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well hello hello hello welcome back to the ex- homeschoolers club uh I am of course your host Jacob Gooden um back
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again with my wonderful lovely friend an and Lee we uh we're just talking about
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how we have known each other for going on 12 years at this point um and uh we've been trying to got to backtrack
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and figure out uh yeah some things but uh we're going to continue to discuss it
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while recording so anly welcome to the show it's great to have you hi I'm so
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happy to be here like I said we've known each other for like 12ish years um I we met for Mrs
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yip's uh writing class so shout out Mrs Yip and I think we did two years of that
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class together maybe yeah it must have been two years I think I yeah I went to public school after that so don't tell
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anybody but yeah I left well we'll get into that we'll get into that you went
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to the dark side um I did but um so I before Mrs yip's class I don't remember you from any homeschool
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anything and that's not to say maybe our path had crossed before that but give me
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the breakdown of like being a homeschool kid how long were you homeschooled you just said you went to public school for
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some of it like give me the give me the rundown yeah so I mean I went to a private elementary school um which is it
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was like a wal dwarf Elementary School which is kind of I mean it's tangential
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to homeschooling they like focus on liberal arts um and I kind of hated that school and so at fifth grade I think it
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must have been fifth grade um I started homeschooling my Mom hated Public Schools so she was just like we're gonna
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do anything but um put you in public school so homeschool from fifth grade through sopore year of high school
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um I mean I think homeschooling I mean home so different now but it's kind of
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like an Antiquated term because I think like homeschooling doesn't mean you're
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at home all the time which I think is a huge I don't know misconception about it
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um but yeah was homeschooled G sophomore year and then I wrote my parents a letter and I was like I would like to go
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to public school so I went to public school for two years at the end of high school and that was kind of insane but
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I'm glad that I did that in the end I think it's a good experience yeah so okay first of all why a letter
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and then and then secondly what was that change like was it I mean you like you said You' already kind of gone to
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some private public school kind of environment before you had been in a classroom before but yeah okay letter
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and then and then what was the shift like I mean I wrote a letter because I think I I mean I don't particularly love
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talking in most environment in most environments um hey it's on you for having me on this show okay um but yeah
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I wrote them a letter because I think I wanted to like have a very concise way of explaining why I wanted to go to
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public school um and my dad was always Pro public school and so it was really it was really just kind of for my mom
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but um I think the letter just I don't even remember now but I think it just
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kind of said that like I was writing a lot when I was 13 or 14 and I was like I can't write about high school
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experiences because I don't even know what a locker room looks like I don't
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know what walking down the hallway looks like I don't know what having five minutes before class looks like um and
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so I felt like that was just really lacking and all my friends went to like the high school um by my house and I was
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like I know people it's not going to be a big deal so yeah I mean the transition
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was it was a lot I mean there's a lot of busy work in high school that you don't
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have in homeschooling and I think that's kind of the main I mean that's the main
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draw to homeschooling as an idea I think for me um but I think it it was great because you're around a lot of people
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and in homeschooling you're around some people but there I in my experience like
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it was from a lot of different areas so it would be like what I mean it was like
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you and that class was like a specific English class click and then there was like a different click I had for like a
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science class and a different group I had for like an outdoors class and a different like extracurricular group and
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so it was just too too much for me I was like I just need like a Consolidated um friend group I guess
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yeah yeah I feel that that's that's an interesting way to put it well also I
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think you're different in it from the other guests that I've had on so far
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because most of the guests I've had on so far we all lived in Ventura ohigh area you did not live in that area and
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so yeah like you were separate from a lot of that group because because ation yeah and like um I
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mean you you slowly became integrated I mean especially you were friends with me
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Emily um and Colin uh but you know and I know you started coming to like the dances and stuff like that but uh but
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yeah I remember like if we wanted to go to something you were doing we had we to
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go quite a ways uh Thousand Oaks G Maria oh my God that's right you kind of went
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to a choir concert or something of mine that's crazy I about that we did yeah
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yeah Emily was like we're going to go do this we're going to go support her um
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and and she's like you're driving yeah yeah that she's like yeah Jacob you're going to come pick us all
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up um and we're gonna go do this thing so and we made it happen but Mrs Yip was
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there too shout out to Mrs y again um yes yeah I I guess the qu you might not know the answer to this but like how did
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you get tied into like Mrs yip's writing class then because I honestly I think I
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think my mom must have known someone in another class or heard about her through someone else um and I remember
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not wanting to go to that class because I'd heard that mrsf was kind of strict
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or scary about like grammar I don't I mean we had a band list of words right
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and that that list of words is still in my head to this day um so I was scared to go to that class I like didn't want
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to be forced into a classroom but I mean I think it was great I I mean we're still friends
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so yeah something worked out yeah know it's funny because yeah Mrs zep's class was so interesting because
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it was like it was a mix of like all kinds of different writing like I remember doing creative writing I
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remember doing essay writing um that was very like researched um that was very researched um uh Wikipedia researched um
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on my end um but yeah the band the band Words List was always really interesting
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it was all words that we couldn't use in our papers we got dinged points for that
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um the uh the sentence openers that was a worksheet that was like fantastic for me because you know when you write so
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much it's like if you don't know what you're doing your sentences all start to
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sound the same right it's like I this he that you know and they they all kind of
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start in a similar pattern uh and so learning like oh okay here's how to start with this and here's like how to
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pose a question and here's like all those different things was super interesting it was something I used in
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college too uh I don't know about like I had that sheet just like plastered in my
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door DM room a print out yeah no seriously I like add it taped in my dorm room or my desk or
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something uh and I used it for all kinds of stuff and yeah and it I mean came in
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so clutch I had to write like a law paper at one point for entertainment industry and that was like you know it
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was my paper was more interesting than something else I mean it was still boring it's a law of paper but I was
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like okay I gotta I gotta fit in all this stuff that has been taught you know um I don't know but what a great way to
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meet I know that class was so fun yeah yeah and yeah that was I I feel like you and I didn't really get along at the
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beginning um I don't remember that I possible I mean I get along with anyone I feel we just kind of poked each
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other's buttons a little bit we just knew how to kind of like intentionally though yeah yeah yeah from a place of
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Love yeah totally um that's yeah uh anyway um but yeah I mean you slowly it was cool that
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I mean you became obviously we had a friend group from that class and then we ended up like doing stuff together and
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hanging out and you started coming to the dances um even though you Dan they were crazy that that was even those
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existed at all I mean I mean I I I mean ballroom dancing is one thing but like getting that many people together in one
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room to ballroom dance is crazy I'm interested because like like I said you were kind of an outsider to
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that group so like we all knew each other very like a lot of us had grown up together so like was it just really I
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don't know did it feel like oh my gosh these are the weirdo homeschool kids that like I like or was it like I don't
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know like what what was that like I guess I mean I think when you homeschool and like it depends on how your parents
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did it but like I think you learn how to code switch a lot um and I I mean I think that's one of the things that I
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learned that I still use obviously to this day would be like code switching between groups of people and like how
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you're interacting or talking with those groups of people um so I never thought
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that anybody was super weird but I think that I probably then like you know pulled the lever of like I'm going to be
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weirder when I'm with them or I'm going to be more homeschooled or I'm going to
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be more into ballroom dancing um I was always into BM dancing actually but but I mean bomom dancing in a group of
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people like that was insane um so I don't know I mean I didn't think you
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guys are weird I mean I'm pretty weird though so my judgment is is not great we were weird
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um you yeah you're being nice still are weird you know oh yeah no 100% so okay so you homeschooled through
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sophomore year going into High School junior year senior year mainly for kind of like that
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experience because you like you said in your in your letter you were like I need
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to understand what it's like to have a locker and be in a locker room um and
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all that kind of stuff but um what came what what came after high school was it College immediately did you take some
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time off like you know I went straight into college um okay yeah it was school for so many years I mean s 17 years I
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straight um and every time I've had a break I've realized that like there's
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there's so many other things outside of school and it's crazy to think that
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we're both kind of you know adults so to speak now but it's weird to think that
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we're adults like and think that it was 15 years ago is that like I was homeschooled like I don't even
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homeschooling isn't even a big part of my it's a big part of my identity but
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it's not a big part of my elevator pitch like when I meet people like do you
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still list off like that you were homeschooled when you're like laundry listing things you've done in your life
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not really I mean it's it's sometimes part of like it depends on the situation
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right um but it's yeah it's like one of those things things where it depends on the situation
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honestly um if I'm meeting somebody who is like a in a Homeschool Group obviously it's like yeah okay I'm GNA
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bring up that I was also a homeschool kid you know um but yeah if I'm meeting
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if I'm networking at an event or something like that it's not my go-to like oh I was a homes school kid it's
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not part of my identity I'm not ashamed of it in any way but I'm like I go more
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towards that like I'm a podcast editor I'm a producer I'm a Creator I'm you
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know I'm this I'm a that I manage these of things right that's more in line with
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like who I identify as currently um no that's an interesting question cuz yeah
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I do I mean doing the show now I'm kind of putting it more forward it's like hey
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this is a big part of who I was um but yeah but I this show was started mostly from the the selfish standpoint of I
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want to know what all of my friends are doing today because I think a lot of them are doing really cool stuff um and
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I just want to talk to them about it and hear about it and then in the process also reminisce about some stuff and then
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hear about their homeschool Journey like like we were talking about it's like I
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didn't really know that you went to school then you were homeschooled then you went back to school and then on to
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college it's like I didn't even know that because I knew you during the home
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school years that's about it you know yeah they're eras they're very distinct
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eras you know like if we get an eras toour it' be like super distinctive my school yes yes absolutely so okay so
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seven years in college wait no five years in college five years in college you said 17 years of school in total so
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five years of college was that just a bachelor's degree or did you end up doing like a
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master's doctorate I did did I did a master's um so I did four years of my
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undergrad and then a year um abroad but it was during covid so it was not really
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abroad um for my masters and that was just like I mean it was an English Lit so it's not I wouldn't say I'm like a
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master at anything uh just reading a lot and writing a lot but but yeah I mean it
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was it was nice during covid because like what else is I gonna do anyway yeah exactly the world shut down it's like
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yeah what do you might as well read get also a degree for it yeah exactly no that's so did you also did you get your
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undergrad in English as well yeah I double majored in English lit and public relations so like English Lit was like
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what I would have preferred to do only but like public relations was like the Practical I can get a job with this
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application so yeah but it's all writing yeah no exactly and no and you have to
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have that good you have to have the good combo of both right and uh yeah I I recently met
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uh a PR person that works with one of my clients and we met a while back and she's very good at what she does and uh
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we sat down and I was just like asking I was like well what do you do like kind of like what is your job and like how do
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you get your job and like all this stuff and she's like well you have to have a
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really good understanding of writing and I was like okay I'm out but I was like
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that's awesome like you know I I'm not I don't write that's not my thing that's
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not my specialty um sorry Mrs yep I I gave up on writing a long time ago but um yeah anyway but uh okay so PR and in
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English and then we were talking you kind of did some like brand strategy marketing type stuff after that um yeah
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for careerwise but like yeah so tell me a little bit about that and like what did that entail what that look like I
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mean right out of college I got a job at a brand strategy agency um and branding
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is I mean people always ask me what it is because they think it's like the Kardashians um but branding corporate
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branding more is like the step before marketing so we would be writing like how I would be writing how you
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communicate as a brand what you should say and how you should um like change what you say depending on the audience
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um so that was just very strategic writing and I think it came pretty naturally after PR because most of the
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pr stuff that I learned in internships or at school was was pretty it was pretty much strategic communication so
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um I mean I I love branding most of the work I do now for freelance is like copywriting um which is less interesting
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sometimes because it's less strategic um where it's less of like the part of a
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brand that stays there forever because it could be like a social media post or a blog post or whatever so but I don't
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know I mean all of it's strategic I think writing is very strategy driven and I think strategy is also very
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writing driven because if you can't write it you're not gonna be able to
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really say it um right yeah a lot of writing always a lot of writing no that's that's super cool because
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like I've worked with a couple Brands now who some have successfully launched
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and they tend to have that element of like coming up with the strategy behind the wording and the vision and all of
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those things um and then I've worked with some other brands who are just kind
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of like fly by the seat of their pants and they're like we'll figure it out as
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we go and six months down the line we're like screwed um yeah it's so inconsistent exactly so um yeah so for
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those listening if you are thinking about starting a brand uh either hire anly or invest in some good
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people um to help you kind of create that strategy around your brain because uh it will it will take you a lot
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farther than you think it also makes it easier when people like me come in who my job is more on the production side of
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like creating a podcast or creating social content or something like that it's a lot easier when you already have
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that guide those guidelines of like this is how we write this is the style all that kind of thing because otherwise I'm
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winging it and I'm doing it in my own voice and that's not in line with your
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BR is yeah anyway okay no that's I I love chatting about this stuff I I honestly like this
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is about 50% of the conversations I have with people at this point are around this type of stuff where it's like we
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got to sit down and strategize and like I am not the pr person to go to but you know you pick up things as you go along
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the lines it's like I've been doing this for five years now it's like you kind of
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pick up what works and what doesn't work at some point and so um it's just been yeah it's just an
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interesting thing where you just kind of I don't know I don't know if you ever
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have this with a client where you can sit down and you're just like you get it
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and it's very clear like what you want and how we can get you there and other
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people you're like this is going to be work to get you to that point yeah it's
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crazy when that happens you're kind it's like meeting someone and you're like I
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don't understand you at all like I don't even understand on surface level like
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what you are and then you get to know them and you're like don't know either
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this is this is really annoying like what am I supposed to do with this how are we supposed to be friends what do we
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have in common like nothing of course yeah yeah no it's funny I so in college
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the my I I majored in uh music business so entertainment business my goal was to
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manage bands manage creatives which is kind of weirdly what I do now anyways um it's just not with musicians it's with
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podcasters but what was crazy was working with musicians you realize I mean these people are like I was going
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to name my brand like head in the cloud Studios or head in the cloud something because it was just like these people
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who their head was in the clouds and they just like they are the idea they and they suffer from like uh shiny
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object syndrome right where it's like they see this thing and they're like go
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go go go go that's the thing and they pull it towards them uh right and then
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they get bored of it and then the next thing comes along and they you know go over here and it's like we have to hone
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you in we have to figure out how to do that and so um it's people like you who
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really can help with that because yeah just oh my God like dealing with those people's insane sometimes you're like
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yeah I don't know I've gotten offs out of meetings yeah exactly and I'm just
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like where's a pillow I'm gonna scream into it better the pillow than like at them
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so yeah absolutely um yeah no you got to learn to it takes a it takes a special person sometimes to to handle uh
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creative people um and you know create the the systematized steps basically I I tell people I'm like your job is to be
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creative and my job is to give you the framework to do it inside of um framewor are important yeah and if we can get
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there you're set you're gonna do really well um yeah so very cool well Okay so we've talked
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business and we talked some homeschooling um I have been just like the last couple days in prepping for you
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to to come on the show been like reminiscing about I don't know just things we did and like Adventures we
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went on and things like that and the one that always comes to my brain is the photo show in your backyard at the beach
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um where you and Emily you guys clearly knew what kind of you were doing um when
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it came to taking photos and Colin and I had no freaking clue what we were doing
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um some of those photos are hilarious to this day yes and they're going to get posted some
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of them as of recording some of them did get posted today uh with Emily's episode
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but more of them are going to get posted uh when this episode comes out as well because they're just hilarious and too
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good yeah I know you and Emily were really into photography are you still into photography is that a big part of
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stuff though I mean I was I'm I yes I think the reason I like photography is
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one it's very creative it's great all the reasons someone likes photography I
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think the other reason is I hate being photographed and so the best way to not be photographed is to literally pull out
00:22:08
a camera and be like I'm taking a picture of you and like so sorry but like I'm not going to be in the picture
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um so yeah I mean I I still take a ton of photos to this day I my camera roll is a mess um I was the vice president of
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USC's photo club and college which is a really random flex and very nerdy but
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but yeah but again it was all about that was all about like being behind the camera so I don't have to be in front of
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it I mean you know who likes being in front of the camera some people I know some people
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it's the creativ yeah I think why you and I get along so well is we are cut from a similar cloth of like yeah I I
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hate to say we're behind the scenes people but we kind of are the behind the
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scenes people that make we make the world turn um yeah we make things work come on yeah
00:23:04
exactly we're great exactly um so that's funny to hear that yeah I I don't blame
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you I don't like being on camera the fact that I'm doing this podcast now I
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mean it's been I know why couldn't it just be audio I mean yeah why not not to
00:23:21
roast format but I bought a microphone for this podcast to start a podcast in 2017 2017 201 18 2017 bought a podcast
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never used it sat in the corner didn't ever get used um for years and years and
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years have like prepped podcasts to go out like up to the point of recording and then it's just like never happened
00:23:43
and it's always been imposter syndrome that stopped me from doing it and uh yeah and then I finally hit publish and
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here we are um you know it's fun though I feel like doing that fun yeah forcing
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yourself to be in front of the camera and Stu exactly it's like yeah kind of putting a
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switch on it because you know what it takes to be on the other side of the camera right you know what it it should
00:24:06
be easy exactly theoretically it should Bey because you're like I know what goes
00:24:13
into it I know the head space I have to be in but it like oh my God it's so much
00:24:17
harder than so hard I ever thought it would be so um yeah oh my gosh anyway but um was okay
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are there any homeschool stories that as you've been kind of thinking about has
00:24:33
anything popped in your brain lately of like oh my gosh I forgot about this I blacked this out um story-wise of just
00:24:40
things that happened when you were a homeschool kid oh I mean there's so many
00:24:47
things I'm trying to think of one that has to do with you um I don't know a lot of the memories I
00:24:57
have of like you and Emily and Colin are just like hanging out and we're all in a big group and then I
00:25:06
felt like all of my interactions were still centered around like you Emily and Colin like I can remember specific
00:25:14
incidents of like looking at Emily and knowing we're thinking the same thing
00:25:18
about nobody else in the room but the four of us like it was a weird it was like a weird little click within a click
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and I have no idea why it was like that and it still feels like that to this day
00:25:28
like when I see Emily we just talk about and we talk about like nf's class it's
00:25:32
always just about the four of us and then we can't remember the names of anybody else in class which is insane no
00:25:38
same I like legitimately yeah no clue who anybody else was in that class besides the four
00:25:45
of us so I don't know what that is that's yeah yeah I was something that
00:25:50
came to mind recently was and I I want to say you were there I believe it was Colin's birthday and we went to to the
00:25:58
summers's house and they rented we went on a scavenger hunt do you remember this
00:26:03
I don't remember the scavenger hunt but now I remember the party like you you
00:26:07
Unearthed it uh yeah so okay so here's what I remember and Colin's got to come
00:26:13
on the show at some point because maybe he can set this all straight if I've got
00:26:16
it if I've got it crooked um what I remember is going to The Summer's house
00:26:21
it was surprise party for Colin he shows up and then they ended up surprising all
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the rest of us by being like we're going on scavenger hunt and there's a limo
00:26:29
parked outside we were like okay and it was just that it was a giant scavenger hunt we jumped in limo we drove all
00:26:36
around Ventura went to the beach we went downtown Ventura we went like I'm trying
00:26:41
to even remember where else but yeah basically we drove around for hours on end doing the scavenger hunt thing for
00:26:47
Colin's birthday and uh yeah and I remember there being a good number of people there um
00:26:54
but yeah just another one of those like I wouldn't say that's exclusive exclusively like homeschool kid story
00:26:59
that's obviously like just a birthday party that anybody could have but uh but
00:27:05
all of the people there were hes school kids um yeah so dang I don't remember
00:27:11
there being a limo I remember the party I don't remember there being a limo wasn't a limo I don't know I mean
00:27:17
that's a pretty big make come set off the photos he'll be like here's you and limo like obviously
00:27:26
photoshopped no for sure but oh man I don't know I I agree with you that it's hard to think
00:27:36
of one instance because I feel like a lot of my memories with you guys are just like you said there events that
00:27:41
there was a lot of people there but for whatever reason they're just centered
00:27:45
around the four of us and I don't know I don't know what like what that is about
00:27:49
that but yeah I don't know some kind of special connection I guess yeah between
00:27:55
the four of us crazy yeah okay so one of the things we were talking about before we hit record was
00:28:04
Mrs y's class and you told me that you dug up a poem that supposedly is written
00:28:10
about me yeah so I I mean you know what I think we were in the phase of class where we were writing poem parodies so
00:28:19
supposed to be like structured the same as another poem what's crazy is I don't
00:28:24
remember the original poem that I based it on but I think it I feel like I had a
00:28:30
dream not about you but about a situation and then I just applied it to the poem and then for some reason the
00:28:36
individual in the poem and I can read it but the individual in the poem like became
00:28:42
you um so it's titled the heart and the hat and it goes he shot his heart into
00:28:51
the air it fell to Earth into a girl's hair for so so horrible his aim its flight ended up nowhere near his heart's
00:29:02
Delight the wind whisked his hat into the air he cursed and swore and ran as fast as he dared for his legs and feet
00:29:11
could barely beat the rapid whisk that the wind did Fleet super wordy um a short time
00:29:19
afterward with much of a plight he found the hat with his heart's Delight but now
00:29:24
his heart present no more couldn't help and he could only abhor no idea it's a mystery I it's absurd I
00:29:38
don't even like who was I talking it was definitely your hat though that's the only thing I remember
00:29:45
it was like a hat that you used to wear in class yeah I guess yeah I've yeah pretty
00:29:50
much always been a hat boy so yeah the hat and the red pants I mean those are your two iconic
00:29:56
things yeah yep yeah no I'm much more basic now um yeah much more neutral colors but so boring I you know when you
00:30:07
read the first line of that it reminded me there's a poem that is like he shot
00:30:12
an arrow yes it's that one yeah and I don't know what that poem is called but
00:30:17
that's what it reminded me of so yeah that's what it's about but I agree with
00:30:21
you I think I do remember that being a thing where she was like okay yeah you're going to take a famous not even a
00:30:26
famous poem just a poem and recreate it in whatever or memorize it or memorize it or yeah something I we memorize poems
00:30:35
every week it's crazy yeah yeah no I I love Mrs yep for pushing us to do poetry
00:30:42
and I took another writing class with somebody else um that they also pushed us to do poetry as well and that was
00:30:49
always like um I don't know it's hard it's not like I'm not good at it I'm not
00:30:54
a good writer but um but I don't know just poetry is really it's really beautiful to me so yeah it's good to
00:31:02
appreciate it even if you can't do it so what is next for an and Lee like what is
00:31:09
next on the docket as far as Adventures go as far as life goes um you know I know you travel quite a bit or so it
00:31:16
seems so it seems you travel quite a bit so it seems on social media yes um uh and have been to many beautiful
00:31:24
wonderful places but is there anything exciting coming down the pipeline I mean I've been freelancing a
00:31:31
lot so I think professionally at least I think some sort of like longer term goal
00:31:38
and I was talking about this with some of my designer friends because again I'm
00:31:41
not like visually Super Creative um but you know words and visuals but I it' be
00:31:48
great to open like a small like brand like creative brand Studio something like that um I
00:31:55
think I mean it's like you said like I think I have a big interest in like Frameworks and infrastructure of like
00:32:01
how the internal things work and how that can like really affect the external elements of something so I think owning
00:32:08
a company or like not managing other people because that sounds weird but like owning the workflow of how certain
00:32:14
systems are organized would be really fun for me um so I've been looking into
00:32:18
that a lot I think I think it'd be really interesting to create some sort of agency or Studio that
00:32:26
really Bridges a wi that I I think there is between like Freelancers and agencies
00:32:31
like I think if you're paying so much for a world class agency or paying not
00:32:35
very much for a freelancer there's got to be an in between for someone who's
00:32:39
like a middle middle siiz like middle Revenue company um yeah so yeah I've been doing some market research but
00:32:47
that's about it no that's super cool where do you think your like interest
00:32:53
love came for like the words and like the the fra finding the frame where do you think that like came from like do
00:33:02
you think that you've had that for a while from being a little kid or is it something that like you just kind of
00:33:08
like I took one class and it just like it hooked me it just solidified that it was like this is the thing I mean I
00:33:14
don't know I've always enjoyed writing I've always enjoyed reading I think I
00:33:18
mean I was homeschooled and then before that um the the Waldorf School I went to
00:33:22
like sort of didn't believe or didn't advocate for um like forcing a child to
00:33:26
learn how to read so like they they advocated for like I know they advocated for like
00:33:34
you pre a certain age like they advocated that you just kind of like let your child learn as they go um and I was
00:33:42
someone that was like I want to read this book and so I kind of just like taught myself how to read at one point
00:33:47
like I just like forced myself to learn how to read I have no idea how this happened I've been told this is what
00:33:52
happened um so I think I always had like a like an interest in reading and interest in words um the systems thing
00:34:00
is interesting though I feel like that's just I feel like when you work behind
00:34:03
the scenes on anything like a podcast like even like a PowerPoint deck you start to realize like why is like this
00:34:12
like why is this so bad why is this organized so bad and you're like I can't
00:34:16
even be efficient so like how so like how can I make this better so that I'm
00:34:19
more efficient um and I think if you have like a a natural tendency towards that then you're like I'm gonna let me
00:34:25
reorganize this whole Google Drive and like make it make sense to me so that it you know it's easier for other people so
00:34:33
I don't know why do I mean why do you like systems and infrastructure you know I think so I'm
00:34:40
the oldest in my family and I think that with that come there's a certain personality type that the oldest kid
00:34:47
always is so tie that in with I'm also a Leo um which if you believe in that or
00:34:55
not it's just I me I'm a Virgo so makes sense to me makes sense um uh so like
00:35:02
one of the traits of being a Leo is kind of a leadership which tends to result in
00:35:07
some organization stuff but being the firstborn I think resulted in just a lot of unintentionally I think there's a lot
00:35:16
of expectation when you're a firstborn and so you kind of become a systematized
00:35:20
person this isn't true for everybody it just was true for me always very clean
00:35:24
always very neat just like school work done on time that kind of thing and so I think that that just played into I mean
00:35:31
I remember being in college and when kids were late to school or you do a gr project and there's that one kid who
00:35:37
like yeah you go gole drive and you're like you're like what the hell is going
00:35:41
on in here um I just have always been that person to fix it and make it like and then create some kind of system of
00:35:48
like here's how we're going to do it um and explain it to everybody um and so
00:35:52
that's funny enough well yeah I edit and I do all this stuff behind this SC for
00:35:57
podcast I I think the biggest thing that I've done for a lot of people is just
00:36:00
create that framework of like this is what your show is going to look like it's going to have XYZ components we lay
00:36:06
it out for you this is how we're going to record them you know boom boom boom
00:36:10
boom boom and and then here's what happens so once it's recorded you know
00:36:15
or here's pre-production here's you know actual production and then here's
00:36:18
post-production kind of a thing and uh I don't know I just like like you said I
00:36:23
think it's one of those things that I didn't really realize until I started
00:36:27
actually like doing stuff that I was like oh okay I'm this is what I think I'm supposed to
00:36:33
do um and so found that kind of I don't know I just you find what you're good at
00:36:39
and then you're like I I think I'm just going to stick with this until it
00:36:41
doesn't work anymore right yeah yeah and ideally if you've set it upright it
00:36:45
works forever exactly exactly I will ask you this though because I mean you understand the freelance thing as well
00:36:53
as I do but like have you had any of those moments of like crap I got to go get a real job at this
00:37:00
point like maybe money's not coming in or you're just like I'm living in
00:37:03
fantasy land I shouldn't be making this kind of money like yeah I mean I think I
00:37:09
think every freelancer um and at least all the ones I know they've gone through
00:37:13
that moment of like why am I doing this like what what am I getting out of this why is it worth it like am I even like
00:37:19
what's the point and really actually though what is the point right I think I
00:37:24
mean I I've had this moment with school and homeschooling too of like why why am
00:37:27
I bother like why why would I do this like why am I homeschooled why am I in public school like what was the point of
00:37:33
all of this if I could have just learned it like on my own hypothetically because
00:37:37
there's no way I could have kept myself accountable in any way with stuff like
00:37:41
that but I mean I think we all have that moment of like why am I doing this yeah
00:37:47
no 100% I to the point where I I basically had all of my clients dry up at one point and I was like I just was like oh
00:37:57
great I'm out of luck right now and uh I started going on job interviews and
00:38:01
I went and did a job interview for Enterprise Rena car and I was just like I just need a job and I was like and
00:38:07
they the the reason I went to them was one I was like I could do this job and two they have a career path set out for
00:38:13
you they have a system in place and I was like I'm attracted to that you know
00:38:17
um they have a system in place you start here and you're going to end up managing
00:38:20
your own branch of the store or whatever and I was like okay that's attractive I
00:38:24
did the interview and the guy legitimately told me he's like one you've got the job if you want it but
00:38:29
two he's like I don't think you should take this job because you are not going
00:38:32
to be passionate about this like you have a passion for this other thing to go pursue your own stuff and you should
00:38:37
just like lean full into that and it's so weird because like it was one of those moments where it was an aha moment
00:38:43
for me where I I it's one thing to have like your wife your mom your dad tell you
00:38:51
like yeah you could do this you know it's another thing to have somebody who
00:38:54
you have just met for 20 minutes be like no you're really passionate about this
00:38:59
like why are you here yeah yeah exactly that was a legitimate his question he's
00:39:03
like I don't understand why you're here like just go get somebody else to fill
00:39:07
the empty void you know yeah um so yeah that's a thing I mean I yeah encouragement from strangers is a big
00:39:16
that outside perspective is so important I think especially when I think especially when you're trying to do
00:39:23
something that you like doing because most people don't like their job and they're doing it all day and it's crazy
00:39:30
to think that like you could I mean you could just do anything and make a lot of
00:39:34
money but oh 100% I mean the way the world is set up now yeah exactly whatever you're passionate about you
00:39:40
chase the passion and I mean if you want to monetize it you can monetize it you know yeah it's hypothetic very very do
00:39:49
yeah hypothetically but it takes the passion to actually make it happen you know um that's that's the big thing is
00:39:56
like I I only work with clients who if they come to me and they're like my goal
00:40:02
I'm gonna I want to start the show it's going to replace my income it's going to
00:40:05
do all these things in six months I'm like cool I think you're doing it for
00:40:09
the wrong reason they just want to do it so they can quit their 9et to-5 and I'm
00:40:12
like that's the wrong reason to want to do this I think you should want to do
00:40:15
what you start a podcast or YouTube channel or Tik Tok account or whatever for the sole reason of you have a
00:40:22
passion to do this and you have a passion to communicate whatever and educate in whatever capacity uh it is
00:40:28
entertain whatever um I don't know I think that's just like an important
00:40:33
thing of like if you're not passionate about it why do it you know it's like yeah I agree I mean I mean some
00:40:42
people don't even know it they're passionate about and that's where it
00:40:44
gets to I think but and that's the problem with I think with sometimes the way the system is set up and I think
00:40:51
what's cool about your story of education is like you know you you did School in a classroom homeschooled back
00:41:00
to public school to college so like you experienced the gamut of different education Styles and some of them
00:41:08
probably encouraged you to pursue passions some of them maybe didn't as much that kind of a thing and so when
00:41:15
you when you can be in those types of environments like I had an education experience where I had parents who were
00:41:20
very encouraging of like what are you into let's pursue that let's look more
00:41:24
into it let's go more in depth with it let's travel to Museum let's go invest
00:41:29
in audio gear let's whatever it was you know um it just was one of those things
00:41:34
where it was like you I had people back me up on my passions and and then when I
00:41:41
got in a setting where people maybe weren't backing me up with my passions I
00:41:44
was like but my passions are the most important thing so I should pursue them regardless of you know if it's going to
00:41:49
be the job or not it's important to have something like that so yeah I think
00:41:53
that's homeschooling is really good for that like if you have a child that is
00:41:57
very adamant that they want to do something specific like it's a great I think it's a great environment to
00:42:03
encourage someone to do what they want to do and also just like be themselves or like a weirder version of themselves
00:42:11
but I mean it's a great environment to be who you want to be um and I think there's just like a lot less pressure
00:42:16
from everyone to tell you what to do which is great yeah is there anything from your homeschool experience that
00:42:23
you're like you're like this was just not it it was not good it was God awful and like it just
00:42:33
could have been better is there anything like that that pops in new Bing I mean I'm sure there was a couple years there
00:42:39
where I was not in school realistically speaking you know I was like at home maybe learning a few things um and I'm
00:42:47
someone who likes a lot of organization and routine so for me that was really hard um even when I was like 12 but I
00:42:53
think I mean yeah I mean I don't know you had like a nice Homeschool Group but
00:42:59
I think I did a lot of different classes like I take Community College classes and homeschool classes and
00:43:05
extracurriculars and there was a time where I wasn't doing that and that was
00:43:09
really hard because it's easier to do a lot of things than than to do nothing
00:43:13
for me and I was like I don't even think I'm learning anything right now so I had
00:43:16
to like start you know taking more classes because my parents are like I don't think she's is she in school I no
00:43:21
she's sitting at home like reading a book right so yeah right yeah it's kind
00:43:27
of easy to kind of fall off that train of like yeah yeah are we teaching anything is there or is this kid just at
00:43:35
home all day long you know yeah that is kind of a yeah I don't I don't think
00:43:40
people check themselves on that sometimes it's like you know I think it's funny because I think people who
00:43:46
grew up in the public school system have a hard time when they go to college because they're like I don't have busy
00:43:51
work I don't have like a whatever like at 9 to 300 p.m. 5:00 p.m. School schedule and they have a really hard
00:43:59
time adjusting and I think for me it was actually the opposite where I had come from so much like chaos that going into
00:44:08
public school then felt like you know not enough chaos and it was like too much and then going to like college
00:44:14
after public school and home school was an interesting balance in between where it was like you have classes they're not
00:44:20
all day you have time to do work there's not a lot of busy work and it was just
00:44:24
like this great in between home schooling in public school that I think a lot of people felt like they couldn't
00:44:30
adapt very well I don't know if that was like your experience when you went to
00:44:33
school since you were homeschooled for longer than I was but man that's an interesting take on that because yeah I
00:44:40
mean I purposefully I chose the college I chose for strategic reasons because it
00:44:45
was a smaller school I think it was about a thousand students maybe a little bit over so smaller class sizes so a lot
00:44:51
of the classes were about the size of a missia writing class for maybe maybe a dozen kids um so very normal but you
00:45:00
know the bigger the school you go to the bigger the classroom right and so I had
00:45:03
a couple classes that were like 50 kids and that was like overwhelming for me but I had never thought of it in the in
00:45:10
the regards of like yeah to go from public school where it's like yeah busyness all day it's very structured in
00:45:16
that sense of like you're going to be here from this time to this time cuz college is not that you have a
00:45:22
class at like 8 in the morning and you have a Hu gigantic break and then your next class is at 2:00 in the afternoon
00:45:27
right um and so there's these weird gaps of time sometimes that you just have to
00:45:34
fill with something and yeah homeschooling totally prepared me for that because I was used to that it's
00:45:40
like I mean especially by the time I was graduating high school it's like I worked a couple jobs I Tau guitar
00:45:47
lessons dance lessons during the summer like I did stuff and it would be at different times and weird times of the
00:45:53
day so yeah your education just fit in where it needed to that's oh man I had not
00:46:00
even thought of that as like a example that's a great example of yeah you need
00:46:05
that mix of chaos and structure um yeah and I mean some homeschool kids had a lot more structure than like some
00:46:13
had a ton I was like why don't you just go to school this is crazy yeah exactly
00:46:18
I I've met a few kids who yeah they're it's like what are you talking about you
00:46:22
know and I think my mom tried to do that at first she tried to do the like you're
00:46:26
out of bed by 8: a.m. like like crazy you're out of bed and like ready to go
00:46:30
for school by 8: a.m. and then by the time we were finishing it was like I mean if you get started by noon that's a
00:46:36
good sign kind of a thing yeah that that was me I was like I'm sleeping in what
00:46:40
an alarm I was like what excuse me yeah exactly it was like what's the point
00:46:46
yeah um yeah and I don't know she learned to play to our strengths I think is is like yeah um so yeah listen to I'm
00:46:58
still hung up on the college thing but yeah that's like great example of that
00:47:03
um because yeah it is a it's a massive jump for a lot of people and I think a
00:47:07
lot of people are just like not prepared for it um yeah I mean kids do terribly yeah yeah the first year of colle I mean
00:47:15
I always tell people I'm like the first year of if you can make it through the
00:47:17
first year of college you can do the rest of it you like it's it's easy after
00:47:22
you do the first year I mean I gave up I wanted to give up so many times freshman
00:47:25
year was calling begging please let me come home I don't ever want to come back
00:47:29
to this place like I'm done I'm just going to like get a job kind of a thing
00:47:33
and uh I'm glad I stuck it out cuz I mean my dad was just kind of like you got to do one year and then you know
00:47:40
let's we'll go from there kind of a thing and after one year it was like this this is easy you know it had
00:47:46
its moments but it was like oh this is so much easier I know what to expect I know how to handle myself all that kind
00:47:52
of stuff scheduling yeah scheduling your own life is crazy when you've spent 16
00:48:00
years or 12 years guess that's why I've been doing some work with a client and
00:48:05
they talk to a lot of people who did sororities and fraternities and I think that's a a big part of why kids join
00:48:12
those potentially is because a lot of times with sororities and fraternities they schedule out your entire day for
00:48:17
you um and like you're going to be at this event you're going to take these
00:48:20
classes you're doing this that the other right which is very much I don't want to
00:48:25
say excl that's it kind of is a public school typee thing where it's like yeah
00:48:29
you're going to be here you're going to be there like we're telling you where
00:48:32
you're going to be for the next however many hours of your day and so maybe that's why people thrive in that because
00:48:38
yeah and it's like a friend group that has the same mentality too you're like I
00:48:42
have a already made friend group which is crazy actually yeah that's interesting I don't know if you did like
00:48:47
a lot of clubs and stuff in college but I think like I feel like my college experience was really reflective of like
00:48:55
my homeschooling experience in the sense that I had a lot of different friends from different areas of like College
00:49:01
from clubs or from classes or from uh high school or from like an extracurricular or something like that
00:49:07
so I had a lot of different friend groups um but I think most people if you're in like a frat or sorority you
00:49:12
have that one friend group and you don't really you don't really leave it which
00:49:16
is scary to think but yeah I don't remember being in a ton of clubs I mean I did a bunch of stuff I mean my my
00:49:26
major was because it was entertainment we ran all the shows on campus so that was that chewed up a large chunk of our
00:49:32
time um and then I mean there's always opportunities for run this event do that
00:49:38
I mean we did like a gospel festival and we did I mean just like all kinds of little stuff too we would help run
00:49:44
events for the school when the board of directors would come into town or whatever you know we would be in charge
00:49:49
of stuff like that so not so much a club um but we busy we were just busy doing a
00:49:55
lot yeah and then touch and base with a bunch of different friend groups you know and working across the different
00:50:01
majors and stuff to be like okay we need this or we need that room kind of a thing so um yeah give me the room yeah
00:50:08
exactly give me the room yeah um oh man so many fights about that but um that's
00:50:14
a story for another time uh and this has been so awesome I appreciate you coming on so much because
00:50:22
one um I mean we haven't chatted in a while so I'm thankful to catch up with
00:50:26
you and um I don't know and it was cool to hear your home school Journey because
00:50:31
like yeah I didn't really I didn't I don't know we knew each other but I just
00:50:36
didn't know that element I think of you and I don't know I don't I think I go
00:50:41
into a lot of things I think during home school years I would go into a lot of things expecting like oh well everyone's
00:50:46
home school journey is kind of similar to mine and it's like that's just really
00:50:49
not the reality um which is kind of the point of the show is like to talk to people about like it's very different um
00:50:56
for anybody and everybody but here we are we survived we made it out barely with our
00:51:05
lives very cool well aside from that I don't know is there anything we haven't touched on
00:51:12
that you're just like oh shoot we got to talk about this I mean I don't think so other than you
00:51:18
know your red pants but I think Emily already really wanted to talk about that too so well if you haven't listened to
00:51:26
Emily's episode um to I had red pants yeah in high school and they're yeah um
00:51:33
and in college I'll find a picture of them at some point and post them um because yeah they were God awful um did
00:51:40
you did you wear them in college I wore mine in college but it's different for a
00:51:45
girl okay yes I did I wore them to I wore them to an event I want to say I wore them to homecoming um I had a
00:51:53
couple quack in college that's so funny that really were were wild but yeah I
00:52:00
don't know I was you know attention seeking yeah it's funny that I say it's
00:52:06
funny that I say I'm a behind the scenes person because no I'm very clearly also
00:52:09
an attention seeker um type person so you can be you can be both it's fine now
00:52:15
you're in front of the camera so exactly here we are yeah seeking all the attention different person well an this
00:52:24
has been awesome I again thank you so much for coming on because this I don't
00:52:28
know I just like hearing people's stories and I appreciate you taking the time and um yeah I don't
00:52:34
know any last words for the people I mean everyone should think about homeschooling their children because we
00:52:42
turned out so fantastic and I mean we're not weird at all we like being in front of the camera
00:52:49
and behind the camera we wear red pants what else can I summarize we write insane poems
00:52:57
yeah apparently about each other yeah of course yeah yeah no absolutely if if if
00:53:04
nothing else sells you on homeschooling this episode definitely should so yes um
00:53:09
yes so once again thank you so much for coming on and for those of you who are still listening I appreciate you so much
00:53:15
um if you would hit the Subscribe hit the follow hit the like hit the comment button uh leave a festar review if you
00:53:22
think that this is a f star worthy conversation um I think it was um and uh I want to hear from you guys so you know
00:53:29
if you've got something you want to say to me you can either hit me up on Instagram at uh thex homeschoolers club
00:53:35
or you can email me at exhs [email protected] and uh it goes to me so um yeah anyway
00:53:44
until next time later [Music] [Music]