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GameChanger [Music] [Music] welcome to True Crime garage wherever you are whatever you're doing thanks for
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enough of the be all right everybody gather around grab a chair grab a beer let's talk some true
00:03:28
crime love is like a oh [Music] take Saturday November 12th 196 9-year-old Gloria kowitz left her
00:03:51
parents house before 8 a.m. to head to St Mary of Mount Carmel Church for the 8:00 a.m. Mass the church chur was
00:04:00
located at 6722 South Hermitage Avenue on the southwest side of the great City of
00:04:08
Chicago the walk wasn't far just three or four blocks from her home located at 2002 West 67th Place and Gloria was
00:04:18
accustomed to making this walk it was a different era back then obviously young children were much Freer to go to and
00:04:27
from places like School Church Church Parks without parents it doesn't appear that Gloria's parents gave her walking
00:04:36
alone a second thought but they did give it a second thought when she didn't come
00:04:42
home in fact she never made it to church that day said a school friend who waited
00:04:48
for her at the church entrance her parents reported her missing on Saturday afternoon and I apologize to you captain
00:04:57
and all the wonderful listeners out there there we do not have a clear time of when she was reported missing slack
00:05:04
her but they would not have to wait too long before A call came in from the police the dreaded call the call that
00:05:12
nobody wanted at 11:40 on that Saturday morning a laundry truck driver was taking an early lunch break from his
00:05:21
route and was seated at a roadside table next to the Palos Hills forest preserve
00:05:28
after part working on the shoulder glancing into the woods this man's name is Harry lindman he was startled to see
00:05:37
something in the underbrush of a ravine closer examination made him draw back in
00:05:43
horror it was a dead child that he saw her face and head were bloody and disfigured to the point that until
00:05:53
autopsy police suspected that she had been beaten to death her pink and brown Checker dress was pulled pulled up
00:05:59
exposing her underwear and her shoes and socks were missing her blue leotards lay
00:06:06
on the ground near her body her father Edward was called to the scene to see whether the corpse was in fact his
00:06:13
little girl and unfortunately it was he told police that the little girl's blue coat purse rosary and a prayer book were
00:06:22
all missing from the scene but they weren't missing for very long either these items were found along various
00:06:32
roadways heading back toward the city of Chicago yeah it seems like the killer was dumping the evidence as they drove
00:06:38
back into the city you are exactly right police believed that the killer had tossed them out of the window of his
00:06:45
vehicle on his way back to the city he took the girl from the city drove out of town she's killed and then he is
00:06:54
disposing of her items as he is driving back to town and to back that up we have
00:07:01
this from the Chicago Tribune that says glorious purse containing her white gloves two prayer books and a Rosary
00:07:08
were found a block west of the Southwest Highway along Highway 83 along with one
00:07:15
of her shoes the other shoe was found at Highway 83 and 69th Avenue her blue coat
00:07:22
was found on Highway 83 at ridgland Avenue about 5 mil east of where the was found it's like this guy didn't really
00:07:32
care about leaving a potential road map to where he was going and was almost maybe even bragging about what he had
00:07:39
done yeah or it's a ruse I'm going to dump these items like I'm going back into the City and then turns and goes to
00:07:46
another suburb but what was the cause of Gloria's death the autopsy it was found
00:07:52
that Gloria had been shot twice in the head at close range they know that it was close range because she had powder
00:07:58
burns on her her face mhm one bullet entered the top of her head and the other the left temple it was believed
00:08:06
that the first shot was inflicted while she was standing and that the second shot the shot to her Temple was done
00:08:14
after she was on the ground so we have these gunshot wounds to her face they thought she was initially beaten but
00:08:22
then the autopsy is going to say well gunshot wounds so was she even beaten at all or is this just damage from the
00:08:31
gunshot wounds it it's difficult to to sit here and say with any level of certainty right other than using their
00:08:38
words and their words were up until the autopsy we had thought that she had been beaten to death now
00:08:45
how is this similar to Nancy's case how is it not similar so we have a situation
00:08:51
where a person is taken off of the side of the road and then a short time later found having been driven several miles
00:09:00
away and then shot to death so the the victimology is similar and the crime itself is similar do we have signs in
00:09:11
either case of sexual assault in Nancy's case absolutely now the in Gloria's case
00:09:17
it's a little more difficult so reporting at the time of Gloria's case was that a pathologist who conducted an
00:09:24
autopsy said that they saw no signs of sexual assault on this little victim's body and this is again from the Tribune
00:09:32
coroner Walter McCaron said Dr Harold Wagner his chief pathologist found that microscopic test indicated that the girl
00:09:41
had not been sexually molested this has never been refuted if the authorities have any
00:09:48
evidence of sexual assault of of Gloria they have kept it under wraps for 62 years I have a difficult time believing
00:09:57
that that she wasn't sexually assaulted right in some form or manner I do think that we should talk about the location
00:10:04
where Gloria was found this Palos Park area the Tribune says the body was lying 20 feet where some articles say 100t
00:10:15
which seems a little more likely to me but regardless 20 ft or 100 ft depending on which article you're reading west of
00:10:24
104th Avenue which is also called Willow Springs Road the exact spot was approximately a mile south of Highway 83
00:10:35
in a ravine this is basically a large nature preserved area wooded and untraveled and
00:10:42
the location was about 15 mi from the koala witz house do we know any more about her timeline from my understanding
00:10:50
Gloria's parents they owned a gas station in the city and her parents are Edward and Esther they said that Gloria
00:10:58
had been walking to church that morning to receive communion with her classmates
00:11:04
she had received her first communion on October 29th and was instructed to take communion every day for the next two
00:11:12
weeks that Saturday the day that she was abducted was to be the last day of that
00:11:19
two weeks Edward said that he and Esther his wife had warned their young daughter
00:11:24
repeatedly not to take rides from strangers and never to accept anything from anyone on the street but again
00:11:32
she's a small child and we all know how little kids can be enticed by promises from adults and so on or she could have
00:11:41
simply been grabbed off of the street while she's making her way to the church yeah or in this case we know that
00:11:48
there's a murder weapon which is a gun so you can easily control especially a a small child with a gun they would be
00:11:57
scared out of their mind a funeral was later held for Gloria unfortunately she was the koala wit's only child the
00:12:06
services were held at the church that she was actually walking to when she was abducted it was attended by all 650
00:12:15
students that went to the church school that Gloria attended she was in the third grade at the time police said they
00:12:23
were confident that Gloria was killed where she was found based on the amount of blood that they found at the scene
00:12:31
but the bullets that killed her they were not found with our victim and they were not initially located at all so
00:12:41
police employed an army mine detector to scan the area for the bullets and they failed to find them police had resorted
00:12:52
to sifting through the dirt by hand now there was some very confusing reporting in the Tribune that said says that
00:12:59
police sifted the ground where her body was found and Unearthed two 22 caliber shell casings right the captain of
00:13:07
police went on to say that both had a little rust on them and one was chipped but the 22 caliber shell casings isn't
00:13:16
really matching up with what their suspicions were because they believe that the bullets that killed Gloria came
00:13:22
from either a 32 or a 38 caliber weapon so these bullets the shell casings may just have been found there it just may
00:13:30
be happen stance that they were found in the same area so police spent the next few days coming the scene for any
00:13:38
evidence including the missing bullets they finally found one of the bullets on Thursday this is nearly 5 days after the
00:13:46
murder it was a 38 caliber and it was found dug into the ground 2 feet from where her body lay the nose of the
00:13:54
bullet was smooshed but the rifling was intact meaning it could possibly be linked to a weapon if they were to find
00:14:04
a weapon to test it against test showed it was almost certainly one of the projectiles that passed right through
00:14:12
Gloria's head for some reason they spent and expended a lot of time and effort searching that immediate area for the
00:14:23
gun presumably they hoped that if they could locate it its registration would lead them back to the killer or it's one
00:14:30
more tool to lead them to the killer yeah or fingerprints they had 400 Boy Scouts that were brought into col a two
00:14:39
mile a two square mile area dive teams even went into a nearby lake looking to see if anybody had dumped the gun there
00:14:48
police said they thought that the offender might have discarded it but that's just a suspicion because they
00:14:54
searched this Lake they searched this two square mile area they never located a gun they did find a tire track at the
00:15:04
murder scene yeah which we did not find in ny's case right the head of the Chicago police crime lab told the media
00:15:12
we found a tire track at the murder scene presumably Captain I'm guessing that they must have ruled out that the
00:15:19
tire track that they're talking about was not made by the person who found her body Harry lindman remember he had his
00:15:27
laundry truck out there with him that day they found a wallet on the ground and this was considered to be a very big
00:15:36
and important lead right we love it when a killer is dumb enough or makes the mistake of leaving an ID a photo ID or
00:15:45
or any form of identification right there at the murder scene right this wallet that they found belonged to a
00:15:52
teenage boy this is a 16-year-old teenage boy so they tracked this individual down down and he said that
00:16:01
yes that's my wallet but I lost it the summer before so I've lost that I lost that wallet months ago his parents his
00:16:10
friends and many people back up this story so he eventually ends up being crossed off of the list yeah but I
00:16:18
wonder what his life was like in the community for the next month of people not buying that story on glorious purse
00:16:27
remember that was recovered from Road they found a fingerprint on the strap that was not glorious a later article in
00:16:35
the Tribune said that they had actually had a palm print taken from Gloria's white plastic handbag so it's a it's a
00:16:42
little confusing if we're talking about a fingerprint or a palm print going forward I have I have the suspicion that
00:16:49
they actually found both that they may have found a fingerprint and a palmprint that both did not belong to Gloria on
00:16:55
this purse right either way it's a good piece of evidence there police spoke to all of the people that would be outw
00:17:04
working right out driving about that Saturday morning so this is people like bus drivers deliverymen and others who
00:17:12
regularly drove the route Gloria would have taken walking from her home to the church to which she never arrived then
00:17:19
they did a door-to-door canvas of Gloria's neighbors and people who lived along that route that she would have
00:17:25
taken to get to the church that morning and this is where they're hoping to develop a
00:17:31
more comprehensive timeline right they believed that she had been abducted really just a few minutes after setting
00:17:39
out from her home just before 7:45 a.m. we know that she never reached the church and this is based off of our
00:17:48
witness her friend that was waiting for her and the statements of the investigators at the time well and
00:17:53
there's probably other patrons of the church that didn't see her there that day so the investigators thought that
00:18:00
Gloria was likely picked up as she walked along Marquette road but later reporting said that she could have been
00:18:07
grabbed as she walked along 67th Street either way this gave a very narrow window of time for the actual abduction
00:18:16
as the walk even at a child's Pace was less than 10 minutes what's scary about both these cases in in my mind's eye is
00:18:25
is how visual they become in your imagination you can see you can almost see these cars following these girls
00:18:35
along whatever path they're going Nancy heading home with her sister Cheryl and seeing Gloria waking up heading to
00:18:44
church so she can take communion and and then being followed by a vehicle you can
00:18:50
almost see how that would play out or even like you said is there some ruse that they used or like get the get the
00:18:57
girl close to the car and will abduct her with a with a gun now in nany's case it's different because we have
00:19:04
eyewitness this person jumps out of the car and snatches the individual this could be the same thing that happened in
00:19:11
Gloria's case now in ny's case like we said we had we have her sister Cheryl that was with her so that was a solid
00:19:20
eyewitness but again she's only 5 years old in Gloria's case do we have any eyewitnesses we end up with several
00:19:28
potential eyewitnesses and again this walk is less than a 10-minute long walk so to have several eyewitnesses is very
00:19:37
lucky and helpful in this investigation so first we have a gentleman who owned a
00:19:44
grocery store on Damon Avenue this is located behind the koala wit's home he says that he saw Gloria leave the house
00:19:52
on that Saturday morning waving goodbye to her mother as she left so we don't need to be looking in the direction of
00:20:00
the parents as far as this eyewitness statement goes because she was alive and well when she left her parents' home
00:20:07
that morning then we have the statement of the parents Esther her mother said that she watched her daughter walk North
00:20:15
on Damon Avenue and watched Gloria turn East on 67th Street so that's a portion of her travels then we have a a man
00:20:27
who's a plumber who told police that he saw Gloria standing at the corner about a half of a
00:20:34
block from her home at approximately 7:45 a.m. this was on the corner of Marquette Road and Winchester Avenue he
00:20:42
was stopped at a light he's driving and he noticed her because she was hopping from foot to foot he said it appeared
00:20:49
she was waiting for someone that's a really weird part of this story where you have a witness who does not know the
00:21:00
victim and he is of the belief that the girl was possibly there waiting for somebody now what's interesting to me
00:21:09
Captain is he says that he notices her because she's hopping you know hopping around from foot to
00:21:15
foot but he's there because he stopped at a light on the corner of these roads well
00:21:25
why I'm wondering if she had the opportunity to walk across the street but did not and that gave him the
00:21:33
indication maybe she was waiting there for something or someone another witness who was described as a 45-year-old
00:21:41
maintenance man his name is Carl Bartel told police that he saw a girl who he thought could have been Gloria and
00:21:50
what's strange about this Captain is he says that he saw this girl that he thought might be Gloria riding in a car
00:21:55
with a man on Saturday morning this would have been been around 8:40 a.m. he said that the two were driving on 131st
00:22:04
Street at 104th Avenue about 2 miles from where Gloria was eventually found they turned North on
00:22:14
104th the child was with a man aged 25 to 40 with black hair this is as described by our witness the car was a
00:22:26
1954 or 1955 Plymouth four-door sedan olive green I don't want to jump back and forth between the two cases too much
00:22:37
because it will get a little convoluted along the way but remember in Nancy's case it was described as a four-door
00:22:47
sedan a four-door vehicle dark colored and a lot of the reports say black there are some reports that say possibly a
00:22:56
dark green and Gloria case we have this witness who's saying look if this was Gloria that I saw in the vehicle with
00:23:03
this man with black hair age 25 to 40 they were traveling in what I believe was a 1954 or 1955 Plymouth four-door
00:23:13
sedan olive green police took Bartell to the crime lab to view Gloria's clothing
00:23:20
to confirm the sighting if you do a little map detective work here and look up about the time that it would take to
00:23:29
drive from Gloria's house to the intersection where this man says that he saw Gloria and the darkhaired man it
00:23:36
takes about 34 minutes to drive that 14 or so miles so this timing could be fairly
00:23:46
accurate backing up his statement that he believes that he saw Gloria in this car so if she were picked up at
00:23:52
approximately 7:50 a.m. they could be on 131st and 104th at 840 as reported by this witness now of course give or take
00:24:05
15 minutes which could mean all of the world entirely another helpful tip came from a Mrs Steven Griffin no relation to
00:24:14
Peter who saw the blue coat lying on Highway 83 west of ridgland Avenue at approximately 9:15 a.m. so the timing of
00:24:23
the blue coat having been discarded in the roadway meant it was possible Gloria had been killed within an hour of the
00:24:31
abduction we also do need to point out though just because we painted the picture earlier of the Killer killing
00:24:38
Gloria leaving her where her body was found and then driving back to Chicago or heading back the direction he came
00:24:46
and discarding her her items along the way there's always the possibility that this coat was tossed out the window
00:24:53
while Gloria was still alive fortunate in this case there was another tip that was called in this was an anonymous tip
00:25:01
however and this was simply a woman that called police identifying herself only as a neighbor of the
00:25:08
caloes per the Chicago Tribune they say quote she said the murderer was driving an automobile Whose license is issued to
00:25:18
a resident of Alton in Madison County end quote so it's unclear how this witness this Anonymous witness would
00:25:27
know this right or if she even knew it at all it could have been a complete hoax but then you have to wonder if she
00:25:34
did in fact know it did she see the car did she have knowledge of this crime or or knowledge of the
00:25:43
suspect did it if she did see the car did it have some kind of sticker or some other Mark that designated it as being
00:25:50
from Alton was she referring to the license plate that she saw on the vehicle all of this stuff is is unknown
00:25:59
and really unfortunate because this tip comes in we get this information it seems very very Loosey Goosey and we
00:26:08
never hear anything of this tip [Music] again this show is sponsored by better help do
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SL [Music] podcast [Music] me all right we are back m cheers he's back I'm back cheers to the
00:29:01
people in the back mhm tall cans in the air now here's a part of our investigation that comes up every time
00:29:10
we run one of these investigations especially when we're talking about the abduction and murder of a youngster and
00:29:17
this is the part of the investigation Captain when the Chicago Police did the old pervert
00:29:24
Roundup and they rounded up all of the Usual Suspects PPS out and they demanded aliis from anyone in the neighborhood
00:29:34
where Gloria lived who had a history of any kind of sexual or sex charges against them sex crimes a 19-year-old
00:29:43
girl reported being followed home by a blonde youth wearing jeans and a tan jacket right around the same time that
00:29:51
Gloria was taken so right about that same time there this was on Marquette Road between Damon and Winchester
00:29:59
Avenues we've named all three of those roads before so this is same area yeah yes this could be significant the young
00:30:05
man followed the teen as she got off of the bus and walked home and then stood outside of her home until her mother
00:30:12
shouted at this man or this youngster to leave he was last seen walking down 67th
00:30:19
Street police were interested and tracking him down and told the public about this but it's not clear as we sit
00:30:26
here all these years later looking back whether they ever did in fact track him down and then the other thing too is if
00:30:34
we're going to cross reference this with the other statements by potential eyewitnesses who say that they saw
00:30:41
Gloria in the car with a darkhaired man between 25 and 40 well another man by that's described as a blonde youth might
00:30:52
not be our same guy right both can't be true but regardless these are witnesses these are people in the area trying to
00:31:00
help out trying to help the investigation within 2 days of Gloria's murder detectives said that they
00:31:07
believed that Gloria had been killed by the same quote sex maniac who had struck
00:31:12
in the city recently so remember this is early November they state that since October
00:31:22
17th there had been four assaults on women and girls in that area do we have any eyewitnesses of those
00:31:31
assaults well what we have in this situation is we have the people that were going to be assaulted are our
00:31:40
eyewitnesses and what what happens here though without going into the details of
00:31:45
each one of these attacks is I would categorize these more as attempted assaults because it looks like whoever
00:31:55
was doing this was scared off before he got to do whatever it is that he set out
00:32:01
to do so that makes it very difficult when you have these air quotes unsuccessful attacks compared to
00:32:10
Gloria's case where it's an abduction and a murder it gets very hard to sit here and go well is the mo even the same
00:32:20
right it because it sounds completely different but in the attempted assaults we do not know what the end result would
00:32:27
have been had the attacker been successful or not scared off right by the 15th of November police said that
00:32:35
they had no solid leads in the case which was about to change very quickly but up to this point it doesn't appear
00:32:43
to me Captain that this was for a lack of trying they really worked this case the best that they could in the early
00:32:51
stages they reportedly had 50 5 detectives from Chicago who who worked with Cook County Sheriff's investigators
00:33:00
on the case they claim to have spoken to about 800 people in the days since Gloria was found they were still working
00:33:09
the leads that they had the fingerprint on the purse strap is one of the potential leads they're also working the
00:33:15
tire track that was found near the body and the possible sighting of the girl in
00:33:20
the company of a man driving down the street Chicago detectives were also in touch with authorities in paing Ohio as
00:33:28
we had mentioned at the end of yesterday's show this is to speak with authorities there as to whether there
00:33:36
could be any connection between Gloria's murder case and that of Nancy eagleson now note that this is about 230 Mi away
00:33:47
but the cases bore startling parallels and again both cases we have a child being abducted into a vehicle
00:33:57
not a man on foot so 200 and some miles is is far but not that far yes and we have the chief of detectives James
00:34:06
McMahon in Chicago who openly ask the question to reporters when he's telling them hey we're in contact with some
00:34:15
people in Ohio about a case that they have he said have we got a killer traveling cross country so the chief of
00:34:23
detectives McMahon he goes on to say that he was checking and had been in contact with Sheriff John Keeler at the
00:34:32
paing sheriff's department via telephone they were both talking about the two slangs that happened recently in their
00:34:41
areas both noted the likenesses of the two atrocities the similarities in both cases according to the chief of
00:34:50
detectives McMahon he stated to the papers the abduction gloryia apparently was seed by
00:34:57
a man as she walked to church on that Saturday Nancy was grabbed by a man in an automobile as she and her sister
00:35:04
walked home from a movie on Sunday the death scene he said was similar Gloria's body was found in a wooded area a forest
00:35:12
preserved southwest of Chicago lying in a ravine about 100 ft from the road Nancy's body was found in a desolate
00:35:21
wooded area about 100 ft from a country road the cause of death Gloria was shot in the head twice with a weapon believed
00:35:29
to be either a 32 or 38 caliber gun Nancy also was shot in the head but the caliber of the weapon at that time and
00:35:40
really a little bit still to this day is a little bit in question and at the time
00:35:47
of this reporting they state that the caliber of the weapon used in ny's homicide wasn't known yes but the cause
00:35:55
of death to me would be more important than if the caliber matched because you could be dealing with somebody that
00:36:02
commits a crime and then gets rid of anything that they used to commit that crime and then they commit another crime
00:36:10
and they could then get rid of that murder weapon as well well this is really a shocker here
00:36:19
because the Chicago Police kind of pretty quickly felt like they may have their man
00:36:27
and they also thought that maybe this guy was good for Nancy eagleson's murder 230 mil
00:36:34
away this suspect drops into their laps essentially when a car was reported stolen in Chicago on that Saturday night
00:36:45
a stupid son of a [ __ ] the car was located on Sunday in leaport Indiana now you don't have to be a
00:36:53
geographical wizard to know that the great state of Indiana is right in the middle of Ohio and
00:37:00
Illinois so they find the stolen vehicle from Chicago in Indiana not only do they
00:37:07
find the stolen vehicle but inside we got a guy yay we got a suspect sleeping inside is 17-year-old
00:37:17
Robert Lee stovel and he happens to be wearing bloody clothing which of course immediately
00:37:25
raised suspicions I like that they tell us that in the newspaper it immediately raised suspicions when did it did Bloody
00:37:33
clothing not raise suspicions he told the police that the blood was the result of a bar fight this
00:37:41
guy is an idiot so he's described in the paper as a Detroit native Detroit Michigan native if you look at the guy
00:37:49
he's got a mustache go and sideburns he lied to the police about where he got the car right the car was report
00:37:56
reported stolen he's telling police I borrowed the car from my sister's boyfriend liar remember they
00:38:04
always have a story whenever you're caught in a stolen car you better have a story MH so he lied to the police about
00:38:11
this you can quickly check and and confirm that it does not belong to anybody that he knows in fact I'm not
00:38:17
certain who the car belonged to and his story about his whereabouts on Saturday night and really that Sunday did not
00:38:26
check out out so investigators intended to check his shoes to see whether dirt on them match the soil in the Ravine
00:38:34
where Gloria was found now keep in mind we're looking at this angle right here of this Robert Lee stoval individual
00:38:43
we're looking at all the information about him based off of what the authorities in Chicago are telling the
00:38:50
newspapers and are reporting at the time well he is going to be questioned by law
00:38:55
enforcement in the ne Nancy eagleson case as well yeah Pauling Ohio investigators in fact it was Sheriff
00:39:02
John Keeler who questioned this individual about Nancy's case this known liar what is weird here though to me is
00:39:12
this this is the guy that kind of ties these two cases together right you have these
00:39:20
two crimes that they're rare crimes potential stranger abduction both of them are children an abduction and a
00:39:28
murder similar age similar day yep both victims are found rather quickly the only thing that really separates them is
00:39:37
that 230 miles well you get over that hurdle real quickly when you find this guy in Indiana with a stolen car covered
00:39:46
in blood M now and also where he's from because if you take where he's from and you go through Ohio and then on to
00:39:56
Chicago that path makes sense well what's weird here about this guy is as good of a suspect as he may look as
00:40:06
interesting as he may appear to be to investigators right away it seems like both law enforcement agencies at some
00:40:13
point must have had been pretty clear that there was nothing that they could tie to him or nothing tying him to
00:40:20
either of the actual murders so where he is once and very briefly at that the prime suspect I mean his picture is in
00:40:30
the papers his his name is in the papers as being questioned in both of these homicides the prime suspect and both
00:40:36
murders however however briefly he was actually considered to be a suspect he seems to have been
00:40:42
dropped by both agencies and dropped out of the spotlight very quickly again very
00:40:48
strange because he's covered in blood I'd be testing that blood before I drop him from my suspect list right and
00:40:55
that's what I mean is weird here that we get his picture in the paper we get his
00:41:00
name in the paper as being interviewed and questioned in both cases and then they move on from him in both cases but
00:41:08
we're never really told why they moved on from him and I'm assuming we can see all the work that they were doing in
00:41:16
paing we can see all the work that they were doing in Chicago on these these two
00:41:21
cases and I don't like to assume but you have to believe that they had something
00:41:27
that moved them off of this guy or something that told them that he was not their guy in fact you have the statement
00:41:35
very quickly from the chief of detectives in Chicago that says despite the similarities the chief of detectives
00:41:45
said there wasn't enough evidence presently to Warrant sending a Chicago detective to Ohio but McMahon the chief
00:41:54
of detectives emphasized that if Keeler John Keeler the John Keeler the sheriff in Ohio if he ever had a suspect in
00:42:03
nany's case then the Chicago Police Department will waste no time in sending a man to paing to assist in the question
00:42:12
yeah this is very strange and very confusing and and maybe this is why these cases are not solved 60 years
00:42:21
later and this is one of those really truly unsatisfying parts of any story of any True Crime Story that remains a
00:42:31
mystery to this day here we sit 62 years later Nancy and Gloria are killed abducted and killed on the same weekend
00:42:43
in 1960 230 miles apart from one another there was enough similarities in this case that the investigators thought that
00:42:53
there was a chance that they could be connected that maybe this Maniac this man that
00:43:00
they find covered in blood in a stolen car from Chicago kills the little girl makes his
00:43:07
way through Ohio after abducting and killing ncy and then returns only to be caught
00:43:15
with the stolen vehicle covered in blood in Indiana and yet we sit here these years later we're not being told that
00:43:23
this Robert Lee stovel who was Des cried as a habitual liar right he was described as a a psychopathic liar at
00:43:32
one point in the newspapers which that term and that word means a lot different today than what it did in 1960 it's just
00:43:40
really frustrating it seems that he had some kind of mental issues that he may have been in and out of Institutions at
00:43:49
portions in his life so we do not know what went down behind the scenes when these investigators are talking to this
00:43:56
guy because I I want to be clear on this when he's picked up the way that the the
00:44:02
way that the Chicago Police and the way that it's described in the papers at the time and maybe this
00:44:09
is just the media taking a little bit of Liberties here with the story but it's described as oh snap we had this murder
00:44:19
in Chicago this one of the most horrific murders we can think of in recent memory
00:44:24
we have this AB uction and murder that takes place in paing Ohio a place that does not see this type of crime this
00:44:31
kind of violence and we found this man covered in blood he's our guy he is the guy he's
00:44:39
traveling driving around like a maniac looking for the next victim and we got him right that's the way that it's
00:44:46
described yeah you just these types of crimes that this this person is obviously they weren't afraid of being
00:44:54
seen by the younger eye witness this person probably is a psychopath these are crimes of a psychopath correct but
00:45:02
then there in lies the problem you sit here all these years later and you go maybe this guy Robert Lee stoval was the
00:45:09
only thing that was really binding these two cases together tying them connecting
00:45:14
them together and once he is removed from the situation once they believe or once they
00:45:21
move on from this guy cuz I don't want to say that he's cleared they never say that he's cleared but they looked at
00:45:28
this guy long and hard in Chicago they thought this was the guy and they moved on from him so there was
00:45:36
something telling him that he is not responsible for Gloria's murder there was not enough on this guy for them to
00:45:44
remain interested in him for Nancy eagleson's murder I really want to know about them testing that blood
00:45:52
evidence because obviously they don't have DNA back then but they could have tested it to see if it was the same type
00:46:00
of blood in the Glorious case and that's why I mean that it's unsatisfying you have this guy that they moved on from
00:46:08
and yet we do not know why we have we sit here and have no clue as to why they moved on from Robert Lee stoval now I
00:46:15
will tell you this tell me something keep in mind Cheryl who was with her older sister Nancy the night that Nancy
00:46:22
was abducted right she had never heard of Robert leoville she did not know that another little girl was killed that same
00:46:30
weekend two states over and because his picture was readily available because he was in the paper so
00:46:38
much at the time I showed Robert Lee sto's picture to Cheryl and she said I've never seen that
00:46:47
man before [Music] like take me [Music] and a quick note before we wrap up this week's set of shows we are doing a part
00:47:11
three in part four on the Nancy eagleson murder investigation and that is because
00:47:17
our involvement with the porch like project has made it so that we are privy to certain information that has not hit
00:47:23
the newspapers in this case and so we really took a deep dive looking at the Nancy eagleson investigation which has
00:47:31
gone on now for 62 years so with so much information we were just not able to cram it all into
00:47:40
two episodes well that's what we like to do here in the garage is let the information dictate whether it's going
00:47:46
to be a one parter two-parter three-parter or heck even sometimes we'll do a six parter like with The John
00:47:52
Bay ramsy case so we get to take a deep dive into this one and make it a four parter in Parts three and four we will
00:48:00
continue to look at the Nancy eagleson investigation and we will also take a look at another similar crime as well as
00:48:08
the suspects yeah the old turd burglars and you won't want to miss when we get to the suspects because I think you're
00:48:14
going to find them to be very interesting thank you for joining us here in the garage thanks for letting us
00:48:20
whisper in your ears for the last few hours you are our friends our buddies our Pals and we appreciate you Colonel
00:48:27
do we have any recommended reading for the beautiful listeners yes we do Captain this week we are recommending
00:48:33
that you go and do your reading over at uncovered. look there are more than 200,000 unsolved cases that have gone
00:48:41
cold in this nation since 1980 uncovered is the nation's largest database of information powered by you the public
00:48:51
they are crowdsourcing cold cases uncovered. check them out and until next week be good be kind and don't
00:48:59
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