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at indeed.com/mpodcast. Heat. Heat. [music] [music] >> [music] [music] [music] >> Welcome to True Crime Garage. Wherever
00:02:04
you are, whatever you're doing, thanks for listening. I'm your host, Nick, and with me as always is a man who [music]
00:02:10
lives rentree in your ear balls. Here is the captain. >> And I'm so sorry for that. It's good
00:02:14
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00:03:15
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00:03:21
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fund. And to everyone listening, however you listen, we [music] say thank you. >> Yeah, BWR, you win. Beer run. Make sure
00:03:44
you subscribe to the podcast. Make sure you check out our YouTube [music] page and tell your mother, tell your brother,
00:03:50
and that's enough of the business. >> All right, everybody. Gather around, grab a chair, grab a beer. Let's talk
00:03:56
some true crime. [music] [music] >> [music] >> With Robin Abrams missing for an extended period of time, her lawsuit was
00:04:23
dismissed. This takes place, Captain, on January 9th, 1991. That's quite convenient for several
00:04:30
folks who we have already mentioned in this story thus far. And here's a quote. quote, "Marquez," meaning Tony Marquez,
00:04:40
was an auxiliary officer at the time, but he was best friends with Will County Sheriff John Johnson, who was also my
00:04:50
sister's boss, and he was running for reelection, and she had a lawsuit against them at the time." End quote.
00:04:58
This was from Robin's Abrams sister, Jodie Walsh, as she told it to the Joliet Patch. Fishy as hell, right? Yep.
00:05:08
>> Fishy as can be. So, let's get back to the investigation here. As we said in our first part, Sheriff Johnson handed
00:05:19
the case over to the ISP, to Illinois State Police. This was after the Will County States attorney advised him to do
00:05:28
so. there was just too much of a conflict. Although the sheriff denied that, saying that he had relinquished
00:05:37
the case because quote several police jurisdictions were involved. End quote. The ISP investigation placed Robin at a
00:05:47
gas station on the afternoon that she vanished, and that gas station was near the office of Tony Marquez. But that was
00:05:55
about it. They had no idea where Robin had gone. By October 18th, the Illinois State Police admitted that they were
00:06:05
stumped. Captain Ed Wolf of the ISP told the Southtown Star, "We simply have no good
00:06:13
clues as to what happened to Robin." It had been hoped that running her photo in the papers would result in sightings,
00:06:24
but any sightings called in proved to be mistaken. The FBI had been called into the case, but it
00:06:32
doesn't seem that they made any headway either. That they were involved what looks kind of briefly to me here,
00:06:39
Captain. So, five weeks after Robin's disappearance, Captain Ed Wolf of the Illinois State Police maintained that
00:06:47
the case was still being actively worked by four full-time investigators and the
00:06:53
FBI. He denied that they were focusing on the Will County Sheriff's Department, saying, "We don't have a focus right
00:07:01
now, but we are not at a dead end either. We are working with what we have." He said that although the chances
00:07:11
were slim that Robin was still alive, stranger things have happened. >> Well, it's really sad in this case, the
00:07:17
eyewitness that saw the tow truck, if that individual would have just been able to get some identifying marker from
00:07:26
that truck, this could have changed the whole investigation. In this case, I would love to have a sitdown with that
00:07:33
individual because what that person witnessed is described differently at different times as this investigation
00:07:42
and this true crime story drags on. [clears throat] >> I would really like to hear it for my
00:07:47
own with my own ears. see what I can make out of it because I don't know what this story, right?
00:07:55
This eyewitness account is being told second, third, fourthhand sometimes and I would like to know what has been left
00:08:03
out and and and by who along the way. On the first anniversary of Robin's disappearance, the Chicago Tribune did
00:08:12
an article about the case. Remember, it's kind of at a standstill at this point, but the article described the
00:08:18
state police as frustrated and the Will County State's attorney's office as puzzled. Her mother, Barbara, was
00:08:27
interviewed for this article. She's weeping. She is clutching a photo of her missing daughter. She tells the
00:08:34
reporter, quote, "Not knowing if Robin is alive or dead really drives me crazy. I can't get through the night without
00:08:42
waking up worrying, thinking, is this a missing person's case or a fatal attraction
00:08:49
investigation. But even Barbara acknowledged that Robin was likely deceased by this time. She told the
00:08:56
Tribune, "Robin was such an intelligent girl. She made one stupid mistake. Why did she have to pay for it this way?"
00:09:05
But the article reported that the state police had evidence, perhaps even a witness capable of identifying a suspect
00:09:13
in a lineup and there had been a grand jury in the case. See, you mentioned the the tow truck and
00:09:20
that witness. That's my suspicion here, right? that would be the person that would make the
00:09:27
most sense or at least the one the person that's already mentioned in the story so far as being capable
00:09:34
of identifying a suspect in a lineup. We should point out here though too that the new sheriff in Will County, the the
00:09:40
man who took over, his name was Thomas Fitzgerald, he fired Tony Marquez in December of 1990.
00:09:47
>> Well, let's also point out he was a a ex auxiliary cop. So, he was essentially a
00:09:52
wannabe full-time cop that was making full-time cops look like shits. But maybe there's a eyewitness, like you
00:10:01
said, maybe the eyewitness that saw the tow truck, maybe they could identify somebody. Or maybe there was another
00:10:08
eyewitness that saw when Robin would have been abducted from her car. There's very little to go on for this
00:10:16
investigation, right? Like regardless of what you think happened or or who you think is responsible, there's not a lot
00:10:24
for them to follow here or at least information that's made its way to the public. And speaking of public, publicly
00:10:31
the investigation into Robin's disappearance stalled out. Nothing seemed to be happening, but behind the
00:10:38
scenes, it sounds like there might have been a lot that was going on because the
00:10:42
Will County prosecutors were gathering evidence against Robin's ex and a potential accomplice and trying to
00:10:51
make a homicide case against the two of them. Robin's disappearance was still classified as a missing person's
00:10:59
investigation, not a homicide. The Will County State's Attorney, Edward Burmila,
00:11:05
said to the Chicago Tribune, quote, "You need a body, some remains for the case to be labeled a homicide." The state
00:11:14
police captain, Ed Wolf, on the other hand, said the likelihood that she is alive is very remote. The grand jury
00:11:21
probe proceeded nonetheless with Burmila trying to obtain concrete information and tangible evidence against his two
00:11:31
suspects. The suspect was named Tony Marquez. No surprise there, right, Captain? And the alleged accomplice,
00:11:40
Tony's alleged accomplice was none other than Tony's stepbrother, John Romo. >> Douchebag number one. Douchebag number
00:11:48
two. 7 months after Robin vanished in 1991, this is in May of 91, the prosecutors convened a grand jury to
00:11:59
conduct a confidential investigation into whether these two had offed Robin. Now, we don't know what they had on
00:12:08
these guys. That's never been released. We do know that someone saw two men dropping off Robin's car. Maybe the
00:12:16
descriptions provided by that witness were consistent with both Tony Marquez and John Romo. But whatever they had, it
00:12:25
was enough to take a significant step in the investigation. According to the Southtown Star, quote, Illinois State
00:12:31
Police investigators named the ex-boyfriend and his half-brother as people of interest in the investigation.
00:12:39
So that's some form of progress, I guess. Tony Marquez's alibi captain for the night that Robin Abrams disappeared
00:12:48
was his stepbrother or as just reported by the South Star, his halfb brotherther
00:12:55
John Roma. >> Yeah. Once you both become suspects, that alibi doesn't hold water for
00:13:01
>> No. No. No. Yeah. You can't say I I couldn't have abducted her because I was busy hanging out with Romo. And then
00:13:07
they're like, "Yeah, but he's a suspect." >> Romo's like, "I was hanging out with
00:13:11
Tony. I couldn't have done anything. >> I mean, come on. Tony's a member of law enforcement.
00:13:16
>> Did anybody else see him? I don't think so. >> Neither man was charged with anything,
00:13:21
but it's clear that they were in the line of fire of this grand jury. And so, the grand jury was attempting to use
00:13:29
subpoena powers to require both Tony Marquez and John Romo to play ball. They issued subpoenas to require the Wonder
00:13:40
Twins here to one submit to in-person lineups before an unidentified witness. Again, we can surmise that this is
00:13:50
likely the person who saw the two men disposing of the car. Two, require these guys to submit blood and hair, head and
00:14:00
pubic hair samples. Three, testify before the grand jury. And they wanted Tony Marquez to be
00:14:10
required to submit finger and palm prints. >> Well, so maybe these two knuckleheads
00:14:16
somehow get a tow truck and they're the ones that towed Robin's vehicle to that location. And again, they put it in a
00:14:26
bad location. It did somebody try to break into this car or did they staged that? Who knows? But they put it
00:14:33
obviously in a bad location because then they go, "Well, Robin must have been in
00:14:38
a bad location and something bad happened to her." >> That's not the worst idea when you're
00:14:44
trying to >> cover thing up. Not the worst idea >> with this information here, though,
00:14:49
Captain. I've seen people openly question like, okay, if the grand jury wants wants to require these guys to
00:14:58
submit hairs, hair samples, testify in front of the grand jury, submit blood samples, and Tony Marquez to submit
00:15:07
finger and palm prints. >> Don't forget the pubes. >> Well, what? >> Give me those pubes.
00:15:14
>> My pubes are the same as my head hair. The [laughter] >> too much information. straight as an
00:15:19
arrow. People have openly speculated, well, if this is what they want to require these guys to submit,
00:15:27
they must have something to compare this to. What are what do they have that they
00:15:31
want to compare all this to? And I actually think that it it might be a whole lot of nothing. Okay. There maybe
00:15:39
they're they were hoping to pull some prints that match Tony Marquez's from the vehicle. Yeah, but that won't
00:15:46
explain anything because they had a relationship. My speculation is, hey, why we have the opportunity? Let's
00:15:53
collect this information. >> If we discover if we discover Robin's body, then maybe we'll find evidence
00:15:59
there. And now we don't have to go back to try to collect something. >> As it turns out, we park our cars in the
00:16:05
same garage, my friend. Because I I'm with you. I think it's like not comparing it to what we have now, but
00:16:11
but we might have nothing now, >> right? What we do know absolutely 100% with this case is there are items in
00:16:19
this case that we've not found her body, anything that may be with her body, additional crime scenes. So, let's
00:16:26
collect this while we can force them to do so to comply and then we keep it and we have good evidence for anything that
00:16:36
we might find in the future at a later date. Now, while some court documents that we reviewed made reference to
00:16:43
evidence found in Robin's car, ISP Captain Ed Wolf said items were found of evidentiary interest. He told the
00:16:51
Southtown Star that the subpoenas were intended to permit the police to follow up on these items of evidence. So, we
00:17:00
look, we were bashing some of the guys from the Will County Sheriff's Department. I think that that's
00:17:05
warranted. I think we should point out how difficult of an investigation this is for the state police and it seems
00:17:11
like they were doing everything they can regardless of who's responsible for what
00:17:17
happened to this young woman to find that person bring them to justice and close out this case.
00:17:23
>> Well, and what we do know is Robin was afraid. >> Correct. >> But also Robin was a officer herself.
00:17:32
So, if somebody did abduct her, I have no reason to believe that Robin went quietly. I think Robin probably put up
00:17:42
one damn good fight. The circuit judge, Rodney Leoir, was concerned about the legitimacy of
00:17:51
using the grand jury subpoenas to obtain physical evidence from two men who had not been technically charged or even
00:18:01
officially named as suspects yet publicly in the case. He said, "I don't know if subpoenas are the proper avenue
00:18:09
to get blood and hair samples. I want to see evidence before someone's constitutional rights against illegal
00:18:15
search and seizure are violated. Now, in order to obtain a search warrant for physical evidence, prosecutors would
00:18:23
have to show probable cause as to why the needs of the state to access the samples of Tony Marquez and to supersede
00:18:34
Tony Marquez and John Romo's privacy rights. But after hemming and hawing, the judge ended up approving the
00:18:42
subpoenas or or for the most part. Okay. So Tony Marquez and John Romo appealed the subpoenas issued by the grand jury
00:18:52
and the appellet court denied the subpoenas for blood samples and pulled head hairs but approved them for
00:18:59
everything else. So that's the pubic hair clippings and combings, clipped head hair, head hair combings,
00:19:06
prints and lineups. The court felt that the items, these items are already exposed to the public, right? These are
00:19:16
items that you could just walk behind them and and collect if they fell off of them,
00:19:21
>> right? So, it's not really invading their privacy rights, but they are saying that the forcible collection did
00:19:31
violate their fourth amendment. >> I want to point out I don't like this at all.
00:19:35
>> I don't like we have evidence that they were abusive at least one of the individually
00:19:45
somebody's putting the stepbrother with Tony. Well, you who gives [clears throat] a [ __ ] about your rights
00:19:50
right now? Look, here's my thought on it, though, too. It's like, you're telling me that we have to have probable
00:19:58
cause in order that we're not violating their rights, their constitutional rights. I'm fully on board with that
00:20:06
every day of the week and twice on Sundays. But we have probable cause against Tony Marquez. Another judge
00:20:15
approved an order of protection for Robin against this dude. >> Right. that that to me if if one of your
00:20:22
colleagues, another judge says, "I see that there's a threat to this woman's physical being
00:20:29
from this individual, and I'm signing off on an order of protection." That, my friend, is your
00:20:36
probable cause. >> Well, not just Robin, but protection for Robin's mother as well.
00:20:42
>> So, the Step Brothers took the case all the way to the Illinois Supreme Court.
00:20:46
The court ruled that the Illinois Constitution provided more individual privacy rights than did the US
00:20:53
Constitution, recognizing a zone of personal privacy. So, we found the court documents relating to this ruling in May
00:21:01
1991, Will County Grand Jury, the people of the state of Illinois, Appell and Crossappellant verse Tony Marquez. This
00:21:11
was dated October 15th, 1992. It says the appellet court found under a fourth amendment analysis that the demand for
00:21:19
the pubic hair samples constituted a search and seizure under the fourth amendment and that bearing probable
00:21:28
cause such a subpoena was unreasonable. And I could continue to read it all but let's not do that. That is exactly what
00:21:37
it says in short form. Okay. So Tony Marquez, Joe, John Romo won their legal battle, thus avoiding providing hair
00:21:49
samples and prints. Their attorney called the subpoenas a fishing expedition by the
00:21:59
grand jury, suggesting that they had nothing, that they had no evidence. And still we know nothing of what was found
00:22:10
in Robin's car other than the camera with no film in it. We learn very little is made publicly about what was found or
00:22:19
not found in Robin's purse. And more importantly, what exactly did the witness see and how clearly? This is a
00:22:28
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00:25:43
>> Raise them high. Raise them high. >> In the sky. >> In the sky. The Will County authorities
00:25:50
didn't give up, however. In 1993, a new Will County States Attorney, his name is
00:25:56
James Glasgow, recommended against a lineup. So, this is where we get into a lot of that back
00:26:04
and forth of what did the witness see, how good was their description, how clearly did they see, is there is there
00:26:13
a description, is there information changing over time? Well, and the tough thing too is if you call,
00:26:19
[clears throat] you're the eyewitness, you call about this car, you then later find out who this car is connected to
00:26:25
through news outlets, and then you figure out that this individual, Robin, had a lawsuit against law enforcement
00:26:35
officers, and it's a good possibility she's not just missing, but she's dead. that might influence how much
00:26:44
information you give to anybody. >> And I want to be clear here too. I know the US garage vultures are circling
00:26:52
heavy around this Tony Marquez. And I say rightfully so, but the lawsuit doesn't have to be the lone reason that
00:27:02
this woman ended up dead. Tony, if in fact he was guilty of all the harassment and the bullying that she claimed in her
00:27:11
lawsuit, he had some he grew to hate this woman. It could have been something as simple as their paths crossed, they
00:27:20
get into an argument, it turns physical, and he chokes her to death. He strangled
00:27:24
the poor woman. >> I think this guy is probably very abusive physically, verbally, and
00:27:30
mentally towards women. Here is why I kind of question about what the statements from the witness were and how
00:27:36
they have changed may have changed over the years, right? Because we have Will County authorities. We have the the Will
00:27:44
County states attorney at one time is really pushing for a grand jury and it seems like a lot of that was submitting
00:27:52
to a lineup to possibly being identified as one of the two men in the tow truck dropping off the vehicle, right? whether
00:28:00
that be Tony Marquez, John Romo, or both. But then later you have the attorney saying, "We don't want we're we're going
00:28:10
to say no to the lineup. We're not recommending a lineup anymore." The reason why I say that I question if this
00:28:16
witness's information or description of such has changed over time is I do not I
00:28:24
absolutely do not question that the witness saw the truck dropping off the car. Tow trucks are loud. This is a
00:28:31
small street. Houses are close together. Cars are parked on the street 10:00 at night on a Thursday. If somebody pulled
00:28:39
up a tow truck in front of my house or or adjacent to my house, I would hear it. I would look out the window. I would
00:28:46
see and recognize a tow truck is dropping a car. The other thing, too, I don't doubt is that somebody called in
00:28:54
and said, "Hey, it looks like somebody's attempting to break into this vehicle that's out here, a red Dodge Daytona
00:29:01
hatchback, 1989. I'm old enough to remember those vehicles. That car sticks out. That's a car that sticks out. And
00:29:08
in 1990, some dude walking down the street in a town that maybe has a lot of car
00:29:16
breakins and sees a camera inside the vehicle. That's an item of value. The person may have wanted to break into the
00:29:23
car to steal that and in hopes that there were other items of value inside that vehicle. Here's an idea, too. Maybe
00:29:30
the person walking down the street, we said the keys were found in the ignition. Door's locked, the keys in the
00:29:36
ignition. Maybe dude sees the keys in the ignition and goes, "I make it into that car. I can drive off with that
00:29:42
thing." So, I don't doubt any of that occurring. What I what I what I wonder is is the big hangup here kind of with
00:29:52
this witness is when the person calls in at 3:00 in the morning, this car, someone's trying to break into this car
00:30:01
in front of my house. Cops show up. The person attempting the break-in gone. We want to know more about this car. The
00:30:09
caller says, "Well, it was dropped off here at 1000 p.m. by two guys in a tow truck." When that person is making that
00:30:17
report, giving that statement to police, he or she, they know hide nor hair of what Tony Marquez looks like. Robin goes
00:30:27
missing. It's known that she's missing. She's missing for days. It turns into weeks. and he starts getting named
00:30:35
publicly as a person of interest. Guess what? His picture makes it to the public.
00:30:42
Now all of a sudden I wonder where I couldn't tell you what the guy looked like. If the witness is starting to fill
00:30:49
in the blanks naturally, innocently on their own, and says, "You know what? The guy I saw looked exactly like Tony
00:30:58
Marquez." Now, now that I think of it, now that I come to think of it, the the man had dark hair and dark complexion
00:31:04
and was built similar to that Tony Marquez. The There's good reason. I believe there's good reason why this attorney
00:31:15
decided not to pursue the photo lineup or the uh the in-person lineup, identification lineup at some point.
00:31:25
Well, like we've said a million times, eyewitness accounts are not that accurate unless I saw it with my own two
00:31:34
eyes and my own three eyes. So, of course, this is not going to help the investigation. It's not going to further
00:31:42
the case against Marquez, not going to further the case against Romo. the FBI and the ISP, they would continue to
00:31:52
investigate. But in December of 1993, Captain Sergeant Charles Kitchens or Kitchen with the ISP said, "All the
00:32:01
investigative leads have pretty much been exhausted. We are hoping for new leads." He admitted to the Southtown
00:32:08
Star that there are no new suspects that have been developed. simply meaning that
00:32:14
Tony Marquez and John Romo were still the only suspects it sounds like that they were looking
00:32:21
at. >> Yeah. And it makes you wonder about what else was going on in Robin's life
00:32:25
because with all this crazy stuff happening and this harassment, was there somebody else that saw
00:32:34
opportunity? Well, if I get rid of her, law enforcement is going to look in this
00:32:39
direction. And then also, not only do you have Tony, but you have the stepbrother. And then again, I keep
00:32:46
saying, what did his wife know? Because if his wife knew everything was true that Robin was saying, how was this
00:32:54
affecting Tony's business, his job with law enforcement? Was this affecting her job? How was this affecting their family
00:33:04
and society? Could she be a suspect? >> She could be. But I'll tell you this. Here's one thing I do know. Do you know
00:33:10
where tow trucks do not take cars that they pick up? They don't take them to a residential street and drop them at some
00:33:17
random spot. That's that's not the tow truck business, right? Who whoever those two men were have direct involvement
00:33:28
with her disappearance. Whether they're responsible for her murder, whether they're responsible for her abduction,
00:33:35
whether they're responsible for whatever happened to Robin, I can say 100% that those two men are directly
00:33:44
involvement involved in some form of the crimes committed against Robin Abrams. >> Well, that makes me wonder too about the
00:33:52
eyewitness accounts. You said it. If you could talk to this individual, you could
00:33:57
get better details when it's misreported and maybe not on purpose or maybe the individual's changing their changing
00:34:05
their story because if you're just looking out a window and you see a car being dropped off, well, was it a tow
00:34:12
truck or was it a regular truck that had a trailer? So, I think those details matter, but because Tony's involvement
00:34:23
with law enforcement, is it possible that he had access or did the stepbrother have access to a tow truck?
00:34:30
Again, these are a bunch of questions I would love to have the answers to. >> There's also ways to determine if a
00:34:37
person got inside the vehicle and manipulated the vehicle in any manner, right? Did they put it into neutral?
00:34:44
We know the keys were found in the ignition, but I'm one could use the hook and just just forcibly pull the vehicle
00:34:53
up to the the tow truck. That can be done. I I want to know if there was anything that was suggestive in the
00:34:59
vehicle that to that police could go. Well, we think that somebody secured it after dropping it or somebody put it
00:35:07
into neutral before picking it up and moving it. What we do know though, Captain, is that we're going to get a a
00:35:14
dig. Okay, we're we're going to have a a big search here. And this apparently is
00:35:19
the result of a tip. This took place in May of 1995. The police were conducting a dig at a home at a residence. And
00:35:28
simply put, they're digging up a basement. It was stated to the newspapers, "We're digging up this
00:35:34
basement looking for Robin Abrams." So they were opening up some holes in in this basement and they bringing in
00:35:41
cadaavver dogs. The home's basement foundation had been poured just 6 weeks before Robin Abrams went missing. But an
00:35:51
officer in charge, a sergeant in charge at the time said, quote, "Other things are done after a foundation is laid."
00:35:57
So, police had used ground penetrating radar in this basement a few months earlier and detected a their words a
00:36:04
variance that had characteristics inconsistent with the ground. They actually what's reported is eight
00:36:12
suspicious spots were detected. However, after opening up these holes, bringing in the cadaabver dogs, nothing was
00:36:19
found. >> But we're not privy to who this property was connected to. Well, we don't know
00:36:25
who was living there at the time of the dig, but it being the basement being poured just six weeks before Robin went
00:36:32
missing is also suggestive that nobody was living there at the time that she went missing,
00:36:38
>> right? >> You know, they poured they poured the basement and then build the house on
00:36:41
top. But what's key here is John Romo was the person that poured that basement. Well, the other question I'd
00:36:50
want to know about this property was there any claims made, insurance claims made from this property because like you
00:36:59
said, Tony had an insurance company. Yeah, he he had a insurance agency at one time. That's correct. But here's
00:37:07
here's the other thing that this tells me, right, John Romo? Anybody in the garage, raise your hand if you know a
00:37:14
person, you've encountered a person in your lifetime that has only poured one basement. [laughter]
00:37:21
Nobody pours just one basement in their in a lifetime. All right. Maybe my grandfather when he built his own home
00:37:28
back in the 50s or 60s or whenever the hell it was, >> right? >> Most people >> he probably had help by somebody that
00:37:35
poured more than one basement. Most people don't pour one basement in a lifetime and then and never live in the
00:37:42
home itself. So this guy had access to all kinds of ways of making it so that someone disappears and not just
00:37:53
for a little bit of time but disappears permanently for good. >> Well, but they found nothing though,
00:38:02
right? >> Correct. But I I'm I'm saying that this wouldn't be the only basement that
00:38:08
he poured. >> Oh, I get what you're I'm picking up what you're putting down now.
00:38:12
>> Maybe they just had the wrong house. Maybe they just I don't Again, I've never met people that I've met several
00:38:19
people in my lifetime, God bless them, that have have built homes, that have poured basement. None of them have ever
00:38:26
told me that's the only basement I ever poured. They've all built multiple homes. And some of them work for outfits
00:38:33
that have built dozens, if not hundreds of homes. All right, so let's let's uh move outwardly here a little bit. Let's
00:38:40
bring things up to speed because we have a little bit more information from 2006.
00:38:46
Don Abrams, poor father, whose daughter has been missing at this point for more than a decade. He speaks with the
00:38:54
Southtown Star about his missing daughter. Unfortunately, his wife Barbara had passed away by this time.
00:39:02
But the family told the publication that because the case was still classified as
00:39:06
a missing person's investigation and nothing was being done that they felt alienated from justice because of the
00:39:12
lack of progress. He said we need closure. The one of the sisters Donna said that her sister Robin had told her
00:39:20
if anything happens to me my ex was responsible. In 2007, Robin's sister, Jodie Walsh, gave an extensive interview
00:39:30
to the Southtown Star about her sister's case. She said the family was very frustrated with the way the case had
00:39:36
been handled. They felt that the rights of the victim and her family were secondary to the rights of whoever
00:39:42
committed the crime. They said that they had poor communication with the investigators and felt that they had no
00:39:48
outlet or resources. One of the sisters told the paper that she believed there are people who know
00:39:55
who killed her sister and they need to do the right thing. That's kind of what I was circling around and and
00:40:02
hinting at with the two men driving the tow truck. Whether those two men were Tony and John
00:40:11
>> or not, I think even Tony and John or whoever one or both of those guys were in that tow truck told somebody
00:40:20
something. Somebody out there in this one knows something. This case just it's at its core there's more than one person
00:40:29
involved. >> Yeah. But the problem is once Robin goes missing, anybody that has any suspicion
00:40:37
towards Tony, then you got to go, well, if I come forward with information, these two Yahoos can get rid of me.
00:40:47
>> Yeah. Yeah. That's You're right. That's incredibly frightening. >> Well, and I think that's probably
00:40:54
>> They were successful once, >> right? And that's probably the reason why Tony's wife never left. I mean, he
00:41:00
if he's if he's physically abusive towards his girlfriend, he's probably physically abusive towards his wife. And
00:41:08
then so even if she wanted to leave him, then well, now I got to pull the trigger
00:41:13
because if I leave him, I'm possibly setting in motion my own murder. It's a scary world. And what also sucks about
00:41:24
this Tony guy, this auxiliary cop, is that he probably wanted that position for for simply the power. And
00:41:36
that's scary when we we put people like that into a position of power, into a position of law enforcement. CBS News
00:41:45
Chicago did a lot of great work on this case and was used as a one of our primary resources as well as the other
00:41:54
papers and news outlets that we've cited already in the story. But I want to hone
00:42:00
in on something that took place in 2014. This is when they CBS News Chicago reached out to
00:42:08
Robin's family. They spoke with one of the sisters learning of course that the family still suspected Tony Marquez as
00:42:16
being responsible and from their coverage one of their reporters visited the home
00:42:24
of Tony Marquez who was living in south suburban Elwood at the time in 2014. You
00:42:30
had asked about his wife earlier. So, when this reporter approached the home, Tony's wife was the one that answered
00:42:38
the door. And the reporter said, quote, "You don't think he had anything to do with her disappearance?" end quote. And
00:42:46
the wife's answer, "I don't know. Of course not." End quote. You catch somebody offguard like that and you get
00:42:55
the honest answer. The honest answer from that woman, from the wife is, "I don't know." Not, "Of course not." That
00:43:01
was her second answer. Her secondary answer. Her real feeling in her heart is I don't know. We've heard that from
00:43:08
detectives several times when when you have cases similar to this one where they believe that they hone in on the
00:43:15
responsible party at some point, be it a week after the murder or disappearance,
00:43:19
two weeks after the murder or disappearance. One thing that detectives have told us consistently
00:43:25
is that we wish we would have had the opportunity to interview him to speak with our suspect right after he or she
00:43:34
went missing, right after he or she was killed, right after he or after we found
00:43:39
the body. We we wish we could have talked with him that night or the next morning. And in this case, the reporter
00:43:45
not getting the opportunity to talk to the wife until 2014 after more than two decades had passed.
00:43:54
>> Yeah, there's nothing more frustrating than looking into a case and sometimes a
00:44:01
case can be very complicated, but more more likely it's the simple answer. And in this case, I think
00:44:10
there's a simple answer, but we still don't have any justice. The next bit of public information about this case
00:44:17
emerged the following year. In the following year, this is in 2015, the Will County States Attorney's Office
00:44:25
told a newspaper that the case was still under review. But then the Chicago Tribune reported on a mysterious letter
00:44:33
that was sent recently recently. So that means 20 recent to 2015. This letter sent to a former Will County Sheriff at
00:44:43
his home, one who had been a lead investigator on the case at some point. The letter reportedly was several pages
00:44:52
long and was described by the sheriff's office spokesperson as being of a threatening nature. They admitted that
00:45:00
the unsigned letter referenced the disappearance of an unnamed deputy 25 years earlier. And of course, the only
00:45:08
missing former sheriff's deputy was Robin Abrams. The county sheriff was now investigating this letter of of
00:45:17
threatening nature. So, could this letter have been sent to the former sheriff to one keep him quiet? What what
00:45:23
were the threats, right? Who sent it? There was no other information about this letter that that I could find.
00:45:31
>> Right. >> But this leads us >> love to have the content of that letter. >> You know me, I love a good letter.
00:45:36
>> Yeah, there's something about a letter and a true crime story. >> Send us the letter. This leads to
00:45:43
another dig. This is dig number two. if you're keeping score at home. This takes
00:45:47
place in March of 2017 when police dug up a basement, a concrete slab at the same home that they had excavated in
00:45:57
1995. This was thanks to new leads. So, they're something's giving them on more than one occasion information about this
00:46:06
particular basement. >> Yeah. You wonder if she's in the basement or is she just on the property
00:46:12
somewhere? And of course, we wouldn't be sitting here telling this story very likely if if something of significance
00:46:18
was recovered, especially if it was Robin Abrams. What we can tell you about this second dig, uh, again, reported to
00:46:26
be that of the same basement that they had dug holes into prior, it's located in the 1000 block of South
00:46:34
Margaret Street. So, some some family there has a pretty messed up basement by this point. Uh, nothing of significance
00:46:44
were found. We do have uh the Tribune was told by a police officer that a cadaavver dog had hit on the home's
00:46:53
basement that they did find a human bone, but it turned out to be over 1,000 years old. So,
00:47:03
just a coincidence here. But listen to this. The family then says, "It's our belief that she was
00:47:11
there at some point and that we believe that she may have been killed there but moved to another place."
00:47:18
>> That would make sense. >> Well, and doesn't that kind of hearken back to what the investigator was
00:47:25
saying? Like, yeah, this basement was poured six weeks before she was disappeared, but other things take place
00:47:33
afterwards. Other things happen after the foundation is poured. >> Think about this.
00:47:39
If this douchebag had other officers that were helping him harass Robin, then possibly
00:47:48
they're feeding him information on any investigation into him. >> Mhm. And it could just be they don't
00:47:57
think he's involved and but it's like, "Hey, this is your ex-girlfriend and this is what's happening and that's
00:48:04
maybe why the sheriff gets a threatening letter. Maybe that's why things have moved or changed or maybe how they or
00:48:13
why they decided to move her body." Tony could be fed information from these these other law enforcement officers. in
00:48:22
April of 2018. This is an article from the Juliet Patch that commemorated the 28 years since Robin had disappeared. It
00:48:32
was also giving a voice to her family to vent about their frustrations. Quote, "The coverup still goes on," said one of
00:48:41
Robin's sisters. She said that the investigation had deliberately failed to find Robin so that the men who killed
00:48:49
her would be protected. Quote, "Well, it was one of their own," she said, referring to the fact that Tony Marquez
00:48:58
and the Will County Sheriff's Department was suspected of being involved in her death and hiding her body. She went on
00:49:05
to say, "It's a brotherhood. The good old boys. They run deep and they cross the boundaries.
00:49:13
You wash my back, I'll wash yours. They're like kissing cousins of the South, but their dirty little secrets
00:49:20
will be revealed one day. End quote. The sister goes on to tell the newspaper, quote, "We got nothing for Robin. It's
00:49:28
like she just disappeared off the face of the earth. I'm hoping to keep it in the news. maybe someone who knew about
00:49:38
it would come and clear their conscience so we can bring her home. We should point out here too that by August of
00:49:46
2024, there were 10 unidentified persons excluded on Robin's Nameless page. That means 10
00:49:56
bodies were compared to DNA from Robin's family and found not to be her. These comparisons are done only if the
00:50:04
characteristics or circumstances of the Jane do are similar to Robin's. That's a
00:50:10
significant number of rule outs of exclusions and Robin remains missing as of this
00:50:19
recording. The Robin Abrams case genuinely seems to be one of those frustrating cases in which everyone
00:50:27
knows who is responsible for what happened. But a cone of silence maintained by the persons of interest
00:50:36
has worked very effectively to put a halt to the investigation. Tony Marquez, an experienced member of
00:50:44
law enforcement, was experienced in law enforcement methods and evidentiary procedures and clearly connected with
00:50:52
the sheriff's department, possibly took very deliberate measures to ensure that Robin Abrams would never be found and
00:51:01
that he was not connected to her disappearance in any concrete way. It also seems that he got lucky with no one
00:51:09
finding Robin and the witness who saw her car being dropped off being un able to identify anyone reliably
00:51:18
and the case taking place in 1990 prior to cell phone tracking records and surveillance cameras. It seems the
00:51:27
window law enforcement had to bring charges against Tony Marquez was open early on
00:51:35
but now has closed. And that is the most unfair outcome we can imagine when you have a young woman who worked
00:51:46
hard to follow her dreams and enter into law enforcement falls under the spell of
00:51:52
an older experienced law man. and it ends up costing her everything. I want to give a special shout out to
00:52:01
CBS Chicago. It was one of their online articles that caught my eye and inspired
00:52:06
us to cover Robin's case this week. The article headline is case of former Will County Sheriff Deputy Remains mystery
00:52:15
years later. That was from March of 2014. The opening paragraph to that article is what caught my attention. And
00:52:23
it reads, "She," meaning Robin Abrams, "has been missing longer than Stacy Peterson and Lisa Steic combined, but
00:52:32
you've probably never heard of Robin Abrams, who disappeared from Beer, Illinois back in October of 1990. I know
00:52:40
Stacy Peterson's case. We will. We have yet to get to that one, but True Crime Garage did cover Lisa
00:52:48
Stebick's case. That was episodes 271 and 272 on your garage radio dial back from January of 2019.
00:52:59
And one of Robin's sisters, Jodie Walsh, she has openly expressed her and the family's disappointment with this
00:53:09
investigation, but she says she will keep fighting for her sister. Quote, "Her life was
00:53:16
important to us. I'll never give up. Never. [music] >> [music] [music] >> Want to thank everybody for joining us
00:53:43
here in the garage. Thanks for telling your mother. Thanks for telling your brother. If you're not listening to Off
00:53:49
the Record, you should join us in the garage. We just covered a possible update in the Brian Schaefer case and we
00:53:57
have so much more in store for the great listeners of Off the Record. Colonel, do
00:54:02
we have any recommended reading for the beautiful listeners? >> Yes, we do. Captain, you are always
00:54:06
quick to mention your mother and your brother. But guess what? Thanksgiving's coming up. So when you're sitting around
00:54:12
the table feasting, don't be afraid to tell your cousins, even the ones you don't really like, about True Crime
00:54:18
Garage. This week we are recommending uh this book's fantastic. It's by good friend of the show Bob Ciphers has
00:54:26
recently released his second true crime book and it's a damn good one. The title
00:54:31
is 25 frozen onethalled murder and mayhem in the Midwest. Many of these cases are cases that Bob worked during
00:54:39
his time as an investigative journalist and crime reporter for some of the best newspapers in the Midwest. And as you
00:54:46
can tell by the title, one of these cold cases is heating up. And we hope that one and all of the others are closed out
00:54:55
real soon. Again, that's 25 frozen, onethalled, murder and mayhem in the Midwest by the great Bob Ciphers. You
00:55:04
can find that title and many more wonderful recommendations on our recommended page located at true
00:55:10
crimegar.com. And until next week, be good, be kind, and don't litter. [music] >> [music]
00:55:42
[music]