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[Music] Matt Heath welcome to my podcast thanks for having me Dom so good to have you
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here um yeah we've been friends for a while and I've invited you on and finally got
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some [ __ ] to promote well you know we've had lots of chats over the years in an
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unprofessional manner we we met over a in a professional manner though I think we met when we were both asked to host
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the radio awards together that's when we met yeah that's what I was thinking
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about this the other day because it's um it was like a pre-recorded Radio awards
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and I was thinking this was way before Co though oh this was the global financial crisis yeah that's right so
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there was the 2008 2009 so we old school crisis that one so we uh we were in a a
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like a studio and we did a like a pre-recorded video which was then played yeah that's right the radio broadcasters
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of New Zealand and pre-record always take so much longer than anything else cuz you just keep messing up and then
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you get to go again so I remember that taking a really long time but the reason why we're friends is cuz we got given a
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voucher to spend on booze and food and something so we had to meet up at another point to spend it and then and
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then then a friendship Blossom from there yeah that's that's right so yes so
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you you you were working at Radio H which is where you're working now I was working at the edge they both there's
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two media companies in New Zealand they're both different media companies and I think from each side to do Theo
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was your boss um a lady called Jane Hastings that that thought it would be good uh would be a good peering and I
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was that was the first time we met is when we're in the studio and we were doing this thing and I I was really
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nervous about meeting you because I I just thought you were going to be this angry this angry dude that hates
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everything wow that's interesting I wonder where that impression came from no well I suppose
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it came from the little I knew about you which was like you'd been the bfm guy
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yeah yeah um you you were in deja Voodoo uh back of the wi Masterpiece television
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yeah I was doing a lot of angry acting at that point but you you couldn't be
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more more Placid or peaceful or Cal yeah and um a friendship bonded and it's
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quite funny cuz it's um we're not we're not close close we may be see each other
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like twice a year and we're very spontaneous so I'll Mage you on a Saturday afternoon saying it's a sunny
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day let's go drinking and you you'll do the same yeah whenever I have a period
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where I'm like I might try sobriety like you're one of the reasons that I think I
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shouldn't do it CU we have fabulous ketchups yeah we do yeah they they're
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they're they're Drunken ketchups To be honest but they wonderful but but yeah
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they're great know they're fantastic but yeah it's like you're not we're not
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going to just meet and um you know and both of us are interested in health and such but those those aren't the days
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when we going to lean into Health are we absolutely not like the amount of the amount of long lunches we've had at um
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my favorite restaurant it's a place in Pon called prago where we they do amazing food and we won't even eat we
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might get some calamari this year but it's you know it's been a good lunch
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when it's dark and and then there's been so many different layers of people
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coming through and you're still there yeah um but great service there you know
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they look after you it's it's wonderful so um you're here today um the primary
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reason is because you've got this amazing new book out called a lifel punishing uh 13 ways to love the life
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you've got which is cuz you've always got to have that thing after the title
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don't you like say 13 ways to to explain what it is so it's actually really long
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name is it it is a great book it's really it's really you must be proud of
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it yeah like it was when when they sort of came up to me and said would you like
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to write a book I was like yeah and I thought this is going to be really fullon and you've written three books um
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I thought yeah it's going to be full on and you know it's going to be full on
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it's like painting my house was a similar thing I thought this is going to be a lot but I wasn't quite sure exactly
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how much it was and how all consuming it was going to be CU it's always over your
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head and it's really enjoyable and and I wanted to do a lot of research for it
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and I want to kind of do it right and then it was just so consuming for my life you know like you know lunches at
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prao out you know you know like by the way hey I'm I'm pleased you bring up the
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house painting thing because I feel like uh through the duration of our friendship there's been there's been
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three it's been like a Trilogy of excuses to get out of a a date with me first one early on it was the kids oh
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got the kids this weekend now your kids are like grow how old are your kids uh one's 17 and one's 14 yeah so that's
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sort of done yeah so they'll be you'll see them at prer so there was excuse one
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then the last few years it's been the book now it's been the painting thing
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which is and now I'm like such a free man like cuz the house painting cuz I wanted to do something I mean you know
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good to talk about the book but the house painting has been freaking big cuz I'm not the I wasn't the most practical
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guy but I've had to learn how to do everything it's been freaking great but
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like painting a house it's like shouldn't take it took four months to pain paint the house you know it was a
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four month epic journey of self-discovery painting the house cuz I started off being completely useless and
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near the end I noticed a weatherboard that need to be replaced around the side of the house was cutting it in um fitted
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it in you know and I was like [ __ ] I'm practical it's great I feel like you've used the excuse
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on me for more than four months anyway this so this this book it's um it's the latest chapter in uh
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what has been to date um an incredible media career really he like if you think about it TV series movie animated TV
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series um a signed musician morning radio weekly column commentary and now this it's it's Stellar Yeah well yeah
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it's just sort of sort of simmering it sort of simmers you know the pots never
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sort of boiled over it's just sort of just operating in the background kind of
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there's always there was always something but they're all kind of the same thing aren't they really you know
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TV radio books like transferable it's all media but it's um yeah it's really
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cool you must look back and be proud of like your body work yeah I I am I'm learning to be that way but what do you
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mean you're learning well learning to be proud of things cuz I'm always feel like
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they're not perfect and they didn't do learn exactly what they wanted to them
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to be and and I've you know and that's kind of part of what this book is about
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is actually appreciating stuff because you know you you like really lucky to have all these
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opportunities but always like I'm not quite [ __ ] ripping the throat out of
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it you know it's not quite the greatest thing ever and and so you you living
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this of constant um needing to do more to prove it and yourself and then overshooting the mark and then then you
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never and then it goes away and then you're like like recently I did my last
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column for The Herald and um I wrote it about that it's like it's only you only
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appreciate it when it's gone like that that's the thing like all your little
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projects when they move on that's when you go that was awesome but at the time
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you're going ah God nothing's working you know so so yeah I feel I feel sort
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of the same way and I never allow myself to be sort of um proud or happy of what
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I'm doing I wonder if part of that comes from being from like Regional New Zealand you know I'm from pal paliston
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North you're fromen I'm from a farm outside denan and no no one lets you get
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you know too too big for your boots well when I was growing up my biggest wor in
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life was that I could live close enough to a Dairy that I could walk to a Dairy and buy an ice cream I thought that
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people that lived like that were living the absolute dream and I'd visit cousins
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and stuff and I go you guys can just go to a Dairy that that was the most amazing thing and I quickly reach that
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goal and then there's just and I didn't even enjoy that goal at one point I was
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living above a dairy and I was thinking this is it you know I can buy things anytime I want it was a two 24hour da
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almost but like but now but now yeah for now I'm not living near a Dey well I am
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actually living quite near a Dey but I didn't even appreciate their moment so
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close to a deiry when they came through so how how happy are you right now pretty freaking happy are you I reckon
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probably the happiest I've ever been and most content and mow I've ever been in
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my life and I wasn't when I started writing this book which is why I wrote the book cuz I thought you know I had
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this idea that maybe I could read and research my way out of bit of a funk I was that I was in and I think it turned
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out to be accurate because because I've come out the other end feeling pretty
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freaking good actually it's kind of making me feel a little bit nervous how good I feel cuz I feel like I'm I'm
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tempting the gods to punish me for being this good why what um what was the what
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was the secret what what what has made you happy what what's been helpful I I
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think the most helpful thing I I think is just um just I don't know it's such a
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cliche but being a little bit grateful for things and looking the right way and and and things and it's like a stoic
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principle that we're always looking you know like say you can be in a house right and you can look at the mansion
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and go why aren't own the Mansion or you could look at the person that's living
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in a dump in Mumbai and go how lucky I am you know what I mean and and that's
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the same thing across everything you may not be the most successful in what you're doing but you're not the least
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successful and you are managing to feed yourself and your kids are healthy and all that that kind of stuff it's just
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kind of learning to look in the right direction on things I'm going to say you
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know all of us like we have look into our kitchen and we go oh this kitchen needs to be we need to this ISS very
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middle class but this kitchen needs to be renovated you go and you look at it it's like no it doesn't cuz some
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freaking people have to carry the water to drink on their heads you know like mill hundreds of millions of people have
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to carry the water to their their their bucket and and and if you told them that
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not only were you not really happy and grateful for the kitchen you have you're
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thinking about you know ripping it out and putting a new one in you know even if you can't afford to to to rip it out
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and put a new one in you're still looking at going jeez wouldn't it be good if that tap was just immediately
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boiling water with a freezing cold water one there and how come my fridge isn't
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plumbed you know this this yeah the tap water is not ased as what it there's a
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terrible way you can look and the truth is there's always someone better off
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than you and there's always someone living the dream life but there's always many many
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more people worse off than you and it's an absolute shame if you don't learn to
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enjoy the good times because you know as they say the bad times are always coming
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yeah that's so true what do you think the lowest was for you what was what was
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your low point I don't know the the I reckon the lowest point with for me and
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I start the book in it when I was going through this really freaking bad stage in my life and the most annoying thing
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for me was like I had no right to be feeling like that you know cuz I was like well what what really do I want to
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do here and what's the problem here and and I guess like I'd sort of been in the
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pos position where i' had like these two really important woman in my life my
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mother and and my partner and I and I I guess now looking back I just those are the people that I I I talk to about life
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and and one died and and the other one the relationship ended and so I think I was just kind of um spiritually at see
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and and then um probably punish you with a bit of this chat uh here and there probably 25 bottles of wine deep but
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like um but you know and then and then but I didn't realize that at the time I
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was just like why am I [ __ ] I was in Queen down actually it's another terrible way to put it I was looking out
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over the lake very glamorous like I was looking out the lake and going oh [ __ ]
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my life's freaking terrible and I was going is it though and then and then I
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had this idea that maybe what I could do is just go really hard on researching you know a a way to feel better about
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things and and then this I didn't know that I I was writing that book at the
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time but really that just involved reading a lot of books and and listening to a lot of podcasts well you know but
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from our conversations that's one thing that I've always um like admired about
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you like I can listen to a three-hour Andrew hubman podcast about alcohol and at the end of it it's like I don't
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recall any specific facts but I know that alcohol is bad and I'm drinking too
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much whereas you're really good at like listening to these things or reading a
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book and then like recalling specific quotes it's quite punishing to hang out
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with me though because uh I will just whatever I've consumed comes back out the other end like cuz your fact
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dispenser yeah well that's what this bug is it's just a spew it's what I've done
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it's what I do to everyone it's like I've just in ingested it and then spewed
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it back out um yeah so oh you know you're doing that self-deprecating thing but it's it's really really good like
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you're taking some complex and well researched ideas but um you know sharing
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it or reuting it in a way that's easy to digest I I think it's really cleever
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yeah well well and what I want wanted to do was um make it slightly entertaining
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as well so there's some humiliating stories in there and stuff but you know I'm very interested in history and
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interested in science and very interested in philosophy um my degrees is in philosophy well it's in
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anthropology and philosophy so it's kind of this is right in my my wheelhouse
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writing this book finally get to use that degree it's funny I only bought the
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degree out like I found it when I was moving out of a house and I found it and and like some you know the box of
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special things and I'd never taken it out of the cardboard that it was sent to
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me because I didn't turn up to accept it in fact my dad was one of the people
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that was handing out the degrees and he had to read or stand there with my name in one of you know those stupid outfits
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and and and I didn't even turn up to accept my degree that had taken me 5 years to get why I thought for some
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reason I'd moved on I I I don't know I just moved on I got the degree and I was
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out of there I was like it was wasn't an anger thing or anything no I think I was
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making a TV show at the point and that was all consuming so I didn't do it I
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just finished it and then forgot about it kind of and then and I got the invite and I didn't get the cap or the Gown or
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go down there or or do anything well do you feel sad now like as a actually I do
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actually why don't I go and enjoy the degree because like I could have had to
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throw the hat in the air and do all that and had that picture what's a moment it
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represents a lot of hard work I know and I actually had that moment when I um I um put it on the wall and and the dean
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in my house I was like oh I'm actually going to put this degree up it's pretty
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pretty good it took took me quite a while to get it and um and then I actually I I actually was talking to a
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friend um Andrew Schusterman at the time and I um sent him a picture of it he goes rubbish frame like spend some money
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on the freaking frame if you're going to hang that up and I was like oh yeah
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looks terrible doesn't it so the moment of enjoyment was very short yeah yeah
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yeah so um yeah let's because you mentioned this in in the book um you you mentioned your your mom and your ex
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lannie just a second ago so that was a su I think this was about the time we met so when we met um you were still
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with lannie who's um she might be not to some people as the bass player from the
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band Lop yeah yeah mother of my children yeah you got the two kids together um so
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when we first met you were still going out then you sort of broke up and then you got back together a bit um but it
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seems very amicable you're still it's an admirable relationship yeah she's a
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fantastic mom and she's just done such a good job and especially all those times
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when you know I was working a lot and you know she travels a lot and um we both do and she's just amazing like
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she's just a natural mom whereas I wasn't necessarily a natural dad took me
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a while but she was she just she was a baby came out and she was like oh this is what you're doing I was like [ __ ]
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does it I was like asking does it just keep breathing like you know I didn't
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know anything about babies I was like what do you do what what do we do with it she's like it's fine put it in a you
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know she just took charge and it's been great what happened there because it
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does seem like you've got a good relationship now it kind of reminds me a bit of the the relationship that I have
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with with my xjj but yeah I mean I was just walking over here I was texting you you know about some funny thing you know
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so we're good very good mates yeah yeah do like how you look back on that now
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and do you think um you like you could have tried harder or you could have done something differently or did it just run
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its course I I just guess it R's course and she's got a great life now and I've
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got a great life now and she'll always be in my life so it's like um it's sweet
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ass you know it is what it is that's cool and um yeah you describe who as the
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best person you've ever met alongside your mom which I think she she must have
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um God she must have been emotional when she read that she she probably hasn't read it yet
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all right she may not read this yeah I'm pretty annoying I don't know she she's
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heard so much of my crap like I think reading this book would be torture to just hear me go you know oh but that
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that's a high high praise it's a really nice thing and then um then there's
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there's your mom like I I never got to meet your mom but I know how important
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she was to you and she was um yeah you're from a smart family like your mom spoke five languages yeah um your dad's
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an a professor from Oxford yeah he he he got his um one of his phds at Oxford yeah so what what what were your early
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aspirations see I just wanted to be a rock star from really early on like I really I wanted to be two things an
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anthropologist like Indiana Jones and a rockstar and I remember saying that to a
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career uh you know counselor at high school I was like they're like what do you want to be I said well I want to be
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musician or rockar and they're like but that's not a serious thing is like that
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is it is and and or I want to be like an archaeologist like you know on a on a site so um so then of course my dad said
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you have to study law because he wanted me to be a doctor and and so I started studying law at y um but then quickly
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transitioned that into an an anthropology degree and um whilst playing in bands which was my main my
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main thing and interestingly enough our manager at one point was Grant Robinson who went on to be the Finance Minister
00:17:58
of new oh wow and Deputy Prime Minister yeah he yeah he sent me a he sent me like a this
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letter at some point um which was him sending out for us to get gigs like you know High School gigs like we were out
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playing in high schools you know cuz we were teenagers playing out and it was like they can so so I really wanted to
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be that's that's what I wanted to wanted to do and but I also also wanted to be a
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movie director as well so they're all pretty lofty goals for someone growing
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up and and um you know and and in the outs of Den on a farm it seems unobtainable and what what about your
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parents were they like Mor you know it's easy to say as a kid I I want to do this
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then to actually followed through and do it I was the third kid and so I think that sort of moved on a little bit
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there's not a lot of photos of me and my little sister um of four and when I was
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13 I moved into a renovated Barn one into the farm it was miles away from the house and so when I got my car I was
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pretty inde independent I was just I was moving I was moving friends in and out into the house as
00:19:02
well like I had one friend living in this Cottage on the on the farm and and moving people into my room so I was very
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it was very independent so apart from seeing my report cards and going you know they're always the same report
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cards everyone gets um you know but did your do your parents have like an understanding of um like the the the
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intell we get we'll get into the work you've done and it's all all had like a
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bog and San on it but um like I've gone in a a deep dive in you're working the
00:19:29
last couple of weeks and it's it's really clever stuff like underlying there's some real clever stuff did they
00:19:34
understand the the Brilliance of it or were they sort of like curling their toes up at what you were doing
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essentally CU my sisters have said to me that my mom would accept anything from me so you know we'd be on TV doing
00:19:45
something absolutely shocking like I remember we did the skit called um you know it was Perman and we and they ran
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into this woman called scat woman and Scat woman was just fighting pman and wh with you know you know I can imagine
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what it was it was just so um outrageous and then and then my mom's laughing at
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it and my mom was pretty straight like unbelievably straight but because it was me then it was fine you know if she'd
00:20:13
seen anyone else doing it it would be crime but but she was she was always very very very supportive oh you could
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just do no wrong no wrong yeah I I think Looking Back Now I I I I was lucky in that regard that she would L me away
00:20:26
with anything pretty much what um yeah what what did she what did she pass away from um she just did it was a it was
00:20:34
pretty it was just uh genetic heart disorder right she was basically she was basically destined to Die the day she
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died from from birth pretty much it was just a it was a and you know my father being a medical guy had a pretty
00:20:48
intensive autopsy done on on her when she passed cuz it was pretty hardcore for him you know he was in the in the in
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The Farmhouse with her when she went down and um you know he tried to save her but it was there's no chance
00:21:00
whatever um so yeah I mean it's funny cuz like she was a t toal um you know ate so well and then just she was gone
00:21:12
um and uh how old was she she was just very just just syy so um so that was that was distant to happen like you know
00:21:20
you know one of those things that there was nothing that she could do but you know I wonder if you know if you're not
00:21:25
try trying to I think about it like if you're not trying to live to if you're
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not trying to live to 95 and you knew you were out at 70 then I mean there's
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there's a lot more things you could have done but she was never going to be the
00:21:35
person that was going to be really rip it up like I wasn't really wasn't really
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but who knows I've got a freaking heart so yeah you know it's well known that
00:21:46
that um you can build resilience by doing tough things and forcing yourself into difficult situations probably the
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same maybe it's the same with your organs like punish them a little bit slowly over the years yeah maybe yeah
00:21:56
hopefully cuz done really had to go my organs over the years so what um [ __ ] what due to the sportic sort of nature
00:22:03
of our relationship and seeing each other twice a year like I I I feel I feel [ __ ] about this CU I wasn't really
00:22:09
there for you at the time I suppose I didn't didn't even know you mom like
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I've never met her but that must have been a bloody difficult time like yeah
00:22:15
no yeah it was um it was full on and especially like if you're to be honest bit of a mummy's boy so you know I was
00:22:21
like you know you know there wasn't long times you know and the last thing I I
00:22:26
wrote about in the book ity because you know I want to talk about there's chapters you know there 30 chapters
00:22:31
they're all about different emotions but one of them is grieving and um and you
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know like you know just before she died like you know last thing I said to her on the phone after a really long chat
00:22:40
was you know I love you m it was one of their classic 2hour Chats on the phone you know like 2our chat yeah we chat all
00:22:45
the time I think says a lot about your relationship yeah cuz she was a philosopher you know you know and it's
00:22:50
funny cuz I'm when I finished the book I was just thinking about what I'd written
00:22:53
about and there's a lot of a parallel between Greek and Indian thought like you know between um stoicism and
00:22:59
Buddhism and and and you know a lot of other [ __ ] in there Neuroscience all that kind of stuff but then I was
00:23:03
thinking about oh that's what my mom wrote her thesis on the parallels between Greek and Indian thought so um
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so you don't know what you're repeating a from your parents do you like you
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don't even know doing it's amazing what um what you pick up there sinks in yeah
00:23:18
yeah [ __ ] she'd be she'd be so proud of this book right well she' be she was
00:23:21
proud of skom so so this this book would be like a relief finally he's reach potential yeah
00:23:29
it would be funny she'd be like it's a bit it's a bit light man so so the 2hour
00:23:33
conversation the the last chat you had what do you what were the contents of that just general yarning yeah we always
00:23:39
talk about philosophy and politics and and and that kind of thing and you know and she was quite cheeky and smart and
00:23:47
she was like and in fact I've had lots of relationships where they're like oh
00:23:50
why are you always trying to win points over me but that was the that was the conversations with my mom were always
00:23:56
like who was smarter which was always her by miles but you always trying to see if you could prove a logical Point
00:24:02
against each other and so we're always spinning around at the end of the argument it would always be it was an
00:24:06
argument but it was pleasant and so I grew up with that these kind of pleasant intellectual debates debates that were
00:24:12
quite heated in a way but you were trying to win but there's also a lot of love in it so you know blah blah hat you
00:24:19
be getting sweaty while your mom was beating you on the argument you know on the phone you can't let it down and then
00:24:24
you'd be like anyway I love you Mom and you know so it was it was it was Qui freaking intense and so I think
00:24:30
maybe that's why you know you know I say in the book when I was sort of all at
00:24:33
Sea in life and couldn't really understand what was going on I was like probably because I wasn't having these
00:24:37
bloody huge conversations with my ex and my um and uh my mom although I feel like
00:24:43
my ex would have probably preferred if I didn't bring so much of that kind of
00:24:47
logical intense debate structure to our relationship so you're trying to debate
00:24:52
with her she like man I'm a bass player at B this [ __ ] what are we having for
00:24:56
dinner so did you did you did you always sign off your conversations with your mom that way love you
00:25:02
Mom fish them yeah yeah yeah always yeah yeah right was like anyway love you Mom
00:25:08
[ __ ] that's and then when did you get the news about her her passing who who
00:25:11
did that was that your dad or yeah yeah yeah my dad rang um did you want to talk
00:25:14
about that or oh oh when when he died do I want to talk about oh yeah yeah no it's fine yeah yeah he just he just rang
00:25:20
in the middle of the night said um she's gone and I was like what do you mean she
00:25:23
goes she she's dead she dropped dead in a study and I was like [ __ ] that's
00:25:28
pretty intense because you know you sort of worry about that when you're younger
00:25:32
don't you you're like oh my parents and then what happens it's quite intense but
00:25:35
I I behaved in a very cliched fashion I just drank an entire bottle of um Jack Daniels and tipped over a bunch of chair
00:25:43
and act like a real duck when were you at home yeah I was just having to be home by myself so I
00:25:49
was like and then and um I had a breakfast show to do the next day and I talked to
00:25:55
my dad and I said oh I'll fly down he goes well you have to do you breakfast
00:25:58
show he's very intense about work so I was like you got to get that you got to
00:26:03
get your job done flying down after your job so I went to my radio show and then
00:26:06
flew down yeah and uh it was pretty intense actually but uh you know happens to everyone isn't it it's not a unique
00:26:12
experience everyone Grieves everyone loses people yeah but it's just the sudden nature of it it's quite but I
00:26:18
suppose the the opposite of that is um slow death where you get to leave no stone unturned and things things don't
00:26:25
get left unsaid but it's it's a trade-off isn't it yeah and but when I
00:26:29
think about it in a way even though I prefer she was around obviously there were some parts of it that are really
00:26:34
good and that you know and that the last thing I see to us that and that we were
00:26:37
in a really good space and and not that we ever really had any problems I mean one time I turned up for Christmas din I
00:26:42
so hung over and I had bought anyone presents when I was about 23 and I and I fell asleep on the Christmas table with
00:26:50
my head down and I remember just been working up to be told I ruin Christmas but that relationship was pretty good
00:26:58
oh so yeah so how old were you how old were you when she passed that's a very
00:27:02
good question um I can't even work it out I was in 40s 40s right okay so she
00:27:08
so you yeah you got to make her proud she was proud of your work she was proud of your how you were doing as a dad yeah
00:27:14
yeah yeah yeah she she she she' she met obviously she'd met both my kids and
00:27:19
spent a lot of time with them and and so that's that's pretty good because
00:27:22
because I think that would be hard if she hadn't met the met the kids but you
00:27:25
know yeah and what about your dad he's fine yeah yeah I mean freaking pretty
00:27:29
rough on him tell you yeah absolutely was cuz you know he was stuck in that house and then then the huge snowfall
00:27:34
came in he was locked in there so he got online and he bought a new house while he was in the old house he bought a new
00:27:39
house I'm I can't stay in here as soon as I get out of here and then he he
00:27:44
moved out and I'll tell you what if you live in a big place people will know
00:27:47
this you know if you live in an apartment you can't store a lot of stuff but if you live in a farm with multiple
00:27:52
buildings you can store everything that you've ever bought or been past and you
00:27:56
never have to throw anything out for for for years and years and years you grow to the space you've got yeah yeah that's
00:28:02
right so the cleanup you know you know me and my three sisters and uh my dad cleaning up that house and all those
00:28:09
memories cuz when I moved out like I just left my room cuz no one was even going to go into the top of that Barn
00:28:13
again so that was just exactly as I'd left it they had to be freaking cleared
00:28:17
out there was condoms everywhere you know what I'm saying so many Posh wanks
00:28:22
there was so many things that needed to be moveed moved out um do you do you think he he wanted to move because it
00:28:27
was just too painful staying there yeah yeah I know for a fact he had to get the
00:28:30
hell out you know um cuz he was he was very they were they were a very devoted couple as it were as it were I don't
00:28:37
know that's not the right saying they were a very devoted C you know they were
00:28:40
they were the kind of people that would um embarrass the kids by telling each other how much they love each other over
00:28:45
the breakfast over The Breakfast Table dinner table and you're like but now I
00:28:49
think it's quite cool oh it is it's it's wonderful right it's wonderful um okay
00:28:54
let's talk about some of the career stuff so the book starts with um you retelling a story of a fist fight you
00:28:58
had in front of Tim fin in 2003 21 years so how old were you like early 20s yeah
00:29:04
yeah this is about probably about the same year is when you fell asleep at the dinner
00:29:08
table so um this is with your friend um comedy partner and bandmate Chris step yes so what's what's the story there
00:29:15
well well yeah like with the book I wanted to write about all these emotions and anger so I had to have these
00:29:20
examples of when cuz I used to be an Angry Young Man oh yeah you were saying before you thought I'd be angry I used
00:29:25
to be quite an angry person I can't I I find it hard to reconcile I know everyone simers down with age but I I
00:29:32
can't imagine you being angry you're the least angry person I I I I mean that
00:29:36
that story was freaking bad so we we're on soundcheck we're touring with Tim
00:29:40
Finn um and it's such a stupid story because we just one of the songs we hadn't been playing that well and I was
00:29:47
like oh I want to practice it twice and he said no um but there was another part
00:29:53
of the show where we we I'd light guitars on fire and and had them around the head with them um while while Tim
00:30:01
Finn sung the song inber hink song 10 guitars and I'd broken a couple of Chris's ribs the day before but I didn't
00:30:08
know because I'd swung wrong there was 10 guitars acoustic guitars supposed to
00:30:12
smash them over his head but just to mix it up on day three of the tour I swung low hit him in the ribs so I didn't know
00:30:20
that he was going through that pain later on I found out that he he had spent the night before in his hotel room
00:30:27
in a bath drinking vodka to try and deal with the pain with bath salts and stuff
00:30:32
I don't know that anyway so I was saying we need to practice the song three times
00:30:35
because we were terrible last night and he goes no and then and then we just got
00:30:39
into an argument and then next thing you know he's holding his the bird in front
00:30:43
of my face and then we [ __ ] beating the crap out of each other on stage I throw them down some stairs and then we
00:30:50
end up in the in Tim Fin's dressing room he's about to do his sound chck and it's
00:30:54
like the table set up for later on with like drinks and stuff on it and I throw Chris through the table and then Chris
00:31:00
is timin's up against the wall going is this a bit are we he couldn't understand
00:31:08
it and then and then I managed to get Chris's shoe off and I was just beating
00:31:11
him on the head with the shoe in the middle of the room and then just had this moment I looked around you know
00:31:16
those moments of clarity and there was people just standing there was things was wrecked and I was like this is
00:31:22
humiliating like what has happened here you're wildly inappropriate just so bad just so bad um
00:31:30
that uh yeah and so that was an you know yeah and I can't imagine myself getting
00:31:34
that angry again but but we all get angry and just the argument in this this book is that anger is you know one of
00:31:40
the things that makes your life unnecessary bad like not a lot of good comes from being angry you know you
00:31:44
don't make good decisions when you're angry you can ruin your life I mean got
00:31:48
prisons are full of people that got angry and um and you don't Red Mist yeah
00:31:53
yeah and you don't really need to get angry you no and and then you just embarrass when you when you're
00:31:57
regulating back to normal you're just embarrassed about how you acted even as
00:32:01
an angry text you know or or you never feel good like it say like if you storm out of a room and you've got angry and
00:32:08
you've lost control you've never made the situation better and you've
00:32:11
definitely not held your dignity you know and and you probably haven't furthered your cause and um yeah so
00:32:19
it's so that's something I would not yeah how did so how did how did you
00:32:26
in Chris mate it was a very very successful partnership yeah well um we met because I wanted to join a band and
00:32:33
he had a band and so I tried out to be in the band as a as a it was called kid tunity and I tried out to be a B in the
00:32:39
band was it serious band or yeah yeah yeah serious band and um and they were looking for a girl cuz I wanted a girl
00:32:44
bass player and at the time I had really long ha and he goes well you basically [ __ ] look like a girl so you might as
00:32:51
well be in the band you can play bass I was like okay so that was about the level of our communication for the next
00:32:59
but it was um it was very successful so you did back of the Y together the full length motion picture movie The Devil
00:33:04
Dar me to the band Deja Voodoo yeah yeah we we we we morphed into kind of a silly
00:33:09
band at one point yeah I think um yeah like re researching for this podcast like I think um yeah Deja V slipped me
00:33:19
past at the time like I I just thought you were this remember we got into that big scrap at an edge Fest like with the
00:33:24
band Alien Ant Farm oh no I remind me know this I I forgot you played at an N Fest hey did you play at n Fest oh no I
00:33:32
think like what happened was lony was playing El was playing an N Fest I was down there and we were drinking in the
00:33:37
in her dressing room and then there was an altercation about her mirror and someone thought thought we were stealing
00:33:43
the mirror and then ended up just being this fullon fight uh between us and alien amp farm and then the edge
00:33:50
organizers I think Leon said to our management they weren't even freaking paying what what why have we got this
00:33:57
these this band down here fighting our headline act when they're not when they're not even um they're not even on
00:34:02
the Bell they're not even on the bill what are they what are they even doing
00:34:05
there just outside Hamilton having a fight but it's sort of reinforced yeah and and the music of
00:34:13
deja voo like it's kind of like heavy sort of rock but I listened to it yesterday at the gym and it's um like
00:34:19
musically it's it's very clever like it's brilant it's like spinal tap like
00:34:23
comedy songs like what fight of the Concords was doing I I always sort of struggled with that a little bit because
00:34:29
I wanted to like everything I was like we're in this band and we're playing
00:34:32
these big shows and we we're having success like I mean not huge success but
00:34:36
you know like you're having success of you're selling out venues and you can
00:34:39
and you know you can dive into the audience and and get carried around when you're playing guitar so that's success
00:34:44
to a certain extent and um you know and and stuff but I was like why are we a joke band I was like why can't we be a
00:34:51
real band I'd like to be in a real band so I once again I didn't even enjoy that
00:34:54
situation cuz I was like going you know instead of standing on stage going all these people are singing the songs this
00:34:59
freaking great I'm like why aren't we a real band why are we singing these
00:35:02
stupid songs that I've that I've written for the start so it's all my own fault
00:35:06
you know bloody great songs e like um very clever like today tomorrow tamaru it's a great song um yeah it sounds like
00:35:14
it could be an exponent song you yeah well that was a tribute to the exponent so me and Chris wrote that song when we
00:35:19
were hitchhiking from Den to Christ Church and um we stopped off in taru and and we're like oh that's this is where
00:35:24
bloody children Luck's from so we wrote a a a tribute to to the exponents called
00:35:30
today tomorrow U that yeah but you know that bugs me because I wish we changed key like in the last chorus should have
00:35:36
changed key and it freaking annoys me I don't know why what we were thinking and
00:35:39
also would it kill us to get some freaking harmonies going in the cor can can you do you struggle to look
00:35:45
back at any of your work and and see anything but the floors yeah well I mean back of the way
00:35:51
like a first television show was kind of meant to be really ropey um and I think
00:35:56
that was actually pretty good like I I watched that again and for what it was which was kind of pure Anarchy I think
00:36:01
that was actually that first SE season was really quite cool so I'm quite proud
00:36:05
of that but proud of it but I don't like my kid I don't I haven't shown it to my
00:36:09
kids but pretty proud of it you have they not seen it no it kind of hasn't because it was cuz the idea was to shoot
00:36:15
a TV show on TV andz that was shot on handic cams like was shot like on handic cams but was also on a big set and so
00:36:24
it's kind of a weird idea that you have a kind a [ __ ] version of a really mainstream show that then has you know
00:36:31
like the the stage was a um was weighted like a wrestling ring so we could you know slam each other on the stage when
00:36:38
we were we were fighting cuz I back the I started with me and Chris just sitting
00:36:40
in a room with a um camera on a tripod um Wayne's World style for triangle television in ockland so we just
00:36:48
interview each other dressed up as stuntmen and we'd go and do stunts and then and then we' release it and then
00:36:53
and so we wanted to keep that ethic when we went to or that aesthetic when we went to when we finally got onto TV andz
00:36:59
with our show and um and so I think that's pretty cool because it's it's
00:37:02
such an odd thing like I imagine if I came across that I like what's this I heard once that Paul Holmes did a show
00:37:08
called I think it might been called grinder but anyway it was a show that he did years ago that there not many copies
00:37:13
of before he was a big like a big star that was really sort of rough on a bunch of friends so I imagine if I found back
00:37:19
of the wi now I'd go wow this existed this is OD but but if if we were coming
00:37:24
up now would just be clips on YouTube wouldn't we we would wouldn't be on yeah
00:37:27
Tik Tok yeah I watched um season 1 episode one yesterday it's still on YouTube or NZ on screen one of those
00:37:33
sites and it's it's really really good like you can see the you can see the
00:37:36
mirr in it but it's it's full noise yeah it's great so um I remember I remember
00:37:40
once um uh we we went out cu the show was immediately quite popular and back then
00:37:46
when you had a show on TV people would immediately recognize you I went from no one really knowing who I was to and and
00:37:51
the first episode there's this joke where I go um I go up to people on the street and de them it was it was a
00:37:56
parody of this show called who dear wi oh Mike Whitney Whitney ex Australian AFL player yeah yeah and it was like um
00:38:03
you'd go you know he dare you and so I'd go to people with a mic Whitney head on
00:38:08
and go I dare you to I dare you to eat my piss and drink my [ __ ] and if you do
00:38:13
I'll give you five bucks and I go up to people like in malls and stuff and and
00:38:16
say that um yeah and so so the next day like cuz at that point I was working in a record store real groovy records and
00:38:24
literally the next day after the show went to ear um um people would just start saying eat my [ __ ] and drink my P
00:38:31
everywhere I went I was like well this isn't how I was going to imagine it playing out I thought maybe I thought I
00:38:36
might get some attention from woman or absolute [ __ ] bogans telling me to eat this [ __ ] it was really good though
00:38:43
at the end there's like a the New Zealand on air logo and you're like this
00:38:46
is absolutely not funded by New Zealand on air and yeah there's V looks like v v
00:38:52
sponsor so we're like government fundings for losers uh we didn't take any of your taxpayer money up your ass
00:38:58
this is paid for by V that was that was our thing which was I mean you know like
00:39:02
cuz cuz you know that's the first thing that happens isn't people go this is [ __ ] I paid for it you know
00:39:09
yeah the tax p is oh couldn't we build another prison yeah oh um Bill Roston say he was
00:39:15
a TV reviewer at the time didn't he didn't he try and get it boycotted like
00:39:19
before it even went it got sent out and and he ran a campaign against it every week it was he was writing something in
00:39:25
his column which was in a paper don't think it was the heral but um and just
00:39:30
saying the Beck the's got to die and I killed Beck the Y cuz he got it pulled
00:39:34
like he didn't get it pulled but there was so much media about it being the shock most filthy and disgusting show
00:39:38
that had ever been made and it shouldn't be on New Zealand television and it got
00:39:42
pulled and TV ear just rang up and said it's not going to ear it's being sheld
00:39:47
because and um but there was a guy called Jeff Steven who was who's the um commissioner at the time at tvz he was
00:39:53
wonderful guy loved the show and so he was quite gutted about it and you know my sign off was um
00:39:59
see you CTS next week and he was like um at the end of the show House see you CS
00:40:03
next week um and um he was like that's got to stay he's got to that's got to
00:40:07
stay you know and this is 2001 so that that's got to stay um so he was really
00:40:12
supportive but then it got pulled but just so happened that one of the guys that worked on our show his auntie was
00:40:18
the minister of broadcasting at the time and so she just rang up TV andz at one point said what what where the hell is
00:40:23
my nephew's freaking TV show why isn't that on and then it was sudden back on
00:40:28
and then and then it was announced it was going to here a couple of weeks a couple of months later why why why was
00:40:33
there so much um you why was there so much blowback from one person's opinion I yeah I I
00:40:39
just think it it really blew up and then there were questions asked in parli about it so before she did it there were
00:40:45
people saying why is tvnz because you know tvnz's always Under Pressure because it's owned by the government so
00:40:50
why is tvnz and it was just listing some of the jokes in it and like on on paper
00:40:55
it didn't look good you know well there's one yeah so for anyone a lot of
00:40:58
people wouldn't have seen it they're probably search searching it up as they
00:41:00
listen or watch this but it's um kind of like jackasses would that be the thing
00:41:05
to compare to but but really full noise like in season one episode one there's
00:41:09
what's the cop sketch called a constables constables yeah so there's a cop that um like tries to stop drunk
00:41:15
drivers but he's pissed himself he just wants to confiscate their alcohol yeah
00:41:18
yeah it's yeah it's outlandish stuff yeah so what was your thought at the
00:41:23
time like when when you and Chris were riding it you just want to shock people you
00:41:27
did you just find it funny or yeah well we grew up in quite a Bogan area um and so we found Bogan quite funny but we
00:41:35
weren't really bogans ourselves and you know it reminds me of um you know Fredick NRI said battle you not with
00:41:41
monsters lest you become a monster and that was kind of what happened we started making stuff about bogans and
00:41:47
then we actually became bogans because we were so concentrated on it so we weren't so we found all that kind of
00:41:53
stuff really interesting because denan is a really weird cross between University students that are quite this
00:41:59
way and locals which are quite Southland bogens you know that that's kind of the
00:42:04
way it works out and so we were locals so we were the pieces of [ __ ] in town really you know what I mean so so so you
00:42:10
got all these rich orlanders coming in and you're the local piece of [ __ ] so
00:42:14
that's kind of what we were leaning into you know like you know like there's all
00:42:16
these students walking around they live in their flats and then then they'll
00:42:19
have a party in five cars of bogans will turn up and ruin it and those are the locals you know and all the trouble in
00:42:25
Den this is the thing people don't know about denan all the trouble is caused by
00:42:28
locals and it's all blamed on the students you know and so we were the locals causing trouble and um and uh
00:42:34
yeah so that was where it all came out of like our sort of celebrating that Bogan part of New New Zealand so yeah
00:42:43
and also we freaking loved TV so we just loved it and we loved New Zealand TV so
00:42:48
it was all a tri you know like I was called my character was Danny Parker that was named after you know Steve
00:42:52
Parker and Danny Morrison you know so not Danny Morrison Danny Watson yeah yeah I want to ask about that yes
00:43:00
so you you're like a presenter of this TV show back of the Y Master television
00:43:04
but it's and it's it's m with a fake mustache you're calling yourself Danny
00:43:07
Parker then you this rockar with Deja Voodoo and you're kind of like doing almost like a parody of what a rockstar
00:43:13
should be did you was was that an impostor syndrome thing like hiding almost hiding behind these personas I
00:43:18
was listening to someone that were saying the other day can you sing completely without irony you know and if
00:43:23
you can then that's awesome cuz for the longest time I thought you know uh being
00:43:26
genuine Sincere was there was something wrong with it but actually sincerity is the hardest thing to find and you know
00:43:33
because of the like vulnerability yeah and it's like like writing this book I'm
00:43:36
very sincere in it and I just would not have been able to do that and so I think
00:43:39
you're 100% right I think it was all hiding from who I was and and entirely trying to recreating myself as a totally
00:43:48
different person like moved to Oakland and and was just a totally freaking different person and lying basically
00:43:56
like lying about I was and who who what my history was and and everything so I must have been ashamed of it for some
00:44:03
reason maybe it's a a comfort thing it just T takes a certain while to to grow
00:44:08
onto yourself and to grow on your own I feel you're very comfortable with who
00:44:11
you are now yeah I am but I I think so you know we all have our moments but like I think also like comedy music is a
00:44:17
real copout and and because you can easily say it's like the kid that doesn't try try and goes I I didn't try
00:44:24
anyway and you know loses but they didn't try anyway it's kind of that kind
00:44:27
of thing it's like oh we're just a silly band we're not a real band but if you
00:44:30
actually write a real song with real emotions where you actually touch people emotionally that's freaking something
00:44:39
you know singing I will give you one of my beers but I've only got six it's a
00:44:42
great line it's so good and then um oh not much this the song Feelings let's
00:44:47
talk let's talk about feelings feeling your tits feeling your ass feeling your
00:44:51
tongue in my duck feeling your lips all covered in jazz yeah it's not a 2024
00:44:55
song that one it's it's brilliant though like it's it's outrageous but that was almost like
00:45:02
cuz that song starts with me with this core progression I'd come up with that
00:45:05
was just I really liked it and I was going feelings feelings feelings We Like a Beach Boys Harmony and all this kind
00:45:12
of stuff it was good and then Jerry I mean not Jerry geez Jeremy's who I work
00:45:16
with now Chris he was like you know the Muppets when it goes you know and that guy comes in goes so what
00:45:23
if I you you're singing a song that's really lovely and and then I just come in and freaking
00:45:29
destroy it like so you're singing about feelings and then then the other member
00:45:33
of the band is just a piece of [ __ ] got the the feeling your feeling your ass feelings feelings let's talk about
00:45:39
feelings go feeling your ass and like so so that the nice guys walks back in the
00:45:45
video and looks around and goes what the [ __ ] happened to my song that that was
00:45:48
the gay it's it's bloody great and what about the P song I smoked pee and I'm
00:45:52
okay what's the big story with cuz i' we've been shooting a show in in the UK
00:45:56
and um was that balls of steel uh that was before B balls of steel that was stuff we were doing some stuff for MTV
00:46:01
over there and we were flying back to New Zealand and I hadn't heard of P I'd
00:46:06
been in the UK for a while and I and I got heral and I was talking about p and dog attacks and I didn't know what P was
00:46:12
I was quite confused and so I was reading about it and then um then I read that you smoke it and I was just
00:46:18
thinking uh it's probably not that bad so I just sort of wrote the song on the
00:46:21
plane I smoke pee and I'm all right got on the pee stayed up all night and I
00:46:27
didn't really realize and then we then we we came back and recorded that album and um and then eating me lunch
00:46:34
jumped on it cuz I was friends with jery at the time and he was like hey let's
00:46:37
we'll pay for a video for it we we'll get on there and and then at that time I
00:46:41
was talking to my aunti who's a psychiatrist and she was working with PE you know people that are addicted to
00:46:46
meth at um at um at you know M Eden prison I was like oh that's a bit more serious there's a little Joker and then
00:46:57
then over the years over the years I've seen what it's done to our country and
00:47:01
I'm like Oh my little joke on the plane back from England was but but the point
00:47:06
of it the song's actually a little bit sounds like a lame justification but the
00:47:10
the the the song's a bit more meaningful than that it's like talking about you
00:47:13
know we're all going to die um and and kind of me and Chris were talking about
00:47:19
how media promotes something so the biggest promoter of P was the media because it was the outrage and the and
00:47:24
the and the terror of it and it was happening they gave it a name that no one had ever called it anywhere in the
00:47:28
world before it was called P now and and um and so that's got all these kind of
00:47:33
slightly political lines in it that go you know the papers wouldn't lie we're
00:47:36
all going to die you know um but I was really happy with the video to that because it starts off with graham Hill
00:47:42
smoking a pea pipe in front of the in front of a fire and a dressing gown like an old man like an old school pipe yeah
00:47:51
like an old school pipe but it's a pea pipe and he's just like was the idea of
00:47:54
this kind of um you know like gentleman like smoking this PE but yeah so were you guys like trying to shock people at
00:48:02
was it a shock thing that one that one cuz I ended up on Sun Sunday being interviewed for and they said you're the
00:48:06
face of p in New Zealand aren't you and I was like ah what about anony Dixon
00:48:11
yeah that's right yeah well um yeah he get he gets a reference on the song There the line there about I didn't chop
00:48:16
anyone's hands off I didn't cut anyone's hands off so I think that was the
00:48:19
Tipping Point for p yeah this guy Anthony Dixon yeah had he was was had a psychotic episode after three days on P
00:48:26
yeah I think he did he did he kill one of his exgfs he cut some hands off yeah it was pretty freaking Grim yeah it was
00:48:31
um but yeah no I think actually cuz when we actually recorded that song it was a
00:48:35
few years after we wrote it or a year or so 18 months so things had really changed so we added that line and then a
00:48:43
a few few things to it but um yeah I I I wasn't the face was going full on being on one TV 1
00:48:52
big Prime Time television then then when it went out phones ringing everyone's
00:48:57
going you know family members Lan's family members are ringing up going what
00:49:00
the you know yeah how how was that at the time did you sort of En enjoy the notoriety at the time or were you like
00:49:06
[ __ ] I was anything for a gag you know like so so anything for a gag even though I said we tried to put a bit of
00:49:11
message in it it did come from the point of view of they're promoting this but
00:49:15
they're judging it you know you know they they're judging it but at the same
00:49:18
time they're elevating it you know which I mean it's always the um way media has
00:49:21
to go doesn't it um well always shreds that line um so I wasn't really by the time it was
00:49:29
really blowing up and you know we were be on tour and then then people were just trying to give me you know grab me
00:49:36
for a freaking grab me with a light bulb and go around the corner smoke PE right yeah yeah yeah so
00:49:44
people were bringing pee to wear gigs because they to to cheer with me and I'm
00:49:47
like oh [ __ ] this is a freaking joke and those people are freaking you know there's some freaking terrifying people
00:49:52
I mean I I remember there's one in in Vago where we were playing show gagle and it's it's crazy and like the lights
00:50:00
just got pulled down on someone's head and their head was open I was going and you could just it was like
00:50:05
myth zombies in the front row and I was like felt as it was a joke just sort of like a RI side on on New Zealand
00:50:15
s what have I done yeah um did did you did you ever did you ever or would you ever consider doing like some some
00:50:22
proper music um yeah I mean I do do you do you write and perform at home for fun
00:50:27
just for yourself I'm always writing songs and playing my guitar and God I'm
00:50:31
such a much better guitarist than I ever was when I was playing it's kind of guts
00:50:35
me but musically the deja Voodoo stuff it's real good right uh yeah it has its
00:50:40
moments you know we had better musicians in the band than me later on like um Sky
00:50:45
the general that joined Gerald Stewart who was a really really good guitarist and um and that really helped so the
00:50:50
ideas we had could come into fruition and stuff but you know I listen to it now and huge fan of Rick bi you follow
00:50:55
Rick bi no who's that oh he's a YouTuber um you know music analyst and um and you
00:51:01
know I know so much more about music theory now and you know the algorithm on YouTube is complet you know how it finds
00:51:07
you mine is just music theory I just get punished constantly With You music analysis and so now I'm going what
00:51:15
listen to those songs go why don't we like as I saying why don't we change at
00:51:19
the end it would be such an easy win on the course if we change K and you know why don't we why don't we do like a at
00:51:26
least a three Harmony in one of the choruses all of the choruses is ridiculous and and um was it about this
00:51:32
time that you did um the devil Des me too yeah so the devil Dey 2 was 2007 came out that was about the time year
00:51:38
because we came back from England to do that after balls of steel we did balls of steel for Channel 4 in the UK um so
00:51:44
balls of steel so so back of the Y Masterpiece television balls of steel was basically just like a condensed
00:51:50
version of that there's a bunch of like various s of sketches on the show you we
00:51:54
the sketches a big show though right Big Show but like it totally didn't make any
00:51:58
sense right so our show was stunts shot with handic cams on BMXs right and then they look pretty violent people were
00:52:07
getting pretty hurt I mean we did some pretty freaking crazy stuff I mean I've
00:52:11
got massive scars when my bones came out lost my teeth and all that kind of stuff
00:52:15
doing the show so they're quite full on right um when they're shot on a handic
00:52:18
cam and it's small and it's being silly so then we get this this show in the UK
00:52:23
and they fly us over there and we're shooting in romley bybo studios huge Studio it's the same Studio they shoot
00:52:29
like at lunchtimes we were going out and the Mighty B was shooting there so I actually thought the Mighty B was a kids
00:52:34
show because all the props and it was the same thing they shot that movie Sunshine so it was a huge film studio
00:52:39
they had like huge Towers like 10 camera people anything we wanted and then it's
00:52:44
us in our stupid costumes with our little mustaches doing our little BMX bike jumps it just didn't make any sense
00:52:50
cuz you watch that you go there's so much money being spent on this why don't
00:52:53
you freaking jump the Grand Canyon your Muppets why don't you you know what I
00:52:55
mean it doesn't it didn't really work it didn't really upscale like that it had
00:53:00
to be silly you know what I mean there was part of the the appeal of it though wasn't it well I think the P needed to
00:53:05
be shot terribly and needed to be small so it's it was more more impactive and
00:53:11
more silly you know it was more um amateur it work better amateur when it's professional I think this happens to a
00:53:17
lot of people if your stick stick as amateur and you go professional you you're you're really showing up and I I
00:53:24
reckon what we did and we were really showing up in the UK cuz all our stick was being small and silly and and you
00:53:31
know when you've got you know stunt I mean and and I I wrote about in that book when I was on fire as an ape in in
00:53:38
one of the chapters I was dressed as an ape and and the the bike landed on me and I was on fire and everything went
00:53:45
wrong but there was stunt coordinators there was proper stunt coordinators and stuff but and I was pretending to be a
00:53:50
stunt coordinator but some was they were offering 15 they were going to pay this
00:53:55
is what happened they were going to pay a stunt man um 2,000 to be in the to be the monkey and I was like [ __ ] that I'll
00:54:02
be the monkey I'll but play two roles so I play the stunt coordinator and then
00:54:05
and the joke is that the monkey's not angry enough so he gets set on fire to
00:54:10
make him angry in the cage and I get stuck in the cage and I can't get out and I'm running around and then I'm
00:54:15
running towards this this studio audience on fire there's a big studio audience and then and and but the our
00:54:22
dumb jokes are still going on like the the other actors are kicking me and stuff and but but my um masks gone
00:54:28
around that way I can't see where I'm going um and I'm really on fire but I'm
00:54:33
mainly thinking about missing my girlfriend because I was being something happening in my life and then and um and
00:54:39
it's like so was very full- on for me and then you watch it on when it was played out on Channel 4 I like that
00:54:44
looks freaking stupid there a guy going it a major moment for me and and and all
00:54:51
it was was going in a monkey suit that's massively on fire but if you'd had like
00:54:55
a handy Cam and you know it's dangerous and you know we're doing it and illegally you know it's just on the
00:55:00
street and not in a studio you know what I mean it's sort of a lot of D loss
00:55:04
because you can see anyone on fire in a movie you know that happens all the time
00:55:08
so it was too elevated to make the gags work if you know what I mean yeah that could be once again me
00:55:14
doing that thing I said before I always think everything we do is [ __ ] yeah yeah
00:55:18
yeah I wonder if you're overthinking it because um like it was it was really
00:55:21
good and really successful and and you look at it now and it's um it's most
00:55:26
people probably won't even remember it that people that do remember like back
00:55:29
of the y or the devil dead to may remember how it made them feel at the time but they won't necessarily remember
00:55:33
it I watched um the movie The Devil gave me to just the other day it's on Amazon
00:55:37
Prime right it's really good is it it's really good yeah um heavy signage with
00:55:42
um V The Rock and C4 yeah um that was that was my whole thing back in the day was selling like getting everything paid
00:55:51
for to try and and and the devil dare me to you know we got money from um you know from the fil commission as well but
00:55:57
we freaking sailed it up the Wazoo to get the budget up and as a result we you know paid out profit points and it made
00:56:02
money you know how how much how much how much funding did you get like how much does it cost to make a movie well back
00:56:07
then because this was right on the cusp of digital and so it was shot on digital
00:56:11
part of the reason part of the meaning part of the funding um that an tson worked out who's you know a great man
00:56:17
and and and with along with some other people um was it it had to be an example of a digital film shot in New Zealand
00:56:22
like the first time that shot a feature film but not on film and and so we shot it like that and so
00:56:29
the budget at that point was I think we got 400,000 from to shoot that part but then we you know sold it up the wazu and
00:56:36
got up to us more budget but then it cost another 500,000 to turn it from digital to film cuz it still had to be
00:56:44
in film to go into the theaters in 2007 so more of the budget was spent on transferring it from digital to film
00:56:50
than it was on actually shooting the movie which was you know when we were doing that at the time I was like um
00:56:57
you know we could have really done with this this money and then and that would seem that was right on the cusp so it
00:57:03
would seem ridiculous now when when when did you last see it um I tried to watch
00:57:09
a little bit recently because you know in the book on the on on the on the you know chapter on
00:57:16
dissatisfaction I'm talking about how you know we were we were screening screening in Germany Germany Germany and
00:57:22
col and we're like um and uh cuz we traveled the world with it and we do Q&A
00:57:26
before and no we we introduce it before and do a Q&A afterwards and so we're in
00:57:30
a PE theater uh theater in colon and um and uh I start boing the film I was just
00:57:38
so sick of seeing it we've been traveling around the world watching it and I was like it's not it wasn't what I
00:57:42
wanted it to be so I started going this is [ __ ] and we got asked to leave and then but the security was dragging us
00:57:48
out and then then the organizer of the festival that these German people that are driving us around CU we were all
00:57:53
over Germany well that it did quite well in Germany and um they were like you can't throw these guys out this is these
00:57:59
are the stars of the FM the director and the producer like they have to stay in here and they're like well can you stop
00:58:05
abusing the film like no we will not I yeah cuz I read that patter in the book and I thought knowing you reasonably
00:58:12
well I thought oh you were just being funny you were just trying to get a laugh we we were you over it by
00:58:20
then guess it probably be 50/50 I probably we we'll probably me and Chris will probably trying to get a laugh from
00:58:25
each other but to be fair we were but also we were disappointed in it so there was truth in it and not truth in it you
00:58:32
know what I mean and plus there was some confusion with the alcohol percentage of
00:58:35
the beer we were drinking those be very strong I think we thought we were drinking you know like
00:58:42
four TB exported and we were like so so there was there was a number of factors playing into that what were you what
00:58:49
were you disappointed about with the movie I just don't think it was funny enough um I don't think the was very
00:58:56
good I didn't really like my performance in it I thought it was too Grim when it
00:59:00
could have been it should have been yeah it just felt it had an empty vibe to me
00:59:05
it just wasn't everything it it could have been and it was a very different story than what we originally wrote and
00:59:11
it kind of got changed by the film commission and they made me it didn't make any sense this is what annoyed me
00:59:16
because they made it that one of us was older and one of us was younger and Chris is older than me and so I was the
00:59:20
older person in the film was playing dick joh hansenon who was the sort of evil guy in was playing Randy Campbell
00:59:27
like an upcoming stuntman okay basically you but no one aged me up so I was like
00:59:31
it doesn't make any sense I'm look watch this film this guy's clearly younger
00:59:33
than that guy and he's supposed to be the older guy and it's like I know we
00:59:37
were directing it at the time but that was cuz it was a last minute um script change it was supposed to be two buddies
00:59:41
that fell out and and because one was interested in um you know making money and the other one was stunt man and and
00:59:47
one of them discovered that the other guy can't die in stunts so he's going to
00:59:50
utilize them as much but as soon as they made that difference so I just watched that movie and I'm like going well
00:59:55
that's a huge floor that is a that is a massive flaw but there's some good lines
00:59:58
in it I thought it was yes it's a great movie and um some recognizable because I
01:00:03
saw it at the time but I haven't seen it since but Dominic Bowen's in there Josh
01:00:06
Thompson who's done very well Tyson Kennedy from the band stereogram and you're acting um I thought it was really
01:00:12
good like you play a real [ __ ] yeah yeah yeah yeah there was good for boating because what happens to me in
01:00:17
prison um is four boed all the way so every line I say in the movie is about my ass and then later on when I get sent
01:00:24
to prison it'll come a lot of dropping the soap I I feel like you've um you you have this um uncanny
01:00:33
ability to see the the floors and everything you do uh yeah potentially although I reckon less so now and and
01:00:42
looking back now it's kind of what I've been saying and I guess that's kind of
01:00:45
why I wrote the book as well because it was like you can live a lifeless punishing just to throw the N of the
01:00:51
book in but like there doesn't need have to be their punishing like just enjoy it
01:00:55
freaking hell you make a movie with your mates that's good you've already won you
01:00:59
you know you've already you're already doing something great whether the movie
01:01:02
turns out exactly like you wanted or not that's just that's just icing on the
01:01:05
cake the fact that someone was paying you to spend that much time with your friends um and to write a story and to
01:01:12
shoot it and and hang out and meet all the crew that was involved it was just such a great crew that whole experience
01:01:17
in itself because it took us 18 months to make that 18 months was a freaking great 18 months and if the movie had
01:01:22
turned out to be as good as I wanted it to be then that would have been a bonus but that that's that's the whole problem
01:01:27
we have we we never do it and like you know I I do a radio show and I'm really
01:01:32
conscious of that idea of finitude you know like um the idea that everything you do you were going to do for the last
01:01:37
time at some point and and then those things are suddenly in the past and then you fail to enjoy them so like you talk
01:01:42
about that movie that 18 months at the time you're working so hard you're
01:01:46
wrecked with goat and you don't even go this is freaking awesome you know and
01:01:49
you and you got to do that right um 100% how many people get to make like a a fulllength motion picture movie they
01:01:55
gets played on the big screen and 20 years 20 years on almost it's um available on Amazon Prime it's it's
01:02:01
crazy yeah yeah it's crazy and it said it said that you um have this distorted
01:02:06
view of oh really pisses off a lot of my friends cuz they're like let's watch
01:02:10
going out [ __ ] or like we finished the show and like we've made a TV show and it's going
01:02:14
to year and I say you came to the thing now nah no I'm done with it I've moved
01:02:19
on to the to to the next thing but it's but it's a failing that I've that I
01:02:22
think I've I've worked out cuz it's such a cuz like for everyone it's the I think
01:02:27
it's the true for everyone right like I mean things are always going to get worse you know that's just that's just
01:02:34
the nature of the universe so it's so stupid to not enjoy the good times cuz
01:02:39
you're going to you know yeah yeah that's the thing thing about happiness a
01:02:43
like it has to be here and now it can't be something you're chasing because
01:02:45
you're never going to find it but is that what happened with the book because
01:02:48
this book was supposed to come out like a year ago or months ago and um then you
01:02:52
you told the Publishers you needed more time was that the same sort of thing like a yeah perfectionism complex oh
01:02:58
maybe um cuz yeah I was on that show traitors when I would first finish writing it which was about a year ago um
01:03:07
and so I was locked in my room because it was like one of those shows where people get eliminated or whatever um
01:03:13
it's good fun actually um but uh so I was writing it then but then I was reading it in my room and and and I was
01:03:20
like uh this is [ __ ] so I rewrote rewrote it because I was trying to what what it was is that thing we were
01:03:24
talking about before I was it was all irony and it was all um it wasn't sincere so so and and I talked to the
01:03:31
Publishers and I said and they were like yeah you got to find your voice I think
01:03:34
they said Voice or yeah they said voice you got to find your voice and I was like that's true cuz you can't
01:03:39
just becomes like a silly kind of parody kind of thing unless you like what's the
01:03:44
point of writing a book like this about making you know enjoying the life you've
01:03:47
got if you don't actually write about that if you're not just blasting on
01:03:51
about um being a deck if being a deck all the way through it it's kind of pointless
01:03:56
yeah are you are you quite good now at um like showing a bit of vulnerability yeah being authentic I think so yeah
01:04:04
yeah a lot better and God life so much better if you if you do that and you know that in broadcasting like so you
01:04:10
know you you broadcast for a very long time and you know lots of great jokes but the bits that people remember is the
01:04:15
bit where you drop the facade and you're actually really say something and you're
01:04:20
really meaningful you're human for a second and they go oh yeah and you can't
01:04:24
be that all the time it's a different type of show you know um but yeah you still need the lws yeah yeah you still
01:04:32
need the lws um but but people people of course they do because people because humans we all kind of share a really
01:04:40
similar experience I think we're not as different as we think we are we're all
01:04:44
kind of no matter what everyone's doing in life we're kind of sharing the same
01:04:49
thing and there's actually a bit that I I was reading about a lot which I thought was really interesting is the
01:04:53
idea that you know we're were evolved to be dissatisfied because the guy that was
01:04:59
satisfied sitting on the Savanah and this um Professor interviewed for the books I I I interviewed a whole lot of
01:05:04
people from around the world that I thought were great thinkers this guy called William B Irvine and he said you
01:05:08
know the guy that sat on the savan and went sweet as you know was immediately eaten by a lion and the guy that sat
01:05:15
there and goes the View's good but maybe I should climb a tree or maybe I should
01:05:19
build some walls or actually this place isn't that good and started doing something else that was the person that
01:05:23
survived so we are evolved from these people that were never satisfied because satisfaction was death and so I think we
01:05:30
just got to realize that that no matter how good things get um or and arguably sometimes how bad things are we're all
01:05:36
equ we've got equal levels of dissatisfaction so that thing that you're chasing you get there and you're
01:05:42
immediately just as dissatisfied as you were before because that's not you know
01:05:46
that that's just you're not going to solve your dissatisfaction yeah you
01:05:50
definitely find that with material possessions he like I I learned that the hard way like I filled my last house oh
01:05:56
you know that we had many parties at the house did you and you have a spar pole and you have a heated pool and and then
01:06:03
you realize that none of the stuff's bringing me more than like a temporary like dopamine fix and that's it yeah and
01:06:07
you had that Corridor with all the doors and it was like there was so many doors
01:06:11
down that Corridor and you were like um which which door m in tonight with which
01:06:16
random stranger it was like a Scooby-Doo situation with opening doors and running
01:06:20
around but yeah but yeah what what's that I wrote a bit about that is that concept of hom onic adaption where you
01:06:27
you whatever you got you adapt immediately to it it's like whatever luxury you have is not a luxury for long
01:06:33
then it's then it's just the base level and then you can't live without of it
01:06:37
you get no joy from it you know what I mean yeah so true is that why um I read you you've become like a cold shower guy
01:06:42
is this this in the book yeah you do three minute cold showers how long have you been doing that I've been doing that
01:06:47
um for ages now yeah I mean it's just that basic thing uh uh you know that um
01:06:54
you know our Pleasure and Pain centers are collocated and in our brains so if you do something really you know and you
01:07:01
know we're um beings that are evolve for scarcity in a in a time of abundance so
01:07:06
we're just constantly hitting the the the the joyful part you know the the the
01:07:12
luxury part of our brains the pleasure goes and the and the way things are it's
01:07:17
homeostasis so our brains always trying to bring us back to normal and it goes back to that death satisfaction thing
01:07:23
because we can't be satisfied or all get killed by a lion so whenever you do
01:07:28
something really really pleasurable there's an equal and opposite uh reaction in the um in that part of the
01:07:34
brain the vendil Paladin um and um and so a cold shower that's just that's just
01:07:40
starting the day with some pain and so then your brain gives you some pleasure it's as simple as that it's like a
01:07:45
seesaw so if you're just pleasure all the time then the body then the brain is
01:07:50
just constantly going pain pain pain pain pain pain pain pain pain pain pain to to to bring you back to the middle so
01:07:56
that's where pleasure ends in pain so um when you that's one of the lessons that
01:07:59
I learned was so good and so cold showers cold plunges and it's you sound like a Wonder going on about it CU
01:08:06
everyone does do you do you you found like like a poor man's art green yeah yeah exactly exactly but it's so
01:08:14
freaking true yeah it's it's great I I couldn't agree but a run a run is the
01:08:17
same or or exercise or yoga or anything is the same or just doing something hard
01:08:23
like you feel better after like if you if you're a builder then you do a hard
01:08:27
day's work and you feel a lot better when you come home after Hard Day's Work
01:08:30
and that's why you know work from home people that do nothing all day um not
01:08:33
all of them but a lot of them they they spiral into depression because everything's comfortable for them even
01:08:38
they don't even have the commute commute to deal with so you have to do hard
01:08:41
things to to to um offset the in inevitable amount of pleasurable things we do right now yeah cuz there's no
01:08:48
there's no sort of discomfort anymore is there life life has become so comfortable in the cold shower thing I I
01:08:54
bloody love that um you're foring to do something that you with every fi of your being you
01:09:00
don't want to do and that's a victory as well in the morning as well like if I'm
01:09:03
in the shower and I go it's like you've had a win cuz you've you've doused yourself in cold water and
01:09:11
sometimes I just forget and I'm heading off to work and you know I start work
01:09:14
really early on the breakfast show and it's like I'll be leaving the door I'm
01:09:17
like I [ __ ] had a hot shower and then and I was like that was stupid cuz now I
01:09:22
feel weird but I mean you could the the The Logical conclusion that you could come to is that you should then punch
01:09:28
yourself in the face so you get something something painful but that's kind of productive but it would work but
01:09:35
you can only punch yourself in the face so many times yeah yeah um oh yeah you brought up the radio thing we haven't
01:09:40
even got into your radio career yet so so how did that start so you had all the TV and the deja voodo stuff then you
01:09:46
started on bfm which is the student radio station in Oakland yeah so um I started actually I was at Edgefest this
01:09:53
is coincidence actually I was at Edgefest and that before the fight alen an farm and I got a ring up in a ring up
01:10:00
a phone call it's so long since phone calls are so ancient now I don't know what to call
01:10:05
them um I got a phone call when it was like um on the landline at the venue Mr Heath you know um and someone
01:10:13
said you want to do the drive show on bfm and I was like yeah on a Thursday and I was like I've never done any radio
01:10:19
before but yep that'd be cool and so me and Chris started doing that um and you
01:10:24
love at one point they say can you shorten your breaks a bit I mean I think if you keep them to 15 minute breaks
01:10:30
that would be good between songs how long were your breaks freaking long cuz I didn't know that people didn't want to
01:10:36
hear you talk and now like you know on Commercial radio we got a clock on the wall over 3 minutes 30 and you know it's
01:10:42
a problem siren stuck going yeah you get you get matched from the building um yeah so they they offered me that and
01:10:50
then we started doing that and then after a while and that was a pretty that was fun and then then they just offered
01:10:55
me the breakfast show and then I did that for like 5 months and then I on bfm yeah and the with with oh just yourself
01:11:02
just me on the breakfast show um and then what a great training ground what a great opportunity yeah yeah yeah CU I
01:11:08
said something horrific on the air like a week out before that happened anyway doesn't matter um oh no what was it can
01:11:15
you remember or uh kind of um probably probably won't say it that this for him
01:11:22
but um anyway I ended up doing the breckfast show by myself um he got the pup but I don't know they it doesn't
01:11:28
matter but anyway and I wasn't on for very long I was on for 5 months and then
01:11:31
I got a ring from rid um Mike Regal great New Zealander and he rang up and said um you want to do the drive show
01:11:38
because what had happened to Ian Stables oh that's right yeah Ian staes who I
01:11:43
worked at the edge uh yeah we were friends for for a number of years and then he he was going to do the drive
01:11:48
show and then I think he had a a fight with someone at the jet star chicken counter yeah so he was flying up to do
01:11:53
the drive show on radio haki and he um he got into a fist fight at the airport with you know yeah the guy someone at
01:11:59
the counter yeah and was on CCTV footage and there was I don't know if this is
01:12:03
true there was some talk of some racial content in and I don't know I would hate
01:12:07
to speak there was no audio to go with the pictures yeah but there there were accusations and it it takes quite a lot
01:12:13
to get a to get a guy out from behind the ticketing countdown I mean have you ever seen anyone climb over and come at
01:12:21
you I mean what do you have to do no I've seen I've seen a lot of carens at
01:12:24
the airport too but I've never seen someone leave their post so someone left their post and beat
01:12:31
the [ __ ] out of him on the for court uh of the at the airport of a jet star terminal and um my God I forgot all
01:12:38
about that yeah and so he got his contract terminated before he even did his first show and so they were like we
01:12:45
need a drive show host and then they were just flicking through the channels and they heard me on bfm which is
01:12:50
amazing cuz how far I was from commercial radio and they said you want to do that and I said no
01:12:56
cuz I was terrified I was like I couldn't do commercial radio like as you know like if you have cuz I was a TV
01:13:00
producer at the time like working for Great Southern television doing this sort of radio show but commercial radio
01:13:06
seems very complicated from the outside and it is pretty complicated um and so I
01:13:12
was like H and then they show me how much you get paid and I was like okay well maybe then I'll come in and then um
01:13:18
and then did the first show I remember walking to to the first show Drive show the May Heath Drive show on radioi and I
01:13:23
was like never been more terrified in my entire life never like impostor syndrome
01:13:28
like cuz it was legitimate imp imposter syndrome I couldn't do the job I'd
01:13:32
signed up to do like I had never done it commercial radio oh so you were you sort
01:13:37
of on on the air like doing what you your best Act of what you thought a commercial radio announcer should be no
01:13:44
no this is before I even got there so I'm working walking down there and I've
01:13:47
sort of been quite clear that I I'm not qualifi for the job but they they've
01:13:50
thought I am and then I was walking to the to work and um and I wed past the bottle store and I
01:13:58
went okay I'm just going to have to get drunk to do this and so so I went in and
01:14:02
and a bottle I bought Little Hippie and I was just about to drink it and I just had this moment I go if I drink this now
01:14:08
then I'll have to be drunk for every single one of these shows that I ever do
01:14:12
and if this becomes a career I'll become an alcholic so I like put the lid on it
01:14:15
and throw it in the rubbish and I went no I'm going to I'm going to face this
01:14:18
you know and and went in and did the first show and um I was lucky out a pure luck teamed up with this guy called Tim
01:14:24
bat who um is a friend to this day and he was just this young dude that was just kickass and so we became really
01:14:29
good friends and we did the first show and and um I was like wow that was pretty good and then we got this call
01:14:36
immediately and the guy goes I'm going to [ __ ] kill you you've ruined radio H
01:14:40
I'm going to freaking kill you I'm waiting in the car by freaking I'm going
01:14:43
to [ __ ] kill you and I was like oh okay it didn't go quite as well as as I
01:14:48
thought um but why why was someone so outraged uh there's a certain type of radio listening to this day that that
01:14:56
runs a certain amount of Rage it might have been the myth amphetamine thing who knows but actually we got to know that
01:15:01
guy we called him death threat Dave and so I thought we'll face us head on so we
01:15:04
rang we got us number CU it come up and then we rang him the next show and said hey you still want to kill
01:15:10
me then about four days in he was like I'm actually coming around to the show
01:15:14
actually I quite like it now um how how long was it before you you felt comfortable faking years
01:15:21
comfortable yeah so I think that was about the time where we met we doing afternoons on radioi yeah yeah um yeah I
01:15:28
mean comfortable I guess yeah I mean you do thousands of shows I mean I'm pretty
01:15:33
freaking comfortable now doing it but it took me a while um to to feel awesome doing it um and you do you know you know
01:15:41
what it's like you have good and bad shows to this day like today we had a freaking great show on the m and jury RF
01:15:46
show that was wicked um and then might have a crappy one tomorrow but you know they're all pretty they're actually all
01:15:52
really good now like yeah you you're your low Benchmark becomes like a seven
01:15:56
out of 10 but I reckon maybe there's no coincidence that you're into running
01:15:59
because once you finish a breakfast show you have this weird energy because you have put so much into it and you're sort
01:16:05
of up and you're saying all these things and there's all this energy it's live
01:16:09
and it's coming back and then you stop and you go to the office and people are
01:16:12
arriving at work and and you're hyped up and you can get that kind of nervous
01:16:17
energy after that angess so you kind of have to do something straight after that
01:16:22
or us it's it's a problem cuz you're not going to get enough compliments to make you
01:16:26
feel like it was awesome the start a you know cuz no one was listening to it like
01:16:30
most of the people in the people coming into to sell things and to do their jobs
01:16:34
and that you know you think that they'll be totally listening to your show you're
01:16:38
like did you say did you hear did you hear the bit with it the B get is great show this morning
01:16:44
without any specific yeah great show boys great energy yeah so so how did the partnership with um you and J yeah you
01:16:53
you've had two really success for professional partnership so you and Chris St yeah and now you and Jeremy
01:16:59
Wells both really long-term relationships yes I'm in Jeremy um with friends beforehand um just through media
01:17:06
circles yeah yeah and through through different things and um yeah and then um we just were at a party once and we said
01:17:14
you know would be freaking cool if we did a breakfast show together it' be awesome so we went to to I was doing the
01:17:19
drive show and I just said hey we would love to do a breakfast show together and
01:17:23
they were like you know jemy was a big name and they're like um turns out they
01:17:28
already had someone hired to do the breakfast show we didn't know this um and then they went okay yeah we'll sign
01:17:33
you guys up to be the breakfast show there was you know it was more complex than that but it was quite a good um
01:17:38
proposition to them you know cuz I think you know it was good to get jery on there and and um and you know it's been
01:17:44
really good I mean we've been working together for years and never had an argument you know yes I was I was going
01:17:49
to ask you that about creative friction cuz you talked before about um Chris and
01:17:51
you breaking his ribs and you guys having arguments but you were a lot younger than you in your 20s you know
01:17:56
you and Jeremy are both in your late 40s I guess 40s 50s early 50s late 60s yeah
01:18:03
um so yeah so there's never been any sort of like creative friction or uh no
01:18:08
and it was actually quite an ie open for me to work with someone cuz I remember on the first day cuz he'd had
01:18:12
interesting creative relationships as well and oh yeah he worked with Havoc for a number yeah Havoc for a long time
01:18:17
so Havoc was his chis and there was you know that was great and they did amazing
01:18:20
stuff but there was also you know there was also you know um I guess you'd say
01:18:24
stess issues and from and stuff you know you know it was interesting and um and you know he had been working on eating
01:18:31
lunch all that kind of stuff and we just had a chat before we started and we both
01:18:33
said to each other hey um should we just accept that each other's ideas are good
01:18:38
and just do them because that's the thing you know expend some so much time trying to explain someone's idea to them
01:18:45
to no your idea to someone and they don't quite get it or they're explaining
01:18:48
their idea to you and you think it's [ __ ] like you're always pitching it to
01:18:51
each other yeah and and and you think it's [ __ ] but that's cuz you don't fully
01:18:54
understand and they're not explaining well and then you do it and it's great
01:18:57
and so we just decided to whatever idea either of us pitched to each other we just go we'll do it we'll see what
01:19:01
happens and that's that's what we've always done so there's never a situation
01:19:04
where we go nah I don't think it's a good idea which has got us into a certain amount of trouble over the years
01:19:09
I guess you got to say like trouble with I mean management or yeah a bit of trouble with management I mean we had
01:19:16
this idea we had called No Sleep Till breakfast where we do a breakfast show and then we'd drink and party all the
01:19:21
way to the other next breakfast show so people would see what state would appear
01:19:25
on ear and that caused some problems um with who um you know what it's like on
01:19:31
radio it doesn't really affect us but there was just someone was having to deal with problems and there's some
01:19:37
legal problems that we've written things that we're not allowed to talk about you
01:19:39
know got n disclosures on a few things and and um I guess you know I listen to you you know your discussion with um you
01:19:48
know your pod with Simon Bridges there was one with him where where I asked him whether he hated the baby when just s
01:19:52
had a baby and what did he say that's hilarious he said yeah Pinko little bloody and he
01:20:00
goes typical it's a girl like it's not it's not like it's not like J C could
01:20:03
have a boy but that wouldn't be right not and he was joking he was being silly
01:20:07
because you know what he's like in your environment he was playing to your level
01:20:10
yeah yeah and then you know then somehow on newshub decided we'd been transphobic
01:20:15
I can't I still can't work out how they made the oh no no no sorry it wasn't
01:20:19
that we took aim at the rainbow community and I still can't understand how they crossed that River but but you
01:20:25
know there things like that I mean like but but also in commercial radio like there has to be certain am amount of
01:20:29
those anyway you know yeah one thing one thing I I love about you you you've had
01:20:34
the odd controversy yeah we just listening to you now I think in reflection one thing
01:20:42
I did was to just take it far too seriously yeah would take every break seriously and then when you CU I I was a
01:20:48
lifer like I got into radio when I was 17 um I was in you know the age for 20 years and and you end up in this bubble
01:20:56
where you take it really seriously and you think when the ratings come out everyone cares about it when you take a
01:21:00
step back you realize no one gives a [ __ ] yeah no the the only the only ratings I I don't even know when ratings
01:21:07
day is Le like JJ or you tell me and then you read what's in the New Zealand
01:21:12
hero well it's funny she mentioned JJ CU she gave us some advice really early on
01:21:16
and she just said it doesn't really matter what you're saying as long as it
01:21:19
seems like everyone's having a good time you've won half the battle like because
01:21:23
if if it sounds like people are having a bad time then then you know whatever the
01:21:28
content is is not going to be great but if at the very least if feels like it's
01:21:33
a positive thing and people are having a good time then you've kind of you've
01:21:36
you've You've Won 50% of it you know that I didn't learn that lesson for for
01:21:41
a very very long time so like you know that you say the thing taking a break too seriously that can kind of sometimes
01:21:46
take away from the very point of it which is just a couple of some a few people enjoying themselves and having uh
01:21:52
a good time is kind of I mean like conversations at pubs aren't necessarily the greatest thing in the world but like
01:21:57
there if there's a general harm of of happiness in the year then that's half
01:22:02
the battle of a of a good time yeah and a disastrous Voice break like come on come on it's not the end of the world
01:22:09
yeah then it's then it's 28 voice breaks ago then it's a week ago then it's a
01:22:12
month ago then it's 10 years ago yeah and and and no one gives a [ __ ] as much
01:22:16
as you do that's another thing you was asking for about lessons I've learned in
01:22:20
life is no one gives as much of a [ __ ] about it as you do like your humiliations and you know what whatever
01:22:26
it's happened how people are think about it that people don't and then you know
01:22:29
like if you're infinitude the world doesn't really give that much of a [ __ ]
01:22:33
and then the universe definitely doesn't give that much of a [ __ ] so I I I I
01:22:37
fully agree like everyone everyone's kind of self-conscious to a degree and everyone's wondering what other people
01:22:42
think about them but everyone else is just thinking the same as you they're thinking about themselves yeah so and in
01:22:48
terms of being remembered yeah no no one's going to be remembered like 200 years from now no one's going to know
01:22:53
who Ed yeah well I saw this thing recently about how little Jimmy Hendricks is getting play played now you know like
01:22:59
they were tracking artists that have continued on Queen are bigger than they've ever been you know um there's
01:23:05
various artists that just keep going and going Nana are huge now you know and and
01:23:09
then for some reason Jimmy Hendricks is going and sliding into the past and disappearing like these huge Stars you
01:23:15
know like look at Elvis and there'll be a point where the Beatles aren't aren't
01:23:19
anything there' be a point when Taylor Swift is isn't anything like if Taylor
01:23:22
Swift is not remembered then good luck freaking me well you think of all the all the all the all the people on
01:23:29
statues around the world like who are they who's that guy on the Statue yeah
01:23:32
and was yeah um no one thing I I really love when I hear you guys it's like almost the the the Defiance like you
01:23:39
must be like your boss's nightmare it's almost like you have um like a meeting
01:23:43
with do you have Consultants who do you yeah we've we've had Consultants yeah
01:23:47
yeah like usually it's usually someone from like someone from LA or someone from Australia because someone from
01:23:52
overseas knows more about radio than what people he do and that they tell you what you should be doing and the usual
01:23:57
thing is keep your brake length shorter but you guys it always comes around to keep your Brak length shorter they go
01:24:01
blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah and just tighten up those
01:24:04
brakes a little bit and then they always say that thing goes not that if it's if
01:24:07
it's great content then they go through as long as you want but tighten up those
01:24:09
brakes a b and then they put a clock in and you realize that all they care about
01:24:13
is that you that you talk for three minutes that's yeah I was always always about giving them value for money it's
01:24:18
like I'm being paid really well so I want to rather than less is more it's
01:24:23
like no more is more that's why podcasts are so good and kind of approved a point
01:24:28
in a way that people do have the appetite for long form yeah yeah yeah um although but I also do actually now over
01:24:36
time realize what they're kind of saying and that and then because I'm going to
01:24:39
play back here play your back a break that you thought was freaking amazing you're like you I should have jumped out
01:24:44
there we're just saying the same joke over and over and over again and you know so maybe maybe it was maybe it was
01:24:49
time to get time to get out it's it's good though it's it's a very good show
01:24:52
you guys you guys do how long have you been going now 10 years on whole breakfast yeah wow n years that's
01:24:59
amazing and you you still love it you enjoy it freaking love it I actually love it more now than ever cuz a lot of
01:25:05
these things that you're talking about by you know like um that idea of not taking it too seriously and not and just
01:25:10
letting go you know letting go of the previous break and going cuz you know like I think you asked me for one of the
01:25:15
lessons that I've learned most over the years and it's that at any second you
01:25:18
can just flip things like any conversation that's not going well you can just suddenly make B cuz you know
01:25:23
the past is the past is realm you don't live in you can just make it better so
01:25:26
like if the you can chew on something like you can even be halfway through an interview and it's not going well and
01:25:31
you start chewing on it or you can go oh no I'll just make the interview good
01:25:34
from now and then that's in the past and then if it ends good then then it's good
01:25:38
so that's so that's what I've learned so if I'm even in the middle of a break I'm
01:25:42
like oh this isn't going well I'll just make it good you know like rather than
01:25:47
going oh this isn't going well I'll just you know pet her out yeah I think having
01:25:51
that awareness is a good thing and you can you can do that when relationship with your your partner like you know
01:25:56
like you know when you know when you got those opportunities in a relationship you know everyone knows these moments
01:26:01
you've got a pathway you're talking to them and you know that you can niggle
01:26:04
them you know and you they might be doing something wrong but you have a choice whether you
01:26:08
can which way you go on it and you can always make it good or bad or at least better but but for a long time in your
01:26:16
life you go you for some reason you always choose the I'm going to burn the whole house down I'm going to screw this
01:26:22
you know but if you just go hang on this is just seems to be going this way you know what I'm going to I'm going to make
01:26:27
I'm going to I'm just going to change my attitude here and I'm just going to I'm
01:26:31
going to be good now I'm I'm going to make I'm going to make it better I'll
01:26:33
see if I can make this a a good experience that's so true it's so true I
01:26:38
I do do you feel like that you've reached this point because you've done
01:26:41
the the work or do you think this is just like a maturity thing and you would I wonder about that because a lot of the
01:26:46
things I think about can you tell a 22y old calm down 22y old mat wouldn't have listened no you can't they' be like
01:26:55
piss off they hate cuz they want to burn the world down um and they want to and they think you think you know everything
01:26:59
at that point um but that's but but but I think also because you know they always say that youth is wasted on the
01:27:05
young but I also think it's wasted on the middle-aged and the old like all of
01:27:08
us have the ability to ruin the whatever amount of time we've got cuz who knows
01:27:13
you could die tomorrow what whatever but we all have that ability don't we to
01:27:17
just go to just waste it and and so like yeah and you just look back at what you
01:27:23
were doing in your 20s and you go but what what you did in your 20s has got you to where you are so you know there's
01:27:29
a there's possibility you have to go through those phases you know yeah insane ambition that you've got to that
01:27:34
you have and the and destructive thing and and and all all that stuff but you know if I guess if you if you changed a
01:27:43
single thing back then then you wouldn't be where where you are now yeah the
01:27:47
butterfly effect thing um yeah I probably still have um this issue with fully enjoying or appreciate what I've
01:27:54
got now and and you do you every now and then you catch yourself and you realize
01:27:58
things could be a whole lot worse oh [ __ ] yeah I mean I I I was think I always think about these two people and
01:28:04
like it's such a cliche but I was in an India not so long ago um and I saw these
01:28:09
two like they look like 11year old kids and they were in a dump and they had no shoes and they were actually going
01:28:15
through the dump on the side of the road and um and uh Bangalore and and they I made eye contact them with them as we wh
01:28:22
past in our car and for some reason you have those moments that just it's kind
01:28:26
of like a cinematic moment you're like oh my God and they just got me thinking
01:28:29
you know imagine those people looking at us and knowing that we are freaking dissatisfied with their life they be
01:28:35
like you what you don't think you got enough like or you know what I mean like
01:28:40
and and then then not only they would do anything to have what you have but then imagine if they found
01:28:46
out that you were dissatisfied with what you got and you think you deserve more you'd be like that that [ __ ] what they
01:28:52
drove past in the car at pay and eyeballed me he's unhappy outrageous entitlement what a piece of [ __ ] you
01:29:00
know is he ever going to be [ __ ] happy if he's not happy happy there you know have have you had any counseling or
01:29:07
therapy over the years no never you've just worked it out yourself with podcast
01:29:12
and books I had um you know relationship therapy but I'm suspicious that maybe
01:29:17
relationship Theory might be just helping you out of the relationship and it's just like a step
01:29:22
on the way out it's like soften the um is softening the departure I've Got a
01:29:27
Theory on that I'd like to see the stats on how many relationships get turned around because yeah yeah um but
01:29:35
um no no I haven't and so that was that was my plan really was to see if I could
01:29:40
I just had this idea when I was you know up late one night I was like I wonder if
01:29:43
I can read my way out of this and and and listen to podcasts and and listen to audio books and and then um you know
01:29:50
listen to uh P scientific papers and stuff and so like I got a p PDF reader that was in my ears all the time and
01:29:58
started running a lot and listening to the the stuff and and I feel like that's
01:30:02
actually not a bad path because you got to do something if you're not feeling
01:30:05
great it's stupid not to do something and yeah that's I think it was Einstein
01:30:09
that said the definition of Madness is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result which is
01:30:12
exactly what we all do yeah yeah and and so um I think there's something to that
01:30:17
but but also like what I'd say especially with the mybook is it's like it's not four people with horrific I
01:30:24
mean they're welcome to read it but not but it it's not for you know this this
01:30:28
really serious clinical depression and there's there's things that are quite
01:30:31
different from this but I'm sort of looking at the person that has all the capability to be enjoying the life
01:30:37
they're having and is failing to do so is really what the the idea is cuz that
01:30:43
feels it feels almost disrespectful to to to have it okay and there's so many
01:30:49
levels of okay you know but but but but has all everything in the in their grasp
01:30:54
to actually enjoy their life and you know there's so many people God everyone
01:30:58
sees the person in a wheelchair with you know one you know like trying to make it
01:31:02
down the street to the dairy and and when that person goes past you you can either go um you know I don't know I
01:31:10
mean if you don't see that and and reflect back on your life and go I probably owe that person to probably
01:31:15
enjoy what I've got you know even to that very very very low level you know yeah 100% oh the the book um really
01:31:23
resonated with me I have that sometimes it's like why am I unhappy I've got
01:31:27
nothing to be [ __ ] unhappy about um and it's a it's a weird feeling eh
01:31:31
because you you do have a sense of guilt as well like you know you should be happy yeah you're like why am I not
01:31:35
happy yeah that that's that's what I had and turning into it but there was
01:31:38
there's a thing that you've knowah harar wrote in his book which I thought was
01:31:41
interesting it's not his idea but he was talking about his three Slots of unhappiness of um basically concern we
01:31:48
have fear and anxiety that we have there three slots and if you're in a trench
01:31:53
and you've seen that movie they shall not grow old you know Peter Jackson and
01:31:56
they smiling and doing that stuff cuz their slots are filled with um you know being shot um you know you know trench
01:32:03
foot um and you know grenades and such and and and so they and and so that's
01:32:10
that takes them to their base level of Happiness so they return to that and you know they're fearful all that kind of
01:32:15
stuff but we all have those slots so we feel no matter how good things get we fill those slots with whatever stupid
01:32:20
things like that [ __ ] at Works giving me [ __ ] you know like um you know my career is not quite right and then I
01:32:27
once heard the story from Paul Stanley from Kiss You know that guy he rang up crying to the bentle Bentley because he
01:32:33
wasn't a he'd been dropped out of the top five people who get the the latest
01:32:36
Bentley given to him so he'd filled one of his slots some people had you know in
01:32:40
the trenches you're filling that slot or if you're starving then you fill that
01:32:44
slot with having to feed your family or you know feed yourself or survive um like your manufacture problems yeah yeah
01:32:50
so if you're Paul Stanley you fill that slot cuz he's got nothing to worry about
01:32:53
you f that slot with you you've been taken out of the top five guys to receive the latest car yeah and but you
01:32:59
can easily CH you know you just have to um change your mindset yeah have to change your mindset and look at what
01:33:04
what you have you know learn you know like um getting more stuff doesn't make you happy you know
01:33:12
but learning to want what you want what you've got is the trick right yeah yeah
01:33:16
be be happy with what you've got them where you are yeah oh oh we're going to
01:33:19
wrap up but one one one more thing which I feel like is worth a mention uh um the
01:33:25
up the was um that's a big movement that's been going the last couple of
01:33:28
years and there's a new one the the P Pon and you are the creator of that well
01:33:33
it's so genius isn't it like so I was just sitting in a pub drinking a pin on
01:33:36
W watching The Warriors and I sent to a group chat which happened to be a radio group chat cuz we all you know when we
01:33:44
were watching The Warriors we all text each other and stuff and I was like the pen on was and then and then someone put
01:33:50
it up online and it it sort of blew up and oh it's it's blown up in a big way yeah
01:33:56
yeah it's it's it's gone everywhere you know it's gone quite it's blown up and I
01:34:00
reckon it's the same reason why Kung Fu Panda is popular it's because it's the
01:34:05
Opposites isn't it it's like like everyone's trying to say what a Grassroots Warriors fan they are and
01:34:09
everyone's trying to say that they've been there for the start and they're not
01:34:12
a bandwagon Dr you know and you know like they and then you're like I enjoy the Warriors matched with
01:34:20
the delicious ponir it's like it's like so so silly but um it certainly got me a
01:34:26
lot of uh a lot of pin on was in my way oh my God that's amazing some boxes and boxes so um in
01:34:33
fact I I bought you a bottle today you you you did it was a lovely bottle something that was delivered to me um
01:34:39
just before I came up here yeah we you and I we do enjoy our pin on wild we've
01:34:42
had a lot of them over the years um so out of all the work you've done what are
01:34:45
you what are you the most proud of do you do you ever think of recency bias we yeah what you know do you know what I'm
01:34:52
actually quite proud of this book at the moment I'm I'm quite proud of this book
01:34:56
at the moment and um I'm also quite proud of I reckon I'm a really good dad and
01:35:03
that's that's I mean I've really really worked on that and that's that's I've
01:35:06
been lucky in that I've done breakfast radio so I've been home for my boys when
01:35:09
they come home from school so right now it's those two things and I think I'm
01:35:13
quite proud of how much I'm um en you know enjoying life and trying to be a bit more of a less of a freaking eore
01:35:20
about everything you know what I mean like I I think I've turned some Corners
01:35:25
um it's funny you have to do the work though way yeah you do like no one can
01:35:28
do it for you and it never stops and also you don't all the things that people say it's just an ideal like even
01:35:34
like the most amazing like I know like take cica for example you know one of you know great sto philosopher and
01:35:40
Statesman he like there's so many stories of him being a complete freaking [ __ ] you know and and just being you
01:35:47
know doing terrible terrible thing so there's no one even the most supposedly
01:35:50
enlightened people screw up or or all the time so even if you like go oh my God I'm like so amazing now um I don't
01:35:58
let things get to me you'll then just spend a whole day being angry at someone
01:36:01
and and being a [ __ ] dick and and and and then and then that's that's [ __ ]
01:36:09
fine because at least you've got something you know that um have you ever read that book um when breath becomes
01:36:12
ear by Paul K Kell no haven't heard it's a great book it's about a guy who he
01:36:19
he's a neuroscientist that develops a brain tumor and dies throughout the book
01:36:22
actually so it's and he wrote the book and then it was released after he was
01:36:25
dead um so it's it's um it's a comedy yeah it's it's comedy yeah but but it's
01:36:31
kind of grum but then he's talking in you know about like he basically says you don't get there but the best thing
01:36:37
in life is to have at least have something to strive towards you know and he wanted to strive towards dying that's
01:36:42
a [ __ ] grum example I've come up with you but but he he wanted to um he he
01:36:46
wanted to strive towards being perfect for his his wife and his kid on the way out and made it e easy for them and and
01:36:52
he wanted to strive to being really good but you can't do that but at least he
01:36:55
knew what he wanted to be you know yeah I think I think that that's a good message that I think that's the best
01:37:01
thing you can do it just make your immediate circle sort of proud and yeah hopefully when when you're gone they
01:37:06
miss you like your kids or yeah if if you can make if you can make people around you's life a little bit better in
01:37:12
your life and then it's not freaking bad but but but too often the time we make
01:37:18
people's lives around us [ __ ] Terrible by being absolute penises yeah well you do you save the your worst
01:37:24
behavior for the people you love the most oh yeah [ __ ] yeah I catch myself my my girlfriend moved in like four months
01:37:29
ago I haven't find myself doing it like she'll leave um just little things like
01:37:34
she'll have a half drunk cup of tea and she'll leave leave it on the sofa or
01:37:37
she'll there'll be an empty toilet roll and you're doing the same thing to me I
01:37:40
liveed by myself for a long time after the my big break up and then now and then everything's in the exact freaking
01:37:46
right space and then you're like um there's another toothbrush in the bathroom um
01:37:54
and that's sticking up in a weird kind of kind of way now there's like a Q-tip
01:38:00
that's yeah you know like are you living with your partner now no no no no okay
01:38:06
but um just mysterious sometimes but but we've talked about it a lot because
01:38:10
because I become a weirdo which like everything's really tidy and then suddenly her things are all in a drawer
01:38:15
she's she's just come around and she's she's laid everything out and she's put
01:38:18
her stuff where she' put herself which is pretty normally and then she goes upstairs and she goes back down and
01:38:22
everything's back he put away like a weirdo and she's like um the [ __ ] are
01:38:27
you doing and I was like just I've just love you do you you you do get set in your ways yeah and
01:38:35
it's a it's a it's a dangerous thing and and I think becoming tidy because you
01:38:39
can always be more tidy like I talked to someone on a that worked on a cruise ship for a billionaire and she was
01:38:43
telling me that they have to everything like the level of tidiness is because they're billionaires and R in the boat
01:38:49
every now and then you're around like every brick you know not not there's a
01:38:53
lot of bricks on boats but everything would be made sure that was all the same color and the whole thing and there's
01:38:58
levels of Tidy so I think it's a think that perfectionism of tidiness and when
01:39:02
you're a little bit older and you've broken up with someone that you can you
01:39:05
can you can go you can go into the minut of tidiness but also I quite like being
01:39:10
tidy because um it's controls the chaos around your life a little bit I don't
01:39:15
know and also I freaking love cleaning because it's easier than what I normally
01:39:18
have to do is write something or do something so it's like they're like cleaning yeah [ __ ] great like if if
01:39:24
everything [ __ ] ends I could just I sounds [ __ ] lame but become a cleaner become cleaner for Airbnb or
01:39:34
something cleaning what what do you want to do um what do you want to do next is
01:39:37
there anything that you haven't done that you want to do like we talked about
01:39:40
this at the beginning you know TV series movie um animated series which we didn't
01:39:45
get into music you've done you've done now on the ACC I'm just a comments man
01:39:50
when I'm commentating sport I'd like to be allowed to do the ball by ball at
01:39:52
some point like not not Jeremy Wells or Jason hood off or or Mike Lane off and actually be allowed to call the ball boy
01:39:59
ball and not just be the comments guy that would that would be good I tried to do it recently I sort of jumped on and
01:40:03
then there was panic in the panic in the booth not yet m not yet not years acc's
01:40:10
only been going it's only been 10 years mate you're not you're not ready yeah
01:40:14
anything else it has been a hell of a career and I feel like you've still got
01:40:18
so much to to you know to do yeah [ __ ] what do I want to do that's a very good
01:40:23
question question cuz like you know part of maybe writing a book was like to write a book you know when I was off to
01:40:27
write a book I mean that was kind of like as much as I had something to say and wanted to do it I guess um I also to
01:40:32
write a book it's kind of cool you said you mean you wrote a book you wrote your
01:40:34
first book years and years ago but when you wrote a book you go it's kind of one
01:40:37
of those things you say it's like I've written a book yeah oh it is especially
01:40:42
when most of your stuff's on radio so it's um you do you do a break whether
01:40:45
it's good or bad it's out there and um a book is something a bit more permanent
01:40:49
and it's something I I suppose someone like your dad can sort of understand a
01:40:52
bit more I tell you what I'm enjoying now when I want to lean into more I just
01:40:55
did this podcast today which I spent about 3 weeks researching for that I recorded the first episode for today and
01:41:02
it was like deeply researched podcasts not just talking [ __ ] like you know you do so much more
01:41:07
research than I do for my podcast but you know like really getting to know something and then imparting that
01:41:14
information over three-part podcasts is something I'm [ __ ] loving leaning into now so you just know more about
01:41:23
like this one particularly was about Peter plumy Walker that murder so I probably know more about the Peter
01:41:27
Plumley Walker murder than nearly anyone not murder it wasn't a murder but Peter
01:41:32
plumbley Walker situation what was I Peter Plumley Walker this was in the 1980s Cricket Umpire yeah Cricket Umpire
01:41:40
love BDSM yeah yeah and um he end up getting thrown over the hook of Falls by Renee chigal and nille Walker yeah right
01:41:47
after so so BDSM so he got a he got a flogging and they flogged him too much no no it's very complicated right but oh
01:41:55
I was young at the time so I vaguely remember the story oh that sounds good yeah yeah so so so it's a serious
01:42:01
podcast uh well no as serious as what you serious just as deeply researched deep deep deeply deeply researched and
01:42:08
that that's pretty fun just spending like three weeks really getting to know
01:42:15
a topic you know so you you said something you vaguely interested in and then you just know everything about it
01:42:21
that you can possibly find that's that's that's pretty fun so I might lean into
01:42:24
that for a while how good how can people find it what do they search oh that's
01:42:27
just the m and jury daily bespoke podcast the next that'll be in there somewhere in the sea of because we do a
01:42:33
bunch of stupid ones every now and then there's a good one research one so oh no
01:42:37
they're all good they're all good but um and this book is amazing a life less
01:42:41
punishing 13 ways to love the life you've got um yeah yeah you must be proud of that it's bloody great yeah oh
01:42:47
no I am and I um thank you so much for for for talking to me and it's kind of
01:42:51
weird to talk to a friend like this you know what I mean like over it's bizarre
01:42:56
but it's really good it's probably the best conversation we've ever had because
01:42:59
we we don't um normally normally we're drinking drinking and making [ __ ] jokes
01:43:04
and being idiots and and then you know laugh you know like me like and I always enjoy it though I always definitely I I
01:43:13
always enjoy our ketchups I always go away and think um yeah Mets Mets a good dude I'm pleased I've got him as a
01:43:18
friend but I'm also after after doing the research for this uh it's a good
01:43:22
thing we meet when we did like if we met in our 20s I think we would have both thought the other one was a
01:43:28
dick but but when your 20s you everyone else is a dick especially in media you're like that [ __ ] [ __ ] yeah
01:43:34
all right I um cheers yeah I love being your friend thanks for coming over yeah yeah me too thank you so much for floody
01:43:40
lets have a wine let's go I'm the wise I'm the p on wise [Music] a