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foreign [Music] foreign garage wherever you are whatever you are doing thanks for listening I'm your host
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Nick and with me as always is a man who is actually seven but he looks much older he is the captain well my middle
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name is Benjamin it's good to be seen and good to see you thanks for listening thanks for telling a friend
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[Music] today we are drinking Aztec death Whistle by tactical Brewing Company tactical is brewing up some amazing
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to Carrie in Goodlettsville Tennessee next up Captain we have Benjamin or as I like to say been jamming in Parts
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Unknown most recently voted safest city in America by where it's at magazine and
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also in beautiful parts are known we have Ashley and Michael Parts Unknown was also named the sexiest City and the
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whole universe well thanks to everyone that contributed to this week's beer fund the feeling
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Fami reference comes from an old t-shirt that we put out after four after a four-part series titled boys on the
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Page at True Crime garage.com and guess what that's enough of the business all right everybody gather round grab a
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chair grab a beer let's talk some true kind let's let's talk some true crime [Music]
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Captain we went through the case and much of the details of the case and covered it pretty well yesterday what I
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want to get to today is we have several things to give yourself a pat on the pack oh you're welcome you know you're
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welcome we really did a great job well there are several things that I want to get through today and get your
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opinion on and kind of dissect them a little bit because there are a lot of question marks in this case
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and this still unsolved case when we went through the details one thing that we were talking about is how fast the
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gunman moved and all the actions that they took to get in there get whatever they were looking for or presumably get
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the cash that they were seeking out flee the area afterward one thing I've often wondered about this case were the
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gunmen waiting for 9 A.M to make their way into the bowling alley we know that we have employees inside of the bowling
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alley and they're active and they're working at 8 am but the bowling alley was not scheduled
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to open until 9 A.M I wonder with the short amount of time and given how close we were to 9 A.M
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were the gunman outside waiting for that nine o'clock hour to hit and as soon as
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those doors were to be unlocked make their way inside No I say I say nay I say these individuals knew what time the
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employees arrived and this crime happening in 1990 I would guess if this happened today what you could do simply
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is go back through your surveillance footage for the last couple weeks because I believe these individuals
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would have been there would have been around that area would have been casing this bowling alley for quite some time
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to have this information yeah I think a couple of possibilities could be likely here and of course we
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there's no way to know for sure until we bust these guys until these guys are apprehended we may not know why they did
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what they did or exactly how they planned what they did but what I think we see here is
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what we talked about yesterday it appears that they already decided on the plan because they're moving very fast
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Through the Motions to get back out and to flee the area the thing that I think that we we might be looking at some
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possibilities you know often when these businesses are hit a lot of times you want to hit them when they're closed
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because you don't want to have the added risk factor of additional people being inside the building customers so often
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what these offenders will do is they will hang around outside of a place and they will wait for things that will
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cause the doors to be open or unlocked you know deliveries or employees coming and going from the building to a car
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often what an offender or robber will do is wait for someone simply to take out the trash
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jump them stick a gun in their side out in the parking lot and walk back into the establishment with them take the
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money that they're looking for and then flee the area right right I think we could have one of two
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things either yes maybe they were waiting for 9 A.M seems like they arrived a little early to just be
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standing around a place that you are going to eventually Rob right but if they were standing there waiting around
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to rob the joint maybe they saw Steve Scenic enter and then exit the building both times without having to use a key
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or locking the door behind him right and thought you know what as soon as this dude pulls away we're gonna walk in to
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the place and take it over or maybe it was as simple as they were going to walk up and knock on the door and if the
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person opened up shove a gun in their face and work their way in to me if it were me trying to pull this thing off
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I would want to avoid that 9 A.M when there could be additional people coming in in and out of the building with the
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customers and the doors being opened in the business being in operation at that time well maybe not so much if it was a
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Monday or Tuesday but this is a Saturday this is going to be a lot busier of a day for the bowling alley
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that's why I think the level of sophistication of these criminals is very high I would I'd even look into
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somebody that had some military background I'd also like to know if there was a set schedule of who open
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because we know that the Donner opened up so I'm assuming some days the daughter opened up and some days the
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father would open up or possibly her brother which again if you're two men with a gun
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it's less likely of a risk that somebody's going to fight back if they're female right or if they did
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fight back you have a better chance of controlling the situation so did these perpetrators know that there was a
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schedule there was a system and and that's again that would be little things that I think you could
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find out if they had the surveillance footage of this bowling alley right and just to throw a little tidbit of
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information in there on what you were talking about one thing that's interesting is the owner
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he Ronald Cenac at the time he was living in the bowling alley but he was not there that weekend he was
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in I believe he was in Arizona on a golf trip that weekend well I'm thinking about
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this they're they're possibly are people that could connect these individuals to the owner or to the bowling alley or
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to other people that they knew but but they're dead so we we don't have that evidence again
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that would be more motive of why did they they didn't have to kill these individuals but if you were connected to
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the owner you're connected to the bowling alley if these people could identify you any way shape or form then
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that that's motive to get rid of all of them right and then speaking to that you
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know you have two suspects according to the survivors and what we know about the
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case and eyewitnesses and such these suspects did not wear masks or gloves right when I look at this case I
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go why wouldn't you just put on a freaking mask and some gloves and go in there Rob
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The Joint make off with whatever money you can and not hurt anybody yeah but which eyewitnesses are saying that they
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didn't wear gloves the survivors in the bowling alley that were robbed and shot by these two guys
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and we also have Steve Scenic outside who says you know I didn't they weren't in masker gloves when he saw them either
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well no I buy the fact that they're not again in mask because again maybe you know that these eyewitnesses are going
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to be able to identify you whether you're wearing a mask or not the glove part doesn't make a lot of sense to me
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you'd think how militant they were that they would wear some protections because
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that's identifying factor is your fingerprint well that also leads us back to a big question that we've been
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circling around for a portion of yesterday is could this have been some type of inside
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job okay if these guys either one of them had worked at this place before they would
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have been busted by now so nobody's speculating that you know because that's typically what you get with some of
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these robberies where it's a former employee and they know the daily routines and operations of that business
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right here what I mean is did we have somebody feeding them some kind of information because it does seem like
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you pointed out that the two gunmen knew some stuff about the Saturday operations
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of the bowling alley right it appears to me judging by what the set of events that we have during the commission of
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that robbery and the murders it appears to me based off what the survivors are saying and how things went
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down that these guys knew the general location of the employees well let me run something by you that kind of stuck
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up to me but maybe I'm crazy well we know I'm crazy but so we have a situation where we have the
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employees at the bowling alley they're all female until the brother shows up so the brother shows up but then he
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leaves I wonder if these individuals knew that all the all these women are going to come in to start the day
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and that we have a technician that's going to come in and he's male so once they see that this male entered
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the building now all the people that are going to be there before it opens are now in the building so then they get out
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to start approaching the building and he comes walking out they go well now now this is a lot easier because we knew
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that the technician coming in was mail so there I'm guessing that these uh perpetrators believe that that was the
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technician but now he's leaving okay well that's easier for us let's walk in why they didn't lock the door behind
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them I don't know but again I'm assuming that they believe that everybody was now
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in the building but they just saw that guy leave and drive off and then that's why they would have been surprised by
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the technician showing up yeah that's a good question why wouldn't they have just flipped the lock
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themselves but they but that's my belief is they they believe that uh the brother was the
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the technician and he already left so we don't have to worry about him now well my other guest though too would be that
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you need a key regardless on what side of the door that you're on yeah to lock the door because you don't want some
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jackass kid going up there and locking your door in the middle of business so um or some non-jackass kid for that
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matter yeah he was just trying to be safe you're calling him names I'm sorry yeah
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jackass kid but so the thing that really kind of upset me here was the the location of the employees right how
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quickly they move inside the gunman and then very quickly one of them knows to go into the kitchen immediately like
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they knew before they got in the building to expect an employee to be inside that kitchen working right and
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that's very troubling to me and and where I took that a step further and just really speculating and being
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suspicious of everyone was I was like [ __ ] man this Steve Scenic he provides a
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description of this really kind of weird story right he described he describes the two gunmen
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or the people he believes could be the gunman and then we never find these guys so I wondered for a while like
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was he somehow involved if this was an inside job did he pull up in the parking lot that day to one make sure that the
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guys that were hired by whomever were there and then he's like oh maybe he found the door locked went in
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grabbed his book bag and purposely left it unlocked on his way out then the he pulls off the gunman make their way in
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I was very highly suspicious of the scenic family and Steve Scenic and the owner Ronald Scenic was he did he just
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happen to be out of town on the weekend that the murders took place or was he conveniently out of town yeah
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then we have the issue of Ida okay she was the one working in the kitchen she gives a description that is very similar
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to what Steve gave and she survived the attack from the inside and was shot several times
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I don't think that it's convenient I don't think that Steve put himself there to unlock the door for these gunmen I
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think that that whole horrible weird coincidence of the door being unlocked was just one of those weird freak things
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that took place and these gunmen were going to do whatever they set out to do anyway regardless of the the state of
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the lock on that door yeah well because if he would have just went out to his car again and just put his book bag back
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in his car and went back in these these murderers they're coming in no matter what whether
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Steve's there or not again I think they knew how many people were supposed to be there and whether
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they're whether or not they're supposed to be male or female well the thing too is let's say they did have some prior
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knowledge because if if they did have prior knowledge they could have been working under the
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assumption that there was only going to be two employees there right we would have the manager the day
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manager would be there regardless their duty is to open up the bowling alley for
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the day it sounds to me like some form of kitchen employee or kitchen staff member is going to be there on a busy
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Saturday prepping regardless if it's Ida a woman a man whomever so now we got two people inside the
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building before nine I think where it gets a little iffy if you did have some Intel about
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what would be going on that Saturday morning is Ron Scenic the owner being gone out of town that might be
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unforeseeable to whomever provided that information also we have the two girls who were with
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Stephanie Scenic in the office that morning I would bet you there's a good chance
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that these guys may not have anticipated one or both of those girls being there now we do know that they were there to
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work that day they were going to run the daycare center at the bowling alley that
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day we could also presume that if they expected to be out before the mechanic arrived
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his his shift may not have started till nine maybe he shows up early that day I don't know but but the other thing is we
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they wouldn't anticipate him showing up with two daughters with him they're not scheduled to work obviously they're
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little kids right so they might have been surprised by how many people were at the bowling alley I
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think that they were I mean this is seven victims here no no I think they were surprised by the technician but
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again the the other thing that hurts us in this case is 1990 it's a bowling alley most of the transactions at that
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time would have been cash cash money you know I used to go bowling all the time a
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couple times a week and it was cash right and most people would use cash in 1990 these these individuals they I
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believe wholeheartedly they knew all the ins and outs they knew this was going to
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take them 10 to 15 minutes and we just have to be very um a matter of fact about it and I think
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they were surprised by the technician and the fact that he brought his two daughters because because they knew that
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there was a technician I just believe they they thought Steve was the technician these individuals probably
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went bowling the Saturday the before so they would have known also that there was a daycare open but were they
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expecting for there to be two children with the technician I think they were surprised by that
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yeah and that but see that's the terrifying thing to me is that I don't feel like
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I can't look at anything in this case and go okay that's the thing that set these guys off and then they decided to
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shoot all these people now that was premeditated right it's like they went in there going no matter what happens
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we're shooting them yeah you know like we we covered the Lane Bryant case and you can point to oh
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the the perpetrator of that caught somebody on the phone with 9-1-1 we don't know for certain if that shooter
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would have shot them or not but what we do know is there was a 9-1-1 call that took place and then
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the shooting started right we have no situation like that in this case and we also don't have any eyewitnesses or any
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survivors saying that there was any discussion right between these these guys there's no all two guys huddled in
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the corner going now what do we do there's seven people that's what I'm saying this is this is a level of
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sophistication these are these guys aren't dummies that's also another reason why the case
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is not solved these guys aren't dummies they knew like I said it's step by step by step
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right and it didn't matter that now you have again I think um less level of sophistication less
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like again military somebody that has killed before once those children are involved that's a whole another level
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but as as far as sick and and twisted and level a piece of [ __ ] that you have to be so that's another level but they
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didn't hesitate all now there's children here get in the office by the way we're
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shooting you off and we're setting the goddamn place on fire and they're setting the office on fire not the whole
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building they're we're our the purpose of the fire is to get rid of the evidence and the awarenesses yeah yeah
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to get get rid of the evidence of the men being in that office and to to confuse and convolute the whole mess
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already messy situation and the thing that drives me nuts is this seems so familiar on so many levels
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to like the yogurt shop murders begin a situation where we have all female workers we're going to we're
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going to get into that bit of it here in a minute and I'm glad that you brought that up but one thing I want to make
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sure that I point out before we move on too far and I forget about it is Ida one
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of our survivors the the lady working in the kitchen that morning she says and there are a couple other
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people too and I couldn't find people by name you know reference by name having said this but what I found was Ida and
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others have said this that they think that they have seen these two men in the bowling alley before
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and that they weren't there bowling they weren't there shooting pool they weren't
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really interacting with anybody they were just kind of sitting there looking around now that would explain some of
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the things because you don't have to have Insider information from somebody that works there owns the place or
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previously worked there to get an idea of the daily operations right you can you can go in there and you can sit
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around and you can go you know what all right I see employees coming in and out of this room over here at this location
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that must be like some kind of office or something oh and over there by the bar or by the tables I see employees coming
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in and out of that room that must be a kitchen oh we got this huge bowling alley 32 lanes and that's really where I
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see the majority of the workers congregating right those are our two places to be concerned
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with once we come in here when there's no customers right and it's just like the guitar store I used to work at like
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we opened up every day at 10. so all you have to do is show up a couple times when we open
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but chances are you would have seen if you got there 10 minutes early the lights didn't even turn on until five
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minutes before we opened meaning these employees haven't been there for the last hour sitting in the dark so if
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you're going to rob a place like that you you wait till it opens at 10. and you also know that there's not a bunch
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of customers at 10 o'clock especially like on a Monday or Tuesday but in this case
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they're there 45 minutes roughly 45 minutes to 30 minutes earlier than the doors were supposed to open
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so I mean this is this is again maybe it's not that they're getting their uh Intel from Insider Scoops but it's them
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casing The Joint right and you know what you could case The Joint to figure out where the employees are spending most of
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their time to to have areas to focus on once you enter the building you don't have to even go in on a Friday night to
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know that they're busy you can drive by the parking lot and see how many cars are in the thing to know that hey
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they're busy they make a lot of money on Friday nights now the difficult thing here is to know that the money that the
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cash from the night before is going to be in the building the morning after that's the difficult thing because not
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every business operates that way some businesses do night deposits after the business closes you could follow
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employees after a Friday night shift and go all right not a single one of them went to the bank so they're not
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depositing the money but that makes it more difficult when the owner lives at the balloon alley right that I don't
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know if there would be any way for them to know that you know if they were a former employee
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correct and again I I really believe if they were former employees this case would be solved yeah unless there was
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something that the owner did that these guys had something on him and this was like a way of them showing him hey we're
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we're serious guys that you don't want to mess with yeah but they shot his granddaughter and his daughter and his
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daughter even though she survived years later she died from the injuries from that attack yeah so it's like I I mean
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what do you have on the guy that that he doesn't go screw it I don't care what these guys
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have on me I'm telling the cops everything I know because they they tried to kill my family
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yeah and they killed little kids of people that I know so it you know I I don't really and look
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here's here's the thing Ronald Scenic and there's people out there that know this case really well
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and they're going to go Ronald Cenex is suspicious dude he's look he's not a likable guy I'm not going to sit here
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and pretend like he's a likable guy who's your favorite and you know we have people that in
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interviews say he's not a likable guy the police didn't like him the police said you know this guy was out talking
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to everybody after the after the case took place after the shootings took place he's out telling them stuff that
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isn't true they looked into Ron Scenic and whether you like the guy or not at the end of
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the day what we have is we have detectives saying we looked at this dude super hardcore we put him under a
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microscope looked at every aspect of his business dealings in his life yeah we spread his cheeks we looked inside and
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we couldn't find any illegal activity you know the guy was not a smart businessman he had a successful bowling
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alley that he ended up losing it in an auction in a court-ordered auction I believe less than a year or maybe one
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full year after the shooting but he was not a smart business guy he was not a likable guy but if I really
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believe dude if he was anyhow involved in this or looking for some kind of insurance
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scam or whatever that I think they would have found this because they really honed in on him
00:27:33
something pretty good [Music] [Applause] [Music] [Music] cheers mates Cheers Cheers Cheers I can't stop
00:28:06
looking at this picture of the suspects these these uh composite drawings and just thinking Sherman Sherman Sherman
00:28:17
all right Captain well I want to discuss how did these two suspects make such a clean getaway they were basically
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undetected yes they were seen fleeing on foot by one person but I've often wondered were they
00:28:32
running to a vehicle or were they running to a nearby house or building to kind of hide out for a little bit
00:28:42
one thing that we talked about when we discussed the I5 killer and it's weird to go into the story and
00:28:49
say I5 killer but for those that don't know the story the I5 killer was also a robber and he was a very experienced
00:28:56
robber in fact sometimes he would go in and rob a place and not kill anybody but one thing that he learned along the
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way in his robbery career was that a vehicle is a really good way to get detected to get identified and get
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picked up and arrested for these robberies and in his case the killings so he learned very early on that it was
00:29:21
not wise for him to park his vehicle near the place he was robbing so he would often park at blocks and blocks
00:29:28
away because this dude was pretty athletic the I5 killer he would Rob the place sometimes kill the person and then
00:29:36
he would flee on foot and then get to his vehicle and then drive off I thought maybe that might be what these
00:29:44
dudes were doing maybe they want to flee on foot and then make a dash for the Border
00:29:50
but then we we have a very big difference between these two different people the the I5 killer and the unknown
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gunman at Las Cruces the I5 killer was wearing a mask and gloves when he committed his crimes so
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he did not want to be detected or identified where the Las Cruces gunman they're not wearing mask or gloves then
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you have to take it a step further and go well how much do they really care if their vehicle is spotted right but see
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again that almost makes me think maybe they didn't have a vehicle to to run to right but I I also wonder if my theory
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is correct that these guys case the joint for a while that they would have thought the brother
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was the technician and that got and then maybe thinking that the technician doesn't show up
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everybody else shows up around 8 o'clock technician shows up about 8 30. well we have an individual showing up in
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between that time so he would have been early if he was the technician did that startle them so
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they weren't able to put on their mask or their gloves they went oh there's a technician we gotta go Oh you mean for
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the purpose of fleeing no I mean that they startled them at the beginning so before they entered the building they
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didn't put on their mask or gloves yeah I I don't know I would think if they brought masking gloves with them they
00:31:18
would have put them on regardless of the situation we do have a statement by the LCPD they
00:31:27
have stated in the past and this is pure speculation on their part as well that they believe that the two gunmen
00:31:34
may have had some type of help that someone may have sheltered the two of them shortly after so they could lay low
00:31:41
and then maybe flee the area at another time I have a hard time believing that they
00:31:47
just kind of hung around Las Cruces for the next 30 years because as said their pictures were plastered everywhere and
00:31:55
we have Steve Scenic saying that is exactly what you drew looks exactly like the two guys that I saw and then we have
00:32:02
Ida backing that up we have the other witness that says hey people that look like that I saw them running from the
00:32:09
area what's interesting is that kind of plays a part into this next portion where a woman named Irma tiarina
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comes forward at some point and says hey I think that the two gunmen were staying
00:32:23
with me when they committed the crimes she says that there were two guys and I believe they were involved in some kind
00:32:31
of illegal drug activity at the time that we're staying with her and when the helicopters were flying around looking
00:32:39
for the two gunmen who fled the bowling alley she says one of them said to the other one we're right under their noses
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and they don't even know it this is a little weird this is a really weird portion of the story for me
00:32:53
Captain because this Irma this Irma Tia Arena she passes a polygraph but at some
00:32:58
point the police like she recance her statement saying that she was just looking to
00:33:06
I'm a little confused by her statement it it implied that she was looking for a way to score some drugs I don't know if
00:33:14
that meant that she was looking to provide false information to the police and hoping to collect some of the reward
00:33:20
money but the short of it is she had her demons she was involved with drugs and it seems like quite a bit especially
00:33:31
around this time I have in my notes here that she passed away in 2001 from a drug
00:33:35
overdose what I do know is that at some point the police seem to be not interested in talking to this woman
00:33:42
anymore yeah it could be I mean we've seen this in a lot of cases where somebody comes forward with supposed
00:33:49
information and then you find out nobody was even staying with her right these guys didn't even exist they just existed
00:33:55
in our head or some of the things that she's telling them they were probably able to prove or not true right and so
00:34:02
they're like well we we can't uh we can't let her steer our investigation because it's uh nonsense
00:34:10
one of the things though too that is often mentioned in this case is that the locals the local rumor always seems to
00:34:18
have been that there were drugs involved or suspected drugs involved in this case and that
00:34:26
eventually the two gunmen fled to Mexico and I think there could be some truth to
00:34:32
both of those portions of the story but a lot of that I think stems from the idea that Ida says that she believes
00:34:41
from the gunman's actions that they were looking for something else in the office
00:34:46
that day not just the money in the safe and the way that this portion of the story goes down is that once they're
00:34:53
aware of where the safe is or they have access to the safe that they still continue to look through
00:34:59
filing cabinet drawers and desk drawers like they were all they were looking for
00:35:03
something else not just the money in the safe well again this kind of goes to the
00:35:08
idea of what if the owner was doing something shady and these guys were like Hey we're going to come collect
00:35:15
from you he happens then be out of town and then these guys again looking they get the money because maybe the owner
00:35:25
owes them money and maybe or maybe he was going to traffic some drugs for them and so the drugs are gone but he's never
00:35:33
paid them the money so they go in there steal the money look for any extra drugs
00:35:39
or these guys just hear a rumor a bad rumor that's not true that the place is full of drugs
00:35:46
right I mean that that does happen a lot I mean we got the the whole clutter family was murdered because they thought
00:35:53
ten thousand dollars was somewhere in that house and there was no money in that house yeah or they're looking for
00:35:59
money but they're looking for something else that a value that isn't drugs but again a rumor by somebody well that's
00:36:07
where I bring in RJ Scenic he's another son of Ron Scenic and he's a known drug user in fact he passed away from a drug
00:36:18
overdose as well and I believe this was in 1997 or 1999 seems to stick out but it was in the
00:36:27
late 90s he was a known drug user and I believe he was he was known to have maybe even
00:36:35
dealt drugs he worked at the bowling alley in some form or fashion most Reports say state that he was a
00:36:41
bartender now obviously he was not working on that day on that Saturday when the place was robbed and these poor
00:36:48
people were shot but then you have to take it a step further is that does that become the
00:36:54
Genesis of this bad rumor or is RJ out there telling people on the streets stuff that's not true
00:37:01
or was he did somebody know that he was actually running drugs out of there selling drugs at the bar and then they
00:37:08
go in there looking for said drugs and this money from the safe then I want to go to what you referenced
00:37:16
earlier here Captain the Austin yogurt shop murders we covered those in episodes 81 and 82 in 2017. when we
00:37:25
covered this I was amazed at how many people told me they have always wondered if these two
00:37:31
cases these two absolutely horrific crimes if they were possibly connected the yogurt shop murders is an open
00:37:39
homicide case in Austin Texas this took place on a Friday December 6 1991 so less than two years later a very similar
00:37:49
crime and what do I mean by similar crime at a yogurt shop in Austin Texas the store was robbed
00:37:55
the girls there were four of them present were brutally attacked and the building was set on fire afterwards all
00:38:02
four killed again it's a no one spared situation one of the big difference though was they were robbed at night
00:38:09
right and this was robbed in the morning correct and we also have the I mean they they
00:38:17
were subjected to rape and all kinds of attacks yeah where the Las Cruces situation is much different where the
00:38:26
guys the robbers killers were in and out rather quickly but wasn't there a eyewitness that saw some guys
00:38:34
in the yogurt shop earlier that night that possibly had Army fatigues or well that's the thing
00:38:41
we really did our best to try to lock in on two very who who we believe might have been the suspects and they were two
00:38:50
individuals that were spotted in the yogurt shop just before closing time that have never been identified
00:38:55
everybody else that entered the yogurt shop that night as far as we know that were seen by other customers have been
00:39:01
identified to this date except for these two guys the description of these two guys would make them significantly
00:39:08
younger than both of our suspects here in Las Cruces [Music] and this case took place as said after
00:39:17
Las Cruces so that doesn't really track but one thing I wanted to look at real quick was the hold back information now
00:39:24
what is hold back information hold back information is what the police will hold
00:39:29
back so that the public doesn't know about this in case they get false confessions or if they get people that
00:39:34
they think are serious suspects information that they can try to pull out of them to make them even stronger
00:39:41
suspects things that only the perpetrators would know about the crime and the yogurt shop they held back 13
00:39:48
bits of information now we know what this is because eventually this did go to trial that whole thing is a mess long
00:39:55
story short it's still an unsolved case but let's go through this real quick because I wanted to compare it to Las
00:40:02
Cruces here are the items that they held back at the yogurt shop one how and where the
00:40:08
fire was started well we know that in Las Cruces Bowl the key to the front door that's
00:40:14
interesting because I would think that the detectives would want to have held back the information that the gunman
00:40:20
found the door unlocked at the bowling alley mm-hmm that wouldn't have been people in the public wouldn't expect the
00:40:27
door to be unlocked it was closed the business wasn't open yet right how much money was taken I think that what we
00:40:33
have here at Las Cruces that they have held that information back all the reports State 4 000 or 5 000 or
00:40:41
somewhere between four and five thousand dollars was stolen from Las Cruces and I'm guessing that they're getting that
00:40:47
number from what they think the business probably would have made the night before but we have no way of knowing how
00:40:55
much business how much cash the business left on hand or how much cash that the owner stored
00:41:03
of his own cash in in the cell safe because that's where he was living well we have the day
00:41:10
manager there they're doing the books had she already gone through everything from the night before and counted all
00:41:16
the money right they would know how much was missing now the rumor has always been that they didn't take all of the
00:41:22
money and which has always been weird because sometimes it's reported that they left some of the money in the safe
00:41:28
they didn't take all the money from the safe or they didn't take all the money from the bowling alley which again maybe
00:41:34
they already loaded one of the registers and they just didn't check the register
00:41:38
before they left regarding all of the money in the safe one thing I've always wondered about
00:41:44
that Captain because people will point out well that is proof that they were looking for something else I do believe
00:41:49
they were looking for something else I don't think if they left money in the safe it's proof of such especially if
00:41:54
the one portion of the story is true where the girls where they put the victims in charge of loading up the
00:42:02
briefcases made out maybe just out of fear or Panic they forgot one of the areas that there's cash yeah exactly or
00:42:09
they were startled by Stephen Tehran who came in unexpectedly yeah possibly or it's a situation I mean look I know it's
00:42:18
Hollywood but you watch the town you watch Point Break sometimes those guys have timers after
00:42:25
this timer goes off now we're moving on to the next thing no matter where we're at and in the process right
00:42:32
there are several items on this list of 13 that may not pertain to what we have here at Las Cruces a lot of
00:42:42
the help hold back information at yogurt shop had to do with the Bindings that were used to tie up the girls and also
00:42:51
some of the injuries sustained to the victims but we don't ha as far as we know the
00:42:59
victims here weren't tied up and it doesn't appear that they Unleashed any kind of violence on these victims before
00:43:06
shooting them so that may not have any relevance in this case unless they did and that is part of the hold back
00:43:14
information in Las Cruces but we also have one interesting thing here there were two different caliber of
00:43:21
guns used in yogurt shop and it's believed that there were two guns used in Las Cruces Bowl as well we have
00:43:29
reports that one of them was likely a 22 but never any reports of the other caliber of guns so maybe that's a
00:43:38
portion that has been held back there's also a couple of references here out of the 13 items in Austin yogurt shop of
00:43:48
additional items that was taken from the shop that that was not money so you have to wonder was there anything
00:43:56
else taken from the bowling alley that has been held back from the general public well as fascinating as I find
00:44:06
this case and as fascinating as I find the Austin yogurt shop murders and if you haven't listened to those
00:44:14
episodes you should check those out I really think it's that there's a control here in this one
00:44:22
and is it possible that these individuals Rob multiple places and started losing
00:44:30
control as they went on because this happened and then in 1990 yoga shop I believe was 91
00:44:38
so did they lose control as they went um I I just I I view them as different things I really feel like the yogurt
00:44:46
shop murders it was a lot more chaotic perpetrated by different kind of monsters yeah with different agendas but
00:44:56
that doesn't mean that but to me somebody that has this much control is capable of doing this time and time
00:45:05
again without almost any fear of being caught yeah so one article that I found that I
00:45:12
thought was really intriguing Captain this was from the Associated Press in December of 1990 in fact it was December
00:45:20
19th of 1990 where they were talking to Fred Rubio he's the Las Cruces Police Captain the head of the Department's
00:45:29
detectives at the time and he's talking about you know hey I would hate to leave
00:45:34
this profession without being here when they saw this I love the optimism of when they saw this and he says this case
00:45:43
still haunts us now at this time we're talking it's only 10 months old but he says we're not used to having Unsolved
00:45:51
Mysteries here in this city and that is intriguing because not only is he referencing that hey the case was
00:45:59
covered on Unsolved Mysteries but remember in 1989 they only had two homicides and I didn't go through the
00:46:08
entire year of 1990 to figure out how many homicides Las Cruces had in that entire year but what I did find was two
00:46:16
interesting things by February 16th of 1990 Las Cruces the city of Las Cruces had
00:46:25
seven homicides by February 16th where the year before two for the entire year now of course we know that four
00:46:33
unfortunately four died on February 10th of 1990 right that leaves three other homicides we actually mentioned one of
00:46:41
the other ones earlier in our coverage of this case there was a man that was stabbed and he was found at 2 30 in the
00:46:47
afternoon the same day as the shootings they solved that they found the guy that
00:46:52
did that so there's one that's down there was a stabbing that took place on February 16th where unfortunately a
00:47:01
victim died they located the perpetrator of that murder very quickly and apprehended them what we have here is
00:47:10
almost at the end of 1990 on the 19th of December Fred Rubio says we only have two homicide cases
00:47:21
for the entire year of 1990 that remained unsolved that is the Las Cruces bowling alley Massacre and a gas station
00:47:30
robbery that took place in January well what's that case cotton all right Captain let me run this by you and you
00:47:37
let me know your feelings here this is from an old Crime Stoppers article it says that they are looking for
00:47:46
information leading to the arrest and prosecution of the persons involved in the Robbery Homicide that occurred on
00:47:54
January 14 1990 at Ray's Shell station located at 2417 West Picasso in Las Cruces
00:48:07
the Las Cruces Police Department was called to the scene at approximately 1004 a.m where they found the attendant
00:48:15
Salvador Lozano lying face down in the office area further investigation revealed that the victim had been shot
00:48:24
one time in the back of the head the victim's hands were tied behind his back the caliber or type of firearm used has
00:48:33
not yet been determined investigators believe there was more than one person involved in this robbery murder
00:48:40
investigating officers have been able to determine that a robbery did take place
00:48:46
prior to the victim being shot and I'm going to go off of article here for a second I did some further snooping and
00:48:53
found that it's believed that approximately 500 was stolen from the gas station before this man was murdered
00:49:00
and then they go on to say anyone with information please call The Crime Stoppers or call the New Mexico State uh
00:49:10
police so what I'm going where I'm getting at here Captain is that 30 years ago these two crimes took place less than a
00:49:20
month apart in time the distance between these two businesses both located in Las
00:49:26
Cruces is 3.2 miles from one another they both took place on a weekend day in the morning this was on a Sunday at 10
00:49:36
A.M well they found the victim at 10 A.M this could have taken place at 8 30 or 9
00:49:42
A.M but we have Las Cruces bowl that took place on a Saturday and we know that the murders were committed before 8
00:49:52
30 on that day there seems to be a lot of similarities here where they're shooting unnecessarily shooting the
00:49:59
person who is attending the business that they are robbing shot in the back of the head more than one offender both
00:50:07
still unsolved after 30 years not just the two unsolved homicide cases from 1990. well definitely in some very
00:50:16
interesting some similarities in those cases you almost have to wonder if either
00:50:23
police have reason to believe that they're not connected proof that they're not connected and we
00:50:29
just don't know about this or is this a situation where the gas station was not that big of a score five hundred dollars
00:50:38
roughly and you have to wonder were they looking for a much bigger score and thought that Las Cruces Bowl could be
00:50:45
what they were after not just the money in the safe but maybe some kind of drugs
00:50:51
or a large quantity of Narcotics are on scene as well and then this horrific crime multiple murders on the same day
00:51:02
and now it's just to the the heat has been turned up they got to get out of Dodge it's it's a tricky situation
00:51:09
because you want both of these crimes to be solved and then you sit here and wonder
00:51:15
is it the same perpetrators and that's why neither of them have been solved for 30 years
00:51:21
well again with the evidence being destroyed with the fire [Music] these individuals what we do know is how
00:51:30
vicious they are and you would think they're so vicious over even such small amounts of money
00:51:39
that they would eventually get caught yeah you yes or and yeah end up in prison for some other offense or even
00:51:48
some other murder mm-hmm we do have some new information that came out recently and this is very interesting and I and I
00:51:56
hope and pray that this goes somewhere somehow because we still have people that are hurting very bad and here's the
00:52:05
other thing you got to keep in mind too when we talk about there is no real closure in these cases
00:52:12
and that is absolutely true and victims and family members of victims will tell you there is no real closure in these
00:52:21
cases but one thing that I think is important to bring up here when you have a situation
00:52:26
like this where you have multiple people multiple victims some of them did not survive that day
00:52:34
some of them did unfortunately the ones that were lucky enough if you want to call it that lucky
00:52:41
enough to survive that day they live in fear for the rest of their lives because they know that these two
00:52:49
gunmen are still out there somewhere or could be out there yeah could be out there somewhere so when we talk about no
00:52:56
real closure that might be some pretty significant form of closure for our surviving victims well we hear a lot
00:53:05
that that the family serves answers and answers doesn't always mean closure but answers are important knowing what
00:53:15
happened and why it happened is important even if they're never going to get closure yeah because you can't bring
00:53:22
people back and that's the that's the sad sad truth but we've had the 30-year anniversary I guess if you want to call
00:53:30
it that it's been 30 years since these murders took place and that was of course in February of 2020 and we wanted
00:53:38
to cover this ideally we would have covered this right around the anniversary but we were busy doing our Shaker
00:53:45
Heights project at that time and it couldn't couldn't be put off any longer so here we are now captain and I'm kind
00:53:52
of glad that we waited a little bit because we wouldn't have had this little tidbit of information had we done this
00:53:58
case back in February so what happened was on the 30-year marker we have Las Cruces Crime Stoppers upped
00:54:07
the reward for information on the ID of the possible suspects this is to thirty thousand dollars
00:54:15
and around the same time we have ABC 7 anchor her name is Stephanie Vale she said that around the 30-year
00:54:26
anniversary she received a call from a woman originally from Las Cruces who gave her the name of a man
00:54:34
the tipster is certain is the younger of the two attackers the younger gunman right
00:54:42
she claims that his family knew or had a decent idea that he committed the crime but remained quiet
00:54:50
about it all of these years this man that she is implicating killed himself in 1997.
00:55:00
we will see if this comes to be what comes of this information I'm sure we'll find out here hopefully sooner rather
00:55:09
than later the Las Cruces Police Department still urges anyone with any kind of information at all no matter how
00:55:18
seemingly insignificant to please please call Crime Stoppers at 1-800-222-8477 [Music]
00:55:31
foreign [Music] thanks for for joining us in the garage Colonel do we have any recommended
00:55:48
reading this week Captain I am very excited to recommend to the good garage people an incredible book this is one of
00:55:58
if not the best True Crime book of 2020 so far the book is called the Garden State Parkway murders a Cold Case
00:56:07
Mystery by Christian Barth the Garden State Parkway murders is the true story of two College friends who were brutally
00:56:15
knifed to death and their bodies left off the parkway the author identifies several suspects including Infamous
00:56:21
serial killers Ted Bundy and Gerald stano this wonderful book is the result of nine years of nose to the Grind
00:56:30
investigative research and it's out of wild blue press a premier publisher of True Crime books so
00:56:38
you know it's good check out the Garden State Parkway murders and other titles on our recommended page at truecrime
00:56:46
garage.com yeah I'm with the holiday next week we will be off we have we'll still have off the Record
00:56:54
but we have something very exciting for you so make sure you're following us on Twitter or
00:57:03
Instagram or Facebook because next week there'll be some very exciting things happening with the garage we are going
00:57:12
to be hot and heavy as they say hot in the hot tub if you're not following True Crime garage make sure you get that
00:57:20
started today you don't want to miss out on next week everybody have a great safe
00:57:25
and wonderful Fourth of July until next time be good be kind and don't let it [Music]
00:57:52
thank you foreign