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[Music]
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well welcome back to the ex
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homeschoolers Club I am of course your
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host Jacob gon and today I've got a very
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special guest for you guys Mrs Ruth
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Brooks is here with us you may remember
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her son Derry he was one of like my
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first interviews but I have known Mrs
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Brooks for a very long time she makes
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some of the world's greatest chocolate
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chip cookies and uh I'm so thankful for
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her to be here today Mrs Brooks welcome
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to the ex homeschoolers Club oh thank
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you it's good to be here and and you can
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call me Ruth
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okay Ruth uh there's this weird
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transition period I feel like where it's
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like as kids it's always Mr and misses
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and then they're hits this point and
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it's like I don't I don't quite know
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what it is and yeah so Ruth it's it's
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good to have
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you thanks oh my gosh we have so much to
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talk about uh I just I learned recently
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well I learned when Derry was on the
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show that you were also a homeschool kid
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and so I know that kind of potentially
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shaped you homeschooling your own kids
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and stuff but can you tell us a little
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bit about like your homeschool
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experience and growing up and like what
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home life was like and that kind of a
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thing yeah for sure so uh I I was in
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public school until through fourth grade
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and then my older sister was going in a
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junior high at that point she had just
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finished sixth grade and in San Diego we
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lived in San Diego uh junior high was
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7th and eighth grade and the the school
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that she would have gone to had a known
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drug problem and my parents were like
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were you know they've been thinking
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about homeschooling and so they decided
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this is a good time we'll pull them out
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nobody did it back then so the early
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days it was just weird because we didn't
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walk to school with our friends anymore
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and right we had to hide from the truin
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officer and it was just it was just
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weird and kind of people in the
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neighborhood our friends were like oh
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there's that family that does weird
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stuff but you know it wasn't I loved
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being around my mom mom and I had little
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siblings I had at that point I think
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three younger siblings maybe my mom
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might have been pregnant with the fourth
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um and so it was you know we got used to
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it and um you know it just became what
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we knew and we did our stuff on our own
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we my parents used a super like
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structured program at first where we sat
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at desks we wore a uniform you know they
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were you know it was just we we modeled
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our school after a private Christian
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School and used that curriculum blah
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blah blah so that was in the late 70s
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okay and um I was fifth grade so between
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Fifth and the end of high school I was
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homeschooled it's interesting because
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most of the people who I talk to who
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they go from having gone to a public or
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private school to homeschooling those
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first couple years tend to be that much
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more like structured we try to mimic
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school as much as possible possible you
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had to wear uniform I didn't have to
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wear uniform but I do remember my mom
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being like okay like we're going to get
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up at this time and we're going to like
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these this is the day it's chunked out
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very much like Traditional School was
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and then it just all kind of uh went to
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hell after a little bit because she
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realized this is not working but how
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many siblings do you have again uh I
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have eight I grew up with seven I grew
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up with seven siblings eventually um but
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the last one wasn't born till I was 16
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so I
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had yeah that's also kind of a families
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with the with a lot of kids tend to also
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be like The Homeschool families uh for
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sure I feel like that's the that's the
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norm so so as time went on as you got
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like later into high school years did
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you guys also do like as an older
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sibling were you also responsible for
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kind of helping educate and like raise
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the younger siblings or did your mom
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really hold a lot of that I would say
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more in like child care not necessarily
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educating them um we yeah we got into a
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really
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strict um par Church organization when I
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was in in my teens and then so we went
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from being kind of more um happier
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homeschooling to very strict and
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structured in a lot of anxiety because
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they required all this stuff and um and
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so I think my
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mom uh she did not love that uh it was
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the bill goth Advanced Training
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Institute America so the Shiny Happy
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People people right okay and um and so I
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would say that made it a little harder I
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mean a lot hard harder for her and
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um so I I wouldn't say I was educating
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the younger siblings but I had a lot of
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responsibility for the household stuff
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like cooking and um child care and and
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stuff like that which I you know I loved
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my younger siblings I didn't mind caring
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them around to different classes or
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whatever um you know was part of part of
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being in a big family yeah you know
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absolutely I think that's I mean I'm a
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family of I come from a family of four
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you know this mom dad and my sister and
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I but uh it was always interesting to
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watch The Homeschool families who were
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bigger because yeah they had much more
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of this like everybody has a role to
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play right and it's and it it it can
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look really strange from the outside but
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when you're in it and like um going over
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like I I used babysit for the Hester
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family and like being there and
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experiencing it you're like oh okay I
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see it like it's just we H everybody has
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their job that that they have to do and
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that's how that's just how everything
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works out at the end you know what I
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mean like we have to get everything done
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um and there's a billion in one of us so
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like you know everybody's got their role
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to play um and I think that it's it's
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kind of fun I don't know I
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I don't regret not having more siblings
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but I think it would have been an
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interesting experience for sure well
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just different it would have just been
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different so you're you're I feel like
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maybe you're more of an individual when
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you have fewer siblings and you're one
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of a of of a pod you have to play a part
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or you got to carry your weight or
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something isn't going to go right you
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know so it's just a different a
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different experience completely so when
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it came to Let's flush forward just a
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little bit so like you're you graduate
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you move on you get married you have
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kids now and it's time to decide what
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they're going to do for school
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like were you pretty set on like I'm
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going to be a homeschool parent as well
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because I enjoyed my time in it or were
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you thinking public private school like
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what kind of led to you deciding well I
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think there was a lot of um it was very
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fear-based uh the the decision so and
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back when my parents started
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homeschooling it was very like it was
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protecting from something really bad
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drugs or whatever it might be so it was
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so then my exper and then and then
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introduced were many many more fears
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um through that Atia program and so like
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we we had to like I I didn't feel like I
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had a choice I had to homeschool okay I
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had to protect them from all the evils
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of the world you know and so but I also
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loved being with him and I couldn't
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imagine put you know I didn't want him
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to leave at five years old to go into
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school um but it was definitely a
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fear-based decision for sure now the
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difference you brought up like when you
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were a kid and and going into homeschool
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and you were like we also had to hide
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from like the Trent officer but like by
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the time I mean Darry and I are the same
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age so I mean we're talking 2000s is you
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know starting the homo homeschooling was
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a little bit more I feel like accepted
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at that point um and so maybe not having
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to run from the law as much I know there
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was other Fierce like you said a lot of
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people had but um
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so I I guess I guess my question there
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is
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like not so much what the fear was
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associated with it but like do you feel
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like how do I want to phrase this do you
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feel like it was almost easier to
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homeschool your kids than what you had
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seen like your mom potentially have gone
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through back in the 70s of like okay
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there's a lot more access to just things
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to be able to do this now oh 100% I mean
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there were you had you had more than two
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choices for curriculum you know I mean
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you had so many choices and so um yeah
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definitely easier it was more accepted
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people think you were weird especially
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in where we ended up in ohigh it was
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super common I mean there was a huge uh
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Catholic home school group that we kind
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of just you know hung out with and um
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you know we had the the Christian group
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and the Catholic group and we all hung
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out you know we all did tenis together
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and whatever you know and similar values
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and um we didn't have quite as many kids
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but you know very similar values in like
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kind and uh truthfulness and all these
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like character qualities that we're
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trying to instill in our kids so it was
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definitely an easier Road how quickly
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did you get involved in some of the like
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homeschool groups because I know like my
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I I felt like I was it wasn't until I
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interviewed my mom that I realized like
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I thought we had like a couple years in
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there where it was just like we're on
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our own uh turns out no she was like
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pretty plugged into like group Solutions
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and Achieve very early on um was it kind
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of the same with you maybe those
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specific groups but well I okay so the
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group that was before group Solutions
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was Kos and it was a culum that they Ed
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super handson their little by line was
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man says sit still God says wiggle and
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so they were very much about kids
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getting to
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experience learning in all these
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different ways and so we joined that
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when uh Derry was first grade Cali was
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Kindergarten okay and so that was all
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like a bunch of people that were also
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ended up over in in group
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Solutions um were also in konos but you
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know like the Fran's were in konos and
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um the Goldens and like there were just
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a bunch of people Susie E's family they
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were in there um you know so it was it
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and it was every
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Friday for like four hours or something
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super fun it was it was really really
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kicked back um Joanie Livermore ran
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and it was just a great intro and had
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some really nice people in it and I feel
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like it was much more laidback group
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Solutions there was a lot for me a lot
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of anxiety in group Solutions like a lot
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of you know first time obedience and Mr
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and M always and I just felt like konos
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was much more like my jam it was mellow
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kind of more hippie you got the hippie
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Vibe um so group Solutions stress me out
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big time yeah you know I will I will say
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coming to your house as a kid your house
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always felt like just the chill the
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chill house like it like I don't know I
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don't know what it was you walked
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through the front door and it was just
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like a breath of fresh air sometimes
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like I I'm a firstborn kid my mom is a a
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firstborn kid like they or not a first
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she's a twin but she she's the first of
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their generation but we more High Strung
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people I guess much more of that
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structured group Solutions is like like
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right up our Jam because it's just the
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structure right but yeah coming to your
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house it was like oh okay like kick my
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shoes off like you said we GRE ohigh
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ohigh was hippie dippy like it you know
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was just like much more breath of fresh
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air um and your kids exemplified that
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too I mean I can't name you the number
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of times there was like dude just chill
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like it's
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okay coming from a first
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board yeah I was like I don't know how
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Derry is so chill um and he still is
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today um but no that's it's interesting
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to see kind of the evolution of where
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like people ended up and then I remember
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hearing a lot um about konos but I was
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not a part of it um but that I love what
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you said about like man says sit still
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God says like wiggle and like kind of
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that that freedom because I think a big
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part of homeschooling that is just a
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positive for a lot of us was the fact
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that like there's so much flexibility
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and what you can do and what's working
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and what's not and like each child's
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individual education it can be a pro and
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a con right um for sure but um I know
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like I did really well with my
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parents did I think did an okay job at
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realizing like okay his strengths are
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here now let's tailor his education to
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that um and um I feel like you guys did
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kind of a similar thing at least leaning
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into your kids of like they're into do
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this like let's give them the tools they
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need to like pursue those things um
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so okay when it came to like curriculum
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because and like things of that nature
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your your kids are vastly different um
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and just like their personalities and
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their learning styles and everything
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like der had made this comment when he
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was on about like you guys doing like a
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science altogether the four of you but
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just people were at different age ranges
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and that was like slightly different
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than like my experience but like I don't
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know can you talk a little bit about
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like how you chose some of the
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curriculum or how you structured certain
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things inside of like your homeschool of
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like okay we're kind of all doing this
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together but we do have to create I mean
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there's there's an age Gap here there's
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a learning a difference here um yeah I
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don't know share a little bit about that
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it was mostly by necessity because I had
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I had two kids close together my first
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two were 18 months apart so it was easy
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with those two to kind of like you had
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to do math separately but a lot of other
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things you could do together um but you
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know around year four of homeschooling I
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realized like something wasn't working
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with Derry and it he turned out you know
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turned out he was dyslexic and so that
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influenced quite a bit of how we did
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school so a lot of things became
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auditory I would read stuff out loud I'd
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read the text out loud we'd answer
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questions together um and and so a lot
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of the choices and coming from that kind
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of more hippie um like those books that
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were written like better late than early
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that were written in the 70s and there
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was one book um the Angel and the marble
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and it's a quote from um is it Le oh
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well anyway one of the great Masters one
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of the great artists and he would he
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said he would see a chunk of marble and
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he would say say I saw the angel in the
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marble and I I freed it basically and he
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would you know bring out this beautiful
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piece of art and so that was kind of
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what I was going for like who are they
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and then when you add a little learning
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difficulty like dyslexia where you can't
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read your own text
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well then I had to be more involved and
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I I loved reading to my kids and so yeah
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but then some of the choices that I made
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were going to be based on can we do this
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together can we do this handson and and
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so it turned out that cie also has
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dyslexia but she was diagnosed more with
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disc calcula and it was like turning
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numbers around and so math was difficult
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for
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her so anyway I ended up choosing I mean
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different things every year I didn't use
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one thing consistently throughout it was
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like an if I found something that worked
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better I would get that you know and
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when was in fourth grade and he started
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going to a tutor um Suzanne galison
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amazing woman um then you know we
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started doing this curriculum that they
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used this Barton system which was super
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expensive but it helped them learn all
00:16:52
the rules of the English language which
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truly texting did more eventually
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texting were underlines it in red I
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think that did more for Derry to give
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him proficiency than any learning to
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read curriculum you know and then my dad
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who who was an educator he would say
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don't worry about it the Greeks and
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Romans never taught their boys until
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they went through puberty like wait
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until he's 14 and the Brain starts
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growing again and so you know I had
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these influences that were telling me
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just to relax yeah and and that you know
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it helped because I was freaking out
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when my fourth grader couldn't read I
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was freaking out and we had you know all
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these people for as as hippie dippy as
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ohigh is The Homeschool Group was not
00:17:41
like that The Homeschool Group was very
00:17:43
much like teach them so they can get
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into a good University so the that's the
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The Homeschool influence I had around me
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was very it was much more that way in
00:17:54
ohigh than it was in Ventura no that's
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interesting because I mean I definitely
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my parents from a very young age were
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kind of they instilled in me this like
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okay like here's kind of what life is
00:18:07
going to look like right you're going to
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be a kid you're be at home with Mom and
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Dad and we're going to you know we're
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going to do all these things and you're
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going to go to school and you're going
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to all these things and then you're
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going to get turn 18 and you're going to
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graduate from high school and then you
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get to make a decision you get to either
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go to college or university or you're
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going to be a trade or you're going to
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get a job or you know whatever in the
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down line maybe you'll get married and
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maybe you'll have kids and maybe you'll
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do XYZ right and so
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they were kind of setting me up for that
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but yes I do remember some ohigh
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families also being very uh you're this
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is the path and you follow the path and
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the path is good you know um and the
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path does not work for everybody um I
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like um I know when I had Derry on he
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was just like we were talking about he
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had just he just graduated from college
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with a degree and so very different
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paths and that's okay it's like
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everybody's we all have our own path to
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walk right yeah and that's that's
00:19:01
probably one of the hardest things is
00:19:04
letting your kid make their own decision
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when you feel like well this is the path
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you should be on but but not trying to
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overly emphasize that I hear from my
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kids that I pressured them a lot to go
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to college and to get a degree like I
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heard that after the fact I didn't feel
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like I was doing that but but I wasn't
00:19:23
it wasn't uh an option for me in my hom
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School journey is with the the with that
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group that we were with you did not go
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to college Christian college or or
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regular University and so I was like why
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would you not if you have the
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opportunity why would you not get a
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degree I couldn't understand that and um
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so I I mean I did my best to not
00:19:48
pressure them but I have heard that I
00:19:50
did pressure them so sorry
00:19:53
kid I think it it's it's interesting now
00:19:57
because we were talking about this a
00:19:59
little bit um when you and I chatted a
00:20:01
few weeks ago and even in my
00:20:03
conversations with der it's like it's so
00:20:05
interesting now because Darry and I were
00:20:07
a decade out of high school um and like
00:20:12
to look back and go okay like my parents
00:20:14
did this and maybe I view it now as
00:20:18
negatively but there's also this like
00:20:20
level of like you also kind of have to
00:20:22
be like my parent was also kind of just
00:20:23
doing the best they possibly could right
00:20:25
or what they thought was right right and
00:20:28
while you don't feel like you were
00:20:28
pressuring your kids okay but now it's
00:20:32
great that they can communicate that to
00:20:33
you and say okay hey this felt like this
00:20:36
right and then hopefully as a parent you
00:20:39
can also be receptive to the fact that's
00:20:41
it's like okay this was like this and
00:20:44
help encourage other parents or make
00:20:47
changes in your own life um to kind of
00:20:50
like alter that right and and it to be
00:20:54
different um I don't know that's what I
00:20:56
do with my parents as well like we have
00:20:57
all these difficult conversations
00:20:59
now about like well I don't like that we
00:21:02
did this as kids you know I don't like
00:21:03
that you pushed me to do this it's like
00:21:05
but now we can I don't know work on it
00:21:08
together and still have a relationship
00:21:10
you know well one one thing your mom
00:21:13
said which so resonated with me is just
00:21:16
that you know she hadn't brought a super
00:21:19
emotionally healthy version of herself
00:21:21
to Parenting because we come and and
00:21:23
that's the same with me like I did not
00:21:26
have a lot of good tools
00:21:29
and So you you're flying by the seat of
00:21:31
your pants and you're doing some of in
00:21:33
reaction to how you were raised you're
00:21:35
like well I'm not going to do that and
00:21:37
so you swing the other way right and but
00:21:40
then you bring all this unconscious
00:21:42
stuff like you you don't realize you're
00:21:45
doing it but you're just you so want
00:21:47
your kid to be okay that you you
00:21:52
know but yeah you do your best with the
00:21:54
tools you have and and prepping for this
00:21:57
and and chatting with you like um I
00:21:59
haven't watched Shiny Happy People but I
00:22:01
I did a lot of I was I was reading a lot
00:22:03
of things about that particular
00:22:05
Institute and I know my mom had some
00:22:07
involvement and something similar to
00:22:09
that and and things like that and
00:22:11
so as a 28-year-old guy now it's like
00:22:15
I'm learning the things that my parents
00:22:17
and my parents friends and my friends
00:22:19
parents they went through these things
00:22:21
right and they are unpacking so yeah
00:22:23
there's there's generational trauma in
00:22:25
there there's all these different things
00:22:27
and I think now we're at a point
00:22:29
hopefully in the world where we're at
00:22:31
least starting to talk a lot more about
00:22:32
these things and be open about them and
00:22:35
that's um that's the difference I see
00:22:39
with certain parents over other parents
00:22:42
is the parents who are willing to be
00:22:43
like okay I'm I'm learning I'm unpacking
00:22:46
I'm healing right they tend to have
00:22:49
still very good or at least some
00:22:52
relationship with their kid um as
00:22:54
opposed to the parents who are just
00:22:55
stuck in the like no I did I did
00:22:57
everything right and followed the rule
00:22:59
book and whatever it's like their kids
00:23:00
are leaving and they don't want anything
00:23:02
to do with them anymore um and it's like
00:23:05
are you surprised um to be real to be
00:23:09
honest um so anyway so kudos to you and
00:23:13
and Keith because I feel like you have
00:23:15
relationship with your kids three of
00:23:17
them live at home with you still um I
00:23:19
know that's not for long but three of
00:23:20
them are at home and it sounds like you
00:23:22
guys get along decently well still well
00:23:25
we I mean we've definitely had our times
00:23:28
yeah definitely and and where you you
00:23:30
just have to be like I'm sorry like I
00:23:32
didn't realize and and I honestly like
00:23:36
it's really hard and I'm I'm sure my
00:23:39
kids could tell you that I get defensive
00:23:40
and I'm like like I I didn't know that I
00:23:44
was doing that like I'm sorry you know
00:23:46
before I'm like okay you guys I'm sorry
00:23:48
I'm actually sorry I definitely like it
00:23:51
it rises up in me like I was doing my
00:23:53
best you know yeah but you know you just
00:23:56
have to say sorry and and go from there
00:23:59
you know like you said try to talk about
00:24:01
it again it's just I think it's being
00:24:04
open and then for kids too like myself
00:24:06
it's like I held a lot of things maybe
00:24:08
over my parents sometimes that I was
00:24:10
like once I got to a point of realizing
00:24:12
that I was like well my parents were
00:24:14
doing the best they could and the best
00:24:15
they knew how to and that's why I
00:24:17
encourage people learn about what your
00:24:20
parents went through learn about what
00:24:21
you know your friends parents went
00:24:23
through and why it maybe it helps you
00:24:25
kind of piece together the picture of
00:24:26
like well why are they the way they are
00:24:28
right and when you start to understand
00:24:30
that you go okay I I get it right a
00:24:33
light bulb clicks on and it's like okay
00:24:35
I I get it now and I understand why why
00:24:37
my parent you know understanding why
00:24:38
your parent chose to homeschool you
00:24:39
understanding why your parent wanted you
00:24:41
to grow up in church understanding why
00:24:42
your parent wanted to do XYZ you know
00:24:44
it's like sure I get it now I understand
00:24:47
it I can accept it and then it's a
00:24:50
healing Journey for all of us so yeah
00:24:53
it's cathartic I mean even like
00:24:56
listening to your other podcast
00:24:59
you know parents of course I'm going to
00:25:01
um understand more but the the other
00:25:04
students that you've interviewed it's
00:25:06
it's it's very it's cathartic for sure
00:25:09
well thank you that's that's the
00:25:12
hope the show started in a very like oh
00:25:15
I just want to like you know fluffy
00:25:17
catch up with people and then it's
00:25:18
become a lot a lot deeper than that so
00:25:21
um which has been good I i' I'm hoping
00:25:23
people find healing or something out of
00:25:26
this but 100% so so it sounds like
00:25:29
around your fourth year of homeschooling
00:25:32
was really where you kind of found it
00:25:34
sounds like your groove and like okay I
00:25:36
kind of got this now but was there ever
00:25:40
was there ever a point where you
00:25:41
actually were like okay I think I got
00:25:43
this like I think I know what I'm doing
00:25:44
I feel even though things were changing
00:25:46
like you said curriculums were changing
00:25:48
and whatever but was there ever a point
00:25:50
where you were like okay I think I think
00:25:52
I'm good I would say no okay I I never
00:25:56
felt super confident I I mean I I would
00:26:00
I would be so puzzled by families that
00:26:03
would pick one thing like one curriculum
00:26:07
type and stick with it all the way
00:26:09
through I had a cousin who did that
00:26:11
there were several homeschool moms that
00:26:13
were like oh yeah we've stayed with such
00:26:14
and such a curriculum we get the box of
00:26:17
books every year and all the things and
00:26:20
I was like I can't imagine that I just
00:26:23
can't imagine not changing it up a lot
00:26:26
because as as my kids needs change to
00:26:29
change it up or we didn't like that
00:26:32
particular thing so let's try something
00:26:33
else so I and maybe that's a little bit
00:26:36
about my personality I don't know I
00:26:39
think I like to be able to count on
00:26:43
something I I love a certain amount of
00:26:46
structure but other like other structure
00:26:49
I hate I just chafe under it so my my
00:26:52
youngest has told me recently that she
00:26:55
thinks I have ADHD so I would have never
00:26:58
thought that but I wasn't the best
00:27:00
student um I did like like Hands-On
00:27:04
learning and so I did kind of do that
00:27:07
more with my kids so I don't know I
00:27:09
never felt confident we changed up all I
00:27:12
mean hey I don't think my mom felt
00:27:13
confident at any point even though I
00:27:14
would say oh we found our groove around
00:27:16
this point but I don't yeah I think
00:27:18
there's that I think there's that
00:27:20
constant fear especially as a parent
00:27:21
that it's like what if I'm really
00:27:23
screwing this up like what if there's
00:27:25
just you know I'm setting them up for
00:27:29
failure which is the exact opposite of
00:27:31
what you want to do right when it comes
00:27:33
to you brought up like the kind of like
00:27:35
Hands-On learning thing what uh is there
00:27:40
anything that sticks out in your brain
00:27:41
where you're like okay I know this was I
00:27:43
mean you also to wear a homes school
00:27:44
kids so maybe it wasn't so like out of
00:27:46
the box thinking but like is there
00:27:48
anything that comes to your brain when
00:27:48
you go okay like we did this and this
00:27:51
was very like non-traditional school
00:27:54
style anything oh I would say reading
00:27:57
out out loud to my kids all of them
00:28:00
together okay and so that that also
00:28:02
plays into that kind of uh curriculum
00:28:05
that we used a few things that were it
00:28:07
was very literature-based and so you
00:28:09
would literally sit on the couch and all
00:28:12
the kids would come and listen to um you
00:28:15
know a book on on science and it would
00:28:18
be
00:28:19
somebody's story and how this scientists
00:28:23
discovered you know something and we
00:28:25
would read it together so my younger
00:28:27
kids you know they might not even be in
00:28:29
grade school yet but they would sit and
00:28:31
listen and um you know so yeah I would
00:28:36
say that's not super traditional but it
00:28:39
is a homeschool thing my mom did and and
00:28:42
so you're absorbing a lot and the little
00:28:45
kids maybe learn at a higher level and
00:28:49
they just get part of it they might not
00:28:51
get all of it but my two younger ones I
00:28:53
felt like they did they absorbed a ton
00:28:57
um but it would be interesting now to
00:28:59
quiz them on like what do you remember
00:29:01
from this because it might be totally
00:29:03
different than what I thought they were
00:29:04
getting you know so you said you would
00:29:06
read books that were maybe like maybe
00:29:10
fiction or like a biography more of a
00:29:12
story about somebody like in the science
00:29:14
realm right uh like Madame cury or
00:29:16
something like that right where it was
00:29:18
more of a story that would lead into
00:29:21
okay now we
00:29:22
understand yes this aspect of whatever
00:29:26
yeah but but some of the books were it
00:29:28
was part of the science curriculum that
00:29:30
we were using and so it would talk about
00:29:34
like so and so did this scientific
00:29:36
experiment and then this is what
00:29:38
happened so but it wo the story their
00:29:41
life story into it so it BEC in my
00:29:43
opinion it was more interesting just
00:29:46
this is the scientific experiment that
00:29:48
came out of it absolutely I mean I
00:29:51
like that I think it's so much better to
00:29:54
learn through sometimes the lens of like
00:29:56
trying to see the world through the
00:29:57
person uh as opposed to reading a
00:29:59
textbook can just be very boring
00:30:03
daunting dry um yeah when my family we
00:30:07
did a similar thing we would read all
00:30:08
together and read like I remember
00:30:10
reading we were learn about lwis and
00:30:11
Clark and we read a whole book that was
00:30:14
kind of through the lens of sakaia and
00:30:16
and kind of experiencing that whole
00:30:18
thing and yeah maybe the book wasn't
00:30:20
100% accurate but it was pretty close
00:30:22
you know and then we could kind of weave
00:30:24
out you know and and carve out some of
00:30:26
the stuff that maybe wasn't as accurate
00:30:28
WR and it just tied in with the textbook
00:30:29
a lot nicer sometimes to be like okay I
00:30:32
I can picture this now um and I think
00:30:35
that's sometimes the hardest thing about
00:30:37
learning
00:30:39
is we have a learning system in our
00:30:42
country right now that's very like
00:30:44
regurgitative right where it's just like
00:30:46
you you learn it you just vomit it back
00:30:49
out and then you don't really ever have
00:30:50
to deal with it again and and but when
00:30:53
you can tie things into something that
00:30:54
people actually like care about well all
00:30:57
of a sudden it's like going to stick a
00:30:58
lot more with people than just kind of
00:31:01
this like
00:31:02
regurgitative mess right and sure oh
00:31:05
yeah um yeah but that was but it's
00:31:08
interesting because while that's
00:31:11
important when I got to college I
00:31:14
realized that I had to learn how to just
00:31:16
like regurgitate information very
00:31:18
quickly because it was vastly different
00:31:20
because I was like I can't give a crap
00:31:22
about any of this stuff anymore because
00:31:24
it was everything was so much faster um
00:31:27
where I was like I just have to be able
00:31:28
to like memorize it for 24 hours put put
00:31:31
it down on paper get an A on the test
00:31:33
and move on like yeah and part of life
00:31:35
is like that like we eventually they
00:31:38
were taking classes at Ventura College
00:31:40
and so you just had to eek it out and
00:31:44
you did get timed on stuff and I I very
00:31:47
much stayed away from that because I
00:31:49
thought it produced so much anxiety like
00:31:51
the time test but eventually they did
00:31:53
have to do some of that I did want to
00:31:56
ask you about that too because your kids
00:31:58
were some of I know it wasn't uncommon
00:32:00
for The Homeschool kids to go take
00:32:02
classes at VC but within I don't even I
00:32:07
don't even say within the hes School
00:32:08
group it was UN or in the ohigh valley
00:32:10
it was uncommon but I I didn't do that
00:32:12
but what at what point did you kind of
00:32:14
make that decision of like okay hey
00:32:16
they're going to go take this class at
00:32:17
VC or like what led to to that I think
00:32:21
necessity because I couldn't teach them
00:32:25
the like upper level anything okay and
00:32:28
and then it was the dual enroll thing
00:32:31
and that they could go to VC for free
00:32:33
and then get those high school credits
00:32:35
so so with Dair it was we started later
00:32:39
because I was still homeschooling all
00:32:41
the younger ones and it just was impr
00:32:43
practical to drive him there but so I
00:32:46
think he was about 16 or something when
00:32:48
he started taking classes and so like he
00:32:51
could get art he could get um I think he
00:32:55
took a an English class I I don't
00:32:56
remember all the things he took but but
00:32:59
with my youngest I mean Mia was taking
00:33:02
uh cie was get I think cie had already
00:33:05
graduated and was taking her GES so she
00:33:09
was taking a math class and Mia took it
00:33:12
with her so MIA was way younger I think
00:33:14
she was ninth grade and and it was so
00:33:17
amazing because they had a great teacher
00:33:21
and I think they both I mean they could
00:33:23
correct me here but I think they both
00:33:24
went from feeling not super smart in
00:33:27
math to feeling like oh I love math
00:33:30
because this teacher was so amazing and
00:33:33
so they they took uh one summer it was
00:33:35
like a an accelerated uh class with two
00:33:40
two classes in one over the summer um so
00:33:43
it it was mostly because I didn't feel
00:33:45
at all qualified to teach those things
00:33:47
and why not get it free uh than going to
00:33:50
like a private tutor and paying so much
00:33:53
money you know I mean group Solutions
00:33:55
and Achieve had kind of built some of
00:33:56
that like classroom set for a lot of us
00:33:58
but going I mean my first time ever
00:34:01
entering a college class I was like I
00:34:04
was overwhelmed I was like there's so
00:34:05
many people in here and like but it t i
00:34:08
very quickly picked up the like okay
00:34:10
this is how this functions but to have
00:34:12
done that in ninth grade I think would
00:34:14
have I think it would have set me up
00:34:15
even more
00:34:17
for success I guess um so that's good
00:34:21
that's I don't know I I was I I don't
00:34:24
know I was just always interested why
00:34:25
people chose to do that over uh you know
00:34:29
because some people just stayed at home
00:34:30
like I did I just I was at home the
00:34:31
whole time yeah but your mom your mom
00:34:34
also had a college degree this is true
00:34:37
and so yeah and I think I always felt a
00:34:40
little bit of that like impostor
00:34:42
syndrome maybe like what am I doing I I
00:34:46
I'm very much a
00:34:48
selftaught person and I think that's a
00:34:51
the beauty of homeschooling like you
00:34:53
have to learn on your own because I mean
00:34:55
in our family my mom had all these other
00:34:56
kids so we had to be self-taught to a
00:34:59
certain extent and that that helps you
00:35:02
in life quite a bit if you're a
00:35:04
self-starter and you go pursue things
00:35:06
you're interested in um yeah so I just I
00:35:11
feel like I I had a little bit of that
00:35:14
uh where I just didn't feel confident
00:35:17
like I don't I don't remember that math
00:35:19
I I was okay at algebra but it' been so
00:35:21
many years that I was like let them do
00:35:24
it and then they get the dual and roll
00:35:26
thing and that was part of the maybe
00:35:29
where my kids felt pressured like go get
00:35:31
started in college you can get these
00:35:33
credits for free and then you're already
00:35:35
on your way to a degree so that could
00:35:38
have been where some of the pressure was
00:35:41
um I mean I think Mia feels
00:35:44
like I I just think it was good that she
00:35:46
was with cie because I think it would
00:35:48
have been super overwhelming for to
00:35:50
throw her into a math class by herself
00:35:53
at 14 so Callie was a big buffer there
00:35:57
because she'd been taking classes you
00:35:59
know for for as much as we had The
00:36:01
Homeschool Group and we had friends and
00:36:03
like we were not the unsocialized
00:36:04
homeschoolers that most people hear
00:36:06
about there is still that
00:36:09
like there's a real anxiety around
00:36:12
sometimes like entering into a classroom
00:36:13
for the first time or being put in a
00:36:15
situation where you're like okay I have
00:36:16
to kind of like be normal quote unquote
00:36:19
I mean also ninth grade going to a
00:36:21
college level
00:36:23
class probably a little bit overwhelming
00:36:25
Community College is nice in that you
00:36:28
get such a wide range of like anybody
00:36:31
and everybody is there there's high
00:36:33
school kids to there's full-fledged
00:36:35
adults in their 40s and 50s who are you
00:36:37
know finally fulfilling their dream of
00:36:39
getting a degree so it's like um get a
00:36:42
little bit more of a gamut there but
00:36:44
yeah
00:36:45
but I don't know that's that's
00:36:48
interesting and Cali and Mia you guys
00:36:50
are welcome to come on the show um I'm
00:36:51
going to throw that out here now if you
00:36:53
felt like listening to your mom's
00:36:55
interview but please come on the show
00:36:56
because um you can set your mom's uh
00:36:59
story straight that's right I might not
00:37:02
listen to it but no I would have to I
00:37:06
too curious that's been one of the cool
00:37:08
things about doing this show is getting
00:37:11
to now not only talk to the kids who
00:37:15
grew up with this but also now the
00:37:17
parents and getting to hear their side
00:37:18
of things
00:37:20
because I could sit here and complain
00:37:22
all day about my mom didn't do this or
00:37:24
my mom did this poorly or whatever right
00:37:26
um but being able to hear a parent
00:37:28
perspective on well I chose to do this
00:37:31
because of X I push my kid to do this
00:37:33
because of Y um I think that's important
00:37:36
and so thank you first of all for coming
00:37:39
on because it's not easy to get on
00:37:43
camera and be willing to put yourself
00:37:45
out there
00:37:47
um with that is there something that is
00:37:50
there a piece of advice you would give a
00:37:52
parent who is maybe early in their
00:37:54
homeschool career or thinking about
00:37:56
homeschooling their kid that you're like
00:37:57
like if I had just known maybe this one
00:37:59
thing it would have it would have
00:38:01
changed things or it was or maybe it was
00:38:03
a piece of advice you had been given
00:38:05
that you were just like okay this this
00:38:06
made things a lot easier well I mean
00:38:10
honestly I think the more the healthier
00:38:14
you are emotionally as a as a parent the
00:38:18
better you're going to do with your kids
00:38:20
and that's I mean that's so loaded it's
00:38:22
so hard when you're raising little kids
00:38:25
to like make time for therapy or make
00:38:28
time to uh process like hard stuff in
00:38:31
your life but but I honestly feel like
00:38:34
if we're not if we if we don't know how
00:38:37
to attune to them we're we're not going
00:38:40
to do a good job and so I kind
00:38:43
of you know I did try to be in therapy
00:38:47
back then but it was it was just a hard
00:38:50
time to do it both like takes time it
00:38:53
takes money it's expensive you don't
00:38:56
even I mean for me I didn't even know
00:38:57
myself then I feel like I've gotten to
00:39:00
know myself much better after like 40 um
00:39:04
but I would just say follow your gut
00:39:08
follow your gut don't read all the books
00:39:11
that say you have to do this or that
00:39:13
unless unless it like lines up with how
00:39:17
you already feel in your gut because
00:39:19
it's I just feel like when I gave into
00:39:22
peer pressure from other homeschool
00:39:24
parents because there's a ton of it um I
00:39:27
made poorer decisions and when I when I
00:39:31
like really um kind of focus on what
00:39:35
felt right it went better and what felt
00:39:39
right to me was like being with my kids
00:39:43
like sitting on the couch and and
00:39:46
reading and spending the time and
00:39:50
um I know that's super like Hoy toyy but
00:39:55
I I just feel like the
00:39:58
more I would just say pay attention to
00:40:00
your kids pay attention to their their
00:40:04
emotions and let them have big emotions
00:40:07
I feel like I did not do a good job of
00:40:10
that I was always trying like it's okay
00:40:12
it's okay rather than just like you're
00:40:14
upset it's okay to be upset you have
00:40:17
these big feelings it's okay so I would
00:40:19
say don't be
00:40:23
I I don't know it it's GNA so differ
00:40:26
with each person but if I could go back
00:40:29
and be like forget the curriculum today
00:40:32
my kid just needs to Vibe with me right
00:40:35
now and you know so hippie it out dude
00:40:41
that would be my
00:40:43
advice I love I love that advice that's
00:40:46
that's great I think you said some
00:40:48
really powerful things there of just
00:40:50
like being
00:40:51
it I think the reason a lot of people
00:40:54
want to homeschool their kids well
00:40:56
there's I think now there's really two
00:40:57
reasons but one of the main ones that I
00:40:59
hear from people is they're like I I
00:41:01
just want to have a good relationship
00:41:04
with my kids and whether that I think
00:41:06
just being able to spend time with your
00:41:07
kids is important and and it's valuable
00:41:10
and I think a lot of kids will look back
00:41:11
on that and go okay mom and dad cared
00:41:13
about me and they cared about you know
00:41:15
my emotions and my feelings and and it's
00:41:18
never too late that's the other thing
00:41:19
it's never too late I mean my dad and I
00:41:21
can still hang out to this day um and
00:41:24
it's not always been that way um so
00:41:28
no that's super powerful the other thing
00:41:30
I wanted to ask you was about kind of
00:41:32
the transition out of being a homeschool
00:41:34
parent and
00:41:35
now all of your kids are graduated
00:41:38
they're they're full-fledged adults like
00:41:41
to go from okay I'm not only I'm Mom I'm
00:41:45
teacher I'm a wife I'm all these things
00:41:48
to okay like teaching is done now like
00:41:52
what how was that transition for you
00:41:54
like was there a morning period was
00:41:58
there uh like I'm unsure what to do now
00:42:01
like I don't was it a was it a difficult
00:42:03
transition or do you feel like you had
00:42:05
kind of like I don't know accepted it
00:42:08
building building up as as time went on
00:42:11
well I think it it was pretty uh gradual
00:42:15
I uh when Mia so I just had Mia left and
00:42:20
she was taking all of her classes at
00:42:23
ventur college she was probably 16 at
00:42:24
the time and I started volunteering in
00:42:27
at the church where I work now
00:42:30
and and and so I would drop her off at
00:42:33
Ventura College and I'd go volunteer in
00:42:35
the office doing administrative stuff
00:42:38
and then pick her up and we'd go home
00:42:40
and so I was I was volunteering probably
00:42:42
three hours at a time a couple days a
00:42:45
week and then that turned into a job I
00:42:48
was offered like a 20-hour week job and
00:42:51
so it just it kind of gave me enough to
00:42:53
do that I wasn't as aware of the season
00:42:56
was ending
00:42:57
but then when it did end I think like
00:43:02
there's definitely been this grieving of
00:43:04
like I'm done I my kids are raised and
00:43:08
and then you start for me like I I think
00:43:11
of all the things I wish I'd done
00:43:13
differently and which is a you know a
00:43:16
spiral there um and so so anyway it was
00:43:20
gradual because I was volunteering and
00:43:22
then it turned into a job and and so it
00:43:24
was great and then you know they they
00:43:26
didn't need me at home and so I was at
00:43:28
work half the time and and then it
00:43:30
turned into a full-time job but um but
00:43:33
it was it was I kind of felt like God
00:43:36
was nice to me and being like here's
00:43:38
something for you to do so you're not
00:43:40
going to be a weepy like mom sitting at
00:43:43
home in a puddle you know no I really
00:43:45
just like I said I wanted to ask because
00:43:47
I think
00:43:49
that I watched my Mom struggle with the
00:43:52
transition out and if you want to hear
00:43:55
more about it go listen to the episode I
00:43:56
did with my mom cuz it it's I it was
00:44:00
interesting I didn't think about I I
00:44:02
hadn't thought about I went through
00:44:03
transitions right I moved to college and
00:44:05
I was doing all these things but yeah
00:44:06
her job essentially was going away so
00:44:09
it's nice that you kind of like like
00:44:11
well we kind of just transitioned it
00:44:12
just kind of this this pan you know
00:44:14
slowly panned out and this new thing
00:44:16
kind of came in and it gave me some
00:44:17
purpose and and that's important I think
00:44:22
because so
00:44:24
many I've said this on the show before I
00:44:26
think a lot of homeschool parents did
00:44:28
this the end goal was like get the kid
00:44:30
to the end of high school and like then
00:44:32
my job is done but nobody was prepping
00:44:35
for what was coming after so both the
00:44:37
kids sometimes struggled because they
00:44:39
were like I don't know where to go after
00:44:40
this and then I think the parents
00:44:41
sometimes struggled because they were
00:44:42
like well now I don't know where to go
00:44:44
after this um because that was it that
00:44:47
was the end goal um and maybe it's
00:44:50
easier for dads Because dads tend to
00:44:52
have a job that they're still working um
00:44:55
but for moms I think finding that thing
00:44:58
that you have a passion for and being
00:45:00
able to
00:45:01
transition that and and still have kind
00:45:03
of this like purpose and meaning uh is
00:45:06
important so that's not to say it's not
00:45:08
bumpy like yeah for sure bumpy like
00:45:12
navigating an adult relationship with
00:45:13
your kid and being knowing how to do it
00:45:16
because we we did and and honestly I
00:45:19
think it's easier in a way if your kid
00:45:21
goes
00:45:22
away um and then like Darry he was gone
00:45:25
at 20 and and he got to work through a
00:45:28
lot of his angst on his own and
00:45:33
sometimes that's a lot easier than your
00:45:34
kid is in your house working through
00:45:36
their angst with you yeah and then your
00:45:38
button heads a lot or whatever you know
00:45:40
so yeah um and and it's also nice that
00:45:44
it happens one at a time like they turn
00:45:46
18 one at a time and you know so you
00:45:50
grieve you grieve at different times and
00:45:53
it's you know so but I I love each of my
00:45:58
kids and I think they're amazing humans
00:46:00
and I just you know there's so much I
00:46:02
wish I could have I could go back and
00:46:05
change with the knowledge and the tools
00:46:06
I have now not that I'm killing it now
00:46:09
they will tell you I'm not but but I
00:46:12
feel like I'm like I'm
00:46:14
becoming you know a healthier person
00:46:18
little by little and so anyway hopefully
00:46:21
our adult relationships can can continue
00:46:24
to grow and and be good you know it's so
00:46:27
crazy to me
00:46:29
that I when I started the show I never I
00:46:32
didn't expect parents to resonate with
00:46:34
it as much I was like this is really
00:46:37
for the kids it's really for the 20year
00:46:40
olds and you know and some of the early
00:46:43
30 year olds um but I was like that's
00:46:45
that's who it's for and then I
00:46:47
immediately started getting messages
00:46:48
from parents yourself included who were
00:46:50
just like I'm also changing I'm learning
00:46:53
I'm like growing and it's like oh okay
00:46:58
and it took me a minute because I was
00:46:59
like I I'd already seen that in my
00:47:01
parents but I didn't
00:47:03
really I don't know you sometimes think
00:47:05
about other people's parents as just
00:47:07
like that's just who they are that's
00:47:08
just you know they're they're you know
00:47:11
Ruth Brooks will always be Ruth Brooks
00:47:13
in my eyes and not that you change like
00:47:15
drastically in like person personality
00:47:17
or anything like that but it's so
00:47:19
interesting to now hear from parents
00:47:21
that it's like they are also evolving
00:47:24
you know they're also changing they're
00:47:26
later stages of the life than I am and I
00:47:29
they can still help me they can still be
00:47:32
there for me um in different ways so um
00:47:36
so thank you again for being vulnerable
00:47:38
and and sharing your story with with us
00:47:41
today I really appreciate it you too you
00:47:44
too you set the stage Jacob just with
00:47:47
with the way you've been super
00:47:49
vulnerable that's it's just it's an
00:47:51
amazing thing so I appreciate all you've
00:47:53
shared thank you so
00:47:55
much I will ask you this are there any
00:48:00
homeschool stories that we did not touch
00:48:01
on that you're like oh my gosh this is
00:48:03
whether it's a cringey moment or just a
00:48:05
like super happy moment or anything like
00:48:08
that um we're not going to talk about my
00:48:10
red pants because that's that's been
00:48:12
beat to death on this but um here's your
00:48:14
opportunity to embarrass your kids if
00:48:16
you want to um but I will say this while
00:48:20
while you think about that the the
00:48:21
Brooks house for me was always a very
00:48:23
safe place uh I played Airsoft there a
00:48:26
lot community group with everybody there
00:48:28
at their house it was wonderful it was
00:48:30
wonderful experiences always um and I
00:48:33
don't really have any negatives about it
00:48:35
and I'm sure the house was not always
00:48:37
rainbows and unicorns but um but I say
00:48:41
that to say that one of the the great
00:48:43
things about being in a homeschool
00:48:45
Community was families like the Brooks
00:48:48
family um like other families in kids
00:48:51
who have been on the show they had safe
00:48:54
places for us to hang out and to to to
00:48:56
grow as people and and it was amazing so
00:48:59
thank you also for that oh for sure I'm
00:49:02
glad you felt that way I mean that's
00:49:04
always that's always what I was going
00:49:06
for but so I would say like one of the
00:49:10
best feelings for me was like you all
00:49:14
you boys out there playing
00:49:16
Airsoft and then I remember this one
00:49:18
time I think the guys were playing
00:49:20
Airsoft and cie had a couple little
00:49:23
girlfriends over and they were kaying in
00:49:25
the creek
00:49:27
do you remember that I want to say I
00:49:30
remember that I remember kayaking in
00:49:32
your creek and I yeah and I remember the
00:49:35
girls would hang out sometimes yeah I
00:49:36
just don't know like if those happened
00:49:39
at the same time but it for me as a mom
00:49:41
it was like no better feeling than to
00:49:44
have all my kids around having fun and
00:49:47
then their friends here you know at the
00:49:49
house too it was just such a a like
00:49:53
fulfilled feeling I loved it but it just
00:49:56
I thinking back I was like did they
00:49:58
kayak while the boys are playing Airsoft
00:50:00
because s a little bit dangerous but I
00:50:03
think it did happen once it's very
00:50:05
possible yeah and just said this SC the
00:50:08
scene too the Brooks house is built
00:50:10
almost on top of a river so there's a
00:50:13
river and brush and I know it looks very
00:50:16
different now but it was like a jungle
00:50:18
in their backyard so when we talk about
00:50:20
playing in the backyard it was like I
00:50:22
mean we would joke it was like Vietnam
00:50:24
like we crawling through brdes bushes
00:50:27
and all kinds of stuff but it was like
00:50:29
some of the most fun was had in your
00:50:31
backyard um I know for myself and for a
00:50:34
bunch of a bunch of homeschool kids so
00:50:37
yeah there were be kids that showed up
00:50:39
that I KN had no idea who they were but
00:50:42
they would heard about I was like oh
00:50:44
that kid must be from like CB Valley or
00:50:47
something like I would I'd only see them
00:50:50
at the airsoft battle yeah oh my gosh
00:50:54
well Ruth thank you once again um
00:50:57
before I close any last words anything
00:50:59
else I mean You' shared so much already
00:51:01
but um well I would I would like to say
00:51:05
that if if my other kids come on they
00:51:08
can say whatever they want about me and
00:51:10
I will just suck it up and be like yes
00:51:13
this is your truth I didn't mean to
00:51:15
screw you up but this is your truth no
00:51:18
but but seriously I would hope that they
00:51:20
could come on and know that I will be
00:51:22
fine with whatever they say because I
00:51:25
was a I was I did not have it together
00:51:29
and anyway you should hear Mia mimic
00:51:33
me okay Mia you gotta come on the show
00:51:36
we're we're gonna we're gonna put you to
00:51:37
the test um yeah this and and that goes
00:51:41
for any homeschoolers out there if you
00:51:42
guys want to be on the show if you want
00:51:44
your parent to be on the show like reach
00:51:45
out to me I mean I don't bite I promise
00:51:48
um there's two really great ways to do
00:51:50
that you can either DM me on Instagram
00:51:52
that's exhs Club um or you can email me
00:51:55
at exex [email protected] and just say hey
00:51:59
what's up I want to come on the show or
00:52:00
if you don't want to come on the show
00:52:01
but you still want to share a story i'
00:52:03
would love to hear that as well um aside
00:52:06
from that I also there's a survey down
00:52:08
below I forgot to mention at the top of
00:52:09
the show survey at the top of the show
00:52:12
it's a link it's got a couple questions
00:52:13
just about things we can do on the show
00:52:15
better for you where we can build a
00:52:17
community all those great things this
00:52:19
has been the exom schoolers club and uh
00:52:21
yeah until next time I'll see you all
00:52:23
right peace
00:52:26
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00:52:31
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00:52:37
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