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amazon.com [Music] [Music] AdFree [Music] welcome to True Crime garage wherever you are whatever you're doing thanks for
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listening I'm your host Nick and with me every week riding shotgun ladies and gentlemen here is the cap Regulators
00:01:27
Mound up it's good to be seen and good to see you thanks for listening thanks for t a
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[Music] friend this week we are featuring garage beer that's right garage beer how the
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captain and I are not major shareholders in this company is beyond me but we are
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not in the garage beer business as much as we would like to be we are in the True Crime garage business garage beer
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is a light logger brewed in small batches for better taste and higher quality ABV 4 % garage grade three and
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3/4 bottle caps out of five and here's some of our highquality listeners that helped us out with this week's show
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filling up the old garage fridge first up a shout out to Mary from seabook Texas and a big we like your jib goes
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everyone we just mention they went to True Crime garage.com and helped us fill up the fridge for this week's show thank
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content and that is enough of the business all right everybody gather around grab a chair grab a beer let's
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talk some true [Music] crime you know being a killer is this part this it's a step about this far
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from aggravated Robert you know what I mean killing somebody yeah but I heard this wasn't just
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killing somebody you know what I'm saying I heard this wasn't just running up to him
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shooting them and Ne you know what I'm saying no so this is somebody this is a killer this is a killer you know what
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I'm saying this is a bad [ __ ] person you know whoever did this is is do you think whoever did this went there with
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the intent to kill somebody or do you think they were there looking for something and something went bad it went
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too far it depends what story is true it depends if if the story that I heard is
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true what did you hear I heard that they um what I hear all the details about that I've heard they got shot in the
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back of the head I heard they got strangled I heard they got Lisa's finger nails got ripped off I heard um yeah I
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heard all Lisa's fingernails were ripped off they tortured her I heard her head was almost severed off I heard they got
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one shot in the back I heard a whole bunch of different stories you know I mean if they really pulled her finger
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off and almost severed her head off they were com there to kill him you know what
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I'm saying they weren't coming all right what if I told you that her fingernails
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weren't torn off and her head wasn't head wasn't severed [ __ ] so that's [ __ ] well I'm not
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saying anything I'm saying what and why they do they get shot or did they get suffocated you know what I'm saying well
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the what the the coroner already reported how they died in the paper died of asphixiation that's that's yeah I
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yeah right yeah [ __ ] so did you hear anything about anybody getting shot well when it first happened I heard they got
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execution style in the back of the head you know what I'm saying that's what that's the first story I heard
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[Music] autopsies are performed on both of our victims young adults 21-year-old Johnny
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Clark 20-year-old Lisa strob the autopsy's captain were conducted by a Dr Pandy he's a deputy corer and forensic
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pathologist with the Lucas County coroner's office the doctor notes their injuries
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and describes the manner in which the two had been bound he declares the cause of death for both victims to be exfix
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due to strangulation and Suffocation but he is not able to confirm a specific time of death nor the order in which
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they died evidence is also collected from items of clothing that is worn by our two victims and of note captain we
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have DNA that is found on Johnny's sweatpants Pandy states that Lisa's toxicology report showed that she had
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therapeutic levels of vicadin and peret in her system while Johnny's toxicology report showed he had minute levels of
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Percocet in his system and the presence of marijuana in his urine there are sources out there several that report
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that both were known to have been casual and recre ational drug users this throws
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a whole another wrench into our set of circumstances here and trying to determine who is responsible for killing
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these two young individuals yeah because that could become a motive and just to be clear to the listeners the the clip
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that you guys heard in the trailer today was a a clip from an interrogation of Anthony Watson that's correct and he is
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basically telling law enforcement about a lot of the rumors that he heard and obviously in a very small town that is
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connected to a larger City there's going to be a lot of rumors when it comes to a
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a double homicide yeah and he's from my understanding Captain he's a little older than Johnny and may have been an
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associate of Johnny's he's a bit of a thug or it at least has a very even violent at times police
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background he does seem we've watched the entirety of that interview and he does seem rather forthcoming with the
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detective now I don't want to go as far to say that he is a suspect or or not a suspect in my opinion what I do know is
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he was a suspect in the opinions of the police detectives well again when you have a autopsy that shows that these
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individuals were drug users that creates a whole another level of possible motives you know is because people that
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do use drugs sometimes purchase large amounts of drugs and so then when you have a situation where you have evidence
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or possible evidence that somebody goes into this house and kills these two individuals but is clearly
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looking for something clearly and that's that becomes another issue for the investigation because as we touched on
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yesterday and talked about there was that rumor that was going around within some of these Social Circles that Johnny
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had either bragged that there was a a safe in the stob family home that may have contained large amounts of cash
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right and then the other version of that same rumor is that the stobs had a lot of
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money okay so look look if we're going to bring drugs into this I want to be clear about something here and this you
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you can test this Theory all day and night if you want come at me if you will but here's the deal when drug addicts
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are involved they a lot of them some of them the violent ones will do anything and go by any means necessary to get
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those drugs drugs take top priority for some of these individuals over money number one and
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number right number one and number two priority for that type of look we're not talking about everybody we're not
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talking about all drug addicts we're talking about a very specific small sample size of these individuals violent
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individuals most of them with police backgrounds with a record with a History of Violence those individuals what we're
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talking about here is priority number one and just like the captain pointed out priority over your life and my life
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priority number one is drugs yeah priority number two is money why is money priority number two cuz they can
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get drugs they're going to use it to get drugs and how do we know that priority number two is money because they always
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trade money for drugs so the thing here is now you got to wonder if they are recreational users do we have a couple
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of other possible motives one did somebody believe that they could find a large quantity of drugs inside the home
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I don't think that there's anything in Johnny's background or Lisa's background to suggest that people would expect to
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find large quantities of drugs in a home that doesn't even belong to either of these individuals it belongs to Lisa
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str's parents no I I understand that but I the reason why I wanted to be clear on
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where this audio clip was coming from and to point out rumors Lisa's family has a lot of
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money play the telephone game that that turns into oh yeah I bet they have a safe with a bunch of money that turns
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into somebody thinking that's fact or hey you know I heard Johnny and Lisa were going to have some people over on
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Saturday night so they bought a lot of drugs for their party I mean it's not that hard for these stupid
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Rumors in a small town to get started well and one thing I want to be clear of too is one thing that we're going to see
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as we get further into the suspects and to the where the investigation and evidence starts to direct law
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enforcement is to Toledo not to Holland okay and to some of the people in Toledo Holland is
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considered upper class right and like you're pointing out here Captain is when you take somebody from lower class and
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you put them inside the home or or tell them about this home of Lisa str's parents who are doing well for
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themselves they go oh yeah they got money yeah I've seen their house or oh I've heard about it they got money they
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and it doesn't take a whole lot to imply that to somebody that comes from another
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side of the tracks and what we're going to consistently see in this case in this
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investigation that most if not all of those suspects are going to come from that other side of the tracks if you
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will right and so now what we have going on here Captain is we have two good kids
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look Lisa didn't have any money she works at TGI Fridays nothing wrong with that I was a server I was a bartender
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for a long time good job still sometimes serves people I enjoy it and Johnny was getting ready to go to
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school right and I'm not I'm unclear he may have been between jobs at this time school was going to be one his main
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focus and unfortunately you know when we have a funeral it usually happens just days
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after one passes away Johnny was supposed to start school to be a barber to he wanted to open up a
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barber shop and own a small business yeah on that day that he was supposed to start school instead it was his
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funeral so that's how close he was to we we talk about advancing ourselves in life that's how close he was if if you
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want to say he had a drug problem and you know Johnny fine I didn't know him what what the evidence tells me is
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exactly what's reported in by most of these sources that he had a recreational use problem and that he may have been
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working his way out of it yeah and I can't throw shade on anybody because you know I I've had my vices in the
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past well and their kids they're 20 and 21 yeah a lot of that time it's a experimental phase I got about 2 and a
00:14:06
half years that I can't even remember and it happened in that same time period that we just talked about at my age well
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we remember cuz we all tell the stories yeah I was like uh like like Joe Walsh for about two years two and a half
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years yeah I got about 22 years I can't remember this is such a difficult case I
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mean I think it's I think some of it is because of the 911 calls and and you just feel so bad for
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the family and what they actually had to witness because a lot of times the family
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doesn't actually witness the victims in the victim State mhm and you have these two young
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kids on the verge of starting their adult lives and like we said the evidence as far as drug use is just
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it could be experimental phase but this phase was connecting them with I think the wrong type of people yes people that
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they normally would not associate with right and and keep in mind too it's going to be persons when we say
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associate with we're going to see one one factor repeated over and over in this investigation at people that they
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looked at these may not even been close friends with our victims these were people
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that their associate on their Social Circle persons that were on the fringes of their Social Circle right are
00:15:41
Associates with the suspects so let's attempt to go down the trail that we believe the detectives
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would have followed here so detective kak is going to be the lead investigator for much of this investigation and of
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course he's is going to want to talk to Tiffany Williams right so remember yeah because
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we have a red flag with the with the mom saying hey look this is this is all strange and
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suspicious and if the mom is suspicious of an individual that's where you need to start that's obviously also who they
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were planning on hanging out with and they never met they never made that connection that day correct so so when
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the detective sits down with Tiffany Williams she describes going to her friend Zach's house to obtain some pills
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and while there she says she called Johnny at 10:41 this is that call that we've discussed at length here and this
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is she says for the purpose of firming up their plans for that night she states that Johnny picked up the phone didn't
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say hello says bro what are you doing or something to that effect and then she says that the
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call drops well not necessarily drops drops but Johnny hangs up saying he would call her back he does not call
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back she tells the detective that she discuss this call with Zach and we know the outcome of this situation we know
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that when she receives no response at some point she and Zach drive out to Lisa's house now how did they get in
00:17:21
contact with John's parents is what I'm going to want to know as the detective and why they go to reach out to Johnny's
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parents they say it's because they were concerned and they couldn't get in touch
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with Johnny and Lisa so what will we learn Captain is that Zack will reach out to an individual named Ruben Riz now
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Reuben the reason why Zach wants to reach out to him is because he knows he and Tiffany know that Reuben is Johnny's
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best friend like lifelong best friend he might know one what's going on with Johnny
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but if he doesn't know he's going to know somebody that they can contact correct so now we learn that Tiffany and
00:18:05
Zack do not know or possess the ability to get in touch with Johnny's family now
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Ruben says will tell police that Zach asked if they could pick him up and go to the stob house with them
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now Ruben says Reuben is is clean okay Reuben he's never had a drug problem he doesn't have a police
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background doesn't have a record no History of Violence he says look when this dude calls me I know that Zach is a
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problem I know that he has a a drug problem and I don't really know the guy very well so I wasn't willing to go
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anywhere with them in the middle of the night right yeah I was concerned about my
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friend and so then that is when Tiffany is forced to call Sharita because their first
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person they attempted to go to Reuben does not want any involvement Sharita then is the one that calls Johnny's
00:19:05
parents okay and again remember Sharita is more of more a peer of Johnny's friends and people that would
00:19:13
be of Johnny's age she's much younger than Johnny's parents now we have the parents at the scene and all that's
00:19:22
going on that we already are aware about but we know that police the authorities
00:19:27
took down Tiffany's information and Zach's contact information before allowing them to leave that
00:19:33
night the other thing here Captain is we've talked about the drugs I want to Circle back to something real
00:19:39
quick the detectives when they start talking to Johnny and Lisa's Inner Circle and
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then expanding outward from there that's when they the police catch wind of this
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thought and this rumor that's going around that there was a safe or maybe a large sum of money kept at the stob home
00:20:01
right so now we have police working with a theory that makes a whole hell of a lot of
00:20:05
sense a couple things we we can shrink our suspect pool very quickly here there are things going on
00:20:15
socially that are telling us that one it's very likely that the perpetrators would have either known Johnny and or
00:20:25
Lisa or would have known people that did know them because if we have people saying that Johnny bragged a couple of
00:20:33
times or maybe just once about there being a safe or maybe the stobs got a bunch of
00:20:38
money it was one of his friends that heard that and they had to tell somebody else if it wasn't one of his inner
00:20:45
circle that is responsible for what happened to these [Music] guys well it's official fall is here if
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garage there's no safe like [Music] simplysafe all right we are back cheers mates to the windows to to the walls
00:22:59
onward and upward tall cans in the air cheers to the people in the back so when you have a a
00:23:05
homicide of course you want to look at the Inner Circle but but here we have something different we have Johnny and
00:23:12
Lisa are supposed to meet up with somebody to me if I'm law enforcement that's the first person that I'm
00:23:19
questioning and we don't know what type of person this is and like we said if they're in a experimental phase with
00:23:26
drugs they're an experim experimental phase with friends and who is this Tiffany and here's a little clip of her
00:23:35
their calling an interrogation but a questioning by law enforcement I think this kind of shows you a little glimpse
00:23:43
of who she is and her her recall of the events that night I want to go over that
00:23:49
conversation again in detail that's fine all right you call Johnny on the phone M
00:23:56
how many times did it ring you think um once or twice okay one to two rings picked it right up
00:24:05
mhm you know it was Johnny Yes how long of a pause before he said anything he didn't say hello all right
00:24:14
so he never said anything never said hello so all right so you're on the phone mhm how long before you hear
00:24:21
anything on the phone did you what did you like as soon as he picked it up he didn't say hello to me but he was like
00:24:28
bro what are you doing all right I want to get this down again bro what are you doing okay okay and he
00:24:37
said that approximately three times okay then all right let give me his voice was it bro what are you doing or
00:24:47
bro what are you doing yeah just like that he sounded pissed yeah did he sound scared no not he just sounded pissed
00:24:55
just pissed yeah all right so you hear you hear bro what are you doing three times Johnny sounds pissed mhm all right
00:25:01
then what he say then the next thing he said was who the hell are you how many times um once and then
00:25:14
that's when I heard the other person in the background but I couldn't hear what he was
00:25:21
saying so you overheard a voice in the background a guy voice you're sure it was a guy positive a
00:25:31
guy have you ever heard it before no well I really couldn't tell you know what I mean but
00:25:39
okay all right so then what then he asked again bro what are you doing after he said who are after the three times he
00:25:47
said it here he said it again yeah and that's when this guy was talking so that's why I couldn't hear him is
00:25:53
because Johnny was saying um bro what are you doing once again all right did you hear anything in the
00:26:03
background like a door closed footsteps sound like Johnny was did he sound pissed here again mhm did he sound
00:26:11
pissed here yeah did he sound like he was out of breath no did he sound like he was scared or nervous no did he sound
00:26:20
like he knew them people mhm that's why I said I think that whoever did it he knew
00:26:28
because you know if you knew Johnny how how did he end the conversation with you
00:26:32
TI I'm G call you back and H up okay now not he didn't give me a chance to talk okay he just hangs out he says
00:26:40
he'll call you back okay which means he probably knows who's in the house mhm okay now you
00:26:50
call who I didn't call nobody who did you call to tell them that conversation ation with Johnny nobody I just told
00:26:59
Zach okay how did Johnny's mom find out about the phone conversation um after I had drove out to their house and there
00:27:08
was no response I drove back to Lisa's house well after I left Lisa's house I drove back and I was like well maybe
00:27:15
they're just ignoring us we just drive around look for them and I called my friend Sharita to get Ruben's number
00:27:23
which is Johnny's best friend so that I could get in contact um well see if Johnny could answer if he
00:27:31
would answer Ruben and then Ruben didn't get an answer then we can get a hold of
00:27:35
the family and let the family know cuz I just thought maybe he was ignoring me why would you listen listen listen
00:27:43
why with that conversation would you let somebody's family know that hey something's wrong I
00:27:54
wasn't calling to let him know something was wrong I was calling to let don't know like can you get him will he pick
00:28:00
up the phone to you because like I he told me he'd called me back I didn't think nothing was it because you were
00:28:06
concerned yes I was very concerned about what was going on yeah because it was like no I was not getting no response
00:28:14
cuz right after I heard that I called Lisa's phone and there was no pickup and then I called her a couple more times no
00:28:22
answer so I text her like are you okay and she didn't answer then I kept calling Johnny's phone Zach said he was
00:28:28
doing the same also and they wasn't picking up so that's when I started calling you know his best friend to see
00:28:35
if he would answer to his best friend and he was just ignoring us because he didn't want to share pills or you know
00:28:41
what I mean that's what I thought all it was that's very telling to me there Captain here we have the det I think
00:28:48
it's it's utter it's utter confusion to me thank you for saying that because that will prove a point that that I have
00:28:56
for all the beautiful listeners out there so there's three key elements to this portion of the discussion before we
00:29:04
get to those three key elements here and the three key elements to Tiffany Williams
00:29:11
herself is one a portion of the clip that we did not hear is because it's a rather lengthy clip right it's probably
00:29:19
20 to 30 minutes long total and the part that we don't hear is that prior to going through this exchange
00:29:29
that Tiffany Williams has said occurred between her and Johnny is that before the detectives get into the words of
00:29:38
that conversation the detective clearly is locking Tiffany Williams into a truth or fallacy by saying your phone
00:29:51
when you you called Johnny but he's clarifying you called him not by means of a landline or Zach's phone or
00:29:57
something somebody else's phone your phone you called Johnny with your phone at 10:41 and she says correct my
00:30:05
phone so the reason why we're locking her into that is because we are going to be able to pull those records and prove
00:30:13
if that part of the story is right or not because we have a lot that seems to be riding on what this conversation was
00:30:20
between Tiffany and Johnny you hear them the detectives trying to figure out based off of
00:30:26
Tiffany words if Johnny was upset if he was pissed if he was surprised if he was
00:30:32
scared if he knew the individuals if he didn't know the individuals right but I want to keep in mind and I know that I
00:30:40
keep harping on this same idea here that conversation if it went down that way only matters if it went down that way we
00:30:51
have Tiffany Williams who I am incredibly suspicious of and welcome to the party welcome to the club there's a
00:30:58
lot of people that are suspicious of her well let's point out a couple obvious things the cops are trying to get her to
00:31:08
say that you're concerned because of the call that you heard and she's not even smart enough to realize I just I need to
00:31:20
keep going back to what was concerned by his actions on that phone call but she's
00:31:26
more concerned that they're trying to do drugs and not include them in the drug usage I think what the detectives are
00:31:36
trying to point out and the corner that they're trying to back her into is oh you were so concerned about that call
00:31:44
and what you say you heard on that call but you don't act on that concern until two hours later so it doesn't seem like
00:31:52
you were really concerned about what you heard on that call this going back to the same idea that I keep I'm beating a
00:31:59
dead horse here Captain we don't have Johnny to tell us what was said on that call we only have
00:32:07
Tiffany Williams who can tell us what was said on that call I don't think any of that [ __ ] that she says happened on
00:32:14
that call I mean and this shows you though like the lengths that somebody will go
00:32:22
to she is telling us these are the links that we're you're not answering in your
00:32:28
phone you might be doing we know you have some pills you might be doing these pills without us well who do we know
00:32:37
that he might answer his phone for call his best friend and of course the best friend
00:32:45
thinks this whole interaction is fishy to begin with it it's it's very strange well I like that you point out
00:32:55
that the the her explanation when she's trying to explain her actions you know who did you call and when did you call
00:33:04
them and why you hear that toward the end of the clip it's all very confusing and muddled
00:33:10
correct yeah you know why that is because it's easy to tell the truth it's difficult to lie and what's
00:33:19
happened here is that clip our victims were killed January 30 January 31st without a
00:33:31
doubt okay that interview is taking place March 23rd by this time Tiffany Williams has explained the same story
00:33:41
to M and Johnny's family multiple times she's explained the story to the police and detectives multiple times why does
00:33:51
she sound so damn confused there someone's going to say Nick well she's got a drug problem fine but I'm I'm
00:33:57
going to point out here it's difficult to lie it's easy to tell the truth she sounds confused here because she's
00:34:02
trying to recall what she's told all these people along the way and keep her story straight and now it's getting very
00:34:09
difficult for her to do that now 3 months later or sorry now it's getting difficult for her to do this almost two
00:34:17
months later well if you go back to the calls to 911 when she's telling the story there
00:34:25
it's a lot of uh um um you do that when you're trying to think of your next statement if you made a phone call and
00:34:38
you were really concerned and you went okay well we got this weird phone call and then I started calling him and he
00:34:44
didn't answer the phone so then I called his girlfriend and she didn't answer the
00:34:47
phone so we decided to go over there and we rang the doorbell and and they didn't
00:34:52
answer so then we tried to call their phone again I wasn't even there there and I
00:34:57
can tell you the story without going uh uh uh so I think even back to the day in
00:35:07
question you can almost hear her trying to think of what the best thing to say is well she's she's getting caught there
00:35:18
and the police almost had her the detectives almost had her when she starts getting confused and she starts
00:35:23
sounding confused in her delivery as to what she did and why why they're asking her specifically well why did you reach
00:35:30
out to the family well cuz I was concerned about that phone call okay well that doesn't make sense because you
00:35:35
waited two hours oh well I knew that they could get in touch with them I wasn't so concerned I I just knew that
00:35:41
they could get in touch with them and I was I thought maybe they were just avoiding us or not answering our calls
00:35:46
or maybe they didn't want to share pills with us so now she's got a different explanation that has that has no meaning
00:35:52
on the prior question or her prior explanation and the the reason why this is all key is because of something that
00:36:00
she said way too early she done [ __ ] up oh droing the f bomb the first 911 call by m to the police what does m say
00:36:12
to the police I got this call from Tiffany some girl named Tiffany and she's saying that uh there was this
00:36:20
weird phone call that she would had with my son and it sounded like people were breaking into the house and she's
00:36:26
calling us and saying that she's concerned and that she went over there and she saw the house was ransacked and
00:36:31
I'm worried that my son has been abducted or or something worse has happened during the course of a robbery
00:36:37
Tiffany said to M that she went to the home and saw that it had been ransacked that cannot be this is a big
00:36:45
problem this is a big problem for Tiffany and here's why because what do we know these are facts man these like
00:36:53
you can people out there can can question a lot of what I say sometimes because some because you're an idiot
00:36:59
speculation thanks Captain all right uh but the thing here is this is not speculation these are these are words
00:37:07
that's why we're P playing these recordings for you because they're not the Colonel's words my T says to the 911
00:37:14
operator this is before she goes to the scene before her husband's at the scene that this girl says that she was at the
00:37:21
scene and saw that the place was ransacked and that's why she called it she was concerned the problem with that
00:37:27
portion of her story is guess who else went to that scene the police yeah they did not see any reason for probable
00:37:35
cause they did not see that the home had been ransacked M and her husband went to the scene into the home and what did
00:37:43
they say all the blinds were closed we couldn't see in we only kicked down the door once we hoisted somebody up into
00:37:52
the air to see into that window and I wish there was photographic evidence and and maybe
00:37:59
there is by law enforcement but like you said this is a big this is a big deal because the police walked all the way
00:38:07
around the home attempted to look in every window guess what they couldn't see anything because all the blinds were
00:38:12
closed right the first question of that night should be well how did you see this how did you see
00:38:20
something that we're not able to see Johnny's father walked around the entirety of that home and looked in
00:38:26
every window couldn't see everything because anything because the blinds were closed M walked around the home looked
00:38:32
in every window couldn't see anything because the blinds were Clos yet this woman who
00:38:38
claims she saw that the home had been ransacked and that's why she's concerned and that's why she reached out to the
00:38:45
parents because she's concerned for the safety of her friends the only way she would have known at that time when she
00:38:52
contacted the parents that the home had been ransacked there's only two explanations either she was in the home
00:38:58
and had seen that the outcome yeah or that somebody that was in the home had told her and gave her that knowledge
00:39:06
there's no other way around it it's one of those two situations which means she was either there when the attack
00:39:13
happened or she knows who did the attack well like you said we have cell phone technology shouldn't they be able to say
00:39:23
well if if she actually took this call from Johnny at at what do you say 10 she made the call remember that's why they
00:39:29
purposely cleared that up right right she made from your phone you called him at
00:39:34
10:41 right because couldn't they do cell phone ping technology and put her at that Residence at that time she
00:39:43
doesn't have to be there to be involved true yeah again she could have had knowledge somebody that was inside
00:39:51
the home could have told her yeah we ransacked the place yeah yeah we we ripped up the place we killed them and
00:39:57
we tore the place to Pieces yeah cuz we were looking for drugs or we were looking for money what do you mean you
00:40:03
guys didn't find anything we looked everywhere we looked everywhere we tore the place
00:40:08
apart so yeah they can do self-own technology and and and here's the next question that people go they go well
00:40:15
then why the hell would she alert the family right that doesn't make any sense no it doesn't make any sense it actually
00:40:23
does make complete sense they didn't try to the family they wanted to alert Reuben right Johnny's friend remember
00:40:31
they offered to pick up Reuben and bring him back to the straw home they wanted to alert
00:40:37
somebody but they had to they had to alert somebody and here's the thing Reuben too smart says you know what I'm
00:40:44
not going over there I don't know you guys very well you got a drug problem I'm not getting in a car with you but
00:40:49
he's concerned enough for his friend they contact the parents they had to contact someone why why would they
00:40:56
have to contact someone because of the cell phone records right right they know they figured it out two
00:41:08
hours too damn late wait a second the police are probably going to want to know why I called Johnny who ends up
00:41:16
dead yeah now I've got to explain that away oh well I couldn't have been involved because when I called him there
00:41:23
was already something going on yeah or also the fact that if they had plans at all to meet up
00:41:32
then who did Johnny tell that we're going to meet up with Tiffany who did Lisa possibly tell right
00:41:42
they have to be able to explain away the plan the possible plans if there ever were any right because again that's we
00:41:48
only have Tiffany to tell us that but then on top of that because according to Johnny's family when they spoke to him
00:41:55
he said they had no plans for the night they were going to go home they were going to chill right that could be true
00:42:02
now the thing here is you're exactly right Captain if they had plans with Tiffany now she's got to explain away
00:42:07
why those plans didn't happen and why she could not have been involved right and the way that she's trying to explain
00:42:15
that away is alerting someone that oh by the way when I talked to him at 10:41 he
00:42:20
was he was pissed he was confused there was somebody like breaking into the house right then and there
00:42:27
yeah so her own words means that she has knowledge of she has knowledge of these crimes that
00:42:39
she was privy to before the police were before Johnny's parents were before anybody else that arrived on that scene
00:42:47
and the only way that she could have had that knowledge was to either a be there
00:42:53
or B somebody gave her that knowledge but we have this messy crime scene I mean this I mean this is what's
00:43:04
so horrible like I said is most of the time the victim's family do not see the victims in the victim
00:43:11
state but we have DNA evidence yeah we have plenty of DNA evidence so as mentioned we had some
00:43:21
that was found on Johnny's sweatpants and they also collected DNA from the cell phones so what happens at
00:43:29
some point here Captain the perpetrators they rip the batteries from Lisa and Johnny cell phones and I believe they
00:43:37
even broke the cell phones themselves and the cell phones were recovered different sources either on
00:43:44
top of the victims or nearby the victims right and so this act of breaking and removing the battery puts perpetrator
00:43:53
DNA on those cell phones also on the sweatpants here's what I'm I would love to know and we talked about this when we
00:44:02
we talked about Richard Allen's vehicle the the suspect in the deli case being confiscated and and and uh searching
00:44:10
that vehicle and we've talked about this plenty of times I love the logic that is
00:44:16
applied to a crime scene by these technicians because guess what they have this is a big house they would have the
00:44:23
whole house and every item that was ransacked knocked to the floor pulled out of drawers to check you can't check
00:44:28
every damn thing so what do you do you have to prioritize where you are going to be looking for fingerprints and DNA
00:44:36
and blood and what do we know about the crime scene what does the crime scene tell us
00:44:43
well the crime scene is talking to the technicians and the crime scene says somebody either emptied Johnny's wallet
00:44:52
or made sure that it was empty yeah where does one keep their wallet in their pant
00:44:58
pocket so where will we one where's One location that we will prioritize looking for physical evidence
00:45:06
Johnny's pants pockets and so well think about that too because even if you're wearing gloves
00:45:13
that normally you have a space between like even if you're wearing long like a long sleeve shirt you have that space in
00:45:22
between and that would make contact if you're reaching in into somebody's pocket correct and where on his pants do
00:45:30
they find DNA evidence his pants pocket so very likely somebody reached in and removed his wallet and then took money
00:45:39
out of it or made sure that it was empty right and what's what's interesting here
00:45:44
too again the crime scene what is it telling us what is it telling the technicians and the investigators we
00:45:50
know there was a sign of a struggle Johnny was a big guy he was strong he was a he was a weightlifter bodybuilder
00:45:56
at one time he put up a struggle we know that the the crime scene shows a struggle at
00:46:02
the at the door going from the garage into the home it's believed that that's where Johnny tried to fend off the
00:46:09
Intruder Intruders well the Intruder may have injured themselves during the course of
00:46:15
that scuffle right it is blood it it's blood evidence that they find that will give them the
00:46:23
DNA evidence in Johnny's pocket so as you said perpetrator reached in pulled out that wallet and left a little
00:46:32
something of them behind unknowingly at the crime scene the other location that they find
00:46:38
DNA evidence is on the duct tape which is which is often a place that people will find DNA evidence and here's why
00:46:47
how many times have you witnessed a person for any number of reasons you're you know you're just out
00:46:52
doing something whatever how they either have to tear the duct tape cut it or a lot of people stick the end in their
00:47:00
mouth and use their teeth and tear it off right that saliva is going to leave DNA evidence on that duct tape so they
00:47:08
find DNA on the duct tape Johnny's p pocket and they also find it on the cigarette butt now of their suspects and
00:47:16
they talk to a lot of people here some of them agree to polygraph some don't some agree to a DNA swab some don't they
00:47:24
end up collecting I believe it's about two dozen DNA swabs from persons that they talked to and again not everybody
00:47:31
was willing to consent to this two individuals that did not consent in fact two individuals that
00:47:39
were not even on police's radar get immediately pulled into this case none of the DNA that they had
00:47:48
collected matched that on the duct tape the pants pocket or the cigarette butt but on the cigarette butt the
00:47:57
Newport cigarette that was found at the crime scene near the door to the garage yielded
00:48:06
two DNA donors and both of those individuals had a criminal background so they are
00:48:15
already listed in codus right when police check the DNA found at the scene against
00:48:22
cotus it delivers them to Prime suspects that they were unaware of one Samuel Todd
00:48:30
Williams and two Cameo pedway well what happened to you aside today there's some things that Mr Ross and I
00:48:47
would like to talk to you about okay uh we ran some names by you um you've been advised to your rights and
00:48:59
stuff um you're saying you never been to that house can we get to the to the me of
00:49:11
what we want to talk to you about then we we problem at that house last winter did you hear anything about
00:49:19
it no okay couple kids were found dead in there uh young adult and uh they were probably the victim of a
00:49:37
burglary they got bum rushed in the place you know what we're talking about bum rushed somebody just crashes in on
00:49:43
you and maybe robs you or burglarizes your house I mean you know what we're talking
00:49:50
about okay so that's what happened to these young couples so how did my name get brought up in this
00:50:00
science I don't understand how well remember when these guys respond to a scene and they go in
00:50:09
there you're criminal justice major right you courting off the area everybody that is involved in that
00:50:18
Scene goes in they start collecting evidence okay these guys collected a lot of evidence
00:50:27
and they had a lot of evidence tested for DNA do you know what DNA is okay explain to us what you think DNA
00:50:37
is you salival whatever soliva poop piss skin cells hair follicles all that stuff
00:50:48
gives up an individuals individual characteristics if you buy that based on what you've been taught in
00:50:56
school I haven't I'm only doing my like basic courses right now I'm not doing they will tell you soon enough the DNA
00:51:05
is like fingerprints you know there's no two fingerprints that are alike there's
00:51:10
no two DNA that are alike each of us have a separate one if they tested Jeff here he it come up with a certain roow
00:51:19
of numbers that mean something to the scientist they tested you you'd come up with a different bunch of numbers in a
00:51:26
row that means something to the scientist but yours would be like Jeff's if I Spit on a cotton swab and they did
00:51:34
my DNA numbers would come up mine would not be like yours mine would not be like
00:51:40
his we're all separate just like if they took our fingerprints tonight your fingerprint would be
00:51:47
different from Jeff's be different from mine mine would be different from him and from you you understand where we're
00:51:54
going it's Unique to the individual there's no two DN that are alike totally understand
00:52:02
it okay okay now when these guys collected a lot of pieces of evidence in there that were involved in this
00:52:10
crime they s it down to Bowling Green for testing okay and items in that scene came back
00:52:21
with your DNA on it okay how do you explain that how can we explain that I have no
00:52:31
idea you've never been to that house never to you don't know those kids I don't know them people and your DNA is
00:52:37
in that house I don't know you have no idea no do you understand where that puts
00:52:51
you do you understand where this is going [Music] if you are a member of law enforcement
00:53:10
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00:53:22
much for joining us here in the garage and sharing this case on social media until tomorrow be good be kind and don't
00:53:30
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