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[music] [music] [music] [music] >> Welcome to True Crime Garage. Wherever you are, whatever you are doing, thanks
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for listening. I'm your host Nick and with me as always is a man that I can only describe as a horse of a different
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>> And during our top 100 we talked about unsolved cases that we have covered. Mhm. So people keep on saying, "Hey, uh
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>> [music] >> what about this case or what about this case?" What about Abraham Lincoln?
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Right. It's only cases that we covered. Uh and if you would like to find those old episodes you can do so on our
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gather around, grab a chair, grab a beer. Let's talk some true crime. >> [music]
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[music] [music] [music] >> This is True Crime Garage. And this is the case of Casey [music]
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Anthony. I'm pleased to tell you that you're recorded. I can help you. Hello. Hi. I was I drove to the police
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department here on Pershing but you guys are closed. I need to bring someone in to the police department. Can you tell
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me where I can the closest one I can come in? What what are you trying to accomplish by bringing them to the
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station? I have a 22-year-old person that has um grand theft sitting in my auto with me. So the 22-year-old person stole
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something? Yes. Is this a relative? Yes. Where did they steal it from? Um my car and also money.
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Okay. Is this your son? Daughter. Okay. So your daughter stole money from your car?
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No. My car was stolen. We retrieved it today. We found out where it was at. We retrieved it. I've got that and I've got
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affidavit for my banking account. I want to bring her in. Okay. >> have her charged. Where where did all of
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this happen? Oh, it's it's been happening. >> I know but I need to establish a jurisdiction is what I'm trying to
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>> Oh, I live in um in Orlando. Yeah, but what address did these thefts occur at?
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Um well I guess my residence. I guess 41 Okay. 41 That's actually going to be in the
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jurisdiction of the sheriff's office, ma'am, not the Orlando Police Department. All righty. Let me transfer
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you over to the communications section for the Orlando Orange County. Okay. Now is the Orlando Sheriff's Department the
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one on 436 that is that open this afternoon this evening? Uh the substation you're
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at on Pershing if it's Orlando Police we're we're open primarily during the day.
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Uh-huh. But that's not the sheriff. That's city police which does not have jurisdiction
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for your area. >> I know there is a sheriff's department on 5th I mean on 436. Well what I'm
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going to do is I'm going to transfer you to the sheriff's communication section and you can um determine that. Hold on.
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Okay. So my next thing will be downtown saying and we'll have a court order to get her.
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If that's what you want to play we'll do it and you'll never Well then you have all your days.
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No, I'm not giving you another day. I've given you a month. 911 what is the address that's
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happening? Um I have someone here that I need to um be arrested in my home. They're there right now? I have a
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possible missing child. I have a 3-year-old that's been missing for a month. A 3-year-old? Yeah. Have
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you reported that? I'm trying to do that now, ma'am. Okay. What did the person do that you
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need arrested? My daughter. For what? For stealing an auto and stealing money. I already spoke with someone. They said
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they would patch me through the Orlando um Sheriff's Department have a deputy here. I was in the car. I was going to
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drive her to the police station and no one's open. They said they would bring a deputy to my home when I got home to
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call them. So she stole your vehicle? Yes. When did she do that? Um on the 30th. I just got it back from
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the impound. I'd like to speak to an officer. Can you have someone come out to my house? Okay. Okay. I got to ask
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you these questions so I can put them in the in the call, okay? Okay. 30th of June?
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Yes. Okay. How old is your daughter? 22. Okay. What's her name? My name? Her name? Her name?
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And you said you have the vehicle back? Yes. And I have the um statement. Is there right now? Yes. I got her. I
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finally found her after a month. She's been missing for a month. I found her but we can't find my granddaughter.
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Um 5 ft 1 and 1/2. Thin, medium, or heavy build? Thin. Color hair? Brown. What color
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uh shirt is she wearing? White. What color pants? Oh, they're shorts. She's wearing um
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plaid. They're like pink and teal and white plaid plaid. Does she have any weapons on her?
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No. And she's not telling you where her daughter is? Correct. Okay. We'll have a deputy out to you as
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soon as one is available, okay? Thank you. Thank you. Bye. >> Bye. 911 what's your emergency?
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I called a little bit ago. The deputy sheriff is not here. I found out my granddaughter has been taken. She has
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been missing for a month. Her her mother finally admitted that she's been missing. Okay.
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>> Okay. What is the address that you're calling from? We're talking about a 3-year-old little girl.
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My daughter finally admitted that the baby turned 4. I need to find her. Your daughter
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admitted that your the baby is where? The baby turned 4 a month ago but my daughter's been looking for. I told you
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my daughter was missing for a month. I just found her today but I can't find my granddaughter. She just admitted to me
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that she's been trying to find her herself. There's something wrong. I found my daughter's car today and it smells like
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there's been a dead body in the damn car. >> Okay. What is the 3-year-old's name?
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Caylee. C A Y L E E Anthony. Caylee Anthony? Yes. Okay. Is she white, black, or Hispanic? She's white.
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How long has she been missing for? I have not seen her since the 7th of June. What is her date of birth?
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Um 8 8 9 2000 Oh gosh. She's 3. She's Caylee Anthony Caylee Anthony Caylee Anthony took her a month ago.
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She's been missing for a month. Okay, I just I need I I understand I can you just can you calm down for me for
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just a minute and I need to know what's going on, okay? I'm going to try and talk I'm sorry. What is the week of I
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want to get the [ __ ] Is your Is your daughter there? >> I want my phone with them. Is your
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daughter there? Yes. >> Can I speak with her? Do you mind if I speak with her? Thank
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you. I called them 2 hours ago. They haven't gotten here. Can you see 5 minutes and
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Caylee took her a month ago? Ma'am. Ma'am. The sheriff's department they want to
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talk to you. Answer the questions. Hello. Hello. Yes. Hi. What can you Can you tell me what's going on a little
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bit? I'm sorry. >> Can you tell me a little bit what's going on? My daughter's been missing for the last
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31 days. And you know who has her? I know who has her. I've tried to contact her. I actually received a phone
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call today. Now from a number that is no longer in service. I did get to speak to my
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daughter for about a moment about a minute. Okay, did you guys call and report a vehicle stolen?
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Um yes, my mom did. Okay, so there's been a vehicle stolen, too? No, this is my vehicle.
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What vehicle was stolen? Um it's a '98 Pontiac Sunfire. Okay, I have deputies on the way to you
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right now for that. But now you're Now your 3-year-old is Caylee Anthony missing. Caylee Anthony.
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Yes. White female. Yes, white female. 3 years old, 8 9 2005 her date of birth. Yes. And you last saw
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her a month ago? 31 days. It's been 31 days. Who has her? Do you have Do you have a
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name? Her name is Zenaida Fernandez Gonzalez. Who is that? Babysitter? She's been my
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nanny for about a year and a half almost 2 years. And why Why are you calling now? Why
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didn't you call 31 days ago? I've been looking for her and have gone through other resources to try to find
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her, which was stupid. Okay. Can you Can you give me the name of the the nanny again? Like spell it out for me?
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Zenaida. Z E N A I D A Last name? >> Fernandez. Fernandez? Hyphen Gonzalez. I think officers are here.
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The officers are there? Yes. Okay, hold on a second. Don't hang up with me yet. I need you
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Okay. >> [music] [music] [music] >> Caylee Anthony was born August 9th, 2005. She lived with her mother Casey and
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Casey's parents George and Cindy Anthony in a ranch style home in Orlando, Florida. Casey was 19 when she gave
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birth to Caylee. In June of 2008, the two were still living with George and Cindy. Caylee is now 2 years old and
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Casey 22 years old. On June 9th, Casey and Caylee move out of George and Cindy's house and move in with Casey's
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ex-boyfriend Ricardo Morales and his friend Amy. On Sunday, June 15th, 2008, Caylee goes with Cindy to visit Cindy's
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father in an assisted living facility. Mhm. Later that day, Caylee and Cindy swim together in the Anthony family's
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above ground pool. This is Father's Day. And before the night was over, there was
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going to be a showdown in the Anthony household. And I'm guessing that this was not the first of its kind. Cindy,
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who was 50 years old, she is attacking Casey's parenting skills or lack thereof. Right. Casey decides to argue
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back and this argument becomes pretty heated and at one point allegedly Cindy is threatening that her and George are
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going to take legal custody of Caylee. Mhm. And at some point Cindy has her hands around Casey's neck.
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George ends up diffusing the situation. Uh and everybody they they just kind of part their ways, but then a pretty
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heated argument takes place that evening. The next day is Monday, June 16th. Now this is a work day and at this
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time Cindy is a nurse and she works during the day. George is working basically a second shift security job.
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His work day typically starts at 3:00 p.m. So after Cindy leaves for work, we would just have Casey and Caylee and
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George there for the morning hours Mhm. until Casey goes off to work and Caylee goes to the babysitter's apartment.
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George would later say that he last saw Casey and Caylee as they left the house at 12:50 p.m. At 2:30 p.m., George left
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for work. >> And this would be the last time any of her parents actually see Casey with
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Caylee. Yes, in the next few weeks George and Cindy do not see Casey or Caylee. They They did however talk on
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the phone with Casey several times. >> Mhm. On these occasions, Cindy would ask to speak with the little Caylee and each
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time she would be unable to do so because the child was with her nanny or at an amusement park, but she was the
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little kid was always busy doing something and Cindy would not be able to speak with her. Casey would tell her
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parents that she was she was quite busy mostly with work and some personal things as well. And where is she working
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at? She was currently working at the very popular Universal Studio theme park. >> Mhm. On June [clears throat] 30th, a
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1998 white Pontiac Sunfire was towed from a store parking lot. The vehicle [clears throat] was considered to have
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been abandoned and was transferred to the Johnson's Wrecker Service impound lot.
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On July 3rd, Cindy posted on her MySpace page the following. This precious angel
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from above gave me strength and unconditional love. Jealousy has taken her away. Jealousy from the person who
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should be thankful for all of the support given to her. On July 7th, pretty much we can assume
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in retaliation, Casey posts on her own page what is titled Diary of Days that says what is given can be taken away.
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Everyone lies, everyone dies, life will never be easy. Well, and for kids that don't understand what MySpace is,
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MySpace was basically the precursor to Facebook. But again, don't You don't need to air your dirty
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laundry on social media. For everybody out there to see, huh? Yeah, well I just think it's hilarious. Like, well I'm
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going to make this statement and then and I'm not going to address who I'm talking to and then they're going to
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make a statement. It's just very childish. On July 15th, George Anthony at He's at home and he was
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>> Does he post on his MySpace page? >> [laughter] >> George got on there and said, yes,
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everybody does die and everybody lies. I don't have any posts from George, but on
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the 15th of July when he's at home, he receives a certified letter from Johnson's Wrecker Service this notifying
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him that the 1998 Pontiac Sunfire registered to him and his wife Cindy has been sitting in the impound lot. Mhm.
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>> George then calls Cindy. Cindy is at work and the two go to retrieve the vehicle. Uh this is of major concern to
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both George and Cindy because even though the vehicle is owned by the two of them, the vehicle was primarily being
00:17:54
used by Casey to the point of well, you'd probably just consider the car to be hers. And this was the car that Casey
00:18:02
and Caylee had left the Anthony house in on June 16th. Right, and this is going to be pretty alarming to the parents
00:18:09
because not only are they worried about their daughter, but they're also worried
00:18:11
about their granddaughter. Yeah, the two were supposed to have been on a mini vacation in Jacksonville, Florida. So
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finding this vehicle abandoned is very scary for them. Um they get to the impound lot, but before George attempted
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to start the Sunfire, he asked the impound lot attendant to check the trunk of the vehicle with him. Uh they both
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smelled a terrible smell inside the vehicle and he thought they better check the trunk because George thought it was
00:18:39
possible that he might find the body of Casey or Caylee or maybe even both of them in the trunk with the with the
00:18:45
vehicle being abandoned. Right now listeners are probably thinking, how does this make any sense? Well, let's go
00:18:51
back a little bit with George's history. George was uh police officer for a time
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period and also in his transition phase of work, he was also security guard. So at his time of being uh
00:19:04
in law enforcement, he smelled you know, a dead body. >> Correct. >> And so he feels like what he is smelling
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is that of a dead body. And the crazy thing here, too, Captain, is that not only does George have that experience,
00:19:18
but I don't have the gentleman that from the impound lot I don't have his name here with me. He's actually
00:19:24
familiar with that experience as well because they had They had towed a vehicle at one point and there was They
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found a body in it, you know, days after it sat on the lot. Um instead, you know,
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the two men they popped the trunk uh and thankfully so, they they find a white trash bag full of garbage.
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Uh this kind of explaining the smell to the two men. Uh George looked in the bag, the attendant then removed the bag
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and threw it in a dumpster. The vehicle they found was out of So they put a little gas in the car and
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George drove off in the Sunfire. Cindy was furious about the car. And so she makes some calls to some of
00:20:04
Casey's friends because she wants to Not only is she furious that the car has been towed. I mean they had to pay a
00:20:10
small fortune to get this car back. And then on top of that, you know, this is a
00:20:14
car you're letting your daughter use. >> Right. You're paying the insurance. You're you probably paid for the car.
00:20:20
Yeah. And you're you're helping out your kid. This car is abandoned. But but also
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you're probably worried worried about your child's safety. Well, and this is you know, here's somebody that they keep
00:20:29
enabling and enabling George in one of his statements to the law enforcement claims
00:20:35
that there was multiple times where you know, she would steal gas from the home or she'd steal money, you know,
00:20:42
here and there to to fill up the tank. But also she had a easy pass. And then instead of
00:20:48
slowing down for the easy pass or no, maybe she didn't have an easy pass, but she would claim, "Well, I threw the
00:20:53
money in there and the you know, the toll pass." For anybody that doesn't know, so we have some states have tolls
00:21:00
that you have to pay. And she would go through these toll lanes. Claim that she put money in it.
00:21:07
And then come back and he would be fine because the car was registered in their name. Correct. So whoever the car is
00:21:13
registered in has to pay those fines. And so this guy is going, "Look, we help you with your daughter. You know, we
00:21:20
help with our grandkid. We pay for your gas. We pay for the car. We pay for the insurance.
00:21:25
And you can't even pay the toll." Right. Right. And now I have to go down and fish this car out of the impound lot.
00:21:31
And then on several occasions, too, they they believe that Casey had used their credit cards or charge cards without
00:21:38
permission. So this is kind of an ongoing thing. And I think what takes over here is you might lose track about
00:21:45
worrying about the safety of the kid. And now you're just so furious that this is just continually happening again and
00:21:51
again. Right. And when when uh they go to visit the the grandfather that's in the nursing home. That's
00:21:58
another thing that's going on is they have a separate bank account that has money for him. And there's actually some
00:22:04
suspicious uh some suspicion that Casey is taking money from that account as well. So they got a big
00:22:11
problem on their hands. Yeah. Yeah. So Cindy she tracks down Casey calling some of her friends and finds out that Casey
00:22:20
is in fact she's not in in Jacksonville at all. Mhm. Uh she is at her boyfriend's home. Uh this is Tony
00:22:26
Lazarro. And Cindy drives out to Tony's condo. Uh she of course finds Casey there. She
00:22:34
is trying to get Casey and Caylee to come home. Mhm. And she starts telling Casey that you know what? If she can't
00:22:40
talk Casey into coming home, then she would just take Caylee and take Caylee home with her. But Caylee is not there.
00:22:48
She's not at the condo. Casey finally agrees to go home with Cindy. Cindy then calls the police on the way
00:22:56
home. Right. Those are the 911 tapes you heard earlier. Yeah. And she wants to charge her daughter with stealing the
00:23:02
vehicle and stealing some money from her. Once they get back home, Cindy calls 911
00:23:08
again requesting an officer to the house so that she can make a report against her daughter. Then a short time later a
00:23:16
third call is made. And of course we we just heard all three of these calls uh earlier. But it's the third call when
00:23:24
little Caylee is finally reported missing. Not by Casey, but by Caylee's grandmother Cindy.
00:23:31
One has to wonder had Cindy not gone to Tony's condo and tracked down Casey that
00:23:37
night, how long would it have been until little Caylee would be reported missing?
00:23:42
>> Right. Currently we're at 31 days. And what's interesting about that 911 call,
00:23:47
the third one, is when she is calling and she's she tells Casey, "Hey, they want to talk to you." And you can hear
00:23:54
faintly Casey Anthony say, "I don't have anything to talk to them about." Mhm. Now, your daughter has been missing for
00:24:02
31 days. And you don't got anything to talk to the law enforcement about? That you know, that's pretty strange to
00:24:10
me. >> Mhm. Well, when the Orange County Sheriff's Department arrive at the Anthony home,
00:24:15
it's Detective Yuri Melich that will be in charge of interviewing the family and
00:24:19
taking statements. Mhm. George had told Melich that George had once worked in law enforcement up in Warren, Ohio and
00:24:26
that Casey was not being truthful and that they had retrieved the car from the impound lot earlier that day and that
00:24:34
the vehicle smelled, and these are his words, smelled like death. Right. Uh Melich focused on Casey's statements.
00:24:42
Uh he asked her to repeat her story several times and even asked her if she would like to change anything before he
00:24:49
took a sworn statement from her. She did not want to change anything and she delivered the same story time and time
00:24:54
again. >> remember she has nothing to talk to them about. Well, Casey stated that she had
00:24:59
last seen Caylee on the morning of June 9th. So we have a discrepancy in days already. Casey took Caylee to the
00:25:07
babysitter's on her way to work. The babysitter is Zenaida Well, let's just let's be clear about this discrepancy.
00:25:14
She's saying, "Well, the last time I saw my daughter was June 9th." Right. But the last time that any of the family
00:25:20
members recall seeing her with the granddaughter is on the 16th. >> June 16th, right. The babysitter's name
00:25:28
is Zenaida Fernandez Gonzalez. Mhm. More famously known as Zanny the Nanny. Yes.
00:25:34
And she according to Casey lives in Orlando's Sawgrass Apartments in unit 210, uh which is located on the second floor.
00:25:44
Casey said that she went back to the apartment after work to pick up Caylee, but no one was home. No one answered the
00:25:50
door. She called Zenaida's cell phone and again no answer. Uh Casey states that she waited in front of the
00:25:58
apartment for a while expecting them to return. She then went to Blanchard Park where Zenaida sometimes took the kids.
00:26:05
Right. Uh after which she then went to some stores and shops where she thought she may find the babysitter with Caylee.
00:26:13
Which makes all logical sense. I go to pick up my kid from the babysitter. They're not there. Oh, where could they
00:26:20
be? And also, you know, cell phones are pretty popular at this point. So you could be [clears throat]
00:26:25
making some calls. You can be sending out some text messages. Yeah. She she tried calling her and says that that
00:26:31
there was no answer on the phone. >> Mhm. So she goes around looking for Caylee and the babysitter even at the
00:26:37
stores and the shop. But again, this doesn't pan out. And she decides that after not being able to find the two,
00:26:44
that she would go to her boyfriend's condo where she had been staying since. Uh she said that she was staying at
00:26:51
Tony's because she felt safe there. And that while she was staying there, she was actually conducting her own
00:26:57
investigation to locate Caylee. Mhm. And to get her daughter back. Um she didn't contact law enforcement
00:27:05
because she had seen on TV and in movies that when a person is kidnapped or taken
00:27:10
hostage that people get hurt once law enforcement is contacted. Casey was asked to produce the
00:27:16
babysitter's phone number which she says she doesn't have this number memorized.
00:27:22
Uh but the number is stored on her phone which has been left at her office at work at Universal Studios.
00:27:30
Casey says that she has known Zenaida for years and she's been watching and taking care of Caylee for almost 2
00:27:36
years. A year and a half to 2 years. She says that she met Zenaida from a mutual
00:27:41
friend. His name is Jeffrey Hopkins. Casey worked with Jeffrey Hopkins and Jeffrey's son, 4-year-old Zach, was one
00:27:48
of the kids that Zenaida was watching and caring for as well. Then law enforcement are going to wonder, "Well,
00:27:54
if you didn't tell your parents, you know, that 31 days ago that the nanny took your kid, who did you tell?" Yeah.
00:28:01
Yeah. So she states that she did tell some of her co-workers. She told Jeffrey Hopkins who we already
00:28:07
mentioned as well as Juliet Lewis, another co-worker at Universal. Juliet Lewis, okay. When asked if her in
00:28:15
investigation had provided any intel, she says no. What efforts did she make to track down Caylee? Casey says she
00:28:22
tried to make contact with Zenaida's mother Gloria. Mhm. Uh she in fact made several attempts to call and get in
00:28:30
touch with Gloria. >> Gloria Estefan. Yeah. Uh could she give the detective Gloria's
00:28:36
phone number? And she states no, that she could not. Uh double-checking that this is not
00:28:42
simply a custody dispute, they inquire about the father of Caylee. And they learn from Casey
00:28:49
uh that the father's name is Eric. And Eric had died in a car accident. Casey's parents tell the detective they have
00:28:57
never met Eric. Detective Melich asked Casey if she had any problems with narcotics,
00:29:03
specifically cocaine, ecstasy, meth, or anything like that. Mhm. Uh Casey states
00:29:08
no, she doesn't have any drug problems. Melich then asked if Casey had ever been
00:29:12
to Lakeside, which is a local mental health facility. And she states that she has not. We're going to get right back
00:29:20
to the law enforcement questioning of Casey Anthony right after this quick [music] beer break.
00:29:30
>> [music] >> All right. [music] Cheers, mates. So we are still at the Anthony household and
00:29:43
law enforcement is asking questions to Casey regarding the disappearance of her daughter Caylee. Mhm. Now remember she
00:29:49
had stated that she had in fact told two co-workers that the nanny had run off with with her daughter and she was
00:29:55
conducting her own investigation. >> Right. >> They want to know more about these
00:29:59
co-workers and this is Jeffrey and Juliet that we had mentioned earlier. So they ask, you know, does Juliet still
00:30:05
work at Universal? Casey says yes, she does. Well, what is Juliet's job? Casey says that she's an
00:30:12
an event coordinator. Okay, great. Can you give us her phone number? No, she cannot and in fact, this
00:30:20
must have triggered some memory because Casey explains that she was mistaken that Juliet does not work for Universal
00:30:28
anymore. That she left two months ago and moved back to her home state of New York.
00:30:34
So let's go to Zenaida's apartment and see what's going on over there, right? Right. So they ask Casey
00:30:42
if she could take them to the babysitter's apartment. >> Of course she can. >> And she said that she would she would be
00:30:47
pretty sure that she could. Yeah, that's a that's a flag there, right? >> Yeah, yeah, cuz when I drop my kids off
00:30:55
at the babysitter, I'm not really for sure which apartment they go into. Well, Casey Anthony leads them to the
00:31:00
apartment complex and then to the upstairs apartment unit of 210. >> Yeah, she gets out of her car the gets
00:31:07
out of the police officer's car and says she lives in that one. Mhm. Well, the sheriff's department quickly discover
00:31:13
that no one is living in the apartment. Mhm. Uh Melich then ask if uh if she could think of any other place
00:31:21
where Zenaida would have lived before, you know, she started living there. Well, now now look look, I I don't know
00:31:27
if this raises that many red flags because if you had take somebody's kid you might not be there. Right, you might
00:31:34
just pack up all your stuff and hit the road. >> Mhm. Well, Casey explains that she knows
00:31:41
where Zenaida's mother Gloria used to live. And she says that she could take them to Gloria's
00:31:47
>> sound machine. >> apartment complex. They arrive as directed by Casey and this turns out that the place is a home
00:31:55
for the elderly. Melich checks with the home. No one there has ever heard of Gloria.
00:32:01
Surprise, surprise. They drive around with Casey until 3:00 in the morning and then they take her back home to the
00:32:08
Anthony's. And when they get back to the Anthony's so they drop her off but what's
00:32:13
interesting here is that George is going to come out and talk to the police officers. Yeah, he's he's going to tell
00:32:18
Melich that Casey has been lying to him and that there is something very suspicious going on in his opinion and
00:32:24
that the detective should continue to investigate this. The next morning Casey and Cindy spend
00:32:30
most of the morning building MySpace and Facebook pages for missing Caylee Anthony. Uh yeah, that's yeah. They were
00:32:37
also texting and calling friends and persons in the community to organize a search and spreading the word of
00:32:44
Caylee's disappearance. >> And I yeah, I think it was uh the day before or that day
00:32:50
was when there was a a mass text message group, you know, where you group everybody and I think she's uh Casey
00:32:57
sends out a huge text message to everybody all her contacts saying, "Hey look, my daughter's been missing now for
00:33:03
32 days and and you know, if you have any information, I think the nanny took her." Mhm.
00:33:11
Well, it's around noon that Casey is picked up by the sheriff's department. And they are going to go looking for
00:33:17
Casey's phone at her work so they can start reaching out to the babysitter and the co-workers. Mhm. Uh you know, she
00:33:24
she didn't know these phone numbers so we have to get to that phone, right? Casey agrees to go with the officers to
00:33:30
Universal Studios. However, she informs them that her phone has been stolen and this occurred while she was at work.
00:33:38
She has reported the incident to loss prevention and they are looking for Casey Anthony's phone.
00:33:44
>> Right. When they pull up to the security check-in gate at Universal, Casey does
00:33:49
not have her identification badge with her. >> No, really. She explains that she has
00:33:54
lost the badge. The officers convinced security to let them through. They pulled up to an office building.
00:34:01
Casey takes the officers inside, makes a left-hand turn and walks them back down
00:34:07
a back hallway when she suddenly >> Well, you're missing a part of the story cuz
00:34:12
they actually talked to one of like the front front of house Mhm. people and she's saying, "Hey, well, I need to talk
00:34:19
to this person." Well, what's their extension? Well, this is their extension. There's nobody The extension didn't
00:34:25
work. >> Right, right. So this guy has no clue. You know, so not only does the front
00:34:29
gate let them through, but the front office then they go, "Okay, well, if you want to search around, maybe I am
00:34:36
mistaken. You're here with law enforcement. You claim you work here. So okay, find your office." Yeah. And when
00:34:43
she goes down this corridor or goes down this hallway that go to a dead end. Yeah.
00:34:50
And And then she turns around and says uh I don't work here. Yeah, okay, I don't
00:34:56
work here. And and the police officers kind of they kind of had their suspicion that
00:35:01
this was the case anyways but they wanted her to come out and and be the one to say, "I'm lying." Yeah,
00:35:09
and I think they wanted to give her enough rope to hang herself as the old expression goes.
00:35:14
>> Mhm. Um what they were able to confirm is the following. They did confirm that
00:35:19
Casey had in fact worked at Universal at one time. However, she had been fired April 24th, 2006 when she failed to show
00:35:27
up for work. Right, which was like two years prior. >> Mhm. The detectives are at Universal
00:35:32
with her on July 16th, 2008 and she hadn't worked there for over two years. Right. A quick check of the names
00:35:41
of the co-workers that Casey had said she told about the disappearance of Caylee, Jeffrey Hopkins uh he did work
00:35:49
at Universal, but he was fired back in 2002 and Juliet Lewis did not exist. They
00:35:55
couldn't find any record of her at all. Juliet Lewis-Dreyfus. Right. Yeah, and and
00:36:02
Casey had also said that her supervisor was Tom Frank. Uh Tom also did not exist. Well, that's a horrible name to
00:36:09
come up with. Tom Frank. Yep, well, that was her boss. >> Welcome to True Crime Garage. My name is
00:36:14
Tom Frank. Well, they decide to arrest Casey and they take her back to the station for further questioning and even
00:36:22
when they confront her with her lies, Casey sticks to her story. Um she claims she did not know where
00:36:30
Caylee was and again, the last time she had seen her was with Zenaida with the babysitter, Zenaida
00:36:37
>> on the 9th. Now okay, here's a list of the lies so far. Mhm. One, your kid didn't go missing on the 9th.
00:36:44
Your parents saw the kid with you on the 16th. >> Mhm. So lie number one. Uh I work at
00:36:50
this place. I've been working there for two years. You've been telling your parents that you've been working at this
00:36:54
place for two years. Lie. Mhm. She's with the nanny. She lives here. Lie. Yeah, well, they
00:37:03
they confirm that >> here. They confirm that that not only did Zenaida Fernandez Gonzalez not live
00:37:09
there. Um >> She never lived there. Right, that that apartment had been vacant for 142 days.
00:37:17
No one had occupied that space for 142 days. >> Right, and so then when she says, "Well,
00:37:22
I told this person at work. I told this person at work." One person worked there, the other two people were made
00:37:27
up. Now the police officers have to be thinking that Zanny the nanny is probably a fictitious person.
00:37:33
>> Mhm. Mhm. Well, >> So I mean we got a slew of lies, you know, and then again, well, well, we're going
00:37:41
You've been lying to your parents for 30 some days. Right? So every time you called and every every
00:37:48
time you talked to your parents you lied. Yeah. For 31 days. She wasn't in Jacksonville like she said she would
00:37:55
be. She was at the boyfriend's apartment. Uh and then furthermore, you know, the the crazy thing here, Captain,
00:38:02
is people lie. I get it, right? There there are people out there that lie. But the
00:38:08
thing that seems very crazy to me is >> is that she has given detailed lies. >> Mhm. She's she's come up with names,
00:38:17
first and last names of people. She's given them job titles. She's also stated that Juliet Lewis was an event
00:38:24
coordinator who just quit two months ago and returned to her home state of New York. Right. Yeah, and she went on to
00:38:31
tell that, you know, Juliet Lewis came from a um a well-to-do background that she grew up in New York.
00:38:37
>> the Seinfeld show. She grew up in New York and then she moved to Florida uh to
00:38:41
go to college and then afterwards she started working at Universal. So she's got this whole life story for some of
00:38:48
these people. We're talking about Jeffrey Hopkins, uh she states that he has a 4-year-old son Zach who is being
00:38:56
watched by the same nanny as her daughter Caylee. I mean, these are these are extensive lies here.
00:39:02
>> You're making up fake people and then giving them fictitious well, look, that
00:39:06
makes a lot of sense. If you're a fake person, why wouldn't you have a fictitious son?
00:39:11
You know what I'm saying? I mean I look >> There are some people that are just chronic liars, habitual liars. Yeah,
00:39:19
that's the ticket. And that's what she is, you know? Well, she's arrested and charged with child neglect. This is for
00:39:27
failing to report Caylee missing. Mhm. Uh especially after this much time has passed and she has been lying to law
00:39:34
enforcement, obviously. Casey was originally assigned a public defender lawyer. However, she had asked a
00:39:40
relative to contact a private attorney to see about taking her case. Attorney Jose Baez was operating a small
00:39:49
firm in Kissimmee, Florida, and he gets the phone call. Uh his secretary sent him to the jail to meet with his new
00:39:58
potential client. Mhm. Jose was unaware that this case had been on the news at this time. When Baez arrived at the
00:40:05
jail, there was a public defender waiting there to meet with Casey. The public defender advised Casey not to
00:40:13
speak with anyone, that the case had been on the news, and detectives would probably be going down there again soon
00:40:19
to meet with her for further questioning, and she should not be talking with anyone unless she has an
00:40:25
attorney representing her and present during any and all talks. The public defender then left.
00:40:32
>> Why? Cuz everything she's going to say is just, you know, malarkey anyways. The
00:40:36
public defender then left, and Jose Baez meets with Casey Anthony for the first time.
00:40:40
>> And what they have to do is they have a bond hearing set. So, they got to figure
00:40:43
out what the bond is, and then if can they pay that so she can actually go home. Yeah, the first thing that Jose
00:40:50
says that he believes to be strange about this whole case is that when he's reviewing Casey Anthony's paperwork, it
00:40:57
clearly states on there no bond. Mhm. And most of the time with these lesser charges, especially for someone without
00:41:04
a criminal history, usually they set a reasonable dollar amount to set to set for this person to make bail. Right. I
00:41:12
think the problem here though is what he's not understanding is when you lie to a law enforcement over and over and
00:41:18
over, and we have a missing child that's under the age of three, we might start suspecting foul play
00:41:25
immediately. Well, and you're exactly right, and that's something that he quickly realizes. He does realize that,
00:41:31
you know what, this this phone call that I got regarding a child neglect case uh is in fact a missing person's case,
00:41:39
and this could very likely turn into a homicide case. Um Jose Baez then goes and meets with Casey's parents uh for
00:41:47
the first time, and he's explaining he's explaining what he's going to do is file a motion to get Casey out of jail.
00:41:56
During this visit, Cindy would explain to Jose the many excuses that Casey had told her during the 31 days that Caylee
00:42:03
and Casey were not at their home. You know, we don't need to go through all of these stories because we all obviously
00:42:09
know now that these were all lies. >> Uh most of the excuses involved Casey's job, which we know she didn't have, and
00:42:17
the nanny, which after learning about the apartment, it looks like nanny the nanny doesn't even exist. Right. And
00:42:23
then let's just get that whole part out of the way. The The police do eventually
00:42:27
find an individual with this person's name. >> Mhm. Uh so, Zenaida the nanny is real,
00:42:34
but she didn't know who Casey Anthony was or Caylee Anthony, never heard of them, and there's no
00:42:40
connection. It just so happens that they found somebody with that name. It also just so happens that Casey Anthony also
00:42:47
picked a pretty, you know, common name, and she might have knew about this person somehow
00:42:53
beforehand. Well, and I think they were they were further able to confirm that this this real Zenaida that they found
00:43:00
never in fact worked as a babysitter or nanny in any capacity at all. >> Right. Right. Right. So, let's just get
00:43:06
that off the table. >> Mhm. So, after agreeing to an attorney fee of $5,000, Jose Baez becomes Casey
00:43:12
Anthony's attorney on July 17th, 2008. Now, it's on July 22nd that Casey Anthony had her bond hearing. The judge
00:43:23
ruled that because Casey was now a suspect in the disappeared case, that they would be setting a bond much higher
00:43:29
than usual, and they end up setting the bond at $500,000. Damn. After this bond hearing, Casey
00:43:36
told Jose that she has something very important to tell him. Casey said that she was in her cell when
00:43:43
an inmate came by, and with her hands, she signaled to Casey five and then five. The inmate was staring at Casey,
00:43:52
and her lips with her lips, she mouthed the words timer 55. Casey explained that what
00:44:00
this actually had meant was what had actually happened to Caylee, Mhm. stating the following, that Casey
00:44:07
>> Wait, are you sure she wasn't trying to say primer 55? Uh according to according
00:44:13
to Jose Baez, it's timer 55. >> Okay, timer 55. And and we'll let Casey Anthony explain what that means. Ah, I
00:44:20
can't trust a damn thing she says. Go ahead. >> She says that that that her and Caylee
00:44:25
were with Zenaida at Blanchard Park. Zenaida took Caylee and put her in her car, in Zenaida's car.
00:44:33
When Casey asked what the woman was doing, Zenaida grabbed Casey, and with a very hostile tone, had told her that she
00:44:41
was not a good mother, and that she didn't know how lucky she was, Mhm. and that she was going to teach Casey a
00:44:48
lesson. Zenaida jumped in her car, and as she was pulling away, she said that she would make contact
00:44:55
with Casey, giving her further instructions. Casey said that Zenaida contacted her
00:45:02
and told Casey to change all of her passwords to timer 55 on her computer. Okay. An interesting thing here though,
00:45:11
Captain, is that investigators did find that Casey's MySpace and Facebook passwords were both in fact timer 55.
00:45:20
Mhm. Casey said, "If you count 55 days from June 16th, the date that Caylee was last seen, Even though she claimed it
00:45:30
was the 9th. Mhm. Okay. you get August 9th. August 9th is Caylee's birthday. Uh stating this is exactly 55 days. And
00:45:41
is it? If you If you do the math. >> what, I didn't I di- I as I'm reading this, I didn't look it up, but this is
00:45:47
this is Jose Baez's story that he that that as told to him by Casey Anthony. Um Do you want to look it up real quick?
00:45:55
We could, yeah. Hold on. So, it's technically 54, but if you count the 16th, you know. Then then we do get to that 55
00:46:04
days. >> Timer 55. That's That's odd. And Yeah, it >> dove into this case a bunch, and I
00:46:10
actually haven't heard about this yet, so. Well, so exactly 55 days from the day that she took the girl until the
00:46:17
girl's birthday on August 9th. And Zenaida states that she's going to give Casey instructions to go to different
00:46:25
places around Orlando to get Caylee back on her birthday. Mhm. Uh she says that Zenaida would post the places and
00:46:33
instructions on Casey's MySpace and Facebook accounts, and then erase them shortly after, so there would be no
00:46:40
trace of this. And that Zenaida could easily do this because she in fact had the passwords to those accounts. Mhm.
00:46:48
Um this is when Jose Baez says that he realized that there was something very off about his client. Uh he said that
00:46:57
this that in his conclusion, either that Casey is an extremely bad liar, or she's completely nuts. I mean,
00:47:05
to tell him such stories after he's already told her, "Stop talking to me about Zenaida. We We
00:47:13
We don't believe she exists. You need to come up with a you know, you need to come up with a different story. You need
00:47:18
to help us find your daughter to get you out of this trouble." And then she comes
00:47:21
up with this elaborate timer 55 story. Mhm. Uh Well, it sounds like you're you're a
00:47:28
little nutso. Well, and not right, exactly. Because not only is this an elaborate lie, but then on top of that,
00:47:34
to believe that Zenaida the nanny has the power to to get an inmate to, you know,
00:47:42
to tell tell you about this, to remind >> I was >> you're sitting in jail. She's probably
00:47:47
talking about primer 55. >> Well, around this same time, um Cindy, Casey's mother, had requested a private
00:47:53
meeting with Jose Baez. And Cindy said that she had something very important that she wanted to tell
00:47:59
Baez. Mhm. And she was telling him this because she needed Baez to relay this information to Casey.
00:48:06
Cindy told Baez that she had received a letter from a man in Maryland who was planning to plant a rose bush in the
00:48:14
Anthony's backyard for Caylee's birthday, and that Cindy needed Casey to tell them
00:48:20
the exact spot where to plant the bush as a memorial to the little girl. Uh Baez said that
00:48:28
he felt that this was a little strange as well, but he he took the message to Casey anyway, and Casey offered no
00:48:37
information as to where to plant the bush. Basically stating, "You can plant it wherever you want. I don't know what
00:48:43
she's talking about." >> Well, it's it's weird because it seems like it's all code. You know, like we're
00:48:48
going to have this rose bush planted. Almost like, "Tell me I'm going to try to give this code to my daughter. Hey,
00:48:56
tell me where to plant this bush in my yard." Thinking that maybe Casey will get the hint of, "Did you bury Mhm. your
00:49:03
daughter in our backyard?" >> Yeah, or did she die in a certain spot in the yard?
00:49:08
Um Right. Yeah, it's it's almost like a fishing expedition where, you know, does
00:49:12
Did the mother come And I I want to be clear here about this this story with Cindy. Mhm. Um the only person that I've
00:49:19
heard tell this story is Jose Baez. So, you know, there's no way to confirm that this
00:49:25
actually took place. Um I don't I don't see a reason why he might lie about it. Um Kind of a weird
00:49:32
story to lie about. >> Yeah, but but the thing that we're seeing here >> a lot of weird lies already. Yeah. Yeah,
00:49:38
this this this whole thing is a bundle of lies. Uh well, remember Captain, we talked
00:49:44
about the $500,000 bond um to get Casey Anthony out of jail. Well, nobody >> Chump change.
00:49:50
>> Nobody in the Anthony family had the funds to post the bond for Casey. Oh. Um
00:49:55
but nonetheless, someone did come forward um uh and Baez wanted Casey out of jail not
00:50:02
only so she could be with her family and assist with her defense, but also that she could possibly help find Caylee in
00:50:10
the process. >> Yeah, yeah. So, August 21st, 2008, uh we have a new character enters the story. We have
00:50:18
bounty hunter Leonard Padilla. And he pays Not Dog the Bounty Hunter? >> No, he pays Casey Anthony's $500,000
00:50:26
bail. Now, Leonard Padilla was a bounty hunter uh with a show on National Geographic Channel.
00:50:33
Um his goal was to become more successful and more popular than Dog the Bounty Hunter, who had had a hit show.
00:50:41
Um and Leonard paid the bail >> Well, I think all you have to do is uh start making a bunch of racist remarks
00:50:46
and you'll become more popular than Dog. Or more hated. Right. >> Yeah. So, he Leonard pays this bail and
00:50:54
I'm guessing this is obv- an obvious effort to promote his show, his name, and his firm. Um you know, that's a lot
00:51:02
of money. He did make an agreement with the defense that his company would be able to be in the Anthony home watching
00:51:10
over Casey. That's just creepy. Well, Casey was Well, they got to watch over their investment, right?
00:51:17
>> Yeah, I understand. >> And Casey was fitted with an electronic tracking device. Uh but Leonard's firm
00:51:23
believed that Casey could be a suicide risk. The security officers that watched over Casey have, of course, gone on to
00:51:31
give their interviews about their experiences. And they have said that very quickly after they became involved,
00:51:39
they knew they would not have to worry about suicide. They could quickly tell that Casey cared far too much about
00:51:46
herself and that she would never commit suicide. >> Mhm. They have also said that that
00:51:51
another eye-opening moment for them was when they first got her home. You know, she's been in She's been in jail for
00:51:57
quite some time. And the first thing >> like 30 some days? The If you want to hit pause, we can count
00:52:03
the calendar. I'm joking. Um We're not counting any more days. But she's been in jail for quite some time.
00:52:09
And at this point, they they bring her home. And the first thing that she said when she arrived at home was, "What's
00:52:16
for dinner? Prison food sucks." Um you know, nothing to do with her missing daughter. Uh you know, now we
00:52:24
have a 3-year-old daughter that is still missing and would have celebrated her third birthday less than 2 weeks ago
00:52:31
before this discussion about dinner took place while Casey was locked up. Uh you
00:52:36
know, not what's going on with the searches, not what's going on with the case, just what's for dinner. Right. Uh
00:52:42
one of the male >> Beef. Beef is what's for dinner. >> One of the male officers had said that
00:52:48
he believed that Casey was often flirting with him. He believes that she was someone that that might use her
00:52:54
sexuality to manipulate situations. You think? >> Um but anyway, when when she is
00:53:00
released, Baez drives her home in his SUV accompanied by the security vehicles from Leonard's firm.
00:53:08
As they get closer to the Anthony home, they start to see the protesters' signs,
00:53:13
you know, signs saying things like baby killer and burn in hell, [ __ ] and lock
00:53:17
her up uh amongst a whole army of other things. Right. And look, we should be pretty
00:53:23
clear about this because what happens in Florida is that anytime that the there's
00:53:28
information that is known to the police department, I believe that they have to disclose that. Well, that's that
00:53:35
sunshine law, I believe it's called, where the freedom of information uh sunshine law that they have down there,
00:53:41
where it's almost everything is public record at some point. And not only that, but this this story's been on the news,
00:53:48
and amongst most of the public, she's probably already been convicted because she's not behaving the way that you
00:53:53
think that a >> Well, the mother should. Well, at this point, people are probably
00:53:58
hopeful that they find their you know, her child, that they find Caylee. The problem is is that from the get-go,
00:54:08
your kid's been missing for 31 days and you didn't tell anybody. Mhm. Uh what's what's up with that? Right. You
00:54:15
know? Right. You you you are a piece of [ __ ] Well, and I think that when she was released, that
00:54:22
this is when this thing really turned into a circus. I mean, it was already a media frenzy from very early on, but
00:54:30
this thing got crazy. I mean, protesters basically setting up shop in front of the Anthony house. Pounding You can see
00:54:37
them pounding on the door, getting into fights with George. There's one part where Cindy She's out front waving
00:54:43
around a hammer. Yeah, she's just screaming >> Like she's Too legit to quit. Yeah, hey.
00:54:50
But she's waving it around almost like she has the intention of of hitting somebody with it.
00:54:55
>> Yeah. >> [laughter] >> Cuz she's she's a little I mean, look, the the apple doesn't fall fall too far
00:55:01
from the tree here. Mhm. And then that's all I'm going to say about that. Well, this this release from jail didn't last
00:55:09
very long because just 8 days later, the sheriff's department arrest Casey again.
00:55:15
This time it's for writing bad checks. Remember when Casey and Caylee went to live with her former boyfriend and his
00:55:21
friend Amy? Mhm. Well, Casey had stolen some of Amy's She stole Amy's checkbook and wrote four checks. Right. Uh this
00:55:30
this is during the time that the state starts >> dive Look, let's dive into this for a
00:55:35
little bit cuz one, the initial claims that the mother said, "Hey, he stole my car." Uh she didn't steal your car,
00:55:42
okay? You The car was registered in your name and and your daughter had access to the
00:55:48
that car. Right. And >> her access to that car. >> I would argue she was the primary user
00:55:53
of that car. That Like I said, you could basically call it Casey Anthony's car with the exception of it having, you
00:55:59
know, a different name on the title. Right. That that car was not stolen. But if there's money being taken from the
00:56:06
grandpa, if there's money being taken from your account, taken from your purse, taken
00:56:10
from your house, if if she's stealing uh you know, you know, going over and you know, the gas can for the lawnmower,
00:56:18
if she's taking that and putting that into her car, Mhm. you know, this is all parts of being a theft. And when you
00:56:26
have no job for 2 years, you got to come up with money somehow. You have to come up with money somehow.
00:56:30
>> Especially because the people you were living with believe you to be working this entire time. Right. Mhm. They see
00:56:38
this woman get up every day and leave with her daughter and supposedly go off to work dropping
00:56:44
the kid off somewhere. I mean, that's that's one hell of a marathon lie, right? That's not just
00:56:51
like a that's not just a little white lie that you just got to get through the day
00:56:55
with. This is something you get up and you repeat day after day after day for for damn near 2 years. All right. So,
00:57:02
you know, no more beef for dinner. They lock her ass back up. Yeah, for the checks. Mhm. So, she picked up for these
00:57:10
these fraudulent checks. And it's at this time that the state start starts talking about working out a possible
00:57:16
deal with Casey Anthony, that they might be willing to throw out some of these lesser charges that Casey is facing in
00:57:23
trade for the location and or confession regarding her daughter, Caylee. Right. Of course, this deal is refused. Um on
00:57:34
September 5th, Well, didn't you hear the timer 55, you know, story? Mhm. You didn't buy that? You didn't You didn't
00:57:41
think that was, you know, reality? On September 5th, Casey's parents post bond for her. Um I don't know how much
00:57:50
of the bond they actually came up with. Sometimes these things they can work out
00:57:54
deals if your house is worth a certain amount of money, so forth and so on. You have certain amount of assets. Mhm.
00:57:59
>> Um but they basically get their daughter out of jail. And again, she is fitted
00:58:05
with a tracking device and and released one more time. Right. >> It's on September 15th that Casey turns
00:58:12
herself in. This time it's because of new fraud charges and false identification and petty theft. Yeah.
00:58:21
She spends one night in jail and then she's released the next day because she's she's only being held overnight on
00:58:27
these new charges, which are all pretty small misdemeanor charges. Um >> But she at least admits to those? Um I I
00:58:35
I don't know that she admitted to them, but it was something they could only hold her for a night on those charges.
00:58:40
>> turned herself in. She turned herself in and she's released. >> admitting to this? I think I think
00:58:45
you're exactly right there, Captain. >> [laughter] >> Right. Right. So, she spends the night
00:58:49
in jail. She's released the next day. And then on October 14th, Casey Anthony is indicted by a grand jury, and she is
00:58:57
looking at first-degree murder charges, child abuse, manslaughter, and giving law enforcement false information.
00:59:04
>> Okay. Okay. Uh how does this make any sense, though? How can you charge somebody with
00:59:09
manslaughter when there is no body? Well, I don't understand the whole legality of the
00:59:16
situation, but from what I what I believe is that when a grand jury meets and they decide that there is reason or
00:59:24
cause to believe that a murder occurred, then then there's a separate investigation that goes on, and I
00:59:29
believe they can detain somebody that's being investigated for that. Don't I don't want to be emailed by every lawyer
00:59:36
in in America. That's That's my understanding. These are the facts though, she was arrested. Right. Well,
00:59:42
okay. So So, we have this little hobbit person, right? Casey Anthony, and she's lying to
00:59:49
everybody. Mhm. And she's making up people. Right. And uh then she makes up this timer 55 story,
00:59:58
which you got to believe is real. It It makes so much sense. Yeah. So, and then you get Man, that we that that the
01:00:05
planning of the rose bush is so strange. Yeah. >> [sighs] >> And And we'll kind of get into this I
01:00:14
I don't Do you want to get into the the conversations with them at the police stations and in jail?
01:00:21
Cuz one of the things that's like I said with the Florida the sunshine law or whatever it is, kind of this
01:00:27
transparency thing, when she's in jail, she's being, you know, visited by her mother and her father and also visited
01:00:35
by her brother. Mhm. And they're And these tapes are recorded. You can actually watch them in their entirety.
01:00:41
They actually give the inmate almost an hour to have conversations with these individuals. And I don't think that
01:00:47
there is like a set amount where like if your lawyer shows up, you can talk to them for an hour. If your parents show
01:00:53
up, you can talk to them for an hour. Right. Uh and all these tapes are released,
01:00:59
you know, so if her parents met with her, let's say, on a Friday, some of these tapes were being released
01:01:04
to the media outlets by Monday morning. >> Mhm. It was not taking that long for them to be released. That's why when you
01:01:12
said, you know, there is no body found, there is no, you know, as far as we know, Caylee is
01:01:19
still missing at this point. >> Right. But because of the all these weird interactions and the way she is
01:01:25
acting on these tapes, the public immediately starts going, "This troll did it." Mhm. Right?
01:01:32
Well, I I'll tell you what, I've seen the tapes at length and I've seen the cut versions that they show on TV. Mhm.
01:01:39
Um I would throw a little warning out there to to everybody listening that the cut versions, look, she doesn't look She
01:01:47
doesn't make herself look good in the long version or the cut version. You shouldn't get with makeup. And I would I
01:01:52
would say though, Captain, that I believe that some of the the TV stations may have made her look even worse. Um
01:02:00
Yeah. Yeah. They did They did cut things um and they slightly manipulated uh some
01:02:05
of the interactions, especially with the parents. I didn't notice it so much with
01:02:09
the brother and her, but more so with her and her parents, uh where they would kind of clip They would you might have a
01:02:15
very lengthy question and she might give a very lengthy answer. And instead, when
01:02:20
you see it on TV, you're going to get the the the clipped version of that question with the with the most worst
01:02:26
part of her answer. Uh Right. And odd actions or lying like look, at this point of covering this case,
01:02:34
yeah, very odd actions, you know, she's lying. Mhm. We know that, but that doesn't mean that you're a murderer. And
01:02:41
that also doesn't mean that you're a murderer of your daughter. Mhm. But there's some very interact weird
01:02:46
interactions and like I said about the rose bush thing is so fascinating to me is if you watch the clip, her brother,
01:02:52
Lee, I believe his name is Lee Anthony. Yeah. So, you got Lee Anthony and Casey Anthony talking.
01:02:58
Um And she's just so always so bubbly in these these jailhouse interviews uh or Well,
01:03:07
she's bubbly in most of them, but she's also hysterical in some of them. Wouldn't you agree? I mean, Not Yeah,
01:03:12
but hysterical is probably not the right word because I think hysterical Irate? Right. Irate would be the more correct
01:03:18
word, I think, because if you think hysterical, my baby is missing, I'm crying, I'm hysterical. No.
01:03:26
She doesn't ask about her child. It I don't think she ever brings up her child first.
01:03:32
It's always the other individual, whether she's talking to the parents or she's talking to the brother, and they
01:03:37
bring up the child. Mhm. Now, look, that's that's odd. And if you watch the stuff that Lee Anthony talks about, it's
01:03:45
very strange to me because uh and I I think I texted you this when I was watching, saying, "Hey,
01:03:52
if I'm if I'm ever in jail and you come to talk to me, right?" >> Mhm. Don't ever talk to me like this, ever,
01:03:59
because he goes through this whole laundry list of "By the way, our conversation will be
01:04:05
recorded. Oh, by the way, if you want to communicate with us through letters, this is how you have to do it. Right.
01:04:13
This is the chain of command. If you just give it to your lawyer, your lawyer might read it. You have to give it to
01:04:18
this person. And if you give it to anybody else, that letter can be read. Mhm. So,
01:04:24
um very strange. And then she is also, you know, making some friendships with some inmates while she's in jail. Right.
01:04:33
Right. Well, you know what? You You make me wonder about something here. You know, we talked about the road the rose
01:04:39
bush, right? And that was a a a story that came from Jose Baez Mhm. that that he is told that he is to
01:04:46
deliver this message from directly from a one-on-one conversation with Cindy to Casey. And then hopefully get some kind
01:04:55
of answer that he's going to bring back to her in in another private conversation give her the answer. And
01:05:01
you're right, it it's very cryptic. And but But does that make you It makes me wonder
01:05:07
what's going on here. Is this Is this Cindy trying to figure out if her daughter did it?
01:05:14
Yeah. Or Or is it Cindy trying to assist her daughter in in in her in her in innocence or or
01:05:24
proclaim her to be innocent by possibly moving something? Right. Like, tell me where the body's
01:05:30
buried. I will I will dig it up and I I will I'll put it somewhere else. And if they don't ever find this, it's
01:05:37
going to be a lot harder for them to prosecute you. Right. That's what it feels like to me. I think you're right.
01:05:43
When we sat down here today, it felt more to me like Cindy was trying to figure out if her daughter was guilty.
01:05:48
Yeah, well, she's been on the fence about this and she needs some answers and even if it's even if no matter how
01:05:53
she has to go about getting it, she's willing to do so, but But as we sit here and discuss it, I
01:05:58
think you're right. I think I think maybe she was looking to help or move or something. Yeah, but if you watch the
01:06:04
interaction between uh George, uh Cindy, and Casey, it's very odd because there's multiple
01:06:14
times where the mother, you know, is looking at Casey and saying, "Hey, uh look at me.
01:06:21
Look at me in the eyes." Yeah. Now, what the mother wasn't understanding was, "I
01:06:25
have to look at a monitor to see you talk. And by doing so, my eyes go down. Mhm. So, I can't really do
01:06:33
that. But there's multiple times where it's like, "Okay, what What else do you know?
01:06:38
What can he give us? You Never mind the fact that you gave law enforcement all types of [ __ ] Right.
01:06:48
>> Right? All I mean, you're making up people. You know what I mean? Mhm. You know what I'm saying?
01:06:54
>> With a full with a full background story for each person. You're like, "Oh, yeah.
01:07:01
Yeah, this person, this uh Zanny the Nanny. Yeah, yeah, she's real. Oh, and Tom old
01:07:08
Tom Frank. Mhm. All I can think is like Tom Hanks. Big shout-out to all the Tom Franks out
01:07:15
there. Yeah, if there's a Tom Frank that listened to this show, cheers, mate. Did So, did
01:07:20
What else did you Did you find anything else odd about the interaction between Cindy and Casey?
01:07:26
I I think she kept on, as much as she was talking about, well, first of all, let's just the elephant in the room is
01:07:35
when she goes, "Well, right now, our concern has to be uh Caylee, right?" Right. And then
01:07:43
then the troll says, "Well, definitely my I don't know I don't know how she does
01:07:48
You're going to try to make a voice? I was going to do a voice for the troll. >> But Casey is basically saying that that
01:07:54
I understand >> Yeah, I'm concerned, but what about me? Yeah. My life is being taken from me.
01:08:01
Everything's being taken from me. Me, me, me, me. Mhm. Uh I know a lot of moms, right?
01:08:08
That [laughter] Oh, you do. That sounded real bad. Hey, I'm the Captain and I know a lot of
01:08:13
moms. Um No, but it sounds bad, but none of my friends would act like that if their kid was missing. No, no. They
01:08:23
would be hysterical. They wouldn't be irate, they'd be hysterical. They would be crying. It'd be hard to console them.
01:08:29
You They couldn't even lie to you because it'd be hard for them to get out anything but tears.
01:08:34
This girl is not crying. You know, everybody else is tearful. Everybody else is fearful. She's not
01:08:41
crying. She She She wants to know what's for dinner. She's She is crying at times, but But the times that she
01:08:48
appears to be crying to me is when she gets angry about something. Right. >> Or Or the focus is either on her or not
01:08:57
her, if that makes sense. You know what I mean? Like, it's it's almost like a sympathetic cry for herself Right.
01:09:02
>> rather than for the situation or the situation that her daughter may be in. Um it
01:09:08
It And again, with the anger, when she cries when she's anger angry, it's for herself. It's not for She's angered
01:09:15
because she can't find her daughter. >> Right. Right. When I But I think some of
01:09:19
it, too, though, is when you've told so many lies that when you are telling the truth, or
01:09:25
is anybody believing you? Mhm. That That would be a question, too. And so now she's in jail,
01:09:32
right? >> Mhm. And uh she's going to The grand jury indicted her, so she's going to be charged, but at the
01:09:38
end of the day, we don't we still don't have a body. Correct. We Yeah, we've not gotten to the body
01:09:44
yet. There's a lot that we haven't got to with this case. You know, usually when we pick these cases, Captain,
01:09:50
sometimes we can sit down and we can determine, you know, we used to do one show a week, and that was that was a lot
01:09:55
of fun. Um and we would have to cram everything into to one episode or >> back to one show a week.
01:10:00
>> And now we've been doing two because we found that with most of these cases, uh
01:10:04
there's just so much to cover that we can't get through it in one show. Uh the problem with
01:10:09
>> we found our calling. The problem with this case so far, Captain, is we've got
01:10:13
several items that we didn't get to yet today. So, tomorrow's show is just going
01:10:17
to be jam-packed. Yeah, this this case is like this crazy onion that keeps peeling back layers, and there's just so
01:10:24
much more to this story. And I never really understood why so many people were fascinated. I believe my ex was
01:10:31
really interested in this story in 2008 and was always watching Nancy Grace, and
01:10:39
I'd always hear all the time when I was making dinner, "Top mom! Top mom! Top mom!" You would hear the yelling of
01:10:44
Nancy Grace. Yeah. Um beautiful sound. That's a golden voice she has. So, anyways,
01:10:52
um I I never really understood why people were so fascinated by it, but but the the amount that I've dove into this
01:10:57
and I know the amount that you have dove into this, this is is a very fascinating case, so much more
01:11:04
to get to, Mhm. and we'll get back to it tomorrow. Here is an interview with Casey Anthony's parents, December 9th,
01:11:13
2008. >> [music] >> We now welcome George and Cindy Anthony, the grandparents [music] of the missing
01:11:25
Florida toddler Caylee Anthony. They last saw her in mid-June. How are you holding up?
01:11:32
We take one day at a time. You know, it's it's very hard. A lot of sleep loss, lost a lot of weight. Um
01:11:40
you know, we just take one day at a time. When did you last see Caylee? I last saw her on uh June 16th, the day
01:11:46
after Father's Day. What happened the day she went missing? Um we actually didn't find out until
01:11:52
July. Um so, um She'd been missing how long when you found out? Um about a month.
01:11:59
And that's strange. Um well, not really. Um my daughter, you know, had her, and um
01:12:08
you know, we just we just um assumed that Casey and Caylee were, you know, out visiting friends.
01:12:15
George, why wouldn't your daughter call you and say, "Caylee's gone"? That's really a good question. I
01:12:24
I know we kept in contact with at least Cindy did almost every day or every other day.
01:12:28
Uh little text message here, and everything was fine. So, what do you make of it?
01:12:33
I mean, she's your daughter, you have to have some Yeah. Why wouldn't she not Why wouldn't she
01:12:37
tell you not tell you? I think she's um I think she was frightened. I think um from what we understand that you know,
01:12:49
there's been threats to not only Caylee's well-being, but also to our family's well-being. By
01:12:55
By the people that have Caylee. Do you think Caylee was taken? Your daughter knew obviously knew she
01:13:02
was taken. Mhm. For what purpose? Um you know, I'm still trying to sort that out. You
01:13:10
know, the the person that originally has her or had her, um we've had three or four different sightings with
01:13:20
the same description that Casey released that they finally released on this person.
01:13:26
Um and the the Zenaida that the police department tracked down was one out of thousands
01:13:35
that um Casey said right from the beginning was not the correct person. They just now released within a couple
01:13:41
weeks ago the actual description of the babysitter. And we've had three that I'm aware of
01:13:48
tips that have come in since June that people describe this person to a T that had Caylee.
01:13:56
What does your daughter think, George? Well, my daughter thinks that Caylee needs to be found, and she said
01:14:03
>> Well, what does she think happened? Oh, she's already told us that this Zanny,
01:14:06
this babysitter, is the one that has her. Who denies it? Well, the one at the like Cindy just
01:14:12
said about the one at the sheriff's department, our local sheriff's department had brought to the like
01:14:16
daughter's attention, it's not her. So, let's go back to July 15th. Cindy, here's part of the 911 call that you
01:14:23
made. 911, what's your emergency? I called a little bit ago. The deputy sheriff's not here. I found out my
01:14:32
granddaughter has been taken. She has been missing for a month. I told you my daughter was missing for a month. I just
01:14:37
found her today, but I can't find my granddaughter. And she just admitted to me that she's been trying to find her
01:14:43
herself. There's something wrong. I found my daughter's car today, and it smells like
01:14:51
there's been a dead body in the trunk of her car. Do you suspect your daughter? No.
01:14:58
Never? In all of this? Never. I have not. From day one, I haven't. Um you know, Casey has been a loving, very
01:15:07
caring mother, and um I could see that first night um that she was very frightened when the
01:15:15
um sheriff's department arrived at the house. I mean, she was devastated. She was on the floor
01:15:22
um just beside herself. And she has been very emotional since day one, which hasn't been reported. Um
01:15:32
her main focus has been as same as ours has been look has been looking for Caylee since the very beginning.
01:15:40
When they arrested her, were you shocked, George? Oh, absolutely. When they took her into
01:15:45
custody the very first time, I was just appalled because I wanted them to No one put an Amber
01:15:52
Alert out for my granddaughter, which they never did. They never contacted the FBI that I wanted them to contact.
01:15:57
I mean, I have a little bit of knowledge on some stuff, and you would really think that they'd want
01:16:01
have some uh someone's want to have help them with assist trying to find this beautiful
01:16:07
3-year-old girl. And all I was trying to do was trying to help them, and And why do you think they wouldn't?
01:16:14
Had their mind made up. They had their mind made up. You know, they picked out a Zenaida Gonzalez.
01:16:20
They picked out a 38-year-old woman when Casey told them it was a 24-year-old woman. They picked out someone that had
01:16:27
children. Right, and she told them she had no children. You know, they from the very beginning decided how this was
01:16:34
going to um take place. They made judgment on her within 2 hours of having her in custody, and that's the
01:16:43
way it's been. They have not assisted us into looking into finding Caylee. And we believe she is alive.
01:16:52
>> it. I want to get to that. Have they set a trial date? Um right now, January 5th. And no death
01:16:57
penalty, right? >> They removed They had it and then removed it. They removed it. You don't
01:17:02
realize the whole United States is looking for our Caylee. I know that, Mom. Uh we're back. Casey Anthony, by the
01:17:11
way, was interviewed by members of the Orange County Sheriff's Office July 16th. Here's part of that.
01:17:18
Why didn't you call prior to today? I think part of me was naive enough to think that I could handle this myself,
01:17:25
which obviously I couldn't. And I was scared that something would happen to her if I didn't notify the
01:17:33
authorities or got the media involved or my parents, which I know would have done
01:17:38
the same thing. Just fear of the unknown, fear of the potential of Caylee getting hurt, of not seeing my
01:17:47
daughter again. Why do you think she was arrested and charged, George? Uh because they had their like Cindy
01:17:54
said, they had their mind made up. It was just too easy for them to just close the book on this and say, "Well, we're
01:17:59
going to charge you with your daughter's disappearance, and just be done with it." Did they ever look at why a mother
01:18:04
would kill a daughter? I mean, did anyone ever question motive? Right. There is no motive, and they
01:18:10
haven't found a motive. They even said they haven't found a motive. They They told us they thought it was an accident,
01:18:16
and she's scared, and she's trying to cover it up. >> Killed her by accident and then buried
01:18:20
her or something. They don't feel there's a motive. Have they looked for the child? We've had five searches
01:18:27
done by the sheriff's department, done by um Tim Miller with Texas EquuSearch. I know him. Um and it's come up with
01:18:36
nothing. There's nothing that they have found that, you know, has given them any
01:18:43
evidence that Caylee is no longer with us. Where do you think she is, George? Oh, Caylee?
01:18:52
She's with hopefully a loving family that's taking good care of her. We got a tip today. Today? Today. Um at 4:00
01:18:59
today. Um right now being investigated by >> Um in Tennessee. Someone spotted a girl that looked like
01:19:08
her. >> in the grocery store in Tennessee, and my investigator's already spoken with
01:19:12
the Tennessee authorities and also the tipster. And we're just waiting to see if there's any um
01:19:20
you know, any video in the store. You know, you realize if they find Caylee, this is a terrible miscarriage
01:19:25
of justice. Well, it's been a terrible miscarriage of justice. >> However, you want You must understand
01:19:31
the authorities' viewpoint here. Here they are with a dilemma of this woman that a nanny that does a nanny says, "I
01:19:36
didn't do it. I wasn't with her." She waits a month before telling I mean, they certainly have grounds for
01:19:41
suspicion, don't you think? No. They found They looked at one Zenaida Gonzalez. One Zenaida. They told us that
01:19:49
there was only one in our area. There was 11 just in Orlando. They picked out one. There's Casey told them to check
01:19:58
New York or Miami because she had a New York license. She told them that. They pulled up Ohio license. Bottom line is
01:20:06
Caylee's out there. We've had people from June the 20th that have given us sworn
01:20:13
statements that they have They have seen Caylee in Orlando. We have sworn statements from July 2nd. We have people
01:20:21
that are out there can't sleep at night because they've seen her in July. We had people that we
01:20:27
met last night that saw her in California just 2 weeks ago. It's a It's a How do you How do you fight with someone
01:20:35
or or you know, say if they're sitting 4 ft away from this child and they say that
01:20:41
they're positive that this is Caylee? Because they've seen her picture for the last 6 months. 4 ft. How old would she
01:20:48
be now? Three. Now, let's look Let's listen to a bit more of Casey's July 16th interview with
01:20:54
authorities. Or is there anything that you want to change or divert from what you've
01:20:59
already told me? >> No, sir. Um did you cause any injury to your child, Caylee? No, sir. Did you hurt
01:21:05
Caylee or leave her somewhere and you're worried that if we find that out that people are going to look at you a wrong
01:21:10
way? No, sir. And you're telling me that Zenaida took your child without your permission and
01:21:15
hasn't returned her. The last person that I've seen with my daughter. Let's take a call Winston-Salem, North
01:21:22
Carolina for George and Cindy Anthony. Hello. Hello, George and Cindy. I am so sorry for the trouble that your family's
01:21:28
been going through. I just wanted to ask you, Cindy, when you first called the police, you said something like it
01:21:32
smelled like there was a dead body in the trunk of your daughter's car and more recently you've said that you
01:21:39
believe that it was maybe old pizza. And I was just calling wondering why you changed your mind on that.
01:21:45
Um I changed my mind on that. I never changed my mind on that. What I stated was the car smelled. Okay?
01:21:54
The um I was told by my husband and also by the gentleman at the tow yard that there was a bag of
01:22:05
food that contained pizza and maggots in the car. I went down and I I spoke myself with the manager of the tow
01:22:13
company and he told us that that was the cause of the smell in the car. I don't know of anybody that has ever
01:22:20
smelled decay of food that's been in a car trunk for 19 days in Florida heat. I've opened my refrigerator and made the
01:22:32
comment something died in here. Following Casey's arrest in July on child neglect and other charges, George
01:22:38
and Cindy visited her in jail. Here's some of the surveillance video from that. I don't care what I have to do.
01:22:45
When I told them I would lie, I would steal, I would do whatever by any means to get her back. That's exactly how I
01:22:51
feel. It's the truth. Casey, we have to find her before her third birthday. Mom, I know. That's coming up fast.
01:23:02
Uh there were reports of photo shots, I think, of of your daughter partying and the like and out having a good time
01:23:09
during all this while her daughter's missing. Explain that. Um there was one photo out of all the
01:23:14
photos that have been showed of her partying that was after June 16th. One. And what we have learned that that is a
01:23:26
staged photo. That those are photos that they used to entice other people to come into that
01:23:35
club. That she would have gotten paid for that photo. So, in fact, that she was working and we
01:23:42
have proof of that. Where George is Caylee's father? Uh Caylee's father lived somewhere in
01:23:50
the Carolinas, I believe, at one point. He's deceased. Oh, yeah. He passed away at right around
01:23:55
her second birthday. Oh, so she was still around when he died? Right. He was never part of her life.
01:24:01
>> He hasn't been. Sioux Falls, South Dakota. Hello. Thank you, Larry. My question is for
01:24:06
George. Um George, removing yourself from your family, I know you were a professional
01:24:12
in the department. What was your professional opinion of the smell in that trunk?
01:24:20
My professional opinion is I never really realized how long it would take a garbage to smell for 19 days or 18 days
01:24:26
inside of a car in Florida. To be honest with you. What do you What do you do, George?
01:24:32
Right now, I'm in the security field. You know, being in law enforcement for years and I sort of stayed in security
01:24:37
field off and on over the years. So, after moving to Were you in law enforcement in Orlando? No, never was in
01:24:42
Orlando, no. I have was in law enforcement 20 some odd years ago, so. So, you would understand law
01:24:47
enforcement's psyche. To a point, yes. Possibly, yes. But then again, I know what I feel inside that that's
01:24:55
like Cindy says, inside that bag was garbage. There really was. It was pizza. I mean,
01:24:59
I seen it. I mean, I I I know what was in there. And there's no way you can fathom, Cindy, your daughter
01:25:06
harming your granddaughter. No, there's nobody that has come forward that has ever seen
01:25:13
or said anything other than that that Caylee was an excellent mother. So, there's Casey has done nothing to
01:25:21
her daughter. There's no evidence that shows that. Um and I can with 100% of my being say that I believe
01:25:33
that Casey had nothing to do with Casey Caylee's disappearance. We have a little
01:25:38
more to show you from inside the jailhouse. Watch. What's your gut telling you right now?
01:25:44
Well, you have the same >> me that she's okay. Okay. And your gut tells you that she's
01:25:50
close or some She's She's hiding. She's not far. I know in my heart she's not far. I can
01:25:57
feel it. Oh, boy. It's a This is Are you optimistic that you're going to find I mean, how do you feel about it? All this
01:26:06
been a long time. Well, over the last several [clears throat] weeks we've gotten probably our best sightings. We
01:26:13
had one in the middle of November right in Orlando. Um two women, very credible,
01:26:22
were within feet of her, watched her for 20 minutes, took photographs of her. Um this last couple that we met last
01:26:30
night that saw her um you know, a week after that point were within 4 ft of her. So, she's somewhere,
01:26:38
you think? Absolutely. Why do you think so many people get angry at you? Um because they only hear one side of
01:26:46
the story. They only see what is put out there by the Nancy Graces of the world and
01:26:53
the Leonard Padillas of the world. They don't look at [snorts] themselves and look at their own families and and
01:27:01
figure out what they would do if one of their children was missing. You know, there's a very There's a There's a lot
01:27:09
of people that are in our shoes and there's a lot of people that will do one of several things. They'll either go
01:27:15
into a recluse and they'll just withdraw. You could do that or you could get up every morning and you can fight for the
01:27:26
people that you love. And we're not going to I'm not going to sit back and worry about what people think about us
01:27:33
cuz my focus is on Caylee. And anybody that wants to criticize me for that, that's their problem. Has Nancy Grace
01:27:41
convicted your daughter? Absolutely. Nancy Grace is the reason why there are people out there. But I'll tell you
01:27:47
what, there's just as many people that watch Nancy Grace that only watch her because they don't have local media like
01:27:53
we do in Orlando keeping up with with Caylee. That's their only outlet. They don't believe in the things that she's
01:28:01
doing. In fact, they tell us that when this is all done, when Caylee's home, they're never going to watch her again.
01:28:05
So. Thank you both very much. >> [music] [music] >> We'll see everybody here tomorrow and
01:28:17
until then, be good, be kind, and don't litter. >> [music] [music]