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GameChanger [Music] [Applause] [Music] [Applause] welcome to True Crime garage wherever
00:01:43
you are whatever you are doing thanks for listening I'm your host Nick and with me as always much like William H
00:01:48
Bonnie AKA Billy the Kid my co-host promises he'll make you famous he is the captain
00:01:56
Regulators Mount up it's good to be and it's good to see you thanks for listening thanks for telling a
00:02:03
[Music] friend today we are drinking Jesse James Most Wanted by Aftershock Brewing
00:02:14
Company garage grade four out of five bottle caps this is a very smooth Stout with an ABV of 12% so if you're drinking
00:02:22
this bad boy make sure your horse knows its way home also this is rare it's a hard to find beer so if you locate and
00:02:28
try Jesse James Most Wanted and check it in on the untapped app make sure you snap a picture because no one will
00:02:35
believe you and this hardto find bad boy was apprehended and brought to us by the
00:02:39
following you know we had the captain deputize a few of our members of True Crime garage Army you have to have to
00:02:45
keep Parts Unknown safe right Captain that's what we got to do right there first up we have Deputy Luke from
00:02:51
primont Australia next we have Deputy Allison from lower Bureau Pennsylvania and over the pond we have Dena from
00:02:58
London we like your G we have a message here from a happy Tracy in Tustin California Tracy says she sent a note
00:03:06
referencing an older episode Captain where you said you were going to quit the show so happy Trac working on it she
00:03:12
says you are not allowed to quit Captain because if you jump she jumps so hopefully nobody's jumping off of
00:03:18
anything we're going to have a jumping party off the bridge at parts unknown and last but not least we have Deputy
00:03:24
Justin in papalon Nebraska I looked that up I wanted to make sure it was a real place because sometimes I think people
00:03:31
are just sending in fake cities making them up so so I screw up and struggle to pronounce their names we have fake
00:03:37
captains and fake Parts Unknown with fake jibs well thanks everybody for filling up the fridge for this week's
00:03:44
show if you want to buy us around for next week's show go to True Crim garage.com and click on the Donate
00:03:49
button and if you'd like to get a special team Nick shirt they're available now on the merch page at true
00:03:56
Crim garage.com all right Captain that's enough of the business business everybody gather around grab a chair
00:04:01
grab a beer let's talk some true [Music] crime the FBI is seeking your help to apprehend the following
00:04:36
individuals Robert William fiser allegedly killed his wife and two children and blew up their house in
00:04:44
Scottdale Arizona in 2001 Eduardo rello charged with the murders of pregnant US Consulate employee her
00:04:55
husband and a friend in Mexico 7 years ago Yasser SED is wanted for allegedly murdering
00:05:06
his two teenage daughters the girls died of multiple gunshot wounds on January 1st
00:05:14
2008 Walter yavan Gomez is wanted for his alleged involvement in the brutal murder of a man in planfield New Jersey
00:05:23
in May of 2011 the victim was struck in the head numerous times his throat was cut and he
00:05:31
was stabbed 17 times in the back Luis meedo a Latin King's gang member is wanted for his alleged
00:05:40
involvement in the death of a 15-year-old boy in Chicago Illinois on May 1st 2009 the victim was beaten shot
00:05:50
and set on fire badrish Kumar Patel the FBI is offering a $200,000 reward for the arrest of bad Rish Kamar
00:06:00
he is wanted for allegedly killing his wife by striking her multiple times with an object while the two were working at
00:06:07
a donut shop in Hover Maryland on April 12th 2015 for more information visit fbi.gov
00:06:17
slanted these are just some of the most Wanted men in America and this is true crime
00:06:25
[Music] garage [Music] we want to do something a little different on this episode we wanted to
00:06:47
dive into the FBI's top 10 most wanted list yeah we grew up being fans of the shows Unsolved Mysteries in America's
00:06:55
Most Wanted and so kind of paying a little bit of a tribute to those two shows you know there there is this list
00:07:02
this living breathing list that's provided to us by the FBI and anybody at any time can go to their website and
00:07:08
look at the photos of these wanted individuals read about the stories and it's something that I think that not a
00:07:14
lot of us are paying attention to and we got a lot of web sthers out there we got
00:07:18
this whole community of people looking for these terrible people that we talk about every week but there's this list
00:07:24
there's this list of people that we should be hunting yeah and I it's a list that I haven't checked out in a while
00:07:30
but going back to the Unsolved Mysteries in America's Most Wanted if you could host if you could revive one of those
00:07:36
shows and you could be the host which show would you pick well see here's the thing Captain I would 100% without
00:07:43
without fault I I immediately would pick Unsolved Mysteries oh yeah choice I mean
00:07:49
Robert Stack's voice is so incredibly good just because you're the host doesn't mean you get a sound like Robert
00:07:54
Stack well right right and but that's what scares me it would be very big shoes to f Phil you know what I mean he
00:08:01
did such a good job with that and he he was like creepy enough that it that added to the creep factor of the show
00:08:07
well Colonel I think you're uh creepy enough to fill his creepy shoes well I I will take that as a compliment well it
00:08:14
really wasn't a compliment but let's uh let's dive into the history and some of the cases that Fascinate us on the FBI's
00:08:21
most wanted list for over 60 years the FBI has sought The public's assistance in a very special way through one of
00:08:28
their most most effective longest running publicity programs the top most wanted fugitives list in 1949 a reporter
00:08:37
this is James Donovan he asked the FBI to identify the toughest guys that they were investigating at the time the FBI
00:08:46
provided him with photos of 10 dangerous fugitives which he then published on the
00:08:51
front page of the Washington Daily News the top 10 list was extremely popular at
00:08:57
the time and several of the fugitives were C captured as a result so during the following year the FBI they
00:09:03
formalized its 10 most wanted fugitives publicity program which since 1950 has led to the location of hundreds of our
00:09:12
nation's most dangerous criminals they have an they have over a 90% success rate when they place somebody on the
00:09:19
list of apprehending them which is a high percentage but one of the criteria is they put these individuals that they
00:09:25
think the public can help them capture yes that's right and what go through the criteria of how someone ends up on the
00:09:32
list according to the FBI but uh from the director you know the director states that the FBI's top 10 program it
00:09:39
celebrates not only the FBI success story but it emphasizes the need for citizen cooperation in the fight against
00:09:47
Crime MH the 10 most that's where we come in that's what we're doing that's what we're doing that's what we're doing
00:09:52
right now right here the 10 most wanted fugitives program tracks the evolution of crime of the crime problem in America
00:10:01
while the list began with bank robbers and murder suspects fleeing State jurisdiction it has recently involved
00:10:07
into a search for major organized crime figures serial killers domestic and international terrorists cyber criminals
00:10:15
and white collar criminals and it seems like a lot in the last 5 to 10 years have actually been terrorists yeah
00:10:21
during the last 17 years the list has Illustrated the international scope of crime as well as the importance of
00:10:29
strong Global Partnerships in the search for terrorists sexual predators human traffickers and other violent criminals
00:10:36
who pose a significant danger to us all right so the FBI program is evolving correct So Gone are the days when the
00:10:43
top 10 posters could be found in post offices since 1996 the top 10 posters have appeared on the FBI's Internet site
00:10:51
that is www.fbi.gov uh you know this obviously to reach across borders uh sometimes these people
00:11:00
these criminals will flee to other countries and we need worldwide help to apprehend these guys well it seems like
00:11:06
the FBI is also getting hip with social media yeah they've used things like Facebook uh Twitter I believe there's
00:11:13
there's even a FBI app where you can keep track of the top 10 list and and who's on it and who we should be looking
00:11:20
for in the first 60 years of this FBI list there were 494 fugitives that appeared on the top 10 list
00:11:29
and during that 60 years 463 of them had been located now I do want to be clear about this because not all of the
00:11:37
fugitives have been arrested out of that 463 some of these people surrendered uh
00:11:43
other others have been found deceased MH or they may have been found innocent you
00:11:49
know at some point where they thought that this person was guilty of a crime and they were seeking him or her then
00:11:55
later evidence comes out the point that they're not actually the P the guilty party can you imagine being on that list
00:12:01
like being that guy that's being the guy that's like you know uh we got the captain from True Crime garage on the
00:12:08
top 10 list I'd be I'd be I'd be [ __ ] in my pants my friend all right so what is
00:12:14
the criteria to be on the list I get there's two primary criteria used to determine who should be placed on this
00:12:21
list first The Fugitive must be particularly dangerous uh a menace to society and or have a length record of
00:12:29
committing serious crimes secondly as you pointed out the FBI must believe that Nationwide publicity will assist in
00:12:37
apprehending The Fugitive right so here's how they come up with this list Captain they they have many FBI offices
00:12:45
that are involved in selecting the fugitives who will make it on the list the criminal investigative division the
00:12:51
CID at FBI headquarters they contact all of their other field offices in an effort to solicit the most dangerous
00:12:59
fugitives for consideration so they basically all kind of nominate somebody and then they review the nominees and
00:13:06
decide who is going to be on the list well and off the Record earlier weren't you saying that there's no like one
00:13:13
through 10 I believe so like I I always thought of this list when you hear top 10 lists you hear like oh this is the
00:13:19
most Wanted guy Public Enemy Number One right and the list doesn't appear to me to be a number one two or three uh
00:13:27
anytime I click on there or go to their website the the order seems to change uh
00:13:32
who's on there so I think you're really just on the top 10 list you're not really they're not ranking these guys so
00:13:39
right CU forever we heard you know Osama Bin Laden was the number one most wanted
00:13:44
you know man uh by our government by our FBI and that may be the case or may have
00:13:49
been the case at the time I don't know if they've changed the way that they format the thing um but unless a top
00:13:55
tener is captured found dead or Surrender uh there that's the only way those are
00:14:01
the only conditions of getting removed from the list cuz one of the cases that we're going to dive into what I when
00:14:08
we're looking at the list he was in the number one spot MH and when you look into his crime I mean you know he's a
00:14:14
hideous person but you know it's almost like really that's all that's all you have to do to get to the number one spot
00:14:21
yeah well I would encourage everybody to go to fbi.gov and dive more into this you can look into the CR and look about
00:14:29
the history of the list and people that have been apprehended throughout the years uh one thing that I found
00:14:35
particularly interesting when I was reading about this was where they located some of these fugitives um this
00:14:42
is this is right off of their website says while many of the top teners apparently stay close to the crime you
00:14:48
know one in one in six fugitives never left the city where they committed their crime but 2/3 were eventually
00:14:56
apprehended far from the location of their crime in fact more than 40% of the top 10 fugitives have been apprehended
00:15:04
outside of the United States right but not anybody there was no individual from the list that was found in Parts Unknown
00:15:11
no that's correct just to let you know that's exactly right well one of the famous let's talk about one of the
00:15:16
famous cases from the top 10 list uh this is a man named William Raymond Nesbit on December not my favorite one
00:15:25
but we'll start with this one okay on December 22nd 19 36 William Raymond Nesbit together with three other men
00:15:32
including a man named Harold Baker and his girlfriend they burglarized a wholesale jewelry company at Sous City
00:15:40
Iowa well the company reported more than $37,000 worth of jewels that had been stolen later that month all of the
00:15:48
participants drove to minihaha county in South Dakota so if anybody's in South Dakota and I completely butchered that
00:15:55
County send us an email that's the actual name of the County I'm moving there F this is 5 miles east of sou Fall
00:16:02
South Dakota M they did this in order to obtain some Dynamite to make nitroglycerin okay at once they arrive
00:16:12
and then they get out of the car three of the men became involved in a fight the girlfriend this is Harold Baker's
00:16:18
girlfriend she got out of the automobile and attempted to stop the fight as she did so William Raymond Nesbit struck her
00:16:25
in the head with a hammer several times and one of the other men then shot her she was dragged into a powder house now
00:16:34
Baker Harold Baker he was knocked unconscious during this fight and he was drugged into that powder house as well
00:16:41
well one of the men in the group he lit a fuse to some powder and fled the scene
00:16:46
Baker's girlfriend although she had been severely beaten and shot uh she was able
00:16:50
to crawl away the fuse exploded this this blew up 3,500 lb of dynamite and 70 I'm sorry 7,000 PBS of black powder this
00:17:01
killed Harold Baker the explosion was huge it it rocked the country side it shattered Windows mirrors and glasswar
00:17:09
in sou Falls which remember we said was 5 miles away well while the police were conducting an investigation to determine
00:17:17
what had caused the blast they were advised that a woman had been brought to the hospital and she was suffering from
00:17:23
bullet wounds and shock the invest and those you know Hammer to the face hits you know she's suffering from those too
00:17:31
well the investigation revealed information concerning the three men including William Raymond nezbit who had
00:17:37
been responsible for the murder of Baker and for shooting uh Baker's girlfriend Nesbit was apprehended in Oklahoma City
00:17:45
Oklahoma this was on February 26th 1937 he was returned to sou Falls where he was tried and convicted for murder
00:17:55
and he received life imprisonment in South Dakota State Penitentiary mhm now 9 years later nesbit's life term was
00:18:03
commuted to a 20 20year sentence that's ridiculous yeah well listen to this I blew this guy up with
00:18:10
dynamite and you're going to give me 20 years yeah and nesbet during this term had become a trustee and eventually was
00:18:19
allowed to leave the prison to perform housework landscaping and duties as a chauffeur wellow that's ridiculous so
00:18:26
you got this you got this uh jewelry Thief turned murderer who's now driving people around town on September
00:18:34
4th 1946 uh when the night check was made at the penitentiary Nesbit was missing on
00:18:41
December 26th 1946 a federal complaint was filed before the United States commissioner at Rapid City South Dakota
00:18:49
charging William res William Raymond Nesbit with unlawful flight to avoid confinement and a warrant was issued for
00:18:56
his arrest right and then once they issue this warrant the FBI is going to get involved at this point yeah they're
00:19:01
going to be looking for Nesbit in March of 1950 a news article which carried a picture of nesbet together with his
00:19:10
description and fugitive status was published in a St Paul Minesota newspaper as well as other newspapers
00:19:16
around the country on Friday afternoon March 17th a 14-year-old boy arrived home from school and he noticed a
00:19:24
newspaper on the kitchen floor as he looked at the paper he noted that the photograph of nesbet and the
00:19:32
accompanying article advising nesbet was wanted by the FBI so this boy and his 13-year-old friend they spent a lot of
00:19:41
time playing along the Mississippi Riverbank in St Paul Minnesota with other boys from the neighborhood well
00:19:47
over the past few months they had become acquainted with a guy that they called Reay who lived in a cave on the
00:19:57
riverbank yeah they would visit they would visit this Ray guy about once a week I wonder how many times they told
00:20:04
their parents about Ray uh we hang out with Ry oh that's nice dear where does Ry live oh he lives in a cave yeah they
00:20:11
parents think that Ry is some created some uh creation of their imagination right uh well for during this four-month
00:20:18
time period they would visit this Ray guy you know when anytime they were down by the river they said about once a week
00:20:25
they would see Ray and he would allow them access to his cave uh occasionally telling them stories about his travels
00:20:34
about his life and finally in early March of 1950 Ry then he didn't want to see any of the boys anymore he told them
00:20:42
that they needed to stay away from the cave because it was a dangerous area they were likely to get hurt well yeah
00:20:48
you know Ray became like a motivational speaker you know he kept on saying you you guys don't want to end up like me
00:20:54
you don't want to be living in a cave down by the river well and you have to wonder if Ray came up with this at about
00:21:00
the same time that the newspaper article came out with his face and picture on it
00:21:05
m well the the 14-year-old boy he cut out the article uh from the newspaper believing that the man in the photograph
00:21:12
was Ray Ray from The Cave yep and the boy took the article to his friends and showed them the article and they agreed
00:21:20
that it looked like this Ray character well the next day the boys went down to the cave to make sure that Ry was indeed
00:21:27
the man in the photograph they then after seeing him confirmed their belief they then phoned the police and told
00:21:36
them of their suspicion so on that Saturday morning this is just March 18th 1950 just two days after William Raymond
00:21:45
nesbet was placed on the top 10 list well he was apprehended by St Paul police due to the courage and bravery of
00:21:55
these two young boys that had seen his picture mhm that would make one heck of a like a dramatization if they took that
00:22:03
and just made that little part a movie mhm you know a 13 and 14-year-old you know seeing this you know this is Ray
00:22:10
from The Cave but this guy is on the FBI's uh most wanted list Ray from the cave and we got to we got to go down
00:22:18
there and confront him mhm I mean that's oh man can you imagine the terror that was in there Their little bodies you
00:22:27
know what I wonder about that though Captain I wonder if you know of course they weren't too young to have fear but
00:22:32
you almost wonder if they fully understood the in comprehended the the gravity of the subject yeah that they
00:22:39
could be placing themselves in immediate danger well this is kind of showing the
00:22:43
history of how it works and and and how they implement it yeah and how quickly somebody can be apprehended once they're
00:22:50
placed on the list yeah you said what a couple days yeah it was just two days after they showed the uh newspaper
00:22:56
article what another really interesting case is Robert Van whis now he was wed for murder for I believe 30 years or so
00:23:05
MH uh before he actually ended up on the list well and I'm going take some of this story from a uh this is adapted
00:23:12
from a new story from K view which is an ABC affiliate um back in 2015 now this story takes place in
00:23:20
Austin Texas now more for more than three decades after a brutal murder in South Austin Police say that they knew
00:23:28
who had did it but the suspect was still not in custody in September of 1983 employees at the South Austin
00:23:36
office building got to work and discovered 22-year-old Lori Stout in the men's restroom she had been sexually
00:23:44
assaulted strangled and suffocated now Lori Stout who is she she owned a cleaning business along with her husband
00:23:52
and she had been working that night in the building and she died that night uh she was murdered this happened at an
00:23:59
office building on South First Street near the US Highway 290 now back in the 1980s the University of Texas they had
00:24:08
offices there so this is where UT students would be signing up for classes and so this building was open late that
00:24:16
night so there are many people coming in and out of the building that evening right so this is the this is the
00:24:22
University of Texas this the Longhorns right yeah big giant University we we talk about Texas a lot it's a big state
00:24:30
Lots going on so one of the students that was in and out of the building that night was 18-year-old Robert Van whis
00:24:38
everyone who was in the building that night after they discovered the murder I think that his friends called him young
00:24:43
Wheezy young Wheezy Young Weezy young van Wheezy old young Wheezy well after the the victim was discovered everybody
00:24:53
that was in the building that night they were questioned and this included 18y old van whis uh he was there late
00:25:00
registering for a class uh that he was going to attend at the University at the time he taking computer probably that's
00:25:07
what most people sign up for um he was given fingerprinting and some kind of DNA test right but he wasn't apprehended
00:25:15
at this time right right because they have to process the fingerprints and the DNA yeah and they really had nothing to
00:25:20
hold him on and it wasn't until later that they were able to match his fingerprints with fingerprints found at
00:25:27
the crime scene and do we know if they were able to match the DNA or not well let's get into that let's uh introduce
00:25:34
Angel palansky she was with the Austin Police Department now there's a few things that she she's got a lot of
00:25:40
opinions about this case she's worked this case for a long time saying that you know this was a case that they
00:25:46
talked about daily at their Department it was one that they believed was going to be solved and then later once they
00:25:52
had the evidence they really felt that they knew who had committed this crime it was all about a apprehending this
00:25:58
person so what happens here Captain is not only are those fingerprints found at the crime scene but according to
00:26:05
palansky the fingerprints are in locations that are very damning to him uh there what ended up happening too
00:26:14
this is a bit strange but she added that A lab technician had misread the DNA originally and this ruled out van whis
00:26:23
it wasn't until 1992 that another investigator realized that there was mistake so they went back and they were
00:26:30
able to get familial DNA which ended up connecting van whis to this case so this
00:26:36
solidifies their theory that they had the right guy right but when you hear stories like that I mean doesn't it just
00:26:43
make you question The credibility of the system yeah it it does but but we're humans you know we're all flawed people
00:26:51
make mistakes speak for yourself uh the police believe that that van whis left the country before they
00:26:58
could apprehend him now the next challenging thing would be of course locating him and then they believe that
00:27:04
he had he had gone to Mexico well let me guess he was living in a cave down by the river I don't think that was the
00:27:12
case no but not only was the problem finding him but also a big problem would be if he was to be located in Mexico
00:27:20
would law enforcement they extradite him back to the United States yeah they have
00:27:25
to be cooperative with us a US Marsh's supervisory detective says that this could be a long cumbersome process it
00:27:33
could take months it could take even years you know van whis init initially faced the death penalty but
00:27:39
investigators were going to have to lessen the charge if they did locate him in Mexico and wanted to get him back
00:27:45
because Mexico does not agree with our death penalty as a punishment and they're very upfront about not agreeing
00:27:51
to even consider extradition of any Mexican national that has a capital murder at as the charge or death penalty
00:27:59
as the possible uh possibility of punishment yeah that's very interesting well what they ended up doing Captain is
00:28:05
just that right so they uh regarding van whis they lessened the charge and his punishment was going to carry a life
00:28:15
sentence right uh once that changed the FBI and the US Marshals were working very hard to find him well after 32
00:28:25
years it wasn't going to be easy and then let me throw this at you too investigators only had one picture of
00:28:33
Van whis this was him at the age of 18 you know so of course he's going to look a lot different after 32 years and yeah
00:28:44
or he could be like Ralph machio and he looks exactly the same I think Ralph is sleeping in tupperware he's he's holding
00:28:51
it together very well the other thing though all of the lead investigators like I said they believe that they knew
00:28:56
who did this from the get-go from very early on in this crime investigation and their big concern was you know they
00:29:03
didn't want him to hurt anybody else you know in 32 years you have to sit back and wonder well I hope he hasn't raped
00:29:11
anybody else or murdered anyone else during that time that's of course a big concern for us all well and I think the
00:29:17
other concern was that his family lived in the area and they weren't being cooperative with police or FBI so then
00:29:24
they were wondering right if they're like sponsoring him if they're supporting him yeah they would offer the
00:29:29
police no help with their investigation to find their family member well you know but in their defense I mean you
00:29:35
have one DNA comes back and it's read wrong quote unquote so H how can you be for sure that these fingerprints match
00:29:44
him and if they don't then therefore you know he's innocent I mean that would be
00:29:48
a simple argument right why are you running from the law well the they say my fingerprints match but they don't and
00:29:56
they said before for that my DNA didn't match and now they're saying it does MHM
00:30:01
yeah there I can see both sides of the coin there but you know he fits the criteria very well for being on the list
00:30:08
because he's would be considered a dangerous fugitive and second of all he's somebody that it seems very obvious
00:30:14
that they need the Public's assistance in apprehending this guy especially if he did flee the country right but this
00:30:21
is all going to change December 13th 2016 yeah because they're going to Place van whis on the FBI's most wanted list
00:30:31
uh he becomes the 511th person added to the list and after that takes place well
00:30:36
it doesn't take very long Captain because on January 26 2017 uh he surrenders to us officials in
00:30:45
Laredo Texas at the Mexican border now on March 28th 2017 van whis pled guilty to murder and was sentenced to 30 years
00:30:55
in prison ha gotcha gotcha so that's where you can see a guy that's wanted for a crime for over 30 years he's
00:31:03
placed on the list and it's what about 45 days later approximately that he surrenders and ultimately pleads guilty
00:31:11
to having committed this crime all right so 90% of the time it works all the time
00:31:17
all right let's get right back to this right after this quick beer [Music] break
00:31:28
[Music] this show is sponsored by better help do you look forward to the holidays maybe
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to answer call us at 1888 [Music] Freedom all right we're back cheers mate cheers so we are going to feature some
00:33:44
persons that are wanted by the FBI these are straight off of their list so these
00:33:49
are live cases Active cases we encourage everyone to go to fbi.gov wanted and do your part you know look at
00:33:57
the faces read the stories because just like Robert Stack used to say who knows maybe you could solve a mystery yeah but
00:34:05
he'd say it way cooler than that you're you're right he would so first on our list let's talk about a guy named Jason
00:34:10
Derek Brown uh a little background on him he was born in 1969 he's an American fugitive wanted
00:34:18
for first-degree murder armed robbery in Phoenix Arizona this took place November
00:34:24
29th 2004 on December 8th 2007 he was named by the FBI as their 489th fugitive to be placed on the 10 most wed list now
00:34:36
of course Brown is considered armed and extremely dangerous um like we said he was born in California back in
00:34:43
1969 uh he attended the lagona beach High School Brown speaks fluent French and he has a master's degree in
00:34:51
international business well he actually should be called like the MTV killer and
00:34:57
I say that because one Laguna Beach M right wasn't there a show called Laguna Beach I think so and then uh so there's
00:35:05
that part uh typical you know it seems like kind of a a richy rich white guy but the funny thing is is for a while he
00:35:12
was trying to rock the poly d uh from Jersey Shore haircut well he grew up a bit of a privileged lifestyle um he
00:35:20
served a mission for the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints in Paris France from 198 to
00:35:27
1990 uh so when we say he's fluent in French he's extremely fluent in French uh between 1990 and 2004 Brown resided
00:35:36
in several places in Orange County California this included Dana Point as well as a neighborhood of Newport Beach
00:35:44
Brown also owned two businesses this was based in Salt Lake City Utah uh these are identified uh by computer records as
00:35:51
toys unlimited and on the- doorstep advertising both of these companies he operated out of his Utah home now brown
00:36:00
had been employed as as a toy salesman and a golf equipment importer as well now okay so he's got these businesses
00:36:07
plus he has these jobs that he's doing this is a guy that later in life and leading up to his crimes he's trying to
00:36:15
support a very luxurious lifestyle right but let's go back for a second so the there's no storefronts mhm these are
00:36:23
just online he's like a distributor correct so this guy you know 4our work week and he took that to the extreme mhm
00:36:30
so he's selling toys online and he's also selling golf equipment correct correct now what is his exp his his
00:36:37
luxurious lifestyle well this is a guy that has extremely expensive taste uh he likes cars fast cars motorbikes boats um
00:36:46
he he portrayed himself to be a wealthy man um but he was not a wealthy man this
00:36:52
was a guy that was racking up tens of thousands of dollars in debt sounds like the captain well Jason Brown he finds
00:37:00
himself big time in debt by the year of 2004 mhm now in November of 2004 uh Brown took a Firearms class he purchased
00:37:10
a 45 caliber Glock pistol um and he purchased this from a place called totally awesome guns uh they yeah this
00:37:20
was uh hey I got a great idea let's sell guns what do you want to call it totally
00:37:25
awesome guns dude well and this place was in Salt Lake City but they also had a uh a range a shooting range there as
00:37:32
well now he wanted to take some classes he wanted to get his um conceal and carry license so he passed a background
00:37:40
check and as part of the class he was fingerprinted and his prints were sent to state and federal authorities you
00:37:47
know this is part of the agreement when you sign up for these different things now his his instructor at the class
00:37:55
would later described Brown as an obnoxious student um he was a guy that had you know he had a chip on his
00:38:03
shoulder he was kind of goofing off during the class didn't take it too seriously um and he this is coming from
00:38:09
the guy at uh totally awesome guns totally awesome guns okay uh he also says that brown seemed to be extremely
00:38:17
inexperienced with Firearms well you can just picture this right I mean some rich
00:38:22
white kid I'm going to learn about guns and he just you know he's just joking around about it not taking it serious
00:38:29
well and to paint a bit of a picture too for the listeners he's got kind of this
00:38:32
uh you know some of the pictures you'll see of him he's got a bit of a a tan California Surfer Dude kind of look to
00:38:38
him yeah but he's also kind of uh a couple people have said he kind of looks like Shawn Penn I guess if you do a I'm
00:38:45
going to do a Google image search real quick yeah uh and yeah for some reason they they put pictures with sha pin next
00:38:52
to him to kind of show you he looks similar but I I think he just looks like a douche on Monday November 29th 2004
00:39:01
this is the Monday after the Thanksgiving Day weekend now there's a there's an armed truck that's going to
00:39:09
pull up to a movie theater and this is in Phoenix Arizona okay so the way that this thing would work is that the truck
00:39:17
would pull up and you have a driver and then you have a guard that would get out
00:39:21
of the truck yeah I used to have to deal with these guys uh Brinks was the company that I dealt with when I worked
00:39:26
at the bank and they would show up I think our uh money drop was every Tuesday so they'd have to show up
00:39:32
Tuesday and and you could have different if you had like special orders they'd come on different days but yeah one guy
00:39:38
would stay in the truck the other guy would come in but these both individuals are heavily armed mhm yeah anybody
00:39:44
that's familiar with this these guys they look like these guards they they're dressed very much like police officers
00:39:51
uh and it's usually pretty obvious that they're wearing bulletproof vest and as the captain said they're all armed um my
00:39:58
experience with with persons in this profession was I always got the the G Joe kind of feel from these guys they
00:40:04
were very aware of their surroundings they were very fit physically young dudes um a lot of them wanted to go into
00:40:11
law enforcement at some point in their careers we actually we actually had one guy that was not physically fit at all
00:40:19
it was like this little he should have stayed in the truck right but he was this like a little Russian guy and he'd
00:40:24
always come in he'd always be so pissed off about everything right and then like
00:40:29
so you'd have coin and and so not only would they drop off the money to you which they would like put nice and neat
00:40:35
on their little uh dolly or whatever so then once you gave them bags and other stuff they didn't have time to like put
00:40:42
it back on their Dolly so this guy he never wanted to take two trips so he would just be like waddling out with
00:40:51
this money like just sweating carrying as much as possible to avoid the second trip yeah was I I will never forget that
00:40:58
guy cuz he was pissed off every Tuesday when I'd be like I got tons of coins for
00:41:03
you no problem I do this myself it's got to be a stressful job you know it's a high-risk job as we will see in this
00:41:11
particular story as well and I think obviously they probably want to spend as little time out of outside of that truck
00:41:17
as possible well for this particular pickup this was going to be a pickup from a movie theater this is an AMC 24
00:41:25
movie theater and Phoenix Arizona they had the same like what they would call drop point um where the truck would pull
00:41:33
up and park in the same area every time the one single guard would get out of the truck the truck is then locked by
00:41:40
the driver from the inside and then the guard goes in and collects the money well and they do this like my bank was
00:41:47
on a corner MH and their their pickup spot was always um you know they have to have an exit
00:41:54
plan right so they would Park you know on the curb but like if anything went down they had a straight away to turn
00:42:01
right M so um so they do this every time and if somebody was parked in that spot
00:42:08
they would just loop around until they could be as close to that spot as possible yeah yeah I was once told to
00:42:17
move my vehicle by one of these uh guards by one of the trucks I guess I was blocking their spot or their getaway
00:42:23
spot like you had said and then what did you say to him you go not my problem no
00:42:27
I just said yes sir and I moved my car uh I said not my problem and then he pulled a gun on me and I was forced to
00:42:35
move my car well this is at 10:00 a.m. on a Monday and their job here is going to be to pick up money from this movie
00:42:42
theater so they Park in their designated spot now it sounds to me like the guard
00:42:47
had a considerable amount of distance to walk to get into the movie theater to collect this money or waddle yeah well
00:42:55
this is uh 20 2 4ye old Keith palomares he is the guard that's going to get out of the truck right okay so around 10
00:43:04
a.m. that morning as palomares is making his way back to the truck and he gets just to you know at the movie theater
00:43:11
where they sell the the tickets at the ticket kiosk and sometimes it's outside of the movie theater he's walking just
00:43:18
past them when he's approached by a man this is a hooded man and he's got a gun he ambushes the guard unfortunately the
00:43:28
guard is armed but does not have time to defend himself he is shot at six times at close range and five of the Six
00:43:37
Bullets that were fired struck the guard in the head yeah because these individuals also wear bulletproof vest
00:43:44
mhm and and so the the gun used in this attack was um well it was going to be this 45 caliber semi-automatic Glock um
00:43:55
that we had discussed earlier that brown had purchased from the awesome guns in range in Salt Lake City um police won't
00:44:02
know this exactly at this time unfortunately the young guard uh only 24 years of age he died at the scene um and
00:44:12
the gunman immediately took the bag of money from the guard and this contained $56,000 in cash now the gunman he ran
00:44:22
into an alley and he was seen leaving the scene on a bicycle well and he he had to know somebody because you know
00:44:31
your drops are different every week so you know there'd be times that we you would have to order money you know so
00:44:39
branks would bring us the order of money well sometimes I mean I'd be in the back
00:44:43
room and I'd have to you know count maybe $200,000 worth of cash that's what I ordered but there'd be other weeks
00:44:50
where maybe we only ordered large or or a certain number of bills and it could be as little as
00:44:57
$1,500 right so the fact that he's going to be walking away with $56,000 anybody
00:45:03
listening and going hey this sounds like a great idea the chances of it being that large every time there was a drop
00:45:10
at the movie theater I would say is extremely low so I wonder if he knew some individual that worked there well
00:45:17
the other thought here Captain is that it would have been after the Thanksgiving Day weekend right um so I
00:45:23
don't know if that if that created a longer time between so sorry to cut you off but question is is this after the
00:45:32
individual picks up the money or are they dropping off money they are picking up money from the movie theater I was a
00:45:40
little confused but okay so then he would have some knowledge that we know that that's one of the biggest weekends
00:45:45
all year MH and so yeah okay that makes a little more sense to me sorry sorry about that and so so police immediately
00:45:53
are believing that this is a planned crime you know that this guy didn't just happen to be in the area with a gun and
00:45:59
decided oh there's an armed guard I'll go rob him they they believe this to be planned like you said it's a big movie
00:46:06
weekend um and this guy is leaving the movie theater he's the attacker knew that the guard would be armed knew that
00:46:14
he would be wearing a bulletproof vest and immediately Fires at the head of the guard well police originally in their
00:46:22
investigation they start hearing stories of a guy that had been hanging around the mall
00:46:29
I'm sorry around the movie theater for weeks and this was a guy that would that drove a silver
00:46:35
BMW now the only problem here though is he doesn't match the description by eyewitnesses on the day that the guard
00:46:43
is shot on that day Witnesses describe the shooter as somebody being 25 to 30 years old and Hispanic well the guy that
00:46:52
had been hanging around the movie theater for weeks in his silver BMW was a white guy but he did fit the age uh
00:46:58
that the witnesses had stated a couple days later police locate the bicycle that the guy had fled on well on this
00:47:08
bicycle they find a bunch of fingerprints well they match these fingerprints to a guy named Jason Derek
00:47:15
Brown remember he was fingerprinted when he purchased that gun and signed up for
00:47:19
the Firearms class and and looking at Jason there's no way you would mistake him as a Hispanic individ ual
00:47:28
um so that that that's kind of a little strange to me it is a little strange but
00:47:33
I will throw this out there when I said he's got that kind of California surfer dude look yeah well he has the blonde
00:47:38
hair too you know the bleach well it's frosted tips yeah and but he's he's pretty tan in a lot of these pictures
00:47:47
that you see and he would have been hooded you know he was wearing a hoodie when he attacked the guard so they might
00:47:53
have only been able to see a small portion of of his face right and we have his fingerprints that were on the bike
00:47:59
the getaway bike and we have his fingerprints from the shooting range the totally awesome gun store yeah so now
00:48:06
the police are armed with his name they have a name it's Jason Derek Brown and they make an announcement that they're
00:48:12
looking for this guy jdb because of the shooting that took place in front of the
00:48:17
movie theater well there's a local guy and he hears the name in the news report and he contacts thece police department
00:48:26
and he says I met this guy I actually met him the day before the guard was shot to death he was out somewhere and
00:48:34
he had parked his truck and there was a guy out there practicing it like shooting you know he's he's firing his
00:48:41
gun off doing some practice shooting okay and he had these um like paper plates that he was shooting at and using
00:48:49
them as as targets well remember we said he was a very inexperienced shooter right yeah he accidentally shot this
00:48:56
guy's truck so what had happened was the guy he approaches him and he's like look man
00:49:02
you you just shot my truck and so this dude and he he says he very you know California Surfer looking kind of dude
00:49:11
shot my truck and he he agreed to pay me $1,300 in Damages for the Bullet Hole in
00:49:18
the truck and he wrote out some kind of contract uh result you know what was the
00:49:25
the result of what happened and how they decided to work this out he wrote it out
00:49:28
on some of those paper plates that he was using as targets and he signed his name Jason Brown M and so this guy
00:49:37
brought these paper plates to the officers and said look this this is a dude I saw him out practice shooting the
00:49:43
day before this crime went down sure enough they match the bullet that is in this truck to be that of the same
00:49:51
bullets that were used to kill the guard so not only do we have so they could do
00:49:56
a ballistic test you know comparing uh the bullet holes of the paper plates and the bullet holes on the victim yeah so
00:50:03
now you have Fingerprints of this guy on the getaway bicycle as well as matching
00:50:08
the bullets uh that that he signed a paper plate saying that he was using the day before this guy was shot so where
00:50:16
are they at now on this investigation well before we I bring you totally up to speed you know as soon as he was named
00:50:22
and identified as the suspect in this case uh they they traced him around and followed him around the United States
00:50:29
for quite some time uh they were tracking him to uh Henderson Nevada which he fled from Arizona uh he had
00:50:37
also traveled to Las Vegas at one point uh there he swapped out his cars remember they were looking for this
00:50:44
silver BMW it was one of those uh Series 3 um and they were looking for this vehicle well he swapped out this vehicle
00:50:52
in Nevada where he he started driving a black Catal Cadillac Escalade baller well after he switched out these
00:50:59
vehicles Captain he drove back to California remember he's got family there right and he would actually stay
00:51:05
with some relatives until the police were once again on his Trail M now here's a very disconcerning thing here
00:51:14
um his relatives admit that he stayed there uh but originally they tell the police that yeah he you just missed him
00:51:21
by like an hour or two we don't know where he went but he left here in his silver BMW well the police get smart
00:51:29
right they're they're not stupid they're like okay you're housing this fugitive and you're going to tell us you know you
00:51:36
don't know where he went but this is what he's driving so the police immediately are like we're not looking
00:51:41
for a guy in a silver BMW we're we're not putting that out on our B on the lookout for we're going to put it out
00:51:47
that he could be driving a silver BMW or any other type of vehicle right it was after this that they do learn at some
00:51:54
point that they were lied to by the relatives and that he was in fact in a black Cadillac Escalade by that point
00:52:00
well they should be charged and locked up I think if they did that guess who's going to be well he's not going to turn
00:52:06
himself in because he only gives a [ __ ] about himself for one and but you know
00:52:11
but but they need to put pressure on the family I think that's the right thing to
00:52:14
do well in 2005 the authorities found Brown's catalac in the long-term parking lot at a Portland Oregon Airport MH okay
00:52:25
now while he was in Portland they learned that brown had been mailing packages of clothing and golf equipment
00:52:31
to his brother David John Brown who was still in San Diego again okay we have a case where your family's lying so you're
00:52:40
you're lying to the police you're harboring a fugitive right so charge him with something oh he's mailing stuff to
00:52:47
his brother charge the brother mhm I mean it's ridiculous I mean he killed an innocent person that was doing nothing
00:52:55
but his job a young man you know you know providing for himself probably maybe even his family and and this ass
00:53:03
wipe with frosted tips is running around all over you know uh sending golf supply
00:53:09
so he can go play golf somewhere that's ridiculous that's that this family is one uh this is a this is not a family
00:53:17
tree this is a family pile of [ __ ] well I like that you're getting so worked up
00:53:21
Captain because and I tell you why because like you said earlier people look at the top 10 list and they're like
00:53:27
this guy he killed one person and he's on this list how does he make the list and I I think when you really think
00:53:35
about this crime and think about the guy that perpetrated it this Jason Brown mhm
00:53:42
he knew he knew when he woke up that morning that if he saw the guard he was going to kill the guy for nothing other
00:53:48
than just greed just straight up greed to make off with as much money as he who knows how much he thought thought he was
00:53:55
going to get out of this but regardless of what he thought he was going to get out of it he took away someone's life
00:54:01
took someone away from their family permanently for $50,000 well and I i' would assume too
00:54:08
that these money trucks fall under the same guidelines as Banks do and so it becomes you know if you rob a bank
00:54:14
that's a federal offense and so same with armored vehicles you are exactly right it is considered a federal offense
00:54:22
to rob the armed truck um regarding his family we mentioned his brother David Brown he was indicted for obstruction of
00:54:32
justice um and the the indictment also claims that he tampered with evidence because he cleaned out Jason's BMW in
00:54:42
early December of that year um so he was involved in helping him obtain that other vehicle or switch out those two
00:54:49
vehicles right but we know it's his gun we know it's his fingerprints but again it's a obstruction of justice because
00:54:56
there's probably more evidence in that car mhm and and that's what they're angry about now in 2005 the FBI had more
00:55:04
than 200 leads in this case the majority of the leads were from outside of Arizona and dozens were coming from
00:55:12
outside of the United States including possible sightings in Canada well come on Canada help us out here well the FBI
00:55:19
says that they have more leads on Jason Brown than anyone else on the FBI's most
00:55:24
wanted list right uh but they said that most of these leads have been unhelpful um you had mentioned we had
00:55:31
mentioned sha pen earlier right that he Bears a close resemblance or people have
00:55:35
stated that he looks somewhat like Shawn pen I think a lot of that's coming from
00:55:39
his wanted poster that picture of him wearing the red hoodie that was the picture that was taken of him when he
00:55:45
was trying to obtain that uh conceal and carry license so that was a relatively recent photo of him right before the
00:55:53
crime now in a strange twist here one of Shawn Penn's body doubles was once mistakenly arrested by authorities who
00:56:02
thought he was Jason Brown and I'll post some pictures of Jason Derek Brown on our Instagram page at True Crime garage
00:56:09
investigators over the years have been presented with many different theories regarding where he could be hiding out
00:56:15
or the location of Jason Derek Brown one of the theories that seems to come up a
00:56:19
lot with him is that maybe he committed suicide and they've just not found his body yet now there's an investigator
00:56:27
worked this Cas for many years and he says in in an interview he says you know what I don't want to get into the
00:56:33
psychology of this whole thing I'm not going to try to get into the criminal's head but he says you know this guy is a
00:56:39
narcissist at the highest level he thinks way too much of himself and he says you know what I don't think that
00:56:45
this guy would kill himself he was greedy enough to put his life above anybody else's just to commit a murder
00:56:52
out of greed to take $56,000 well let's think about this for a second maybe maybe he's right right
00:56:58
he's a narcissist this is a greedy act you know he a malicious act to you know kill somebody for for what gain for some
00:57:07
monetary gain but this is an individual that you know his appearance is important to him you know his hairline
00:57:13
is running away from his face you know he he was driving a BMW he's all about appearances and he can't keep that
00:57:21
appearance up mhm so I could see somebody then coming to the you know reality to go you know well my life was
00:57:28
a sham none of these things matter or they shouldn't have mattered to begin with and and then often himself well and
00:57:36
sometimes being on the run for so long it creates its own stresses and can do things to a person over time there was a
00:57:44
credible sighting of him in 2008 this was August of 2008 uh a person that knew him recognized Brown at a traffic light
00:57:54
in Salt Lake City um he said that the person that brown looked over at him and recognized him back and when this took
00:58:02
place that brown ran the traffic light right now so we have a situation where Captain you know there is a reward for
00:58:10
everybody that is on the top 10 list the minimum reward is $100,000 they've doubled the reward for Jason Derek Brown
00:58:17
It's $200,000 at this time another theory that the authorities have thrown out there is that they believe he could
00:58:25
possibly be hiding amongst the Mormon Community under an assumed identity remember he has a lot of traces back to
00:58:33
that Salt Lake City area and he was also seen there in 2008 they believe that he
00:58:39
might be living with a woman kind of mooching off of her uh somebody that may not know his real identity he seems like
00:58:46
the type they also say that it's possible that he did flee the country and they would believe that he could be
00:58:53
living in France or Thailand is also noted I don't know what the the background is regarding Thailand yeah
00:58:59
that seems a little more likely to me I mean you know we talked about that he was overseas for a small period Well
00:59:06
Jason Dereck Brown has gone by many aliases over the years um including Jason Brown Derek Brown Greg Johnson
00:59:13
hairline Johnson we also have Greg Johnson and John Brown and J Brown so he's used many names over the years um
00:59:22
who knows if he's still using one of those names but remember you know if you see anybody on this list and again we
00:59:28
encourage you to go to fbi.gov and check out these sorry hairline Johnson yeah that's what it say we're just going to
00:59:36
glaze over that one yeah uh we are but we encourage everybody to go look at the faces of the people that we mentioned on
00:59:44
today's program and tomorrow's program and familiarize yourself with them and their description you know Jason was
00:59:50
listed as 5'10 blond hair medium build um 170 to 180 lbs at the time that he has fled he has green eyes um again
01:00:01
speaks fluent French and may be using any of those aliases but keep in mind if you see or you think you have any
01:00:08
information regarding somebody that's on this list all these people are extremely
01:00:12
dangerous people these are this is not somebody that you want to approach you want to notify authorities and let them
01:00:19
do their job yeah it's definitely don't don't be going uh Catey kid on them don't go r machio on them uh but we got
01:00:26
a lot more to get to tomorrow and it's getting late so yeah we're up against it and there's several more people that we
01:00:33
want to discuss some open cases that we will discuss on tomorrow's [Music] show check out the store Page cuz guess
01:00:49
what we got those team Nick shirts in and I'm not going to let the captain beat me here don't let the captain win
01:00:55
all right team captain strong team captain we need more team Nick people out there than team captain all right
01:01:00
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