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okay Runners only with dime Harley Runners only with dom Harvey and Sir Ashley Bloomfield g'day
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oh I mean it's fabulous to have you here how does it sit with you being called
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Sarah oh yeah well people mostly come up to me and say well do we call you sir Ashley or is it Dr Ashley
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or is it Professor I just call me Ashley you know so this is New Zealand um occasionally the titles get you gets
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used but uh for the most part uh sort of I Can Go the whole you know days without
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even remembering that it's a thing yet right well we've got to get to that
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Knighthood there's so much um ground to cover with you first of all the podcast
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is called Runners only with dom Harvey I know you have a relationship with running you you still run you preferred
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sort of form of exercise these days as mountain biking I believe well I enjoy time on the mountain bike of course
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about six months ago as happens every now and then there are two sorts of bikers those who have fallen off their
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bike and those who are going to fall off their bike six months ago I was in the first group and I break my thumb coming
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off the bike so uh it's it's mostly gentle biking now and it's actually
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given me a bit of an opportunity to get back into a bit of running nothing too serious yet but trying to rebuild the
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fitness because you have um as far as I am aware you've done the Rotorua Marathon twice I've done it three times
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three times yep and uh yeah so I've done a marathon three times in my life and
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all times it was uh it was twice with mates and the first and the third time the second time I went down there to try
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and um do the best time I could and managed to smash out three hours so that's there was the Pinnacle of my
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running career and it's been downhill since three hours and three hours in you
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know kind of zero was just right really yeah no desire to go back and try for a sub
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three like sub three is like the Mount Everest for an everyday Runner well I was in uh I was in you know
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you know I'm a little bit older right now so yeah running is a great thing and
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you know the thing I love about running is it doesn't matter where you are and I
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don't go anywhere without my running shoes because you can just you've got a
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set of running shoes you can exercise and it's such an efficient form of keeping fit and keeping the old
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cardiovascular health there so you know it's one of the things I really love
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about as well as the endorphins of course yeah I I agree I still can't believe that um like three hours is a
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legit time like regardless of what age you are that's going to get you know be
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a Boston qualifier time I can't believe you didn't want to go back and go for a
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time that they had a two in front of it oh also three hours in Rotorua rotor is a notoriously it's a pretty hilly course
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yeah it's a sub three on a flat anywhere yeah well for me uh it was sort of like
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uh I felt like I'd reached the Pinnacle and then uh it could have all been down
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but I'll take the win okay so um we are recording this and um late March 2023 and uh I was thinking
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about it on my run this morning it was exactly three years ago that um things were turning to [ __ ] quite
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frankly and uh I suppose this is when you became like well known in New Zealand what was I said what are we now
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22nd of March 22nd of March yes right this this week period you know we're right we're sort of right near the end
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of it but like if we go back to last week the Border shut on the food if it was this
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time three years ago the Border shut to everybody except kiwis citizens and and permanent residents returning on the
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Thursday the pm at the time Jacinda radin made that announcement to the Nation about
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the alert level framework and you know it was a big it was in a big address to the nation
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and said we're going to be an alert level two for a couple of weeks well Sunday everything changed because we
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could see actually two weeks was was too long and Monday the announcement was okay people we're in alert level 3 and
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Wednesday which is basically today but that you know as we talk we go into a full lockdown uh so and here's the point
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things were turning to custard overseas and we had an opportunity if we acted quickly to avoid the same here and by
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goodness um not everything went right over the next two or three years but there was one decision that was really
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well timed yeah yeah that must have been um I mean it was a surreal term for everyone but I'm thinking you know for
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me it meant going to the supermarket and seeing people panic buying you know toilet paper and canned food but for you
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I guess it was um you know just a whirlwind of a time for a completely different reason you must have been like
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like 80 nowadays 20 hour days what well a pretty long day so I think the the key
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thing was um for me it and as you've alluded to what what transpired to be the key role that
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I played was was the the community of public communication alongside either the prime minister or a minister and I
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had to just Focus my my uh my work and my life on that so I handed over quite a few of my responsibilities to other
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colleagues at a chief executive role of the Ministry of Health I handed but you know that side of it over to someone
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because that Focus that was required the mental and physical effort that was required to prepare for and kind of see
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through those daily stand-ups and then you know it was a bit of recovery period afterwards that was really the big focus
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and of course when we started them back at the end of January we had no idea that they were going to become such an
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important part of of their communication with the public and of sort of rallying
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people I use this definition of leadership as being a collective call to action and it was you know that the
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daily stand-ups were how people kept in touch with what we needed to do collectively to to
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yeah and there was I think 307 of them that you did at the end those stand-ups those 1pm briefings
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um we're gonna get there's so much ground cover and we will get to that um but first of all director general of
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Health like what does that mean because in my entire life I think you're probably the only director general of
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Health that I could name well that's right uh it's not usually a role that
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anyone knows that it's there let alone who's in the role is that how it should
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be well if you have a dream Runners director General that's right yeah I'd
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obviously didn't ring the fine print on my contractor but you know this is the
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thing I mean all government departments Ministries whether it's education Social
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Development uh you know primary Industries they've all got a chief executive in some of those roles uh have
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got quite sort of old-fashioned anachronistic titles director general of Health you've got the Comptroller of
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Customs uh you know there's the the commissioner of of ird so there are specific titles for a number of these
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roles but you're also the chief executive of that organization and I guess the the role of director general
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of health is there are two parts to it one is you and your organization are the principal advisors the government around
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Health policy and health matters but also the role sort of leads the health system and given us is a pretty complex
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system um that's it's a big role even in peacetime it's a huge and complex role
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it's not very often you open the newspaper pandemic or no pandemic and you don't find health either on the
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front page or fairly close to it okay so the director of general of health is always a busy job it's it's always a
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huge job really yeah um so let's go right back to the beginning so you were born in Napier in the late 1960s school
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teacher mum military Dad yeah so military dad part-time he was my my mother was a primary school teacher and
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my dad who was from a farm in southern Hawke's Bay Hong konga um you know real rural upbringing there
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and Danny Boyce high he was a mechanic he got a mechanic apprenticeship uh but like a lot from his generation you know
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never never had tertiary education but clearly was was smart and had ambition and um and that kind of his career
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actually progressed when he finished he was the chief executive of Mitsubishi Motors New Zealand that's right it was a
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man from the shop floor right right to that role yeah yeah yeah so what was his role in the military well he was uh he
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did his compulsory military training and didn't enjoy it very much but but also
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uh saw the potential of being in the territorials and he joined he was in an infantry and he rose through the ranks
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and became a lieutenant colonel he was commander of one of New Zealand's infantry battalions before he finished
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up in the late 70s and you know little known fact I actually followed him this one steps and I've done my officer
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training in the late 80s and wasn't commissioned into the medical Corps I was commissioned as an infantry officer
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and I did that for a number of years um actually based here at the Battalion in Auckland and uh you know again all
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these life experiences shape who you are and and so when you put in these kind of
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really s challenging crisis type situations to be honest some of the training and
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experience end the degree to which I was pushed during officer training you know
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was actually incredibly helpful do you feel like you got both um your parents traits like um I suppose the nurturing
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side from your mum being a school teacher and you know they I suppose the strict business side from your dad being
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you know a military man yeah well uh say I did and you know both my parents are dead now my mum passed in 2008 and
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Dad about five years ago and 20 uh started 2018 and I feel you know I think about them every
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day I feel them every day and it's funny because I'm close to my brother and
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sister and we see them in each other and often joke about it but you're right and
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my mother being a primary school teacher you know we kind of got a little that that Head Start in
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life because she was interested in teaching us to read and and so on and of course she was very interested in us
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doing as well as possible through our education and without being pushy because neither of them were pushy but
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they were just really supportive and gave us every opportunity yeah so your dad wasn't strict I'd imagine he was but
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um but if anything uh more that like many of his generation he didn't know how to show affection and the
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wonderful thing I saw was when he had grandchildren he and often this happens especially men of that generation that
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was when he he learned to show physical affection and emotional you know respond
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emotionally not just to his grandchildren but to his children as well and so you know our relationship
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with him once we had our own children was quite different and it was a lovely thing actually and I'm so pleased he got
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you know that that was something that he was able to enjoy in his life yeah yeah
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that's so funny that I think it's a product of the generation like I'm um
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I'm just a few years behind you but I was you know like um my uncles they they if you were
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naughty they could spank you but you're like yeah anyone was up for a spanking
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and I never said my uncle John who was a Dairy Farmer never saw him cry once now
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you'll see me to 21st or 50th whatever the function is and he'll be born yeah
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my father was the same you know and again I think it was a lovely thing that these men of that generation who didn't
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necessarily experience it when they were children you know their physical and emotional
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interaction and affection with their parents that they were able to to you know to experience that in their later
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life yeah yeah I finally let some walls down and show a bit of vulnerability so you grew up in tawa yeah tawa was where
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we shift I was six years old we shifted to Tower big move South and to be honest
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my father applied for a job in Wellington he was quite happy as service manager of what was called Townsend
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Motors in Napier but it was my mother that prompted him and one of the reasons why she went to cheated her teacher
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training in Wellington and just loved the place and she just wanted to go back so she got him to apply for a job down
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there and uh and we'd made you know we loaded the car up put the cat in the in
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the cage and then uh off we we totaled down on the Hillman Superman's to Tower
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where I you know did my my growing up and it seems like you were you're a good
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kid um first 15 head pre-feet in the School production for Oklahoma um were you like a like a like a nerdy
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kid a goody two shoes like you're people from your school year that didn't like
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you what's like what's the worst thing they could say about at you she make no mistake I wasn't a goody two
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shoots you know I mean I got into trouble including his head prefect ideas say but uh do you like what
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I just you know a little bit of um you know misbehavior in the chemistry lab with the water bottles uh which uh the
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teacher didn't take too kind to read a few other things okay but the point here
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is you know and you've described some things I just loved and this is one of
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the sacrifices my parents did make we lived in tawa Tower College was a good college but they sent us to Scots my
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brother and myself um yeah big Trek across town train and bus and I mean that was an experience in itself uh
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every day but when it came to secondary schooling we had they had intended us to
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come back to Tower but we just had sealed into Scots and the opportunities there were were manifold
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um you know we had uh that the sporting and the cultural things I was in the pipe band I was in the choirs and the
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school productions I played the flute I you know put me put to a school band uh you know rock band with some mates I
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loved sport and of course you could do athletics and you could do swimming and rugby and I was useless at cricket bat
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where he had a bit of a social team so I just think the opportunity I was a jack
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of all trades and so I think you know school years and I've got a I'm still
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really close to a number of guys from my from my school year we get together quite often and um just a you know
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really I have great memories of that time yeah it seems like you were um like just a phenomenal kid I went to
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um Palmerston North boys high school and uh the the guys in the first 15 were like very very good rugby players but
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very few of them were really intelligent so there was like um those sort of jocks
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and then there was the intelligent people that were nerds but it feels like you had the theater aspect going on the
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sport aspect the intelligence well uh you know I guess I was uh blessed I was I was you know reasonably smart but also
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again and I put a lot of a lot of the credit to my mother and she created opportunities you know I can remember
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for years as a kid tricking along to piano lessons and thinking why am I doing this and oh my goodness and then
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guitar lessons and then she really loved the flute so she asked me to take up Luna flute but I tell you what uh you
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know a few years down the track I just was so grateful that she made me do that and I was always interested in sport and
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you know what it's like as a kid in those days I mean tawa we ruled the streets we we were out the whole you
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know after school you were out on the streets on your bike you would build trolleys and you'd race them up and down
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the street um you know but here raising I have to say at times but you we had the bush over the road so we were always
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outside as well so you know we were fit and and uh and then you know you could you have an expression of that by
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through playing your rugby or your Cricket or or running or whatever it might be yeah and um you you wanted to
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be a pilot I believe until you're about that stayed with me right through probably till I was about 14 and then a
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visit to the hospital one day on a sort of a you know an open sort of thing and um
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maybe maybe medicine's the thing and and then that really shaped my last few
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years at school because you had to do all three Sciences so that was good I still managed to keep up um some other
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things I did I did Rush in through as Scots was one of the few schools in the country at that time that taught Russian
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so I did Russian a bit of French and so on but you know really started to hit the focus on the sciences and then uh
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managed to get just enough marks to scrape into Medical School and came up here to Auckland yeah so why medicine
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was there a moment what was it an episode of Jordan Street it was just you know being in the
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hospital and talking to people and seeing and then you know I was um I'd been brought up in the church so
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that was quite a big shaper of my values and you know the the thing about um just you know kindness and looking
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after other people and and caring for others I guess was a was a sort of a value base that I had and so it fitted
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well with a with um with the opportunity to do medicine what's your religion well uh now I say
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people say oh so you've got a faith I've got a faith but not a traditional one
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now but you know I'm a very eclectic Max I was brought up in the Baptist Church
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and tawa had an incredibly strong Baptist Church uh and very musical uh so a lot of the music I I experienced was
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through the church it was a fantastic opportunity I went so uh Baptist start bringing me to a presbyterian School uh
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my wife's now a lay chaplain and and very active in our local Anglican Church
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one of the kids is christened as an Anglican two are Presbyterians and so on so an Eclectic mix what I would say is
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um in terms of you know my life those Christian values are the things that have really kind of shaped who I am and
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I talk now you know when I do my leadership talk I talk about values and the one that's top of the list is
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kindness and if you look at all the world's major religions kindness is an absolute fundamental principle it's
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about doing things for other people without expecting reciprocity and it's kind of what distinguishes us as humans
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actually from other species that we do that you know it's funny you should say
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that I I had um Adam parory sitting in this chair last week on the podcast and at the end of the chat I said to my
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you're you're really kind and uh he had like a nervous laugh and then we got
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talking about the word kind and it's like in my 20s I I would have like sort
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of thought of anyone calling me kind but now it's like I'll take it as the
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highest compliment oh absolutely I think you're doing well if yeah I agree I I
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you know I make it really kind of sad people like I'm a fully paid up member
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of the kindness club actually uh and you know and uh there's just such good evidence actually really good evidence
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about the importance of kindness and also for your own well-being acts of kindness to other people incredibly
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supportive of your own mental and and physical and emotional well-being yeah so um so how brutal is medicine School
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you see you qualify and then um don't half the people get like kicked out after the first year well it's something
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a lot harder now than it was I would say you know my mates who I went through medical school and I often say to each
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other I would never have gotten now it's that that first year there's a huge
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number of kids who are Keen to get into medicine and both otago and Auckland they do that first year Health Sciences
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but the you know only a small proportion of them really get in and so then those
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others go on to do other other degrees immediately do other health professional degrees which is fantastic
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once you're in though it's uh it's a very high retention rate yep it's pretty
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it's pretty tough it's hard work I mean I've got our two oldest kids have just
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studied engineering and I tell you what that's four really busy really hard years it's it's not an easy degree and I
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know because I've got a niece and a nephew who've done or are doing law as
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well it's hard work that first year law here in Auckland a lot of kids do the
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first year but not not not a huge proportion and get through into the second so it's it's a thing with a lot
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of those professional degrees and medicines no different yeah so so you do meet us and then um
00:19:01
you at what point do you decide to go into public health because surely no one's studying medicine for seven or
00:19:05
eight years to go you know what I'm going to be a public servant yeah well that's right I can remember telling my
00:19:10
parents so they're going what what you kind of study what but you know what about being a surgeon or something uh
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yeah I just mid 90s and a critical thing was a good mate of mine for medical school had
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because I took a year off in the middle so I ended up in in the year behind which was great for finding a wife
00:19:28
because my wife was in that year and we we got together and got married in our final year so that was a lovely thing
00:19:34
but this mate of mine was a year ahead and he he said I I'm on the Public Health Training scheme I think you'd
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enjoy this so I had a bit of a look at it and thought Oh yeah I'll do this I
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loved my clinical medicine I really actually enjoyed being in the hospital I did a bit of general practice but I
00:19:49
decided Public Health was a thing and you know the rest was history well actually I did most of my Public Health
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Training here in Auckland and then towards the end of it I I said to my wife um I'd just like to get some experience
00:20:03
in the policy setting so let's go to Wellington for six months to round out my training so we went down
00:20:09
for six months and we're still there 25 years later you know I just loved that
00:20:14
it was the Nexus between public health and public policy and I just found the environment stimulating and invigorating
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and as my wife says to me I could never work it's everything's too gray you know
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because medicines are very sort of black and white here are the here's the here
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are the symptoms here's the diagnosis we'll do some tests bumper next next
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please but public policy and public health it's a long-term game yeah you've
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got to be tenacious and it's also it's about the art of the possible so anyway
00:20:42
I just love the Wellington environment and and state and I suppose you got the chance to have a lot of people rather
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than just like individuals that's exactly it it's I thought that and so an
00:20:52
example and uh not so much now but in early in my career in the in the naughties I was heavily involved in
00:20:58
Tobacco Control and I can remember as 20 years ago that the legislation to create
00:21:02
smoke-free workplaces was passed and at the time there wasn't even 50 percent
00:21:07
report for that within three months it's even 70 of even smokers supported it
00:21:12
because we suddenly I mean can you remember the days of going out they can go days without even seeing a
00:21:28
smoker you know this is a thing now in New Zealand uh it's different in Europe
00:21:32
having just been in Geneva last month you walk down the street still yes no smoking inside workplaces but you can
00:21:38
you just walk through this cloud of smoke as you walk down the street it's quite unpleasant well even yeah even
00:21:43
like if you're flying some plans around in new on the New Zealand flight there's
00:21:46
still plans that have the old um ashtrays that's crazy did someone Smoke On A Plane yeah and so you know now here
00:21:53
we are I was working on it you know we had really high rates of smoking by our year
00:21:58
10 students four formers and we do a survey every year now 95 to you know over 95 percent of them
00:22:06
of all ethnicities boys and girls have never even touched a cigarette whereas back in around 2000 it was sort of 60 of
00:22:15
them had at least tried it and you know for Maori girls it was really high so huge change huge benefits for Public
00:22:21
Health big intergenerational benefits and then of course there are new risks that come along vaping potentially oh
00:22:28
you love vaping though don't you know you're mad about the Vape you love a
00:22:32
watermelon Vape I don't need to be mad about it you sit there we're at low Med over the weekend
00:22:39
and you know I thought oh this place is you know I thought there's got to be big
00:22:43
clouds of marijuana smoke hovering over and was it was Vape you know it was Vape
00:22:47
clouds so when you see someone in traffic vaping in their car it's the most obnoxious thing you see these big
00:22:52
clouds of uh Vapors seeping out the window yeah it's a bit of a bit of a sidebar here but um what are your
00:22:59
thoughts on alcohol do you feel like alcohol is hitting the same way as tobacco in terms of you know the
00:23:03
awareness about it and do you think like 20 years from now or 50 years from now or whatever the time frame is we'll look
00:23:08
back and go can you believe that you know alcohol was encouraged to drink for the antioxidants and for the health
00:23:14
benefits so you know a few things I have been involved quite a lot in alcohol policy
00:23:19
both in New Zealand and internationally uh over the years there are there are a couple of key differences first of all
00:23:26
alcohol is much more widely used you know here in New Zealand 80 over 80 percent of people would have a drunk of
00:23:31
alcohol at least once a month so it's a much more widely used product yes it's a
00:23:37
drug and actually it's it's a quite harmful drug it's carcinogenic it harms
00:23:42
the fetus so you know improved for pregnant women there's really good evidence for these things there's no
00:23:46
dispute but it is much more widely used and here is the thing it can be consumed
00:23:50
in in the right in small quantities safely whereas that's not the same for debate
00:23:56
yeah yeah tobacco is harmful at any level so those are a couple of key references so saying there is a huge
00:24:04
burden of Public Health um or you know there's a huge Public Health burden family and uh violence a whole uh
00:24:13
crime a whole lot of things that are associated with alcohol there's a very strong association between alcohol and
00:24:19
suicide especially in young people and these are issues we need to absolutely look at much harder than we
00:24:28
are and you know I think the media is actually being pretty good at highlighting these issues and you've got
00:24:33
uh you know guy on aspener who's who's just published a book talking about his
00:24:38
experience uh and and a number of other prominent people I think we will see policy change here because there is no
00:24:45
doubt there is a burden of harm for alcohol from alcohol in New Zealand even though it's it contributes of course
00:24:52
really positively to our economy in many ways and there are there are some sort of social benefits as well yeah I had
00:24:59
guy on on the podcast a couple of weeks ago talking about his book the drinking game and yeah since then I've been um
00:25:04
just watching I love my Pinot noirs I've just been watching my intake and being
00:25:09
more mindful about how much I drink look it's really important you know we often
00:25:13
talk about youth drinking as a problem actually it's it's often more people
00:25:17
outrageous middle-aged people who coming home and opening a bottle of wine and consuming it either themselves or with a
00:25:24
partner is not an uncommon thing and that is actually quite heavy drinking and when you're of that age when you
00:25:30
went to University maybe it was different from Med students I don't know because you're wiser but you were of
00:25:35
that age when you went to University where it was a badge of honor if someone said Bloomfield he can hold his purse oh
00:25:40
totally yeah and there was no difference oh really you know of course in those days beer came and caught bottles and by
00:25:46
the crate and uh and you know I certainly had my my share of experience here at University
00:25:53
um but it's interesting to see I I don't see quite so much of that um you know
00:25:58
with with kids who are in there now mid you know not late teens to mid-20s it's
00:26:02
not quite so much that um they're a little bit more like aware or wiser they sort of managed to drink more
00:26:13
like the Europeans do and don't necessarily get you know just drink to get intoxicated every time yeah yeah
00:26:18
there's still there's still far too much of it and of course it goes then to
00:26:21
available in the links with Sport and sponsorship we have to address all these things
00:26:27
these were issues with tobacco so on alcohol I think we could do better and we would benefit from doing better on
00:26:33
that yeah nice okay so um let's go back to med school so that this is where you
00:26:38
met your wife Libby I did yeah can you remember remember that moment who who laid eyes on who first well is this
00:26:44
early on or through anything with um we we actually both remember seeing each other because I was a year ahead and
00:26:52
when you start medical school back in those days there was a thing called Fresh's camp and all the medical
00:26:57
students would come together there's only 100 in each class it was a pretty small you know quite a close group and
00:27:02
the Frisch's Camp was run by the students from the year above and I was involved in running it and I can still
00:27:06
remember seeing her arrive at Frisch's camp with a friend of hers but um you know obviously you're ahead we
00:27:13
took a year off in the middle we didn't actually start going out to about halfway through our fifth year at med
00:27:18
school and we were married a year later um you know I could we can still both Remember The Time Of course when it
00:27:24
happened and we knew and that was that and you know we're 32 years down the track and amazing still enjoying each
00:27:30
other's company so it was like a slow burn like a friendship for a while well
00:27:33
we knew of each other more yeah yeah and actually interestingly it was her brother that kind of I got to know and
00:27:40
he he did the matchmaking uh interest you know sort of so it was outside of Medical School uh he was quite Keen for
00:27:46
us to get together and he's still a a great friend and um you know we we were
00:27:51
very close as a family here was it fairly Mutual was his were you Keener than her initially and you had to win
00:27:57
her over or vice versa or that was the thing it was kind of a you know it was mutual and uh well it's nice so the
00:28:04
moment arrived and suddenly that was it we knew and you know you know I can safely say within two months it was she
00:28:10
was she it was it was my wife that raised getting married first yeah is that right within two months and it was
00:28:16
more the question was so when are we going to get married that was that it wasn't a you know or shall we get
00:28:21
married to you like when you know you know when you know you know um and after that point the Press she was pressuring
00:28:26
you to propose like no no we just planned it all out because the fifth year of medical school is the big one
00:28:31
and you have exams at the end of the year that are substantial and we did a lot of study she's a she's really smart
00:28:38
but she's an A plus student I am not an A plus student so I did have the benefit
00:28:42
of her um her diligence uh did sort of rush off on me and I got my best marks ever at Medical School in that year but
00:28:49
we just we decided as soon as the exams are finished we're going to get engaged
00:28:52
that that day and so we we got engaged that same day I did the traditional thing and went and kind of semi asked
00:28:59
her father for permission uh and he was he appearance so I think we're we're
00:29:03
sort of you know uh well they were they were delighted I think uh and uh you know they're great as I said earlier on
00:29:09
my parents have passed now so it's lovely to have her parents that that in a sense my kind of um uh now my my
00:29:16
parents and we're we're all very close it's just a lovely thing here yeah yeah
00:29:19
well I've I've just turned 15 both my parents are still alive but obviously
00:29:23
they're getting older I think um yeah in anything after the age of 50 if your
00:29:27
parents are still around you're doing you're doing pretty lucky aren't you
00:29:30
um can you remember the proposal was it a romantic proposal or yeah well of course this wasn't a surprise you know I
00:29:36
didn't see people yeah we've gone and chosen the ring and we we yeah we did we went down to the
00:29:42
Waterfront there on Tamaki Drive Mission Bay and just you know formally I proposed to hear and
00:29:48
it was just lovely and uh yeah it's it's a special thing really um and uh yeah it's nice to still be kicking
00:29:56
around together oh absolutely is there anything any sort of secret or anything that you've you know your whole
00:30:03
you think is the the key or the Cornerstone or the the pillars to your successful marriage uh yeah well it's a
00:30:10
bit like leadership that that the hardest domain of leadership is leading self and so the the the the best way to
00:30:17
have good relationships with other people including with your you know your lifelong partner is the is to understand
00:30:23
yourself really well and be on that that journey of maturity and growth and yeah
00:30:28
and uh but fundamentally it's also about communication you know you've got to
00:30:32
keep communicating about what what what what's going well and what's not going
00:30:36
so well and just it's the same with anything yeah it's and a lot of hard
00:30:41
work I mean that's the other thing is you've got to put effort in you've got
00:30:44
to put work in to relationship we do it we do it all the time but of course the person you kind of spinning your your
00:30:51
life with you've got to keep putting the work in yeah I suppose that's the hard
00:30:55
thing about it especially like um during the last three years for you like if you're busy at work all day and you're
00:31:00
doing these one o'clock briefings and you come home the probably the last thing you want to do is have a
00:31:04
conversation or talk about mundane but very important you know home stuff well well that's the challenge and you know
00:31:10
Libya was fantastic she kept our home covered free in both the literally and the metaphorical sense so when I came
00:31:17
home I wasn't a debrief on Covert she wasn't asking me well you know what's
00:31:20
the latest she would she would watch the world with everybody else but um uh the
00:31:28
the thing was um I did try and I've always tried to come home because you know I've been in
00:31:32
senior roles for quite a while and so you've got to come home and it's you
00:31:36
can't come home and just just crash on the sofa and say all right grab me a beer I'm just done you've got to come
00:31:42
home and have energy for your whanau you've got to be your best self um and there's no you know you're in the
00:31:48
wrong job if you're coming home and just feeling complete it that doesn't mean
00:31:52
you don't come home and you're not tired but the thing was and you've alluded to
00:31:55
this was my headspace so you know a classic conversation would be you know it'll be good you know would say all
00:32:00
right there's a couple things I need to talk about with you you know just general stuff and I'd say I've just I've
00:32:06
just got a head full of stuff at the moment I've got this I'm just working
00:32:09
through um and she would say quite rightly when can we talk about it and I would say I
00:32:14
can't even think about when you know wind might be a good time yeah speak to
00:32:18
my PA get an appointment but the thing was when I did finish and you know when I sort of hung up my boots as it were at
00:32:24
the end of July last year and suddenly got my brain back and it made me realize I was carrying the co the analogy I used
00:32:33
I was carrying the covered thousand piece jigsaw puzzle in my head the whole time and it was a jigsaw puzzle where I
00:32:39
didn't have the benefit of the picture on the box to start with and every bit
00:32:43
of information that came along I had to work out where does this go what's the
00:32:46
picture and that had taken my entire virtually my entire brain capacity for two or three years so when I you know
00:32:52
left when I walked out of the building suddenly when she said when Libby said uh or can we talk about a couple things
00:32:59
yeah yeah let's do it right now you know and you know what a relief for her yeah
00:33:04
she'd been so patient so yeah at six months six months they're kind of just
00:33:09
doing it yeah a big to-do list tell you what actually it was the long list of things
00:33:16
you could enjoy doing them together without the pressure of you know thinking oh gosh I've got a I've got
00:33:21
Mike asking at five to seven tomorrow morning better start you know you know mentally preparing for that yeah is that
00:33:26
a stressful thing like if you were actually we can play fast forward and we'll get into the into the pandemic
00:33:31
stuff because I'm mindful of your time here um but I've been thinking about you and
00:33:36
what you do a lot because it's and in terms of those one o'clock briefings
00:33:41
for the journalists that are in the room it's like a win for them if they can
00:33:45
catch you with your pants down or if they can catch you off guard and I think one thing you were very good at is um
00:33:50
you know just just being honest and being knowledgeable saying when you knew something and saying when you didn't
00:33:54
know something but if you say you don't know something too many times that's
00:33:58
when they go this guy's a goon we've got to get him out of here so you're in a
00:34:02
room of people that are basically trying to it's like you're betting in cricket
00:34:06
and each of them is a bowler that's trying to bowl you out that is that is stressful it is stressful and I'm glad
00:34:13
you used the cricketing analogy Cricket got me into trouble at one point because
00:34:16
I went to a black cats game when I wasn't supposed to if I haven't been invited but but the cricket analogy is a
00:34:22
good one you know because the first six weeks or so of the pandemic when when this was all going off were the most
00:34:27
stressful because there was so much uncertainty you didn't know where it was
00:34:31
going and I was literally waking up at three in the morning on the dot in a cold sweat I'd be you know dreaming
00:34:37
covert it was just occupying my sleeping and waking time and oh I'm going to get
00:34:43
this wrong uh it's it's all going to go badly I'll get thrown under the bus you
00:34:47
know I wasn't so worried about myself I was worried about making the wrong calls
00:34:51
giving the wrong advice but then one morning I don't know what it was I just got up and I thought hey
00:34:57
it's okay you've trained you've got um you've got great people around you all
00:35:02
you can do and I've been starting to do that um the stand-ups by this point yeah
00:35:07
and I've had some really helpful feedback from my team when you know I'd
00:35:10
started the stand-ups had started become a bit of a thing and this was before the
00:35:13
lockdown and you know it was who was the stop the Bloomfield guy and people were
00:35:17
watching and and there was something funny that someone had put on social media after the stand up that day and I
00:35:22
got back to the ministry and my team were all there huddled around the computer twittering away and they said
00:35:26
come and have a look at this what was it so this is pretty this is preet a lot yeah so because if this doesn't spread
00:35:32
your legs no no this was just generally you know the kind of it was when I was you know because it would become a daily
00:35:37
thing and there was big decisions maybe it was one I'd done with the PM or with
00:35:41
the minister but they they showed me this and I can't remember what it was but one of them turned to me and said we
00:35:47
don't get it we just see you out there being yourself every day and I said tell
00:35:51
me if that changes because that was all I could do was be myself and I got up more and more and I think just just play
00:35:57
a straight bet that's all you can do so you never know whether it's a googly
00:36:02
coming down or a bouncer but you know you've just got to play a straight bet
00:36:05
and for my part I had the advantage of not being a politician and you've made
00:36:10
this point you can say actually it's okay to say and people don't expect you
00:36:14
to have all the answers so it's okay to say we don't know that at the moment or
00:36:19
I don't have that information with me but we will get it to you it's you know
00:36:23
straight after this yeah but if you say pull out that card too many times that's
00:36:25
when people are going to be like this guy we need someone else in there someone that does so this was the point
00:36:29
is that because we were in that situation where nobody knew I think people okay you know the Public's
00:36:33
actually pretty Discerning if you say if you're the Minister of Finance to say
00:36:37
you don't know the latest um inflation rate well there you've got a problem
00:36:41
but if it's clearly emergent information and this is the point I mean I I did
00:36:46
make sure I was incredibly well briefed including on the detail and so one of the things that gave me confidence to
00:36:53
hold that kind of overall narrative was knowing that if I got asked a question it was well What proportion of Pacific
00:36:59
have now been vaccinated or you know what was the what was the ethnic breakdown of the cases this week that I
00:37:07
would be able to pull that information up and then that helps give people confidence actually this person they may
00:37:14
not have all the answers that's okay but they've got a lot of answers they've got
00:37:17
a lot of answers they know what they're doing and so you're trying to build
00:37:20
trust and confidence it was the key currency and in terms of building Trust of course and this is again the
00:37:25
advantage I had over politicians there's no mileage in a politician saying we've
00:37:30
changed our mind you know where it's like I had to do that a number of times
00:37:33
think about the evidence around masks it was a year in before wha changed their advice and of course you get roasted the
00:37:40
media go well how come you've been saying for the last year masks actually the evidence has changed that was our
00:37:46
previous View now this is the advice and again people are pretty Discerning and of course the biggest one to do is when
00:37:52
things don't go right and you stand up there and put your hand up and say we
00:37:57
could or should have done better here's what we're going to do about it and when we were sort of having a chat
00:38:02
beforehand you know I talk about the media's favorite F-bomb failure you look
00:38:08
at their headlines they've got a favorite c-bomb as well crisis so everything that doesn't go perfectly
00:38:13
is a failure they overuse the word but I did I did start to respond to them by saying it's not a failure if things
00:38:20
don't go right it's a failure if we don't review and learn and improve and
00:38:27
you know in that sort of situation where you don't know what's going to happen
00:38:29
the last thing is you need is for your people to stop pushing the pushing the boundaries yeah
00:38:35
and because of the fear of failure so it was really important that when things didn't go right I fronted up
00:38:40
never through any one of my people under the bus but said no I'm responsible this
00:38:45
is what we're doing about it because the the last thing you needed was for them
00:38:48
to stop taking risks as it were because because we had to make decisions so quickly yeah now what was the cricket
00:38:55
thing you were talking about before you said you're going to travel for Ghana oh
00:38:57
well I got an invitation from New Zealand Cricket very kind to them to go and watch the the black caps versus
00:39:03
Australia it was one of the 2020 games actually the black caps had a great win over Australia at the stadium
00:39:10
um and uh he had a lovely invitation afterwards down to the dressing room and uh great chat with Kane Williamson what
00:39:16
a fantastic guy oh and that whole team I mean the culture you could just feel it
00:39:20
in the in the room got some photos you'd be mad not to accept the invite well he
00:39:24
get he he got me he gave me one of his jerseys that you know with signatures on it but here's the thing as a public
00:39:30
servant uh you decl you get given a lot of things and we got a lot through you know I got boxes of wine would arrive
00:39:36
through the painting and big you know trays of muffins and all sorts of things and you declare it and most of it I'd
00:39:42
give away to the staff and the odd thing when I left I was able to take with me but the point was I was not supposed to
00:39:48
have accepted the the hospitality who who snatched yeah well well partly it was because at that time they they were
00:39:56
planning for a tour overseas and the vaccine was just become becoming available and there was a suggestion
00:40:02
that my invitation to the match was helping uh bump them up yeah right which wasn't the case but you know it's all
00:40:10
about perception and it's really important that as a public servant you just seen as being you know Integrity is
00:40:16
so important in terms of public trust yeah you're you're I mean you're an
00:40:19
incredibly intelligent guy were you mad at yourself after that because you thought [ __ ] I should have seen this
00:40:23
potential loophole well uh yeah and you know but then you look at the photo viewing Kane and you're like well that's
00:40:28
still pretty well I mean interesting the public response was very much on the side look if he wants to go to a bloody
00:40:33
crooked game he should be able to go to a quick game um but you know it is an important thing
00:40:38
and you know I guess you know I kicked myself a bit because I'm incredibly meticulous about
00:40:43
that because because is it chief executive you declare even the invitations you get that you don't take
00:40:48
up it's all out it's all public your salary every expense is is public information and that's all
00:40:56
about transparency and about maintaining the Integrity of the public service so anyway I did my Penance uh made a big
00:41:03
donation to um uh might have been Wellington City Mission to you know to that would have been the price of the
00:41:09
tickets and uh these things uh you know move through pretty quickly you still got the memories of the game as well
00:41:15
that's right so so during this whole um the one o'clock briefing thing like what
00:41:19
an average day for you look like you mentioned before that you'd wake up in a
00:41:22
in a wake up at 3am in the morning and start thinking it through was there just a lot of reading involved what did a day
00:41:28
look like so 3am you wake up well that was the early days I did seal into a slightly better pattern but you say they
00:41:35
were they were two sorts of days it was the day when I was once a week I'd do
00:41:39
the morning media round we shared that you know the Prime Minister uh Chris Hipkins I do one day Grant Robertson
00:41:45
Friday was his day in the morning media around um you know it was probably seven or
00:41:50
eight bang bang bang starting with Mike hosking at five to seven you've got to
00:41:53
be awake for that um you know our radio NZ it'd be um a couple of TV things that YouTube two or
00:42:01
three other radio stations that wanted to have a chat in maybe maybe a couple of papers
00:42:07
so you know we'd do an hour and a half just banging through those now those mornings I'd be awake at three and be
00:42:12
it'll be start to just preparing in your mind and and focusing and kind of thinking okay have I got this like when
00:42:19
you're doing um uh ZB with Mike Hoskin you're not given a you know like a like a gauge in advance
00:42:25
about what he's going to ask well that's where you've got you know if say you
00:42:29
know of course some people recognize this I was not a one-man band Fantastic Team behind me and my the media guys uh
00:42:36
well I call them guys you know men and women were just fantastic they'd been at
00:42:40
work at six going through all of what was coming through and the stories what Mike was talking about that morning you
00:42:46
know what everyone was covering so then we'd sit down before the first one and
00:42:50
we'd do 10 minutes that brief me and say here are the issues by the way this came
00:42:53
up overnight or have you seen the story from the UK X so so I'd be briefed ahead
00:42:58
of those but yeah other you know part of it's also and you know Mike was great
00:43:03
because I sort of talk about you know people oh how do you put up with it but you know I'd bring it you'd call in and
00:43:08
of course it was a pre-record um about 10 minutes before and he'd say g'day mate how's it going okay let's get
00:43:13
into this and we'd do our thing and he'd do a shock joke kind of questions and
00:43:17
I'd you know play him a straight bet and then at the end it'd say thanks mate
00:43:20
good as ever and off we go now the last of you he some people a lot of people have hear this because he's very popular
00:43:28
I mean he's huge and he's very very good at his job and he said to me so actually
00:43:33
we've had you know a few interactions so how would you rate these discussions out
00:43:37
of 10 what would you give them I said I'm and I'd say I'd give them a seven to
00:43:40
eight you're trying to do your job as well as you can and I'm trying to do
00:43:43
mine and I turned it back to him I said what about you and he said oh well I don't rate your performance very highly
00:43:49
no surprise I didn't lose any sleep over there he said there's one thing I will
00:43:54
say as you always turned up and you know that's the thing isn't it sometimes I
00:43:58
knew you know I was going to get asked when are you going to resign because something had not gone right or and I'd
00:44:03
get a roasting or you you know you expect that that here's the thing I was turned up and I never I don't think I
00:44:10
ever turned any interviews down though sometimes it might have just not you know might have been a timing Clash
00:44:14
because part of my responsibility was to just be available yeah the stand up on a
00:44:19
typical stand-up day 10 o'clock in the morning almost to I could sit my watch
00:44:23
bite my cortisol levels to start to go up classic response you know um no appetite but sweaty heart rate
00:44:30
goes up just starting to mentally prepare for keep repair I do two hours prep with my team going through all the
00:44:36
data going through what you know lines we'd be working with the prime minister's office and then I'd race down
00:44:42
the road I'm a pretty fast Walker raced down the road to the PM's office we'd
00:44:47
spend an hour going through what we're going to say finalizing it all making
00:44:51
sure we had the latest data getting really clear about our messages and then down and I talk about you know we go
00:44:58
down on the lift together to the ground for the Beehive and walk into the theater and it felt like walking into
00:45:03
the Coliseum you know not the Coliseum now as a tourist attraction was like a couple of thousand years yeah
00:45:10
yeah and and the intensity of it because as you say you've got all those reporters there and they won't get you
00:45:16
out you know they want to get you out and personal protective equipment PPI you know PPE was the classic one so Dr
00:45:24
Bloomfield are you saying that every health professional in the country's got
00:45:26
the PPE they need well that's what we're that's what we're absolutely aiming to
00:45:30
do well I've got a text here from Maureen a nurse and Kai tire and she has she they want these masks in it okay you
00:45:36
give us the information and we'll follow that up so you know the big thing is and
00:45:41
this is the thing that people remember because they get I had such lovely letters and emails and people could
00:45:47
still come up to me every day on the street the thing people remember about the stand-ups it's the old leadership
00:45:53
adage people don't remember what you said or did they remember how you made them feel yeah 100 and the most
00:45:59
important thing that I did and of course the Prime Minister was doing it was being calm
00:46:03
to and it just gave people a sense of assurance we've got this so whatever was
00:46:08
being thrown at me my job was to and it's about that's you know leading self
00:46:14
you know don't let the I couldn't let the media give any sense that they got
00:46:18
under my skin yeah I had some you never rolled your arms three times you know actually take every question for what it
00:46:25
is and people say to me how did you put up with the same question over and over and I would
00:46:32
say it's fine there was a gift because that meant I could give the same answer
00:46:36
and reinforce my message you know so I just treated that as a as a gift and uh and you know and I said and by the way I
00:46:44
knew that I didn't need to get annoyed because the rest of New Zealand was doing it on my behalf you know yeah oh
00:46:48
100 starting at the TV yeah so um yeah so what was it like um behind that first of all like pre-pandemic what was your
00:46:55
relationship like as the Director general of Health with the the Prime Minister did you had anything to do with
00:46:59
her you saw her occasionally yeah I had a little bit to do with her because of three things that had already happened
00:47:06
while I was DG quite big things um well the measles outbreak in Auckland but first of all the first time I met her
00:47:13
was after the terrorist attack on the mosques in Christchurch and I still remember that vividly and because that
00:47:19
weekend we we had happened on the Friday again because we're meeting at night
00:47:23
over the weekend we met as a group because because the health response was part of it you know that all the injured
00:47:29
people were in Christchurch Hospital uh and uh so I you know I was involved in all those briefings we met four or five
00:47:37
times on the Saturday and Sunday so that's when I first got to know her and other ministers then we had the measles
00:47:43
outbreak and you know that was a big lesson for us because we were too slow out of the blocks I commissioned a
00:47:49
review we took the findings really seriously and actually in the end I got quite involved in that including
00:47:55
fronting some of the media there and then and and then later in the air you know to cap it all off and December we
00:48:01
had forkari white Island another disaster of course that required a really significant Health System
00:48:07
response as well so you know we were off the back of all those three things so I
00:48:12
did know here and I guess we had a bit of a relationship there and um and a degree of trust already yeah because
00:48:18
from from like my perspective in New Zealand perspective all we saw was you guys like washing your hands walking in
00:48:23
and up to the um up to the lecterns um so what did does she call you Dr Bloomfield or Ashley you call her
00:48:30
Jacinda or prime minister that's quite funny because when I talked to groups of
00:48:34
kids sometimes um they'd say oh it's just Cindy or BFF you know because there was the
00:48:40
impression that they only saw you know it was always the two of us like a unit and and I know there were some kids that
00:48:46
thought we were married you know it's it's quite funny isn't it uh no I look
00:48:50
her number in my phone it's changed now about her number in my phone said pm and
00:48:57
even when she'd call me in the evening I'd I'd never called her Jacinda the the
00:49:01
first time I did that was after she stood down a few weeks ago and I texted her and said for the first time you know
00:49:08
hi Jacinda and just sent her a message just to of support just to see how she was and she responded that actually oh
00:49:16
dear sir Ashley I've been wanting to say that um she would call me Ashley when it was
00:49:23
just the two of us but in front of others you know in front of ministers and so on she it would be to General so
00:49:28
she called you Ashley I suppose if she if if she wanted you to call her Jacinda she could say please call me Jacinda
00:49:34
yeah that's that that's something I bet she didn't yeah and I wouldn't have and
00:49:39
you know this is the thing is you you she's the Prime Minister it's the office
00:49:42
that you're you're sort of respecting and acknowledging and so on so um yeah
00:49:47
sort of tell a little bit of an anecdote about Winston Peters because he was in the government of course when um when
00:49:53
the pandemic started uh for those first couple of years and I I knew how he was feeling about me and my advice because
00:49:59
if he was happy he would call me Ashley so Ashley tell me this if he wasn't it
00:50:03
would be so Dr Bloomfield it was a it was a really clear signal anyway helpful that's funny
00:50:11
um um no name is necessary but in terms of the um the Press gallery or the journalist did you come to greet anyone
00:50:17
in particular you see some of it no I didn't No I um look you know again the the they their job is to hold people
00:50:27
to account and if if new zealands are a well-functioning democracy and it is it needs a number of ingredients but one of
00:50:35
them is a is a good strong independent media and they're doing their job well
00:50:40
if they're holding the public service and the government to account I mean it's not all their role but it's not bad
00:50:44
apart um and on a couple of occasions especially when they were coming under Fire you know there were some some of
00:50:51
the journalists that people sort of took a dislike to because they were tough tovaro Brian's Andover and Jessica just
00:50:57
over then Jessica the question I sometimes get when I'm doing my speaks speeches is how do you decide between
00:51:03
who goes between time and Jessica but you know um they were doing their job and I can tell you this especially in
00:51:11
those that first year after we'd done a stand-up when we're in a lockdown and I
00:51:15
was walking out most days one or other in journalists as I was walking out would say thanks to
00:51:20
your team for their hard work you know so they're playing their role I got invited to the Press Gallery parties and
00:51:27
you know that's a nice opportunity just to connect and I you know I've done a
00:51:31
few interviews recently I just did a little bit of media around the whole political neutrality thing
00:51:36
I I I just I don't have any residual issues I think we we've got some really
00:51:41
good journalists in New Zealand it's a tough environment yeah my goodness me uh
00:51:46
being in the media but uh they if the if the response in New Zealand overall was
00:51:51
a really good one the media played an important role there because of the them fulfilling role of keeping and holding
00:51:57
us to account yeah although if we want to go back to the qriket analogy there were a lot of wides being bold like uh
00:52:03
asking you questions about drinking bleach or um there's a question about um a
00:52:08
hospital visitor having sex with a covert positive patient yeah yeah there are a few things
00:52:15
that you know might create a good front page or a good line for a subby but um yeah you know you just gotta again keep
00:52:22
playing the straight band of course if it's a white you just um don't swing yes
00:52:27
um there's an article I read in the guardian um or I've got a passage of it here uh
00:52:32
Dune has occasionally referenced Bloomfield poking fun at her as she tackled her own epidemiological learning
00:52:38
curve and said I'll keep the details of a sporadic I'll keep the details of his
00:52:43
sporadic mockery of me to myself yeah anything that Springs to mind it sounds like you're taking the piss out of prime
00:52:49
minister um well um yeah that doesn't sound quite so good does it happen well look I will say this
00:52:56
is uh just Senator James got a fantastic sense of humor and actually of course he
00:53:02
didn't see it up there when it from me either but I use a lot of humor in my in
00:53:06
my day with my team it's um it's one of my uh my wife speaking to character strength she's done it on our
00:53:13
family it's one of my character strengths but of course when you're fronting a pandemic you don't do that
00:53:18
but yes we would have quite a bit of banter and one of the things that I would one of the things the Prime
00:53:23
Minister has referred to and I think in whatever interviews was at one point um we had a couple of it was when there was
00:53:29
just a few cases there was and there were two people and mastered and we were trying to track down and um we're trying
00:53:36
to find out some information and the Prime Minister was asking question after question in the end I said well prime
00:53:42
minister would you like us to give you your cell phone numbers and she said yes before she and then she sort of says
00:53:47
before I realized he was pulling my leg you know yeah but uh so yeah we did have
00:53:52
I would say that was part of just you know of course humor is a way you deal with the pressure and the stress but um
00:53:58
it it didn't help us I guess just develop a sort of relationship of trust we needed you know she needed to know
00:54:05
that when we were doing the the stand-ups that I was going to be reliable and and uh if she threw things
00:54:11
to me I was going to be able to pick them up and and vice versa it was a political issue that I was being asked
00:54:16
about she would step in there so I guess you know often the way we connect with people even if it is a a work
00:54:22
relationship and a purely sort of uh formal relationship is through you know kind of knowing each other about his
00:54:29
people and and I guess on that human level we certainly enjoyed a little bit of banter yeah yeah and you you guys are
00:54:34
catching up um privately yeah we're going to have a cup of tea at some point
00:54:38
just uh you know um the the Prime Minister finishes up uh well sorry Jacinda radoon finishes in Parliament in
00:54:44
a couple weeks time that's it um and so you know we we uh just thought now we're both out the other side we
00:54:50
have cup of tea and I'm interested if you know just to kind of see how she is
00:54:54
really yeah she's got you know Nevis starting school fairly soon I know she she and she's talked about that she's so
00:55:01
looking forward to just been how to spend more time with Neve be there for her when she starts school and of course
00:55:06
I'm sure spend much more time with Clark as well yeah he'll appreciate that I
00:55:09
mean um yeah it's a crazy thing that you've both been through that links you
00:55:14
both together for life like I've had um uh Jimmy nisham on an early episode of
00:55:18
my podcast and he talked about his relationship with Martin guptill into some Innings they've been through
00:55:22
together that just links them to to for life in a bond that no one else can imagine and it's the same for you and
00:55:27
Jacinda are doing did you copy any other I I feel like as far as um leaders go like she copped it pretty bad and in
00:55:34
terms of like partners of leaders I feel like Clark's had it worse than almost
00:55:37
anyone in memorable history you know there's just been so many absurd rumors
00:55:41
what about you how did you fear did you have you copped any sort of yeah I copped a bit uh and you know I was aware
00:55:48
of it but I I I never felt unsafe I got advice around my security and if and there are some there are some people
00:55:57
out there and you think of some of the things that were being said around the protests in Parliament about hanging
00:56:02
people and I was on that list about bottle doing you know bodily harm and and so on to people but let's make let's
00:56:10
put this on the table and I've I've talked about it public before it is extremely gendered and it is is deeply
00:56:17
misogynistic so you know if you're a female you know so not just um just under a dune but people like Susie Wiles
00:56:24
and others who are commentating was objected to just this absolutely and there's no other word for it vile and
00:56:31
very very you know deeply unpleasant kind of abuse and the and and there's no
00:56:37
doubt in my mind that because the prime minister at the time was female that made it you know just layered the
00:56:43
unpleasantness on and you know including including when she was out and about with with you know Neve with her people
00:56:52
just shouting actually disgusting stuff at it and um it's not okay it's just not okay I was
00:57:01
never subjected to any of that and I know that a big reason for that even though I was you know clear I wasn't the
00:57:06
Prime Minister but I was the architect of a lot of the advice around things that upset people like mandates and um
00:57:14
and so on and the vaccination program uh that you know I never was subjected to that sort of vitriol which she
00:57:21
unfortunately was yeah have you had anything in public I you sort of people have had on the show on the podcast that
00:57:27
are polarizing um they generally say any mean stuff about them is online and face-to-face it's nothing but positivity
00:57:35
absolutely my experience yeah you know this is interesting because I'm sure there are some of those people see me
00:57:41
and they either don't have the courage or you know you know I'm thankful they
00:57:45
don't come and say anything every day literally every day people come up to me
00:57:49
from all walks of life I've had many many thousands and only one only one of
00:57:55
them has said something kind of well I hope you have a horrible day [Laughter] you know if that's the worst of it but
00:58:04
literally I still get people hangover set something last night we were saying I was saying earlier you know at the
00:58:09
University here launch of these this wonderful Coupe Scholars that the 18 amazing young people for the year and
00:58:15
the parents of one of them came up to me oh you know we're just huge fans of what
00:58:20
you and your team did and you know the fellowship my hand and the woman said can I just give you a hug which I was
00:58:27
really happy about because I I you know I love connecting like that and that's
00:58:31
just a lovely thing and it was the letters and the cards and the messages that I got every day usually to me and
00:58:38
my team that just kept us going you know classic one this envelope arrived it said on the front Dr Bloomfield
00:58:45
Wellington I think that was the address found its way to me 92 year old woman from invercargill said in that beautiful
00:58:53
you know how old people write slightly spider inviting yeah beautiful card I've
00:58:58
never never sent a card or anything like this before but I just have to thank you
00:59:02
and your team for looking after us I know I'm alive today because of what you
00:59:06
did for us and you know that's gold and I could every every week I'd have an
00:59:10
online um kind of all staff and especially when people couldn't come into the office and
00:59:14
I'd just be able to read through some of these things and that just kept people
00:59:18
going give you the motivation yeah yeah um there was um probably the biggest viral moment I think through that whole
00:59:24
period is when you were doing a stand-up with um Chris Atkins as a minister of Health not prime minister
00:59:28
um and he he had a slip of the tongue and he said spread your legs um and what he was meaning to say
00:59:34
stretchy legs correct right and then um you can be seen smirking and then um like you raise your eyebrows to someone
00:59:42
in the wings who what was happening there behind the scenes someone's laughing and well they make eye contact
00:59:48
with you I wasn't doing it at anybody I I was just standing here thinking you
00:59:53
know instead of I couldn't help myself this little smile I thought did he really say that and then I could see I
00:59:59
think he can he kept his composure I just did this to the library so he hassles me about it says I'd be a
01:00:06
useless poke apart I can't keep a poker face well what was happening was the
01:00:11
reporters who all had masks on it was at that time they all had tears running down their faces they were laughing so
01:00:17
hard and of course no one else could see this and then at the end when we finished the room just absolutely
01:00:22
erupted um so you know uh it was it was quite a moment I just had to sort of try and get
01:00:28
through the rest of it without kind of cracking up I just couldn't do that but
01:00:32
anyway um I sent uh now prime minister Chris Hopkins changed his number to PM in my
01:00:37
right I sent him a text when when he got got the role and he said a nice one he he sent me a lovely text
01:00:44
um uh uh at the end of the year last year and and when I got my New Year's honor but I said oh well done you know
01:00:50
and great stuff and he and he sent this text back saying yep um uh thanks very much it was your eyebrows that got me
01:00:57
here so I said well they're available anytime if you need them oh it was a great moment
01:01:02
um another moment which I don't know if you remember doing this because I'm sure
01:01:05
you do a lot of media and stuff but there's um a segment done by um the stuff website called Kia kids news oh
01:01:11
yes and um there was a thing I watched yesterday some kid asking you about farts and whether you can catch covert
01:01:17
through farts how do you how do you answer something like that oh well it's not right I mean those are the sort of
01:01:24
things I love doing and I should say yeah um I got a lot of big envelopes of letters from classes of kids you know
01:01:30
their teachers would set them an assignment through 2021 to write a letter to Dr Bloomfield and got some
01:01:35
amazing there's a school and they have plenty to send me they had been tasked
01:01:38
with inviting me to this school and giving the reason why I should come so it was kind of dear Dr Bloomfield if you
01:01:45
come to our school we can play bullrush on the backfield and you know did look to Bloomfield if you come I will buy you
01:01:50
a cup of coffee from the Celtics not from the BP because their coffee's rubbish so and then occasionally I'll do
01:01:58
zooms just with with classrooms of kids and it would be just gorgeous so you just got to take these questions as they
01:02:03
come you know kids are great aren't they yeah oh they're fantastic it's a great
01:02:06
thing but I guess yeah I could say I'd been used to having curveball questions
01:02:09
surround at me in the media stand-ups not necessarily about farts but there were some pretty unusual ones oh there
01:02:14
were like the drinking bleach one that I mentioned before and questions about 5G
01:02:18
and that relation yeah um you were you were very good at batting them off though I think yeah I
01:02:22
think it's very successful um again another thing that you went viral for was um doing like a drum and
01:02:28
bass video that was for rhythm and Vines um like let's make summer summer Unstoppable I wanted to ask what is an
01:02:34
Unstoppable summer look like for you oh well lots of reading lots of family time
01:02:40
lots of family time and you know we we've had we had a lovely summer this time we've got a little place down at
01:02:45
Nelson Lakes where we go down to and um head that for a wee while and so it's
01:02:49
just time in the sun actually just sitting on the beach with friends out on the boat doing a bit of stuff nothing
01:02:55
flash um getting out into the hills for some for some walks and of course some biking
01:03:00
but you know we're just so lucky in this country we've got so many lovely places
01:03:05
you can go to and beautiful beaches so sun is is what it's all about really and
01:03:11
but I I really like it down at the lake I love swimming in the fresh water it's
01:03:14
cold up there up at 600 meters above sea level but that's great for the endorphins though isn't it it's great
01:03:19
for the endorphins so you know we um and here's the thing you know we had a couple of pretty amazing Summers here in
01:03:27
New Zealand in the middle of a pandemic that no one else could enjoy you ask any
01:03:32
other no other country in the world was doing these big events yeah crowd with with hot crowds concerts and so on so we
01:03:39
had a lot more freedom through covert even with even though we had the lockdown periods and of course Auckland
01:03:45
had that really long lockdown in 2021 I still usually apologize when I'm talking
01:03:49
to crowds up here but we had nowhere near the the length or extent of lockdowns that most other countries had
01:03:56
and they had the double whammy of actually having their Health Systems kind of over and and large numbers of
01:04:02
death so we enjoyed some good Summers here of course what we've seen from this
01:04:06
last summer is Summer's going to be different in the future and it may well be for the north of the North Island
01:04:12
it's less of a summer and more of a wet season um and we're going to have to be really
01:04:18
thinking hard about how we how we're ready for that and prepared for that yeah
01:04:22
um there's a couple of other things I wanted to ask you so um the Knighthood
01:04:26
thing becoming a sir yeah when do you first hear about that and what's your first reaction well uh I got this you
01:04:33
know it's not like the old days apparently where a horse would ride up to you somewhere and you know someone
01:04:37
would hand you this parchment yeah an email arrived out of the blue from the Department of prime minister and cabinet
01:04:42
and I opened it and I read it I thought well what's this about you know I I had
01:04:47
to call my wife and I said let me come have a look at this just can you read this what's it saying
01:04:52
you know I really was quite taken aback and uh we were sort of quite shocked and
01:04:58
of course you do get a heads up and you're the first heads up is to ask you if you uh
01:05:05
if this is offered or you know is conferred on you would you accept it and which I think is a reasonable question
01:05:10
to ask well we had quite a chat about it and talked about it and I decided yes I
01:05:15
would and again uh it's not not so much about me but actually it is it's a lovely
01:05:22
public recognition and um it's uh it's a wonderful honor really uh and for me it's also it shows the
01:05:30
degree which that the whole effort was appreciated yeah the effort of the public service I was the face of and the
01:05:38
most visible kind of person and that effort because of my role but you know new zealanders saw what the public service
01:05:46
does for them day in day out to look after them and to try and make their you know improved lives for new zealanders
01:05:51
all new zealanders and um so that was sort of a part of my rationale at least for being for have been replying saying
01:05:58
yes I will accepted and then you know kind of lovely then just before Christmas to get
01:06:03
a letter from from the governor general who I know from we've known each other
01:06:07
because she she some of her work has been in public health over the years and she put a nice little handwritten note
01:06:13
at the bottom so yeah so your parents passed before director general of Health before coronavirus before the the
01:06:21
Knighthood what would they make of all of us uh I think that'd be immensely proud and um and as I said
01:06:28
I think about them every day and I and I sort of feel them with me because they're they're the most important
01:06:35
kind of influence on your life they've shaped me who I am I'm lucky I've got
01:06:39
I'm close to my brother and sister who've been so supportive and and and so
01:06:43
lovely and and my wife's family as well and so yep my parents can't come to the
01:06:47
investiture which is in late may but my wife's parents are coming down as my
01:06:50
kind of surrogate parents and I have Libby and they're one of our children who isn't overseas and um and my brother
01:06:57
and sister and partner so what does it make living now did she become a lady or a dog no she can but she decided pretty
01:07:03
quickly there is still this very anachronistic opportunity to use the courtesy title of ladies so she would be
01:07:08
lady Bloomberg she decided very quickly that wasn't going to be her uh and you
01:07:13
know I know it sounds very Bridgeton doesn't it it does sound original and you know I don't I haven't even used I
01:07:18
haven't used this year anything yet you know it's not something you're quite
01:07:22
different to the main Bunch around yeah who now goes by the Facebook name sir Peter Leach yeah Yeah well yeah it might
01:07:28
come along I don't know I don't own it own it um geez I've taken up so much of your
01:07:32
time have you got a little bit longer one thing I do like to ask all my guests about some mental health questions yeah
01:07:37
all right I'll just just take one because they've got to get off and I've
01:07:40
got a coffee appointment yeah look at it or take one okay um okay oh um maybe I'll just make a comment about
01:07:51
resilience okay yes please yeah I was gonna ask if you have a resilience plan yeah I don't have a formal plan but I
01:07:57
had a huge lesson for me during covert was for the first time in my life and in my career which had had some pretty high
01:08:03
pressure moments I've had really good physical mental well-being but I did reach them I reached the point where I
01:08:08
needed to take some days off I was um and and the real um insight for me around resilience was
01:08:15
that I know resilient people and my goodness they've got enormous capacity to to do stuff but they don't just keep
01:08:23
going they don't burn out they know their boundaries their physical and mental emotional boundaries and they
01:08:29
take active steps to stay within them yeah and so they are very in tune with what their body's telling them and so
01:08:36
that's the key to results resilience is listening to your body being active and
01:08:40
about being physically fit looking after your mental well-being whether it's
01:08:44
through you know meditation mindfulness or whatever it is making sure you've got
01:08:47
time to do the things you enjoy doing spending time with people who you who you connect with and who are the ones
01:08:53
that you know your foot whether it's your whanau or your close friends that you know just nurture your soul and and
01:08:59
that's that's the fundamental thing about resilience it's not about keeping
01:09:02
going regardless yeah I I feel like everyone needs to come up with their own resilience plan because what may work
01:09:07
for you won't necessarily but are there any absolute must-haves for you every
01:09:11
day like are you a cold shower guy of a three-part resilience strategy it's it's opening the curtain and checking
01:09:19
the sun's come up and if the sun's come up the world hasn't ended overnight and
01:09:23
it's gonna be a good day coffee is a good thing in coffee drinkers now there
01:09:27
but also for me it was especially on those tough days when I'd get up in the
01:09:31
morning and think I'm not sure I can do this you know yeah um I've my Tank's empty you know
01:09:36
was just getting into work and starting to interact with people and and the energy and the commitment and the
01:09:44
goodness that you get from that and then you know I always say you're in the
01:09:47
right job if you've got more energy at the end of the day than when you started
01:09:50
with it and so that that for me was the thing was just spending time with people with
01:09:55
great people yeah and were you good at recognizing that yourself or does it take Libby or someone close in your team
01:10:00
to go Ashley well you're not where you should be I I I learned I I guess and I guess I've
01:10:07
learned over the year years to kind of recognize what my body's yeah yeah all right hey thank you so
01:10:12
much for coming over today really appreciate everything you've done for the country I appreciate you being on
01:10:16
the podcast and um all the best for the future whatever that may bring sir Ashley Bloomfield thanks very much it's
01:10:23
been a pleasure [Music] thank you