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What the heck is secular progressive homeschooling? That is what this former conservative Christian homeschooler was
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wondering. Thankfully, today's guest is going to break it all down for us. This
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is the Exhomeschoolers Club, and I'm your host, Jacob Gooden. If you're new
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here, this is the show where we talk about the good, the bad, and the ugly of growing up a homeschooled kid. And if
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you're returning exhie, what is up? Welcome back. Thank you for being here today. Today's guest is Ashley Peak, who
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is not only a current homeschool parent, but also a content creator and a podcaster. You can find everything she's
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doing at Secular Homeschool Revolution. That'll be linked down in the description below. But Ashley and I got
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connected via social media, and I just knew I wanted to have her on the show. Today, we're going to talk about why she
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chose to homeschool her kids, how she's doing it a little bit differently. We're
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going to talk about finding the community that was right for her, or actually not really finding the
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community, instead actually ended up building the community that was right for her and her kiddos. and uh now even
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getting into like doing some micro schooling and some other really cool things that are happening in Texas.
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Okay, so stay tuned, lock in. This is a great conversation and I hope you enjoy.
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[music] Well, Ashley, welcome to the exhomeschoolers club. I'm so excited to
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have you uh here with me today. >> I'm really excited to be here, too.
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Especially since you came up on my for you page on TikTok. >> Yeah. No, I that's I was going to bring
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that up. That's kind of how we got connected is social media and you know obviously um you know I post homeschool
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videos, you post homeschool videos. I think the algorithm just knew we we needed to meet. Um and so I was really
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intrigued with your content because you are a secular homeschool mom. So that's
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the other thing that's going to be really cool about today's conversation,
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talking to a current homeschool parent. Um and like exploring like how things have changed cuz I've been out of it for
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a decade at this point. but and and I was a Christian home school kid. So, just kind of the whole flip side of
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everything that's just different and I'm just like so excited to like have a
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conversation with you and learn about like what's new essentially. So, Ashley,
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I'd love if you kind of like kick us off a little bit. Tell me a little bit about
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like your homeschool journey, like what led you to choosing to homeschool your kids. Give me kind of like the what a
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typical day in the life maybe looks like. Maybe it's every day is very different, but like set the stage a
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little bit for us. Okay. So, I do want to clarify. I do categorize myself as a secular progressive homeschooler. Um,
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and I think that's a relatively new term in homeschooling in itself. Um, because
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you have the branches of like Christian, then you have secular, then you have like the secular progressive
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homeschoolers. Um, and I didn't initially think of that when I started my homeschooling journey. I never saw
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myself as a homeschooling parent. And if I'm being transparent, I hated school. I
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started skipping school in sixth grade. I had teachers who were unsupportive. Um, and I graduated with a lot of gaps.
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Um, so it took me I took a lot of remedial classes to catch up. Um, and so that was why I never saw myself as a
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homeschooling parent. Um, but when my kid was about six, we found out that she needed an IEP and I was like, great, the
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school system will support her. And it became this upward battle. I didn't understand why it was so difficult to
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get my kid the services that she needed. And I was working at the time, but I had
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to quit because I spending so much time at the school right when we got everything approved. Why isn't she
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having her accommodations? why am I having to micromanage these things? Um, and then I eventually had to have when
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it was time to like check on her services or update them, she still didn't get fully what she needed. And so
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I had to get a friend who was working as a special education advocate to like give me information on how I can push
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this further. And it got ridiculous cuz she was like, "You're you're advocating
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for your kids, so don't take no for an answer." And she's visually impaired.
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So, the things that I wanted was like a lamp desk, a lamp at her desk, a slant board, and why was that so hard? And I
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also couldn't bring it because it was a liability. And she needed a few other
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things, but again, it it it wasn't anything super expensive or drastic, right? And
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I got frustrated because I ended up sitting in a six-hour IEP meeting. Like, we look we we had a little break from
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lunch and we're still going back and forth on these things. And I said, you know what? I had a conversation with my
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husband. I was like, "This isn't the best fit." So, I found a small private
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school. And I thought because it was I think it was like less than 10 kids in the class that it would be a better
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situation. It was not. And traditionally, private schools aren't equipped to support kids who have IEPs.
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And I kind of knew that, but I thought, well, her accommodations are so simple. It could be met at a small Christian
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school. And it was a Christian private school. and my family isn't religious,
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but I thought we could just overlook those parts. And it it was really difficult. And then it became harder
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when she wasn't getting supported. Um, and then we tried a small charter school. Charter schools traditionally
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aren't equipped either to support kids with IEPs. I'm like, "My kid is visually
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impaired. Why would I come up here?" Cuz I joined the PTA because I'm a
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helicopter mom cuz my kid isn't getting what she needs. And I'm like, "Why is
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she sitting in the back of the room? Why are we keep putting her back in the back
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of the room?" and she's a quiet kid and so I could see how she probably was not
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a priority in the sense of the kids who are more rowdy or more outspoken or and okay she's you're the teacher's telling
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me she's not reading at grade level she's not doing these things so the system ultimately was failing her
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because I'm sitting in the meetings I'm transitioning her to school so again I
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talk to my husband and I'm looking into homeschooling and I hear all the negative stereotypes so I'm like I don't
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know. And we were just like, you know what? Let's just do it. We jumped in. And it was scary. It was hard the first
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year. And I was overwhelmed. Um because I also had a kid that was three turning four. So
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jumping into homeschooling with two kids essentially was a lot to handle. And then I started looking at the resources
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and a lot of them were very Christian-based. And like I mentioned earlier, we're not a religious family.
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Um, so it became really hard and because they were young, it was easier to piece
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together curriculum. So we were at the library a lot. I'm googling 2 3:00 in
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the morning because also it's my first year. I'm looking for material. I'm up
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having like parent anxiety at 2 three in the morning where I'm like asleep and
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I'm like, "Oh my gosh, do I have a lesson for next week?" D. And so that is
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essentially how I got started into homeschooling. >> I Yeah. Do I How How long have you been
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homeschooling now? >> We are going on almost eight years. So, it has And it's crazy because I like to
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say I was a homeschooler before COVID because I think CO was responsible for a lot of change in the homeschooling
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world. And I know as a secular homeschooler, it's brought a lot of new materials. It brought a lot of new
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people to the community. And that's like the one thing I'm thankful for out of co
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>> I Yeah, cuz I was going to ask like how cuz I know you're based out of Texas
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and so I was I was doing a little research. I was like, "Okay, what states have the highest homeschool like
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populations and it's California and Texas. I grew up in California, big homeschool groups. You're in Texas
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obviously big homeschool groups there as well." And um and so it's interesting
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because as I've interviewed other people from other states, I've been New Jersey
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and Ohio and like all these other states, they they talk about like well there's just not like there's not like
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builtout community, there's not co-ops, there's nothing here, but California,
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Texas seem to have some massive homeschool groups. And so as you were getting started, were you already
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looking at like co-op community opportunities for your kids or were you like, "Okay, we're just going to like
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pull pulling the kids out. we're going to do it all at home. The very stereotypical like I not isolation, but
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just kind of like, okay, we're keeping everything at the house right from the
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get-go. >> It was a hard first year and part of it was I didn't have community support. And
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when you look at statistics on why people leave homeschooling, it's because they don't have support going through.
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And so I was like, I'm feeling lonely. This is feeling like a silo. And that's
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when I started learning about the co-ops and community meetup groups and everything. And actually my first me and
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I'm a very um talkative, outgoing, friendly person, so I don't ever feel
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like anybody's a stranger. And I go to my first meetup and there wasn't any
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people of color. And then this is when this was I think after Trump came into office. And so we were just talking and
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politics came up and my politics didn't agree with him. And it was crazy because
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like we were talking in a group and then all of a sudden people started shifting
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away from me and then they were calling their kids. I was like, "Wow, you wow."
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Okay. Um and and I still was like, "Wow." And then I go to a second group
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and I hear again there was no people of color and I I'm trying to spark up conversation because I know it's kind of
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hard when people have known each other for years or months and the new person's
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trying to get in there. So I was like, "Oh, is there a such thing as, you know,
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a a homeschooling Girl Scout troop?" Oh, the eyes. It was like, "Uh, no. It's
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they're they're terrible. They support abortion. They do all these things. you
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need to look into American Heritage. And I'm like, oh. And so on my phone, right?
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And I'm like, oh. I was like, what? They don't sell cookies. And they didn't
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think that was funny. [laughter] And so then it was like, well, what do you like about Girl Scouts? And it again
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became weird. And then I did go to another one that was more diverse, but they were more Christianle leaning. And
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religion and politics kept coming up and it we just weren't aligned. And I will
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say I did go to one playgroup and it it was a small playgroup, but it was a lot of parents going in and out of public
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school. So I felt like I felt lonely again, right? Cuz I wasn't I wasn't feeling motivated to try other
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groups, if that makes sense. >> That totally makes sense. I mean like as someone who grew up in like the
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Christian community, homeschool communities, every home school community I was a part of was a Christian
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organization and everybody that I knew as far as far as I knew everybody was a Christian and we all had these aligned
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values and it it just very much it built a bubble and so I could imagine Ashley if you if you and your family had
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showed up we would have probably given you unfortunately some of the same stairs and some of the same like what is
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going on who are these people and that's very unfortunate uh to begin with. But
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so how did you then come to like find your people out of that because like that's
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overwhelming. It >> it is overwhelming. But I do want to tell you Jacob, thank you for stating
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that because when I've had that say and I'm sh I've shared that same scenario
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with other Christian homeschoolers. they look at me like I'm exaggerating or I'm
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crazy and I was like, "Wait, you've never done this to people or you just
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don't want to acknowledge that you've done that to people." Um, and so it was
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weird. Um, but I appreciate your honesty in that way. Um, so again, I'm a very
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social, outgoing person. So I would just take my kids to the park and you know, I'm I'm picking up people and it was
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like, "Oh, okay. This is a great conversation. We're adding each other on
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social media." And then somebody randomly posted that they were having a pool party. And so I was like, "Huh,
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they there looks like there's some diversity in responding to this comment." And so I end up going to the
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pool party with my kids. And we started talking. We started vibing. And then we were like, "Hey, maybe we should
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formalize some things." And we created a Facebook page. And it was just three of
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us initially. And we were posting consistently about park dates and we were very um intentional about posting
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pictures to make sure we were drawing in, you know, diverse people and we were very clear that we were secular. And
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again, I wasn't raised religious, so I didn't understand how triggering the
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word secular was for people. Um, and I think that's when I really started leaning into my journey of like secular
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progressive homeschooling because even though these people were coming to a secular space, they still were bringing
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religion and a very I wouldn't say narrow-minded but very conservative views. I think that's better. Very
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conservative views. And I was hearing things that weren't allowed aligned with
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my values. And I do want to say I do think like you were saying y'all were grouped into a bubble. I do think it's
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important for kids to have a variety of experiences. But if these are your like chosen people that you're building
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community with, I would like to not feel ostracized because of my values. Like I'm not homophobic. I I don't believe in
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purity culture. You know, so it was these things that I'm hearing that weren't aligned aligned with me. And so
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I was like, okay, how can we make this clear that this is that's not accepted
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in this space. Um, and so we started posting more direct messages and slowly but surely by fall like we had a huge
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Halloween party. So again, we started around July and by October we had over a hundred people attend our Halloween
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party. Um, and I think it has a lot to do with our consistency and posting. um because you know people are joining the
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homeschooling community on a daily basis. So, and a lot of the families that joined us were new families. I
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think that's really interesting too that the the words secular and progressive
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like are so triggering when we talked before that was like you you brought up that like
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those words in particular have they maybe uh put some people on edge a little bit but also like it's such an
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you were very clear in your messaging which I think is important and that's one of the things that even looking as
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I've done more research into like the groups I was a part of growing up there
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is very clear messaging of like what they are. These are Christian homeschool groups and I think that's that's
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important. They're very clear on this is what we believe, this is where we stand,
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that type of thing. And so to your point of like finding the community that works
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for you and like that messaging needs to be very clear because it's really easy
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to get just into a home school group that you're like, "Okay, yeah, everything's good and it seems good."
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And then all of a sudden it's like flags are going up. And diversity is important
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in thought process and all those types of things, but you also do need some people who you can align with. You can
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have healthy conversation with who are not going to talking about. >> Yeah, absolutely. Well, and it's funny
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how it's not funny, but I appreciate you again stating when you went back and
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looked at the messaging from your previous groups, that's accepted. Like that is accepted in the homeschooling
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group. But when you start wording, you know, you're centering, you know, black
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and brown kids experiences and you're working on decolonizing history and just
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like your group meups, that's a problem for people and but we're we why can't we
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coexist in the same way that you're existing and for some reason there's
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there's been a little push back on that? >> So So tell me like what are the main
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differences? I maybe that's the wrong word, but like what is secular progressive homeschooling look like and
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what do you see as it being like what is the difference there between like a traditional Christian conservative
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homeschool group? >> Well, for I would say that my experience or my definition of like a secular
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progressive homeschooler is, you know, I'm an ally to the queer community. I
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believe in Black Lives Matter. I also believe in science and evolution in that way. I don't support creationism. Um so
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that's not what I teach my kids. That's not what's explored necessarily in my
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homeschooling community. And um we try to offer a justice centered education. And I think in order to offer a justice-
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centered education, we have to look at history in a way from you know everybody's perspective to see how were
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people contributing to that time whether it was a great experience or a negative
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experience. We have to acknowledge it right and we look at books. We look at banned books. We look at why are these
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books being banned? You don't want your kids to have access to a queer experience, right? and and and it and it
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doesn't always it's not always salacious, but because that is what's
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represented, you know, people get all with their panties in a bunch. Um and so we I think if I'm giving my kids access
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to all of these stories, they'll have a more expanded world view rather than if
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I'm, you know, centering it. And I've noticed within the Christian homeschooling, there is a lot of um
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Bible and God laced into a lot of the curriculums and the curriculums are not diverse. The book lists aren't diverse.
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We're not looking at history from all perspectives. It's a very limited view.
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I'm thankful. I was um I did an episode a few weeks ago at this point um probably two months ago at this point um
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about and I kind of had gone through some of the curriculum that I used and and I'm thankful that the history that
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my mom had put us through was it has a little bit of a Christian vein. However, it is more accepted as like a a better
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understanding of history. is looking at some of that difference. And while some of the other things that I maybe went
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through were not quite as diverse or not quite as as inclusive. Um it is interesting now as an adult to like go
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to some of those places, go to some of those historical areas cuz now I live in the south. Um grew up on the west coast
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like we don't have civil war history um there as far as like actually going in
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person to see it, right? And so now living in the south, I'm like, "Oh, I
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can actually go to some of these battlefields, plantations, all those types of things and experience what it
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looks like and hear a firsthand accounts. Not maybe not a firsthand account, but I can hear like a
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generational account of the experiences." And um anyway, so what I find so interesting about like what
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you're doing too is that like I I love what you're doing first of all because I
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am a huge advocate for like kind of hearing all these different like viewpoints on things and I believe that
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like difficult conversations within families is like an important thing. And so having your kid be able to read
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something and maybe you know, okay, so like what happens when two girls, you know, like each other and it's romantic
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or, you know, what about this aspect or what, you know, and you you brought up like people viewing it as like salacious
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or things like that, but it opens up conversations in your household that I think are important to have, right? As
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opposed to just very much like this is the viewpoint, this is what we believe and like that's it. We don't touch
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anything outside of that. So, have you even seen that within your own home of just like the diversity of like
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conversation being able to be had with you and your kids? >> Yes. So, I absolutely believe in having
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an open and honest um household and so I appreciate the fact and I think that's
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telling in the in the way that I'm raising my kids that they are absolutely comfortable sometimes too comfortable
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asking questions and wanting answers like for instance like sex. So, you know, sex can be a difficult
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conversation for a lot of parents with their kids. And so, I was like, "Okay,
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so you have these questions. I'm not scared of it. Um, I also don't always
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have the tools to directly have the conversation." So, you know, I got the book, Sex is a Funny Word, and we were
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able to go in graphic novel style, but I appreciated that they were able to come
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and talk to me rather than their friends having that conversation with them or they find it on the internet because if
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you type in the word, it's not going to take you to an educational website. [laughter] And so, I love that we can
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have these open and honest conversations and when they become adults, they'll be
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able to approach it in such a healthy way. Um, but I do think it starts with explaining to them, a this is how your
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body works. This is where it transitions. This is how it transitions. And I think all but people when they
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hear sex, they automatically think it's the get it on. But there's so much more
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information prior to that that we don't talk about. And for some reason, especially even in schools, it's it's
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shunned. >> I just did a whole series on the podcast talking about I reread a a purity
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culture book. um called I kiss dating goodbye by Josh Harris. Very in the in the Christian world, it's known as like
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literally the worst dating book uh possible. Um >> but it was interesting. Yeah,
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>> it's up there as far as just bad books overall because it's all about throwing
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away traditional dating and sexuality and basically bringing in like a very courtship style
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saving yourself for marriage and all these types of things. And so, um, but I appreciate what you're doing because,
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yeah, it was very awkward to talk about sex as a kid. It was very awkward to talk about sexuality and all these
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different things. And it all got lumped in together and it was just like bad, bad, bad, bad bad um, and maybe hint at
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a little thing here or a little thing there. And yes, of course, my dad gave me like the birds and the bees
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conversation and things like that, but um, it wasn't enough. Um, I'll say that
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like now as an adult, I've had to re-educate myself on so much. And so many of my friends, the same deal. I was
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like, I've had to re-educate ourselves. And there are so many times now, it's
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funny, we talk and we go, man, I wish my parents would have just been able to explain this to me as a kid. And there
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are so many ways that like I've read some of these books that explain sex to
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to a younger kid, and I'm like, this would have made so much sense and not been too graphic, not been, you know,
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not been awful. So, um, yeah. So, I appreciate what you're doing there because that's just that's another big
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area that like I just have my own internalized traumas from all of that kind of kind of thing. And I know that a
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lot of us ex homeschooler Christian kids, we have that. And so, hearing that there's a new generation of
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homeschoolers coming that have that and are equipped with that education. Wow, that makes me feel a lot better. Even
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with your podcast, like I said, I came across it as well on my for you page on Tik Tok. And I'm a person that never
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likes to be the smartest person in the room or assume that I know everything. And I am a first generation
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homeschooling parent. And so I'm looking to learn from other people's experiences, whether it's good or bad.
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And so I've read the Reddit threads and it's it I would the questions that you
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ask from people's experiences is what I want to know when I'm looking at these
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discussion boards or I'm in these Facebook groups because you don't always
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get like the clarity around whatever statement or experience that's being shared. Um so I'm like, "Oh, okay. This
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was traumatic. Let me check make sure I'm I'm I'm aware of this." And I also I
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think your podcast has made me realize is that my kids might resent me for making this choice. Um, and while I
00:24:04
think it's like the most amazing thing ever, their their experience is their
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own. And even with me having three kids, they're still having their own experiences in this household and it's
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not going to be identical. So, you know, one of them might hate this choice, another one might love it, and the other
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one's like, "Well, I do have some resentment towards you, but it is what
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it is." Um, because there's just no way to fill up all of their cups. But it was
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a decision that I made and and in full transparency, I think I was open at one point to putting them in public school.
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Um, but then when I'm looking at how, you know, educational politics are going
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right now, I'm not as supportive of them going to public school right now. So,
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I'm constantly, you know, asking them what are they feeling, what are they needing, so that I can try to offer
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that. Um, and so that's how we opened a co-op. Um, and it is a secular progressive homeschooling space, and I'm
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really proud of it again because it's the same three families that started it.
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And now we maxed out at 60 kids every Wednesday from you know 10 to 2. We often have waiting lists to be a part of
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our groups and we're like okay there's a waiting list and so we've added on a
00:25:21
part where it's just field trips since we don't have the room for you in our
00:25:24
Wednesday co-op. We offer weekly field trips or meetups and gatherings but bottom of the line is there were people
00:25:31
who were wanting and needing the space. Well, let's break down your co-op a little bit and like talk about what a
00:25:38
Wednesday looks like and how you guys have it structured because like I have my own experiences with co-ops. The most
00:25:43
famous one I talk about on the show is group solutions. It was a one day every two weeks. It was like a Friday and it
00:25:50
was three class periods and it was like very kind of a traditional school setting where it's like we go in, we
00:25:55
have some kind of teacher that's teaching there's a plethora of subjects.
00:25:58
Could be science, could be something fun like just how to play board games. That's how I learned to play poker.
00:26:03
Surprise, surprise. Christian homeschool community. >> Gambling. >> Mom taught me how to play poker. Yeah.
00:26:09
Yeah. Well, we didn't gamble, but we Yeah. But we were like Yeah. But I don't
00:26:13
know. I don't remember what we played with, but Yeah. It was We were told it
00:26:16
wasn't gambling. It was just Yeah. This is how you play blackjack and this is
00:26:19
how you play poker. Yeah. Um but yeah. So, walk me through like what your co-op looks like and how like a Wednesday is
00:26:25
structured for you guys. >> Okay. So, we currently have ages 4 through 17 and they're broken up into
00:26:33
five age groups. Um, when they arrive to co-op, we do like a quick 15minute morning session. Um, just to get good
00:26:42
vibes in the air. So, people share things that they're excited about or what brought them joy for the week from
00:26:47
the last time that we saw them. And then we all chant an affirmation just to get
00:26:52
more good vibes going. And it's basically celebrating who they are. and that they don't have to be like other
00:26:59
people and their journey is their journey. And then we break off to two classes before lunch and then they come
00:27:05
back for one more class and then we go into clubs. And we do um offer very progressive
00:27:14
classes like we've done anti-racist kitchen where we're looking at foods and
00:27:19
looking to see how they were gentrified. when we taught Texas history, we taught
00:27:23
it from an indigenous, we started it from an indigenous perspective and move forward. Um, we taught like the history
00:27:30
of Harlem Renaissance and an ethnic studies class. We do science, we do dissections, we do an experiment class.
00:27:38
Um, so I'm very fortunate for the parents that we have. Oh, we taught borders and bias and you know, what does
00:27:44
fascism look like throughout history? Um, so I'm excited that we have parents
00:27:49
who are about the mission and are able to offer the classes that they do. And often our kids are like, I wish I was in
00:27:56
this class, but I don't want to leave this class. And so it's a good feeling
00:28:00
to have that kids want to take so many different classes that we offer. Um, every Wednesday, you know, from 10 to 10
00:28:08
to 2:30 that we have them going. >> And then what what do the clubs look like? So is that like more of like a
00:28:15
traditional after school club or you know like I'm envisioning chess club when you said that but I I would assume
00:28:21
it's a little bit more diverse than that. >> So I'm really excited. Our clubs are
00:28:26
mostly led by our kids and so for instance my kid is co-leading a writing club. She's really into writing.
00:28:35
She's writing her own book. Her friend is also writing a book. And these girls
00:28:40
really went all out. So, they created lesson plans for six weeks. They created Google Slides. They created homework
00:28:47
that the kids have to upload. I'm like, "Hey, what kind of club is this?" But we
00:28:51
also have a crochet club. We have a Lego club. We have an improv club. And so, and we also have like silent book
00:28:59
reading for our kids who, you know, at the end of the day are over stimulated. So, it is so nice that they are able to
00:29:06
create a space and like acknowledge this is what they need at the end of the day.
00:29:10
And we also have a book club that isn't silent. Um, and then you like we have
00:29:15
like a spirituality uh club where they're just talking and like doing vision boards and manifestations.
00:29:22
And so it is really cool. And like my kid's 13, but then we have another kid
00:29:28
who's 17 and another kid who's nine that are leading these clubs in such a great
00:29:32
way. And I love that that is truly what a child experience looks like, especially in a community space. I think
00:29:39
what's cool too is like homeschooling also provides kids such an opportunity
00:29:44
to do whatever the things that they're passionate about, right? So whether that's music or writing or uh you
00:29:50
mentioned all the other clubs that you guys have, the improv club and things like that, it's like that's so cool that
00:29:55
those things are like you guys are building you you have built already a time for them to focus and have those
00:30:01
things. Um, and then, you know, instead of it just being like, hey, you do this in your free time after school is done,
00:30:08
you know, it's like, no, like here's a here's a set time where you can actually
00:30:12
build and create something that's uniquely yours. Even like the commitment piece, right? We have some amazing
00:30:18
parents who are truly bought into the mission and who are dedicated. And so, I can't thank them enough because it's not
00:30:25
all my doing because without them, we wouldn't have a space for kids. Um, so
00:30:29
in most of I would say this was probably the first year we've been going on for
00:30:34
three years and this was the first semester that we actually lost someone um and it was just well we lost two
00:30:42
families and but other than that our families aren't leaving and even in the
00:30:46
summer they're committed. We don't offer any kind of summer programming, but even
00:30:50
in the summer, there's a big pool of just like, let's hang out. And it's not
00:30:53
just the kids, it's the families that truly want to build community with each
00:30:57
other. And I like that this space was has allowed them to find their people in that way.
00:31:01
>> The other part of this that you mentioned was the field trips aspect. Um, and so talk to me a little bit about
00:31:07
that and like where where have you guys gone? Where are you guys planning to go?
00:31:10
What kind of what constitutes a field trip? Um, and you know, I don't know, are you guys where are you guys looking
00:31:16
to go? >> Oh, so we we are museum regulars and so we have three really cool museums here
00:31:25
in San Antonio. So every time there's a new exhibit, we are there. Um, we also
00:31:30
have a really great relationship with um, a theater here that used to be a black theater. Um, and well, I think it
00:31:38
stemmed from being like the only it was I think it was the library the library that only black people could go to at
00:31:46
that time and then it like transition to a school I believe and now it's a theater and um they offer matinea shows
00:31:54
and so a lot of times the shows that are coming to the theater they'll offer
00:31:59
daytime views of it and for a while it was only public schools and then we were like hey don't forget about us
00:32:04
homeschoolers and so we've been able to see some really cool shows. Um, we also
00:32:09
have a larger theater that we attend. Um, and like Black Violin is coming and so we're able to see Black Violin for
00:32:17
free because they have student matinea shows as well. And we also we're in San
00:32:21
Antonio so we have like the Alamo and we're looking at it and seeing it from a
00:32:25
decolonized perspective. Um, and then we go to, you know, Amazon field trips. We
00:32:31
also go to the Toyota plant. We go to like a gaming center, park days. Um, we stay pretty active. I mean, last year we
00:32:41
did close to 70 field trips and that includes like park days and those theater visits. Um, and again, I think
00:32:47
it's us trying to respond to those stereotypes of like homeschoolers not being socialized. And I'm like, huh? And
00:32:54
I I'm not one of those people who truly get annoyed by that and they're like,
00:32:58
are they going to be socialized? I know what I'm doing for my kids. I know the
00:33:01
experiences that they're having. But I've also met the kids who have not
00:33:05
been socialized. And I don't want to dismiss or diminish their experience, whether they're going
00:33:12
through it now or, you know, they're adults and that was their experience. Um, and it is truly heartbreaking
00:33:18
because it's like almost like a fear of the world or fear of conversations and
00:33:23
not being able to or like what my my mom would say is like they act like they've
00:33:28
never been been anywhere. And you see the difference of kids who have not been socialized, but also there's, you know,
00:33:34
whether they're Christian or secular, secular, progressive, there are parents
00:33:38
who were doing great things with their kids who are being intentional with their time to make sure they are
00:33:43
socialized. >> Field trips was one of my favorite things as a kid. We would go Ronald
00:33:47
Reagan Library was not super far away. Obviously, presidential libraries tend to do a lot of like historical
00:33:53
reenactments and so um that was always interesting. Um, but also we had like an art center that provided us. I I don't
00:34:01
know if we got discounted tickets or not, but we would go see a lot of theater production. Saw a lot of
00:34:05
Shakespeare. Um, oh, I got to go see this was cool. Mary Poppins in theater and Dick Van Dyke showed up. So, that
00:34:12
was >> Oh, that is cool. [laughter] >> Yeah. And he even went on st he did the
00:34:18
the crazy legs like he went out and danced on stage at one point. He wasn't in the theater production. He just was
00:34:23
there to to enjoy it. But they had him come out on stage and say hello to everybody and um Yeah. And he gave us
00:34:29
the famous Dick Van Djk like leg wobbles that he he does in every movie thing that he's ever been in. So
00:34:35
>> yeah, that is a cool experience. >> Yeah. As you were talking about that, I
00:34:38
was like remembering all these like cool field trips and park days that we did that Yeah. just over time they get they
00:34:44
get buried a little bit. Like when we're talking to like neighborhood kids and
00:34:47
just like when I'm going to visit friends who have kids in public school, you know, it's or my friends who are
00:34:53
educators, they're like, "We only go to one field trip a semester or one field
00:34:56
trip a year." Um, and I'm like, "Oo, that's how my kids experience."
00:35:01
[laughter] So I And that's when we're looking at comparison from like public schools and
00:35:07
and then you get the comments like, "Well, it's not always about having
00:35:10
fun." I'm like, "No, my kids work hard during the week. They deserve a field
00:35:14
trip Friday and and that's what we choose to do. So, quit judging. >> No, I I love that. One of the things
00:35:19
that you talked about on uh a semi-reent episode of your podcast uh the sex secular homeschool revolution podcast.
00:35:26
You guys should go check it out. Plug that liking Ashley. Yeah. So, little little pre-plug uh here. Um but um you
00:35:35
talked about how you're you set up your home school week and how it's still a
00:35:38
5day week. However, you only do like three or four days of school and then Friday is always a field trip. Is that
00:35:45
right? Is do I have that right? >> So, it is controversial. We do I mean especially if you're coming from
00:35:51
traditional education and you're looking at it from that lens. Uh, my kids do
00:35:56
three days a week and they do co-op, which I count as an educational day because they take some amazing classes.
00:36:03
And then we do field trip Fridays, which most I mean whether you're going to a
00:36:07
museum or a science experience or just a park day, there's learning to be had in
00:36:12
all of those experiences, right? Um, but people get so pressed when I say they only do school for three days. But I'm
00:36:21
like, those three days, we go hard. we we really take deep dives in whatever subjects we're focused on. Um be because
00:36:29
we enjoy being together and we enjoy doing the educational experience. Now that having three kids was hard because
00:36:36
you're like boopping around to see where everyone's at. Um but now my oldest does
00:36:40
attend micro school two days a week as well as co-op and field trip Friday. Um, and part of it is because I didn't want
00:36:50
to teach the upper level classes. That would have been hard or difficult. So, I was like, "Okay, let's outsource it."
00:36:56
Um, but you're in the the micro schools only from like 10 to 10 to about 3 and
00:37:03
so we get to see her when she comes home. But um yeah, it is 3 days a week and we're very intentional about the
00:37:10
time when we are locked in and and sometimes we do, you know, outings during the week. It's not that we stay
00:37:17
at home, but we make sure that our education is a priority. >> That was going to be my next question
00:37:23
was about the micro school because when we chatted before you brought that up and so talk to me about the micro school
00:37:28
cuz I know your obviously your daughter attends there, but you're kind of involved in the planting of that and it
00:37:33
seems to be doing well. So talk to me a little bit what what is a microschool for people who don't know and then like
00:37:39
what does that look like in in your homeschool community and how are you guys using that like tied to your
00:37:45
homeschool community? >> Okay, so we did open an extra or an extension of our homeschooling co-op to
00:37:52
a micro school for seventh grade and up. Um when again I I don't lead the micro
00:38:00
school, I focus on the community and our co-op. my co-founders do focus on so we're there's three of us um I'm the
00:38:08
community person we have one who focuses on like the branding and organization then we have our educational component
00:38:15
and so our educational person shout out to Kia she leads our micro school and when we were having conversations at
00:38:23
just like a gathering um a lot of the parents were like whoa high school's around the corner what are we going to
00:38:28
do and so that is kind of how the conversation of the micro school opened and I know for a lot of micro schools
00:38:36
the struggle is finding people to be in the seats. Um we have the people our community in general when we're looking
00:38:44
at how many attend um our field trips we're close to about 250 active families. And so when we were looking to
00:38:53
open the micro school, we're like, "Oh, we have the bodies now. Let's organize
00:38:57
the different classes, find the teachers, we have the space as well." And so currently we have 16 or no 17
00:39:08
kids in our micro school and they take um a language art or English comp one. They take uh chemistry. Some of the kids
00:39:17
take chemistry, some of them take biology. and for um his they take history as well. And then we don't offer
00:39:26
a math class, so to speak, because all of the kids have different math learning styles. And so in response to that, we
00:39:33
offer a tutor to come in um both of those days. And so as the kids need help or support, he's able to see where
00:39:41
they're at. Um and they bring their math books or they log onto their math curriculum. And like my kid does CTC
00:39:46
math, she takes her math notebook, she works through it, and if she needs support, she asks the tutor.
00:39:52
>> That's super cool because like I know that that was when I got to high school,
00:39:56
my parents had a similar kind of realization of like there are certain subjects that they were like, we're just
00:40:01
not capable of teaching these things, science being one of them. Uh, you know, they they can understand kind of what's
00:40:08
going on, but they were not like big science nerds. And so they were just like really nervous about it.
00:40:13
Thankfully, we have another homeschool mom who she has a degree in I want to say chemistry, but she has a science
00:40:19
background. And so, she was like, "Look, send all the kids to my house. You know,
00:40:23
they'll read the textbook at home. They come, we do all the experiments. I can
00:40:26
explain how everything is operating, what's going on, uh everything they need
00:40:30
to know uh from like a you know, from a from an adult." And uh and then it worked out the same way. Like my mom,
00:40:38
English major in in college. She wanted to be an English teacher and so she would do all of like our literature
00:40:44
classes. And so she taught us about like reading the great reading some like we Shakespeare. We were read like Beaowolf
00:40:52
and Robinson Caruso and like all these very classical books, Grapes of Wrath, like all these classical books and then
00:40:59
we would have discussions around them and she taught us how to like how to do that. Um which was cool. And so to your
00:41:05
point of like parents not always feeling like capable to teach those higher levels like it is very important to find
00:41:12
those people because otherwise your kid could easily get left behind in those subjects if you're like we don't know if
00:41:17
this is right or wrong. >> Right. Well, and to add to your point again as I'm jump I jumped into
00:41:22
homeschooling, people didn't realize that or I've not all the people I've
00:41:27
come across, but there had been some popcorns in there where they did not realize homeschoolers actually bought
00:41:34
curriculum and I was like, wait, what? They can even buy the curriculum the schools
00:41:38
have. there a homeschooling parents you can do it in a cheap affordable budget friendly
00:41:44
way but a lot of homeschoolers go hard and buy all the manipulatives all the curric and like sometimes before you
00:41:50
know it you're looking at you know $1,200 and you're like wait a minute but
00:41:55
it's because there's that um investment in your kids's education and I'm like no
00:41:59
a lot of there are some who don't use anything right and they do their own journey but a lot of homeschooling
00:42:05
parents truly invest in their kids' education and they do buy curriculum Um,
00:42:08
and they do piece curriculum together. >> No, for sure. I mean, I think that the
00:42:14
there's been a little bit of an uptick in the talk around like unschooling, right? And kids like basically kind of
00:42:20
choosing their own, well, when are my kid starts to ask me questions about that? That's what I'm going to teach
00:42:24
them this instead of kind of the traditional school aspect of like, hey, around this age, you should be learning
00:42:29
this type of material. Um, and so I think there is that stereotype like you're talking about of like sometimes
00:42:36
thinking that homeschool families are like, yeah, not buying any curriculum and just kind of like letting the kids
00:42:40
and decide what they want to learn, which is I I would say it's not an effective way to teach, but that that's
00:42:48
my personal opinion. >> I'm going to join you on that. >> Controversial take there.
00:42:52
>> I think it's controversial, too. Like I Okay, I will say again, I've been in the
00:42:57
homeschooling space for many years. is I'm a very talkative person, you know,
00:43:00
do the things and I I can point I share this scenario with everyone. I've met unschoolers quite a bit and
00:43:12
there's only been two of the like lots of home unschoolers that I've met that
00:43:16
were like doing it in a way that was inspiring, but they also had a plethora of resources. Their finances were not,
00:43:24
you know, I wouldn't even say like middle class. they were living well and they were able like the kid wanted to
00:43:29
learn about you know micro what is it marine biology and so they were like oh I'll take you here and we're going to
00:43:35
learn all the things and scuba diving and we're going to go live was it Jamaica for like you know six months so
00:43:41
that they could take a true deep dive into it right then the other people that I've met and again I could be
00:43:47
generalizing it had been >> it it almost it felt almost like educational neglect in a lot of ways and
00:43:54
people might be upset at me for saying that, but then when I'm looking at threads and look listening to podcasts
00:43:59
like yours and people who had a genuine like unschooling experience, it's very
00:44:05
rare that you hear people talk very positively about it. And so it's like, okay, I do appreciate and I would say my
00:44:11
personal homeschooling style is eclectic where I'm like, okay, you really want to
00:44:15
go into Greek mythology. We're going to pull all the books. We're going to watch
00:44:18
a lot of documentaries about it. We're going to explore where it comes from.
00:44:22
We're going to look at the map, but that's more of like a unit study for me,
00:44:26
right? But and again, that's pulling pieces and taking that deep dive. And I'm going to ask you to subtract the
00:44:31
year of 978 to now and looking at what that subtraction looks like and stuff. And so I struggle with like the
00:44:40
unschooling concept and I have watched it and I think especially for kids of color, they don't necessarily have that
00:44:45
privilege. I think when you're white and you're unschooling a lot and if you if
00:44:49
you come from a very privileged family, you have like a backup plan, a safety net in a lot of ways. And when you're
00:44:56
looking at how you're unschooled, it looks innovative. But when you have a kid of color who can't read necessarily
00:45:02
or process math, that that doesn't that is that's not looked up as the same way,
00:45:08
right? And they're not going to be, "Oh, you're so inspiring. Oh, you're so
00:45:11
innovative." It's like, "Oh, this kid has a huge deficit in life." Um, and I'm
00:45:15
not saying that white homeschoolers don't have that, but it is looked at very differently when we're looking at,
00:45:20
you know, kids of color versus white kids in those uh in those lanes. >> I I agree and I'm thankful my my mom, I
00:45:28
think, had a similar teaching style to you of like, you know, my kid expresses an interest in this thing. Let's deep
00:45:34
dive into that, right? Like, let's lean heavily into that. Like, you brought up
00:45:38
Greek mythology. I love Greek mythology. My mom bought me a bunch of books. She took me to the library. She was like,
00:45:42
"Let's learn everything we could possibly learn about Greek mythology and
00:45:46
um how cool it is." And I still to this day I'm like I'm huge fan. I love that
00:45:52
knowledge. You know, I talk about pirates a lot. I was a kid. I was I loved pirates. I learned every pirate
00:45:58
name under the sun. Um I knew all the flags. I like can tell you so much about pirates. Um it wasn't just Blackbeard
00:46:06
and Jack Sparrow sailing the seven seas. >> Well, that's all I know. >> And hey, that's okay. Um but um it it
00:46:14
just is like one of those things where I'm like I look at it and I still to this day I tell my friends I'm like I'm
00:46:18
so thankful that anytime we were interested in something you guys were just like yeah let's go let's learn all
00:46:22
that we can learn about that um as deep as we can and it's like cool let's you
00:46:27
know and then we'd get you know we'd get over it and then they'd be like okay
00:46:30
what's the next thing let's you know but they provided us areas of of history and
00:46:34
areas of other learning that was like touch on those things and then we would express an interest in it and it would
00:46:40
it would go from there. So, >> well, and that's a little bit Okay, so I'm excited or I'm happy that your
00:46:46
parents did that, but when I'm looking at these new content creators, and I love that people are diving in and
00:46:52
sharing this part of homeschooling, but I have a huge issue with these new homeschooler, I don't even Yeah, mostly
00:46:59
new. Um, where they're like, we went to the grocery store and we did math and
00:47:03
this is their school for the day. While I appreciate that experience and that they know how to count their change
00:47:09
backwards, I don't think that and then they're like, "They socialized with the
00:47:13
checker and they socialized with the stalker." Okay, that's a that's an everyday life
00:47:20
skill, right? To learn how to budget for your groceries. I mean, my my parents did that to me and I wasn't a
00:47:26
homeschooler at that time. Um, so it's a lot of those videos. I'm like, "No,
00:47:31
you're making homeschooling look crazy." And then I remember seeing a lady whose
00:47:37
kid was like adding like the pounds of the apples or multiplying and she was she was like, "Oh yeah, but anyway, the
00:47:44
scenarios I can't remember specifically, but the kid was wrong." And she was
00:47:48
like, "Look, they're learning." And I'm like, "Oh, you you filmed that and put
00:47:51
it on a public platform." I'm like, "You're making homeschooling look bad.
00:47:55
Stop." >> No, I agree with you. I think there there is that level of like it is one
00:48:00
thing to Yeah. put your kid in the world, teach them real life skills. You know, I math I thrived in geometry
00:48:07
because we were we were building a house at the time or we're working on our
00:48:10
house and and so like knowing how to like buy paint to paint on the walls. That's a valuable math skill that is an
00:48:15
everyday skill that I think most people should have. But I also need to know how
00:48:19
to solve for the unknown, you know, and so to your point, it's like there's more
00:48:23
than just the practical stuff that we have to know as people. uh whether you use it in your everyday life or not,
00:48:29
sometimes it's just like important to kind of know. I don't know. I I'm the
00:48:33
weird fact guy in my family. Like we sit down and like I'm kind of a I'm a little
00:48:37
dangerous at trivia night because they're like they're like, "Why do you
00:48:40
know this?" And I'm just like I don't know. It's fascinating on the internet
00:48:43
and I wanted to know, you know, it's like, you know, kind of a thing. And I still view that like as that's kind of
00:48:48
how I view school, too, is I'm like, "You're going to learn a bunch of stuff
00:48:50
that you might not use every single day, but the day that you need it, it's going
00:48:54
to be there for you." >> Okay. So, what are your thoughts on people when they like even with um
00:48:59
deschooling and people not understanding that it's necessary, but also that their
00:49:05
kids will genuinely start enjoying learning again? Um because I know I hear like, "Oh, they'll never just find an
00:49:14
interest. All they want to do is watch TV and video games." I truly think kids
00:49:18
are inherently genius. We just live in a world that doesn't uh especially here in
00:49:23
the United States accommodate kids in their interests and we can see that now like the evolution of like McDonald's
00:49:29
doesn't have a playscape anymore right we don't give kids a lot of opportunity
00:49:34
to play but play leads to learning and so I mean do you believe kids can lead up to their own journey of learning and
00:49:43
and joy of learning >> I think so but I think like I said I think that it's also a responsibility of
00:49:49
the parents and the guardians to like provide opportunity for them to explore things that they wouldn't normally
00:49:55
explore. And so, you know, like push them to do something that okay, yeah, maybe this isn't really my thing, but
00:50:02
like like for instance, okay, so my dad is a he he does carpentry work. That's
00:50:07
his hobby and he's good at it. I'm not a carpenter. I have never enjoyed it, but
00:50:12
I know how to do it because he was like, "Hey, come help me with this project."
00:50:16
And I have a respect for it. I know I know how to use a table saw. I know how to build stuff. I can do it. It's not my
00:50:23
thing. It's not what I get a lot of joy out of. But they exposed me to things
00:50:26
like that where it was like, okay, like, do you have an interest in this? Would you want to pursue that? Um, to your
00:50:32
point about kids needing spaces to play and to learn things. Um, a couple years ago I worked at a toy store and we were
00:50:40
a basically a secondhand Lego store and I love Legos. Um, [laughter] and we had so so we sold already built
00:50:49
models. We had a big table with just loose pieces. Um, you could buy brand new box stuff, retired things, all kinds
00:50:56
of different fun Lego building things. But what was so cool is kids would come and we had these big bins of Legos and
00:51:03
they would just build stuff and we would just encourage them, hey, what are you building? What are you What are you
00:51:07
interested in? What are you trying to make? Uh, same with like the little characters, the minifigures. You know,
00:51:11
we had a whole table that was just pieces for those. And they would come and they would create the most unique
00:51:16
stories. We had build competitions. We come and, you know, build whatever you want, right? It could be anything in the
00:51:22
world. Um, we'd throw birthday parties. You build race cars. Look like Pinewood
00:51:26
Derby cars. Uh, and we'd race them down this track and and those were so much
00:51:30
fun. It was just kind of building this creativity space and trying to tell stories and try to do things. And, um,
00:51:35
and there were a couple kids in there that would come frequently and they would always tell me about like, "Yeah,
00:51:39
I want to grow up to be an engineer. I want to grow up to like be a Lego master or I'm trying to design cars or whatever
00:51:46
it is. Like and I'm like this is is a tool that is getting used to to kind of
00:51:51
further that experience if that makes sense. And so I just I appreciated their parents who would bring them and and be
00:51:56
just let them play, let them be kids. And yeah, sometimes it was rowdy and sometimes we had to say, hey, tone it
00:52:01
down just a little bit, you know, but that's that's more a teaching a kid,
00:52:05
hey, this is, you know, a public space and, you know, there's other people and
00:52:09
we don't want to disturb them totally, but you know, you're still good to play.
00:52:12
You know, we're not in there saying, no, don't don't touch it. Don't, you know,
00:52:16
you can look, but don't touch. That's not what we're saying. We're let's play
00:52:19
with these things together. >> What I'm taking from your answer is as long as the parents provide access to
00:52:24
the learning and play environment that they can thrive. But it falls on the responsibility of the parent to and also
00:52:31
what I learned from your comment is also that there's growth and discomfort. Your
00:52:34
kid might not love it automatically, but they might not know that they do love it
00:52:39
without you giving them, you know, they need you to give them the exposure. >> I do also think because I've also had a
00:52:46
number of conversations with people who did not have pretty much any schooling. um one one of my episodes with Alyssa.
00:52:54
Shout out to Alyssa. Like her mom really didn't teach her much aside from like
00:52:58
here's how to be a good house wife. And that's not what Alyssa is doing today.
00:53:02
She had to eventually get to a point where she had an interest in something and that became like understanding how
00:53:09
the human body works and she wanted to become an educator because she was denied an education for a lot of intents
00:53:15
and purposes. So I do think that that's also an aspect. I do think people can come back around to
00:53:21
being like, "No, I want to learn something. I want to have a skill." I
00:53:24
mean, that's I think that's kind of how we're hardwired as human beings, right?
00:53:28
We're like, we we're meant to have purpose. We're meant to do something
00:53:31
with our lives. Um, it's finding what that thing is. And so, you can either nurture that and and encourage that as a
00:53:38
as a kid or sometimes it's just when you're an adult, you get to a point
00:53:42
where you're like, "Okay, now's now I'm going to do that." It's never too late,
00:53:45
in my opinion, to to find that like purpose in your life. No, I completely agree. I know I'm a person who
00:53:51
continuously loves to learn and evolve and grow. And I think that's how I've
00:53:56
looked at my own journey with like podcasting and next it's going to be video editing and and I'm constantly
00:54:02
reading books and watching different lectures, attending different lectures because it's exciting for me to grow and
00:54:09
I never want to be a stagnant person. So I think with like Alyssa, she's I think
00:54:14
that's part of her journey as well. Oh yeah, 100%. She Yeah, she's not a
00:54:19
stagnant person. I'll tell you that right now. But I do want Yeah. So like let's talk a little bit about what
00:54:25
you're doing outside like social media, your podcast, like what who is it for?
00:54:31
What what got what made what clicked the thing in your brain where you're like,
00:54:34
"Okay, I need to make this. I need to put this out into the world." >> Again, when I was diving into
00:54:38
homeschooling and then figuring out my journey to secular progressive homeschooling, um again, there wasn't a
00:54:44
lot of resources. it was already limited resources for secular stuff and um and shout out to Blair oversee the secular
00:54:53
um Facebook group. I actually got to meet her at a conference and she was so inspiring. Um I met her this summer but
00:54:59
again that was still very limited and so as I'm creating resources that I'm
00:55:03
finding my community and we're talking things through I'm like we we should be
00:55:08
taking up space. Um, and so that's how I ventured into my podcast, Secular Homeschool Revolution. Um, and I talk
00:55:16
about my overall journey. I talk about things that we're using. I'm talking
00:55:19
about different perspectives. So, like a really popular episode um, happened last
00:55:24
week about our homeschoolers dismantling public education um, when we're looking
00:55:31
at public education being dismantled. And I had a conversation with a friend. And I did post about it on Tik Tok about
00:55:39
her pointing fingers at me um for advertising homeschooling and what my homeschooling life looks like. Um you
00:55:46
can find me on Secular Homeschool or Secular Revolution Mama on Tik Tok and I'm Secular Homeschool
00:55:53
Revolution on Instagram and I talk through my thoughts on the podcast because I'm like, you've never mentioned
00:55:59
the politics around education. You've never talked about, you know, marginalized communities in education.
00:56:04
You've never talked about the policy makers, but you want to point your finger at me. So, let's take a deep dive
00:56:10
in statistics. Let's take a deep dive in the impacts of public education and it
00:56:14
has had on BIPO kids and queer kids and sped kids because we just saw a lot of the defunding or defunding in public
00:56:22
education, not just here in Texas, but across the country. But again, you don't
00:56:26
post, you don't talk about that. Um, you're doing that with me. And as someone who's always going to be an
00:56:32
advocate for kids, I write the letters. I show up to the protest. I'm at some of
00:56:37
my my local school district board meetings. Um because while this not everybody can homeschool, right? It just
00:56:45
not everyone can fit make it fit in that way. So I'm like, well, it's still my
00:56:50
responsibility to look out for my neighbor's kids. >> Um but I don't see you at those same
00:56:54
meetings in the district you work at. So what what are you doing besides pointing
00:56:58
your finger at me? >> Yeah. I'm having those conversations and I'm not a traditional podcaster in the
00:57:03
sense where I'm like, oh, we're going to take a deep dive into, you know, math
00:57:07
with confidence because I feel like there's a lot of resources for that. Um,
00:57:10
but I am having the conversations um that I think I'm saying the quiet part out loud. That's to be honest that's
00:57:19
what drew me into your podcast to begin with was because as someone who one I was a decade out of
00:57:25
homeschooling I hadn't aside from like talking to my parents about it and like
00:57:29
every now and then seeing old homeschool friends and we would talk about it like
00:57:32
I wasn't deep diving into understanding the background of curriculums I had used
00:57:37
or what was happening now in the homeschool world and um and then in 2020 I had bosses who all of a sudden they
00:57:44
their little kids were be having to be homeschooled and they were like asking me questions and I was like I don't know
00:57:49
like it's been so long. Um but it but your show has been super informative because like you Yeah, of course I can
00:57:58
find all the content I want around like let's deep dive into the specific curriculum and you know walk through it.
00:58:02
That's great. But you're talking about some of the philosophies that go behind
00:58:06
it again like you were mentioning going out and meeting with like policy makers and taking a stand for what we think the
00:58:12
country should look like and things like that. I'm all for that. Like I think
00:58:17
that that's huge instead of us continually pointing fingers at well our education system is broken. Whose fault
00:58:23
is that? Is it the teachers fault? Is it parents' fault? It's who whose fault is
00:58:27
it? Maybe it's a combination of everything. I don't I don't know. But we
00:58:32
need to be showing up. We need to be putting our voices out there. And so again, I think that's great that not
00:58:37
only, you know, even as someone who has decided you're going to homeschool your
00:58:40
kids, you're going to keep them at home. you're you're doing your micro school,
00:58:43
you have your co-ops, you're doing your thing, you can still go advocate for
00:58:46
other people's kids and giving them the best experience hopefully possible. Um
00:58:51
because yeah, I mean I know Texas, Tennessee, I live in Tennessee now. Our school systems, we're not we're not far
00:58:56
up that list from we're at the very bottom unfortunately. >> We are too. We are too.
00:59:01
>> Not a good feeling. Um, and I know public school teachers here and and I
00:59:05
hear I've talked to them about their struggle and it's it's not easy and I
00:59:08
feel bad for them and and like what can it's meeting those people and talking to
00:59:13
them and asking them what can we do? How can we help help you and advocate for you? So, I appreciate what you're doing,
00:59:19
Ashley. >> Thank you. And I just want to add this last thing. I think what makes my
00:59:22
community with our homeschooling group so successful is that we have the open conversations and talk about how can I
00:59:29
support you? What are your needs? Um, and like my favorite event is we do these community swaps where we're
00:59:33
swapping curriculum, clothes, toys, small appliances. Um, because I'm a firm
00:59:38
believer in mutual aid and I want to braid that into our community. But most of all, I think our parents feel heard.
00:59:44
And when you're looking at why did you choose to homeschool, our parents weren't being heard in public school?
00:59:50
And I've only met a handful of parents in our group who were like, I knew I was
00:59:54
destined to homeschool. And a lot of us were pushed into it. Um, and it was because we were not being heard. So, if
01:00:00
we're looking and talking to policy makers and teachers and principles and superintendent, you're asking why people
01:00:05
are leaving. It's because their voice is being silenced. >> I think that's great, too. It's a great
01:00:12
reminder, too, that like as humanity, we are meant to live in community. And so,
01:00:16
also hearing that your community is doing more than just like helping with schools. We're they're helping each
01:00:20
other. You're filling the gaps. You're being you're socializing with each
01:00:23
other. Like, we're meant to live that. That's just how humanity is. can't
01:00:28
really deny it whe whether you're secular, whether you're Christian, like
01:00:31
you just look at history like humans are meant to live in community with each other, right? And so I think that that's
01:00:36
like amazing what you're doing because I know that for me like it it's great to
01:00:40
know that there's other communities out there that are supporting each other cuz
01:00:43
I know that for me that was a huge part of what made me a successful homechool case is the fact that I had community. I
01:00:49
had friends. I know my mom had friends who helped her through things. And so that is massive. And so the fact that
01:00:56
you're building that in Texas, amazing. Uh I will continue to say all of the
01:01:00
good things about Ashley, what you're doing is absolutely phenomenal. Um so to
01:01:05
you, >> keep it [laughter] up. >> Is there anything else we haven't
01:01:09
touched on that you think is important that we need to talk about? >> Um no. I just am really excited to be
01:01:15
here and I'm excited that homeschooling is expanding, but not in the expense of
01:01:20
public school. And I just want to be clear that a lot of especially from my community we are support we do support
01:01:28
public education. We do not want it to go we want you know to have less censorship in schools. We want updated
01:01:35
curriculums. I know for me I don't want my state to be at the bottom of the education list because then that makes
01:01:41
makes it a level of distrust with the type and quality of education my kids are getting. So, I'm like, I want it to
01:01:46
be better, but I do not want it to be dismantled in any way. >> Same. Well, Ashley, thank you for coming
01:01:53
on the Ex Homeschoolers Club, even though you're current. I guess I I guess I should say you're part of the
01:01:57
homeschooler club. Uh, but you know, someday you'll be part of the exhomeschooler club with us for sure.
01:02:03
>> I appreciate it. >> And of course, of course. And um, all of the links to all of Ashley's stuff is
01:02:09
going to be down in the description, in the show notes, all those types of things. If you enjoyed this
01:02:13
conversation, do all the internet things. Like and subscribe and leave a five stars and leave us comments. Um, if
01:02:18
you want to hear more from Ashley, if you got questions for her, one, you can reach out to her on social media, you
01:02:23
can reach out to me, exhib, okay? Let me know. and go check out her podcast for sure because she answers a
01:02:39
lot of the questions that I had on that show and it's just like phenomenal. So
01:02:44
once again, Ashley, thank you again for coming on the show. It's been a pleasure
01:02:47
having you. I'm looking forward to seeing everything you guys do in the future with what you're doing and um
01:02:53
yeah, so until next time, we'll see you. Peace. [music] >> [music]