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00:01:26
[Applause] 2023 [Music] welcome to True Crime garage wherever you are whatever you are doing thanks
00:01:47
for listening I'm your host Nick and with me as always ladies and gentlemen Sammy Davis Jr was a close personal
00:01:53
friend of his who is he he's the captain it's just impossible to put this piano up my nose
00:02:00
it's just impossible it's good to be seen and it's good to see you thanks for listening
00:02:07
thanks for telling a [Music] friend tonight we are drinking circuit Bohemian pilsner by the wonderful
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wonderful people at Tin Man Brewing Company in Indiana garage grade three and a half bottle caps out of five
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circuit Bohemian pillner sends a thrilling Buzz to your senses with bright color Clarity and energizing
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flavor and this fantastic pilsner was brought to us by first up we have John and Broken Arrow Oklahoma and Amy and
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Cody Wyoming and Jenny From the Block in Chicago wants to give a shout out to her
00:02:43
BFF bill this next one here says here's a beer just for the hot hot Captain all the way from moond daughter in Wales
00:02:52
well we like your CH next up we have Casey in Atlanta we also have Nicole in Atlanta ATL and a big we like your jib
00:03:00
to shoot her down in Texas with the six-pack of the PBR we also have star in Green Lake Wisconsin you know Captain
00:03:08
last week I was reading an article in the USA Today mhm and it said out of the 20 drunkest cities in the great us of a
00:03:16
the great state of Wisconsin has nine nine out of the top 20 drunkest cities in the country so all right everybody in
00:03:24
parts are known step up your drinking game Wisconsin is beating the pants off of us
00:03:30
next up in Indianapolis we have Nicholas who says cheers to Nick and the captain
00:03:35
also in Indianapolis we have Jamie who says are you sending beer money to yourself that's what's going on yeah um
00:03:42
we also have Jamie in Indianapolis who says that she's a garage groupy for Life hey hey girl and also in Indiana we have
00:03:49
Jason Jason is a manager at a diner and he says he often wonders how many of his
00:03:53
third shift patrons are murdered well I hope not many of them you silly bastard it's time for Jason to
00:04:02
get out of the old restaurant Biz I think and we really appreciate everybody that's donating to the Beer fund you can
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do so at true Crim garage.com click on the Donate Banner uh but we can't do 100 shoutouts every week so be patient thank
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you and if you haven't been to True Crim garage.com in a while make sure you go there and check it out click on the
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store Page because we have True Crime garage beer glasses yeah pint glasses Nick design them and for those of you
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that have been following me on untapped they're the ones that you've seen on my pictures that I've been posting there m
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you post pictures somewhere mhm we also have shirts coming out right Captain yeah we Resurgence of a couple shirts
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well we have a logo purple v-neck for the ladies and then we have this like kind of like a dark blue gray logo crew
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shirt for the for the guys and those will be available this week so check those out at True Crime garage all right
00:04:57
that's enough of the business everybody gather around grab a chair grab a beer let's talk some true
00:05:03
[Applause] crime and Marie the autopsy's confirmed identities but how these children were
00:05:30
killed the circumstances surrounding their death police aren't talking about that they say they don't want to say
00:05:36
anything that could jeopardize this double homicide investigation for the second day local
00:05:43
state and federal investigators scoured over the crime scene early afternoon divers joined the search for clues that
00:05:49
could lead detectives to the girl's killer the autopsies confirmed what everyone including the teens families
00:05:56
suspected and feared I think they were in pretty much belief that it was their their
00:06:01
children um but when you hear from an official it's it's it's still a little just still it hits home twice one of the
00:06:10
hundreds of volunteer Searchers found the bodies of Libby German and Abby Williams in a wooded area near Deer
00:06:16
Creek it is an area accessible only by foot or on horse well off the popular Trails the 13-year-olds were hiking
00:06:24
dozens of police are now checking hundreds of leads we are using resources from uh all the way from L Fort Wayne and uh
00:06:33
the Southern State or the southern part of the state's uh police state troopers we will stay on the job until it is done
00:06:40
police say they have no suspects or Persons of Interest they're asking anyone who was in the hiking area who
00:06:45
saw something or heard something or took any pictures contact them should people
00:06:50
in this community be concerned about someone running around targeting kids my response is is no I feel safe for this
00:06:59
Community Libyan Abbey teens teachers describe as happy and go-lucky attended deli's middle school crisis teams were
00:07:07
ready for students and teachers when they arrived at all the district schools they're just asking those questions
00:07:12
right now of oh my gosh it hit me and somebody's there for them the double homicide has prompted one of the largest
00:07:20
investigations some officers say they've ever been part of as far as I'm concerned yes there is somebody out
00:07:26
there that did this horrendous crime and uh we're going to track him down also police say there is someone
00:07:35
out there who probably saw something was on the trails was driving that part of the country just east of Deli they may
00:07:42
have seen someone they may have seen a car that perhaps looked out of place and that's why police want that person to
00:07:49
call them back to you [Music] the homicides of two Deli teenagers Liberty German and Abigail Williams has
00:08:06
shocked the community of Carroll County and left them on edge as police search for Killers or the killer of both we
00:08:15
went through a general timeline of the investigation yesterday but today what we're going to focus on is rumors
00:08:21
speculation and theories revolving this investigation because we have this situation here Captain where we're not
00:08:28
being told a whole lot of information and in my opinion what's going on right now is we have a man hunt we're in the
00:08:34
middle of a man hunt this is Public Enemy Number One in my opinion this is who everybody should be looking for this
00:08:40
is a very very bad person that we are looking for well and to be very clear so everything that we're going to be
00:08:45
talking about is it's all speculative and so take it all with a grain of salt but it's something that you have to look
00:08:52
at with this case being you know open there's really no suspects uh in custody there's nobody charged with this crime
00:09:01
so everything that we're going to be talking about from here on out is uh speculation so if that's not your thing
00:09:08
and you know and a lot of the information that we will provide today is coming from several different sources
00:09:14
it's it's from rumors around the investigation possible leaks from law enforcement or leaks from reporters
00:09:20
sometimes reporters see some things that they're asked not to speak about as well
00:09:25
as Searchers uh volunteer Searchers that were involved in this case mhm we also have some information from some bloggers
00:09:32
YouTubers and just kind of collecting everything that's out there to kind of get a a sense of what is actually going
00:09:39
on in this investigation now regarding the investigation itself of course autopsies were conducted but a cause of
00:09:47
death has not been stated in the case of either girl M now I want to talk about our suspect for a minute and you know if
00:09:55
you hear me say Bridge guy obviously I'm referring to the man in the in the photograph released by police of the guy
00:10:02
on the bridge so yesterday I failed to mention the possibility of a gun involved in this case when you look at
00:10:09
the two pictures of the bridge guy in one of the pictures there appears to be a gun on his person you can see an
00:10:17
outline of a gun um you know I've heard other people speculate that the suspect definitely has a pistol what I see what
00:10:24
I see is the outline of a gun it it appears to be a pistol that is holstered on his right
00:10:29
side uh the gun pointing backward on his right side which would mean which would
00:10:35
imply he's possibly left-handed uh the outline of the pistol in my opinion can be clearly seen in one
00:10:42
of the photos that was released of the bridg man if the gun is on his right side why why does that mean he's
00:10:47
left-handed well because the the handle would be facing his left meaning that he
00:10:53
would draw it kind of like a sword you know you you typically would draw a sword from your opposite side well you
00:10:58
know living in Columbus Ohio I don't have to draw a sword too often uh so that brings us to our first question how
00:11:05
were the girls killed M and it's thought that they were either strangled uh or that possibly the throats may have been
00:11:13
cut according to rumors coming from persons who attended the memorial services for the girls right they both
00:11:19
had scarfs around their neck so this would point to both of those causes of death being likely as for the state of
00:11:27
the bodies when found well I guess someone posted pictures uh on a website and this the photos were quickly taken
00:11:36
down but a number of people saw these photos before they were taken down some of these people being people from Deli
00:11:43
yeah I haven't actually seen these photos myself I have not either uh but I've I've heard secondhand reports of
00:11:49
what was seen in these photos now from what I've heard the photo showed the two dead girls and the coroner uh the person
00:11:57
who posted the photo had some text saying that the bodies were positioned in an odd way this has led to the rumor
00:12:04
or theory that the that the way that the girls were left is some kind of ritual or maybe even something satanic right
00:12:13
satanic Panic yeah this this is a possibility uh you know just but but also just the killer posing the bodies
00:12:21
serial killers like doing this they often pose the victim knowing that they will be found they will pose them in a
00:12:28
manner for Max maximum shock value or to further degrade the victim even after death well the girls were found by
00:12:35
firefighters correct firefighters and volunteer Searchers right and so the rumor was that when the firefighters
00:12:42
found them the the at least one of the girls throats were slit so badly that it was almost uh decapitation mhm and
00:12:50
unfortunately it probably would lean towards the throat slitting uh because of the scarfs um I I don't know know the
00:12:59
specifics of it and I'm not going to pretend to but I would think if it was strangulation that there could be makeup
00:13:06
or something less obvious uh on on the bodies at the at the services the thing here is though we also have a a rumor
00:13:15
that has persisted for quite some time uh this was even before the case uh was released to the media uh these early
00:13:23
rumors coming from family members that Abby survived until the next day this would be February
00:13:30
14th there were different rumors um some of those including that she was found alive but died on the way to the
00:13:37
hospital or that the coroner said that she had survived the attack but died of hypothermia in the woods and that her
00:13:44
body might have still been warm when found now there's information out there that she may have survived the attack
00:13:50
and tried to crawl aways away and then passed away uh if this is true of course you know we don't know how long she
00:13:59
would have survived for after the attack but to me it might lean more towards strangulation you know because we have
00:14:06
seen several cases that we've covered on this show where somebody will attempt to
00:14:11
choke someone and they they think that they've completed um the murder and and in fact have not well again because the
00:14:19
lack of evidence or not the lack of evidence but the lack of uh evidence that they're releasing to the public
00:14:27
it's really hard to understand what motive is cuz we don't we don't know if these um two girls were sexually
00:14:34
assaulted or not yeah and I think that it would be easily assumed that this might be a sexually motivated crime or
00:14:41
sexually motivated murders um you know but we can't always assume that in these cases the the very first rumors from the
00:14:48
family members said that both girls had been raped uh the the other rumor was that only one was attacked this way
00:14:57
there is a new rumor that says that neither girl was raped and what we are seeing with this rumor instead is that
00:15:07
both girls would have been could have been sexually mutilated in some way which of course this is
00:15:12
definitely got to be much worse than than the actual sexual attack itself right but that would lead to the satanic
00:15:20
Panic possi possibly or just an extremely violent offender um I don't know which of these is a more accurate
00:15:29
statement I do however believe that we are dealing with a very bad man and an evil person who easily could have been
00:15:36
motivated by any and maybe all of the above now yeah I can't back this with like some source so again bunch of
00:15:45
speculation but um a friend of mine that has dove into this case uh quite a bit uh was telling me that in this
00:15:54
area yeah it's a small town and 3,000 individuals or so but one in 60 individuals are sexual offenders in this
00:16:04
area a a registered sexual offender right um I you know I don't know I don't know if if they were raped or or one or
00:16:13
the other um you know but you would hope if that were the case that we would have
00:16:18
some form of DNA that could connect to this guy um if if they were just AB assaulted with an object then we might
00:16:26
not be dealing with DNA uh if not then what would be the other possible motives well then you would
00:16:33
think that somebody was specifically targeting one or both of these girls for some kind of uh horrible purpose mhm now
00:16:42
there there's a rumor out there that's that's catching legs and the thing here is I I almost hesitate to say this
00:16:50
because it seems a little far-fetched to me but I but because that's what we're doing here today I think we should
00:16:56
report on it there there's a rumor that possi Abby uh was pregnant uh that victim Abigail Williams age 13 was
00:17:04
pregnant at the time of the attack now I've seen we've all seen the pictures of her on the bridge she doesn't appear to
00:17:10
be pregnant she could be in the very early stages however um I do want to point out that the way that this rumor
00:17:17
goes is that somebody related to the boyfriend wanted to put an end to this pregnancy and possibly wanted to talk
00:17:27
her into to an abortion or maybe even and I cringe when I say this even perform some kind of back alley surgery
00:17:37
himself now this obviously if we're looking at a suspect that is the man on the bridge then this would be somebody
00:17:44
much older than aby's boyfriend and you know his name has been reported he's I guess he's a 16-year-old boy um but so
00:17:52
this would the thought would be it would be a a father or an uncle or a grandfather somebody related to this boy
00:17:59
the problem right and we're calling him boy because we're not going to release this individual's names cuz again it's
00:18:05
just rumors no be and more more than likely in my opinion he's probably a victim because he lost his girlfriend he
00:18:13
lost friends close to him so it's it's not necessary to State his name the thing here is though Captain you would
00:18:20
think that if this theory if it if it really if it was it was a hard concrete Theory that that that had some ground
00:18:30
you would think that that your suspect pool shrinks immediately you know we would be looking at a small group of
00:18:37
people and we have the picture of the guy we have the audio now mind you the picture is not clear the audio is not
00:18:44
super clear however I think if you're only looking at three or four people you could pick one amongst those that best
00:18:51
look like this guy right uh I agree with you and and also yeah those aren't clear
00:18:58
but but we also don't know what else they have I mean do they have 6 minutes of video do they have 40 minutes of
00:19:03
audio uh basically based off the interview from the sheriff is you don't want to hear this audio that they have
00:19:12
which you know leads me to believe that this is an audio recording of the actual
00:19:16
murders yeah that that some or all of the attack took place on the video or audio the thing here is too Captain but
00:19:23
you would think if it was somebody that knew either of the girls or both of the girls mhm if they didn't know they were
00:19:30
being recorded they would probably they might even refer to them by name which would be somewhat of a lead I would
00:19:37
think uh you know how how would a stranger just know their names unless he makes them tell them or yeah which you
00:19:45
might not actually have that part on audio you know there there might not be footage of the guy asking their names
00:19:52
and I don't know the Dynamics of this young man's family of the boyfriend's family but I know with my circle of
00:19:59
friends I've I have had friends that I've been around for 15 20 years I might know their parents but I don't know
00:20:05
their grandparents or their uncles uh what I'm getting at here is the reverse of if the suspect knew the victim's
00:20:13
names if it was somebody somewhat close to their Circle there's a chance the victims could have known his name and
00:20:21
obviously if if they heard a first name on there that again suspect pool much smaller we still have nobody arrested so
00:20:29
I don't think that's for me why this Theory doesn't hold a lot of weight and what's your take on this idea that the
00:20:36
girls were actually moved like that they were um so basically the rumor is that the search team searched that area M and
00:20:45
there's a lot of claims that well we searched that area on the Monday and they weren't there so that they were
00:20:51
either somewhere else the crime scene maybe took place somewhere else and they were just dumped in that that spot or
00:20:58
that the crime scene actually took place in that spot and was moved and then they
00:21:03
were taken back well the thing here is like you said there's been these rumors stemming from the search party and me a
00:21:13
lot of these people are adamant that they searched that very area on the 13th and then they're found there on the 14th
00:21:20
right when you and I were talking about this you brought up a very good point this is February the search wouldn't
00:21:24
have started until 5:30 or so right and it's very possibly that it could be dark
00:21:31
by the time they started that search now I don't want to say that they didn't try
00:21:36
their hardest or their darnest um I believe that they did if they say they searched that area and they think that
00:21:42
it was super thorough I'm going to go with that I could also be talked into believing that they might that they
00:21:48
might have missed it because it was dark I could be talked into it uh it was dark yeah I look I think people
00:21:55
sometimes are mistaken we see that time and time again with with eyewitnesses you know uh I I don't believe and look
00:22:02
again they're holding back so much evidence I don't know if there's any evidence that they were moved well the
00:22:08
thing here is and I'll point to a bit of a theory that I have um I think lay it on me Colonel I think
00:22:17
that this is possibly a sexually motivated crime sexually motivated murders so if that's the case I believe
00:22:24
that this Maniac whatever he was trying to achieve whatever whatever he wanted to do he would need a
00:22:31
little bit of privacy and he would want a little bit of time and that they would
00:22:35
have been taken to a nearby structure I don't I don't really see a situation where somebody you know put them in a
00:22:42
vehicle and drove them far away just to return them later that seems too unlikely it seems too too much of for
00:22:50
this guy to get caught um so I think that if he would have taken them to a nearby structure that that would have
00:22:57
provided him with both a little bit of privacy and a little bit of time now it did look like at some point in this
00:23:03
investigation that law enforcement was working with that idea um they they might have been removed and then later
00:23:12
returned and dumped at this site so this would mean that they would have had to have been returned after 2:30 a.m. when
00:23:19
all the Searchers left and most likely before daylight the next day sun up would have been around 700 a.m. right so
00:23:26
the killer returned the girls according to my theory to the forest where near where they were abducted somehow If he
00:23:34
if he had somewhere close to take them this might not have been very difficult for him to do well and there were some
00:23:40
roads that were leading that way cuz I guess there's some roads through the semetery that's close that you could
00:23:46
take that would help you get back to the area where the bodies were found now one
00:23:50
place that police were searching now this is a structure it's a it's I'll call it a barn cuz that's what it looks
00:23:56
like to me but it's been referred to to in newspaper articles as a structure this is a barn with with three True
00:24:02
Crime structure three big openings and I believe that it's located across the street from Ron Logan's property
00:24:10
remember we discussed Ron Logan yesterday his property kind of meets up with the area that the girls were hiking
00:24:16
right now the distance from this Barn uh to the beginning of the trail where where they would have been uh replaced
00:24:25
uh is approximately about 200 yards that's what it's been reported at okay so two football fields yes this could be
00:24:33
where he took where he took them MH uh to This Barn that now what I've heard about this Barn is that a person there
00:24:42
would have had a perfect view of the area uh he would be able to determine when the searches had stopped so he
00:24:49
possibly knew when the searches stopped at 2:30 a.m. he then returned them sometime between 2:30 and 7:00 a.m. that
00:24:56
morning there is photos of police with dogs searching This Barn the barn that I just described this was reported but the
00:25:06
media reports got it wrong this is where they stated that they were searching Ron
00:25:10
Logan's property again searching his land and in fact it was land across the street this belonging to the MIRS family
00:25:19
uh which is like I said just across the street but the thing here is regarding the structure uh it's about 50 I think
00:25:27
it's 50 yard off of the road so the way that it's been reported to me is that if
00:25:34
you were standing at the road you would not be able to see very far into this Barn you would only be able to see a
00:25:40
couple feet into it now mind you on top of that between 5:30 p.m. and 2:30 a.m. it's going to be very dark I've heard
00:25:50
that it's so dark inside this Barn that you could have placed a vehicle in there
00:25:53
during daylight hours and the vehicle itself not be able to be seen well and so the the the theory that they were
00:26:01
moved kind of lends themselves a lot of people then say well if they were moved because these Searchers claim that they
00:26:07
searched this area and they weren't there which again I think it could just be a simple
00:26:13
mistake that therefore there's multiple Killers because this is a 13 and 14-year-old uh teenage girl and they
00:26:22
would to be able to physically move them which I would argue you know this is a rural area that maybe there's a ATV or
00:26:29
something like that or you could put somebody in a truck or something like that but uh I'm going to go back with the so
00:26:37
let's just address this killer or Killers the reason why I lean towards a single person is one we got a picture of
00:26:46
a single person right and they claim that that's a suspect this is a guy that we need to talk to also the interview
00:26:52
with the sheriff uh when he's answering he he keeps answering as killer and then almost de dismisses the
00:27:02
multi you know multiple person Theory MH um you'd have to listen to it to get the
00:27:09
vibe but that's the vibe I got and so I think if if the sheriff is saying hey an
00:27:16
again it's it's the six minutes of video or 40 minutes of audio that he knows that I don't know mhm and so to me with
00:27:25
all his knowledge and with that they're holding to the vest he's pointing towards one individual and I think i' I
00:27:32
you know I've seen footage of of different interviews with him and I think at least twice I've seen him uh
00:27:38
try and like almost catch himself and then say or Killers you know there's a long Paws and then he goes or Killers
00:27:45
right and I think a lot of that has to come down to they need people to come forward they need they still need tips
00:27:52
you know we're sitting here talking about this case and we're talking about speculation they're still wait 10,000
00:27:57
tips they're still waiting on the tip that's going to close this case and bring this madman to Justice well
00:28:03
there's a couple things one it's it's like a back and forth thing first of all with law enforcement
00:28:10
I I I applaud you that you want to hold it everything close to the chest so that
00:28:14
you can get a conviction of this animal damn it got stop calling them animals monster right yep of this monster sick
00:28:23
individual this guy's a piece of [ __ ] M right that's that's what we do know this
00:28:28
is a 13 and 14-year-old girl you are a piece of [ __ ] man and but law enforcement I understand you want to
00:28:36
keep it keep it close to the chest so that maybe you can get a conviction but I think what law enforcement needs to
00:28:43
understand that the armchair detective Community web sluth Community if this guy is a traveler you have strength and
00:28:51
numbers and there is a lot of smart I mean just doing the show for what 110 episodes the amount of individuals that
00:28:59
we have met that know so much about this stuff well and to further touch upon the
00:29:04
point whether they were moved or not there there's an additional rumor and this is uh might be stemming from The
00:29:10
Searchers as well the rumor is that the Searchers followed drag marks presumably
00:29:15
left by the girls to the site um now this would mean that if if the person used the barn and they they did drag the
00:29:25
girls off that trail to leave them um we're looking at a situation where the killer drove down the road this would be
00:29:33
the road from the barn to the cemetery and then drove past the cemetery then through the southeast gate this would
00:29:40
have put him on Ron Logan's land for a very small bit of time he would have to kind of cross over his land and then
00:29:48
went to the trail where he dragged the bodies now it's not inconceivable because if he did in fact have a gun if
00:29:56
that outlined that we we see that that appears to be a gun he might have been able to control them if he was well
00:30:03
planned or well equipped we talked about a fanny pack or a deer kit there's a chance he might have had zip ties or
00:30:09
something to gain control and could have put them in a vehicle and quickly transported them to that structure that
00:30:16
we just discussed W I'm getting pretty fired up let's get right back to this after a quick beer
00:30:26
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00:32:23
the other question that we have now Captain is was DNA recovered from the crime scene uh which there has been
00:32:31
conflicting information about the DNA collected at the crime scene some reports there there was no DNA other
00:32:37
reports stating there is DNA but there is no match to any known person another says that the DNA that came back is that
00:32:46
of Ivan Bromberg uh this is a man that was involved in the search and he is one of the people that found the bodies
00:32:53
however in this situation it would simply just be we touch DNA um that was found and yeah yeah possible but you
00:33:03
know interesting thing uh I have a friend that's kind of spiritual I don't want to get into it too much uh has
00:33:13
feelings um if that makes any sense nope um she just gets feelings or Vibes about
00:33:20
certain things and one of the things as she was researching this case and she's researched this case a lot she beli the
00:33:27
individual that is responsible for this crime was there was involved in the search yeah the following day and which
00:33:35
would make a lot of sense when you think well maybe the day of and the day the next day mhm and you know which would
00:33:43
make some sense you we're talking about a very small community of 3,000 that's pretty small mhm so well
00:33:53
feeling or not that you know that doesn't really matter the thing here is m you know usually the person that finds
00:33:59
a body is usually considered a suspect that's one of the first people that police want to talk to you know they're
00:34:05
kind of lumped into that group of people with like family members and people close to the victim they're they're put
00:34:11
right in that Center Circle of the investigation right from the get-go you have a different situation here because
00:34:19
multiple people found these bodies and in the situations I'm talking about it's would be where one person stumbles upon
00:34:27
de body this situation though I do want to be very clear about this because we we used we stated his name I want to be
00:34:34
very clear that that this Mr Bromberg um has not been listed as a suspect first of all and second of all he has stated
00:34:43
that when they found the bodies they there were other people there that he did touch the bodies when they were
00:34:50
found right uh yeah okay number one don't touch the bodies that's the rule second uh unless they're not unless it's
00:35:01
not obvious that you know if when you're searching it's it typically it's search
00:35:05
and rescue you know what I mean um you don't know that you're looking for a dead person at that point and don't
00:35:13
touch the bodies okay I can agree with that but what I'm stating is that I think that it's natural for some people
00:35:20
I'm coming to Mr bromberg's defense here is that no I'm not don't touch the bodies in some situations you you think
00:35:27
that there's still chance at hope there's still chance at life and you you go to search and rescue yeah don't touch
00:35:35
the bodies um anyways but that's what makes me believe that this there was a sexual assault because we have DNA of
00:35:44
this guy finding them but yeah there was other individuals around but we have DNA
00:35:48
of this individual on the victims according to rumors right but we're going to dismiss that anyways because
00:35:55
there was a sexual assult that's my gut feeling there that's your that's your opinion yes but kind of just you know to
00:36:02
to clear this up because the options are was there DNA there wasn't any DNA uh well one thing we can go ahead and check
00:36:09
off our list is that if there was DNA found at the scene it doesn't match any known person to them because uh you know
00:36:20
they would have arrested this person by now we would we would be aware with the way that the eyes are on this case and
00:36:25
the rumors coming out I think I think we would have been aware Colonel don't be so naive here right so as far as
00:36:33
registered sex offenders in United States right mhm I'm going to give broad numbers now
00:36:39
a lot of this is coming from the national center missing and exploited children but registered sex offenders
00:36:45
you're looking at about 750,000 okay out of those 750,000 now a big point that you brought
00:36:53
up and I'm not even clear on the answer is are certain sex uh are certain sex offenders do they have to register their
00:37:02
DNA and I think that holds true in some states and in some areas I don't know that it holds true for all areas right
00:37:09
but the that what I'm saying is if they do have DNA that doesn't mean that it necessarily doesn't match somebody now I
00:37:18
would I would favor the idea that if it did match somebody that and here's where
00:37:23
I'm going with this okay out of the 700 you you want to get freaked out right now you want to go run and find your
00:37:31
kids and lock them up because you know how many of those 750,000 which is up almost 150,000 from
00:37:39
10 years ago you know how many of those people are missing I do not anywhere from well they
00:37:47
say zero to over a 100,000 that's a lot of missing sex offenders and so but but I get but the
00:37:59
point is is if they did have DNA and if it did match somebody you're saying might not be a to
00:38:06
find the person right but even if they were missing you would you would think that they would come out and say well
00:38:10
here's the guy's uh photo here's his last known address here's his last known license plate you know everything we
00:38:17
know about the guy this is the dude right but possibly not I think I swallowed a bug the next thing on our
00:38:25
list here Captain is was evidence destroyed or what evidence was found at the destroyed by the uh the
00:38:33
attacker by the murderer yeah or or discarded in another place other than where the bodies were found well let's
00:38:40
talk about the obvious one the phone right there's been a big huge question about the phone well my personal
00:38:45
feelings or my yeah my personal feelings what is this like therapy um my thoughts
00:38:53
on this are pretty simple I think the individual probably took the phone with them probably threw the phone in a a
00:39:00
river or wherever mhm uh and the law enforcement got a break and solving this case got a break with the technology of
00:39:10
the cloud mhm and I think you're right because the other Theory would be that if the phone in fact was not recovered
00:39:17
that if the killer didn't do something with the phone then Liberty would have got rid of the phone to try to hide her
00:39:24
recordings uh think that you know I understand that we're searching the woods here but I think that it would
00:39:31
have been found had she dropped it somewhere on purpose or that's a big area or threw it somewhere on purpose I
00:39:38
think if it's not been recovered you're looking at a situation where the killer did something with the actual phone now
00:39:45
there was also a rumor that bootprints were found at the scene of course this would make sense you know the the bridge
00:39:52
guy that we see he appears to be wearing some type of you know of course he's wearing wearing shoes but they might be
00:39:57
outdoor boots or some form of boots um and law enforcement had some boots in an Evidence bag just a few days after the
00:40:07
killings now they said that the boots had nothing to do with the crime I personally doubt that this is true but
00:40:14
they say that a lot right I I what I would have to guess probably happened is that they did you know they wouldn't
00:40:21
have recovered I don't expect them to recover boots from the crime scene that would make little to no sense it's more
00:40:26
likely that law enforcement matched the bootprints that were found at the crime scene to a specific type and size of
00:40:33
boot and they went out and acquired that exact type and size of boot well there's
00:40:39
some rumors about the girl's clothes as well yeah the rumor from reporters at the scene indicate that the girl's
00:40:45
clothing was found in the creek this to me would make a lot of sense especially if this is a sexually motivated crime
00:40:53
this guy is horrible enough he's not going to bother to clothe them afterward and second of all he's probably wanting
00:41:02
to get rid of DNA the best that he can with we don't know how much time he had to do that but the thing is the bodies
00:41:09
were found according to the press conference the bodies were found near water I I almost wonder if they were
00:41:17
found in the water if one of them was found in the water because they would have been near the creek if you look at
00:41:23
a a map of where the bodies were found they put the dot basically right on what appears to be the creek itself mhm now
00:41:30
if they regardless if they were found in the water or out of it they were found near and therefore it would have been
00:41:37
very easy for the killer to then throw the clothing in the water well it also makes sense with the rumor of the
00:41:44
hypothermia one girl surviving the actual attack but dying from hypothermia if they were in water yeah it was it was
00:41:51
February but it was abnormally warm but when you you know if you were in the water and then out of the water attacked
00:42:01
hypothermia would probably more likely set in then I would assume well I think it's time to address the elephant in the
00:42:08
room here captain or the old guy in the room yeah or the old guy on his property
00:42:12
or the old guy in prison I think it's the more accurate statement so we have Ron Logan he's been he's been and I I
00:42:20
would say in the public eye it appears to me from from what I'm reading from what I'm seeing
00:42:26
that it's generally thought that he's should be the prime suspect in this case so I think we should look at him two
00:42:34
different angles we should look at why you know is he an actual suspect or is he covering for somebody or did he just
00:42:41
have the bad luck of the bodies being placed on his land okay let's make it simpler though why why would he be a
00:42:50
suspect and why he W it so let's start with why he would and I was talking to a a great armchair Detective detective
00:42:57
eventually this guy will write books that and you'll read them and you'll be fascinated with this this individual I
00:43:02
call him the coach talking to the coach he was saying the thing about Ron Logan and we just like to call him Logan thing
00:43:10
about Logan that makes it's the A to B answer where the where are the girls found on Logan's property right um now
00:43:20
and then we have a shaky Alibi mhm right he States while I went to pick up exotic
00:43:26
fish I went to the dump uh and he was supposedly seen day drinking at some restaurant right so his
00:43:36
Alibi is a little shaky but I think that some of that probably does check out uh
00:43:42
well what the other thing too where the public has has got him targeted is that you have people stating that he looks
00:43:52
like the photograph of the bridge guy that he sounds like the odd audio that they recovered from the phone now the
00:43:59
thing here is you and I looked at both because Ron Logan you can if you Google or do any type of search at all you can
00:44:06
find him very quickly he he talked to several reporters it shows him walking the property with the reporters one
00:44:13
thing that surprised me though this guy's like 77 years old and my first thought and I know I apologize to
00:44:20
everybody out there to the older community and I know that that you have both ends of the spect right I know
00:44:26
people in their 70s that can do 100 push-ups and I know people in their 70s that aren't getting around very good
00:44:32
these days but and as far as Ron Logan appears in the interviews with these reporters he's walking up and down steep
00:44:39
hills with them he seems to have no problem he seems to be in good physical condition for his age so my immediate
00:44:47
thought was a 77y old man no not likely but then when you see him easily maneuvering these these Hills and and
00:44:55
such then you think well okay and then it's been pointed out well in some of these interviews he's wearing a similar
00:45:00
getup to the guy to the bridge guy yeah but everybody in that area has similar getups but the other thing that's
00:45:07
interesting that the coach pointed out which I never even thought of before is that the picture of the guy on the
00:45:12
bridge has a demeanor as you know like hunched over rolled shoulders mhm possibly you know you got to look at the
00:45:21
ground anyways because and now some people would say well that's a a sign of maybe he was
00:45:28
intoxicated that this individual was intoxicated you have to look down at that bridge because if you don't you're
00:45:34
going to fall off the did you see rails on that bridge no you're looking down as
00:45:39
you're walking on that bridge nobody wants to be the one guy that every so many years trips off the edge of the
00:45:45
bridge right and the thing too is your foot could go within some of the planks and stuff like that so but the coach
00:45:51
said he the guy in the picture kind of looks maybe intoxicated I didn't really noticed it before um but but looking at
00:45:59
it now I can see that so that would be another uh Point against Logan uh the other thing too yeah but
00:46:09
not to get too far away from the outfit because I think you just quickly dismissed it when you say everybody out
00:46:15
there has that same kind of outfit what you mean by that is you and I watched other interviews with other residents
00:46:21
and they seem to have they all have the same outf they hoodie with it's not like
00:46:26
a crazy outfit that you wouldn't be used to seeing the guy's wearing what appears
00:46:30
to be blue jeans everybody wears blue jeans and he's wearing like a like a blue type coat or jacket to me the with
00:46:39
it doesn't appear to have any type of logo on it that I could see but to me it looked like something I would be used to
00:46:45
seeing like utility workers wear or maybe even possible um construction guys would wear in the colder months it's not
00:46:54
an uncommon jacket or coat yeah it's not like the the the suspects walking around
00:46:59
with a romper on and personally I didn't think that Ron Logan sounded anything like the the short now mind you we only
00:47:08
heard three or four words three words three words down the hill he didn't sound anything to me like that audio
00:47:14
that was just my ears uh cuz uh Logan has kind of a sh sh when he talks right uh uh what's that guy from uh is it
00:47:23
Family Guy the guy the grandpa talk like I know what you're talking about I can't do it um but yeah
00:47:32
he kind of has this whistle to him the other thing too Captain is that it you know if if the guy that I watched on CNN
00:47:42
you know this expert quote unquote expert who said that he believed that the person was somewhere between 40 and
00:47:49
50 years old you know I said that law enforcement it appeared that they were going with that as their kind of age
00:47:55
range from what they saw and mind you they've seen more than I have I I said yesterday I felt the guy was slightly
00:48:02
older but I don't see a 77y old man I feel like I'm looking at a 45 to 55 year old guy yeah I I can see that uh so
00:48:11
another Point against Logan is like I said if you look at the Snapchat picture looking down the now I said it
00:48:19
looks like possibly there's a vehicle and two people in front of it now look I did a little more research and I
00:48:25
understand that those are not people in the picture there's actually um these posts that are set up the red post and
00:48:32
it's basically so people can't drive a ATV or any kind of vehicle onto the bridge right so that's what you're
00:48:40
seeing in front but what I see behind those post to me is a white truck okay so now let's get into this a little bit
00:48:49
because Ron Logan was not supposed to be driving correct so he gets arrested for
00:48:53
this they also do a raid and they actually do a search on his property now the interesting thing here is I believe
00:49:01
that it looks like a white truck possibly a white truck that has a utility back on it so an interesting
00:49:07
thing about Logan is he had a car when they did the search um on his property that he had a car
00:49:16
that was impounded or a truck that was impounded which is white and has a utility back on it m so I I find that
00:49:24
kind of interesting I also find interesting that he's being charged with about four years now he'll probably only
00:49:29
serve two but seems like a very high sentence for a DUI it does I I've heard from several
00:49:38
people that that this was not his first DUI um I want to go on record stating that's just what I've heard uh I've not
00:49:47
reviewed any police records for Ron Logan but I've heard that they're being extra strict about the his probation
00:49:54
violations for a couple of reasons one it wasn't his first driving offense and two we have a situation here where he
00:50:03
wasn't fully honest with with the police and with the sheriff's department now a
00:50:08
lot of people will say that you know what he was charged with that and he was being held for so long because he is
00:50:14
actually a suspect in these murders um just to be clear here he wasn't supposed to be driving he was not supposed to be
00:50:21
drinking those were that was part of his probation um what we do learn Is Not only was he potentially buying these
00:50:29
tropical fish somewhere but then we learn later that he went to the city dump now immediately that puts up some
00:50:37
red flags because people were like well he's probably getting rid of evidence right from what I've been hearing he
00:50:42
went to the city dump hours before they went missing so there was no evidence to
00:50:48
discard it that time and furthermore where I think that he's getting this uh probation violation conviction from is
00:50:56
that I have heard that there is surveillance footage of him at a restaurant and I believe it might be a
00:51:02
pizza king um if you haven't had pizza king oh delicious well and I should throw out there too I think you know one
00:51:10
of the local pizza kings I don't know if this was the one that Ron was at but one
00:51:13
of them was part of donating money towards the reward money in this investigation it's a town of 3,000 how
00:51:20
many Pizza Kings do you need well it doesn't have to be specifically from that town people donated money from all
00:51:25
over the United States the thing here is though if this rumor is true and I feel
00:51:32
my gut tells me that it is that they got surveillance footage of basically what is an old man sitting drinking beers for
00:51:40
quite some time during the course of that day there's a chance that he might not have been home anytime from about
00:51:48
10:00 a.m. until after 5:30 that evening right um which would make if you're looking for a single person and you
00:51:56
think that there's only one person involved that would mean Ron Logan has to come off of your list right uh I I
00:52:05
there's a bunch of other stuff I mean he talks about his son and people want to know it was his son involved is Ron
00:52:12
covering up for his son uh we could spend a whole hour on this Logan character mhm I think what it
00:52:21
comes down to is when they did arrest him the sheriff's come out and say hey don't don't read into this too much
00:52:29
and I and I think sometimes they're just doing that to throw people off their Trail or whatever but they're like don't
00:52:35
read into this too much uh you know he is not a suspect that's what they say right right
00:52:42
and so and we were saying well why would you say that you know because if he was a
00:52:48
suspect then who cares right mhm you just tell the public yeah we yeah well we got him on this charge but he's a
00:52:54
suspect in these murders but we think that he Poss they they're possibly saying that because when he is in jail
00:53:02
that they need to say that so the inmates don't think that this guy is a child killer is a child killer right
00:53:09
yeah and you I mean he I believe he pled guilty to those charges and that could have been a part of his plea agreement
00:53:16
with them um the thing here is though you brought up his son now we don't know anything about Ron Logan's son at all so
00:53:23
of course uh not a ECT but the thing here is I you know if you just do the quick math in your head a 77y old man
00:53:31
would is very likely he has a son that fits the age range of the bridge guy yeah and so again what's his motive I
00:53:39
mean we got a 77 year old man that has no priors as far as you know sexual assaults or rape or or anything so that
00:53:47
doesn't make a lot of sense to me this is not a first-time offender this is not somebody's you know first time murdering
00:53:53
anybody so that's kind of weird to me the other people say well the motive is that he
00:54:00
was tired of these teenagers coming onto his property again when he's given these
00:54:05
interviews he's time and time again says this is a nice Trail to walk on this is
00:54:11
nice for people people to be on again you could just be lying um I don't get um a bad vibe from him when he's talking
00:54:20
I don't have this Vibe of this guy is a horrible you know douche Cano anything but I
00:54:28
think but that that's not to say that this guy is not some mean angry drunk either MH um well let's let's explore
00:54:37
that for a second because if this were the trial of Ron Logan okay and we had to put forth character Witnesses one
00:54:46
would suspect that you could put forward the oh he lied about his whereabouts to
00:54:51
police establishing an alibi that that suggest that he has bad character he lied to the police he didn't come
00:54:58
forward and say I was at a bar and drinking that day and yes I drove my car even though I wasn't supposed to he
00:55:05
didn't come forward and say that so that puts him in bad character if we want to
00:55:08
present a character witness on the opposite end well his ex-wife uh who does not like Ron at all and to put it
00:55:18
very politely she obviously has a very low opinion of Ron but but it sounds like I'm building a case against him the
00:55:27
thing here is though she has stated time and time again I've known this man for a
00:55:31
very long time I don't feel he has anything to do with this this guy does is not capable of such a horrible act
00:55:40
yeah and on top of on top of all that stuff too if there was DNA evidence left behind I believe this was sexually
00:55:47
motivated crime if it was a sexually motivated crime we probably have DNA if they thought this is as simple of a A to
00:55:55
B answer if law enforcement thought that and not just law enforcement I understand that it's a very small town
00:56:00
but you have to remember that the FBI was involved and when the FBI gets involved and then they start putting up
00:56:07
uh Billboards all over the the States you know 48 states or something like that the the FBI is no dummies if they
00:56:15
thought that uh Logan was their guy then it it would have been uh shut already he
00:56:22
would already be uh spinning the rest of his life in jail so I don't believe that
00:56:28
that brings us to the the the other big question here or the other big Theory that's been talked about a lot is this
00:56:34
is this person even local and I'm just going to start off by saying the interview with the local man and the
00:56:40
sheriff to me is very telling of a lot of things but you have two individuals that say I I thought that we'd get a
00:56:47
bite on something that would get some good information once the picture was released and once the picture was re
00:56:54
released the man giving the interview and the sheriff both stated we we've never seen this guy before so to me
00:57:03
that's leaning to the idea that this is an out of out of town killer and for those of of you that live in very big
00:57:10
cities um it might not be able to fully grasp this this thought you know this guy the sheriff in in Carroll County um
00:57:21
you know 3,000 people however many it's a small populated area he knows or knows
00:57:28
about just about everybody you know here's the thing usually when when a crime is committed in a smaller town
00:57:35
it's it's actually easier to solve in some manners okay sometimes they don't have the technology that the big cities
00:57:42
would have that that help the big city police but what they do have is if somebody broke into a home killed
00:57:49
somebody and then left well the sheriff he knows you know what I know these four
00:57:54
or five guys guys that they're always breaking into homes I'm going to go talk to them first that's where I'm getting
00:57:59
at with this and I think the captain's hit on something here it's weird to me is the guy local or or not local it's
00:58:05
weird to me because you would think that somebody would have to have a certain amount of knowledge about the area um
00:58:13
however I think that somebody could achieve this one of two ways and not be a local person maybe they grew up there
00:58:20
and they've moved away in their adult life and returned for some reason or return for the sole purpose of
00:58:26
committing a horrible crime like this or two could this person have arrived in town several days before and scouted out
00:58:35
the area and kind of formed a a general plan of what he wanted to do yeah possibly but it would be hard for them
00:58:43
to know that there was parent teacher conferences on a Monday and that school would be left out let out halfway
00:58:50
through the day right and that brings us to the good question of was this a planned attack or was it a crime of
00:58:57
opportunity well and let's talk about something we haven't really brought this up and I'm just going to it's been
00:59:02
called the meat packing place it's been called a bunch of different things I'm just going to call it the packing place
00:59:08
not far from this location there is a packing place now the interesting thing here is that you have trucks coming in
00:59:15
and out of this so you have your core set of workers you have your truck drivers coming in and out and they do
00:59:20
hire sexual sexual offenders now the that doesn't mean a lot cuz I think you would know the people that are in the
00:59:28
area or if they worked out of town I'm sure that they were you know looked into at some point mhm uh but what is really
00:59:36
interesting is the rumor is that this place was raided by the IRS now I think that was probably a cover up and it it
00:59:44
the FBI was probably involved somehow MH um but I think they did that in order to
00:59:49
get records of other trucking companies that they worked with and again I think that's this makes sense it makes sense
00:59:58
as far as the investigation goes it makes tons of sense and a couple things then I still think this crime was uh
01:00:06
sexually motivated I think it was opportunity and I think that it was somebody from out of
01:00:12
town hence the 40 uh you know States having Billboards everywhere yeah I I'm with you on that you know having the
01:00:20
Billboards in multiple States that's not a cheap thing to do um it's great that they did it and I applaud them for that
01:00:28
uh the thing here is though for me the local or not local thing I have to factor in whether I think that this
01:00:37
is a planned attack or not um you know and we have a situation where there was a inter an interview conducted by the
01:00:45
FBI now this was an interview with a man who owned property on the south side of
01:00:50
the creek um he was asked about his guns his vehicles and whether or not they had
01:00:58
any out buildings now this could just be a matter of General questioning that they're applying to everybody or it
01:01:04
could mean that they believe that a a gun was involved in this crime a vehicle was involved and an out building was
01:01:11
involved and if that's the case to me a gun a vehicle and an out building all point to some kind of planned attack it
01:01:18
doesn't doesn't look to me as if somebody just happened to see somebody and go all right I'm going to snatch
01:01:25
them and you you mentioned the thing with the kids being out of school well there's a couple things that makes me
01:01:31
wonder about that there is a possibility that if somebody was watching the area for days it could be a planned attack
01:01:37
meaning that they were waiting and could have been waiting for days to appear to
01:01:42
to view what they saw was the perfect victim or we have a situation that makes you wonder if if Monday was a school day
01:01:51
then it was a work day these were regular working hour hours who would have the means of not being accounted
01:01:58
for for a certain period of time on that Monday and there's also some rumor and and speculation that this is linked to a
01:02:06
Iowa case yeah and I'll read this very short article from wh tv.com uh in Iowa authorities may have a
01:02:14
new lead in an Iowa Cold Case this is because of the double murder investigation in Indiana 10-year-old
01:02:21
Elizabeth Collins and 8-year-old LC cook were kidnapped in July of 2012 their cousins uh their bodies were located
01:02:31
about six months later in a wooded area about 25 miles from where they were taken now the thing here is the girls
01:02:39
were rided they were last spotted riding their bikes near Meyers Lake in Evansdale okay um no one has been
01:02:45
charged in connection with their murders um their disappearance has some similarities to this recent uh
01:02:52
kidnapping and murders of the two girls in Indiana well we don't know if it's a kidnapping the Iowa well technically it
01:02:59
is technically it is uh the Iowa division of criminal investigation has been in contact with their counterparts
01:03:06
in Indiana about the case uh so far now this is this is an article that came out
01:03:12
shortly after the Indiana investigation so when I say so far this is from a month or so ago they're stating so far
01:03:19
they've shared notes about the two murder cases but haven't determined if there is a connection
01:03:25
um it's interesting though uh because you know abducting two people a double murder of of children is not very common
01:03:34
um and we see this where in both cases on top of that I believe both in both cases the girls disappeared on the 13th
01:03:43
of a month of the month now you know us armchair detectives we like to look at little minute details like that and say
01:03:50
that there's some reasoning for that and and most law enforcement in investigators will tell you usually
01:03:56
people don't think of things like that when they're committing these crimes um but it is strange that they both
01:04:03
disappeared on on the 13th of a month neither case do we have anybody charged or or any major suspects in either and
01:04:12
there you know this case is like we said from the beginning so hard to cover because the lack of the information out
01:04:18
there which on one side I applaud the police one side uh and I applaud the community we're not just talking about
01:04:26
law enforcement that you know found the bodies so there's probably going to be more leaks that come out you know in the
01:04:32
future with this but I I I would I want to make a little bit of a plea to the police to understand that there are a
01:04:41
lot of um smart Minds out there that might not be involved directly with law enforcement and I do feel like if there
01:04:50
was some bits of evidence that you know could be released without damaging your case that you might get a
01:05:00
lot of more help from the public yeah and the thing here is Captain to me I really think it's interesting the way
01:05:07
that they went about this investigation in the early stages I think it was very smart of them to release the picture of
01:05:14
the man and not state that he's a suspect um because as you and I were talking about earlier you know this guy
01:05:22
they could release this picture of this guy and he not maybe not know where the picture came from maybe he didn't know
01:05:28
that the picture was taken from Libby's phone or the audio taken at this point the audio was not released and maybe he
01:05:34
thinks well if we can get this guy to think well somebody else saw you there on that trail somebody else saw you on
01:05:41
that bridge near the time that the girls disappeared well that might that might coers him into coming forward and trying
01:05:47
to just clear his name and then boom you know who your guy is so I applaud them for sitting on that for for some time I
01:05:54
think that was very smart I also appreciate that they've come out and named him as a suspect and released the
01:06:00
Audio I think that there's a tip out there that they still need that they've not received yet I don't know that they
01:06:06
need to be telling us more than what they have and and and and my biggest fear is the reason why they're keeping
01:06:13
so much quiet is that there might not be DNA right um because they'll need certain things in the confession to to
01:06:21
help with this conviction um but the the other thing here is well and and as far
01:06:27
as confessions go is true because we've see it time and time again if you release too much information to the
01:06:34
public then you get you get some nut jobs coming in going I I did it yeah and it's like uh the only information you're
01:06:41
giving us is the information that we gave the public what I would like to see and if anybody has come across this or
01:06:49
could find it please email it to us or put it actually more important put it on our blog on on truecrime garage.com so
01:06:57
everybody can see it because I noticed that during the course of this investigation it said that the Indiana
01:07:03
State Police was working with the FBI to put together a profile of the killer right but I've not been able to find
01:07:10
that actual profile now sometimes they release these things and sometimes they do not when I go searching for it all I
01:07:16
find is articles talking about how they're going to be working on this profile the thing here is I think this
01:07:22
profile could be to this case I think that it could help solve this case and I tell you why I think that this horrible
01:07:30
person that that did this horrible act piece of [ __ ] he he's somebody's father
01:07:36
he's somebody's husband he's somebody's Uncle you know somebody is related to this guy somebody knows this guy
01:07:43
somebody suspects him the problem is the problem is sometimes when somebody that
01:07:49
you love is a is a real life monster you don't want to believe believe it and maybe you don't ever see that side of
01:07:56
that person and the thing here is maybe you have your suspicions but you're thinking to yourself you know what it
01:08:03
can't be him because the experts say that the person is 40 to 50 years old well this guy's that I know in love is
01:08:10
51 years old so it can't be him I'm not going to report him it looks like him it
01:08:14
sounds like him he had some weird scratch marks on his body but it can't be him because they're off on the age or
01:08:21
he doesn't own clothing that looks like that so it can't be him right no no we I
01:08:27
would like to see this profile because I think that if we have some officials telling us you know what here's a box
01:08:34
you you should think outside of the box on occasion but here's kind of a box of some parameters that we think might
01:08:41
Encompass who we think this killer is it might get the right person to pick up that phone or to email the proper tip to
01:08:49
the authorities right so you you got kind of two the you know um roads of thought one they're really
01:08:57
close so they don't want to give away information or one they're super far away mhm and that's what's scary because
01:09:05
these uh these girls deserve a lot they deserve they didn't deserve this and they they deserve uh
01:09:15
answers and their family deserves that as well I would just like to again think think about this Amy M Vic right mhm
01:09:26
they released new evidence that they found at the crime scene how many years later 20 years later yeah close to 20
01:09:35
years later you know and and for people that don't know the story the girl goes missing then she's found and um in that
01:09:42
area that she's found there was these curtains and maybe she was wrapped up in the curtains and maybe she wasn't but
01:09:48
they're customade MH now if you would have released that information 20 years ago you might have had a chance MH but
01:09:55
the person that made those could be passed away could not live in the area anymore so if this thing gets cold
01:10:05
you're going to have to release some stuff in my opinion mhm to get the community behind it and I'm glad that
01:10:14
we're covering this case even though it was very difficult as far as finding that a bunch
01:10:21
of information cuz we'd rather give you information than speculation yeah there I want to go
01:10:27
through one more rumor here because while we're talking about potential suspects and who we could be looking for
01:10:34
um it's been rumored that and I won't go into all the reasons why but one specific reason that I think needs to be
01:10:41
addressed it's been rumored that Libby fought very very hard that that she fought back and and may have put up a
01:10:53
hell of of a fight against this guy to the point where I've heard a rumor that her nails were shredded her fingernails
01:11:00
were shredded if that's the case that means she inflicted some serious damage on this guy and I hope that she did I
01:11:08
hope that those scratch marks were many and they were deep and they were very painful thing is somebody could have
01:11:14
seen those on this person for days afterwards and have suspicions you know we talk about things like a guy wearing
01:11:23
blue jeans or a jacket or a hoodie or maybe a camouflage hunting cap those things those are just clothing that that
01:11:32
he may have been wearing to disguise himself but I want to throw this out there too if this is somebody that you
01:11:38
know you don't really know this person if this person was in fact carrying a deer kit with him like we we said we
01:11:45
suspect maybe yesterday if he was carrying a deer kit with him I mean you cannot put into words how
01:11:53
to despicable and evil this person is you don't really know them now there's some things that the FBI wants to remind
01:11:59
us about wait what does the deer kit have to do with being evil you don't have to use your imagination too long to
01:12:05
think about what could have been in that deer kit and what could it could have been used for okay uh the the first the
01:12:12
thing here I want to talk about is what the FBI is trying to remind us about about this person you know we no longer
01:12:20
does it just have to be somebody that looks like the person in the picture sounds like the guy in the picture
01:12:25
because he could have been trying to disguise himself sounds like the guy in the clip yeah so the thing here is
01:12:30
they're reminding us you know do you know anybody that has changed their appearance since the 13th you know maybe
01:12:38
drastically you know February 13th yeah yeah the haircut shaved changed the way that they're dressing do you know
01:12:44
somebody that has started abusing drugs or alcohol since that date somebody that
01:12:49
has become anxious or irritable uh that that may not have possessed those type of emotions or or characteristics before
01:12:57
someone that canel an appointment or a social engagement on February 13th for unexplained reasons or 14th yeah
01:13:05
somebody that has obsessed over the case or constantly talks about where they were on February 13th um those are some
01:13:13
things that they're reminding us to think about when we look at that picture to think about when we hear that audio
01:13:19
clip and think about before you make that phone call or place that email male yeah and also think about the fact that
01:13:27
this is a 13 and 14y old girl you know 13 and think about the fact that it was a 13 and 14y
01:13:36
old think about the fact that it's a 13 and 14y old girl and how much they had to give to
01:13:44
this world that was taken away and uh this person that you might be suspicious of is a horrible monster m and you could
01:13:54
you could do you could um write a wrong in this world yeah and the other thing that I want to make sure that we mention
01:14:02
before we close up here today is that Libby and Abby I think in my opinion very brave and heroic young girls to be
01:14:13
in a situation as terrifying as as this and have The Bravery to record something
01:14:19
on your phone to to to potentially put yourself into further danger to try to collect evidence against this this evil
01:14:27
monster the thing here is we don't know if this guy has killed before we don't know if he will kill again if he's
01:14:33
capable of what took place on February 13th this it's unimaginable what this monster is
01:14:41
capable of and so I just think that you know we should take a moment to recognize The Bravery of those two young
01:14:47
girls and and I think they're heroes in my mind and should be in the in the community as well
01:14:54
there as a reminder the tip line is is still going on that phone number is 844455
01:15:02
5786 you can also email tips to Abby and Libby tip at CAC sh rf. again that phone number and the
01:15:14
email will be in the show notes um so if you have any information please submit your tips today so recommended reading
01:15:24
this week we're recommending California's lansom murder mystery by Tom zanello now this is a book that
01:15:30
takes place on Memorial Day 1933 when David lansom finds his wife dead in their Palo Alto home well he becomes the
01:15:39
only suspect and this is one of California's most Sensational trials after the judge sentenced David to hang
01:15:46
and San Quinton a group of Stanford colleagues formed the lansom defense committee and they they were able to get
01:15:54
several more retrials so check out this book so you can figure out did lansom truly kill his wife or was an innocent
01:16:02
man put on trial for murder check out California's lansom murder mystery and you can do that by going to True Crim
01:16:09
garage.com and click on the recommended page for everything true crime garage whether it be the new pint glasses or
01:16:15
the shirts go to True Crim garage.com thanks for joining us in the garage this week thanks for subscribing and telling
01:16:21
a friend and we and we'll have a big exciting announcement a little bonus thing for you uh hopefully by the end of
01:16:28
the week all right and until next week be good be kind and don't [Music] litter the Angie's List you know and trust is
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