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Dr. Libby, welcome to my podcast. Dom, thank you so much for having me join you.
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I'm so pleased we made this happen. Um, just to time stamp it, it's 7:30 on a
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Tuesday morning when we're doing this. It is, and I'm happy to be here, even
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though I walked and my eyes are streaming, so I'm not actually crying to see you. It's bit chilly out there, but
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very happy to be here. Thank you. So, because it's 7:30, I've um I've got some
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breakfast options for us, which are they're all the Kellogg's range, and I
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wanted you to rate them from worst to first. So, we have Neutra Grain, uh Froot Loops, and Sultana brand.
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Uh this is um I'm overwhelmed with the with the potential here. Uh so, let's see if
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there are any redeeming features. Sadly, so much nutrition information these days
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is marketing and uh yeah, that's what's on the the front of a lot of these
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boxes. So, that they would not be my choice. So, what would you gun to your head?
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What would you eat and what would you not touch? What would you rather starve than eat?
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Uh yeah, I I just would starve. I would pass on all three. Really? Yes. Which is your favorite?
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See, this is interesting. So, I'm not um I I'd consider myself to be, I suppose,
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reasonably fit and healthy and reasonably in tune with my body. Froot Loops never. I know that's I know that's
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just confectionary. Yes. See, Neutra Grain, I mean, they've always got like an iron
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man athlete on the back. It seems like a healthyish sort of option. Will we look at the sugar content? Will
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we have a look at that? Look at me adjusting. Yes. So per 100 gram there's 24 gram of
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sugar per 100 gram and the World Health Organization says it's okay for us to
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have six teaspoons of added sugar. So that's all six right there with your brekie.
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Okay. So that's no good. So see Sultana brand if I had this I'd think I'm I'm
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doing my body kind of a favor. Well we have a look at what's in there. So it kind of masks itself as that.
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There's actually more sugar in this one than in the neutrorain. So in this one
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we've got 28.4 four grams of sugar per 100 grams. So, we've maxed out our sugar
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for the whole day if we have that to start the day. And that's the trick, isn't it? Because and it's I think it's
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partly why there's so much confusion around nutrition because we kind of gets
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marketed to that things are healthy and food actually isn't healthy. People are
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or they aren't. Food is nutritious or it isn't. So, I go looking at something
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like that and go, what are the vitamins, the minerals, what are the health benefits? What are the what's the juice
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that your body's going to get from that so that it can operate at its best level?
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And uh that's why breakfast cereal is I'm not so much of a fan. Eggs for
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breakfast for me. Love them. Yeah. Have you eaten this morning? I have not. No, not yet.
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What would you have on a standard weekday morning? Eggs on gluten-free toast with a big
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side of spinach and mushrooms. If avocados are in season, that might go on there as well. I smother olive oil all
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over my gluten-free toast. Love olive oil. So what exactly is nutritional biochemistry and why why does it matter?
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So love that as the opener. So um I actually went to uni for 14 years which I know makes me sound really thick and
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like I failed everything or went to the pub too much which may or may not be true but um so I loved learning. I
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originally studied nutrition and dietetics and then did a PhD in biochemistry. So I combined my two
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degrees uh into the nutrition part obviously and then the biochemistry part. So what that means is every single
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second there are billions of biochemical reactions going on in our body that create how we feel and function and
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look. So one biochemical reaction is where let's say substance A gets converted into substance B and then B
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becomes C and on and on that cascade of change goes. So that's operating all the
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time inside of us. We don't instruct it. But for every reaction, so for A to turn
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into B, we need nutrients. So let's say you need iron and vitamin C to convert A
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into B. And if we become insufficient or deficient in either of those nutrients,
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then those reactions won't work as efficiently and then we start to get symptoms. But we're not taught to look
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at our health in that way. So that's that's what spins my tires. A great
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example is so our thyroid gland needs iron to be able to make hormones and a lot of people aren't aware of that. You
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don't think you think of iodine as a thyroid nutrient, but iron's really
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important. So, when I used to work with patients one-on-one, I'd be looking at
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their blood work, looking at blood test results for their iron levels, looking at what their thyroid hormones are
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doing, and if they were both kind of depleted, if you fix the iron, sometimes people's thyroid function improves. So,
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that's the juice of it. It really spins my tires. Oh, it really it really does. Um, yeah.
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14 years of study, the same number of books now. 14 books. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Can I This is a This is a
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real personal question and um uh you may not want to answer it and that's fine and I'm going to be told off
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in the comments, but can can I ask your age? 50. 50. Yeah. You look amazing. Oh, thank you.
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The the reason I the reason I asked that is because um I would have I would have
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if if if you asked me to to guess your age, I would have said some somewhere in the 30s. But because you've studied for
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14 years and put out so many books, I knew it had to be older than that. You look great.
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Oh, thank you. That's so generous. Is is that a result of um like the right nutritional and dietary choices to a
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degree? Well, I think that contributes, but I I have a really happy heart. I feel so
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lucky that I get a turn on earth. So, I'm not I'm not exaggerating when I say
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I wake up every morning and think it's just such a privilege to be here. And um
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I read a book called the top five regrets of the dying and in Bronny Wear's the author of that and one of she
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was a palative care nurse and she describes how when she was looking after people who were dying they would tell
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you that they're going to miss the most ordinary things. They're going to miss
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someone's face or the feeling of their dog's fur under their fingertips or the
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night sky. And we have that now. So I honestly just feel I kind of let myself have what I have which is yeah this even
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when there's challenges it's yeah it's just such a privilege to be here. So I
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feel like that probably contributes and yeah so I would say just a happy heart contributes as well as my food and
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nutrition of course. Yeah. Do do you make poor choices? I don't see it that way. So I eat hot
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chips. I eat whatever I feel like. It's just that I'm mostly drawn to actual
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food, not junk. It's I feel that there's we've made food really black and white
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and full of rules and I worry about that for some people. Some people love rules
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and structure for others that leads them I guess down a more concerning kind of path and they can flip into say
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disordered eating for example when they live with a lot of rules and restrictions. So it's
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what was the question? Sorry. Um like do you do you find it hard I think to make the Rochesteres all the
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time? So it's what we do every day that impacts on our health. It's not what we
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do occasionally. And yeah, so I feel like hot there's a world of difference,
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for example, between having hot chips three times a week every week and having them 10 times a year,
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right? So would you Yeah. If you had to put a ratio on it, you you make the right
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choice like 95% of the time, 99% of the time. I couldn't even put a number on it cuz
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it's I I wrote a cookbook a few years ago or quite a while ago now. this probably 10
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years ago and in that I talk about being a flexitarian. So everyone was always commonly in interviews people would say
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to me how do you eat and I'd say it doesn't matter how I eat basically I
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just eat food and not very much junk but I'm so I'm a flexitarian or a qualitarian try and eat good quality
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food nutritious food. What about alcohol? What's your relationship with booze?
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I couldn't care less about it. So, I live in Australia at the moment and I do
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love a beer at the end of a hot day, but if someone said you can never drink again, I couldn't care less. It doesn't
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really feature as a I don't think about it really. So, if you're having hot chips, you
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might have a beer, but yeah. Or not. Just got on their own is a good time. Um, you've done so much work and you're
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such a massive deal in New Zealand. How many people on the Dr. Libby team? Uh, there are six of us at the moment.
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Yeah. and they're really beautiful human beings. I look forward to seeing them
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and yeah, they all look after different parts of the business whether it's the
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publishing arm or we have a supplement company called Bioblends uh or there's a
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lot of online courses and we create a lot of free articles for my website to support people. So yeah, it's um they're
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beautiful humans. Love them. The the bookw writing thing, how do you fit it all in? How do you how do you um
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how do you think I'm going to write a book specifically about iron and and then come up with 60 to 90,000 words on
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that subject? I actually when I sat to write the iron book, which is my most recent one, I
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started writing a book about a completely different topic and I was 65,000 words into that other book when I
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went, "Yeah, nah, iron is my go." And I'd already written 11,000 words about iron. So I went back
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and kept going with iron because it's yeah it's the one thing I think that
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changes everything for a lot of people when we get that right. But it's I feel
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like we we we look after what we care about whether that's the environment or
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our body. But we also I think we we make time we prioritize and make time for the
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things that we care about. And we've all only got 24 hours in a day. So yeah, I think we um whatever we value,
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we prioritize and yeah, it's important to me to yeah, pull my knowledge is wasted if it just sits with me. I was
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the only person in my family who went to university and that that's all kind of
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wasted if it just sits in my brain. Yeah. Oh, you said, by the way, we're going to get to your background, but you
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say the only person in your family that went to university, but you're an only
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child. Yeah. Of my cousins, like the extended family. I should have clarified. So, um, yeah, your first book
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was called, um, Accidentally Overweight. Um, this latest book about iron is your
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14th book. I'm not going to make you do this, but could like could you name them
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all? Yes, you could. Absolutely. Children, if you kids, you can just Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
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Um, and where do you live now? You're in the Gold Coast. Yeah, in Burley Heads.
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Yeah. And you you love um roller skating. You go roller roller skating in your spare
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time. I think I read this in an article. I do. Yeah. I skated I roller skated for
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sport as a child at at high school and my best friend and I had a ball doing that and uh we reinvigorated that for
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our 50th birthday parties last year. So yeah, I turned up in roller skates to her 50th and had no idea if I'd still be
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able to do it. I thought I'll just wear them for 10 minutes and bring her some
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joy, but no, I could still do it. So I lasted eight hours in my skates all night.
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Do you go right? So these days I actually do. It's astonishing. I love a big concrete car
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park to just zoom around. But for my 50th, um it was super low key. Um but on the while I was while I was in the same
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town as my besties, they organized a and there they rented an empty concrete warehouse and put laser lights all
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around it and just told me to show up with my skates and she created a roller skating rink like we used to have when
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we were kids for my 50th. I'll never ever get over it. Oh my god, that is amazing. Yeah. Are
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you not scared of like breaking a collar bone or rolling? No, I don't think about that. Trust the
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process. What's meant to be is meant to be. So, you spent um seven years living in
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New Zealand. What What were when were they from? 2007 to 2014, right? Is that sort of when you became
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like a big deal here? You're you're massive here, eh? Like uh I'd say it's
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close to being a household name as what someone can be in NZ. Like you're so
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loved and respected here. Oh, that's so generous. Thank you. Well, I so I started I'd been speaking and
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writing, but that um my ex-husband helped me to start a business here and to kind of formalize, I guess, my
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offering. So, yeah, when I moved here, I got some I was offered some really generous opportunities quite quickly.
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So, a magazine offered for me to start writing and I used to do a lot of free seminars, free talks because I loved
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speaking and yeah, so that sort of helped people get to know me, I guess. And um yeah, I I try to make health
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information really common sense. And I think it seemed that it hit a chord. It seemed to hit a mark that there was
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already a lot of confusion that's only intensified. But yeah, I try to just help people make sense of how to take
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care of themselves. But beyond that, I try to I guess sort of help people to appreciate themselves a bit a bit more.
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cuz if we knew who we truly are, I think we would be in awe if we really understood how our actual Earth suit
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operates. And so I try to get people to spend just a little bit more time in touch with that. And so people tell me
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that that comes through in how I communicate. And so I think that's probably why it it connected and I think
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a common sense kind of approach. That that's so interesting to hear about you doing all the free talks early on. I
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was listening to Mel Robbins podcast over the weekend. Exactly the same for her and it's I suppose in a way it's
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like sharpening your axe. Yeah, it is. you get you you practice and also it's an offering isn't it? It's
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a um you know you if this interests you come and come and tune in and there's no
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barrier and then what I found as well down the track sometimes even just a little expense helps people to lock in a
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commitment. So certainly when I was seeing patients, I saw some incredibly generous people over the time and they
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would say, "I've gotten a lot out of this session, so I want to pay for
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someone else to come along and do this." And the other person would come, but
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they wouldn't necessarily embrace what was being offered. So sometimes an exchange of money actually
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helps people to follow through on a commitment or which, yeah, we could dive into the psychology of that, but
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probably not that worthwhile, but yeah. So, and so we moved from offering all the free talks to I think the first one
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I did was then $5 and $10. So, yeah, just got a little bit of skin in the game. Yeah, that's it.
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Um I just realized you're on the waters. I'm on a um a trim milk latte. Um
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Yeah. Is this okay? Well, I I enjoy coffee in the morning and uh there's I I think we need to know
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be honest with ourselves really just about how caffeine affects us. So, some people caffeine drives the some of your
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listeners going to want to block their ears right now. Caffeine drives a production of adrenaline and adrenaline
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is the hormone behind anxious anxious feelings. So some people are just generally they don't really sweat the
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small stuff whereas and so coffee probably just helps their brain focus a bit better for a couple of hours whereas
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other people are real worriers. They're already really anxious and I think caffeine can push them into an
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uncomfortable place. So it's sort of just noticing how we're affected by it.
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Great. Is it is it is it um I don't know what the word I'm looking for is but
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like having the amount of knowledge you have like does it just yeah I don't know
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I don't think about it like if you it's just I don't know just somehow I've well
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I've studied it I've learned it but I'm I'm really curious I my patients over
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the years taught me so much they um they're probably you know up there they're my biggest teachers really cuz
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you really notice what makes a difference for people and what doesn't and it was where there's three pillars
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to my work, biochemistry, nutrition, and emotions or mindset if you like. And that that third pillar, my patients
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really help me to bring that to life because at uni when you study nutrition and
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dietetics, you're just taught that people will do, you know, what you suggest because they're in a
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consultation, but it's not the case. They might do it for 3 minutes or 3 weeks or maybe 3 months. And it's why
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the question that arose for me is why do people do what they do? even though they
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know what they know. It's not a lack of knowledge that would lead a lot of people to polish off a packet of
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chocolate biscuits after dinner. No one does that thinking, "Oh, I'm going to
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feel so fabulous after I do this." They they start and they but they often don't stop and don't understand why.
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It's and it's usually emotional or mindset. And so diving into that I found
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incredibly helpful for people to help them make sustained changes. Yeah. That third one, the the emotional
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one, it's a it's a big one, isn't it? Because I I I can eat pretty well during
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the day. Like so far today I've had um a couple of bagels with avocado on. Um
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I'll eat well during the day. Then in the evening I'll be watching TV and
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maybe I'll be tired from work and I'll have a couple of cans of Coke Zero, you
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know, maybe half a bag of snake lollies. Oh god. Really? Yeah. What do you That's um Coke
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Zero is probably um yeah, one of my one of my weaknesses if I'm being honest.
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Like I love it. I love a couple of cans a day. How is it really bad? It's just it's just fancy water, isn't
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it? Not really. Do you sleep? How do you sleep? Yeah. No, I sleep fine. Okay, great. That's great. Well, the
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caffeine's not disrupting you. So, that's remarkable. But there could be
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some different choices made there that are offer you some nutrition. Offer the earth suit some benefit.
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Okay. Okay. Oh, thanks for that. Um, God, this is going to make me question everything I do after this.
00:17:03
Oh, we don't want that. We don't want that. Just the right amount of mischief.
00:17:07
Think of it that way. Um, actually, let's go back to the do Dr. Libby earlier years. So, you're from
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a place called Tamworth. Tamworth. Yeah. Tamworth. Yeah. Where's that? New South
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Wales. Country New South Wales. Yeah. So, country music capital of Australia, sister city, Gore.
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My my best friend at high school, her she became country music queen. She won the prize and her one of her prizes was
00:17:26
a trip to Gore. That's how she got her passport. It's like the worst international travel
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prize imaginable. She was so excited she got to ride a horse down the main street.
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Yeah. So, it sounds like from what I can gather your upbringing was quite idyllic. like um you know sort of on
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like a lifestyle block, chickens in the backyard. Um e educational parents. So if you picked an orange from a tree,
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they'd be like you they'd explain to you that it's got vitamin C in it and this
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is good for your immune system. And yeah, I grew up very simply. It was just a household yard that wasn't a lifestyle
00:17:58
block. It was a little piece of land. My dad really was a far is a farmer at heart. Um he just never ever got to a
00:18:05
point where he could buy a farm. So yeah, he just created the the housing in the backyard for the chickens and was
00:18:10
always fascinated with soil quality and he grew yeah some fruit trees and um just stock standard things, you know,
00:18:17
herbs and vegetables and but yeah, it was just a natural part of the conversation. It wasn't a big feature,
00:18:22
but I have really distinct memories of them talking to me about yeah, food and um so I'm sure that's influenced me. But
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yeah, it's a very it was a very simple upbringing. Yeah, foundational sort of memories in a
00:18:34
in a way though. I suppose it sort of set set the platform. And you were you like a daily a daily journal writer? A
00:18:39
daily diary writer? Yes. You're so lovely to raise that. Um my mom gave me a diary when I was four
00:18:46
and she just encouraged me to pop something in there each day and so I wrote down how many eggs I collected
00:18:53
from the chickens. That was they were my very first journal entries. And then occasionally um I'd write in there that
00:19:00
I ran under the sprinkler with my neighbor. that there some of the early journal entries which yeah so I still
00:19:05
have all of those books but she started that daily writing practice for me which
00:19:09
I think was yeah it's part of partly why I write books because I I really love
00:19:13
writing um what about junk food as a as a kid you know you even cuz even if you're in
00:19:19
a household where your parents are quite um educated when it comes to food like there's still kids birthday parties with
00:19:26
fairy bread or Cheerios or whatever. Oh yeah. all of that happened. But when um growing up in the ' 70s, the junk was
00:19:33
really only at birthday parties. Um junk was expensive. So we didn't have it in
00:19:38
the house really. It was probably the most processed food was tomato sauce or Yeah. So cuz the junk was expensive, so
00:19:46
it wasn't wasn't available. I remember being allowed soft drink was expensive
00:19:50
compared to water obviously. And I remember being allowed to have one bottle of soft drink for the school
00:19:55
holidays, whereas, you know, we have a lot of people have it every day now. Oh, it's so cheap now. You got to
00:20:01
There's a new world just around the corner. You can buy um you could get a like a bottle of pump water or a bottle
00:20:05
of Coke and the Coke's going to be cheaper than the water. And that's part of the that's part of
00:20:08
the challenge, I think, for so many people. And that's backwards, isn't it?
00:20:11
Yeah. So, um university, you go to university, you're there for 14 years, first person in your broader family to
00:20:18
go there. Why why did you decide to um go in the direction you did in terms of study?
00:20:23
Uh so I had no idea what I wanted to do and I would have I didn't have ambition.
00:20:29
I just had interests and things I was really curious about and so I originally started journalism because I knew I
00:20:35
wanted to write. Uh then did psychology but that was a lot of dissecting rats and studying and statistics in the early
00:20:42
part of that degree. Um but and then realized that all I really wanted to know about was human health and
00:20:48
nutrition and behavior related to human health. So that's when I started nutrition and dietetics and I was
00:20:53
fizzing from day one with that. So knew that was my place. And when did the trans transition
00:20:59
happen? Like when did you start to become like Dr. Libby the brand you know which is who who is I know that sounds
00:21:04
real wanky to say but um you know you are you like you are you're like you you
00:21:08
know you don't even need a last name anymore. It's just Dr. Libby. When did that sort of transition happen?
00:21:13
Did you did you sort of fall into it or uh Yeah. So, well, I just started Yeah. I guess bringing to life the things that
00:21:21
were in my heart and in my brain and whether that was with talks or Yeah. books or online courses. So, that really
00:21:30
started when I first finished when I finished nutrition and dietetics. I started seeing patients. So, really
00:21:36
started to observe yeah what made a difference for people. And then I got a job working in a big health retreat at
00:21:42
the end of my PhD and again saw a completely different demographic of the population. It was
00:21:49
where stress was becoming a thing then. So if you think back even 20 years ago, well about 20 years ago, people really
00:21:56
started to talk about stress a lot whereas prior to that we it wasn't really called that or and that has
00:22:01
drawbacks and benefits I think that we didn't talk about it so much. It's um
00:22:05
that became a big thing and I got to see the big impact that stress essentially had. So, and what I mean by that is when
00:22:13
people were essentially really safe, physically safe, but their bodies, you could see, was getting the message that
00:22:21
they weren't safe and it was coming mostly from thoughts and perceptions. And that led me down a whole other realm
00:22:28
with my work. And getting to see how we create a lot of pressure and urgency. We
00:22:34
create urgency when it's not needed. So there are times when urgency is needed.
00:22:38
Maybe your elderly parent has had a fall and you get a phone call, so you want to
00:22:42
get there as quickly as you can. But what a lot what I started to see is how we've made a lot of what we do each day
00:22:48
full of pressure and urgency and it was communicating something that wasn't true
00:22:51
to our body. I also started to really see how people a lot of people consciously or unconsciously worry what
00:22:58
others think of them. And I ran before I wrote a book in was it 2019 called the invisible load doing
00:23:07
focus groups to research some of the concepts I wanted to explore in that when I worked with when I um sat with
00:23:14
the girls aged between 18 and 25 which was the youngest group I looked at. By far and away, the two top stresses were
00:23:21
body image and social media. And when I share that with older audiences, they can't fathom how social media could be a
00:23:28
stress because they use social media to catch up with their friends overseas or I watch wombat videos. I think wombats
00:23:35
are the most hilarious creatures on the planet. Um, so it's essentially entertainment. And so when for the for
00:23:44
the next group, the 35 to 55 year olds, it wasn't the top one, but a really common stress was running late. But that
00:23:49
doesn't stress everybody out. So that's kind of how you know it's not real. And
00:23:54
essentially when we get stressed about running late, quite often what's underneath that is we're worried what
00:23:59
the person on the receiving end of our running late might think of us. And so and so for the younger group the social
00:24:05
media is a mechanism through which really they're they're seeking approval
00:24:10
whereas for older groups you know it might be entertainment for example. So what I started to see is that our stress
00:24:16
can actually be a mechanism through which we learn about how mechanisms where we're allowing others to judge us.
00:24:23
I know when I was growing up I would have cared about what maybe 10 people thought of me. My parents my best friend
00:24:30
um my ten I played tennis. My German was my favorite subject. He was my German teacher was amazing. There would have
00:24:36
been a boy in that mixture. So, but they were real and genuine people who kind of
00:24:40
I looking back I think well they kind of were meant to be in my heart whereas now
00:24:46
I think for so many young people they care what thousands of people think of them and most of them they've never met
00:24:51
and I think that's another part of why it can be so so stressful. So I encourage people to there's a little
00:24:58
exercise I developed from that kind of work called exploring your forehead words. So, I feel like people have these
00:25:05
traits written across their forehead that they want other people to see in them. So, a great question to ask is,
00:25:11
"How do I need other people to see me?" And write your list. And in 2011, when I
00:25:16
wrote Rushing Woman Syndrome, the things that the women said were, "I need to be
00:25:20
seen as kind, selfless, thoughtful." And so, they would run themselves ragged
00:25:25
trying to prove to everybody that they were that. Other people say, "I need to be seen as
00:25:29
competent, hardworking, efficient." And so so often we we're so determined to
00:25:35
make others see that in us. When we get stressed, it's often because we're
00:25:39
perceiving that someone is seeing us in the opposite way to those foreign words.
00:25:43
And so with that kind of insight, it changes the stress we create for ourselves and it often fosters a much
00:25:50
deeper conversation. You can go to your boss and say, "Hey, you know, I'm so
00:25:53
sorry I was running late for that meeting. A whole world of chaos broke out at home this morning. I do my best
00:25:58
to never let that interfere with work, but please know it's not because I don't
00:26:02
value my job or care. You know, they're going to think you're a gem for expressing yourself and being so
00:26:07
vulnerable. And also, for the rest of a day like that, you won't feel like you've got to prove yourself. You'll
00:26:12
just conduct yourself as your usual competent, hardworking self. So, yeah, I try to dive deep into stuff.
00:26:18
What stresses you out? Um, my parents' health and happiness. That's a big one for me as an only child.
00:26:26
They're really beautiful human beings. I feel very very um fortunate that um
00:26:32
yeah, they raised me in their simple kind way. They're very kind people. So yeah, they're elderly now and yeah,
00:26:40
supporting them is really important to me. So if they're not quite right, that
00:26:43
probably gets under my skin a little bit and I I feel like I I want to do more. Yeah, the the sense of responsibility as
00:26:49
that only child is very strong for me and that has Yeah. Yeah. It's it's a a privilege but a
00:26:55
burden. Yeah. it, as I was going to say, it has drawbacks and benefits, that sense of
00:26:59
responsibility and um but yeah, I'm really really fortunate that um that they're still around.
00:27:05
Yeah. Yeah. You you and I you and I have got some um fun adventures coming up cuz I'm
00:27:09
I'm 52. Both my parents are still alive and um you know, I know it's only a
00:27:14
matter of time. Like it's a privileged position to be in, right? To be in our
00:27:17
50s and have both parents still alive. Exactly. Other people aren't so lucky, but um
00:27:21
yeah, we know there's some some gritty stuff coming up for both of us. Yeah.
00:27:26
And in saying that, none of us ever know when our time is up, not to be morbid. So, it's um you know, we can never
00:27:32
predict how things are going to unfold. And I think it's yeah, so great to have awareness of that. And I think it
00:27:38
makes us appreciate being here so much more. Yeah. What's your relationship like with
00:27:42
social media, you know, just um looping back to that because um yeah, I mean, you're you know, you're middle-aged, but
00:27:48
you've got a massive social media following. You're very active on social
00:27:51
media. Does does that stress you out or get under your skin at all? No. No, it's not. Uh I don't I love connecting
00:27:58
in person like this. This is um an absolute joy. And then I if if this is then going to benefit others, then I
00:28:07
like to share that sort of content. I'm not someone who's ever going to take a
00:28:10
photo of my breakfast and go, "Here's what I'm having." That's
00:28:14
Fruit Loops. It's um so I I I see it as I try to use it as an educational platform or offer
00:28:22
some sort of what I you know something that might value or benefit someone. So yeah and I have help with it as well. So
00:28:30
um I have a younger person in my team who is um it is her vibe so she's really
00:28:35
wonderfully supportive with it. You need a younger person in your team that understands the algorithms and the
00:28:40
hashtags and but but so you never get bothered or stressed by if if if there's
00:28:44
a situation where people are coming at you in the comments or um well I just I I do my best to No.
00:28:54
Yeah, I do. It it definitely can that absolutely can get under my skin. Yes. Um and I just try to though keep it in
00:29:01
its place and respond Yeah. using um I guess the intention with whatever was behind what I've
00:29:09
shared. Um yeah, so I just try to respond with an understanding from where they're
00:29:14
coming from, but also an you know considering where I'm coming from. So yeah, but it it it can get to me, but it
00:29:20
doesn't last. I I try and put it in its box and go it just is what it is. Yeah,
00:29:25
it's good to be able to compartmentalize it. But it's hard because I think as
00:29:27
human beings, you know, there is this um instinct that we just want to be liked by people and then when you open
00:29:33
yourself up to a massive audience like you've got 150,000 followers or something, it's not
00:29:37
it's not possible that everyone's going to like you all the time. No, that's right. But I think then
00:29:41
putting but not requiring that I think is one of the keys, isn't it? And that's
00:29:46
not always easy. But it's where the something like the night sky puts things in perspective because
00:29:51
you go ah it's all okay. You've got so much gratitude, eh? I I can tell you just you're grateful for
00:29:59
everything. Yeah. Do do you ever even even when you do all the right things um and everything you could be to make sure
00:30:05
your body is functioning as well as what it could, do you ever wake up some mornings and just just feel like feel
00:30:10
like [ __ ] or feel a little bit off? No. Oh, I definitely feel I don't always
00:30:16
feel, you know, bouncy, but um but mostly I feel bouncy. Yeah. And if I don't, I see it as feedback. I see it as
00:30:26
information. I um very much believe our body is our absolute best friend and it is always communicating with us. And
00:30:34
sometimes I feel like the we have an obviously an inner voice I think that has our back that knows
00:30:41
when to have lunch, when to stop sitting at a computer, when to go for a walk or
00:30:46
a run. And there's that voice that is inside you looking after you. And we just don't always tune into it. And I
00:30:51
think after a while of ignoring it, it taps you on the shoulder and says, "Come
00:30:55
on." And it does that through symptoms to try to wake us up, to get us to take
00:30:59
a different tack with how we eat or drink or move or think or breathe or believe or perceive. So, it's always
00:31:07
offering us feedback. So, I just I see it as that when when it's when I don't
00:31:12
feel quite right, like, yeah, what do I need to adjust or Yeah. And and quite often it's related to something I'm
00:31:18
worried about. Little a little worrier. Are you can be? Yeah. Well, is is that a form of stress?
00:31:25
Um, it's it's very quiet. It's funny how I perceive stress. It's more like stress
00:31:31
for me feels more intense and short-lived. The little silent worry is more it's kind of deeper and reflects
00:31:41
more of what is actually really really important to me. Yeah. So, um that's it's funny. I
00:31:47
wouldn't even call that stress. All right. Probably is, but it's it's more just
00:31:50
showing me what I care about and something I need to adjust. So, the diet side of thing with Dr.
00:31:54
Libby is lockdown. What about exercise? What's your sort of exercise routine?
00:31:58
Uh, so it's a little it's a little bit off right now. Actually, I have a little
00:32:04
phrase. I have a vegetable garden and when um when it's really healthy, it means I have really great work life
00:32:10
balance. And when my vegetable garden's a bit overgrown and needs weeding, um,
00:32:15
I'm usually working a lot. and the vegetable gut and and exercise is something that is not as big a feature
00:32:21
when yeah work ramps up. I prioritize it less if I'm honest. So it can just be
00:32:27
yeah something like Pilates or walking. Um yeah, I've really I've let my weights
00:32:34
go and I'll get back to that because I really really love it. I feel fantastic
00:32:38
doing that. But yeah, I just I walked here this morning. I I love using my body for that and and for
00:32:45
gardening as well to be honest. But yeah, that's fallen away a little bit. Ex Well, it's got to be so hard for you.
00:32:50
So, as I said, we're recording this at 7:30 in the morning. After this, you're
00:32:52
going to the airport. You get a flight to Invocal. You're speaking down there
00:32:55
at like it's it's it's full noise. It's hard to prioritize exercise with a
00:33:00
schedule like that. Yeah. And it's why so and I'm I will I will though again um when there Yeah.
00:33:08
And it sounds like I'm making excuses. Probably am. But it's um Yeah. It's why
00:33:12
I try and incorporate it. So instead of getting an Uber here this morning, I walked. So I just try to bring it into
00:33:17
my bring it into how I operate on a daily basis. Yeah. Worth noting as well um carry-on
00:33:22
luggage and also it's a reasonably steep incline to the Pod Lab studio from this.
00:33:27
You're generous. No. No. Good for you. Um can we talk about your relationship
00:33:33
because there's a lot of curiosity about or rather your ex your ex relationship.
00:33:37
Um because there's there's a lot of articles about this and a lot of curiosity about this. So, you married a
00:33:42
Kiwi guy called Chris. Yeah. You married when? 2008. 2008. Yeah. Yeah. What was the what was
00:33:48
the meat cute? Um he um he's a really beautiful human being with great energy and shared a lot
00:33:56
of ideas um with me right from the get-go about how he heard me speak and uh said, "It would be really great if
00:34:02
you crafted this into a book and here's how I can imagine you could do that." So
00:34:06
yeah, he was very inspiring to me in in the way that he could see that and that that was possible and yeah, and then it
00:34:14
came to be and he helped me do all of that and create all of that. So yeah, he was a real visionary and yeah, made all
00:34:20
of that possible. I say he sort of set you on the the book path journey. I well I had said to him
00:34:25
that I always wanted to write one but he really encouraged it and yeah could see
00:34:30
how it could all be structured and um yeah was was was a a really key part in the creation of particularly that first
00:34:37
one. Well all of them we set up he he's a person who has an attitude of well how
00:34:42
hard can it be? So when I wrote that, he the first one he said, "Well, we'll just
00:34:46
set up our own publishing company. You know, how hard can it be?" And um he
00:34:52
yeah was really good at uh at connecting with people. So he made some really great connections early on in the book
00:34:58
trade and people were incredibly generous right from the start about stocking my books. Um and yeah, so he
00:35:07
was he really set all of that up right at the start and continued to do so. Yeah. Um, yeah, as as lovers, it it
00:35:14
didn't work out. And in 2016, um, you shared a post on Instagram. I've got
00:35:19
part of that here. Uh, as someone who is by nature an introvert and energized by
00:35:24
solitude, it is with sadness that I let you know that in September this year, I shared with my husband Chris that I
00:35:30
wanted to honor my introverted nature and that I wanted to end our marriage. Um, yeah. Just on that, do you think
00:35:37
that comes from being an only child? like that that introverted sort of side or that that craving of having your own
00:35:43
company probably, but it's also being quiet and going inside is where I feel like I
00:35:49
solve a lot of things and get a lot of insight. It's really being by myself is
00:35:53
incredibly energizing and I I I need that to to do the to do work in the world essentially. So yeah, it's um part
00:36:02
of how I like to live and um yeah, so yeah, that was that all unfolded and it was a really gracious um gentle split
00:36:12
and yeah, he's we're still great mates today. So I'm I'm probably much the same. I think
00:36:16
I'm probably like um an an extroverted introvert and that I can I can force myself to do some like keynote speeches
00:36:23
and things. Um but I'm also quite happy just to be at home in my own thoughts
00:36:27
and a lot of people that's their worst nightmare. Right. That's right. No, I
00:36:31
love it. It's nice that you do, too. Yeah. I think there's there's there's a
00:36:34
No one wants to be lonely, but there's um there's a difference between being
00:36:36
alone and being happy with it and being lonely, I think. Very much. I don't think I've ever felt
00:36:41
lonely in my life. It's Yeah, it's um and I'm sure journaling was part of
00:36:46
that. It was sort of how I worked things out. So, yeah, really really appreciate
00:36:49
the time by myself. Was that um a tough conversation to have at the time? Like how like how long how
00:36:55
long leading up to that had you had those thoughts that I need to be on my own? No, not very long at all. Um and
00:37:01
then opened the conversation up and um yeah, he graciously received it. Was incredibly generous with the way um
00:37:08
yeah, we we let that go. And um I I was going to say this is quite unusual, but it's the same for me
00:37:15
and and my ex. Um you're still a very big presence in each other's life and
00:37:19
you still have a great relationship and you're still good friends, which a lot
00:37:21
of people find odd. Yeah, they Yeah, some people do find it odd, but yes, that's true for us as
00:37:27
well. And um yeah, I think he's he's a really good person, so why would I not want him in my life? And
00:37:35
yeah, he's he's the same, so we still have a laugh. Yeah. Was it tough for him at the time?
00:37:41
Absolutely. Yeah. Yep. And um but as I said, he um yeah, he was just so yeah, gracious in in the in the way he
00:37:51
let it go. What about you personally? Like do do you would you would you you know, do you
00:37:56
believe in the one? Do you think there's a person out there or are you quite
00:37:58
happy just to, you know, like go through life on your own? I have a beautiful boyfriend.
00:38:03
Oh, you do? Yes, I do. Congratulations. Yes. Um, so he's a gem and he's a joy
00:38:10
and um another fellow introvert and uh we have loads in common and yeah, it's
00:38:16
um the absolute joy of my life to to to share my world with him. Yeah. Yeah. How does how does that work with
00:38:22
two introverts? Well, you just re you really understand each other. So, you understand that when
00:38:29
you just kind of get the vibe that there's some downtime needed and no one takes it personally. It's just it is
00:38:35
what it is. And um but we have Yeah, we have a lot we have a great time together.
00:38:39
So, you you live together or you run separate households or No, we live together.
00:38:42
You do? Yeah. Yeah. Yep. So, I'm away a lot. Yeah. So, he gets his quiet time.
00:38:48
You see Oh, you see you coexist and Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, it's beautiful. Oh, that's cool. Um,
00:38:55
this might be too much of a personal question. If you don't want to answer it, that's that's fine. But, um, did did
00:39:00
you did you ever want to have kids or you chose not to have kids or No, it's it's fine to ask. Um, thank you
00:39:07
for being so careful in how you ask that. It's not what I wanted. It was not
00:39:11
ever what I wanted. Um, I remember sitting around at high school with my girlfriends and they're all announcing,
00:39:17
"I'm going to have my first child when I'm 26," or whatever it was. And I
00:39:22
really clearly remember saying, "I don't think I'll ever have them." And um
00:39:26
couldn't explain really why. Um but you know, I've never ever had that drive.
00:39:31
And I can remember when I was doing my PhD, one of my professors was um in biological sciences and he said, "You
00:39:37
just wait till you're 30. It'll all wake up and you won't, you know, it'll be
00:39:41
what you want." And that never ever happened. So um yeah, I it was just nothing that um I felt sort of called to
00:39:49
do. So I have beautiful godchildren and my friends have gorgeous kids so they're
00:39:53
in my world and I feel lucky to know them. Yeah. I suppose in a way your um your
00:39:58
career is like your children in a way keeps you busy. I um I really wanted to have kids and uh you know just through
00:40:07
you various reasons just couldn't end up having it. And it's um it's an
00:40:10
interesting situation a like you can choose not to have kids and that's fine
00:40:13
but if you if that choice or something you thought the second half of your life would look like is taken away from you
00:40:18
it's um it's really weird. It's a strange thing to face. Yes. Suddenly you have this this vision of
00:40:22
how the second half of your life would look with kids and then maybe eventually grandkids and then when that's not there
00:40:26
anymore, it's you do have to reframe everything. Yeah, you do. Yeah. And is that comfy
00:40:31
for you or is it something that you're still sort of exploring yourself and getting comfy with it?
00:40:36
Well, you just have to deal with it really, don't you? And and move on. And uh except that there's pros and cons
00:40:41
from both. Like it allows me to have like a very selfish lifestyle. Um and it's because the choice was taken
00:40:47
away from me. So, it's sort of like a guilt-free. Yes. But yeah, it's tough though.
00:40:52
Yeah. I think to to recognize the benefits and drawbacks and um see them both equally.
00:40:58
I think that that sometimes helps to soften it in our hearts when there's a little ache there. Hey,
00:41:03
100%. You got to find that silver lining and the sooner the better. It's sort of like the there's the thing
00:41:10
that happens. The kids do this really well. So um there's a thing that happens
00:41:15
and then there's sometimes we make a story about the thing that happens and usually we just take the story forward
00:41:22
and I encourage people to take the wisdom from the story and take the wisdom forward and that all takes time
00:41:28
and it's why when we have you know feelings that can be really uncomfortable
00:41:34
from regret or sadness or whatever it is instead of just letting that kind of we
00:41:40
know it's good and healthy to sit with those feelings but instead of letting
00:41:43
them take away from our quality of life. I think it's yeah, as you say, draw the
00:41:48
wisdom from it and let the wisdom, you know, be be more of a guide or provide the benefit that it has.
00:41:54
God, you're so wise, aren't you? like nutrition nutrition and science aside
00:41:58
it's um have you have you done any therapy or anything over the years or you just read a lot of books or
00:42:03
I've read a lot of books and um yeah on there I've been through patches where
00:42:08
I'll go and talk to a psychologist or when there's sort of a big topic that
00:42:13
comes up that I'm not making any progress with myself. I find that really helpful. I've done that through patches
00:42:20
in my life and um until the insight comes that I'm sort of there like this little feeling inside where it just
00:42:26
drops and you think, "Yeah, that's it." And I do try to do that by myself, but
00:42:31
uh I can't always we can't always. So, I think it's great to have a trusted
00:42:35
friend we can communicate with really really openly. You know, no holes barred. I think that's a great privilege
00:42:40
in life if we find that person that where we can express ourselves so freely. Um but then times there are
00:42:47
times when a professional I think is really beneficial. Yeah. It just gives you a different way
00:42:51
to sort of you look at things or frame things that you may not have thought of yourself. E I I put put off going for
00:42:57
years and it was one of the I don't know why. I think it was just scared and then
00:43:00
you go there and you realize it's actually nothing to be scary about. It's
00:43:03
it's wonderful, isn't it? Wonderful. Yeah. Yeah. And it's so helpful. It's so helpful.
00:43:08
What about that vulnerability piece? Like have you got some you got have a really good inner circle of friends and
00:43:12
people that you can talk to and really let your walls down? Yes, very much. Yeah, my my two besties from high school
00:43:18
are still in my life. Very strong presence. They're the roller skating friends.
00:43:23
Uh yeah, and my partner, yeah, he's a beautiful human who listens amazingly.
00:43:28
So, yeah. Yeah, definitely. And and what what's what's he like? I I know like us New Zealand men where um
00:43:33
yeah, we do find it very difficult and I I understand that, you know, I've read
00:43:37
enough Bnee Brown now to understand that vulnerability is a superpower. Um but it's knowing it and still doing it in
00:43:43
real life terms. It's um you know Yeah. It's a hard thing to get over but you
00:43:47
see your partner is but is he good at Yeah. He Yeah. And he makes things so often it'll then transition into after
00:43:55
this really heartfelt conversation. It'll just become incredibly kind of playful and it and it just lightens it
00:44:01
after such a you know after something really big might be shared. Yeah. it becomes really playful and that's just
00:44:07
such a gift to me because I can be really serious and really kind of get boggled down in the detail of something
00:44:13
and yeah so the levity is a welcome introduction in my world. Yeah. Hey, thanks so much for being open
00:44:19
about that stuff. Eh, it's really cool. Oh, thank you for asking. Yeah. Hey, um I see on Instagram you're
00:44:23
coming in and there's like a a bunch of um questions all over the all over the
00:44:27
spectrum here. Um so I thought I'd put these to you. Uh top three to five things to improve our health.
00:44:35
Golly, is that too broad a question? Um, well, it really depends on the individual and it sort of depends on a
00:44:42
starting point. So, if someone's already eating in a pretty nutritious way, then
00:44:47
I probably wouldn't start there. But if someone is living on takeaway food or a
00:44:51
lot of junk, then eating more actual food would be gamechanging. So, for me, there's no such thing as junk food.
00:44:58
There's just junk and then there's food. And as humans, all we've ever eaten for
00:45:02
a really long time is food. And the junk is pretty new. And as I said, on the odd
00:45:07
occasion, no sweat. But when we're doing it every day, it can take its toll. So
00:45:12
top three things would be eat food, not junk. Uh sunshine, and I would probably say connection. It's
00:45:23
hard to not say movement because we the body benefits so much from moving. But I
00:45:27
think yeah that connection to anything whether it's a partner, a pet, a faith,
00:45:33
nature, whatever it is, I think that connection is really valuable to our health.
00:45:37
It's funny that you said sunshine is one of those things. I feel like the sun
00:45:40
gets a bit of a bad rap these days. Yeah. Every cell, this is again why biochemistry spins my tires because
00:45:47
every cell in the body has a receptor for vitamin D. So if we to me that is the classic signal that we need sunshine
00:45:56
because every single cell needs it. The only other thing that every cell has a receptor for is thyroid hormones. So we
00:46:03
know that the cells don't work properly without thyroid hormone. So to me that
00:46:07
says vitamin D is so crucial to every cell in the body working. So yeah, love sunshine. I think we're coming to
00:46:13
understand more too about the benefit of its light for uh circadian rhythm. So having really good sleep wake cycles um
00:46:22
and for our energy across the day. When was the moment that you realized stress was silently destroying people's
00:46:28
health and what did that teach you? Uh love that. So it was when I started working in health retreats. So that was
00:46:38
2004 2004 five somewhere there. Uh, and that was when I got to when I was able to see what I sort of described earlier,
00:46:50
how for someone when they're really safe, physically safe, then actually let's categorize that there's very real
00:46:58
and genuine stress going on in the world, there's very real and genuine stress going on in people's lives.
00:47:04
There's also a huge amount of stress we create for ourselves because of how we
00:47:08
think. And that's the part we can change. So that's what I'm interested
00:47:10
in. So when I'm answering this person's question, when I talk about stress, I'm
00:47:14
talking about the stress that comes from how we think and from our perceptions essentially. Um, so that's when I
00:47:21
really, yeah, it was around working in those health retreats was when I really got to see the impact of that and the
00:47:25
effect on things like sleep, uh, energy, sex hormone ratios. Yeah, that's when that really came to
00:47:33
light. And it's why it's for such a long time we've just been told to manage
00:47:38
stress and that's not really working out very well for many people. And it's why
00:47:43
I tried to dive into it and say let's address the stress. So let's work out
00:47:46
what leads you as an individual to produce stress hormones in the first place and let's see if we can reduce it.
00:47:52
So for example, I really I ask people for examples of just give me an example of something in your day that stressed
00:47:59
you out. And a common thing I've heard over the last few years is, "Oh, I'm
00:48:03
working from home and a colleague rang me and says, "Where's that work? I
00:48:06
needed it yesterday." And if when I'm speaking to a live audience, if I use
00:48:10
that as an example, I then ask the audience, "Raise your hand if that would
00:48:14
stress you out." And about threequarters of the room put their hand up. A quarter of the room don't. And so
00:48:19
that's how you know that's not an actual stress. That's how you know it's coming
00:48:22
from your thinking. So for what that shows me is we don't always hear what someone says. we hear what we think they
00:48:30
meant. So whether that's from that phone call, the colleague saying, "Where's that
00:48:35
work? I needed it yesterday." We will do it with all sorts of things. So we hear
00:48:40
the request for the work, but often what we've also heard is that they think
00:48:44
we're lazy or incompetent or inefficient or not a team player. So we feel we
00:48:48
perceive disapproval coming from someone. And that is a huge part of what creates so much stress in our lives. And
00:48:55
that's why understanding how we think can be a gamecher to stress levels. And
00:49:00
the goal is not to have none, but it's to stop telling ourselves stories that
00:49:04
aren't true and actually address the stress because our body responds to the
00:49:08
information we give it. So if we're thinking thoughts that are creating stress hormones, the body thinks our
00:49:13
life's in danger when we are thankfully relatively safe. And that's why people need to use emojis
00:49:19
more, right? A smiley face or a thumbs up at the end of a blunt sounding email can go a long
00:49:24
way. Absolutely. I really need you to do this smile. Um you have said the body is always
00:49:32
working for us. Can you unpack that? Yeah. So I feel we have a phrase we often use the language, oh that happened
00:49:39
to me. And it can feel like that. I I get that especially when it's really really genuinely big tricky stuff.
00:49:48
And I think when you I had a health challenge in my early 20s and I would have said that that was it was very very
00:49:57
challenging and confronting at the time and I wouldn't be sitting here talking
00:50:01
to you had that not happened. So it was it so that's why I switch it to it's not
00:50:07
happening to us, it's happening for us even when it's really difficult. And so
00:50:11
I don't want to sort of just say it's taking the silver lining. It's
00:50:15
understanding how or or or or deeply appreciating I think how our life is like a symphony of
00:50:23
self-creation that unfolds guiding us to become more of who we truly are. I feel
00:50:29
like our journey is back to authenticity and letting go of expectations or other people's values
00:50:37
that have been shared with us that we've absorbed unknowingly. And sometimes,
00:50:42
yeah, that the things that are we feel are happening to us are actually for us, guiding us back to become more of who we
00:50:47
truly are. What belief about women's health do you most wish we could unlearn?
00:50:56
Was it too Is it too hard to just do one? No, I can pick one. I don't know if this is the one that's
00:51:01
just top of mind right now. Right now, pmenopause is having its moment as a big topic of conversation and that's that
00:51:11
has drawbacks and benefits. The benefits of course are that women are finally being better understood. Women who are
00:51:17
suffering are getting a lot more support and they've needed that for for a long
00:51:20
time. So there's so there's so much more information out there now for women to
00:51:24
get support and that's brilliant. My worry is that there are many women who go through
00:51:31
permenopause with mild or no suffering and then other women suffer in a suffer in a really debilitating way. So we need
00:51:38
to make space for all of those. There needs to be conversations about all of that and there the trick right now is
00:51:46
that if a woman gets any kind of new symptom and they're between the ages of
00:51:51
about 38 and 55, there's a tendency right now in our culture to go, "Oh, it
00:51:54
must be permenopause." And when we say something's permenopause, we're saying
00:51:58
it must be uh our changing sex hormones that are driving that. When the new symptom might
00:52:05
be coming from iron deficiency or insulin resistance or a thyroid that's not working properly and when we just
00:52:11
blame pmenopause, we often don't investigate what else might be there. And the other the other challenge, the
00:52:17
other problem I see that I wish wasn't occurring is women who are now in their
00:52:21
30s are terrified of permenopause and they don't need to be because and again
00:52:26
I've done interviews in this area with women going through permenopause or or
00:52:31
who are out the other side and the ones who didn't suffer when I said did you
00:52:36
talk about that they said no and I'd say why well there's no story to tell and
00:52:40
then other women would say I don't want women who are suffering to feel bad I
00:52:44
kind of feel guily guilty cuz I'm not suffering. But the problem with that is
00:52:47
younger women aren't hearing from the ones who aren't suffering. So it was one of the reasons I wrote Fix
00:52:53
Iron First to be honest because a lot of women go into permenopause severely iron
00:52:57
deficient and it makes a big difference when you change that. I'm not saying
00:52:59
it's the be all and end all, but it can make a difference for some women. So
00:53:02
yeah, that that's a big worry for me with women's health right now. Yeah, that leads us to this next
00:53:07
question. If we got all the correct nutrients, would we fly through per menopause and menopause?
00:53:12
not necessarily all the right nutrients, but that is the best most robust foundation you could create for
00:53:18
yourself. I do without doubt think that thoughts and perceptions and therefore and stress essentially can be a
00:53:26
disruptor. But when we have um great nutritional status, good lymphatic flow from movement, from breathing nice and
00:53:34
slowly um as often as we can rather than short sharp challen. What's the biggest wellness scam you see
00:53:48
all over social media? Well, does it change all the time? Yeah, it's endlessly changing, isn't it?
00:53:54
Some someone just took my face and took my voice and tried to sell weight loss gummies and one of my friends mothers
00:54:01
fell for it. She trusts me. And yeah, so Oh, that AI deep fake thing is alarming,
00:54:06
isn't it? It's really really concerning and that was actually how I found out about it.
00:54:10
My friend rang and she said, "I don't understand why you're doing this." And I
00:54:14
said, "I am not doing that. You're not doing keto gummies?" No. So yeah, that one it directly
00:54:20
affected people who trust me. So that was Did that stress you out? Yeah, it did. And and in the moment it
00:54:29
did and it also does for where all of that can potentially go. It's Yeah, it's
00:54:33
it's really concerning and I don't know what we can do about it. That's I I try
00:54:37
to when I when there's something that bothers me or I try to find a solution.
00:54:43
That's I guess probably how I manage my stress is try and find a solution. And
00:54:47
um I don't I can't we can't solve I don't know how we solve that. M
00:54:51
yeah cuz I think if I was in that same boat like my immediate thing would be stressed out and I'd feel bad for anyone
00:54:56
that had been sucked in and then you you pause take a couple of steps back and you know realize the sensible steps you
00:55:02
have to go through to try and solve the problem but the immediate reaction I think is like stress and panic
00:55:07
it is because people are being affected and they don't deserve to be. It's Yeah.
00:55:12
Yeah. And it's your reputation on the line and all sorts of other things as well.
00:55:15
Oh, she wasted her money on those gummies. That was my worry. Uh, what is something you'd never put in
00:55:21
your body, but everyone else still does? [Music] God, there's numerous things.
00:55:31
Some stuff I probably don't even know about. Um, gosh, gosh, gosh. Um, artificial
00:55:39
sweeteners. Yeah. So, I like my Coke Zero. Can we still be friends at the end of
00:55:45
this though? Yeah. Artificial sweeteners. I would yeah I would not let them go in the
00:55:50
earth suit and a lot of people are having them like they're going out of fashion and that's a concern for me
00:55:56
like a spa tame a spa tame is that how yeah yeah yep yep but for my soda fix would I be I'd be
00:56:05
better having a coke zero than a a full strength Coke wouldn't I so I would just steer you right away
00:56:11
from that completely and get and it might be too much but get a Soda Stream and make fizzy water and then add some
00:56:20
flavoring to that cuz then you can control the sweetness in it and yeah the other things that are in it.
00:56:25
Some flavor like what like honey or uh you could do that. There are companies now making um additions for
00:56:32
those soda streams that have got really low sugar. They've got really considered
00:56:36
ingredients and that can be a really lovely afterdinner drink if you want something like that.
00:56:41
What's one uh what's one wellness trend that secretly drives you absolutely
00:56:45
nuts? um a wellness. So, it's kind of coming full circle now. I I wouldn't say it drives me nuts. I was
00:56:59
more concerned about it. But when cold plunging first came to be, there are definitely people in the
00:57:05
population who can benefit from that, but I was really worried about a lot of the women who I saw as patients were
00:57:13
what I would describe as really depleted with low energy, low iron, um, and jumping into freezing cold water for
00:57:22
someone who's really depleted. That worried me. So sort of that rushing woman who might be in burnout,
00:57:28
that was a big worry that this wellness trend was being sort of displayed as the
00:57:32
beall and end all for everybody because in I haven't studied traditional Chinese
00:57:37
medicine but I have learned a lot from it and I feel it does offer a lot of wisdom. It's all about warmth and so I
00:57:44
felt these really depleted women needed warmth and nurturing and support for their healing and their wellness. So
00:57:50
that was one that I felt the blanket statement of cold plunges were great for everyone. That used to worry me. that's
00:57:55
kind of coming to light way more now, which is great. When when this stuff happens, do you do
00:57:59
you speak your mind or do you sort of sit there and bite your tongue and let these fadeds pass?
00:58:04
Uh it's more if people ask a question then I answer it directly to them cuz I
00:58:09
don't ever I don't ever want to put down something that someone is benefiting
00:58:12
from. And so that's why I'm not a fan of blanket statements at all because I feel
00:58:18
that we we can be drawn to something in our life for a period of time because it
00:58:22
serves us and then we can realize, oh, it's time to let that go. That's a habit
00:58:26
that I've kind of outgrown or my my body is no longer benefiting from also. Yeah.
00:58:32
So, it's more I I I answer things directly rather than make the blanket statements.
00:58:36
What's one daily habit most women need to quit to feel better? Being so mean to themselves. M
00:58:43
yeah. So the harsh self-t talk is can be really brutal. Uh and the judgment we pass on ourselves is usually what leads
00:58:50
us to continue to not take care of ourselves. So for example, if let's say someone eats a packet of chocolate
00:58:55
biscuits and they're treat a whole packet and they're trying to not do that, they'll usually judge themselves
00:59:00
really harshly afterwards. So they put a comma in that sentence and say, "I ate
00:59:03
too many chocolate biscuits, therefore I'm hopeless and pathetic and have no
00:59:06
willpower." and that we don't ever most of what we think is not actually true,
00:59:10
but we're not taught that at school. So, we don't get to the end of a thought
00:59:14
like that and think, "Oh, is that actually true?" We just keep living our
00:59:17
life. And a belief is just a thought that we've thought over and over again and never questioned. And our beliefs
00:59:22
actually drive our behavior. So once we've said that to ourselves many times
00:59:26
that we're hopeless and pathetic and have no willpower after we've eaten too
00:59:30
many biscuits, eventually that translates into not that you are just because you ate the biscuits, but that
00:59:35
you just are that. So we take on these beliefs about ourselves about who we are or who we must be having done those
00:59:42
things. Whereas if we could bring some more curiosity and think I ate too many chocolate biscuits, that might be true.
00:59:48
But if you then say, "I wonder what led me to do that." Then information will pop up. Oh, I skipped
00:59:56
lunch today, so of course I did that at afternoon tea time. My solution is probably to actually eat lunch. Or I ate
01:00:02
the biscuits because I came out of a meeting and someone said XY Z, and I can see my feelings were really hurt. Oh,
01:00:07
did the biscuits solve that? No. What would solve that? Or maybe chatting with them. So it it just helps you to pause
01:00:14
and I guess regroup. So, it's the harsh conversations, the judgment we pass on
01:00:19
ourselves usually. Yeah. What's um what about your personal inner voice? What's that like? Is you mostly
01:00:24
kind to yourself? Yes, I would say yes. Um yeah, it's very you were lovely before
01:00:35
you you acknowledged it before. It's mostly one of appreciation. M I guess I just wonder when someone like
01:00:43
you that's super super high achieving and you've done so much um yeah are are
01:00:48
you ever sort of in the moment are you constantly looking looking ahead and seeing what's next?
01:00:53
No. Yeah, I'm I've sort of I've trained myself to be in the moment at times.
01:00:59
I'm regularly ahead um jumping ahead. Um but yeah, no I I I nature is very brings
01:01:09
me yeah to to be really present. My partner's face really brings me to presence. Um I'm very This will sound
01:01:18
absolutely nuts, but when I drink a glass of water, I taught myself a long time ago to be present with that. So I
01:01:27
imagined sort of swallowing sunshine and that I taught myself that a long time ago. And so that happens now on
01:01:33
autopilot because I just was so appreciative to have access to clean drinking water cuz I'm so aware that so
01:01:40
many people in the world still don't. And yeah, so I bring myself to presence
01:01:45
through little rituals. So sort of like a form of mindfulness every time you drink water.
01:01:50
Yeah, it is. Yeah. Great way to say it. That's really interesting. Okay, gratitude is something I've got into the
01:01:56
last the last few years and if you you know you look for three things every day that you're thankful for or whatever you
01:02:01
can boil that down and go for three things that you're thankful for every day that don't cost any money.
01:02:04
Yeah. Um and that's something that anyone can do and it just makes you realize how
01:02:08
bloody lucky you are. Absolutely. And to um Yeah, it's the the fresh access to fresh
01:02:17
drinking water is something that I don't know. It's just never ever been lost on
01:02:20
me. And um we had rain water. We lived in town and had town water when I was growing up, but we lived we had
01:02:25
rainwater tanks in the backyard. My dad had gazillions of them all around the place cuz he tried to water all the
01:02:31
vegetables just with the rain water and we drank that and um yes, I've done that
01:02:35
for myself again now as an adult. And yeah, I don't know. I just get a little
01:02:39
thrill from that. Uh Dr. Libby, you say the body whispers before it screams. What is a whisper
01:02:46
that most women ignore until it's too late? Lousy energy. So when and what I mean by
01:02:52
that is when you feel fatigued day after day when sleep is not restoring your energy, you want to look at that because
01:02:58
we just write it off to being busy or stressed or maybe not sleeping as well as as we could be. But that shift in
01:03:05
energy is your first sign of a rabbit hole to go down or or or get to the heart of it. And it's I wrote fix iron
01:03:13
first for that reason. Iron deficiency is the most common nutritional deficiency in the globally in the world
01:03:19
including in New Zealand and it's particularly common amongst women across the menstruation years pregnant women
01:03:24
and unfortunately also in children and I'm obsessed with iron because and it
01:03:31
was I developed an iron supplement. It took me five years of research to actually develop iconic iron. So
01:03:38
that shift in energy can be if you're iron deficient, get that sorted because
01:03:42
the ripple effect of living with lousy iron is significant. Anxiety is actually a symptom of iron deficiency. Now I'm
01:03:49
not saying for a second that all anxiety is caused by iron deficiency. But you know, you think about teenage girls,
01:03:54
they've started to menstruate. A lot of them start sadly start to restrict their
01:03:57
diets. they can become iron deficient so quickly and anxiety can then arise and it might be coming arising for many many
01:04:06
reasons but I feel that iron deficiency as a contributor is being hugely overlooked. So your energy more anxious
01:04:13
feelings would be another sign. So instead of just writing things off to stress or being busy or feeling a lot of
01:04:22
pressure, having a lot on the to-do list, try to notice what that really is. Because when we just say it's stress, we
01:04:30
don't really get to the heart of what's leading that to arise. So are the
01:04:34
increase in anxious feelings coming from maybe you are iron deficient? Is it coming from dehydration? Is it coming be
01:04:41
from because you're worried about a conversation you had that morning? So see if you can identify it rather than
01:04:46
just go, "Oh, I'm just really anxious because I feel there's a there's a
01:04:51
tendency in our culture right now to medicalize feelings and that can be beneficial and the right road for some
01:04:57
people to go down, but I feel that the other elements of that are being missed. So um yeah, energy and more anxious
01:05:04
feelings would be the two little watch outs I would say for women. They're little whispers getting you to go
01:05:09
deeper. What What's the easiest way to get more iron? Uh so it's rich in red meat, uh
01:05:16
muscles, eggs, and then our veggie sauces, things like lentils, seaweed, parsley, it's in green leafy vegetables.
01:05:24
The um veggie sauces need some vitamin C to help them be absorbed, though. What's something you do that would
01:05:31
surprise your most devoted fans? I think that maybe they're angling for like a like a bad answer like like you
01:05:39
always have the cookie time cookie on the plane or I don't know. Um, so don't What was the qu Is it Does
01:05:46
it say bad? Uh, no. Doesn't I suppose you can interpret it any way you want, but
01:05:51
what's something you do that would surprise your most devoted fans? I I just assume it's something
01:05:56
uh decadent. I don't know. You interpret that any way you want. Um, I think there's been a lot of things
01:06:05
that would surprise you most of fans. Like even the thing you said before about imagining water as sunshine when
01:06:09
you're drinking it. I thought it was cute. Maybe they're going for the, you know,
01:06:14
does she eat hot chips or something and which we established earlier you do from
01:06:18
time to time. Uh, okay. What do you think about Ozek and the wave of injectable weight loss
01:06:24
drugs? Again, I don't ever want to put something down that someone's really
01:06:28
benefited from. My worry is the way that they're being used. So, the GLP1 receptors respond really, really well to
01:06:39
bitterness. So that's we've known that for a really long time and bitterness is
01:06:44
actually almost moved out of our food supply. So our green leafy vegetables are bitter but they're way less bitter
01:06:49
than they used to be. Um and when we consume bitter foods it actually stimulates those GLP1 receptors that
01:06:55
those medications are working on. And I I guess the the concern is the muscle wastage. The
01:07:06
concern is people going on to them and staying on them for a really long time. The concern is the nutrient deficiencies
01:07:13
that can arise because your appetite's so suppressed. You're just literally not
01:07:16
eating enough food to meet your nutritional requirements. Um so yeah, I have it also doesn't get to if someone
01:07:26
uh is unhealthy as in their health is being affected by how much body fat their structure is carrying.
01:07:35
I then I understand why someone would want to go there. Absolutely. I don't know if it's going to help the person
01:07:42
get to the heart of what led them to treat themselves like that in the first place that created, you know, a lack of
01:07:50
health from carrying, you know, way way way way too much body fat, for example. So, I don't mind about the size. I'm not
01:07:57
talking about that. I'm talking about the effect on someone's health from ex,
01:08:01
you know, significant excesses of body fat. M so yeah I don't know if it helps someone
01:08:06
get to the heart of that. So but essentially in a physical way yeah I worry about it's overuse people staying
01:08:12
on it too long and the muscle wastage and the the nutrient deficiencies that can happen.
01:08:17
Uh what's the biggest myth women are still believing about their bodies that they need. So the calorie equation
01:08:33
was something that was really hammered into me and my education. And I think there
01:08:40
are a lot of women around my age and older who still feel like they've got to
01:08:44
burn off what they consume. And that's a really I think that can be a really
01:08:49
destructive kind of mindset. There's no nurturing in that. There's no caring.
01:08:52
There's no appreciation. It's just kind of this deprivation mindset. Calories in calories out.
01:08:58
Yeah. and that that and yeah that that eating like a bird because they think that's the only way
01:09:04
to maintain the structure that they're trying to maintain. Yeah. I I worry about the harshness of that I guess and
01:09:10
the the yeah the deprivation that comes with that. You've spent your life helping others
01:09:15
heal. Who helped you heal? Oh um anyone in my life I think we we foster relationships with people who
01:09:27
you know so generously offer us all sorts of things that can just be you know a light-hearted conversation over a
01:09:33
dinner party and then someone will drop a statement and you think oh that really
01:09:37
resonates or and and it's not like a planned conversation that you've sat
01:09:41
down to have. It's um that you know just people are so generous in what they
01:09:47
share and I I really trust the coming together of of people in friendships in as acquaintances just in a general
01:09:54
conversation like this. I'll I'll reflect on this after I go away and you know think about some of the things
01:10:00
you said. You have very soft eyes. So as you know communicating with you because
01:10:06
your eyes are so soft it softens me and I feel so comfortable and so open and so
01:10:13
that's an exchange that you know none of us can predict or but I'll carry that
01:10:18
through my day and your generosity in the questions you've asked and how respectfully you've asked them your
01:10:26
interest in even wanting to have this conversation is very touching and it surprises me and yeah I it's it's such a
01:10:34
it's such a gift. So I the the healing comes I guess in everyday interactions
01:10:39
in big ways and small ways, planned and unplanned. Thanks for that. That really gassed me
01:10:45
up. I'll be I'll be thinking about this I I do this thing after a podcast. I'll be
01:10:51
thinking about this all day and I'll think about things that I I wish I asked
01:10:54
and that I should have asked or that I should have done. You don't you don't do
01:10:58
that or you because I've thrown a lot of questions at you and you haven't
01:11:01
pre-eread any of these from Instagram and I'm putting you on the spot. So when you're on the flight to Invoc
01:11:06
will you be thinking [ __ ] I should have said that or I should have said this or
01:11:09
No, you don't. No, I I I tr I just I trust the process. Um I Yeah, I I I love sharing stories if
01:11:20
people Yeah. I Yeah, your questions have been delightful. But no, I don't sort of
01:11:24
reflect on that. I just I trust the process. I yeah, it's um I know I might sit there
01:11:31
and think I I should have told the iron story better because it's sort of my
01:11:36
mission right now is to talk about yeah fix iron first and helping you sort of inspiring people to
01:11:42
really get find out if they're iron deficient and correct that if possible. Um iconic iron is the supplement I've
01:11:49
made is made from organic peas and it contains feritin iron which has its own unique absorption mechanism. So there it
01:11:55
I've said it now, but that'd be some of the things I'd probably sit on the plane
01:11:58
and think I should have talked about. Bioblad's iconic iron. Yeah. Yeah. This has been this this has
01:12:02
been a very a very broad chat about um Dr. Libby. Um not not with a strict focus on iron, which is your um thing at
01:12:09
the moment. It's like the new book and I've listened to so many podcasts over
01:12:12
the past week that you've been on and it's been the focus on the iron stuff.
01:12:15
But um yeah, so let's get into that now. What's like what what is what is the big
01:12:19
takeaway you'd want people to know about iron? Why why should why should they get your new book? Um so the
01:12:27
tagline on the so it's called fix iron first the one thing that changes everything and I encourage if someone
01:12:32
finds out that they are deficient or depleted act on that because you can if you correct your iron levels you can
01:12:39
then see what's left over because I think right now we're attributing and
01:12:43
blaming symptoms that we're experiencing or health challenge health challenges
01:12:47
we're experiencing on other things when a lot of people are just living with
01:12:51
iron deficiency and and not dealing with it whether That's, you know, one of the
01:12:55
symptoms in children is fussy eating and irritability. So, it would change the parents world and the child's world if
01:13:02
that was corrected. Um, so understanding the the wide implications of iron deficiency and
01:13:09
yeah, treat that and then let's see what's left over and buy the book. Get the book
01:13:14
if the topic appeals. Yeah. Um, when do you feel most at peace with yourself and when do you feel
01:13:20
furthest from it? Uh, good question. You must be quite a homebody, eh? Being an introvert.
01:13:32
Big home body. Love. Nothing better than being at home. Love. Yeah. The quiet in nature, looking at
01:13:39
the sky, looking at the trees, watching light change. Love watching light change. That'd be probably
01:13:47
Yeah. Um, a dance off in the kitchen with my partner. that. Feel like myself doing that. Roller skating. Totally feel
01:13:54
like myself doing that. Furthest from myself. Um, don't know if I feel like that anymore
01:14:02
these days. Oh, what a great space to be playing in. And the dance off in the kitchen. What
01:14:07
are you What are we dancing to? Oh, anything. Anything. He's the CEO. He's the curator of the music.
01:14:15
H Have you ever had an unhealthy habit that you struggled to break? And what helped you shift it?
01:14:20
Yes. Uh, in my teenage years, I chewed extra chewing gum like it was going out of fashion. And
01:14:27
is that all right? Must got artificial sweeteners in it. So, no, not a fan. Do you have that, too?
01:14:34
Oh, yeah, I do. I know. I have that one with plastic container with 50 bits in in the car at all times.
01:14:41
So, yeah. So, that was a habit I was really determined to break and um, yeah, it took me a while, but yeah, did it.
01:14:50
Um you you are you are so in tune with your body like if if you if you had the diet I have for one day you'd you'd
01:14:55
probably feel like absolute ass right you'd feel terrible and um but no this
01:15:00
is this has made me aware of this this morning this conversation we've had it's
01:15:02
like um I think I feel pretty good most of the time but the the reality is it's
01:15:06
my body's just been used to being treated poorly I guess and I say poorly in in in comments because I think I do a
01:15:12
lot of right things but I also do a lot of wrong things you know what I mean? Yeah. Um but again let your body give
01:15:19
you the feedback. So if you feel if you feel really good then that's feedback
01:15:22
that it's all okay. It's um yeah but maybe bit few less of those fizzy drinks at night.
01:15:32
Is there a motto or quote that you try and live your life by? Oh that's a bit gorgeous. Um follow the
01:15:40
threads. So what does that mean? Yeah. So I don't actually I don't pursue
01:15:49
things. I don't sort of dream things up and then go right I'm chasing that. An
01:15:54
idea might come or someone might say something to me and then it's almost like a yes no button on the inside. Do I
01:16:02
follow that? And I've learned I don't always do you know I'm not always
01:16:07
exactly true to this but I do my absolute best to really go with the yes and the and the no. So when I say follow
01:16:14
the thread, it's to follow the yes even if it doesn't really make sense to me
01:16:18
and at the time and like an idea pops into your head or someone says would you like to do blah blah. Yeah. I try to
01:16:26
really trust that yes no button. So it's intuition in a way I guess. Yeah. Yeah.
01:16:30
What are your best and worst habits? Um I just don't look at the world like that. Um no I don't. That's a great
01:16:42
answer. It's it's a non-answer, but it's a great answer as well, cuz I know you're being
01:16:46
authentic and honest about it. Yeah, it's it's sort of um I don't see
01:16:53
worst. I understand the question, but I don't see the worst as the worst. The worst
01:17:00
plays a role. The worst. I've created the worst, if we want to label it that.
01:17:07
There's information in it. It's all information and it's what I do with it
01:17:11
that so that worst is prompt if if it is indeed the worst that's prompting me to
01:17:17
see why I'm choosing that. Is it a part of myself that I'm being really mean
01:17:23
about or yeah, what's what's leading to that worst kind of habit? So, it's not I
01:17:29
just don't see it like that. It's not it's just not my world. What a great way to live your life. When
01:17:35
was the last time you cried? With you this morning. I was really misty eyed before when you
01:17:41
said nice things. Yeah. So, this morning? Really? Oh, yeah. Yeah. Really? Oh, I can I cry very easy. I'm um I
01:17:49
can't hide how I feel cuz my eyes get wet with truth, with authenticity, with
01:17:56
honesty, with appreciation. Yeah, it's so Yeah, it's it's not quite a daily occurrence, but happens pretty
01:18:03
often. Not a big blubbering cry, but one of the the last big blubbering cry actually.
01:18:09
Don't know if I can recall it to be honest. They're there, but the misty
01:18:14
eyes are pretty often. Gez, you must cry most days when you when you do a speak like a speech. Like
01:18:19
you're often in the car after this. Um I'm I'm imagining afterwards there's a
01:18:22
line of women that want to speak to you about the impact you've had on their
01:18:25
life. Um and just the value you've added to it. Um yeah, must be a daily occurrence. you're doing these speeches
01:18:32
and then crying afterwards with just just seeing in in real terms the impact you're having on people.
01:18:37
So what what affects me is the shift for them. So I honestly don't I don't think
01:18:46
about myself in that moment. It's almost like there's this will sound nuts, but
01:18:50
it's almost like there's no conscious thought. It's just I'm just It's just an
01:18:55
offering of information that someone might take a little piece from and think, "Oh yeah, I'm going to go to bed
01:19:02
earlier or I'm going to drink more water or I'm going to eat more green vegetables or
01:19:06
let's coke zero. Coke zero. I'm going to get my iron levels checked." Whatever it is that
01:19:10
something has arisen that they've then acted on. And people say things to me
01:19:14
like, "You changed my life." And I I say, "I did not. You just heard some
01:19:20
information and you acted on it. It's all on you. And that the truth of that I
01:19:25
so I get goosebumps when I say that because it's the truth. It's not me,
01:19:29
it's them. It's just, you know, lots of people hear all sorts of information
01:19:33
that might benefit them and they don't necessarily act on it. So, um, but yeah,
01:19:37
that's very moving when, yeah, there's been a big shift for someone and they
01:19:40
share it. Are you proud of yourself? I don't think like that either. Um, I'm
01:19:48
very content with myself. Yeah, I like who I am and I feel really fortunate to like who I am. And
01:19:55
that doesn't mean that there's not things that I don't want to change, but
01:19:58
I'm comfy with that as well. The the bits that Yeah, I like who I am. I appreciate who I am. I honestly just
01:20:04
feel so lucky to be here. This has been wonderful. Oh, thank you. First time we've met and
01:20:11
it's um it's been a really really good chat. Real um insightful. Lots of
01:20:15
takeaways in there. I'm Every time I I I go to the fridge for a Coke Zero, I'm
01:20:19
going to think of you. But without guilt, you just just relish it. If that's what you want to drink,
01:20:25
you just go, "How good is this? I love the taste of this. This spins my tires."
01:20:29
Yeah. Hey, this has been a lot of fun. You're a beautiful human. Thank you. Um Oh, last one. Like goals for the
01:20:35
future. Where do you see yourself at? You know, 60, 65. Just keep writing books.
01:20:41
Yeah, absolut Yeah, I I think so. So yeah, I I can't imagine. I have no desire to to stop. I feel it doesn't
01:20:49
really feel like work. It feels like play. Um so maybe when it feels like work, I'll stop. I don't know. Um yeah,
01:20:56
whileever things arise that I feel might off that might offer someone something,
01:21:01
I'll keep doing it. So yeah, I don't I'm not a good planner. Terrible at
01:21:05
planning. 14 books. I don't know. I don't know. I'd argue with that one. We could debate
01:21:11
that. Hey Dr. Libby, this has been so great. Thank you so much. You're um a national
01:21:16
treasure and it's wonderful to have you on the podcast. Thank you so much for all of your
01:21:20
kindness and generosity, Dom. It's been a joy to be here with you. Thank you.