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hop in a driverless taxi with the Google owned self-driving company whmo opening
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up its Robo taxis to all users in that City the technology of course is hugely expensive alphabet's autonomous vehicle
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unit weo completing another major round of funding Teedra has served as co-ceo at whamos since
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2021 we are on a mission to build the world's most experienced driver and make it safe and easy for people and things
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to get where they're going this is not a move fast and break things this is a move with great great iterative pace and
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focus on [Music] safety please uh join me in welcoming to kedra from weo to the stage hi thank you for thank you it's a
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pleasure thanks for coming thank you so much Hi D thank you tea thanks so much for being here yeah thank you uh tequa
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has been co-ceo of weo since 2021 where she leads the company's business operations and expansion in
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autonomous driving recently weo has been reported to be completing I don't know if weo put this out or if it wasn't been
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used but over 100,000 pay trips per week now is that is that public is that like
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a true thing it's completely true it's over 100,000 over 100,000 week week per week yeah that's awesome and um we can
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now see wh Mo's autonomous ride haing Services in Phoenix La San Francisco in the Bay Area Austin and I think on X you
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announced 5 billion an additional committed funding from alphabet I don't know if that was recent to support wh's
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expansion it was recent congratulations and um so thanks for joining us uh the weo story started a long time ago as a
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Google X Project when did you join and how did you kind of become coo yeah thank you um so weo started as the
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Google self-driving car project back in 2009 and uh actually my co-ceo was one of those founding team members Demitri
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doov and in 2016 at the end of 2016 we spun out and sort of became wh um and that's when I joined um at that point it
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had been determined that the technology was on a good enough path to start to think about commercialization and scale
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um and so the funny the fun thing about joining a moonshot is you know I came from Big tech company so I'm like oh
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product Market fit like it's all there I'm going to join and we're going to scale and the reality is it was an
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opportunity to learn how much this is a process of discovery um how much this is
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a process of figuring out not only the technology roadmap but also the external environment and at that time I had been
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head of policy at a lot of companies and I joined under the idea that if the technology works the market opportunity
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would come from being able to open markets and so that was super terrifying to me because if you're at most large
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tech companies doing policy work you're actually trying to avoid costs or you're trying to defeat
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legislation that's harmful but this was really the opportunity of like how do you Usher in this amazing technology and
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so that's when I joined and then I um was asked by my prior CEO to help launched the first Market which was
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Phoenix back then it was Chandler um and we launched that back in 2017 and we've
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been since 2018 a lot of people don't realize we've had a 247 ride hailing service um Around the Clock it was in
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2020 during covid though that we removed the driver from behind the wheel so we have the weo driver uh that's driving
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the vehicles at all time but there's no human behind the wheel and we've been offering that service now we're almost
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at four years 24/7 not only in Phoenix which was a 315 square m mile territory but also in San Francisco and now here
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in La so in that sort of ushering in from Market one to this role I moved through this coo role um and that's when
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we actually remov the driver and that's you know it was the we're the first company that's done that and um so it
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was daunting and I think that's one thing I love about wh we call our team wonuts is you just have to every time
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get to this point of determining what's good enough uh what's safe enough yeah and then make that leap and then learn
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because you can't learn until you get to that next point and so of course we have
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rigorous safety culture um but it was in that time that I was coo and then in April of 21 I moved into the co-ceo role
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with Demitri so now now that it's scaling 100,000 paid rides a week maybe we can talk a little bit I mean Jason SP
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a lot maybe starting with security would be an interest safety rather would be a
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really good idea um you've done it seems like millions of rides now no fatalities
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correct that's right um but there have been accidents so when you look at the the accidents that have occurred how
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often does an accident occur and in what percentage of the time is it just somebody running into the weo versus the
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wayo running into somebody else yeah so we've done 2 million sort of paid rides um so when we think about we just
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released this week our safety Hub so this you're sort of tapping into an issue that's really important what we've
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been able to determine as of June of this year with over 22 million what we refer to as Ro miles those are miles
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that are fully autonomous uh we've been able to have 83% fewer airbag deployments which of course is
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important because those are high impact um and 74 or 73% fewer injury causing crashes now that's what we're focused
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over a human over a traditional traditional human meaning the counterfactual in that area at that same
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point in time exactly via insurance claims and other data ex we're not we're comparing in San Francisco not on
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highways there Apple Apple's comparison we're comparing in San Francisco or in Phoenix okay great because this is the
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next piece which is you're not yet on highways that's right we're testing on highways in Phoenix and San Francisco
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saf drivers with employees and a human behind the wheel at times and maybe you could explain to us when why you're
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taking that approach cuz in my experience driving a Tesla since the beginning with full self-driving and
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autopilot before that um it seems like it's better on the highway than is on local streets where you have people
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jumping out and weird things that occur on the highway you very rarely have a run into a weird thing it's it's pretty
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ABC so I I would think it was the opposite but is it because speed kills what what's the thinking there so I
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think so just for everyone to orient um when you think about the levels of autonomy we are only focused on level
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four and above level four and above means you do not need a driver's license nor do you need to sit behind the wheel
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so when you're focused on tackling the hardest challenge first it's really important to for the driver the weo
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driver to ingest dense Urban environments because that is where the driver is going to learn the most
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sitting on freeway seeing the same thing every day can be predictable it's not entirely predictable but it's not
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additive to what the machine learns that's a great answer so we're trying to learn as much as we can learn and we've
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always from the beginning been focused on freeways it's just that freeways isn't actually how the machine learns
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the fastest in the most sophisticated environments but because you brought up you know sort of a level three or two or
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one system I think it's also important that for systems where you need someone to sit behind the wheel you can have a
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completely different approach to this technology but we're really when I don't know how many of you here have had the
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chance to take a away my ride here in La it actually includes this campus where we're sitting right now but we you don't
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you can't sit behind the wheel so there's no ambiguity you sit in the passenger seat or you sit in the back
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seat so let's talk about the lar versus camera bet elon's been pretty clear hey you don't need lar it's a waste of money
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the lar on Whos I believe is still in the $1 to $220,000 in incremental class am I ballpark correct I not sure oh okay
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um so with that as you scale costs go down yeah of course so who's who's right I mean are you
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using the liar and is that a critical piece of this or do you think eventually hey the cameras are seeing
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360° they have higher Fidelity than human eyes so and if humans do a great job and you just have to beat the humans
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at driving why even have the liar what do you think so obviously we have conviction that we need liar radar and
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cameras uh we have all three it's given us the opportunity to scale at this point we're the only company that's
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doing level four driving on public roads 24 hours a day it's very different to get to the place of a demo we learned
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that ourselves back in 2015 and 16 and 17 we had an autopilot Highway um product we allowed employees at the time
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Google employees to ride in that product we told them to pay attention we told them you have to be alert and be
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prepared to take over what did they do they do we're human we want to do other staff when we're in the car like I want
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to be on the phone I want to get to that meeting I need to send that last email I
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need to check whether or not my son's doctor's appointment is tomorrow and next Thursday we're distracted and so
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what happens the thing's beeping at you it's telling you to re-engage and pay attention and what we learned is that
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that's not a way to improve road safety and so the question is what's the end goal is it to improve Road Safety or not
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for us as a company we are obsessed our our culture is about safety this mission
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is about safety and we want to expand the number of people who have access to Mobility options if you need a driver's
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license then it's just like every other Mobility platform you have to be behind the wheel can I sorry go ahead I'm
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curious about when this flips from a technology problem and a go to market problem to one of Public
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Health um because that's a staggering fact and you know we all know people that have lost somebody close to them
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whether it's just a road accident or the dunk driving or to you know I don't know
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if you guys saw anybody follows hockey but the you know Johnny hocky who was killed with his brother the day before
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his sister's wedding by a drunk drive this is like so avoidable so what does it take for a politician or a group of
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of politicians and I don't even know at which level this decision would get made
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where they say okay we've seen enough that should be the only solution and are you pushing for that so we are pushing
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to make sure people who put autonomous vehicles on the road have to demonstrate their safety case we think the worst
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thing that could happen is introducing a new technology that doesn't actually improve this problem because it'll kill
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the whole industry because it'll kill the whole industry and the State of Affairs 4 ,000 Americans 1.35 globally
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dying annually from Road crashes is avoidable and so the challenge that we have to tackle with a lot of humility is
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how prepared is the public you know humans can kill other people how prepared is the public to accept that
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this isn't going to be a Panacea and it's not going to be perfect you didn't hear me say 100% 100% 100 right was 70
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there'll be a small error R there's going to be a small and so that's the work that we're doing which is we have
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Community Partners Mothers Against Drunk Driving national Safety Council a host of organizations who've been trying to
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tackle this issue who we partnered with early because it's it's actually in both
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of our interest to figure out how to tell the story that if this technology can reduce 60% of the uh fatalities then
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it's worth the exposure to the risk are you on any sort of internal shock clock meaning there must have been a moment
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where you convened a meeting or you guys had a meeting and you said all right we
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have enough data let's go we're going to pull the guy out of the car or hey this
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is it we're ready and then you show it to regulators and they say okay is there a set of these really important
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Milestones that we're going to feel like goes to other cities like is it only grid cities where this works like so
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where do you go from here yeah I hope I hope that what over time you start to experience is one because we are you
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know super focused on safety you'll see us scaling um and because we're building a driver
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and not a car you'll see a scaling in a number of ways so we have Partnerships right now we have a partnership with
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Uber in Phoenix why are we doing that people are like oh my gosh I got my Uber Eats in AO like why are you all doing
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that it's because we're building a driver and so we're trying to figure out all of the ways in which this driver
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could be applied to future use cases and so over time you're certainly going to see us announce new places but you're
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also going to see like in San Francisco we launched a 24-hour service in a limited territory and over time we've
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expanded that territory is a step functioning complexity to go to cities that are more how would I call it more
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chaotically City planned it is definitely an opportunity for the driver to learn more and so coming to Los
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Angeles for example was more like being in Phoenix going to Austin exactly exactly going to Manhattan we will
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certainly benefit from our work in San Francisco same thing with DC start with the GD cities and work your way into
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more complex Series so can I follow up on the um on that that last point I I I have a friend who's the third or fourth
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investor in Uber and um and he he's uh he's very worried that once this product scales there's not
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really giv me a need for Uber anymore right why would you need Uber if you can just summon the robot car directly or
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the robot driver whatever you want to call it right driver car whatever I mean doesn't this logically disrupt
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Uber at you know once it's at scale I think um well they're a current part I said we
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have a partnership with right I mean I have we have a partnership your friend hasn't sold enough
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share your friend's doing just fine we have the partnership with Uber because we think it's important for us to create
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an AV ecosystem around this technology like this isn't going to be we've created technology we're going to figure
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out everything ourselves like that would be foolish and very expensive and we'd never find ourselves profitable but
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having companies that are experts in integration having Automotive partner you know we have we're not building the
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car having network Partners having Fleet operating Partners public officials like
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there's a lot that is built around us and these are the early days the early Innings and so that's part of it is
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learning in the I'd say five years ago people would say to me you know Network operators would say oh this is exactly
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like we know how to do this well this is a constrained Supply it's not a supply you just sege this is a driver that you
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need to understand actually how to operate with and so I think we're going through those steps to learn together
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and so what I would say is there's room for a lot of people under this is the is
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the insurance Lobby in the insurance industry a proponent or do they would they try to constrain
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your progress so one of the largest uh reinsurers in the world swisser is actually been doing our safety yeah they
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would want to underwrite this yeah but I'm talking about more like the Geico of the world same I think they're very
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eager to get the data sets that we're releasing like we released set 20 uh safety papers last year they're all
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wanting to understand what the actual impact of this technology can be because you know one of the things I think
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that's hard for us to grasp as as humans or at least I'll say for me I don't like
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speaking for everybody the you know we drive in a week more than a human drives in a
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lifetime and you can say that as a company that runs fleets but we're the only company where it's one
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driver and that's not like that's not the way the world is organized right now right FedEx has a lot of drivers all of
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you who have Teslas have a lot of drivers like everyone has a lot of drivers and all of those drivers have
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different capabilities this is one driver learning all the time in unison and so like what can we
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demonstrate that's possible and it really goes back to your other question of like what do what are policy makers 5
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years from now really going to want to know and how will they be able to derive from what we're doing today where were
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you when you heard the news of Cruz dragging that woman in San Francisco 20 feet and then where were you and what
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was your reaction internally to when you found out Cruz covered it up um I don't remember where I was uh when
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I learned but I um you know it's we're here to improve Road Safety so it was pretty um upsetting I think to me and
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the whole org I think as we learned about the lack of transparency like our view has just been be transparent it's
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not Perfection like it's technology yeah but you're considered they contemporary
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and you have a different approach you would never cover it up um they obviously had something dysfunctional
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did that set the industry back significantly how are Regulators talking to you before and after that if
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differently if at all it definitely led to more scrutiny in San Francisco because there was already an active and
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continues to be a fairly active voice against technology in San Francisco and so we needed to continue to engage which
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we were already doing provide more data which which we're of course willing to do and I think over time what we'll see
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is you know we have to get to a place where the amount of data that we're providing actually advances the safety
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concerns I think at that point it was just providing a lot more engagement so if the mission is to reduce those debts
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and to really scale this technology Uber is doing a quarter billion rides a week
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uh you just raised five billion it's a big number uh that gives you another 50,000 cars um which is a fraction of
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the rides in but one city it seems like you need a lot of Partners in the car space to build this so
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wouldn't the best strategy be to license this technology to every car maker and then allow the Ubers the lifts the door
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dashes um and Fleet managers to handle cleaning the puke in the back of the cars and putting the air in the tires
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because I don't think wao wants to be in the back of that car cleaning up the puke and the and doing the air Tire
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right there has to be somebody who manages all that so so maybe talk a little bit about that possibility of and
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even a more beautiful thing would be for you to open source it so has there been
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a discussion internally about open sourcing this technology so I'll start at the beginning I think what you just
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described is exactly the AV ecosystem that I'm talking about and yes out of necessity and because we are the I mean
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whoever was first was going to need to create this it doesn't exist right so we're doing that um I think the second
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part of what you're talking let everyone do what they're good at like we're good
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at building this driver there's though a period where we have to become really good at what does it mean to operate at
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scale and that's the that's where we are right now what does it mean to operate at scale what does it you know
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technology can work and not be delightful not be reusable not be repeatable and that you know we don't
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just want people having tourism rides we want people actually integrating this into their lives and we just did a a ux
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study and we found that a third of people use the service in San Francisco to go to their doctor appointments we're
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like that feels like real life and 36% uh we using the vehicles to go to local businesses which is also real life and
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so these are the kinds of signals that we're trying to get as far as like personally Owned Cars we've always said
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as part of our strategy from the beginning that we would start with ride hailing and local delivery and that
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eventually we would make our technology available to um Automotive companies so that this you know at some point you'll
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find wayo cars sitting on showroom floors for sale oh wow so you you we could go buy one and then put it into
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whatever Fleet we want yes what does it cost to make one of these cars today and
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where do you see it in 5 years yeah and just I guess on that question where's the Tipping Point Unit economics so if
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you look at on the ride hailing business based on I know a lot of people drive during rush hour and then they don't
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need rides the rest of the time so there's a lot of excess inventory sitting around so if you look at the
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utilization of a car over its lifetime and the cost of the car over the lifetime what's the the breaking point
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where the unit economics Mak sense yeah um so your question of cost of car we just don't break it out since we're not
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um reported separately for alphabet we're just bundled rumor is a buck 50 right now it's
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close Okay fck 25 not commenting on rumors not commenting on rumors wa wait if that's that's just the um the system
00:21:13
for self-drive the car plus the system The Car Plus but what 125 to 150 is the rumor rumored cost for the car today
00:21:21
actually is like comment on the rumor well but but that's I mean that's obviously a lot more than a Tesla right
00:21:28
so yeah t 40,000 50,000 yeah so do we do we know ballparks here what can we say keep on so fun we're just we're
00:21:40
poker players so we're trying to read you and bait you and it's not working we didn't know you were a Jedi so so so
00:21:45
sorry let me just ask is it about Reinventing the system or getting the next gen of the system before the unit
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economics break or is it about volume what's the breaking point of where the unit economics become profitable become
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positive um yeah not not going to get into that other than to say to you I is the thing I spend all of my time focus
00:22:05
on and we are on but there's a path there there's completely a path there well without getting into costs so is
00:22:11
one of the plans here to sell this to you know all the car makers so that they can compete with Tesla because most of
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the car companies do not have the technical capabilities to develop their own self-driving it's just impossible so
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are you guys going to be like an oem to all the car makers so that they can provide self-driving yeah we've said
00:22:33
sort of publicly and we've had Partnerships where we've made the technology available um it's a question
00:22:38
of when you know when will a level four sort of product be available and interesting to Consumers at scale you
00:22:46
know that's part of the question but absolutely this is part of our strategy friend of mine can I that yeah of course
00:22:52
I'm sorry friend of mine um who couldn't make it here um is an angel investor and
00:22:56
Uber and um he uh was no uh if you look at the business outside of the United States actually if
00:23:06
you look at Uber's business um there's a lot of opportunity in other markets and
00:23:11
sometimes in other markets they will prove probably more able and open-minded to taking like the public health
00:23:18
priority around these things so why such a heavy Reliance on America considering
00:23:25
the scale and the impr premature of Google could probably pull you into any number of markets anywhere around the
00:23:30
world yeah so we really think about it as this sort of Learning Journey but it's also just where we started right I
00:23:38
mean part part of the conversation we get to have now is what would if the driver was at this level of maturity
00:23:45
where would we have started um that said we have Global aspirations we are always
00:23:50
thinking about the does it just take one geography to prove this point or do do you view it the problem that way like
00:23:57
it's like we're training we're training we're training and then at some point there'll be some City or yeah County
00:24:03
which point I just want to make sure I understand this idea where like you can prove that it's just so reliable and
00:24:08
valuable and that you're saving just I I really care about that idea yeah to who
00:24:15
who who would it prove the point to the people that would make the rules I guess
00:24:20
yeah I think I hope I I don't know I think there's a lot of noise in the system there's a lot of confusion about
00:24:30
full autonomy versus partial autonomy um there's not a lot of legislative activity that's informed by
00:24:38
experts right so I don't know right like certainly It's My Hope and I think one of the things when you think about
00:24:46
certain countries around the world there is more of a nation state top- down approach to some uh regulations and so
00:24:53
that could be easier Singapore yeah you prove it it's codified into law you launch um it had it that hasn't been the
00:25:03
primary way we've thought about Market entri or opportunity but certainly one of the yeah are but as long as some
00:25:08
markets adopt the rest of the markets will see and they'll fall behind and I mean you just have to penetrate some
00:25:13
markets yeah from Google had amazing success with Android and open source so back to that open source question you
00:25:20
must have had this discussion many times internally why not open source the technology and then provide you know the
00:25:26
premium Android to people who want want to pay and is that something on the road
00:25:30
map because I hear there's a big discussion internally to car OEM just open sourcing the maps the software to
00:25:37
make everybody contribute to it to just get this out quicker so where where are you at with those internal discussions
00:25:42
that wayo give away the whole business yeah exactly no well I mean Android it's worked right I 20 billion in it's like
00:25:48
let's just give it away well I mean but freedberg if you look at Android it's only gotten stronger right completely
00:25:53
different I think that that was Defensive on search but not your answer no I like it when you guys answer each
00:25:59
other's questions cuz I get to learn what you actually want to see your answer we we fight a lot it's fine no
00:26:04
it's fun it's actually fun for me um so feel free to keep so on the question of open sourcing that isn't something that
00:26:15
we're spending a lot of time talking about right now let's talk about level six which I believe is inclimate weather
00:26:21
and really heart yeah oh level five rather sorry um and I know when I'm in my Tesla it gives me a little warning
00:26:27
hey in Clement weather and the FSD might be degraded you know extra attention time um how close are you you know to
00:26:35
feeling comfortable with these things driving in snow ice rain or when that happens do fleets just pull over and
00:26:43
game over you know you have you can't use these this technology yeah we've uh been improving weather we've tested
00:26:49
across 25 cities specifically for that so we had massive storms in San Francisco last year and we didn't take
00:26:57
down the fleet like our fleet was able to handle all of the rain so rain and flooding pretty good rain May good
00:27:03
because of like uh liar and radar maybe you said it okay fog snow ice um so we've tested
00:27:12
in we've tested in snow and ice we don't have any deployments there but that's an
00:27:18
area that we're learning fog we've been able to master that 280 no problem same thing with those
00:27:25
sandstorms in Phoenix that was an early like those are actually you know very challenging and then there swarms of
00:27:32
birds in Phoenix like really and and heat right you have a machine brutal it's like it's like Revelation
00:27:40
like there's a lot there's a lot and you know we're the only company that can pick you up autonomously at the airport
00:27:47
right and so like is whole thing what has been the hardest um challenge for you as CEO
00:27:58
I think we've heard I mean we've heard all these rumors about like cultural issues at Google or whatnot but you know
00:28:04
I get the sense that you're much more separated in terms of building a much more Technical and specific culture but
00:28:10
what what have been the hardest challenges for you I think one of the hardest challenges was making we made
00:28:16
such a big decision in going fully autonomous which is sort of the reason we're here during CO mean getting that
00:28:25
person out the person from behind the wheel scaling this and so then bringing the culture back together to now scale
00:28:32
so we just needed like we needed a minute to lock back in that's one of the things and the other one I would say is
00:28:37
what you just said which is you know it's a brilliant team and the team works really hard but like bad things are
00:28:47
going to happen in the real world with human drivers around our cars and the team takes that so seriously and so
00:28:54
that's it's it's like a it's like having worked at I mean I worked at a I know there too but like other kinds of tech
00:29:01
companies I know every kind of company is stressful it's a different kind of stress When people's lives are
00:29:06
completely and they personalize work yeah and so that's it's just a different level of stress and
00:29:12
accountability responsibility differently because of that pressure or no you do when things happen in Industry
00:29:19
you know we need people to sort of you know stay buckled in and believing that this is something that is worth it it's
00:29:26
audacious it's hard but it's worth it and it and it's bigger most people come because they have lost someone like
00:29:33
they're very Mis can I be very honest with you it's it's an incredible framing you gave and I I totally missed it for
00:29:38
so many years which is when you said we're building one driver I thought for whatever reason you were building an
00:29:43
autonomous driving system which I I interpreted very technologically for a very long time but you're absolutely
00:29:48
right you have one goal it's very clarifying actually the world's greatest driver one the world's greatest driver
00:29:53
world's most trusted driver most trusted driver Teedra thank you forred yeah I mean incredible thank you so much
00:30:00
yeah thank you it was awesome thank you so much