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[Music] [Applause] thank you welcome to True Crime garage wherever you are whatever you are doing thanks
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for listening I'm your host Nick and with me as always is a man who shares a rank and title with such Brilliant Minds
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as Captain D Morgan kangaroo Crunch and my favorite Captain America he is the true crime garage's very own Captain
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thank you thank you thank you it's good to be seen and it's good to see you happy Fourth of July everybody thanks
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for listening thanks for telling a friend cheers mates foreign [Music] flannel mouth by Blake's Hard Cider
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Company up in beautiful Michigan garage grade 4 out of five bottle caps flannel mouth is made with 100 Michigan grown
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apples and they use a wide array of late season table and dessert apples this combination giving it a sweet flavor
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that finishes incredibly smooth and Blake's hard cider they have several ciders to choose from including
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seasonals but on the old Blake sweet to dry scale I chose flannel mouth because it falls right in the middle so not too
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sweet and certainly not too dry those apples must have worms in them and this refreshing drink was brought to us by
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These Fine Americans first up we have Annie in Portland Oregon Keep Portland Weird down in Kentucky we have Brittany
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who says she's stalking the captain on social media so watch your back my friend well just remember Brittany
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there's a block button and next we want to give a big thank you to John and Amanda who are celebrating independence
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day in beautiful Parts Unknown America all right and just a reminder for those that are studying computer the computer
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labs and Parts Unknown will be shut down all of July 4th next up we have Patrick
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in South Easton Massachusetts Patrick says he is impressed with our work and appreciates the effort dedication intact
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so some very nice words from Mr Patrick and all the way from San Mateo California we have Kevin cheers to you
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mate and last but not least one of my favorite cities we have Jamie in Dallas Texas Jamie says I can't get through the
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week without the captain and Nick alright thanks everybody for donating to the Beer fun make sure you're patient
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yeah and if you'd like to donate to the Beer fun go to True Crime garage.com click on the Donate button I know the
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captain already beat me to the punch there but we would like to wish everybody a very happy and safe 4th of
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July and thank you to the men and women of the Armed Forces for their service and sacrifice this Captain is one of my
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absolute favorite holidays I love seeing all the American Flags out I love celebrating by filling up the old cooler
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and you know some American Brews fire up the grill watch the fireworks America it
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still manages to surprise me that at this time each year we get to hear about some NFL players suffering a firework
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related injury that they that they cause themselves so unfortunately that's something we'll probably hear within the
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next few days but everybody out there be safe and have a happy Fourth of July and
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drink responsibly and that's enough for the business all right everybody gather round grab a chair grab a beer let's
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talk some true crime [Music] this is true crab garage [Music] and this is the case of Madeleine McCann
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[Music] thank you [Music] foreign [Music] three-year-old British girl who's gone
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missing in The Algarve area of Portugal and she went missing last night hundreds
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of people have been searching for the girl and that search continuing this morning so we will try to get as much on
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that as for for you as soon as we can that missing girl in Lutz and we will bring it to you as soon as we get
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further detail well they're still hopeful that this is simply a case where a girl has gone
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missing left her apartment and maybe asleep on a tree but that said Colin it's quite some time now since she went
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Miss was at 10 p.m last night that the little girl Madeleine McCann her parents Jerry and Katie were out for dinner they
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got back to their uh their uh self-contained apartment and she wasn't there they do have two other younger
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children but uh three-year-old Madeleine was not there a search was uh was started in the Ocean Club resort uh
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staff and guests at the resort searched it until 4 30 this morning uh the search
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has resumed this morning but as yet nothing this is uh the Ocean Club resort in Playa del Luz in the western Algarve
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as you say it's run by the company Mark Warner which is described as a sort of upmarket all-inclusive package holiday
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uh these are self-contained Villas it's actually in a small town but it is self-contained uh with with the Cordon
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around it so so perhaps she is still within the corner but as I say at some time now since she went missing
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presumably mark they'll Mark Warner have a presence out there in the Algarve and
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presumably they'll be doing or making sure they've got people if they're not out there already heading that way to
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liaise with the police and obviously try and help the family as best they can because of course these first few hours
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are absolutely critical in this search aren't they absolutely they are and they are indeed
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and and the car the UK foreign office is working with local police local airports
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have been informed so the searches is widening but as I say this the uh the manager here who I spoke to says he
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still is hopeful that this will be resolved that she will be found soon [Music] anymore on The Disappearance now of
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Madeleine McCann the three-year-old girl who went missing while on holiday in Portugal on the line as a local resident
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Mark mccarrick who is one of those helping in this search for little Madeleine Mark thanks very much indeed
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for speaking to us today it's a dreadful cliche to talk about every parent's worst nightmare but that is precisely
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what we're talking about here isn't it yeah I mean that's to be honest I just got this morning and uh and head on the
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news but apparently that the child went missing last night so we have had this there's a search been going on since 10
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o'clock last night right the way through so obviously now and obviously there's more local residents come out to to lend
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a hand how many people are involved Mark what's the area that's been covered what are
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people searching well the the covering the the beaches the the pools uh obviously it's it's quite tight around
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here so there's a lot of apartment blocks and townhouses and people sitting Gardens uh the response has been
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tremendous and the area around luge we're looking at a map of Portugal at the moment
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placing it on the southern coast there in the Algarve what kind of area are we talking about there
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the child's got missions from The Ocean Club and it's maybe about two minutes from the from the beach uh so as I say
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there's a big big Coastline people have walked along there they've had the the dogs out as I said we're just all
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keeping our fingers because I've just had a little bit of information from some of the people at the Ocean Club uh
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that the parents were actually at the the restaurants the tapas bar which is actually on the complex and the children
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were actually in the the apartments or the townhouse by themselves they've actually at the the door to jar so they
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kept looking over the place they've been going over checking on everything so I think it's a bit positive that obviously
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with the door being up maybe maybe little Maddie's just walked out and obviously Gone Missing
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we're just hearing actually mark from the Press Association here in the UK they're telling us a bit more about the
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family concerned that Madeleine apparently lives with her parents Gerald the father who's a doctor and Kate
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McCann uh the younger siblings as well all from rossly in leicestershire a neighbor there quoted as saying that as
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you might expect we're absolutely devastated a really nice family good neighbors as well we see them take their
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bikes up and down going for walks it's understood according to neighbors that Madeleine who was due to start at school
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in September and what are the local media making of all this Mark how much attention is this getting out there
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there's there's people starting to come down now with cameras they haven't actually obviously spoken to any any of
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them but I think I think the main concern is obviously all getting out and finding there they haven't actually got
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Representatives here from the from Mark Warner just uh just obviously filling the local press in I mean I haven't
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really got into that because obviously we're just getting flyers and getting them around the Shops and and walking on
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the beaches and the main concern is obviously you're getting out with I'm finding that
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[Music] Gerald McCann better known as Jerry met Kate Healy in Glasgow in 1993. they got
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married in 1998 both are physicians in May of 2003 they had their first baby Madeline Beth McCann
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in February of 2005 they were blessed with twins Sean and Emily and Madeline became a big sister
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in 2007 the mccanns were excited to take a vacation with some of their longtime friends to the Algarve region of
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Portugal joining the mccanns on this trip were David and Fiona Payne with their two
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children and Fiona's mother Diane Webster also on the trip where Matt and Rachel Oldfield and their child the last
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family of the group is Russell O'Brien and Jane Tanner with their two children a trip consisting of nine adults and
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eight children on Thursday May 3rd 2007 the mccanns are enjoying their sixth day of their
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week-long vacation at praia Deluge Resort at 10 A.M parents Jerry and Kate McCann Place their daughter Madeline and
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her younger twin siblings and the ocean club's kids club while they go for a walk 12 30 PM Kate and Jerry collect
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their children from the kids club and went to their apartment to have lunch after lunch they will go to The Ocean
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Club swimming pool at 2 29 PM the last photograph of Madeline has taken this is of her at the pool
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the camera clock reads 1 29 PM but the McCann family would later say that the clock was off by one hour
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at 3 30 PM Jerry and Kate McCann return the children to the kids club at 6 PM Kate McCann gets her kids from
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the kids club and takes the children back to the apartment while Jerry goes to an hour-long tennis lesson
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around this time the McCann's friends the other seven adults on this trip who would later be known as the top of seven
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are having tea at the resorts Cafe according to what we can see on the security cameras the three men of the
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group leave the cafe around 6 30 PM the four ladies leave shortly after just after 6 30 PM David Payne goes to
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the tennis courts to talk to Jerry McCann Jerry asked David to go check on Kate and the children at the apartment
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after the tennis lesson at 7 pm Jerry returns to the apartment and the mccanns put their children to
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bed in the front bedroom of the apartment Madeline is in a single bed nearest the
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door there is an empty bed against the opposite wall beneath the only window in the room
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between the two beds are two travel cots this is where the twins slept the parents kept the window in the
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shutter in the bedroom closed and the door to the room almost all the way closed
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once the kids had gone to sleep the mccanns get ready to go out to dinner with their friends after a shower and a
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change of clothes Jerry and Kate enjoy some wine together 8 35 p.m Jerry and Kate McCann are the
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first couple of the group to arrive at the Tapas restaurant which is located at the resort just about 50 meters away
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from the McCann's apartment [Music] at 8 55 PM the group has ordered starters when the routine of checking on
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the children begins Matt Oldfield goes to check on his own apartment he also tells the pains who are still in
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their apartment that the group is waiting for them at the restaurant [Music] 905 pm Jerry McCann returns to the
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apartment through the unlocked patio doors to check on the children earlier that week the mccanns had used a
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key to go in through the front door next to the children's bedroom but worrying the noise might wake the children they
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began using the patio doors the patio doors can only be locked and unlocked from the inside
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so on this night they were leaving them unlocked Jerry entered the apartment and sees
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that the children's bedroom door which they always left slightly ajar is now open to 45 degrees
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thinking this is odd he glances into his own bedroom to see if Madeline has gone
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into the parents bed she is not he sees that all three of his children are still asleep right where he and his
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wife had left them closing the door again almost all of the way like they had done earlier
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Jerry then went to the restroom before leaving the apartment on his way back to the tapas bar and
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restaurant this is at 9 08 pm Jerry sees Jeremy Wilkins another guest at the resort
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Jerry stops and speaks with him the two men spend several minutes talking shortly after Jane Tanner who
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had recently left the Tapas restaurant to check on her own children she walks up the road
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she is not seen by Jerry McCann or the gentleman he is speaking with but she says she sees them
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after passing the two men she sees a man walking quickly across the road in front
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of her the man is walking in a direction leading him away from the McCann apartment and heading toward the outer
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road of the resort complex he is carrying what she described as a sleeping girl in pink pajamas
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the little girl appears to be limp in his arms the sighting is odd but hardly an
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exceptional sighting at a Holiday Resort she then arrives at her apartment everything is fine
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so she returns to the Tapas Bar and Restaurant [Music] 9 30 pm it is Kate's turn to get up and
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make the next check on her children but instead Matt Oldfield and Russell O'Brien are checking on their children
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as well so Matt offers to check on the McCann's kids while he is away from the table
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in the McCann's apartment Matt notices the children's bedroom door is open but this means nothing to him
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he observes all his quiet and simply glances inside the kid's bedroom seeing the twins in their cot
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from his angle he says he does not directly see Madeline or her bed from the doorway
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[Music] 10 o'clock P.M Kate goes and checks on the children she enters the apartment through the
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unlocked patio doors once back in her apartment she heads towards the children's bedroom before she gets there
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the door to the children's bedroom blows shut Kate opens the door inside the room she
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quickly noticed the bedroom window is open and the shutter is up she sees the twins the twins are
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sleeping in their cots in the middle of the room she looks to her left and she is surprised to see that her
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daughter Madeline's bed is empty Kate quickly checks the apartment but she sees no sign of Madeline
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she leaves the apartment and runs to the tapas bar the group sees her running up
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she's screaming they have taken her [Music] just after 10 pm Rachel Oldfield goes to
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Jane Tanner's apartment and tells her Madeline is missing Jane Tanner tells Rachel oh my God
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I saw a man carrying a little girl sometime around 10 10 pm Jerry McCann tells Matt Oldfield
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to go to the Resort's reception desk and call the police Matt does so and the police are called
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10 30 pm the local police arrive on the scene at 11 10 pm detectives arrive having been contacted
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by the police the detectives are told there has been a child abduction a very large search is underway for the
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missing girl Resort staff members guest of the resort and police are searching the resort the
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beach and the surrounding areas they find nothing around 4am the search for Madeleine is
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called off [Music] this is true crab garage and this is the case of Madeline McCann
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foreign [Music] McCann was called off about 4 4 30 in the morning you know a lot would take
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place before then we have the police arriving we have later detectives arriving we have a weird situation
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though here in my opinion because we got kind of two things going on if I'm an officer and I'm arriving to the scene
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what am I witnessing what am I experiencing well I'm experiencing two things and they're a bit of of opposites
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if you ask me first off we have the mccanns and we have their group of friends stating that
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Madeline has been abducted and that we need to be looking for her and looking for her abductor at the same time we
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have the hotel staff I say hotel I should say Resort I apologize but the resort staff they're saying that we have
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a missing girl that she probably wandered off well that that's problem so for for many
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different reasons right right okay so what direction am I going to take this who do I trust here do I trust the
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mccanns these are well-to-do people they're both Physicians smart people here traveling with their friends their
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friends are smart educated people as well yeah foreigners yeah so do I trust these people and believe that we're
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looking at an abduction or do I go with the experience of the resort staff telling me that we have a little girl
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that's wandered off this has happened before and we know it's happened before because the resort staff has says you
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know this this sort of thing happens here uh but we've always managed to find the little boy or little girl that's
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gone missing well a couple things so one the McCain's are going on with the theory that no the kid didn't just
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wander off because this window was open and it wasn't open before therefore there's some evidence that somebody came
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in and possibly abducted her that's what their Theory now I think there was a motive as far as the resort goes to go
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hey now chances are nobody broke into the apartment and she just went missing and we're going to find her no big deal
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because it's bad for business well it's bad for business and I get what you're saying there but at the same time I
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think I think we got they're going off of experience we've experienced this before and this has always been the
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resort the the result I'm sorry that somebody's always just wandered off and we've found them later now we said that
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there was a search going on this was was quite a big search you had about 60 I believe it was 60 of the resort staff uh
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looking for the little girl we also had several of the guests staying at the resort looking for her as well there's
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one Resort uh employee that stated you know there were so many people looking for her within this area that you could
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stand on one side of the property and hear the people from the other side of the property calling out her name now
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after a short period of time we see that the the detectives are called in because
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yes we might have an abduction here and this is going to start off with well we need to interview we need to question
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the parents and their friends to get a good idea a good sense of what took place that evening that's why we spent
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so much time earlier going through that timeline and we'll dive into that a little bit more later but but first off
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one thing that that was strange to me is that when when first confronted by the police and detectives uh this is
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outside and in an open area of the Resort open air area the um the husband the father Jerry McCann he throws
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himself down on the ground and he's obviously very distraught that his daughter is missing but the the
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detectives immediately got kind of a weird vibe about what they were witnessing right almost like they
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thought he was putting on some kind of act well what made what would further their suspicions is that later when they
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were with the mccanns back at the apartment both of them together almost repeated the same display right where
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they throw themselves kind of down on their knees they're almost in a in a begging on
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it's almost like a Praying motion yeah it is hysteric you know they're the obviously they've lost their daughter
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one would expect people to be very upset but again we have seasoned detectives getting an odd feeling about this
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Behavior by first the husband and then by both parents the other thing that's odd here is that you know Kate McCain
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she claims that the window was open and when the detectives and uh arrive to the
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scene that it's there's kind of a misconception uh and this is a very blurry area some detectives have made
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statements saying the window was not open when we arrived there right and then that that would lead to a lot of
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there's a lot of questions about the window but but the other thing here too though
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is that we also have a lot of people now in what is possibly a crime scene correct and so we have a bunch of people
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going in and tracking in their Footprints and people put you know touching things and and putting
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fingerprints everywhere so this is you know they should have roped this off from the beginning the thing that I've
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heard here reported and you're right if the mccanns and their friends are right and and it was an abduction from that
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apartment then you're you're exactly right that whole apartment is a crime scene I've heard that there's been 20 or
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plus 20 plus people in that apartment that night uh and and I don't know I don't have a full understanding if that
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includes investigators and police officers or if that's on in addition to like I said when you have the resorts
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stating hey this is probably just a girl that got up on our own and took off that's not you know I think you need to
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prepare for the worst and if they would have prepared for the worst they would have blocked off that area they would
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have had to give them another room and said look we just gotta shut down this this scene what was another thing that
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happened that night Captain we have the the whole group that there is there on vacation together we have we said we
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have nine adults and eight children yeah a lot of people call them the tap is seven uh but I I like to use the BBC's
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reference they call them the tap is nine that includes all the adults that were on vacation together including the
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mccanns as well right so what they did was they had the group sit down and because it is a bit of a convoluted uh
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situation of different people getting up at different times to go check on children and check on other people's
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children um we have a lot of moving pieces and parts there so they do have the group
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sit down and I believe using Madeline's own activity book or some kind of notebook that she had they use that to
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kind of write down a general timeline of that evening about who was doing what and when so they could try to maybe
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track down and figure out what time the little girl went missing yeah that that was very loose and very rough there
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wouldn't they wouldn't actually sit down with law enforcement to actually go over
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the details of that night for about seven days again in this case if we want to assume the worst then we're we need
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to remove these individuals uh you know again assume the worst remove these individuals question them a little bit
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harder that night and separately as well and like you said it what they put together was kind of a rough very
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general vague copy of what what had gone down that night and then later we have a
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situation where individually their their times are a little skewed from that they they each
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one of them has different things to report because they you know witness things separately that evening
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um but the problem we have here one thing I found um terribly uh troubling when when we
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were researching this case is is the timeline itself not only do we have the varying accounts by the different
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individuals in the tap is seven or tap is nine uh if you include the mccanns but we also have depending on what
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publication you would read because some of the Publications would get very vague
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with them as well they they seem to me like they would round things to eight o'clock or round things to 8 30 rather
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than by going going to a minute by a minute account of what actually went down yeah and what's going to happen is
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that we have the tap is nine they have a timeline and then the resort has a timeline that is off by about 30 minutes
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the other interesting thing here is that UK has a very they have very strict laws
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on child neglect and so a lot of people when you look into this case go well why
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were these nine adults yeah 50 meters away you know from their children and in these unlocked apartments in a foreign
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town so like I stated before the tapest nine would be questioned about a week after the weird thing here for me is
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that their stories don't even line up with each other's that well and why I find that weird is because they were
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saying that they were taking these turns every 30 minutes well if you're doing something every 30 minutes then you're
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checking your your watch a lot more a lot of people now have said well they're on vacation and they're having some
00:29:34
drinks so they're not really checking time and that's why there's some inconsistencies but if you are checking
00:29:40
on your children every 30 minutes then you're probably well more aware of the time we'll get right back to this after
00:29:46
this quick beer break [Music] there's so much to discuss here Captain it would be easy to get off the tracks
00:30:06
and before we get too much into the mccanns and the rest of their group let's go through and talk about some of
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the possibilities right because you know we said the search was called off at 4 4
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30 a.m that that morning but the search started quickly after that it started the next morning after police were able
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to regroup and organize a better search with larger numbers of people searching a larger area bringing in some dogs
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setting up roadblocks there was a lot of stuff that happened the following day and that didn't turn up any sign of
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Madeline as well unfortunately it took several days before they were Interpol had announced that you know anywhere
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traveling outside of the country they were on high alert for a missing girl as well so this quickly became and
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Madeleine McCann quickly became probably the most famous missing person in a very
00:31:02
very long time yeah I think somebody I heard somewhere that maybe she was the most uh reproduced photo of of the
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decade yeah yeah I read that as well so what are some possibilities of why Madeline had disappeared and let's talk
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about this because this situation right we have a missing child so it's easy there's not too many
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possibilities when you really look at it in the broad sense of things you have what I think of as three possibilities
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and of course each of these they certainly come with their own set of questions right so let's let's start
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with the resorts Theory the Resort's theory is that she got up noticed that her parents weren't around and she took
00:31:47
off to look for them right right so Madeline has gone missing because of Madeline like you said she woke up
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wandered off and eventually leading to her disappearance and or death right well she's three almost four so I'm not
00:32:00
going to put any responsibility uh you know on her the other thing too is like again the thing that makes a lot of
00:32:07
parents angry is why would you why would you leave your kids uh you know especially when they had this like
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daycare that they could have sent them to but that was 15 an hour but maybe you're too cheap so you know we're gonna
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take turns look I've heard a lot of rumors that uh people in the UK are a little more Loose as parents uh I I
00:32:29
don't again I I don't think it's acceptable so we're going to go off this Theory but
00:32:35
we have this extensive search and nothing comes up and I think the only possibly that this could still be true
00:32:41
is if somehow she traveled very far and hit water and and died in the water and that that's how they never found her
00:32:51
but to me there's not a lot of evidence that this is this one of these theories is actually uh what happened well and I
00:33:01
I like where you're going with this and I have to agree and I have some of my own reasons to top that off right so I
00:33:07
thought about this a lot if if she woke up and wandered off where would a child go well I think she probably most likely
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would go look for her parents or go look for something fun um these two things make sense to me if
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she woke up and didn't find her parents in in their bedroom or in the apartment it's certainly conceivable that she left
00:33:29
the apartment looking for them if she would have went out the front door uh one of the directions she could have
00:33:36
gone would have led her right to the main entrance there would have been a receptionist there there would have been
00:33:42
somebody some form of Staff working there she would have been located very quickly well no that's it depends on
00:33:49
which way you go if she went out the front door and she took a right then she's just going off into into the
00:33:55
countryside if she takes a left then yeah she's going to go into the front but there's
00:34:00
no Lobby she doesn't have to pass through a Lobby correct and what I meant by that is if she were to go basically
00:34:06
any other direction other than traveling along the wall of the resort if she left
00:34:11
the front door right that would almost that forces her into the street she's a small child I'm I'm going off of what I
00:34:18
think is likely here I think she would have stayed along that resort area and that would have led her to the main
00:34:24
entrance if she went if in fact she went out the front door or here's this gives
00:34:29
us a good opportunity to actually talk about the layout so first when we're talking about this wall the whole Resort
00:34:34
basically is Walled off but now it's not secure it's not like you need some uh security pass to get into the different
00:34:43
parts of the resort correct and so if we want to think about this so the let's just look at the apartment first
00:34:51
the apartment that they're staying in 5A has an apartment above it but when you look at the front door you have a front
00:34:59
door and then to the right you have a window and that would be the room that Madeline and the twins would be sleeping
00:35:05
in if we go to the back of the apartment we have a sliding glass door that lets you
00:35:10
into apartment now if I'm on that patio there is steps leading down to the street and we have that wall that kind
00:35:18
of secures the the resort premise and then if you're on that patio I will be able to look out
00:35:26
and I see a pool and pass that pole is where the uh the Tapas Club is so when the when the tap is nine are
00:35:35
eating and drinking they can only see the back of the apartments they can only see where the
00:35:41
sliding glass doors were and I tell you what Captain I do have to I might have to disagree with you on
00:35:47
that but I don't think we should get to it that too much at this moment the thing here is you know hold on just be
00:35:53
clear you want to disagree with me that you can see the sliding glass door correct right right yeah no but what I
00:36:00
meant by that is yeah because that's something that people dispute but if you're behind the pole in the Tapas Club
00:36:07
if you were if you were able to see any of the the doors gotcha you'd only be able to see the sliding glass doors what
00:36:15
I'm stating is you could not see any part of the front of the building gotcha so you're I got what you're saying
00:36:20
you're sitting at the restaurant table you look past the pool you're seeing the back part of that entire apartment right
00:36:27
you're seeing the patios the patios the balconies okay so the thing here is we have we have a situation where the the
00:36:36
Tapas group there they've requested this table and this table was poolside and we
00:36:43
we've been told that they requested this table because they wanted to be able to
00:36:48
see their apartments right you know that they intended to sit out each evening and have dinner and drinks together at 8
00:36:56
30 and Reserve this table for their entire group with the thought like we said that they could view or keep an eye
00:37:02
a close eye somewhat on their Apartments yeah and it's it's 50 meters so look it's it's not extreme distance but still
00:37:12
you know the fact that they're leaving doors unlocked and you're in a foreign country it's it's not responsible
00:37:19
parenting so if she wakes up frightened or if she wakes up confused and goes off
00:37:24
looking for people or Mom and Dad regardless it's it's a it's sad to think about you know regardless of anything
00:37:32
happening to her it's sad to think about a small child waking up being confused or frightened and looking for Mom and
00:37:38
Dad and not finding them immediately um you know if no one interfered with her if no if she wandered off and nobody
00:37:46
interfered with her I really think she would have been found found alive the chief investigator here called the
00:37:53
search one of the largest searches for a missing child in Portugal history so this really seems like a very very
00:38:01
unlikely possibility leading us to possibility number two that would be that she was abducted by a stranger
00:38:09
someone unknown to her and unknown to the McCann family this would lead me to some immediate questions I would have
00:38:15
about the second possibility right one would this be a Target or a random abduction two how would the abductor
00:38:24
know that there is a child in the apartment unattended three how would the abductor move in and out of the
00:38:32
apartment undetected or move the child unnoticed um you know he or she is not seen that
00:38:39
we that we know of um what route would that would that make them take well we do have an individual
00:38:45
that was seen carrying a child and four was the abductor a woman a man or was this a group or some kind of organized
00:38:55
uh abduction and like what we stated before on May 3rd they you know the police show up and you have the family
00:39:03
saying our child was abducted and you have the resort saying no she probably just went missing on her own she went
00:39:10
out the door and we'll find her but now that we've done this extensive search the police have no other choice but to
00:39:15
go hey this abduction thing probably makes a lot more more sense and that would lead us to what would probably be
00:39:23
there firstly the sighting of the man carrying the girl this was the sighting done by Jane Tanner one of the the Tapas
00:39:31
group so the remember well let's just go through her story real quick because we
00:39:38
kind of went through the McCain story but her story and we're just going to start from the major point she's at
00:39:44
dinner she's drinking um this is at the point where Jerry has already checked on the kids
00:39:52
he's checked on the kids he's leaving the apartment he goes down to the street he sees a guy that he's played tennis
00:39:58
with he's talking with this individual on the right hand side of the street it's pretty dark and Jerry even says
00:40:04
there's nobody out there's there's no motion nothing so their friend Tanner goes to check on her kids and to check
00:40:12
on I think somebody else's kids she walks down the same street as them on the left hand side they're on the right
00:40:18
hand side now she says I saw them I saw both of them talking now neither one of those
00:40:24
gentlemen Jerry nor the other guy said that they saw her but she passes them on the left hand side and as she
00:40:31
gets she's going around to the front of the apartment and as she's going around to the front apartment before she turns
00:40:38
left to go in front of the apartment she sees a guy carrying a child maybe three
00:40:43
four-year-old girl wearing pink or light pink pajamas and she she doesn't think much about it
00:40:52
and then the guy goes across the street and she goes up to the apartment so that's that's the sighting now
00:40:59
the two individuals uh Jerry and the guy he was talking to about tennis not only
00:41:04
did they not see Tanner but they didn't see this gentleman that she saw so Tanner describes this sighting and
00:41:11
the man as not as being not far from Madeline's bedroom he was heading east away from the front of Apartment 5A the
00:41:19
child in the man's arms he she is wearing a light pink pajamas with floral pattern and cuffs on the legs this is
00:41:27
similar to what Madeline was wearing that night and she described the man as white dark-haired about five foot seven
00:41:35
inches tall 35 to 40 years old he appeared to her to be Southern European or maybe Mediterranean this guy was
00:41:44
wearing gold or beige pants and a dark colored jacket now later an artist impression was made of the man that
00:41:53
Tanner saw this was not released until October of 2007. now in the picture in the artist rendering it it actually
00:42:03
appears that we said a dark colored jacket but according to the artist it appears like it's possibly a dark brown
00:42:10
that's what it looks to me and she said that he did not he he did not look like a tourist to her she thought he was
00:42:20
somebody that was a local this description is what many call the Tanner sighting uh this description like we
00:42:29
said was not released to the media uh for three weeks the drawing was conducted in October 2007 but the
00:42:37
description itself was not released to the media until three weeks into the investigation of course if the child in
00:42:43
the man's arms is in fact Madeline then the course the the direction that he is taking it the the direction he is
00:42:51
traveling is of great importance but in the early days of the investigation the direction in which he was walking was
00:42:58
thought to be extremely important because the man spotted caring the child was heading in the direction of the home
00:43:05
of Robert moratt this is a 33 year old British Portuguese businessman he's living near where the mccanns were
00:43:14
staying so near Apartment 5A and he's a suspect at that time okay so of course here Captain it looks like maybe that's
00:43:23
why the police were not releasing the description of the man because they already have a suspect that somewhat
00:43:30
matches that description traveling in a direction of his home and the tap is uh nine they all made statements saying
00:43:39
that that Robert was seen around the resort uh but also seen around the resort that night yeah the the sighting
00:43:47
was also considered to be very important because it offered investigators a time
00:43:51
frame for the actual abduction itself now the um the thing here though Captain is that the later they identified the
00:44:01
man that was carrying this child this is in October it's not until October of 2013 this Scotland Yard said that a man
00:44:10
on vacation has been identified as the man carrying the child that Tanner saw well on this just to stop you before you
00:44:18
go any further let's just start off with the idea that this happened in 2007 and
00:44:23
now we're talking 2013. the man was the man that they identified was in fact carrying his daughter back to their
00:44:31
apartment that they were staying in the girls pajamas that she was wearing that night matched the description that was
00:44:38
given Scotland Yard took photographs of the man wearing the same clothes to the one that he was wearing that night and
00:44:46
posed about the same way according to Scotland Yard so they believe they've identified the man and he frankly was
00:44:55
just carrying his his daughter back to their room so the sighting itself even though the detectives at the time that
00:45:03
night didn't believe Tanner had seen anything at all we have a situation where she did in
00:45:09
fact see what she said she saw because they identified the man and they rule that he has absolutely nothing to do
00:45:15
with the Abduction of Manny right with which will also point to the fact that we have this guy Robert that uh lives
00:45:22
with his mother and and the Tapas nine said they saw him around and see the first day of the search he was around
00:45:28
and he was helping out with the search and so then it became okay this is our Prime Suspect but there was really no
00:45:35
evidence other than the fact that maybe this guy could have been the guy carrying the kid and it was heading into
00:45:40
the direction of his uh mother's house uh again no evidence and eventually they cleared this gentleman well let's let's
00:45:48
expand on that a bit because you you actually have three members of the group uh that was traveling with the mccanns
00:45:55
that said that they saw morat outside of Apartment 5A and this is shortly after The Disappearance there's also a bunch
00:46:03
of other people that spotted him as well we have an Ocean Club Nanny we have two
00:46:07
guests that we're on vacation we have a barrister and a local woman all these people seeing him his claim is and his
00:46:14
mother backs him up on this he says that he was home all of that night right so this wasn't until May 15th but they did
00:46:23
like you said they did an extensive investigation into this guy his home and cars were searched this included his
00:46:31
computers and phone they drained his uh pool they searched his yard using ground
00:46:36
radar and dogs and they questioned people who knew him um but like the captain said they had
00:46:44
cleared this guy but I wanted to go into how extensive they looked into him the thing here is though you know they
00:46:51
questioned him they questioned people that knew him I want to be clear though they continued to question him years
00:46:57
after they quote unquote cleared him they questioned his wife years after and in fact they question his mother as late
00:47:05
as this year and one of the things that she stated in in some of the things she witnessed that evening was what she
00:47:14
referred to as suspicious activity that she saw that night and the thing here is she I mean she
00:47:20
might be right because that Murat home where they lived was only about 150 yards from Apartment 5A she told the BBC
00:47:29
that she had driven past Apartment 5A that night and had seen a young woman in a plum colored shirt just outside of the
00:47:37
apartment uh she did give this information to the police at the time she also said that she saw a small brown
00:47:45
rental car speeding toward the apartment and she only noticed it because the vehicle was going the wrong way down a
00:47:52
one-way street so Robert was pretty much the number one suspect from the or the first number one suspect correct right
00:48:00
and then we have the like we said we have the Tanner siding you know their friend that saw this guy you know a guy
00:48:06
carrying you know what some people believe was his daughter my problem with that is the direction he was heading in
00:48:12
was away from the apartments what she claims I agree with you and then the other thing that I have a
00:48:19
problem with this too is uh they basically claimed that he was picking up the kid from the child service and and
00:48:26
that's kind of how they figured this all out but again it's six years later and I I I'm not 100 I I hundred I don't
00:48:36
100 believe that this is the gentleman that that that Tanner saw I'm with you because what I kept looking for when
00:48:44
researching this exact sighting here was that all I could ever find was it was Scotland Yard saying that we have
00:48:51
identified this man as being as being who Gene Tanner saw that night I couldn't find any definitive thing where
00:49:00
she's saying yes that was the guy that I saw that night so leave some question there right but we also have a sighting
00:49:07
uh that occurred a little bit later that evening this would be around 10 o'clock
00:49:12
and this is referred to as the Smith sighting right so we have the Tanner siding in about 30 minutes later now
00:49:19
give or take I mean like I said with timeline always go back 10 minutes or forward 10 minutes but about 30 minutes
00:49:25
later um the in the Smith family sees a man in similar outfit carrying a a young female
00:49:35
yes this is Martin and Mary Smith they are on vacation as well uh they're from Ireland I I like this this sighting a
00:49:43
little better I find it a little more maybe a little more credibility here just because there's more than one
00:49:49
person stating the same thing they're saying that at around 10 p.m about 500 yards away from the McCann's apartment
00:49:56
walking away from The Ocean Club toward the beach uh they spotted a man he was carrying a little girl that the Smiths
00:50:04
believed to be about three to four years old the little girl had blonde hair pale
00:50:09
skin wearing light-colored pajamas no socks or shoes or slippers she was barefoot
00:50:15
um The Smiths believed that the man would have been in his mid-30s approximately five foot seven to five
00:50:20
foot nine inches tall with a slim to normal build they reported him as having short brown hair uh this guy was wearing
00:50:29
cream or beige colored pants and they said as well that he did not look like a tourist to them according to the Smiths
00:50:37
he had he seemed uncomfortable carrying the the little girl right in my arm my argument there on not believing that
00:50:47
they identified uh the man that Tanner saw is that if if you carried a three-year-old almost a four-year-old
00:50:54
for over 500 yards so over five five football fields you're going to be pretty uncomfortable
00:51:01
yeah yeah if if it's in fact the same two people and you know we've heard people say that it's not possible the
00:51:08
time doesn't line up no we're talking about 30 to 45 minutes later a guy wearing a similar outfit is carrying a
00:51:16
similar girl with a similar outfit on and it's what were we captain we're now we're 500 guards out yeah
00:51:24
something like that but it's roughly about a quarter mile so you got to make a quarter mile in 30 minutes not that
00:51:30
hard it doesn't seem hard to me um the thing here is we have a composite drawing of this guy uh the description
00:51:38
that was given by The Smiths this was released it's it's called an e-fit it was released by Scotland Yard in 2013.
00:51:46
it's basically a computerized uh uh drawing of what they think they believe so there's two pictures of this guy both
00:51:54
looking somewhat similar and Captain I there's there's so many things that are similar about the two sightings
00:52:02
the one that I'd say is a big thing that you know kind of sticks out in my head as Tanner claims that the gentleman had
00:52:10
a little bit longer hair and and the Smiths Claire clearly state that his hair was not long very short hair
00:52:18
um and the thing here is Captain I I found some I've I thought that the the the man in
00:52:25
the e-fit picture that the Smiths saw it's a vague resemblance but it to me it vaguely resembles Jerry McCann uh
00:52:35
vaguely resembles almost any European male yeah it looks like a lot of people all right so since we're on the Smith
00:52:44
siding let's just go ahead and discuss this a little bit because uh we're kind of jumping back and forth as far as like
00:52:51
you know time frame you know 2007 2013. at some point years after the Smith family uh sees a BBC reporting and they
00:53:02
see uh Jerry McCain carrying one of his Twins and they are convinced the the I believe the gentleman
00:53:10
um and the Smith family was saying 60 to 80 percent sure that the guy I saw that
00:53:17
night now we're talking years later was Jerry McCain now then that threw up these big red
00:53:24
flags right right and I think they're saying that because this is Martin Smith saying this
00:53:30
he's saying it because like the captain said he sees Jerry on TV he sees him hold not only holding his his other
00:53:38
child but he's his head is kind of down his shoulders are kind of up he's almost
00:53:43
in a similar position that he would have seen that man that evening and he's saying wow man when I see him in that
00:53:51
stance when I see him with his head just that certain way this 60 to 80 percent that that's my guy that that's the guy
00:53:59
that I saw walking that night carrying a child right so again when we first start
00:54:04
this whole thing when uh Kate comes out running and saying they abducted her they took you
00:54:11
know they took my daughter right we have the resort saying no no she probably just ran went and left on her own and
00:54:18
we'll find her they don't find her so now we're going with this abduction Theory but there's these little things
00:54:23
that don't keep you know that they're not adding up like you know uh we get this really weird feeling with with
00:54:29
Jerry so we have these these things not quite adding up so now we we're we're kind of
00:54:34
splitting off into two theories one that somebody abducted her or that there was
00:54:42
an accident or or somebody killed her and to cover it up they're claiming that she was
00:54:50
abducted and so when you have the Smith family coming out saying okay now we know who
00:54:58
we saw that night it was Jerry McCain now the problem with that was even the I believe even the Portuguese police told
00:55:07
them hey look based off of the timeline and not just and not just the the tap is
00:55:13
nines theories but based off the resorts timeline and what they saw there is no way that you could have seen Jerry
00:55:24
carrying Madeline that night yeah and that's that's the troubling thing with the investigation when the when the
00:55:31
investigation kicks off they're they're already stumbled by the fact that Madeline could have wandered off and
00:55:39
then they're further stumbled by we have the whole group stating it's an abduction let's look at that and the
00:55:45
third possibility like you said is that this is some kind of cover cover-up something happened to where they had to
00:55:51
cover up the death of their daughter and now we have the and that's why she's missing
00:55:58
the thing here is that was not really did that seem to you like that most of the investigators from the beginning
00:56:06
thought that that was a possibility thought it was the number one possibility no it looked to me like they were
00:56:12
checking the other avenues first all right so here here's where we're at though right so now now we got two
00:56:18
theories right that either she's abducted or that the McCain's had something to do with it and that it's a
00:56:26
cover-up well and therein lies Captain what I would call the the bulk of the story the bulk of this investigation is
00:56:33
the family the mccanns themselves we all know that they've become suspects in in
00:56:39
The Disappearance of their daughter um but the problem here is you know this is a 10 year old case and yeah I know we
00:56:47
cover a lot of 10 15 20 30 year old cases this case is different in the sense that it is like we said she is
00:56:55
probably the most famous Madeleine McCann is probably the most famous missing person maybe in the history of
00:57:03
of you know these types of cases that being said everything has been under a microscope if we went through
00:57:10
everything through the course of this 10-year investigation it would take us a whole season just to talk about
00:57:16
everything that's taken place let's do it starting now what I think the the thing that we need
00:57:24
to hone in on and focus in on and we're going to have to do this on tomorrow's show but what we're going to do is
00:57:29
there's been a lot of theories there's been a lot of speculation there's been a lot of Suspicion around the McCann
00:57:36
family there's a lot of but but every couple months or so we get new leads and we get new evidence I think what we do
00:57:42
is I think we we kind of pour through that evidence and we point out if if this does this point towards a guilty or
00:57:50
not guilty in in our opinions yeah and I think you'll be able to see how weird our brains work when we look at the
00:57:58
evidence so of course the whole world 10 years later still looking for Madeleine
00:58:03
McCann tomorrow Captain you and I will look for for the truth about what happened that night all right everybody
00:58:09
happy Fourth of July and I don't even care where you're from happy Fourth of July get some fireworks out crack open a
00:58:18
couple beers enjoy yourselves barbecue a little bit all right we'll see you guys
00:58:22
tomorrow in the garage that's right be good be careful be kind and don't lift [Music]
00:58:38
foreign [Music]