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subject to credit approval see store or ashley.com for details [Music] [Music] welcome to True Crime garage Wherever
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You Are whatever you are doing thanks for listening I'm your host Nick and with me as always is a man with a
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reminder that you don't bring a knife to a chainsaw fight here is the captain I can't afford to cut up people these days
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with gas prices being so high it's good to be seen and good to see you thanks for listening thanks for telling a
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snazzy and Colonel that is enough of the business thank you snazzy Captain all right everybody gather around grab a
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chair grab a beer let's talk some true crime the most prolific serial killer in American
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history Samuel little has confessed to 93 murders she fight for her ice and I'm fight for my
00:03:27
pleasure it's disturbing to listen to but investigators want to hear it all and more she was
00:03:37
laughing when I was killing the most prolific serial killer in American history I reached over I choked her and
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once she was dead I pulled her out of the car looked around jumped back in the car little says he has a photographic
00:03:57
memory and has drawn sketches of his bronze sketches of his Bundy gasy the Green River
00:04:08
Killer all topping the list of some of the most prolific serial killers of all time but the number of victims taken by
00:04:16
each of these monsters is dwarfed by the evil work of another killer a killer who
00:04:23
was so stealthy and cunning that often not only did no one know who had committed the murder in some cases no
00:04:32
one knew that his victims had even been murdered this man stayed under the radar
00:04:39
for decades killed dozens of victims in multiple States over 35-year period the only reason that we know
00:04:49
about most of these murders is because he decided to talk this is true crime garage and this
00:04:58
is the story of Sam little the killer of [Music] women when we left off yesterday Cold
00:05:17
Case detectives in La were working on building a case of three homicides committed by Sam little and they are
00:05:24
starting to connect him to other similar Cold Case homicides in other states so now in 2013 after Sam little has
00:05:33
continually murdered America's women for roughly four decades Sam little was indicted once again and facing trial in
00:05:41
California for the 1987 and 1989 murders of Carol Guadalupe and Audrey in Mississippi investigators were going
00:05:51
back to reopen cold cases that fit Sam's M Mo and murders that occurred during the time that he lived in Mississippi
00:05:58
his first arrest there was in 1977 his last was in 1982 these arrests amongst other things teach us and tell
00:06:08
us that he was in fact in Mississippi for a period of time a Mississippi investigator told the son heral
00:06:16
newspaper quote we know he left some for dead but they survived they are good Witnesses now they remember everything
00:06:23
that happened to them like it was yesterday they have always identified Sam little as their attacker Sam little
00:06:31
is a monster there's no telling how many people he's attacked were killed now that little had finally been nailed for
00:06:38
murders that very strongly resembled Mississippi's 1982 Cold Case murder of 24-year-old Melinda lupri detectives
00:06:48
started trying to put together a case against Sam little tracking down old Witnesses and retesting physical
00:06:55
evidence in Melinda's case but of course in the interim between the murder in 1982 and
00:07:02
2013 decades had passed and little had killed many women during that time the failure of Florida and Mississippi
00:07:11
authorities to nail Sam little in the early 80s would be replicated over and over again throughout the United States
00:07:19
for decades now we know that they tried to put Sam little on trial back in San Diego but that didn't work out so this
00:07:29
be the first real investigation into Sam little and his crimes and this starts in
00:07:35
2012 2013 this will be significantly different from any other investigation that took place in Sam Little's
00:07:43
existence so this is after Little's arrest in 2012 in California and the discovery that three unsolved murders
00:07:52
could definitively be linked to him by DNA California investigators put together the other attacks he had
00:08:01
carried out on the two San Diego women back in 1984 remember Tanya and Lori that we talked about yesterday as they
00:08:08
dug into little they began to realize that this guy whose background and life history was very vague and who was
00:08:17
nomadic potentially had as many as 40 other murder victims they started reaching out across the country to try
00:08:26
to get a handle on just how widespread his crimes may be and to see if he could be conclusively linked to other murders
00:08:37
but of course Captain this is going to be quite the challenge so they started off by searching cotus until the
00:08:45
computer started smoking from so much action there were no more cases in which Little's DNA could Point them to a
00:08:52
murder and his fingerprints turned up in police files time and time again but only for lesser crimes
00:08:59
Petty crimes like theft in the murder inquiries as the LA Times put it modern forensics played no role the inquiries
00:09:08
came down to shoe leather police work interrogations and digging through Dusty files for Clues like a Western Union
00:09:17
MoneyGram from 1982 a witness who spotted a yellow El Dorado a prostitutes last meal of carrots that's what a lot
00:09:26
of these cases are going to come down to single but very specific situations and
00:09:32
items Within These individual cases throughout the United States now keep in mind we are talking about many murder
00:09:41
victims from an error before taking DNA samples on corpses was standard if little left a trail of bodies they were
00:09:50
going to have a hard time following it because the victims he was suspected of killing often preceded DNA databases if
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they were identified by name they still were likely to have been killed long before DNA analysis so any connection to
00:10:08
little would be unknown from a physical evidence standpoint and even if the victims did have names you know many of
00:10:16
them became Jane Do's they could still have predated DNA testing or be the type of victim that no one bothers to take a
00:10:24
DNA sample from many of his victims were sex workers and performing a rape kit was deemed useless in a lot of these
00:10:32
cases that sounds horrific and that's going to be jaw-dropping to many people to hear that statement but it is in fact
00:10:41
true when you have a sex worker you can't just simply say that oh we found Seaman from Sam little on this victim
00:10:52
therefore he must have killed her it doesn't work that way because his defense could be as simple as this
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I had consensual sex with that woman I paid her and then I left and then later somebody else came along and killed that
00:11:08
woman and left no DNA on her or no seen on her and it's that simple it's shocking but it's true I think it's hard
00:11:17
to investigate somebody like sam little because he's a criminal 100% of the time
00:11:23
if you take somebody like BTK for example he's living part of his life as a normal obst standing citizen he
00:11:30
doesn't commit crimes he has his double life as a serial killer Sam little is a criminal 100% of the time he's Street
00:11:39
Smart too and he's going to know how to talk with police he's going to know how to dodge their questions you point out a
00:11:48
very good interesting fact there Captain this is somebody that has sat across the
00:11:53
table many times or sat in the back of a cruiser many times and his existence not
00:11:58
not facing murder charges not being suspected of murder this is being picked up for other crimes he's used to talking
00:12:05
to police now there's been a lot of piling on in Sam Little's case and I get it and I've been I've been part of that
00:12:16
at times as well where I go oh the atrocities how could law enforcement let this guy kill for for decades well it's
00:12:25
not just that simple they didn't let him kill some of these cases and I think we
00:12:29
need to look at this on a caseby casee basis and throw criticism where it's due but I also think that there was a lot of
00:12:38
good detective and police work that was done in many of these cases I think in San Diego we talked about the 1984 cases
00:12:45
the attempted murder cases there was a lot of good police work on that case they had the right guy in court they
00:12:52
just couldn't get a guilty verdict from the jury let's talk about some things that were working in Sam Little's favor
00:12:59
and working very much against the investigators and the detectives looking into these homicides let's start with LA
00:13:08
because La is very intriguing here in the Sam little case in the late 80s when Sam little killed three victims that we
00:13:16
know of in Los Angeles there were several serial killers all at work at the same time so think about that you
00:13:24
have these stranger on Stranger murders which are incredibly difficult to investigate to start with with we have
00:13:30
victims living a high-risk lifestyle I'm not victim blaming it's just the truth people that makes it difficult to
00:13:37
investigate their homicides and then you have several other active unknown serial
00:13:41
killers working all in the same area and all with similar victimology to their crimes ones that I can think of for
00:13:49
instance you have Lonnie David Franklin Jr better known as the Grim sleeper killed 10 plus in Los Angeles between
00:13:57
1985 and 200 7 you want to not sleep tonight look up a picture of that guy Michael Hughes is another he was
00:14:05
convicted of killing seven females in California mainly in Culver City during the late 80s and early 90s but three of
00:14:12
his victims were killed in Los Angeles Chester Turner was convicted of 11 murders in Los Angeles over the course
00:14:19
of about 11 years in the 80s and 90s so that's three and I guarantee you there were more so the investigators had to
00:14:29
start from scratch pulling all unsolved cases from around the country in which the modus operandi fit Littles to see if
00:14:38
they could link any to him to do this they had to have a very thorough understanding of hiso so they could use
00:14:47
his methods to identify his victims so what law enforcement is going to have to do is look at Sam Little's known crimes
00:14:55
or the ones that they believe he's responsible and use that as their template yeah this will become their
00:15:01
template for looking for similar victims who were killed in a similar manner maybe left or dumped in a similar way
00:15:09
with reviewing these they start to get a clear picture of this guy's Mo and his victimology what the LA prosecutor
00:15:17
called Little's blueprint and this is what they came up with here's a quick list here Captain he cleverly and
00:15:23
deliberately selected marginalized female victims who would not be missed or were unlikely to have families with
00:15:31
resources to find them he chose women addicted to drugs Andor alcohol and then used those things to lure them he
00:15:41
preferred sex workers because they were an easy target and they would get into his car without a second thought he
00:15:49
opted for the physically vulnerable often attacking skinny weak small ill or high or inebriated women who could not
00:15:59
defend themselves could not fight him off he used his hands as his weapon of choice this is practically untraceable
00:16:09
when you compare it to things like knives and guns and he often left the victims cause of death
00:16:16
unknown sometimes they were finding these victims decomposed later and because they were strangled it was
00:16:22
difficult for them to tell that they were even a homicide victim that's part of the reason why some of these cases
00:16:28
were not even really investigated you have a drug addict that you find dead on the streets who's been dead for 2 weeks
00:16:36
or stuffed in an abandoned house somewhere and been there for months you don't find any bullets in
00:16:43
your victim or murder weapon nearby or a skull crushed or stab marks on any of the
00:16:50
bones and you go well the the the hypothesis here the Assumption here would be that this person died of a drug
00:17:00
overdose in this abandoned building and we're just now finding her unfortunately
00:17:05
well and then if the victim lives it becomes he said she said and little even though he doesn't have much of a standup
00:17:16
character he thinks he can at least win the argument well she was a drug user she attacked me or she was a sex worker
00:17:25
and she was trying to steal my money yeah as some of these survivors were not reporting some of the crimes and then
00:17:34
you have some survivors reporting them keep in mind this dude it was not uncommon for him only to be in a city
00:17:41
for 3 to 10 days he didn't have a residence if he attacks somebody and they survive or he sees a notice of
00:17:50
there's some sexual predator on the loose and it oh it looks like me or they got a match of my vehicle he just skips
00:17:56
town and goes on to the next city this is from the uh FBI a direct quote from one of their reports and this goes
00:18:04
back to the difficulties even categorizing some of his victims as homicides when they are initially found
00:18:11
and it says quote with no stab marks or bullet wounds many of these deaths were not classified as homicides but
00:18:18
attributed to drug overdoses accidents or natural causes and quote the other thing too and look I'm
00:18:27
glad to here in the garage with my my buddy the captain when I'm in the garage like to have a cold beer if I were home
00:18:34
right now I'd be eating some Honey Nut Cheerios and I only say that to tell everybody if you are if you are eating
00:18:40
something put this down step aside either hit Paws or stop eating because we're going to have to get into some
00:18:47
gross stuff with with Sam little he's a as you already know he's a Despicable disgusting human being I don't even know
00:18:55
if you can call him a human being but one of his MOS that they put in his template his blueprint if you will was
00:19:01
that he would often masturbate while strangling his victims and then dump their bodies and in fact he told
00:19:08
investigators that he could not rape would not rape the women because he struggled with erectile dysfunction old
00:19:15
Soft Cell so his victims often times are not even appearing or or would appear to
00:19:21
be like a rape victim raped and then murdered and keep in mind we touched on some of his disgusting habits the other
00:19:29
day and really how much of a monster this guy was it's not uncommon for a murderer even if it's a one-time murder
00:19:39
for a male to kill a woman to cover up a rape right leave no witness but what we have with Sam little
00:19:50
is completely different he's he's sexually assaulting because of the killing where the the killing is the
00:19:59
prime motive for his excitement right not raping and then murdering to cover up the rape this is a whole different
00:20:08
kind of monster here well he's getting off on the fact that they can't breathe exactly it's also worth noting here that
00:20:17
Sam little was 6'2 in tall and was well over 200 lbs he was trained as a boxer so these women didn't stand a chance
00:20:27
against him one once he got the victims into his vehicle he would stun or knock them out with a Punch To The Head and
00:20:35
then have his way with them and strangle or suffocate them there's not a lot of pictures of Sam little online but we'll
00:20:42
post some of those to our Instagram and Twitter Facebook all those you can find us at truecar.com but we'll we'll post
00:20:51
some of his older mug shots and you can see he's he's he's a lot different of the version of the crippled old man that
00:20:59
you see later on and and the the same little that we've all come to know this crippled old man yeah by the time we see
00:21:08
him on TV and we are able to hear of his horrible crimes that he committed he's in a wheelchair and he looks like an old
00:21:18
a sick old man by this point and you're going to go Nick you're lying there's no
00:21:21
way he was 6'2 over 200 lb but trust me he was listen to this okay investigate say we know he punched one victim with
00:21:30
such force that when he struck this victim in the abdomen he broke her spine this is from the autopsy report of
00:21:38
Audrey Nelson one of Little's 1989 LA victims quote injuries throughout her body revealed pre-death blunt force
00:21:47
trauma consistent with having been punched repeatedly in the head Nelson suffered severe bruising underneath her
00:21:54
skin this bruising extended into her chest muscles stomach and abdomen in addition the hard bone of her spine was
00:22:04
crushed during a blow to the upper Central adomen with deep bruising to the stomach itself it was a sign of
00:22:13
considerable Force like many of Little's victims Audrey's body displayed drag marks very early in Little's serial
00:22:21
killer career he stopped bothering to bury or even hide his kill just discarding the corpses on roadsides in
00:22:29
alleys ditches parking lots Ravines what have you wherever he happened to find himself think about this though too his
00:22:37
early victims and we see this a lot of times with serial killers where they will go to Great Lengths they will put a
00:22:43
a great deal of effort into concealing their crimes early on and then after a while they start to get confident they
00:22:50
start to believe you know what I can get away with this I'm smarter than the police so I think we have a little bit
00:22:55
of that going on in Sam Little's case we also have the situation of he's often high or drunk or both when he's
00:23:04
committing these horrible acts so he might not be in such a great physical state to be able to conceal the bodies
00:23:10
and then factor in the location of the murders a lot of these victims were in LA or were in bigger cities where you
00:23:19
know what driving around with the victim in your car is a risk in itself hismo which worked time and time again often
00:23:28
was get rid of the body as quick as possible and get out of Dodge get as far away from the body as I can I'm so tired
00:23:35
of these serial killers getting like really cool names Like Son of Sam or BTK Sam little should go by Soft Serve
00:23:45
because he couldn't make it hard right well they did they had a here's another disgusting uh part of the case they
00:23:52
actually called him the choke and stroke killer for you know sometimes these guys
00:23:59
get weird monikers and nicknames and and sometimes it comes from the media sometimes it comes from the general
00:24:05
public or law enforcement I don't really know where this one came from I'm guessing it's law enforcement because
00:24:12
this is something that likely the media and the general public would not know from from reading the newspaper but
00:24:20
basically what we just went through here Captain is his blueprint what they're calling the Sam little blueprint and
00:24:27
they're using Little's Mo and victimology the LA authorities are to desperately try to figure out what else
00:24:35
little had done no matter what state it took place in but again because they couldn't match anything else up on codus
00:24:41
with his DNA they're kind of blindly searching in the dark for more victims so basically they had to notify every
00:24:49
law enforcement agency around the entire country go ahead and Google that number
00:24:54
to see how many uh law enforcement agencies there there are in this country and say hey do you have any violent
00:25:02
unsolved murders of women probably sex workers drug addicts or homeless with strangulation as the cause of death
00:25:09
between the years of let's say 1960 and 2012 I mean can you imagine trying to put together this list this is an
00:25:17
enormous task it would be easier to figure out a way to get him to talk but of course we know that when he's first
00:25:26
arrested he refused to cooperate he did not even cop out to the three women with
00:25:33
whom his DNA had been found when he did talk to detectives about his history of arrest he said they were for shoplifting
00:25:41
and Petty thefts no mention of nearly 100 dead women he would eventually be linked to well and they poked and
00:25:48
prodded him but they couldn't get him aroused after he was charged with those three counts of murder for the 87 and 89
00:25:56
homicides in LA in April of 2013 La homicide detectives called in the big guns they get the FBI involved
00:26:06
and they bring in analyst Christy palazolo from the FBI's viap they wanted help compiling cases that could be
00:26:14
attributed to Sam little they wanted the FBI to do some digging into his background to try to reconstruct his
00:26:21
life which could lead to more victims so they could have kind of a road map of his life of where he was at what times
00:26:30
vicap maintains a database of known crimes and categorizes Mos and other characteristics like manner of death and
00:26:38
victimology that can help locate similar crimes and thus link perpetrators they knew little emo so palazolo started
00:26:47
digging in June of 2013 she issued a vicap alert asking detectives Across the Nation to check their files for unsolved
00:26:58
strangulation murders of vulnerable women soon her timeline of Little's life became 150 Pages she started cross
00:27:09
referencing events and locations in Little's life that overlapped with crimes in the vicap database and now
00:27:16
years later the FBI is still digging [Music] this show is sponsored by better help do
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00:30:01
uh Sam's officer of little cheers to the people in the back those are the ones that count the most this is going to
00:30:09
take us to the 2014 trial the murder trial for the three murders that he committed in Los
00:30:16
Angeles now prosecutors arm themselves with information about possible other crimes and other jurisdictions lining up
00:30:24
witnesses to testify against Sam little such as the survivors of his attacks in Mississippi and San Diego these women
00:30:32
testified that they remembered him they remembered his large hands and how he beat and choked them investigators in
00:30:39
California were able to link Sam little to crimes in 24 States but in a 56-year life of crime he had served only about
00:30:51
10 years in prison he was suspected of multiple murders but never convicted of a Murder well good news captain that all
00:30:59
will end in 2014 well I don't want to sound like a pessimist and I guess it's better to be
00:31:06
caught late than never yes and this is one of those situations where it's going to be some kind of answer for the
00:31:16
families and we're talking about a lot of families in this case so there is some good that comes out of it you feel
00:31:23
like you're lost right I know that investigators and prosec feel like they lost all around in the Sam little case
00:31:30
but there is some good you are bringing some closure giving some answers to these many families that were just left
00:31:37
guessing for many years remember some of these victims were Jane Do's for a long
00:31:43
period of time or still are Jane do so it only took the jury two hours to convict Sam little of the murders of
00:31:51
Guadalupe Carol and Audrey he was sentenced to three life terms in prison without the Poss possibility of parole
00:31:58
as his sentence was pronounced he shouted out loud in the court that he was innocent even though they had his
00:32:05
DNA in all three of these cases well he's an idiot so yes yes he is now let's bring in a very important character a
00:32:15
very important person in this story it's Texas Ranger Jimmy Holland this is an experienced investigator with training
00:32:24
in psychopathy who specialized in interrogating techniques this did not mean that he was
00:32:30
the guy that would come into an interrogation room and physically abuse the person that he was questioning or
00:32:37
take out his service revolver and put it to the back of the the individual's head
00:32:42
or the suspect's head yeah taking his pencil and shove it in the dude's dick hole or even dropping massive folders of
00:32:49
daunting looking files on the desk and glaring at the suspect instead he had a whole different method with which I
00:32:57
think proves to be much better instead he calmly appealed to the ego and used the carrot approach bribing his suspects
00:33:08
with little concessions that would incentivize them to cooperate now let's think about Sam little he's locked up
00:33:15
for Life he's an old man three life terms in prison without the possibility of parole you are going to die in prison
00:33:23
sir now can you help us out at all do you want to sit in your cell all day long or do you want to sit in this room
00:33:29
and talk to me well in December of 2017 Jimmy Holland was teaching an interrogation class pertaining to
00:33:39
questioning of psychopaths and sociopaths at a police conference in Florida he started chatting with a crime
00:33:47
analyst this was Angela Williamson a 41-year-old Australian with a doctorate in molecular biology and expertise in
00:33:56
forensics she was employed by vicap and a justice department initiative to train and fund
00:34:03
local police and sexual assault investigations during Holland and Williamson's conversation two detectives
00:34:11
from Florida came up and asked them if they knew anything about a California serial killer who was refusing to talk
00:34:19
these detectives suspected Sam little in an unsolved Florida case maybe more than
00:34:25
one Holland was intrigued well yeah you'd be intrigued because a killer like this and a a nomad really his victim
00:34:36
list could be a significant number yes exactly you hit the nail on the head my friend and this is a situation though
00:34:44
Holland wants to get involved but he cannot without a Texas case so he started thinking about this Sam little
00:34:52
guy and the fact that he wouldn't talk and several jurisdictions seem to suspect him in many murders so then he
00:34:59
called Williamson in March of 2018 and asked if they could do something about this guy Williamson put Holland on hold
00:35:07
and asked another cubicle occupant this is our friend palazolo who we've already
00:35:13
introduced if she had heard of Sam little and of course boom she sure had palazolo said tell him about the Odessa
00:35:23
case Odessa Texas case this was a case case that she was sure would be attributed to Sam little and in fact 12
00:35:32
of the potential victims in the viap analyst had put on her list of potential Sam little murders were murders that
00:35:40
took place in the great state of Texas so Holland was definitely intrigued by the Odessa case this was 38-year-old
00:35:49
Denise Christie brothers who was found dead in 1994 now per the LA Times quote like
00:35:56
little LA victims she had been strangled and left partially clothed in a vacant lot police records showed little had
00:36:04
interaction with local police around the time of the killing end quote Holland believed that he could get Sam little to
00:36:11
talk but we we have to remind The Listener that Sam L was in prison at this point for already four years and he
00:36:20
was over 80 years old so Holland headed to California to assist in these investigations to see if he could get
00:36:29
Sam little to talk when he gets there the LA detectives inform Holland of what he was up against and they tell him that
00:36:37
Sam little despised law enforcement and that he was free to use that to his Advantage if he could the detectives
00:36:44
also said that Sam little hated being called a rapist though his seen was found on the clothing of two of his
00:36:51
victims and prosecutors labeled him a sexual predator perhaps Holland thought thought Sam little saw a distinction
00:36:59
between rape and becoming aroused during a strangulation that was something that
00:37:04
he thought he might be able to work with when interrogating Sam little now it's worth pointing out that one of the
00:37:11
detectives little despised was Mitsy Roberts who we've already talked about of the LAPD who had noted the pattern in
00:37:19
the 87 and 89 bodies found and made the codus connection to Sam little she and Beth Silver
00:37:27
the LA County Deputy district attorney were the women who finally put Sam little away so their theory was that Sam
00:37:36
little hated women of course but also hated being bested by two women and would be much more inclined to talk to a
00:37:44
man potentially about his crimes definitely seems like Sam L has some kind of intimacy issues with females and
00:37:51
so if he's going to open up and make himself vulnerable he's probably not going to do that
00:37:57
with a female well and obviously to kill this many women you have to hate women and that's what I think is part of his
00:38:04
emo here that he hates women in general it will be May of 2018 when Holland sits
00:38:11
down with Sam little of course we have the FBI listening in the Next Room now the formerly big man sam little was now
00:38:19
in a wheelchair and he's still sharp though at this time and was interested in the Texas Rangers motives for the
00:38:29
visit Holland gave little some peanut M&M's and tried to you know butter him up but little told Holland that he had
00:38:38
no interest in helping law enforcement close any cold cases because he had been convicted on fake evidence and
00:38:45
lies and so he pushed back quite a bit but we have Holland who is smart impatient and then he through
00:38:53
conversation and through this visit and other visits started to earn the trust of Sam little
00:39:01
soon they would be calling each other Sammy and Jimmy almost like their buddies this comedy duo Holland nudged
00:39:09
Sam little to take control of his story he pointed out that no one knew his name
00:39:14
but he could change that this is from the LA times has Sam little killed people yeah come on we both know that
00:39:21
Holland said the question is does Sam little want to talk about those killings and does he want to Define what really
00:39:30
happened Sam little studied the ranger quote hookers is all you are going to find Sam said Holland could
00:39:39
tell the killer was testing him Holland Shrugged do you see me tearing up see he's almost putting himself out there
00:39:48
like yeah I identify with you I agree with you that yeah you only killed people that of of a lesser value of what
00:39:56
that's what Sam Little's saying right and the detective here the Texas Ranger excuse me is smart enough to play along
00:40:03
he's playing to his ego he knows that if he can play to his ego Sam will likely open up and a whole new can of worms is
00:40:12
going to come out of every conversation that they have this is when Holland takes the chance to mention that Odessa
00:40:18
case from Texas and it seemed to motivate Sam little to start talking well don't you think a lot of these guys
00:40:25
want the truth to be out there or their truth to be out there well and he also has no more appeals at this time too so
00:40:34
it's really like he's got nothing to lose from spilling the beans he might feel like he has something to gain and
00:40:44
of course in any jailhouse snitch situation here he's telling on himself but of course you as a detective you
00:40:53
know going into that that they are only doing this for some benefit to them can I figure out what the benefit is that he
00:41:01
is seeking and kind of play to that in fact he opens up so much about this Odessa case he bluntly tells them
00:41:09
exactly what took place how he picked up this Denise Brothers what kind of car he
00:41:16
was driving what he used he used crack and black tar heroin for Denise to get him get her to join him he then pulls
00:41:26
into an alley and grabbed her by the throat and tossed her over the back seat of his vehicle like a doll where he
00:41:33
strangled her with one hand while masturbating with the other she fought back this is where one of his um
00:41:41
statements comes from that is more well known today in some of his confessions but he said that he would
00:41:50
make these encounters as long and slow as possible because the Act of Killing was
00:41:58
synonymous with sex for Sam little so he's often letting his victims repeatedly regain
00:42:06
Consciousness he said that the last time that Denise came too her head was in his
00:42:11
lap Sam little said her eyes big as marbles Sam says I told her I own you you're mine forever she cried and I
00:42:22
kissed her I kissed her tears from her face and then squeeze the life from her little knew exactly what vacant lot he
00:42:31
had dumped Denise in and they're able to take the details that he States during this interrogation during this basically
00:42:39
what's a conversation at this point and match these details up to the known information they have in the case
00:42:47
well Sam little is going to tell law enforcement that he stopped counting his killings at 84 victims and that's a very
00:42:57
large number of victims and then very oddly Captain he goes into detail about his first murder and his last murder and
00:43:07
his first murder was a woman that he met in a bar in Miami on New Year's Eve 1970
00:43:13
this was a victim that we spoke about yesterday Mary broley in our trailer for this week's episodes remember she
00:43:20
remained at Jane Doe until she was finally identified after a Florida detective had ENT Ed her information
00:43:27
into namus and got a match to a Massachusetts woman missing part of her pinky with a surgically repaired hip and
00:43:35
dyed blonde hair so even though they identified her this good detective did good work with the nameus program to
00:43:44
identify her through dental records they still had no idea who had killed her but
00:43:50
they knew it was a homicide because she was one of his victims that were buried and that it was
00:43:56
in this interview that they learned that broley was killed by Sam little well we've seen a lot of serial killers that
00:44:04
don't want to talk at all or the information that they give to law enforcement is so misleading but
00:44:11
everything that Sam is saying this is would give you hope I think as law enforcement that you're going to uncover
00:44:19
more answers for more victims and that's going to lead to closing some of these cases yes and he says that his last
00:44:27
murder victim was in 2005 this would be 7 years before he was identified by that
00:44:33
codus hit and this was a murder from Tupelo Mississippi now this is all interesting because he
00:44:42
gives detailed accounts of the first and last murders but we know that there's going to unfortunately be a whole lot of
00:44:50
Carnage between those two bookended murders now after getting him to talk of course course law enforcement's
00:44:57
confident at this point that Sam little is willing to talk about his other crimes his other murders so what they
00:45:03
end up doing here Captain is they get a letter from a Texas prosecutor pledging not to pursue the death penalty for Sam
00:45:13
little for any of the Texas murders that he confesses to and little agreed to start talking
00:45:21
about more murders but again remember he wants something in trade he wants to transfer to a Texas prison facility that
00:45:30
same day after these negotiations he confesses to 17 more murders all female victims he starts off
00:45:39
with really an emotionalist tally provided by Sam little he simply says Jackson Mississippi one victim
00:45:48
Cincinnati Ohio one victim Phoenix Arizona three Las Vegas one and so on and so on
00:45:56
most of these victims weren't on the FBI's list palazolo resorted to Google searches as they tried to keep up with
00:46:04
all of these Grim confessions coming from their prisoner well like I said law enforcement has to be optimistic because
00:46:11
they are making some Headway with this serial killer and as of mid November 2018 law enforcement has been told by
00:46:22
Sam little that he he's responsible for over 90 some homicides yeah that this was an announcement actually to the
00:46:31
general public where law enforcement is saying that Sam little is confessed to murdering dozens of women and he might
00:46:37
be linked to as many as 90 homicides this will be because they're probably going to need the Public's help at some
00:46:43
point now two weeks later the FBI announced that the vicap team have confirmed 34 of his murder
00:46:53
confessions saying that Sam little wasn't making any of this stuff up little claimed to have killed 93 women
00:47:00
between 1970 and 2005 and 18 or 19 States ranging from all the way to Florida and to California more than 30
00:47:11
of his confessions remained unmatched they have yet to be linked to any known victims this as of late last
00:47:20
year the FBI web page has a list of these and the detail and drawings which we we will get to in a minute furnished
00:47:30
by Sam little some of the confessions were no surprise whatsoever he confessed to the murder of Melinda lepri who we
00:47:38
already talked about who was murdered and he had not been indicted for after a grand jury vote he also confessed to
00:47:46
that old Gainesville case that he had eluded conviction on Patricia Mount was her name eventually Sam little admitted
00:47:54
to killing Carol gu Lupe and Audrey in LA in 87 and 89 which of course we already knew based off of DNA and other
00:48:03
circumstances that he did kill those women and then of course he confessed to 88 more little said to the LA Times that
00:48:11
he confessed in the end because he knew his time was running out and he wanted to help the families get closure and
00:48:18
perhaps exonerate someone wrongfully accused others said that little clearly wanted credit for what he had done the
00:48:27
New York Times said quote investigators who have spoken to him say he also appears to enjoy the attention he is
00:48:34
receiving as he recites details only a killer would know after Decades of discussing them with no one whatever his
00:48:43
motives Beth Silverman the LA prosecutor who locked little up for good in 2014 said that his confessions were hardly a
00:48:52
victory for law enforcement rather she said it's simply a tally of the Carnage he
00:49:01
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