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[Music] [Applause] [Music] [Applause] thank you thank you welcome to True Crime garage wherever
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you are whatever you are doing thanks for listening I'm your host Nick and with me as always is my brother from
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another mother he is the captain thank you thank you thank you it's good to be seen
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that's good to see you [Music] today we are drinking Devil's Triangle by Florida beer company in beautiful
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Cape Canaveral Florida garage grade four out of 5 bottle caps I said it last week
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Captain this is IPA weather so check out this IPA Devil's Triangle has a hazy golden amber color with hints of citrus
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and grapefruit to start and a strong Pine bitter finish and Devil's Triangle was brought to us by these little Devils
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first up we have Vanessa and Wellington New Zealand next we have Robin in Jeffersonville
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Indiana and all the way up in Kingston Ontario a big shout out to Sherry next we have Frank and gatesburg Maryland
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Frank says great show America needs you America America needs you he loves the Funky Music and our desire for justice
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that's because we're in them we're in America We Gotta Keep It Funky in America also we want to give a shout out
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to Tony and Sabrina in Brick New Jersey Tony congratulations to you for seven years of sobriety so hats off to you my
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friend cheers to you give me cheers to that you can take your hats off to you I tip my hat to you my friend and we've
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been flooded with birthday shout out so first up we say happy birthday to April who is celebrating and we also give a
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big birthday shout out to Helena Lee happy 30th Helena all right and then 25th birthday big shout out to goes to
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Ryan in Southern Ontario his girlfriend sent that she must actually really like you Ryan so happy Birthday to everybody
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out there and thank everybody for filling up the fridge this week and if you want to pitch in for next week's
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show go to True Crime garage.com and click on the Donate button and guess what number we were sitting at last
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night you know sitting at four for worldwide worldwide rankings of podcast shows well I don't even know this world
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I'd ring and it might just be America ranking we're number 35th 35th in in the United States of America
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friend thanks for playing if somebody was telling me about this road trip they took and they were playing the show for
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everybody now they're hooked now they're in the garage now they want to do some partying with Nick and the captain the
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garage is getting full we might have to change this to True Crime Warehouse if you'd like to give us a five-star
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rating do so on iTunes Now it helps to show tons and I will be shipping the t-shirts this week the douche canoe
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shirt so look forward to that and that's enough of the business everybody gather
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around grab a chair grab a beer let's talk some true crime foreign [Music] [Music]
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December of 2008 you learned in December of 2008 that the remains of your granddaughter were found
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is that correct yes sir what effect did that have on you when you learned that Haley's remains had been
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a deep a deep heart inside tears the whole gamut of just an emotional loss or breakdown inside of me
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and seeing what my wife and my son went through up to that moment had you held out
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the hope that Kaylee would be found alive absolutely every day from July 15th until the day we are told
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it was kindly in January of 2009 you went oh thank you breakfast man that's right let me get through this I
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need to have something inside of me to get through this do you need to break your staff no sir
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I'm fine January just let me know when you're when you're okay I'm okay sir on January 22nd of 2009 Mr Anthony you
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went and got a gun didn't you my understanding of the events of this date are that Mr Anthony
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went and got a gun that he did so with the purpose I believe he will testify he did so with
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the purpose of forcing people who he believed might know something about who killed Kaylee specifically friends
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or boyfriends of the defendant with the intention of forcing them to reveal what they knew
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and then taking his own life it is revealed in the suicide note and I believe he will testify
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that that's what happened the defense has brought up the suicide I do so the court knows intend for him
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to identify his suicide note and in my case I do intend to offer it because it shows that on January 22nd of
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2009 this man had no idea who killed Kaylee Marie Anthony and it rebuts implications by the defense that he did
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is directly contradictory to the defense's argument and it is proof and I do have case law when we try to
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admit the note but at this point the circumstances of suicide were raised by defense counsel when he asked the
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question about that event and I believe I'm entitled to go into that on the 22nd
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of January of 2009. this is um approximately six weeks after The Remains were found
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did you travel to a hotel in Daytona Beach for the purposes of taking your own life
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yes sir why on that particular day did you decide to take your life why that particular day I picked out I I
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really don't know all I know is my emotional state even through today is uh is very hard to accept that I don't have
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a granddaughter anymore but for that particular day I don't know I just felt like the right
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time to go and be with Kaylee did you show up call relatives and perhaps not literally but say good say
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your last goodbyes to them Oro I wanted to talk to my parents uh my sisters I know I called my son and then my wife
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and just step it out now I was okay um yes to say goodbye from last time did any of them try to get you to tell
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where you were do you remember the the content of the conversations no because really I was supposed to be going to a
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meeting that day and uh I just I know I just decided that was the time for me to get away from all this to spend time
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with Kaylee [Music] the trial of Casey Anthony the trial of the woman that the media was calling the
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most hated woman in America is about to be underway but before we get eyeballs deep into the trial just a couple of
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little tidbits leading up to it we have April 14 2009 that's when the State of Florida announces that they will seek
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the death penalty in the trial against Casey Anthony January 26 2010 Casey Anthony pleads
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guilty for 13 fraudulent check charges in April of 2010 Judge Stan Strickland steps down after the defense team files
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a motion accusing him of having an appropriate conversations with a blogger now this blogger who goes by the name of
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marinade Dave he blogged about the Casey Anthony case often and he had articles about the case and one of his articles
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was titled Casey Anthony Must Die Strickland basically had oh that guy was just who's getting right to the point
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yeah he it seems like the Blogger had already chose his side and it might be easily considered inappropriate for the
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judge to be having interactions with this blogger basically judge Strickland had a private meeting with the Blogger
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having lunch with him uh discussing the case and even giving him a tour of sorts
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of the court building and it turns out that Judge Stan Strickland was a fan of marinade Dave so
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after the defense files the motion Stan Strickland steps down for the trial Strickland would make a comment to the
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media stating that it appears that the truth and Miss Anthony are strangers yes that was a comment that he had made and
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of course Jose Baez in the defense team later would state that this is a big time inappropriate statement for the
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judge to be making so we now have judge Belvin Perry Jr who is appointed to take
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over the case August 14 2010 Cindy Anthony appears as a guest on The Today Show where she calls Casey Anthony a
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victim and she also claims that she is not involved with what happened to Kaylee's remains
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later that month George and Cindy Anthony's attorney Brad Conway he steps down because he disputes a Jose Baez
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motion claiming Conway was given unrestricted access to documents belonging to Texas equisearch to which
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the defense team was not given the same access before jury selection the defense filed
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a motion for a change of venue to move the trial out of Orlando you know you we have this this this case that's about to
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go to trial it's probably going to be the biggest case they kind of knew this going in I mean because the media
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coverage before the trial was gigantic and I think this is probably because of you know the precursor like the O.J
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Simpson trial yeah and you have like you said we have this media circus we have all these people she's already been
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basically convicted in the Public's eye wouldn't you agree and and the thing here is Jose Baez in the defense team
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well they have an obligation to their client to provide her with a fair trial and they don't think that they're going
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to be able to get that in Orlando with all the media coverage that they have had so they filed for this motion of
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change of venue um and it's by us same says that he was hoping that the trial will get moved to
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a place like Miami you know a place that has a lot more going on the more hustle
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and bustle where people weren't so in tune or so locked into all the media coverage of this case what ends up
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happening is Judge Perry decides that they would not have a change of venue in order to find a fair jury but rather the
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judge would select a city for the jury pool and they would bus this jury into Orlando and the location when when he
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says this the location of his choosing is not revealed to anyone for a while but it is announced later that Saint
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Petersburg Clearwater Florida would be the location for the jury pool which is actually it's curious why he picks this
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location because it's only about an hour and a half away from Orlando and now at
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this point we're at the jury selection so let's dive into that for a minute yeah after the trial defense attorney
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Jose Baez has spoke of what they were looking for as they tried to strategize about shaping the jury to its liking
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Jose said that the plan was to avoid young mothers and especially single mothers stating that young and or single
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mothers would be constantly comparing themselves or comparing Casey to themselves throughout the trial and they
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most likely would have a strong hate for Casey or at the very least May convict her of murder just because they feel
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that she is a bad mother they were hoping to fill the jury with as many males over the age of 45 as
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possible the thinking here is that an older the older men may look at a female of Casey's age pretty much as like a
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child where you might be more willing to forgive a child or maybe Overlook some acts that a child would make on May 20th
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2011 after 11 days of jury selection Judge Perry swears in a jury of five men and seven women plus three men and two
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women as alternate jurors now I want to take just a minute here and go through the jury that was selected for this
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trial we'll we'll let them remain nameless but we'll talk about them how the prosecutor as well as the defense
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team kind of saw them going into the selection process now the first woman that was selected she's an elderly
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Caucasian woman and she's a retired nurse now the defense was happy about this selection because you know older
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women she's a nurse nurse nurses tend to be nurturing and the defense also thought that there were some problems
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with some of the forensic evidence that the nurse might have somewhat of an understanding of
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um the second juror was a 45 year old African-American male he's an I.T guy we've already discussed some things
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regarding the I.T situation you know the the use of the family computer um so they thought that somebody with
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knowledge in that background could be good for the defense could also work out poorly for you and sway to the
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prosecution side the third juror was a 32 year old Caucasian female she was a volunteer at an alternative lifestyle
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camp and this this is a person that the jury really liked even though she was a jury
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really like you mean the defense really um I apologize the defense really liked this election because of her
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volunteering at this uh at this camp that she might be somebody that was more understanding of young people or young
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adults and have have some mindset towards that the fourth juror selected was a 54 year
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old African-American lady uh now the thing I got to point out here is that the defense wanted to they wanted a
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mixed race jury uh the defense stated that African Americans have historically have been discriminated by law so of
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course they are less trusting of law enforcement and they wanted to kind of put they they really wanted to put a
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bunch of African Americans on the jury because of their distrust of law enforcement and also that they they
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believed that because it was a death penalty case that that could sway in their favor as well well I think we both
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we've talked about this before we we both believe that that you know looking back that that was probably a mistake
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you know by the prosecutors to or the State of Florida to go after the death penalty yes
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the fifth juror selected was a 71 year old Caucasian woman retired um and there was a couple things that
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the defense really liked about her because of her age she didn't have any young children uh and the other thing
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was she didn't own a computer nor had she ever owned a computer so this was somebody that they knew right away might
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not have been privy to a lot of the information out there about Casey against Casey this is somebody that
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wouldn't be you know communicating with bloggers or reading blogs about Casey juror number six it was a 37 year old
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white Caucasian male he was a chef yeah and he had several young children that lived at his home so this was one that
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the prosecution uh really liked because of the fact of him having young kids um juror number seven is a 47 year old
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divorce Caucasian female she was a youth counselor so you could kind of lump her
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in the group with the uh the volunteer at the uh the camp right the summer camp juror number eight we have a 60 year old
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Caucasian woman um she is a service rep for a phone company uh and juror number nine is a 53
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year old Caucasian male who is unemployed juror number 10 uh 57 year old Caucasian
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male now he too was a service rep for a phone company and this is the same phone
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company as juror number eight which was of major concern to both the prosecutor and the defense uh the fear being here
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that the two knew each other uh but it was very quickly established that they did not
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juror number 11 was a 30 year old Caucasian uh male gym teacher at a high school uh apparently this guy was pretty
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good looking um okay yeah this is not the defense or the prosecutor stating that this man is
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this is handsome this is your statement this is my statement this was one good looking juror he was he was one handsome
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man wink wink um no but the thing here is the the reason why I say he must be pretty good
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looking is because some of the media would refer to him as instead of Juror number 11 they would refer to him as
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George Clooney so I get anytime you get compared to that guy right everybody wants to be compared to that guy I've
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never I've never been compared to that guy it's not happening for me either juror number 12 is a 61 year old
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Caucasian female and she worked at a Publix grocery store um you know we see some wins as far as
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the prosecutions concerned in some way ends as far as the defense is concerned but those are their kind of General
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thoughts on the jury that was selected for this trial now you know that both the prosecution and the defense they get
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a good opportunity to vet these people before they are chosen to be on the jury and according to questioning it appeared
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that out of the 12 jurors chose chosen that only one was considered to be pro-death penalty uh May 24 2011 the
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trial begins in Orlando Florida the prosecution States after Casey's parents left the house on June 16 2000 wait hold
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on I'm just trying to follow you we're now to opening statements we yes we are now at the opening statement of of the
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big trial some are calling it The Trial of the century the trial against the most hated woman in America and the
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troll trial yes the prosecution states that Casey's parents left the house on June 16
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2008. Casey returned to the home with Kaylee at this time using chloroform Casey knocked the kid out and placed
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duct tape over the mouth and nose of the child the baby suffocating her she then bundled the little girl's body
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up in trash bags and a laundry bag place them in the trunk of the vehicle she was
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driving and left the home that evening she went on a date with her boyfriend going to the Blockbuster Video Store to
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rent some movies which we talked about last episode then sometime before her vehicle was towed from the parking lot
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Casey Anthony dumped the body in a wooded area just several feet from Suburban Road about one quarter of a
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mile from the Anthony home during the prosecution's opening statement they made these claims and they went on to go
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through each of the events that took place in the 31 days that expired between the time Kaylee went missing and
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the time that she was reported as such needless to say it was a rather lengthy opening statement
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the defense States that Kaylee never was missing Kaylee Anthony died June 16 2008 when she
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drowned in her family's swimming pool defense attorney Jose Baez says to the jury that the Anthony family is
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extremely dysfunctional and the Jose Baez wanted to take the jury into the Anthony home on Hope Spring Drive
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stating that Casey was out partying and having fun during the days that Kaylee was unaccounted for because she was
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hiding in that deep dark place called denial a place that she had hid most of her life
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the defense told the jury that Casey was a good mother that Kaylee was never abused and was never without food
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without clothing Or Without Shelter stating that the jury would not hear one person testify about Kaylee being abused
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or mistreated by Casey and bias is going to claim that you know this whole family
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is just about lies and secrets and this is going to start way back when Casey was just eight years old yes the lies
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and secrets are all wrapped in this case and it started when she's eight years old when her father came into her room
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and began to touch her inappropriately and it escalated and escalated it started with fondling and then led to
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intercourse he stated that George was having sex with Casey several times a week until she was 12 years old Baya
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suspected that George either stopped at this time because she was getting either
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too old for his taste or the threat of the young girl getting pregnant and then when Casey was older her older
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brother Lee then inherited the traits of his father and Lee began sneaking into Casey's room at night and fondling her
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this started with with Lee when Casey was 15 years old and these were all secrets that Casey
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kept that she hid and this is why she is a liar she had to learn to lie to hide the Family secret pointing out further
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how dysfunctional the Anthony family is baya's brought up a wedding attended by the Anthony family when Casey was seven
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months pregnant and and showing it too she's showing the pregnancy the whole family attended this wedding and when
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when Cindy's brother asked her well isn't there something you would like to tell me about my niece Cindy asked what
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and her her brother says well she's clearly pregnant Cindy and George denied the pregnancy
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explaining Casey was just overweight Baez pointed out that the parents hid the pregnancy and that if they hid this
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child in life they would certainly hide this child in death stating they hid this child like a flower in the Attic So
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what were the defensive's claims to the accounts of death yeah that's one thing that I found very interesting was that
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bias went on to explain to the jury how Kaylee had died stating that on the morning of June 16th Cindy woke Casey
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and Kaylee before she left for work around 7 A.M saying goodbye to them in their bed then the two went back to
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sleep sometime later George woke Casey up this is estimated to be several hours later and started yelling at her you
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know where's where's Kaylee where's Kaylee and the two of them went and searched the house they searched the
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closets they searched under the beds and in the garage then the backyard and then
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noticing the pool ladder to the families of above ground pool was still up he told the jury how George held Kaylee's
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lifeless body and yelled at Casey as Casey cried telling Casey that her mother would never forgive her for this
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and that she was going to go to prison for the rest of her life for child neglect the other thing he kind of
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brains up which is you know smart on his part is he says well look here's another
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thing that's a problem with the prosecution's claims is they don't really know how the baby died we don't
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know how Kaylee died so therefore how can you charge somebody with murder and on top of that go after the death
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penalty when you don't know exactly how she died yeah and I think that I mean that had to have been a smart thing to
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do you know they don't know the cause of death and he's stating this right out of
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the gate and he's letting you know that you know you're going to hear this from the prosecution side later what I'm
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telling you now they're going to back it up that they don't have the cause of death so how can we charge anybody with
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murder we'll get right back to the trial of Casey Anthony right after this quick
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beer break all right cheers mates back to the troll trials now we have a lengthy trial to
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cover here captain and we can't go through every detail of such there were a lot of people that were called to
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testify and if we did so this this show we would basically have to do a show that was the length of the trial and
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we're here to just kind of point out the important parts as we see them as well as maybe some you know Peaks and valleys
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that took place during the course of the trial so we're going to kind of pick some key players some key characters
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that were involved in this trial and we'll kind of give an overview of what took place of of the statements that
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they made and testified to so the first witness that is called by the prosecution is George Anthony now under
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oath he would state that he never sexually abused his daughter Casey he's going to state that he had no knowledge
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of the death of Kaylee or did he cover up the death of Kaylee in any way also under tested while testifying he
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will state that he as well as the tow truck manager both agreed that from their experiences that they did smell
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what they consider to be human decomposition coming from Casey's car before George drove it home all right
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right so exactly when they go to uh pick up the car from it being in pound they both smell the same thing yes and this
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would be in July now under cross-examination George Anthony is going to state that he did not smell
00:29:32
decomposition in Casey's car on June 24th 2008. now this is when he would have seen the vehicle back at his home
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before it was ever towed and just to be clear he was not actually in this vehicle he was just feet away from the
00:29:48
vehicle out on the 24th the other thing that he would State too remember Casey returned gas cans to him that were
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stolen from his shed she stole from the shed now he would state that he did put duct tape over one of those cans after
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she had returned them to him he also testified that he had bought a gun to threaten Casey's friends into
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telling him where Kaylee was even though he knew that having a gun violated Casey's bail now the thing here is
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George believed that when they could not find Kaylee that that not only Casey may
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have known where she was but her friends the people that she was shacking up with
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during this 30-day time period that they would know more about the Kaylee situation than her than he and Cindy
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knew and he thought he was going to have to go and talk to these people and ask the hard questions often thought this
00:30:44
would make an amazing show right so what you do is you maybe you dress up like clowns I don't know because clowns are
00:30:53
creepy and he gets some guns and some torturing devices and you and these cases that aren't solved that you really
00:31:00
want solved you find these individuals and you torture them to until they tell you all right
00:31:07
I think I'd be a good show it might work well I'm not putting my stamp on that hey uh
00:31:14
Discovery call me that's right call him Jose is then asked George Anthony about his suicide attempt which took place in
00:31:24
January of 2009 and the next day the judge allows the jury to see the suicide note now this is one thing that we are
00:31:32
yet to cover in this case George Anthony did have a suicide attempt this took place January 23 2009 the the basics of
00:31:43
it are this that George decides to check himself into a hotel he takes about 70 pills and he drinks as much alcohol as
00:31:52
he can in attempt to take his and end his own life while there he was texting family members and calling some of them
00:32:00
and he did in fact leave that suicide note which the judge allows the jury to read I think this is important evidence
00:32:08
for the prosecution because the defense is trying to paint a picture here that you know well look the how she died was
00:32:17
that that George found Kaylee in the poll and what the prosecution is going to claim is
00:32:24
based off the evidence and the suicide note it proves that George wasn't involved
00:32:31
and he had no knowledge of what was going on so do you want to read that note well it's a bit of a double-edged
00:32:36
sword isn't it because I think I think at the time that the defense is trying to state that you know this might show
00:32:44
that there was a lot more going on with George and but I think you're right the prosecution as well they're they're like
00:32:50
yeah this also kind of shows he's innocent regardless it's full of emotion and the the suicide note that the jury
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was allowed to read is as follows it says Symphony Marie as you get this letter this should be no
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surprise that I have decided to leave this earth because I need to be with Kaylee Marie I cannot keep going because
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it should be me that is gone from this Earth not her I have lived many years I am satisfied with my decision because I
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have never been the man you Lee Casey and especially Kaylee Marie deserved I have never been the man any of you could
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count on I have always let each of you down in more ways than I can remember I do not
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feel sorry for myself I am just sorry I burden all of you the way I have my loss
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of life is meaningless Cynthia Marie you have always worked your hardest given the most to me and I have never thanked
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you 28 plus years ago you corrected me a man who has now found his identity and life
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what I mean is you always challenged me the right way and I always could never live up to your expectations you have
00:34:07
always been smarter more knowledgeable and thought things through and I love you for that
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I cannot be strong anymore Kaylee Marie our granddaughter I miss her I miss her so much I know you do too you
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were always the one that provided for her what did I provide I blame myself for her being gone
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you know for months as a matter of fact for a year or so I brought stuff up only
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to be told not to be negative Kaylee Marie I miss her I miss her I want my family back
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I sit here following apart because I should have done more she was so close to home why was she there who
00:34:52
placed her there why is she gone for months you and I especially you always question why
00:35:00
I want this to go away for Casey what happened why could she not come to us especially you or why not Lee
00:35:10
who is involved with this stuff with Kaylee I'm going crazy because I want to go after these people Casey hung with
00:35:19
prior to Kaylee being gone that is why I got that gun I wanted to scare these people you know they know
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more than they have stated you cannot sugar coat Kid Glove these people they need Hard Knocks to get info from
00:35:36
sure that will not bring Kaylee Marie back but was Casey threatened you know Casey does not deserve to be where she
00:35:44
is I miss her I miss her so much I am worried for her her personal safety is always on my mind I try to deal with so
00:35:54
so much as I do you also I have never wanted to my family for sorrow in any way I realize families have ups and downs
00:36:05
but we have suffered our share and then some Cynthia Marie you have always deserved
00:36:11
more and with me being gone you will I have always brought you down you know that you are better off
00:36:19
Lee will be there for you I cannot function knowing our granddaughter is gone Kaylee Marie never had a chance to
00:36:26
grow I wanted to walk her to school I wanted to help her in so many ways I sit here empty inside for her for you for us
00:36:36
yes you deserve more and you will have freedom to enjoy what you deserve I have taken what meds was given to me with
00:36:44
alcohol and I'm ready to give up as I can tell by my writing and thinking I am getting very stupid wow what a word
00:36:53
stupid yes I am again I do not feel sorry for myself I am stupid I cannot deal with stuff anymore the loss of
00:37:02
Kaylee Marie the loss of Casey the loss of us Cynthia Marie the meds I am ready saying goodbyes please understand it is
00:37:13
for the best I do not deserve life anymore you are the best you always have been I am sorry
00:37:19
for all that I have done to us I love you I hope you get to see Casey soon I am sorry I will take care of Kaylee once
00:37:28
I get to God hopefully I want to hold her again I miss her I will always love us I am sorry Cynthia Marie I am so
00:37:37
tired I am sorry I love you Cynthia Marie Kaylee here I come Lee I am sorry and like I've stated from the beginning
00:37:46
um George was more of her father you know Kaylee's father and he was the grandfather because she didn't have a
00:37:54
father figure so I would assume that that's how Kaylee saw him and so I think this was a pretty
00:38:02
crushing blow to him I think it just points to the idea that he didn't know what happened so the defense's argument
00:38:10
that Kaylee drowned and that George helped Casey cover this up I think is a lot of malarkey yeah and I to be honest
00:38:19
with you Captain I don't know which side of the fence was pushing for the suicide
00:38:25
note to be viewed by the jury I think what the defense was trying to do I don't think they were trying to accuse
00:38:31
him of murder obviously they never State at any point during the trial that they
00:38:35
believe he killed the girl right but I think what the defense was trying to do was bring up this suicide attempt by
00:38:42
pointing out pointing out that George may have you know because of the suicide maybe he did have more involvement maybe
00:38:49
he had more on his chest than we know about and well I think they brought I think they brought up the idea of
00:38:55
suicide and then I think the prosecution is the one saying hey look if you're going to bring this up that's fine but
00:39:02
that's then we're going to look at this note and by the context of the note it points to the fact that he didn't know
00:39:09
anything about it and I yeah I agree it would be totally different if he said I can't live with myself for what I've
00:39:15
done but I didn't say that he said I got a gun and I wanted to get answers you know and I and these people know more
00:39:23
the thing that constantly brings constantly with this family is the enabling and and parents never want
00:39:33
their children to fail they never want them to hit rock bottom and most of the time people know that if somebody's
00:39:39
going through some crap in their life they have to hit rock bottom but if you have parents or friends that keep
00:39:45
enabling you and keep bringing you to the surface you never hit rock bottom and I think that's what happened
00:39:50
constantly with this family again even in this note even at the time of his well you know wanting to take his own
00:39:57
life to be with his granddaughter he keeps on saying my daughter doesn't deserve to be where she's at
00:40:04
um uh yes she does yeah but that's the parent in him speaking and I and I think what you hear in right suicide note
00:40:12
right but some parents are more enablers than others yeah and I think I think what you hear in that suicide note
00:40:19
you're exactly right I think the it it totally if you if anybody on the jury had any speculation that the suicide
00:40:28
attempt would help further the defense's case if if you would believe that George
00:40:34
knew then what you were talking about I think the suicide note clears that up really quickly and it it washes that all
00:40:41
away for me because in that note yes he's talking about mainly about his shortcomings and things that the family
00:40:49
deserved better and he didn't give enough and didn't do enough but he never says that he's guilty of anything other
00:40:55
than maybe he could have been a better parent or a better husband at times right and I think these are all thoughts
00:41:01
that whether we're having good days or bad days I think we all have those thoughts in in the back of our minds
00:41:06
from time to time that we could be better parents we could be better spouses we could be better brothers or
00:41:12
sisters or or children uh to our parents you know we you always have those feelings inside of you and that
00:41:19
certainly there's no there's no words of guilt in my mind in that suicide note you do the best you can as a parent you
00:41:27
try to provide at the end of the day you just can all you can do is try your best
00:41:33
you know tough thing but then so then next they're going to start bringing up character Witnesses for Casey Anthony
00:41:40
yeah they're gonna call a lot of Casey's friends to the stand um and we're not going to go through
00:41:45
them individually but the the basic summary of what they're all kind of saying is that all of them had heard
00:41:52
Casey at one point or several points tell them lies about Casey having a job during that June and July of 2008 the 30
00:42:02
days basically yep about uh the nanny you know that Kaylee had a nanny these were all lies that she didn't just tell
00:42:09
to her family she was telling them to the friends as well there were some that kind of stood out from from amongst the
00:42:17
group there one would be Amy remember her friend Amy the one that she uh stole money from yeah she stole the checks
00:42:24
from her now Amy would state that she received a text from Casey on June 27th stating that he Casey had a dead animal
00:42:35
that she had hit with the vehicle and that was kind of wedged up in the the frame of her car and that's
00:42:43
all the further explanation she gives regarding this may be pointing out why there might be some kind of foul smell
00:42:49
coming from the vehicle um another one of importance is a former boyfriend testifies that Casey told him
00:42:59
that uh Casey's brother Lee Anthony had sexually groped her at one point in her life Judge Perry does not allow the the
00:43:09
jury to hear testimony from Casey's uh ex-boyfriend stating this um that that he had tried to grope her
00:43:18
and a witness that I thought was really interesting was the neighbor the neighbor came forward and said that in
00:43:23
mid-june that uh Casey came over with her boyfriend and asked to borrow a shovel because she wanted to dig up a
00:43:31
bamboo root yeah and there's some interesting things here um you know he couldn't give a date on
00:43:37
that but he did say it was sometime in mid-june it didn't seem of anything of great importance to him so why would
00:43:43
would he remember the exact date the thing here is you know there there's a great true crime author Diane Fanning
00:43:50
who who wrote a book very early in this case actually before it went to trial and shortly after she was arrested uh
00:43:57
Casey Anthony being arrested not Diane Fanning but Diane gives her gives her kind of idea of what she thinks happened
00:44:06
in this case and one thing she states in there is that she believed it was unbeknownst to her at the time that that
00:44:13
Tony was with Casey when she went to borrow the the shovel and Diane speculated that maybe uh Casey had
00:44:20
borrowed the shovel to to assist in disposing of the body and that maybe the dogs remember the dogs had gone the
00:44:28
cadaver dogs had smelled and hit on some points in the backyard of the Anthony family home right and her thought was
00:44:35
maybe Casey's original thought was that she would bury the body in the backyard we now know at this time she was not
00:44:42
alone on that day she was was with her boyfriend Tony and he would further testify that they actually borrowed the
00:44:49
shovel to break into the shed where they were going to go steal the the gas cans
00:44:55
now they're going to start calling police officers and FBI agents and the first police officers that arrive at the
00:45:00
Anthony's household the day that they're going to report her missing remember those the 9-1-1 calls they're going to
00:45:07
claim that in the Pontiac they didn't actually smell any deceased body right right they they didn't smell any human
00:45:14
decomposition in Casey's car they also did admit that they did not search the other two vehicles that were on the
00:45:21
property that night a dog handler that is called he describes the dog alerting to human
00:45:27
decomposition in the trunk of this vehicle as well as near Kaylee's playhouse in the backyard now and just
00:45:37
since we're on this point right they actually had a scientist that did this study or did this test basically he
00:45:45
created this test yes and what they would do was they would take the sample and they would kind of I think they
00:45:51
would liquefy it and then turn it into a vapor and then somehow put that into a can whatever anyways the test was to
00:46:00
prove that there was a rotting body basically in the trunk of the car yeah right and so he he's done this test many
00:46:09
times he created the test he created the he created the contraption that that conducts the test this is Dr uh Voss
00:46:19
and he you know he's got some big long word that describes this contraption that is going to conduct this test but
00:46:27
he does state that he found uh using this test signs of human decomposition and a high level of chloroform in the
00:46:34
trunk of Casey's car so now we got two things pointing against Casey Anthony now Baez the defense attorney is going
00:46:41
to do something pretty smart here he's going to State well that's great that you have this it's scientific proof okay
00:46:48
it's not this is not an opinion right this is scientific proof and bias kind of shatter is that by saying well you've
00:46:57
never testified before well not only has he not testified but also this method of
00:47:02
of determining that there was human decomposition in the trunk has never been used in any trial anywhere before
00:47:09
right and I would also just like to make the statement that it has been several hundreds hundreds of times now
00:47:16
since since this date right uh yeah Baez would go on to claim that Dr Voss had a
00:47:23
uh Financial uh course in this because if if he could get it into one trial then this would be
00:47:31
considered somewhat fact and it could be used all over the country and this was a
00:47:37
device that he could then sell to law enforcement right and a bunch of law enforcement use it now but but that's
00:47:44
because it's science well an FBI forensic chemist confirms chloroform residue in the trunk of Casey's car but
00:47:54
also states that household cleaning products leave traces of chloroform right a professor of chemistry called by
00:48:01
the defense says that chemical compounds identified by Dr Voss and air samples can be found in household products and
00:48:10
garbage as well what ends up happening here is we get into this lengthy battle over is this test going to be considered
00:48:20
evidence or not you know you have the prosecution wants it to be evidence obviously and the defense is going to
00:48:25
try to poke as many holes in it as they possibly can I found that this was one part of the trial that got a little
00:48:32
chippy you know where it seemed like the defense and the the prosecution were kind of going at one another more than
00:48:38
talking to the experts right what ends up happening is that Judge Perry decides because I don't I'm not clear on how
00:48:46
they got to this point but this is how chippy it got Judge Perry decides that he is not going to allow the jury to
00:48:53
sniff air samples that were taken from the car trunk from the trunk yeah they don't need to do that yeah here here
00:49:00
smell this don't be one of those people oh my God this salad tastes so bad try it
00:49:08
no well while actually while we're on the trunk of the car let's talk about the single hair that was removed from
00:49:14
the the trunk of the vehicle uh and this was similar to the hair uh from Kaylee's
00:49:20
hair brush and it had what what they call as root banding and it was consistent with that from a decomposing
00:49:27
body uh that's what I'm calling the death band on that hair the thing here is you know this is something that they
00:49:35
are again it's kind of like the the smell coming from the trunk they have some proof of this but the defense is
00:49:44
pretty quick to poke some holes in this as well because there were other hairs that they found you're a mother of a the
00:49:50
child the child's in your car there's hairs everywhere right so I so that's fine and that's going to be easy for the
00:49:59
defense to poke holes in but the fact that there's this band is what's way more interesting to me yeah they were
00:50:06
able to get somebody the defense was able to get someone to testify that that finding that on that hair could also
00:50:12
just mean that it sat in the trunk of the car for an extended period of time right which you would think that like if
00:50:19
you're getting groceries in and out of a car a hair could fall off of her you know it's pretty easy to explain another
00:50:26
thing that was brought up uh We've brought up the duct tape already well crime scene investigators identified a
00:50:32
piece of Hinkle brand duct tape uh found at the the scene and testified that it is the same brand as George Anthony put
00:50:41
on the red gas can uh one investigator states that no Hinkle brand tape was found elsewhere in the Anthony's home
00:50:50
now FBI they did test on on this duct tape that was found on Kaylee's body and they could not find any fingerprints
00:50:58
on this duct tape they didn't find Casey's fingerprints they didn't find George Anthony's fingerprints but the
00:51:05
the other thing here is uh they also didn't find any DNA now now the thing that I would argue here that this does
00:51:13
not point to anybody being innocent in my mind whether whether you want to fight for Casey or whether you want to
00:51:19
fight for George it doesn't point to either them being innocent that no DNA was found because they didn't find any
00:51:25
DNA of Kaylee it was on her the body was so far decomposed and on top of that duct tape has has certain natural fibers
00:51:34
that are in it as well and from from it sitting out it for six months in the Heat and that area had flooded at one
00:51:42
point and in you know in the rain and all the elements any trace of DNA was removed from the duct tape furthermore
00:51:49
any of those natural fibers had basically disintegrated by this point by the time that they found Kaley his body
00:51:56
so they have the duct tape right and then we know that that's connected to the Anthony household it's
00:52:02
the same brand yes and then we have this laundry basket yeah laundry bag okay so
00:52:09
this laundry bag they're sold in pairs the other pair is found at the Anthony household yes the the this is actually a
00:52:15
pretty common bag it's something you could buy at any grocery store but like the captain said it's sold in at like a
00:52:21
two or three pack and they found the other ones at the home uh Kaylee Anthony's whole bedroom is decorated in
00:52:26
Winnie the Pooh stuff and they found a Winnie the Pooh blanket at the scene now so you know yeah well and what they're
00:52:36
going to point out there is that you know in the beginning Casey was stating that this was well not a stranger
00:52:44
abduction that it was a nanny abduction oh zany The Nanny yeah and the prosecution here is pointing out that
00:52:50
look sorry but every item that was found where Kaylee was found was found in the
00:52:56
Anthony home this body was transferred from the Anthony home right basically it's saying everything that comes out of
00:53:03
this girl's mouth is horseshit and it's not even just the zany The Nanny thing then it became this whole well it's
00:53:09
somebody else and there's this whole sex ring and it's sex trafficking and all this crazy nonsense that Casey kept on
00:53:17
throwing out uh and that was just to get people talking about something other than her yeah well it's at this point in
00:53:24
the trial that you know while they're talking about the duct tape the investigators they show photographs of
00:53:30
the remains of Kaylee and some of these photos show that the duct tape appears to be over the mouth area now one invest
00:53:37
investigator does admit that the duct tape might not have originally been on the mouth and could have shifted
00:53:44
position as he collected The Remains at this point in the trial Casey Anthony becomes ill looking at the photographs
00:53:52
and the jury is dismissed for the day the prosecution also brought into the trial some video footage now we talked
00:54:00
about this this is all video that we've seen on CNN Fox News Nancy Grace Nancy Grace all everybody that was covering
00:54:08
the trial top mom this was video footage showing Casey Anthony yelling at her parents while she's in jail lying to her
00:54:15
parents while she's in jail and and but the interesting thing here Captain is there is video footage of her denying to
00:54:22
an officer on July 16 2008 that Kaylee had drowned in the pool as the officer had suggested to her
00:54:32
right now you would think right that this would be a big home run for the prosecution right first we have this
00:54:39
woman Casey Anthony that nobody likes anyway and now we are showing you video footage of her lying to her parents
00:54:46
right uh but what ends up happening is this actually only ends up being what I would consider to be a small victory for
00:54:52
the prosecution because they end up showing the jury two tapes and both of the tapes are very long extremely long
00:55:00
where we're only actually showing small parts of herself of Casey making herself
00:55:05
look very bad in a very short period and one thing that we know is one of the worst things
00:55:11
you can do in a trial is to bore the jury you know they they lose interest they lose focus of what's important at
00:55:18
that moment if you drag things out too long our listeners are saying the same thing
00:55:24
about the show here smell this hey come here people say have you seen those videotapes of her in prison oh man she's
00:55:32
the worst person ever it's very small fragments where she is the worst person ever but she is the worst person ever
00:55:38
but I think it's a huge home run and the jury distance catch on to that your defense came from this police officer
00:55:45
your defense came from well what makes the most logical sense oh she drowned in the poll this is how we're going to
00:55:53
defend you but you already denied that before and that's going to be your argument if I'm on the jury I'm
00:56:01
going this troll is lying about everything that all the evidence points to her having knowledge all the evidence
00:56:08
points to her line about everything and then on top of that her defense is something she already denied yeah yeah
00:56:17
and you know what Captain here's where I think that they made a quite a big stumble the process execution that is
00:56:22
one not only showing the the lengthy tapes but you know what I would have done just that little clip of her
00:56:29
denying it to the officer you got a pool like that JFK moment you know from Oliver Stone's great movie back into the
00:56:36
left back into the left back into the left you just keep showing that part and over and over again rather than
00:56:44
showing them almost I think they spent back into most of the day reviewing these two tapes it was extremely long
00:56:51
and I think you could have really just honed in on a few points and really hit the home run a grand slam even with that
00:56:59
back into the left of showing her denying that piece I probably would have you can play it a hundred times right
00:57:04
yeah just play it a hundred times uh you sure she didn't drown in the pool nope sure she didn't drive on the pool nope
00:57:12
just keep playing it over and over yeah so we have we have the medical examiner and I and we're not going to go through
00:57:19
all of that because we we know that they said that this was a homicide and we know that the defense is saying well you
00:57:26
can't you can't say that because you can't give us a cause of death they ruled it a homicide because of the duct
00:57:33
tape because the body was hidden because nobody reported her missing you know those are the reasons for doing so but
00:57:38
an expert that was called This is an expert in forensic entomology uh states that he found flies related to
00:57:46
decomposition in the trunk of Casey's car now the defense is going to call their own expert that is an expert in
00:57:54
the same field and this expert will state that there was if there was a body in the trunk uh they should have found
00:58:03
hundreds or thousands of these blowflies trapped in the trunk so where one expert
00:58:09
says we found we found flies uh I think it was like one or two you know maybe two or three flies and the defense is
00:58:18
saying that you should have found hundreds of or thousands of them let's be clear though that was all cleaned out
00:58:23
when they got the car right they pulled stuff from the trunk initially they all smelled a bad smell and they threw away
00:58:31
trash that that uh the mother claims there was maggots all over yeah maggots and flies and all that stuff so there's
00:58:39
your hundreds of flies that were thrown out as evidence well but also the defense is going to claim that with this
00:58:46
expert that these the the flies that they found that they're saying are related to a decomposing body are the
00:58:53
same that you would expect to find in rotting trash as well okay uh now we talked about the computer activity on
00:59:01
the Anthony's home computer so they're going to call the state and the defense are both going to call several software
00:59:09
analysts um and one will state that someone used the Anthony computer to search a website this is sizepot.com for
00:59:17
Chloroform 84 times on March 21st 2008 uh during four times 84 times that's a lot of research during cross-examination
00:59:27
this expert admits that the automatic page reloading could account for that number and there was no way of knowing
00:59:36
how many times chloroform was actually searched and furthermore they could not State who
00:59:44
or they could not know who was the person performing the searches on the computer at the right time
00:59:50
um but here's what's interesting go for it is that there's only two adults in the household at this time
00:59:57
so we have George or Casey that is by all evidence the only two adults that could have been in
01:00:07
the household at the time now the defense is going to call Casey's mother and she's going to come to the stand and
01:00:13
she's going to testify I made that search right and then the prosecution is going to come back and go hey crazy
01:00:22
you are at work right everything states that you're at work yeah and there's time cards to prove so
01:00:30
there's co-workers stating that you were there and she still lies no that was me
01:00:36
because I was looking up this thing uh because the bamboo you have to kill certain things of the bamboo and and I
01:00:43
misspelled it and it this came up and I clicked on it yeah if you type in the first few letters of what you're
01:00:48
searching for some a more popular search might be the first that appears and you
01:00:53
click on that where the prosecution dropped the ball and what the defense was ready for
01:00:59
was this other search death by Suffocation right and the for some reason during the trial
01:01:06
the the the prosecution never brought this up no they spent most of the time trying to prove that Cindy uh was not
01:01:13
the one that searched for Chloroform right and what what they're also able to confirm is that a search for Chloroform
01:01:21
on the Anthony computer uh took place not only on March 21st but uh there was also how to make chloroform on March 17
01:01:30
2008. so we have two different searches here the defense is also going to claim that Casey didn't know what chloroform
01:01:37
was and that she had searched for Chloroform because it was something she had seen on her was it her boyfriend or
01:01:44
ex-boyfriend at the time his Myspace or Facebook page that he had some kind of post that said win her over with
01:01:51
chloroform it was supposed to be some kind of joke where you see a some really shitty joke a good job you just made a
01:01:57
shitty joke on MySpace A well-dressed man standing behind A well-dressed woman saying when when her over with
01:02:03
chloroform and that the search was simply for she didn't know what it was and wanted to look it up and figure out
01:02:09
why that post was so funny um it which that look that explains the one but because the prosecution didn't
01:02:15
bring up death by Suffocation then you know they they dropped the ball there because big time while we're
01:02:22
talking about the investigators let's talk about a lead detective that uh testified during the trial and he stated
01:02:29
that there were no phone calls between Cindy and George Anthony during the week of June 16 2008 but he went on to admit
01:02:38
that he was not aware that George Anthony had a second cell phone now Cindy will be called to the stand to
01:02:45
testify yes and she will testify that she swam with Kaylee the night before she was last seen in the family's above
01:02:54
ground swimming pool and she also would testify that Kaylee could get up the ladder into the pool by herself
01:03:02
uh she also believed that Casey worked at Universal Studios in Orlando uh and believed that there was a babysitter
01:03:10
named zany uh Cindy Anthony says that uh her description of Casey's car smelling
01:03:17
like someone had died or like something had died in the damn car right and that's what we heard on the 9-1-1 call
01:03:23
on the stand she says that that was just simply a figure of speech that she she ultimately ended up trying to get rid of
01:03:31
the smell by spraying Febreze all within the car and inside the trunk as well she
01:03:38
says that on the evening of June 16th when she came home from work that she did find the pool ladder in the pool you
01:03:47
know so it was attached to the pool so somebody could get into the pool with that ladder being up and she also stated
01:03:54
that Kaylee did have the ability and had witnessed it on more than one occasion of opening up the sliding back door to
01:04:01
the home to get out to the pool by herself well you know she can't open that if it's locked right right she
01:04:09
couldn't or she couldn't climb the ladder if it was not up right she also stated in her testimony that
01:04:15
she definitely recalls the latter being up on the night of the 16th because she remembers having a conversation with
01:04:22
George about that ladder being up stating that it should not have been up because after swimming with Kaylee the
01:04:30
night before that she had remembered taking the ladder down so she had this conversation with him about why the
01:04:36
latter would be up to the pool at some point during the trial the defense then shows a a picture to the jury and after
01:04:46
hearing Cindy's comments this is a pretty powerful picture because this is a picture of of young Kaylee opening the
01:04:54
sliding glass door at the home it clearly showing that she was able to do so now in the picture this is kind of
01:05:01
a famous picture so I shouldn't have to describe it too much you cannot actually
01:05:04
see Kaylee's face but you kind of see what appears that she may have run into the room you see the back of her little
01:05:11
body with her hair and her arm is reaching up up in her hand has has opening the sliding glass door unlike
01:05:17
you stated before she is going to you know make the claims that she did the Google searches yeah and that's just
01:05:24
false and I think a lot of her testimony is just false and I think she's a liar and I also think she's somebody
01:05:32
that doesn't want to believe that her child is capable of uh murdering her granddaughter
01:05:42
and I think at this point and I think we talked about this a while back though um
01:05:49
is the idea that she already lost her granddaughter and she can't do anything about that
01:05:56
and one of the reasons why I think the prosecution shouldn't have went for the death penalty
01:06:03
is that by doing so you're going to put both of her parents in a defensive mode because they need to defend her at least
01:06:12
through the trial right right and and Casey's mother States well maybe not to the point that
01:06:20
she doesn't receive prison time but you know because there there was first degree murder charge and a manslaughter
01:06:25
charge maybe the maybe Cindy's thoughts were okay I could see maybe Casey was you know guilty of some type of
01:06:33
manslaughter charge but not that of a first degree murder right here's the problem with it she made this statement
01:06:40
saying oh well you know I prayed to God and I prayed and I prayed you know to spare my daughter's life or actually
01:06:50
what she stated was give me an answer if she is guilty of this then find her guilty the problem with this you
01:06:59
hypocritian is that you lied on the stand and if you didn't lie on the stand then
01:07:07
maybe she is found guilty right so you can't sit there and say well you know God gave me the answers
01:07:16
you're lying for some of those answers well and I think in my opinion that uh Cindy was the most
01:07:24
interesting person to watch on the stand and it was uh one because I didn't know
01:07:29
I never had a clue what she was going to say next what her answer would be to the
01:07:33
next question right um but the thing that was fascinating to me is you know the prosecution's made up
01:07:39
of a team it's not just one person you know they had they had a you know very bright group of people working on this
01:07:45
prosecution team and but she would go Toe to Toe with every one of them and she would get you know she'd make her
01:07:51
mean little face and she'd point at them from time to time and she would argue with them you know she would dance with
01:07:58
anybody on that prosecution team it's definitely a bright individual and any time that the prosecutors seemed unhappy
01:08:05
with her answers or like they maybe they didn't believe her she was willing to argue it until the end of the day if she
01:08:13
had to so it was interesting to me to watch the interaction between her and the prosecutors when they necessarily
01:08:19
didn't agree with what she was saying and I and I want to be clear I feel for this individual right
01:08:27
she lost her baby you know yeah her granddaughter but her baby and then in the process
01:08:35
she's losing her daughter right I told I can't even imagine or to to begin to tell you what I would do but I have to
01:08:46
it's really hard for me to lie because I physically get sick for example I did well I can't even say it I was
01:08:56
going to go to do 10 miles on my bike the other day right okay somebody text me they said how many miles you get
01:09:03
well I got 9.9 right most people would just go 10. you look like you're physically getting sick yeah because I
01:09:11
can't but it's like but some people just uh some people are just honest people and
01:09:17
and maybe she was lying look if she's lying to protect her daughter I feel for you but at the same time there's no
01:09:24
justice there's no justice for that little baby and and and that's something that you could have gave to that little
01:09:32
baby that you didn't well there was also a big question regarding uh another one of her actions
01:09:39
and this would be that private investigators that worked for the Anthony family now I want to be clear on
01:09:45
this they did not work for Casey Anthony they worked for George and Cindy Anthony
01:09:50
uh there was a and I don't really understand what the defense was trying to point out about this situation but uh
01:09:59
they were trying to prove that Cindy had sent the private investigators to search
01:10:05
the area where Kaylee's body would later be found um maybe they were trying to point out
01:10:11
that the that the parents knew where the body would be that where the body would
01:10:15
be found and that they wanted their investigators to find the body um obviously that didn't happen or maybe
01:10:21
there was a tip yeah and um Cindy would deny that on stand she said that she never sent the private
01:10:28
investigators to that area to find to to look for Kaylee's body um but even though there was proof of
01:10:35
that right well the the proof came with some other people involved in the trial first of all you had
01:10:42
um remember melish detective melish that we talked about he stated that he heard
01:10:47
Cindy direct them to that area to to search that area uh we also have Lee Anthony her own son says that under
01:10:57
testified to this that he knew that his mother sent the investigators to that area to search for Kaylee
01:11:06
um he states that she sent them to that area after she had spoken to a psychic but again she would deny this and this
01:11:14
is another part of the trial where you see them call Cindy for a little bit she gives her testimony then they call these
01:11:20
other people to kind of you know discredit that and then they call Cindy again and she sticks with what she had
01:11:26
said now uh on the stand though Lee the the other thing that I found interesting
01:11:31
that he had said as well Lee would be the brother yes that's Casey's older brother
01:11:36
um Lee Anthony stated that he was not told that Casey was pregnant with Kaylee until just days before Kaylee's birth so
01:11:43
that kind of backs up the weird thing that the defense brought up with Cindy's brother saying you know it was kind of
01:11:49
like the parents were trying to hide this this pregnancy um you know during even when Casey was
01:11:55
seven and a half months pregnant well and again that's one of the things I thought was funny
01:12:01
about the Discovery ID documentary was how she was saying you know oh well Casey was so excited to have this baby
01:12:09
and she wanted this baby and she was wanted to be a mother and we were all excited uh that's not true it doesn't
01:12:18
seem like and then we have a we have friends that came forward saying oh well when she found out that she was pregnant
01:12:24
she really didn't know who the father was and then she was like I'm just gonna have an
01:12:30
abortion and then the mother talked her out of that and probably the mother said
01:12:34
oh no we'll be here for you and and we'll we'll help you and so you didn't know who the father was then she lied to
01:12:43
guys about who the father was and then they had to take tests and figure out well you're lying to me well there's no
01:12:49
honor Amongst Thieves right and I know they're not thieves but but we're talking about a lot of people telling a
01:12:55
lot of stories that just don't add up at the end of the day a couple things that
01:12:59
took place with Casey during the trial we talked about her breaking down and during when they were showing the
01:13:05
picture of pictures of the remains but some other interesting tidbits was on June 25th uh judge Belvin Perry Jr he
01:13:14
temporary halts proceedings after the defense makes a motion to determine if Casey was even competent to stand or to
01:13:22
proceed with the trial two days later she is found competent and they carry on with the trial this is after a
01:13:29
psychological evaluation uh just a few days after that this is when Casey tells the judge that she does not want to
01:13:38
testify on her own behalf so for those of you that didn't keep track during the trial or didn't want trial she actually
01:13:44
never took the stand now the defense is going to call a witness named Crystal Holloway yes and for me this is like the
01:13:52
Matlock witness remember the old courtroom show drama Matlock and once in a while they would you know have not
01:14:00
every episode but once in a while they'd pull some witness or you know person up
01:14:04
to the stand and it was the witness that's totally out of left field somebody you didn't expect to hear from
01:14:10
the whole episode you'd never heard of this person and then all of a sudden everything becomes very clear well I
01:14:15
don't know that this made anything more clear for me but what it did do was this
01:14:19
was the witness out of nowhere for me I didn't know who this person was and when
01:14:24
they started making these statements I thought wow this is this is truly truly a mystery here now Crystal Holloway she
01:14:33
was actually a volunteer that that it volunteered during some of these searches for Kaylee and she was called
01:14:40
To The Stand because she well according to her testimony she states that she had an affair with
01:14:48
George Anthony and she states that George Anthony during the course of their relationship had told her that
01:14:55
Kaylee's death was simply an accident that snowballed out of control now under cross-examination she also agreed with
01:15:05
her earlier statement to police which she said George Anthony did not say that he knew it was an accident which is
01:15:13
pretty confusing in itself but the thing we have here okay Judge Perry ends up telling the jurors
01:15:22
that Crystal Holloway's testimony could it could be used to impeach George Anthony's credibility but that it was
01:15:31
not proof of how Kaylee died so we get some additional instruction from from the judge to the jury there which is a
01:15:40
little more than what I think is necessary but when they go back and talk to George you know she claims she had an
01:15:46
affair with him and he denies that yes and he doesn't deny that he went to our house which I thought was kind of odd uh
01:15:53
because he claimed I think he went to her house three times yeah that's quite a bit well you're a married man I don't
01:16:00
know if you should be going over to a lady's house that many times that especially somebody that you just met
01:16:06
that just came into your life it's not like a long time friend or anything yeah Crystal Holloway would claim that they
01:16:13
had a sexual relationship that they had a romantic Affair that went on for some time that they spoke not only you know
01:16:20
not only over the phone but they texted one another from time to time and furthermore that she loaned George quite
01:16:28
a bit of money I think it was like five thousand dollars or something like that which I kind of that to me kind of rings
01:16:35
true of a kind of a true statement because we know how much George had issues financially so but we also have
01:16:44
to take into account you know where this is coming from right this is coming from
01:16:48
a lady that got involved with the searches uh some people want to find the missing
01:16:54
baby right some people just want to be involved right and I think this is one of those people yeah I think
01:17:02
she just wanted to be involved and when the searches are over okay I can you know is it a made-up story that they had
01:17:09
a fair I don't know is it a made-up story that George told her something I don't know right you know I I just I I
01:17:16
you know there's so many people in this case that lie yeah that it's hard to believe
01:17:23
anything anyone's saying well and I and I believe that she gave that she said that he told her that statement that it
01:17:31
was an accident that snowballed out of control before they found the body of Kaylee now the other thing that the that
01:17:38
the defense would present is that she lived in one of those condo communities this Crystal Holloway and they had a
01:17:46
security guard from that from that condo community that had seen George going to
01:17:51
and from her condo on several occasions now like you said George does not deny that he went to visit her he does deny
01:18:01
any type of romantic relationship with her he denies that he ever borrowed any money from her he does state that he
01:18:07
visited her on several occasions he exchanged text messages with her he was stating that she he was under the
01:18:15
impression that she had some form of cancer or or a tumor and that he thought that he was you know she needed somebody
01:18:21
to talk with she needed somebody to spend some time with her and that he thought he was doing a good deed in
01:18:28
spending time with her and helping her through her her troubled time as far as closing statements go they did a lot of
01:18:35
just repeat they basically mirror what both the defense and the prosecution was trying to prove in their opening
01:18:42
statements and throughout the course of the trial one of the big differences here though was because Baez didn't
01:18:49
prove or even try to prove any sexual abuse that they were ordered by the judge that you can't talk about that in
01:18:56
closing in your closing argument correct you can't bring that up correct you think and and to me that's that's pretty
01:19:04
sneaky pretty slimy to make these allegations from the get-go to make all the jury go whoa what's going on here
01:19:12
you can't unhear things sometimes and I think that's kind of what bias was doing
01:19:18
there this is absolutely a whale of a case everything that took place before and then we get to the trial was it the
01:19:24
trial of the century one could argue that you know the trial against the woman the most hated woman in America
01:19:29
well it's a whale of evidence right and so and all that all the lies and all that speculation of what was going on in
01:19:38
those 31 days uh such a mystery like we said the trial's huge now we have to go over the
01:19:46
verdict and then we have to go over the aftermath there's all these odd things that keep popping up some stuff that
01:19:54
just popped up recently and uh the parents have interesting theories now looking back on things and then of
01:20:01
course our thoughts on the troll I'm looking forward to that Captain maybe tomorrow you know what maybe I'll take
01:20:07
the handcuffs off you and and stop holding you back so much regarding this I can't tell you guys how many times
01:20:12
I've had to edit some of my bad words we'll certainly give you a little window uh for that tomorrow well thanks for
01:20:19
supporting the show we love you and make sure you support our sponsors thank you
01:20:24
thank you thank you and we'll see you guys tomorrow and until then be good be kind and don't let it
01:20:38
[Music] [Applause] thank you