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>> [music] [music] [music] >> Welcome to True Crime Garage. Wherever you are, whatever you are doing, thanks
00:01:38
for listening. I'm your host Nick and with me as always is a man who knows that the first rule of True Crime Garage
00:01:44
is tell everybody. Here is the captain. [music] >> Yeah, make sure you tell your mom. It's
00:01:50
good to be seen and good to see you. Thanks for listening. Thanks for telling a friend. [music]
00:01:57
Today in the garage, we are very excited to be sipping on Trotwood Lager with lime juice by the good folks over at
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Warped Wing Brewing Company. [music] They are all over in the Dayton area and just northeast of Cincinnati. A great
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brewery that's been doing it the right way for a long time. Trotwood Lager, this one is juiced up with lime. It's a
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fresh, clean, and a crisp, cold with a touch of real lime juice. Enjoyed best when the sun is out. ABV 4% garage
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grade four out of five bottle caps. And let's raise a glass to some of our so fresh and so clean clean garage friends.
00:02:42
First up, a long distance cheers to Al Cronin all the way over in Steinwenden, Germany. Prost.
00:02:50
>> And a big we like to tip goes out to Ash from Raleigh, North [music] Carolina.
00:02:54
>> Here's a cheers to Haley Derryberry in Temple, Texas. >> Tall cans in the air to Trent Jones in
00:03:02
Evansville, [music] Indiana. >> Next here's a cheers to the Smiths in Southwest Fort [music] Wayne. And last
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but certainly not least, we have a cheers to Irene or I Rizzle if you're nasty. Must be an Apple [music] or Patreon
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subscriber. Everyone we just mentioned went to truecrimegarage.com and contributed to this week's beer fund.
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And for that, we thank you. >> For everything true crime, check out truecrimegarage.com.
00:03:26
While you're there, sign up on the [music] mailing list. And Colonel, that's enough of the bees knees.
00:03:30
>> All right, everybody gather around, grab a chair, grab a beer. Let's talk some
00:03:34
true crime. >> [music] >> The year was 1978. A time that now feels like a distant [music] memory for many.
00:03:52
In a small blue-collar town in western Ohio, life revolved around two central pillars, the Goodyear factory and high
00:04:01
school football. The town of Saint Marys was centrally located, yet connected to the wider
00:04:06
world only by a web of country roads, and it had a distinct character. It was a little more than 20 or so miles
00:04:15
from the industrial city of Lima, and a similar distance from the Indiana state line.
00:04:21
Goodyear, established in the late '40s or early '50s, was the largest employer, with nearly one in every four households
00:04:29
having someone on its payroll. The town's rhythm was set by factory hours, and the roar of crowds on Friday
00:04:36
nights, where the only passion that eclipsed local football was the fervent support for the Ohio State Buckeyes.
00:04:45
This was also a cruising town, a scene straight out of American Graffiti. On weekends, the main strip became a
00:04:53
bumper-to-bumper parade of cars filled with teenagers, a loop that often included a stop at a local drive-thru or
00:05:00
carryout for a beer run, a purchase a 17-year-old could make on occasion without getting carded.
00:05:08
Back then, Auglaize and Mercer counties were notorious for their high alcohol consumption. It was how many folks in
00:05:15
blue-collar communities spent their Friday nights and weekends back then. It was just part of the working-class
00:05:22
culture that fueled a thriving business for local carryouts. Downtown Saint Marys, a mere three blocks long, and at
00:05:30
one time, an old-timer recalled about 50 bars you could walk or boat to around nearby Grand Lake Saint Marys.
00:05:38
The town had a rowdy side, with bar fights common enough that a prospective police officer's ability to break up a
00:05:46
brawl was a key hiring criteria. At the center of this world was a drive-thru carryout on the west side of town.
00:05:54
An epicenter of a local commerce near Kmart and other major stores. Owned by two men, Roger and Larry, the
00:06:02
business was perpetually booming. It wasn't uncommon for the line of cars to snake out onto the street.
00:06:10
More than just a place for a six-pack, it was a one-stop shop for essentials, a hub of activity year-round.
00:06:18
It even catered to the hardier crowd, selling live bait and fishing tackle for those heading out to Grand Lake, just
00:06:26
two blocks away. Violent crime like homicide was a rarity, extremely rare, in fact, as the
00:06:33
county might go years without a single murder. And when one did occur, it was typically a domestic dispute or
00:06:41
crime where the suspect was quickly identified. This stark reality would make the events
00:06:48
of one cold winter night all the more jarring, creating a crime that would haunt the community for decades to come.
00:06:57
This is True Crime Garage, and this is the still unsolved murder case of Roger Parent Jr.
00:07:07
>> [music] [music] >> On the evening of Friday, December 29th, 1978, Roger Parent, a 33-year-old man, found
00:07:28
himself unexpectedly at his post at the drive-thru that he and a long-time friend together owned.
00:07:36
It was called the P&S Carryout, located in St. Marys, Ohio at 2111 Salina Road. The name P and S Carryout
00:07:47
stood for the owners, Roger Parent and Larry Sullivan, P and S. The business was a small white block building with a
00:07:56
large Pepsi sign painted on the side. Next to the door there is a large dark painted arrow pointing to the drive-thru
00:08:06
with the words drive-thru service in white. So the small structure included both a
00:08:13
drive-thru and a walk-in entrance to the business. Roger Parent Jr. wasn't originally
00:08:21
scheduled to work that night. So earlier that day at home he had received a call from his colleague, Joe
00:08:29
Hudson, who wanted to leave his shift at the drive-thru early that night. And an
00:08:35
arrangement was made, Captain, and Roger drove the short three-to-four-minute journey from his home to take over for
00:08:43
the night. Joe could take off a little early on this Friday night and Roger, one of the co-owners, would handle the
00:08:51
closing duties and lock up for the night at the end of the shift. Now that night,
00:08:57
my friends, wasn't just any old Friday night in Saint Mary's, Ohio. That night was the night of the 1978 Gator Bowl, a
00:09:06
collegiate football game. It was a bit of a down year for the Ohio State Buckeyes going 7-3-1
00:09:14
during the regular season, but the schedule meant playing seven nationally ranked teams that regular
00:09:20
season, going 3-3-1 against those ranked opponents. But the Bucks and legendary coach Woody Hayes
00:09:28
were coming off a 14-3 loss to rival Michigan, marking the the third straight loss to that team up
00:09:38
north, putting pressure on the team to secure a bowl victory, and even more on their coach, Woody
00:09:44
Hayes, to end the season on a high note. Their opponent, the Clemson Tigers, who
00:09:51
entered the match with a 9 and 1 regular season record. The 1978 Gator Bowl was televised nationally by ABC Sports,
00:10:00
featuring legendary announcer Keith Jackson. The game kicked off at 9:10 p.m. Eastern Standard Time, but that was
00:10:09
exactly 933 miles away in Jacksonville, Florida. Back in St. Marys, Ohio, the air was
00:10:19
still with the quiet hum of a typical winter Friday evening. Many local residents were settled in
00:10:27
their homes, maybe with some popcorn or perhaps hosting a watch party at their homes. Whatever the location,
00:10:35
many folks most certainly were tuned in and their attention captured by the Ohio
00:10:41
State game flickering on television sets. Now, you can tell by today's show title that this story is going to be
00:10:51
all centered around this drive-thru, the P&S Carryout. And to be fair, it's a carryout/drive-thru, but I'm calling it
00:10:59
drive-thru for a few reasons. One, if you were to be driving through town for the first time,
00:11:07
I would believe that this is a drive-thru if I were driving through town. The words drive-thru are much more
00:11:16
dominant on all of the signage for the business, and the majority of the customers were drive-thru customers.
00:11:24
The carryout portion of the business was cool, and it worked like this. The folks
00:11:29
that walked up to the little store obviously used the carryout door, and sometimes folks would pull into the
00:11:36
business. They did have a little area there where a couple of cars could park, and you could park your car and then
00:11:43
walk in. But our listeners know when you have a great local drive-thru, it's the
00:11:49
best way and most convenient way to go and quickly and easily collect soda, beer, lottery,
00:11:56
snacks, and small items. Now, also we have owners Roger Parent and Larry Sullivan. These are long-time friends.
00:12:05
They grew up in the area. They knew each other since childhood. They went to grade school together.
00:12:12
Both Roger Parent and Larry Sullivan worked at the Goodyear Tire and Rubber Company. This is a very large nearby
00:12:23
factory job that was putting most of the meat on the tables of families living in
00:12:28
this area. I talked to several folks who lived there in the 1970s and the '80s, and they described it as either someone
00:12:38
in your house worked at Goodyear or one of your neighbors did. I think it was something like one in every four
00:12:45
households had someone working at that Goodyear. >> Well, like you said, they both worked
00:12:51
there together, and they worked there as they also worked at the drive-thru. >> That's a lot of time together, my
00:12:58
friend, as you and I both know. Roger Parent was born October 28, 1945 in Akron, Ohio, and he served this greatest
00:13:07
of nations, serving in the US Army from 1965 to 1968, was a member of the VFW, the American Legion, the Eagles, and the
00:13:18
Bass Masters Association. So, both Roger Parent and Larry Sullivan were working at Goodyear. Larry Sullivan
00:13:26
was also working part-time at a local carryout when the owner at some point decides he wants to sell the business
00:13:34
and Larry Sullivan was working there wanted to take ownership of the little store. So he then approaches his buddy
00:13:40
Roger Parent and the two agreed to go in halves on the store. They would work at Goodyear
00:13:46
during the day and ran the store during their off hours, mostly splitting time there. Due to their careers at Goodyear,
00:13:55
they did have a handful of part-time employees that would help them run the store.
00:14:02
Both Roger and Larry had family so they couldn't spend every waking hour working
00:14:08
at one of the two businesses. >> Well, I'm guessing the dream was eventually just to work
00:14:14
the drive-thru or possibly buy more drive-thrus. >> Yeah, so back then, especially back
00:14:20
then, these larger outfits like Goodyear, Goodyear was a major operation, still is. And back then I
00:14:27
would imagine the idea would be, hey, let's put it you put in your time there, 20 years, 25 years,
00:14:33
>> get a good pension. >> Get a good pension, fairly early retirement, but you're still young
00:14:38
enough that you want to do something and here you have this entrepreneurship where you could run your local store and
00:14:45
this was like a a cool local store. This was a favorite of the locals. And so they had a lot of traffic through
00:14:52
there and they were both well-known in town because they worked with everybody at Goodyear and then people knew them
00:14:59
from the drive-thru as well. >> And also it's nice to know the people at the drive-thru.
00:15:05
>> Now, shout out to the hardworking men and women of the Auglaize County Sheriff's Department and specifically
00:15:11
Sheriff Michael Vorhees who runs that fine outfit. The Auglaize Sheriff's Department is in Wapakoneta, Ohio, a
00:15:18
beautiful town that is famous for Do Captain? >> I have no >> Deep down I know you know. Neil
00:15:23
Armstrong, the first man on the moon grew up in Wapakoneta. >> Well, if you buy that story, yeah.
00:15:30
>> And some don't. But, to the credit of the Sheriff's Department, Auglaize County has
00:15:36
one one single outstanding cold case homicide. The murder of Roger Parent Jr. They
00:15:44
solve violent crimes committed there. They get the bad guys. They lock them up. This case has been worked to the
00:15:51
bone, my friends. Roger's case is revisited at least once or twice every year with
00:15:57
an all-hands-on-deck approach. This year they chose to meet with us, True Crime Garage, so that we could cover the
00:16:04
story. So, they don't mind thinking outside of the box. They have held case presentations in the county over the
00:16:12
years to meet with people in the community, sharing the facts and some of the evidence in the case with the
00:16:17
public. They have pushed to keep the story in the media as well with an open communication policy with the news and
00:16:24
the papers. And now utilizing what I believe to be the best form of media when it comes to true crime and cold
00:16:31
cases, podcast. So, here we are today talking about this cold case. Now, as we said in the trailer, this is a rather
00:16:41
low crime area for the most part, even today, especially violent crime. However,
00:16:49
listeners of this show and followers of true crime know businesses that stay open late at night
00:16:54
in the '70s and still to this day sometimes are an easy target for bad guys looking to make a quick score.
00:17:03
There was and had been one previous robbery in 1974 that took place at this particular store.
00:17:13
Okay, so that would be several years before our case that we're talking about here today. But that robbery, Captain,
00:17:21
in 1974 had prompted the owners to implement a policy of having two employees on duty at closing time. So
00:17:31
that '74 robbery did take place near closing time as well. Now, on this particular night, the night
00:17:38
in question, for reasons lost to time, it seems like that rule was broken. Joe Hudson, who was working that night at
00:17:46
the P&S Carryout, left his shift at the drive-thru early that night around 11:35 p.m., leaving
00:17:56
Roger Parent alone to manage the final stretch. >> Well, sometimes this happens, right?
00:18:02
It's a slow night. You have an employee there, but you're the owner trying to be the good guy. Hey,
00:18:09
we're a little slow. If you want to get out of here, I can close up. No big deal.
00:18:14
>> Factor in a couple things, too. There's a short window of time here between the
00:18:18
time that Joe Hudson would leave and closing time, and Roger Parent is in his early to mid-30s, and he's he's from the
00:18:25
army. He can take care of himself, right? It's It's a half hour alone. So the bars were having their last rushes
00:18:32
around this time. People were making their final beer runs before heading home. As midnight approached, the flow
00:18:39
of drive-thru customers was slowing down around this time, now that we're down to
00:18:45
one worker. Within a short window of time, a local man who we will call customer number one
00:18:52
pulled into the drive-thru. As he approached, he noticed a vehicle parked off to the side of the building.
00:19:00
He says a man was standing near this car or this vehicle, briefly kneeling down before standing up again as customer
00:19:07
number one's vehicle passed. A moment later, as customer number one was at the window speaking with Roger
00:19:17
about the football game, he says he saw that same man now inside the carryout. And at the time, this man,
00:19:26
this person is a seemingly innocuous figure in the background. Customer number one completed his
00:19:35
purchase of beer and soda and then drove away, unaware that he was to be possibly
00:19:41
the last person to see Roger Parent alive. The cash register tape would later corroborate his purchase, customer
00:19:51
number one's purchase. Customer number one says that he left the drive-thru and then drove to the
00:19:56
nearby La Grand pizza place to pick up a pizza pie there. What happened in the minutes that
00:20:02
followed is a vortex of speculation and sparse evidence. The man that customer number one saw, he described as a white
00:20:11
male, around 35 to 40 years old, about 5' 8" tall, and weighing 160 to 170 lb. He had curly, sandy-colored hair,
00:20:26
and was wearing blue jeans, a brown or tan jacket, and most notably, a gray hat.
00:20:34
Describing the hat as like the kind that old men wore to church. >> Yeah, I almost say like a old detective hat, but
00:20:44
he also had no facial hair, no glasses, and was a stranger to this eyewitness. >> Yes, and I think that's key here. So,
00:20:53
customer number one noted that the man kept his hands in his pockets the entire time, a detail suggesting that
00:20:59
>> He was playing pocket pool. >> He was concealing weapon. >> Okay. >> The witness did not
00:21:06
>> recognize this man as you had said there Captain, which in a town like Saint Mary's
00:21:12
>> Yeah. >> is significant. >> This was my initial thought, too, as you go, "Well, is he wearing this type of
00:21:18
hat to conceal his identity?" But, he's not wearing any glasses or anything else. So, I wonder if this is
00:21:27
just a part of his persona. >> The official timeline suggests the murder took place in a very narrow
00:21:36
window of time, sometime around 11:45 p.m. The motive appeared to be robbery. The weapon
00:21:45
a 12-gauge shotgun, but the execution is puzzling. So, the killer confronted Roger.
00:21:54
Remember, he has a military background. >> Right. >> And by all accounts is a level-headed
00:21:59
man, but also not one to start fights. There is no sign of a struggle at this murder scene.
00:22:08
It seems Roger was either taken completely by surprise or even possibly had his back turned when a 12-gauge
00:22:16
shotgun was fired at very close range directly on or just inches from his back. Roger Parent was wearing his Bass
00:22:27
Masters jacket, a testament to his passion for fishing, which would initially conceal the full
00:22:35
extent of the level of bloodshed at the scene. So, the cash register tape logged just
00:22:43
one more transaction after customer number one's purchase. Remember, customer number one purchased beer and
00:22:50
soda before leaving to go pick up a pizza. After that purchase and after customer
00:22:56
number one had left the drive-thru, a single pack of cigarettes was logged as a transaction on the
00:23:05
register. >> Does it show that it was paid for? Cuz I remember back in the day you'd pull into
00:23:10
the drive-thru. They would take your order. You go, "Give me a pack of Marlboro Lights. Give
00:23:17
me a six-pack. Give me a can of Coke." They'd go to the register, normally type something in,
00:23:23
and then come back to give you the items, and then also to collect the payment. Correct.
00:23:29
>> Now, the unfortunately, I've had I've had the opportunity to review the register tape
00:23:37
from that night. That is part of the evidence that was collected that night. It doesn't read that way. So, it doesn't
00:23:45
read as cash received or even change given. It's simply each transaction is typed in,
00:23:54
and it's money received, put in the register, and and like I said, what what the register tape is taking inventory of
00:24:04
is simply the sale. And keep in mind the time period that we're talking about. We
00:24:10
have folks that that run cash registers today, and they can be quite complicated
00:24:15
with the computer screens and everything, but back then it was even more work to run a register. Because often times
00:24:23
the machine isn't generating the the change that you are to give for them. Here with this cash register, who knows
00:24:31
how old this thing was. My guess is they had this cash register it came with the
00:24:36
store when they bought it years prior. And it was simply you didn't type in Budweiser six-pack, and then it came up
00:24:43
with the price of it. No, you you had memorized, or you would review the price tag on the side of the item, and you
00:24:51
would simply type in the cost of those goods, the dollar amount. So, the register doesn't read Budweiser, Pepsi,
00:25:00
pack of Marlboros. It doesn't read like that. It simply reads the dollar amount.
00:25:05
The one thing that it does do automatically is it will add the tax for the person running the register and
00:25:14
based off of the portion of the register tape that I reviewed, it looks like either the register doesn't provide for
00:25:21
you the amount of change that you are to give or the operator is just calculating
00:25:26
that in their head and doing it themselves. So, if you you come through the the drive-thru there, Captain, your
00:25:34
purchase is $5.50, you hand me a 10, I can quickly say $4.50 is your change and make change for
00:25:42
you. What we do know is based off of the prices of the items in the drive-thru, it's very it lines up with customer
00:25:52
number one's story that they bought beer and soda and then left. The reason why the thought is that a single pack of
00:26:00
cigarettes >> [snorts] >> was the next purchase is based off of the price. It was the same price as a
00:26:06
pack of cigarettes what they were selling them for. And some evidence that would later be found at the scene as
00:26:12
well. So, the the other part of this that they find a pack of cigarettes outside nearby,
00:26:19
unopened. Okay, so one thing they don't find is they interviewed everybody who claimed to have been there that night,
00:26:28
to have claimed to have come through the drive-thru within that hour or even the hour before the
00:26:35
homicide took place. No one interviewed ever claimed to buy a pack of cigarettes
00:26:41
and then lost them or threw them down right that night. So, the idea here, it's presumably the killer requested a pack
00:26:50
of cigarettes. Roger then recorded the purchase on the register. The killer shot Rogers
00:26:57
Roger in the back. Roger collapsed. The killer took $95 from the register, then fled the scene.
00:27:06
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00:30:06
the air. Cheers to the people in the back. >> And sorry, if you are tuning in for the
00:30:11
first time to our little garage show, do know that we discussed a solved case and a
00:30:16
unsolved case last week, and next week we have another unsolved case, a true crime story from Georgia. So, make sure
00:30:23
that you hit that subscribe button. Now, that night, the silence of the night was broken, but not by the gunshot.
00:30:33
Because that squatty little solid block building sealed the sound, muffled the sound Yeah. of that gunshot. So, the
00:30:41
silence of that late Friday night was broken by a chilling discovery. A woman who we will call customer number two
00:30:51
lived in the surrounding neighborhood. There's a neighborhood that surrounds the store backs up to this neighborhood
00:30:59
is better way to describe it. >> Well, sometimes the drive-throughs would become walk-throughs.
00:31:05
>> Well, and we know this from where we grew up. We would we had little local stores that we would often ride our
00:31:11
bikes to. They were short distance from the house and a lot of times on summer days you would just use it as something
00:31:17
to do to pass the time or to to get some kind of snack or treat. This customer number two who lives nearby decided to
00:31:25
make a last-minute trip to the drive-thru carryout to collect a late-night snack, a bag of potato chips.
00:31:33
Customer number two having been inside the carryout countless times before, she likely called out for whoever was
00:31:41
working or you know, a quick hello or maybe even to Roger as she walked in expecting a familiar greeting.
00:31:48
Instead, she says there's nobody in there. She's met with unnerving silence. She walked through the side door and
00:31:56
toward the main counter. As she approached the counter, she peered over the counter and then her heart froze.
00:32:04
There on the floor lying in a pool of blood was Roger. She panicked. She turned and
00:32:12
at the same time she threw the bag of chips and fled back to the neighborhood screaming. She was
00:32:18
looking for help and looking for it fast. She needed to get Roger help, but she wasn't going to go back into the
00:32:25
store alone. So, she ran to the first neighbor that she could think of. Let's call him neighbor number one. She tells
00:32:32
neighbor number one what she had found, Roger lying in a pool of blood behind the counter at the carryout {slash}
00:32:39
drive-thru. Neighbor number one rushed back to the carryout with customer number two, knelt beside Roger,
00:32:48
checked for a pulse. This is a desperate futile gesture. Roger, by neighbor number one's account, was
00:32:59
probably already gone by this point. Confirming their worst fears, neighbor number one ran back to his house to call
00:33:06
for help. This is an era before 911. So, he called the fire department for EMS and then the local police or
00:33:15
sheriff's office. After making the calls, he returns on foot to the scene, pulls down the large drive-thru door.
00:33:23
This is a quick, but grim attempt to secure the area while they waited for authorities.
00:33:29
I mean, you're there. You have a great idea, unfortunately, of what happened, right? It's a late-night drive-thru
00:33:36
carryout. Owner dead on the floor. You don't know where the perpetrator is. Is he coming
00:33:43
back? >> And you don't know if the perpetrator was on foot or if he drove through.
00:33:49
And then also, if the if those doors are open and the lights are on, it's a drive-thru. You have to drive through
00:33:56
the building, which would then disturb your scene. So, it's it's pretty smart to go, "Hey, let's
00:34:02
shut these doors. Let's make sure nobody can drive through our crime scene." >> Yeah, and the bars and the pizza places
00:34:09
and all those businesses that are going to stay open late for a Friday night, they're all closing around this time.
00:34:16
Same as what they were attempting to do with the drive-thru. So, you could get people on their way home. Oh, the
00:34:22
drive-thru's still open. Swing through. So, this quiet night was pierced by the wail of of sirens.
00:34:29
>> The sirens or silence? >> Sirens. Police sirens. >> Sirens. You're not saying that word completely
00:34:39
correct. >> Sirens? >> Sirens. That's better. >> I don't know what you were hearing, but
00:34:45
I was saying sirens. >> I'm telling you the listeners they heard it. >> Hopefully you can delete this portion in
00:34:51
post. >> No. >> So the quiet night was pierced by the wail of sirens. Police sirens, we're going to have fire
00:35:00
department and so on. The call went out and law enforcement began to converge on
00:35:04
the scene. The crime had occurred just outside of St. Mary's city limits, but the community considered it part of
00:35:11
their town. We have a designated township deputy, a man named Marsh, was known to be close
00:35:19
by. This is due to the high concentration of bars around this area. This is a lake
00:35:25
community. According to one of the firefighters who arrived at 12:03 a.m., Deputy Marsh had already beaten them to
00:35:34
the location. Customer number two and neighbor number one who had discovered the body had to open the door for him,
00:35:41
granting the first official access. It wasn't until Rogers body was moved that the true volume of blood became
00:35:51
apparent. >> Yeah. >> His glasses were found on the floor near his head. A brand new unopened pack of Marlboro
00:36:00
cigarettes was found on the ground just outside of the store. It's exact location
00:36:08
nearby. It It looks to me that either someone simply dropped them. I mean, there's there is
00:36:19
a chance that these cigarettes have little to nothing to do with the case at all.
00:36:25
>> But like you said, it matches. >> Maybe somebody purchased them there and dropped them on accident. Maybe somebody
00:36:31
had them on their lap when they got out of their po- out of their car and they fell to
00:36:37
the ground. But it seems to stand to reason or at least basic logic that when you
00:36:46
have this purchase of what would be the exact cost of Marlboro cigarettes as the
00:36:53
last recorded transaction on the register and the cigarettes found outside that either A, the killer
00:37:04
did this to distract Roger Parent or actually wanted the cigarettes and and dropped them on his way fleeing the
00:37:13
scene. >> Well, and I don't know if we have evidence if the killer drove through the
00:37:19
drive-thru or if they walked through because to me, if you're going to commit this
00:37:24
crime, it'd just be easier to walk in, commit the crime because if you're going to take money, if the motive is to take
00:37:32
money from the cash register, then if you just walk in, you don't have to get out of your vehicle, if that
00:37:38
makes any sense. >> Well, exactly. You would pull up and then the problem you would have if you chose
00:37:46
to exit go into the drive-thru, exit your vehicle, and get the money, regardless of where
00:37:53
you shoot the clerk, you have the potential of somebody pulling up behind you, reading your
00:37:59
license plate, seeing you getting back in the car, and then once they figure out that uh there's a robbery homicide
00:38:05
here, you're if you were trying to conceal your identity, now you have a big problem. Your your car is sitting
00:38:12
under lights for a great description. Your plate would be easily visible to anybody
00:38:20
behind you. So, it it it stands to reason that the person would want to come inside if this was something that
00:38:27
they had thought through and had a general understanding of the store. This also goes along with what
00:38:34
customer number one is saying. Right? He's saying when when I approached the drive-thru, I'm in my
00:38:41
vehicle. I drove past the guy that he was near he was near a vehicle parked off to the
00:38:46
side. And then once I'm in the drive-thru and talking to Roger, I then see the man in the background, that same
00:38:54
man. He's he's on foot inside the carryout waiting for me and Roger to be done talking.
00:39:01
And then I left. Everything was normal when I left. So, back to that item at the scene, a brand new unopened pack of
00:39:09
Marlboro cigarettes found outside just outside that it's assumed to be the very pack from the final ghost
00:39:19
purchase of the night. Had Roger rung up the cigarettes and handed them over before being shot or was the request a
00:39:27
diversion to get close without raising suspicion? >> Well, and sometimes people rob locations
00:39:34
and they they don't have a full understanding of the business. So, they go, "Okay, well, I'm going to
00:39:40
rob them towards the end of the night the end of the night because that's when they're going to have the most money."
00:39:46
>> Mhm. >> But, sometimes people rob a business and without the understanding that they're
00:39:52
not going to have a lot of cash on them. So, you go, "Well, they didn't score that much cash." So, that makes this
00:39:59
motive seem a little flimsy. But, if I'm an investigator, I'm going, "Okay, well, is this
00:40:06
to establish a motive? And is this killing based on something else? And so, I think you have to look
00:40:12
at the individuals in Roger's life. What kind of relationships friend-wise does he have? And And what kind of
00:40:20
relationships, maybe, does he have romantically? >> Yes, and I agree with you, it's not a
00:40:25
great score. Um 95 bucks. 95 bucks back then would be roughly about $500 today. >> Yeah, but it could be enough money get
00:40:34
you from point A to point B. >> Oh, I would think $500, you know, 95 bucks gets you a good stretch if you
00:40:42
needed to get from point A to point >> And we don't have a ton of evidence, but we do have this eyewitness that says, "I
00:40:49
didn't know the guy. >> Mhm. >> Here's what the guy looked like, and I didn't know him." That doesn't mean he's
00:40:54
not local, but there is a good possibility that he isn't local, because that's another
00:41:00
thing, too. We have eyewitnesses seeing this this uh camper van, a a red camper truck.
00:41:09
>> Yeah, we should point out that customer number one is not the only potential eyewitness for this night.
00:41:17
>> Right. >> Back to something you said, though, we do know a lot about customer number one.
00:41:21
Okay, we're choosing not to identify these people because it's an unsolved homicide from a small area. With
00:41:29
customer number one, who grew up in the area, >> Yeah. >> saying, "I didn't recognize the guy,"
00:41:36
you're exactly right, Captain. Doesn't mean that the guy's not local, but what it does mean is that it
00:41:42
severely decreases the chance that he is local. Customer number one knows, growing up there, knows most of
00:41:51
the people in in that area. Now, when investigators began to process the scene, they were
00:41:57
met with some puzzling set of clues. Look, motive here obviously would appear to be
00:42:04
straight robbery. It's late at night, the owner-operator is working alone, potential witnesses before and after the
00:42:11
crime, but no one else present in the drive-thru during the robbery or the murder. But there
00:42:17
there is some holdback information here, and we all know that the devil hides in
00:42:23
those details. That information was discussed when I met with the detectives and the sheriff, and we all agree that
00:42:30
there holdback information well, I should say I should say I agree, Captain. It's highly suggestive of two things.
00:42:39
One, the killer probably did not know Roger. Or if he did, he didn't know him extremely well.
00:42:47
And two, I believe that the killer had been in P&S Carryout on a prior occasion or on prior occasions, but I don't think
00:42:55
that the killer worked there or at least never worked there during the time that
00:43:00
Roger Parent and Larry Sullivan owned the business. >> Yeah, and just to be clear, it's a it's
00:43:06
a complete honor that any law enforcement would reach out to us and share information about cases.
00:43:14
They prefer to share the information with you. And most law enforcement officers say,
00:43:21
"Well, we'll share the information with the Colonel. We don't need to hear any dick jokes."
00:43:26
>> So now in our timeline, Captain, it's after midnight. Roger was transported to a local
00:43:31
hospital, but by the way things looked, it was already too late. When he was found on the floor behind the counter
00:43:39
by customer number two and then neighbor number one. The Gator Bowl was coming to
00:43:44
a close and the score was tight. With the game on the line, it was third and five for the Buckeyes who were
00:43:50
trailing 17 to 15 with just two minutes left in the game. Ohio State had the ball on Clemson's
00:43:57
24-yard line. OSU quarterback Art Schlichter was having one hell of a game. He had two rushing touchdowns and had
00:44:05
completed 16 of 19 passes. So, legendary coach Woody Hayes decided to keep the ball in the hands of his
00:44:13
star QB. On that third and five, he called a pass play. Ohio State quarterback Art
00:44:20
Schlichter then threw a short pass that was intercepted by Clemson nose guard Charlie Bowman.
00:44:28
Bowman avoided several tackles gaining 12 yards. Bowman was finally shoved out of bounds on the Ohio State sideline and
00:44:36
after he got up, Ohio State coach Woody Hayes grabbed his jersey and punched him
00:44:42
in the throat. OSU players pulled Hayes away and back behind the sideline. The player thankfully was unaffected by
00:44:52
Hayes's attack. But the incident sparked a brief, intense, bench-clearing fight between
00:44:59
players of both teams. But in the end, the Clemson Tigers had the ball and the lead and they held both until time
00:45:08
expired. The game concluded at prac- at approximately 12:28 a.m. Eastern Standard Time. The final score,
00:45:16
Clemson 17, Ohio State 15. >> Well, just to be clear for the listeners out there that don't like
00:45:22
sports, you're not allowed to punch the other team's players if you're a coach. That's not allowed.
00:45:29
>> I don't think anybody's allowed to punch the other team's players. Roger Parent,
00:45:33
a guy who everyone knew, not just because he was a good dude, but also because he had worked for years at the
00:45:40
factory that was very much the backbone of the community, and he co-owned the best drive-thru and carryout in town,
00:45:48
was pronounced dead at the hospital. OSU coach Woody Hayes was fired the next morning and since that day for the folks
00:45:57
of St. Marys in Auglaize County, those two events have always been tied together.
00:46:03
>> Right. >> It will always be the night that Woody Hayes punched that Clemson player and
00:46:07
the night that someone walked into the P&S Carryout and shot Roger Parent in cold blood.
00:46:15
>> Well, when you said that this individual the killer might have been seen at the drive-thru previously,
00:46:24
it makes me wonder because some of these towns we know they have the the rubber factory, right? So
00:46:31
>> We should we should clear that up. I didn't say that he had been s- You mean right before the murder or on a
00:46:36
previous occasion? >> Previous occasion. >> Okay, we we should clear that up. My
00:46:42
it's my opinion. Uh there's no witness to say that they had seen this person in the carryout
00:46:47
before that night. It's my opinion based off of the evidence that was reviewed with the
00:46:53
sheriff's department that I believe the perpetrator had been in the carryout prior to that night on at least one
00:47:01
occasion. >> No, and that's interesting because like I said the these towns would be known to
00:47:07
have these factories and sometimes s- especially more back in the day, people would
00:47:15
would drive a distance to get a job like this because hey, it's going to cost me a little bit more
00:47:22
in gas, but it's a solid job with a solid retirement plan. >> I believe that the guy was probably
00:47:30
local, but not local local. I think he was like next town over local. I think that it was an individual that probably
00:47:39
had been there before and knew that they stayed open late and that there would likely be only one person in I think it
00:47:46
was somebody going straight for a robbery. And straight to look to take whatever
00:47:51
was in that register. >> And and they might have also had knowledge that this game was going to be
00:47:57
on. I mean, this would have been a big deal game, especially around this time period.
00:48:05
Well, heck, I mean, back then, it's like, once it hit dark, there was just not that many people on the roads.
00:48:12
>> A crucial detail from the autopsy report, Roger was shot once in the back with a
00:48:19
sawed-off shotgun. So, they were able to determine that it was a sawed-off shotgun fired at very, very close range.
00:48:26
I know we described some of that prior, but what they did was a grease test on his jacket and the wadding from the
00:48:37
shell that had passed through his body had helped determine the proximity of the
00:48:42
weapon at the time that it was fired. Right. A sawed-off shotgun would have been easily concealable under a coat.
00:48:50
This may explain why the individual in the carryout witnessed by a couple of people
00:48:58
uh outside and then inside by customer number one was seen without a weapon and is in fact the murderer.
00:49:06
So, again, the the whole thing here is, and it goes back to something that you were saying
00:49:15
earlier, but it's it's the round table discussion of well, did he shoot Roger first? If he
00:49:23
did, how did he manage to get the register open? But, the more practical side of
00:49:28
this says that he probably requested the cigarettes. We don't know if if if that was actually
00:49:35
paid for, if he handed over any money, and he requested the cigarettes, giving him just enough time to have the victim
00:49:43
turn away so he could pull out the weapon. Either the weapon wasn't present and he
00:49:47
asked Roger for another item and Roger turns his back, or the weapon is present and Roger turns his back to
00:49:56
turn away from the gun and then is shot. >> Which makes a lot of sense. It also makes me wonder, too, is does
00:50:04
Roger have the pack of cigarettes and when he turns kind of tosses them, or do they fall on
00:50:12
the ground, and then the killer, when he turns to get away, kicks them by accident?
00:50:18
>> The cigarettes >> it's a nothingburger, but it's this this is an interesting scene.
00:50:24
>> It is. And And I I'm glad that you want to stick with this for a minute, because
00:50:27
the cigarettes to me are uh troubling, okay? Because think of the scenario. What would the killer the It's
00:50:37
suggestive that the based off the register tape and the cigarettes being found outside,
00:50:42
unopened, that the killer gets these cigarettes and then in the course of fleeing either
00:50:49
drops them or throws them down cuz he's not even a smoker, gets in his car, drives off with $95
00:50:56
cash and a smoking hot gun. But what did I just say there? He also has cash and the gun. A guy
00:51:04
doesn't have three hands. >> Right. >> And the cigarettes, if they were the ones that were rang up, made their way
00:51:10
outside of the drive-thru carryout. >> I mean, it's possible he has three hands, but the eyewitness never stated
00:51:18
that he saw a man with three hands. >> I'm just saying the likelihood that that the cigarettes fell out of a pocket seem
00:51:25
much less to me than if they were just tossed or or he dropped them. But in his hands, presumably at this time, he's got
00:51:32
three things: the gun, the cash, and the cigarettes. >> Yeah, but this seems so violent to me
00:51:39
that it's that makes me wonder Okay, if he's not a smoker, then picking out that as a item is a ruse. Is that
00:51:48
the only ruse? And would you kill somebody over 95 bucks? Or is there another motive and
00:51:59
because this makes sense to me. It wouldn't take a rocket scientist to go, "Hey, I want this guy dead for whatever
00:52:07
reason. I will go to his place of work where I have easy access to go in and out. I will ask to purchase a a
00:52:18
pack of cigarettes and then I will shoot him and I'll rob him and then people will assume
00:52:26
that this was just a just a robbery that went bad." And so I really want to know what was
00:52:32
going on in his personal life. >> Well, there's Yeah, but there's also the old adage of leave no witness, right?
00:52:40
Well, regardless if you know the individual or not and and you're This has really the the ongoing theories
00:52:49
for investigators here have time and time again that they're forced to revisit are two
00:52:58
primary scenarios for the murder. First, like you said, a robbery gone bad. The perpetrator
00:53:04
didn't intend to kill Roger, but was startled, nervous, perhaps Roger reached for the cigarettes and the shotgun goes
00:53:12
off. The second was an an intentional premeditated murder where it could be either A, like you say, maybe there's a
00:53:20
reason for this individual to want to kill Roger Parent or it's just simply premeditated in the sense that the
00:53:29
killer waited for other employees to be gone, Joe to leave knowing that the cash
00:53:35
register would potentially be at its fullest at the end of the night, goes in there to collect goes in there
00:53:41
to collect the money and decides I'm leaving no witness. And so the >> Right there. Hold on. Hold on. Hold on.
00:53:47
Hold on a second right there. Because that to me would suggest he he doesn't have to be local local, but that would
00:53:55
suggest he's local on some capacity because if you're from a whole different state,
00:54:02
what would it matter that he saw you? You're going to take the 95 bucks and within an hour you're in a different
00:54:10
state. So, but if you're local, then you would be worried about him identifying you.
00:54:19
>> Or someone else seeing you. And that that's one thing that the investigators discussed was if it were an intentional
00:54:28
murder, they then that would obviously point more toward a local person. Someone who knew Roger, knew his
00:54:35
routine. Maybe it wasn't personal in nature. Maybe it had everything to do with the robbery. But it would be
00:54:41
somebody that didn't want to be identified. An out-of-towner, as you just reasoned and others would it
00:54:49
makes sense, wouldn't care as much about being seen. So, this all leads back to the description
00:54:58
of the potential suspect. Was that just what he was wearing? Some kind of his you know, his normal getup?
00:55:04
Or could be could could that have been a disguise? >> Right. >> And like we said, there it's believed
00:55:11
that there was more than one person to have seen this individual that night, but not necessarily inside the building.
00:55:18
We do know that he was also spotted by customer number one out in the parking lot for a very very brief time.
00:55:26
Customer number one, let's call him the key witness here, worked with a sketch artist
00:55:32
and also with the Identikit that was popular back then. That's where you kind of go through and
00:55:40
you pick out the the nose that looks the best, you pick out the hat that looks the best, and by the time you go through
00:55:45
picking everything out, you have your complete description of the individual. One thing we're going to be releasing
00:55:53
that has not been widespread to this point, there are the suspect composite sketches,
00:56:00
uh a profile picture as well as a I shouldn't say picture, a profile sketch, >> Right.
00:56:07
>> as well as a front view sketch, but there there's also that Identikit. That's not been widespread to this
00:56:14
point. And the sheriff's department and I, we all agree that needs to be thrown out there as much as the
00:56:21
the sketch itself, because to me they don't they look very very similar, but they don't look the same.
00:56:27
And I think that the other one could trigger hopefully trigger someone's memory better than what the sketch has
00:56:35
for all this time. The other part of this though too, that's interesting, is this this stupid
00:56:41
hat, okay? The image of the suspect depicts a man in a hat. >> Yeah. >> And you described it a little
00:56:49
differently than I did. I think both of them >> stupider hats. >> I think both of our descriptions are
00:56:54
good. I also think that the one uh one of the witnesses' descriptions of uh well, what kind of hat was it? He didn't
00:57:00
he didn't name it what kind of hat it was. He says, "Oh, it's the kind that, you know, old men might wear to church
00:57:05
on Sunday." >> Yeah. >> Then others seeing the the hat, the drawing of the hat, have described it as
00:57:11
a fedora. Then this is interesting, because with all these cases, especially these
00:57:16
old ones, what's one of the things that we like the most here in the garage? Talk to the local people and and hear
00:57:25
their suspicions and hear what the rumors were that they were hearing at the time, because we've seen this, not
00:57:32
every case, but many many cases, that something that was said by the locals early on
00:57:39
ends up being true. There's some truth to it once the solution is presented for the mystery. So, one thing that the
00:57:47
local old-timers have suggested to the sheriff's department in this case One thing we need to keep in mind, 1978
00:57:55
none of the guys working the case today were on the sheriff's department at that
00:57:59
time. In fact, the meeting that we had a room full of 10 people there was one individual that was old enough to to
00:58:07
know the area and the people at the time in that meeting. He was like eight at the time of the murder.
00:58:13
>> Right. >> Some locals, when they presented this case to the public, like I said, they've
00:58:18
they've gone to the public many times and presented the case to the the public. Some of the local old-timers
00:58:23
have told the sheriff's office this hat might not have been a fedora, might not have been a dress type hat. It could
00:58:30
have been a bucket hat. And the old-timers have a few reasons for the suspicion. One
00:58:37
it actually was a popular style of hat worn by Goodyear workers at the time when they were at work to
00:58:44
keep soot out of their hair during their shifts. >> Yeah, again it goes back to that
00:58:51
what was his personal relationships? Is there a possibility that he had a co-worker that he had run-ins with? And
00:58:58
so, it could be a fedora hat. It could be a bucket hat or what I call a fisherman's hat. Or possibly could be
00:59:05
something like a pork pie hat. But I lean towards the the first two options. >> The other part of that is
00:59:12
to extend on what you're saying here, a fisherman's hat, this is a lake community. Yep. Fishing is a big
00:59:19
time shared hobby here. I live near a lake. I see 9 months out of the year, if I go 1 mile to the east,
00:59:29
I will see something that is suggestive of fishing. I will see a boat, fishing rods, a person who is dressed as they're
00:59:36
going fishing, a person purchasing bait. I >> Scuba Steve. >> Every you just see it all the time.
00:59:44
So, the the bucket hat makes a lot of sense there. It's not described or depicted as
00:59:52
such in the sketches or the identikit, but it's something to keep in mind, and it's something that makes a whole lot of
01:00:01
sense. >> Yeah, and if we're trying to connect the dots, you go fisherman hat and this red camper truck,
01:00:08
lake community, to me, you go, well, it could point to somebody going there to to go camping, to take a little
01:00:18
break. And it's also it's around the New Year's time, so you would assume that people would have
01:00:25
time off of work. I mean, we know it was a Saturday, but I'm just saying, does that make sense?
01:00:32
Depending on where when New Year's falls. >> going into Saturday. >> Yeah, and so, depending on when New
01:00:39
Year's falls, the person would have time. So, we see a lot of these crimes take place during these holiday
01:00:45
weekends. >> Initially here, the hope of the individual depicted in the sketch and the
01:00:54
identikit, it I mean, it was the hope that this was just an innocent bystander, that he
01:00:59
could be another potential witness, or have information that would help the sheriff's office.
01:01:05
>> Right. >> However, it's been over 40 years, this guy has not come forward and said, "Oh,
01:01:12
yeah, that's me in the sketch." Or that's me that had that vehicle that was described as being outside. That
01:01:18
person's never come forward, and you've heard us talk about this, if you're [clears throat] a long time listener,
01:01:23
you've heard us talk about this aspect of cases many many times. >> just to be clear, there's there was more
01:01:30
than one witness that saw this individual, right? >> Customer number one by far has the most
01:01:36
detailed description of the man and the most detailed description of the potential vehicle that he could be
01:01:43
linked to. We need to keep in mind one big part of the story is he's while he may have been spotted kneeling down next
01:01:50
to a vehicle, he's never seen getting in or out of a vehicle by any witness at all.
01:01:55
>> Yeah, so his vehicle could have been parked somewhere else. >> Or he could have been on foot. I mean,
01:01:59
we just said it backed up to the There the possibilities here are So, one of the possibilities that I thought was
01:02:05
crazy on its surface doesn't seem so crazy after the fact because we talked about
01:02:12
and we're going to get into these rumors some of the rumors here, but one of the
01:02:16
rumors was that a local bad guy was at one of the nearby bars. They're super busy. It's Friday night.
01:02:24
Nobody's really keeping tabs on everybody and keeping check on who's here and who's not. They were saying
01:02:30
like, "Look, it it wouldn't be crazy. It's not out of the realm of possibility that this dude gets up from his seat at
01:02:38
the bar and says, "I'm going to the bathroom." or the place is busy and disappears for
01:02:44
15 minutes. The Somebody could have presumably walked from one of those bars. Quick jog over to the carryout, go
01:02:52
inside, shoot the guy, take the money, and then you're back on your barstool in 15-20
01:02:57
minutes. >> Yeah, and what happens when you start drinking? You want to start smoking.
01:03:03
>> Again, it goes back to the idea this guy never coming forward that it's prob-
01:03:07
this is probably your guy. This is probably your suspect. And the part that we're talking about now has been
01:03:16
a little bit of a a point of confusion, right? So, we have customer number one who saw a car parked on the side of the
01:03:23
building. We have earlier notes about a red and white camper truck. Then, we have
01:03:30
something about a teletype came in. It was circulating about an orange Pinto that was urging officers to be on the
01:03:39
lookout for an orange Pinto, but use caution. As the way that the the case file reads today,
01:03:46
40 years later, almost 50 years later, there's no clear explanation as to what this orange Pinto may or may not mean to
01:03:54
the investigation, but it is something that is in the case file. Turn of the year, New Year's comes. By January 1979,
01:04:03
the community buzzed with rumors as they tried to piece together this puzzle. The randomness or possible randomness of
01:04:11
this crime was a reoccurring theme of those rumors. Was a reoccurring theme to the locals who were trying to come up
01:04:19
with their best theory as to who and why this was done. The carryout, the drive-thru, was highly visible. It's a
01:04:28
high-traffic area. And so, what you cannot completely dismiss, it's possible the killer was an
01:04:36
out-of-towner who had been at one of the nearby bars like the Surf Club, just a short walk across
01:04:44
an open field. But, there were other theories, Captain, and other rumors that swirled much closer to home. So, within
01:04:51
a few months of the murder, two local men died by suicide. The rumor mill immediately connected them individually,
01:04:59
separately to the crime. One name in particular kept surfacing, Mike Sampson. So, this is a name, this is a story that
01:05:07
has remained and is persistently linked to the Roger Parent homicide over the years, but to be perfectly clear, it
01:05:16
lacks in both details and more importantly evidence. So, as the story goes, in February of 1979,
01:05:24
overwhelmed with guilt, Samson killed himself in his bedroom, leaving a note that explicitly confesses to the crime.
01:05:33
It the the rumor is that the note said something as simple as I killed Roger. Now, according to that local rumor, the
01:05:40
father discovered the scene and destroys the note to protect his family's reputation.
01:05:47
Investigators looked into this theory time and time again, actually. They've revisited this theory.
01:05:54
But, the official reports on Samson's death contain no mention of a note. So, either A, the father was successful
01:06:02
in destroying that >> Right. >> evidence and cleaned up the suicide scene a little bit before
01:06:08
folks got there to document what took place, or the other option is the note never
01:06:15
existed, and this was something >> Yeah. >> something that was made up. It was something that was made up to reconcile
01:06:21
both of these events. >> Well, and this would go against the eyewitness reports, right? I mean, the
01:06:28
I'm assuming that this guy was younger than 35 to 40. >> Yeah, actually, you're you're spot on
01:06:34
with that. He would have been in his early 20s, and I asked the um the older gentleman to describe this
01:06:42
individual that was in our meeting. And now, again, he was 8 years old at this time, but it's an area where everybody
01:06:49
practically knows everybody. And he said that in in the others in the room agreed with him based off of what
01:06:56
they've heard over the years that this individual, unfortunately, who who did take his own life, regardless of the
01:07:03
circumstances, was described to me as somebody that wasn't functioning on a normal level.
01:07:09
They were hesitant to give a diagnosis, but did say that today this individual would have There would have been a
01:07:17
certain term for for why he was not functioning on a normal level. Uh he was somebody that never lived outside of his
01:07:25
parents' home. Uh he was somebody that did get into trouble on occasion, got into trouble
01:07:31
fairly regularly as an adult. But they they're suspicious that that it was more of his
01:07:39
more in regard of his condition rather than being just an evil, terrible human being.
01:07:45
>> But still could be responsible for heinous crime. >> Yeah. Another that other suicide
01:07:52
uh occurred the same year, 1979. This also drew the attention of investigators at the time and of course
01:08:00
the locals. This individual uh his name is Alan Hockenball. He took his own life shortly
01:08:06
after the murder. His wife says that she believed that it that it was because he
01:08:13
knew who killed Roger. >> Right. >> Um n- maybe not that he did it. She says that
01:08:21
um the the sheriff's department has a bit of an issue with this story because there was a lot of turmoil
01:08:29
in this marriage. So she they're not living together at the time that Alan takes his life.
01:08:36
They suspect that that is probably why he took his life, that his his marriage and his family had completely fallen
01:08:42
apart mostly by his own wrongdoing. But >> can be a big stressor. >> He the as the story goes or as the rumor
01:08:52
has always been, he called his soon-to-be ex-wife and said, "I know who did it." Naming the person
01:08:59
that was responsible. Then he takes his own life. So, the investigators agreed at
01:09:06
the time of a couple of things. It was easy to see the problems with this air quotes confession, but they
01:09:13
also found the lead to be very compelling, viewing his statements almost as a confession without confessing. Possibly
01:09:21
that he was the individual responsible, but on the phone call claiming to know who was responsible.
01:09:29
But it not being him. >> Did he not give a name to his >> The the rumor as the story goes is that
01:09:35
he gave a name to the wife and this name was passed along to investigators. The name has never surfaced though.
01:09:41
>> Interesting. >> And it it is it's something that the sheriff's office are are well well aware
01:09:48
of, but >> Blink twice if you know the name. >> I if I if I do I did know the name and I
01:09:54
don't know it today. Sometimes I purposely forget things. It's in the interest of the It's in the
01:09:59
best interest of the case for me to forget things. Another suspicion, and this is it's very
01:10:06
close to home. So, as the years passed, Roger Parrott's brother, the victim's brother,
01:10:13
his name is Larry, not to be confused with Larry Sullivan who was co-owner. So, as this story goes, Roger's brother
01:10:19
Larry, who was at a party the night of the murder, began to form his own suspicion. So, he was at a
01:10:26
football party that night. He shared a story about another one of the brothers, Louis Parrott.
01:10:35
He says, "Look, Louis owned a lot of guns, a lot of shotguns. He was known to associate at the time
01:10:43
with a very, what he referred to as a rough crowd, and he was always in need of money."
01:10:50
So, Larry believed that Louis might have been involved in the 1974 robbery at the
01:10:58
carryout and drive-thru. The most suspicious part for Larry in regard to his brother Louie
01:11:06
was not evidence, but complete silence. He says that from the day that Roger Parent was shot, Larry
01:11:17
never saw nor heard from his brother Louie again. He simply vanished. >> That's suspicious.
01:11:25
>> Now, the last known trace of this individual was a report that he was living somewhere in a he's sleeping in a camper
01:11:36
in someone's backyard outside of Tampa, Florida. >> Is it a red camper? >> I don't have any information beyond
01:11:44
>> bizarre your your brother is murdered. Seems like the motive might have been robbery. But
01:11:53
you're non-existent to your family afterwards. That's a pretty bizarre. >> Well, and obviously Roger would be able
01:12:01
to identify his own brother. Therefore, needs to be killed. >> Absolutely. >> One one part that we should point out in
01:12:10
Louie's defense, one thing I do know about Louie and am well aware of is that it wasn't all peaches and cream with him
01:12:19
with the family before Roger was killed. It's not like he you know, the brother says it's complete
01:12:26
silence. He never saw him again after Roger's killed, but it's not like they were hanging out and they were all
01:12:31
chummy beforehand. He was already on the outs with the family prior to this. Again, he was running
01:12:37
with a bad crowd. He was always need in need of money. He wasn't somebody in the
01:12:42
family that the family members were looking forward to seeing or kept in regular contact with.
01:12:48
>> Well, and also you can go down a rabbit hole of maybe this brother knew what happened to
01:12:55
his brother and knew that those guys or that guy was a bad individual and he had to get out
01:13:01
of town. >> Decades later, the murder of Roger Parent remains unsolved. The physical
01:13:06
evidence, the pack of Marlboros, was collected. Modern forensic analysis has, unfortunately, yielded nothing
01:13:15
on that. We do have a single fingerprint that was found on the pack of cigarettes. It's been checked
01:13:22
against databases for years, but never produced a match. They also have the slug and the wad from
01:13:29
the shotgun collected by the Bureau of Criminal Investigation, BCI. That remains as well.
01:13:36
We have the sketch based on a man seen in the drive-thru shortly before the murder. A white man
01:13:43
aged 35 to 40 with a brimmed hat was seen by an unspecified number of witnesses at the P&S Carryout around the
01:13:53
time of Roger Parent's murder. And keep in mind that's such a short window, right?
01:13:59
With people going in and out of there that only closes that window and makes it even smaller. Witnesses described the
01:14:06
suspect as a Caucasian man between ages of 35 and 40, about 5 ft 8 in tall, 160 to 170 lb, curly, sandy-colored hair,
01:14:17
was wearing a man's old-fashioned wide-brimmed felt hat. Uh some say it was gray.
01:14:24
He was also wearing a light brown or tan 3/4 length coat and blue jeans, had no facial hair, no glasses,
01:14:32
was a stranger to our best witness, customer number one, kept his hands in his pockets the entire
01:14:38
time, and he was a walk-in customer and was not seen getting into or out of a vehicle. The identity of the man in the
01:14:46
sketch and the identikit has yet to be identified according to Auglaize County Sheriff's Department. Before we wrap
01:14:54
here today, we mentioned that Pinto was able to track down some more info on this Pinto and figuring out if it's
01:15:05
directly connected or not is difficult based on the case file, but that Pinto was also spotted as at a 7-Eleven.
01:15:16
And there were three people inside this vehicle. There was an individual that had a jacket on that had
01:15:25
the words Black Bull Inn on the back of that jacket and that would have been a business that would have been a town or
01:15:35
so over. It's referred to as kind of a legit biker bar, a hangout for bike clubs for,
01:15:43
you know, bike clubs like the Outlaws from Lima and the local Barbarians as they were called back in '78, '79.
01:15:51
The problem with this and how much weight do you put into this lead has always been that the suspect's
01:15:57
description did not match that of a typical biker or the people that would uh frequent that Black Bull Inn on a
01:16:05
Friday night. >> Right. >> So, it was really just it's an interesting lead. Uh I know that they have attempted to
01:16:12
follow up on it over the years and will continue to follow up on all these leads
01:16:16
that we've discussed here today. Uh but it's really truly it's just another piece of a very complex puzzle.
01:16:23
I do want to give a shout-out to Abigail Miller who wrote a great article. There's not while the Sheriff's
01:16:30
Department have kept in close contact with the media and given presentations to the community and the public over the
01:16:35
years on this case, there's not been a lot of media on this story in the 40 some years that have
01:16:44
gone by. And Abigail Miller's piece that she did titled Cold Case Who Killed This
01:16:51
Man from uh 2023 in the Daily Standard was the best one that I came across when looking for information outside of the
01:17:00
Sheriff's Department. And truly where the case sits today, I'm hopeful. I think that it could still
01:17:07
very likely be solved, but the case is a collection of persistent rumors, family
01:17:12
suspicions, and faded evidence. And then top that off with the specters of Mike Sampson, Louie Parent, Alan Meckstroth,
01:17:22
and the unidentified man in the hat continue to haunt the investigation leaving a community with more questions
01:17:29
than answers and a family without closure for a brutal, senseless act that stole a man's life on a cold December
01:17:37
night. Another shout-out is due to Detective and Lead Investigator Timothy Ramel and Chief Deputy Mike
01:17:49
Peterson and the team there at the Sheriff's Department that they put together to speak with us True Crime
01:17:55
Garage. This is a case that has been talked about a lot over the decades since Roger has been killed.
01:18:01
And we discussed a lot of the local rumors. A lot of people liked Roger Parent Jr. and wanted to do whatever
01:18:07
they could to try to help. So, the Sheriff's Department did receive a lot of information early on and that has
01:18:14
continued over the decades. We are hoping that everyone listening today will take the time to look at the
01:18:20
composite sketches, look at the identikit that we have for you of the suspect, and more importantly share
01:18:29
those images. If you have any information about the events that led to Roger Parent's murder, you should report
01:18:36
that information to the Auglaize County Sheriff's Office at 419-739-6565. Ask to speak with Detective Tim Ramel or
01:18:48
Chief Deputy Mike Peterson. Callers can remain anonymous and tips can also be sent in anonymously through the
01:18:56
Sheriff's Office's website. >> [music] [music] >> All right, I want to thank everybody for
01:19:15
joining us here in the garage each and every week. Thanks for telling your mother. Thanks for telling your brother.
01:19:21
Your mom goes to college. Colonel, do we have any recommended reading for the beautiful listeners?
01:19:25
>> Yes, we do, Captain. This week we are recommending Michael Rosenberg's book War As They Knew It. Woody Hayes, Bo
01:19:33
Schembechler, and America in the Time of Unrest. The late 1960s and early 70s were a time of total turmoil in America.
01:19:44
The country was being torn apart by a war most people didn't support. Young men were being taken away by the draft
01:19:50
and racial tensions were high. Nowhere was this turmoil more evident than on college campuses. The uncertain times
01:19:59
presented a challenge to two of the greatest football coaches of all time. Woody Hayes, the legendary coach of Ohio
01:20:06
State, feared for the future of America. His protege and rival Bo Schembechler of
01:20:12
the University of Michigan didn't want to be bothered by these distractions. Michael Rosenberg dramatically weaves
01:20:20
the campus unrest and political upheaval into the story of Hayes and Schembechler, a rivalry that began at
01:20:28
the height of the Vietnam War. War As They Knew it, Woody Hayes, Boshamer, Beckler and America in the time of
01:20:36
unrest by Michael Rosenberg is this week's recommended reading. You don't have to write that title down now. We
01:20:42
will have it for you on our website, truecrimegarage.com. >> Until next week, be good, [music] be
01:20:47
kind and don't litter. >> [music] [music] [music] >> Support for this podcast comes from
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