00:00:00
And I remember out on the balcony having a cigarette. Have you ever considered like maybe we're just not that good?
00:00:04
>> All the evidence was pointing to that. Every time we released a video, it would
00:00:07
tank. >> So in in hindsight, were you good enough then or did you just need to keep like
00:00:10
tweaking until you found >> I think there was a spark there. >> What did you see yourself doing when you
00:00:14
were training? >> My best aspirations back when I was studying would have been like get a roll
00:00:18
on Short Street. That would be the best thing that I could ever imagine. >> So you've never been successful today.
00:00:22
>> I guess not. >> My brother just kind of having like a bit of a serious chat with me. Have you
00:00:25
got a backup kind of playing? And I was like no not really. The subtext was you can't stay here and keep chasing this
00:00:30
crazy film dream. And luckily Anigan from a place of love. Genuinely like 2 or 3 weeks after that was when I landed
00:00:35
the job. >> What were your expectations when you started this? >> If we get a million that's an outlandish
00:00:39
number. >> $500,000 would get us something. A million would get us something.
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>> What did that generate? >> $4.2 million New Zealand. >> 3 days.
00:00:47
>> The average amount is actually only $70, but 10 people gave 15,000. >> We couldn't fathom what it actually
00:00:52
represented. Like >> a week ago, I hadn't heard of you guys. 7.3 million YouTube subscribers. less
00:00:57
than 1% of your audience is New Zealand based. Why do you think it is that you don't get much more attention here in
00:01:02
New Zealand than >> we kind of stay quiet? We just get seen internationally. Month to month, we'll
00:01:05
get tens of millions of views, sometimes hundreds of millions of views. And then
00:01:09
when you get on Seven Shark, you get all the texts from the aunties. And >> what's the biggest brand deal you had to
00:01:14
turn down because it didn't fit? >> Our Facebook account just stopped monetizing.
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>> The stakes are a lot higher. >> Luckily, we didn't have any, if any,
00:01:20
employees. >> How many full-timers? It goes up to 20, 30, 40 on a busy day.
00:01:24
>> I know we really can't stuff it up. You must have moments where you just feel
00:01:27
creatively bankrupt. >> Their dream had turned into a nightmare. >> The YouTuber burnout is a big thing.
00:01:32
>> You become a slave to the frequency. >> How do you know if you're burning out or
00:01:35
do you not know? >> I often call my anxiety a superpower. >> There's an anxiety that kind of builds
00:01:39
up within me if we're not making progress towards something. >> This little dream of being at the
00:01:43
Oscars. >> The dream it never went away starting to creep into my daydreams again.
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>> I just like to thank the academy. >> Then you finally made it. >> What are you each most proud of with
00:01:51
VLDL? >> I'm actually most proud of the community. We've really won at life
00:01:55
here. >> Oh, good. You're here. Come on. This is the center of performance. Whenever
00:02:02
there's a top performance in New Zealand, it all comes from here. That's
00:02:05
Lisa Carrington. She's been doing that for days. That's the boys who got the
00:02:09
Holland one in to it again. Hey Finn, how's the performance going? >> Top tier.
00:02:16
>> Nice. This is our generate room. In here, you'll find our top performers
00:02:19
helping Kiwis maximize their Kiwi Saver investments. Get in here, Finn. Maximize, generate,
00:02:25
>> putting performance first. >> Viva Dirt League, welcome to my podcast.
00:02:29
>> Thank you very much for having us. >> Let's start by doing a flight of the
00:02:32
Concord style roll check. Rowan, >> my name is Rowan. >> Alan, >> present.
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>> Adam, >> present. >> Mate, it's so good to have you guys
00:02:39
here. >> It's good to be here. >> Thank you very much. >> It's unbelievable. Full full uh
00:02:43
transparency. Um a week ago, I hadn't heard of you guys. >> Um I saw the excitement of the people
00:02:49
around the office. >> And now you're an addicted subscriber, right? >> Have you subscribed? Actually,
00:02:53
>> I have subscribed. Yeah. >> Thank you. >> I'm not the only one as well. 7.3
00:02:57
million YouTube subscribers. >> 5 billion YouTube views. >> 5 billion. Damn.
00:03:04
>> A AI estimates your lifetime YouTube revenue earnings $10 million US. >> Oh god. I wish. It's wildly off.
00:03:14
>> So, next up for you guys, I guess, is a diamond YouTube play button. >> Far away. 10 million. 10. Yeah. So, when
00:03:22
we get to 10 million, in theory, we will get the diamond. >> I've completely forgotten about that.
00:03:26
I'd kind of written that off. >> And this is the great thing. Once that
00:03:28
happens, once we reach 10 million subscribers and we get the diamond play button, we can finally relax. We'll be
00:03:35
happy eternally happiness like, yeah, achieved achieved all of our dreams >> and we'll just live in a state of
00:03:40
constant%. >> I'm on uh 26,000 YouTube subscribers. So, the um the original play button, the
00:03:48
silver one, seems like a lifetime away from me. Was it special for you guys when you got that first one?
00:03:53
>> I oddly enough, it was more special to get the 100,000 than it was to get the
00:03:57
million. >> Yeah, the same thing. >> I I guess it's because we just never saw
00:04:02
the growth in the future necessarily. And it really represented something. >> It represented something and it was
00:04:07
literally because it was the first acknowledgement from YouTube of hitting the don't get me wrong, the million
00:04:14
>> to me that they were both very special. To me, the million was the big one cuz
00:04:18
that was just like wow. I never thought we'd get to a million. >> Yeah. Million was the bigger like was
00:04:23
obviously the most significant number, but it was something about getting that first button was was
00:04:26
>> I know what you mean though, but like getting that first 100,000 was a was the
00:04:29
cuz everything's so new at that time like like oh my god I think we're actually proving that we're successful
00:04:34
and making this work. Oh my god, we got 100,000. >> It's all relative. I remember when we
00:04:40
were in uh Sydney at a convention >> and we were literally in a uh not a convention, a conference rather, and we
00:04:48
were in like this quiet little theater like trying to listen to someone who's
00:04:51
talking at a panel and the three of us are looking going, "Oh my god, there's
00:04:54
only there's only a few little subs left." >> That was I remember that. Yeah. Yeah.
00:05:02
>> So, it's crazy what you guys have done. Um, and it's um it's it's been a long
00:05:06
time in the making. You like I think um to time stamp it. So the 2011 Rugby World Cup, iconic New Zealand sporting
00:05:13
event uh where we beat the French by one point in the final and Richie McCoy had
00:05:17
a broken foot and that's when you guys that's how long you guys have been doing
00:05:20
this. >> Yeah. 2011. Yeah. >> Wow. >> Since the first video. Yeah.
00:05:25
>> And to give you some context on that, that was not we we didn't know we didn't
00:05:29
have a plan back then. It was just for shits and giggles back then. as when the >> years it was just for years. It was kind
00:05:36
of it was just a a I mean obviously we hoped some something would happen but it was a just a creative outlet that we uh
00:05:42
because we we weren't getting much work outside of Viva. So we just wanted to to
00:05:47
make our own stuff and and and work with mates and and luckily caught on. >> It's that kind of whole thing where
00:05:53
everyone's like one day I'm going to make my short film or I'm going to make
00:05:56
that thing that I want to make and we're just kind of like we should make it this
00:05:58
weekend. Let's do it. >> Yeah. is kind of the strength. Our strength was the fact that we just did
00:06:03
it >> and we just kept doing it despite it being even though we're like we're not
00:06:08
>> all the evidence was pointing at us at the moment and sometimes they weren't
00:06:11
very good. >> Okay. So, um people can Google this but most people probably won't. So, what is
00:06:17
the origin of the name? >> The origin of the name is uh it's a >> I wish we had a different name. I wish
00:06:25
we we all do. And uh the we used to play a video game. A lot of video games have
00:06:29
this like ranking system. If you're if you're quite bad at the game, bronze
00:06:32
league and it kind of works up. Silver, you're a bit better. Gold, you're
00:06:34
better. Platinum >> uh Diamond Master. But we were we were so bad at this one particular video game
00:06:39
called uh Starcraft that we we gave ourselves our own >> bracket which was Dirt League. And then
00:06:45
we typed that into YouTube and it had been taken. And so we added Viva in front of it. And that's the story.
00:06:52
>> It was literally the name they wanted was taken. So like let's make it viv
00:06:57
you know but I don't think we ever thought we'd make it as part of the like
00:06:59
so it's it's we we didn't put that much thought into >> I remember around maybe 200 or 300,000
00:07:05
subscribers we had a big chat about changing the name of the >> channel it's too late I feel it was
00:07:10
earlier than that I feel like it was um possibly even before 100 going oh >> who knows maybe you're right but but
00:07:17
just kind of going no it's too late now to change it to something that's that's
00:07:20
like just two syllables >> yeah was a two there could be so many just two syllable, easy to remember,
00:07:26
easy to spell words, but it's stuck in >> film boys, game boys. >> Yeah.
00:07:30
>> And I can't take it. >> So now the the cool thing I think about
00:07:33
you, one of the cool things about you guys is um like you were telling me just before, less than 1% of your audience is
00:07:38
New Zealand based. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Mainly in America, a lot in
00:07:43
Europe. Interestingly, a lot in India and Southeast Asia as well. >> Yeah.
00:07:46
>> Yeah. >> But uh yeah, less than 1% in New Zealand, >> which is kind of good, which is we're
00:07:51
okay with that. Although per it's because New Zealand's a small population. It's like per capita.
00:07:56
>> Yeah. >> Like New Zealand about the same amount of if you got a random thousand people
00:08:00
from New Zealand or a random thousand people from America, probably about the same amount of people would recognize
00:08:04
us. >> Yeah, I think so. Yeah. >> Y >> yeah, just that there's a small
00:08:06
population. >> So, how recognized do you guys get in New Zealand? Do you have weird like
00:08:10
people looking at you in the supermarket place out of place? >> If you go to something like the
00:08:14
supermarket or a big box store or the mall or something, almost every time you go to the mall, for sure. Yeah. And New
00:08:20
Zealand fans are so lovely. They're timidly approaching be, like, "Oh my
00:08:24
god, I'm so sorry for disturbing you. You don't mind if I just say hi and can
00:08:27
I please please get a hold?" >> But it's really manageable. It's not
00:08:30
crazy like at all. >> But it's exactly that type of fame which is like it it doesn't surprise me in the
00:08:36
slightest that you've only just heard about us like that. It's either you've
00:08:38
either know about us and you're quite a big fan or you've never heard of us.
00:08:42
>> And that's just how online is. >> Yeah. And and that's why there's you get
00:08:45
often the interaction is a dude dude some gamer dude kind of go oh my god are you ran from viva dirt league and then
00:08:51
and then you get he hands the phone to his girlfriend and she's got no idea who
00:08:55
we are and he take a photo >> someone behind this girlfriend behind camera taking a
00:09:00
strange >> the famous one my boyfriend has like literally gone insane and lost his mind
00:09:05
>> the boyfriend who's usually quite stock is shaking while like >> so how does that sit with you guys that
00:09:12
you you were following from New Zealand is so small and why do you think it is that you don't get much more attention
00:09:16
here in New Zealand than what you do? Is it a talk Bobby thing or is it something
00:09:19
else? >> It's it's so it's happening more and more but I feel like it was just kind of
00:09:24
for many years we >> we kind of stay quiet. We kind of >> we kind of don't disrupt like we we
00:09:31
honestly just operate out we stay in our little bubble. We've just got our own
00:09:34
thing kind of going. >> Often we do things like this. >> Yeah. And all of our success came from
00:09:39
like really early days was like we'd make the content, make the skit, put it
00:09:42
on an international um kind of platform and it would just get seen internationally. So there was no reason
00:09:48
for it to specifically um be kind of concentrated in New Zealand. >> It was just being seen by the world and
00:09:54
so naturally it just kind of rose >> around the world. >> Well, on this podcast like I love
00:09:58
celebrating New Zealanders um that are doing amazing things and that that's what you guys are. So it's it's quite
00:10:04
like there's a few articles online. There was some some old spin-off articles when you had like a million
00:10:08
followers and there was a RNZ uh podcast piece. >> Um, but I felt like you deserve more
00:10:14
attention than what you've got over the years. >> Yeah. Well, thank you.
00:10:17
>> Thank you. I I hate to say so, but I think so. >> Get a little bit more.
00:10:23
>> But at the same time, I don't I don't mind it. I actually genuinely there's
00:10:27
something really just nice about just tinkering away and working on our own stuff and and doing what we want. It's
00:10:33
so funny that when we like month to month we'll get tens of millions of views sometimes hundreds of millions of
00:10:38
views and then when you get on seven sharp uh you get all the texts from the aunties and I saw you on seven SHARP YOU
00:10:47
KNOW IT LOOKS LIKE YOU GUYS ARE DOING quite well >> validated validated >> it's the only media service they know
00:10:53
>> the stamp of approv yeah yeah >> so uh 2018 you started doing this
00:10:59
full-time I believe it was you first Rowan >> uh well it These guys both had full-time jobs. I I
00:11:04
my background is I studied as an actor. I've always been an actor and so that is
00:11:08
never a full-time job. So I was like I'm constantly unemployed. So I I I can I
00:11:12
can you guys keep working while we're figuring this out and I'll be the inverted commas fulltimer
00:11:18
>> which involved paying him like oh like two no to the start it was like 200
00:11:22
bucks a week to be the editor. >> All the revenue that we were making back
00:11:25
then which was all the revenue >> would have been about 200 bucks a week and we're like going to give me I'll
00:11:30
just I'll be the editor. Yeah. And it was basically paying your rent, right?
00:11:33
Paying your rent. >> And then but there was a point, was it maybe 2018 where you guys made quite a difficult
00:11:40
decision to to both of us had pretty cushy jobs. I was at TV and Zed, Alan was at NZME. And I mean, we were doing
00:11:48
pretty well career-wise for the >> It was bizarre that that felt like the the safer option was to stay at those at
00:11:54
those jobs rather than take the take the leap. But so obviously so glad we we took said leap. It must have been there
00:12:00
must have been a point and I bet it would have been when we kind of got on Patreon and so we we had this kind of
00:12:05
regular do you know you know the Patreon of course >> we had this regular kind of uh fan base
00:12:10
who gave us a regular amount maybe it was like $10 $20,000 a month or something >> nowhere near that no way down it would
00:12:18
have been $1,000 a month around that and then that combined with a little bit of Facebook uh you wouldn't
00:12:24
be Facebook but then a little bit of YouTube revenue was just enough for you guys to go I think this is growing. Can
00:12:30
we take the leap? >> And do you know what was the big we could see that we could see the graph.
00:12:34
You could see where it was like where it was kind of going was views were picking
00:12:37
up and subscribers were picking up and we're like, okay, >> if we dedicated our time to this, surely
00:12:42
it's only natural for that to to um grow faster. Yeah. Had a little bit of savings which were like like I literally
00:12:50
for myself did the math. So I was like, "Okay, imagine if we made almost no
00:12:54
money for the next how much of my savings will I go through for food and rent?" And then I figured out that I had
00:12:59
like 3 or 4 months to live. >> I made that plan as well, but then I went to Europe and spent it all and came
00:13:04
back. I was like, "We got to make this work as quickly as I was. It makes a
00:13:09
difference to me, guys. I'm still unemployed. That's you guys." >> Yeah, we we took a leap of faith. You
00:13:14
kind of took like a little stumble of faith. >> Took a stumble of faith. >> I mean, Rowan, you you had a promising
00:13:19
acting career though, right? You went to Toy Ficardi, the iconic film school, which is notoriously hard to get into
00:13:25
>> and you had some bits on Shortland Street. >> I've had like I mean I studied for a
00:13:29
year at the Hegley theater company in Christ Church straight out of home and then three years at Toyardi. So I
00:13:34
studied for 4 years and then just kind of into the industry and and I got the you know an ad here and a little role on
00:13:39
Legend of the Seeker and Spartacus. And >> did you know that Ron's an Avatar? Oh, I
00:13:43
have this there's a well-known meme amongst our fan base is that I am a prominent extra in one scene on on
00:13:50
Avatar. >> It's the scene where he's giving the big in the big briefing room where he's like
00:13:54
>> in Pandora. >> Yeah. Sorry. >> Yeah, >> that's good. That was a good recreation.
00:13:59
>> He said the line wrong. >> I think Oh, something back in Kansas. >> I'm just with no lines. I just happened
00:14:07
to be placed at the front row of this of this briefing with General Quart and I'm
00:14:11
just there looking stoic and cool and stuff and and it just made a big prominent part of the
00:14:16
>> But there's also a deleted scene where you had a line, right? >> Uh no, that that I could No, no,
00:14:23
>> I thought you had a line. >> No. God, I never got a line. >> But there are there were other deleted
00:14:27
scenes that I had more prominent parts. There's one. Yeah, but that that was the
00:14:31
one. Yeah, that's >> famous. He's an avatar. I'm an avatar deal.
00:14:35
>> Yeah. But what did you see yourself doing when you were training? >> Uh what was that? Sorry. Oh,
00:14:39
>> what did you see yourself doing when you >> What was my kind of plan?
00:14:41
>> Yeah. >> I mean my best my best aspirations back when I was studying would have been like
00:14:46
I mean I remember actually doing a kind of a a a talk a research project on what
00:14:52
becomes of Toyari graduates and first of all I had to define how success what success is for people. So I was like
00:14:59
well no the question was how successful are toyardi graduates and then I defined
00:15:04
success for myself. I remember doing like a talk to the class and I was like the success for me would be if I could
00:15:09
just like get a a roll on Sha Street like a core cast role on Shan Street. That's it. Like I've peaked. That would
00:15:14
be the best thing that I could ever imagine. That was it back then. That's like if I can get that.
00:15:18
>> And so you've never been successful then. >> Well, I guess not. I never got I had two
00:15:22
tiny rolls on Short Street but I never had a cart. >> Never made it. So you're a made it.
00:15:26
>> You're a failure then. >> Did that ruin in that room? Never made
00:15:28
it. >> No wonder your mother's so not proud. >> So disappointed.
00:15:32
>> Yeah. What a let down. I suppose that's the that's the benchmark. I've had a
00:15:35
couple of um Toy Ficardi uh graduates on the podcast including um Cam Jones. I don't know if he was on Shortland Street
00:15:41
for a while in Dallas on Shortland Street and for him like his parents were like, "What are you doing? You're going
00:15:45
to be an actor." But when he got a role on Shortland Street, it was like >> the seal of approval for you know family
00:15:51
and aunties. >> My parents wanting to be an actor and filmmaker. They were they were
00:15:55
supportive but they were like you're let's just be realistic. You're probably
00:15:59
not going to make it. So I have a backup plan. Thanks mom and dad. They made me do a law degree.
00:16:03
>> Although >> I keep forgetting that about you degree. >> My family was very supportive of me
00:16:08
doing acting. But there was a point I remember um and this in the early days of EVA before we anywhere near made it.
00:16:14
And I remember my brother kind of just kind of having like a bit of a serious chat with me and just kind of going, you
00:16:18
know, you you know, you know, have you got have you got it back up kind of playing? And I was like, no, not really.
00:16:24
And it was like, okay, just maybe you should, you know, it was just trying with love and everything like
00:16:29
>> from a place of love, >> place of absolute love. I did do the same thing with you, didn't they?
00:16:32
>> They did. It was very, very similar story. It was um I just nothing was
00:16:36
working. It was I'd been to film school. I just did a one year New Zealand film
00:16:38
and television school. Got out of there, tried to make a couple of my own projects. Nothing happened. uh was doing
00:16:44
the odd job here and there. Did a lot of like corporate gigs just nothing was clicking and my parents did had a weird
00:16:49
very ser not very serious it was the same sit down of like >> you need to start thinking about
00:16:54
especially cuz I'd moved back home then and I think they were like you can't
00:16:57
stay here. The subtext was you can't stay here and keep chasing this crazy film dream
00:17:01
>> and luckily and again from a place of love and and they were very supportive
00:17:04
up until that point but it just went so far. Uh but then like genuinely like two
00:17:09
or three weeks after that was when I landed the job at NZME which wasn't exactly this like high-profile video job
00:17:13
or anything but at least it was a job with a camera allowed me to pay uh pay the bills and and come up to Oakland to
00:17:21
so I was close to Ron and we could start doing Viva properly. So it all kind of worked out but the timing was um
00:17:26
>> Was there a moment where so they were like oh thank god he's got a real job
00:17:31
and then there was a moment when you're like hey I'm actually quitting all that
00:17:34
and committing to you >> no surprise I was expecting that but surprisingly there wasn't my parents did
00:17:40
to me >> they were like are you sure >> like because there's a good career path
00:17:44
here at TVn like >> are you sure lots of memories I remember them surprisingly not being
00:17:53
>> they were loving about it like they wanted the best for Viva and for me but
00:17:58
yeah there was >> of course but it was just this crazy idea like that how is that ever going to
00:18:02
work >> so unknown and I I think it's more of a pathway now for people to say I want to
00:18:06
be a YouTuber but it wasn't even a thing when when you guys started >> it's more understood now for sure
00:18:11
>> how did you guys all meet >> so the the the kind of the origin story
00:18:15
is like way I'll kind of breeze past the first part which is we were a bunch of
00:18:19
actors there were more of us actually back then there was a bunch of actors and gamers who all were nerds who played
00:18:24
this one game, Starcraft, including Alan and myself. And then we started making Starcraft parody music videos.
00:18:31
>> So, actually November 24, 2011, that's when you put out the blue all rise one.
00:18:36
>> That's the one. Yeah. >> All right. The the first lines tell me
00:18:49
that you watched. >> I did. I did. Okay, has it? >> Yeah, that one's fine.
00:18:54
>> That one's okay. There are other ones you should just not watch. >> There are other ones.
00:18:57
>> There's another one to parody of um What does the fox say? >> That's the one we were talking about.
00:19:04
>> You guys have pumped it out about going back and deleting it. >> I'm so pleased you haven't
00:19:10
legacy. >> Jimmy Donaldson, Mr. Beast, the biggest YouTuber in the world. Like, if you look
00:19:14
at his early stuff, it's it's really awful. >> It's like a time capsule and you can see
00:19:19
the progression and development. part of something really special about that. >> I think so as well. That's why we've
00:19:24
never deleted the music videos cuz totally agree with that. >> Yeah. >> And so we went through the stage of
00:19:28
getting mild success from that and then there was a point later on where the that whole initial group of us kind of
00:19:34
disbanded. People got busy with their own lives and um and then it was just kind of me and Allan for a bit just kind
00:19:40
of just buming around. We we started making this board skit series and it was not doing that well. Um
00:19:46
>> every time you released a video you lost subscribers. We actually we'd go, "Oh,
00:19:49
we just released a video and >> oh, so our audience wants us to not make anything is what the subscribers."
00:19:54
>> That's what the takeaway was, right? >> Because people are going, "Oh,
00:19:57
>> our subscribers were >> when when what in retrospect what was actually happening was that we were we
00:20:02
were losing all the music video people who were there just for the music videos and we were gaining this cult audience
00:20:07
of gradually." >> Yeah. Very slowly. But the real success happened when we met Adam uh when we
00:20:13
kind of were all in the same kind of phase of our life or whatever that was and and we we started kind of working on
00:20:20
well we started working on wrecked together. you you guys were already working on Regg and you've been it was a
00:20:26
web series that they wanted to make and get funded through New Zealand on Air and I was working with another team on
00:20:30
another web series that I wanted to get funded through New Zealand on air >> and through a mutual uh mutual producer
00:20:37
we got introduced and we just had a coffee and a chat and you know got on like a house on fire considering we love
00:20:43
film and video games and we're trying to do web series and then it was suggested
00:20:48
that I help these guys write wrecked and uh just through the multiple sessions we
00:20:54
had writing this series together, we kind of really got along as friends and then they're like, "Yeah, do you want to
00:21:00
help us with a couple of funny videos? Do a do a couple of sketches with us of board and some other things." And I
00:21:05
pitched a few ideas that I thought were funny and >> then the rest is history.
00:21:09
>> And that's why selling is so important. and and it kind of just I almost feel
00:21:17
like the um the little side skits were just more like a little side project from the real thing which is the music
00:21:23
videos or something like at the Yeah. I wonder I can't remember that might have
00:21:27
been a mindset. >> Even then like I came on >> We'll be back to music.
00:21:31
>> The first one I came cuz we had been playing Starcraft the game that brought
00:21:34
us all together at that point. And the first thing I came on for was Legacy the the uh the music video.
00:21:42
>> I don't I don't mind that actually. >> That's very good. But
00:21:46
>> that video was like the main focus at that point and two days of filming.
00:21:49
>> It was Yeah. two days of filming and then going to be a long edit and Ron had
00:21:52
put a lot of effort in to make the song. And the same one of the same days we're
00:21:57
filming, we also just decided to do a fun little sketch, >> a silly little half sketch, a silly
00:22:02
little halfstone sketch where I get angry at my phone and then break my phone and Rowan talks to camera about
00:22:07
the life lesson of that. And that took half an hour to film and got significantly more views than the music
00:22:14
video >> than the music video. And we were like, >> "Wait a second, pump the brakes.
00:22:18
>> What's going on? We should keep doing skits and and less music videos.
00:22:22
>> Yeah. And the other thing with music videos is you can't monetize them. So
00:22:24
they >> parody licensed to music. >> Yeah. Well, it gets blurry and it's hard
00:22:30
to get very kind of gray area with it. But >> especially these days on YouTube where
00:22:34
copyright strikes so strong. It wasn't as much back in the day, but these days
00:22:38
it is. >> Is there anything you miss about those simpler times? >> Ah, we
00:22:41
>> What do you miss? Like I mean you've done so much incredible stuff, but I'm
00:22:45
guessing it's completely different now. Like the process and the team. I think
00:22:48
we look at it through rose tinted glasses. Yeah, I we The short answer is yes. They were magical days and it was
00:22:55
just the idea of like chasing the dream. It was just the three of us. It was like
00:22:59
uh there was a certain like just this this excitement about it, this palpable excitement. But then I remember it was
00:23:07
just the three of us on set lugging our costume and art department and everything ourselves. I remember having
00:23:12
to wake up early, go to Roland's house, get into your garage, which wasn't human
00:23:17
height. So, we had to like dip into the >> garage 10 crates of random costumes, put
00:23:23
them into the car, >> and then it was poorly planned. So, we kind of would arrive on set and we
00:23:28
haven't finished the script. So, we have to kind of come up with it on the fly,
00:23:30
which was the way we tended to do things. So, >> like it, yes, I look back on it very
00:23:34
very fondly, but at the same time, I we've got such an incredible team now. Our crew is so amazing.
00:23:40
>> Uh, and we can shoot more content at a higher production quality than we ever
00:23:45
could. And so, >> yeah, I miss it, but I also I'd much choose right now.
00:23:50
>> Well, I suppose like back then you your dream actually it was probably too big
00:23:54
to even dream is what you had. >> Oh, yeah. Oh, if if you back in even 2018 said you'll own a studio
00:24:01
>> uh with a a mass Oakland's biggest permanent green screen uh a full
00:24:05
medieval tavern and like a tech store set >> a full working crew >> and a full crew and you've got like uh I
00:24:11
don't know at least 10 of constant employee how many do we have on constant employment
00:24:17
>> that and that we would just be like oh sure >> and that when you days when you shoot
00:24:23
will be 30 40 sometimes 50 60 people >> and have and you guys don't I guess
00:24:29
don't have to go to first scene anymore to hire the costume. I think we get the
00:24:32
odd thing for person still not knowing that we don't have >> we don't have we still 16 staff did you
00:24:38
say >> I I lose >> so like on a on a quiet day we've got 16 permanent staff but as I say that ramps
00:24:45
up when we get into filming and it can a normal day would be about 30 maybe 40 I
00:24:49
I remember like we it was a creative outlet was one of my my few creative outlets was probably the most important
00:24:54
and I I genuinely enjoyed doing it as well but there was definitely a point there where we we uh We any sane person
00:25:03
probably would have stopped. >> Well, we often I do remember this one point out
00:25:08
>> Yeah, this is years ago where we were actually before Adam where we' had the
00:25:13
the group the old group had disbanded. The music videos was kind of over. >> Me and Alan were just making the
00:25:19
occasional episode of this board tech series. >> Every time we released it just
00:25:23
>> was just not doing well. And I remember out on the balcony having a cigarette
00:25:27
just just going um what did I say? I said >> maybe we're not that good.
00:25:32
>> Do you know bro? Have you ever considered like maybe we're just not
00:25:35
that good? >> And it was just really this this big bombshell like I mean the the all the
00:25:41
evidence was pointing to that was probably the the real the the truth. >> They were right
00:25:47
>> and and it was all and then we gave up and now we're here. Um >> yeah, we're not that good but this guy
00:25:53
came this guy. But no, there was no way to argue it because like I thought we were pretty good. I thought we were on
00:25:57
to something. But yeah, every time we released a video, it would tank and >> I feel like your response to that was
00:26:02
something like, "But people who aren't that good don't ask that question."
00:26:06
>> Yeah, that's right. I was >> something like that. >> I did say that, didn't I?
00:26:09
>> Early days. >> Yeah. Well, that was a smart response. Yeah, it's profound
00:26:13
>> cuz there are a lot of people cuz I know a good good friend and actor Ben uh
00:26:18
Vanlair who we work with, he's got a a really good expression which I I don't
00:26:21
know if he made it up but the expression goes uh follow your dreams but don't
00:26:25
follow them off a cliff >> and and that's that one of the things when you get like cuz the truth is most
00:26:31
actors don't make it statistically or most Twitch streamers or most YouTubers
00:26:36
or most most people statistically don't make it >> most creative and You know, the truth is you
00:26:45
>> that's a likely scenario, but a lot of people like that don't necessarily ask
00:26:49
the question, maybe I'm just not that good >> that they kind of in a bit of a blind
00:26:55
kind of if I just keep making stuff, I'm sure it will eventually work out. >> Yeah.
00:26:58
>> So, in in hindsight, were you good enough then or did you just need to keep
00:27:01
like tweaking until you found the >> I think we I think there was a spark there. There was
00:27:07
>> absolutely magic. I remember watching all of the music video before I actually
00:27:11
kind of got engaged with you guys when we first met. I watched all of everything basically
00:27:16
>> and I was like, man, this the production quality is a bit ropey here and there,
00:27:20
but there's a absolute spark. >> Yeah, I agree. Yeah. There's obviously a lot that we we've
00:27:26
improved a lot since then, but there was still this undeniable >> like Yeah, I guess spark is is a great
00:27:32
word for it. >> Yeah. So, so in the early years, um, you were getting a bit of YouTube money coming
00:27:37
in. I I don't know what else. What were you doing? Were you just reinvesting it?
00:27:40
You're giving Rowan 200 bucks initially. >> That was that was literally it is just
00:27:44
putting it back into the videos into buying props, costumes. >> Oh, yeah. And most of those were
00:27:50
>> rent and food. >> Yeah. But like before then we were for the first few years we were just
00:27:55
investing in the in it. Like it would all come out out of our pockets, >> but it was almost nothing cuz I just I
00:27:59
owned all the camera equipment already. Yeah. Yeah. >> Uh we could film in most locations kind
00:28:03
of for free >> cuz you just don't tell anyone. >> Cuz you just don't tell anyone.
00:28:06
>> You're just gorilla film making. >> Yeah, 100%. >> And then the locations we were using
00:28:10
like Playtech, they were lovely enough to let us film there for free and how historical village were allowed let us
00:28:16
film there for free for the first few years. >> I I think it might have been free. Yeah.
00:28:21
>> It was free. Yeah. >> Oh, wait. Is is Playch an actual store? >> So Tech Town the the show the store in
00:28:27
the show now is fake. that's at our studio. But Playch, which it used to be in, is a real store on the North Shore.
00:28:33
And the owner was just lovely enough when you guys first asked to say yes. >> Great guy. The store is very, it's a
00:28:38
very cool store. >> We had a really like symbiotic relationship in the early days where he
00:28:42
he obviously had a really good business sense and saw even though we weren't
00:28:45
massive at the time, we were like 20 maybe less 20 less than >> No, it was it was 20,000 plateaued at
00:28:51
that for like a couple years. Yeah. >> And and we we basically approached him
00:28:54
and said, "Hey, could we film this new little tech store series you want to do
00:28:57
in your store?" And he was very com he was like, "Okay." >> Um, and he saw these, you know, this is
00:29:02
free publicity if if they do well. And it did very well. But, um, >> when we left Playtech, we were on 3
00:29:08
million subscribers. >> Oh my god. So, you 20,000 when you started. >> And did you say you plateaued? You pl
00:29:14
you sort of plateaued on 20,000. >> We plateaued at 20,000. This is from memory, but after the kind of the music
00:29:19
video. >> 22 was the number I remember. >> Yeah, I think around 22. We just we were
00:29:22
just we weren't the dial wasn't moving from there at all. And that that was
00:29:26
after we' done the music videos and we were starting to just uh do the sketches. But the sketch
00:29:30
>> there was even the plateau at 22 for a few fair few months when I started as
00:29:34
well. And it wasn't until >> we really started doubling down into let's try and do two. It was that first
00:29:40
two videos a week and then three videos a week that it really started to pick off.
00:29:44
>> Yeah. It rewards consistency, doesn't it? >> It does. It's really important.
00:29:48
>> And um Yeah. Was it was there a tipping point moment or did was it just sort of
00:29:51
like gradually? >> For the most part, it's been quite gradual. There've been little little
00:29:55
moments of of like acceleration >> but nothing like nothing. >> We've never had a video that it's like
00:30:01
ah this is your 15 minutes of fame and then get off the stage. It's all little
00:30:05
spiral viral spikes and then just consider >> there were more kind of like I feel like
00:30:09
the first instance of okay I think this is really starting to work and we're
00:30:13
seeing the the trajectory change and angle upwards might have been epic man. >> Yeah. Like we started doing that and we
00:30:20
started noticing that that started bringing in more >> literally from the very very first
00:30:24
episode of Epic. Man, it was quite clear. Oh, we've hit on >> something good here.
00:30:28
>> And then the next one was when we started doing uh PUBG logic uh do this
00:30:32
game called PUBG which is uh was a massive game when it first came out. Uh and it's just like this kind of war game
00:30:38
battle style. It's still it's still big, but it was it was just this it became
00:30:43
like the most popular game of all time for for significantly like maybe a few years. Uh, and it's it's still the most
00:30:51
ever consecutively, is that the word? like at any one time it's it still holds
00:30:56
the record in there. Like it was just it came out and we saw uh a gameplay of it
00:31:02
and realized like you can make skits about this for like almost no money cuz the vast majority of the game was kind
00:31:08
of somebody that kind of looks military, not too military, quite low budget military, uh holding often just scraps
00:31:15
of gun like small a pistol or a basic shotgun or something in an open grassy field. And we were like
00:31:21
>> all those we have those things. We literally have them all. And and the
00:31:25
beautiful thing about how Viva was and this is something that I miss a little bit was that we could we just called up
00:31:30
each other which we >> let's do it you guys free on Saturday >> and we so we just got out there and and
00:31:35
did it without any planning required because there's nobody else to wrangle and we just got out there and did it and
00:31:40
we literally rode the coattails of PUBG uh creating this uh content called PUBG logic which is just leaning into the
00:31:46
gags of of PUBG >> and they went gang busters and for the longest time that was our largest draw
00:31:52
card. A lot of people would find us through PUBG and then they'd see this other stuff that we're doing like epic
00:31:57
men in tech town over there. >> Um, but those they were they were very secondary to PUBG and luckily luckily
00:32:02
the PUBG popularity kind of dropped down and epic. >> There was a period there where I was
00:32:06
really scared that we'd become the >> PUBG guys. We didn't want to become
00:32:10
>> saying that to you guys like [ __ ] >> Yeah, >> we really need to diversify cuz are we
00:32:13
going to become the PUBG guys? >> Yeah. And then you'll be holding into a
00:32:16
game of like if a game isn't popular anymore then you're you're just in a lot
00:32:19
of trouble. But luckily Epic CN and Tech Town, which are our two main things, are
00:32:23
by far and away like our biggest rock out and continue to be to this to this day.
00:32:27
>> Yeah. >> Jeez, you must have all been single at the time, right? >> No.
00:32:31
>> Well, you had relationships. >> From what you've explained, it seems
00:32:34
like every weekend was like the 48 hour film festival for >> basically. Yeah,
00:32:38
>> it was. Yeah. >> I remember getting to a point where we were like, what's the point of doing the
00:32:43
48 hour film festival? >> We're doing it constantly. We did do it one year and we got second place
00:32:47
actually and it was second or third actually. >> I might have been third but third
00:32:51
actually and um and after that we did it twice and it was the second time we kind
00:32:56
of went >> why are we doing we do it twice or do we just do it one time? There was the
00:33:00
charity run and then there was the photographer one. >> Oh the photographer one. Yeah. Right.
00:33:04
>> And um and then now these days we actually sponsor the uh the 48 hour do
00:33:10
the comedy award. >> Yeah. Like I genuinely remember 48 hours before doing Viva was 48 hours was a
00:33:14
really important thing for me because it was like proof that I could make something
00:33:19
>> and then even just witnessing it even if you make something kind of [ __ ] just
00:33:23
have seeing it on the screen in front of an audience like cool this is possible like
00:33:27
>> I think it's one of the best things that's ever happened to the New Zealand
00:33:30
film industry is iconic filmmaker should be entering 48 hours. So 2022 is when you did that Kickstart uh campaign.
00:33:40
Yeah. Oh, >> the second one. >> Wait, is that the one that where you got
00:33:44
millions? >> Yeah. >> When was the first one? >> First one was in 2019.
00:33:48
>> And what did that generate? >> Uh like seven was it 700,000,000 new
00:33:54
that was to make a that was to make a film. >> Yeah. >> Called Balen's route which did really
00:33:58
well. >> Yeah. It's just a little half hour short film that we did set in the world of
00:34:01
epic NBC man. >> Yeah. So, it's sort of like proving to our audience and to ourselves that we
00:34:05
could film create bigger stories within the world of epic museum. Uh, but the second one that you're talking about was
00:34:11
uh, yeah, the one that we gang busters. >> How much did it make? >> $4.2 million New Zealand dollars
00:34:16
>> in 3 days. Four days. Three weeks. Almost a month. Yeah. >> So, were there any big donors? What was
00:34:22
the average amount? >> There were some really big ones. >> Yeah. The average amount is actually
00:34:26
only $70, but there were four people that gave $30,000. Um, I think 10 people gave 15,000.
00:34:34
>> Some fans are just like >> That's the thing, like if if you have a
00:34:37
large enough fan base, some of them will just be doing quite well. >> There's some fans out there who are like
00:34:42
millionaire people gave $100. >> Yeah. >> This is where you're so lucky that less
00:34:46
than 1% of the population is Kiwis cuz Kiwis don't like >> Yeah, totally. We're always blowing.
00:34:51
>> Feel weird about giving money to So, what were your expectations when you
00:34:54
started this? Like what were you thinking? What were you thinking a good result would be
00:34:58
>> of of the that Kickstarter or or or of Viva? >> No, the Kickstart that one.
00:35:02
>> I remember kind of thinking, man, if we get a million >> like I I was
00:35:06
>> even by the way, even that's an outlandish number, right? I I was kind
00:35:10
of hoping for like $500,000 would get us something. A million would get us something. Okay, that would probably be
00:35:18
great. I and I think we were we weren't don't we weren't crazy confident, but I
00:35:23
remember we were gauging it from the previous Kickstarter we done where we' raised 700,000. So, it's like okay, like
00:35:28
we know people are willing to donate, >> but this one was such such an unknown
00:35:32
because it wasn't another film or project. It was a very specific thing we were asking for which was like invest in
00:35:39
the future of the company kind of not invest donate for the future of the company. Um,
00:35:43
>> in many in many ways like it was um you could interpret it as help us get a
00:35:48
mortgage. >> Yeah, we we made it we dressed it up real nice, but at the end of the day
00:35:52
that was what we were asking for. We were like help us get a studio and the studio will do all all of these things
00:35:57
that allow us to upgrade shows and and make new shows, but at the end of the day like that we got the money and just
00:36:01
all went on to the the >> it paid for um a good a good chunk of it, but we we still got a massive
00:36:07
mortgage to pay for Yeah. >> the rest of it. All the sets and the renovation.
00:36:11
>> Yeah, we put a lot of work. I remember like when we first started and I was
00:36:15
imagining maybe if we're real lucky we I might get a million dollars out of this
00:36:17
then we could invest in our own and the kind of studio that I was imagining we could get is basically like a a a room.
00:36:23
>> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. A room. >> A room. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Maybe we could hang a
00:36:26
green screen. >> And we could hang a green screen on it. Um and so when we got $4.5 million New
00:36:31
Zealand dollars, I was just like, "Oh." And we could now look at like big spaces
00:36:36
big warehouses and stuff. >> That was mind-blowing cuz that's massive.
00:36:40
>> Yeah. Yeah, I'd love to see in real life at some point. It looks incredible. Um,
00:36:45
I just can't I can't understand why that wasn't a big part of the mainstream news
00:36:49
cycle in New Zealand. >> We we had we had an interview on on >> Was it the project? I think No. No. Or
00:36:58
am I going crazy? >> I think you're going crazy. I don't know if we did any any publicity about it.
00:37:02
>> No, I don't think we did. No, >> it seems crazy. There three Kiwi lads
00:37:05
doing this thing with this support internationally. >> It's like it's an unbelievable amount of
00:37:09
money. >> Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. Were you guys Yeah. What was that period like for you
00:37:13
guys? Were you constantly refreshing each other? >> There's a I love There's this particular
00:37:19
clip of the last few seconds of the Kickstarter campaign where we made a lot of money in the last like 2 hours live
00:37:25
streaming it >> and and the three of us losing our absolute minds as uh as it kind of
00:37:31
closes on $4.5 million. >> It was difficult to comprehend it because it we couldn't fathom what it
00:37:37
actually represented. Like we knew it meant huge support internationally, which was huge,
00:37:41
>> but then what what it literally meant and like we didn't know. We had this
00:37:46
idea of what the studio was we could hypothetically get, but it was just this it was it felt like it was unlocking
00:37:53
something new to us and it very much has. And so it was a just insane amount of money.
00:38:00
>> When when the dust settled on that, did it feel like a huge amount of pressure
00:38:02
like like you owe? >> We are still fulfilling the obligations from the Kickstarter. We're just about
00:38:07
done. >> That's true. Yeah, cuz a lot for the Kickstarter, you get a lot of uh like um
00:38:12
for for all the donate every donation would often have like a if you can donate this much, then we might um give
00:38:17
something in return. Uh but but yeah, we're still we're still paying those
00:38:21
off. >> Yeah. If we can get to a million dollars, we'll do the Sims logic show.
00:38:27
>> We started because we started making so much money, we started just throwing new
00:38:31
ideas out there. We'll do this and we'll do that. Like because we kind of had all
00:38:33
our goals and like we threw our list like what are new things we can do. There was one which is like um we we did
00:38:38
think about this. We did we knew what we're getting into, but we were like for
00:38:42
for every donation over $100, we'll write your name on the mural on this mural wall.
00:38:48
>> Yeah. >> Knowing and we were like >> we get a thousand of those or something.
00:38:51
Oh, like even if more than that, but just going we'll just commit the time over and then and then and then it just
00:38:57
became a nightmare trying to like fix. >> We ended up we ended up getting 14,000
00:39:01
people at that uh tier and above which meant that we did the maths on it and it would literally be days.
00:39:08
>> We' still be writing to this day. >> Yeah, it would be days into weeks of
00:39:10
8our days of writing. >> And we found a way to digitally do it with our handwriting and stuff and get
00:39:15
get on the wall. But yeah, it was >> we genuinely tried a lot of ways to make
00:39:18
like make that work, but it was too much. There was too much too much support. >> It's a it's a wonderful problem to have.
00:39:26
>> So So with that money, you get um you go to the bank and you get a mortgage on
00:39:30
this uh on this property. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And and why did you you build build like
00:39:36
the uh the giant green screen and also a medieval tavern which looks like something out of Lord of the Rings? Why
00:39:40
why a tvern? Was that a big >> epic epic NBC man is uh is all fantasy and it was kind of going to serve two
00:39:49
purposes. It was going to serve the We've also got a second channel where we
00:39:52
play D and D and we wanted to have a nice cool space, a nice cool backdrop for our D and D games. So, it was going
00:39:58
to be the tavern for the backdrop for DN D, but then also the tavern for uh our Epic MBC for for Honeywood. And we we
00:40:08
thought those two will be pretty useful, but we've used it for so many other
00:40:12
shows, so many other things. >> It is actually probably the the main out of those three sets. We got the tecton
00:40:17
set, the tavern set, and the green screen and the tech and the tavern would be the one we use the most. Most
00:40:22
surprisingly. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. I I can't remember if there were
00:40:24
ever any other discussions about other things there. Maybe we considered a castle like a fully
00:40:29
>> like like permanent >> a permanent like was it was it down to tavern or something else? I think
00:40:33
>> so. I think we we would have always gone in my mind it was like the most
00:40:36
important ironically the most important thing is the tech town set. >> Yeah. Yeah.
00:40:40
>> That's the one that we we need to have. >> We know we'd use it a lot. And then the
00:40:43
next thing was that and then the green screen has come second cuz that's like
00:40:46
you can do anything with the green screen. And then third uh still important but least important uh was the
00:40:51
tavern cuz we will use that for doing D and D games >> and and but I think that would would
00:40:57
have always been the way we thought about it. But >> yeah, >> never thought that the tavern would just
00:41:01
be gets used so much. >> But I can see why now cuz it's just like this incredible well-made tavern.
00:41:08
>> So beautiful. >> Just beautifully made. >> And how do how does it work with team
00:41:11
decisions? Do you do you get one vote each and it's majority rules? >> That's exactly it's just whatever I
00:41:16
want. I get >> not easy. >> We basically as the it's the rules commander and
00:41:24
chief CEO. >> Uh it basically works that just like Okay, guys. I'm I'm sorry. It's I want
00:41:29
it this way. >> Just remind you I am Rowan. >> I want it this way and that's the way
00:41:32
it's going to be. Thank you. >> Thank you. And then we just follow his
00:41:34
lead. But it's the great thing about having three is is that any just >> any tiebreaker. Yeah. anytime and it's
00:41:40
it's very I mean it's we have to make a lot of decisions and it's very much a I
00:41:45
I suppose we're all pretty desensitized right now if you're the one that's
00:41:47
outvoted it's just like ah whatever kind of vibe >> we're all very and have been for the
00:41:51
longest time all very good at going okay I mean I think the opposite to you two but it's funny often will say that like
00:41:57
you kind of go I I don't I don't like this thumbnail I think we should do the
00:42:00
other thumbnail >> and the other guys go like no we both like that thumbnail like and you this is
00:42:04
like a running g you go okay well you guys are both wrong but that's cool >> yeah but they're both
00:42:10
Oh yeah, cuz the thumbnail was so important. E the thumbnail. >> I heard a podcast, I think it was Lex
00:42:15
Freedman podcast with Mr. Beast on and he was talking about if he's got a great
00:42:19
concept but the thumbnail is not great, he just won't do the idea. >> Yeah, wild. That's really
00:42:26
>> Mr. Beast really lives and dies by his thumbnails for sure. >> And that's so important because in many
00:42:31
ways for a lot of people the thumbnail the thumbnail is the entire marketing campaign.
00:42:36
>> It's everything. It's it's the first and only thing that someone might say.
00:42:39
>> Yeah. >> And it's the and they're either going to click it or not because of the
00:42:42
thumbnail. >> I know it hurts our crews feeling sometimes, but you say the phrase that
00:42:47
the thumbnail's more important than the video because people aren't going to
00:42:50
watch the video unless they click on the thumbnail. >> Which goes against everything we were
00:42:54
raised with. Don't judge a book by its cover. It's like literally judge it.
00:42:57
>> Judge it. Judge >> judge between the thumbnail, any text on the thumbnail, and what the title is on
00:43:03
YouTube. all so important >> and we've struggled with it for like it's an constantly evolving process of
00:43:09
going >> what maybe these these thumbnails feel a bit too >> kind of um over saturated and colorful
00:43:15
and this that what and well let's change it a bit let's we we're constantly
00:43:19
trying things with our thumbnails like we're never satisfied >> feel like we're going through a big
00:43:22
change again at the moment because they've got too samezy and too >> not that we use AI in the thumbnails but
00:43:29
they just look a bit like too overly edited or something they're too photoshopped and they look they But it's
00:43:34
just hard, man, cuz you like you're trying to make we we release uh multiple
00:43:38
pieces of content every every week and to to try and tell a story and try and find find the optimal thumbnail for that
00:43:44
particular video is such a huge job. >> I think we've got a pretty good system
00:43:50
down to like very at the very least like do do the video justice. But like yeah,
00:43:54
there's you could have a whole team dedicated to Mr. Beast does. >> Yeah, exactly.
00:43:59
>> Well, yeah. Creatively then, how does it work for you guys? Are are you guys in
00:44:02
the weeds with every aspect of it? >> A lot of us. A lot of us. >> Okay, I'll give you an example. So So um
00:44:07
I saw a clip yesterday that you guys put up. I don't even know if you guys have
00:44:10
seen this, but it's you in the Techtown store. A guy comes in. Uh he wants to
00:44:15
speak to a man. >> Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> And there's two really knowledgeable
00:44:19
girls that try to serve him, but you end up screwing him over with some >> I always Yeah.
00:44:24
>> Yeah. But so are you guys are you guys over that clip? You guys aren't in the
00:44:27
clip, but >> I'm over I I did direct that one. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So I I directed that and uh
00:44:34
we were all in the room when it got written. >> Yave may have been written by one.
00:44:38
>> Give you a bit of an like a from start to finish the process. >> Yeah.
00:44:42
>> So the the way the process works is we start with a writer's room which is
00:44:46
where we're going today's writer room is we're generating ideas for uh for
00:44:51
Techtown say and and so we'll have a big what about this? What about if a customer comes in and they or or for
00:44:57
that example, what if a customer comes in and they're a bit of a chauvinist and
00:45:00
they only want to speak to a man like okay okay >> who's the worst man we could put up
00:45:05
Rowan. >> Yeah. And then Rowan comes in and then so we go who wants to write that one and
00:45:08
someone gets allocated to write it and then they'll write that one and everyone
00:45:11
else writes other ones and then the next writer's room is we're reading the
00:45:13
scripts and we're giving notes on the script. So all of us together with also
00:45:16
with other great writers >> uh and then we go okay these notes that one's not quite landing change this
00:45:22
change that until we're happy with the draft and then it goes into the filming
00:45:25
and it goes uh and then that script gets picked and then on the filming day uh we
00:45:30
got we got the scripts now and we'll film it and in that case you were directing that one. Uh it's not it's not
00:45:36
always I'm not I'm not sure. It might might be one of might be one of these
00:45:39
guys directing it or it might be an outside director. Uh, and then we we film it. And then the next part of the
00:45:44
process is after filming is the editing stage. So we we don't edit anymore. We've got editors, but they'll give us a
00:45:50
first draft and then we'll go through and we'll give notes. >> So it's such a huge relief. We don't
00:45:53
have to edit anyone. >> Such a taxing. Oh my god. >> Because especially when we had uh jobs
00:45:59
during the day, you'd I mean there was a per there was a period where every Ron
00:46:02
was doing the majority of editing, but also >> there was a longer period where each of
00:46:06
us did one episode each You come home from, you know, 8 10 hours of work and then be like, "Oh, I got to edit.
00:46:12
>> I got to edit. I'll have dinner and then I'm going into my office to edit for a
00:46:16
bit." >> Yeah. That's that's why I'm amazed. I I asked before if you ever came close to
00:46:19
giving it up because it's um the tenacity required like uh you do it as a passion project, but um as soon as a
00:46:25
passion project becomes a drag. It's like that's when you question what it's
00:46:28
all about. Yeah, man. >> I do remember editing sometimes most of the time was a drag, but I do remember
00:46:35
the odd time being really jazzed about about what we were making and just being like, I want to be doing this right now.
00:46:42
It's late. It's 9:00 p.m. and I'm technically working still, but >> it was the closest thing to the the
00:46:46
dream that we had really, I guess, like making our own stuff even though nobody was watching it yet.
00:46:52
>> Um, the we were making our own stuff and that's that's worth something. It's
00:46:58
obviously like we would much prefer to have >> had views come along with that, but um
00:47:03
it was it was the closest thing that we had to to feel like we were putting our ourselves and our work out there.
00:47:08
>> Especially in those early days when you're like you haven't inverted commas
00:47:11
made it yet and you're kind of going okay this one could be a really good one
00:47:15
and you're kind of excited about editing and okay I think it's quite funny guys.
00:47:18
I remember there was a there was a real like there was cuz editing is another opportunity to re almost retell the
00:47:24
entire story like not so much with sketches where the duration's much shorter but you can really get some
00:47:29
definitely >> but you you um I remember being really jazzed when you get you've really nailed
00:47:35
a certain moment and you can share it with the guys and then there's a certain
00:47:38
beat that works really well and you've managed to just perfect that moment. I
00:47:42
remember editing the gold shirt saga and I was so proud of those videos. I was like, "Guys,
00:47:49
>> check this out. >> Here they are." Oh, lots of notes. Oh, no.
00:47:53
>> That's the other thing. Yeah. Yeah. You had to use You also had to some eat
00:47:56
humble pie sometimes. >> You got There's got to be no notes because I [ __ ] nailed this. And then
00:48:01
it's like, "Oh, wow. There's 20 notes. >> What is all What? [ __ ] you."
00:48:05
>> And you really Yeah, I do remember taking as a real personal insult a lot
00:48:09
of time. No. Oh, so you hate me obviously. >> Well, you're wrong. Well, you're wrong.
00:48:13
>> I I must say it it one it's good to have editors. You're right. But our editors
00:48:18
are so one so freaking amazing at what they do. They give us such amazing edits. But I do feel really bad from
00:48:24
time to time because the curse of an editor is all the feedback they're getting is this is wrong, change it to
00:48:29
this. >> We we need to keep in our minds to say, >> let's do a great job. I sometimes have the
00:48:37
impulse to cuz we get this this software called frame II where you can go through
00:48:40
and at that at 1 minute and 3 seconds you can stop it and put a note on the on the edit and I sometimes get the impulse
00:48:46
to just go hey this is great >> but I'm also aware that's a note >> that's that's a that's a note they'll
00:48:51
receive and they'll have to filter that okay that was a compliment and they'll
00:48:54
probably start getting quite annoyed by it actually that was another compliment like
00:48:58
>> so we always we give whenever we go we'll say love it great work we've
00:49:03
chucked our notes in like we do do that >> yeah I try to specific sometimes. Love
00:49:07
it. That moment at the thing was [ __ ] hilarious. >> Yeah, we use frame here as well. So, so
00:49:11
how many people have got access to it? How many people are allowed to contribute?
00:49:14
>> Can I can I ask you, do you need to log in every time you use it? Do you do you
00:49:18
review it if you're giving a note? Cuz every time, we haven't figured this out
00:49:21
yet. Every time we >> If you're in chatio, stop making us log in every time.
00:49:26
>> I I don't the team out there. Sha, do you have to log in every time?
00:49:29
>> YES, ABSOLUTELY. >> IT'S ANNOYING. >> FRAME.IO FRUSTRATING.
00:49:33
>> Why did you do that? Just let me stay logged in. It's like >> a verification code.
00:49:38
>> Yes. >> Yeah. >> Hey, Frame. I'm sure you're listening.
00:49:42
Um, please, please figure that out. >> Can you at least just do the 30? Remember me for 30 days?
00:49:47
>> 30 days. I'll take 30 days. >> Still me on my phone giving notes like
00:49:50
it was yesterday. >> Like it was yesterday. No one. Nobody stole my phone and is trying to give
00:49:54
notes on >> Yeah. Calm down. Calm down with your security. So, how many full-times? How
00:49:59
many full-times and what are they? What are the >> roles? 16. >> Yeah. On the quietest day, we've got
00:50:04
about 15 or 16 people. Um, and then as I was saying before, it goes up to >> like 20, 30, 40 on a busy day.
00:50:11
>> This is wild. E, so just three creative dudes having a bit of fun and you've
00:50:15
created these these job opportunities for so many New Zealanders. >> Yeah, that is [ __ ] cool.
00:50:19
>> Yeah. Thanks, man. That comes with a lot of pressure obviously because it is
00:50:22
cool, but it's like, okay, now we really can't stuff it up. I also love I also
00:50:25
love that we're importers technically because we are we sorry exporters because we're sending stuff out to the
00:50:31
world and bringing back American money bringing into the economy. >> Yeah.
00:50:36
>> Uh and the team is is ranges from we've got multiple editors, we've got
00:50:41
production, we've got a social media manager, uh design, we've got uh art
00:50:47
department, costume all inside our >> our space. Um, yeah, it's a fullyfledged
00:50:51
like production company >> where everybody they they do wear multiple hats. Some some you kind of
00:50:57
have to cuz it's still like we are much larger than we used to be obviously, but
00:51:00
it's still in terms of a actual production company, relatively niche. >> It was one of the things I never
00:51:05
>> I never sought out was to become like a boss. Uh, I I was like, "Yay, I want to
00:51:12
I can't wait to be a creative and do videos and stuff." And it it kind of
00:51:14
snuck up on us. It's like, "Oh, we have employees now. We have to be like uh run
00:51:20
do the business side and do management. >> Yeah. >> Performance reviews and stuff.
00:51:24
>> Yeah. Performance review. >> Do do you guys do that or do you have
00:51:26
like an HR person? >> We do some of >> we do some of them. >> Yeah.
00:51:30
>> But between the production team and us, uh we've seen our producer and us, we do
00:51:34
we do them all. >> Yeah. >> It's fun. >> And if you had to do like a pigraph,
00:51:40
where does where does your income come from? Like how much is like brand deals? How much is YouTube? Yeah, you really
00:51:46
need eggs in every basket because I would say maybe 20% from YouTube, 20% from Facebook.
00:51:51
>> I'm just going to make it easy. 25% from social media, 25% from our own paid
00:51:55
subscription website, which >> we have our own website called Viva Plus, which is people subscribe. It's
00:52:00
like our own Patreon. >> Yeah. And your merch store, by the way, it's phenomenal. Really great merch
00:52:04
store. Does that go all right? >> Uh that goes all right. >> It's a trickle. It's just another
00:52:08
constant revenue stream. Uh and then another 25% would come from uh sponsor jobs. and another 25% from
00:52:15
miscellaneous. >> Sponsor jobs are typically like a video game company or someone will come along
00:52:19
and say, "Hey, could you make a skit about our video game and put it on your
00:52:23
channel and we'll pay you to do it." >> Yeah. >> Uh and in many ways it's it's often a
00:52:27
bit like filming an advert like um but we try and really put give it our own flavor.
00:52:31
>> But that's that's a big part of our kind of a revenue stream as well.
00:52:34
>> I I um I've watched a ton of your videos. I I couldn't notice like a I
00:52:38
don't know a can of Celsius or a Google t-shirt or anything anywhere. We we don't do like product placement in terms
00:52:44
of it's just like sitting over here as a Coke or whatever. Like we generally what
00:52:48
we'll do is we'll do a dedicated video for that brand. So if it's a a video
00:52:53
game comes to us, they'll say what the new things in the video game are and we'll just make a full skit about their
00:52:59
video game. And so it's very obvious when we do sponsored jobs and we try to
00:53:04
make them as entertaining and high quality as and funny as well. >> The the best feedback is when someone
00:53:09
that gets right to the end of the skit and then there's our call to action. I
00:53:11
go, "Oh, I didn't realize that was sponsored." >> Yeah, that's cool. We made it. But we
00:53:15
also have like ever revenue streams from uh from exciting things outside of our medium, which is uh we've recently done
00:53:22
uh card game which is coming out. So, we just our third Kickstarter, which has just recently wrapped up. Uh so, a card
00:53:27
game's coming out. And we did a video game last year, so a bit of revenue from
00:53:30
that as well. So, it's like there they've got like different >> trying to set up as many little revenue
00:53:34
streams as we can. >> What's the biggest brand deal you had to turn down because it didn't fit,
00:53:37
>> you know? Oh my god, it wasn't turned down. So this is ah this is um okay so
00:53:42
so we we got a mass it's okay I can talk about it now it's been a few years I can
00:53:46
talk about this >> you can talk about it man >> we had through EA Electronic Arts a huge
00:53:51
sponsor job lined up for their newest Battlefield game Battlefield which was a few years ago now Battlefield 2042 or
00:53:57
something >> and it was the most money we'd ever seen in our like Viva League lives we knew
00:54:03
more money existed out there but we'd never been offered this much um and we
00:54:08
were like yeah 100% % it was like it was all go go go and then the funniest thing
00:54:11
happened co came along and so we couldn't film it and we were just like oh oh the the and the release date was
00:54:19
sneak out really really fast and we reached out to them and we were like okay so so we can't film and release
00:54:24
this we're going to film a whole series called FPS Logic season 2 which was going to be this big bombastic series
00:54:32
with with action and explosions and military vehicles and um We we we were location scouting. We were getting it
00:54:40
was all storyboarded and scripted. Then CO hit. We had to try and reschedule. They said, "Don't worry about it. It's
00:54:45
fine. You can you can we'll reinitiate this contract once the game is live and
00:54:50
we'll we'll do it for >> the first patch, >> the first kind of uh seasonal whatever
00:54:54
it is. They release like seasonal updates >> and then the game released overwhelmingly negative reviews. So EA
00:55:03
and their infinite wisdom were just like stop all marketing, cut all like so just
00:55:08
so that the job that it was just like just >> we were so excited by it. >> So um we were so pumped to make it and
00:55:14
it and it just didn't happen. So that would have been the most heartbreaking
00:55:17
part. There wasn't a pass on money. We just didn't we wanted it. >> We do turn down a lot of sponsored jobs.
00:55:24
>> We do. You get ones from mobile games or uh gambling companies and things that we
00:55:32
just don't associated with. We had a mobile game once ask us to make a very not R18 but very very risque video and
00:55:41
we were just like absolutely not. >> What was that one? It was that uh I don't know if I want to say the brand,
00:55:48
the one where it was like a devil woman uh walking towards camera and then she with big with hardly any clothes on and
00:55:57
they said they wanted could you please get Brit to play this character. >> I don't remember that one but
00:56:02
>> and then she mounts a devil man and like not simulated sex but like kind of like
00:56:07
they're grinding it against each other. >> I'm glad >> I didn't know we know I didn't know
00:56:11
those details. Wow. Yeah, I'm glad to I knew the costume >> and they said, "Yeah, can you please
00:56:15
essentially recreate this with Brit and one of you guys, I guess?" And uh remember the cinematic that they
00:56:20
reference and then lots and lots and lots and lots of money. >> And we went, "Nope,
00:56:26
>> no, >> cuz that's gross as hell." >> Is that is that quite a robust
00:56:29
discussion or you all pretty much on the same page? Like >> No, we're t typically very much on the
00:56:33
same page and things like that. >> Yeah. Stuff like >> that's one of the things that has been
00:56:37
to our success is we're almost always on the same page. talking about having
00:56:42
disagreements before and having to vote two. >> Disagreements are always quite trivial
00:56:45
trivial. >> Yeah, it's actually usually about very trivial things. The big things we're
00:56:49
always in alignment on >> Yeah, the trivial things. Now >> um now you built this thing on YouTube
00:56:56
and it it I mean you've grown to such a such a big um stage. Does it worry you
00:57:01
that it's like it's their platform and not your platform? >> Yeah.
00:57:04
>> Is this something you think about at the stage you're at now looking towards the
00:57:08
future? 100% so many things over the past 10 years that uh the platforms changed things at a whim
00:57:16
and don't obviously tell creators when they're changing something to do with
00:57:19
the algorithm. And like one time I can't remember how many years ago now, but our
00:57:24
Facebook account just stopped monetizing. And I mean talking to Facebook or trying to get it was like
00:57:30
talking to a brick wall. >> At the time Facebook was like a massive part of our revenue as well. It was like
00:57:36
over 50% of our overall revenue. >> Um, and it just suddenly just stopped >> zero overnight.
00:57:41
>> And we were and we were like what what's happened? What's happened? And and we
00:57:44
started kind of trying to we didn't have a contact. So we >> all there's just a little notification
00:57:48
in the top corner where everyone gets their notifications in Facebook saying you have violated our policies.
00:57:53
>> And then it go and and you go what what what have we done wrong? And and it says
00:57:56
look at the policies try and try and figure it out. Try and figure it out yourself. And we were and and so we
00:58:02
luckily we managed to find someone who knew someone we got. >> It was difficult. It was
00:58:05
>> it was very difficult and weeks passed and then we we even like heard that you
00:58:09
can apparently contract contact Mark Zuckerberg if you just email like something
00:58:13
>> Mark Facebook market Facebook back >> surprisingly we didn't didn't get a
00:58:17
response but eventually we got we got through to someone who was able to say >> they they figured it out and the reason
00:58:22
was the algorithm randomly just thought that we were selling guns. Yeah, because
00:58:28
we make videos about about shooting about shooting games. Do you want to go to something else? I did try to pivot
00:58:35
the channel without Is that what happened? That's what happened. >> This is um yeah, incredibly stressful.
00:58:39
Like suddenly the stakes are a lot higher. >> Luckily, we didn't have many if any
00:58:44
employees. That's definitely the most high stakes one. But like it happens, not every day, but a lot where you go,
00:58:50
"Oh god, that video didn't go off for whatever reason." Like on our website on
00:58:56
Viva Plus most like depending on what the content is most videos are within a small bracket of views like most things
00:59:02
get watched >> whereas on YouTube and Facebook it can be I mean especially Facebook some
00:59:09
videos can get almost nothing can can get right up here and so it's just >> possible
00:59:15
>> and that's the reason why we made Viva Plus our own subscription service is to
00:59:19
try and escape the algorithm. That was kind of our slogan when we first started. It was like we just need a safe
00:59:25
place we can gather an audience and it's going to give us avenue steady revenue
00:59:30
away from this unpredictable algorithm. >> How's Viva Plus doing? It always takes a
00:59:33
while to build these things audience. >> It does. Uh we're really happy with it.
00:59:37
So it's been out for I I guess verging on 2 years now. >> Uh and we're really happy with the with
00:59:43
the numbers and and there there's going to be a lot more >> uh content on the way there. So, it's
00:59:48
almost like I think we've got our like our hardcore fans that were just like
00:59:51
there to support us. They're there now >> and now we need to step it up.
00:59:54
>> And now we need to step it up and start producing content that draws in like a
00:59:57
wider audience. >> Do you guys have like a a business development manager or
01:00:03
>> the three of you? >> We don't. And it's actually something
01:00:05
that I've often thought about. >> It's one of those weird things. >> No, we know everything. I don't I don't
01:00:10
think there's anyone. We actually we we briefly dabbled in getting a marketing/
01:00:17
business person uh in Viva and it didn't really work out. There's there's no one
01:00:22
in New Zealand in my opinion that has enough knowledge in that singular person who's not already smashing it in some
01:00:29
other job. we would absolutely have to get someone from the UK or from America who's already working at YouTube or
01:00:36
Google or some highpowered company. >> But even then, that's such a different
01:00:39
beast compared to what we're trying to what we're trying to do. >> Like in a in a weird way, it's almost
01:00:45
like we are like, and I might be naive, but the the we are the right people for the job cuz we've been here since day
01:00:50
dot. And if we got someone who was very knowledgeable from like a BBDO or Sachi and Sachi or something,
01:00:58
>> they just wouldn't have the right mentality for our fast and loose comedy.
01:01:02
They would have this marketing lens on it which >> I don't know right if they were young
01:01:08
like us gone through this this marketing kind of >> it would have to be this like really
01:01:12
disruptive like disruptive uh vibe that like a lowbudget disruptive vibe but ironically attached to this big thing
01:01:20
that we've built that >> I see I don't even know what what we're
01:01:24
pitching for and that was a big part of like uh when we were trying to find a person for this role we really didn't we
01:01:29
were like we're trying to craft an entirely new role here >> but we do have a great team behind us.
01:01:33
So like our team is very knowledgeable. Our social media team is great. Our marketing is great. We also are ripped
01:01:39
by our CA creative artist agency in the states and they are very wellconed worldwide.
01:01:46
>> They they know their stuff. They're very good. >> They're not necessarily they're just our
01:01:50
agents. They're not our business managers, but they almost act like our business.
01:01:53
>> They have some really good ideas sometimes. Yeah. So, we've catch them
01:01:57
regular. >> Have they pitched any celebrity collabs or anything? Like a cameo from
01:02:02
>> We would We would genuinely if we were in the States, we'd be doing a bunch of
01:02:04
that, I think. Uh, >> so who who are some of some of your um A-list fans? >> T
01:02:13
um you know, and we're a fan of you, T. >> And we're a fan of you, T.
01:02:18
>> It makes me so happy hearing that. >> That's what makes me so happy as well.
01:02:21
You you hear about these odd little T's probably the most famous one that we
01:02:26
know of, but you hear of these odd little celebrities here and there. You go, "Oh my god, that person
01:02:30
>> Joey Batty Joey Batty >> Joey Batty the guy." So he's Joey Batty
01:02:33
who who played Dandelion in The Witcher opposite Henry Cable the in the TV series.
01:02:37
>> He messaged us. >> He messaged us after Witcher wrapped up. He was like cuz we did Witcher Logic and
01:02:42
where uh we played Geralt and I played Dandelion. Very much inspired by his portrayal and it was just so cool to
01:02:48
know that he's seen that. I would love to hear from Henry Caval. >> I want It's one of those things where
01:02:55
I've you always wonder like there must be like people who Joey Batty's watching
01:03:00
it. Surely he's going he would have shown Henry. He would have and I bet he laughed and laughed and laughed and
01:03:05
laughed and laughed >> and subscribed. I have to think about that. What other big F all we know Brad
01:03:12
Pit like is a is a quiet little fan and love and is a bit of a nerd like >> you and watches our thing. you who knows
01:03:18
and I'm and I often kind of want to say like if you are famous >> if you're a big famous person can you
01:03:24
[ __ ] just reach out and say hi >> so so we can go oh awesome didn't didn't
01:03:30
realize that's awesome >> I'm in New Zealand >> t stop being so cool right
01:03:36
>> I think that'll be a good fit like you your humor is very um nerdy humor but
01:03:40
it's it's very Kiwi humor as well >> very Kiwi humor >> which makes it even more more amazing
01:03:44
that it's connected with an international audience rather I think I think that's why it's connected with an
01:03:48
international audience. Like the Americans love Father of the Concords. They love Taika. And I I think that's
01:03:54
part of the reason why we've gone so well is we do have a lot of shortorthhand for our acting and our
01:04:00
writing. And one of those short hands is whenever we're getting into, you know,
01:04:05
silly, I want a silly serious mode is to go Kiwi accents >> or the opposite is what we like. We
01:04:13
could be like doing a Techtown uh skit and we're just talking like, "Oh, did
01:04:16
you bring the thing?" And then the music might do to a big dramatic beat. We
01:04:19
suddenly start talking English. How how dare is the very like ethos of epic and me seeming quite kiwi in its in its and
01:04:27
like beginnings where we're following quite a lowly >> just average guy underdog that's the
01:04:34
whole I mean same with tech I guess to an extent just we're just following regular dudes the underdogs
01:04:39
>> so yeah like then we will often flip that idea in EpicNC man we've got this
01:04:44
this big dark lord who's evil and trying to take over the world with his fire
01:04:49
magic and then when someone goes Uh sir, your your flies on it. Oh [ __ ] Really? Oh no. Oh
01:04:54
no. >> Oh no. Oh but what? Oh the adventurers are coming. Oh [ __ ] >> I'm going to take we become resting.
01:05:04
>> If in doubt go restart. >> If in doubt it's it's worked well for
01:05:07
us. >> Absolutely. I >> I read um an old interview where one of you guys said uh trying new things is
01:05:12
our mantra. >> What interview was that? >> Oh years ago I think maybe I remember
01:05:17
that. I I I can certainly relate to that in the early days like back when we were
01:05:21
like um music videos aren't working let's try this halfstone skit's not
01:05:26
working let's try this we just keep trying until we kind of landed on things
01:05:30
that was definitely if we didn't keep trying new things like if we were still
01:05:33
trying to do music videos I don't know if we the context of uh I think the the
01:05:39
answer that we gave then is still I I feel is still valid cuz we still do new shows to this day uh is
01:05:44
>> we still do new shows and still iterate on the shows like Tech Town and NPC man
01:05:48
like they're still constantly evolving and we'll try something and and sometimes it won't work and we'll move
01:05:54
on. >> That actually is a conversation we've kind of recently had in the writer room
01:05:56
is like um should we have a writer room and try and generate like a brand new series like and try and um just come up
01:06:03
with new stuff >> and we have done a bunch of new stuff recently. Some of it's not landed and
01:06:07
you kind of go well we enjoyed making that it's not landed we'll move on and
01:06:10
then some of it has landed and we've g some awesome new things to do. >> So the writer room what does that look
01:06:15
like? Who's in there? Three of you, >> three of us, and then three others. So,
01:06:18
we got Ben Vanlier, who's kind of our head writer. We've got Gabe uh I was
01:06:22
going to say Gabe Newle. >> I was going to say Gabe New. That' be great. He's he's a very We don't have
01:06:28
>> Gabe Gabe Lunty and uh Brit Scott Clark, who's Ben and Britt are both very
01:06:32
prominently featured in in our sketches as well. >> So, are your weeks quite structured now?
01:06:38
>> Yeah, quite >> but at the moment that just shocker. >> Yeah. Yeah. Busy busy.
01:06:43
>> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And when do you do you film? Do you film constantly or do you film a certain
01:06:47
period each year? >> So, we used to when when it was just us, we'd film like every second or third
01:06:52
weekend probably and just try and get as much as we could, which often wasn't
01:06:55
more than one or two sketches. No, we probably got pretty good actually before >> by the time we were doing three sketches
01:06:59
a day. It would be kind of like, okay, let's we're filming on Saturday at
01:07:02
Howard Village. Let's try and get five. >> Yeah. Yeah. But it was and then we had a
01:07:07
producer join us, Alex, a few years ago after we did our short film, Balance Route, he jumped on for Balance Route
01:07:11
and he kind of he re he he made us reevaluate our entire structure, which was he was like, "Why aren't you guys
01:07:17
doing filming blocks?" And our weird resistance to it cuz it was just wasn't
01:07:21
the way we did things. But I remember we then more weird him out, the more it made sense. Like we could b we could
01:07:26
book out um external crew much easier because they'd be on for numerous days.
01:07:31
Same with cast. like it would just and and then it would be cheaper and you get more out of it and we tried it out and
01:07:36
it was immediately sold. So we for the longest time did four filming blocks a year which probably averaged about two
01:07:42
weeks each time. It's about 8 weeks of filming and then now we we're trying
01:07:45
this year we're trying >> two was it not three weeks >> two and a half generally maybe two and a
01:07:50
half. Um and then now we're doing three >> we're triing this year just even less
01:07:55
filming blocks three big filming blocks. So, we've just come out of big filming
01:08:00
block and uh it's kind of shed us. >> Yeah. No, we're super giant. That's why
01:08:04
that's why I look the way I do. >> No, you usually look like that. >> Yeah, I do. I actually look like.
01:08:08
>> Yeah. Thanks, man. Thanks, man. >> And and the release schedule. So, the
01:08:10
the clip I'm I was talking about earlier that came out yesterday. Um I saw it
01:08:14
last night. Had been up for like 5 or 6 hours. So, I'm guessing it came out like
01:08:16
11:00 a.m. >> Uh they come out and so 9:00 a.m. is our release time. >> We used New Zealand.
01:08:22
>> Why is that? Where's that peak time in the Interestingly, we used to for the
01:08:25
longest time, for all time essentially, release at 1000 p.m. New Zealand time. The reason being is it's just before
01:08:33
people wake up in the East Coast in the States. So, the video would be ready for
01:08:37
them when they wake up and they're having their breakfast or going for a poop or whatever. And then essentially
01:08:42
the video would get views as the sun rises around the world. >> Yeah. >> Um,
01:08:45
>> we follow the poop. >> We follow follow the poop around the world.
01:08:49
>> That's your mantra. That's the mantra. It's on the wall. >> Follow the poop. uh releasing videos at
01:08:54
10 p.m. once you've we've now got a very established crew and people who are
01:08:57
trying to work 9 to5 was starting to become a little bit of a nightmare. >> If there's any any little errors or
01:09:02
something, you go, "Oh, that thing's wrong. That thing's wrong." You can't
01:09:05
fix it or you can't change it until the next day, >> which is a bit of a shame. So, we were
01:09:09
having a bunch of uh videos be delayed to 9:00 a.m. anyway. So, we were like, "Well, let's try a different time." And
01:09:15
9 a.m. kind of makes sense. It's it's kind of that's midafter afternoon in the
01:09:21
east coast of America. So you're getting people on the way home or their lazy
01:09:25
afternoon scrolling type thing at work and then following again it's following
01:09:29
it's afternoon poops following the afternoon poops >> and I suppose also in in Europe
01:09:34
>> follow the poop >> for any any night owls that might might be awake to still to still see them kind
01:09:39
of like >> cuz on YouTube and Facebook still to this day the algorithm rewards that
01:09:43
first 24 hours. So if you can just get a good circle of the globe >> I I I know it's not it's not practical
01:09:49
for us. I feel like the perfect time to release would be like 5:00 a.m. or something cuz cuz then you go that's uh
01:09:56
hitting America or all just kind of early early morning and it's also it's
01:10:01
5:00 in the afternoon for like Europe. >> So like yeah to be honest. Yeah. I think
01:10:05
the time that we were doing it maybe midnight would be like the perfect time. New Zealand time.
01:10:10
>> We were we were doing 10 p.m. because it was just we could just kind of hit go
01:10:14
live before you go to bed. >> Yeah. Final checks and stuff. Do one of you must still bother about the
01:10:19
analytics. Sit there looking at it the first hour. >> I used man I used to live by that. Um
01:10:25
nowhere near to the same extent I used to just like you used to like like just follow the views. I mean what I was
01:10:30
saying the comments as they were rolling in. I I for the longest time was so engaged with uh analytics but especially
01:10:36
the vanity number of subscribers which I like >> just have that as a tab open.
01:10:41
>> Honestly it was one of the first things I checked when I woke up. Do >> you know the part that sucks the part
01:10:45
that kind of almost probably ruined it for you? >> Yeah. and me a little bit is when there
01:10:48
used to be social blade would give you a live count. >> Yes. >> And so you could literally open it up if
01:10:53
if we had it now. We'd open it up and have it here. >> Yeah. >> And you see the number just go like uh
01:10:58
up >> up. You're like >> down. Who was that? Down. >> And the thing is we'd find them and we
01:11:04
force them to resubscribe. >> It's fun to watch. It's just fun to watch your little number your little
01:11:09
number. This number that represents your success just moving. Yeah. You look at it.
01:11:12
>> And you I really like I I don't know. I think this says a lot about me, but I
01:11:16
put so much value on that number to the point of like but I think that was it's
01:11:19
a natural thing to do, but it really doesn't mean as much as people think, man. Like we we I I used to lean on it
01:11:25
very very hard. I think some sometimes it still works in our favor of people being like, well, they've got x amount
01:11:30
of subscribers and so we can approach them with a sponsor job or something. >> There there are channels significantly
01:11:35
smaller than us that get more views and channels significantly larger that get less views. It doesn't really
01:11:40
>> It's all about engagement on each video rather than the subscriber number.
01:11:43
>> Yeah. How much um does the algorithm play into your into your process when
01:11:46
you're in the writer room now, >> if at all? Do >> you know what? It's not the algorithm.
01:11:52
And I've heard actually Mr. Beast say this as well is it's not the algorithm
01:11:55
is not your fault. It's it's it's your audience. Like you need to think about
01:12:00
what your audience wants. And I mean the algorithm is the audience. If they're
01:12:05
not watching and not liking it, then more people are going to not watch it and not like it. And the algorithm is
01:12:10
just the barrier of that essentially. in terms of the ideations that I don't give
01:12:14
the algorithm any thought which is quite >> we just try and make stuff that we think
01:12:18
is funny >> that we like and that and by virtue of that the fans will like
01:12:23
>> yeah and five to 10 5 to 10 years have you thought about yeah where do you see
01:12:28
yourselves >> I we will do you plan that far ahead can you plan that far ahead
01:12:33
>> it's quite >> no >> I don't know it's a tricky one I I
01:12:36
>> we definitely plan a lot further ahead than we these days we used to like I
01:12:40
would say some things are being planned 18 months to 2 years ahead. >> We would we would have done a feature
01:12:46
film in 5 years. >> 5 years. One thing that we're really passionate about at the moment is making
01:12:52
video games. I would say video games. >> Another one maybe two video games.
01:12:56
>> 5 years from now, I'd love to be like sitting on a really really really
01:12:59
successful video game. We we enter I'm super passionate about both those those were we we entered this space
01:13:07
being our two passions were film making and video games and for like 15 years we've been doing just the film making
01:13:13
the video game it's time to do some video games we've done one we did a video game and released last year which
01:13:17
went really well um which was a really it was a small it was small indie um game set in the world of epic semen and
01:13:25
and we're so stoked with how how it went and Conrad and the team at at Fusion and
01:13:29
played so well. >> Um, but yeah, we want to make bigger and better games as well.
01:13:34
>> It's been creeping and I haven't had this little daydream in at least 12, 13,
01:13:39
14 years, but it's starting to creep into my daydreams again to be like, h there's this little dream of being at
01:13:46
the Oscars, receiving an Oscar for the dream. It never went away >> for a feature film.
01:13:50
>> Yeah. Yeah, it has. >> Is it coming back? >> It's kind of creeping back.
01:13:54
>> Manifest manifest >> of going, >> did you ever push away? I always I give
01:13:59
myself like Oscar acceptance speeches in the car sometimes. Like I never I never
01:14:03
stopped. >> I I I kind of did stop for a long time going I'm really happy with where Viva
01:14:08
is. >> Yeah. That's >> and I but now it's because >> the we've been having a lot of
01:14:15
conversations about doing feature films within the last kind of 3 four months >> and it's got and I'm kind of going oh
01:14:21
wow it's pretty real for us to be possibly doing that soon and the little voice in my head going what if you want
01:14:27
to ask her? I just like to thank the academy. >> Then you'd finally have made it and you
01:14:30
can be >> and then I'll be eternally happy and never have to be if you get an Academy
01:14:34
Award. You'll be eternally happy. >> What's this expression of Jim Carrey?
01:14:37
Like I wish everyone could win an Oscar so they realize how much it doesn't matter.
01:14:40
>> Well, let me be the judge of that. >> I will be happy forever. I'll finally be
01:14:44
happy. >> And can can it be on the three of you or if one of you decides you've had enough
01:14:49
and you just don't want to do it anymore? Uh what have you seen? >> So the Okay, hang on. Okay. Okay.
01:14:54
Hypothetical. Let's say right now we all died in a car crash. What What do you
01:14:59
think would happen to Viva? >> I'd be very surprised how the car hit us
01:15:02
right now. >> Okay. Let's say after the three people uh right now >> I I think even now even now right at
01:15:12
this moment it would it would somehow find its feet again. And >> I think people could like
01:15:18
>> it would struggle. Don't get me wrong. whether or not we all died or if we just
01:15:22
slowly all kind of disbanded. I I feel like we've got such an awesome cast now
01:15:27
and like a main cast with us like Ben and Brit then a secondary cast. >> That's the thing I was going to say if
01:15:33
one of us went away like there's the Ben could step in. Um but >> yeah, I don't I that it would be tricky.
01:15:42
I'd hope it would because it's just the I I think Viva I want we want to
01:15:45
establish Viva as the thing that that outgrows us out >> and and that in 10 years or more that
01:15:52
there's there's some other people running the dayto-day of the skits and
01:15:57
stuff. >> My 10 year thing is I I always want to be doing this sketches in some capacity
01:16:01
but just not being as beholden to them as we are now. Right now we're very much
01:16:05
it's all we've been doing for the longest time. I've done over 1500 videos
01:16:08
now, which is like I'm so grateful to be able to do it, but I would love to be
01:16:11
able to be more creatively involved in longer form content over here and come back to the sketches just kind of
01:16:18
whenever I wanted. If there are a few YouTube channels that are vastly different castwise than they used to be
01:16:24
10 years ago, like College Humor is >> basically there's no one surviving from
01:16:30
the original College Humor crew. >> Yeah. Still gone. and like uh Corridor
01:16:35
Digital like they've really brought up a bunch of talent. It's still got Samo,
01:16:39
but they've brought up a bunch of people. >> This is like an extreme example, but
01:16:43
when Funny or Die launched, if you knew the website Funny or Die, which was launched by Will Frell and Adam McKay
01:16:50
and somebody else, I think, but they and they would just they just help they it was a platform for all of these other
01:16:56
really talented comedians and filmmakers to make content and they would pop in once every while. And it was much
01:17:01
different to the infrastructure than what what we've got with Viva. But um I
01:17:04
I love the idea of of doing that of like just not completely leaving and always it'll always be comfort food for me
01:17:11
coming back and just doing sketches even after we make a feature. I'd love to
01:17:14
come back and keep them. >> Yeah, because it's a lot of work you guys are doing. You do do you have
01:17:17
moments where I suppose it never happens on the same day where you're all feeling
01:17:20
the same way, but you must have moments where you just feel creatively bankrupt.
01:17:23
>> 100%. >> That's it doesn't it very rarely happens with all of us at the same time. And
01:17:28
that's one of the benefits of having three people. >> Sadly, it did happen all at the same
01:17:32
time a few days ago. >> Recently, >> straight after the the first writer's
01:17:35
room after the filming block was just like, "Okay, ideas, guys. What do you
01:17:39
got?" >> All right. Be funny. Go. >> Funny. You got something funny.
01:17:42
>> But generally, that's the great thing about three people is one will be down,
01:17:46
the other two can pick up the slack. Maybe two down and one can affect >> do a lot of heavy lifting. I
01:17:50
>> I I do worry about it. Like it is something I I'm constantly striving to
01:17:54
try and find a bit more work life balance. Um and and it sometimes it feels like we've go go straight from
01:18:01
Christmas to the next year and straight into it to the next. >> We haven't stopped since the start of
01:18:05
this year. It's actually this has been a crazy one in particular. >> Yeah.
01:18:08
>> So I it's something I would >> genuinely to an Yeah. work life balance
01:18:12
is something we need to focus on where we we are kind of victims of our own self-inflicted success
01:18:18
>> which uh we're so obviously blessed and privileged and stoked to have. But yeah,
01:18:23
there's >> a YouTuber burnout is a big thing. So many people talk about it.
01:18:28
>> Is it actually >> genuinely? Yeah. Yeah. A massive thing. The the amount of YouTubers that give up
01:18:34
and their the reason for giving up is burnout is >> because you become a slave to the
01:18:38
frequency of it's an inferno of content, isn't it? >> Absolutely. The reason why he says
01:18:44
specifically YouTuber or like in like um that kind of burnout is because >> you've got this expectation of this
01:18:50
schedule and you got to keep that algorithm going other if you stop for a period of
01:18:56
time there's a chance that it can kind of like >> it's the same kill your algorithm
01:19:00
>> same with Twitch and Tik Tok and Facebook Facebook >> there was this huge like this this this
01:19:05
exodus of YouTubers in the last like it was like a year ago or something I just noticed like so
01:19:09
>> so many really big key YouTubers I'm done. I can't I can't do it anymore. It
01:19:14
was just that that their dream had turned into a nightmare and they were uh they were just feeling trapped and
01:19:19
stuck. >> About a year ago, wait, there was a large number that gave up last year
01:19:24
>> and I was Yeah, we were it's it's so different if it was just >> most of them felt like they were just
01:19:29
one it was like one person YouTubers, the solos cuz we've >> even if it's a rough day like we're
01:19:34
doing a rough day with mates and we can kind of like you know lean on them a bit
01:19:38
but um but yeah, I couldn't imagine it. wouldn't that would never have lasted
01:19:41
with doing one person wouldn't. >> If you had to start again today with
01:19:44
zero audience, what would you do the same? What would you do differently? >> I'd be pissed.
01:19:50
You know what? I'd be really angry after starting. >> That's an interesting question because
01:19:54
it's a totally different world now. You couldn't just I don't I think starting
01:19:59
>> a whole brand new skits channel from scratch would be harder now cuz you've
01:20:03
got cuz back when we started there was just YouTube basically and Facebook. Tik Tok and all these reals.
01:20:10
>> You just YouTube just kind of accepted anything that was pretty cool. >> You know, we it was it was we got our
01:20:17
growth because we it was we we were doing just something quite endearing which was doing parody music videos and
01:20:22
and that unto itself was like worthy of viewership even though they weren't particularly good. I I think it was this
01:20:27
this innocent time where if you changed a couple of words in a song and re-released it, it was like that's cute.
01:20:32
But now it's so overwhelmingly like like just oversaturated that uh that that
01:20:37
just can't couldn't fly. >> Even when we started doing sketches like
01:20:40
there weren't many people doing high quality comedy sketches on YouTube. There was smosh written link college
01:20:49
humor funny or die and that's kind of it. Now, now if you starting from scratch, it's just so saturated. I it
01:20:56
would be really if if we had lost out because because there is luck involved as well. It's I I
01:21:03
luck is a really key ingredient. It's consistency and creativity and passion
01:21:06
and all the rest of >> I had to start from scratch like start again like say the somehow the channel
01:21:11
just completely died or whatever and >> everybody could I don't know if I could
01:21:15
start from scratch >> and but then we No, but you've got 15 years of exhaustion behind you.
01:21:21
>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> What do what what luck did you guys have? Where's the luck?
01:21:26
>> The luck is um >> I think just having videos connect and having them go viral on YouTube
01:21:32
>> just being the algorithm picking up on them. I mean >> some I mean
01:21:36
>> a lot of that's trial and error though. Like I don't think you're giving
01:21:38
yourself enough credit for the hard work. So some of the things that I'd put
01:21:41
in vercom luck is in the early days >> your post going off on Reddit was really
01:21:46
important like um and that way was could often be luck like you post it and if those first 20 people that stumble upon
01:21:52
it just go h and download it then it just very quickly like those first 5 10 minutes on Reddit if it doesn't do if it
01:21:58
doesn't hit hit it then it's gone it's buried >> that's luck like literally who were
01:22:03
those first kind of people >> we like but we'd make good I mean this is if we decided like look let's keep
01:22:09
going cuz I don't know how to do anything else. We I think we've got the
01:22:13
we've got the knowhow and the >> I think yeah, we've got all of the
01:22:16
knowledge. The knowledge is something >> consistency. Uh make sure you're doing
01:22:21
like you got a consistent schedule. Find a thing that has a consistent schedule.
01:22:26
Find a niche like our niche is gaming comedy. Um make sure make sure whatever the content
01:22:32
is has got a good niche and then just make sure it's good videos and have fun.
01:22:36
>> And have fun is pretty important. It turns out >> you guys mentioned Reddit just before.
01:22:40
Are you are you um are you affected by comments at all? Like if there's some
01:22:44
comments saying that you guys have jumped the shark or you're not as funny as you used to be or
01:22:48
>> I got a great one the other day where just someone just said um [ __ ] Adam's
01:22:53
looking old and that was that was the that was the um that was the comment >> and you and you just went and that's the
01:22:59
one you obviously all these wonderful positive comments now that one I'll put
01:23:03
in my brain. >> I just remember that one. He's he's But he you did actually reach out to us
01:23:08
about skincare routines the other day as well. >> Did that coincide with like
01:23:12
>> Absolutely. >> You're only human. Um it was funny though 500 good comments but one bad one
01:23:18
and that's the one that stands out. >> Yeah. They don't affect me anywhere near
01:23:20
as much. >> I'm very >> I'm very like a tough skin to an out.
01:23:25
>> The to be honest I can joke about it because even when I first read it it
01:23:28
didn't actually really affect me that much because I am just getting older and
01:23:32
that's affected life. But what the ones that really do hurt me is where people
01:23:35
are just saying absolutely factually incorrect things in our comments and not lying willingly, I guess, but like we'll
01:23:44
do a video being like, "Hey, come check out Viva Plus. We've got so much cool
01:23:48
content over there." And these [ __ ] sellouts got they've got literally
01:23:53
millions, billions of dollars. They're famous, rich YouTubers, and they're
01:23:56
asking us for money. And it's like, "Oh my god, if you only knew how difficult
01:24:01
running our business was." >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. How does it work? So, you guys all draw like a
01:24:05
salary each month or >> salary? Salary. >> Yeah. >> Is it all right?
01:24:10
>> It's it's good, but it's like um there's a lot of overheads and a lot of
01:24:16
bills. >> Yeah. >> So, yeah, it's a it's a constant stress kind of going
01:24:23
we still paid good. >> Yeah. >> It's the hardest way to make an easy
01:24:26
easy living. This space we're sitting in now, this is a business I set up 15
01:24:29
months ago. It's my first time owning a business in my life. and you realize
01:24:33
you're the last person to get paid. The plant hire's got to be paid. The every
01:24:37
[ __ ] subscription has to be paid. And then like the random little things like,
01:24:41
oh, someone needs to come by and check the fire extinguishers every 3 months that charge to do that.
01:24:48
>> Oh, all the randomst like like regular expenses that come up owning a studio is
01:24:52
insane. >> And you guys didn't ask for this. You guys just wanted I just wanted to make
01:24:57
cool content, Dom. >> That's all I wanted. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. It's like you become like business
01:25:01
entrepreneurs without even trying to ask us for that. >> Totally. We we I I set out to make just
01:25:07
be making cool videos and now we've found that we would I would say that that our uh business/creative split is
01:25:13
about 50/50 >> between having like meetings and and actually being creative.
01:25:18
>> Yeah. >> Which but it's that's that's I get it. We totally understand and we're very
01:25:23
lucky to have that because it means the business is working. Um, but it's just
01:25:28
it's it's much more skewed towards business than I would. >> Oh, it's a lot to it. You you're keeping
01:25:31
a lot of balls in the air. All three of you. >> Oh, the the the clip I've mentioned a
01:25:35
couple of times that went live yesterday. Um, I know this morning when I wake up there's like over a thousand
01:25:40
comments there and the Viva Leert League account had responded to some of them. Who Who's got um like comment rights?
01:25:47
>> That would mostly be Tara. >> Tara, I jump in a lot as well. Still to
01:25:51
this day, I I don't check uh view, sorry, what not views, analytics as much anymore, but I still love jumping on and
01:25:59
giving a bunch of hearts and a bunch of comments. So, it'll either be Tara or
01:26:02
me. >> I jump in on we've got a Viv live stream. We've just launched like 24/7
01:26:07
skits all the time. So, I'll jump in in there sometimes as is Viva Delague cuz
01:26:11
there's just this ongoing of all of our >> about half of our sketches right now.
01:26:14
We're going to upload more and more, but it's just like it keeps going and going.
01:26:17
Uh so there's a constant stream of uh conversation happening there we can jump
01:26:21
in on and then on Viva Plus as well is where we all jump in from. >> It's almost like a Viv League TV channel
01:26:27
that's just constantly running on YouTube. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Are you guys good at switching off?
01:26:32
>> I'm not. >> No, I'm not. >> I'm I'm famously in the crew really bad
01:26:37
at switching off. Yeah. >> Yeah. I I I I it's hard to No, it's still even at like
01:26:43
9:00 p.m. I can be like I just want to clear the messages. So I kind of go like sweet just going to check that one more
01:26:48
time. Oh, there's 10 messages. Ah, cool. Ah. Um just that one doesn't concern me.
01:26:53
That one doesn't Oh, I need to make >> Yeah. But even on for me just talking
01:26:57
about weekends or holidays or anything like this, there's a there's and it's
01:26:59
something that I'm very aware of wanting to work on is I I there's an anxiety
01:27:03
that kind of builds up within me if we're we're not making if I'm not making
01:27:05
progress towards something. the same thing >> where it's something that I cuz I would
01:27:09
love to be able to just enjoy holidays. That'd be cool. And relax. Uh but it's
01:27:13
it's very much part of my of my um of my DNA, I guess, is is wanting to be actively working towards something.
01:27:21
>> It sounds like a strength and a weakness at the same time. >> I mean, a strength is and it's got you
01:27:26
as far as what you've got. >> But let me enjoy it now. >> Please brain.
01:27:30
>> Yeah. Yeah. >> You go. >> I was going to say I often call my
01:27:33
anxiety a superpower. like it it is it is a mental health condition but it has got me to where I am today. Like I I
01:27:40
have the same thing as Alan that I I I can switch off for a couple of hours, play a video game, read a book, do some
01:27:47
gardening, whatever. But then the anxiety will creep in of going, you're not being productive. You should do
01:27:53
something. >> What I can say is I've actually I've started enjoying the process of of what
01:27:56
we do a whole lot more. Like for the longest time, I was always so hyperfixated on the final product and
01:28:00
releasing it, getting it out there and just quickly moving on to the next thing. when now I'm managing to be more
01:28:06
present and just enjoy being on set set with mates which is a really cool >> I think I think the one thing that we
01:28:12
would all benefit from which is hard to do is the ability to take like a a threemon complete break
01:28:20
>> that's such a foreign concept there's no way I could do it >> and there's no way we could do it cuz it
01:28:23
would just be con you go if I I could ignore if say say you you planned it you're like guys I'm not going to part
01:28:28
of the next shoot block I'm not going to be here for 3 months I'm going away on
01:28:32
holiday or whatever you're doing I'm I genuinely say it and I feel I'm getting
01:28:36
fear already >> and then but my my fear is not the is not the FOMO. It's the the amount of
01:28:41
messages that I would have to catch up is the trying to catch up on afterwards. >> It's not even FOMO per se. It's it's
01:28:48
what I just said before is the I wouldn't feel productive. I wouldn't feel
01:28:52
>> my mind immediately goes to like and this is like confronting as soon as okay
01:28:57
3 months. Okay, I guess I I'm writing for the 3 months and I'm going to take
01:28:59
my lap. What can I take my laptop and I'll write? >> Oh, great. I don't have to do Viva for 3
01:29:03
months. That's great. What else can I do? What else can I >> Yeah. How else can I be productive?
01:29:07
Which again, yeah, is a a strength and a weakness. >> Yeah. How how many days would it be
01:29:10
before you you start getting itchy feet? >> One. >> I I might push it out to two.
01:29:15
>> But that is that is the thing. It's really really hard to actually completely sign out.
01:29:21
>> Yeah. >> A lot of jobs you can work really hard. You can be like a really busy person and
01:29:25
stuff and then you can you sign out and you don't think about it or be affected
01:29:28
by work. Broadly speaking, it doesn't bother me too much because the smaller
01:29:32
things I love doing. Like I love jumping into the YouTube chat and and uh talking
01:29:38
with fans or getting on Discord and talking with fans or checking some messages here and there. It it can be a
01:29:43
lot though. >> Do you know I'm I'm sc I remember this one time I kind of did this.
01:29:47
>> Me and Byron went away on a photography trip u and we're uh way in the South
01:29:51
Island. We had like >> I was away from full on reception for like 5 days. Like I had no reception. Um
01:29:58
and and it was incredible. >> But then I I remember being when I got back when I came back into reception
01:30:07
>> and and the amount of stuff for months I was catching up on like kind of going
01:30:10
there oh what what is this meeting? What is this discussion you guys talking about?
01:30:14
>> Oh it was that thing thing and I'm like when was oh [ __ ] and I felt gas lit the
01:30:17
whole time going like did you tell me about this? I was trying to >> you went on holiday.
01:30:23
>> Wow. >> How dare you? >> This is this is your punishment. You abandoned us.
01:30:28
>> That's scarred me ever since. It's like, yeah, you're just trying to even sign
01:30:32
out for 5 days. Yeah. >> How do you know if you're burning out or do you not know? You probably don't
01:30:36
know. I guess >> I don't I don't know. It's I think burnout is one of those things where
01:30:40
it's easy to say you're burning out, but I don't know what the true definition of
01:30:45
burnout is. >> Being tired and being burnt out are two very different things.
01:30:49
>> You can be very tired, >> but I feel like the like phrase burnout
01:30:54
is a medical condition, right? M >> is it is it when you do like there's
01:30:57
just like one of the one of the symptoms is just suddenly there's just no passion
01:31:01
or no creativity I don't it's not even that it's like when there's literally no
01:31:05
gas in the tank and no matter you could go on holiday for 3 months and even that
01:31:09
wouldn't fix it like you're like you're proper dumb >> yeah I don't know it's a
01:31:15
>> yeah I'd love to know what the early onset signs are >> I I thank you so much for sharing these
01:31:20
insights like it sounds it's it sounds like a hamster wheel >> as we said having the three of us and
01:31:25
then having a freaking awesome dedicated crew behind us. It makes it so much different
01:31:33
because they're solo with a tiny tiny crew. whereas we can really lean on each other and
01:31:40
>> and we have to take stock like I know I just talked about how like the the the
01:31:44
tiredness and the you can't take a break and stuff but then you've got to take
01:31:48
stock and go [ __ ] we're lucky >> like to have the amount of people that
01:31:51
would be just like would love to have this life like to make fun videos with your friends um make a living out of it
01:31:58
>> and you say going away for 3 months there is absolutely a world where one of
01:32:02
us could go away for 3 months and the company would ab keep functioning perfectly fine for the most Yeah.
01:32:09
>> Yeah. We're our own. >> I'm taking the next 3 months off, guys.
01:32:12
Can you more warning, please? We need more time. >> Say say you guys were Destiny's child.
01:32:17
Who's the Beyonce? Who's the Who's likely to break free and go solo?
01:32:22
>> Oh my goodness. >> Or who's who's most likely to go solo?
01:32:25
>> I think we're all Beyonces, you guys. >> We're all Beyonce.
01:32:28
>> I see the three of us as three Beyoncees. >> I remember I remember years ago I did.
01:32:32
>> You thought you were >> Do you remember like years music video days? I I kind of like made my own
01:32:36
little YouTube channel. >> You did. That's right. You did because you were Beyonce.
01:32:40
>> Cuz I was sick of the drama. I was I'm going to do it myself. I don't need you
01:32:43
guys. I'm the star of the show. >> I'm back. I didn't like that. It all
01:32:48
work out. >> Yeah. >> I think those videos are somewhere. >> I think I think genuinely all three of
01:32:52
us would would if we chose to go off and and succeed. >> They would be all three different to us.
01:32:59
>> You'd go off and become a famous writer. I think so. You'd go off and become a
01:33:02
famous actor and I'd go off and become a famous director, I guess. >> I guess so. That's where Yeah. Yeah.
01:33:07
>> What are you each most proud of with VLDL? >> I mean, it's a boring answer just saying
01:33:12
that >> cuz it's it's everything. Um, so I'm not going to be boring. I'm going to say
01:33:16
I'll choose something specific. >> I can I can say something if you want to
01:33:19
think for a bit. >> I'm actually most proud of the community. Like that's one of the things
01:33:24
that >> that's part of the reason I gave up on that winning an Oscar dream is because I
01:33:29
kind of went, man, we've really won at life here because >> we won our Oscar here.
01:33:33
>> We've won our Oscar with our community are our Oscars. >> No, the the uh making a TV or movie
01:33:39
series, you have a quite a one-way relationship with the audience. It's here it is, watch it. I hopefully you
01:33:45
enjoy it. Oh, bad scores, good scores, whatever. With our audience, we're constantly in communication. We're
01:33:50
constantly hearing from them. We're getting immediate feedback. We can literally stream on Twitch if we want
01:33:54
and have immediate conversations with them. And it's awesome. Our our audience
01:33:59
are very cool as well. >> And it's hard one. An audience is hard one. Anyone that's tried to be a content
01:34:04
creator will know. >> Yeah. Hard one and then hard. Like you got And you can't take it for granted.
01:34:08
We we don't. >> And then in a purely business sense, like once you have an audience, there's
01:34:13
so many things you can do. Like we had the cheat code for Twitch when we decided we want to start streaming on
01:34:17
Twitch. Instant audience. We want to make a video game. instant audience like >> well yeah no that's that's a very good
01:34:23
answer um I >> copy paste >> a copy paste but also I for it would be
01:34:28
uh balance out a short film that we made 5 years ago um we made a 35ish minute uh
01:34:34
short film >> and for me it was it was a milestone because it was the longest thing that
01:34:39
I'd written to date that was actually being made so a short film not a feature
01:34:43
film but um and it was proof that we as filmmakers could make longer form content than 3 to four minutes which was
01:34:49
like our average which I I think at that point I was a little bit worried like is
01:34:52
this all we can do like I don't even the idea of making something longer was a
01:34:55
bit scary and daunting >> uh but then it proved to ourselves that we not not only could we be do that as
01:35:00
filmmakers but we could make longer form content in the world of epic NBC man which is our intellectual property we
01:35:06
the world of our um sketches >> um and yeah prove to our audience and they they're just hungry for more
01:35:15
content like that so that that would be cool so that came out like 5 years ago next month.
01:35:19
>> Yeah. >> So, yeah, >> for for me, I'm probably like the kind
01:35:23
of a boring answer is just the fact that we were able to make a living out of this that that I never thought that was
01:35:28
ever going to happen. So, that I'm so proud of that moment, wherever that moment was where we could make a living
01:35:33
out of this. But on a more kind of practical like visceral level is our studio. Like the fact that we we now own
01:35:40
this incredible studio space that has these incredible sets and that it has this incredible uh cast and crew that we
01:35:49
have and actually the fact that we we are we've able to >> employ people and give people
01:35:54
employment. Absolutely. >> That's that's cool. >> Yeah. That's really cool.
01:35:57
>> That's really cool. >> It's huge. Creative jobs in New Zealand.
01:35:59
There's not a lot of them around and you guys have you guys have done it. >> Yeah. I suppose everything becomes sort
01:36:04
of, you know, novelty or semi Sammy after a while. But yeah, what's it like when you drive up to your own [ __ ]
01:36:08
studio? >> It's still very cool. Very cool. Very cool. Yeah. Like I still sometimes will
01:36:14
just at the end of a day just walk through the studio being like, "What?"
01:36:17
>> And then whenever you get a friend over who's never seen it before, a new
01:36:21
business meeting, you're showing them around the studio of >> this is the green screen. This is what
01:36:26
happened. This is the thing. And it's always a reminder when how like jaw-dropping they are. I'm like, "Oh,
01:36:31
that's right. This is incredible. forget cuz you get used to things. >> Of course. Yeah.
01:36:35
>> [ __ ] you guys have done it. Are your parents proud? >> Yeah, they're proud.
01:36:39
>> I remember uh when I was really young, so Epic NBC man, which Alan was talking
01:36:43
about just before, is based mainly on World of Warcraft, which is a very large video game, been around for 23 years. Uh
01:36:50
when I was 13, I begged my mom if I could have uh a subscription to World of Warcraft, and she said no. initially
01:36:58
begged enough and she ended up giving me a a subscription and I have had I pay for it myself now but
01:37:06
she still >> love of your mom. >> Um but uh had it for 23 years and uh
01:37:13
when we got to a million subscribers I think it was I sent my mom a text and uh and kind of said hey look thank you so
01:37:20
much. Shame. >> Shame. >> No, basically just saying thank thanks so much because you allowing me to be
01:37:28
who I wanted to be as a kid has got me here. >> Yeah, that's powerful.
01:37:32
>> Um, for for me, my parents have always been really supportive and stuff, but
01:37:36
there there was the early days where I could tell that they were doing their best to be supportive of a thing that
01:37:41
wasn't that successful. But my mom, all my parents are massive supporters, but
01:37:45
my mom particularly is so proud that she'll she almost doesn't want to gloat
01:37:52
too much around her like she's almost whereas my my stepdad's kind of like go
01:37:56
n he's famous and this that that many views. Mom's kind of like she's kind of
01:38:00
almost being a bit kind of koi about it. My my he's he's so proud of him, but I don't
01:38:05
want to brag. I don't want to brag. >> My dad does the exact same thing your
01:38:08
stepdad does is whenever he meets new people, oh my son's famous. Look, check
01:38:12
it out. Here's the thing. >> Yeah. Well, you guys have done great and it's all been done independently as
01:38:16
well. >> You know, you think like 20 20 years ago you'd be reliant on someone from TV3 or
01:38:21
TV a director of programming to rubber stamp it. >> That's another thing I'm very proud of
01:38:25
is that we we're just operating our own little bubble and unaffected largely by
01:38:30
the the the the creative world around us. We can just keep doing whatever we want to do and
01:38:35
without intent. It was never our intention, but we we've become this completely self- sustaining little
01:38:39
ecosystem where we can like from from ideiation all the way through until execution and to like the literally
01:38:45
releasing and having the audience for it and the platform for it. We're like it's
01:38:48
all self-contained >> which is which is mind-blowing like it's the coolest thing. And one of the fun
01:38:55
little stats I like talking about not having to go to media works or TV and zed or someone is if you take our
01:39:02
monthly views which is some 50 60 70 million views uh on any given month uh and then just take that 1% of New
01:39:09
Zealanders so it goes down to 400 500 600,000 uh views per month. Uh we are always in the kind of top five of the
01:39:18
Neielson ratings just under country calendar. the country. >> We declare war on country calendar. Damn
01:39:25
it, country. >> We'll beat you. >> Yeah. Well, relax. You got You got
01:39:28
plenty of time. Country calendar's been going for like 60 years or something.
01:39:32
>> You guys are just kids and we just want to trip them up. >> Oh, this has been this has been great.
01:39:36
I'm I'm super proud of you guys and what I feel almost like slightly embarrassed
01:39:41
that um I wasn't aware of this amazing work. >> Nothing to be embarrassed, man. Some man
01:39:46
of people who don't know about us. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Well, Adam, Alan, and Rowan,
01:39:52
>> Viva Dirt League, >> that's us. >> Thank you so much for coming on the
01:39:54
podcast today, guys. Thanks for having us. Thank you so much.