
it makes the health outcomes better for
01:03:34
people, it's got to be good in the long
01:03:35
run.
01:03:36
>> Yeah. And I guess, you know, one a big
01:03:39
thing that people talk about is when I
01:03:40
go to the doctor, they're just looking
01:03:41
and typing at the computer. And so, if
01:03:43
AI can be typing uh the notes out for
01:03:46
you, you actually get to see the
01:03:48
patient, the patient gets to see you.
01:03:50
>> And we've heard from patients that it's
01:03:51
a little bit awkward because I've never
01:03:53
seen you look at me so much. Um, but
01:03:56
that can only be good for for rapport.
01:03:59
>> Although, yeah, if you're talking about
01:04:00
um intensely personal stuff, sometimes
01:04:02
it's nice to have that conversation if
01:04:04
it's not direct eye contact.
01:04:05
>> Yeah,
01:04:05
>> it can be quite intimidating. Hey, um,
01:04:07
thanks for sharing all this stuff. We've
01:04:08
been going for over an hour now, and we
01:04:10
haven't even got to the um the sport
01:04:11
stuff.
01:04:12
>> Oh, cool.
01:04:12
>> It's all been academia.
01:04:14
>> Mom will be happy.
01:04:16
>> So, okay. So, so while you're at med
01:04:18
school, you're playing netball, you have
01:04:19
dreams of being a silver fern. Um, then
01:04:21
you realize that they just can't coexist
01:04:23
together because of your schedule.
01:04:26
and my height.
01:04:28
>> Yeah, you meet big one there. You meet
01:04:30
Tim George and you realize that yeah,
01:04:32
you're a shorty.
01:04:33
>> So why why powerlifting of everything
01:04:36
you could have done?
01:04:37
>> I so I just started going to the gym. So
01:04:40
I also never used to go to the gym
01:04:41
because when you're playing net ball and
01:04:43
you're in a few teams, you're just
01:04:44
training most days anyway. Um, so I
01:04:47
joined a gym uh in my first year at the
01:04:50
hospital and then I just sort of started
01:04:52
seeing uh on Instagram uh people women
01:04:57
squatting like 170 kilos, 180 kilos and
01:05:01
they looked really really strong and
01:05:03
they also were like super toned and like
01:05:05
ripped and I thought I want to look like
01:05:07
that. I want to be that strong. So, um,
01:05:10
I just got a PT to show me how to do the
01:05:13
movements and kind of just found out
01:05:15
that I was like naturally very strong.
01:05:18
Um,
01:05:19
>> what is that? Is that is that tongen
01:05:21
genetics?
01:05:22
>> I think Oh, I got to be careful with
01:05:24
that answer.
01:05:26
Both. It's both. It's tongen and moldy
01:05:28
genetics.
01:05:30
>> But I was thinking about it this morning
01:05:32
um when I had my run. Like I And I don't
01:05:35
know. I I don't know if this is right or
01:05:36
wrong, but no, like no one's naturally
01:05:38
born naturally strong. Or are they? Do
01:05:39
people just have natural strength?
01:05:41
>> I think definitely genetic and you see
01:05:43
that in across other countries as well,
01:05:45
but yes, uh Pacific Island Moldi is very
01:05:48
strong. Every time I talk about um the
01:05:52
powerlifting and hope that it gets to
01:05:54
the rest of New Zealand, I just have
01:05:56
this feeling that the the usurper is
01:05:59
listening and like they're going to come
01:06:01
and and and be as strong as I am in my
01:06:04
sport, which I welcome. Um but yeah, I
01:06:07
think it's it's a I think it's a Kiwi
01:06:08
thing, too.
01:06:10
>> Can you remember your first squat?
01:06:12
>> Yes.
01:06:12
>> What was it? Just the bar?
01:06:13
>> It was it was
01:06:14
>> 20 kilo bar.
01:06:16
>> Oh, just the bar. And then we worked up
01:06:18
to uh I think it was three a triple that
01:06:22
100. So that that was I thought that was
01:06:26
normal but my PT was like that's not
01:06:28
normal. Um that's pretty strong. You
01:06:31
should have a look at the sport. Um and
01:06:33
it just yeah went from there. As soon as
01:06:35
I started looking at the New Zealand
01:06:37
records in my head I was planning okay
01:06:41
I'm going to do this sport for a year
01:06:43
maybe two. um get top three in New
01:06:46
Zealand and then I'm going to do my GP
01:06:49
training and and that's it. That was a
01:06:50
fun time. So, it it didn't work out that
01:06:53
way. I'm glad.
01:06:54
>> So, did you get quite good quite
01:06:56
quickly?
01:06:56
>> Yes. Yeah. And and uh that kind of
01:06:59
happens to everyone. They at the
01:07:01
beginning, newbie gains, they're really
01:07:02
fun. Um you just get strong quickly the
01:07:05
more you train. Uh but it did take a
01:07:08
little while to get to to this level.
01:07:10
So, it still took maybe like four years
01:07:12
to get to the level I'm at.
01:07:14
>> And your first competition was in 2018.
01:07:17
>> Yes.
01:07:17
>> Yeah. What are your recollections of
01:07:18
that?
01:07:19
>> Ah, it was it was really nerve-wracking
01:07:21
because you come from team sport and
01:07:24
you're playing with your teammates and
01:07:26
there's the crowd is your family. So,
01:07:30
you don't get that stage fright type of
01:07:32
feeling. But in powerlifting, it's just
01:07:34
you in the center stage and the crowd is
01:07:37
in front of you. and me the crowd was
01:07:39
maybe 30 people, but it was still uh
01:07:42
really nerve-wracking to sort of think
01:07:44
you're getting on a stage in front of
01:07:46
people to perform. Um, but as soon as
01:07:50
you get your first squat, you get
01:07:51
addicted. You should do a competition.
01:07:53
>> Absolutely not. Absolutely not. I
01:07:55
haven't um I haven't I'm terrible with
01:07:57
leg day. I I have started doing um
01:07:59
strength and conditioning again to
01:08:02
>> um help with my running, but um
01:08:04
>> yeah, I can probably bench more than
01:08:06
what I could squat at the moment. Okay.
01:08:08
>> I um I got the highest I ever got I had
01:08:10
a personal trainer many years ago and um
01:08:11
he was big on legs. So I got up to three
01:08:14
three plates. So 140 kilos all up.
01:08:16
>> Nice.
01:08:17
>> Um I sh myself once.
01:08:20
>> Hey that's the commitment. Uh
01:08:23
>> have you ever done that? I push no like
01:08:26
on. So I got down parallel with the
01:08:28
floor and then getting back up again. I
01:08:29
pushed so hard like a a poo came out.
01:08:32
>> Well hey did you get make it all the way
01:08:34
up?
01:08:36
>> I did. That was the session over. So
01:08:38
then if I really want to get out of it,
01:08:39
that's what I got to do. I'm going to
01:08:41
[ __ ] myself.
01:08:42
>> There's a I on a regular basis talk to
01:08:45
patients about poo. So this is fine.
01:08:47
>> Yeah, you're okay with it. It's not your
01:08:49
first rodeo. Do you remember? Yeah. What
01:08:51
do you So um before you like when you're
01:08:53
in a competition, what do you do? Like
01:08:54
um you hype do you listen to music to
01:08:56
hype yourself up? Yeah.
01:08:57
>> What's your pre-lift routine? M. So, you
01:09:01
are there's warm-ups obviously out back
01:09:04
and it's kind of a funny um sport where
01:09:06
because you have it's weight class based
01:09:08
and you have to make weight um you are
01:09:12
weight cutting and then you have like a
01:09:14
one and a half hour window to rehydrate
01:09:17
and and get some food in and and warm up
01:09:20
for your your first squat. So the it's I
01:09:23
used to really enjoy that part was just
01:09:26
eating food and drinking um electrolytes
01:09:29
or energy drinks um before you warm up
01:09:32
and uh then yeah there's hype music
01:09:35
playing uh in in your earphones and
01:09:38
you're kind of just some people uh want
01:09:40
to talk and um have fun and things. I'm
01:09:43
I'm less the fun talkative type and more
01:09:46
the like get out of my face just tell me
01:09:48
what I need to lift type. Um, so yeah,
01:09:51
that's that's how how I lift and uh
01:09:54
yeah,
01:09:55
>> game face on.
01:09:56
>> Game face.
01:09:57
>> What What are you listening to? JLo. You
01:09:59
like JLo, right?
01:10:00
>> JLo. Uh, maybe in general I like JLo,
01:10:03
but um for
01:10:06
we go like a little bit meaner for um
01:10:08
for competitions. At first it
01:10:11
controversial, but it was a lot of DMX
01:10:13
um in the beginning and then it kind of
01:10:15
just changes as competition goes by.
01:10:17
like you might have a song that makes
01:10:19
you feel a certain way and can help you
01:10:21
emotionally get to that spot. Um, so
01:10:25
yeah. Yeah, it changes all the time, but
01:10:27
uh the better the noise cancelling
01:10:29
headphones the the the better.
01:10:32
>> And then like do you have like steps
01:10:34
that you go through in your head when
01:10:36
you go out to the bar or like what are
01:10:37
you what are you focusing on? You
01:10:38
focusing on your breathing like do you
01:10:41
have um like statements that you're
01:10:42
repeating to yourself?
01:10:44
>> Yeah. when you're new there that's going
01:10:46
through your head a lot you know you're
01:10:48
trying to remember the calls that you
01:10:51
have to listen to and sort of you're
01:10:53
trying to create your I guess your flow
01:10:56
uh now I don't really think about
01:10:58
anything um because it's just it is flow
01:11:02
basically and there's not a lot of
01:11:04
thinking going on but when uh things are
01:11:07
on the line championships or podium
01:11:10
places again back to the uh positive
01:11:13
selft talk a lot of affirmations going
01:11:15
on and right before going on that there
01:11:18
may be something um this year I at
01:11:21
Sheffield it was my third Sheffield and
01:11:23
I uh came second and so before that was
01:11:27
before that final deadlift was uh I just
01:11:30
kept saying like it's my time it's my
01:11:32
time it's my time it's my time and I'll
01:11:34
just keep saying it until I get to that
01:11:36
bar um so yeah positive stuff
01:11:39
>> that's so cool I I um read an interview
01:11:42
with you um way back and uh at this
01:11:45
point you'd go to the bar and you'd you
01:11:46
look at the bar and you'd say you're
01:11:47
mine.
01:11:48
>> Yes. Yeah. I still do. Yeah. You're mine
01:11:52
or fight or Yeah. You're mine. That's a
01:11:55
that's a a common one.
01:11:57
>> Um what about drug testing? Is drug
01:11:59
testing big in your sport?
01:12:00
>> Massive.
01:12:01
>> Are drugs ripen the sport?
01:12:03
>> Not in our uh federation. So we are drug
01:12:07
tested federation, a part of drug-free
01:12:08
sport New Zealand. Um, and I get tested
01:12:11
in and out of competition. Like they
01:12:13
knock on my door at 6 in the morning and
01:12:15
get me to pee. So, they are very drug
01:12:18
tested. Um, but there's other uh
01:12:21
federations that are not drug tested and
01:12:23
you'll probably be able to tell um uh a
01:12:26
difference. Um, so yes, in our
01:12:30
federation, super drug test controlled
01:12:32
and um people get very angry if anyone
01:12:36
tests uh positive, which
01:12:38
>> yeah, rightfully so. It almost never
01:12:39
happens with people at the top. It's
01:12:41
kind of always people I don't know out
01:12:43
of the top 10.
01:12:45
>> Do you remember your first um drug test?
01:12:47
That must be quite confrontational.
01:12:48
>> It was so confrontational. It was so I
01:12:51
was not expecting it because you know
01:12:54
with for people who don't know they need
01:12:56
to see your urine leave your body. So
01:12:59
that's how close up and and personal it
01:13:01
has to be. And that's it's really hard
01:13:04
to be in front of somebody. So the
01:13:06
process can take ages. Um, but at least
01:13:10
you know that this is the standard that
01:13:12
is being tested and you can feel very
01:13:14
safe that people you're going against
01:13:16
aren't cheating.
01:13:18
>> And you you're probably in a position um
01:13:20
I mean you deal with feces and urine all
01:13:22
the time in your line of work. So it's
01:13:24
probably less foreign to you than what
01:13:26
it is for some other people. But it's
01:13:27
still awkward, right?
01:13:28
>> Yeah, it's still awkward.
01:13:30
>> So there's a lady in the room with you.
01:13:31
Yes. So you're just sitting on a toilet
01:13:33
>> and they're and if it's a little
01:13:34
cubicle, they're literally like right
01:13:36
here just watching.
01:13:38
>> I could never I couldn't go.
01:13:39
>> You couldn't?
01:13:40
>> I could never go in that environment.
01:13:41
>> It's really really hard. Yeah. Yeah.
01:13:43
It's so hard to um to stage fright um to
01:13:49
pee in front of somebody and it is just
01:13:51
it is so awkward cuz they just like you
01:13:53
know like hold everything up and and
01:13:55
keep everything out of the way and it's
01:13:57
like okay hi what's your name again?
01:14:01
It's awkward because they're just doing
01:14:02
a job as well. They don't want to watch
01:14:04
someone pee. They're just doing a job.
01:14:06
>> And I think they're they usually this is
01:14:09
sort of like a casual job for them too.
01:14:11
Like they they have normal jobs during
01:14:13
the day and then they just uh sign up to
01:14:15
do these tests every now and then. So
01:14:17
they are really just normal people.
01:14:20
>> Yeah. So what does your diet look like?
01:14:21
So at at the point where we're recording
01:14:23
this, you're two weeks out from a
01:14:25
competition.
01:14:26
>> Um is this like an intense diet stage? M
01:14:30
it is maybe the uh it's different for
01:14:33
everyone. I'm lucky that I sit fairly
01:14:36
close to my weight class. So 2 3 months
01:14:39
out is just pretty um boring and clean
01:14:43
in the way that there's enough protein
01:14:45
and carbs for fueling yourself. There's
01:14:48
not a lot of fats. And then you know on
01:14:50
the weekend there is treat meal. Um and
01:14:54
that's competition. So it's for me it's
01:14:56
a it's pretty standard. I've done it for
01:14:58
years. It's It's normal. And usually
01:15:00
it's the people around me who care more
01:15:02
that I'm not like having a piece of cake
01:15:04
or whatever. I I do uh look forward to
01:15:08
the day where I can just do that.
01:15:11
>> So So like an average day of eating.
01:15:14
>> Yeah. What does it look like?
01:15:15
>> Yeah. So um in the morning I would have
01:15:18
like two eggs, three toast, honey on one
01:15:21
toast, and coffee. And then I'd have
01:15:23
protein yogurt and protein powder and
01:15:26
fruits for snack. And then lunch and
01:15:28
dinner is very much the same. There'd be
01:15:29
a meat, veggies, lots of veggies, and um
01:15:33
and a carb like potato or something like
01:15:35
that.
01:15:36
>> And then um my snacks are basically the
01:15:38
same, but it's the same every day. I I'm
01:15:41
a creature of habit. I love routine and
01:15:43
I don't get bored of of the food that I
01:15:46
eat every single day, which helps a lot.
01:15:48
Um, yeah, it's just it's pretty easy for
01:15:51
me to do. Yeah. But the sport, you know,
01:15:54
with this sport, there's not a lot of
01:15:56
calorie burning in it. You know, we
01:15:57
train for hours at a time, but we're
01:16:00
quite literally just building muscle and
01:16:02
getting inflamed. And so, it's not like
01:16:04
a sport maybe like running or CrossFit
01:16:07
where you have to really refuel a lot
01:16:10
cuz actually the my expenditure is not
01:16:13
that big.
01:16:15
>> And in terms of that treat meal or treat
01:16:16
day you're talking about,
01:16:17
>> Yeah. What's that?
01:16:18
>> I would I like to we like to cook so
01:16:21
we'll usually cook something and then at
01:16:22
least that way I kind of know what's
01:16:24
going on. So it would change like we
01:16:26
might make ribs or might make a brisket
01:16:28
or um burgers and yeah. So uh I love
01:16:32
food.
01:16:34
>> So um we're doing this podcast in a
01:16:36
morning in the morning on a Friday. Uh
01:16:38
you're at the gym this afternoon.
01:16:40
>> What would that session this afternoon
01:16:41
look like? Like how many hours are you
01:16:42
going to be there? Yeah, I will be there
01:16:45
for maybe four and a half hours um
01:16:47
today.
01:16:49
>> Wow. Um yes, today is a heavy day, so
01:16:52
I've got a heavy squat and heavy bench
01:16:54
session and it just takes a lot longer
01:16:57
to warm up to sort of those 200 kilo um
01:17:01
areas and it just it takes a bit of time
01:17:03
and and rest. Um it doesn't feel like
01:17:07
four hours, but by the time you get to
01:17:09
sort of 6:37 and you you left home at 1,
01:17:12
you're sort of like, "Oh my god, I'm
01:17:15
still here.
01:17:17
>> It's such a sacrifice."
01:17:18
>> E
01:17:19
>> like in terms of the training, like it's
01:17:21
it's massive. It's a massive commitment.
01:17:23
>> Yeah.
01:17:23
>> So So you go to the gym, so say a 4-hour
01:17:26
session or whatever it happens to be
01:17:28
today. So your first lift, what is it
01:17:30
like a a real light set to begin with?
01:17:32
How
01:17:33
>> light? Yeah. I'll start with the bar. I
01:17:34
always start with the bar just to uh you
01:17:37
know I guess it's more of a practice and
01:17:40
keeping things uh the same. Um and then
01:17:43
you go like bar 70 kilos, 100 kilos, 130
01:17:48
kilos. Um and then you jump maybe 15 to
01:17:51
20 kilos until you get to 170 and then
01:17:54
slow it down a bit um from there. You're
01:17:57
just doing one rep on each of those or
01:18:00
>> uh maybe for today because it's a heavy
01:18:03
I'll do maybe three or four reps until I
01:18:05
get to uh 180. I might do two and then
01:18:08
I'll slow it down um to match whatever
01:18:10
I'm about to do. Um but yeah, uh
01:18:14
it's pretty taxing pretty taxing on the
01:18:17
body. Um, I always feel bad because
01:18:20
there's a lot of rest time and I never
01:18:22
used to feel bad because I was at a
01:18:24
private gym, but now I feel I'm like,
01:18:27
are people watching me and wondering why
01:18:29
I'm just sitting down doing uh
01:18:31
supposedly nothing? Um, but there I
01:18:34
promise I'm lifting weights.
01:18:36
>> How long how long is the break between
01:18:38
>> Yeah, I tr I keep a timer now because
01:18:40
I'm so aware, but like 3 minutes.
01:18:44
>> Oh, that's not bad. I've done I've done
01:18:46
longer at jets like I'll do a set very
01:18:49
light weights, mind you. And then I'll
01:18:50
just sit there and scroll on my phone
01:18:52
for 15 minutes.
01:18:53
>> Oh, 15 minutes. Okay. Well, heavies.
01:18:55
Yes. When I'm working up to a heavy,
01:18:57
like 10 minutes, probably.
01:19:00
>> I reckon other people would be looking
01:19:01
like, "God, she's hogging all these
01:19:03
weights and she's just sitting there."
01:19:06
>> Probably just hogging the area. Really?
01:19:07
Just hogging that corner. I've got
01:19:09
because, you know, my gym bag is like
01:19:11
this huge and it's full of all my
01:19:13
equipment and gear and Yeah. I I mean I
01:19:16
also don't really tell people that who I
01:19:20
like that I have a world championship or
01:19:23
two titles. So I I sometimes wonder if
01:19:26
they're sort of like why does she have
01:19:27
so many things like why is she just
01:19:29
doing this for a gym session? But they
01:19:31
could also just not be thinking about me
01:19:33
at all.
01:19:34
>> Do you when you've got a heavy lifting
01:19:35
day like uh today do you get anxious
01:19:38
beforehand? Like are you nervous
01:19:39
thinking about it now?
01:19:40
>> Yeah, I get um excited. I I I just
01:19:45
really love lifting heavy weights and I
01:19:48
love the the thought of, you know, what
01:19:50
could I do today? What can I what am I
01:19:52
going to lift today? What's do I hope
01:19:54
that I can lift today? Um so I get
01:19:57
really excited and I sort of spend the
01:19:59
whole day just kind of trying to prepare
01:20:01
for it. Um whether that be like rolling
01:20:04
out on the floor and stretching and just
01:20:07
making sure that I really did sleep well
01:20:09
the night before and I'm just trying to
01:20:11
line my whole life up for this one heavy
01:20:14
session.
01:20:14
>> Wow. And do your patients know what you
01:20:17
do?
01:20:18
>> Some of them do. Yeah. My my my regulars
01:20:21
know. Um mostly like my elderly patients
01:20:24
because they're so interested to know
01:20:26
and and more about you know their
01:20:28
doctor. And so yeah, we've had a lot of
01:20:30
hugs and a lot of celebrations the the
01:20:33
last couple of weeks um because I would
01:20:35
have seen them before Worlds and then
01:20:37
now they want to know what happened. So
01:20:38
they do know but I think then also a lot
01:20:41
will be like
01:20:42
>> oh my god I didn't know that she did
01:20:44
that.
01:20:45
>> That's why I can never get in to see
01:20:46
her.
01:20:48
>> Yeah. Is your work quite good? Like at
01:20:50
the moment because you've got a big
01:20:51
competition coming up you're down to two
01:20:53
days a week. Is your work quite
01:20:55
understanding supportive?
01:20:57
>> Absolutely. like very understanding. Um,
01:21:00
and that's just a part of why I love
01:21:03
working there. And they would be the
01:21:04
same for any anyone else. They're really
01:21:07
understanding with family commitments
01:21:09
for the other GPS um, and for me. And I
01:21:12
think it's just that it's so hard to to
01:21:14
to get GPS at the moment. And so I don't
01:21:17
think it's selfish of them, but I I do
01:21:19
think they want to make sure that we're
01:21:21
happy and want to stay working there. So
01:21:24
if you cut back to two days a week, um
01:21:26
you only get paid for the the two. Yeah.
01:21:28
>> Yeah.
01:21:30
>> Massive sacrifices you're making, eh,
01:21:32
>> for this for for this um for the sport
01:21:34
where there's no sort of real financial
01:21:37
incentive to speak on.
01:21:39
>> Yeah. Yeah. I think it's more like I
01:21:42
feel I don't feel like I'm sacrificing
01:21:45
things, but more that I'm just giving
01:21:47
extra things to be able to do um to be
01:21:51
able to pursue this because it's it's
01:21:54
pretty rare that anyone in their life
01:21:57
gets to pursue a world title in
01:22:00
anything. And I think more than
01:22:02
anything, I feel really privileged that
01:22:04
I have a job that would allow me to save
01:22:08
up enough to take 6 months of less work
01:22:11
and not, you know, completely um well,
01:22:14
not go into any debt or not worry too
01:22:17
much about money um and actually just do
01:22:20
this for six months. So I think it's
01:22:22
more of you know I I give a lot but then
01:22:25
I get a lot back and because of you know
01:22:28
the privilege that I have.
01:22:30
>> Yeah. Even though it's very much a a
01:22:33
niche and minority sport. What's that
01:22:35
like the first time you represent your
01:22:37
country?
01:22:37
>> Yeah. It's amazing. You know it's Kiwi
01:22:41
sport kids always want to wear the fern.
01:22:43
Like we just grow up wanting to wear the
01:22:45
fern and so obsessed with a fern. Um,
01:22:48
and so the first time I got my uniform,
01:22:50
we have, I think, the best powerlifting
01:22:52
uniform. So, it's a just this big fern
01:22:54
across um, our suits, I I just felt so
01:22:57
proud. And the first time I got to wear
01:22:59
it was in New Zealand um, at a
01:23:01
Commonwealth Championship. And so, that
01:23:04
was extremely special. Um, there's a lot
01:23:07
in our sport, a lot of like t-shirt
01:23:09
swapping and suit swapping and it's
01:23:11
taken me so long to be able to get to
01:23:13
that place because I just even though I
01:23:15
have so many of them, I just they're
01:23:16
mine. Like I I wanted to wear it for so
01:23:20
long and I work so hard for it. I find
01:23:22
it so hard to think about switching,
01:23:24
>> you know. Oh, I've had I haven't had him
01:23:26
on the podcast. He'd be a dream guest,
01:23:28
though. But I believe Richie McCo was
01:23:30
like that. Apparently, he was a real
01:23:31
real Scrooge with his jerseys. Really?
01:23:33
>> Like swapping jerseys with opponents.
01:23:35
Yeah, he like ended up with like 148 of
01:23:37
them. Chill out, Richie. Oh, you're the
01:23:40
same. E, that's so funny.
01:23:41
>> Yeah, I just like I when I watch it and
01:23:44
I watch people switching, I'm like,
01:23:46
that's so cool. And then people ask me,
01:23:48
I'm like, I so sorry. Like I just I this
01:23:53
year was the first time I did it and and
01:23:55
I'm I'm glad I did. I gave it to two
01:23:57
amazing amazing uh strong women and I'll
01:24:00
probably wear one of their suits today
01:24:01
at my squat um session, but it took me a
01:24:04
long time.
01:24:06
>> Why why is the sport not um an Olympic
01:24:09
or come with game sport?
01:24:10
>> I'm not actually sure. I know they've
01:24:12
been trying for the longest time. I have
01:24:14
no idea why, but I think we're closer
01:24:16
than ever with um being a part of the
01:24:18
World Games to getting into the
01:24:20
Olympics. Um but yeah, I might have to
01:24:23
be a cheerleader for one of my other
01:24:25
friends uh by that time.
01:24:26
>> Yeah. Would you be keen to once your
01:24:28
time's up, will you be keen to stay in
01:24:29
the sport as like a coach or a mentor or
01:24:31
something? Do you think lifting will
01:24:33
always be a part of your life? Yeah, I
01:24:34
think in some shape or form uh fitness
01:24:37
will always be a part of my life and so
01:24:38
strength will always be a part and I
01:24:41
have my best friend is still up and
01:24:44
coming in the sport and so I think if we
01:24:46
get to the Olympics she's going to go
01:24:48
and then I'll just be just uh
01:24:51
>> be a carry-on luggage with her so that I
01:24:53
can go too.
01:24:55
>> Yeah, strength training is good. E is it
01:24:57
something that you try and like bang
01:24:58
into your patients?
01:25:00
>> Yeah. um if it comes up um straight in
01:25:03
there, you know, we're both doing like
01:25:05
body weightight squats and showing them
01:25:07
how to do it. And especially with my
01:25:09
elderly patients, um I have I inherited
01:25:13
a few who already go to the gym and so
01:25:15
it's really cool to um introduce new
01:25:17
exercises to them or talk to them about
01:25:19
their training. Um, I think strength
01:25:22
training is, you know, not it's
01:25:25
competitive for me, but in life, and I
01:25:28
see it every day, you know, when I go to
01:25:30
get my 80-year-old patient, and if they
01:25:32
can get out of their chair without
01:25:34
pushing, holy moly, that's amazing, you
01:25:36
know, that's amazing strength. And
01:25:38
that's probably somebody who has in some
01:25:40
shape or form been uh been exercising or
01:25:43
doing weights. And then maybe I see
01:25:47
someone who's a bit younger and that
01:25:49
it's really hard for them to get out of
01:25:51
the chair. Um, those are the things that
01:25:54
I see in strength that maybe people who
01:25:56
are just going to the gym might not
01:25:58
realize that that's what you're setting
01:26:00
yourself up for is for when you're 70,
01:26:02
80, you are walking fine. You're able to
01:26:06
be functional and you're able to lift
01:26:08
things and do things.
01:26:09
>> Yeah. There's this um incredible book I
01:26:11
like. It's by a guy called Dr. Peter
01:26:13
Aier called outlive
01:26:15
>> and it's basically that it's a really
01:26:16
long book but in a nutshell it's about
01:26:18
reverse engineering aging.
01:26:19
>> So he his sort of take is if you're 70
01:26:22
and you see yourself traveling somewhere
01:26:24
and you want to be able to put a 15 kilo
01:26:26
suitcase in an overhead carrier then
01:26:27
when you're 40 or 50 you need to be
01:26:29
doing a lot more than that because it's
01:26:31
it's going to decline.
01:26:32
>> Absolutely. Absolutely. He's like, if
01:26:33
you want to be um you know, sightseeing
01:26:35
around Croatia, the old town of Croatia
01:26:37
in your 60s or 70s, then you're going to
01:26:39
have to be able to run or walk like 10
01:26:41
kilometers when you're 30, 40, 50,
01:26:43
whatever it is.
01:26:44
>> Exactly.
01:26:44
>> It's a really good way of looking at it.
01:26:45
But um yeah,
01:26:47
>> cuz there' be nothing worse than being
01:26:48
old and being trapped in a body that
01:26:50
that you can't do the things you want it
01:26:52
to do.
01:26:52
>> Yeah. And it's really it is really
01:26:54
really sad. And you know, and my
01:26:56
patients share that with me, you know,
01:26:58
they always say, "Don't get old." And
01:26:59
I'm like, "Oh."
01:27:01
when they're struggling to get old. Yes.
01:27:05
Exactly. And they're showing me the
01:27:07
importance of how do you want to get
01:27:09
old? Um and so yeah, I talk to them
01:27:12
about strength a lot.
01:27:13
>> Yeah.
01:27:15
>> What are your big goals in the sport
01:27:16
before you're done?
01:27:17
>> Yeah.
01:27:20
I I feel like I came in like hard and
01:27:22
fast and then I did a whole bunch of
01:27:24
things really quickly and so sort of
01:27:26
three and a half years at the top level
01:27:30
has felt like maybe six years. So I feel
01:27:32
like I've been in it longer than I
01:27:34
actually have. I have two world titles,
01:27:36
one second. Um a big goal was to get on
01:27:40
the podium at Sheffield. You know that
01:27:42
podium is
01:27:44
taken from 12 female champions. So that
01:27:46
podium is important. um world games. I
01:27:49
would love to podium and get one of
01:27:50
their massive Olympic looking um uh
01:27:54
medals and then we've got Sheffield in
01:27:57
in January again. And I just take it
01:28:00
comp by comp. Every year I I'm like,
01:28:02
"Okay, I'm going to take it easy now."
01:28:04
And then the drive just keeps turning up
01:28:07
and I'm like, "Oh gosh, I it just
01:28:09
doesn't uh it's not stopping at the
01:28:12
moment." M
01:28:13
>> does it piss you off that you're not a
01:28:14
bigger deal in New Zealand
01:28:16
>> like that this I suppose the sport or
01:28:18
you as an individual with your
01:28:20
achievements doesn't get
01:28:22
>> like more of a light a light shone on it
01:28:24
>> I I really wish that we were a bigger
01:28:27
deal and I mean I'm I'm one world
01:28:30
champion we have another female world
01:28:31
champion in New Zealand Eevee Coran and
01:28:34
and and so yeah people just don't know
01:28:36
but the more I actually listen to sort
01:28:38
of like your podcast or sports oh sorry
01:28:41
sports podcasts I the more I realized
01:28:43
there are a lot of Kiwi World
01:28:44
Championships like in snowboarding and
01:28:47
uh in cycling uh not not Olympic cycling
01:28:50
BMX um just so many that I'd never heard
01:28:53
of and so it kind of makes me feel like
01:28:55
oh okay
01:28:56
>> they're famous overseas uh
01:28:59
>> famous in their own sort of like ecos
01:29:01
and that's one thing I I love about this
01:29:03
platform and doing this podcast like
01:29:05
I've got um episodes coming up with um
01:29:07
Courtney Duncan who's uh like from um
01:29:09
the South Island and she's like one of
01:29:11
the world's top motocross champs. Yes.
01:29:13
>> Um she reached out to me about coming on
01:29:14
the podcast and you do the research and
01:29:16
it's like she's a big [ __ ] deal
01:29:18
>> and you know most people would not have
01:29:20
heard of her. Same as Nico Pius got an
01:29:21
episode with him coming up and he's won
01:29:23
like a couple of uh you know winter
01:29:25
winter gold Olympic medals and most
01:29:28
people probably aren't familiar with the
01:29:29
name and it's um it's nice to have this
01:29:31
platform where you can give these people
01:29:33
a bit of attention. Oh, well, we
01:29:34
appreciate it so much that you do
01:29:36
because you're I see you as mainstream
01:29:38
and the the reach that you have with the
01:29:40
the guests that you've already have and
01:29:42
then to get people like me and like
01:29:44
those two that you just mentioned on can
01:29:46
only be good for our sports to help them
01:29:48
grow. I mean, New Zealanders are so
01:29:50
talented, you know, whether you're like
01:29:52
Kiwi born uh Pacific Island Moldi, I
01:29:55
think we're very we punch above our
01:29:58
weights in in many uh rooms that we
01:30:00
enter.
01:30:00
>> Yeah, 100%. Yeah, there's um that's the
01:30:03
thing. just highlights just how many how
01:30:04
many New Zealanders there are out there
01:30:07
doing epic stuff. Yes.
01:30:08
>> And it's really cool. Although you're
01:30:09
only here today because your mom made me
01:30:11
do it.
01:30:14
>> Hey.
01:30:15
>> No, I'm kidding. Um Yeah. What is um
01:30:19
just this is a more broader answer to do
01:30:21
with like every aspect of your life, but
01:30:23
what does success look like to you now?
01:30:25
>> Not to others, but to you.
01:30:26
>> Yeah.
01:30:28
Oh. Um,
01:30:31
I guess success
01:30:35
at a in a broader sense to me is being
01:30:38
able to get yourself into a position
01:30:42
where you can truly do things that you
01:30:45
love and enjoy. Not because you have to,
01:30:48
but because maybe the work that you've
01:30:50
put in and the luck that you've had
01:30:52
before has gotten you to a space where
01:30:54
you can take 6 months of less work and
01:30:57
pursue a side passion and make that an
01:31:00
athlete career for a little bit. I'm so
01:31:03
aware that just so many people cannot do
01:31:06
that. And I think that that has brought
01:31:08
me so much joy and um and filled my cup
01:31:13
so much that I've been able to do that.
01:31:15
I think that's the the successful part
01:31:18
of of my story is getting to a place
01:31:20
where I can do things that I really want
01:31:22
to do and I enjoy.
01:31:25
>> I love that. And you got such a
01:31:27
supportive partner and supportive
01:31:28
parents as we've mentioned more than
01:31:30
once.
01:31:32
>> Um what about your mental health? How's
01:31:33
your mental health been? I I know you've
01:31:35
dealt with some burnout over the years.
01:31:36
>> Yeah. Mostly good.
01:31:38
>> Mostly good. Yeah. I think um it's very
01:31:42
human to go through phases of periods
01:31:45
where anxiety levels are higher or sleep
01:31:48
is not good because something in your
01:31:50
life is not going well. And I think
01:31:52
that's very human to experience those
01:31:54
things. I've been really fortunate to
01:31:55
not experience prolonged uh levels of
01:31:58
anxiety or or low mood. Um but
01:32:03
>> uh I think yeah, thanks mom and dad.
01:32:05
like the stuff that they taught me as a
01:32:07
kid uh unknowingly is what is what kept
01:32:10
me um from not experiencing those things
01:32:13
for too long and being able to use some
01:32:15
coping mechanisms to come out the other
01:32:17
side. But I'm so aware of it because I
01:32:20
see it in in my work and I see it every
01:32:22
day.
01:32:23
>> Yeah.
01:32:23
>> Yeah.
01:32:24
>> Yeah. Um Yeah. Is there anything you
01:32:26
still struggle with today that people
01:32:28
probably assume you've overcome?
01:32:33
Um
01:32:35
I think
01:32:38
in well something like nothing is
01:32:40
perfect. My life is not perfect. It's
01:32:42
been really good.
01:32:43
>> Um but the the line of work that we're
01:32:47
in there's a lot of giving and a lot of
01:32:50
empathy and a lot of compassion and
01:32:52
understanding and and even just wanting
01:32:54
to know about your patients. And
01:32:56
sometimes that can really empty the tank
01:32:58
for the rest of your your the other
01:33:01
parts of your life. And so I know that
01:33:04
there are other part in when I'm not at
01:33:06
work, it's not as easy actually for me
01:33:09
to be really empathetic or maybe ask how
01:33:12
someone is feeling. Um because it almost
01:33:15
switched off when I left work because I
01:33:18
needed to leave all of that that weight
01:33:21
at work. And so it's not as easy to step
01:33:24
back into any type of role like that in
01:33:27
my usual life. So I think that's when I
01:33:30
when I said that my teammates might
01:33:32
think I'm a hard ass that that's where
01:33:34
it is coming from. And my family too, I
01:33:37
think my family too would probably um
01:33:40
understand that. So that's an area I
01:33:42
need to work on is how can I brings that
01:33:44
empathy and compassion and communication
01:33:47
um into my life.
01:33:50
>> It's hard. I I genuinely believe we we
01:33:52
save our worst behavior for the people
01:33:54
that we love the most because, you know,
01:33:55
they're always going to be there.
01:33:57
>> But yeah, your um your boyfriend, he
01:34:00
must be like third third cab off the
01:34:01
rank. You know, there's the energy that
01:34:04
you're expending with your job
01:34:06
>> um and with your workouts and then when
01:34:08
you when you get home, it's like
01:34:10
>> Yeah.
01:34:10
>> I'm just out of words.
01:34:11
>> Yeah. Yeah. And it's you have to be so
01:34:14
aware of it and so effortful in just
01:34:18
starting the conversation cuz once you
01:34:20
once you start it then then it flows.
01:34:22
But it's an effort like you it's not
01:34:26
>> a good effort a good investment. Um but
01:34:29
it just doesn't flow as easy as it does
01:34:31
at work for some reason.
01:34:33
>> Yeah, for sure. Well, I suppose at work
01:34:34
you just switched on. It's what you have
01:34:36
to do.
01:34:36
>> Yeah. Yeah.
01:34:37
>> What are your best and worst habits? Um
01:34:41
I think uh best habit, best habit.
01:34:45
Um
01:34:46
>> I I can think of many possibilities like
01:34:49
drive, discipline, commitment.
01:34:52
>> Oh, right.
01:34:53
>> I don't know. I don't want to put words
01:34:54
in your mouth.
01:34:54
>> I mean that Yeah. I think uh maybe the
01:34:56
best habit is when of consistency.
01:35:00
um when I pick something up, uh being
01:35:04
consistent in carrying it through and uh
01:35:08
not just dropping it off because you
01:35:11
didn't get the result straight away. Uh
01:35:14
I think anything that you do
01:35:16
>> to get an outcome, you need to be
01:35:18
consistent with things. And that's huge
01:35:19
in powerlifting is consistency. Uh when
01:35:22
you don't feel motivated, consistency
01:35:24
will get you through training. Um,
01:35:26
sometimes there is no drive, but if
01:35:27
you're consistent, you're going to
01:35:28
training anyway. So, I think that's um
01:35:31
my biggest uh probably one of my biggest
01:35:34
um habits, best habits. Yeah.
01:35:36
>> Consistency and hard work. Hey, they're
01:35:38
so underrated as far as superpowers go.
01:35:41
>> Yes. Yeah,
01:35:42
>> they really are. What about worst habit?
01:35:44
>> Worst habit.
01:35:47
>> Um, what's my worst habit?
01:35:49
>> What would your mom say? Nothing.
01:35:50
There's nothing.
01:35:51
>> Nothing. Absolutely. been perfect. No.
01:35:55
Um maybe that I am a bit tough. I think
01:35:58
so. Maybe I'm a bit tough on people.
01:36:01
Yes, I can be. I can be. Yeah. Yeah.
01:36:05
>> In all aspects of your life
01:36:07
>> in in varying ways. Yeah. So, uh it can
01:36:12
help at work to be a bit tough on
01:36:14
people. Um, but like you said, you save
01:36:16
your worst habits for the people closest
01:36:18
to you. And
01:36:19
>> I can I can be tough on on the people
01:36:23
closest to me. And sometimes they just
01:36:25
might want uh support and they maybe
01:36:27
they did not want a solution or they
01:36:29
didn't want uh uh an opinion.
01:36:32
>> Are you a fixer?
01:36:34
>> You're a fixer. Someone comes to you
01:36:36
with a problem and they may just want
01:36:37
like an ear to listen to that you Okay.
01:36:40
>> Sometimes. Yeah. I feel like I I feel
01:36:42
like that's mainly a guy thing. Guys
01:36:45
want to be like a fixer. Like it seems
01:36:47
sometimes your partner or whoever it
01:36:49
happens to be just wants, you know,
01:36:50
wants you to be there to listen.
01:36:51
>> Yeah. Yeah. So I've caught myself
01:36:53
recently just I want to say something
01:36:56
and then I'm thinking, no, they don't
01:36:57
want to fix this. They just want to be
01:37:00
heard. So zip it.
01:37:03
>> Um and if you had to think of three
01:37:05
words that um family or friends would
01:37:07
use to describe you, what do you think
01:37:08
they would be?
01:37:10
Um
01:37:12
I think it would yeah it would be uh
01:37:16
determined
01:37:17
>> um
01:37:20
loyal I would hope and
01:37:25
um
01:37:31
h
01:37:33
what would a third one
01:37:37
Maybe.
01:37:41
Oh, I'm blanking. I'm like this. So
01:37:43
like, oh my gosh, what would they say?
01:37:45
>> One word left. Determined. Loyal.
01:37:47
They're both great words.
01:37:49
>> Yeah. You happy with them?
01:37:50
>> I am happy with them cuz I that's what I
01:37:53
I want to be. Um and I want I guess to
01:37:57
like exude to people around me. um loyal
01:38:03
and
01:38:07
h I think what I'm trying to think of
01:38:10
something that helps them. What about me
01:38:12
helps them but just so I can sound like
01:38:15
a nice person.
01:38:16
>> Well, you are a nice person. You are a
01:38:19
nice person. You got goals. You got the
01:38:20
[ __ ] that you want to get done.
01:38:22
>> Yeah. I mean I keep high achieving comes
01:38:24
to always comes to my mind because
01:38:26
that's I'm a
01:38:28
>> that's been the chapter of my life for
01:38:31
like the last maybe 20 years.
01:38:36
>> Yeah. Yeah, but I suppose you're still
01:38:37
in that period where it's the you the
01:38:39
selfish I don't know. I don't know if
01:38:40
selfish is the word, but the selfish era
01:38:42
of your life, you know, where where you
01:38:43
you've got goals that you want to
01:38:45
achieve for you, but yeah, I mean, maybe
01:38:48
at some stage you'll want to be a mom
01:38:49
and that'll change or your parents are
01:38:51
going to get older and you're going to
01:38:52
have a carer role there.
01:38:54
>> Um, yeah. So, now's now's the time for
01:38:56
you to shine. Yeah, I think that's
01:38:59
that's you've hit the nail on the head
01:39:01
with why I was finding it so hard to
01:39:03
find a word because it does feel like
01:39:06
that's the stage of my life is that I'm
01:39:09
hustling and and trying to do these
01:39:11
things for me and and not finding a lot
01:39:14
of time for anything outside of that.
01:39:16
But yes, I know that there are phases
01:39:19
and stages of life and this is just one
01:39:21
phase and
01:39:22
>> yeah, that time will come. This window
01:39:23
will close. Yeah.
01:39:24
>> You know, you have limited years as an
01:39:26
athlete, don't you? M
01:39:27
>> how how close are you to being the best
01:39:29
version of yourself?
01:39:32
>> I think um
01:39:37
I don't know if we'd ever get to 100%
01:39:41
but I would like to think that I am
01:39:44
closeish maybe
01:39:47
75%.
01:39:49
Um cuz there's always work on and I
01:39:53
think the best version of you changes
01:39:56
with the stages of your life. Like
01:39:58
>> for me the best version of me is is like
01:40:01
going out and thriving in the world and
01:40:03
and trying to set myself up for a future
01:40:06
so that I can thrive in that future. Um
01:40:09
>> yeah,
01:40:11
>> I love that answer so much. Yeah. Yeah.
01:40:14
I think you'll probably if you're always
01:40:15
at 75 or 80% wherever you are in your
01:40:18
life, I think that's good.
01:40:19
>> Yeah.
01:40:19
>> Um I'm 52 now. When I was in my 20s, I
01:40:22
would have thought I would have seen
01:40:23
someone that was 52 and I would have
01:40:24
thought they've they've learned
01:40:26
everything. There is they're capped out.
01:40:28
That's it. They've learned everything
01:40:29
they're going to learn. There's nothing
01:40:31
more to do.
01:40:31
>> This is the best that you've got.
01:40:33
>> And then you get here and your mom's
01:40:35
sitting out there, she's probably
01:40:36
exactly the same. Like there's probably
01:40:37
still things she's working on. And I
01:40:39
think that's a great way to live your
01:40:40
life.
01:40:40
>> Absolutely. like I'm watching my my
01:40:42
parents go through different phases of
01:40:44
life and have new goals and different
01:40:46
goals and working towards them. So, no,
01:40:49
it's not the end. And
01:40:50
>> and what I'm trying to do is like set
01:40:53
myself up so that, you know, I can also
01:40:55
do that is have new goals and try
01:40:58
different things. And I don't think I'll
01:41:00
ever be sort of 100% in in GP, but I'll
01:41:04
never leave because I love it. Um, but I
01:41:07
just I want to have other things going
01:41:09
on and enjoy other things. How old are
01:41:11
your parents now?
01:41:13
>> 55 and 54. I hope that's right.
01:41:16
>> And they're both in good shape.
01:41:17
>> Yeah. Yeah. We um Mom works out a lot
01:41:21
every day. She's in good shape. Um and
01:41:23
then dad has started, which is great.
01:41:26
So, he sends me updates every day. Um I
01:41:29
love that. Yeah. Yeah.
01:41:31
>> Now, yeah, they're probably scared of
01:41:33
you. Your dad's probably scared. You're
01:41:34
going to be you're going to be Are you
01:41:35
going to be the There's five kids, but
01:41:36
what's your role going to be when they
01:41:37
get older? Are you going to be
01:41:38
>> Oh, yes. Yes.
01:41:39
>> Are you going to be the bossy one or?
01:41:42
>> Yeah, I'm the
01:41:45
>> There are other bossy ones. Honestly, my
01:41:47
sister's a bossy. Um, more I'm going to
01:41:50
be the the steadfast one. The one that
01:41:53
can make hard decisions and and keep
01:41:56
everyone uh on the on track.
01:41:59
>> Yeah.
01:42:00
>> I I reckon when Yeah. They're going to
01:42:01
be scared of you when you get older.
01:42:03
>> I think a little bit of me now.
01:42:06
>> And last one. Are you proud of yourself?
01:42:09
>> Yeah, I'm I am. I'm really proud of
01:42:11
myself. Um and proud of everything and
01:42:14
everyone around me who helped me get to
01:42:17
this to this point um and helped me do
01:42:19
all these amazing things uh that I've
01:42:22
been able to experience. It's I'm so
01:42:24
lucky. I live like a really cool life. I
01:42:26
I I feel really grateful um to even be
01:42:30
here. This is so cool um chatting with
01:42:32
you.
01:42:34
>> It's been great today. It's been
01:42:35
wonderful.
01:42:35
>> Thank you.
01:42:36
>> Yeah. Has it been enjoyable for you?
01:42:37
>> Yeah, it has been. I was really, really,
01:42:39
really nervous. Um, but it was really
01:42:42
nice to just Yeah, just chat. It felt
01:42:44
really uh natural.
01:42:45
>> Yeah. Oh, that's cool. No, you you've
01:42:47
done some [ __ ]
01:42:49
>> And and uh
01:42:50
>> and there's more to do.
01:42:51
>> 100%. I was going to say that. And
01:42:52
you're just getting started.
01:42:53
>> Yeah. Yeah.
01:42:55
>> Thank you so much.
01:42:55
>> This has been great. Hey, good luck for
01:42:56
the competition that's coming up and
01:42:58
good luck for whatever the future may
01:42:59
bring. Dr. Kina Tongate.
