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GameChanger [Music] welcome to True Crime garage wherever you are whatever you are doing thanks
00:01:42
for listening I'm your host Nick and with me as always is a guy that car pulls to work with Sasquatch he is the
00:01:49
captain well if you're not running with Sasquatch you are running from Sasquatch
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my friend it's good to be seen and it's good to see you thanks for listening thanks for telling a friend
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[Music] tonight we are drinking Laura Li barraged extra Maple by the brilliant Folks at omnio brewing and beautiful
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Stockholm Sweden garage grade 4 and a half bottle caps out of five this is an imperial Porter and just like Trent
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resner said it is as black as your soul but very very delicious Taste of coffee hazelnuts and of course maple syrup and
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this bad boy was brought To Us by these good folks first up we have Christy in Massachusetts and a big shout out to
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list or subscribe to us on YouTube and that's enough of the business all right everybody gather around grab a chair
00:03:14
grab a beer let's talk some true crime [Music] this is true crime garage and the
00:03:58
following is by far not your your typical missing person's case for in this story you will hear about a missing
00:04:05
man a missing woman and a missing submarine you will hear about the intense and heartbreaking search for all
00:04:15
three then the explanations and multiple versions of tragic accidents you will hear the destruction
00:04:23
of Dreams the tragic loss of life and relationships you will hear the gruesome discoveries The Morbid details as we
00:04:33
dive into the deep Waters and into madness this is the case that has been called the most spectacular case in
00:04:43
Danish [Music] history Kim wall was born in 1987 she grew up in the Clos Nick community in a
00:04:57
small town in trell Borg this is in southern Sweden just across the street dividing Sweden from Denmark now even
00:05:05
when Kim was young she was very ambitious and driven she studied international relations and from there
00:05:12
she went on to earn two master's degrees one from Colombia's internationally renowned School of Journalism Kim took
00:05:21
to journalism immediately she loved stories she specialized in stories about the fringes of society about identity
00:05:29
gender and societal subcultures her stories often conveyed a sense of social justice for these Fringe
00:05:37
groups and she won awards for her articles her work was published across the world in esteemed Publications such
00:05:44
as the New York Times Time Magazine and the guardian just to mention a few last year in
00:05:51
2017 Kim is 30 years old she is a successful freelance reporter that spent years traveling the world in pursuit of
00:06:00
the next great story she went all over the globe to places like Uganda Cuba Kenya New York City and North Korea in
00:06:10
August of 2017 Kim was staying in Copenhagen with her partner Danish designer Ali stobby
00:06:18
when she began investigating a group of do-it-yourself inventors who were responsible for Cutting Edge privately
00:06:25
financed rocket and submarine construction projects Kim and olly had been walking around
00:06:32
their neighborhood one afternoon past the decrepit buildings of an old Shipyard when they came across the
00:06:39
rocket building workshops this got Kim's interest she reached out to various Publications and had email exchanges
00:06:47
with editors at Wired Magazine working toward a freelance assignment to write about the rocket Builders she knew of
00:06:56
one of them who was considered a bit of a local celebrity he spearheaded the rocket and sub building projects this is
00:07:03
Peter Madson also known as Denmark's rocket Madson now there was a clear and obvious direct competition between two
00:07:13
of the Rival space rocket building companies this is what attracted Kim wall she knew there was a story here and
00:07:20
a good one Kim and her boyfriend olly were planning on moving to Beijing the departure date Captain was August 16th
00:07:28
and this was approaching but Kim wanted to finish her article on the Copenhagen subor orbitals that's tough to say and
00:07:35
we're going to have to say it about 30 times today before she left permanently for China on August 10th a Thursday Kim
00:07:43
and Ali were preparing a goodbye party with friends in the late afternoon just as they were setting up for a barbecue
00:07:50
Outdoors along the water Kim got a text from Peter Madson in response to her inquiries about a possible interview mhm
00:07:59
the two had never met he invited her for tea at his Workshop The Hanger where he
00:08:06
worked was not far from her place so she figured she had enough time to go and still be back in time for this party now
00:08:14
after a quick half-hour meeting with Peter Madson for tea Kim returned home to let her boyfriend know that Peter had
00:08:22
offered to take her out on his submarine she said that over te Peter had been quote all over the place and that she
00:08:30
was nervous to go on the submarine with him but it was a big opportunity so after discussing this Kim decided to
00:08:38
foro her own goodbye party for the opportunity to ride on the famous sub and get an exclusive with Peter Madson
00:08:47
yeah and you never let your girlfriend go on any other man's sub or boat well she asked Olie to join her but
00:08:55
apparently at this time when this discussion is happening their friends have already been invited over they've
00:09:02
already set everything up and it's my understanding that friends had already started to arrive by this point so Ali
00:09:09
says hey look we got all these people coming over if we both go uh we're really doing a diservice to our friends
00:09:16
here well it shows you how passionate about her craft Kim was she's going to drop everything cut everybody out of her
00:09:24
life in this one moment so she can go get her story right missing a uh potentially missing most of or all of a
00:09:33
goodbye party for her right when she's planning to move very far away just 6 days later so I want to discuss this
00:09:42
submarine real quick because it's a bit of a big deal for many reasons because this is what made Peter Madson become a
00:09:50
minor celebrity let's say the May 2008 launch of this submarine made him a minor celebrity this was manufactured by
00:10:00
the suborbital company which was founded by him and another guy now the submarine
00:10:08
that they made they named it the uc3 Nautilus awful name this is or at least at the time hold on if you're going to
00:10:17
name a submarine what's it going to be oh I have never thought about naming a submarine 1 two 3 go believ
00:10:28
land you can't have the word land in any water that's what makes that's what makes it so good yeah good job I don't
00:10:36
know I have no idea that's why I don't name submarines so but the thing here Captain the
00:10:42
Nautilus at at one time or maybe still to this day it was the world's biggest privately built submarine right the
00:10:51
uc3 is a 58 ft sub weighing 40 tons built from donated iron and and other parts it's diesel SL electric and the
00:11:03
interior featured a galley bathroom bunks mess area bridge and engine room do we know the square footage of this I
00:11:13
don't I do not but it's I mean 58 foot is a decent size sub from my understanding but regardless you know
00:11:20
we've all seen The Hunt for Red October and Under Siege and well I don't think that took place in a sub maybe at some
00:11:27
point it did but regardless we know that this is a confined space MH okay and even though that it's 58 ft we discuss
00:11:36
the rooms that were there you know the the galley which you would expect which is basically a kitchen uh you have the
00:11:42
bathroom bunks note that they State bunks instead of bedroom so that should give you an idea that it's a small
00:11:49
confined space right now Kim set off to meet Peter at the submarine she was wearing an orange fleece a skirt and a
00:11:58
pair of white sneakers apparently these sneakers were special to her in a way like these were something that she
00:12:04
always wore when she went out on these different reporting Journeys like her lucky sneakers maybe lucky sneakers part
00:12:12
of the uniform kind of deal you know people have that thing going on um around 700 p.m. she texts the boyfriend
00:12:19
some photos and this was of the submarine she also texts photos of the windmills in the water and herself at
00:12:28
the steering wheel these photos of Kim and and Peter were in some of these photos as well and I
00:12:35
guess they can be found online I've only been able to find uh one or two of them
00:12:40
not all that I have listed here but yeah I've seen a few an article that I found
00:12:44
stated that you could find these pretty easily now Kim continued to text Olly periodically uh with her last text
00:12:51
reading I'm still alive by the way but going down now I love you he brought C CFE meaning he is Peter Madson brought
00:13:01
coffee and cookies though a while later olly was at the bar barbecue with all the friends and one of the friends comes
00:13:09
up to him and says hey Ali look and points out off into the water where he could see the submarine setting off to
00:13:17
Sea and Kim is waving toward him from the hatch the goodbye party went late and continued later on at a nearby bar
00:13:28
and since Kim had promised to be gone for only a couple of hours olly did begin to get apprehensive about the fact
00:13:35
that he had not heard from her since the time of seeing her wave to him in the distance M the two were supposed to
00:13:42
leave for a wedding very early the next morning and it was unlike Kim to not stay in
00:13:50
touch his thoughts and this is where my head would go to is perhaps there's no cell service I mean you're in a
00:13:56
submarine you know at the at the bottom of the of the sea right right um well we
00:14:03
have you know we don't know what their relationship was as far as like texting goes but as far as this day she text
00:14:10
them several pictures several messages and this is pretty much in a short period of time from when she leaves the
00:14:19
the party to get on the submarine so you'd think that right when they come to service right when she gets service to
00:14:26
her cell phone that she's going to be texting him something well and we have to keep in mind here too that they lived
00:14:32
fairly close to the launch area for this submarine you know one uh she discovered
00:14:39
this place when they were just out on a walk in the in the area near their apartment or whatever they lived in and
00:14:45
and from their party from their I'm guessing their backyard area or where they were hosting this barbecue he could
00:14:52
see her from the launch waving to him so and then we also have the situation of Peter has that quick meeting with her
00:15:00
and rather than her just texting or calling Ali to say hey turns out this meeting's going longer and I'm going on
00:15:07
the submarine no it seems to me she's the type of personality and they must be close enough that she goes wait Peter I
00:15:14
have to go home and talk to my boyfriend let him know what's going on where I'm going and such she went a bit out of her
00:15:21
way to make sure that there was a good understanding between the two of them well and remember they have a wedding
00:15:26
they have to leave for early in the morning and I don't know what time they have to leave but You' assume that she
00:15:31
needs to get home so she can get ready I don't know if she packed most people packed the night before mhm so you'd
00:15:37
think that would be something else on her plate that she had to do yeah and she took off like I said around like 700
00:15:44
p.m. so uh or I'm sorry she text him photos at 7 p.m. saying we're getting ready to go under and she was only
00:15:52
supposed to be gone for a couple of hours or at least so she told him by 1:40 a.m.
00:15:59
he the boyfriend olly gets he's starting to get extremely worried now not having
00:16:05
heard from her well and also I mean let's face it as a boyfriend you you can also suspect that you know not suspect
00:16:13
but you might get worried that hey is there some kind of infidelity or something going on this guy owns a
00:16:20
submarine well he decides to call the police uh and he reports Kim missing then a half an hour later he calls the
00:16:29
Navy mhm now no one could find Kim obviously there was no sign of the submarine either in fact separately from
00:16:37
oi one of Peter's co-workers found it very strange and very concerning that the sub had not returned yet so this
00:16:47
coworker alerted authorities that the uc3 Nautilus and Peter mson were missing well and I applaud Ali cuz not only does
00:16:56
he call the police he calls the na mayy say hey what's going on here well and and you know what's um this is kind of a
00:17:04
little out of bounds but when we were discussing this case last week the first thing that obviously jumps off the page
00:17:11
we've never discussed a missing submarine before we've talked about missing individuals missing adults
00:17:16
children uh vehicles of all types uh this the first thing being the submarine I who would even know where to begin
00:17:25
thank God you got the Navy you can call well you you start by Looking In The Water Well a search for the submarine
00:17:34
started and the two missing individuals as well this began around 4:00 a.m. that
00:17:39
morning now they used helicopters and ships to begin the search uh searching Waters around Copenhagen and a call went
00:17:48
out for volunteer vessels to join the search at some point late on that Thursday night into Friday morning the n
00:17:59
was apparently sailing in the orand strait M between Sweden and Denmark and this is from my understanding a very
00:18:08
busy thoroughfare for ships the sub nearly collided with a freight ship a witness on the freighter told police
00:18:16
that the submarine had been sailing with no lights on which is one very strange and obviously very very dangerous in the
00:18:25
busy nighttime Waters the freight ship avoid Ed crashing into the sub only because the Moonlight hit the submarine
00:18:33
in a way that alerted the captain of the freighter to its proximity and he was somehow able to avoid a collision with
00:18:41
the submarine you think they these vessels would also have some kind of sonar uh well yeah I would think some of
00:18:49
them would uh this report this was reported I'm sorry near the island of suam this would be of great concern for
00:19:00
Searchers it because it makes you wonder several things right one is the submarine operating correctly is it uh
00:19:09
is it running properly right it also makes you wonder if anyone if who or if anyone is actually
00:19:18
operating the craft yeah now they would continue to search for the entirety of the night then at 10:30 a.m. on Friday
00:19:29
August 11th the Nautilus was spotted near a lighthouse in Co Bay mhm near a deserted stretch of Shoreline which is
00:19:39
about 30 Mi Southwest of ref chilon thankfully they were finally able to make radio contact with the sub Peter
00:19:49
reported to the lighthouse that he was heading back to Copenhagen but the sub was having some technical problems
00:19:57
according to a local news report at 11:00 a.m. we have a gentleman named Christian isbo M uh he's a local boat
00:20:06
owner helping with the search he saw Peter Madson swimming toward a nearby fishing boat now Peter was alive and
00:20:14
well he was pulled aboard the fishing boat when this boat docked at the nearest Port reporters were waiting to
00:20:22
get the story of the missing submarine a reporter called out to Peter asking if everything was okay Peter turned around
00:20:30
and gave the reporter a thumbs up he said he was fine but he was sad because the Nautilus sank there had been a
00:20:38
defect on the ballast tank he said still there was no sign of Kim wall and Peter
00:20:45
Manson made no mention of her to his Rescuers this show is sponsored by better help do you look forward to the
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that [Music] all right cheers mate cheers Captain so later on Friday the police put out a
00:23:12
statement saying that Peter Matson told them in a lengthy interview that he had dropped Kim off near the halend de
00:23:20
restaurant on the tip of rechelon Island at around 10:30 p.m. on Thursday night so this would be just the night before
00:23:29
the submarine sank police were not able to find anyone who had seen Kim after this time after he stated that he had
00:23:38
dropped her off the boyfriend hadn't seen her nobody in the area had seen her she had not spoke to anybody or reached
00:23:44
out to anybody she didn't text her boyfriend so Kim is now officially a missing person then the police spoke
00:23:52
with a man who said that he saw Peter just minutes before Peter was rescued he said said that he saw Peter and the
00:23:59
submarine before it sank saying he saw Peter Go Down the Hatch of the submarine and then reemerged as the sub began to
00:24:08
sink the sub disappeared into the waters within a matter of seconds and this man
00:24:14
described Peter Madson as completely calm the entire time and said that Peter stayed in the tower of the Nautilus
00:24:23
until Water started pouring into the tower and then Peter swam away to safety saving himself mhm and you think that he
00:24:32
would close it so the water wouldn't get into the submarine yeah there well there's all kinds of problems with this
00:24:38
one I don't I'm not going to sit here and pretend to have a full understanding of how typically submarines sink I will
00:24:45
and what is the evacuation process for such um but just here here's one thing the obvious thing is the guy stating
00:24:55
that the man seemed to be calm I don't think that this is a calm situation you know most people wouldn't behave that
00:25:02
way as the submarine sank one and two this is his baby he he built he was one of the people that built this
00:25:11
submarine well that's where I'd argue that maybe he would be calm cuz he knew what the malfunction was and knew maybe
00:25:19
there was nothing he could do about it so therefore he remained calm I got you that's you know that's what what I took
00:25:26
it as one of those things is I I know what the problem is I was here to witness this baby go down and I know how
00:25:32
to fix it it's just a matter of time I just need the right stuff and also there's nothing that I can do about it
00:25:37
so I just got to let it sink and we're also talking about a company that built this thing so they have the money to
00:25:46
then when it sinks we'll go get it we'll fix it mhm no big deal well police quickly reviewed CCTV footage of the
00:25:55
area where he said said that he had dropped Kim off mhm and this was provided to them by a restaurant owner
00:26:03
by the owner of the the restaurant that we mentioned uh when looking for Kim well because we know that's a bad thing
00:26:09
and you're going to get publicity saying that a you know a very attractive lady got dropped off here and went missing
00:26:17
from this restaurant or or nearby yeah you're like okay that's a great way to encourage people to come to the area
00:26:24
right so they get involved they give them the footage here's the strange thing though police do not see any sign
00:26:31
of Kim on any of that that Clos caption footage and or close circuit TV footage I'm sorry the other thing though is look
00:26:42
they had several cameras there this wasn't like they had one little Rinky Dink camera and they didn't see Kim
00:26:48
right they had plenty of cameras at different angles picking up large portions of that area they don't see Kim
00:26:56
more what I find even more damning here is they don't see the sub you know they don't see the submarine at any time
00:27:04
docking letting anybody off anything like that you know Kim maybe another woman could easily be mistaken for Kim
00:27:11
or or not for Kim or so on and so forth but a sub is a sub right right so we have a weird situation where
00:27:19
this this inventor this engineer builds a sub invites this lady onto the sub to interview him mhm the sub sinks so now
00:27:31
that's strange and then this other strange thing of him saying that he dropped her off but we have no sign of
00:27:37
her and we have no sign of the sub correct so at this point you know law enforcement is going something's not
00:27:43
right here well something's not right that and you know what's interesting to me though is you know she's she doesn't
00:27:50
become missing until they locate him right everybody knows several people knew that that she was last with him
00:27:58
right so once once he's located and the sub is witnessed to have sunk to the you
00:28:04
know to the bottom and he's he doesn't tell them until this interview so what's weird here is where we know something
00:28:12
strange and suspicious has probably happened but at the same time we mentioned that he didn't mention
00:28:19
anything about Kim wall to The Rescuers or to the reporters that were in the area well if he dropped her off the
00:28:25
night before why would he mention anything he dropped boom he where in a sinking ship you know
00:28:34
sinking right so in that aspect you start almost wanting to believe his story yeah you wonder well what could
00:28:42
have happened in that area and why didn't why is there no footage of it I'm thinking here captain that the police
00:28:49
likely doubted Peter's story from the get-go mhm because authorities stated publicly at some point and this is
00:28:57
pretty early on in the investigation that they actually believe that they were looking for a body you know while
00:29:04
they're still continuing to look for Kim and hope and pray that she's alive they
00:29:09
publicly state that they think they might be looking for her body at this point and I wonder Peter being local if
00:29:16
he just came off as a odd character anyways and that would make them lean towards that well actually there was
00:29:25
some evidence that are going to Point them in this direction and it's around the same time you know when they make
00:29:31
this public statement that they might be looking for a body this was a 5:30 p.m.
00:29:36
on that Friday August 11th just hours after he had been rescued from the waters police arrested Peter and placed
00:29:44
him in what's called a quote preliminary detention which is the equivalent of preliminary criminal charges pending uh
00:29:52
on suspicion of involuntary manslaughter for and this is their exact wording for
00:29:59
having killed in an unknown way in an unknown Place Kim Isabel Freda wall of Sweden sometime after 5:00 p.m.
00:30:10
Thursday okay so pardon my stupidity but how are they jumping from rescuing him to this well um one there was one more
00:30:20
charge and and we'll get into this evidence here which is pretty uh it's it's interesting it's sad but it's
00:30:26
interesting um he was also charged with indecent handling of a corpse now we don't know
00:30:33
what went down during his lengthy interview you know we do know that he told them that he dropped her off but
00:30:42
the indictment revealed that Kim's DNA had been found on Peter's hands neck and nostrils now we should talk about this
00:30:53
for a minute because I don't think this is something that's pretty this isn't clear to everyone so when somebody kills
00:31:00
somebody and it's it's in a manner that it's up close and personal obviously you're going to get blood and evidence
00:31:08
of that victim on yourself okay or on the perpetrator will and so a lot of times what will happen is the
00:31:17
offender even if they're very good at cleaning up the evidence and cleaning off the evidence of themselves a really
00:31:24
great spot and place for investigators to use a DNA swab is in the nostrils because that's a place that they don't
00:31:33
you don't see in the mirror naturally and it's a place that they forget to clean right and they also swab the ears
00:31:41
sometimes because In the Heat of the Moment when we have blood spatter especially if it's up close and personal
00:31:47
and you're if you're at a excited heightened State you might be breathing heavily in and out inhale exhale and
00:31:55
some of that blood spatter will will end up in the nostrils yeah and have you seen Peter have I have I seen him yeah
00:32:03
yeah I've seen pictures of yeah so one he might have the world's largest dick nose and then two he probably shouldn't
00:32:09
have been working on submarines he could have probably been flying around with those giant ears he has well one thing
00:32:16
that was weird about this there's a well-known photo of Peter and this is when he's speaking to an officer
00:32:23
immediately upon docking uh with the fishing boat that rescued him and in this photo you can you can find this
00:32:30
online and you can zoom in and you can see what appears to be either a cut or a drop of blood on his nose and you can
00:32:39
also see that he has uh a dark substance underneath his fingernails when he was examined at the hospital they did find
00:32:49
scratches uh that were visible on his arms he attributed these to injuries that came from being on the submarine as
00:32:58
it was sinking the authorities were able to raise the Nautilus from the depths turns out it was only 22 ft down they
00:33:07
emptied it of water and they searched the sub they did not find Kim they determined that the submarine had been
00:33:13
deliberately sank and the local media began to speculate that Peter attempted to cover up a bigger crime right this
00:33:23
speculation increased when the chief homicide investigator for the cop Copenhagen police said that coagulated
00:33:30
blood was found inside the Nautilus and later was determined to belong to that of Kim wall the DNA that they found on
00:33:38
him during the investigation or during the interrogation how did they do this DNA
00:33:44
test so quickly uh that I don't know I but it was done relatively fast well okay so let's talk about that because
00:33:53
you know when you have let's say somebody breaks into your home and they they find blood at the scene like maybe
00:33:58
they broke their their they cut themselves on some glass breaking into your house and when they take from my
00:34:06
experience having worked in security usually there's been times where we have submitted and said hey look we believe
00:34:12
this is the DNA or evidence of the person that committed this crime they'll take it they'll add it to the report
00:34:19
they'll add it to the file with the caveat of telling you that you do know that we if we do check this at all it
00:34:26
could years it's because it's a Breakin it's a it's a it's a lower level crime nobody was harmed in the committing of
00:34:34
that crime or killed yeah and we saw this here specifically in Columbus when that that real piece of [ __ ] [ __ ]
00:34:42
abducted that woman outside of her work for no reason other than to rape and kill her right and we saw how quickly
00:34:53
they were able to provide the DNA results to that t test right they were on to him pretty quick they found plenty
00:35:00
of evidence of him at the scene where they found her body and eventually you know we heard what was it a day or 48
00:35:07
Hours it was it was very quick very quick so I think that we're seeing a similar situation here plus you know
00:35:16
these different areas operate differently we're also talking about an area that has an incredibly incredibly
00:35:23
low murder rate like to the point that it's so low that it's it's hard to even compare it to anything here mhm okay so
00:35:30
um they may not have as many things waiting in line to be checked or to be tested right but but it's either way
00:35:38
it's impressive it it is impressive I agree with that so now we're left with the big question of what happened to Kim
00:35:46
wall we know that she was due to go on this submarine she sent pictures of herself on there she's waving goodbye to
00:35:54
her boyfriend as they take off off mhm this guy that's that's the Manning the boat I'm going to keep keep referring to
00:36:03
it as a boat but this guy called a submarine the guy that's Peter Madson says he drops her off obviously he
00:36:09
didn't drop her off they find evidence to to the fact that she was either injured or killed in that submarine yeah
00:36:16
and evidence that maybe she fought back yes and even now that theyve found and located the sub we still don't have Kim
00:36:25
wall now her parents of course were extremely devastated by their daughter's missing person status and they issued a
00:36:34
statement that read quote it is with great concern that we her family received the news that Kim is missing
00:36:41
after an interview with Peter Madson in Denmark we sincerely hope that she will be found and that she is well now the
00:36:50
very strange thing here though to Captain is that we talked about Kim's resume as a journalist as somebody that
00:36:59
traveled all over the place I mean she went to some very dangerous she took on very dangerous assignments in foreign
00:37:06
places over the years and it it's so hard to believe and I can't imagine that anyone thought that she could be a
00:37:15
victim in her own land after having gone to all these dangerous corners of the world in her own land where it's
00:37:24
considered to be one of the safest right in the world well it's just like I said before her
00:37:28
passion for her job and her craft it's it's pretty inspiring well the next day so this is August 12th now this is in a
00:37:36
courtroom appearance in the involuntary manslaughter charge Peter told the court
00:37:43
that Kim had act accidentally died on board in a quote terrible accident he said that a
00:37:51
150b hatch had fallen and hit her on the head she she then fell to the bottom of
00:37:58
the Tower with a fatal head injury Peter Madson said that he panicked at that point and he used a rope to drag Kim's
00:38:07
body up and out of the submarine to which then he said he buried it at Sea okay okay so so one bury it buried it at
00:38:17
Sea does that mean he just put it in the water sounds to me like it's a tossed tossed her overboard situation and I I I
00:38:27
never understand these people that say it's an accident and I freaked out so I buried the body out or tossed it out
00:38:34
into the ocean right if if I'm in my submarine cuz I only have like three or four of them but when I'm in when I'm in
00:38:43
the big one if there was an accident and I freaked out you know what that freak out is going to consist of me
00:38:51
not going around the body me calling the cops right me calling an ambulance that's me freaking out right
00:39:02
me what what's not freaking out is when you can grab the body you can touch the body you can move the body that's not
00:39:10
freaking out mhm that's you being a piece of [ __ ] well and I think that's right though I mean that's that would be
00:39:18
the expected natural behavior and reaction to a horrible accident you would you would go to the person see if
00:39:26
you can Aid them and help them in any way and once that's determined that it's too late for that right it's get them
00:39:32
some real help get them to another place you know get them in a better space well
00:39:37
I'm calling the I'm calling 911 right away anyways because what am I going to help them with well the thing here is
00:39:45
and we've seen this in several other cases okay this is in Peter's defense at least a more believable story given the
00:39:55
information and the evidence that they now have right but you can't believe him at this point because we do have
00:40:01
evidence that he sank his own submarine we have evidence that he lied about where he dropped her off so to then all
00:40:10
of a sudden believe this story which doesn't Point much guilt towards him you go wait a second and it's for all those
00:40:18
reasons that the authorities didn't have any you know they very obviously weren't
00:40:23
buying what he was selling trying to sell them you he was they were not going to release this guy which only makes
00:40:29
sense like you said by his own statements we know that he's lied at least once and now he's admitting some
00:40:37
form of guilt of getting rid of this corpse right and we have evidence of her fighting you we have evidence of her DNA
00:40:45
being in your nostrils it doesn't happen if she just dies from an accident well as we said Captain the police pretty
00:40:52
much arrested Peter Manson right away as they believed that he harmed or killed Kim very early on well they searched his
00:41:03
computers shortly after they arrest him they even recreated his uh profile the profile of his mobile phone somehow now
00:41:12
neither his phone nor Kim's phone would ever be found so presumably it's pretty easy to to use a little bit of
00:41:22
imagination here and figure out that likely Peter tossed both of them into the water right right but you you'd
00:41:30
think they'd be able to retrieve the records or even maybe the text messages they did not anticipate what they were
00:41:36
going to find on his computers okay now some people have pornographic material on their computers well what they found
00:41:45
on his computer was not just regular porn right uh police discovered more than 40 videos on Peter's laptop that
00:41:53
appeared to show women being strangled hanged decapitated skinned sexually impaled and tortured some of these
00:42:01
videos were animations but one in particular of a woman being beheaded was deemed by authorities to be real or at
00:42:11
least they believed it to be real other hard drives owned by wait so so we have videos of women being tied up and and
00:42:22
choked and and that's you know that's one level but then we have where they think this video this
00:42:31
decapitation video they actually think it's real mhm yeah so some of them like I said
00:42:40
some of them were animated videos and others were probably dramatizations or or the real deal now all I have is their
00:42:50
statements what they said to the public and I don't know how many of these were animations how many were dramatizations
00:42:56
how many were thought to be real but this one there was one uh in particular that the authorities that viewed this
00:43:05
material stated they believed it to be real that'd be my luck they would say captain go in the corner watch these
00:43:13
videos let us know what you think that'd be my first day on the job well they also checked out other hard drives owned
00:43:21
by Peter and this contained over 100 additional videos of that were all similar in nature some of these went
00:43:28
back as long as 2004 so meaning he was downloading these as early as 2004 Peter's phone contained seven texts
00:43:40
regarding impaling women in the genital region even more distressing authorities were able to
00:43:47
determine that Peter had actually searched for and watched some of these videos meaning meaning he didn't just
00:43:56
stumble upon some of the videos that were on his hard drives some of them he was searching for or believed to be
00:44:03
searched for because they could find terms that he was using when searching and the terms he was using were
00:44:10
executions and dismemberment and starting in March of 2017 yeah these searches continued into
00:44:19
July and August of last year as well most horrifyingly the night before before Kim boarded the submarine Peter
00:44:28
Googled beheaded girl Agony and watched the video that showed up when as a result of that search do they think that
00:44:38
one was real or does it matter uh I don't have their opinion on this one but I do know some of the details of that
00:44:48
video it's it's a video that was entitled young woman in pain as she slowly as she slowly beheaded with a
00:44:56
small knife now it's you know and there's been you know beheading videos that terrorists have Post online and I
00:45:05
know that people have watched them mhm I've never been able to bring myself to watch one and then you have this guy
00:45:15
that's watching these for sexual gratification I mean he's he's watching a woman be decapitated while he's playing
00:45:27
a game of flicky flicky well at least that's what it's titled um I I don't know that that's what exactly was
00:45:35
depicted in that video well not in that video but we have the police stating that one of the videos they think is
00:45:41
real right so again I mean and this go I think this goes beyond because they always kind of talk
00:45:50
about you know you know watching too much pornography will desensitize you on some level but this is a whole different
00:45:58
level this is not even being desensitized this is somebody that has well and I wouldn't even call this
00:46:04
pornography at this point I mean this is this is It's they're snuff films you know they're they're torture porn snuff
00:46:12
films right but right you know it's it's not even pornography at right but it's like you to me it's like you wonder
00:46:20
how what was broken in this guy's brain to to make him think that this is okay to be watching
00:46:30
well in In fairness I guess to Peter he did deny that these videos were his uh pointing out that all the videos that
00:46:39
were found were found on computers that were accessible by others including his phone uh including um interns that
00:46:49
worked at his office uh he stuck to this story for a little while but he did later fess up to to having watched these
00:46:58
videos um for his part he did he denied deriving any sexual pleasure from these torture and snuff films he said to the
00:47:09
authorities that he watched them to feel quote strong emotions end quote and also
00:47:16
quote I watch these videos to cry and feel emotions he said okay so if we believe him which I
00:47:26
which I don't but if we do believe him yeah maybe um I mean look and I hate to compare Peter to like Elon Musk but
00:47:38
it's like you know I was watching the interview with Elon Musk and Joe Rogan and there's times where Elon and you see
00:47:46
this with um the Facebook Creator Zuckerberg yeah Mark Zuckerberg where almost computer likee
00:47:56
they start talking sometimes and you and you wonder how they seem to have such lack of emotion so it's like if you do
00:48:04
believe what Peter is saying is he did he get that far gone mentally where he's like I don't I don't feel anything good
00:48:14
or bad I think there's evidence that shows that he's not just watching it for what
00:48:20
he's saying but again there's there's some mental break there you you have to be a pretty sick individual to be saying
00:48:29
I don't feel anything so I have to watch something this awful to just create some kind of emotion in me
00:48:38
well if we're to believe him that means he's dead inside right he's dead inside he's void of emotion Yeah by his own
00:48:45
statement and if we don't believe him and which I think is probably more likely if not you could have a
00:48:52
combination of both but then that means that yeah you could that means that the other alternative would be that he is
00:48:59
deriving sexual pleasure from watching these videos right and when he states that you know and then I'd cry well I
00:49:08
think afterwards like I said if there's something broken inside you you might cry after this because you're going what
00:49:15
the hell is wrong with me why am I having to watch this to to you know get off during a game of flicky flicky I
00:49:24
mean so I just I don't know it's just it's so bizarre but he didn't feel that bad did he let's say he did cry all
00:49:32
right let's let's say he by his own words he cried to feel emotion whatever emotions he was feeling
00:49:40
they weren't bad enough for him to stop watching this [ __ ] no no no so he didn't
00:49:44
feel that bad he may have felt a let's say he did I'll give him the benefit of the doubt he felt bad in the moment if
00:49:50
you truly feel bad about something if you truly feel bad about something he's 100 100% or should be 100% in control of
00:49:59
this despicable action that he's doing repetitiously right but this he could he at any time could stop or seek help for
00:50:07
this right on a psychology level that's what makes me wonder it's like you I mean you look at a dmer or somebody like
00:50:14
the fantasies that dmer was was having were very odd fantasies and and so it's it's it goes
00:50:22
back to was this individual born broken or did they get broken you see what I mean so I it's just I
00:50:31
wonder what the hell happen for him to get to this point or if or if he was just made this
00:50:41
[Music] sick so hopefully everybody is all caught up on all of our episodes if not
00:50:55
it's very easy they are available to you for free all of the old episodes on the
00:51:01
Stitcher app we have the conclusion of Kim Wall's case tomorrow until then be good be kind and don't
00:51:08
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